StoneCo Ltd (STNE) 2023 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by. Welcome to the StoneCo First Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. By now, everyone should have access to our earnings release. The company also posted a presentation to go along with its call. All material can be found at www.stone.com.br on the Investor Relations section.

先生們女士們晚上好。謝謝你的支持。歡迎參加 StoneCo 2023 年第一季度收益電話會議。到目前為止，每個人都應該可以訪問我們的財報。該公司還發布了一份演示文稿來配合其電話會議。所有材料均可在 www.stone.com.br 的投資者關係部分找到。

Throughout this conference call, the company will be presenting non-IFRS financial information, including adjusted net income and adjusted net cash. These are important financial measures for the company but are not financial measures as defined by FRS. Reconciliations of the company's non-IFRS financial information to the IFRS financial information appear in today's press release.

在整個電話會議中，該公司將展示非國際財務報告準則的財務信息，包括調整後的淨利潤和調整後的淨現金。這些是公司的重要財務指標，但不是 FRS 定義的財務指標。該公司的非國際財務報告準則財務信息與國際財務報告準則財務信息的調節表出現在今天的新聞稿中。

Finally, before we begin our formal remarks, I would like to remind everyone that today's discussion might include forward-looking statements. These forward-looking statements are not guarantees of future performance, and therefore, you should not put undue reliance on them. These statements are subject to numerous risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from the company's expectations. In addition, many of the risks regarding the business are disclosed in the company's Form 20-F filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission, which is available at www.sec.gov.

最後，在我們開始正式發言之前，我想提醒大家，今天的討論可能包含前瞻性陳述。這些前瞻性陳述並不是對未來業績的保證，因此，您不應過度依賴它們。這些陳述受到許多風險和不確定性的影響，可能導致實際結果與公司的預期存在重大差異。此外，公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的 20-F 表格中披露了與該業務相關的許多風險，該表格可在 www.sec.gov 上獲取。

I would now like to turn the conference over to your host, Rafael Martins, VP of Finance and Investor Relations Officer at StoneCo. Please proceed.

現在我想將會議交給東道主拉斐爾·馬丁斯 (Rafael Martins)，他是 StoneCo 的財務副總裁兼投資者關係官。請繼續。

Thank you, operator, and good evening, everyone. Joining us today on the call, we have our CEO, Pedro Zinner, and our Chief Strategy Officer, Lia Matos. Today, we will present our first quarter 2023 results, discuss some recent trends and provide an updated outlook for our business.

謝謝接線員，大家晚上好。今天加入我們的電話會議的有首席執行官 Pedro Zinner 和首席戰略官 Lia Matos。今天，我們將公佈 2023 年第一季度業績，討論一些最新趨勢並提供最新的業務前景。

I will now pass it over to Pedro, so he can share some highlights of our performance. Pedro?

我現在將其交給佩德羅，以便他可以分享我們表現的一些亮點。佩德羅？

Thank you, Rafa, and good evening, everyone. First, I would like to say that I'm honored and excited to join the Stone team. And I would like to thank Thiago for all that he has done for the company and to ease my transition into the CEO role. I'm confident that Thiago will continue to contribute to our success in his new role as a Board member. I'm also pleased to report that Stone has continued to build on its solid performance from 2022 and deliver stronger-than-expected top line and bottom line results in the first quarter of 2023.

謝謝拉法，大家晚上好。首先，我想說，我很榮幸也很興奮能夠加入Stone團隊。我要感謝蒂亞戈為公司所做的一切，並讓我順利過渡到首席執行官的角色。我相信蒂亞戈將在擔任董事會成員的新職位上繼續為我們的成功做出貢獻。我還很高興地報告，Stone 從 2022 年起繼續鞏固其穩健的業績，並在 2023 年第一季度實現了強於預期的營收和利潤。

Let me provide some quick comments on the strong quarterly results and share some initial impressions on the company so far. In our last earnings call, the team outlined our priorities for 2023. I'm quite happy with the results achieved so far, which you can follow on Slide 5. Our first priority was to grow with efficiency. I'm pleased to report that we have exceeded our expectations on both fronts. We grew our revenues 31% year-over-year and deliver strong profitability with adjusted EBITDA of BRL 324 million in the quarter, 22% above our guidance. As a result, we were able to deliver adjusted net income of BRL 237 million, which was our best Q1 performance in our company's history. Our second priority was to generate cash. In Q1, we had strong cash flows from operations, and we were able to increase our adjusted net cash by approximately BRL 500 million to reach BRL 4 billion.

讓我對強勁的季度業績進行一些快速評論，並分享迄今為止對公司的一些初步印象。在我們上次的財報電話會議中，團隊概述了我們 2023 年的優先事項。我對迄今為止取得的成果感到非常滿意，您可以在幻燈片 5 中看到這些結果。我們的首要任務是高效增長。我很高興地報告，我們在這兩方面都超出了我們的預期。我們的收入同比增長 31%，盈利能力強勁，本季度調整後 EBITDA 為 3.24 億雷亞爾，比我們的指導水平高出 22%。結果，我們實現了 2.37 億雷亞爾的調整後淨利潤，這是我們公司歷史上最好的第一季度業績。我們的第二要務是創造現金。第一季度，我們的運營現金流強勁，調整後的淨現金增加了約 5 億雷亞爾，達到 40 億雷亞爾。

Our third priority was to keep expanding our financial services business. As you can see, we have delivered a very strong performance in our MSMB segment. We grew MSMB TPV 2x above the industry, accelerated net addition of clients in both payments and banking and are in line with our plans to resume our credit business. We have taken significant steps on the credit side, having disbursed to a small number of clients, but most importantly, we have improved many aspects of the product and operations that will enable us to grow our portfolio in a sustainable manner.

我們的第三個重點是繼續擴大我們的金融服務業務。正如您所看到的，我們在 MSMB 領域取得了非常強勁的業績。我們的 MSMB TPV 增長速度是行業的 2 倍，加速了支付和銀行業務客戶的淨增加，並且符合我們恢復信貸業務的計劃。我們在信貸方面採取了重大步驟，向少數客戶發放了款項，但最重要的是，我們改進了產品和運營的許多方面，這將使我們能夠以可持續的方式擴大我們的投資組合。

I want to take a conservative approach towards the expansion of the solution and grow the portfolio depending on market conditions and the completion of the tests we are doing. Finally, we were able to achieve this growth and evolution with a significant increase in monetization with take rates reaching 2.39%, an 18 basis point improvement over the last quarter. The fourth priority was to evolve our software business.

我想對解決方案的擴展採取保守的方法，並根據市場狀況和我們正在進行的測試的完成情況來擴大產品組合。最後，我們實現了這一增長和演變，貨幣化顯著增加，採用率達到 2.39%，比上季度提高了 18 個基點。第四個優先事項是發展我們的軟件業務。

On this front, results were below my expectations. The team is working hard to build the foundations that will enable us to deliver a unified experience to our clients, integrating software and financial services and becoming the one-stop shop solution for small and medium Brazilian retailers. We're making progress integrating and building of those capabilities, but we are not there yet. In our software sales, our revenue growth was hurt mainly by a reduction in ad spending by some of our enterprise accounts, and our EBITDA margin was also impacted by an increase in selling expenses. Throughout the rest of this year, I want to put a strong focus on our team integration, cost discipline and streamlining of our software portfolio.

在這方面，結果低於我的預期。該團隊正在努力奠定基礎，使我們能夠為客戶提供統一的體驗，整合軟件和金融服務，並成為巴西中小型零售商的一站式解決方案。我們正在整合和建設這些能力方面取得進展，但目前還沒有實現。在我們的軟件銷售中，我們的收入增長主要受到一些企業客戶廣告支出減少的影響，我們的 EBITDA 利潤率也受到銷售費用增加的影響。在今年剩下的時間裡，我希望重點關注我們的團隊整合、成本控制和軟件產品組合的精簡。

And finally, our fifth goal is to build a fit-for-purpose organization that will enable us to deliver on our long-term priorities. We have to make sure our organization is properly equipped to withstand the additional pressures that come with a high-speed growth. I don't think this guarantee success, but I believe not having the right resources in place is a leading indicator of failure. As part of this process, I want to welcome Luiz André Barroso as our new Board member. His experience as a Google Fellow and a seasoned professional in the tech industry will help us on our path to differentiate ourselves and lead through innovation.

最後，我們的第五個目標是建立一個適合目標的組織，使我們能夠實現我們的長期優先事項。我們必須確保我們的組織具備適當的能力來承受高速增長帶來的額外壓力。我認為這並不能保證成功，但我相信沒有合適的資源是失敗的先兆。作為這一過程的一部分，我歡迎路易斯·安德烈·巴羅佐成為我們的新董事會成員。他作為 Google 研究員和科技行業經驗豐富的專業人士的經驗將幫助我們走上差異化並引領創新的道路。

Now I want to share some additional thoughts on the company and my experience in the role so far. The first thing I'd like to highlight is the inspiring and fantastic people I have met over the last couple of months. Whether I've been spending time with teams in our hubs at our distribution centers or within our offices, the great ideas, the positivity and enthusiasm for the work we do is really inspiring. I believe the superior talent in this company will continue to be a great driver for our long-term success.

現在我想分享一些關於公司的額外想法以及我迄今為止在這個職位上的經歷。我想強調的第一件事是過去幾個月裡我遇到的鼓舞人心且出色的人。無論我是在配送中心還是在辦公室與團隊一起度過，偉大的想法、對工作的積極性和熱情都非常鼓舞人心。我相信這家公司的優秀人才將繼續成為我們長期成功的巨大推動力。

The second is that we have significantly improved the company's governance structure and management systems over the past year. I see the company doing a better job of setting more clearly defined goals, cascading this to different layers within the organization more effectively and linking compensation more closely to our performance. This is improving decision-making and I see that we now have a better understanding of the key value drivers affecting our business. This is certainly a continuous process, but I believe we now have better structure to maximize value and returns over the long term.

二是一年來我們公司治理結構和管理制度顯著完善。我看到公司在設定更明確的目標、更有效地將其級聯到組織內的不同層面以及將薪酬與我們的績效更緊密地聯繫起來方面做得更好。這正在改善決策，我發現我們現在對影響我們業務的關鍵價值驅動因素有了更好的了解。這當然是一個持續的過程，但我相信我們現在擁有更好的結構來實現長期價值和回報的最大化。

The third is the strong foundation of our client-centric culture. I think a key driver of Stone's success during its journey has been its ability to identify and ease the points of friction that MSMB clients have with traditional financial institutions. This, combined with the last mile and distribution capabilities that Stone has built over the past few years, has become a significant competitive advantage that has enabled Stone to disrupt the market. I think the same attributes can also extend our value proposition into banking and credit. And longer term, extend our competitive advantage in our software business by solving the vertical specific complexity of our clients and creating a more cohesive ecosystem of integrated software, hardware and financial services.

第三是我們以客戶為中心的文化的堅實基礎。我認為 Stone 在此過程中取得成功的一個關鍵驅動因素是它能夠識別並緩解 MSMB 客戶與傳統金融機構之間的摩擦點。這與 Stone 在過去幾年中建立的最後一英里和分銷能力相結合，已成為使 Stone 能夠擾亂市場的重要競爭優勢。我認為同樣的屬性也可以將我們的價值主張擴展到銀行業和信貸領域。從長遠來看，通過解決客戶的垂直特定複雜性並創建一個更具凝聚力的集成軟件、硬件和金融服務生態系統，擴大我們在軟件業務中的競爭優勢。

For the short term, I believe that focusing and excelling on the basics we will emerge stronger and more resilient. For example, our cost management initiatives are already improving our operating leverage and our pricing discipline is impacting our profit margins. Longer term, I am working with our team to design our strategy through 2030, setting clear goals and execution path ahead. We will provide you with more details on this new long-term plan at an upcoming Investor Day that we're working towards and we will share more details of the event a little later this year.

就短期而言，我相信，通過專注於基礎知識並取得優異成績，我們將變得更強大、更有彈性。例如，我們的成本管理計劃已經提高了我們的運營槓桿，而我們的定價規則正在影響我們的利潤率。從長遠來看，我正在與我們的團隊合作設計到 2030 年的戰略，設定明確的目標和未來的執行路徑。我們將在即將到來的投資者日向您提供有關這一新長期計劃的更多詳細信息，我們將在今年晚些時候分享該活動的更多詳細信息。

And now I'm going to pass it over to Lia, who will discuss our first quarter 2023 performance and strategic updates. Lia?

現在我將把它交給 Lia，她將討論我們 2023 年第一季度的業績和戰略更新。利亞？

Thank you, Pedro, and good evening, everyone. I would like to begin by briefly going over our consolidated results in slide 6. As Pedro mentioned, this was a strong quarter with growth and profitability above our expectations. Total revenue reached BRL 2.7 billion, growing 31% year-over-year and our adjusted EBT increased to BRL 324 million, above our guidance of BRL 265 million. As a result, our adjusted net income increased almost 6x year-over-year to reach BRL 237 million with a margin of 8.7%.

謝謝佩德羅，大家晚上好。我想首先簡要回顧一下幻燈片 6 中的綜合業績。正如 Pedro 提到的，這是一個強勁的季度，增長和盈利能力超出了我們的預期。總收入達到 27 億雷亞爾，同比增長 31%，調整後的息稅前利潤增至 3.24 億雷亞爾，高於我們 2.65 億雷亞爾的指導。因此，我們的調整後淨利潤同比增長近 6 倍，達到 2.37 億雷亞爾，利潤率為 8.7%。

Now from Slide 7 to 12, I will double-click on the performance of our Financial Services segment, which continues to produce strong growth with consistent profitability improvements. Revenue in this segment increased 36% year-over-year and was flat sequentially despite the typical weaker seasonality in the first quarter. This was driven by good performance in our MSMB client base, which demonstrated strong TPV and client base growth, produced higher take rates and generated more revenue from our banking solutions and PIX. In addition to this top line improvement, incremental cost efficiency gains generated higher profitability with adjusted EBT reaching BRL 306 million in the segment and a 13.1% margin.

現在，從幻燈片 7 到幻燈片 12，我將雙擊我們的金融服務部門的業績，該部門繼續強勁增長，盈利能力持續提高。儘管第一季度典型的季節性因素較弱，但該部門的收入同比增長 36%，與上一季度持平。這是由於我們的 MSMB 客戶群的良好表現所推動的，這證明了 TPV 和客戶群的強勁增長，產生了更高的採用率，並從我們的銀行解決方案和 PIX 中產生了更多收入。除了收入的改善外，增量成本效率的提高還帶來了更高的盈利能力，調整後的息稅前利潤 (EBT) 達到 3.06 億雷亞爾，利潤率為 13.1%。

Moving to Slide 8. I want to talk about some of the highlights in our MSMB performance. MSMB active payments clients reached 2.8 million in the quarter with an acceleration in net adds to 232,000. This good performance resulted from successful marketing campaigns, driven in part by our lead sponsorship of Brazil's most popular reality show, which increased our brand awareness in both TON and Stone and from a significantly lower churn in all client tiers. By optimizing our commercial strategy of TON and Stone offerings across our multiple sales channels, we were once again able to drive client base growth in all client tiers this quarter. This approach continues to produce good levels of profitable TPV growth, as I will show on the next page.

轉到幻燈片 8。我想談談我們 MSMB 性能中的一些亮點。本季度 MSMB 活躍支付客戶達到 280 萬，淨增至 232,000。這一良好的業績得益於成功的營銷活動，部分原因是我們對巴西最受歡迎的真人秀節目的主要贊助，這提高了我們在 TON 和 Stone 中的品牌知名度，並且所有客戶層的流失率均顯著降低。通過優化跨多個銷售渠道的 TON 和 Stone 產品的商業策略，本季度我們再次推動了所有客戶層的客戶群增長。正如我將在下一頁中展示的那樣，這種方法將繼續帶來良好的 TPV 盈利增長水平。

As seen on Slide 9, we grew TPV in MSMB clients by 25% year-over-year, over 2x the industry growth to reach BRL 79 billion. We generated this growth while also increasing our take rates on a year-over-year and quarter-over-quarter basis. Our MSMB take rate reached 2.39% this quarter, up from 2.21% in the fourth quarter of '22 and 2.06% in the first quarter of '22. Our take rate improvement is a result of higher monetization of prepayment, stronger growth in our TON brands, higher contribution from banking revenues and higher credit TPV mix compared to the fourth quarter. We continue to execute pricing discipline across our initiatives.

如幻燈片 9 所示，我們 MSMB 客戶的 TPV 同比增長 25%，是行業增長的 2 倍多，達到 790 億雷亞爾。我們實現了這一增長，同時也逐年和逐季提高了我們的轉化率。本季度我們的 MSMB 利用率達到 2.39%，高於 20 年第四季度的 2.21% 和 22 年第一季度的 2.06%。與第四季度相比，我們的採用率提高是由於預付款貨幣化程度更高、TON 品牌增長更強勁、銀行收入貢獻更大以及信貸 TPV 組合更高。我們繼續在我們的舉措中執行定價紀律。

On Slide 10, we will move to the performance of our key account segments. Given that sub-acquire volumes have become immaterial to our TPV, we have decided to stop disclosing the breakdown of our key account volumes this quarter to simplify our disclosure. Overall, key accounts TPV decreased 26% year-over-year to reach BRL 15 billion in the quarter as we continue to shift our priority from sub-acquiring business to platform services within the segment. However, as a result of our priority shift, our take rates in key accounts increased 31 basis points year-over-year. On a quarter-over-quarter basis, TPV declined, especially due to first quarter seasonality and continued deprioritization of sub-acquirers. Take rate remained flattish sequentially, mainly due to lower prepayment penetration.

在幻燈片 10 中，我們將討論主要客戶部門的績效。鑑於次級收購量對我們的 TPV 已變得無關緊要，我們決定停止披露本季度主要賬戶交易量的細目，以簡化我們的披露。總體而言，隨著我們繼續將重點從子收購業務轉向該領域的平台服務，本季度大客戶 TPV 同比下降 26%，達到 150 億雷亞爾。然而，由於我們的優先順序發生了轉變，我們的大客戶接受率同比增長了 31 個基點。環比來看，TPV 有所下降，尤其是由於第一季度的季節性因素以及子收購方的優先級持續下降。採取率環比持平，主要是由於預付款滲透率較低。

Now I will give some highlights of our banking performance on Slide 11. As we mentioned in our last earnings call, this quarter, we launched Super Conta Ton, our full banking solution for micro clients. As a result of this launch, we saw significant growth in our banking active client base to BRL 1.3 million in the first quarter of '23, 2.5x higher year-over-year and a growth of 81% quarter-on-quarter. This has also led to a quarter-on-quarter decrease in ARPAC, from BRL 45 in the fourth quarter of '22 to BRL 37 in the first quarter of '23, as micro clients generate lower revenue contribution in comparison to SMB clients.

現在，我將在幻燈片 11 上重點介紹我們的銀行業務業績。正如我們在上次財報電話會議中提到的，本季度我們推出了 Super Conta Ton，這是我們為微型客戶提供的完整銀行解決方案。由於此次推出，我們的銀行活躍客戶群在 2023 年第一季度顯著增長至 130 萬雷亞爾，同比增長 2.5 倍，環比增長 81%。這也導致 ARPAC 環比下降，從 22 年第四季度的 45 雷亞爾下降到 23 年第一季度的 37 雷亞爾，因為與中小企業客戶相比，微型客戶產生的收入貢獻較低。

We have also started piloting debit cards in Stone, which is an important step in evolving our banking solution for MSMBs. Client deposits reached BRL 3.9 billion, which was roughly stable quarter-over-quarter despite a seasonal decrease in TPV which is an important driver of deposits as it is the main cash-in method for clients that use the complete acquiring and banking solution. With the ramp-up of new clients and the launch of new features, we expect deposits to continue to grow over time.

我們還開始在 Stone 中試點借記卡，這是我們為中小型企業發展銀行解決方案的重要一步。客戶存款達到 39 億雷亞爾，儘管 TPV 季節性下降，但環比大致穩定。TPV 是存款的重要驅動因素，因為它是使用完整收單和銀行解決方案的客戶的主要現金方式。隨著新客戶的增加和新功能的推出，我們預計存款將隨著時間的推移繼續增長。

On Slide 12, I want to give a quick update on the credit front and on the results we have so far achieved with our pilots. We enhanced our working capital loan product by combining a flexible daily settlement mechanism with minimum monthly down payments, which increases predictability for both our clients and for us. We're in advanced stages of improving our system automation and credit life cycle monitoring and making our decision models more sophisticated through enhancements of data. We have also fully integrated our systems with the register of receivables and formalized personal guarantees as a form of collateral, which has already been executed as expected. We're currently working to rebuild our recovery and renegotiation process to give our clients the possibility to renegotiate directly through the Stone app if they wish to do so.

在幻燈片 12 上，我想快速介紹一下信貸方面的最新情況以及我們迄今為止通過試點取得的成果。我們通過將靈活的每日結算機制與最低每月首付相結合來增強我們的營運資金貸款產品，這提高了我們的客戶和我們的可預測性。我們正處於改進系統自動化和信用生命週期監控的高級階段，並通過增強數據使我們的決策模型更加複雜。我們還將我們的系統與應收賬款登記冊和正式的個人擔保作為抵押品的形式完全集成，並已按預期執行。我們目前正在努力重建我們的恢復和重新談判流程，以便我們的客戶可以直接通過 Stone 應用程序進行重新談判（如果他們願意）。

Until the end of April, we have disbursed around BRL 6 million to approximately 200 clients with key credit performance indicators in line with our business model and our credit underwriting standards. We're in line with our plans to test our credit card solution in the second half of this year. As Pedro said previously, we will take a conservative approach towards the expansion of this solution and grow the portfolio depending on market conditions, and the completion of the test we're doing.

截至 4 月底，我們已向約 200 名關鍵信用績效指標符合我們的業務模式和信用承銷標準的客戶支付了約 600 萬雷亞爾。我們計劃在今年下半年測試我們的信用卡解決方案。正如佩德羅之前所說，我們將採取保守的方法來擴展該解決方案，並根據市場狀況和我們正在進行的測試的完成情況來擴大產品組合。

Now I'm going to shift to the discussion of the performance and strategic updates of our software business in Slide 13 and 14. In the first quarter of '23, software revenue increased to BRL 358 million, with a 10% year-over-year growth, representing a deceleration from past quarters given some weakness in our ads business from large enterprise accounts that reduced spending this quarter. Adjusted EBITDA for software was BRL 40 million in the first quarter, with a margin of 11.1%, a 120 basis point decrease compared to the first quarter of '22, which was mainly driven by the softer revenue growth in the quarter and an increase in selling expenses as we invested in our sales team.

現在我將在幻燈片 13 和 14 中討論我們軟件業務的績效和戰略更新。23 年第一季度，軟件收入增至 3.58 億雷亞爾，同比增長 10%。由於大型企業賬戶本季度減少了支出，導致我們的廣告業務出現一些疲軟，因此較過去幾個季度出現了減速。軟件第一季度調整後 EBITDA 為 4000 萬雷亞爾，利潤率為 11.1%，比 2022 年第一季度下降 120 個基點，這主要是由於該季度收入增長疲軟以及我們投資於銷售團隊時的銷售費用。

On Slide 14, I want to give the main highlights of our performance and priorities. Software revenues this quarter was positively affected by a higher number of POS and ERP locations in smaller client tiers as well as inorganic expansion. The growth in number of locations focused on lower tier clients was in line with our strategy to increase our presence in medium and small clients with our software solutions. This shift towards smaller client tiers is also expected to drive average tickets down, while it should open up a broader TAM opportunity ahead.

在幻燈片 14 上，我想重點介紹我們的績效和優先事項。本季度的軟件收入受到較小客戶層中 POS 和 ERP 位置數量增加以及無機擴張的積極影響。專注於低層客戶的地點數量的增長符合我們通過軟件解決方案增加中小型客戶業務的戰略。這種向較小客戶層的轉變預計也會導致平均門票價格下降，同時也應該會在未來開闢更廣泛的 TAM 機會。

Looking ahead, I would also like to share with you our priorities for software for this year, and we emphasize our long-term view. We have 5 key priorities for this year. A strong focus on cost discipline, integrating teams and functions across StoneCo; increasing operational leverage; continue to expand our presence by scaling our distribution channels; driving growth within medium and small client segments; continued efforts to build an end-to-end value proposition of software and integrated financial services in select verticals and segments.

展望未來，我還想與大家分享我們今年軟件的優先事項，我們強調我們的長期觀點。今年我們有 5 個關鍵優先事項。高度重視成本紀律，整合 StoneCo 的團隊和職能；提高運營槓桿；通過擴大我們的分銷渠道來繼續擴大我們的業務；推動中小​​型客戶群的增長；繼續努力在選定的垂直領域和細分市場建立軟件和綜合金融服務的端到端價值主張。

We believe this is key for us to strengthen our differentiation in some client segments where we have a relevant opportunity to address, streamline software assets to increase strategic focus and expand our addressable market by entering in new retail verticals through M&A. In the long term, our goal is to build a unified commerce solution for our clients, and our software business is an integral part of this strategic vision. We believe we have a lot of work ahead of us. But we're on an exciting path to become the only end-to-end integrated software and financial services provider for Brazilian merchants.

我們相信，這對於我們在某些​​客戶群中加強差異化至關重要，在這些客戶群中，我們有相關機會來解決、簡化軟件資產，以提高戰略重點，並通過併購進入新零售垂直領域來擴大我們的目標市場。從長遠來看，我們的目標是為客戶構建統一的商務解決方案，而我們的軟件業務是這一戰略願景不可或缺的一部分。我們相信我們還有很多工作要做。但我們正走在一條令人興奮的道路上，成為巴西商家唯一的端到端集成軟件和金融服務提供商。

Now I want to pass it over to Rafa, so he can discuss in more detail some of our key financial metrics. Rafa?

現在我想將其轉交給拉法，以便他可以更詳細地討論我們的一些關鍵財務指標。拉法？

Thank you, Lia. I would like to begin on Slide 15, where we discuss the evolution of our costs and expenses. As we have mentioned in the past, 2023 should be a year with more cost discipline and OpEx control. In the first quarter, we have started to see initial results of that approach, especially in administrative expenses, as I will detail shortly. Cost of services increased 7% year-over-year to BRL 721 million.

謝謝你，莉亞。我想從幻燈片 15 開始，我們在其中討論成本和費用的演變。正如我們過去提到的，2023 年應該是成本紀律和運營支出控制更加嚴格的一年。在第一季度，我們已經開始看到這種方法的初步結果，特別是在管理費用方面，我將很快詳細介紹。服務成本同比增長 7%，達到 7.21 億雷亞爾。

As a percentage of revenue, it was 26.6% in the quarter, 600 basis points lower than last year. Compared to previous quarter, it grew 3%, mainly driven by higher investments in technology. As we said in our last earnings call, we expected administrative expenses to reduce on an absolute basis and to increase below inflation for the year.

本季度佔收入的百分比為 26.6%，比去年下降 600 個基點。與上一季度相比增長了 3%，主要是由於技術投資增加所致。正如我們在上次財報電話會議中所說，我們預計今年的管理費用將絕對減少，且增幅低於通貨膨脹率。

In the first quarter, administrative expenses decreased 11.5% sequentially, mainly explained by lower third-party advisory expenses and more normalized levels of personnel expenses that was seasonally higher in the fourth quarter. As a percentage of revenue, administrative expenses improved 70 basis points year-over-year and 130 basis points quarter-over-quarter to reach 9.7% of revenue. Selling expenses grew 1.6% year-over-year and decreased 4% sequentially, with operational leverage gains in both comparisons. The main reason for the quarter-over-quarter improvement was lower personnel expenses, partially compensated by higher marketing and sales commissions.

第一季度管理費用環比下降 11.5%，主要是由於第三方諮詢費用減少以及第四季度季節性較高的人事費用水平更加正常化。管理費用佔收入的比例同比提高 70 個基點，環比提高 130 個基點，達到收入的 9.7%。銷售費用同比增長 1.6%，環比下降 4%，運營槓桿率在兩次比較中均有所增加。環比改善的主要原因是人員費用降低，營銷和銷售佣金的增加部分彌補了這一損失。

Financial expenses increased 10 basis points as a percentage of revenue to reach 33.5%. Due to the market dynamics this quarter, we conservatively decided to hold a higher average cash position during part of the quarter, which indirectly impacted our financial expenses. Lastly, other expenses decreased 17.5% sequentially and 90 basis points as a percentage of revenue as our fourth quarter results were affected due to the impairment of proprietary software and write-off of some noncore assets.

財務費用佔收入的比例上升10個基點，達到33.5%。由於本季度的市場動態，我們保守地決定在本季度部分時間持有較高的平均現金頭寸，這間接影響了我們的財務費用。最後，其他費用環比下降 17.5%，佔收入的百分比下降 90 個基點，因為我們第四季度的業績受到專有軟件減值和一些非核心資產沖銷的影響。

Moving to Slide 16. I would like to talk about our cash generation. This quarter, we have increased our adjusted net cash position by almost BRL 500 million to reach BRL 4 billion. The main driver for this was the strong cash flow from our operations as well as the sale of our stake in Banco Inter for net proceeds of BRL 218 million. Compared to the first quarter of last year, adjusted net cash increased by BRL 1.5 billion.

轉向幻燈片 16。我想談談我們的現金生成。本季度，我們調整後的淨現金頭寸增加了近 5 億雷亞爾，達到 40 億雷亞爾。其主要驅動因素是我們運營產生的強勁現金流以及出售我們在 Banco Inter 的股份以獲得 2.18 億雷亞爾的淨收益。與去年第一季度相比，調整後淨現金增加15億雷亞爾。

Now moving to our second quarter 2023 outlook on Page 17. We expect total revenue and income above BRL 2.875 billion in the second quarter, representing a year-over-year growth above 24.8%. For MSMB TPV, we expect volumes between BRL 83 billion and BRL 84 billion in the second quarter compared with BRL 69.9 billion in the second quarter of 2022, representing a year-over-year growth between 18.8% and 20.2%. Finally, we expect adjusted EBT of more than BRL 375 million compared to BRL 324 million for the first quarter. This number is not adjusted for any share-based compensation expenses.

現在轉向第 17 頁的 2023 年第二季度展望。我們預計第二季度總收入和收入將超過 28.75 億雷亞爾，同比增長超過 24.8%。對於 MSMB TPV，我們預計第二季度的銷量將在 830 億雷亞爾至 840 億雷亞爾之間，而 2022 年第二季度的銷量將達到 699 億雷亞爾，同比增長 18.8% 至 20.2%。最後，我們預計調整後息稅前利潤將超過 3.75 億雷亞爾，而第一季度為 3.24 億雷亞爾。該數字未針對任何股權激勵費用進行調整。

With that said, operator, can you please open the call up to questions?

話雖如此，接線員，您能打開電話提問嗎？

(Operator Instructions) And the first question will come from Sheriq Sumar from Evercore ISI.

（操作員說明）第一個問題將來自 Evercore ISI 的 Sheriq Sumar。

On the take rate front, can you provide us some color as to how should we think about for 2Q and 3Q and even 4Q as well? And in terms of how much more pricing upside can we see and I think the current economic stake, the average is expecting a decline in the rates -- in the CV rates going forward. So can you remind us as to how should take rates evolve if interest rates are going to go down in the back half of the year and in '24 as well?

在採取率方面，您能否為我們提供一些關於我們應該如何考慮第二季度、第三季度甚至第四季度的信息？就我們可以看到的定價上漲幅度而言，我認為目前的經濟利益，平均預期利率會下降——未來的CV利率會下降。那麼，您能否提醒我們，如果利率將在今年下半年和 24 年下降，那麼利率應該如何演變？

Sheriq, this is Lia. Thank you. Regarding take rates, the first message is we continue to see positive take rate trends going forward. I think regarding repricing, as we've said many times before, this is like the dynamic and continuous process. So we always take into account where we are and the opportunities that we have to reprice the base based on our return hurdles. So I think that's the message and that we can expect to continue to see a positive trend going forward.

謝里克，這是莉亞。謝謝。關於轉化率，第一個信息是我們繼續看到積極的轉化率趨勢。我認為關於重新定價，正如我們之前多次說過的，這就像一個動態且持續的過程。因此，我們始終考慮我們的處境以及我們必鬚根據退貨障礙重新定價的機會。所以我認為這就是我們要傳達的信息，我們可以預期未來會繼續看到積極的趨勢。

Sheriq, Rafael here. Just to add to Lia's answer. Over time, over the coming years, what we do expect is that new revenue streams like banking credit, they should also contribute more and more to take rates over time. So not only the pricing in acquiring alone, but also the monetization in other fronts.

謝里克，拉斐爾在這裡。只是為了補充莉亞的答案。隨著時間的推移，在未來幾年，我們確實期望銀行信貸等新的收入來源，隨著時間的推移，它們也應該為利率做出越來越多的貢獻。因此，不僅是收購方面的定價，還有其他方面的貨幣化。

Got it. And just one more follow-up. On the banking front, this new macro like this new product or this new offering for the macro clients. Can you talk about what's the cost of acquisition for these clients and the profitability of that going forward? The main reason I ask is, is there a way in which you could increase your ARPA from these accounts to kind of drive better margins for the overall business?

知道了。還有一個後續行動。在銀行業方面，這個新的宏觀就像這個新產品或為宏觀客戶提供的新產品。您能談談獲取這些客戶的成本以及未來的盈利能力嗎？我問的主要原因是，有沒有一種方法可以增加這些賬戶的 ARPA，從而為整體業務帶來更好的利潤？

Thank you for the question, Sheriq. I think regarding trends and talking a little bit about Super Conta Ton, so the full banking solution for micro clients. This is a solution that is completely bundled to the acquiring solution. So there's no incremental tax when we sell the banking solutions to micro clients, it's one completely.

謝謝你的提問，謝里克。我認為關於趨勢並談論一下 Super Conta Ton，即針對微型客戶的完整銀行解決方案。這是一個與獲取解決方案完全捆綁在一起的解決方案。因此，當我們向微型客戶出售銀行解決方案時，不存在增量稅，這完全是一種稅收。

Regarding ARPAC trends, as we have been saying for a couple of quarters already, ARPAC will trend downwards basically due to a mix effect, right? Because the economics of the micro clients is naturally smaller than the economics of an SMB client.

關於 ARPAC 趨勢，正如我們已經在幾個季度中所說的那樣，ARPAC 將基本上由於混合效應而呈下降趨勢，對吧？因為微型客戶的經濟性自然比中小企業客戶的經濟性要小。

So as we grow faster in the micro segment, this will contribute to our back overall trending downwards due to a mix effect. But the important message is that, overall, because this is incremental to our banking business in Stone, overall deposits grow, both as we grow banking clients itself in Stone and TON products, but also as we expect to -- as we advanced on the banking portfolio, the banking road map, we expect to increase engagement of our clients with banking. So I think those are the trends that you can expect.

因此，當我們在微型細分市場增長更快時，由於混合效應，這將導致我們的整體趨勢下降。但重要的信息是，總體而言，因為這是我們在 Stone 的銀行業務的增量，所以總體存款會增長，不僅是因為我們在 Stone 和 TON 產品中增加了銀行客戶本身，而且正如我們所期望的那樣——隨著我們在銀行業務投資組合、銀行業務路線圖，我們希望提高客戶對銀行業務的參與度。所以我認為這些是你可以期待的趨勢。

The next question will be from Tito Labarta from Goldman Sachs.

下一個問題將由高盛的 Tito Labarta 提出。

Congratulations, Pedro on the new role. A couple of questions also. I guess first on your TPV continues to be pretty healthy, particularly in a decelerating environment. But just kind of curious if you can give any color, I know you don't break out micro merchants versus SMB. But just to understand a little bit the competitive dynamics in those 2 segments. I don't know if there's any color you can give, like how much of your growth is coming more so from growing faster in micro merchants? How is the competitive environment there? And similarly, how you're seeing that on the SMB side.

恭喜佩德羅擔任新職務。還有幾個問題。我想首先你們的 TPV 仍然相當健康，特別是在減速的環境中。但只是有點好奇，如果你能給出任何顏色，我知道你不會區分微型商人與中小企業。但只是為了了解一點這兩個細分市場的競爭動態。我不知道您是否可以給出一些顏色，比如您的增長有多少更多來自於微商的更快增長？那裡的競爭環境如何？同樣，您在中小企業方面也看到了這一點。

And then my second question, just a little bit more of a regulatory question. There's been a lot of discussions about potentially capping revolving credit card rates and some discussions talked about maybe reducing interest installments I don't know if you've been involved at all in any of those conversations at all. But just kind of curious your thoughts on some of the regulations being discussed and potential impact on your business.

然後是我的第二個問題，更多的是一個監管問題。關於可能限制循環信用卡利率的討論很多，還有一些討論可能會減少利息分期付款，我不知道您是否參與過這些對話。但只是想知道您對正在討論的一些法規以及對您業務的潛在影響的看法。

Tito, Lia here. Thank you for the questions. I'm going to take the first one regarding TPV trends, and then I'm going to pass it over to Rafa. So overall trends in TPV, Tito, is that looking ahead, we expect to continue to see growth in MSMB business above the industry over time. While, of course, we maintain pricing discipline. When we look at consolidated volumes, we have to take into account the effect of the deprioritization of sub-acquirers, right? But within MSMB, we expect to continue to grow and gain market share, so grow above the industry.

蒂托，莉亞在這裡。謝謝你的提問。我將討論第一個關於 TPV 趨勢的問題，然後將其交給 Rafa。因此，Tito，冠捷科技的總體趨勢是，展望未來，我們預計隨著時間的推移，中小型企業業務的增長將繼續高於行業。當然，我們維持定價紀律。當我們考慮合併交易量時，我們必須考慮次級收購者的優先級降低的影響，對吧？但在 MSMB 內部，我們預計將繼續增長並獲得市場份額，從而超越行業。

Market share isn't a goal in itself, but it's a consequence of everything that we're doing, the value proposition to our clients, the investments that we make behind all of our distribution channels. And on your question regarding mix between micro and SMBs, what we can say is that we've seen positive net adds, so growth in client base in all client tiers. And we continue to execute on this strategy, of course, always focusing on bringing the best clients with pricing discipline, but continuing to grow and balance that growth with profitability. Rafa, you want to take on the question on micro -- on regulatory?

市場份額本身並不是目標，而是我們所做的一切、對客戶的價值主張以及我們在所有分銷渠道背後進行的投資的結果。關於您關於微型企業和中小企業混合的問題，我們可以說的是，我們已經看到了積極的淨增加，因此所有客戶層的客戶群都在增長。當然，我們將繼續執行這一戰略，始終專注於通過定價紀律為最好的客戶提供服務，但繼續增長並平衡增長與盈利能力。拉法，您想回答有關微觀監管的問題嗎？

Sure. So Tito, we know that there have been discussions with Brazilian authorities about the possibility of implementing a cap on interest rates for a revolving credit card. This is not a new topic in Brazil and it's been carefully considered by regulator in consultation with different industry participants, particularly large banks. Some players argue that high revolving rates are only necessary because they subsidize installment transactions in Brazil, the so-called parcelados.

當然。蒂托，我們知道，我們已經與巴西當局討論了對循環信用卡實行利率上限的可能性。這在巴西並不是一個新話題，監管機構與不同行業參與者（尤其是大型銀行）協商後仔細考慮了這一問題。一些參與者認為，高循環利率是必要的，因為它們補貼巴西的分期付款交易，即所謂的“parcelados”。

They suggest that reducing rates would require a decrease in installment transactions. However, based on the profitability of the card business in Brazil, it does not appear to us that the revolving credit business relies on the parcelados to be profitable. And this is especially true considering that Brazil has one of the highest interchange fees in the world, and that those fees also remunerate the institutions for the risk they take.

他們建議降低利率需要減少分期付款交易。然而，從巴西卡業務的盈利能力來看，我們認為循環信貸業務並不依賴於parcelados來盈利。考慮到巴西是世界上交換費最高的國家之一，而且這些費用也為機構承擔的風險提供了報酬，這一點尤其正確。

So additionally, one other consideration is that a significant part of the consumption in Brazil is based on credit and parcelados, right? So 50% of credit card transactions in the country are done in that type, and this is especially true for lower-income people. So basically, I think that before implementing any changes that we don't have any visibility, we are not directly participating in this discussion because we are not directly involved as we are not big issuers. We believe that Brazilian authorities will consider various economic and social aspects of that measure.

此外，另一個考慮因素是巴西消費的很大一部分是基於信貸和包裹，對吧？因此，該國 50% 的信用卡交易都是通過這種類型完成的，對於低收入人群尤其如此。所以基本上，我認為在實施任何我們沒有任何可見性的改變之前，我們不會直接參與這個討論，因為我們不是大發行人，所以沒有直接參與。我們相信巴西當局將考慮該措施的各個經濟和社會方面。

Okay. That's great. Just one follow-up, I guess, on Lia's response on the messaging, micro and SMB. Just any comments you can give on the competitive environment within those 2 different segments? Any differences that you're seeing in the micro merchant space relative the SMB base from a competitive perspective?

好的。那太棒了。我想這只是 Lia 在消息傳遞、微型和中小企業方面的回應的一個後續行動。您對這兩個不同細分市場的競爭環境有何評論？從競爭的角度來看，您認為微型商戶領域相對於中小型企業基地有何差異？

Tito, yes, so I think regarding competition, if anything, the competitive landscape has been more stable compared to -- there's 3 important trends happening in the industry, right, that are worth mentioning. First, the industry overall has adjusted prices upwards over the last year. Cost of capital, of course, has increased and that makes it more difficult for new entrants to come into the market. So we see a market that is more stable from that perspective.

Tito，是的，所以我認為就競爭而言，如果有什麼不同的話，那就是競爭格局更加穩定——行業中出現了 3 個重要的趨勢，對吧，值得一提。首先，去年行業整體價格上調。當然，資本成本增加了，這使得新進入者更難進入市場。因此，從這個角度來看，我們看到了一個更加穩定的市場。

And third, overall, players have evolved, right, beyond a pure acquiring to a more complete financial services offering. And we think that strategies are more and more taking into account this complete financial offering mindsets. And more broadly, players like ourselves, the integrated financial services offering both from a product and from a go-to-market perspective, we'll be better positioned to win client relationships and gain market share overall in the future. So I think that's what -- those are our main perspectives on the industry.

第三，總體而言，參與者已經從純粹的收購轉向提供更完整的金融服務。我們認為，戰略越來越多地考慮到這種完整的金融產品思維。更廣泛地說，像我們這樣的參與者，從產品和進入市場的角度提供綜合金融服務，我們將在未來更好地贏得客戶關係並獲得整體市場份額。所以我認為這就是我們對這個行業的主要觀點。

The next question will come from Juan Recalde from Scotiabank.

下一個問題將由豐業銀行的胡安·雷卡爾德提出。

Pedro, Lia, Rafael, congratulations on the extraordinary result. My question is related to the software business. So we saw that the revenue growth accelerated there at the EBITDA margin compressed. So I was wondering, first, if this was expected. Second, what drove the top line deceleration on the profitability deterioration? And third, what kind of growth and profitability do you see for this segment going forward.

佩德羅、利亞、拉斐爾，祝賀你們取得了非凡的成績。我的問題與軟件業務有關。因此，我們看到收入增長加速，但 EBITDA 利潤率壓縮。所以我首先想知道這是否是預期的。其次，是什麼導致盈利能力惡化導致收入減速？第三，您認為該細分市場未來的增長和盈利能力如何。

Juan, Lia here. I'm going to start answering regarding top line and maybe hand over to Rafa to give some more color on margin evolution. So we did expect a deceleration in terms of growth, but as Pedro mentioned, the revenue performance still came behind our expectations. This weaker growth was mainly driven by our ads digital business, as I mentioned. This business declined 8.7% year-over-year, while core POS and ERP revenues actually grew 12% year-over-year.

胡安，莉亞在這裡。我將開始回答有關頂線的問題，也許會交給拉法，以提供更多關於利潤演變的信息。因此，我們確實預計增長會放緩，但正如佩德羅提到的，收入表現仍然低於我們的預期。正如我提到的，這種疲軟的增​​長主要是由我們的廣告數字業務推動的。該業務同比下降 8.7%，而核心 POS 和 ERP 收入實際上同比增長 12%。

And on the positive side, core revenue growth was driven by an increase in the number of locations and consolidation of (inaudible) while average tickets remained relatively stable. And these dynamics are a result of us investing in the growth in medium and small client segments. That's where we see the biggest market opportunity ahead. So that performance in terms of growing in smaller client tiers is in line with our plans.

從積極的一面來看，核心收入的增長是由地點數量的增加和（聽不清）的整合推動的，而平均票價保持相對穩定。這些動力是我們投資於中小型客戶群增長的結果。這就是我們看到未來最大的市場機會的地方。因此，小客戶層增長方面的表現符合我們的計劃。

And I think the message going forward is a scenario of lower inflation and more volatility in the digital business should continue to weigh on software top line growth. But we continue to execute on the priorities that we have, both on the revenue side, mainly growing in medium and smaller client tiers and defending the revenue in the enterprise clients, but also focusing on cost discipline. Rafa, do you want to complement on margin trends or maybe Pedro?

我認為未來的信息是通貨膨脹率下降和數字業務波動性加大應該會繼續影響軟件收入的增長。但我們繼續執行我們的優先事項，無論是在收入方面，主要是在中小型客戶層中增長，並捍衛企業客戶的收入，但也注重成本控制。 Rafa，你想補充利潤趨勢還是 Pedro？

Yes, maybe I'll jump in. Juan, I think looking ahead, I think we're going to remain focused on investing behind our franchise and inbound channels. to grow in the middle of the pyramid because that's where we see the biggest opportunity, both in terms of software and cross-sell. And I think regarding the margins that you asked, I think we already expected a lower margin this quarter, especially due to the seasonality of the revenues.

是的，也許我會插話。胡安，我認為展望未來，我認為我們將繼續專注於對特許經營和入境渠道的投資。在金字塔中間成長，因為這是我們在軟件和交叉銷售方面看到最大機會的地方。我認為關於您詢問的利潤率，我認為我們已經預計本季度的利潤率會較低，特別是由於收入的季節性。

However, the margin was a bit lower than we expected as a combination of 2 main factors. I think the first one is the lower revenue growth, which, of course, reduces dilution of fixed costs and also higher selling expenses this quarter as we invested in commercial headcount, which weighted on selling expenses for the software. The revamping margins should be driven by efficiency initiatives associated to the integration of back-office functions across Stone company to be executed with the implementation of our shared service center, amongst other initiatives that we have in the pipeline.

然而，由於兩個主要因素的結合，利潤率略低於我們的預期。我認為第一個是收入增長較低，這當然減少了固定成本的攤薄，而且本季度的銷售費用也增加了，因為我們投資了商業人員，這增加了軟件的銷售費用。調整利潤率應由與整個 Stone 公司後台職能整合相關的效率舉措來推動，這些舉措將通過我們的共享服務中心的實施以及我們正在實施的其他舉措來執行。

The improvement, I think it's important to highlight that the improvements we have are not a short-term challenge. It will take time. But as I mentioned during the call, we are confident that the rewards are really worth it. We are aiming to bring together the software and financial services to the Brazilian merchants through better products and services. And we really believe this is very hard to replicate by any other type of competitor. I don't know if we addressed all the questions you had.

對於改進，我認為重要的是要強調我們所取得的改進不是短期挑戰。需要花時間。但正如我在電話中提到的，我們相信這些回報是值得的。我們的目標是通過更好的產品和服務，為巴西商家提供軟件和金融服務。我們確實相信任何其他類型的競爭對手都很難復制這一點。我不知道我們是否解決了您提出的所有問題。

Yes. That's very helpful.

是的。這非常有幫助。

And the next question will come from Kaio Prato from UBS.

下一個問題將由瑞銀集團的 Kaio Prato 提出。

I have 2 questions here. If I missed out, one related to the guidance, if we look to your guidance of BRL 375 million plus earnings before taxes in the second quarter I understand that this is the bottom of the guidance. But this is an only BRL 50 million increase on a quarter-over-quarter basis. And in the second quarter, we will see the first effect of the cap on interchange fees of prepaid and debit cards which tend to be positive. And in addition to that, expectation of continued healthy growth on SMB, TPV and so on.

我這裡有兩個問題。如果我錯過了與指導相關的一項，如果我們查看你們第二季度 3.75 億雷亞爾加上稅前利潤的指導，我知道這是指導的底部。但環比僅增加了 5000 萬雷亞爾。在第二季度，我們將看到預付卡和借記卡交換費上限的第一個影響往往是積極的。除此之外，預計中小企業、冠捷科技等將持續健康增長。

So just wondering what type of impacts could reduce your ability to have a higher EBT. Is it financial expense, more investments or any type of price reduction due to competition? Just would like to hear your thoughts about the dynamics in the next quarter. Or if you can consider that you were more conservative on that guidance. This is the first, and then I can follow up with the second.

因此，我只是想知道什麼類型的影響會降低您獲得更高息稅前利潤的能力。是財務費用、更多投資還是由於競爭而導致的任何類型的降價？只是想听聽您對下一季度動態的想法。或者，如果您認為自己對該指導意見更為保守。這是第一個，然後我可以跟進第二個。

Okay, Kaio, thank you for the question, Rafael here. So when you look to our guidance of the second quarter, you do see an implied margin expansion, while, as you said, we keep TPV growth between 19%, 20%, which we think is a healthy level. And what we have been looking for, as we have been mentioning over the last few calls is to grow with profitability. And that's what this guidance implies. We do see a positive effect from the cap, as you said in the guidance. And as you said, it's above BRL 375 million, right? So this is the floor and that's what we are comfortable at this moment in providing.

好的，Kaio，謝謝你的提問，Rafael。因此，當您查看我們第二季度的指導時，您確實會看到隱含的利潤率擴張，而正如您所說，我們將 TPV 增長率保持在 19% 至 20% 之間，我們認為這是一個健康的水平。正如我們在過去幾次電話會議中提到的那樣，我們一直在尋找的是隨著盈利能力的增長。這就是本指南的含義。正如您在指南中所說，我們確實看到了上限的積極影響。正如你所說，超過 3.75 億雷亞爾，對嗎？這就是我們目前願意提供的地板。

Of course, we'll keep discipline in growth with profitability. So we are not providing any specific guidance about the cap impact. This is net positive for us, and we believe for the whole industry so. And regarding TPV, if you look at our TPV guidance you have that the first half of this year, we should be growing TPV around 22%. We see that the industry was growing 10.7% in the first quarter. So it's a good balance between growing more than the industry, and at the same time, improving profitability and increasing the take rates.

當然，我們將保持盈利增長的紀律。因此，我們不會提供有關上限影響的任何具體指導。這對我們來說是積極的，我們相信對整個行業也是如此。至於 TPV，如果你看看我們的 TPV 指導，你會發現今年上半年，我們的 TPV 增長應該在 22% 左右。我們看到該行業第一季度增長了 10.7%。因此，在超越行業的增長和同時提高盈利能力和提高采用率之間取得了良好的平衡。

Okay. And the second one is around the key accounts, TPV, as you mentioned, it went down a lot this quarter, and you didn't break down between the sub-acquirers and platform services in order to simplify the reporting. But if you could please help us understand how much of this quarter-over-quarter drop was related to platform services and to sub-acquirers. And moreover, if you could please share us the competitive landscape in the key account segment and what we can expect in terms of TPV growth going forward.

好的。第二個是圍繞關鍵客戶冠捷科技（TPV），正如您提到的，本季度下降了很多，並且為了簡化報告，您沒有在子收單方和平台服務之間進行細分。但如果您可以的話，請幫助我們了解季度環比下降有多少與平台服務和次級收單機構有關。此外，請您與我們分享一下大客戶領域的競爭格局以及我們對冠捷未來增長的預期。

Sure. Kaio, Rafael, again. The big majority of the drop is related to sub-acquirer. So if you look at sub-acquire volumes, they have dropped very significantly both quarter-over-quarter and year-over-year. As you said, it's -- they are not relevant anymore to the company nor TPV or bottom line. That's why we decided to simplify it. And -- but overall, when we look at other key accounts, I think if you look at key accounts, players like e-commerce, those marketplaces, big retailers, it's obviously a lower-margin business versus SMBs and micro.

當然。凱奧，拉斐爾，又來了。下降的大部分與次級收單方有關。因此，如果你看一下子收購量，就會發現它們環比和同比都大幅下降。正如您所說，它們與公司、TPV 或底線不再相關。這就是我們決定簡化它的原因。但總的來說，當我們關注其他關鍵客戶時，我認為如果你關注關鍵客戶、電子商務等參與者、這些市場、大型零售商，與中小企業和微型企業相比，這顯然是利潤率較低的業務。

So it is a competitive environment in payments there. And of course, we do see opportunities there to penetrate also with software, not only with payments alone. So I think that's the main focus when we look strategically to the key accounts regarding payments.

因此，那裡的支付環境是一個競爭激烈的環境。當然，我們確實看到了軟件滲透的機會，而不僅僅是支付。因此，我認為這是我們戰略性地關注有關支付的關鍵客戶時的主要焦點。

And the next question is from Geoffrey Elliott from Autonomous.

下一個問題來自 Autonomous 的 Geoffrey Elliott。

You mentioned a couple of times the weakness in the ads business. Can you just give us a bit more detail? What does that business look like? Who are the clients? And why was it weak in the quarter?

您多次提到廣告業務的弱點。您能給我們提供更多細節嗎？該業務是什麼樣的？客戶是誰？為什麼本季度表現疲軟？

Geoffrey, this is Lia here. So our ads business is basically a portion of our digital business within Linx that is -- its nature is transactional. So it isn't -- its nature is not recurring revenues. So what that means is that our clients can have more -- larger or bigger volumes, depending on what their needs are and what their demands are. Most of the clients there are enterprise clients.

杰弗裡，這是莉亞。因此，我們的廣告業務基本上是 Linx 數字業務的一部分，即它的本質是交易性的。所以它不是——它的本質不是經常性收入。因此，這意味著我們的客戶可以擁有更多、更大或更大的數量，具體取決於他們的需求和要求。大多數客戶都是企業客戶。

And this effect that we saw this quarter was basically those enterprise clients using less ads volume as compared to last quarter. So essentially, that's a -- like we mentioned, compared to the recurring software business that we have, part of it in digital, but mostly in core software. So I think those are the main messages in our ads business.

我們本季度看到的這種影響基本上是那些企業客戶使用的廣告量比上季度減少了。所以本質上，就像我們提到的，與我們擁有的經常性軟件業務相比，其中一部分是數字業務，但主要是核心軟件業務。所以我認為這些是我們廣告業務的主要信息。

And if I could just squeeze another one in. You've talked about growing TPV faster than the industry, but what's your latest view on industry TPV growth this year?

如果我能再塞進一個的話。您談到了 TPV 的增長速度快於行業，但您對今年行業 TPV 增長的最新看法是什麼？

Yes. So like Rafa said, we saw industry growth around at 10.7% this quarter. ABAC's pointed to between 14% and 18% this year. We think it's going to be in the lower end of this range. So that's our view on the market. We have to continue to observe the numbers as they come out, but we expect on the lower end of ABAC's guidance.

是的。正如 Rafa 所說，本季度我們看到行業增長率約為 10.7%。 ABAC 預計今年的增長率將在 14% 到 18% 之間。我們認為它將處於該範圍的下限。這就是我們對市場的看法。我們必須繼續觀察公佈的數據，但我們預計 ABAC 指導值會處於較低水平。

The next question is from John Coffey from Barclays.

下一個問題來自巴克萊銀行的約翰·科菲。

So the first part I had was actually echoed or was reminiscent of the question you just had regarding the industry growth. When I think of what you're seeing or what you were expecting for the first half, I think you said around 22%. If we were to extend that out to the second half of the year, is there anything that you would caution us on? Any tough comps or anything that might be specific to Q3 or Q4 that might actually push that rate higher or lower? And the second question is, as far as key accounts go, when does the pain of the declines end? When do you get to that bottom point at which TPV starts to grow again?

因此，我的第一部分實際上是在呼應或讓人想起您剛才提出的有關行業增長的問題。當我想到你所看到的或你對上半年的預期時，我認為你說的是 22% 左右。如果我們把這個時間延長到下半年，您有什麼需要提醒我們的嗎？有任何艱難的比較或任何可能特定於第三季度或第四季度的事情，實際上可能會推高或降低該比率？第二個問題是，就大客戶而言，下滑的痛苦何時結束？何時達到 TPV 開始再次增長的最低點？

John, Rafael here. So regarding -- there's nothing that causes our attention right now that should change significantly those 20-ish percent growth levels in the MSMB TPV in the second half of the year. Of course, as we have said, we do rely on different factors and macro factors that -- like inflation and economic activity in retail that we do not control. But as of now, there is no big indication of big changes from those levels. When -- your second part of the question regarding key accounts, can you please repeat it, please?

約翰，拉斐爾在這裡。因此，目前沒有什麼引起我們注意的事情會顯著改變 MSMB TPV 下半年 20% 左右的增長水平。當然，正如我們所說，我們確實依賴於不同的因素和宏觀因素，例如我們無法控制的通脹和零售經濟活動。但截至目前，沒有明顯跡象表明這些水平會發生重大變化。關於關鍵客戶的問題的第二部分，請您重複一遍好嗎？

Yes. Well, I mean the TPV has been declining for a while. I thought a lot of that is due to lower volumes from the sub-acquirers. When does that sub-acquirer volume become negligible and then you really start to see the TPV start to grow again quarter-over-quarter or year-over-year?

是的。嗯，我的意思是 TPV 已經下降了一段時間了。我認為這很大程度上是由於子收購方的交易量減少所致。什麼時候子收購方的交易量變得可以忽略不計，然後您才真正開始看到 TPV 開始再次逐季度或逐年增長？

Oh, yes. Yes, perfect. I think that if you look at our key accounts policy in payments and TPV, of course, the sub-acquirer has declined strongly, but overall, we have been more strict in pricing in key accounts. And I think that, that policy does have some negative effect in TPV. And so I would say that the coming quarters, we should still see year-over-year growth in key accounts being sort of depressed at those levels that you see now. But of course, at the end of this year, we believe that you had and then we might see an acceleration there.

哦是的。是的，完美。我認為，如果你看看我們在支付和TPV方面的大客戶政策，當然，子收購方已經大幅下降，但總的來說，我們對大客戶的定價更加嚴格。我認為，該政策確實對冠捷產生了一些負面影響。因此，我想說，在接下來的幾個季度，我們仍然會看到主要客戶的同比增長在你現在看到的水平上有所下降。但當然，在今年年底，我們相信你已經做到了，然後我們可能會看到那裡的加速。

And the next question is from Josh Siegler from Cantor Fitzgerald.

下一個問題來自 Cantor Fitzgerald 的 Josh Siegler。

Congrats on the strong results this quarter. For my first question, I think in your prepared remarks, you mentioned being significantly lower churn on the MSMB vertical. I'm curious what some of the drivers were behind the strong retention this quarter and if you expect that to persist throughout the year.

祝賀本季度的強勁業績。對於我的第一個問題，我認為在您準備好的發言中，您提到了 MSMB 垂直領域的客戶流失率顯著降低。我很好奇本季度強勁的留存率背後的一些驅動因素是什麼，以及您是否預計這種情況會持續一整年。

Josh, Lia here. So yes, we saw a significant lower churn across all client tiers and both in Stone and TON brands. And we think that this is a trend that will continue. It's the result of the expansion of our product offering, also a greater focus on client life cycle monitoring. So we've done a lot in terms of actions towards the base. So agents visiting -- making more life cycle visits more engagement through all client life cycles.

喬什，莉亞在這裡。所以，是的，我們看到所有客戶層以及 Stone 和 TON 品牌的客戶流失率都顯著降低。我們認為這種趨勢將會持續下去。這是我們產品供應擴展的結果，也是我們更加關注客戶生命週期監控的結果。所以我們在基地行動方面做了很多工作。因此，座席拜訪——使生命週期拜訪次數增多，從而在所有客戶生命週期中增加參與度。

And also, we cannot ignore the fact that industry is much more rational, right? So that also impacts positively our churn. So those are the 3 main messages that we have regarding churn trends, and we think that these trends are going to continue.

而且，我們不能忽視這樣一個事實：工業更加理性，對嗎？因此，這也會對我們的客戶流失產生積極影響。這些是我們關於客戶流失趨勢的 3 個主要信息，我們認為這些趨勢將持續下去。

Understood. That's very helpful color. And then for my follow-up, I'm curious how you're thinking about sizing the opportunities to continue to cross-sell the banking solutions to TON customers. Do you expect increased acceleration in banking active clients as you roll out the new Super Conta Ton product?

明白了。這是非常有用的顏色。然後，對於我的後續行動，我很好奇您如何考慮繼續向 TON 客戶交叉銷售銀行解決方案的機會。當您推出新的 Super Conta Ton 產品時，您是否預計銀行活躍客戶會加速增長？

Yes, Josh, great question there. Just to give some color on this. There was a big incremental contribution this quarter because not only we grew Super Conta Ton, the new TON clients, but we also migrated clients that had the simple wallet to the full banking solution, right? So I think what we can say looking ahead is that every single TON clients will have both in acquiring and a banking solution, so growth in Super Conta Ton will be in line with growth in TON itself.

是的，喬什，這是個好問題。只是為了對此提供一些顏色。本季度有很大的增量貢獻，因為我們不僅發展了 Super Conta Ton（新的 TON 客戶端），而且還將擁有簡單錢包的客戶端遷移到完整的銀行解決方案，對嗎？因此，我認為我們可以說，展望未來，每個 TON 客戶都將同時擁有收單和銀行解決方案，因此 Super Conta Ton 的增長將與 TON 本身的增長保持一致。

And I think another important comment, just to also emphasize this, that's also the reality in Stone products, right? So as much as it's not a bundle where 100% of the clients actually use acquiring banking in Stone. We have a very high penetration of banking solutions to acquiring clients in Stone as well. So that's also going to drive growth in banking clients looking ahead.

我認為另一個重要的評論，只是為了強調這一點，這也是 Stone 產品的現實，對吧？因此，儘管並不是 100% 的客戶實際使用 Stone 中的收單銀行服務的捆綁包。我們在 Stone 的收購客戶方面也擁有非常高的銀行解決方案滲透率。因此，這也將推動未來銀行客戶的增長。

And the next question will be from James Friedman from Susquehanna.

下一個問題將由來自薩斯奎哈納的詹姆斯·弗里德曼提出。

Yes, it's Jamie here from Susquehanna. A question for Lia, about Slide 14, the software strategy layout. I was just wondering if you could step back and say, at a higher level, how the strategy articulated in Slide 14 has changed now versus when you originally acquired Linx. What's -- I know the world changes, but what's -- how are you thinking about it now? And what may have changed your thinking in that process?

是的，我是來自薩斯奎哈納的傑米。問 Lia 一個關於幻燈片 14 的問題，即軟件策略佈局。我只是想知道您是否可以退後一步，從更高的層面來說，與您最初收購 Linx 時相比，幻燈片 14 中闡述的戰略現在發生了怎樣的變化。我知道世界在改變，但是你現在怎麼想？在此過程中，什麼可能改變了您的想法？

Thanks, Jamie. I'm going to take this question first and then maybe pass it over to Pedro also to hear his thoughts. I think we've always believe very strongly in the opportunity to combine software and financial services, right? We are intensifying our integration efforts this year. I think the reason is about focus, right? Perhaps there wasn't such a big focus before.

謝謝，傑米。我將首先回答這個問題，然後也許會將其傳遞給佩德羅，聽聽他的想法。我認為我們一直非常堅信將軟件和金融服務結合起來的機會，對吧？今年我們正在加大整合力度。我認為原因在於專注，對嗎？也許之前並沒有這麼大的關注點。

We mentioned many times that in 2021, there was all the issues with credit, and then we really started sort of focusing a lot on the overall turnaround of the business last year and changing the management system. Of course, that was true for financial services platform and for software platform. But now we're really putting a lot more emphasis on the integration efforts.

我們多次提到，2021 年，信貸出現了所有問題，然後我們才真正開始關注去年業務的整體扭虧為盈，並改變管理體系。當然，金融服務平台和軟件平台都是如此。但現在我們確實更加重視整合工作。

And so strategically, the thought is the same. I think it's just about how we're prioritizing and where we're putting the focus. And I would say around the integration, our focus is really threefold, right? Number one is around back office. We already did a lot on that last year, but I think that there's still a lot of work to be done. Pedro talked a little bit about this already. The second is really on product integration and integrated offerings. So a lot of our effort last year was around product integration.

因此，從戰略上講，想法是相同的。我認為這只是關於我們如何確定優先順序以及我們將重點放在哪裡。我想說，圍繞整合，我們的重點實際上有三個，對嗎？第一個是後台辦公室。去年我們已經在這方面做了很多工作，但我認為還有很多工作要做。佩德羅已經談過這一點了。第二個真正是關於產品集成和集成產品。因此，我們去年的很多努力都是圍繞產品集成進行的。

Now we're shifting to really think from the client perspective, how we can really build the best combined offering of software and integrated payments and financial services. And the third is really around go-to-market and how do we really incentivize and coordinate our go-to-market efforts, both in financial services and software so that we maximize this combination, right? So I think it's more about the how as opposed to the what. The strategic rationale hasn't really changed. But I think we've changed a little bit how we've been focusing on the initiatives. Pedro, do you want to comment.

現在，我們正在轉向真正從客戶的角度思考，我們如何才能真正構建最佳的軟件、集成支付和金融服務組合產品。第三個問題實際上是圍繞市場進入，我們如何真正激勵和協調我們在金融服務和軟件方面的進入市場努力，以便我們最大限度地發揮這種組合，對吧？所以我認為更多的是如何而不是什麼。戰略理由並沒有真正改變。但我認為我們已經稍微改變了我們關注這些舉措的方式。佩德羅，你想發表評論嗎？

Yes. I think -- if I might add, I think one of the points that Lia raised is really -- my view is the key reason, which is focus. But another point that is really important is that we do believe that the opportunities within the software business are huge, right? If Linx clients sell around BRL 0.5 trillion, which is equivalent to 5% of Brazil's GDP, and we still have a low penetration of payments and financial services into those clients.

是的。我認為——如果我可以補充的話，我認為利亞提出的觀點之一確實是——我的觀點是關鍵原因，那就是焦點。但另一點非常重要的是，我們確實相信軟件行業的機會是巨大的，對吧？如果 Linx 客戶出售約 5 萬億巴西雷亞爾，相當於巴西 GDP 的 5%，我們對這些客戶的支付和金融服務滲透率仍然較低。

So we haven't put all the effort and the focus we needed if that offering the integrated solutions will bring a very differentiated value proposition to our clients. And I think there is another point that it should be highlighted, is we may optimize capital allocation within the software business, really trying to focus on select that are more strategic to us.

因此，如果提供集成解決方案將為我們的客戶帶來非常差異化的價值主張，我們還沒有投入所需的所有努力和關注。我認為還有一點應該強調，我們可以優化軟件業務內的資本配置，真正嘗試專注於對我們更具戰略意義的選擇。

And the next question is from Mario Pierry from Bank of America.

下一個問題來自美國銀行的 Mario Pierry。

Let me ask the first question on -- during your speech, you talked a lot about cost discipline and expense control. Can you talk about some of the measures that you're taking and help us quantify the benefits of these measures? And I ask because when we look at your headcount, it's much larger than some of your peers. And we have seen some of your peers reducing headcount. So indirectly, I'm asking if there are any plans to reduce headcount or what are any initiatives that you have to control costs? And then I'll ask the second question.

讓我問第一個問題——在您的演講中，您談到了很多關於成本紀律和費用控制的問題。您能否談談您正在採取的一些措施並幫助我們量化這些措施的好處？我之所以這麼問，是因為當我們查看你們的員工人數時，會發現它比你們的一些同行要多得多。我們已經看到一些同行減少了員工人數。因此，我間接地問，是否有任何減少員工人數的計劃，或者您有哪些控製成本的舉措？然後我會問第二個問題。

Mario, Rafael here. Thank you for the question. So I think there are many initiatives that we have been implementing in the company. We have created, for example, a shared service center, which tends to incorporate more activities in the future and bring back office gains. We are also focused on structural efficiency improvements, technology, platformization of the business.

馬里奧，拉斐爾在這裡。感謝你的提問。所以我認為我們公司已經實施了很多舉措。例如，我們創建了一個共享服務中心，該中心往往會在未來納入更多活動並帶來後台收益。我們還專注於結構效率改進、技術和業務平台化。

I think that if you look at the headcount, and I think Pedro can talk a little bit about this, there is a business model thing, which when you compare to other companies, our business model is more verticalized. So part of what other companies might outsource, we do internally in-house, and that all, of course, reflects in our headcount.

我認為，如果你看看員工人數，我認為佩德羅可以談談這個，有一個商業模式的事情，當你與其他公司相比時，我們的商業模式更加垂直化。因此，其他公司可能外包的部分工作，我們是在內部完成的，當然，這一切都反映在我們的員工人數上。

But as we have mentioned last, in last earnings call, we do expect administrative expenses to go below inflation this year. So I would say that we are working towards more structural measures, we have different measures in operational efficiency in customer service, logistics and technology, cloud costs, so on and so forth, so. But I would say that the headcount reflects a big part of the difference is business model difference versus other areas. Pedro, do you want to add?

但正如我們在上次財報電話會議中提到的那樣，我們確實預計今年的管理費用將低於通貨膨脹率。所以我想說，我們正在努力採取更多的結構性措施，我們在客戶服務、物流和技術、云成本等方面的運營效率方面有不同的措施。但我想說，員工數量反映了很大一部分差異是商業模式與其他領域的差異。佩德羅，你想補充一下嗎？

Yes. I think one point that is really important to highlight, you mentioned in terms of KPIs and so forth. I think last year, there was a huge effort put in place and within the process, you had the package owners for the main expenses within the company. So that brought us visibility in terms of where we should attack, how we should attack and when we should attack in terms of streamlining expenses and actually having better control as we move ahead and set the company for its growth strategy.

是的。我認為有一點非常重要，您在 KPI 等方面提到過。我認為去年，我們付出了巨大的努力，在此過程中，公司內部的主要費用由包所有者承擔。因此，這讓我們清楚地知道應該在哪裡進攻、如何進攻以及何時應該進攻，從而精簡開支，並在我們前進並為公司製定增長戰略時實際上擁有更好的控制力。

In terms of headcount, I think I mentioned at the beginning of the call that we're really setting the stage to position Stone throughout 2030. And so we have to make sure that we have the right people at the right roles to build a fit-for-purpose organization, as I mentioned before. So having the ZBB tool in place and understanding where we want to be over the next couple of years, will be an important tool in terms of how we manage headcount as we move ahead.

就員工人數而言，我想我在電話會議一開始就提到過，我們確實正在為 2030 年的 Stone 定位做好準備。因此，我們必須確保我們有合適的人員擔任合適的角色，以建立一個合適的團隊。 -有目的的組織，正如我之前提到的。因此，擁有 ZBB 工具並了解我們未來幾年的目標，將成為我們在前進過程中如何管理員工數量的重要工具。

All we want to do kind of -- how can I say -- back and forth review in terms of headcount filing in hiring people. So it's really building a fit-for-purpose organization as we move ahead, right?

我們想要做的就是——我怎麼說——在招聘人員的人數申報方面進行來回審查。因此，隨著我們的前進，這確實是在建立一個適合目標的組織，對吧？

Okay. My second question then, let me change the subject a little bit, focus on your funding costs. Can you talk about your ability to tap third-party funding, given recent events in Brazil? How are you seeing the market?

好的。那麼我的第二個問題，讓我稍微改變一下話題，關註一下你的資金成本。鑑於巴西最近發生的事件，您能談談您利用第三方資金的能力嗎？您如何看待市場？

Mario, so we are not seeing problems in tapping funding sources, especially because the company has been generating cash, increasing liquidity. So we have a very robust balance sheet. So we are not seeing any problems there. We did see in the industry a very slight increase in funding cost that as you can see, it was not anything that reflected in our P&L. So we are -- we have different funding sources in the company, and we believe that those will be even more diversified, I mean, in the coming future. So it's not something that worries us.

馬里奧，所以我們在利用資金來源方面沒有看到問題，特別是因為該公司一直在產生現金，增加流動性。因此，我們擁有非常穩健的資產負債表。所以我們沒有看到任何問題。我們確實看到該行業的融資成本略有增加，正如您所看到的，這並沒有反映在我們的損益表中。所以我們——我們公司有不同的資金來源，我的意思是，我們相信在未來這些資金來源將更加多元化。所以這不是我們擔心的事情。

Okay. And Rafa, if you can just remind us your sensitivity to a lower rate environment. What would be the impact of 100 basis points reduction in FIDC assuming all else, e-com?

好的。還有拉法，請您提醒我們您對較低利率環境的敏感性。假設所有其他因素（電子商務），FIDC 減少 100 個基點會產生什麼影響？

Mario, so I think that this question is hard to answer because there could be like a theoretical answer that consider ceteris paribus. But we know that when rates change, the commercial dynamics might change as well. So we don't like to provide a specific guidance around that sensitivity. If you look at our interest rates -- our financial expenses, sorry, they have been evolving over time basically with TPV and CDI. So you can pretty much do a simple math on where they are today.

馬里奧，所以我認為這個問題很難回答，因為在其他條件不變的情況下可能會有一個理論上的答案。但我們知道，當利率發生變化時，商業動態也可能發生變化。因此，我們不想針對這種敏感性提供具體指導。如果你看看我們的利率——我們的財務費用，抱歉，它們基本上隨著時間的推移隨著 TPV 和 CDI 的變化而變化。所以你幾乎可以對他們今天的處境做一個簡單的數學計算。

And if CDI decreases, you'll see a percentage decrease there. But of course, it is a net positive for us if rates decrease, but it's very hard for us to say a number because we would otherwise assume that commercial activity in competitive environment will be the same. We do believe that players would not rush to decrease prices and it's really hard for us to guarantee that. So if you look at our financial expenses, a little over BRL 900 million with CDI almost 14%, you can do some math there and see, it's 100 bps is relevant, in fact.

如果 CDI 下降，您會看到百分比下降。當然，如果利率下降，這對我們來說是一個淨積極因素，但我們很難說出一個數字，因為否則我們會假設競爭環境中的商業活動將是相同的。我們確實相信玩家不會急於降價，但我們確實很難保證這一點。因此，如果你看看我們的財務支出，略高於 9 億雷亞爾，CDI 幾乎為 14%，你可以在那裡做一些數學計算，看看，事實上，100 個基點是相關的。

Okay. So -- but basically, you're saying that it depends on how your competitors are going to behave, not necessarily -- so it doesn't mean that you are going to be the first mover in case if rates come down, that first mover in reducing prices.

好的。所以 - 但基本上，你說這取決於你的競爭對手將如何表現，而不一定 - 所以這並不意味著你將成為第一個行動者，以防利率下降，首先降低價格的推動者。

Yes, Mario. So we will not be first movers in bringing down prices. I think that -- and of course, we do have our internal hurdles, our internal return goals. It's not 100% reliant on what our competitors will do, but we do look at competition and environment to decide what we're going to do. But this is not something that we'll do proactively bringing down prices if rates come down.

是的，馬里奧。因此，我們不會成為降低價格的先行者。我認為——當然，我們確實有內部障礙，我們的內部回報目標。它並不是 100% 依賴於我們的競爭對手會做什麼，但我們確實會考慮競爭和環境來決定我們要做什麼。但如果利率下降，我們不會主動降低價格。

And the next question will be Neha Agarwala from HSBC.

下一個問題是來自匯豐銀行的 Neha Agarwala。

First, on the software business, if I understood correctly, you mentioned that you've not been able to penetrate the large clients that have come from Linx and that presents a huge opportunity for you to cross-sell your payment services to them. Why -- I mean it's been a while since you integrated Linx. I thought it would be an easier opportunity, a low-hanging fruit to cross-sell your payments business to the Linx clients versus bringing the software expertise from Linx to your SMB segment. So why haven't you been able to integrate that part?

首先，關於軟件業務，如果我理解正確的話，您提到您無法滲透到來自 Linx 的大客戶，這為您向他們交叉銷售支付服務提供了巨大的機會。為什麼——我的意思是您集成 Linx 已經有一段時間了。我認為，與將 Linx 的軟件專業知識引入您的中小型企業部門相比，將您的支付業務交叉銷售給 Linx 客戶將是一個更容易、更容易實現的機會。那麼為什麼你不能整合那部分呢？

And that's related to my question on TPV as well.

這也與我關于冠捷的問題有關。

So the TPV growth has been almost twice that of the industry as a whole. What are the reasons for this strong growth? Whom are you gaining market share in the SME segment from because with most of your peers when we talk to them and we see the numbers, they are mostly close to the low teens in terms of TPV growth. So what is driving the strong growth in terms of your TPV?

因此冠捷的增長幾乎是整個行業的兩倍。這種強勁增長的原因是什麼？您從誰那裡獲得了中小企業領域的市場份額，因為當我們與您的大多數同行交談並看到數字時，他們的 TPV 增長大多接近十幾歲以下。那麼是什麼推動了您的 TPV 的強勁增長呢？

Has there been some contribution from growth in larger accounts, which might have led to the stronger TPV growth? If you could shed some light in case there's a change in mix. And then I'll ask my next question.

大客戶的增長是否做出了一些貢獻，這可能導致了 TPV 的更強勁增長？如果您能透露一些信息，以防混合發生變化。然後我會問下一個問題。

Thank you, Neha. Your question cut a little bit in the middle, but I think I got it all. Let me take it and then if there's anything missing, let me know, okay? So I think your first question was payments in financial services penetration within Linx clients and where our focus is. So our focus is really on the middle of the pyramid. I think that's the best way to describe it. Those are medium and a little bit the upper tier of SMBs, right, the larger small clients and the medium clients and a little bit of large clients as well. That's where we see the biggest fit in terms of offering both the offerings that we have on the financial services side as well as the product portfolios that Linx has.

謝謝你，尼哈。你的問題有點中肯，但我想我已經明白了。讓我拿走，如果有什麼遺漏，請告訴我，好嗎？因此，我認為您的第一個問題是金融服務在 Linx 客戶中的滲透率以及我們的重點在哪裡。所以我們的重點實際上是在金字塔的中間。我認為這是描述它的最好方式。這些是中型和稍上層的中小企業，對吧，較大的小型客戶和中型客戶以及一些大型客戶。這就是我們認為最適合提供金融服務方面的產品以及 Linx 擁有的產品組合的地方。

So just to clarify this point, our focus really is -- the initial focus really is on cross-selling financial services to software clients. But there's actually a convergence in terms of our strategy when we consider software and financial services because Linx is very highly penetrated already on the very large clients and the opportunity for us to grow in software itself is going lower in the pyramid, right, going to the medium of the pyramid with software.

因此，為了澄清這一點，我們的重點實際上是——最初的重點實際上是向軟件客戶交叉銷售金融服務。但當我們考慮軟件和金融服務時，我們的戰略實際上是趨同的，因為 Linx 已經在非常大的客戶中具有非常高的滲透率，而我們在軟件本身方面的增長機會在金字塔的較低位置，對吧，去金字塔的媒介是軟件。

But that's going to be -- continue to be done through Linx's channels, Linx's franchise channels, and Linx's inbound channels. So there's a convergence there. I think that's the important message regarding software and where we're looking at in terms of cross-sell.

但這將繼續通過 Linx 渠道、Linx 特許經營渠道和 Linx 入站渠道來完成。所以那裡有一個融合。我認為這是關於軟件以及我們正在考慮交叉銷售的重要信息。

I think on your TPV question, message is we take market share from pretty much every competitor, right? And we have actually pretty granular view of who we're taking market share from, in which client tiers and in which regions. Of course, the dynamic changes a little bit region by region and tier by tier, but the message is we take market share from all competitors, right? And the growth in TPV trends that we see is both driven by our growth in the micro segment, that was also a big driver of net adds in the quarter. But let's remember that our strategy within the hub has been to focus on larger SMB clients, right? So more and more, we're shifting our hub strategy to look at the top tier of the SMB segment, and we're seeing pretty healthy growth there, and that's driving TPV growth. Did I get all your questions?

我認為，關於您的冠捷科技問題，傳達的信息是我們從幾乎所有競爭對手那里奪取了市場份額，對嗎？事實上，我們對我們從誰那里奪取市場份額、在哪些客戶層以及在哪些地區有非常詳細的了解。當然，動態會隨著地區和層級的不同而略有變化，但傳達的信息是我們從所有競爭對手那里奪取了市場份額，對嗎？我們看到的 TPV 趨勢的增長是由我們在微型細分市場的增長推動的，這也是本季度淨增長的一大推動力。但請記住，我們在該中心的策略是專注於較大的中小型企業客戶，對嗎？因此，我們越來越多地將中心戰略轉向中小企業細分市場的頂層，我們看到那里相當健康的增長，這正在推動冠捷的增長。我收到你所有的問題了嗎？

Yes. Yes, Lia, largely. So there has been some move upmarket, not particularly large accounts. but maybe somewhere in between the large accounts and the SMB. So more higher-tier SMBs. That's the focus.

是的。是的，莉亞，很大程度上。因此，已經有一些向高端市場轉移，但不是特別大的客戶。但可能介於大型客戶和中小企業之間。所以更多的高層中小企業。這就是重點。

Yes, exactly. Higher tiers within SMB, exactly.

對，就是這樣。確切地說，是中小企業內的更高層。

Okay. My second question is on the credit. So we finally see you piloting your credit product. You mentioned that you've been fully debated it with the receivables registry. Could you talk a bit about that as to is the registered receivables fully operational? Is there a complete transparency in terms of data and do all the registries communicate with each other?

好的。我的第二個問題是關於信用的。所以我們終於看到您試用您的信貸產品。您提到您已經與應收賬款登記處進行了充分的辯論。您能否談談登記的應收賬款是否完全可操作？數據是否完全透明，所有註冊管理機構是否相互溝通？

And secondly, on -- what other -- has it been integrated with the hubs? And what are the other product changes that we can see in the coming quarters? And when do you think you can fully launch it.

其次，它還與集線器集成在什麼方面？未來幾個季度我們可以看到哪些其他產品變化？您認為什麼時候可以完全啟動它？

Yes. Neha, great questions about credit. Let me start with your question on the registry. So the message is with this initial group of clients, we already did them with the integration to the registry system working. It's working, but we're using it as an extra data point, not as a single mechanism of collateral. I think that's an important message. And regarding on your question of how we're involving the hubs, this is something that we're starting to test the level of involvement of the hubs in the current life cycle of our clients.

是的。 Neha，關於信用的好問題。讓我從您關於註冊表的問題開始。因此，我們向這批最初的客戶傳達的信息是，我們已經將他們與註冊表系統的集成工作完成了。它正在發揮作用，但我們將其用作額外的數據點，而不是作為單一的抵押品機制。我認為這是一個重要的信息。關於您關於我們如何讓中心參與的問題，我們正在開始測試中心在客戶當前生命週期中的參與程度。

Initially, we have been distributing the product mostly digitally, but remember the whole group of clients still. And so we're running several tests. In terms of the involvement of agents in the credit life cycle overall, we think that we have a very big edge to leverage there, but the way in which we're going to do it is still a learning process.

最初，我們主要以數字方式分發產品，但仍然記住整個客戶群。所以我們正在運行一些測試。就代理人參與整個信貸生命週期而言，我們認為我們在這方面擁有很大的優勢，但我們要做的方式仍然是一個學習過程。

And the next question is from Soomit Datta from New Street Research.

下一個問題來自 New Street Research 的 Soomit Datta。

A couple of questions, please. One, just on the balance sheet. There's a nice slide in the deck showing cash position just steadily rising and, obviously, the business is moving into greater profitability. So how are you thinking about use of cash going forward as that number presumably continues to inflate? Are there any acquisition opportunities you would be considering at this time?

請教幾個問題。一，僅在資產負債表上。甲板上有一張漂亮的幻燈片，顯示現金狀況正在穩步上升，顯然，該業務正在轉向更高的盈利能力。那麼，隨著這個數字可能繼續膨脹，您如何考慮未來現金的使用？您目前會考慮任何收購機會嗎？

That's the first question, please. And then just a quick follow-up, if I could, just back to industry TPV. I know it's come up a couple of times. Just curious, the 10.7% growth is a little bit softer than we were looking for. As you look through to the rest of the year, would you expect that to increase? Are there any kind of comps that you can think of, which would be impacting that? And I say that because it feels like in the context of the kind of cash to digital shift, it's not as impressive as it might be. So just curious your thoughts there.

這是第一個問題，請。然後，如果可以的話，我會快速跟進，回到 TPV 行業。我知道它已經出現過幾次了。只是好奇，10.7% 的增長比我們預期的要慢一些。展望今年剩餘時間，您預計這一數字會增加嗎？您能想到有什麼類型的比較會對此產生影響嗎？我這麼說是因為感覺就像是在現金向數字化轉變的背景下，它並沒有想像中那麼令人印象深刻。所以只是好奇你的想法。

Thank you for the question, Soomit. Rafael here. So regarding your first part of the question, we do have a strong balance sheet, as I said, BRL 4 billion in adjusted net cash. This enables us to have flexibility to grow faster whenever we want and to invest in different fronts of the business. One of the -- as we have been mentioning for a couple of calls already, one of the use of that cash is to reduce a little bit of the debt that we have in the balance sheet, as you can see over time. That's why financial expenses, they have stopped increasing a lot mid-last year, but we also look very carefully capital allocation opportunities. And of course, it's better to have that flexibility.

謝謝你的提問，蘇米特。拉斐爾在這裡。因此，關於問題的第一部分，我們確實擁有強大的資產負債表，正如我所說，調整後的淨現金為 40 億雷亞爾。這使我們能夠隨時靈活地實現更快的增長，並投資於業務的不同領域。其中之一 - 正如我們已經在幾次電話會議中提到的那樣，現金的用途之一是減少我們資產負債表中的一點債務，正如您隨著時間的推移所看到的那樣。這就是為什麼財務費用在去年年中已經停止增加很多，但我們也非常仔細地尋找資本配置機會。當然，最好具有這種靈活性。

One other element here is environment scenario, any more uncertain macro scenario, we do have cash to keep growing the business. For example, in the pandemics, we had our prepayment business working during even the worst week of pandemics because we have flexibility and cash on hand. So I think that's sort of a policy of the company. And we're closely looking to different capital allocation opportunities with a lot of discipline.

這裡的另一個因素是環境情景，任何更加不確定的宏觀情景，我們確實有現金來保持業務增長。例如，在大流行病中，即使在大流行病最嚴重的一周，我們也能開展預付款業務，因為我們擁有靈活性和手頭現金。所以我認為這是公司的一項政策。我們正在密切關注不同的資本配置機會，並嚴格遵守紀律。

Regarding the industry, I think that 11% growth sort of is coherent with our view that the industry growth in the year should be more closer to the bottom of the range of what the ABAC Association guided to, which is 14%. So I think that's hard for us to estimate for the whole year, but it's close to the bottom range. So it's not something that calls our attention.

關於行業，我認為 11% 的增長與我們的觀點一致，即今年的行業增長應該更接近 ABAC 協會指導範圍的底部，即 14%。所以我認為我們很難估計全年的情況，但它接近底部範圍。所以這不是引起我們注意的事情。

And just to reinforce one point, Soomit, having said that, this is for the industry, right? When we look at our TPV as we have guided, it's running a little over 20% in the first half of this year. And we expect that those growth levels should continue to be above industry this year. Of course, looking at pricing discipline, always not growing by growing rate.

只是為了強調一點，Soomit，話雖如此，這是針對整個行業的，對吧？當我們按照我們的指導來查看 TPV 時，今年上半年的運行速度略高於 20%。我們預計今年的增長水平應繼續高於行業水平。當然，從定價紀律來看，總是不會以增長率增長。

And the next question will be from Pedro Leduc from Itaú BBA.

下一個問題將來自 Itaú BBA 的 Pedro Leduc。

A little bit on financial -- sorry, on pricing dynamics. So this quarter, we saw a little bit the last rounds that you guys have implemented when you look at your take rate. If you've noticed some competitors moving recently, some are saying they're moving up. Hence, if you're seeing room for maybe another round there given the lower churn that you mentioned. And if in 2Q, we should see a little more pricing effects or just the better take rate coming from the interchange cap.

一點關於金融的——抱歉，關於定價動態。因此，本季度，當您查看採用率時，我們看到了你們實施的最後幾輪。如果您注意到一些競爭對手最近有所變動，有些人會說他們正在晉升。因此，考慮到您提到的較低的流失率，如果您認為可能還有另一輪的空間。如果在第二季度，我們應該會看到更多的定價效應，或者只是來自互換上限的更好的採用率。

Thank you, Pedro. Rafael here. I think that we did reprice clients in the first quarter. We do expect to reprice clients in the second quarter. I think this is a continuous process of pricing optimization. It's not -- as I said before, it's not a big price change as we saw in the beginning of last year to adjust for higher interest rates in the country, but it's a continuous optimization process that we do see opportunities to optimize prices further.

謝謝你，佩德羅。拉斐爾在這裡。我認為我們在第一季度確實對客戶重新定價。我們確實預計在第二季度對客戶重新定價。我認為這是一個持續的定價優化過程。正如我之前所說，這並不是我們去年初看到的為了適應該國較高利率而進行的重大價格變化，而是一個持續的優化過程，我們確實看到了進一步優化價格的機會。

As I said, there is the gap of prepaid cards. This also helps in the take rate. So I think that the message here is very disciplined pricing policy and a balance between growth and profitability that we think is healthy.

正如我所說，預付卡存在差距。這也有助於提高采納率。因此，我認為這里傳達的信息是非常嚴格的定價政策以及我們認為健康的增長和盈利能力之間的平衡。

And thinking back a bit on that, of course, impressive guidance for the upcoming second quarter. But you also have been beating guidance at least 3 quarters that I remember it. Things have been ending up better than what you see mid-quarter. How should we think about that a bit? Again, it is a strong figure for 2Q. I'm just wondering if what is an upside scenario like we've been seeing consistently beating it.

當然，回想一下這一點，對即將到來的第二季度的指導令人印象深刻。但據我所知，您至少有三個季度的表現都超出了預期。事情的結局比你在季度中期看到的要好。我們應該如何思考這一點？同樣，第二季度的數據也很強勁。我只是想知道是否有像我們一直看到的那樣的上行情況。

Yes, Pedro. So when we look -- when we define the guidance, we look at the forecast we have for the quarter. We see potential deviations around that, both the upside or downside and we try to provide a number to the market that we are confident in achieving. Of course, there's always upside on the number. But of course, macro scenarios that we don't control -- so I think that the idea is really to be precise given the timing of the macro scenario involved in our results that we cannot control. So Pedro, do you want to add?

是的，佩德羅。因此，當我們定義指導時，我們會查看本季度的預測。我們看到了圍繞這一點的潛在偏差，無論是上行還是下行，我們試圖向市場提供一個我們有信心實現的數字。當然，這個數字總是有上升空間的。但當然，我們無法控制宏觀情景——所以我認為，考慮到我們無法控制的結果所涉及的宏觀情景的時間安排，這個想法確實是準確的。那麼佩德羅，你想補充一下嗎？

Yes. I think in terms of the guidance, I think it's important to highlight that we do not expect to change our policy of quarterly guidance in the next quarter. However, in the future, we do plan to provide a longer-term perspective of the business rather than a quarterly number, which we believe is more aligned with our long-term value creation strategy.

是的。我認為就指導而言，我認為重要的是要強調我們預計不會在下一季度改變我們的季度指導政策。然而，未來我們確實計劃提供業務的長期視角，而不是季度數據，我們認為這更符合我們的長期價值創造戰略。

And the next question is from Nicolas Riva from Bank of America.

下一個問題來自美國銀行的 Nicolas Riva。

A few questions on your debt going back to Mario's questions. So I appreciate your comments about saying that you continue to see access to be able to tap funding sources. But I did see that in the quarter, your debt with the FIDC is declined a bit over BRL 300 million in the quarter, and it's been down even more over the last year. So if you can comment on your access to financing in the FIDC market?

關於你的債務的幾個問題回到馬里奧的問題。因此，我感謝您關於繼續看到能夠利用資金來源的評論。但我確實看到，在本季度，您在 FIDC 的債務下降了略多於 3 億雷亞爾，而且比去年下降得更多。那麼您能否評論一下您在 FIDC 市場的融資渠道？

And maybe the reason why we are seeing less FIDC event in the balance sheet is because you're using more off-balance sheet financing where you do not keep equity stakes in the FIDC. And then also a similar question on your bank debt. If I look at your short-term bank debt, it declined by about BRL 500 million in the quarter. So if you can comment a bit on your access also to bank financing after the dip of Americanas and also many other distressed Brazilian corporate train now. And then we have a separate question.

也許我們在資產負債表中看到較少 FIDC 事件的原因是您使用了更多的表外融資，而您沒有保留 FIDC 的股權。還有一個關於您的銀行債務的類似問題。如果我看一下你們的短期銀行債務，本季度減少了約 5 億雷亞爾。因此，您能否評論一下您在美洲股市下跌後獲得銀行融資的情況以及許多其他陷入困境的巴西企業現在的情況。然後我們有一個單獨的問題。

Thank you, Nicolas. Rafael here. So I think that the effect that you see, as I said, when someone asked about the allocation of cash, is part of that is because we are increasing cash generation, right? And we are using part of that to both amortize the FIDC that you mentioned and also short-term debt. Remember that in the first quarter, we did sell our stake in Banco Inter for BRL 218 million, so they help the BRL 0.5 billion increase in adjusted net cash. So I think that this has nothing to do to access to funding lines, but rather cash on hand with a good capital allocation to reduce leverage and reduce debt given where interest rates are.

謝謝你，尼古拉斯。拉斐爾在這裡。所以我認為，正如我所說，當有人詢問現金分配時，你看到的效果部分是因為我們正在增加現金生成，對嗎？我們正在使用其中的一部分來攤銷您提到的 FIDC 和短期債務。請記住，在第一季度，我們確實以 2.18 億雷亞爾的價格出售了國際銀行的股份，因此它們幫助調整後的淨現金增加了 5 億雷亞爾。因此，我認為這與獲得融資額度無關，而是與手頭現金和良好的資本配置有關，以在利率水平的情況下降低杠桿並減少債務。

Okay. And then my other question is on your financial expense. So in the income statement, you booked a very large amount of financial expense, a bit over BRL 900 million a quarter or about BRL 3.7 billion over the last 12 months. But if I compare that with your total debt size, if I include the 2028 bonds, bank loans, FIDC debt and deposits for the banking product, I get BRL 8.5 billion in total debt at the end of March. I'm not including the payables to the merchants.

好的。我的另一個問題是關於你的財務費用。因此，在損益表中，您記入了大量財務費用，每個季度略高於 9 億雷亞爾，或者在過去 12 個月內約為 37 億雷亞爾。但如果我將其與您的總債務規模進行比較，如果我包括 2028 年債券、銀行貸款、FIDC 債務和銀行產品存款，那麼到 3 月底我的總債務為 85 億雷亞爾。我不包括應付商家的款項。

So again, about BRL 3.7 billion in financial expense in a year compared to BRL 8.5 billion in total debt. It seems a very large amount of financial expense I believe this -- the financial expense you book in the P&L also includes some of the noncash discount on receivables sold to FIDC but if you can tell us why that's the case. Why such a large amount of financial expense in the P&L compared to your debt side?

同樣，一年的財務費用約為 37 億雷亞爾，而總債務為 85 億雷亞爾。我相信這似乎是一筆非常大的財務費用——您在損益表中登記的財務費用還包括出售給 FIDC 的應收賬款的一些非現金折扣，但如果您能告訴我們為什麼會這樣。與您的債務相比，為什麼損益表中的財務費用如此之大？

Thank you, Nicolas, for the question. Very good question. I think it's good to clarify. So whenever we sell receivables, card receivables and transform them into cash, we incur in financial expenses, right? So if you look at our adjusted net cash position, that's why we look both as an asset and card payables as liabilities. We still have a surplus of we have more receivables than payables. And it's basically our option to convert them into cash as this is a very liquid market. To help investors understand that dynamics we have provided -- started providing in our financial statements in Note 16, the breakdown of our financial expenses. How much of it comes from sale of receivables how much of it is interest related to that, that you see in our balance sheet. So I think that is very detailed there.

謝謝尼古拉斯提出的問題。非常好的問題。我認為澄清一下很好。那麼每當我們出售應收賬款、卡應收賬款並將其轉化為現金時，我們就會產生財務費用，對嗎？因此，如果你看看我們調整後的淨現金頭寸，這就是為什麼我們將應付賬款視為資產，將信用卡應付賬款視為負債。我們仍然有盈餘，因為我們的應收賬款多於應付賬款。基本上我們可以選擇將其轉換為現金，因為這是一個流動性非常強的市場。為了幫助投資者了解我們提供的動態，我們開始在附註 16 的財務報表中提供財務費用的明細。其中有多少來自應收賬款的銷售，有多少是與此相關的利息，您可以在我們的資產負債表中看到。所以我認為那裡非常詳細。

And this is basically the dynamics, which is important to remind everyone, is that whenever we sell receivables and we incur financial expenses, we decided every day how -- if we want to incur those expenses are not based on the spreads we have in our prepayment business. So we incur in financial expenses, but we have financial income related to those expenses that are appropriate for us in terms of returns. So it's not something that we are -- we have those financial expenses at any cost. We'll only incur them if we think the spreads are attractive and you'll see the net result in our P&L as an attractive one.

這基本上就是動態，重要的是要提醒大家，每當我們出售應收賬款並產生財務費用時，我們每天都會決定如何——如果我們想承擔這些費用，而不是基於我們的利差預付款業務。因此，我們產生了財務費用，但我們有與這些費用相關的財務收入，這些費用在回報方面適合我們。所以這不是我們的事——我們不惜一切代價承擔這些財務費用。只有當我們認為點差具有吸引力並且您會在我們的損益表中看到最終結果具有吸引力時，我們才會承擔這些費用。

And maybe just one last follow-up on this subject. Would you have kind of a proxy or I guess, ballpark for your cash? So if I compare to this BRL 900 million plus of interest, accrued interest expense in the P&L what will be kind of a ballpark for your cash interest payments? I mean there are 3 lines that you use as reconciliations in the cash flow statement.

也許只是這個主題的最後一個後續行動。你能有一個代理或者我猜，你的現金大概嗎？那麼，如果我將損益表中的應計利息支出與這 9 億巴西雷亞爾的利息進行比較，那麼您的現金利息支付大概是多少？我的意思是，現金流量表中有 3 行用作對賬。

And using those 3 lines and getting cash interest payments of about BRL 423 million in the quarter, so roughly a bit less than half the size of the accrued interest expense in the P&L, which would mean funding costs of about 18.7%. Does that make sense? Or if you can give us an idea of if your cash funding cost or cash interest payments right now, per quarter.

使用這 3 個項目，本季度獲得約 4.23 億雷亞爾的現金利息支付，大約略低於損益表中應計利息支出的一半，這意味著融資成本約為 18.7%。那有意義嗎？或者您是否可以告訴我們您現在每季度的現金融資成本或現金利息支付情況。

Yes, Nicolas. So I think that if you look at our cash flow, we do have the amount of interest paid there. And I think that one additional element is that our cash flow, we have interest paid, and we have the net effect of the interest income received from prepayment business and how much is the funding cost for that only for the sale of receivables that we have. So I think that if you look in our cash flow statement, and you'll see the interest income received net of costs and you see the income -- the interest paid, you have pretty much the information to do the reconciliation you want to do. So I think that if you want to go off-line as well, of course, we are fully available to make those details for you.

是的，尼古拉斯。所以我認為，如果你看看我們的現金流，我們確實有支付的利息。我認為另一個因素是我們的現金流，我們支付了利息，我們從預付款業務中收到的利息收入的淨效應以及僅用於出售我們擁有的應收賬款的融資成本是多少。因此，我認為，如果您查看我們的現金流量表，您會看到扣除成本後收到的利息收入，您會看到收入 - 支付的利息，您幾乎擁有了進行所需調節的信息。所以我認為，如果您也想離線，當然，我們完全可以為您提供這些詳細信息。

Sure. Maybe just one last one. Since you mentioned generating cash and in some cases, using this additional cash level to repay some that debt, would that potentially -- and I know that we have asked this question a few times in earnings calls, would that potentially include buying back some of your 28 given they are trading at about BRL 0.80.

當然。也許只是最後一張。既然你提到產生現金，並且在某些情況下，使用這些額外的現金水平來償還一些債務，這是否有可能 - 我知道我們在財報電話會議上多次問過這個問題，這是否可能包括回購一些債務您的 28 美元的交易價格約為 0.80 雷亞爾。

Yes. So I think we answered that question last time, I think it doesn't change the answer. We are looking closely to different capital allocation opportunities, including that you said. As I said, we like to have flexibility in terms of cash. And if we look at the bonds, you have to look at the discounts. We have to look at the cost to unwind the hedge of the bond, which is negative right now. So I think there is many factors that we have to take into consideration when deciding to do that. And we are always looking very closely to that sort of alternative.

是的。所以我認為我們上次回答了這個問題，我認為這不會改變答案。我們正在密切關注不同的資本配置機會，包括您所說的。正如我所說，我們希望在現金方面保持靈活性。如果我們看債券，你就必須看折扣。我們必須考慮解除債券對沖的成本，目前該成本為負。所以我認為我們在決定這樣做時必須考慮很多因素。我們一直在密切關注這種替代方案。

Ladies and gentlemen, there are no further questions at this time. This concludes our question-and-answer session. I would like to turn the call back over to Pedro Zinner for any final considerations.

女士們、先生們，目前沒有其他問題了。我們的問答環節到此結束。我想將電話轉回給 Pedro Zinner，以供最後考慮。

Well, I just want to thank everyone for participating in the call, and hope to see you again soon in our next quarter conference meeting. Thank you very much.

好吧，我只是想感謝大家參與這次電話會議，並希望很快在我們的下季度會議上再次見到你們。非常感謝。

And thank you, sir. The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

謝謝您，先生。會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連接。