StoneX Group Inc (SNEX) 2011 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good day, everyone, and welcome to the International Assets first quarter fiscal-year 2011 earnings conference call. Today's call is being recorded.

At this time, I would like to turn the call over to Mr. Bill Dunaway, CFO. Please go ahead, sir.

Good morning, my name is Bill Dunaway, CFO of International Assets Holding Corporation.Welcome to our earnings conference call for the first quarter of fiscal 2011, ended December 31, 2010. After the market closed yesterday, International Assets issued a press release reporting its earnings for the first fiscal quarter of fiscal 2011. The press release is available on our website at www.intlfcstone.com. Additionally, we are conducting a live webcast of this call, which will also be available on our website after the call's conclusion.

Before getting underway, I would like to cover a couple of housekeeping items. On these conference calls, and in the management discussion portions of our SEC filings, we present financial information on a non-GAAP basis in order to take into account mark-to-market adjustments in our physical commodities business within our commodity and risk-management services segment.

As discussed on previous conference calls and in our filings, the requirements of accounting principles generally accepted in the US, which I will refer to as GAAP to carry derivatives at fair value but physical commodities inventory at the lower cost for fair value may have a significant temporary impact on our reported earnings. Under GAAP, gains and losses on commodities inventories and derivatives, which the Company intends to be offsetting, are recognized in different periods.

Additionally, GAAP does not require us to reflect changes in estimated values of forward commitment to purchase and sell commodities. For this reason, we believe that GAAP numbers do not reflect the commercial results of our physical commodities business, and therefore, the Company as a whole. Instead, we assess all of our businesses, as do our lenders, on a fully mark-to-market basis in our daily and monthly internal financial reporting. We also calculate commodity trader bonuses on the basis of fully mark-to-market results, not GAAP results.

Readers of our form 10Q filings should look at item 2 in our selected summary financial information for a summary of both GAAP and non-GAAP information. This section also provides the reconciliation between GAAP and non-GAAP information required by the SEC.Please note that whenever we talk about an adjusted number on this call, we are talking about a non-GAAP number . Secondly, we are required to advise you, and all participants should note, the following discussion should be taken in conjunction with the most recent financial statements and notes thereto. As well as the form 10Q filed with the SEC.

This discussion may contain forward-looking statements within the meaning of section 27A of the Securities Act of 1933, and Section 21E of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934. These forward-looking statements involve known and unknown risks and uncertainties, which are detailed in our filings with the SEC.Although the Company believes that its forward-looking statements are based upon reasonable assumptions regarding its business and future market conditions, there can be no assurances that the Company's actual results will not differ materially from any results expressed or implied by the Company's forward-looking statements.

The Company undertakes no obligation to publicly update or revise any forward-looking statements, whether as a result of new information, future events or otherwise. Readers are cautioned that any forward-looking statements are not guarantees of future performance.

With that, I'll now turn the call over to Sean O'Connor, the Company's CEO.

Thanks, Bill, and good morning, everyone. Let me just apologize in advance. The brutal winter here has finally got a hold of me, so I have a cold, if I sound a little strange.

In our view, our financial performance in the first quarter of 2011 was strong. On a non-GAAP mark-to-market basis, which is how we always look at our results, we recorded adjusted net income of $11.4 million, which equated to a 17.5% ROE. And an adjusted EPS of $0.62 a share.This is the first time since the FCStone acquisition that our ROE has been higher than the stated targeted ROE of 15% we set for ourselves, a result that we were not expecting to achieve for at least another year. Aggregate adjusted operating revenues were up 67% from last year, with all of our business segments showing strong gains.

Adjusted net earnings were up 226% from a year ago, and 208% from the preceding quarter. GAAP earnings were $4 million compared to a loss of $4.2 million a year ago, and a loss of $4.5 million in the preceding quarter. GAAP EPS was $0.22 per fully diluted share.

The adjusted mark-to-market results are net of approximately $4 million in after-tax items that we would consider to be nonrecurring this quarter, but we will take you through the details later in this call. But these items relate to a change in the accounting treatment of our earn-out contingencies, which now have to be adjusted through the income statement for the first time, which means we are now effectively having to expense a portion of the purchase consideration relating to acquisitions. And in addition, we had some additional bad debt provisions.

Obviously, our first-quarter performance was much improved over recent quarters. In fact, our first quarter adjusted earnings amounted to nearly 74% of the entire 2010 fiscal-year adjusted earnings. This improved performance was partly attributable to a much better market environment, where increased volatility resulted in more customer activity and volume. In addition, we were pleased to see significant revenue synergies arising from our recent acquisitions. Most notably, the Hanley Derivative and Structured Products business, which has synched in very well with our existing customer base.

The Provident Investment Banking business has not yet made a meaningful earnings contribution, but has a very full pipeline of transactions, and has seen good synergies with our customer base. We are confident that we will soon realize the benefits of this acquisition, and the added capability it brings.We've also made good progress in integrating the Hencorp acquisition.

As we said last quarter, we have now assembled all the capabilities to provide our target customers, who are largely midsize corporations, with a comprehensive range of risk-management, treasury and investment banking services. We have achieved some early and meaningful successes that have validated the strategy. But we believe that we are still in the early stages of reaping the full benefits from the acquisitions we have made over the last 18 months. Management is now focused on assuring that our wide range of capabilities is delivered more seamlessly to our nearly 8,000 commercial customers, and we've become more efficient at internalizing and optimizing the margin embedded in these products.

As we mentioned nearly a year ago, we've instituted a systematic approach to manage our positive exposure to interest rates, which is a meaningful driver to our earnings in normal conditions, but in the current low interest rate environment, has been a material and ongoing drag on our results. Our approach is to use derivatives to swap out our short-term interest exposure out to two years using swaps, while doing this on a systematic quarterly basis, which should result in us achieving the two-year average of the two-year swap rate. The underlying logic of this approach was that the two-year rates offered a meaningful pick up in yield in the vast majority of times.

We have steadily implemented this approach, and at the end of Q1 have 37% of our net short-term interest rate exposure swapped, and have realized approximately a 40-basis point enhancement on this portion of our customer segregated funds. Equivalent to $700,000 in additional cash flow per quarter. And this should increase as we layer in more swaps over time.These swaps are accounted for on a mark-to-market basis, as opposed to being amortized. And overall, these swaps resulted in a positive mark-to-market gain for fiscal 2010 of nearly $2.5 million in aggregate. However, we incurred a mark-to-market loss of $1 million for the first quarter.

Despite the growth in revenues and increased customer activity, we remain very liquid. On a mark-to-market basis, we now have long-term equity capital of $270 million. With total bank facilities this quarter end of $340 million, of which $189 million was drawn, and we held cash of $125 million, of which $47 million was restricted.

As most of you are aware, and disclosed in our filings, we've had our share of legal issues to deal with. During fiscal 2010, we incurred some $2.3 million in legal fees on these matters. We have made some progress recently, and have settled three of our lawsuits in a favorable manner. In addition, around 40% of the convertible notes outstanding at September 30, 2010, have been converted, which effectively resolves a large part of that dispute.We've also received a favorable decision on the outstanding class-action matter, and we believe that this may induce some progress towards resolving this issue. But the final outcome is still uncertain, and largely in the hands of our D&O insurance carrier.

Given the various acquisitions we have made over the last 18 months, and the different capabilities, the organic growth and increased market volatility, it is essential that we remain vigilant and focused on risk-management. We believe that we've made good strides over the last 18 months in reengineering and restaffing the entire risk-management process. We also believe that certain of our acquisitions have provided meaningful additional resources both in terms of people and systems to more effectively manage risk. We believe that the best way to evaluate our management of market risk is by empirically observing revenue volatility. In our filings, we disclose a graph showing daily distribution of mark-to-market revenues.

Despite a very volatile period over the last quarter, with numerous limit move days in a number of commodities, we recorded only one negative day out of 66 trading days, with a loss for that single day amounting to less than 50% of an average trading day's revenues. During the whole of fiscal 2010, we recorded three negative days, out of a total 264 trading days, with all of these negative days representing less than 0.25 of an average trading day's revenue. These statistics bear out the customer-centric nature of our activities. Where we are trying to capture spreads or commissions out of customer volume, rather than running directional proprietary positions.

Regarding counter-party and customer credit, we believe that we've insulated the Company from any major potential for loss. Partly by eliminating a number of clearing accounts, which were just too large for our capital base and risk tolerance. However, we still have an unacceptable number of small losses, which continue to affect our results. We shall continue to refine this process, which may require us to rethink certain of our business segments and customer profiles.

While we have suffered no direct losses as the result of the current turmoil in Egypt, we have some direct exposure to that country out of our Dubai precious metals business that we are monitoring carefully. There may also be knock-on effects, for example, in the energy and cotton industries, which call for added vigilance.

I will now hand you over to Bill Dunaway for a more detailed discussion of the financial results. Bill?

Thank you, Sean. Let me remind everyone, as I said at the outset of the call, that the fully mark-to-market numbers are not in accordance with GAAP. The differences between the GAAP and fully mark-to-marketed numbers are arrised in our commodities and risk-management services segment. In all of our other business segments, GAAP results and mark-to-market results are the same.

As discussed on prior calls, the merger with FCStone occurred on the last day of the fiscal-year 2009. So, this is the first fiscal quarter in which my discussions of quarterly performance will include comparisons of year-over-year results as both periods include the activities of FCStone, and the two periods yield meaningful comparisons. Therefore, I will be including discussions of both first-quarter 2011 results as compared to the first quarter of 2010, as well as comparisons to the most recent fourth quarter of 2010.

I would like to start with a few financial highlights of the first quarter of fiscal 2011. Adjusted operating revenues were $108.8 million, up 67% from the first quarter of 2010, and up 42% from the fourth quarter of 2010. Every segment of the Company experienced growth in adjusted operating revenues in the first quarter, as compared to both the prior-year first and fourth quarters, with adjusted operating revenues in our core commodity and risk-management services segment increasing 129% over the prior-year period. The operating revenues continue to be constrained by historically low short-term interest rates. However, interest income increased 79% to $2.5 million for the first quarter, as average customer assets on deposit increased 102% over the prior-year periodto $1.9 billion.

Non-interest expenses were $87 million, up 51% for the first quarter of 2010, primarily as a result of the increase in variable expenses associated with the increase in adjusted operating revenues, plus the effect of our four acquisitions made in calendar-year 2010. As with prior quarters, the majority of non-interest expenses were variable, with 54% of total non-interest expenses being variable in nature.

Total employees increased to 773 at the end of the first quarter of 2011, as compared to 626 at the end of the prior-year period. Total compensation expense was 39% of adjusted operating revenues versus 37% a year ago. Adjusted net income from continuing operations for the quarter was $11.4 million as compared to $3.5 million in the prior-year quarter, and $3.7 million in the fourth quarter of 2010. Return on equity for the first quarter of 2011 on this basis was 17.5%.

Total operating revenues under GAAP for the first quarter were $96.7 million as compared to $59.6 million for the prior-year period, and $65.9 million for the fourth quarter of 2010. Adjusted operating revenues, which include the mark-to-market adjustments in our commodity and risk-management business, increased by $43.6 million from the prior-year period, and $32.1 million over the fourth quarter of 2010 to $108.8 million, as increases in commodity volatility, higher commodity prices, renewed activity in the retail equity markets, and recent acquisitions resulted in substantially higher transactional volumes and revenues, particularly in our risk-management business.

Operating revenues for the first quarter include a mark-to-market loss of $1 million on the interest rate swaps entered into to manage a portion of our aggregate interest rate position, as discussed on previous earnings calls and as mentioned by Sean earlier. The objective of these interest rate swaps is to invest the bulk of our customer segregated funds in high-quality, short-term investments, and swap the resulting variable-interest earnings into a more stable medium-term interest stream at the Holding Company level. From a cash flow standpoint, ignoring the mark-to-market effect of these swaps, they had the effect of increasing our interest income by $700,000 for the first quarter of 2011.

Non-interest expenses increased $29.4 million to $87 million, as compared to $57.6 million in the prior-year period, primarily as a result of $13.5 million increase in variable expenses represented by compensation, clearing and related, and introducing broker commission expenses. Other non-interest expenses increased by $15.9 million. Included in this increase was $2.6 million in bad debt provisions, and a $1.6 million charge related to contingent acquisition payments to be made by FCStone related to pre-merger acquisitions made by FCStone.

As part of the merger transaction, all goodwill related to the pre-merger acquisitions were written off through purchase-price adjustments. And therefore, future contingent payments related to these pre-merger acquisitions must be recognized through current-period earnings. On a go-forward basis, as certain earning targets are met, an additional $400,000 will be expensed in the first quarters of 2012 and 2013 for these contingencies.

In addition, a portion of this increase in non-interest expenses was related to post-merger acquisitions made by INTL. Accounting guidance in place following the merger with FCStone require contingent earn-out liabilities related to acquisitions to be recorded as a liability on the balance sheet as of the acquisition date at the net present value of the expected payments in future periods.Then in each subsequent period, an adjustment to these contingent liabilities is necessary to amortize the interest expense plus any change in underlying expected payment amounts, and must be recognized through current-period earnings. As a result of this guidance, INTL recognized an expense of $1.4 million of contingent liability revaluation expense through current-period earnings. Both the pre-merger and post-merger contingent liability expense is recorded through the other expense line of the income statement.

In addition, the increase in non-interest expenses was related to fixed compensation expense, as the number of employees increased from 626 employees at the end of the first quarter 2010, to 773 employees at the end of the first quarter of 2011. This increase was primarily driven by the acquisitions of RMI, The Hanley Group, Provident, and Hencorp, [Bextel] and Futures.

Variable compensation increased $10.8 million to $22 million for the first quarter as compared to the prior-year period.While variable clearing and related expenses increased $1.5 million to $19.6 million for the first quarter, primarily related to increased volumes in the CRM, and clearing and execution segments.

Of our total non-interest expenses, 46% were fixed and 54% were variable in the first quarter of 2011. Compared with 42% fixed and 58% variable in the prior-year period. Compensation and benefits made up 49% of total non-interest expenses in the first quarter compared to 42% in the prior-year period. Interest expense increased from $2.5 million in the first quarter of 2010 to $3.8 million for 2011. With the increase primarily driven by increases in committed line of credit fees, and renewed and expanded credit facilities, as well as an increase in the commodity financing business in our other segment.

Now, I will discuss the results in our various operating reporting segments. Our commodity and risk-management services segment is our largest segment, and provides our commercial customers with a full range of risk-management training and advisory services, including the execution of hedging strategies through the execution of exchange traded futures and options, over the counter derivatives including structured products, as well as physical trading in precious and base metals and select other commodities.

Adjusted operating revenues increased by 129% to $66.2 million in the first quarter as compared to $28.9 million in the prior-year period. As compared to fourth-quarter 2010, adjusted operating revenues increased 61% or $25.2 million. Within soft commodities, including agriculture and energy products, exchange-traded and OTC volumes increased 29% and 163%, respectively, over the prior-year period. An increase in underlying volatility in agricultural commodities, as well as the effect of rising commodity prices, were the main drivers of the increases in exchange-traded volumes, as well as to a lesser extent the acquisitions of RMI and Hencorp Futures.

Over the counter volumes and revenues increased over the year-ago period as commercial customers, primarily in the agricultural commodity markets, including cotton and sugar, have started to implement the Company's risk-management strategies, particularly in the international markets including Brazil. The acquisition of the Hanley companies in the fourth quarter of 2010 led to an increased offering of structured OTC products to our commercial customers, contributing to the significant increase in operating revenues in the first quarter.

Adjusted operating revenues at our precious metals product line increased 54% to $5.4 million in the first quarter as compared to prior-year period, as an increase in global demand drove a significant increase in the number of ounces traded, particularly in Singapore and Dubai. Adjusted operating revenues in our base metals product line were break-even with the prior-year period, as moderately lower levels of business activity were offset by wider margins.

Adjusted CRM segment income increased 178% from $9.4 million in the prior-year period to $26.1 million in the first quarter of 2011. Fourth-quarter 2010 adjusted segment income was $8.9 million. This segment recorded a bad debt provision in the first quarter of 2010 of $2.9 million, primarily relating to a precious metals customer who we'd consigned gold to, which was partially offset by recoveries of previously recorded bad debt.

The foreign exchange segment consists of our treasury, global payment, and foreign exchange services, as well as customer clearing and execution of spot trading, and a proprietary operation arbitraging cash and futures on foreign currencies. Operating revenues in the first quarter totaled $14.5 million, representing an 11% increase over the prior year period of $13.1 million. Fourth-quarter 2010 operating revenues were $11.7 million. The volume of trades in the Company's global payments business increased from the prior year period as the segment continued to benefit from an increase in customers consisting primarily of financial institutions and our ability to offer an electronic transaction order system to our customers.

In the first quarter of 2011, the customer speculative foreign exchange business decreased slightly over prior-year levels, and the proprietary foreign exchange arbitrage desk experienced a decrease in the level of arbitrage opportunities in the cash versus futures market. Segment income increased 15% from $6.2 million in Q1 2010, to $7.1 million in the first quarter of 2011.

Operating revenues in the security segment, which is a combination of the equity market making and debt capital markets businesses, increased by 46% to $5.4 million in the first quarter of 2010, to $7.9 million in the first quarter of 2011. Revenues in our equity market making businesses increased 19% to $5.6 million, as compared to the prior year. Revenues in our debt capital markets business increased to $2.3 million in the first quarter of 2011. The increase in operating revenues in the equity market making business were driven by an increase in trading in the global equity markets, while the debt capital markets benefited from the global economic recovery, as well as the addition of the Provident investment banking business. Segment income increased 23% from $1.3 million in the first quarter of 2010, to $1.6 million in the first quarter of 2011.

The clearing and execution services segment provides competitive and efficient clearing and execution of exchange traded futures and options for primarily institutional and professional traders. Operating revenues in the segment were $17.1 million for the first quarter of 2011, as compared to $16.1 million in the prior-year period. Operating revenues were $14.3 million in the fourth quarter of 2010. Operating revenues increased primarily as a result of a 5% increase in exchange traded volume. Interest income increased moderately, although it continued to be constrained by historically low short-term interest rates. The CES segment income was $2.22 million in the first quarter of 2011, as compared to $900,000 in the prior-year period.

Finally, the Other segment includes our asset management group, and our commodity financing and facilitation business. Operating revenues were $2.8 million in the first quarter, as compared to $2.2 million in the prior-year period. Assets under management were $356 million at the end of the first quarter, as compared to $349 million at September 30, 2010. Operating revenues in the commodity financing and facilitation business increased from $250,000 in the first quarter of 2010, to $950,000 in first quarter of 2011. Segment operating income was $800,000 in the first quarter, as compared to $1 million in the prior-year period.

On a GAAP basis, net income attributable to common shareholders was $4 million for the first quarter of 2011, or $0.22 per fully diluted share, as compared to a net loss of $4.2 million or $0.25 per diluted share in the first quarter of 2010. Adjusted net income from continuing operations increased 226% to $11.4 million for the first quarter of 2011, from $3.5 million in the prior-year period. The adjusted net income from continuing operations for the entire 2010 fiscal year was $15.5 million.

Looking at our balance sheet, at December 31, 2010, total assets were $2 billion, relatively unchanged from the end of September 2010. The balance sheet is very liquid, with total cash and cash equivalents of $78 million. 87% of our assets consisted of cash, cash equivalents, deposits and receivables from exchanges and counter-parties, financial instruments, and commodities inventory. Our commodities inventory increased $28.7 million from the end of September 2010, to $153.7 million at the end of December 2010, stated at the lower of cost or market value.

Borrowings, excluding the $11.2 million of convertible notes, were at $188.9 million compared with $114.9 million at the end of September 2010. During the first quarter of 2011, convertible note holders of $5.5 million in principal amount of the notes converted the principal and accrued interest into 255,359 shares of common stock of the Company. Subsequent to the end of the quarter, convertible note holders of $1.3 million in principle of the notes converted the principle and accrued interest into 57,743 shares of the common stock of the Company. Following these conversions, the outstanding principle of the convertible note holders are convertible into 458,861 shares of common stock of the Company.

With that, I would like to turn it back to Sean to wrap up.

Thanks, Bill. Fiscal 2010 was a very active year for us during which we assembled all the parts of a business that we believe has a unique and unmatched set of capabilities for our customers and prospects around the globe. As a result of these efforts, we now have a high-touch, value-added and customer-focused approach to providing risk-management, treasury and investment banking services in a seamless fashion. And the ability to internalize and optimize the margin embedded in these products. We believe that Q1 saw the validation of this approach as we started to integrate some of these newly acquired capabilities. We are still early in the game, and have much to do to deliver on this strategy and provide the high returns we believe are possible.

We are also taking advantage of the current market environment to expand our franchise globally, and are starting to get traction in some of the newer markets we have targeted. As we've said for the last 18 months, this is a three-year project, and we are not yet halfway through the build out. The favorable market environment that prevailed in the first quarter may not always be there for us. However, we remain convinced that this is an opportunity that if executed well, should lead to consistent high ROEs for our shareholders.

Finally, I would like to mention that as most of you noticed, we changed our ticker symbol some months back to INTL, something we had wanted to do for a long time and fortunately the ticker symbol became available. In addition, we are proposing at our upcoming shareholder meeting to change the name of the Company to INTL FCStone from International Assets Holding Company, which we think better leverages the brand and customer awareness of the various legacy companies have built up over many years.

So with that, I would like to turn it back to the operator to open the question and answer session. Operator?

Thank you. (Operator Instructions)Graeme Rein with Bares Capital.

Good morning. I have a couple questions.In the queue, you guys disclosed adjusted EBITDA for the last 12 months was like $52.4 million, I believe. I just want to check my numbers, if I back out the previous three quarters, it comes to about $22 million for this quarter. Is that correct?

Bill, do you want to take that?

Graeme, I'll have to run that real quick, I don't have the EBITDA number handy right here.

Does that sound unreasonable, or is that about the right number?

On an adjusted basis? Yes, that would be about right.

And then the legal issues related to subordinated notes, it sounds like that's completely gone away? Is that right?

Now, Graeme, let me jump in. We actually have -- there are four note holders that organize themselves into two separate lawsuits. Brian, are you on? -- your baby.

Hi, Graeme. The lawsuit started off with one from, call it Investor A, who had about $3.8 million of notes. All of those notes were converted by the end of December, so that lawsuit has gone away. Investors B, C and D followed suit a few months after the original lawsuit, and they started out with approximately $13 million worth of notes, and that number has not come down to $10 million following some conversions, but that lawsuit is still in the works.

Okay. And then, it sounds like you guys are doing great down in Brazil with some agriculture activity. Are these brand new customers? I know you mentioned that they are just hedging cotton and sugar and some of these soft commodities for the first time. Can you just explain if they are new customers, or if they are existing customers that are just using more of your capabilities. Could you explain why you are having such success down there.

Pete Anderson, do you want to take that for us?

Yes. Hi, Graeme. A part of it, Graeme, is basically historical customers, but it's also pretty substantial amount of growth, both in grains and sugar, cocoa. I think the addition of Hencorp has been pretty significant. It's brought us a substantial amount of business out of Brazil and across Latin America. But it's really a mix of both, it's really ramping up customers that have really plugged into the services and products that we offer, and really managing risk and taking advantage of cash and carry, and seasonal basis, that kind of thing.

And then a whole host of new customers coming into all aspects of different commodities. So it has been pretty significant growth, and the volatility in the markets brought substantial amount of volume as well.

Graeme, just to give some rough ballpark numbers, I think that the number of customers in Brazil over the last 12 months has grown by about 25%. So that's been an increase, and then it's been market volatility and obviously a significant impact from the Hanley acquisition being able to internalize the margin on the OTC side. So, those three factors together.

Okay, great. And then, Sean, the performance this quarter was much better then we were expecting, and it sounds like better than you might have been expecting as well. Was this just an aberration, or is this the type of financial returns you guys expect to put forth in the coming years?

Yes, we were a bit surprised. And I think when we put these pieces together, we had high hopes that this was the kind of combination that could create a high ROE for our shareholders. We thought it might just take a little longer to get to the 17% or 18% or 20% level. And if you back out some of the non-recurring numbers, you can do the math, but it comes out to like a 25% ROE that we actually achieved in the first quarter. So, it is great to seek validation of that approach. But I do think that we had very good market conditions helping us. And it is hard to strip out what the effect of that is. But there certainly was some effect by just increased volatility and so on. But I think overtime, as we can get this rolled out in a more seamless way, we should be earning those kind of ROEs. Maybe it was a little bit up front just because of some market help. We'll have to see in the next couple of quarters whether we can offset that by just getting this working better, faster.

Okay, well, congratulations, and thank you for your time.

(Operator Instructions)

Are there any other questions, operator?

It appears there are no further questions at this time.

Okay, well, let's wrap it up then. So, thanks, everybody, we will speak to you next quarter. Thanks.

Again, that does conclude today's presentation. We thank you for your participation.