PagSeguro Digital Ltd (PAGS) 2021 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good evening. My name is Kyle, and I'll be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to PagBank PagSeguro's earnings conference call for the second quarter of 2021. This event is being recorded. (Operator Instructions) After the speakers' remarks, there will be a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions) This event is also being broadcast live via webcast and may be accessed through PagBank PagSeguro's website at investors.pagseguro.com, where the presentation is also available. Participants may view the slides in any order they wish. The replay will be available shortly after the event is concluded. Those following the presentation via webcast may post their questions on PagBank PagSeguro's website.

晚上好。我叫凱爾，今天我將擔任你們的會議操作員。此時此刻，我歡迎大家參加 PagBank PagSeguro 2021 年第二季度的收益電話會議。該事件正在被記錄。（操作員說明） 演講者發言後，將進行問答環節。（操作員說明）該活動還通過網絡直播進行現場直播，並且可以通過 PagBank PagSeguro 的網站 Investors.pagseguro.com 進行訪問，也可以在該網站上觀看演示。參與者可以按照他們希望的任何順序觀看幻燈片。賽事結束後不久將提供重播。通過網絡廣播觀看演示文稿的人員可以在 PagBank PagSeguro 的網站上發布他們的問題。

Before proceeding, let me mention that any forward statements included in the presentation are mentioned on this conference call are based on currently available information in PagBank PagSeguro's current assumptions, expectations and projections about future events. While PagBank PagSeguro believes that their assumptions, expectations and projections are reasonable in view of currently available information, you are cautioned not to place undue reliance on these forward-looking statements. Actual results may differ materially from those included in PagBank PagSeguro's presentation or discussed on this conference call for a variety of reasons, including those described in the forward-looking statements and Risk Factors sections of PagBank PagSeguro registration statement on Form 20F and other filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission, which are available on PagBank PagSeguro's Investor Relations website.

在繼續之前，請允許我提一下，本次電話會議中提及的演示文稿中包含的任何前瞻性陳述均基於 PagBank PagSeguro 目前對未來事件的假設、預期和預測中現有的信息。儘管 PagBank PagSeguro 認為，鑑於當前可獲得的信息，他們的假設、預期和預測是合理的，但請注意不要過分依賴這些前瞻性陳述。由於多種原因，實際結果可能與PagBank PagSeguro 的演示中包含或在本次電話會議上討論的結果存在重大差異，包括表格20F 上的PagBank PagSeguro 註冊聲明的前瞻性聲明和風險因素部分中描述的內容以及其他向公司提交的文件美國證券交易委員會，可在 PagBank PagSeguro 的投資者關係網站上找到。

Finally, I would like to remind you that during the conference call, the company may discuss some non-GAAP measures. For more details, the foregoing non-GAAP measures and the reconciliation of those non-GAAP financial measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measures are presented in the last page of this webcast presentation.

最後，我想提醒大家，在電話會議期間，公司可能會討論一些非公認會計準則措施。有關更多詳細信息，本網絡廣播演示文稿的最後一頁介紹了上述非 GAAP 衡量標準以及這些非 GAAP 財務衡量標準與最直接可比的 GAAP 衡量標準的調節表。

Now I will turn the conference over to Ricardo Dutra, Chief Executive Officer. Please, Mr. Dutra, you may begin your presentation.

現在我將會議交給首席執行官 Ricardo Dutra。杜特拉先生，請開始您的演講。

Good evening from Sao Paulo, everyone, and thanks for joining our second quarter results conference call. Tonight, I have here with me Artur Schunck, our Chief Financial Officer; and Eric Oliveira, our Head of Investor Relations. First, we hope you and your families are well and safe. Before we proceed, let me share a quick update about the current situation related to the pandemic and its impacts in Brazil. Last quarter, we shared our improving confidence that it seems the worse was over. Vaccination continues to take place. Currently, approximately 70% of the population took at least 1 shot and around 30% took 2 shots already. The contamination and death ratios have been decreasing, which has been encouraging authorities to ease the social distance measures in several regions of the country.

聖保羅的大家晚上好，感謝您參加我們的第二季度業績電話會議。今晚，與我同在的還有我們的首席財務官 Artur Schunck；以及我們的投資者關係主管埃里克·奧利維拉 (Eric Oliveira)。首先，我們希望您和您的家人身體健康、安全。在我們繼續之前，讓我快速分享一下與這一流行病及其對巴西的影響有關的當前局勢的最新情況。上個季度，我們分享了我們日益增強的信心，即最糟糕的情況似乎已經過去。疫苗接種仍在繼續進行。目前，大約 70% 的人至少注射過 1 次疫苗，約 30% 的人已經註射過 2 次疫苗。污染和死亡率一直在下降，這鼓勵當局放鬆該國多個地區的社交距離措施。

The ongoing secular shift from cash to electronic and digital transactions continues, reinforcing that the consumer behaviors are changing despite the reopening, and we have seen millions of people being included into the financial system. We also see across the world, several companies embracing the digital banking strategy to explore this unique opportunity. For example, in this quarter, we were honored to see PayPal and Square announcing their initiatives to expanding into financial services, which is the move we have done in May 2019 with the launch of PagBank. In addition, as the regulators in Brazil continue to foster competition, players with tech DNA, strong execution and robust balance sheet have the chance to explore new verticals, cross-selling strategies and close the existing loop between merchants and consumers while optimizing the gross profit generation per user.

從現金交易到電子和數字交易的長期轉變仍在繼續，這強化了儘管重新開放，消費者行為正在發生變化，我們已經看到數百萬人被納入金融體系。我們還看到世界各地有多家公司採用數字銀行戰略來探索這一獨特的機會。例如，在本季度，我們很榮幸地看到 PayPal 和 Square 宣布了向金融服務領域擴張的舉措，這是我們在 2019 年 5 月推出 PagBank 時採取的舉措。此外，隨著巴西監管機構繼續促進競爭，擁有科技DNA、強大執行力和穩健資產負債表的參與者有機會探索新的垂直領域、交叉銷售策略，並在優化毛利潤的同時關閉商家和消費者之間的現有循環。每個用戶一代。

Having consistently invested during the last years in our 2-sided ecosystem has been paying off. In June 2021, the number of PagBank clients surpassed 11 million, and the engagement continues to increase, as the number of logins only in our app per workday reached 10 million, or 1 login per user per workday. Another example is the credit expertise. After more than 3 years, the combination of sophisticated data analytics, an incredible team, the banking license, and a unique active merchant base gave us the diligence to decelerate the underwriting amid the pandemic, to warm up the engines for the reopening. We are delighted to announce that our credit portfolio surpassed the mark of BRL 1 billion with an increasing origination for the coming months and controlled NPL ratios.

過去幾年對我們的雙向生態系統的持續投資已獲得回報。2021 年 6 月，PagBank 客戶數量超過 1100 萬，並且參與度持續增加，每個工作日僅在我們的應用程序中登錄的次數達到 1000 萬，即每個工作日每個用戶登錄 1 次。另一個例子是信貸專業知識。經過三年多的時間，複雜的數據分析、令人難以置信的團隊、銀行牌照和獨特的活躍商戶基礎的結合使我們在大流行期間努力放慢了承保速度，為重新開業預熱了引擎。我們很高興地宣布，我們的信貸組合突破了 10 億雷亞爾大關，未來幾個月的信貸發放量不斷增加，不良貸款率也得到控制。

In payments, the scenario also looks brighter. Our acquiring TPV continues to grow strongly, giving us the confidence to review upward our payments volumes guidance for 2021. Comparing with Q2 2020, PagSeguro was the company in the Brazilian market with the highest acquiring TPV growth among the top 5 Brazilian acquirers, 89% year over year, and probably, the highest total net revenue growth, 75% year over year. Our strong brand, superior logistics infrastructure and complete pack is offered to our merchants, among other strengths, allowed us to keep growing in the long tail and to roll out our Hubs faster than expected.

在支付方面，情況看起來也更加光明。我們對冠捷的收購繼續強勁增長，這讓我們有信心上調 2021 年的付款量指引。與 2020 年第二季度相比，PagSeguro 是巴西市場前 5 名收購者中收購 TPV 增長最高的公司，同比增長 89%，並且可能是總淨收入增長最高的公司，同比增長 75%。我們強大的品牌、卓越的物流基礎設施和為我們的商戶提供的完整包裝以及其他優勢，使我們能夠保持長尾增長，並以比預期更快的速度推出我們的中心。

Our [reg] results have been impressive reinforcing our thesis that it's easier to go up in the pyramid than to go down, and that even SMBs are underserved in the country. With this new TPV mix, as we commented last quarter, our take rates are stable, and we expect this take rate level for the rest of the year. Finally, we continue to pursue for the optimum capital allocation and the best balance between growth and profitability. We reduced the CapEx per sales ratio from 25% in Q2 2020 to 17% in Q2 2021, a positive surprise leading to a guidance review for CapEx in 2021, driven by lower POS acquisitions, since we took the right decision in the last year to prepare the inventory levels, which reinforced our massive scale and purchasing power, improving the unit economic of our cohorts.

我們的 [reg] 結果令人印象深刻，強化了我們的論點，即在金字塔中上升比下降更容易，而且即使是中小企業在該國也得不到充分的服務。正如我們上季度所評論的那樣，通過這種新的 TPV 組合，我們的採用率保持穩定，並且我們預計今年剩餘時間的採用率水平。最後，我們繼續追求最佳的資本配置以及增長和盈利之間的最佳平衡。我們將每銷售額的資本支出比率從2020 年第二季度的25% 降低到2021 年第二季度的17%，這是一個積極的驚喜，導致在POS 收購減少的推動下對2021 年資本支出進行指導性審查，因為我們去年做出了正確的決定準備庫存水平，這增強了我們的大規模規模和購買力，提高了我們團隊的單位經濟性。

Investments in technology have been helping us to maintain our strategy to grow organically, and we are happy to highlight 4 new products. First, cell phone insurance. Our fourth insurance product distributed by PAGS. We also launched an exclusive investment fund, PagBank All Seasons, which gives the options to our clients to diversify their investments. We will also launch Brazilian treasury bonds trade platform. Our PagInvest vertical already comes with 5 CDs and 50 investment funds with several asset allocation strategies, such as equities, corporate bonds, FX, gold, even cryptocurrencies. Finally, we are launching an overdraft loans product, initially offered only to our best cohorts, which will expand the credit options for our clients.

對技術的投資一直在幫助我們維持有機增長的戰略，我們很高興重點介紹 4 款新產品。第一，手機保險。我們的第四種保險產品由 PAGS 分銷。我們還推出了獨家投資基金 PagBank All Seasons，為我們的客戶提供多元化投資的選擇。我們還將推出巴西國債交易平台。我們的 PagInvest 垂直市場已配備 5 個 CD 和 50 個投資基金，具有多種資產配置策略，例如股票、公司債券、外匯、黃金，甚至加密貨幣。最後，我們正在推出透支貸款產品，最初只向我們最優秀的群體提供，這將擴大我們客戶的信貸選擇。

All the positive impacts we have been producing in our society will be shared in the next months in our first sustainability report, where all the stakeholders will have the opportunity to follow closer our initiatives to serve better our clients, measured by the highest standards available in the market. Also, we plan to have our first Investor Day in November, a brand-new initiative to discuss the strategic plans for the company for the coming years, where Luiz Frias, our Founder and Chairman, and part of the PAGS' senior management team will share their thoughts about the trends, the future of finance, and how we are preparing the company to keep consolidating its leadership in financial services and payments. I'm very encouraged by the recovery trajectory and pleased with the momentum in both businesses, PagSeguro and PagBank.

我們在社會中產生的所有積極影響將在接下來的幾個月中在我們的第一份可持續發展報告中分享，所有利益相關者將有機會更密切地關注我們的舉措，以更好地服務我們的客戶，並以最高標準來衡量。市場。此外，我們計劃在11 月舉辦首個投資者日，這是一項全新的舉措，旨在討論公司未來幾年的戰略計劃，我們的創始人兼董事長Luiz Frias 以及PAGS 高級管理團隊的一部分將在會上分享他們對金融趨勢、未來以及我們如何讓公司做好準備以繼續鞏固其在金融服務和支付領域的領導地位的想法。我對複蘇軌跡感到非常鼓舞，並對 PagSeguro 和 PagBank 兩家公司的發展勢頭感到滿意。

Finally, nothing of this would have happened without the confidence of our shareholders, the commitment of our suppliers, and the best and most committed team working hard every day to promote our mission: being part of the financial lifecycle of every Brazilian citizen, promoting a massive financial inclusion in our country. Thank you very much PagBank PagSeguro team. That said, Artur and I will present some slides, and we'll have a Q&A session at the end.

最後，如果沒有我們股東的信心、供應商的承諾以及最優秀、最忠誠的團隊每天努力促進我們的使命，這一切都不會發生：成為每個巴西公民金融生命週期的一部分，促進我國的大規模金融包容性。非常感謝 PagBank PagSeguro 團隊。也就是說，阿圖爾和我將展示一些幻燈片，最後我們將舉行問答環節。

On Slide 3, we highlight the achievements of the second quarter. Record total revenue of BRL 2.4 billion, up 75% with acquiring revenue reaching BRL 2.2 billion and PagBank revenue of BRL 182 million. All-time high consolidated TPV of BRL 102 billion, up 154%, with acquiring TPV growing 89%, with Hubs TPV and Online TPV maintaining the strong growth trends observed in the past quarters, and PagBank TPV growing 341%, both in comparison to same period of last year.

在幻燈片 3 上，我們重點介紹了第二季度的成就。總收入創紀錄地達到 24 億雷亞爾，增長 75%，其中收購收入達到 22 億雷亞爾，PagBank 收入達到 1.82 億雷亞爾。綜合 TPV 達到歷史新高，達 1,020 億雷亞爾，增長 154%，其中收購 TPV 增長 89%，Hubs TPV 和 Online TPV 保持過去幾個季度的強勁增長趨勢，PagBank TPV 增長 341%，兩者相比去年同期。

Adjusted EBITDA of BRL 629 million, up 64%, with acquiring adjusted EBITDA reaching BRL 730 million and PagBank adjusted EBITDA reducing losses as a percentage of PagBank Revenue gaining traction to reach the break-even in the coming quarters.

調整後 EBITDA 為 6.29 億雷亞爾，增長 64%，收購調整後 EBITDA 達到 7.3 億雷亞爾，PagBank 調整後 EBITDA 減少了損失佔 PagBank 收入的百分比，有望在未來幾個季度實現收支平衡。

Non-GAAP net income of BRL 345 million, up 12% year-over-year. CapEx per sales went down from 25% in Q2 2020 to 17% in Q2 2021.

非 GAAP 淨利潤為 3.45 億雷亞爾，同比增長 12%。每銷售額的資本支出從 2020 年第二季度的 25% 下降至 2021 年第二季度的 17%。

In June, our PagBank active clients surpassed 11 million, driven by an outstanding 2.1 million net addition in the quarter, while active merchants continue to be healthy net addition pace above 220,000 reaching 7.6 million active merchants.

6 月份，我們的 PagBank 活躍客戶超過 1,100 萬，受本季度淨增 210 萬的出色推動，而活躍商戶繼續保持健康的淨增速度，淨增超過 22 萬，達到 760 萬活躍商戶。

Next slide, we present PagSeguro's highlights. While in Q2 2021 versus Q2 2020, the total cards industry in Brazil grew 52%, our acquiring TPV grew 89%, driven by the secular shift to electronic payments combined with our successful go-to-market strategy to serve, not only long tail merchants but also sellers larger than long tails through our Hubs. Our active merchants reached 7.6 million. Although our metric for active merchants considers at least one transaction in the last 12 months and it may differ from other players, in chart below, we can see our dominance in number of merchants when compared with other players in the industry.

下一張幻燈片，我們將展示 PagSeguro 的亮點。與2020 年第二季度相比，2021 年第二季度巴西的銀行卡行業總量增長了52%，而我們收購的TPV 增長了89%，這得益於向電子支付的長期轉變以及我們成功的市場進入戰略，不僅服務於長尾業務通過我們的中心，不僅可以吸引商家，還可以吸引大於長尾的賣家。我們的活躍商戶達到760萬。儘管我們對活躍商戶的衡量標准考慮了過去12 個月內至少一筆交易，並且可能與其他參與者有所不同，但在下圖中，我們可以看到與業內其他參與者相比，我們在商戶數量方面佔據主導地位。

In Q2, we had 226,000 merchants net adds. Although it is a strong number, it wasn't better because we saw a higher churn in April 2021 related to the business mortality from April 2020, during the peak of pandemic and lockdowns in Brazil. As for active merchants, we consider at least one transaction in the last 12 months. Businesses that closed in April 2020 and did not generate any TPV since then only affects our churn rates in April 2021. Important to say, we did not observe higher churn in May and June, and we had healthy net adds in these 2 months.

第二季度，我們淨增加了 226,000 家商戶。儘管這是一個強勁的數字，但情況並沒有更好，因為我們看到 2021 年 4 月的客戶流失率較高，這與 2020 年 4 月（巴西疫情和封鎖高峰期）的企業死亡率有關。對於活躍商戶，我們考慮過去 12 個月內至少有一筆交易。2020 年 4 月關閉且此後未產生任何 TPV 的企業只會影響我們 2021 年 4 月的流失率。重要的是，我們在 5 月和 6 月沒有觀察到更高的客戶流失率，並且在這 2 個月中我們有健康的淨增加。

Moving to the right side of the slide. TPV trends observed in July and first day of August are also encouraging. Despite the hard comps due to the coronavoucher program distributed last year, volumes grew 55% year-over-year in July. Additionally, during the last week, the Saturday before Father's Day in Brazil, we reached a new all-time high daily TPV. Bottom right, we see that in the first 7 months of the year, acquiring TPV grew 70%.

移動到幻燈片的右側。7 月和 8 月第一天觀察到的 TPV 趨勢也令人鼓舞。儘管由於去年發放的新冠優惠券計劃而產生了硬性競爭，但 7 月份的銷量同比增長了 55%。此外，在上週，即巴西父親節前的星期六，我們的每日 TPV 創下了歷史新高。右下角，我們看到今年前 7 個月，冠捷收購增長了 70%。

Moving to Slide 5, acquiring revenues grew 77% in comparison to the same period in the last year, or 35% on a 2-year CAGR basis. The growth was due to a better TPV mix towards credit cards volumes and our successful strategy to serve larger merchants, which supported the acquiring net take rate of 2.24%, stable in comparison to the first quarter. Bottom right, our adjusted EBITDA reached BRL 730 million, almost a 60% growth in comparison to second quarter of 2020. Important to mention that in the last year, there was a tax provision reversal in the amount of BRL 84 million, which we excluded for a better comparison. Despite the higher investment to roll out our Hubs and continuous improvements in our payments' services to our merchants, we were able to gain market share, consolidate our position and increase EBITDA.

轉向幻燈片 5，收購收入與去年同期相比增長了 77%，按 2 年復合年增長率計算，增長了 35%。這一增長得益於 TPV 對信用卡交易量的更好組合以及我們服務大型商戶的成功戰略，這支持了 2.24% 的收單淨接受率，與第一季度相比保持穩定。右下角，我們調整後的 EBITDA 達到 7.3 億雷亞爾，與 2020 年第二季度相比增長了近 60%。值得一提的是，去年有 8,400 萬雷亞爾的稅收撥備沖銷，為了更好的比較，我們將其排除在外。儘管我們投入了更多資金來推出我們的中心，並且不斷改進我們為商戶提供的支付服務，但我們仍然能夠獲得市場份額，鞏固我們的地位並增加 EBITDA。

Moving to next slide. Taking the opportunity explored in the previous slide, I want to share the results of our Hubs. Hubs TPV grew 4x year-over-year, outpacing best estimates of our models, due to the economy reopening and a disciplined execution to serve larger merchants, combined with a powerful competitive advantage which is PagBank. We are the only payments company in the market with a complete digital account and without any conflict of interests with controlling shareholders or partners, which allow us to look for the best combination to serve merchants and leverage the gross profits per clients, exploring both money flows, the cash in and the cash out.

轉到下一張幻燈片。利用上一張幻燈片中探討的機會，我想分享我們中心的成果。由於經濟重新開放和服務大型商戶的嚴格執行，再加上 PagBank 強大的競爭優勢，Hubs TPV 同比增長了 4 倍，超出了我們模型的最佳估計。我們是市場上唯一擁有完整數字賬戶的支付公司，與控股股東或合作夥伴沒有任何利益衝突，這使我們能夠尋找最佳組合來服務商戶並利用每個客戶的毛利潤，探索資金流向，現金入金和現金出金。

We are targeting merchants, on average, 4 to 5x larger than our average long tail seller. And by the end of 2021, we are expecting to cover more than 80% of the Brazilian GDP with approximately 300 Hubs throughout the country. Backed by a strong sales culture, which mingles young professionals with seasonal sales professionals from other sectors, we are creating a unique relationship model driven not only by client's activation, but also by client's engagement. We are also observing a larger number of software subscribers, which was 801,000, already representing 11% of PAGS' active merchants.

我們的目標商家平均規模是我們平均長尾賣家的 4 到 5 倍。到 2021 年底，我們預計將在全國建立約 300 個中心，覆蓋巴西 GDP 的 80% 以上。在強大的銷售文化的支持下，我們將年輕的專業人​​士與來自其他行業的季節性銷售專業人士融為一體，我們正在創建一種獨特的關係模式，不僅由客戶的激活驅動，而且由客戶的參與驅動。我們還觀察到軟件訂閱者數量增加，達到 801,000 人，已佔 PAGS 活躍商家的 11%。

Finally, PagBank continue to be the best strategy to engage merchants and increase cross-selling opportunities. In June, we reached 82% of heavy users, PAGS' merchants that used payments and digital banking within the last 12 months, a growth of 54 percentage points in comparison to Q2 2019.

最後，PagBank 仍然是吸引商家和增加交叉銷售機會的最佳策略。6 月份，我們覆蓋了 82% 的重度用戶，即過去 12 個月內使用過支付和數字銀行的 PAGS 商戶，與 2019 年第二季度相比增長了 54 個百分點。

Moving to Slide 7, we give some infos about our online and omnichannel volumes. Bottom left. Online TPV grew 104% year-over-year, driven by web checkouts, cross-border transactions, and link of payments. Omnichannel volumes, which considers volumes from merchants that accept not only POS transactions, but also use online payment solutions, doubled their share in comparison to Q1 2020, the last quarter before the outbreak of COVID-19 in Brazil. We continue to take advantage of MoIP platform, increasing the barriers against competition and potential pressures on yields once its anti-fraud system guarantees the best approval rate in the market. And split payments solution is highly customizable for e-commerce, marketplaces, and other payments methods. On the bottom right, although it represents a small portion of our total TPV, BoaCompra, our subsidiary focused on providing cross-border transactions for merchants is growing steadily.

轉到幻燈片 7，我們提供了有關我們的在線和全渠道銷量的一些信息。左下方。在網絡結賬、跨境交易和支付鏈接的推動下，在線 TPV 同比增長 104%。全渠道交易量（考慮了不僅接受POS 交易而且還使用在線支付解決方案的商家的交易量）與2020 年第一季度（巴西COVID-19 爆發前的最後一個季度）相比，其份額增加了一倍。我們繼續利用MoIP平台，一旦其反欺詐系統保證了市場上最好的批准率，就會增加競爭壁壘和潛在的收益壓力。拆分支付解決方案可針對電子商務、市場和其他支付方式進行高度定制。右下角，雖然只占我們TPV總量的一小部分，但我們專注於為商戶提供跨境交易的子公司BoaCompra正在穩步增長。

Moving to Slide 8, another grateful surprise. We had a record net addition of 2.1 million new PagBank clients, surpassing the mark of 11 million PagBank active users, being 45% of these clients composed by consumers. Combined with the increasing in product per user ratio, which went from 2.6 products in Q2 2020 to 3 products in this quarter, accelerated PagBank TPV, which grew 341% year-over-year. PagBank revenues continue to present healthy trends, reaching BRL 182 million, up 89% year-over-year, with the better trends in adjusted EBITDA losses, which had a negative margin of 80% in Q2 2020 versus negative margin of 55% in Q2 2021.

轉到幻燈片 8，這是另一個令人感激的驚喜。我們淨增了創紀錄的 210 萬 PagBank 新客戶，超過了 1,100 萬 PagBank 活躍用戶的大關，其中 45% 的客戶由消費者組成。再加上每用戶產品比率的增加（從 2020 年第二季度的 2.6 個產品增加到本季度的 3 個產品），加速了 PagBank TPV 的增長，同比增長 341%。PagBank 收入繼續呈現健康趨勢，達到1.82 億雷亞爾，同比增長89%，調整後EBITDA 損失趨勢較好，2020 年第二季度的負利潤率為80%，而第二季度的負利潤率為55 % 2021 年。

Moving to Slide 9, we want to share some additional information about the engagement metrics. The number of active cards indexed to a 100, increased 4x in comparison to Q2 '19, while cards spends doubled in comparison to Q2 2020. PagBank app logins reached an incredible mark of 783 million, 3x more than the same period of 2020, which is similar to say that every PagBank client logged in our app on average 1 time every workday. The number of payroll portability skyrocketed, increasing 7x, backed by our cashback incentive to clients with formal paychecks to make the portability to PagBank being able to receive up to BRL 600, or $120, in the next 36 months.

轉到幻燈片 9，我們想分享一些有關參與度指標的其他信息。活躍卡數量指數達到 100，與 19 年第二季度相比增加了 4 倍，而卡支出與 2020 年第二季度相比增加了一倍。PagBank 應用程序登錄量達到了令人難以置信的 7.83 億次，是 2020 年同期的 3 倍，這相當於每個 PagBank 客戶平均每個工作日登錄我們的應用程序 1 次。工資可轉移的數量猛增，增加了7 倍，這得益於我們對正式工資客戶的現金返還激勵，使PagBank 的可轉移能夠在未來36 個月內收到高達600 巴西雷亞爾（即120美元）。

Finally, PagInvest assets under custody almost reached BRL 5 billion, up 85% year-over-year, driven by our increasing number of registered clients with access to CDs and investment funds offers. In July, registered clients were 647,000, and we were offering almost 50 investment funds in our platform, which has been key to deepen our relationship with our clients as well to attract the new ones. As I said in my initial remarks, we are happy to launch our Brazilian treasury trade platform in the next week.

最後，PagInvest 託管資產接近 50 億雷亞爾，同比增長 85%，這得益於我們越來越多的註冊客戶能夠獲得 CD 和投資基金優惠。7 月份，註冊客戶為 647,000 名，我們在平台上提供了近 50 只投資基金，這對於加深我們與客戶的關係以及吸引新客戶至關重要。正如我在最初的發言中所說，我們很高興在下週推出我們的巴西國債交易平台。

Now, I would like to turn the conference over to Artur, our CFO, who will talk about our credit portfolio and our financial results for the quarter. Artur, please go ahead.

現在，我想將會議交給我們的首席財務官阿圖爾，他將討論我們的信貸投資組合和本季度的財務業績。阿圖爾，請繼續。

Thanks, Ricardo, and good evening, everyone. I also hope all of you and your family are well and in a good health. Following our presentation in the Slide 10, the performance of our credit portfolio is improving every day based on efficient credit models, our experienced team, and several learnings from the last 3 years of operation. June ended with a total credit portfolio surpassing BRL 1 billion, being 56% of growth in capital loans, 41% of credit cards and 2% of other credit products.

謝謝里卡多，大家晚上好。我也希望你們和你們的家人都身體健康。在幻燈片 10 中的演示之後，基於高效的信貸模型、我們經驗豐富的團隊以及過去 3 年運營中的一些經驗教訓，我們的信貸投資組合的績效每天都在改善。截至 6 月份，信貸組合總額超過 10 億雷亞爾，其中資本貸款增長 56%，信用卡增長 41%，其他信貸產品增長 2%。

I would like to reinforce that credit underwriting in Brazil is not a 100-metres sprint race. It is a marathon where learnings from the experience, patience and preparation make all the difference. We have been preparing the company since day 1 and now we already achieved more than 3 years of credit underwriting to micro-merchants. The portfolio is 100% booked in our balance sheet, which provided us the awareness and diligence to decelerate in the past and to speed up now. Additionally, we see the registry of receivables as an opportunity for tech companies which provides financial services, even though market should not assume the registry as a parachute for poor credit underwriting.

我想強調的是，巴西的信貸承保不是一場百米短跑比賽。這是一場馬拉松，從經驗中學習、耐心和準備會讓一切變得不同。我們從第一天起就開始為公司做準備，現在我們已經實現了超過3年的小商戶信用承銷。該投資組合 100% 記錄在我們的資產負債表中，這使我們有意識和勤奮地在過去減速，現在加速。此外，我們認為應收賬款登記對於提供金融服務的科技公司來說是一個機會，儘管市場不應將登記視為不良信用承銷的降落傘。

On the right side, our cash position remained very strong with a positive balance of BRL 8.2 billion, reinforced by the issuance of PagBank CDs to fund the credit disbursements. Loans to deposits ratio was 62% guaranteeing stamina to grow our credit portfolio in a healthy and sustainable way.

在右側，我們的現金狀況仍然非常強勁，有 82 億雷亞爾的正餘額，並通過發行 PagBank CD 為信貸支出提供資金而得到加強。存貸比62%，為信貸健康可持續發展提供了後勁。

Moving to Slide 11, we present our quarterly financial results.

轉向幻燈片 11，我們展示季度財務業績。

In the top left, our consolidated net take rate reached 2.43%, 2 basis points higher in comparison to first quarter 2021 and 13 basis points versus fourth quarter '20 driven by better TPV mix with more credit, lower debit transactions and helped by a larger PagBank revenue. In the top right graphic, we share our non-GAAP total costs and expenses reached totaled BRL 1.9 billion in the second quarter of 2021, up 87% year-over-year. Cost of sales and services represented 67% of total costs and expenses, increasing 63% year-over-year at the same level of TPV growth, driven by higher interchange and card scheme fees, higher depreciation and amortization related to our solid active merchants' additions during the past quarters and expenses to implement new products and services.

在左上方，我們的綜合淨採用率達到2.43%，與2021 年第一季度相比高出2 個基點，與20 年第四季度相比高出13 個基點，這得益於更好的TPV組合、更多的信貸、更低的借記交易以及更大的貸款規模。 PagBank 收入。在右上圖中，我們分享了 2021 年第二季度的非 GAAP 總成本和費用達到 19 億雷亞爾，同比增長 87%。銷售和服務成本佔總成本和費用的67%，在TPV 增長水平相同的情況下同比增長63%，這是由於交換和卡計劃費用增加、與我們穩固的活躍商戶相關的折舊和攤銷增加所推動的。過去幾個季度的增加以及實施新產品和服務的費用。

Selling Expenses represented 26% of total costs and expenses and increased 155% year-over-year due to the headcount expansion for Hubs and PagBank teams and higher marketing expenses for new campaigns. Financial services jumped from a share of 2% in second quarter of '20 to 7% in the second quarter of 2021, mainly due to a TPV mix improvement, requiring additional working capital volumes to prepay our merchants. On top of that, the increase of the Brazilian basic interest rate and the exchange rate devaluation for international transactions for BoaCompra also pushed expenses up versus last year. In the bottom left chart, the adjusted EBITDA went from BRL 384 million in the second quarter of 2020, excluding the benefit of BRL 84 million related to a tax provision reversal last year to an adjusted EBITDA of BRL 629 million this year with a growth of 64% versus the same period of 2020.

由於 Hubs 和 PagBank 團隊的人數擴張以及新活動的營銷費用增加，銷售費用佔總成本和費用的 26%，同比增長 155%。金融服務的份額從 20 年第二季度的 2% 躍升至 2021 年第二季度的 7%，這主要是由於 TPV 組合的改善，需要額外的營運資金量來預付我們的商戶。除此之外，巴西基本利率的上調以及BoaCompra國際交易的匯率貶值也推高了BoaCompra的費用較去年增加。在左下圖中，調整後的EBITDA 從2020 年第二季度的3.84 億雷亞爾（不包括去年與稅收撥備轉回相關的8400 萬雷亞爾的收益）增至今年調整後的EBITDA 6.29 億雷亞爾，增長了與 2020 年同期相比增長 64%。

Finally, in the bottom right, we share our capital allocation. During the second quarter of this year, we invested almost BRL 407 million, being 50% in POS acquisitions and on almost another 50% in R&D to develop new products, features, and services. As a percentage of revenues, CapEx decreased 8 percentage points, reaching 17% versus 25% in the second quarter of 2020.

最後，在右下角，我們分享了我們的資本配置。今年第二季度，我們投資了近 4.07 億雷亞爾，其中 50% 用於 POS 收購，另外 50% 用於研發，以開發新產品、功能和服務。資本支出佔收入的百分比下降了 8 個百分點，達到 17%，而 2020 年第二季度為 25%。

Moving to the Slide 12, the last one of this conference call.

轉到幻燈片 12，這是本次電話會議的最後一張。

As Dutra said in his initial remarks, the positive trends of the first semester led us to review our acquiring TPV growth guidance from above 40% to above 45% in 2021. We also project a reduction of capital expenditures in BRL 200 million, setting a new level of BRL 1.8 billion for this year, optimizing the cash flow generation.

正如杜特拉在最初的講話中所說，第一季度的積極趨勢促使我們重新審視了 2021 年收購冠捷增長指導，從 40% 以上調整至 45% 以上。我們還計劃減少 2 億雷亞爾的資本支出，今年將資本支出設定為 18 億雷亞爾的新水平，優化現金流生成。

Now we end our presentation, and we can start the Q&A session.

現在我們的演講結束了，我們可以開始問答環節了。

Thank you. Operator, please.

謝謝。接線員，請說。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from Mariana Taddeo with UBS.

（操作員說明）我們的第一個問題來自瑞銀集團的瑪麗安娜·塔迪奧（Mariana Taddeo）。

My question is related to net adds in the acquiring space. In this quarter, it decelerates. Is there any impacts of business more targeted from COVID-19 1 year ago in the second quarter last year? And could you also talk a bit on the competitive scenario and your expectation for net adds going forward? Do you think that PAGS would be able to accelerate the pace of net adds again?

我的問題與收購領域的淨增加有關。本季度，增速放緩。去年第二季度，一年前的 COVID-19 對業務更有針對性嗎？您能否談談競爭情況以及您對未來淨增長的預期？您認為PAGS能否再次加快淨增速度？

Mariana, this is Ricardo. Good to hear. Thank you for the question. Let's talk first about the net add in Q2. We saw a increase in business mortality from merchants in April 2020, so as our active merchants metrics consider at least one transaction in the last 12 months. So the business that were closed or shut down in April 2020, they generate churn in April 2021. If you remember well, in Brazil, April 2020 was the worst month in terms of the pandemic and lockdowns. So that's why we had a impact in churn related to business mortality from 1 year ago. But it's also worth to say that these merchants, they were not transacting since May 2020. So we didn't see -- we didn't have any TPV from them since then. So it's the metric for the churn. They impacted, but TPV, we didn't have this TPV since May 2020. So that's why we saw this 226,000, which is a very different number, but it could be better if we didn't have this more targets from last year.

瑪麗安娜，這是里卡多。很高興聽到。感謝你的提問。我們先來談談第二季度的淨增量。我們發現 2020 年 4 月商家的商業死亡率有所增加，因此我們的活躍商家指標考慮了過去 12 個月內至少一筆交易。因此，2020 年 4 月關閉或關閉的業務將在 2021 年 4 月產生流失。如果您還記得的話，在巴西，2020 年 4 月是疫情和封鎖最嚴重的一個月。這就是為什麼我們從一年前開始就對與企業死亡率相關的客戶流失產生了影響。但還值得一提的是，這些商家自 2020 年 5 月以來就沒有進行交易。所以我們沒有看到——從那時起我們就沒有從他們那裡得到任何 TPV。所以這是流失率的衡量標準。他們受到了影響，但是 TPV，我們自 2020 年 5 月以來就沒有這個 TPV。這就是為什麼我們看到了 226,000，這是一個非常不同的數字，但如果我們沒有比去年更多的目標，情況可能會更好。

Regarding the competitive scenario, what you see here, as we've been talking in the past quarters, some of the acquirers from the incumbents from the banks, they decided not to play in the long tail market anymore. Some of them, they were vocal saying they will not play. Some of them just increased the price by 5x or things like that. This is a way not to work in this market. And I mean, you don't say no, but it just increase the prices. It's a way for not to play anymore. We keep seeing some competition from the same players that we had a year ago. Everybody -- everyone knows about the natural competitor is Mercado Pago. We keep adding thousands of merchants every month.

關於競爭場景，正如我們在過去幾個季度中一直在談論的那樣，您在這裡看到的，銀行現有企業的一些收購者決定不再參與長尾市場。其中一些人大聲表示不會參加比賽。他們中的一些人只是將價格提高了 5 倍或類似的事情。這是在這個市場行不通的方法。我的意思是，你不會拒絕，但這只會提高價格。這是一種不再玩的方法。我們不斷看到來自一年前的同一批球員的競爭。每個人——每個人都知道天然的競爭對手是Mercado Pago。我們每個月都會增加數千個商家。

We saw some of our competitors increasing prices this week. Some of that increase in the prepayment rates. Some of them made a different price for different card schemes, mainly in the local card schemes, such as Elo and Hipercard. So we saw more rationality in pricing, not crazy movements. And the scenario is similar to what we had in the past quarters or even better. We didn't give this year a guidance for net adds, but we keep talking to some of you that we expect to have 1 million net adds in the year. We had more than 500 -- 530 in the first semester. So I keep saying it's feasible to have this 1 million or even more. So let's see the following months, and then we can give you more color. But I mean the best information could be keep thinking about 1 million net adds in this 2021.

我們看到一些競爭對手本週提高了價格。其中一些是提前還款率的增加。其中一些針對不同的卡方案製定了不同的價格，主要是當地的卡方案，例如Elo和Hipercard。所以我們看到定價更加理性，而不是瘋狂的波動。這種情況與我們過去幾個季度的情況相似甚至更好。我們沒有給出今年的淨增量指導，但我們一直在與你們中的一些人交談，我們預計今年淨增量將達到 100 萬。第一學期我們有超過 500 到 530 人。所以我一直說這個100萬甚至更多都是可行的。所以讓我們看看接下來的幾個月，然後我們可以給你更多的色彩。但我的意思是，最好的信息可能是繼續考慮 2021 年淨新增人數 100 萬。

And our next question comes from Craig Maurer with Autonomous Research.

我們的下一個問題來自自治研究中心的 Craig Maurer。

The take rate in the quarter held up better than my expectation. Can you talk about -- you just addressed pricing in general? But can you talk about how we should think about that trend as the SMB Hubs continue to grow? And that will have a dilutive effect on take rate, I would imagine. Secondly, if you could talk about the progress in lending products, specific to PagBank and how that will drive take rate there? And just a last modeling question, how we should think about financial expense going forward?

本季度的採用率比我的預期要好。你能談談——你剛剛談到了一般定價問題嗎？但您能否談談隨著中小企業中心的不斷發展，我們應該如何看待這一趨勢？我想這會對採用率產生稀釋作用。其次，您是否可以談談貸款產品的進展，特別是 PagBank 的進展，以及這將如何推動那裡的利率？最後一個建模問題是，我們應該如何考慮未來的財務費用？

Craig, this is Ricardo. Also good to hear, and thank you for the question. I'm going to start and then Artur can help me here. Regarding take rates, we have this different moving parts, so to say, the tailwinds and the headwinds. So the tailwinds would be if we had the consumption coming back. In Brazil, we are having high inflation, pandemic is still here. We are not 100% back in the office, people are not traveling. So I mean, the consumption is not happening because of COVID and because of also the inflation that is kind of presenting some consumption. So that would be the tailwind. What is showing in this quarter, we already saw a slightly better net equating long tail, for instance, because the mix is getting better.

克雷格，這是里卡多。也很高興聽到你的提問，謝謝你的提問。我要開始了，然後阿圖爾可以在這裡幫助我。關於轉化率，我們有不同的移動部分，可以說，順風和逆風。因此，如果我們的消費回升，就會出現順風。在巴西，我們的通貨膨脹率很高，大流行病仍然存在。我們還沒有 100% 回到辦公室，人們也沒有出差。所以我的意思是，消費之所以沒有發生，是因為新冠疫情，也因為通脹帶來了一些消費。所以這將是順風。例如，本季度所顯示的情況是，我們已經看到了相當於長尾的淨值稍好一些，因為混合情況正在變得更好。

And in the headwind, which I would say, it's not really a headwind, but I mean, in terms of take rate, it's because we are having better performance in Hubs than we expected. So we are exceeding our expectations. You know that our merchants from Hubs, they have usually 4 to 5x larger TPV than long tail. And of course, they had a lower take rate. So if you look at the percentage, it's going to be lower, but in absolute terms, should be better because they have a TPV that's 5x larger than the long tail. So that's why we talked in the call before here that we expect to be flat or a little bit higher than that looking forward. So for these points here and there. Let's see how it's going to be the recovery here, and then we can give more information for you. But that's the moving parts. Those are the moving parts that you have consumption that could be back. And on the other hand, we are increasing and growing faster in our Hubs operations to serve SMBs.

在逆風中，我想說，這並不是真正的逆風，但我的意思是，就採用率而言，這是因為我們在 Hub 中的表現比我們預期的要好。所以我們超出了我們的預期。你知道我們Hubs的商家，他們的TPV通常比長尾大4到5倍。當然，他們的接受率較低。因此，如果你看一下百分比，它會更低，但從絕對值來看，應該更好，因為他們的 TPV 比長尾大 5 倍。因此，這就是為什麼我們之前在電話會議中表示，我們預計未來將持平或略高。所以對於這些點。讓我們看看這裡的恢復情況如何，然後我們可以為您提供更多信息。但這是活動部件。這些是您消耗的活動部件，可以恢復。另一方面，我們正在增加並更快地發展我們的中心業務，為中小型企業提供服務。

Regarding the lending product suite, we've been working in these models for, let's say, 3 years. We learned a lot. We were supposed to have a increase in disbursement last year. But because of COVID-19, we just decided to stop, not to give any credit, the same movement that we saw other banks doing in Brazil. And then we are giving some credit again in this year. The NPLs are under control. We see some of our merchants having better TPV recovery. So it will help our take rates. It could help our take rate the lending. It is also worth to say that, I guess, Artur can give more numbers here, but I'm going to finish and Artur can complement and talk about financial expenses.

關於貸款產品套件，我們已經在這些模型上工作了三年。我們學到了很多。去年我們本來應該增加支出。但由於 COVID-19，我們決定停止，不提供任何信貸，就像我們在巴西看到其他銀行所做的那樣。然後我們今年再次給予一些榮譽。不良貸款得到控制。我們看到一些商家的 TPV 恢復情況較好。所以這將有助於我們的收率。它可以幫助我們對貸款進行評級。還值得一提的是，我想阿圖爾可以在這裡提供更多數字，但我要結束了，阿圖爾可以補充並談論財務費用。

It's worth to say that we use here IFRS 9. So when you give some credit, we need to make the provision right at the beginning. So to some extent, we are, let's say, making the provision at the beginning and then the result is going to happen in the future. So that's why if we increase the credit, it could be even, let's say, not to help that much in short-term because of this IFRS 9 that we follow here. And about financial expenses, I guess, Artur can also help us. Thank you.

值得一提的是，我們在這裡使用的是 IFRS 9。因此，當您給予一些信用時，我們需要在一開始就做出撥備。所以在某種程度上，我們在一開始就做出了規定，然後結果就會在未來發生。因此，這就是為什麼如果我們增加信貸，甚至可以說，由於我們在此遵循的 IFRS 9，短期內可能不會有太大幫助。至於財務費用，我想阿圖爾也可以幫助我們。謝謝。

Okay. Craig, thank you for your question. Good talk to you again. And so regarding to our financial expenses, the big -- the 2 big impacts in this quarter was related to the TPV growth that is higher than our expectation and also impacting a larger working capital needs related to the advances of receivables to our clients, and also the increasing of Brazilian basic interest rate that is increasing the cost of PagBank CDs, and also the advances of receivables with bank insurers. Going forward, we expect that the basic interest rate achieved 7% in the end of this year. Obviously, we will increase our expenses.

好的。克雷格，謝謝你的提問。又和你聊得很開心。因此，就我們的財務費用而言，本季度的兩大影響與高於我們預期的 TPV 增長有關，並且還影響與向客戶預付應收賬款相關的更大營運資金需求，以及巴西基本利率的上漲也增加了PagBank CD 的成本，以及銀行保險公司的應收賬款預付款。展望未來，我們預計今年年底基本利率將達到7%。顯然，我們會增加開支。

What I can tell you is that Q3 will be higher than Q2 and Q4 will be higher than Q3. But we are following very close what the market is doing related to that because we can adjust the prices for SMB and larger clients that is used to have the prices paid to this -- in relation to this basic interest rate. And also for long tail, as Dutra said, some players in the market increased the prices. We don't have this plan for now, but we are very close to this movement in the market, and we'll take an action if necessary.

我可以告訴你的是，Q3 將高於 Q2，Q4 將高於 Q3。但我們正在密切關注市場的相關動態，因為我們可以根據基本利率調整中小企業和大型客戶的價格，這些客戶習慣於為此支付價格。正如杜特拉所說，對於長尾來說，市場上的一些參與者提高了價格。我們目前沒有這個計劃，但我們非常接近市場的這一變化，如有必要，我們將採取行動。

Our next question comes from Mario Pierry with Bank of America.

我們的下一個問題來自美國銀行的馬里奧·皮耶里。

Let me ask you 2 questions as well. The first one is on your credit portfolio. As you just talked about, right, last year, you're being cautious. Now you're accelerating lending at a time that even some of your peers that they're having problems, right, with the credit product because of problems at the chambers of receivables. So what makes you comfortable to start accelerating your credit growth now? And why aren't you having the same problems as some of your peers? And then the second question is related to your -- it's about your appetite for inorganic growth. About a month ago, there were some news or some rumors that you were interested in making an acquisition for BV. So if you could tell us a little bit about what happened, what is the strategy? How do you look at inorganic opportunities?

我也問你 2 個問題。第一個是你的信用投資組合。正如你剛才談到的，去年，你很謹慎。現在，您正在加速放貸，甚至您的一些同行也因為應收賬款商會的問題而在信貸產品方面遇到了問題。那麼，是什麼讓您願意現在就開始加速信貸增長呢？為什麼你沒有像你的一些同齡人一樣遇到同樣的問題？第二個問題與你有關——關於你對無機增長的興趣。大約一個月前，有一些消息或傳言稱您有興趣收購 BV。那麼，如果您能告訴我們一些發生的事情，策略是什麼？您如何看待無機機會？

Mario, this is Artur speaking. Thank you for your 2 questions. I will take the first one related to credit portfolio. And after this, Dutra will continue with the inorganic question. As Dutra said, we -- last year, as you mentioned too, last year, we stopped our operations related to the pandemic and the crisis that we have in the world. And this year, what encourages us to disburse more than last year was related to the NPL cohorts that are improving every time. And now we have 3 years of experience, a more sophisticated credit models. And that -- those models does not take in care of the chamber of receivables, okay? We are not considering the chamber of receivables helping us to collect. So I would say that our models need to work without the chamber of receivables. Obviously, we know that the chamber could help us who -- could help us in all the credit products, but we are not considering at this point, okay?

馬里奧，我是阿圖爾。謝謝你的2個問題。我將選擇與信貸投資組合相關的第一個。在此之後，杜特拉將繼續討論無機問題。正如杜特拉所說，我們去年，正如你也提到的，去年，我們停止了與大流行和世界危機相關的業務。今年，促使我們比去年支出更多的原因與不良貸款群體每次都在改善有關。現在我們已經有了3年的經驗，更加成熟的信用模式。而且這些模型不考慮應收帳款室，好嗎？我們不考慮應收帳款商會幫助我們收款。所以我想說，我們的模型需要在沒有應收賬款商會的情況下發揮作用。顯然，我們知道商會可以幫助我們，可以幫助我們所有的信貸產品，但我們目前不考慮，好嗎？

And regarding the rumors that you mentioned, we made this communication in the same day, and I hear confirm that there is no intent to acquire a big bank or BV bank to name here. There are no related signing agreements to do so. And we reinforced that during the call here. We do talk to many players in the market. We need to be aware of what's going on in the market. It's my duty to be here to understand what's going on in our Fintech environment. Of course, we cannot follow everything. But the big deals or the hot deals, they came to us through advice or people just getting comfortable with us to talk about opportunities, and you need to talk, understand what's being sold, what's the price and so on. So we did talk to many players, and -- but it was a rumor, nothing more than that.

關於你提到的傳言，我們在同一天進行了溝通，我聽到證實，沒有意圖收購一家大銀行或BV銀行。目前尚無相關簽署協議。我們在這裡的電話會議中強調了這一點。我們確實與市場上的許多參與者進行了交談。我們需要了解市場上正在發生的事情。我有責任來這裡了解我們的金融科技環境中正在發生的事情。當然，我們不可能遵循一切。但是大交易或熱門交易，他們通過建議或剛剛與我們熟悉的人來找我們談論機會，你需要交談，了解正在出售的東西，價格是多少等等。所以我們確實和很多玩家談過——但這只是一個謠言，僅此而已。

Our mind for inorganic growth is to look for targets that can speed up our initiatives here, our ecosystem. So just to give some examples, we bought EMV and MoIP in the online payments. We bought BIVA and BoletoFlex for a faster deployment for credit. We bought Action Tech and NetPOS and Zygo for software features to ecosystem and things like that. So that's what we usually look for. I would say you that every week, there is a [super] acquirer coming to us trying to sell volumes. And we don't buy volumes. We know that it's a niche at some point, the super acquirers need to be, let's say, consolidated or they will consolidate with someone else or with another super acquirer.

我們對無機增長的想法是尋找能夠加速我們在這裡的舉措、我們的生態系統的目標。舉個例子，我們在在線支付中購買了EMV和MoIP。我們購買了 BIVA 和 BoletoFlex，以便更快地部署信貸。我們購買了 Action Tech、NetPOS 和 Zygo，以獲得生態系統等軟件功能。這就是我們通常尋找的。我想說的是，每週都會有一個[超級]收購者來找我們試圖出售數量。我們不批量購買。我們知道，在某種程度上，這是一個利基市場，超級收購者需要進行整合，或者他們將與其他人或另一個超級收購者進行整合。

So we had this opportunity to buy volumes, and we don't have that in mind because at some point, the price is not competitive. And so the main idea here is to speed up our ecosystem and to have the same culture because the -- you know better than me. The -- out of 10 M&A, at least 8 of them don't go well because of the day after. So we need to be very careful what we are acquiring. And if the culture that's going to be fit, and it's going to be easy to integrate and have a better service for our clients. So that's why we have in mind here to have, let's say, companies to speed up our ecosystem.

因此，我們有機會大量購買，但我們沒有考慮到這一點，因為在某些時候，價格沒有競爭力。所以這裡的主要想法是加速我們的生態系統並擁有相同的文化，因為——你比我更了解。在 10 起併購中，至少有 8 起因為後天原因而進展不順利。所以我們需要非常小心我們所獲得的東西。如果文化適合，那麼就很容易整合併為我們的客戶提供更好的服務。這就是為什麼我們想要讓一些公司來加速我們的生態系統。

Our next question comes from Jorge Kuri with Morgan Stanley.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根士丹利的豪爾赫·庫裡。

I have 2 questions, please. The first one is on your CapEx guidance that is a tap lower. I know it's not a lot, but it is lower. And so I'm wondering if -- what should we read into it? Could we maybe start to saying that expense growth is going to slow down as well, given that you're already have built enough of the infrastructure for the new businesses? Or is this just related to POS? And then my second question, sorry to go back to this. But I wanted to understand a little bit better that answer to the receivables chamber. What does it mean that your underwriting models don't consider that? I mean, don't you need to make sure that credit card receivables are not being used as a guarantee elsewhere for you to leverage then? I'm just trying to understand exactly what the comment from Artur was.

我有 2 個問題，請問。第一個是您的資本支出指南，該指南要低一些。我知道這不是很多，但它更低。所以我想知道——我們應該解讀什麼？鑑於您已經為新業務建立了足夠的基礎設施，我們是否可以開始說費用增長也會放緩？或者這只是與 POS 有關？然後是我的第二個問題，很抱歉回到這個問題。但我想更好地理解應收賬款分庭的答复。您的承保模型不考慮這一點意味著什麼？我的意思是，您不需要確保信用卡應收賬款不會被用作其他地方的擔保以供您利用嗎？我只是想準確理解阿圖爾的評論是什麼。

Jorge, this is Ricardo. With you here, thank you for the question. I will start with the chamber of receivables and Artur can come back and talk about the CapEx. We -- I guess what Artur was trying to say that our models, when you look to our models, we consider the behavior we have with our clients with us, the way they behave with us in the transaction history that you have from them, how much they sell, if they're growing or not, what is the mix and so on. And today, as the chamber of receivable is not 100% working, it's not even possible for us to go there and look if this merchant is making transactions in another acquirer or if they have some other players that are serving them. So that's why when Artur said it's just like we are looking for the behavior that we have in our database. There was no chamber of receivables until June, and we keep collecting this client.

豪爾赫，這是里卡多。謝謝你的提問。我將從應收賬款開始，阿圖爾可以回來討論資本支出。我們——我想阿圖爾想說的是，我們的模型，當你查看我們的模型時，我們會考慮我們與客戶的行為，他們在交易歷史記錄中與我們的行為方式，他們賣了多少，是否在增長，其組合是什麼等等。而今天，由於應收賬款商會還沒有100%正常工作，我們甚至不可能去那裡看看這個商家是否在另一個收單機構進行交易，或者他們是否有其他參與者在為他們提供服務。這就是為什麼當阿圖爾說這就像我們正在尋找數據庫中的行為一樣。直到六月份才出現應收帳款室，我們一直在收集這個客戶。

So that's why the chamber of receivable is going to be an additional way to collect but we don't count only on chamber of receivables to, let's say, to collect the money from the lending or for the working capital levels that we offer for our clients. I would just take advantage of your question just to give an overview about the chamber of receivables. It's a complex project. You know that Central Bank and all the industry is working hard to make it work. Although it's not 100%, we've seen lots of progress in the past weeks. It's going to work, let's say, in the next weeks because there is some integration that is happening between the registers and so on. We do believe that it's going to be very good for credit. We see an opportunity there because today, we have 9% market share in the acquiring business. So there's 90%, 91% that is making transactions to other players that we can go there and even offer credit through a very effective way to collect if the chamber of receivables is working 100%.

因此，這就是為什麼應收賬款協會將成為一種額外的收款方式，但我們不僅僅依靠應收賬款協會來收取貸款或我們為我們提供的營運資金水平。客戶。我只想利用你的問題來概述一下應收賬款室。這是一個複雜的項目。你知道，央行和整個行業正在努力使其發揮作用。雖然不是 100%，但我們在過去幾週已經看到了很多進展。比方說，它將在接下來的幾週內發揮作用，因為寄存器等之間正在發生一些集成。我們確實相信這對信貸來說非常有利。我們在那裡看到了機會，因為今天我們在收購業務中擁有 9% 的市場份額。因此，有 90%、91% 的企業正在與其他參與者進行交易，我們可以去那裡，如果應收賬款商會 100% 運轉，我們甚至可以通過一種非常有效的方式提供信貸來收集。

So I guess what Artur was trying to say that today, we don't go there to see if the merchant is using another player, and we don't consider that to collect the money. As of today, we are not using the chamber of receivables because it's not working 100%. So I don't know. If it's not clear, just let me know.

所以我猜阿圖爾今天想說的是，我們不會去那裡看看商人是否正在使用其他玩家，我們也不認為這是為了收錢。截至今天，我們還沒有使用應收帳款室，因為它沒有 100% 正常工作。所以我不知道。如果不清楚，請告訴我。

Okay. Thank you for your question related to CapEx, and good to talk to you, [Jorge]. So and what we consider for our CapEx is that we'll support the growth of the company for the future. And there is 2 big points inside the CapEx. One is POS and the other is R&D. So both we consider to support the growth of the company. And we changed the guidance to BRL 1.8 billion because now we have a better view of the year comparing to what we projected in the beginning of this year.

好的。感謝您提出與資本支出相關的問題，很高興與您交談，[Jorge]。因此，我們對資本支出的考慮是，我們將支持公司未來的發展。資本支出中有兩個要點。一是POS，二是研發。所以我們都認為支持公司的發展。我們將指導值更改為 18 億雷亞爾，因為與今年年初的預測相比，現在我們對今年有了更好的看法。

We have a lower currency rate right now versus also what we projected. Related to mix of clients, so change of the value a bit versus what we projected to. And we are always looking for to be more efficient in the investments that we do in the company. So now we can say that BRL 1.8 billion is more fair for this year. And also, as the last point is related to the expenses that we don't have any relevant change for now. If we have any movement in terms of expenses, depreciation or amortization, so we will communicate to the market.

我們現在的匯率低於我們的預期。與客戶組合相關，因此價值與我們的預期略有不同。我們一直在尋求提高公司投資效率。所以現在我們可以說今年 18 億雷亞爾更為公平。而且，由於最後一點與費用有關，我們目前沒有任何相關的變化。如果我們在費用、折舊或攤銷方面有任何變動，我們將與市場溝通。

Our next question comes from Bryan Keane with Deutsche Bank.

我們的下一個問題來自德意志銀行的布萊恩·基恩。

Two questions, if I may. Just on the Hubs strategy, it sounds like it's coming in better than anticipated. So wondering about the volume trends. I think last quarter, you indicated maybe the top end of the range of 6% to 11%, given the growth in the Hubs strategy. Is that still hold? Are we now maybe even getting push above that range for 2021 volumes? And then secondly, the net income margin was 14.6%, I think, in the quarter. And I know you're making a lot of investments in the business. And I'm just trying to figure out going forward, should we be at or a little bit below that margin level? Or just any guidance on that?

如果可以的話，有兩個問題。就樞紐戰略而言，聽起來比預期的要好。所以想知道成交量趨勢。我認為上個季度，考慮到中心策略的增長，您可能表示了 6% 到 11% 範圍的上限。那還堅持嗎？我們現在的 2021 年銷量是否可能會超出該範圍？其次，我認為本季度的淨利潤率為 14.6%。我知道您在這項業務上進行了大量投資。我只是想弄清楚未來我們是否應該達到或略低於該利潤水平？或者只是對此有任何指導？

Bryan, this is Ricardo. Thank you for the question. Good to hear. Regarding Hubs, you're right. We are exceeding our expectations in terms of volumes, in terms of the performance, even the production of the people, the salespeople in the street. So I mean, it's getting better than what we had in our assumptions. And it would be probably higher than 11%. That's something that will surpass -- this 11% is a combination of the execution we are having here, better efficiency in sales force and probably will be higher than that. We are in half of the year. It's hard to give you the number right now, but it's going to be -- it seems going to be higher than the 11%, the top of the range, which is good news.

布萊恩，這是里卡多。感謝你的提問。很高興聽到。關於集線器，你是對的。我們在數量、性能、甚至人員、街道銷售人員的生產方面都超出了我們的預期。所以我的意思是，它比我們的假設要好。而且可能會高於 11%。這是將會超越的——這 11% 是我們這裡的執行力、銷售人員更好的效率的結合，而且可能會更高。我們已經過半年了。現在很難給你這個數字，但它似乎會高於 11%，即該範圍的頂部，這是個好消息。

I mean, we were, let's say, conservative when we thought about the volumes from pro-Hubs, and we're going to get more. It's -- I mean, we saw that even the SMBs in Brazil are underserved. The majority of our SMB is not to say 100%, they already have another player. So it's different than long tail that we are bringing new merchants to the system. In the SMBs, we need to go there to talk and to get clients from competitors. So we use a lot of the strategy to talk about PagBank, the digital bank. That is 100% free, and they can use for daily tests, financial daily activities such as paying suppliers and so on. So it's -- we are being successful there. And going back to your question, it will be probably higher than 11%.

我的意思是，當我們考慮來自親樞紐的數量時，我們是保守的，而且我們會得到更多。我的意思是，我們看到即使是巴西的中小企業也得不到充分的服務。我們的大多數中小型企業並不是說 100%，他們已經有了另一個玩家。因此，我們將新商家引入系統與長尾不同。在中小型企業中，我們需要去那裡交談並從競爭對手那裡獲得客戶。所以我們用了很多策略來談論PagBank，數字銀行。這是100%免費的，他們可以用於日常測試、財務日常活動（例如向供應商付款等）。所以我們在那裡取得了成功。回到你的問題，它可能會高於 11%。

Bryan, it's Artur speaking. Good to talk to you, and thank you for your question. Regarding to net income margin, as we have been sharing in the last calls, we are not obsessed by margin right now. Our focus is continue to deliver healthy and positive nominal results. That means nominal -- positive nominal results for adjusted EBITDA and net income. So our intention is to lead a larger company for the future. In 2022, 2023 increase our margins. Regarding to the next quarters, I can say that we expect a slight improvement versus Q2. Q3 probably will be better than Q2, Q4 better than Q3. And for the full year, we are expecting something above 15%. And also excluding interchange fee -- interchange and fees from the schemes, so our net income margin should be above 22% or something above 23%.

布萊恩，我是阿圖爾。很高興與您交談，謝謝您的提問。關於淨利潤率，正如我們在上次電話會議中所分享的那樣，我們現在並不癡迷於利潤率。我們的重點是繼續提供健康和積極的名義結果。這意味著調整後的 EBITDA 和淨利潤的名義結果為正。所以我們的目的是領導一家更大的公司走向未來。2022年、2023年我們的利潤率會增加。關於接下來的幾個季度，我可以說我們預計與第二季度相比會略有改善。Q3可能會比Q2好，Q4比Q3好。我們預計全年增長率將超過 15%。而且還不包括交換費——來自計劃的交換費和費用，所以我們的淨利潤率應該高於 22% 或高於 23%。

Just to be clear here, Bryan, Artur is saying that the net income margin as we are reporting is going to be higher than 15% this year. It's going to be better in Q3, Q4. And when we talked about 22%, when you use the same methodologists of other players that they discount interchanging cards consist from net revenues. So that's going to be close to 24% if we exclude interchange and cards [fees] from the revenues.

布萊恩，阿圖爾，需要澄清的是，我們報告的淨利潤率今年將高於 15%。第三季度、第四季度會更好。當我們談到 22% 時，當你使用與其他玩家相同的方法論時，他們會從淨收入中扣除交換卡的費用。因此，如果我們從收入中排除交換費和卡[費用]，這一比例將接近 24%。

Our next question comes from Marco Calvi with Itau BBA.

我們的下一個問題來自 Itau BBA 的 Marco Calvi。

Two questions here. The first one on the acquiring take -- net take rate of 2.24% revised disclosure during this quarter. We saw a growth, right, quarter-over-quarter or a flattish quarter-over-quarter and a growth over the fourth quarter. Can you guys share with us the trends of these acquiring net take rates, given that you guys are moving towards a large client? And even so at least comparing to the last 2 quarters, the net take rate on the acquiring business, either, say, flattish or increased? And my second question is on your software business. You guys mentioned that you guys ended the quarter with roughly 100,000 clients and penetration close to 11% of the active merchants. I was just wondering what sort of software are you referring to? And if you can share the average features specifically on the software product?

這裡有兩個問題。第一個是關於收購的——本季度修正披露的淨收購率為 2.24%。我們看到了季度環比增長，或者環比持平，以及第四季度的增長。鑑於你們正在向大客戶邁進，你們能否與我們分享一下淨獲取率的趨勢？即便如此，至少與過去兩個季度相比，收購業務的淨收購率是持平還是上升？我的第二個問題是關於你們的軟件業務。你們提到，截至本季度末，你們擁有大約 100,000 名客戶，活躍商家的滲透率接近 11%。我只是想知道你指的是哪種軟件？您是否可以具體分享軟件產品的平均功能？

Marco, this is Ricardo. Thank you for the question. Good to hear. Regarding net take rate in the acquiring business, as you could see in Q4, we had 2.06%, then 2.23% in Q1, 2.24% in Q2. And looking forward, we see at least 2 big moving parts here or the headwinds or tailwinds. So in the tailwind, we see the better consumption or increasing consumption in the country. Now we are having higher inflation. Unemployment is still here. Pandemic is still here. We're not 100% back to our normal lives. And so that's the tailwind. The people start consumption more, getting some business trips or even the trips with the family and so on. So that's the tailwind.

馬可，這是里卡多。感謝你的提問。很高興聽到。關於收購業務的淨收購率，正如您在第四季度看到的那樣，我們為 2.06％，然後第一季度為 2.23％，第二季度為 2.24％。展望未來，我們至少看到兩個重要的變化因素，即逆風或順風。因此，在順風的情況下，我們看到該國的消費更好或消費增加。現在我們的通貨膨脹率更高。失業仍然存在。大流行仍然在這裡。我們還沒有100%恢復正常生活。這就是順風。人們開始更多的消費，進行一些商務旅行，甚至與家人一起旅行等等。這就是順風。

And the headwind in terms of take rate is because we are having better performance in the Hubs. So we are changing the mix of our TPV. The Hubs clients, they have TPV 4 to 5x larger than the long tail. So when you bring this larger merchant, the SMB, they impact net take rate. In absolute terms, it's a good business because, I mean, the volume is much higher than long tail, even with a lower net take rate. But if you look specifically net take rate, we have this headwind. So that's why we prefer to say it is going to be flattish looking forward, but there are these 2 moving parts. The one is the consumption is going to help the net take rate. The headwind is the performance of the Hubs is going to, let's say, decrease the net take rate.

就採用率而言，不利因素是因為我們在 Hub 中擁有更好的性能。因此，我們正在改變 TPV 的組合。Hubs 客戶的 TPV 比長尾大 4 到 5 倍。因此，當你引入更大的商家（中小企業）時，他們會影響淨採用率。從絕對值來看，這是一項好生意，因為我的意思是，即使淨利用率較低，其交易量也遠高於長尾。但如果你特別關注淨收入率，我們就會遇到這種阻力。所以這就是為什麼我們更願意說它的前景將是平淡的，但有這兩個移動部分。一是消費將有助於提高淨收入率。不利的因素是集線器的性能會降低淨利用率。

Regarding the software business, we consider usually the point-of-sale that people can go there, use for managing their businesses at the end of the day, take some reports, such as how many coffees did I sell, how much they sell-through cards to debit cards, credit cards in cash. So usually, a small, let's say, software that helps people to measure their business better. We also consider here R2TECH, our reconciliation business that some of the clients use to make mismatch between sales and the money that goes to their bank accounts. So at the end of the day, they can see how much they sold and if the money is coming to their bank account. So those are the 2 main software.

關於軟件業務，我們通常考慮人們可以去那裡的銷售點，用於在一天結束時管理他們的業務，獲取一些報告，例如我賣了多少咖啡，他們賣了多少 -通過卡轉借記卡、信用卡現金。因此，通常來說，一個小型軟件可以幫助人們更好地衡量他們的業務。我們在這裡還考慮了 R2TECH，我們的對賬業務，一些客戶利用它在銷售額和進入其銀行賬戶的資金之間進行錯配。因此，最終，他們可以看到自己賣出了多少，以及錢是否存入他們的銀行賬戶。這些是兩個主要軟件。

We also had some other software that is smaller merchants using to use Minizinha to make this point-of-sales to work, the example that I gave about the report. Usually, we don't charge for software. They are very simple. They don't require implementation. They don't require someone to go there to install anything. We don't sell licenses. We just need to download the app and next, next, next few clicks, we can use the software. So usually, we don't charge for the software. We see that as a way to give a better service for the client, increase their loyalty and keep them working with our acquiring solutions for longer time.

我們還有一些其他軟件，小型商家使用 Minizinha 來使銷售點正常工作，這是我在報告中給出的示例。通常，我們不收取軟件費用。它們很簡單。它們不需要實施。他們不需要有人去那里安裝任何東西。我們不出售許可證。我們只需要下載該應用程序，然後點擊幾下，我們就可以使用該軟件了。所以通常情況下，我們不收取軟件費用。我們認為這是為客戶提供更好服務、提高客戶忠誠度並讓他們更長時間地使用我們的收單解決方案的一種方式。

Our next question comes from Eduardo Rosman with BTG.

我們的下一個問題來自 BTG 的愛德華多·羅斯曼。

Two questions here. First one, we just saw Sebrae publishing a service -- sorry, survey saying that they -- more than 50% of small merchants in Brazil, they're still not accepting cards. So I just want to get your feedback on the ground. What can we expect like kind of idea for maybe next year? If you think adding 300,000 merchants per quarter is still doable? You should think you can grow more than 30% TPV in the acquiring segment still for another couple of years. So it would be interesting to see. I just have a qualitative view about what to expect for the coming years on your segment. And the second one is on PagBank. You mentioned that you expect breakeven to come in the next few quarters, but EBITDA was still kind of BRL 100 million negative, right, this quarter. So can you elaborate? Do you have -- should we expect that to breakeven second part of next year, 2023? So that's it.

這裡有兩個問題。第一個，我們剛剛看到 Sebrae 發布了一項服務 - 抱歉，調查顯示 - 巴西超過 50% 的小商戶仍然不接受銀行卡。所以我只想得到你們的實際反饋。明年我們可以期待什麼類似的想法？您認為每季度增加 30 萬商戶是否仍然可行？您應該認為在接下來的幾年裡，您的收購領域的 TPV 仍可增長 30% 以上。所以這會很有趣。我只是對您的細分市場未來幾年的預期有一個定性的看法。第二個是在 PagBank 上。您提到預計未來幾個季度將實現盈虧平衡，但本季度 EBITDA 仍為負 1 億雷亞爾，對吧。那麼你能詳細說明一下嗎？我們是否應該期望明年（2023 年）下半年實現收支平衡？就是這樣了。

Rosman, thank you for the question. Good to hear. Regarding the Sebrae survey, you're right. They've said many business in Brazil, the small businesses don't accept cards yet. And I would say you -- there are no other companies in the -- in our industry more prepared to, let's say, to take advantage of that or to serve this wave with all the history that you have, the expertise that we have to serve long tails distribution channels to average the overall audience and all the ecosystem that we have been building all this year or this quarter. So that's why you keep adding 1 million net adds per year. That's what I expect to keep adding in the following quarters. There is still main opportunities out there.

羅斯曼，謝謝你的提問。很高興聽到。關於 Sebrae 調查，你是對的。他們說巴西的許多企業、小企業還不接受銀行卡。我想說的是，在我們這個行業中，沒有其他公司比我們更願意利用這一點，或者利用你們擁有的歷史和我們所擁有的專業知識來服務這一浪潮。提供長尾分銷渠道，以平均總體受眾和我們今年或本季度一直在構建的所有生態系統。這就是為什麼您每年淨增加 100 萬的原因。這就是我預計在接下來的幾個季度中繼續增加的內容。那裡仍然存在主要機會。

And I would say that we are the company more prepared to serve those that are out of the financial system because, I mean, we've been doing that since 2006 in the online world. And since 2012 with the POS. But you're right. It's a great information just reinforce what we've been saying for -- from any quarter that there is still many business in Brazil don't accept cards. Some of these merchants, they start accept debits. And then after a while they start to accept credit. So we see as this opportunity in the survey from Sebrae just reinforce our view.

我想說的是，我們是一家更願意為金融體系之外的人提供服務的公司，因為我的意思是，自 2006 年以來，我們一直在網絡世界中這樣做。自 2012 年起使用 POS。但你是對的。這是一個很好的信息，它強化了我們一直以來所說的——從任何一個季度來看，巴西仍然有許多企業不接受銀行卡。其中一些商家開始接受借記卡。過了一段時間，他們開始接受信用。因此，我們認為 Sebrae 調查中的這個機會強化了我們的觀點。

Regarding PagBank, I'll just introduce and then Artur can help me here. But you're right. We -- the margin in absolute terms increased, but as a percentage of the revenues, we decreased from 80% to 55%. So the business is growing. We need to dilute fixed costs, but we keep investing in the business. So that's why, to some extent, the absolute terms, the absolute numbers is -- are growing here. But Artur, can you just complement here?

關於PagBank，我就簡單介紹一下，然後Artur可以在這裡幫助我。但你是對的。我們的絕對利潤率有所增加，但佔收入的百分比從 80% 下降到 55%。所以生意在增長。我們需要稀釋固定成本，但我們會繼續投資於業務。這就是為什麼，在某種程度上，絕對值、絕對數字在這裡正在增長。但是Artur，你能補充一下嗎？

Yes. I will say just more words related to PagBank. PagBank is a long-term project to us. We are succeeding because we are adding millions of clients every month are required. And we are monetizing those clients. It's true that for consumers, normally consumers take more time to start to monetize. It's true because the cashing is not automatically. This is the biggest advantage that we have in terms of merchants using PagBank because we have the cashing automatically. As Dutra said, we are at the moment to invest a lot in the ecosystem to have a more complete offer of products in terms of PagBank. And so we are investing people, marketing campaigns, R&D and everything that is necessary to have a big digital bank in the future.

是的。我會多說一些與 PagBank 相關的話。PagBank 對我們來說是一個長期項目。我們之所以成功，是因為我們每個月都需要增加數百萬客戶。我們正在通過這些客戶獲利。確實，對於消費者來說，通常消費者需要更多的時間來開始變現。這是真的，因為兌現不是自動的。這是我們對使用 PagBank 的商戶而言最大的優勢，因為我們可以自動兌現。正如 Dutra 所說，我們目前正在生態系統中進行大量投資，以便在 PagBank 方面提供更完整的產品。因此，我們正在投資人員、營銷活動、研發以及未來擁有一家大型數字銀行所需的一切。

Rosman, this is Eric. Thanks for the question. I'd just like to highlight here that we don't have 2 CEOs, one for payments, one for banking. We have 1 CEO, 1 CFO, taking all the decisions here to maximize revenues per client. So there's no conflict of interest, and we are travelling here to increase revenues per user and see the profitability better for the coming years.

羅斯曼，這是埃里克。謝謝你的提問。我想在這裡強調的是，我們沒有兩位首席執行官，一位負責支付，一位負責銀行業務。我們有 1 名首席執行官、1 名首席財務官，負責制定所有決策，以最大限度地提高每個客戶的收入。因此，不存在利益衝突，我們來這裡是為了增加每個用戶的收入，並看到未來幾年更好的盈利能力。

Our next question comes from James Friedman with Susquehanna.

我們的下一個問題來自薩斯奎哈納的詹姆斯·弗里德曼。

I'm glad to hear everyone is doing well. It's Jamie at Susquehanna. I just want to ask a couple of questions upfront. So the TPV per merchant continued to expand, right? So your TPV grew double merchant growth roughly. Is that the Hubs? Or is that the COVID or something else? That's the first one. Historically, you've had some seasonality, where the industry is seeing seasonality in the Q3. And I wanted to ask about that. Do you expect any promotions in the Q3 at an industry level because sometimes we see that in the Black Friday? That was the second one. And then the third one is, what are you going to talk about in the Analyst Day?

我很高興聽到每個人都做得很好。我是薩斯奎哈納的傑米。我只想先問幾個問題。那麼每個商家的 TPV 繼續擴大，對吧？所以你的 TPV 大約是商家增長率的兩倍。那是集線器嗎？或者是新冠病毒還是其他什麼？這是第一個。從歷史上看，存在一定的季節性，該行業在第三季度就出現了季節性。我想問一下。您是否預計第三季度會有行業層面的促銷活動，因為有時我們會在黑色星期五看到這種促銷活動？那是第二個。第三個問題是，您將在分析師日談論什麼？

James, can you repeat just last one? I'm sorry. I couldn't hear.

詹姆斯，你能重複一下最後一個嗎？對不起。我聽不到。

What are you going to talk about at the Analyst Day?

您將在分析師日談論什麼？

Okay. Okay. Well, we've already -- I'll start with the TPV promotion. We saw this Q2, of course, is a easy comp, James, just to be clear here, I guess, around the world. That was the worst quarter in terms of COVID and lockdowns and impact of the economy around the world, and in Brazil was not different. So the worst month for us last year was April 2020. But of course, we had impact from COVID all over. Second quarter was the worst one. When we compare, we are growing a lot. And part of this growth is coming from, I mean, from every business that we have here from different clients size. But the majority of the growth is coming from pro-Hubs. We gave some information here. The Hubs TPV quarter-over-quarter grew 4x. And the company as a whole grew 89%. So the long tail also grew strongly, steadily, but not the same level that is on the Hub. So just going back to your question to mid-year, here the TPV promotion increase can be more explained because of the Hubs that help it because those are the guys that with more volumes and improved 4x year-over-year.

好的。好的。好吧，我們已經——我將從 TPV 促銷活動開始。當然，我們看到第二季度是一個簡單的比賽，詹姆斯，我想在這裡澄清一下，我想，在世界各地。就新冠疫情、封鎖以及對全球經濟的影響而言，這是最糟糕的一個季度，巴西也不例外。所以去年對我們來說最糟糕的月份是 2020 年 4 月。但當然，我們到處都受到了新冠疫情的影響。第二季度是最差的一個季度。當我們比較時，我們成長了很多。我的意思是，這種增長的一部分來自於我們這裡擁有的不同客戶規模的每家企業。但大部分增長來自親Hub。我們在這裡提供了一些信息。Hubs TPV 季度環比增長了 4 倍。公司整體增長了 89%。因此，長尾也強勁、穩定地增長，但與 Hub 上的水平不同。所以，回到你年中的問題，在這裡，TPV 促銷的增長可以得到更多解釋，因為有幫助它的中心，因為這些中心的銷量更大，同比增長了 4 倍。

Regarding Q3 seasonality, we don't think there's going to be any, let's say, impact from the industry here. No big promotions we have in mind or so on. I'll just take advantage here that we plan to have a new marketing campaign from PagBank in the following days. We see the opportunity here at PagBank which is -- we have this wind of opportunity to grow PagBank. We grew 2.1 million new clients in Q2. We see the opportunity to keep growing strong in Q3, and we will start a new marketing campaign in the following days.

關於第三季度的季節性，我們認為該行業不會產生任何影響。我們沒有計劃進行大型促銷活動等。我將利用 PagBank 計劃在接下來的幾天內開展新的營銷活動的機會。我們在 PagBank 看到了機遇——我們有機會發展 PagBank。第二季度我們增加了 210 萬新客戶。我們看到了第三季度保持強勁增長的機會，我們將在接下來的幾天內開始新的營銷活動。

Regarding the Analyst Day, the idea here is to have a meeting in November. We don't have still the details. We still have this to decide how this specific date, but there's going to be a meeting with Luiz Frias, our Chairman and the Founder of the company and some of the PAGS' senior management team to give a more overview about we have in mind, what we see the future for our industry, what is going on in Brazil in terms of financial marketing in Fintech arena, I mean be more close to the investors and, of course, share our ideas in our future plans to many of you. So that's the idea.

關於分析師日，我們的想法是在 11 月舉行一次會議。我們還沒有細節。我們仍然需要決定如何確定這個具體日期，但我們將與我們的董事長兼公司創始人 Luiz Frias 以及 PAGS 的一些高級管理團隊舉行會議，以更全面地了解我們的想法，我們對行業的未來有何看法，巴西在金融科技領域的金融營銷方面正在發生什麼，我的意思是更加貼近投資者，當然，也向你們中的許多人分享我們在未來計劃中的想法。這就是我們的想法。

Our next question comes from Tito Labarta with Goldman Sachs.

我們的下一個問題來自高盛的蒂托·拉巴塔（Tito Labarta）。

A couple of questions also. I guess, to go back on your margin, and sorry to harp on this point, I just want to make sure I understand. If we look at your margin last year, it was 20%. I remember on the 4Q call, you mentioned, if you take out COVID and PagBank, your margin would have been 30%. So now you're roughly half of that and your PagBank margin has improved. So is this mostly because of the growth in the Hubs? Just wanted to understand the decline and kind of what's driving that, particularly if PagBank isn't improving? And then I'll ask the second question.

還有幾個問題。我想，回到你的邊緣，抱歉在這一點上喋喋不休，我只是想確保我理解。如果我們看看你們去年的利潤率為 20%。我記得在第四季度的電話會議上，您提到，如果您剔除 COVID 和 PagBank，您的保證金將為 30%。現在，您的利潤大約達到了一半，並且 PagBank 的利潤率也有所提高。那麼這主要是因為樞紐的增長嗎？只是想了解下降以及推動下降的原因，特別是如果 PagBank 沒有改善的話？然後我會問第二個問題。

Tito will start, it's Artur speaking. Thanks for your question, and good to talk to you. Regarding to margin, it's -- all the things that you mentioned is right. And the impact of what we are seeing today is related to Hubs because it's an operation that is not mature, and also, the investments that we are doing for PagBank. And so when we have a more stable company in the future, a larger company, we will leverage those investments that we are doing right now. And the expectation that we have today is the margin grow again. Go ahead, Tito.

蒂托將開始，我是阿圖爾。感謝您的提問，很高興與您交談。關於保證金，您提到的所有事情都是正確的。我們今天看到的影響與 Hubs 有關，因為它是一項不成熟的業務，而且我們正在為 PagBank 進行投資。因此，當我們未來擁有一家更穩定的公司、一家更大的公司時，我們將利用我們現在正在進行的投資。我們今天的預期是利潤率再次增長。繼續吧，蒂托。

No, I was just going to say -- but your PagBank margin is improving, right? So I mean, again, you're still investing, but I mean, so revenue is growing faster. So just to understand the pressure on the margin wouldn't be coming from PagBank compared to last year, right? Is it more just the Hubs?

不，我只是想說——但是你們的 PagBank 利潤率正在提高，對嗎？所以我的意思是，你仍然在投資，但我的意思是，所以收入增長得更快。因此，與去年相比，PagBank 不會面臨利潤壓力，對嗎？僅僅是集線器嗎？

It's Hubs and PagBank, as I said.

正如我所說，這是 Hubs 和 PagBank。

Remember also, Tito, this is Eric, higher depreciation amortization, given that we had BRL 2 billion in capital expenditures last year, being BRL 1.5 billion of debt related to POS's acquisition. This year, remember the previous guidance considered BRL 2 billion in capital expenditures for 2021. Artur just reviewed this information to BRL 1.8 billion. So higher depreciation, amortization, also higher financial expenses given the rising of interest rates. So this is why we saw these impacts. And remember, if you remember in Q1, we had the digital account losses too that impacted for the full year numbers that we already sold to this, okay? So basically, these are the reasons why we saw this impact in the short term.

還請記住，Tito，這是 Eric，更高的折舊攤銷，因為我們去年的資本支出為 20 億雷亞爾，其中與 POS 收購相關的債務為 15 億雷亞爾。今年，請記住之前的指導意見認為 2021 年的資本支出為 20 億雷亞爾。Artur 剛剛查看了該信息，結果為 18 億雷亞爾。由於利率上升，折舊、攤銷和財務費用也會增加。這就是我們看到這些影響的原因。請記住，如果您還記得在第一季度，我們也有數字賬戶損失，這影響了我們已經出售給該公司的全年數字，好嗎？基本上，這些就是我們在短期內看到這種影響的原因。

Okay. Perfect. That's helpful. And then my second question, you mentioned earlier BoaCompra and growing cross-border transactions as well. Is that something that's significant for you? Do you see a lot of growth potential in that? Just kind of curious on that opportunity for you?

好的。完美的。這很有幫助。然後是我的第二個問題，您之前提到了 BoaCompra 以及不斷增長的跨境交易。這對你來說很重要嗎？您認為其中有很大的增長潛力嗎？只是對你的這個機會感到好奇嗎？

Well, Tito, to be sincere, it's a small part of our TPV. It is growing very fast, but it's a small part of our TPV. We already had this company, I mean, for a few years now. Some of the clients, the online clients, they ask us to serve them in other countries of Latin America. And then we use BoaCompra to serve them. So it's something that we are always looking for the opportunity here. We know there is some country there more developed in terms of cards industry than others. We keep looking to that. But it's hard to compete with the opportunity that we have in Brazil. We are #1 in terms of clients here. We have PagBank. We have UOL, but we keep evaluating if there is some opportunity. There are some opportunity in other countries. But to be sincere, it's a small part of our TPV. It helps. It is important to serve some clients. But at this point, it's not something that, let's say, P&L transformation to be clear here.

好吧，Tito，說實話，這只是我們 TPV 的一小部分。它增長得非常快，但只是我們冠捷科技的一小部分。我的意思是，我們已經擁有這家公司幾年了。一些客戶，在線客戶，他們要求我們為拉丁美洲其他國家的他們提供服務。然後我們使用 BoaCompra 來為他們服務。所以我們一直在這裡尋找機會。我們知道有些國家的卡業比其他國家更發達。我們一直在關注這一點。但很難與我們在巴西擁有的機會競爭。就客戶而言，我們在這裡排名第一。我們有 PagBank。我們有 UOL，但我們一直在評估是否有機會。其他國家也有一些機會。但說實話，這只是我們冠捷的一小部分。它有助於。為某些客戶提供服務很重要。但在這一點上，這不是損益表轉換需要明確的事情。

Our next question comes from Domingos Falavina with JPMorgan.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根大通的多明戈斯·法拉維納。

Just got -- wanted to boss off ideas and take your point of view as well on the debit side of the operation, basically. The FX, the card association put out the industry-wide figures just not long ago. And what we saw is basically debit accelerating. It's really hard to exclude the COVID here, obviously. But I mean, if we compare versus 2019 and see kind of an average of CAGR '19 over '21, or I should say, '21 over '19. April, May and June actually accelerated even above credit card, growing 19%, 20% year-on-year, which give and takes, it came across as a surprise. When we look at the market share, we did see, obviously, I think you guys mentioned that a lot may be heard true the market share of credit used to be in 2019 and before, 63%. It came down to 59%. And in this year, it's striking around 61% credit and the last being debit and prepaid. So my question for you is, what else can you share? Like how are you seeing those debit volumes? How you're seeing PIX? And do you have any guess on what is PIX substituting and what you are seeing in your base?

基本上，我只是想提出一些想法，並在操作的借方方面也表達你的觀點。FX、信用卡協會不久前公佈了全行業的數據。我們看到的基本上是藉方加速。顯然，在這裡很難排除新冠病毒。但我的意思是，如果我們與2019 年進行比較，就會發現“19 年”比“21 年”的平均複合年增長率，或者我應該說，“21 年”比“19 年”的複合年增長率。4月、5月和6月的增速實際上甚至超過了信用卡，同比增長19%、20%，這讓人感到意外。當我們查看市場份額時，我們確實看到，顯然，我認為你們提到的很多人可能都聽說過，2019 年及之前的信貸市場份額為 63%。下降到了 59%。今年，貸方比例高達 61%，最後一個是藉方和預付。所以我問你的問題是，你還能分享什麼？比如您如何看待這些借方金額？您如何看待 PIX？您對 PIX 正在取代什麼以及您在基地中看到的情況有任何猜測嗎？

Thank you, Domingos. Good to hear. This is Ricardo. Well, let's start with PIX. We have the option for all our devices. So we have 7.6 million merchants, active merchants. We -- on average, we have more than 1 device per merchant. So I mean, easily more than 7.6 million POS industries, all of them accept PIX. Right? We see the penetration of PIX in our acquiring business, very, very small. We know there might be some merchants here and there try to use PIX to avoid MDRs. But if you think that debit MDR is only 1.99, it's so small that at some point, it's easily for the merchant even to accept debit, it if they need to pay the 1.99. They know it's safe. They know their money is going to come to PagBank account right after transaction. So we don't see PIX payment taking our base. We don't see PIX increasing the churn of the company. We do see PIX replacing TED, wire transfers for those who are not familiar with the names in Brazil because for obvious reasons, it works 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. It's automatic. So we see PIX, let's say, replacing wire transfers.

謝謝你，多明戈斯。很高興聽到。這是里卡多。好吧，讓我們從 PIX 開始。我們可以為所有設備提供選項。所以我們有760萬商戶，活躍商戶。平均而言，每個商家擁有超過 1 台設備。所以我的意思是，輕鬆超過 760 萬個 POS 行業都接受 PIX。正確的？我們發現 PIX 在我們的收單業務中的滲透率非常非常小。我們知道各地可能有一些商家嘗試使用 PIX 來避免 MDR。但如果你認為藉記 MDR 只有 1.99，那麼它太小了，以至於在某些時候，商家甚至很容易接受借記，如果他們需要支付 1.99。他們知道這是安全的。他們知道交易後他們的錢將立即存入 PagBank 賬戶。所以我們不認為 PIX 支付會佔據我們的基礎。我們不認為 PIX 會增加公司的流失率。對於那些不熟悉巴西名字的人來說，我們確實看到 PIX 取代了 TED、電匯，因為顯而易見的原因，它每週 7 天、每天 24 小時運行。這是自動的。所以我們看到 PIX 正在取代電匯。

In terms of debit, I know the debit growth has been strong during all these years. And I would say that part of that is because also the people getting into the financial system. I -- my -- our guess here is that debit is kind of replacing the cash. There is a lot of the economy in Brazil and still based in cash. And people are getting, let's say, digital accounts, getting new cards. We saw these accelerate in the pandemic. People that were -- could not go to the banks to withdraw money in ATMs, they could not go to nearest branches because they were closed. So many millions of people open their accounts. So there are more, let's say, a larger base of debit cards throughout the country. So that's our guess here.

就借方而言，我知道這些年來借方增長一直強勁。我想說，部分原因是人們進入了金融體系。我——我的——我們的猜測是藉記卡在某種程度上取代了現金。巴西的大部分經濟仍然以現金為基礎。人們正在獲得數字賬戶、新卡。我們看到這些在大流行中加速。人們無法去銀行在自動取款機上取款，他們也無法去最近的分行，因為它們已經關門了。數百萬人開設了他們的賬戶。因此，全國范圍內的借記卡數量更多，規模更大。這就是我們的猜測。

And there is the secular shift here happening in Brazil from cash to cards that is still happening. I mean, it's different than other economies that more developed people have this culture to have cards and to use cards. But again, in Brazil have lots of the people are still using cash. So that's why we have this strong tailwind for the industry as a whole. If you consider the whole industry, it grew 52% year-over-year. I know it's an easy comp from COVID, but anyway, it's 52% is a strong number, and we grew 89%. So I don't know if I answer your question here.

在巴西，從現金到信用卡的長期轉變仍在發生。我的意思是，與其他經濟體不同的是，更發達的人有這種持有卡和使用卡的文化。但同樣，在巴西，很多人仍在使用現金。這就是為什麼我們對整個行業有強大的推動力。如果考慮到整個行業，它同比增長了 52%。我知道這是一個簡單的新冠疫情比較，但無論如何，52% 是一個強勁的數字，我們增長了 89%。所以我不知道我在這裡是否能回答你的問題。

No, you did, especially when you said you're not seeing big PIX penetration. Just out of curiosity, when you say this total TPV on the acquirer side, is that including or not including PIX?

不，你做到了，尤其是當你說你沒有看到 PIX 的大規模滲透時。只是出於好奇，當您說收購方的總 TPV 時，是否包括 PIX？

It includes, but it's very, very small, Domingos. If we exclude, it's going to be probably the same 89%.

它包括但非常非常小的多明戈斯。如果我們排除的話，可能會是同樣的 89%。

Our next question comes from Neha Agarwala with HSBC.

我們的下一個問題來自匯豐銀行的 Neha Agarwala。

This is Neha Agarwala from HSBC. I wanted to dig a bit on the PagBank revenues. Last quarter was depressed due to the chargebacks from the digital account losses. But this quarter, there was a small improvement. Not as strong as what we saw in the fourth quarter of 2020. So could you explain a bit more what was the composition of the PagBank revenues? How do you see it accelerating in the coming quarters now that you are pumping up the growth of the credit book? Should we expect an accelerated growth in the PagBank revenues? So a bit more color on that? And my second question is on the chargebacks. I mean, if you look at the chargeback numbers that you have in the cost, it picked up a lot in the first quarter of 2020 -- of 2021, which was due to the digital account losses. It has gone down in the second quarter, but it still seems elevated versus the last quarter. So if I understand, I think it's related to the credit book. So could you talk a bit more about that, why the charge backs are still a bit elevated versus same quarter last year?

我是匯豐銀行的尼哈·阿加瓦拉 (Neha Agarwala)。我想深入了解一下 PagBank 的收入。由於數字賬戶損失導致的退款，上季度業績低迷。但本季度出現了小幅改善。不如我們在 2020 年第四季度看到的那麼強勁。那麼您能否詳細解釋一下 PagBank 收入的構成是怎樣的？既然您正在推動信用賬簿的增長，您如何看待未來幾個季度的加速發展？我們是否應該預期 PagBank 收入會加速增長？那麼多一點顏色嗎？我的第二個問題是關於退款的。我的意思是，如果你看一下成本中的退款數字，你會發現它在 2020 年第一季度和 2021 年第一季度大幅增加，這是由於數字賬戶損失造成的。第二季度有所下降，但與上季度相比似乎仍然有所上升。所以如果我理解的話，我認為這與信用簿有關。那麼您能多談談這個問題嗎？為什麼退款與去年同期相比仍然有點高？

Neha, thank you for the questions. Good to hear. This is Ricardo. I'm going to talk about PagBank revenues, and then Artur can give you more color about chargebacks, but you're right about the credit books here. So the PagBank revenues, as I said, it is growing. Remember, we added 2.1 million clients in this quarter, and the majority of these clients are consumers. What I mean by consumers? They don't have the automatic cashing just like we have with the merchants because the merchants, when they have a sale in the POS, the money goes straight to the digital account, and they can make transactions there. They can use some services in the digital cost that you can monetize. Consumers take a while to put the money there, and it takes a while to start generating revenue.

內哈，謝謝你的提問。很高興聽到。這是里卡多。我將討論 PagBank 的收入，然後 Artur 可以為您提供有關退款的更多信息，但您對信用簿的看法是正確的。正如我所說，PagBank 的收入正在增長。請記住，本季度我們增加了 210 萬客戶，其中大多數客戶是消費者。我所說的消費者是什麼意思？他們沒有像我們對商家那樣的自動兌現功能，因為商家在 POS 中進行銷售時，錢會直接進入數字帳戶，他們可以在那裡進行交易。他們可以使用一些可以貨幣化的數字成本服務。消費者需要一段時間才能把錢存在那裡，也需要一段時間才能開始產生收入。

So we'll be saying that there is some lag between the decline comes to PagBank and it starts to generate revenues. But it is increasing, revenues, that is true. We also made some promotions for some clients. Just to give an example, we have some withdraw fees. If people go to ATM to withdraw the money, we have some fees that we charge. For some of the clients, we decided not to charge in exchange to have more engagement from them. We made some research. Some of the clients that we use here, they're also using other bank because of that. So we decided to take it out this charge. So that's why we at the end of the day, for some clients, we are exchanging short-term revenues for a higher engagement and a longer-term relationship.

因此，我們會說，PagBank 的衰退和開始產生收入之間存在一些滯後。但收入正在增加，這是事實。我們還為一些客戶做了一些促銷活動。舉個例子，我們有一些提款費用。如果人們去 ATM 取款，我們會收取一些費用。對於一些客戶，我們決定不收費，以換取他們更多的參與。我們做了一些研究。我們在這裡使用的一些客戶，因此他們也使用其他銀行。所以我們決定把這個費用去掉。因此，這就是為什麼我們最終對於一些客戶來說，用短期收入來換取更高的參與度和更長期的關係。

So -- but I mean, it's growing. It's fine with us, the level that we have. Acquiring is growing fast as well. So I mean we are very happy with what we had in the country -- in this quarter with the PagBank revenues. But I'll pass the word to Artur to talk to you about chargebacks.

所以——但我的意思是，它正在增長。我們的水平很好。收購也在快速增長。所以我的意思是，我們對我們在該國的情況非常滿意——本季度 PagBank 的收入。但我會轉告阿圖爾，讓他與您討論退款事宜。

Neha, it's Artur speaking. Thank you for your question. Good to talk to you. Related to chargeback, as we said in the last conference call, it's important to mention that we did not have the same issues of Q1 '21 for digital losses as we presented in the first quarter of this year. And also, in the Q2, when we exclude the digital loss -- when we compare to Q1, excluding digital losses, the chargeback over acquiring TPV grew 6 basis points, okay, due to more online transactions that naturally brings more chargebacks and the growth of credit portfolio, as Dutra said. Related to credit portfolio, since we use IFRS 9 the highest accounting standard procedures for delinquency provisions, we booked 12 months of write-off in the first month of the cohort that will present a new dynamic for our chargeback as a percentage of acquiring TPV going forward.

尼哈，我是阿圖爾。謝謝你的問題。很高興和你說話。與退款相關，正如我們在上次電話會議中所說，值得一提的是，我們沒有遇到與今年第一季度相同的 21 年第一季度數字損失問題。而且，在第二季度，當我們排除數字損失時——與第一季度相比，排除數字損失，收購TPV 的退款增加了6 個基點，好吧，因為更多的在線交易自然會帶來更多的退款和增長正如杜特拉所說，信貸投資組合。與信貸投資組合相關，由於我們使用IFRS 9（國際財務報告準則第9 號）作為拖欠準備金的最高會計標準程序，因此我們在該組的第一個月預訂了12 個月的沖銷，這將為我們的退款提供新的動態，即收購TPV 的百分比向前。

And if we compare the credit portfolio that grew 42% quarter-over-quarter, our TPV grew at 12%. So this is the reason that increased the chargeback as a percentage of the TPV. So it's provisions at the end of the day. We have provisions following the IFRS 9 role.

如果我們比較季度環比增長 42% 的信貸投資組合，我們的 TPV 增長了 12%。因此，這就是增加退款佔 TPV 百分比的原因。所以說到底，這是規定。我們制定了遵循 IFRS 9 角色的規定。

Our next question comes from David Togut with Evercore ISI.

我們的下一個問題來自 Evercore ISI 的 David Togut。

This is Spencer Kennedy on for David Togut. So great to see the continued strong momentum in the PagBank's ecosystem. I want to better understand the monetization differences between your consumer and merchant clients. You now have around 82% of your merchants as PagBank clients, which implies the future client additions will predominantly come from new merchants -- or sorry, new consumers. Any stark differences between these 2 groups, delaying the credit and interchange revenue or product usage?

我是斯賓塞·肯尼迪，替大衛·托古特發言。很高興看到 PagBank 生態系統持續強勁的勢頭。我想更好地了解消費者和商家客戶之間的貨幣化差異。現在，大約 82% 的商戶都是 PagBank 客戶，這意味著未來新增的客戶將主要來自新商戶，或者抱歉，是新消費者。這兩組之間有什麼明顯的差異，延遲了信貸和交換收入或產品使用嗎？

David, thank you for the question. What you see here is just in terms of dynamics is because when you are a merchant and you use our POS, you already received the POS in your cash card. So once we start making transactions, the money goes to your digital accounts, and you can have the cards in your hands. You start using. You start buying stuff. You're starting withdrawing money. We start to withdrawing money. So we start generating revenues because it's a, let's say, a closed loop, so to say, because the money goes from the POS to your digital account to have the cards in our hands. So it's very easy for you to use into use and to change the revenues.

大衛，謝謝你的提問。您在這裡看到的只是動態方面的，因為當您是商家並使用我們的 POS 時，您已經在現金卡中收到了 POS。因此，一旦我們開始進行交易，錢就會進入您的數字賬戶，您就可以將卡握在手中。你開始使用。你開始買東西。你開始取款了。我們開始取款。因此，我們開始產生收入，因為這是一個閉環，可以這麼說，因為錢從 POS 流向您的數字賬戶，然後我們手中就有卡。因此，您可以輕鬆使用並更改收入。

When you are a consumer and you ask for a card, of course, we need to make some QAC checks here. Although we are probably the fastest company in terms of sending you the card in Brazil, but it takes a while for you to send the money and to start using -- usually, let's say, if you work in Brazil, you receive twice a month. So the money doesn't go straight in the day that they receive the card. So you open your app, look at the balance is 0. There is nothing to do there, and we cannot generate any revenue. So we need to wait for you to put the money there and then start monetizing. So -- and usually, the consumers, they have a lower average cashing when compared with merchants because the merchants, the cashing is automatic. So what you see here is that's just a lag of -- lack of time between you open the account to start generate revenues.

當你是一個消費者，你要求一張卡時，當然，我們需要在這裡進行一些QAC檢查。雖然我們可能是巴西向您發送卡最快的公司，但您需要一段時間才能匯款並開始使用 - 通常，假設您在巴西工作，您每個月會收到兩次。因此，錢不會在他們收到卡的當天直接轉入。所以你打開你的應用程序，看看餘額是 0。那裡沒有什麼可做的，我們無法產生任何收入。所以我們需要等你把錢放在那裡然後開始貨幣化。因此，通常情況下，與商家相比，消費者的平均兌現率較低，因為商家的兌現是自動的。所以你在這裡看到的只是一個滯後——從你開立賬戶到開始產生收入之間缺乏時間。

Today, the main difference is because it's -- that we don't offer credit products or products with credit risk for consumers. We only offer working capital loans and credit cards for merchants. The consumers that we offer credit cards, we only offer if they have a collateral. If they make the salary portability here or if they invest in a CD because if you get -- if you don't pay us, we can -- we have this collateral to -- we have this as a collateral. We have your salary or your CD. So usually, it takes -- that's the -- also another difference between generate revenues between consumer and merchants. We will start to generate some credit products for consumers in the following weeks.

今天，主要的區別是因為我們不向消費者提供信貸產品或具有信用風險的產品。我們只為商戶提供營運資金貸款和信用卡。我們向消費者提供信用卡，只有在他們有抵押品的情況下我們才會提供。如果他們在這裡讓工資可轉移，或者如果他們投資一張CD，因為如果你得到——如果你不付錢給我們，我們可以——我們有這個抵押品——我們有這個作為抵押品。我們有你的工資或你的CD。因此，通常情況下，消費者和商家之間產生收入之間還有另一個區別。我們將在接下來的幾週內開始為消費者提供一些信貸產品。

We launched yesterday, the overdraft loans, which is a very well-known product around the world and also in Brazil. It's more tickets. It's more risk. Good interest rate. So we will start offering overdraft for consumers. We will also start making some pilots and credit cards. Once the consumers become more and more important in PagBank, we expect to be able to monetize them accordingly as well. So that's the difference. Today, we are building this company or building this ecosystem with consumers and merchants in parallel. But you're right, it takes a little bit more to generate revenues from consumers.

我們昨天推出了透支貸款，這是在世界各地和巴西都非常知名的產品。門票又多了風險就更大了利率好。所以我們將開始為消費者提供透支服務。我們還將開始製作一些試點和信用卡。一旦消費者在 PagBank 中變得越來越重要，我們預計也能夠相應地通過他們貨幣化。這就是區別。今天，我們正在與消費者和商家並行建立這家公司或建立這個生態系統。但你是對的，從消費者那裡獲得收入需要更多的努力。

Okay. Got it. And as my follow-up, I just wanted to better understand the 2.1 million client additions. And just, I guess, thinking through the sustainability of those additions because I guess, historically, I guess you guys have talked about 1 million new client adds per quarter is kind of how we should think about that. So I guess, are the factors that drove that this quarter, are those sustainable?

好的。知道了。作為我的後續行動，我只是想更好地了解新增的 210 萬客戶。我想，考慮這些新增客戶的可持續性，因為我想，從歷史上看，我想你們已經談到了每季度增加 100 萬個新客戶，這就是我們應該如何思考的。所以我想，推動本季度業績增長的因素是否可持續？

David, it's hard to give you this information. It's going to be 2 million again. We'd rather say that we keep with our, let's say, soft guidance between 1 million and 1.4 million per quarter. If we see the opportunity that will accelerate some niches that we can make some partnerships, we can find thousands of clients when you do it, but it was exceptional Q2 for us. We saw some marketing channels working better than we used it to be. We made some new campaigns that are working very well. Our product also getting more mature, people understood that. So I mean, we are -- we would rather say there's going to be more than 1 million in Q3. And so let's see, if we have more color on that, we can update you.

大衛，很難向你提供這些信息。又要200萬了。我們寧願說我們堅持每季度 100 萬到 140 萬之間的軟指導。如果我們看到可以加速某些利基市場的機會，我們可以建立一些合作夥伴關係，當你這樣做時，我們可以找到數千名客戶，但這對我們來說是特殊的第二季度。我們發現一些營銷渠道比以前效果更好。我們做了一些效果很好的新活動。我們的產品也越來越成熟，人們都明白這一點。所以我的意思是，我們寧願說第三季度的數量將超過 100 萬。所以讓我們看看，如果我們有更多的信息，我們可以向您更新。

Our next question comes from Jeff Cantwell with Guggenheim securities.

我們的下一個問題來自古根海姆證券公司的傑夫坎特威爾。

Most of them have been asked. I thought Slide 4 at the presentation has that interesting chart in the upper left corner is a clear progression there, which shows that you're clearly gaining market share in acquiring. So your shares increased by 200 bps over the past year and 300 basis points over the past 2 years. Ricardo, can you talk a little more about what's driven that? Can you think back and talk about where those share gains have come from? Why they come about? What you're seeing out of the market that's different about PagSeguro? The crux of my question, as we look back at the strategy and execution of the company, what's really driven those share gains in your opinion? Is it the PagSeguro versus distribution? Is it the PAGS itself, the strength of the ecosystem? And where do you believe those share gains are coming from, meaning, new businesses, competitive wins? Any kind of detail there would be very useful to hear about what you've seen occur as you gain share over this past 2 years.

大多數人都被問過。我認為演示文稿中的幻燈片 4 的左上角有一個有趣的圖表，那裡有一個明顯的進展，這表明您在收購方面明顯獲得了市場份額。因此，您的股價在過去一年中上漲了 200 個基點，在過去兩年中上漲了 300 個基點。Ricardo，您能多談談是什麼推動了這一點嗎？您能回想一下這些份額收益從何而來嗎？他們為什麼會出現？您認為 PagSeguro 與市場有何不同？我的問題的關鍵是，當我們回顧公司的戰略和執行時，您認為是什麼真正推動了這些股票的增長？是 PagSeguro 與發行版的對比嗎？是 PAGS 本身、生態系統的力量嗎？您認為這些份額收益來自哪裡，即新業務、競爭勝利？任何類型的細節對於了解您在過去兩年中獲得份額時所看到的情況都非常有用。

Jeff, thank you for the question. You're right, we grew from 7.2 to 9.2 in 1 year. Part of the explanation here, of course, is because we started the Hubs, and we keep growing in long tail. As I said before, when we go to a Hub approach for an SMB, the majority of them, not to say 100% already, except cards with another player, we see many, many SMBs unsatisfied or not satisfied with their current provider, with their current player. We don't -- we try not to go there and just beat on price because that's not the smartest way to gain these clients. We try to use PagBank as a differentiator, and it is working. Of course, you need to negotiate. That's why we have the Hubs because if you were not able to negotiate with distributor, you could come here and buy our POS through the website. And we know that SMBs have better take rates than those that we offer in the website. So that's the main idea. To talk to the right person, to the owner of the business and get the deal done.

傑夫，謝謝你的提問。你是對的，我們在一年內從 7.2 增長到 9.2。當然，這裡的部分解釋是因為我們啟動了中心，並且我們在長尾方面不斷增長。正如我之前所說，當我們為中小型企業採用集線器方法時，除了與其他玩家合作的卡之外，大多數中小型企業（更不用說100%），我們看到很多很多中小型企業對其當前的提供商不滿意或不滿意，他們現在的球員。我們不會——我們盡量不去那裡，只是在價格上擊敗，因為這不是贏得這些客戶的最明智的方式。我們嘗試使用 PagBank 作為差異化因素，並且它正在發揮作用。當然，你需要談判。這就是我們設立 Hub 的原因，因為如果您無法與經銷商協商，您可以來這里通過網站購買我們的 POS。我們知道中小企業的採用率比我們在網站上提供的要高。這就是主要思想。與合適的人、企業所有者交談並完成交易。

So we try -- as I said, we try not to compete with price. We use PagBank as a competitive advantage here. There is no conflict of interest. We are under the same umbrella, the same parent company with the same targets. I mean so we are everyone looking for the same direction here. I don't have here on the top of my mind to say you, from this 2 percentage points, how much was from new business that we got in long tail, how much from the Hubs. We can get this information later. And regarding your second question, I would say you here, we are a very hands-on company. We try not to have distractions and to make the best for our clients. I guess that's our DNA. That's what everyone here is committed to. We have a very committed team looking for the best for the clients. We don't do things just because we think it's cool or because we think that the market will like it. We will do things that really the clients will like it.

所以我們嘗試——正如我所說，我們盡量不與價格競爭。我們在這裡使用 PagBank 作為競爭優勢。不存在利益衝突。我們在同一個保護傘下，同一個母公司，有著相同的目標。我的意思是，我們每個人都在這裡尋找相同的方向。我不想在這裡告訴你，從這兩個百分點來看，有多少來自我們長尾的新業務，有多少來自樞紐。我們可以稍後獲取此信息。關於你的第二個問題，我想說的是，我們是一家非常注重實踐的公司。我們盡量不分心，為客戶提供最好的服務。我想這就是我們的 DNA。這就是這裡每個人的承諾。我們擁有一支非常忠誠的團隊，致力於為客戶提供最好的服務。我們做某事不僅僅是因為我們認為它很酷或者因為我們認為市場會喜歡它。我們會做客戶真正喜歡的事情。

We will deepen relationship with PagSeguro PagBank and so on. We do believe that technology also is a tool that you need to use. Then what brought us since 2006 until today, the technology, the way that we have here to scale the solutions, the cost to serve going down as time passes by. So that's what we believe. So to make the best for the clients using technology and be a hands-on taking very attention to details because at the end of the day, these clients, they need to be very well served. Otherwise, they can move to another player. So that's why we try to do very -- a lot of focus on execution here. So that would say, I mean, there is no secret sauce here. Just working hard every day and taking attention details using technology and the best for the clients.

我們將加深與PagSeguro、PagBank等的合作關係。我們確實相信技術也是您需要使用的工具。自 2006 年至今，是什麼給我們帶來了技術、我們擴展解決方案的方式以及隨著時間的推移服務成本不斷下降。這就是我們所相信的。因此，要利用技術為客戶提供最好的服務，並親自動手，非常注重細節，因為歸根結底，這些客戶需要得到很好的服務。否則，他們可以轉移到另一個玩家。這就是為什麼我們在這裡非常注重執行。所以這就是說，我的意思是，這裡沒有秘密武器。每天努力工作，利用技術關注細節，為客戶提供最好的服務。

Okay. That's great color. And then separately, I want to ask you in PagBank. You're touching on this a bit. Can you talk a little more about your efforts right now to get more PagBank cards into the hands of your users and get them active? We can see that the 4x increase in cards, Slide 9, right, over the past 2 years, they're now at 405,000. So when we think about that 11.2 million active user base, the obvious question for us is how many of them [link cards?] How many of them are potentially customers, right, using PagBank cards? And so how much of further expansion should we expect to see from that 405,000? Could you give us any thoughts there about execution and the strategy and how to continue to bring that number forward within your customer base?

好的。那顏色真棒。另外，我想在 PagBank 向您請教。你稍微觸及了這一點。您能否多談談您目前為將更多 PagBank 卡交到用戶手中並讓他們活躍起來所做的努力？我們可以看到卡片數量增加了 4 倍，幻燈片 9，對，在過去 2 年裡，現在達到了 405,000 張。因此，當我們考慮 1120 萬活躍用戶群時，我們最明顯的問題是其中有多少人 [鏈接卡？] 其中有多少人是使用 PagBank 卡的潛在客戶，對嗎？那麼，我們預計這 405,000 人會進一步擴張多少呢？您能否給我們提供有關執行和戰略以及如何繼續在您的客戶群中提高這一數字的任何想法？

Yes, Jeff. Well, when someone comes here to open the account, we don't know if -- I mean, it's hard to -- from the beginning, if there's going to be a, let's say, good client with lots of money coming to the digital account or if they will not put a lots of money here, if they're a heavy user or not. So we try to get some data from the market. We try to get some data from -- that you have here inside the company to try to offer, let's say, to make the best offer for these clients. But at the end of the day, I'll say you that the main -- the most used feature in our account is the wire transfers, and second is the cards because those are the 2 tools the clients have to move the money. So that's the -- what they use more to -- of course, they pay deals and so on.

是的，傑夫。好吧，當有人來這裡開戶時，我們不知道是否——我的意思是，這很難——從一開始，是否會有一個，比方說，有很多錢的好客戶來到這裡。數字帳戶，或者他們是否不會在這裡投入大量資金，是否是重度用戶。所以我們嘗試從市場上獲取一些數據。我們試圖從公司內部獲取一些數據，以便為這些客戶提供最好的報價。但歸根結底，我會告訴你，我們帳戶中最常用的主要功能是電匯，其次是銀行卡，因為這是客戶轉移資金的兩種工具。這就是他們更多使用的，當然，他們支付交易等等。

But the right transfer to send money from one account to another one and also the cards make purchase and to withdraw the money. Those are the 2 most used features. If the client asks for a card and they don't use it, we have a, let's say, a communication process here to send promotions to make some incentives for them to activate the card and to use the card. So our goal here is to have 100% of our clients using the cards, those that receive the card. So I mean, it's key for us. It's key to make the people to use our PagBank as the main bank. We are not the main bank for the majority of the clients at this point. But I mean, it's a decent percentage of our clients say they use PagBank as their main bank, and it is getting better month after month.

但正確的轉賬方式是將錢從一個帳戶發送到另一個帳戶，並且卡可以進行購買和取款。這是兩個最常用的功能。如果客戶索要一張卡但他們沒有使用它，那麼我們這裡有一個溝通流程來發送促銷信息，以激勵他們激活該卡並使用該卡。因此，我們的目標是讓 100% 的客戶使用這些卡，即那些收到卡的客戶。所以我的意思是，這對我們來說很關鍵。讓人們使用我們的 PagBank 作為主要銀行是關鍵。目前我們還不是大多數客戶的主要銀行。但我的意思是，我們有相當一部分客戶表示他們使用 PagBank 作為主要銀行，而且情況逐月變得更好。

So we are developing new features. We are putting new features in the accounts so that people can use us as the main bank. But the goal here is to have more and more people using the cards and see these TPV phone cards increasing. It is still today linked with the TPV from the acquiring because the majority of the cashing is coming from the acquiring. So if the acquiring comes up, the -- usually the TPV phone cards also goes up. When you have these acquiring comes down, what we had in Q1 because of seasonality, we saw also the TPV phone cards with the same trend because the majority of the cashing is from the merchants. But going back to your question, the idea here is to have, I would say, 100% of our clients using the cash card. We will start offering credit cards for some consumers as a pilot, as I mentioned before, but we will start. So it's hard to see how it's going to be the performance. We can, again, give you more color in the following quarters, the following calls.

所以我們正在開發新功能。我們正在賬戶中添加新功能，以便人們可以將我們作為主要銀行。但我們的目標是讓越來越多的人使用這些卡，並看到 TPV 電話卡的數量不斷增加。如今，它仍然與收購中的冠捷科技聯繫在一起，因為大部分兌現都來自收購。因此，如果收購發生，冠捷電話卡通常也會上漲。當這些收購量下降時，我們在第一季度由於季節性原因而下降，我們也看到冠捷電話卡具有相同的趨勢，因為大部分兌現來自商家。但回到你的問題，我想說的是，這裡的想法是讓 100% 的客戶使用現金卡。正如我之前提到的，我們將開始為一些消費者提供信用卡作為試點，但我們會開始。所以很難看出它的表現會如何。我們可以在接下來的幾個季度、接下來的電話會議中再次為您提供更多信息。

That concludes our question-and-answer session for today. I would now like to turn the floor over to Mr. Ricardo Dutra for final remarks. Please, Mr. Dutra. Go ahead.

我們今天的問答環節到此結束。我現在請里卡多·杜特拉先生做最後發言。請杜特拉先生。前進。

Hi, everyone. Thank you very much for the time. Thank you for the questions. Thank you for all the support through all these quarters, and hope to talk to you soon in person. And for some of them that we don't meet in person, we can talk in the next conference call next quarter. Thank you very much.

大家好。非常感謝您抽出時間。謝謝你的提問。感謝您長期以來的支持，並希望很快能與您面對面交談。對於其中一些我們沒有親自見面的人，我們可以在下季度的下一次電話會議上進行討論。非常感謝。

The PagBank PagSeguro's conference call is now over. Thank you for your participation. Have a great night, and you may now disconnect.

PagBank PagSeguro 的電話會議現已結束。感謝您的參與。祝您度過一個美好的夜晚，現在您可以斷開連接了。