Pampa Energia SA (PAM) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning everyone and thank you for waiting. I'm Raquel Cardasz from IR, and we would like to welcome everyone to Pampa Energía's fourth quarter 2023 results video conference. We would like to inform you that this event is being recorded. All participants will be in listen-only mode during the presentation. After the company's remarks, there will be a Q&A session. (Operator Instructions)

大家早安，感謝大家的等待。我是來自 IR 的 Raquel Cardasz，我們歡迎大家參加 Pampa Energía 2023 年第四季業績視訊會議。我們謹通知您，該事件正在被記錄。演示期間所有參與者將處於僅聽模式。公司發言結束後，將進行問答環節。（操作員說明）

Before proceeding, please read the disclaimer on the second page of our presentation. Let me mention that forward-looking statements are based on Pampa Energía's management beliefs and assumptions and information currently available to the company. They involve risks, uncertainties and assumptions, because they are related to future events that may or may not occur.

在繼續之前，請閱讀我們簡報第二頁的免責聲明。我要指出的是，前瞻性陳述是基於 Pampa Energía 的管理信念、假設以及公司目前掌握的資訊。它們涉及風險、不確定性和假設，因為它們與可能發生或可能不會發生的未來事件有關。

Investors should understand that general economic and industry conditions and other operating factors could also affect the future results of Pampa Energía and could cause results to differ materially from those expressed in such forward-looking statements.

投資者應了解，總體經濟和行業狀況以及其他營運因素也可能影響 Pampa Energía 的未來業績，並可能導致結果與此類前瞻性聲明中表達的結果有重大差異。

Now I'll turn the video conference over to Lida. Please go ahead.

現在我將視訊會議轉交給麗達。請繼續。

Hello, everybody. Thank you for joining us to this another new quarter. I will make a quick summary of Q4. You may find more details - in our earnings release, or financial statements. Today we have, for the Q&A, our CEO, Gustavo Mariani; our CFO, Nicolás Mindlin; our Head of E&P, Horacio Turri; our Head of Finance, [Pito Zulegoulas], so full team here.

大家好。感謝您與我們一起度過又一個新季度。我將對第四季做一個快速總結。您可以在我們的收益發布或財務報表中找到更多詳細資訊。今天，我們有我們的執行長古斯塔沃·馬裡亞尼 (Gustavo Mariani) 進行問答；我們的財務長 Nicolás Mindlin；我們的勘探與生產主管 Horacio Turri；我們的財務主管，[Pito Zulegoulas]，這裡的團隊非常完整。

Well, so let's quickly review 2023. This is another challenging year, but it did not prevent us from growing and delivering milestone. In 2023, we will reach again a new peak in gas production exceeding 16 million cubic meters per day. This is a remarkable 44% increase compared to the 2022 record. Thanks to the new pipeline facilitating additional eastbound evacuation and our active campaign Vaca Muerta.

好吧，讓我們快速回顧一下2023年。這又是充滿挑戰的一年，但這並沒有阻止我們成長和實現里程碑。2023年，天然氣產量將再次突破1,600萬立方公尺/日新高峰。與 2022 年的記錄相比，增幅高達 44%。感謝新管道促進了額外的東行疏散以及我們積極開展的 Vaca Muerta 活動。

However, average production did not take off as expected due to soft demand from mild weather and poor thermal dispatch. For the first time in nine years, we deliver below the take or pay. Pampa E&P is mostly gas production, but for now on we aim to diversify with shallow oil from Rincon de Aranda.

然而，由於溫和的天氣和熱力調度不佳導致需求疲軟，平均產量並未如預期成長。九年來第一次，我們的交付低於照付不議。Pampa 勘探與生產主要是天然氣生產，但目前我們的目標是透過 Rincon de Aranda 的淺層石油實現多元化。

Power generation did not stay quiet either. In 2023, we commissioned Ensenada Barragan's CCGT, PEPE IV wind farm, adding 360 megawatts of efficient energy. We also -- will be inaugurated this year PEPE VI, which is total install capacity of 140 megawatts. So with all online, we will be reaching 5.5 gigawatts by the end of this year.

發電也沒有安靜下來。2023 年，我們啟用了 Ensenada Barragan 的 CCGT、PEPE IV 風電場，增加了 360 兆瓦的高效能能源。我們也將於今年啟用 PEPE VI，總裝置容量為 140 兆瓦。因此，如果全部上網，到今年年底我們將達到 5.5 吉瓦。

EBITDA fell 12% year-on-year. This is mainly because of reduced gas sales mentioned before and the impact of the steep peso depreciation over our affiliates. This is Transener and TGS. We will address this issue later. Our way of management helped us to gain efficiencies and be savvy over business and balance sheet.

EBITDA年減12%。這主要是因為前面提到的天然氣銷售減少以及比索大幅貶值對我們附屬公司的影響。這就是 Transener 和 TGS。我們稍後會解決這個問題。我們的管理方式幫助我們提高效率並精通業務和資產負債表。

We used our robust cash flow to enhance our portfolio without neglecting our financial position, strengthening our liquidity and substantially reducing our leverage by paying down debt or taking advantage of the local market. Overall, 2023 was another remarkable year in Pampa's history. We look forward to delivering outstanding results going on.

我們利用強勁的現金流來增強我們的投資組合，同時不忽視我們的財務狀況，增強我們的流動性，並透過償還債務或利用當地市場大幅降低我們的槓桿率。整體而言，2023 年是潘帕歷史上又一個非凡的一年。我們期待繼續取得出色的成果。

So we are in the quarter. We must highlight again, this net leverage reduction, which reached the lowest level in years, $613 million of net debt. The situation was coupled with a soft demand for gas and thermal energy. This is our main product. This was expected, because of seasonality, Q4 is an off-peak season.

所以我們現在處於本季。我們必須再次強調，淨槓桿率下降達到多年來的最低水平，淨債務為 6.13 億美元。這種情況加上對天然氣和熱能的需求疲軟。這是我們的主要產品。這是預料之中的，因為季節性原因，第四季是淡季。

But this was worsened by mild weather with a warm spring and cold start of the summer. A linear effect generating high levels of hydro and therefore ranking senior to thermal dispatch. And as well as high nuclear availability. So that also kind of lagged behind thermal generation.

但春季溫暖、夏季寒冷的溫和天氣使情況變得更糟。線性效應產生高水準的水力發電，因此排名高於熱力調度。以及高核心可用性。因此，這也落後於熱力發電。

And I'll highlight that we are harvesting our drilling campaign in Q4, shale gas represented 47% of our total gas production. This is a significant increase, compared to last year, just nearly 3% of total gas production.

我要強調的是，我們第四季的鑽探活動正在收穫，頁岩氣占我們天然氣總產量的 47%。與去年相比，這一增幅顯著，僅佔天然氣總產量的近3%。

The adjusted EBITDA for the quarter amounted to $129 million. This is 30% less year-on-year because of soft demand. Peso's devaluation also impacted for our affiliates, Transener and TGS. And therefore, because their income, in real terms got hit by the steep jump in the FX, the new PPA's at our wind farms, Ensenada Barragán, CCGT, plus the additional income from the export dollar offset this variation. Therefore, power took most of the total EBITDA share in Q4.

該季度調整後的 EBITDA 為 1.29 億美元。由於需求疲軟，這一數字年減了 30%。比索貶值也對我們的附屬公司 Transener 和 TGS 產生了影響。因此，由於他們的實際收入受到外匯大幅上漲的影響，我們的風電場 Ensenada Barragán、CCGT 的新購電協議以及出口美元帶來的額外收入抵消了這種變化。因此，電力佔據了第四季度 EBITDA 總額的大部分份額。

CapEx in Q4, was 50% higher year-on-year. This is because -- mainly because of the ramp up in E&P, which is concentrated in shale gas drilling and completion of wells, plus the construction of the PEPE VI wind farm.

第四季的資本支出較去年同期成長 50%。這是因為——主要是因為勘探與生產的成長，主要集中在頁岩氣鑽井和完井，以及 PEPE VI 風電場的建設。

So let me give you a quick, simplified explanation how peso depreciation affects Pampa. There's very important things that in the Q4 we accrued $250 million of income tax. This is an accrual, not cash accrual, which is 150% higher than the last year's period. This is because of this temporary lag between IFRS valuation of PPE and its tax appraisals.

因此，讓我給您一個快速、簡單的解釋，比索貶值如何影響潘帕。有一件非常重要的事情是，第四季我們應計了 2.5 億美元的所得稅。這是應計費用，而非現金應計費用，比去年同期高出 150%。這是因為 PPE 的 IFRS 評估與其稅務評估之間存在暫時的滯後。

So tax reporting in Argentina follows the functional currency in pesos and peso is adjusted by inflation. But the steep devaluation that happened in December 13 widened this gap between both valuations. So we generated a temporary non-cash deferred income tax, which, if the peso recovers, right, both valuations will be similar. And the tax -- the set tax should be zero, should reduce to zero.

因此，阿根廷的稅務報告遵循以比索為單位的功能貨幣，而比索則根據通貨膨脹進行調整。但 12 月 13 日發生的大幅貶值擴大了兩者估值之間的差距。因此，我們產生了臨時的非現金遞延所得稅，如果比索回升，兩個估值將會相似。稅收－設定的稅收應該為零，應該減少到零。

Another effect is on the affiliates. So the affiliates, they also follow financial -- the financial reporting follows peso currency, and their figures are also adjusted by inflation. So inflation was unnumbered by the grand devaluation that happened in December last year. Should we all follow functional currency in dollars, TGS and Transener actually posted a higher EBITDA, making Pampa's 2023 EBITDA of $831 million instead of $802 million.

另一個影響是對附屬公司的影響。因此，附屬公司也遵循財務報告——財務報告遵循比索貨幣，他們的數據也根據通貨膨脹進行調整。因此，去年 12 月發生的貨幣大貶值並沒有計算出通貨膨脹的數字。如果我們都遵循美元的功能貨幣，TGS 和 Transener 實際上公佈了更高的 EBITDA，使得 Pampa 2023 年的 EBITDA 為 8.31 億美元，而不是 8.02 億美元。

Taking the side affiliates, the only segment we invoiced in pesos today is just legacy. And actually, not the whole legacy, it's just the conventional thermal and the hydros, which accounts less than 10% of our total Q4 sales.

以附屬子公司為例，我們今天唯一以比索開立發票的部分只是遺產。事實上，這並不是全部遺產，只是傳統熱力和水力發電，占我們第四季總銷售額的不到 10%。

So let's move on to power generation as seen on slide 6. We posted an adjusted EBITDA of $94 million in Q4. This is 10% higher year-on-year, mainly explained by lower operating costs and new PPAs, offset by soft thermal dispatch overhauls, maintenances in some GTs, and peso evaluation that impacted the spot energy, plus the divestment of Mario Cebreiro.

那麼讓我們繼續討論發電，如幻燈片 6 所示。我們第四季的調整後 EBITDA 為 9,400 萬美元。年成長 10%，主要是由於營運成本降低和新的購電協議，被軟熱調度檢修、一些 GT 的維護以及影響現貨能源的比索評估以及 Mario Cebreiro 的撤資所抵消。

Despite seasonality, EBITDA remains similar to last quarter. This is explained by the increase in the spot energy of 28% happened in November. There is another 74% clear from February this year. However, as you can see there, spot prices are still behind inflation and evaluation.

儘管存在季節性因素，但 EBITDA 仍與上季相似。這是因為 11 月現貨能源增加了 28%。從今年 2 月開始，還有 74% 的淨空。然而，正如您所看到的，現貨價格仍然落後於通貨膨脹和評估。

Q4 dispatch decreased 3% year-on-year. This is mainly due to the lower demand and outages mentioned before, partially offset by Barragan's new CCGT, the hydros and the new wind farms. Take or pay capacity is very important, especially for PPAs. It is driven by availability, and in Q4 we reached 93% below last year's 97%. This is because of Loma de la Lata's outage that affected the whole quarter.

第四季出貨量年減3%。這主要是由於前面提到的需求下降和停電造成的，但巴拉甘的新聯合循環燃氣渦輪機、水力發電和新風電場部分抵消了這一影響。接受或支付能力非常重要，尤其是對於購電協議而言。這是由可用性驅動的，第四季我們的利用率比去年的 97% 低了 93%。這是因為 Loma de la Lata 的停電影響了整個季度。

Moving onto PEPE VI expansion, the project's progress is 69%. We keep working on facilities and civil works and power transformers that have already arrived from China. As most of the main components, they are stored in the Bahia Blanca port. The tower's components are being constructed.

繼續進行 PEPE VI 擴建，該專案進度為 69%。我們持續致力於從中國運來的設施、土木工程和電力變壓器。與大部分主要部件一樣，它們都儲存在布蘭卡港港口。該塔的組件正在建造中。

On Tuesday of this week we mounted the first wind turbine. There's 30 more to come, right? So total 31 wind turbines. The estimated COD, it ranges between Q3 July of this year until October of this year, we estimate to finalize the whole wind farm. It is worth highlighting that this wind farm PEPE VI will be sold under B2B PPAs.

本週二，我們安裝了第一台風力渦輪機。還有 30 多個，對嗎？總共有 31 颱風力渦輪機。預計COD，從今年7月3季到今年10月，我們估計整個風電場都可以敲定。值得強調的是，該風電場 PEPE VI 將透過 B2B PPA 進行出售。

Well, moving on to E&P, and as you can see here, gas deliveries are recovering after Q4's weak demand. The late summer boom and the return to normal hydro levels are helping domestic sales and exports to Chile. It is noteworthy to mention the importance of take or pay, a kind of insurance for our investment because for the first time in 2021, we delivered volumes under the take or pay contracts.

好吧，轉向勘探與生產，正如您在這裡所看到的，在第四季度需求疲軟之後，天然氣交付正在復蘇。夏末的繁榮和恢復正常的水力水平正在幫助國內銷售和對智利的出口。值得注意的是照付不議的重要性，這是我們投資的一種保險，因為我們在 2021 年首次根據照付不議合約交付了數量。

On slide 9, our E&P business posted an adjusted EBITDA of $50 million in Q4. This is 30% below year-on-year. The decrease was driven by this sharp decline in local and foreign demand, which affected our gas prices too. This was partially offset by additional income from export dollars.

在投影片 9 上，我們的勘探與生產業務第四季的調整後 EBITDA 為 5,000 萬美元。這比去年同期下降了 30%。這一下降是由於本地和國外需求急劇下降造成的，這也影響了我們的天然氣價格。這被出口美元的額外收入部分抵消。

In Q4, our total production averaged about 56,000 barrels of oil equivalent per day. This is 8% below last year. Zooming in, crude oil represented 8% of our E&P output, but 22% of the segment's revenue, mainly because we're vesting 40% to exports, more than double last year. The activity ramp up explained that our total lifting cost slightly grew by 5% year-on-year, and combined with a lower production. This impacted in the lifting cost per BOE, which increased 14% year-on-year, recording $7.4 per BOE.

第四季度，我們的總產量平均約為每天 56,000 桶油當量。比去年低 8%。放大來看，原油占我們勘探與生產產量的 8%，但佔該部門收入的 22%，主要是因為我們將 40% 用於出口，是去年的兩倍多。活動的增加說明我們的總吊掛成本比去年小幅增加了 5%，而且產量有所下降。這影響了每桶油當量的提升成本，年增 14%，達到每桶油桶 7.4 美元。

Focusing on gas. Our Q4 production decreased by 7% year on year. This is averaging almost 9 million cubic meters per day, mainly explained by the lower demand. 53% of the quarter's production came from El Mangrullo and 25% from Sierra Chata, the latter showing a significant growth compared to the 6% of share recorded last year. The average price for the quarter stood at $3.2 per million BTU. This is 17% down due to lower-than-expected exports. Remember that the local production that is sold under Plan Gas, it's covered under the GSA.

專注於天然氣。我們第四季的產量年減了7%。平均每天接近 900 萬立方米，主要是需求下降。本季產量的 53% 來自 El Mangrullo，25% 來自 Sierra Chata，後者與去年記錄的 6% 份額相比出現了顯著增長。本季的平均價格為每百萬 BTU 3.2 美元。由於出口低於預期，下降了 17%。請記住，根據 Plan Gas 出售的本地產品由 GSA 承保。

Regarding the campaign, the productivity was outstanding. As you can see, nine walls from Sierra Chata rank among the Top 20 producing wells in Vaca Muerta, outperforming peers and El Mangrullo, which they are also outstanding by their own right. In this sense, Sierra Chata almost tripled its production year on year, thanks to drilling 10 wells, and completing 9 doing 2023. In El Mangrullo, we drilled 15 wells and completed another 14, ranking two of them among the Top 20 producing wells in the formation.

就活動而言，生產力非常出色。正如您所看到的，Sierra Chata 的 9 個牆位列 Vaca Muerta 生產井前 20 名，表現優於同行和 El Mangrullo，它們本身也很出色。從這個意義上說，Sierra Chata 鑽探了 10 口井，並在 2023 年完成了 9 口井，產量比去年同期幾乎增加了兩倍。在El Mangrullo，我們鑽探了15口井，並完成了另外14口井，其中兩口井躋身該地層的前20名生產井之列。

So thanks to these outstanding results, especially at Sierra Chata, we recorded a 11% increase in our proven reserves, amounting to 199 million BOE. We almost doubled shale reserves certified in 2022 to 83 million. Although we held a production record in 2023, the reserve replacement was 1.8 times, and the average life increased to 8.6 years.

因此，由於這些出色的成果，特別是在 Sierra Chata，我們的探明儲量增加了 11%，達到 1.99 億桶油當量。2022 年，我們確認的頁岩油儲量幾乎翻了一番，達到 8,300 萬。儘管我們在2023年保持了產量記錄，但儲量更換次數為1.8次，平均壽命增加至8.6年。

The petrochemical business that I'm going to talk briefly, posted a $20 million EBITDA in Q4. This is 33% higher year-on-year because of lower cost due to the drop in production and higher income from this export dollar income. And also, that explains the quarter-on-quarter increase. Q4, 45% of the sales volume was exported. This is higher than last year by 30%.

我要簡單談談的石化事業第四季的 EBITDA 為 2000 萬美元。年比成長 33%，原因是產量下降導致成本降低以及出口美元收入增加。這也解釋了季度環比增長的原因。第四季度，45%的銷量用於出口。比去年高出 30%。

In Q4, we recorded a cash flow of $95 million -- outflow of cash, $95 million. This is mainly explained by the expansionary CapEx in shale gas. We also recorded lower debt service quarter on quarter, benefited from the peso devaluation. Also, diluted the principal amount of the peso debt. Working capital improved as we collected winter sales from CAMMESA during December.

第四季度，我們記錄的現金流為 9,500 萬美元，現金流出為 9,500 萬美元。這主要是由於頁岩氣資本支出擴張所致。受惠於比索貶值，我們的償債額也較上季下降。此外，稀釋了比索債務的本金。12 月份，我們從 CAMMESA 收集了冬季銷售額，營運資金得到改善。

Additionally, net of redemptions, we paid down $37 million in principal debt. In summary, we reduced $129 million in net cash in the quarter, achieving $834 million cash position by the end of the period. However, we increased our cash position year on year.

此外，扣除贖回後，我們還清了 3,700 萬美元的本金債務。總之，我們在本季減少了 1.29 億美元的淨現金，到期末實現了 8.34 億美元的現金部位。然而，我們的現金部位逐年增加。

Moving on now onto slide 12, we show our consolidated financial position including our affiliates at ownership, but let's focus on the restricted group that reflects the bond perimeter. We posted a gross debt of $1.4 billion. This is 10% lower year-on-year. This is accompanied by a 19% growth in cash.

現在轉到投影片 12，我們展示了我們的綜合財務狀況，包括我們擁有所有權的附屬公司，但讓我們專注於反映債券範圍的受限群體。我們公佈的總債務為 14 億美元。這比去年同期減少了 10%。同時，現金也成長了 19%。

Thanks to the strong liquidity position, our commitment to canceling debt and the debt peso -- Argentine peso debt dilution, the net debt and leverage ratio decreased significantly, recording $630 million and 0.9 times leverage. The average life was 3.2 years. Until 2027, as you can see, we don't face any relevant debt maturity.

由於強勁的流動性狀況、我們取消債務的承諾以及債務比索——阿根廷比索債務的稀釋，淨債務和槓桿率顯著下降，錄得6.3億美元和0.9倍槓桿。平均壽命為3.2年。正如您所看到的，到 2027 年，我們不會面臨任何相關的債務到期。

So this concludes our presentation. I will turn the word to Raquel. She will poll for the questions. Thank you very much.

我們的演講到此結束。我會把話轉給拉奎爾。她將對問題進行民意調查。非常感謝。

Thank you very much. (Operator Instructions) Alejandro Demichelis, Jefferies.

非常感謝。（操作員說明）Alejandro Demichelis，Jefferies。

The first one says, how do you see upstream production and sales evolving in 2024?

第一個說，您如何看待2024年上游生產和銷售的變化？

Sorry for the delay. The question was about sales. Can you repeat this question?

抱歉耽擱了。問題是關於銷售的。你能重複一下這個問題嗎？

Yeah. How do you see upstream production and sales evolving in 2024?

是的。您如何看待2024年上游生產與銷售的發展？

Okay. Oil productions, we see it fairly flat. We will put in production tools from Rincon de Aranda that we will be testing in the next few months, but that will have a marginal impact on our overall production of oil. Regarding natural gas, as you recall in July or August of last year, once the Gasoducto, the Néstor Kirchner Pipeline became online, we began to sold what we were awarded in the last round of the Plan Gas auction. And there, we were awarded a flat 4.8 million cubic meters of natural gas per day throughout the year.

好的。石油產量，我們認為相當持平。我們將投入 Rincon de Aranda 的生產工具，我們將在未來幾個月內對其進行測試，但這將對我們的整體石油生產產生邊際影響。關於天然氣，正如你所記得的，去年七八月，內斯託基什內爾管道天然氣管道上線後，我們就開始出售上一輪計劃天然氣拍賣中獲得的東西。在那裡，我們全年獲得了每天 480 萬立方公尺的天然氣供應。

So when you compare what we are expecting in 2024 vis-a-vis what we sold in average in 2023, we believe it's going to be around 30% increase in sales in natural gas 2024 vis-a-vis 2023. That means around an average of 13.5 million cubic meters of natural gas per day average in 2024 vis-a-vis 10.0-something -- 10.3, I believe, was the average quantity of gas sold during 2023. That's upstream sales.

因此，當您將 2024 年的預期與 2023 年的平均銷量進行比較時，我們相信 2024 年天然氣銷量將比 2023 年增長 30% 左右。這意味著 2024 年平均每天天然氣產量約為 1,350 萬立方米，而 2023 年平均天然氣銷售量為 10.0 左右——我認為是 10.3。這就是上游銷售。

Yeah. Thank you. Alejandro's second question says, how do you see power generation sales and prices evolving in 2024?

是的。謝謝。Alejandro 的第二個問題是，您如何看待 2024 年發電銷售和價格的變化？

Healthy here, but the power generation sales will be increased by the fact that we are currently building a new wind farm of 140 megawatt that will be fully online by the third quarter of this year, but probably, it will have partial inaugurations beginning in June/July of this year. So that -- sales from those wind farms, as they become online, will increase our production capabilities this year.

這裡很健康，但發電量將會增加，因為我們目前正在建造一個 140 兆瓦的新風電場，該風電場將於今年第三季度全面上線，但可能會在 6 月開始部分落成/今年七月。因此，當這些風電場上線時，它們的銷售將提高我們今年的生產能力。

Regarding prices, as you know, two-thirds of our EBITDA comes from PPAs, from sales through PPAs, where prices are fixed, and so we don't expect any change there. Regarding legacy capacity that accounts for about one-third of the EBITDA generation of the power generation segment, we were just granted in February an increase of 74% to --

關於價格，如您所知，我們三分之二的 EBITDA 來自購電協議，來自透過購電協議進行的銷售，其中價格是固定的，因此我們預計不會有任何變化。對於佔發電部門 EBITDA 發電量約三分之一的遺留產能，我們在 2 月剛獲準增加 74%--

But -- so we hope that the remuneration will remain, in real terms, fairly flat despite the inflationary environment we are living in. Regarding eventual regulatory changes, we still don't have any visibility on that.

但是——所以我們希望儘管我們生活在通貨膨脹的環境中，但實際薪酬仍將保持相當穩定。關於最終的監管變化，我們仍然沒有任何了解。

Thank you very much both. Bruno Montanari, Morgan Stanley. First one is, can you walk us through Pampa's 2024 CapEx budget for each of the business segments? What projects are already sanctioned and are these projects that can still be considered this year?

非常感謝你們兩位。布魯諾蒙塔納裡，摩根士丹利。第一個問題是，您能否向我們介紹 Pampa 2024 年每個業務部門的資本支出預算？哪些項目已經獲得批准？

Projects already sanctioned? What does it mean? Can you repeat it?

項目已經獲得批准？這是什麼意思？你能重複一下嗎？

PEPE VI, we are already doing that.

PEPE VI，我們已經在這樣做了。

Thank you, Bruno, for your question. Regarding CapEx, we have a very aggressive plans, but we are currently revising that aggressive plan given the, let's say, financial crisis that we are living on CAMMESA, which is an important part of our revenues. Thankfully, CAMMESA today accounts for around 40%, 45% of our overall revenues, but the delays that we are suffering are forcing us to revise our CapEx plan.

謝謝布魯諾的提問。關於資本支出，我們有一個非常積極的計劃，但考慮到我們生活在 CAMMESA 上的金融危機，我們目前正在修改這一積極的計劃，而 CAMMESA 是我們收入的重要組成部分。值得慶幸的是，CAMMESA 目前約占我們總收入的 40%、45%，但我們所遭受的延誤迫使我們修改我們的資本支出計畫。

Basically, before this situation, our CapEx plan were around $700 million. $500 million on the E&P segment, basically half of it new wells, and the other half infrastructure, both for Rincon de Aranda and for Sierra Chata. On power generation, CapEx were around -- we were expecting to spend around $200 million, around $130 million, it's the wind farm PEPE VI, which is already on track.

基本上，在這種情況發生之前，我們的資本支出計劃約為 7 億美元。 5億美元用於勘探與生產部分，基本上一半是新井，另一半是Rincon de Aranda和Sierra Chata的基礎設施。在發電方面，資本支出大約是——我們預計花費約 2 億美元，大約 1.3 億美元，這是風電場 PEPE VI，它已經步入正軌。

And I have already mentioned when we are expecting to be online, and that won't be delayed. The other $70 million is regular maintenance of our power plant, and we are currently revising what can be delayed and at what cost. So we are currently revising those plans as well.

我已經提到我們預計什麼時候上線，而且不會延遲。另外 7000 萬美元用於我們發電廠的定期維護，我們目前正在修改哪些內容可以推遲以及費用是多少。因此，我們目前也在修改這些計劃。

Thank you very much. The next three questions from Bruno are for the E&P segment. First one says, there were encouraging news from Sierra Chata supporting the increasing gas reserve. What is the production profile expected for the field?

非常感謝。布魯諾接下來的三個問題是針對勘探與生產領域的。第一個消息稱，來自 Sierra Chata 的令人鼓舞的消息支持天然氣儲備的增加。該油田的預期產量情況如何？

Hello, everybody. Thank you for your question. We've been pretty successful in developing so far Sierra Chata field. And what we foresee in the future is a significant increase of the production that will account approximately to 3.5 million cubic meters a day.

大家好。謝謝你的問題。到目前為止，我們在 Sierra Chata 油田的開發方面非常成功。我們預計未來產量將大幅增加，每天產量將達到約 350 萬立方公尺。

We moved our early production facilities from Mangrullo to Sierra Chata, due to the productivity we found there. And therefore, that's the total amount of gas we will be increasing in Sierra Chata from approximately 6 million a day to 9.5 million a day. That's on an overall basis, considering our share and Exxon's share.

由於我們在那裡發現了生產力，我們將早期的生產設施從曼魯洛搬到了塞拉查塔。因此，我們將 Sierra Chata 的天然氣總量從每天約 600 萬增加到每天 950 萬。這是在總體基礎上考慮到我們的份額和埃克森美孚的份額。

Thank you, Horacio. Next question says, can you elaborate on your strategy to be more active in your development and production of unconventional oil blocks?

謝謝你，奧拉西奧。下一個問題是，您能否詳細說明您更積極地開發和生產非常規石油區塊的策略？

Yeah, we've been pretty active, particularly in derisking and trying to understand better our new shale oil field, which is Rincon de Aranda. As you probably know, we already drilled and completed one well, Rincon de Aranda 2000, which had pretty good results. And now, we are currently testing Rincon de Aranda 2001 that has as a target Organico Inferior.

是的，我們一直非常積極，特別是在降低風險並試圖更好地了解我們的新頁岩油田（Rincon de Aranda）方面。您可能知道，我們已經鑽完一口井，Rincon de Aranda 2000，取得了相當不錯的結果。現在，我們正在測試 Rincon de Aranda 2001，其目標為 Organico Inferior。

And we only have eight days of testing, so there's not much to say about that other than all the operations are developing normally. We expect to have results probably in 30 days from now.

而且我們只有八天的測試時間，所以沒什麼好說的，除了所有操作都在正常進行之外。我們預計可能會在 30 天內得到結果。

Thank you. And last question, is the company interested to participate in LNG projects being discussed in Argentina? What can we expect Pampa's roles to be on future LNG supply?

謝謝。最後一個問題，該公司是否有興趣參與阿根廷正在討論的液化天然氣計畫？我們可以預期潘帕在未來的液化天然氣供應中扮演什麼角色？

As you recall, we mentioned in previous calls, we were studying through our subsidiary TGS, one rather small project. We call it a modular project that could begin with small size and replicate those modules. Although the studies have not finished yet, our impression is that the lack of scale is a problem that this project will lack the necessary competitiveness.

您還記得，我們​​在之前的電話中提到，我們正在透過我們的子公司 TGS 進行研究，這是一個相當小的項目。我們稱之為模組化項目，可以從小規模開始並複製這些模組。雖然研究還沒有完成，但我們的印像是，缺乏規模是一個問題，這個計畫將缺乏必要的競爭力。

So the energy export in natural gas is key for Argentina, is key for Pampa in the long-term. So Pampa is definitely interested in participating in a big national project like the one that YPF is carry on with another partners that we hope to be invited in the future.

因此，天然氣能源出口對阿根廷來說至關重要，長遠來看也是潘帕的關鍵。因此，潘帕肯定有興趣參與一個大型國家項目，就像 YPF 與我們希望未來邀請的其他合作夥伴一起進行的項目一樣。

Thank you very much. Marina Mertens, Latin Securities. There has been some noise regarding payments from CAMMESA, including Transener's recent release. Could you comment on what Pampa is experiencing regarding this issue and how it might affect working capital needs?

非常感謝。Marina Mertens，拉丁證券。關於 CAMMESA 的付款，包括 Transener 最近發布的付款，存在一些噪音。您能否評論一下潘帕在這個問題上遇到的情況以及它可能如何影響營運資金需求？

Yeah, as mentioned, we are experiencing, again, delays on CAMMESA payments, and the lack of visibility of how this will evolve going forward is adding some uncertainty and stress. To explain the issue a little bit further, prior to February 1 -- and why February 1? Since February 1, there's been an increase in what we call the seasonal price. The seasonal price is the price that distribution companies charges.

是的，正如前面提到的，我們再次遇到了 CAMMESA 付款的延遲，並且缺乏對未來將如何發展的可見性，這增加了一些不確定性和壓力。為了進一步解釋這個問題，在 2 月 1 日之前——以及為什麼是 2 月 1 日？自 2 月 1 日起，我們所說的季節性價格出現上漲。季節性價格是分銷公司收取的價格。

National distribution companies all around the country charges to the final users, final users being residential customers, commercial customers, or industries. And that seasonal price should cover the cost of the fuel for thermal power plants, the cost of generating electricity, and the cost of transmission.

全國各地的全國分銷公司向最終用戶收費，最終用戶是住宅客戶、商業客戶或工業客戶。這個季節性價格應該涵蓋火力發電廠的燃料成本、發電成本和輸電成本。

As I was saying prior to February -- in February 1, there was an increase in that price that will partially help solve the situation. Prior to February 1, the situation, to give you a rough idea and to give you an idea of the magnitude of the problem, the cost of a monthly transaction for CAMMESA was around $550 million. How those -- that $550 million, it goes to pay for the fuel, basically natural gas, to power generation companies and to transmission companies. How those $550 million were collected by CAMMESA, around $200 million were collected from -- or should have been collected from distribution companies, around 40%.

正如我在 2 月之前所說的那樣——2 月 1 日，價格上漲，這將部分幫助解決這個問題。2 月 1 日之前的情況，為了給大家一個粗略的了解，也讓大家了解問題的嚴重程度，CAMMESA 每個月的交易成本約為 5.5 億美元。這 5.5 億美元如何用於支付發電公司和輸電公司的燃料費用，主要是天然氣。CAMMESA 是如何收取這 5.5 億美元的，其中約 2 億美元是從（或應該從）分銷公司收取的，佔 40% 左右。

So that is what was being covered by the final users. And the other 60% was the subsidy, around $350 million was the subsidy that the national government was injecting into CAMMESA. From February 1 onwards, given the increase in the seasonal price that was announced, the money coming from distribution companies went from $200 million to $350 million. And the subsidy that the national government needs to inject into CAMMESA went down from $350 million to $200 million. So figures reversed between distribution companies and national government.

這就是最終用戶所涵蓋的內容。另外60%是補貼，約3.5億美元是國家政府對CAMMESA的補貼。從2月1日起，由於宣布的季節性價格上漲，來自分銷公司的資金從2億美元增加到3.5億美元。國家政府需要向 CAMMESA 注入的補貼從 3.5 億美元減少到 2 億美元。因此，分銷公司和國家政府之間的情況發生了逆轉。

Now, two thirds of the money needed by CAMMESA should come from distribution companies and one-third should come from the national government. Despite this being the situation starting on February 1, we will start seeing this situation beginning April or May because February transaction is collected, or is paid by CAMMESA to power generation companies, the transmission companies in April, May. Until that moment, the situation was the previous one where the money needed monthly from the government was around $350 million per month.

現在，CAMMESA 所需資金的三分之二應來自分銷公司，三分之一應來自國家政府。儘管這是從2 月1 日開始的情況，但我們將從4 月或5 月開始看到這種情況，因為2 月的交易是由CAMMESA 在4 月、5 月收集或支付給發電公司、輸電公司的。在那之前，情況還是以前的情況，每月需要政府提供的資金約為每月 3.5 億美元。

And the situation is that in 2024, the government didn't transfer any money to CAMMESA in January, had only transferred to CAMMESA $140 million in February, and so far nothing in March. And we don't have any visibility how this will evolve. So this is the uncertainty that we are living or that we are suffering ourselves and all the industry, both transmission companies, power generators and natural gas producers.

而情況是，2024年，政府1月沒有向CAMMESA轉移任何資金，2月只向CAMMESA轉移了1.4億美元，3月到目前為止還沒有轉移任何資金。我們不知道這將如何發展。因此，這就是我們生活的不確定性，或者我們自己和整個產業，包括輸電公司、發電商和天然氣生產商正在遭受的痛苦。

It's the issue that the national government is sending to CAMMESA less money than what it should have, and on top of that, the behavior of the distribution companies. Distribution companies, because they have not received the price of their services adjusted by inflation as they should have. They used the money they collect from the end users to finance themselves, and pay less than what they should to CAMMESA.

問題在於國家政府向 CAMMESA 提供的資金少於其應有的資金，此外還有分銷公司的行為。分銷公司，因為他們沒有收到應有的根據通貨膨脹調整的服務價格。他們用從最終用戶收取的錢來為自己融資，但向 CAMMESA 支付的費用低於應有的金額。

In the last few months, they have been paying around 50% of what they should have. We hope that now that the national regulated distribution companies have received an increase in the value added of distribution, the price for the service they provide, they have received a significant increase beginning February 1. So for the future, they won't need to finance themselves by using the money that should be paid to CAMMESA.

在過去的幾個月裡，他們只支付了應得費用的 50% 左右。我們希望，現在國家監管的分銷公司已經獲得了分銷附加價值的成長，他們提供的服務的價格從 2 月 1 日開始大幅上漲。因此，未來，他們不需要使用應支付給 CAMMESA 的資金來為自己融資。

We hope that beginning April or May, the situation will accommodate, but it's going to get very tough to get to that moment if the government continues with this -- with the same behavior we have been seeing in the last few months.

我們希望從四月或五月開始，情況會有所緩解，但如果政府繼續這樣做——與我們過去幾個月看到的行為相同，那麼到那一刻將會變得非常困難。

Thank you very much, Nicolás. Cristian Fera, Balanz. First one says, it seems the [linear] hit hard on results. Do you expect this phenomenon to ease by first half of 2024?

非常感謝你，尼古拉斯。克里斯蒂安·費拉，巴蘭茲。第一個說，似乎[線性]對結果造成了沉重打擊。您預計這種現像到 2024 年上半年會有所緩解嗎？

Well, although we are not meteorologists, we understand that 2024 is coming as a neutral year in terms of hydrology. So that's all we have to say about that.

好吧，雖然我們不是氣象學家，但我們知道 2024 年在水文方面將是中性的一年。這就是我們要說的。

Thank you. Next one says, considering the [Norte] reversal delay by ENARSA, what are your expectations for gas export to Chile during winter? Yeah, considering the Norte reversal delay by ENARSA, what are your expectations for gas during to Chile -- for gas export to Chile during winter?

謝謝。下一位說，考慮到ENARSA的[Norte]逆轉延遲，您對冬季向智利的天然氣出口有何期望？是的，考慮到 ENARSA 導致 Norte 反轉延遲，您對智利期間的天然氣（冬季向智利出口天然氣）有何期望？

Okay. So during the winter, the exports to Chile, particularly through the GasAndes pipeline, which accounts for the most important export share to Chile is capped in 5 million cubic meters day. So our understanding is that that will be fully supplied. So that's the -- what we understand is going to be exported to Chile during the winter.

好的。因此，冬季對智利的出口，特別是透過佔智利出口最重要份額的GasAndes管道，每天的出口量上限為500萬立方公尺。所以我們的理解是，這將得到充分供應。這就是我們所了解的冬季將出口到智利的產品。

Thank you very much, Horacio. And the last question from Cristian. He wants to know if we are experiencing delays in CAMMESA?

非常感謝你，奧拉西奧。克里斯蒂安的最後一個問題。他想知道我們在 CAMMESA 是否遇到延誤？

Well, yeah, I explained at length what we are suffering -- the situation of CAMMESA. But basically, what it means is that the invoice that we should have collected early January, we have only collected 50% from the invoice that mature at the beginning of February. We haven't collected anything, and we will have a new invoice maturing, I think, next Monday. So next week we will be owed 2.5 month of -- 2.5 transactions.

嗯，是的，我詳細解釋了我們正在遭受的痛苦——CAMMESA 的情況。但基本上，這意味著我們應該在一月初收取的發票，我們只收取了二月初到期的發票的 50%。我們還沒有收到任何東西，我想下週一我們將收到一張新的發票。因此，下週我們將欠 2.5 個月的 2.5 筆交易。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Roughly a transaction for Pampa is around $50 million to -- $50 million, between $40 million and $60 million per month of transaction. So as you can imagine this means a significant effort in terms of working capital.

Pampa 的交易額約為 5,000 萬至 5,000 萬美元，每月交易額在 4,000 萬至 6,000 萬美元之間。正如您可以想像的那樣，這意味著在營運資金方面需要付出巨大的努力。

Thank you very much. Next question comes from Paula La Greca --

非常感謝。下一個問題來自 Paula La Greca--

Sorry, this graph that shows here is for the full transaction. So it's not like we are today 28 days debate. Today, we are more than 50 days debate. All right? This is just to clarify. And that transaction that Gustavo mentioned is still not collected yet. Once we collect it, it will be amounting more than 50 days debate.

抱歉，此處顯示的圖表適用於完整交易。所以這不像我們今天的 28 天辯論。今天，我們已經進行了50多天的辯論。好的？這只是為了澄清。而古斯塔沃提到的那筆交易還沒有收集到。一旦我們收集到它，爭論將持續 50 多天。

Daniel Guardiola, BTG. (inaudible-microphone inaccessible)

丹尼爾·瓜迪奧拉，BTG。（聽不到聲音-麥克風無法使用）

We understand that the government is working on regulatory changes, but so far, we don't have any clarity or visibility on what those changes are effectively going to be.

我們知道政府正在努力進行監管改革，但到目前為止，我們還不清楚這些變化實際上會是什麼。

Thank you very much. Daniel Guardiola from BTG asked what is the EUR of Rincon de Aranda?

非常感謝。BTG 的 Daniel Guardiola 問 Rincon de Aranda 的歐元是多少？

We've so far drilled and completed only two wells, so it's too early to give information about the EURs or IP of the block. We still have a long way to go.

到目前為止，我們只鑽探並完成了兩口井，因此現在提供有關該區塊的歐元或智慧財產權的資訊還為時過早。我們還有很長的路要走。

Thank you very much. Thank you. [Pedal et Alier] asks, can you explain how Plan Gas works during off peak season? Could you export the remaining production related to Plan Gas extension? Yeah. Can you explain how Plan Gas works during off peak season? And could you export the remaining production?

非常感謝。謝謝。 [Pedal et Alier] 問，您能解釋一下 Plan Gas 在淡季期間如何運作嗎？您能否出口與計畫天然氣擴建相關的剩餘產量？是的。您能解釋一下 Plan Gas 在淡季期間如何運作嗎？你們能出口剩餘的產品嗎？

Either on peak or off peak season, what you do have is a take or pay that has to be committed by the off taker. And yeah, you're okay to export all the surplus gas to Chile. But as I mentioned before, there is a cap which is the transportation capacity 9 million. Always talking about GasAndes, 9 million during the off peak season and 5 million during the winter.

無論是在旺季還是淡季，您所擁有的都是承購商必須承諾的收入或報酬。是的，你可以將所有剩餘天然氣出口到智利。但正如我之前提到的，運輸能力是有上限的，即900萬。一直在說GasAndes，淡季900萬，冬季500萬。

Thank you very much. And another question from Pedal et Alier is related to Plan Gas extension since 2028 price was $3.5 per million BTU, is there some price adjustment further?

非常感謝。Pedal et Alier 提出的另一個問題與 Plan Gas 延期有關，因為 2028 年價格為每百萬 BTU 3.5 美元，是否還會進一步調整價格？

No, there is not.

不，那裡沒有。

It was a fixed price --

這是固定價格--

It was a -- everybody bid it and it was awarded from down to top and that was it. It was a tender.

這是一個——每個人都投標，然後從下到上授予，就是這樣。這是一個招標。

Thank you, Horacio. Alejandra Andrade, JPMorgan. Can you comment on the health of local capital markets?

謝謝你，奧拉西奧。亞歷杭德拉·安德拉德，摩根大通。您能否評價一下當地資本市場的健康狀況？

Well, local markets as you know, there is a very tight capital controls. So there are lot of pesos still trapped in the economy. That gives companies and whoever need to cover peso needs great opportunities. You've seen us last year issuing local dollars at 5%, dollar-linked bonds at 0%, or peso fixed rates below inflation.

嗯，如你所知，當地市場有非常嚴格的資本管制。因此，仍有大量比索被困在經濟中。這為公司和任何需要支付比索的人提供了巨大的機會。去年你已經看到我們以 5% 的利率發行本地美元，以 0% 的利率發行美元掛鉤債券，或低於通膨率的比索固定利率。

So negative in real terms. These pesos are still available for companies seeking pesos. We're always ready to take any opportunity to cover our needs, until the [peso] is still tight, I think there will be opportunities for companies to finance in the local markets.

實質上如此消極。這些比索仍然可供尋求比索的公司使用。我們隨時準備好抓住任何機會來滿足我們的需求，直到比索仍然緊張，我認為公司將有機會在當地市場融資。

Thank you, Nicolás.

謝謝你，尼古拉斯。

Yes. But as the last comment what I wanted to highlight, especially for those of you that like me have a very hard time reading these financial statements, very complicated given the sharp depreciation of the peso just a few weeks before year end, the inflation accounting, et cetera and et cetera. The way I see the year, or the way I simplify year 2023 for Pampa, that I think was a remarkable year, is by taking two pictures. End of 2022, vis-a-vis the end of 2023.

是的。但正如我想強調的最後一條評論，特別是對於那些像我一樣很難閱讀這些財務報表的人來說，考慮到年底前幾週比索的急劇貶值、通貨膨脹會計，這些財務報表非常複雜，等等等等等。我看待這一年的方式，或者說我簡化潘帕 2023 年的方式，我認為這是非凡的一年，是透過拍兩張照片。2022 年底，相對 2023 年底。

And what you see in those two pictures is that among several other things, but just to highlight a few point. Pampa in 2023 increased its power generation capacity by 80 megawatts. Part of that was money spent in 2022, around half of it. The other half of it was around $150 million was spent during 2023. So we increased our capacity by 80 megawatts of wind farm.

您在這兩張圖片中看到的是其他一些內容，但只是為了強調幾點。2023年潘帕將發電量增加80兆瓦。其中一部分是 2022 年花的錢，大約一半。另一半約 1.5 億美元則在 2023 年花費。所以我們增加了80兆瓦的風電場容量。

We, at Pampa, did a huge increase in its natural gas production capabilities in 2023. In 2022, we had capability -- the capability to produce 11 million cubic meters of natural gas per day at a peak production. In winter 2023, we raised that capability to 16.5 million cubic meters of natural gas per day. That's a 45% increase in production capacity.

2023 年，我們 Pampa 的天然氣生產能力大幅提高。到2022年，我們有能力－高峰產量時每天生產1100萬立方米天然氣。2023 年冬季，我們將天然氣產能提高到每天 1,650 萬立方公尺。這意味著產能增加了 45%。

That is not only drilling new wells, but also building pipelines, building gas treatment plants. So significant effort in terms of capital expenditures. And while doing so, thanks to, again, several things, basically the strong free cash flow generation of our assets, thanks to a very successful management of our liquidity, and an excellent -- and excellent liability management.

這不僅是鑽新井，還建造管道、建造天然氣處理廠。在資本支出方面做出了巨大的努力。在這樣做的同時，再次感謝幾件事，基本上是我們資產強大的自由現金流生成，感謝我們對流動性的非常成功的管理，以及出色的負債管理。

As we explained, given by the peso that we took at the beginning of the year, Pampa was able to reduce its net debt by one-third. We went -- we had net debt position of $900 million at the end of 2022. We now have -- at the end of 2023, we have a net debt of $600 million. So we were able to reduce indebtedness by $150 million and increase cash position by $100 million.

正如我們所解釋的，根據我們年初採用的比索，潘帕能夠將其淨債務減少三分之一。截至 2022 年底，我們的淨負債部位為 9 億美元。到 2023 年底，我們的淨債務為 6 億美元。因此，我們能夠減少 1.5 億美元的債務，並增加 1 億美元的現金部位。

So $300 million reduction of net debt, putting us in a situation of very strong financial situation with a net debt of less than one time EBITDA. That gives an idea of Pampa capacity to finance future growth. So I wanted to end with this optimistic comment.

因此，淨債務減少了 3 億美元，使我們的財務狀況非常強勁，淨債務不到 EBITDA 的一倍。這讓我們了解潘帕有能力為未來的成長提供資金。所以我想以這個樂觀的評論來結束。

Thank you. So there are no more questions. Thank you very much for your questions. I will now turn to Lida for final remarks.

謝謝。所以沒有更多的問題了。非常感謝您的提問。我現在請利達做最後發言。

Okay. Thank you, everybody. I hope all this answers your questions. If you have any more just contact us. We will more than happy to help you. I will bid you a good day. Bye.

好的。謝謝大家。我希望這一切能夠回答您的問題。如果您還有更多，請與我們聯絡。我們將非常樂意為您提供協助。我祝你有美好的一天。再見。