SES AI Corporation (SES) 2025 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon. Thank you for attending today's SES AI fourth-quarter and full year 2025 earnings results call. My name is Tamia, and I will be your moderator for today's call. (Operator Instructions)

午安.感謝您參加今天舉行的 SES AI 2025 年第四季及全年業績電話會議。我叫塔米婭，我將擔任今天電話會議的主持人。（操作說明）

I would now like to pass the conference over to your host, Kyle Pilkington, Chief Legal Officer.

現在我將把會議交給主持人，法務官凱爾·皮爾金頓。

Hello, everyone, and welcome to our conference call covering our fourth-quarter and full year 2025 results. Joining me today are Qichao Hu, Founder and Chief Executive Officer; and Jing Nealis, Chief Financial Officer.

大家好，歡迎參加我們的電話會議，本次會議將介紹我們2025年第四季和全年業績。今天與我一同出席的有創辦人兼執行長胡啟超，以及財務長Jing Nealis。

We issued our shareholder letter just after 4:00 PM today, which provides a business update as well as our financial results. You'll find a press release with a link to our shareholder letter and today's conference call webcast in the Investor Relations section of our website at ses.ai.

今天下午 4 點剛過，我們發布了股東信，信中提供了業務最新進展以及我們的財務表現。您可以在我們網站 ses.ai 的投資者關係部分找到新聞稿，其中包含指向我們致股東信和今天電話會議網絡直播的連結。

Before we get started, this is a reminder that the discussion today may contain forward-looking information or forward-looking statements within the meaning of applicable securities legislation. These statements are based on our predictions and expectations as of today. Such statements involve certain risks, assumptions and uncertainties, which may cause our actual or future results and performance to be materially different from those expressed or implied in these statements.

在開始之前，需要提醒大家的是，今天的討論可能包含適用證券法意義上的前瞻性資訊或前瞻性陳述。這些聲明是基於我們截至目前為止的預測和預期。此類聲明涉及某些風險、假設和不確定性，可能導致我們的實際或未來業績與這些聲明中明示或暗示的業績有重大差異。

Risks and uncertainties that could cause our results to differ materially from our current expectations include, but are not limited to, those detailed in our latest earnings release and in our SEC filings.

可能導致我們的業績與目前預期有重大差異的風險和不確定性包括但不限於我們在最新收益報告和提交給美國證券交易委員會的文件中詳細列出的那些風險和不確定性。

On this call, we are introducing non-GAAP financial measures as a supplement to our GAAP results. These non-GAAP measures are not prepared in accordance with generally accepted accounting principles, but are intended to illustrate alternative measures of the company's operating performance that may be useful. These non-GAAP measures should not be considered in isolation or as a substitute for any GAAP measure, and our definitions may differ from those used by other companies reporting similarly titled measures. Reconciliations of the non-GAAP financial measures to most directly comparable GAAP measures can be found in our latest earnings release.

在本次電話會議上，我們將介紹非GAAP財務指標，作為我們GAAP績效的補充。這些非公認會計準則指標並非依照公認會計原則編制，而是為了說明公司經營績效的替代衡量標準，這些標準可能很有用。這些非GAAP指標不應被孤立地看待，也不應被視為任何GAAP指標的替代指標，而且我們的定義可能與其他報告類似名稱指標的公司所使用的定義不同。有關非GAAP財務指標與最直接可比較的GAAP指標的調節表，請參閱我們最新的獲利報告。

With that, I'll pass it over to Qichao.

這樣，我就把麥克風交給啟超了。

Thanks, Kyle. Thanks, everyone, for joining today. We had an exciting 2025 with full year revenue of $21 million compared to a little over $2 million for 2024. Jim will walk through our financials and the outlook shortly.

謝謝你，凱爾。感謝各位今天的參與。2025 年我們取得了令人振奮的成績，全年收入達到 2,100 萬美元，而 2024 年的收入僅略高於 200 萬美元。吉姆稍後將詳細介紹我們的財務狀況和前景。

This tremendous growth was due to the final contributions from our services agreements with Honda and Hyundai as we completed our EV development work with them. We also had 3.5 months of revenue from the acquisition of UZ Energy for our energy storage ESS business.

這一巨大增長歸功於我們與本田和現代的服務協議的最終履行，因為我們完成了與他們合作的電動車開發工作。我們也從收購 UZ Energy 的儲能 ESS 業務中獲得了 3.5 個月的收入。

While we are pleased to report full year revenue in the range of our previously issued guidance, as the milestone we reached and the year-over-year growth we are expecting from full year contributions in our three revenue-generating business units and for recognizing potential value in the Molecular Universe that has us really excited.

儘管我們很高興地宣布全年收入在我們之前發布的指導範圍內，但我們真正感到興奮的是，我們達到了一個里程碑，並且我們預計三個創收業務部門的全年貢獻將實現同比增長，同時我們也認識到了分子領域的潛在價值。

I'm very proud that we made more progress in the past year than the previous 10-plus years combined. This development of the Molecular Universe has set things up for us. ESS continues to be well positioned to solve the issues of battery development and safety requirements.

我非常自豪，我們在過去一年的進步比過去十多年加起來還要多。分子宇宙的這一發展為我們奠定了基礎。ESS 在解決電池開發和安全要求方面仍然處於有利地位。

With the Molecular Universe, our own in-house AI science company, we have been able to help customers overcome standard timelines in the adoption of new technology. We also have a front seat to see how energy transition needs are requiring more integration of AI software and hardware along with precise battery health monitoring.

憑藉我們自己的內部人工智慧科學公司 Molecular Universe，我們能夠幫助客戶克服採用新技術時的標準時間限制。我們還有機會近距離觀察能源轉型需求如何促使人工智慧軟體和硬體更加緊密地結合，以及精確的電池健康狀況監測。

As we described before, SES has three revenue-generating business units: ESS, drones, and materials. ESS, which is the largest market for batteries is bigger than EVs and bigger than drones. At Battery World 2024, we announced our entry into the ESS market. And through our acquisition of UZ Energy, we are now serving customers across the globe from Australia to Europe to the Middle East, and now we are entering the North American market.

正如我們之前所述，SES 有三個創收業務部門：ESS、無人機和材料。儲能係統是電池最大的市場，規模比電動車和無人機都大。在 2024 年世界電池展上，我們宣布進軍儲能係統市場。透過收購 UZ Energy，我們現在為從澳洲到歐洲再到中東的全球客戶提供服務，現在我們正進軍北美市場。

The ESS business is our largest near-term revenue driver. UZ Energy is a leader in commercial and industrial ESS and has sold almost a gigawatt hours of hardware to customers ranging from residential to C&I to grid. We are now able to collect the large amount of historical ESS LFP graphite data.

ESS業務是我們近期最大的營收驅動因素。UZ Energy 是商業和工業儲能係統的領導者，已向從住宅用戶到工商業用戶再到電網用戶等各類客戶銷售了近 1 吉瓦時的硬體。我們現在能夠收集大量的 ESS LFP 石墨歷史資料。

And then for all future UZ products, we plan to incorporate our predict feature from Molecular Universe into a small box to achieve near zero drift of charge SoC degradation, health, safety and other SOX algorithms and automated nondisruptive recalibration, which helps improve UZ's ability to predict battery health and reduce maintenance costs for our customers.

然後，對於所有未來的 UZ 產品，我們計劃將 Molecular Universe 的預測功能整合到一個小盒子中，以實現近乎零漂移的充電 SoC 退化、健康、安全和其他 SOX 演算法以及自動無損重新校準，這有助於提高 UZ 預測電池健康狀況的能力，並降低客戶的維護成本。

Energy storage systems are financial assets. The value to our customers depends on delivering consistent and long-term performance. Historically, UZ supplied only the hardware to customers, mostly LFP and graphite lithium-ion cells. Now since we acquired UZ, SES has the opportunity to provide an operating system to the hardware and sell customers a complete package to meet their USS needs.

儲能係統屬於金融資產。我們為客戶創造的價值取決於我們能否提供持續穩定的長期績效。從歷史上看，UZ 只向客戶提供硬件，主要是磷酸鋰鐵和石墨鋰離子電池。自從我們收購了 UZ 之後，SES 就有機會為硬體提供作業系統，並向客戶銷售完整的軟體包，以滿足他們的 USS 需求。

We are seeing some early traction with UZ sales efforts as they were able to sign a multiyear $20 million contract with a major distributor recently at the intersolar conference.

UZ 的銷售工作已經取得了一些初步成效，他們在最近的國際太陽能展上與一家主要分銷商簽訂了一份價值 2000 萬美元的多年期合約。

Drones are the next business unit I want to highlight. The drones market requires high energy density and high-power density batteries to achieve longer flight time and greater payload. This is where our lithium metal and high silicon carbon lithium-ion batteries really shine. The US defense drones market, in particular, is where we see the most consequential near-term opportunity and where we are devoting most of our attention and investment.

接下來我想重點介紹的是無人機業務部門。無人機市場需要高能量密度和高功率密度的電池，以實現更長的飛行時間和更大的有效載荷。這正是我們的鋰金屬和高矽碳鋰離子電池真正展現優勢的地方。尤其是美國國防無人機市場，我們認為這是近期最具影響力的機會，也是我們投入最多關注和投資的領域。

It's worth spending a moment on why the drone market is a natural fit for deploying our lithium metal anode and proprietary electrolyte. One, a drone battery needs double the energy density of conventional lithium-ion. Ultimately, you need at least 400 watts per kg to be state-of-the-art and a realistic roadmap to 500 watts per kg to win.

值得花點時間探討為什麼無人機市場非常適合部署我們的鋰金屬陽極和專有電解液。第一，無人機電池所需的能量密度是傳統鋰離子電池的兩倍。最終，你需要至少 400 瓦/公斤的功率才能達到最先進水平，並且要製定切實可行的路線圖，達到 500 瓦/公斤才能贏得比賽。

In other words, range and payload matter. Drone batteries need a high C rate and power for the drone to maneuver and accelerate. We solved for this.

換句話說，射程和有效載荷很重要。無人機電池需要高倍率和高功率，才能使無人機進行機動和加速。我們已經解決了這個問題。

Third, drone batteries need to be manufactured at scale. We've demonstrated this in our EV B sample development.

第三，無人機電池需要大規模生產。我們在 EV B 樣品開發中已經證明了這一點。

Fourth, drone batteries need abundant and inexpensive materials and the military demands that the supply chain to be National Defense Authorization Act for NDAA compliant.

第四，無人機電池需要充足且廉價的材料，軍方要求供應鏈符合《國防授權法案》(NDAA) 的規定。

We recently announced we expect to convert our EV B-sample line in Chungju, South Korea facility to manufacture NDA-compliant cells for drones. This is the same facility that we've developed and built the world's first 100 Mpower cells largest lithium metal cell back in 2021. And this facility has been NDA compliant since 2021.

我們最近宣布，我們計劃將位於韓國忠州工廠的電動車 B 樣品生產線改造為生產符合 NDA 規定的無人機電池。這是我們於 2021 年開發並建造了世界上第一個 100 Mpower 電池的最大鋰金屬電池的相同設施。該設施自 2021 年以來一直符合保密協議 (NDA) 的要求。

To meet the drone demand, we plan to convert our lines from EV PEP 100 Mpower cells to 10 Mpower cells. In this line, we're also planning to deploy our AI for safety and AI for manufacturing to ensure quality and cost effectiveness.

為了滿足無人機的需求，我們計劃將生產線從 EV PEP 100 Mpower 電池更換為 10 Mpower 電池。在此領域，我們還計劃部署人工智慧安全技術和人工智慧製造技術，以確保品質和成本效益。

In addition to our Korea facility, we're also exploring even larger NDA compliant and more versatile cell form factor manufacturing capacities in Southeast Asia. We'll have more to update on our NDA-compliant manufacturing capacity and locations later this year.

除了我們在韓國的工廠外，我們還在東南亞探索規模更大、符合保密協議且用途更廣泛的電池外形尺寸製造能力。今年晚些時候，我們將公佈更多關於符合保密協議的生產能力和生產地點的資訊。

Our third revenue-generating business unit is materials. Both ESS and our Molecular Universe users have also been discovering new electrolyte materials for other applications that we don't build cells for currently. Last fall, we announced a JV with Hisun to leverage their 150,000-ton annual global capacity to produce these materials at a commercial scale to supply to other battery manufacturers for consumer electronics and assets. At this time, we are anticipating that the Hisun JV will only produce materials for Molecular Universe discoveries.

我們的第三個創收業務部門是材料部門。ESS 和我們的 Molecular Universe 用戶也一直在探索新的電解質材料，用於我們目前尚未製造電池的其他應用。去年秋天，我們宣布與海正集團成立合資企業，利用其每年 15 萬噸的全球產能，以商業規模生產這些材料，供應給其他電池製造商，用於消費性電子產品和資產。目前，我們預期海正合資公司只會為分子宇宙的發現提供材料。

Through the Molecular Universe, we discovered six breakthroughs that are currently being tested by over 40 customers -- these breakthroughs, which will be the basis of the revenue we expect from this business in 2026 include: one, better cycle life and storage for EV applications; two, better cycle life and power density for drones; three, better low-temperature cycle life and power density for heavy-duty trucking; fourth, better cycle life and longer life for consumer electronics; fifth, better cycle life and low temperature performance for ESS and EVs.

透過分子宇宙，我們發現了六項突破，目前有 40 多家客戶正在測試這些突破——這些突破將成為我們預計 2026 年該業務收入的基礎，其中包括：一、提高電動汽車應用的循環壽命和存儲性能；二、提高無人機的循環壽命和功率密度；三、提高重型卡車的低溫循環壽命和功率密度；

And sixth, better cycle life and storage for consumer electronics.

第六，提高消費性電子產品的循環壽命和儲存效能。

We also have a pipeline of new breakthroughs that are being tested by customers, which we expect will provide further potential revenue for this business.

我們還有一系列正在接受客戶測試的新突破性技術，我們預計這些技術將為公司帶來更多潛在收入。

Last but not least is what we have been referring to as our own AI for science company. That is, of course, Molecular Universe. I want to be clear on how we view the MU role in this company. While its SaaS revenue continues to build momentum and is expected to make a small contribution in 2026, its biggest contribution is the inherent value of this business on its own and the IP that drives competitive advantage in the ESS drone and materials business.

最後，也是非常重要的一點，是我們一直所說的我們自己的AI科學公司。當然，這裡指的是分子宇宙。我想明確說明我們是如何看待MU在這家公司中的角色。雖然其 SaaS 收入持續成長，預計在 2026 年將做出小幅貢獻，但其最大的貢獻是該業務本身的內在價值以及推動 ESS 無人機和材料業務競爭優勢的智慧財產權。

Molecular Universe has the potential to become a modern-day encyclopedia with battery being its volume one. It provides extremely valuable scientific data and intuition to AI for science models. Over the course of the year, we will continue to explore how we can best demonstrate or unlock MUs value.

《分子宇宙》有潛力成為一部現代百科全書，電池是其第一卷。它為人工智慧科學模型提供了極為寶貴的科學數據和直覺。在接下來的一年中，我們將繼續探索如何才能最好地展現或釋放 MU 的價值。

In terms of demonstrating that value, I will point to our recent investor presentation. In that presentation, we noted there are several AI science companies that are either pre-revenue or have less revenue than the MU that have already passed valuations exceeding $1 billion through private capital raises. These are the closest comps to the Molecular Universe.

為了證明這一價值，我將介紹我們最近的投資者報告。在那次演講中，我們指出，有好幾家人工智慧科技公司，要么還沒有收入，要么收入低於 MU，但透過私募融資，它們的估值已經超過 10 億美元。這些是與分子宇宙最接近的類比物。

So we are keeping an eye on how well these transactions have performed. So we are really excited about the long-term value of Molecular Universe as a platform, not just for batteries, but all science as well as the near-term revenue growth from drones, materials and ESS operating systems.

因此，我們會密切注意這些交易的執行情況。因此，我們對 Molecular Universe 作為平台的長期價值感到非常興奮，它不僅適用於電池，而且適用於所有科學領域，同時我們也對無人機、材料和 ESS 作業系統帶來的近期收入成長感到興奮。

Our priorities for 2026 and beyond are: one, leverage the new business unit leadership and structure to execute on the ESS and drone cell opportunities ahead of us. We've brought on industry veterans to lead these efforts as well as hardware and software integration still.

2026 年及以後，我們的首要任務是：第一，利用新的業務部門領導和架構，掌握 ESS 和無人機基地台帶來的機會。我們聘請了業內資深人士來領導這些工作，以及硬體和軟體的整合。

Second, execute on the conversion of our NDA compliant line in Korea from EV sales to drone sales and line up additional capacity in Southeast Asia that is also NDA compliant.

第二，執行我們在韓國符合 NDA 規定的生產線從電動車銷售轉向無人機銷售的轉換，並在東南亞安排同樣符合 NDA 規定的額外產能。

Third, continue the growth of UZ Energy's existing hardware business in Australia, Middle East and Europe and begin expansion into the US.

第三，繼續發展 UZ Energy 在澳洲、中東和歐洲的現有硬體業務，並開始向美國擴張。

Fourth, deliver on existing novel electrolytes discovered by the Molecular Universe in the materials business and expand our pipeline.

第四，將分子宇宙在材料業務中發現的現有新型電解質轉化為現實，並擴大我們的產品線。

Fifth, leverage MU's material discovery capabilities to accelerate new product development.

第五，利用MU的材料發現能力加速新產品開發。

And sixth, continue to focus on our CapEx-light business model in ESS sales and materials to offset the projected R&D spend in the Molecular Universe.

第六，繼續專注於 ESS 銷售和材料方面的輕資本支出業務模式，以抵消預計在分子領域進行的研發支出。

Before I turn it over to Jing, I want to express my gratitude for our teams who are working super hard to make all of this happen. And thanks to all of you for being on this journey with us. And now here's Jing for financial updates.

在把發言權交給 Jing 之前，我想對我們的團隊表示感謝，感謝他們為實現這一切所付出的巨大努力。感謝大家一路陪伴我們走過這段旅程。現在請Jing為大家帶來財經新聞。

Thank you. I will discuss our financial performance for the fourth quarter and full year of 2025 and provide context on how we're deploying our capital to support SES AI's long-term growth and the strategies Qichao outlined earlier.

謝謝。我將討論我們 2025 年第四季和全年的財務業績，並介紹我們如何部署資本來支援 SES AI 的長期成長以及齊超之前概述的策略。

Revenue for the fourth quarter of 2025 was $4.6 million, representing a $2.6 million or 124% increase year over year. Full year revenue came in at $21 million, in line with our guidance, but impacted primarily by logistics constraints that delayed shipments at the end of the year, resulting in approximately $1.5 million of revenue being pushed out to the first quarter of 2026.

2025 年第四季營收為 460 萬美元，較上年同期成長 260 萬美元，增幅達 124%。全年收入為 2,100 萬美元，與我們的預期一致，但主要受到物流限制的影響，導致年底發貨延遲，約 150 萬美元的收入推遲到 2026 年第一季。

As Qichao noted earlier, revenue for full year 2025 was within our previously issued guidance range of $20 million to $25 million and was up nearly tenfold from the prior year, a year in which we first achieved revenue generation.

正如齊超之前指出的那樣，2025 年全年的收入在我們之前發布的 2000 萬美元至 2500 萬美元的指導範圍內，並且比上一年增長了近十倍，而上一年是我們首次實現收入增長的那一年。

Our Q4 gross margin on a GAAP basis was 11.3%, driven by the higher mix of ESS product sales in the quarter, which carries a lower margin profile relative to our service revenue. On a non-GAAP basis, which excludes stock-based compensation as well as depreciation and amortization allocated to cost of revenue, our Q4 non-GAAP gross margin was 11.7%.

根據美國通用會計準則 (GAAP)，我們第四季度的毛利率為 11.3%，這主要得益於本季 ESS 產品銷售佔比的提高，而 ESS 產品相對於我們的服務收入而言利潤率較低。以非GAAP準則計算（不包括股票選擇權費用以及計入收入成本的折舊和攤提），我們第四季的非GAAP毛利率為11.7%。

For full year 2025, our GAAP and non-GAAP gross margin was 53.8% and 55.7%, respectively. As we have noted previously, we expect gross margin to vary from quarter to quarter as our revenue mix across products, SaaS, and services evolve. We expect the gross margins on our product revenue to improve as we scale volume and optimize the cost structure through our CapEx-light business model and JV partnerships.

2025 年全年，我們的 GAAP 和非 GAAP 毛利率分別為 53.8% 和 55.7%。正如我們之前提到的，隨著我們在產品、SaaS 和服務方面的收入組合不斷變化，我們預期毛利率會逐季波動。我們預計，隨著我們擴大產量並透過輕資本支出業務模式和合資夥伴關係優化成本結構，我們的產品收入毛利率將會提高。

Turning to operating expenses. Our GAAP operating expenses for the fourth quarter of 2025 were $18.2 million, compared to $30.4 million for the same period prior year, a 40% decrease year over year. On a non-GAAP basis, which excludes stock-based compensation as well as depreciation and amortization.

接下來談談營運費用。2025 年第四季，我們的 GAAP 營運費用為 1,820 萬美元，而去年同期為 3,040 萬美元，年減 40%。依照非GAAP準則計算，不包括股票選擇權費用以及折舊和攤提。

Fourth quarter operating expenses were $13.5 million compared to $24.2 million for the same period prior year, a 44% decrease. For full year 2025, our GAAP operating expenses were $93.9 million, compared to $110.5 million in 2024, a 15% decrease.

第四季營運支出為 1,350 萬美元，而上年同期為 2,420 萬美元，下降了 44%。2025 年全年，我們的 GAAP 營運費用為 9,390 萬美元，而 2024 年為 1.105 億美元，下降了 15%。

On a non-GAAP basis, full year operating expenses were $73 million versus $82.3 million in 2024, an 11% decrease. The year-over-year improvement in operating expenses on both GAAP and non-GAAP basis reflects the progress we have made in optimizing our cost structure while continuing to invest strategically in Molecular Universe platform and our commercial growth initiatives.

以非GAAP準則計算，全年營運費用為7,300萬美元，而2024年為8,230萬美元，下降了11%。無論以 GAAP 或非 GAAP 計算，營運費用的年比改善反映了我們在優化成本結構方面的進展，同時我們也繼續對 Molecular Universe 平台和我們的商業成長計畫進行策略性投資。

Adjusted EBITDA for the fourth quarter of 2025 was a loss of $13.8 million compared to a loss of $23.2 million in the fourth quarter of 2024, representing a 40% improvement. For the full year 2025, adjusted EBITDA was a loss of $52.6 million compared to a loss of $81.5 million in the full year 2024 in 23% improvement year over year. We believe this growth reflects the positive operating leverage beginning to emerge in our business as revenue scales, as well as our sustained focus on financial discipline and cost management across the organization.

2025 年第四季調整後 EBITDA 虧損 1,380 萬美元，而 2024 年第四季虧損 2,320 萬美元，改善了 40%。2025 年全年調整後 EBITDA 虧損 5,260 萬美元，而 2024 年全年虧損 8,150 萬美元，較去年同期改善 23%。我們認為，這一成長反映了隨著收入規模擴大，我們業務中開始出現的積極經營槓桿效應，以及我們持續專注於整個組織的財務紀律和成本管理。

Our GAAP net loss for the fourth quarter was $17 million or $0.05 loss per share. Excluding stock-based compensation, depreciation and amortization, changes in fair value of sponsor earnout liabilities and including interest income, our non-GAAP net loss for the fourth quarter was $11.8 million or $0.04 loss per share. This is an improvement over 2024 fourth quarter's GAAP net loss of $34.5 million or $0.11 loss per share and non-GAAP net loss of $19.9 million or $0.06 loss per share.

我們第四季的GAAP淨虧損為1700萬美元，即每股虧損0.05美元。不計入股票選擇權費用、折舊及攤銷、發起人獲利負債公允價值變動，但計入利息收入，我們第四季的非GAAP淨虧損為1,180萬美元，即每股虧損0.04美元。這比 2024 年第四季的 GAAP 淨虧損 3,450 萬美元（每股虧損 0.11 美元）和非 GAAP 淨虧損 1,990 萬美元（每股虧損 0.06 美元）有所改善。

For the full year 2025, our GAAP net loss was $73 million, or $0.22 loss per share compared to a GAAP net loss of $100.2 million or $0.31 loss per share in 2024. On a non-GAAP basis, full year net loss was $53.2 million or $0.16 loss per share compared to a net loss of $66.4 million or $0.21 per share in 2024. The year-over-year improvement on both GAAP and non-GAAP basis reflects the progress we are making in scaling revenue and managing our cost structure as we advance customer engagement, develop the Molecular Universe platform and position the distance for growth in 2026.

2025 年全年，我們的 GAAP 淨虧損為 7,300 萬美元，即每股虧損 0.22 美元，而 2024 年的 GAAP 淨虧損為 1.002 億美元，即每股虧損 0.31 美元。以非GAAP準則計算，全年淨虧損為5,320萬美元，即每股虧損0.16美元，而2024年淨虧損為6,640萬美元，即每股虧損0.21美元。無論以 GAAP 或非 GAAP 計算，同比業績均有所改善，這反映了我們在擴大收入規模和管理成本結構方面取得的進展，同時我們也在推進客戶互動、開發 Molecular Universe 平台並為 2026 年的成長奠定了基礎。

A detailed reconciliation of GAAP net loss to adjusted EBITDA and non-GAAP net loss per share is included in the financial tables at the end of the shareholder letter.

股東信末尾的財務報表中包含了 GAAP 淨虧損與調整後 EBITDA 和非 GAAP 每股淨虧損的詳細調整表。

I want to highlight that our GAAP net loss in any given quarter can be meaningfully impacted by noncash mark-to-market movement in the fair value of our sponsor earned liabilities, which are required to be remeasured each reporting period under GAAP. These noncash gains or losses are not reflective of our underlying operating performance. And we believe, excluding them, provides a clearer picture of the progress we're making in the business.

我想強調的是，根據美國公認會計準則 (GAAP)，我們任何季度的 GAAP 淨虧損都可能受到發起人已賺取負債公允價值的非現金按市值計價變動的重大影響，而這些負債需要在每個報告期根據 GAAP 進行重新計量。這些非現金收益或損失並不能反映我們的基本經營績效。我們相信，排除這些因素，可以更清楚地展現我們在業務上的進展。

This is one of the reasons where we're introducing adjusted EBITDA beginning this quarter.

這就是我們從本季開始引入調整後 EBITDA 的原因之一。

We utilized $10.4 million in cash for operations during the fourth quarter and $58.4 million for the full year 2025. We deployed $3.3 million on the UZ acquisition and $2.9 million on CapEx and returned $1.6 million to shareholders through share repurchases during 2025. This improvement in cash utilization is consistent with the adjusted EBITDA progress I noted earlier and reflects the financial discipline we have maintained as we scale the business.

我們在第四季度使用了 1040 萬美元的現金用於運營，2025 年全年使用了 5840 萬美元。我們在收購 UZ 上投入了 330 萬美元，在資本支出上投入了 290 萬美元，並在 2025 年透過股票回購向股東返還了 160 萬美元。現金利用率的提高與我之前提到的調整後 EBITDA 進展相一致，反映了我們在擴大業務規模的過程中所保持的財務紀律。

We exited 2025 with a strong liquidity position of $200 million, coming in at the top end of our previously communicated expectation of ending the year between $195 million and $200 million. Our CapEx-light business model remains the core financial discipline, and we are confident our current liquidity provides a strong runway to fund operations and execute on our 2026 growth initiatives.

2025 年底，我們的流動資金狀況良好，達到 2 億美元，高於我們先前公佈的年底流動資金在 1.95 億美元至 2 億美元之間的預期上限。我們輕資本支出的商業模式仍然是我們的核心財務原則，我們相信我們目前的流動性為營運和執行 2026 年成長計畫提供了強有力的支持。

For full year 2026, we expect revenue to be in the range of $30 million to $35 million. representing approximately 43% to 67% growth over full year 2025 revenue.

我們預計 2026 年全年營收將在 3,000 萬美元至 3,500 萬美元之間，比 2025 年全年營收成長約 43% 至 67%。

As Qichao noted earlier, our full year 2025 revenue included onetime contribution from OEM services contracts. If we compare the growth expected from the three businesses on an apple-to-apple basis, the revenue growth rate is even higher.

正如齊超之前提到的，我們 2025 年全年收入包括來自 OEM 服務合約的一次性貢獻。如果我們對這三家企業的預期成長進行同等比較，則收入成長率甚至更高。

On the margin front, our three businesses carry different profiles and the mix may shift as we scale our ESS hardware business, which will represent the largest share of revenue in 2026 is expected to operate at around 15% gross margin. As we layer in the hardware software bundle and grow the operating system attach rate, we see a potential path to expanding margins in that business over time.

在利潤率方面，我們的三項業務具有不同的特點，隨著我們擴大 ESS 硬體業務的規模，這種組合可能會改變。預計到 2026 年，ESS 硬體業務將佔營收的最大份額，毛利率約為 15%。隨著我們逐步增加硬體軟體捆綁包並提高作業系統附加率，我們看到了隨著時間的推移，該業務利潤率可能不斷擴大的潛在途徑。

Our drone sales business is earlier in this commercial ramp, but we expect gross margins north of 20% as volumes build through the year.

我們的無人機銷售業務目前還處於商業化擴張的早期階段，但我們預計隨著全年銷售的成長，毛利率將超過 20%。

Our materials business, which will sell electrolyte materials, through our joint venture with Hisun. It's also a product business, and we expect it to carry a margin profile in the 10% to 20% range. On a blended basis, we expect consolidated gross margin to be around 15%, with room to improve year over year as we scale.

我們的材料業務將透過與海正集團的合資企業銷售電解液材料。它也是一家產品公司，我們預計其利潤率將在 10% 到 20% 之間。以綜合計算，我們預期合併毛利率約為 15%，隨著規模擴大，每年都有提升空間。

Our operating expenses for full year 2026, we expect approximately 15% further reduction from the 2025 level. This reflects our continued investments in the Molecular Universe platform, while we are committed to financial discipline, we believe this level of investment is appropriate given the long-term value we're building and the early commercial traction we're seeing from MU-driven material discoveries. We are not anticipating meaningful growth in operating expenses beyond this level, and we'll continue to evaluate opportunities to improve operating leverage as revenue scales and to accelerate the monetization of the MU platform.

我們預計 2026 年全年營運費用將比 2025 年水準再減少約 15%。這反映了我們對 Molecular Universe 平台的持續投資，雖然我們致力於財務紀律，但考慮到我們正在創造的長期價值以及我們從 MU 驅動的材料發現中看到的早期商業進展，我們認為這種投資水平是合適的。我們預計營運費用不會在此水準上出現實質成長，我們將繼續評估隨著收入規模擴大而提高營運槓桿的機會，並加速 MU 平台的貨幣化。

On capital expenditures, we continue to operate a CapEx-light model at the core financial discipline. For 2026 we expect CapEx to remain in the single-digit million, primarily directed towards the conversion of South Korea facility from EV cells to NDAA compliant grown cells, as well as the evaluation of contract manufacturing capacities in Southeast Asia.

在資本支出方面，我們持續秉持輕資本支出模式，堅持核心財務紀律。預計 2026 年資本支出將保持在數百萬美元的個位數，主要用於將韓國工廠從電動車電池生產改造為符合 NDAA 標準的生長電池生產，以及評估東南亞的合約製造能力。

We entered 2026 with $200 million in liquidity and we are well funded to scale and grow, can us the financial flexibility to execute on the opportunities ahead of us. We believe 2026 will be the year in which the full architect of our multi-revenue stream platform comes together and began to deliver. We are well capitalized, financially disciplined and positioned to execute on that vision. We appreciate your continued support and confidence in SES AI.

2026 年伊始，我們擁有 2 億美元的流動資金，資金充足，足以擴大規模和發展，並能利用財務彈性抓住未來的機會。我們相信，2026 年將是我們的多收入來源平台的完整架構師團隊組成完成並開始交付的一年。我們資金雄厚，財務紀律嚴明，完全有能力實現這個願景。感謝您一直以來對SES AI的支持與信任。

Thank you. Now I will turn the call back to the operator.

謝謝。現在我將把電話轉回給接線生。

(Operator Instructions) Derek Soderberg, Cantor Fitzgerald.

（操作說明）Derek Soderberg，Cantor Fitzgerald。

On the final contribution from the Honda and Hyundai development work. Just was wondering what sort of next for that program? You sort of proven manufacturability recently. Obviously, your technology is sort of game changing for the EV market, what's next for that, those relationships and Hyundai, when are you going to commercialize that for EVs?

關於本田和現代在研發工作中做出的最終貢獻。我只是想知道這個計畫下一步會有什麼發展方向？你最近已經證明了其可製造性。顯然，你們的技術對電動車市場來說具有顛覆性意義，接下來你們打算如何與現代汽車建立合作關係，以及何時將這項技術商業化應用於電動車？

So in terms of next step, previously, the next step was to go from B sample to C sample. And I think now, I mean, there's no surprise that the EV market is slowing down and almost no automaker is investing in next-gen battery technology. And I don't mean like early-stage better technology in terms of A and B samples, but no one is investing in mass scale production of next-gen technology, which is C sample, which is what we are trying to get to next. So we hit all the technical milestones, but the C sample is on hold.

所以，就下一步而言，之前，下一步是從 B 樣本到 C 樣本。我覺得現在電動車市場成長放緩，幾乎沒有汽車製造商投資下一代電池技術，這並不令人意外。我指的不是像 A 和 B 樣品那樣的早期更先進的技術，而是沒有人投資大規模生產下一代技術，也就是 C 樣品，而這正是我們下一步努力的目標。我們已經達到了所有技術里程碑，但 C 樣本的開發暫時擱置。

And then so in terms of next step with the OEMs, we are focusing on selling materials, selling materials that we have developed, the electro materials, we are focusing on that. And then in terms of the full-blown lithium metal C sample, then we'll see when the market returns. But the technology is there, and this is why we've been focusing on converting the lines for drones production and also applying the AI for safety, the battery analytics software that we develop for EV for ESS market.

因此，就與 OEM 的下一步合作而言，我們專注於銷售材料，銷售我們開發的材料，即電子材料，我們專注於此。至於完整的鋰金屬 C 樣品，我們還要等到市場恢復時才能見分曉。但技術已經存在，這就是為什麼我們一直專注於改造無人機生產線，並將我們為電動車開發的電池分析軟體（用於安全）應用於儲能係統市場。

So yes, in terms of next steps for the OEMs, we're focusing on material supplies and then also converting the line for drone applications and using the safety analytics software for ESS.

所以，是的，就 OEM 的下一步而言，我們正在專注於材料供應，然後將生產線改造為無人機應用，並將安全分析軟體用於 ESS。

Got it. And then just quickly, what was the onetime service amount? Can you quantify that impact to fiscal '25?

知道了。然後簡單問一下，一次性服務費用是多少？你能量化一下這對 2025 財年的影響嗎？

Jing, do you want to take that?

靜，你想拿嗎？

Yes. So for 2025, the service revenue was $13.6 million. Those are primarily driven by the Honda and Hyundai service agreement. So that's the onetime service agreement we were talking about.

是的。因此，2025 年的服務收入為 1,360 萬美元。這些主要受本田和現代的服務協議驅動。這就是我們剛才提到的一次性服務協議。

Got it. So for '26, you don't expect any of that to sort of recur just given what Qichao just explained or guidance is really just ESS, drones and materials. And I was wondering if you could sort of break that down for us or help us try to understand by segment. ESS, drones, materials.

知道了。所以對於 2026 年，鑑於齊超剛才解釋的或指導方針實際上只是 ESS、無人機和材料，你不會期望這些事情再次發生。我想請您幫我們把這些內容分解一下，或是分部分地幫我們理解一下。ESS、無人機、材料。

Can you help us kind of quantify how each of those contribute to the guidance range? And then any help sort of modeling kind of the first half or second half? What portion of revenue in the first half, second half, anything like that would be helpful.

您能否幫我們量化一下這些因素各自對導引範圍的貢獻？那麼，有沒有人可以幫忙模擬一下前半部或後半部的內容呢？如果能提供上半年、下半年等各部分的收入數據就更好了。

I can take that. So yes, yes, for 2026 guidance, given is the first year we're giving guidance, including all three business units. So we -- first of all, we wanted to be more conservative to start the year. As far as breaking down the revenue sources, ESS going to still be a large portion of our revenue. So of that 30 to 35 guidance, the range, I would say, probably around 65% will come from ESS at least.

我可以接受。所以，是的，是的，對於 2026 年的業績指引，這是我們首次給出業績指引，其中包括所有三個業務部門。所以，首先，我們希望在新的一年伊始採取更保守的做法。就收入來源細分而言，ESS 仍將是我們收入的很大一部分。因此，在 30 到 35 的指導範圍內，我認為，至少 65% 左右的資訊將來自 ESS。

And then the remaining portion will be drones and materials. And then for those two, we're expecting it to be more second half of the year loaded given we're still in the ramping and business development stage. So those two are going to be more towards second half of the year. But percentage-wise, around 65% from ESS and the remaining for those two.

剩下的部分將是無人機和材料。至於那兩款產品，鑑於我們仍處於產能提升和業務拓展階段，我們預計下半年會有更多的產品上市。所以這兩份工作大概會在下半年進行。但從百分比來看，約 65% 來自 ESS，其餘則來自那兩個。

Winnie Dong, Deutsche Bank.

Winnie Dong，德意志銀行。

Just curious, if we look out to maybe like the next two to three years, if we just look at the different business areas, yes, there's raw materials, also you have the Molecular Universe as well. How would you characterize like the growth profile of each of these areas in the next two to three years? Which one has maybe the potential for the largest growth, if there's a way to think about it?

我只是好奇，如果我們展望未來兩到三年，如果我們看看不同的業務領域，是的，有原料，還有分子宇宙。您如何描述這些領域在未來兩到三年內的發展前景？如果要從某個角度思考的話，哪一個可能具有最大的成長潛力？

And then separately for Molecular Universe, I know you've been talking about different tiers of revenue from larger corporations and smaller ones. Could you share like currently what might be the largest bottleneck for adoption from these customers? And then I have a follow-up.

另外，關於 Molecular Universe，我知道你一直在談論來自大型企業和小型企業的不同層級的收入。您能否分享一下，目前這些客戶在採用新技術方面可能遇到的最大瓶頸是什麼？然後我還有一個後續問題。

Yes. On the first one, from a size of revenue and the product perspective, ESS and drones, we expect these two to grow very rapidly, especially on ESS. After we acquired UZ, we're not just selling the hardware anymore. Now we're adding this predict feature on top. So that's really exciting because now we are turning a regular UPS battery pack into an asset that the asset owners can use for energy trading. So it's like supply and demand.

是的。就第一點而言，從收入規模和產品角度來看，ESS 和無人機，我們預計這兩項業務將成長非常迅速，尤其是在 ESS 方面。收購 UZ 之後，我們就不再只是銷售硬體了。現在我們在此基礎上新增了預測功能。這真的很令人興奮，因為現在我們將普通的 UPS 電池組變成了資產所有者可以用於能源交易的資產。所以這就像是供需關係一樣。

And then on the demand side, you have conventional VPP software, but on the supply side, no other VPP software can have as an accurate and advanced monitoring of the battery health, battery safety, battery degradation and all the parameters than ours. So we have a really precise estimation of the state of health of the battery so that gives you an advantage.

在需求方面，您可以使用傳統的虛擬電廠軟體，但在供應方面，沒有任何其他虛擬電廠軟體能夠像我們的軟體一樣，對電池健康狀況、電池安全、電池衰減以及所有參數進行如此準確和先進的監控。因此，我們可以非常精確地評估電池的健康狀態，這能為你帶來優勢。

It's almost like we say that energy trading, it's almost like having Warren Buffett at your fingertip when it comes to energy trading, if you know that level of precise health of your battery. So that we are really excited about this edge box enhanced virtual power plant, especially with this tool that we can add on top of UZ's hardware. So that's ESS.

這就像我們常說的能源交易，如果你能精確掌握電池的健康狀況，就如同擁有沃倫·巴菲特一樣，讓你在能源交易中如魚得水。因此，我們對這種邊緣盒增強型虛擬電廠感到非常興奮，特別是我們可以將這個工具添加到 UZ 的硬體之上。這就是 ESS。

And in drones, -- so drones, it's all about supply chain. It's all about being NDA compliant and then supplying to US and allied drones and then also with the new drones dominance program, we've had this line in Korea, and it's been NDA compliant since 2021. We built this line for GM. It was 100 Mpower cells lithium metal cells. Now we're converting that to 10 Mpower cells for drones. So we have an advantage because we have this asset. It's been NDA compliant since 2021.

而對無人機來說，一切都與供應鏈有關。一切都是為了遵守保密協議，然後向美國及其盟國的無人機提供產品。此外，隨著新的無人機主導計畫的實施，我們在韓國也建立了一條生產線，自 2021 年以來一直符合保密協議的要求。這條生產線是我們為通用汽車公司建造的。這是100個Mpower鋰金屬電池。現在我們正在將其轉換為用於無人​​機的 10 個 Mpower 電池。所以我們擁有這項資產，因此具有優勢。自 2021 年以來，它一直符合保密協議的要求。

And then that market is also growing very rapidly, especially under the new drones dominance program. So I think these two are the most exciting from a size of revenue growth. And then as Jing mentioned earlier, the bulk of the revenue from this year, 2026, we expect will come from these two areas.

而且，這個市場也在快速成長，尤其是在新的無人機主導計畫的推動下。所以我覺得從營收成長規模來看，這兩家公司是最令人興奮的。正如 Jing 前面提到的，我們預計從今年到 2026 年，大部分收入將來自這兩個領域。

In terms of Molecular Universe, we are making very exciting progress, and we're getting some of the largest battery companies and car companies to sign on to this platform, and we expect to make some announcements in the coming months.

就 Molecular Universe 而言，我們正在取得非常令人興奮的進展，一些最大的電池公司和汽車公司正在簽約加入這個平台，我們預計將在未來幾個月內發布一些公告。

And I think in terms of bottleneck, I think it's just new. For example, AI Science has been used in drug discovery a lot, not so much in materials, not so much in chemicals and not so much in batteries. So it's just new.

我認為就瓶頸而言，這只是一個新的問題。例如，人工智慧科學在藥物發現領域應用廣泛，但在材料、化學品和電池領域應用較少。所以它是新的。

But finally, as we said, we use that platform and we demonstrated that we could actually indeed use that and develop six new materials. I mean, previously, it was like it would take you a few years to discover material. And then we've discovered six materials in just over about nine months, nine months to a year. And then later, we'll add more features to it.

但最後，正如我們所說，我們利用該平台，並證明我們確實可以利用該平台開發六種新材料。我的意思是，以前好像要花好幾年才能發現素材。然後，我們在短短九個月到一年的時間裡發現了六種材料。之後，我們還會增加更多功能。

And hopefully, we can get to six new materials per month and per week. So that acceleration of rate of discovery, that's something we're quite excited about.

希望我們能夠達到每月和每週推出六種新材料的目標。因此，這種發現速度的加快，讓我們感到非常興奮。

Got it. And then I wanted to ask a question about OpEx in 2026. It seems that you're characterizing a spending level that is lower than 2025 and that is going to likely sustain at this 2026 level on a go-forward basis. Can we maybe just understand the reason for that? If you're looking to grow these different areas of the business, what is it that you've done that, I guess, allows you to not have to spend further to grow the business?

知道了。然後我想問一個關於 2026 年營運支出的問題。看來您所描述的支出水準低於 2025 年，並​​且很可能在未來幾年內維持在 2026 年的水準。我們能否了解一下其中的原因？如果您希望發展業務的各個方面，那麼您做了哪些事情，使您無需進一步投入資金來發展業務？

I can address that. So I think the 2026 reduction partially is coming from just being disciplined on spending cash on OpEx in general. We have been reducing G&A and also R&D expenses year over year if you go back to 2023, 2024, 2025 year over year, we're managing our costs very efficiently. So that's that part.

我可以回答這個問題。所以我認為 2026 年的減少部分原因是由於在營運支出方面普遍採取了嚴格的現金支出紀律。我們一直逐年降低一般管理費用和研發費用。如果回顧 2023 年、2024 年、2025 年，就會發現我們對成本的管理非常有效。那部分就到此為止了。

And second, the MU as an internal tool for AI for science is creating a lot of efficiencies. And also as part of growth into these three businesses, we're more focused as far as spending cash on product development related R&D and then there will be growth as far as spending wise on the SG&A side like sales and marketing, but it's not linear to the revenue growth.

其次，MU 作為人工智慧在科學領域的內部工具，正在創造許多效率。此外，隨著這三項業務的成長，我們將更加重視將資金投入產品開發相關的研發中，然後在銷售和行銷等 SG&A 方面的支出也會有所成長，但這與收入成長並非線性關係。

So overall, together, including R&D and SG&A we forecast this year to be lower than last year and then sustain at least for the foreseeable future.

因此，總體而言，包括研發和銷售、管理及行政費用在內，我們預測今年的總支出將低於去年，並且至少在可預見的未來將保持在這一水平。

(Operator Instructions) Colin Rusch, Oppenheimer.

（操作說明）Colin Rusch，奧本海默。

Can you talk a little bit about the drone market and the volume of customers you're working with and how mature those relationships are in terms of working through the design process. and potentially being able to announce a purchase award here over the next, call it, several quarters?

您能否談談無人機市場、您目前合作的客戶數量，以及這些合作關係在設計流程上的成熟度？我們是否有可能在接下來的幾季內宣布一項採購協議？

Yes. The drones market is really going through a lot of pressure to change supply chain with the NDA compliance requirements. And then we are focusing on some of the top customers, for example, customers that will order in the range of single-digit millions to potentially more than $10 million a year. Yes. So we are mainly focused on those larger customers. And we actually started testing, engaging with them last year.

是的。由於保密協議的合規要求，無人機市場正面臨改變供應鏈的巨大壓力。然後，我們將重點放在一些頂級客戶身上，例如，那些每年訂購金額在數百萬美元到超過 1000 萬美元之間的客戶。是的。所以我們主要關注的是那些大客戶。實際上，我們從去年就開始與他們進行測試和互動了。

Last year was really when everyone tried to change the supply chain. And I think if a major Jones manufacturer hasn't changed the supply chain by now, I think it's almost a bit too late. So a lot of testing engagement started last year.

去年是所有人嘗試改變供應鏈的一年。我認為，如果瓊斯的主要製造商到現在還沒有改變供應鏈，那就有點太晚了。因此，許多測試參與工作都是從去年開始的。

And then now we are just in the final stage of converting the lines. For example, right now in Boston, we can make pilot scale less than 100,000 cells per year. In Korea, we can make about 200 to 300 cells per year. We're trying to expand that. And then in Southeast Asia, we're also looking to expand to several million cells. This all for -- this is all NDA compliant sales for drones customers.

現在我們正處於轉換線路的最後階段。例如，目前在波士頓，我們每年可以生產不到 10 萬個細胞的試點規模產品。在韓國，我們每年大約可以生產 200 到 300 個細胞。我們正在努力擴大這方面的規模。然後，在東南亞，我們也計劃將規模擴大到數百萬個細胞。這一切都是為了——這一切都是符合保密協議的無人機客戶銷售。

Excellent. And then obviously, you had some really meaningful success at the molecule level, leveraging some of the AI capabilities. I'm curious about your ability to leverage some of that know-how into pack level design and even into system integration design and modeling out some of the duty cycles that may be just to accelerate some of the adoption as you look at some of the robotics and drone opportunities?

出色的。然後很顯然，你們在分子層面上利用人工智慧的一些能力取得了一些真正有意義的成功。我很好奇您是否有能力將這些專業知識運用到組件級設計，甚至系統整合設計以及建模一些工作週期中，以加快您在機器人和無人機領域的一些應用場景？

So you're saying how we can apply this to pack level and sub cell level?

所以你的意思是說，我們如何將這個方法應用到包裝層級和子單元層級？

Yes, at the pack level and even the system level design beyond that pack level. Yes.

是的，在包裝級別，甚至在包裝級別之上的系統級別設計中都是如此。是的。

Yes, we're starting to add that feature. We've got some requests from automakers that want to do the design and predict features at the pack and system level. So we are adding those features. And then also for energy storage, right now, we are adding Molecular Universe predict into the systems.

是的，我們正在開始添加這個功能。我們收到了一些汽車製造商的請求，他們希望在電池組和系統層面進行設計和功能預測。所以我們正在添加這些功能。此外，在儲能方面，我們目前正在將 Molecular Universe 預測技術添加到系統中。

So the predict -- we put that in a small box, we call that edge box. And then that works at the cell level and also the back-end system level.

所以，我們預測——我們把它放在一個小盒子裡，我們稱之為邊緣盒。然後，這種方法既適用於單元級別，也適用於後端系統級別。

Mark Shooter, William Blair.

馬克舒特，威廉布萊爾。

I believe I heard you say that the auto OEM JVs are on hold. Could you clarify that a bit? And then I'm seeing that the industry is -- especially the auto industry is trying to move away from lithium metal. However, at the same time, I'm seeing some local competitors actually enter the public markets here with their lithium metal product. So has any of the engagement appetite with your OEM customers changed around lithium metal? I mean, how are you looking at this?

我好像聽您說過，汽車OEM合資企業專案都暫停了。您能再解釋一下嗎？然後我發現，整個產業——尤其是汽車產業——正在努力擺脫鋰金屬。然而同時，我看到一些當地競爭對手正帶著他們的鋰金屬產品進入這裡的公開市場。那麼，你們與OEM客戶的合作意願在鋰金屬方面是否有所改變？我的意思是，你是怎麼看待這件事的？

Yes. So I mean, we were developing pure lithium metal as well as hybrid lithium metal and silicon anode, and we met all the technical requirements. It's just in terms of OEM appetite for high energy density batteries. I would say back in 2021, the OEM appetite for high energy density batteries was very high.

是的。我的意思是，我們當時正在開發純鋰金屬以及鋰金屬和矽的混合負極，我們滿足了所有技術要求。這只是就原始設備製造商對高能量密度電池的需求而言。我想說，早在 2021 年，OEM 對高能量密度電池的需求就非常高。

But now -- and that's still there, but maybe at R&D level, A sample level and demo car level, but not at C-sample level, which is like mass production. And I'm not seeing any auto OEMs that's going to mass production with a next-gen chemistry. There's a lot of price pressure, cost pressure and most OEMs are switching to just LFP graphite.

但現在——這種情況仍然存在，但可能在研發層面、A 樣品層面和展示車層面，但不在 C 樣品層面，也就是大規模生產層面。而且我沒看到任何汽車原始設備製造商會採用下一代化學技術進行大規模生產。價格壓力和成本壓力很大，大多數原始設備製造商都在轉向使用磷酸鋰鐵石墨。

Yes. Okay. And that makes a lot of sense. And that justifies what we're seeing, too. So that confused me a bit. But switching gears to the ESS market, which is rapidly growing, that is a fragmented market with many different levels to it. And I'm wondering what do you see as the most value add? Where would you play? What is the strategy for the UZ Energy acquisition?

是的。好的。這很有道理。這也解釋了我們所看到的現象。這讓我有點困惑。但換個話題，看看正在快速成長的儲能係統市場，這是一個分散的市場，包含許多不同的層次。我想知道您認為最有價值的附加價值是什麼？你會在哪裡比賽？UZ Energy的收購策略是什麼？

And what section of that energy storage market would you play in? And why are you most advantaged to that section?

那麼，您會涉足儲能市場的哪個領域呢？為什麼你最適合那個部門？

Yes. Yes, exactly the ESS market is very fragmented. It's got a long tail. And the benefit that we bring -- so the ESS market currently does not have a stable widespread operating system, maybe except for Tesla. But in ESS, it's like Tesla and the long tail, very fragmented. So what we can provide is almost like the Android version.

是的。是的，儲能係統市場確實非常分散。它有一條長尾巴。我們帶來的好處是──目前儲能係統市場還沒有一個穩定且廣泛的作業系統，也許特斯拉除外。但在 ESS 領域，情況就像特斯拉和長尾市場一樣，非常分散。所以，我們能提供的幾乎和安卓版本一樣。

And then -- so for commercial industrial and for data center applications, the asset owners actually want to use their battery packs for energy trading, but they're not able to do that, and they're not able to differentiate if they use conventional virtual power plant softwares. So what we can do is because we actually collect the data from the battery, we can have a very accurate estimation of self charge, self-health, see safety, degradation, power, all these different features.

然後——對於商業工業和數據中心應用而言，資產所有者實際上希望使用他們的電池組進行能源交易，但他們無法做到這一點，而且如果他們使用傳統的虛擬電廠軟體，他們也無法區分。因此，由於我們實際上收集了電池的數據，我們可以非常準確地估算自充電、自健康、安全性、衰減、功率以及所有這些不同的特性。

So what that means is when you do the trading, it's supply and demand. Demand is set by the market, by weather, by -- if there's any major sporting events. But the supply, that's set by accurate estimation of SOX and then that we can provide. So that's where this edge box enhanced virtual power plant really shines.

所以這意味著，當你進行交易時，就是供需關係在運作。需求由市場、天氣以及——如果有重大體育賽事——決定。但供應量取決於對 SOX 的準確估算，然後我們才能提供。所以，這就是這種邊緣盒增強型虛擬電廠的真正優勢所在。

So I think the value that we can provide is we can provide this operating system to not just use these battery packs, but to multiple of this long tail of this fragmented market.

所以我認為我們能提供的價值在於，我們不僅可以提供這款作業系統來使用這些電池組，還可以為這個分散市場中的眾多用戶提供作業系統。

There are currently no other questions in queue. So I'll pass it back over to Kyle Pilkington.

目前隊列中沒有其他問題。那麼，我就把麥克風交還給凱爾·皮爾金頓吧。

Thank you. As within our past earnings calls, we offered investors the opportunity to submit questions in advance and we'll cover a brief selection of those questions now.

謝謝。和以往的財報電話會議一樣，我們為投資者提供了提前提交問題的機會，現在我們將簡要介紹其中的一些問題。

The first question is, is there a binding definitive agreement with top material yet? And can you generally provide some details on current NDAA compliance status?

第一個問題是，是否已經與頂級材料供應商達成具有約束力的最終協議？您能否大致介紹一下目前《國防授權法案》的合規情況？

Yes. So top material is one of the options we are exploring. And then as I mentioned earlier, we've had this Korea facility since 2021. It's been NDA compliant since 2021. And then we are focusing on converting this to produce drones batteries.

是的。所以，優質材料是我們正在考慮的方案之一。正如我之前提到的，我們從 2021 年起就在韓國設立了這家工廠。自 2021 年以來，它一直符合保密協議的要求。然後我們正致力於將其轉化為無人機電池的生產基地。

And then in addition to this to our own Korea facility, we're also looking at options in Southeast Asia and then potentially offer better pricing, better value and larger scale to customers. And again, they're all NDA compliant. And actually, we just updated our website and now we have updated drones battery product brochure that's on our website. And then the sales are NDA compliant.

除了我們在韓國的工廠之外，我們還在考慮東南亞的工廠，以便為客戶提供更優惠的價格、更高的價值和更大的規模。再次強調，它們都符合保密協議的要求。實際上，我們剛剛更新了我們的網站，現在網站上有更新的無人機電池產品手冊。而且銷售活動均符合保密協議。

Great. I think we have time for one more. So the question is, with Wildcat and BMW and Aonics and Porsche securing JDAs for AI-driven materials, how is SES protecting its Molecular Universe data advantage to ensure it doesn't lose OEM partners to these specialized private competitors?

偉大的。我想我們還有時間再來一個。因此，問題是，隨著 Wildcat、寶馬、Aonics 和保時捷獲得人工智慧驅動材料的聯合開發協議 (JDA)，SES 如何保護其 Molecular Universe 數據優勢，以確保不會將 OEM 合作夥伴拱手讓給這些專業的私人競爭對手？

So I think we announced that we're offering Molecular Universe to the public mid last year after these other announcements were made. And then Molecular Universe, if we look at the latest version of M Universe 1.5, and we have a 2.0 coming out soon, it really is a game-changing platform for battery development in the EV space. So we're seeing a lot of the OEMs and big battery companies actually using this platform.

所以我覺得，在發布其他公告之後，我們在去年年中宣布了向公眾提供 Molecular Universe 服務。然後是 Molecular Universe，如果我們看一下最新版本的 M Universe 1.5，而且 2.0 版本也即將推出，它確實是電動車領域電池開發的顛覆性平台。所以我們看到很多原始設備製造商和大型電池公司都在使用這個平台。

Great. That's all we have for the investor questions. So I'll pass it back to the operator to conclude the call.

偉大的。以上就是我們針對投資人問題的全部。所以我會把電話轉回接線生結束通話。

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect your lines.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。現在您可以斷開線路了。