Pennantpark Investment Corp (PNNT) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, and welcome to the PennantPark Investment Corporation's third fiscal quarter 2024 earnings conference call. Today's conference is being recorded. (Operator Instructions)

下午好，歡迎參加 PennantPark Investment Corporation 2024 第三財季財報電話會議。今天的會議正在錄製中。（操作員說明）

It is now my pleasure to turn the call over to Mr. Art Penn, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of PennantPark Investment Corporation. Mr. Penn, you may begin your conference.

現在我很高興將電話轉給 PennantPark Investment Corporation 董事長兼執行長 Art Penn 先生。佩恩先生，您可以開始會議了。

I'd like to welcome you to PennantPark Investment Corporation's third fiscal quarter 2024 earnings conference call. I'm joined today by Rick Allorto, our Chief Financial Officer.

歡迎您參加 PennantPark Investment Corporation 2024 第三財季收益電話會議。今天我們的財務長 Rick Allorto 也加入了我的行列。

Rick, please start off by disclosing some general conference call information and include a discussion about forward-looking statements.

里克（Rick），首先請披露一些股東大會電話會議信息，並包括有關前瞻性陳述的討論。

Thank you, Art.

謝謝你，藝術。

I'd like to remind everyone that today's call is being recorded. Please note that this call is the property of PennantPark Investment Corporation and that any unauthorized broadcast of this call in any form is strictly prohibited. An audio replay of the call will be available on our website. I'd also like to call your attention to the customary safe harbor disclosure in our press release regarding forward-looking information.

我想提醒大家，今天的通話正在進行錄音。請注意，本次電話會議屬於 PennantPark Investment Corporation 的財產，嚴禁以任何形式未經授權廣播本次電話會議。我們的網站上將提供通話的音訊重播。我還想提請您注意我們新聞稿中有關前瞻性資訊的慣例安全港披露。

Today's conference call may also include forward-looking statements and projections and we ask that you refer to our most recent filings with the SEC for important factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from these projections.

今天的電話會議還可能包括前瞻性陳述和預測，我們要求您參考我們向 SEC 提交的最新文件，以了解可能導致實際結果與這些預測有重大差異的重要因素。

We do not undertake to update our forward-looking statements unless required by law. To obtain copies of our latest SEC filings, please visit our website at pennantpark.com or call us at (212) 905-1000.

除非法律要求，我們不承諾更新我們的前瞻性陳述。如需我們最新的 SEC 文件副本，請造訪我們的網站 pennantpark.com 或致電 (212) 905-1000。

At this time, I'd like to turn the call back to our Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Art Penn.

現在，我想將電話轉回給我們的董事長兼執行長 Art Penn。

Thanks, Rick.

謝謝，瑞克。

We're going to spend a few minutes and comment on the current market environment for private middle market credit, how we fared in the quarter ended June 30, how the portfolio is positioned for the upcoming quarters, a detailed review of the financials and then open it up for Q&A.

我們將花幾分鐘時間評論當前私人中間市場信貸的市場環境、我們在截至 6 月 30 日的季度的表現、投資組合在未來幾個季度的定位、對財務狀況的詳細審查，然後打開它進行問答。

For the quarter ended June 30, our GAAP net investment income was $0.24 per share and our core net investment income was $0.21 per share. GAAP and adjusted NAV decreased 2.2% to $7.52 per share from $7.69 per share. The decrease in NAV for the quarter was due primarily to valuation adjustments on the nonaccrual loans partially offset by increases in several equity investments.

截至 6 月 30 日的季度，我們的 GAAP 淨投資收益為每股 0.24 美元，核心淨投資收益為每股 0.21 美元。GAAP 和調整後淨值從每股 7.69 美元下降 2.2% 至每股 7.52 美元。本季資產淨值下降的主要原因是非應計貸款的估值調整被多項股權投資的增加部分抵消。

As of June 30, our portfolio totaled $1.2 billion. During the quarter, we continue to originate attractive investment opportunities and invested $163 million and 11 new and 42 existing portfolio companies at a weighted average yield of 12%. We continue to see an attractive vintage in the core middle market. For investments in new portfolio companies, the weighted average debt-to-EBITDA was 3.4 times, the weighted average interest coverage was 1.9 times, and the weighted average loan to value was 50%.

截至 6 月 30 日，我們的投資組合總額為 12 億美元。本季度，我們繼續創造有吸引力的投資機會，投資了 1.63 億美元，投資了 11 家新投資組合公司和 42 家現有投資組合公司，加權平均收益率為 12%。我們繼續在核心中間市場看到有吸引力的年份。對於新投資組合公司的投資，加權平均負債與 EBITDA 為 3.4 倍，加權平均利息覆蓋率為 1.9 倍，加權平均貸款價值率為 50%。

As of June 30, the portfolio's weighted average to leverage ratio through our debt security was 4.3 times and the portfolio's weighted average interest coverage was 2 times. These attractive credit statistics are a testament to our selectivity, conservative orientation and our focus on the core middle market.

截至 6 月 30 日，我們債務證券的投資組合加權平均槓桿率為 4.3 倍，投資組合的加權平均利息保障倍數為 2 倍。這些有吸引力的信貸統計數據證明了我們的選擇性、保守導向以及對核心中間市場的關注。

During 2024, the market yield on first lien term loans has tightened 50 to 75 basis points. As the credit statistics just highlight indicate, we continue to believe that the current vintage of core middle market directly originated loans is excellent. In the core middle market, leverage is lower, spreads are higher and covenants are tighter than in the upper middle market.

2024 年期間，第一留置權定期貸款的市場收益率已收緊 50 至 75 個基點。正如剛剛強調的信貸統計數據所表明的那樣，我們仍然認為核心中間市場直接發放貸款的當前狀況非常好。與中高端市場相比，核心中端市場的槓桿率更低，利差更高，契約更嚴格。

Despite covenant erosion in the upper middle market and the core middle market, we're still getting meaningful covenant protections. At June 30, the JV portfolio equaled $926 million. During the quarter, the JV invested $56 million, including $38 million of purchases from PNNT. During the quarter, the JV made a special dividend of $4.2 million and PNNT share was $2.5 million.

儘管中高階市場和核心中端市場的契約受到侵蝕，但我們仍然獲得了有意義的契約保護。截至 6 月 30 日，合資企業投資組合總額達 9.26 億美元。本季度，合資公司投資了 5,600 萬美元，其中包括從 PNNT 購買的 3,800 萬美元。本季度，合資公司派發了 420 萬美元的特別股息，PNNT 股份為 250 萬美元。

The dividend was the distribution of the JV's cumulative undistributed net investment income, the special dividend is another indicator of the earnings power of the JV. With its current capital base, the JV portfolio can grow to $1.1 billion.

股利是合資公司累計未分配淨投資收益的分配，特別股利是合資公司獲利能力的另一個指標。憑藉目前的資本基礎，合資企業投資組合可以成長到 11 億美元。

We're having discussions with our JV partner to potentially grow the JV. Over the last 12 months, PNNT earned a 19.5% return on invested capital in the joint venture. We expect that with continued growth in the JV portfolio, the JV investment will enhance PNNT's earnings momentum in future quarters. Credit quality remained strong. We had three non-accruals as of June 30. Non-accruals represented 4.2% of the portfolio cost and 2.5% at market value.

我們正在與我們的合資夥伴討論以發展合資企業。在過去 12 個月中，PNNT 在合資企業中獲得了 19.5% 的投資報酬率。我們預計，隨著合資公司投資組合的持續成長，合資公司投資將增強 PNNT 未來幾季的獲利動力。信貸品質依然強勁。截至 6 月 30 日，我們有三筆非應計費用。非應計費用佔投資組合成本的 4.2%，以市價計算佔 2.5%。

Now let me turn to the current market environment. We are well-positioned as a lender focused on capital preservation in the United States. We continue to believe that our focus on the core middle market provides the company with attractive investment opportunities where we provide important strategic capital to our borrowers. We have a long-term track record of generating value by successfully financing growing companies -- growing middle market companies in five key sectors.

現在讓我談談當前的市場環境。作為一家專注於美國資本保全的貸款人，我們處於有利地位。我們仍然相信，我們對核心中間市場的關注為公司提供了一個有吸引力的投資機會，我們為借款人提供了重要的策略資本。我們擁有透過成功為成長型公司（五個關鍵領域的成長型中端市場公司）提供融資來創造價值的長期記錄。

These are sectors where we have substantial domain expertise, have the right questions to ask and have an excellent track record. There are business services, consumer, government services and defense, health care and software and technology. These sectors have also been recession-resilient and tend to generate strong free cash flow. The core middle market, which are companies with $10 million to $50 million of EBITDA is below the threshold and does not compete with the broadly syndicated or high-yield markets, unlike our peers in the upper middle market.

在這些領域，我們擁有豐富的領域專業知識，有正確的問題要問，並且擁有出色的業績記錄。其中包括商業服務、消費者、政府服務和國防、醫療保健以及軟體和技術。這些行業也具有抵禦衰退的能力，並且往往會產生強勁的自由現金流。核心中階市場是指 EBITDA 為 1,000 萬至 5,000 萬美元的公司，低於門檻，不會與廣泛的銀團或高收益市場競爭，這與我們在中高階市場的同業不同。

In the core middle market, because we are an important strategic lending partner, the process and packaging terms we receive is attractive. We have many weeks to do our diligence with care. We thoughtfully structured transactions with sensible credit statistics, meaningful covenants, substantial equity cushions to protect our capital, attractive spreads and equity co-investment. Additionally, from a monitoring perspective, we received monthly financial statements to help us stay on top of the companies.

在核心中間市場，由於我們是重要的策略貸款合作夥伴，因此我們收到的流程和包裝條款很有吸引力。我們有好幾個星期的時間來認真地盡職盡責。我們透過合理的信用統計數據、有意義的契約、保護我們資本的大量股權緩衝、有吸引力的利差和股權共同投資，精心設計了交易結構。此外，從監控的角度來看，我們收到了每月的財務報表，以幫助我們保持對公司的領先地位。

With regard to covenants, unlike the erosion of the upper middle market, virtually all of our originated first lien loans have meaningful covenants to help protect our capital. This is a significant reason why we believe we're well positioned in this environment. Many of our peers who focus on the upper middle market state that those bigger companies are less risky. That is a perception that may make some intuitive sense, but the reality is different.

關於契約，與中高端市場的侵蝕不同，我們幾乎所有發起的第一留置權貸款都有有意義的契約來幫助保護我們的資本。這是我們相信我們在這種環境中處於有利位置的一個重要原因。我們許多專注於中高端市場的同業表示，那些規模較大的公司風險較小。這種看法可能具有一定的直覺意義，但現實卻有所不同。

According to S&P, loans to companies with less than $50 million of EBITDA at a lower default rate and higher recovery rate than loans with the companies with higher EBITDA. We believe that the meaningful covenant protections of core middle market loans, more careful diligence and tighter monitoring have been an important part of this differentiated performance.

根據標準普爾的數據，與 EBITDA 較高的公司相比，向 EBITDA 低於 5,000 萬美元的公司提供的貸款違約率較低，回收率較高。我們認為，對核心中間市場貸款的有意義的契約保護、更仔細的盡職調查和更嚴格的監控是這種差異化表現的重要組成部分。

As a provider of strategic capital, which fuels the growth of our portfolio companies. In many cases, we participated in the upside of the company by making an equity co-investment. Our returns on these equity co-investments have been excellent over time. Overall, for our platform from inception through June 30, we have invested over $511 million in equity co-investments, have generated an IRR of 26% and have generated a multiple uninvested capital of 2 times.

作為策略資本的提供者，這推動了我們投資組合公司的發展。在很多情況下，我們透過股權跟投的方式參與了公司的上漲。隨著時間的推移，我們這些股權共同投資的回報一直非常出色。總體而言，從我們的平台成立到 6 月 30 日，我們已投資了超過 5.11 億美元的股權共同投資，產生了 26% 的 IRR，並產生了 2 倍的未投資資本。

Since inception, nearly 17 years ago, PNNT has invested $8.2 billion at an average yield of 11.3% and has experienced a loss ratio on invested capital of about 20 basis points annually. This strong track record includes investments of primarily subordinated debt, made prior to the global financial crisis, legacy energy investments and recently, the pandemic.

自成立以來，即近 17 年前，PNNT 已投資 82 億美元，平均殖利率為 11.3%，投資資本損失率每年約為 20 個基點。這一良好的記錄包括全球金融危機之前進行的主要次級債務投資、傳統能源投資以及最近的大流行。

With regard to the outlook, new loans on our target market are attractive. Our experienced and talented team in our wide origination funnel is producing active deal flow. Our continued focus remains on capital preservation and being patient investors. We want to reiterate our goal to generate attractive risk-adjusted returns through income, coupled with long-term preservation of capital.

就前景而言，我們目標市場的新貸款具有吸引力。我們經驗豐富、才華洋溢的團隊在廣泛的發起管道中正在產生活躍的交易流。我們繼續關注資本保值和成為耐心的投資者。我們想重申我們的目標，透過收入產生有吸引力的風險調整回報，並長期保存資本。

We seek to find investment opportunities in growing middle market companies with a high free cash flow conversion, we capture that free cash flow primarily in debt instruments, and we pay out those contractual cash flows in the form of dividends to our shareholders.

我們尋求在具有高自由現金流轉換的成長型中間市場公司中尋找投資機會，我們主要透過債務工具捕獲自由現金流，並以股息的形式向股東支付這些合約現金流。

Let me now turn the call over to Rick, our CFO, to take us through the financial results.

現在讓我將電話轉給我們的財務長 Rick，讓我們了解財務表現。

Thank you, Art.

謝謝你，藝術。

For the quarter ended June 30, GAAP net investment income was $0.24 per share and core net investment income was $0.21 per share. During the quarter, we received a special dividend of $2.5 million or $0.03 per share from the JV, which consisted of cumulative undistributed net investment income from prior periods. Given the nonrecurring nature of this dividend, we have excluded it from our core net investment income.

截至 6 月 30 日的季度，GAAP 淨投資收益為每股 0.24 美元，核心淨投資收益為每股 0.21 美元。本季度，我們從合資公司收到了 250 萬美元的特別股息，即每股 0.03 美元，其中包括前期累積的未分配淨投資收益。鑑於該股息的非經常性質，我們已將其排除在我們的核心淨投資收入之外。

Operating expenses for the quarter were as follows: interest and credit facility expenses were $11.5 million, base management and incentive fees were $7.5 million, general and administrative expenses were $1.5 million and provision for excise taxes was $0.7 million. For the quarter ended June 30, net realized and unrealized change on investments and debt, including provision for taxes, was a loss of $12 million.

本季的營運支出如下：利息和信貸便利支出為 1,150 萬美元，基本管理和激勵費用為 750 萬美元，一般和行政支出為 150 萬美元，消費稅撥備為 70 萬美元。截至 6 月 30 日的季度，投資和債務的已實現和未實現淨變化（包括稅務撥備）為虧損 1,200 萬美元。

As of June 30, our GAAP and adjusted NAV was $7.52 per share, which is down 2.2% from $7.69 per share in the prior quarter. As of June 30, our debt-to-equity ratio was 1.5 times, and our capital structure is diversified across multiple funding sources, including both secured and unsecured debt.

截至 6 月 30 日，我們的 GAAP 和調整後淨值為每股 7.52 美元，比上一季每股 7.69 美元下降 2.2%。截至 6 月 30 日，我們的負債股本比率為 1.5 倍，我們的資本結構多元化，涵蓋多種融資來源，包括有擔保和無擔保債務。

As of June 30, our key portfolio statistics were as follows: our portfolio remains highly diversified with 144 companies across 30 different industries. The weighted average yield on our debt investments was 12.7%. We had three non-accruals, which represents 4.2% of the portfolio at cost and 2.5% at market value.

截至 6 月 30 日，我們的主要投資組合統計數據如下：我們的投資組合仍然高度多元化，擁有 30 個不同行業的 144 家公司。我們的債務投資加權平均收益率為12.7%。我們有三項非應計費用，以成本計算佔投資組合的 4.2%，以市價計算佔 2.5%。

The portfolio is comprised of 56% first lien secured debt, 5% second lien secured debt, 10% subordinated notes to PSLF, 4% other subordinated debt, 6% equity in PSLF, and 19% in other preferred and common equity. 96% of the debt portfolio is floating rate. Debt-to-EBITDA on the portfolio is 4.3 times and interest coverage ratio is 2.0 times.

該投資組合由56% 第一留置權擔保債務、5% 第二留置權擔保債務、10% PSLF 次級票據、4% 其他次級債務、6% PSLF 股權以及19% 其他優先股和普通股組成。 96%的債務組合為浮動利率。投資組合的債務對 EBITDA 為 4.3 倍，利息保障倍數為 2.0 倍。

Now let me turn the call back to Art.

現在讓我把電話轉回藝術。

In closing, I'd like to thank our dedicated and talented team of professionals for their continued commitment to PNNT and its shareholders. Thank you all for your time today and for your continued investment and confidence in us.

最後，我要感謝我們敬業且才華橫溢的專業團隊對 PNNT 及其股東的持續承諾。感謝大家今天抽出寶貴的時間，感謝大家對我們的持續投資與信任。

That concludes our remarks. At this time, I would like to open up the call to questions.

我們的發言到此結束。此時，我想開放提問。

(Operator Instructions) Mark Hughes, Truist.

（操作員說明）Mark Hughes，Truist。

The return potential, you described very good, the 19.5% return on invested capital in the JV. If you increase the size of that as apparently you're discussing, what's the -- how does that change the return profile? And is that level of return sustainable?

您所描述的報酬潛力非常好，合資企業的投資資本報酬率為 19.5%。如果你像你正在討論的那樣增加它的大小，那麼這會如何改變回報率？這種回報水平是否可持續？

Mark, it's Art. Good question. Look, we -- certainly, the returns of these vehicles, the BDC itself for the JV are high now. We've been in a high interest rate environment. So I would say to the extent that interest rates start to come down, yields will come down across the platform in the BDC as well as the JV. Today, we've had a really good credit performance in that JV.

馬克，這是藝術。好問題。看，我們——當然，這些車輛、合資企業的 BDC 本身的回報現在很高。我們一直處於高利率環境。因此，我想說，只要利率開始下降，BDC 和合資企業整個平台的收益率就會下降。今天，我們在該合資企業的信用表現非常好。

There's never an assurance that we'll continue that. But we're very pleased with the upper teens. I think if you want to model it, you can certainly be modeling it into the upper teens. And to the extent we finalize the arrangement to upsize the JV, whatever capital PNNT puts in, you can certainly model it in an attractive return on that capital, which should certainly be accretive to PNNT.

永遠不能保證我們會繼續這樣做。但我們對高年級的學生非常滿意。我想如果你想模仿它，當然可以把它塑造成十幾歲的孩子。只要我們最終確定擴大合資企業規模的安排，無論 PNNT 投入多少資本，您都可以將其模型化為有吸引力的資本回報，這肯定會對 PNNT 產生增值作用。

And then the dividend trajectory, you had a special dividend this quarter, obviously, refresh me on how that has trended over time, what the usual pacing has been on those sorts of dividends.

然後是股息軌跡，顯然，本季度有特別股息，讓我重新了解隨著時間的推移，股息的趨勢如何，這類股息的通常節奏是怎樣的。

Yes. I mean, Rick is going to get you the historical -- I mean, usually, we take whatever the NII for the JV is. We pay out the majority of it, and we leave a little cushion and that cushion accumulates over time. We paid out this amount, which is about $0.03 a share because we wanted to pay out all the undistributed income as we look to potentially upsize the JV. So everyone kind of come in kind of with a fresh slate. Rick, historically?

是的。我的意思是，Rick 將為您提供歷史資訊 - 我的意思是，通常情況下，我們會採用合資企業的 NII。我們支付了其中的大部分，並留下了一點緩衝，並且隨著時間的推移，緩衝會不斷累積。我們支付了這筆金額，大約每股 0.03 美元，因為我們希望支付所有未分配的收入，因為我們希望擴大合資企業的規模。所以每個人都帶著新鮮的狀態而來。歷史上的瑞克？

Yes. So Mark, the -- I'll say, kind of the regular kind of core dividend from the JV is about $4.8 million in the quarter.

是的。馬克，我想說的是，該合資企業的常規核心股息在本季約為 480 萬美元。

Yes. And then the equity co-invest, is that something where you might think about either increasing or decreasing the pacing, as your experience recently been kind of more or less favorable in historical terms? And does that influence your appetite on a go-forward basis?

是的。然後，股權聯合投資是您可能會考慮增加或減少節奏的事情，因為您最近的經歷從歷史角度來看或多或少是有利的？這會影響您今後的食慾嗎？

That's a great question. For us, it's usually less macro and more micro. We're looking at the particular companies, the investments, the entry multiples, the growth parameters, prototypical deals for us, we're starting out with a company that's doing $10 million to $20 million of EBITDA. The sponsor has growth trajectory in mind. There's a delayed draw term loan. We're helping fuel that growth.

這是一個很好的問題。對我們來說，通常不是宏觀的，而是微觀的。我們正在研究特定的公司、投資、進入倍數、成長參數、典型交易，我們從 EBITDA 為 1,000 萬至 2,000 萬美元的公司開始。贊助商考慮到了成長軌跡。有延遲提取定期貸款。我們正在幫助推動這種成長。

So the goal is to take that $10 million to $20 million EBITDA company growth to $30 million, $40 million, $50 million and above with our debt capital being a driver of that. So in many cases, it makes some sense for us to participate in some of that equity by co-investing side-by-side with the sponsor. These are not intended to be large equity bets intended to just be a kind of relatively small amount, but over the course of time, 5% to 10% to maybe 15% of the portfolio.

因此，我們的目標是將 1,000 萬至 2,000 萬美元的 EBITDA 公司成長至 3,000 萬美元、4,000 萬美元、5,000 萬美元及以上，而我們的債務資本是這目標的驅動力。因此，在許多情況下，我們透過與贊助商共同投資來參與部分股權是有意義的。這些並不是大筆的股票押注，只是相對較小的金額，但隨著時間的推移，會佔投資組合的 5% 到 10% 甚至 15%。

Robert Dodd, Raymond James.

羅伯特·多德，雷蒙德·詹姆斯。

First one, I may have missed this. There's been a lot of color. On the JV, you just to mark it, are you paying out the excess so that as it gets upside, everybody come in on the same kind of level, so can I read into that, there's the intent to maybe not just upsize it with the existing partner, but is there an intent to maybe expand the number of partners that are involved in that JV.

第一個，我可能錯過了。已經有很多顏色了。在合資企業中，你只是要標記它，你是否支付了超額費用，以便當它上升時，每個人都處於相同的水平，所以我可以讀一下，有意圖也許不僅僅是擴大規模現有合作夥伴，但是否打算擴大參與該合資企業的合作夥伴數量。

Yes, that's a good question. It's working really well with our existing JV partner. It's been great simpatico. We started with them kind of right after COVID. So kind of -- it's been -- we're kind of three, four years old. I think if we had another third-party, we probably just set up a separate JV -- just you start to get more different deciders around the table, make it more complex and each JV partner has their own way of thinking about things, et cetera.

是的，這是一個好問題。它與我們現有的合資夥伴合作得非常好。真是太和睦了。新冠肺炎疫情發生後，我們就開始與他們合作。就這樣——我們已經三四歲了。我認為，如果我們有另一個第三方，我們可能只是建立一個單獨的合資企業- 只是你開始在桌子上有更多不同的決策者，使其變得更加複雜，並且每個合資夥伴都有自己的思考方式，等等等等。

So I think we're open to another JV over time if we can find the right partner who sees credit the way that we see it and sees the world the way that we see it. So I think that's something to -- that's certainly potentially on the table for PNNT.

因此，我認為，如果我們能找到合適的合作夥伴，以我們看待信用的方式看待信用並以我們看待世界的方式看待世界，那麼隨著時間的推移，我們會對建立另一家合資企業持開放態度。所以我認為這肯定是 PNNT 可能會考慮的事情。

Got it. Just on the market outlook, I mean in terms of pipeline demand, Art, do you expect the recent volatility in the market very short term. So who knows how it's going to add, to affect demand in your area of the market. I mean, yes, there's been some BSLs pulled in the very large market, but that's not the area you're typically competing in. And so is it -- do you expect if the volatility does persist that it would affect sponsor activity in your segment? Or any thoughts on how all that is picking up.

知道了。就市場前景而言，我的意思是就管道需求而言，Art，您預計市場近期的波動是非常短期的嗎？所以誰知道它將如何影響您所在市場區域的需求。我的意思是，是的，在非常大的市場中已經出現了一些 BSL，但這不是您通常競爭的領域。情況也是如此——如果波動確實持續存在，您是否預計會影響您所在細分市場的贊助商活動？或對這一切如何恢復有任何想法。

Yes. When you look going back over many years, and we've been at PennantPark now 17 years of business, when you have market shocks, it takes a little while for the core middle market to impact first, obviously, the broadly syndicated loan market has an impact fairly immediately, which then gets articulated to the upper middle market which then gets articulated to the core middle market where we sit. So typically, it takes up to six months of a choppy market before it impacts -- starts to impact our market. What are we supposed to do in the meantime? We could wait. We've got -- we're never in a rush to invest.

是的。當你回顧過去很多年時，我們在 PennantPark 已經營業了 17 年，當你遇到市場衝擊時，核心中間市場需要一段時間才能首先受到影響，顯然，廣泛的銀團貸款市場已經立即產生影響，然後影響到中高端市場，然後影響我們所在的核心中端市場。因此，通常情況下，動盪的市場需要長達六個月的時間才能開始影響我們的市場。在這段期間我們該做什麼？我們可以等待。我們從不急於投資。

We've learned lessons over the years, you should never been -- here, you never should be in a rush to invest. So we're never in a rush to invest. On the other side, when you find great companies and great capital stacks, it's always a good time to invest because we feel like great companies, great situations end up working out no matter what the scenario is.

多年來我們吸取了教訓，你永遠不應該在這裡——你永遠不應該急於投資。所以我們從不急於投資。另一方面，當你發現偉大的公司和強大的資本儲備時，這總是投資的好時機，因為我們感覺自己是偉大的公司，無論情況如何，偉大的情況最終都會成功。

So I think if this choppiness continues, we certainly are going to be thinking about the macro and seeing what's going on, but we're also going to be, as always, looking at the micro and trying to find excellent companies that we can back and support excellent sponsors and try to work both sides against the middle. I don't know if that makes sense or that you understand what I'm saying.

因此，我認為，如果這種波動持續下去，我們當然會考慮宏觀因素，看看會發生什麼，但我們也將一如既往地關注微觀因素，並試圖找到我們可以支持的優秀公司並支持優秀的讚助商並努力使雙方對抗中間。我不知道我說的話是否有道理，或者你是否明白我在說什麼。

Yes, I think I get the general idea. Again, on the non-accrual or new non-accruals, but there was a new non-accrual last quarter, Flock has been restructured the debt back on accrual in one quarter. You had another new non-accrual this quarter. I mean is this a similar kind of thing where it's going to be very short term and a quick restructuring or can you give us any color on what you expect kind of the timeline this time versus last quarter.

是的，我想我明白了整體思路。同樣，關於非​​應計項目或新的非應計項目，但上個季度出現了新的非應計項目，Flock 在一個季度內將債務重組回應計項目。本季您還有另一項新的非應計費用。我的意思是，這是一種類似的事情，它將是非常短期的和快速的重組，或者您能否給我們任何關於這次與上季度相比的預期時間表的信息。

Yes. Flock, that was a restructuring. We converted debt to equity. We put more money into it. We now control the company. This company is the new nonaccrual it's called Pragmatic. They provide corporate training solutions to product managers, in many cases, technology and other industries.

是的。Flock，那是一次重組。我們將債務轉為股權。我們投入更多的錢。我們現在控制該公司。這家公司是新的非權責發生製公司，被稱為務實公司。他們為產品經理（在許多情況下是技術和其他行業）提供企業培訓解決方案。

The sponsor injected equity underneath us. So this is a little bit different. The sponsor injected equity underneath us, we are not in control at this point. The valuation came in, in the low 60s, and it's a PIK instrument. So given the valuation came in the low 60s and it's PIK, we decided ourselves to put it on nonaccrual.

贊助商向我們注入了股權。所以這有點不同。贊助商向我們注入了股權，我們目前無法控制。估值在 60​​ 左右，它是一種 PIK 工具。因此，考慮到估值在 60​​ 左右，而且是 PIK，我們決定將其設為非應計利息。

Paul Johnson, KBW.

保羅·約翰遜，KBW。

You guys seem to be approaching kind of max leverage on the balance sheet and on the BDC and also JV at least kind of the informal sort of market side, I think you had mentioned on previous calls for the JV. I know you're obviously, potentially in discussions to expand that as well. But can you just kind of talk about your investment capacity here as we sit at kind of 1.5 times leverage, should we kind of see -- expecting to kind of pullback here a little bit and focus on just recycling capital at this point?

你們似乎正在接近資產負債表、BDC 和合資企業的最大槓桿，至少是非正式的市場方面，我想你們在之前關於合資企業的呼籲中已經提到過。我知道您顯然也有可能正在討論擴大這一範圍。但是，您能否在這裡談談您的投資能力，因為我們的槓桿率為 1.5 倍，我們是否應該看到 - 期望在這裡稍微回調並專注於此時僅回收資本？

Yes. Paul, that's a great question. I think that's a fair statement, which is we're full leverage now. We're going to use the JV to deleverage. That's the first thing we're going to do. And then over time, we do expect and hope to get some rotation on the equity portfolio. M&A is starting to pick up again. There are some really interesting equity positions in there. So we're very hopeful that we can rotate some of the equity, which will create dry powder to invest in cash-paying debt securities.

是的。保羅，這是一個很好的問題。我認為這是一個公平的說法，我們現在已經充分利用了。我們將利用合資企業來去槓桿化。這是我們要做的第一件事。隨著時間的推移，我們確實期望並希望股票投資組合能夠得到一些輪換。併購活動再次開始升溫。那裡有一些非常有趣的股票部位。因此，我們非常希望能夠輪換部分股權，這將為投資支付現金的債務證券創造乾粉。

And then I realize, I mean, the portfolio overall hasn't experienced a ton of spread compression. But I mean, within the JV, have you seen any spread compression there? I mean should we be kind of tempering expectations for kind of these additional special dividends and maybe the overall return on JVs. Are you seeing spread compressions at all?

然後我意識到，我的意思是，整個投資組合並沒有經歷大量的價差壓縮。但我的意思是，在合資企業內，您是否看過任何價差壓縮？我的意思是，我們是否應該緩和對這些額外特別股利以及合資企業整體回報的期望。您是否看到了擴散壓縮？

Yes. I mean, look, it's been a great time to be in the lending business, particularly if you could select good companies that pay you back. So we've got a really good track record. In general, we've got a really good track record in the JV. Obviously, when you have assets that are primarily floating rate and their spread compression and yields start coming down. For sure, yields and returns are going to come down in the space.

是的。我的意思是，看，現在是從事貸款業務的好時機，特別是如果您可以選擇能夠償還貸款的好公司。所以我們有非常好的記錄。總的來說，我們在合資企業中有著非常好的記錄。顯然，當你擁有主要是浮動利率的資產時，它們的利差壓縮和收益率開始下降。可以肯定的是，該領域的收益率和回報將會下降。

What I can tell you is on the liability side, we've seen spread compression also. If you were on the call or listened into our earlier call in PFLT. PFLT just recently did a securitization CLO financing. And we got 50 basis points of compression on the liability side in that recent securitization. So if you see it on the asset side, in some way, share perform, you're going to see it on the liability side sometimes sooner, sometimes later.

我可以告訴你的是，在責任方面，我們也看到了利差壓縮。如果您正在通話或在 PFLT 中收聽了我們先前的通話。PFLT最近剛進行了證券化CLO融資。在最近的證券化中，我們在負債方面壓縮了 50 個基點。因此，如果你在資產方面看到它，在某種程度上，股票表現，你會在負債方面看到它，有時會更快，有時會更晚。

Our credit facility, we also redid in PFLT. Again, we did it at a tighter spread. So it may take a little while for it to -- you're never fully 100% matched. But if asset spreads are coming down, liability spreads are coming down as well.

我們還在 PFLT 中重新提供了我們的信貸額度。我們再次以更窄的價差做到了這一點。因此，可能需要一段時間才能實現——你們永遠不會完全 100% 匹配。但如果資產利差下降，負債利差也會下降。

And then one more on the JV. What level or, if any, you have loans within the JV, the structure allows and then kind of what percent of, if any, is in the JV.

然後是關於合資企業的另一件事。您在合資企業內擁有什麼級別的貸款或（如果有）貸款，結構允許，然後是合資企業中的貸款百分比（如果有）。

Yes, it's very small. We don't have it -- I don't -- I don't think we have it in hand here. We can certainly call you back, but our level of PIK is very low in the JV. We've had in the nearly four years, we've had one nonaccrual in the JV to date, Dynata Research now. So it's been -- I think it's very, very clean, but we can call you back or I can call you back later, but it's a very low number in terms of PIK.

是的，它很小。我們沒有——我沒有——我認為我們這裡沒有。我們當然可以回電，但我們在合資企業中的 PIK 水平非常低。近四年來，我們在合資企業中擁有一項非應計利息，即 Dynata Research。所以，我認為它非常非常乾淨，但我們可以回電，或者我可以稍後再給您回電，但就 PIK 而言，這是一個非常低的數字。

Melissa Wedel, JPMorgan.

梅麗莎‧韋德爾，摩根大通。

Art, you touched on my first one. I know that equity rotation has been a long-term pull, at least for part of the allocation there. You mentioned it just now that remains part of the strategy. Given the sort of general sentiment around expecting a pickup in deal activity in the second half and as rates come down, you didn't mention it earlier, but I'm wondering if there are any -- if you feel like part of the portfolio is particularly well positioned for that? Is there anything that we should be thinking about in terms of sort of modeling and timing and rotating part of that?

藝術，你觸及了我的第一個。我知道股權輪換一直是長期的推動力，至少對於部分配置來說是這樣。您剛才提到，這仍然是策略的一部分。鑑於人們普遍預期下半年交易活動將有所增加，並且隨著利率下降，您之前沒有提到這一點，但我想知道是否有任何 - 如果您覺得自己是投資組合的一部分對此有什麼特別的定位嗎？在建模、時間安排和旋轉部分方面，我們是否應該考慮什麼？

It's a great question. And last thing we want to do is overpromise and under deliver, Melissa. So you're right. We believe deal activity is going to pick up. We believe interest rates are coming down. We certainly hope and want and believe that a portion of that equity portfolio is going to rotate. Hard for us to put out an estimate or guidance on the amount and the timing other than that, that continues to be a goal of ours.

這是一個很好的問題。我們最不想做的就是承諾過多而兌現不足，梅麗莎。所以你是對的。我們相信交易活動將會增加。我們相信利率正在下降。我們當然希望、希望並相信股票投資組合的一部分將會輪流。除此之外，我們很難對金額和時間安排做出估計或指導，但這仍然是我們的目標。

And as you know, much of it is not in our control. Much of it is with the equity co-investments in particular, we're riding side by side with the private equity firm.

如您所知，其中大部分不在我們的控制範圍內。其中很大一部分是股權聯合投資，特別是我們與私募股權公司並肩作戰。

Yes. Okay. Understood. And then a follow-up question. I just wanted to revisit the dividend and the decision to take that up a little -- a quarter or two ago. Given sort of the earnings power of the portfolio right now, given sort of the tailwind that came from the onetime dividend from PSLF this quarter, which sort of met the dividend level on a quarterly basis.

是的。好的。明白了。然後是後續問題。我只是想重新審視一下股息以及一兩個季度前決定增加一點股息的決定。考慮到目前投資組合的獲利能力，考慮到本季 PSLF 一次性股息帶來的推動力，這在某種程度上滿足了季度股息水準。

How are you thinking about dividend coverage? And feeling just generally about the earnings power of the portfolio given the potential for really a lower rate environment as we go forward. And I keep in mind everything you just said about expanding the JV.

您如何看待股息覆蓋率？考慮到我們未來可能會出現真正較低利率環境的可能性，並且對投資組合的盈利能力有普遍的感覺。我牢記您剛才所說的關於擴大合資企業的一切。

Yes. Look, it's a great question. We're trying to kind of balanced earnings power of the portfolio, the JV, the potential upsizing of the JV and equity rotation. And we do have about $1 a share of spillover. So we got to pay that out and we want to kind of pay out judiciously over time and in a careful fashion, knowing that we're fairly fully levered at this point.

是的。聽著，這是一個很好的問題。我們正在嘗試平衡投資組合、合資企業的獲利能力、合資企業的潛在擴大規模和股權輪調。我們確實有每股約 1 美元的溢出效應。因此，我們必須支付這筆費用，我們希望隨著時間的推移，以謹慎的方式明智地支付，因為我們知道目前我們的槓桿率相當高。

So we're balancing all these different competing interests or different interest, I should say, in terms of paying out the spillover in terms of looking at the earnings power of the company and all the different elements of that. So kind of that really led to our decision to boost the dividend last quarter to $0.08 per month, in large part due to all of these different elements, including the very large spillover.

因此，我應該說，我們正在平衡所有這些不同的競爭利益或不同的利益，從公司獲利能力及其所有不同要素的角度來支付外溢效應。這確實導致我們決定將上季的股息提高至每月 0.08 美元，很大程度上是由於所有這些不同的因素，包括非常大的外溢效應。

And at this time, there are no further questions. I'll turn the call back to Art for any additional or closing remarks.

而此時，已經沒有其他問題了。我會將電話轉回 Art，以獲取任何補充或結束語。

Thank you, everybody, for participating today. We really appreciate your interest in the company. A reminder that next quarter is our 10-K. So the quarterly call will be a little bit later than our normal. We're going to be targeting mid-November for the quarterly earnings release and the quarterly call. In the meantime, wishing everybody a terrific end of summer and fall. Speak to you next quarter.

謝謝大家今天的參與。我們非常感謝您對公司的興趣。提醒您下個季度是我們的 10-K。因此，季度電話會議將比我們的正常情況晚一點。我們計劃在 11 月中旬發布季度收益報告和季度電話會議。同時，祝大家有個愉快的夏季和秋季。下個季度再和你談談。

This does conclude today's conference. We thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.

今天的會議到此結束。我們感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。