MFA Financial Inc (MFA) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the MFA Financial Inc third quarter 2025 financial results conference call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded.

各位好，歡迎參加 MFA Financial Inc 2025 年第三季財務業績電話會議。（操作說明）提醒各位，本次會議正在錄音。

It is now my pleasure to introduce Hal Schwartz, MFA Financial. Please go ahead.

現在我很高興向大家介紹金融碩士 Hal Schwartz。請繼續。

Thank you, Rachelle, and good morning, everyone. The information discussed on this conference call today may contain or refer to forward-looking statements regarding MFA Financial Inc, which reflect management's beliefs, expectations and assumptions as to MFA's future performance and operations. When used, statements that are not historical in nature, including those containing words such as will, believe, expect, anticipate, estimate, should, could, would or similar expressions are intended to identify forward-looking statements.

謝謝你，Rachelle，大家早安。今天電話會議上討論的資訊可能包含或提及有關 MFA Financial Inc 的前瞻性陳述，這些陳述反映了管理層對 MFA 未來業績和營運的信念、預期和假設。當使用時，非歷史性質的陳述，包括包含諸如“將”、“相信”、“預期”、“預計”、“估計”、“應該”、“可能”、“會”或類似表達的陳述，旨在識別前瞻性陳述。

All forward-looking statements speak only as of the date on which they are made. These types of statements are subject to various known and unknown risks, uncertainties, assumptions and other factors, including those described in MFA's annual report on Form 10-K for the year ended December 31, 2024, and other reports that it may file from time to time with the Securities and Exchange Commission.

所有前瞻性陳述僅代表其作出之日的觀點。這些類型的聲明受到各種已知和未知風險、不確定性、假設和其他因素的影響，包括 MFA 在截至 2024 年 12 月 31 日的年度 10-K 表格年度報告中描述的風險、不確定性、假設和其他因素，以及 MFA 可能不時向美國證券交易委員會提交的其他報告中描述的風險、不確定性、假設和其他因素。

These risks, uncertainties and other factors could cause MFA's actual results to differ materially from those projected, expressed or implied in any forward-looking statements it makes. For additional information regarding MFA's use of forward-looking statements, please see the relevant disclosure in the press release announcing MFA's third quarter 2025 financial results. Thank you for your time.

這些風險、不確定性和其他因素可能導致 MFA 的實際業績與它所做的任何前瞻性聲明中預測、表達或暗示的業績有重大差異。有關 MFA 使用前瞻性聲明的更多信息，請參閱 MFA 2025 年第三季財務業績新聞稿中的相關披露。感謝您抽出時間。

I would now like to turn this call over to MFA's CEO, Craig Knutson.

現在我想把這通電話交給MFA的執行長克雷格·克努森。

Thank you, Hal. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us for MFA Financial's third quarter 2025 earnings call. With me today are Bryan Wulfsohn, our President and Chief Investment Officer; Mike Roper, our Chief Financial Officer; and other members of our senior management team. MFA continued to execute on our business objectives during the third quarter and delivered a total economic return of 2.6% to shareholders. After my remarks this morning, Mike will provide details on our financial results, and then Bryan will discuss our portfolio activity, financing and Lima One before we open up the call to questions.

謝謝你，哈爾。各位早安，感謝各位參加 MFA Financial 2025 年第三季財報電話會議。今天陪同我的有：我們的總裁兼首席投資官布萊恩·沃爾夫森；我們的首席財務官邁克·羅珀；以及我們高級管理團隊的其他成員。MFA在第三季繼續執行我們的業務目標，並為股東帶來了2.6%的總經濟回報。今天上午我發言結束後，Mike 將詳細介紹我們的財務業績，然後 Bryan 將討論我們的投資組合活動、融資和 Lima One，之後我們將開放問答環節。

For today's call, I will focus on a new slide that we've added to our earnings deck. This is page 4, which lays out various actions we have taken to increase earnings and grow ROEs over the next year. Although we have previously mentioned some of these plans, we think it is important to highlight these initiatives in the aggregate as we believe that together, these programs will have a meaningful impact on MFA's earnings, returns on equity and dividend generation. The first initiative is higher capital deployment.

在今天的電話會議上，我將重點介紹我們添加到收益簡報中的一張新投影片。這是第 4 頁，其中列出了我們為提高收益和在未來一年內提高淨資產收益率而採取的各種措施。雖然我們之前已經提到過其中一些計劃，但我們認為有必要將這些舉措總體上加以強調，因為我們相信這些計劃加在一起將對 MFA 的收益、股本回報率和股息產生產生重大影響。第一項舉措是加大資本投入。

Over the last several years, we have consistently operated with high levels of liquidity, often with over $300 million of unrestricted cash. This strategy was prudent, particularly during 2022 and 2023 when the bond market experienced extreme volatility against the backdrop of an unprecedented tightening cycle by the Fed and allowed us to capitalize on temporary market dislocations to add assets at attractive yields. During these years, we also executed on a liability strategy to create durable and non-mark-to-market financing for the vast majority of our assets, much of which was through securitizations.

過去幾年，我們一直保持著較高的流動性，通常擁有超過 3 億美元的非限制性現金。這項策略是審慎的，尤其是在 2022 年和 2023 年，當時債券市場在聯準會前所未有的緊縮週期背景下經歷了極端波動，這使我們能夠利用暫時的市場錯位以有吸引力的收益率增加資產。這些年來，我們也實施了一項負債策略，為我們絕大多數資產創造了持久且非以市值計價的融資，其中大部分是透過證券化實現的。

Also over this time, we began adding Agency MBS beginning in December of 2022. As we discussed at the time, we saw agencies as an attractive complement to our mortgage credit portfolio. In addition to providing very attractive returns, agencies significantly increased the liquidity of our overall portfolio and helped us manage the cash needs for margin calls on our interest rate swap hedge position. Fast forward to today, with increased clarity on the path of interest rates, lower market volatility, the increased portfolio liquidity provided by our agency portfolio and the predominance of non-mark-to-market financing on our loan portfolios, we have increased confidence to deploy more of our excess liquidity into our target asset classes, including an increased allocation to Agency MBS.

此外，在此期間，我們從 2022 年 12 月開始增加機構抵押貸款擔保證券 (MBS)。正如我們當時所討論的那樣，我們認為代理機構是我們抵押貸款信貸組合的一個有吸引力的補充。除了提供極具吸引力的回報外，各機構還顯著提高了我們整體投資組合的流動性，並幫助我們管理利率互換對沖頭寸的追加保證金所需的現金需求。時至今日，隨著利率走勢更加明朗、市場波動性降低、機構投資組合流動性增強以及貸款組合中非市值計價融資占主導地位，我們更有信心將更多過剩流動性投入目標資產類別，包括增加對機構抵押貸款支持證券 (MBS) 的配置。

Holding nearly 20% of our equity in cash has been a significant drag on earnings. While the 4%-ish that we earn on cash is certainly better than the 0 we earned in 2021, it's more than 1,000 basis points less than the ROEs we generate in all other asset classes. Investing $100 million of this excess cash will still leave us with substantial liquidity, but the incremental earnings will have a meaningful and immediate impact on earnings and ROE. Finally, our ladder of outstanding securitizations is another potential source of additional capital.

持有近 20% 的股權現金對獲利造成了嚴重的拖累。雖然我們現金收益率約為 4%，這肯定比 2021 年的 0% 要好，但這比我們在所有其他資產類別中產生的 ROE 低了 1000 多個基點。將這筆1億美元的盈餘現金進行投資，我們仍將擁有充足的流動性，但新增收益將對收益和淨資產收益率產生重大而直接的影響。最後，我們未償證券化產品鍊是另一個潛在的額外資金來源。

Because these securitizations delever over time, calling them and resecuritizing the underlying loan collateral often frees up tens of millions of dollars of capital to deploy into new assets, significantly boosting portfolio ROEs even if the new securitization deal comes with a higher cost of funds. We've shared progress over the last several quarters on our efforts to grow origination volumes at Lima One, and we're happy to report that we are starting to see these efforts bear fruit. We announced on our second quarter earnings call back in 2024 that we've made the decision to pause multifamily transitional lending at Lima One. We used this pause as an opportunity to initiate a comprehensive review of the multifamily underwriting guideline and processes. This review led to some changes, and we have recently hired a new multifamily leadership and underwriting team.

由於這些證券化產品會隨著時間的推移而去槓桿化，因此贖回這些證券化產品並對基礎貸款抵押品進行再證券化通常會釋放數千萬美元的資金用於投資新資產，即使新的證券化交易會帶來更高的資金成本，也能顯著提高投資組合的淨資產收益率。在過去的幾個季度裡，我們分享了我們在 Lima One 增加貸款發放量方面取得的進展，我們很高興地報告說，我們開始看到這些努力結出了碩果。我們在2024年第二季財報電話會議上宣布，我們決定暫停Lima One的多戶住宅過渡性貸款業務。我們利用這段暫停期，對多戶住宅承銷準則和流程進行了全面審查。這次審查促成了一些改變，我們最近聘請了一支新的多戶住宅領導和核保團隊。

In the last 1.5 years, multifamily seems to have found some footing with prices above the lows from early 2024, new construction starts down materially about 50% between 2024 and '25 and supply and demand in more balance. We are confident that the changes we have made have significantly strengthened our product offering, and we expect to resume multifamily lending in early 2026. During 2025, we have also made significant new hires to Lima's sales team, rolled out technology initiatives that materially improve the borrower experience, and we're planning to launch a wholesale origination channel next year as well. These initiatives take time to produce results, but we are confident that we have the right team, the right mindset and the right processes to produce quality loan production that we can now begin to scale.

在過去的1.5年裡，多戶住宅似乎找到了一些立足點，價格高於2024年初的低點，2024年至2025年間新開工建設大幅下降約50%，供需更加平衡。我們相信，我們所做的改變已經大大增強了我們的產品供應，我們預計將於 2026 年初恢復多戶住宅貸款業務。2025 年，我們也為利馬的銷售團隊招募了大量新員工，推出了能夠顯著改善借款人體驗的技術舉措，我們計劃明年推出批發貸款管道。這些舉措需要時間才能產生效果，但我們相信我們擁有合適的團隊、正確的思維方式和正確的流程，能夠生產高品質的貸款，現在我們可以開始擴大規模。

Business purpose loans generate some of the highest ROEs of all of MFA's target asset classes. So growth at Lima One into 2026 will contribute materially to MFA's earnings. Another initiative has been expense reductions. Over the last year, we've taken a hard look across all of our operating expenses, both at MFA and Lima One. While most of the significant reductions have been personnel related, we've also canceled or renegotiated many vendor contracts.

商業用途貸款在 MFA 的所有目標資產類別中產生了最高的股本回報率。因此，Lima One 到 2026 年的成長將對 MFA 的收益做出重大貢獻。另一項舉措是削減開支。過去一年，我們對MFA和Lima One的所有營運支出進行了嚴格審查。雖然大部分大幅削減都與人員有關，但我們也取消或重新談判了許多供應商合約。

As Mike stated on our last earnings call, our goal is to reduce run rate G&A expenses by 7% to 10% versus 2024 levels, which is about $9 million to $13 million a year or $0.02 to $0.04 per share per quarter. While we have realized a significant amount of savings already, we anticipate that additional savings will be realized throughout 2026 as many of these actions take time to be realized.

正如麥克在上次財報電話會議上所說，我們的目標是將年度一般及行政費用較 2024 年水準降低 7% 至 10%，即每年約 900 萬至 1,300 萬美元，或每季每股 0.02 至 0.04 美元。雖然我們已經實現了相當可觀的節省，但我們預計在 2026 年全年還將實現更多節省，因為許多此類措施需要時間才能實現。

A further initiative has been accelerating the resolution of nonperforming loans. These loans are across MFA's loan portfolio, but many are business purpose loans, including the aforementioned multifamily transitional loans. Our team has over 10 years of on-the-ground experience resolving nonperforming loans, dating back to 2014 and 2015 when we were large buyers of RPLs and NPLs from banks and the GSEs. We've been working closely with Lima One servicing professionals to resolve these loans, whether through loan sales, foreclosure and liquidation or other forms of asset resolution. And we've made significant progress. The multifamily transitional loan portfolio is almost half of what it was a year ago, and delinquent loans are down from $86 million to $47 million so far in 2025.

另一項措施是加快解決不良貸款問題。這些貸款涵蓋了 MFA 的所有貸款組合，但其中許多是商業用途貸款，包括前面提到的多戶住宅過渡貸款。我們的團隊擁有超過 10 年解決不良貸款的實地經驗，可以追溯到 2014 年和 2015 年，當時我們從銀行和政府支持企業大量購買可回收貸款和不良貸款。我們一直與 Lima One 的服務專業人員密切合作，以解決這些貸款問題，無論是透過貸款出售、止贖和清算，還是其他形式的資產處置。我們取得了顯著進展。多戶住宅過渡貸款組合規模幾乎只有一年前的一半，而截至 2025 年，拖欠貸款已從 8,600 萬美元降至 4,700 萬美元。

Economically, losses associated with these loans were reflected in fair value marks when they emerged, which in most cases was over a year ago or more when these fair value marks flow through GAAP earnings and book value. But these nonperforming loans tie up a lot of capital. In some cases, these loans or REO properties may be unlevered, in which case, they are funded 100% with equity. In other cases, they may be funded partly with borrowing, but the advance rate on delinquent loans is generally lower than for performing loans. Additionally, we do not -- we generally do not recognize interest income on delinquent loans due to our nonaccrual policy.

從經濟角度來看，與這些貸款相關的損失在出現時已反映在公允價值標記中，而大多數情況下，這些公允價值標記是在一年多以前或更久以前透過 GAAP 收益和帳面價值體現出來的。但這些不良貸款佔用了大量資金。在某些情況下，這些貸款或已收回房產可能沒有槓桿，在這種情況下，它們完全由股權提供資金。在其他情況下，它們可能部分透過借款獲得資金，但不良貸款的預付款比例通常低於正常貸款的預付款比例。此外，由於我們的非應計政策，我們通常不會確認逾期貸款的利息收入。

So the equity that we have tied up in nonperforming loans is a significant drag on our earnings and ROE. As we free up capital by resolving these problem assets, we can invest it in our target asset classes that generate mid- to high-teen ROEs. Finally, during the third quarter, we began a program to modestly modify our capital structure. Under our recently implemented preferred stock ATM program, we have issued additional shares of both our Series B and Series C preferred stock and used the proceeds to repurchase common stock at a significant discount to economic book value. While modest in size thus far, this is very accretive.

因此，我們投入不良貸款的股權對我們的收益和淨資產收益率造成了重大拖累。透過解決這些問題資產，我們可以釋放資金，並將其投資於能夠產生中高淨資產收益率的目標資產類別。最後，在第三季度，我們啟動了一個計劃，對我們的資本結構進行適度調整。根據我們最近實施的優先股 ATM 計劃，我們增發了 B 系列和 C 系列優先股，並將所得款項用於以遠低於經濟帳面價值的價格回購普通股。雖然目前規模不大，但成長動能非常強勁。

And importantly, because we are issuing equity in the form of preferred stock, we are not shrinking our equity base despite repurchasing common stock. In the aggregate, we believe we are taking active measures to materially increase earnings and ROEs, and we expect to begin to see these results in 2026.

更重要的是，由於我們以優先股的形式發行股權，因此儘管我們回購了普通股，但我們的股權基礎並沒有縮小。總的來說，我們相信我們正在採取積極措施，以實質地提高收益和淨資產收益率，我們預計將在 2026 年開始看到這些成果。

And I'll now turn the call over to Mike to discuss our financial results.

現在我將把電話交給麥克，讓他來討論我們的財務表現。

Thanks, Craig, and good morning. At September 30, GAAP book value was $13.13 per share and economic book value was $13.69 per share. Each effectively unchanged from the end of June GAAP earnings of $48.1 million or $0.36 per basic common share. Net interest income was $56.8 million for the quarter, a modest decline driven primarily by the nonrecurring acceleration of discount accretion from the redemption of our MSR-related assets last quarter. As Craig mentioned, we continue to make progress with our expense reduction initiatives. Quarterly G&A expenses totaled $29 million, a $900,000 decline from $29.9 million last quarter and a $4.8 million decline from $33.8 million in the third quarter of 2024.

謝謝你，克雷格，早安。截至 9 月 30 日，GAAP 帳面價值為每股 13.13 美元，經濟帳面價值為每股 13.69 美元。與 6 月底的 GAAP 收益 4,810 萬美元或每股普通股 0.36 美元相比，兩者基本上保持不變。本季淨利息收入為 5,680 萬美元，略有下降，主要原因是上季贖回與抵押貸款服務權 (MSR) 相關的資產導致非經常性折價累積加速。正如克雷格所提到的，我們在削減開支方面持續取得進展。本季一般及行政費用總計 2,900 萬美元，比上季的 2,990 萬美元減少了 90 萬美元，比 2024 年第三季的 3,380 萬美元減少了 480 萬美元。

Year-to-date G&A expenses were $92.4 million versus $103.9 million for the same period last year, a decline of approximately 11%. While we're proud of the savings achieved thus far, we continue to make progress on initiatives that we expect will bring additional savings in the back half of 2026. Distributable earnings for the third quarter were approximately $21 million or $0.20 per share, a decline from $0.24 per share in the second quarter. DE was again adversely impacted by credit losses on our loan portfolio, which totaled $0.11 per share for the quarter. DE, excluding these credit losses, declined modestly to $0.32 per share from $0.35 per share last quarter, a decline driven largely by the nonrecurring income in the second quarter on our MSR-related assets.

今年迄今的一般及行政費用為 9,240 萬美元，而去年同期為 1.039 億美元，下降了約 11%。雖然我們對迄今為止的節約成果感到自豪，但我們仍在繼續推進各項舉措，預計這些舉措將在 2026 年下半年帶來更多節約。第三季可分配收益約為 2,100 萬美元，即每股 0.20 美元，低於第二季的每股 0.24 美元。DE再次受到貸款組合信貸損失的不利影響，該季度每股損失總計0.11美元。在剔除這些信貸損失後，DE 每股收益從上季度的 0.35 美元小幅下降至 0.32 美元，下降的主要原因是第二季與 MSR 相關的資產的非經常性收入。

Though we continue to expect some near-term pressure on our distributable earnings, as we made progress on the highly accretive strategic initiatives Craig spoke to earlier, we expect to see growth in our DE in the quarters ahead and continue to believe that our DE will reconverge with the level of our common dividend by mid-2026.

儘管我們預計短期內可分配收益仍將面臨一些壓力，但隨著我們在克雷格之前提到的那些極具增值性的戰略舉措方面取得進展，我們預計未來幾個季度可分配收益將有所增長，並且我們仍然相信，到 2026 年年中，可分配收益將與普通股股息水平重新趨於一致。

Moving to our capital. During the quarter, we sold approximately 70,000 shares of our Series B preferred stock and approximately 125,000 shares of our Series C preferred stock for aggregate proceeds of approximately $4.5 million at a yield well below our common cost of capital. During the quarter, we repurchased approximately 500,000 shares of our common stock at a discount of approximately 27% to our economic book value. As we continue to execute on our strategic initiatives to grow earnings, we find the opportunity in MFA's common stock today to be extraordinarily compelling.

遷往我們的首都。本季度，我們出售了約 70,000 股 B 系列優先股和約 125,000 股 C 系列優先股，總收益約為 450 萬美元，收益率遠低於我們的普通股資本成本。本季度，我們以較帳面經濟價值約 27% 的折扣回購了約 50 萬股普通股。隨著我們不斷推進策略性措施以提高獲利能力，我們認為目前 MFA 普通股的投資機會極具吸引力。

Given current market conditions and the trading level of our common stock, we expect to continue to issue preferred shares and repurchase our common shares as a way to enhance returns to our shareholders without sacrificing scale. Finally, subsequent to quarter end, we estimate that our economic book value is up by approximately 1% from the end of the third quarter.

鑑於目前的市場狀況和我們普通股的交易水平，我們預計將繼續發行優先股並回購我們的普通股，以此在不犧牲規模的情況下提高股東回報。最後，季末之後，我們估計我們的經濟帳面價值比第三季末成長了約 1%。

I'd now like to turn the call over to Bryan, who will discuss our investment activities in the third quarter and our progress with Lima One.

現在我想把電話交給布萊恩，他將討論我們第三季的投資活動以及我們與利馬一號的合作進度。

Thanks, Mike. We acquired $1.2 billion of loans and securities in our target asset classes during the third quarter. This included $453 million of non-QM loans, $473 million of agency securities and $260 million of loans originated by Lima One. I'll expand on the latter 2 in a moment. Our non-QM portfolio now exceeds $5 billion in size and remains our largest asset class. The loans we purchased during the quarter carry an average coupon of 7.6% and an LTV of only 68%, which we believe helps insulate us from a softer housing environment. We remain focused on the credit quality and maintain a robust diligence process, utilizing in-house resources in addition to independent third-party reviews.

謝謝你，麥克。第三季度，我們在目標資產類別中收購了價值 12 億美元的貸款和證券。這其中包括4.53億美元的非合格抵押貸款、4.73億美元的機構證券以及Lima One發放的2.6億美元貸款。稍後我會詳細說明後兩項。我們的非QM投資組合規模現已超過50億美元，仍然是我們最大的資產類別。本季我們購買的貸款平均票面利率為 7.6%，貸款價值比僅為 68%，我們相信這有助於我們免受疲軟的房地產市場環境的影響。我們始終專注於信貸質量，並維持嚴格的盡職調查流程，除了利用內部資源外，還進行獨立的第三方審查。

Credit performance in our non-QM book continues to be strong with a delinquency rate just over 4%. We issued our 19 and 20 non-QM securitizations during the quarter, selling $673 million of bonds at an average coupon of 5.4%. We've now securitized over $7 billion of non-QM paper since our first issuance in 2020. I want to thank our many investors who have consistently supported our deals. We grew our Agency MBS position to $2.2 billion during the third quarter, adding almost $500 million of securities.

我們非合格抵押貸款業務的信貸表現依然強勁，違約率略高於 4%。本季我們發行了第 19 和 20 只非合格市場證券化債券，以平均 5.4% 的票面利率售出了 6.73 億美元的債券。自 2020 年首次發行以來，我們已將超過 70 億美元的非合格市場證券化。我要感謝一直以來支持我們交易的眾多投資者。第三季度，我們的機構抵押貸款支持證券 (MBS) 持股增加至 22 億美元，新增證券規模近 5 億美元。

Spreads have tightened, but it remains possible to generate mid-teens ROE with leverage on these investments. We continue to focus on lower pay-up spec pools that provide additional prepayment protection than generic pools.

利差收窄，但利用這些投資的槓桿作用，仍有可能獲得十幾個百分點的淨值報酬率。我們持續專注於繳費比例較低的投機資金池，這類資金池比一般資金池提供額外的提前還款保障。

Our portfolio is predominantly comprised of 5.5% purchased at a slight discount to par. Our portfolio interest rate exposure remained stable over the quarter with our duration decreasing slightly just under one year. As Craig mentioned earlier, we plan to invest our excess cash into our target assets, which includes agencies. Subsequent to quarter end, we acquired an additional $900 million of Agency securities, and we plan to marginally grow our position further while spreads remain attractive. Given the liquidity of our agency portfolio, we retain the flexibility to opportunistically rotate capital should credit spreads widen from here.

我們的投資組合主要由以略低於面額的價格購入的 5.5% 的股票組成。本季我們的投資組合利率風險敞口保持穩定，久期略有下降，接近一年。正如克雷格之前提到的，我們計劃將多餘的現金投資於我們的目標資產，其中包括代理商。季度末之後，我們又購入了價值 9 億美元的機構證券，並且我們計劃在利差仍然具有吸引力的情況下進一步小幅增持。鑑於我們機構投資組合的流動性，如果信用利差從目前水準進一步擴大，我們仍可靈活地伺機輪換資本。

Turning to Lima One. Lima originated $260 million of business purpose loans during the quarter, a 20% increase from the second quarter. This included $200 million of single-family transitional loans with an average coupon of over 10% and over $60 million of new rental loans with an average coupon of 7%. During the quarter, we sold $66 million of recently originated rental loans at a premium to third-party investors, generating $1.6 million gain-on-sale income. Lima overall contributed $5.6 million of mortgage banking income to our earnings.

再來看看 Lima One。 Lima 在本季發放了 2.6 億美元的商業用途貸款，比第二季增加了 20%。其中包括 2 億美元的單戶住宅過渡貸款（平均票面利率超過 10%）和 6,000 萬美元以上的新租賃貸款（平均票面利率為 7%）。本季度，我們以溢價向第三方投資者出售了 6,600 萬美元的近期發放的租賃貸款，產生了 160 萬美元的銷售收益收入。Lima 總共為我們貢獻了 560 萬美元的抵押貸款銀行收入。

During the quarter, we made important progress in positioning Lima for growth. We hired new talent to help expand Lima's product offerings and origination channels, and we've continued adding to our sales team across the country. As Craig mentioned, Lima is planning to reenter the multifamily lending space in addition to opening up a wholesale channel focused on single-family rental lending. We are exploring partnerships with third-party investors interested in these credits to accelerate ROE growth. We believe these hires, along with further technology improvements will help support Lima's origination volume in future quarters.

本季度，我們在為利馬的成長做好準備方面取得了重要進展。我們聘請了新的人才來幫助擴大利馬的產品供應和業務管道，我們一直在全國擴充銷售團隊。正如克雷格所提到的那樣，利馬計劃重新進入多戶住宅貸款領域，同時開設一個專注於單戶住宅租賃貸款的批發管道。我們正在探索與對這些信貸感興趣的第三方投資者建立合作關係，以加速 ROE 成長。我們相信，這些新員工的加入，以及科技的進一步改進，將有助於支持利馬銀行未來幾季的貸款發放量。

Finally, turning to our credit performance. The delinquency rate for our entire loan portfolio declined by 50 basis points to 6.8% in the third quarter. This was driven by decreases in nearly every asset class, including our multifamily book, where we sold $15 million of delinquent loans at levels in line with our marks from the prior quarter. Over the quarter, we resolved $223 million of nonperforming loans, generating a gain to our prior quarter marks of nearly $15 million. We are excited by the prospect of recycling all of that capital into income-producing assets moving forward.

最後，我們來看看我們的信貸表現。第三季度，我們整個貸款組合的違約率下降了 50 個基點，至 6.8%。這主要是由於幾乎所有資產類別的下降，包括我們的多戶住宅貸款，我們以與上一季相同的價格出售了 1500 萬美元的不良貸款。本季度，我們解決了 2.23 億美元的不良貸款，比上一季的業績增加了近 1,500 萬美元。我們對未來將所有這些資本重新投入到產生收益的資產中的前景感到興奮。

Wrapping up, we're excited about the growth prospects across our business and look forward to sharing our continued progress next quarter.

綜上所述，我們對公司各方面的成長前景感到興奮，並期待在下個季度與大家分享我們所取得的持續進展。

And with that, we'll turn the call over to the operator for questions.

接下來，我們將把電話轉接給接線生，解答大家的問題。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Bose George, KBW.

博斯·喬治，KBW。

(technical difficulty) run rate EAD. Should the starting point be $0.32 where we just basically pulling out that loss provision? And just to be clear, that loss provision is -- since that was already in the mark, that's not having an impact on your book value. Is that right?

（技術難題）運行率 EAD。起始點是否應該設為 0.32 美元，然後基本上扣除損失準備金？需要明確的是，由於損失準備金已計入帳目，因此不會對帳面價值產生影響。是這樣嗎？

Sorry, Bose, we didn't hear the first part of your question. Can you just repeat the question?

抱歉，Bose，我們沒聽清楚你問題的第一部分。您能再說一次問題嗎？

Sure. Yeah, the first part -- actually, the cool question. The first part was the -- when we think about run rate EAD for the company, should the starting point be the $0.32, which is basically the $0.20 after pulling out the loss provision this quarter? And the second part is that loss provision is already reflected in the mark or just confirming that's the case. So there's no book value impact from these loss provisions.

當然。是的，第一部分——實際上，是那個很酷的問題。第一部分是——當我們考慮公司的運作率 EAD 時，起點是否應該是 0.32 美元，也就是本季扣除損失準備金後的 0.20 美元？第二部分是損失準備金已經反映在商標中，或者只是確認情況確實如此。因此，這些損失準備金不會對帳面價值產生影響。

Yeah. Thanks, Bose. So I guess a couple of things. We strip out 100% of the losses in that $0.32 number. This is not a zero loss business. So it's certainly heightened right now, but call it, $0.01 or $0.02 or maybe slightly north of that, certainly not $11. I think if you look at the initiatives Craig spoke to, there's a lot of ROE to be found there, right? And if you look at the lossless DE ROE, it's something like 9%-ish. And then if you look at our dividend yield on book value, it's about 10%. So there's a lot of upside to be found in some of the initiatives Craig spoke to. And you can very, very cleanly bridge the gap between that sort of lossless DE today and where we think we can take DE to and the earnings potential of the portfolio.

是的。謝謝，Bose。所以我想說兩件事。我們從 0.32 美元的數字中剔除了 100% 的損失。這並非零虧損的生意。所以現在價格肯定上漲了，但估計也就 0.01 美元或 0.02 美元，或者略高於這個數字，肯定不會是 11 美元。我認為，如果你看看克雷格提到的那些舉措，你會發現其中蘊含著許多投資報酬率，對吧？如果你看一下無損 DE​​ ROE，它大概在 9% 左右。然後，如果你看一下我們以帳面價值計算的股息殖利率，大約是 10%。因此，克雷格提到的一些舉措確實有很多積極的方面值得關注。而且，您可以非常、非常清晰地彌合當今這種無損失的DE與我們認為DE可以達到的目標以及投資組合的盈利潛力之間的差距。

Okay. Great. That's helpful. And then in terms of incremental capital deployment, you guys -- you noted the $100 million of excess. And how much capital is tied up in the delinquent loans? Like how much could that be in terms of incremental investment?

好的。偉大的。那很有幫助。至於增量資本部署方面，你們提到了1億美元的盈餘。有多少資金被困在了不良貸款中？那相當於多少新增投資呢？

One sec Bose. So I think that could probably be somewhere in the magnitude of like $40 million to $60 million associated with the delinquent loans. And I think I maybe missed part of your previous question. Just to confirm, the losses that are flowing through DE, they've been reflected in book value, in some cases, years ago. We have about -- I think for the quarter, if you look at where it was marked last quarter and then where the asset resolved today, we had about a $15 million gain for the quarter associated with those resolutions. So these are really old news. And in many cases, they're actually positive to book value when they're being resolved.

一秒鐘，Bose。所以我認為，與逾期貸款相關的金額可能在 4,000 萬到 6,000 萬美元之間。我想我可能漏掉了你之前問題的一部分。需要確認的是，DE的虧損在某些情況下，早在幾年前就已經反映在帳面價值上了。我認為，就本季而言，如果你看一下上個季度的標記位置，再看看今天資產的處置位置，我們本季與這些處置相關的收益約為 1500 萬美元。這些都是舊聞了。而且在許多情況下，當這些問題得到解決時，它們實際上會對帳面價值產生積極影響。

Okay. Great. And yes, just on the incremental capital. So $150 million times whatever teens ROE is kind of the way to think about the incremental contribution -- I guess, net of -- on the $100 million net of the cash that you're earning is kind of the --

好的。偉大的。是的，僅指新增資本。所以，1.5億美元乘以任何十幾的ROE（淨資產收益率）就可以大致理解為增量貢獻——我想，淨額是指——在你賺取的1億美元現金淨額基礎上的增量貢獻。--

That's exactly right.

完全正確。

Mikhail Goberman, Citizens JMP Securities.

米哈伊爾·戈伯曼，Citizens JMP Securities。

If I could ask about Lima One, originations were very strong there. What kind of margins are you guys seeing in that portfolio? And do you guys need sort of a higher level of margins to get that mortgage banking income quarterly up from the $5.6 million you did in this quarter to sort of, let's say, a higher single teen million dollar level?

如果我能問到利馬一號的情況，那裡的發源地實力非常強勁。你們在這個投資組合中看到了怎樣的利潤率？你們是否需要更高的利潤率，才能將抵押貸款業務的季度收入從本季的 560 萬美元提高到更高的幾千萬美元水準？

Yeah. In terms of -- I mean, the margins are pretty healthy. So on the short term, you're collecting sort of 1 point to 2 points on origination and then you're additionally getting a servicing strip on the back end. So I think growth there will lead to increased mortgage banking income. On the loan sales related to the rental loans, those sell at generally, say, a 2 to 3.5 point premium. And then we're also collecting origination fees on those loans. So the margins are pretty healthy. I think there's just -- we just need to increase the volume of origination, which would drive that income growth.

是的。就利潤率而言——我的意思是，利潤率相當健康。所以短期內，您在初始階段可以獲得 1 到 2 個積分，然後在後期還會獲得一條服務條。所以我認為那裡的成長將導致抵押貸款銀行收入的增加。與租賃貸款相關的貸款銷售，通常以 2 到 3.5 個百分點的溢價出售。此外，我們也會收取這些貸款的發放費用。所以利潤率相當不錯。我認為我們只需要增加貸款發放量，這將推動收入成長。

And that's ostensibly what the multifamily -- the move into multifamily is going to do, right?

而這表面上就是多戶住宅——搬進多戶住宅——將會達到的目的，對吧？

Right. The multifamily plus the wholesale.

正確的。多戶住宅加上批發。

Right. Great. Maybe if I could ask one more about your Agency MBS capital allocation, how you guys are thinking about what that level might be going forward, what it might grow to?

正確的。偉大的。我可以再問一個關於貴機構抵押貸款支持證券（MBS）資本配置的問題嗎？你們是如何考慮未來的資本配置水平，以及它可能會成長到什麼程度？

Yeah. I mean in terms of the equity allocation, where we are today, we could see some marginal growth as sort of I stated in the prepared remarks, but we don't see it dramatically changing after this additional purchase of $900 million post quarter end.

是的。我的意思是，就股權配置而言，就我們目前的情況來看，我們可能會看到一些小幅增長，正如我在準備好的發言稿中所述，但我們預計在季度末之後追加9億美元的收購後，股權配置不會發生劇烈變化。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Eric Hagen, BTIG.

Eric Hagen，BTIG。

We thought it was a good quarter. The move to get back into multifamily at Lima One, can you say what the levered returns that you're seeing there are? And when you think about the credit box, I mean, have there been any meaningful changes or kind of like edits or tweaks to the credit box? And how you guys are just thinking about like the sustainability of the credit there?

我們認為這是一個不錯的季度。鑑於 Lima One 專案重返多戶住宅市場，您能否透露您看到的槓桿回報率是多少？說到信用額度，我的意思是，信用額度有沒有什麼實質的變化，或者說修改或調整過？你們是如何考慮這種信貸模式的可持續性的？

Sure. I mean in terms of ROEs, we think mid-teens ROEs are achievable. And we also said that we would utilize sort of third-party capital partners as well with that. So we don't necessarily need to take all the loans on our balance sheet. So what really it does do efficiently is help grow sort of the mortgage banking income line down at Lima One. And in terms of the types of assets that we're looking at, really, it's moving somewhat up in market and quality and then thinking more about bridge versus value add.

當然。我的意思是，就投資報酬率而言，我們認為達到十幾個百分點的投資報酬率是可以實現的。我們也說過，我們會利用第三方資本合作夥伴來實現這一目標。因此，我們不一定需要將資產負債表上的所有貸款都納入考慮範圍。所以，它真正有效的作用是幫助利馬一號銀行提升房貸業務的收入。至於我們關注的資產類型，實際上是在向市場和更高品質的方向發展，我們更多地考慮的是過渡性貸款而非增值型貸款。

Okay. That's interesting about the bridge. You guys talked about the agency portfolio. We really like what you guys are doing there. Can you talk about the range for leverage that you guys think you can tolerate in that portfolio? And then on the hedging, I mean, are you using any products which maybe help you better manage the liquidity in that portfolio versus some of the products or the kind of structure that you've operated with in the hedge portfolio in the past?

好的。關於這座橋，這很有意思。你們談到了代理商的作品集。我們非常欣賞你們在那裡所做的事情。你們能談談在這個投資組合中可以容忍的槓桿範圍嗎？那麼關於對沖，我的意思是，您是否使用了一些產品，可以幫助您更好地管理該投資組合的流動性，而不是像您過去在對沖投資組合中使用的某些產品或結構？

So yeah, from a leverage perspective, we're still -- we're not really targeting increasing that leverage. It's still around plus or minus 8. And then in terms of the hedges we use, we use cleared swaps as well as we started using these SOFR futures from ERIS. And they're similar in terms of economics as it relates to the cleared swaps. However, the initial margin is materially lower.

所以，從槓桿角度來看，我們仍然——我們並沒有真正以增加槓桿為目標。誤差仍在正負 8 左右。至於我們使用的對沖工具，我們使用清算互換，並且我們開始使用 ERIS 的 SOFR 期貨。從清算互換的經濟角度來看，它們也很相似。然而，初始利潤率要低得多。

So just as an example, we've added almost $300 million notional of hedges, but we moved some cleared swaps into the SOFR futures, and it reduces the initial margin by, say, $16 million, $17 million, and that can then be redeployed into a mid-teens ROE asset. So if you think about sort of unlocking earnings power of the portfolio, that's about, say, $2 million a year, just moving that. So it's pretty attractive.

舉個例子，我們增加了近 3 億美元的對沖名義金額，但我們將一些清算掉期合約轉移到了 SOFR 期貨，這使得初始保證金減少了 1600 萬美元、1700 萬美元，然後可以將這筆錢重新部署到 ROE 為 15% 的資產中。所以，如果你想釋放投資組合的獲利能力，那大概每年就能增加 200 萬美元，光是轉移這部分資金就夠了。所以它相當有吸引力。

And at this time, there are no further questions. I would like to turn the floor back to Craig Knutson for additional closing remarks.

目前沒有其他問題了。我想把發言權交還給克雷格·克努森，讓他做最後的總結發言。

Thank you, and thank you for your interest in MFA Financial. We look forward to speaking with you again in February when we announce fourth quarter and full year results.

謝謝，也感謝您對MFA Financial的關注。我們期待在二月與您再次溝通，屆時我們將公佈第四季度和全年業績。

Thank you. That does conclude today's teleconference. We thank you for your participation. You may disconnect your lines at this time.

謝謝。今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您可以在此時斷開線路。