西南航空 (LUV) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Southwest Airlines third quarter 2025 conference call. I'm Gary, and I'll be moderating today's call, which is being recorded. A replay will be available on southwest.com in the Investor Relations section. (Operator Instructions)

大家好，歡迎參加西南航空2025年第三季電話會議。我是加里，我將主持今天的電話會議，會議正在錄音中。重播將在 southwest.com 的投資者關係部分提供。（操作員指示）

Now Lauren Yett from Investor Relations, will begin the discussion. Please go ahead, Lauren.

現在，投資者關係部門的 Lauren Yett 將開始討論。請繼續，勞倫。

Thank you. Hello, everyone, and welcome to Southwest Airlines third quarter 2025 earnings call. In just a moment, we will share our prepared remarks, after which we will move into Q&A. I am joined today by our President, CEO and Vice Chairman of the Board, Bob Jordan; Chief Operating Officer, Andrew Watterson; and Chief Financial Officer, Tom Doxey. A quick reminder that we will make forward-looking statements, which are based on our current expectations of future performance, and our actual results could differ materially from expectations.

謝謝。大家好，歡迎參加西南航空 2025 年第三季財報電話會議。稍後我們將分享我們準備好的發言，然後進入問答環節。今天與我一同出席的還有我們的總裁、執行長兼董事會副主席鮑勃·喬丹 (Bob Jordan)、首席營運長安德魯·沃特森 (Andrew Watterson) 和首席財務長湯姆·多克西 (Tom Doxey)。需要提醒的是，我們將做出前瞻性陳述，這些陳述是基於我們目前對未來表現的預期，而我們的實際結果可能與預期有重大差異。

Also, we will reference our non-GAAP results which excludes special items that are called out and reconciled to GAAP results in our earnings press release. Our press release for the third quarter 2025 results and supplemental information, including our initiative highlights, were both issued yesterday afternoon and are available on our investor relations website.

此外，我們將參考我們的非 GAAP 結果，其中不包括在我們的收益新聞稿中被提及並與 GAAP 結果相協調的特殊項目。我們關於 2025 年第三季業績的新聞稿和補充資訊（包括我們的計劃亮點）均於昨天下午發布，並可在我們的投資者關係網站上查閱。

And now I am pleased to turn the call over to you, Bob.

現在我很高興把電話交給你，鮑伯。

Thank you, Lauren, and thanks, everyone, for joining us today. Third quarter was another story of continued strong execution across the board. Operational reliability, cost discipline and the delivery of initiatives against our transformational plan. Southwest continues to transform at a faster pace than ever before, and I'm pleased with the results of our strategic transformation that we saw during the third quarter and the quality of the initiatives delivered. Both costs and revenue finished meaningfully ahead of expectations and the rollout and impact of our initiatives remain firmly on track.

謝謝你，勞倫，也謝謝大家今天加入我們。第三季又是全面且持續強勁執行的又一例證。營運可靠性、成本紀律以及根據我們的轉型計畫實施的措施。西南航空繼續以比以往更快的速度轉型，我對我們在第三季度看到的戰略轉型成果以及所實施舉措的品質感到滿意。成本和收入都遠超預期，我們各項措施的實施和影響也保持穩定。

We began selling assigned an extra legroom seating in July, a major milestone for our customer experience and product changes. The rollout was smooth and while still early, we're right on track with our expectations and we're already seeing a 4 point improvement in customer Net Promoter Score on aircraft with this new configuration. Additionally, we have continued to launch new products and services showing our commitment to meeting the needs of our customers, and our ability to execute quickly. Starting tomorrow, we will be offering free WiFi sponsored by our partner, T-Mobile, for our Rapid Rewards members. We continue to roll out our updated cabins with larger overhead bands in-seat power upgraded lighting and more.

我們從 7 月開始銷售額外腿部空間的座位，這對我們的客戶體驗和產品變化來說是一個重要的里程碑。推出過程很順利，雖然還處於早期階段，但我們已經按照預期進行了，並且我們已經看到採用這種新配置的飛機的客戶淨推薦值提高了 4 個百分點。此外，我們不斷推出新產品和服務，表明我們致力於滿足客戶需求，並具有快速執行的能力。從明天開始，我們將為我們的 Rapid Rewards 會員提供由我們的合作夥伴 T-Mobile 贊助的免費 WiFi。我們將繼續推出升級版的客艙，配備更大的頭頂帶、座椅內電源升級照明等。

We expanded our distribution channels, launching a partnership with Priceline. We launched our new in-house vacation product, Getaways by Southwest. We announced a new partnership with EVA Air to provide customers more connection opportunities. We announced new markets, including the additions of Knoxville, Tennessee, St. Martin, Santa Rosa, California and our first ever flights to Alaska, servicing anchorage all to start in 2026 and we aren't done.

我們擴大了分銷管道，與 Priceline 建立了合作夥伴關係。我們推出了新的內部度假產品「西南航空度假之旅」。我們宣布與長榮航空建立新的合作關係，為客戶提供更多的連結機會。我們宣布了新的市場，包括增加田納西州諾克斯維爾、聖馬丁、加利福尼亞州聖羅莎，以及我們首次飛往阿拉斯加的航班，為安克雷奇提供服務，所有這些都將於 2026 年開始，而且我們還沒有完成。

While we don't have specifics to share today, we're actively looking at continued changes to widen our product offering for our customers, provide additional premium revenue opportunities and further enhance our Rapid Rewards loyalty program and co-brand economics, including things like premium seating, airport lounges and long-haul international destinations served by Southwest Airlines. And our customers are responding to these enhancements.

雖然我們今天沒有具體細節可以分享，但我們正在積極考慮持續的變革，以擴大我們為客戶提供的產品範圍，提供額外的優質收入機會，並進一步增強我們的快速獎勵忠誠度計劃和聯合品牌經濟，包括優質座位、機場休息室和西南航空提供的長途國際目的地等。我們的客戶正在對這些改進做出回應。

Our brand Net Promoter Score has returned to the level seen prior to our policy changes announced in March and we are excited to deliver further enhancements as we improve the customer experience. Our strategic plan continues to progress well, and we're encouraged by the sustained outperformance of bank revenue and the momentum across other key revenue and cost initiatives. We saw a clear positive inflection in the demand environment beginning in early July, which continued throughout the quarter, and we are proud to report record third quarter revenue performance.

我們的品牌淨推薦值已恢復到 3 月宣布的政策變化之前的水平，我們很高興在改善客戶體驗的同時提供進一步的增強。我們的策略計劃繼續進展順利，銀行收入的持續優異表現以及其他關鍵收入和成本舉措的勢頭令我們感到鼓舞。從 7 月初開始，我們看到需求環境出現了明顯的積極變化，這種變化持續了整個季度，我們很自豪地報告第三季度創紀錄的收入表現。

Looking to fourth quarter, we expect to deliver an all-time quarterly record revenue performance. We maintained strong cost discipline across the organization, significantly beating our CASM-X guide for the quarter. We have identified additional cost-saving opportunities in the back half of the year and remain confident in our full year EBIT guidance range of $600 million to $800 million. We are entering the fourth quarter with confidence and anticipate meaningful margin expansion as the benefit from our initiatives continues to mature as we execute our transformational plan. Our people delivered a strong operational performance throughout the quarter.

展望第四季度，我們預計將實現創歷史新高的季度營收業績。我們在整個組織內保持了嚴格的成本紀律，大大超出了本季的 CASM-X 指南。我們已經在下半年發現了額外的成本節約機會，並且對全年息稅前利潤預期範圍 6 億至 8 億美元仍然充滿信心。我們滿懷信心地進入第四季度，並預計利潤率將大幅提升，因為隨著我們實施轉型計劃，我們各項舉措的效益將不斷成熟。我們的員工在整個季度表現出色。

Their dedication, their resilience and the world-class hospitality continue to set Southwest apart. We've made measurable progress across nearly every key operational metrics since January, and we continue to lead the industry as we track our performance against the Wall Street Journal Airline scorecard. These results stand out even more given the hurdles that we faced, including summer weather, ongoing ATC constraints and the full rollout of reduced turn times across many of our stations, and it's a testament to our operational excellence and the heart of our company. While we're not providing 2026 guidance today, we're excited about the opportunities ahead and confident in our strategy. In 2026, we expect to recognize even greater benefits from our portfolio of Southwest specific initiatives, including a full year of revenue from bank fees.

他們的奉獻精神、堅韌不拔的精神和世界一流的服務使西南航空繼續脫穎而出。自一月份以來，我們在幾乎所有關鍵營運指標上都取得了可衡量的進展，並且根據《華爾街日報》航空公司記分卡追蹤我們的表現，我們繼續引領業界。考慮到我們所面臨的障礙，包括夏季天氣、持續的空中交通管制限制以及在許多站點全面縮短轉彎時間，這些結果更加突出，這證明了我們的卓越運營和公司的核心。雖然我們今天沒有提供 2026 年的指導，但我們對未來的機會感到興奮，並對我們的策略充滿信心。2026 年，我們預計將從西南航空的具體措施組合中獲得更大的收益，包括全年的銀行費用收入。

We expect to deliver more than $1 billion of incremental EBIT from assigned an extra legroom seating in 2026 and hit full run rate of approximately $1.5 billion in 2027. We will continue to be disciplined in our cost execution across the organization and expect that momentum to continue into 2026. It's just an exciting time at Southwest Airlines. We're transforming faster than ever before and the momentum is real.

我們預計，到 2026 年，透過分配額外的腿部空間座位，我們將實現超過 10 億美元的增量息稅前利潤，到 2027 年，我們將實現約 15 億美元的全額營運率。我們將繼續嚴格執行整個組織的成本執行，並預計這種勢頭將持續到 2026 年。這是西南航空令人興奮的時刻。我們的轉型速度比以往任何時候都快，而且勢頭是真實的。

And with that, I'll turn it over to Andrew to share more on our revenue and operational performance.

接下來，我將把時間交給安德魯，讓他分享更多有關我們的收入和營運績效的資訊。

Thanks, Bob. I want to echo Bob's appreciation for our people. Their hard work and commitment enabled us to deliver an outstanding operation this quarter even in the face of early July weather challenges. We've come a long way over the past couple of years, working to enhance processes and technology and improve daily operations and better managed disruptions. A great example of this was in September when an external telecommunications issue in Dallas, impacted radar, radio and computer systems, triggering FAA ground stops at local airports.

謝謝，鮑伯。我想贊同鮑伯對我們人民的讚賞。他們的辛勤工作和奉獻精神使我們即使在七月初面臨天氣挑戰的情況下也能在本季度出色地完成工作。在過去的幾年裡，我們取得了長足的進步，致力於改進流程和技術，改善日常營運並更好地管理中斷。一個很好的例子是，9 月達拉斯發生外部電信問題，影響了雷達、無線電和電腦系統，導緻美國聯邦航空管理局 (FAA) 暫停當地機場的運作。

Despite our significant presence at Dallas Love Field Airport, we had just one cancellation, finishing second among all US airlines for the day, including many that weren't directly affected by the issue. Our teams particularly those in the NOC and at the station, responded quickly and effectively, keeping our operations running smoothly and reliably. We know reliability is one of the biggest drivers of customer Net Promoter Scores and a primary driver of loyalty so it's critical that we continue to innovate and invest in both our operations and our people. The demand environment inflected up in early July and sustained momentum throughout the quarter.

儘管我們在達拉斯愛田機場有大量業務，但我們只有一次航班被取消，在當天所有美國航空公司中排名第二，其中包括許多未直接受到該問題影響的航空公司。我們的團隊，特別是國家奧委會和車站的團隊，反應迅速有效，確保我們的營運順利可靠地進行。我們知道可靠性是客戶淨推薦值的最大驅動因素之一，也是忠誠度的主要驅動因素，因此我們必須繼續創新並投資於我們的營運和員工。需求環境在 7 月初出現好轉，並在整個季度保持了良好的勢頭。

The improved demand environment and our execution of our initiatives contributed to our record third quarter revenue and to be in the midpoint of our third quarter guide with RASM coming in at up 0.4%. Even with increased capacity from our strong operational results and our ability to prolong the selling of the 6 2-be-removed seats on our 737-700 aircraft. We were pleased to see load factor up year over year in August, September and so far in October. And corporate travel demand improved sequentially with a particularly strong September where we saw multipoint passenger growth. We're also seeing great traction with our loyalty program and co-brand credit card enhancements, which align with our new product offerings and incentivize everyday spending.

需求環境的改善和我們措施的實施促成了我們第三季創紀錄的收入，並處於第三季指引的中點，RASM 上漲了 0.4%。即使我們強勁的營運業績提高了運力，並且我們有能力延長 737-700 飛機上 6 個可拆除座位的銷售時間。我們很高興看到 8 月份、9 月份以及 10 月份的載客率比去年同期有所上升。商務旅遊需求也隨之改善，9 月尤其強勁，多點旅客數量出現成長。我們的忠誠度計畫和聯名信用卡增強功能也獲得了巨大的吸引力，這與我們的新產品一致，並激勵了日常消費。

Third quarter royalty revenue was up 7% and we saw double-digit growth in co-brand card acquisitions year over year. Our recent 100,000 point promotion saw the highest acquisition activity in over five years, signaling that these enhancements are resonating with customers and driving increased engagement. Looking ahead to the fourth quarter, we expect RASM to be in the range of up 1% to 3%. This outlook assumes the positive inflection in demand we've seen across the industry since early July remains at current levels through the end of the quarter. It also reflects the planned acceleration from our initiatives, the approximate 2 point year over year increase in fourth quarter capacity since July and the recent observed impact of the government shutdown.

第三季特許權使用費收入成長了 7%，聯名卡收購量較去年同期成長了兩位數。我們最近推出的 100,000 點促銷活動創下了五年來的最高紀錄，這表明這些增強功能引起了客戶的共鳴並提高了參與度。展望第四季度，我們預計 RASM 將在 1% 至 3% 的範圍內成長。這一前景假設自 7 月初以來我們看到的整個行業需求的積極變化將在本季度末保持在當前水平。這也反映了我們計劃中的舉措帶來的加速，自 7 月以來第四季度產能同比增長約 2 個百分點，以及最近觀察到的政府關門的影響。

To the extent the demand strengthens beyond current levels, it will provide upside potential to our full year EBIT guide of $600 million to $800 million. We're planning for fourth quarter year over year capacity growth of approximately 6% which compares to a relatively low base in fourth quarter 2024 compared with fourth quarter 2023, plant capacity is up about 1%. This capacity level now contemplates further pushing out the retrofit timing of our entire 737-700 fleet to be completed in January without any impact to the planned operate date for seat assignments and extra legroom seating on January 27. A big shout out goes to our tech ops team for streamlining the time line to complete this work. allowing us to capture additional revenue in those six seats during the entire holiday period at almost no incremental cost.

如果需求超過當前水平，它將為我們的全年息稅前利潤預期（6 億至 8 億美元）提供上行潛力。我們計劃在第四季度產能年增約 6%，相較之下，2024 年第四季的基數相對較低，而 2023 年第四季的工廠產能將成長約 1%。現在，這個容量水準考慮進一步推遲我們整個 737-700 機隊的改裝時間（原定於 1 月完成），而不會對 1 月 27 日的座位分配和額外腿部空間座位的計劃運營日期產生任何影響。非常感謝我們的技術營運團隊簡化了完成這項工作的時間表，讓我們幾乎在不增加成本的情況下，在整個假期期間在這六個席位上獲得額外收入。

On the product side, we launched the sale of assigned an extra legroom seating on July 29. While early bookings are in line with our expectations. We're seeing strong interest from customers and the trends are encouraging, including demand for our new products, fair product buy-up and ancillary seat sales. These offerings are helping us differentiate and enhance our products and drive incremental revenue. We feel confident in our ability to deliver more than $1 billion of incremental EBIT from assigned and extra legroom seating in 2026 and hit full run rate of $1.5 billion in 2027. We're proud of the progress we've made and excited about what's ahead.

在產品方面，我們於7月29日推出了指定額外腿部空間座位的銷售。而提前預訂符合我們的預期。我們看到客戶的濃厚興趣，趨勢令人鼓舞，包括對我們新產品的需求、公平的產品購買和輔助座位銷售。這些產品幫助我們區分和增強我們的產品並增加收入。我們有信心，到 2026 年，我們能夠透過指定座位和額外腿部空間座位實現超過 10 億美元的增量息稅前利潤，到 2027 年，我們能夠實現 15 億美元的全額營運利潤。我們為所取得的進步感到自豪，並對未來充滿期待。

With that, I'll turn it over to Tom.

說完這些，我就把麥克風交給湯姆。

Thanks, Andrew, and hello, everyone. As you've heard from both Bob and Andrew, our initiatives are on track for this year, and we expect further acceleration in contribution from these initiatives into the fourth quarter and into next year according to our plan. As you know, our continued performance on costs is a key element of our transformation, and I am pleased to once again report that we delivered strong cost performance this quarter, with CASM-X coming in at up 2.5%, beating the midpoint of our guide by 2 points, a strong beat with or without the capacity increase we saw in the quarter. We continue to see broad-based cost discipline across the entire business. I should also emphasize that this is more about spending smartly than it is about simply cutting costs.

謝謝，安德魯，大家好。正如鮑勃和安德魯所說，我們的計劃今年進展順利，根據計劃，我們預計這些計劃在第四季度和明年的貢獻將進一步加快。如您所知，我們持續的成本績效是我們轉型的關鍵要素，我很高興再次報告，我們本季度實現了強勁的成本績效，CASM-X 上漲 2.5%，比我們的指導中點高出 2 個百分點，無論本季度是否出現產能增長，這都是一個強勁的增長。我們繼續看到整個企業普遍受到成本控制。我還應該強調的是，這更多的是關於明智消費，而不是簡單地削減成本。

We're simply pushing costs forward as evidenced by the customer, technology and operational investments being made across Southwest Airlines. This was a company-wide effort, and I want to thank our teams for their focus and execution. Looking to the fourth quarter, we are expecting strong continued cost execution with CASM-X up in the range of 1.5% to 2.5% on capacity of approximately 6%, both on a year over year basis. Excluding the impact of expected book gains from fleet transactions in the fourth quarter of both years, which gives a more accurate view of the cost performance of the underlying base business, we expect CASM-X to be in the range of flat to up 1% year over year. Turning to fleet.

我們只是在降低成本，西南航空在客戶、技術和營運方面的投資就證明了這一點。這是全公司的努力，我要感謝我們團隊的專注與執行。展望第四季度，我們預期 CASM-X 的成本執行將持續強勁，年增 1.5% 至 2.5%，產能約為 6%。排除兩年第四季船隊交易預期帳面收益的影響（這可以更準確地反映基礎業務的成本表現），我們預計 CASM-X 的年增幅將在持平至 1% 之間。轉向艦隊。

Boeing continues to hit their delivery plan, and we've increased our 2025 delivery assumptions from 47 to 53 Boeing 737-8 aircraft. We received eight aircraft deliveries in the third quarter and retired 16 aircraft from our fleet, including the sale of one 737-800 aircraft and plan to sell four additional 737-800 aircraft in the fourth quarter. We will continue to be opportunistic as we evaluate potential sale transactions from our existing fleet. We continue to expect full year 2025 capital spending to be in the range of $2.5 billion to $3 billion, which includes the additional aircraft deliveries expected this year as well as the expected proceeds from aircraft sales. We finished the quarter with $3 billion in cash, in line with our liquidity target of $4.5 billion, including our revolver and with a gross leverage ratio of 2.1 times within our target range of 1 to 2.5 times.

波音公司繼續履行其交付計劃，我們將 2025 年的交付量假設從 47 架波音 737-8 飛機提高到 53 架。我們在第三季度接收了 8 架飛機，並從我們的機隊中退役了 16 架飛機，其中包括出售一架 737-800 飛機，並計劃在第四季度再出售 4 架 737-800 飛機。我們將繼續抓住機會，評估現有船隊的潛在銷售交易。我們繼續預期 2025 年全年資本支出將在 25 億至 30 億美元之間，其中包括今年預期的額外飛機交付以及預期的飛機銷售收益。本季末，我們的現金為 30 億美元，符合我們的 45 億美元流動性目標（包括循環信貸），總槓桿率為 2.1 倍，處於我們的 1 至 2.5 倍目標範圍內。

We also executed an accelerated share repurchase program in the amount of $250 million under the previously announced $2 billion authorization. We intend to continue opportunistically repurchasing shares based on market conditions. This reflects our continued confidence in our strategy and our commitment to returning value to shareholders. Overall, our third quarter performance was ahead of our expectations for cost, revenue and net income which is another key milestone as we execute our transformational plan. We're managing costs well, executing our initiatives, investing in our product and customer experience, running an industry-leading operation, maintaining a strong and efficient investment-grade balance sheet, and we remain confident in our ability to achieve our full year EBIT guide of $600 million to $800 million.

我們還根據先前宣布的 20 億美元授權執行了 2.5 億美元的加速股票回購計畫。我們打算根據市場狀況繼續適時回購股票。這體現了我們對我們的策略的持續信心以及我們為股東帶來價值的承諾。總體而言，我們第三季的業績超出了我們對成本、收入和淨收入的預期，這是我們執行轉型計畫的另一個重要里程碑。我們正在妥善管理成本、執行我們的計劃、投資於我們的產品和客戶體驗、營運行業領先、保持強勁高效的投資級資產負債表，並且我們仍然有信心實現全年息稅前利潤目標 6 億至 8 億美元。

And with that, I'll hand it back to Bob.

說完這些，我就把它交還給鮑伯。

Thanks, Tom. As we wrap up, I want to leave you with a few key thoughts. First, the pace of change at Southwest is accelerating and at the same time, our execution has never been stronger. We're transforming our product, enhancing the customer experience and delivering meaningful financial improvement, all thanks to the incredible work of our people.

謝謝，湯姆。在結束演講之前，我想先給你們留下一些關鍵的想法。首先，西南航空的變革步伐正在加快，同時我們的執行力也從未如此強大。我們正在改進我們的產品，提升客戶體驗，並實現有意義的財務改善，這一切都要歸功於員工的出色工作。

Second, we're confident in our ability to hit our fourth quarter and our full year guide. We built a strong foundation, and our initiatives are ramping as planned. The operational rollout of assigned an extra legroom seating has been smooth, and we're seeing encouraging early results. Third, we're not stopping here. We've continued to evolve our product, expand our network and lean into the customer experience. Free WiFi for Rapid Rewards member starts tomorrow.

其次，我們有信心實現第四季和全年的預期目標。我們建立了堅實的基礎，我們的舉措正在按計劃推進。分配額外腿部空間座位的營運推廣進展順利，我們看到了令人鼓舞的早期成果。第三，我們不會就此止步。我們不斷改進產品、擴展網路並專注於客戶體驗。Rapid Rewards 會員可從明天開始免費使用 WiFi。

New markets are launching, and we're building momentum across the business. And while we aren't ready to share specifics just yet, work on the longer-term strategy to meet evolving customer preferences is well underway. Finally, I want to thank our employees once again. Their excellence and hospitality are unmatched, and they are the driving force behind our success. It's a very exciting time at Southwest Airlines.

新市場正在湧現，我們正在為整個業務注入新的動力。雖然我們還沒有準備好分享具體細節，但制定滿足不斷變化的客戶偏好的長期策略的工作正在順利進行中。最後，我要再次感謝我們的員工。他們的卓越和熱情好客無與倫比，他們是我們成功的驅動力。這是西南航空非常令人興奮的時刻。

We're executing with urgency and purpose, and we're confident in the future we're building and the benefit it will provide for our shareholders. Thank you all for joining us today.

我們正在緊急而有目的地執行任務，我們對我們正在建立的未來以及它將為股東帶來的利益充滿信心。感謝大家今天的參與。

And with that, I'll pass it back to Lauren to start our Q&A.

說完這些，我將把它交還給勞倫，開始我們的問答環節。

Thank you, Bob. This completes our prepared remarks. (Event Instructions)

謝謝你，鮑伯。我們的準備好的演講到此結束。（活動須知）

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Conor Cunningham, Melius Research.

康納·坎寧安（Conor Cunningham），Melius Research。

I was hoping you could frame up the sequential improvement that you're seeing into the fourth quarter versus what you were messaging in September. I'm just trying to understand the building box there. I realize that capacity is a little bit higher, but I think you knew that, that was going to be happening. And just if you could just talk about specifically around the new initiatives. Is that still 2 points? And does that carry into the first quarter of next year, just thoughts around the moving parts on unit revenue?

我希望您能夠將第四季度看到的連續改善與您在九月傳達的訊息進行比較。我只是想了解那裡的建築盒子。我知道容量有點高，但我想你知道那將會發生。如果您能具體談談這些新舉措的話。那還是2分嗎？這是否會延續到明年第一季度，只是圍繞著單位收入變動部分的想法？

Yeah, Conor. It's Bob. I'll give it a start. I think it's pretty simple, and it's a couple of things. We have the 2 points of added capacity that you referenced, and that's just delaying the retrofits of the 700s into January that allows us to fly those extra 6 seats through the holidays and just capture extra revenue and peak demand period.

是的，康納。我是鮑伯。我會開始的。我認為這很簡單，只有幾件事。我們有您提到的 2 個額外容量，這只是將 700 的改裝推遲到 1 月份，這使我們能夠在假期期間飛行額外的 6 個座位，並獲得額外的收入和高峰需求期。

Real proud of our tech ops folks because they can get all those retrofits done now in January. So that's the 2 points of capacity. And then we've got two other points and it's -- really, we just chose to not assume that the macro would inflect further from where we are. You heard we had a solid inflection in July that has maintained itself. But we didn't want to assume further macro inflection simply because you've got some uncertainty and in particular, it's uncertainty around the government shutdown its impact and then obviously, it's duration. So we felt it was prudent to guide assuming that things are stable from here, that the demand does not inflect further.

我們為我們的技術營運人員感到驕傲，因為他們可以在一月份完成所有的改造。這就是 2 點容量。然後我們還有另外兩點——實際上，我們只是選擇不假設宏觀經濟會從我們現在的位置進一步轉變。你們已經聽說了，我們在七月份出現了一個強勁的轉折點，並且一直保持著。但我們不想僅僅因為存在一些不確定性就假設宏觀經濟會出現進一步的轉折點，特別是政府關門的不確定性、其影響以及持續時間。因此，我們認為，明智的做法是假設情況從現在開始穩定，需求不會進一步改變。

And then yes, you've got, on the RASM front, you've got a tailwind as the initiatives continue to kick in. All of the initiatives are on track. They're on track from a benefit perspective, they are on track from a timing of delivery perspective. But it's really just those 2 points of not assuming that the macro would continue to inflect further.

是的，在 RASM 方面，隨著各項舉措的持續推進，您已經獲得了順風。所有舉措均按計劃進行。從效益角度來看，他們的進展順利；從交貨時間角度來看，他們的進展也順利。但其實只是這兩點，不假設宏觀經濟會繼續進一步變化。

Yeah. I'd say, Bob, the -- we've seen past government shutdowns, right? And we know what happens when they go on. First, you see government travel -- goes to zero very quickly. Then it goes to government adjacent than overall business travel then leisure travel as we saw in 2018, 2019.

是的。我想說，鮑勃，我們已經看到過去的政府關門事件，對吧？我們知道當他們繼續下去時會發生什麼。首先，你會看到政府旅行很快就降到零。然後是政府相關旅遊，然後是整體商務旅遊，最後是休閒旅遊，正如我們在 2018 年和 2019 年看到的那樣。

Obviously, like everyone else, we experienced, the government stopping travel very quickly. But last week, we did see government adjacent. This is state and local governments, depending upon government reimbursement. These are defense contractors. These are companies that kind of do business with the government and they held up until last week, and they went down sequentially.

顯然，和其他人一樣，我們也經歷了政府迅速停止旅行。但上週，我們確實看到了政府相鄰。這是州和地方政府，取決於政府補償。這些是國防承包商。這些公司與政府有業務往來，直到上週它們還堅守陣地，然後股價就開始連續下跌。

So through that more as a canary in coal mine, it's not material numbers that we're talking about between those two categories that we observed but we know what happens in the future. So if you're uncertain about when the government shut down ends, that makes you less able to assume an economic inflection. And so it all is tied up, I think, when the government shutdown ends.

因此，透過這更像是煤礦中的金絲雀，我們討論的不是我們觀察到的這兩個類別之間的物質數字，而是我們知道未來會發生什麼。因此，如果你不確定政府關門何時結束，那麼你就更難以預測經濟轉折點。所以我認為，當政府關門結束後，一切都會結束。

And Conor, just the last kind of maybe connect your tangent to that is either way, whatever happens to the macro or whatever happens with the shutdown, we're committed to hitting our 2025 reaffirmed EBIT guide. We're not sitting around waiting for the macro to show up as an example. We're going to continue to press on other areas, in particular, costs like you saw with press and beat on CASM-X in Q3 that just add more assurance around meeting that full year guide. So don't -- I wouldn't take that as we're just waiting to see. We're absolutely working proactively put some insurance around the guide irrespective of what the macro does, what the government shutdown does.

康納，最後一種可能與此相關的是，無論宏觀發生什麼，或者關閉發生什麼，我們都致力於達到我們 2025 年重申的 EBIT 指南。我們不會坐等巨集作為範例出現。我們將繼續在其他領域施壓，特別是成本，就像您在第三季的新聞報導和 CASM-X 上看到的那樣，這為滿足全年指導增加了更多保證。所以不要——我不會這麼認為，因為我們只是在等著看。無論宏觀經濟、政府關門造成什麼影響，我們都在積極主動地為指南提供一些保障。

Am I allowed to follow up? Can I just follow up to that? Just on -- so I guess the pushback that I've heard is that basically, you've added 2 points to incremental capacity. And it's basically -- it's almost like that's almost a zero revenue contribution. I mean, you're going to get a natural uplift in overall growth. I just like -- maybe you -- could you just frame up like why was it the right decision to add that incremental growth? I understand that there's a cost benefit. I would have thought costs would have moved down a little bit more. Just how you're balancing that in general on that decision?

我可以跟進嗎？我可以繼續跟進嗎？只是——所以我想我聽到的反對意見基本上是，你已經在增量容量上增加了 2 個點。基本上——這幾乎就像是零收入貢獻。我的意思是，你的整體成長將會自然提升。我只是喜歡——也許你——你能解釋為什麼增加增量成長是正確的決定嗎？我明白這有成本效益。我原本以為成本還會下降一點。您在做出該決定時總體上是如何權衡的？

Sure. I mean, first of all, it's an EBIT guide, not a RASM guide. It did imply a RASM, what you're asking about but the decision, because the tech ops team has been much more productive, we will be doing them faster. So when you do it faster, it overall costs less money and then also that lower number shifts into Q1. And then for the seats, there is incremental and the high periods during the holidays.

當然。我的意思是，首先，它是一份 EBIT 指南，而不是 RASM 指南。它確實暗示了 RASM，這就是您所問的，但由於技術營運團隊的效率更高，因此我們會更快地完成這些決定。因此，當你做得更快時，整體成本就會更低，而且這個較低的數字也會轉移到 Q1。而對於座位而言，假期期間座位數量會增加，高峰期也會增加。

Now we did this late in the curve, so you won't -- the non-holiday portion won't benefit that much. Sot it is very RASM-dilutive, but it's very EBIT accretive because that little bit of revenue plus the cost going down, make it EBIT positive to do that, which is what our guidance is about and what our objective is about is EBIT even though will make RASM look on flattering in Q4. And so that was the decision making behind it.

現在我們在曲線的後期才這樣做，所以你不會——非假期部分不會受益太多。所以它對 RASM 的稀釋作用很大，但對 EBIT 的增值作用很大，因為那一點點收入加上成本下降，使 EBIT 變為正數，這就是我們的指導方針，我們的目標是 EBIT，儘管這會使 RASM 在第四季度看起來不錯。這就是背後的決策。

Mike Linenberg, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的麥克‧林伯格。

Just some questions maybe, Andrew or Tom, just some stats on some of the initiatives, even rough numbers. What we could see in the quarter we did see an inflection on at least connections. It looked like your enplanements outpaced passengers. And presumably, that helped your load factor, which was much better this quarter than where we were in the beginning of the year. And how -- and also on the basic economy rollout, what are you seeing on the buy up? I think there was a point where maybe the majority of Southwest tickets were sold in the bottom fair bucket. I suspect that that's been moving up. Any color or stats that you can provide on some of the initiatives that you put in with respect to those?

也許只是一些問題，安德魯或湯姆，只是一些關於一些舉措的統計數據，甚至是粗略的數字。我們在本季看到，至少在連結方面出現了轉折。看起來登機人數超過了乘客人數。據推測，這有助於提高您的載客率，本季的載客率比年初好得多。以及－在基本經濟推出方面，您看到了怎樣的購買情況？我認為西南航空的大部分機票可能都是在最低票價中售出的。我懷疑這個數字還在不斷上升。您能否提供一些與您提出的這些措施相關的細節或統計數據？

Yeah, I'd be happy to. So yes, as I mentioned in my prepared remarks, we did see, as we had predicted, that load factor would inflect positive post summer. So August, September, October had year over year increases in a load factor that came from the enhanced connectivity we talked about. It came from the third-party channels and also I think some of the basic rollout, which allows you to kind of have a more segmented offering, which means your highs get higher and your lows get lower. So that allows for good targeted volume.

是的，我很樂意。是的，正如我在準備好的演講中提到的那樣，我們確實看到，正如我們所預測的那樣，夏季之後載客率將呈現積極變化。因此，8 月、9 月和 10 月的負載率同比增長，這是由於我們談到的連接性增強所致。它來自第三方管道，而且我認為是一些基本的推出，這讓你能夠提供更細分的產品，這意味著你的高點越來越高，低點越來越低。這樣就可以獲得良好的目標音量。

So we're on track as far as that goes. So switching from yield driving our RASM to load factor driving our RASM, which is kind of what we indicated earlier in the year. As far as the buy-up, the buy up out of the bottom basic, we need that to inflect really positively with seats. In the interim, we have improvements that go about mid-single-digit points of increase in optional buyout, those who decide to buy up to the second, third or fourth, we did see a good traction with that. The big step-up will come in Q1. But in the interim, it is a positive move.

就目前情況而言，我們的進展還算順利。因此，從收益率驅動我們的 RASM 轉變為負載因子驅動我們的 RASM，這正是我們今年早些時候指出的。就買入而言，買入底部基本面，我們需要它對席位產生真正積極的影響。在此期間，我們的可選買斷率有所提高，大約增加了個位數的中段，對於那些決定購買第二、第三或第四份的人來說，我們確實看到了良好的成長勢頭。最大的進步將在第一季出現。但就目前而言，這是一個積極的舉措。

And from a financial standpoint, everything is on track for the initiatives. And so everything that we're seeing for assigned seats and extra legroom is very much on track to -- still relatively early for the late January start for operating that. But all the data that we have so far shows that, that's still on track. And the other suite of initiatives, as Bob said, is also on track.

從財務角度來看，各項舉措均進展順利。因此，我們所看到的有關指定座位和額外腿部空間的一切都進展順利——對於 1 月底開始運營而言，這仍相對較早。但我們目前掌握的所有數據都表明，一切仍在正常進行中。正如鮑伯所說，其他一系列措施也正在按計劃進行。

And if you look sort of getting into maybe granular, what Tom was saying, again, it's early, there are limited bookings in place post January '26 when the -- when bookings started for travel for the new assigned seating extra legroom. But both volume -- the mix of fair products is what Andrew was referencing -- basic should fall further as an example. And then what we're seeing in terms of ancillary seat buy up, all of those things are encouraging and on track. Again, it's early, but I'm really pleased with that. And then again, while we're not literally selling extra legroom for assigned seating.

如果你仔細觀察，你會發現湯姆所說的細節，現在還為時過早，2026 年 1 月之後的預訂數量有限，那時新分配座位和額外腿部空間的旅行預訂已經開始。但作為一個例子，安德魯所指的公平產品組合的基本量應該會進一步下降。然後，我們看到輔助座位購買量的成長，所有這些都令人鼓舞且進展順利。再說一次，雖然還為時過早，但我對此感到非常高興。再說了，我們實際上並不是在為指定座位出售額外的腿部空間。

We're selling it for after January, but we have aircraft out there that have the extra-legroom configuration and folks flying on those aircraft, we have more than 400 converted, are giving us a 4 point higher NPS score than those without and that's without being able to book yourself into extra leg room. That's just they're flying on an aircraft that has that section reconfigured. So that's very encouraging as well from a customer experience perspective.

我們將在一月份之後銷售該配置，但我們有配備額外腿部空間配置的飛機，乘坐這些飛機的乘客（我們有超過 400 名經過改裝的乘客）給我們的 NPS 分數比沒有配備額外腿部空間的乘客高出 4 分。他們只是乘坐了重新配置了該部分的飛機。從客戶體驗的角度來看，這也是非常令人鼓舞的。

And I guess to put an exclamation point to that, Bob, we see literally a knife edge on January 27, in our bookings of pre and post assigned seating, we see a knife edge yield improvement. So clearly, customers are voting with their wallet as well as the surveys that they like assigned seating extra legroom.

我想對此表示驚嘆，鮑勃，我們在 1 月 27 日確實看到了刀刃，在我們預訂前後指定座位時，我們看到了刀刃收益的​​提高。因此，很明顯，顧客們不僅用錢包投票，還在調查中表示他們喜歡指定座位和額外的腿部空間。

And what's great this time around versus bags where we started selling and operating on the same day, and then you were ramping up from then we've been selling the assigned extra legroom since July. So when we hit end of January will effectively be at that run rate.

這次的亮點在於，我們在同一天開始銷售和經營行李箱，然後從那時起就開始加大銷售力度，自 7 月以來，我們一直在銷售指定的額外腿部空間行李箱。因此，當我們到達一月底時，我們的運行率實際上就會達到這個水平。

Savi Syth, Raymond James.

薩維西斯、雷蒙德詹姆斯。

If I might, just on the initiatives and kind of the unit revenue trends ask a little bit of a question on how we should think about as you head into 1Q. Just not assuming any kind of demand environment change just based on that initiative ramp-up and capacity plans. Like how should we think about the progression of year-over-year RASM? I'm not looking for a guide, but just trying to understand kind of the magnitude of how that moves from 4Q to 1Q?

如果可以的話，我想就這些舉措和單位收入趨勢問一個問題，即在進入第一季時我們應該如何思考。只是不要僅根據該計劃的提升和產能計劃就假設任何類型的需求環境都會發生變化。例如，我們該如何看待 RASM 逐年成長的趨勢？我並不是尋求指導，只是想了解從第四季到第一季的變化幅度有多大？

Yeah. So what we have talked about is a $1 billion number for the extra legroom and the seat assignments. And as you think about the other initiatives, by and large, by the time you get to 1Q, those will be approaching run rate. There's some of them that still have some ramp that occurs during the first half of the year. The loyalty program, for example, continues to ramp along with the benefits that come with seating. But I think you can think about it in those terms. We're not guiding 2026 yet, but that $1 billion number that we've talked about for next year and the ability for that to then grow to $1.5 billion as we move to the following year is still very much intact.

是的。因此，我們討論的是增加腿部空間和座位分配的費用為 10 億美元。當您考慮其他舉措時，總的來說，到第一季時，這些舉措將接近運行率。其中一些在上半年仍會出現一些增長。例如，忠誠度計劃隨著座位帶來的福利不斷增加。但我認為你可以從這些方面來考慮這個問題。我們還沒有為 2026 年制定目標，但我們談到的明年 10 億美元的數字以及進入下一年後增長到 15 億美元的能力仍然非常穩固。

And if you look at Q1 capacity, that's already published, now we're not saying it's final, but we know that when we published, we don't move it that much. It's a modest year over year increase. We have not -- we will still be lapping our load factor initiatives that started really in August and beyond. So that will be -- benefit should still carry on into Q1. And as I mentioned, the knife edge improvement yield starting 127 coming from seat fees and buy up to extra higher fare products, those, I think, three combinations of low capacity growth, load factor improvements going and still tracking and extra yield mix for interest in Q1.

如果你看一下 Q1 容量，它已經發布了，現在我們並不是說它是最終的，但我們知道，當我們發佈時，我們不會對其進行太多的移動。與去年同期相比，這是一個適度的增長。我們還沒有——我們仍將執行從 8 月及以後開始的載客率計劃。因此，這種好處應該會持續到第一季。正如我所提到的，刀刃改進收益率從 127 開始，來自座位費和購買額外的高票價產品，我認為這是低容量增長、載客率改進的三種組合，並且仍在跟踪和額外的收益率組合，在第一季度引起了人們的興趣。

Well, yeah, just for full year. I know we're going on a long time about this kind of a combination of what both we're talking about. If you just take the midpoint of our guide that was reaffirmed for EBIT for the year, $600 million to $800 million and then you stack on top of that the $1 billion that Tom referenced around the benefit of assigned seating and extra leg room and then you stack on top of that, the incremental value of a full annualized year of bag fees, which I think is roughly $700 million. And then we have obviously the rewards improvements in a number of other initiatives that are all maturing -- just gives you an idea of kind of the EBIT stack for the -- just sort of the EBIT stack for the year, not trying -- certainly, we're not guiding 2026 today, but it just gives you an idea of how to think basically about that EBIT stack.

嗯，是的，只是全年。我知道我們已經討論了很長一段時間了，討論的是這兩種事物的結合。如果您只取我們指南中重申的年度息稅前利潤的中間值，即 6 億至 8 億美元，然後在此基礎上加上湯姆提到的 10 億美元，用於指定座位和額外腿部空間的福利，然後再在此基礎上加上全年行李費的增量價值，我認為大約是 7 億美元。然後，我們顯然在許多其他正在成熟的舉措中實現了獎勵改進——只是讓您了解一下 EBIT 堆棧——只是今年的 EBIT 堆棧，不是嘗試——當然，我們今天並沒有指導 2026 年，但它只是讓您了解如何基本思考 EBIT 堆棧。

Sheila Kahyaoglu, Jefferies.

Sheila Kahyaoglu，傑富瑞集團。

Maybe if I could ask on -- just if you could fill in the details on the corporate growth, how you're thinking about that filtering into your sales numbers and changes on that growth formula going forward given the set given you're selling forward into January, and you're seeing a knife edge in that yield premium coming through?

也許我可以問一下——如果您可以填寫有關企業成長的詳細信息，您認為這會如何影響您的銷售數字以及未來的成長公式的變化，因為您預計在 1 月份會進行銷售，並且您認為收益率溢價會出現波動嗎？

Yeah. The corporate for the new year is extraordinarily low right now. So I wouldn't give a read into that, I will say, for Q3 corporate sales for future travel kind of excluding the government and inflect it up to plus 5% year over year. So we're seeing corporates improving. Our trip growth was down, as I said, we shrink trips where our competitors increased.

是的。現在新年公司的氣氛異常低落。因此，我不會對此進行解讀，我會說，對於第三季的未來旅行企業銷售額（不包括政府），其年成長率為 5%。因此，我們看到企業正在改善。正如我所說，我們的旅行成長下降了，我們減少了競爭對手增加的旅行數量。

So normally, since corporate is schedule-sensitive, not price sensitive, that should have led to kind of a reduction in share and we didn't necessarily see that. And so we see good solid trends with demand for Southwest business. But we expect, as you hint that in Q1 with assigned seating, that will unlock additional growth. Right now, through various different measures, we think our domestic managed business share is in the mid-teens, which is below our overall capacity share. And we think extra legroom assigned seating should give us tailwinds in our corporate share, and that is not to quantify the numbers that we just gave you.

因此，通常情況下，由於企業對時間表敏感，而不是對價格敏感，這應該會導致份額減少，但我們不一定會看到這種情況。因此，我們看到西南航空業務需求呈現良好且穩健的趨勢。但我們預計，正如您所暗示的，在第一季度，透過指定座位，這將帶來額外的成長。目前，透過各種不同的衡量標準，我們認為我們的國內管理業務份額處於十幾歲左右，低於我們的整體運力份額。我們認為，分配有額外腿部空間的座位應該會為我們的企業份額帶來順風，這並不是量化我們剛剛給您的數字。

Jamie Baker, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的傑米貝克。

So I suppose the definition of sell-side and sanity is asking the same question over and over and expecting a different response, but here it goes. Fourth quarter RASM guide, up 2% at the midpoint. But all of the tactical improvements, the bank fees, royalties and flight credit noise, that's what, 8 points of benefit. So that suggests RASM at your core. So excluding the good stuff, is down mid-single digits. Why is this not the right way to think about it that the core is deteriorating, but new initiatives are making up for now. But of course, that could prove challenging when you begin to anniversary those initiatives.

所以我認為賣方和理智的定義就是一遍又一遍地問同樣的問題並期待不同的答案，但事實就是如此。第四季 RASM 指南，中點上漲 2%。但所有的戰術改進、銀行費用、版稅和飛行信用噪音，這就是 8 點的好處。所以這顯示 RASM 是核心。因此，除去好東西，下降幅度在個位數左右。為什麼這不是正確的思考方式：核心正在惡化，但新的舉措正在彌補。但當然，當你開始紀念這些舉措時，這可能會很有挑戰性。

Yeah, I don't know where you're getting the 8, Jamie. I apologize not following your math. You did mention the flight credits. The way the flight credit breakage works is that when customers cancel flight it drops to a residual travel fund than those break prospectively. So the breakage rate changing is not something that you kind of will see changing until next year.

是的，我不知道你從哪裡得到 8，傑米。很抱歉我沒有理解你的數學。您確實提到了飛行積分。航班積分中斷的運作方式是，當客戶取消航班時，其積分將下降到剩餘旅行基金，而不是預期中斷的積分。因此，破損率的變化要到明年才會發生。

So we expect 2026 to have -- to show breakage benefits from the change in policies. So that one is coming. But the bag fees, obviously, are a, let's call it, a 3 point benefit year over year. Sequential, it's less than one because most of the policy was already in place for Q3. We do have on a year over year basis, if you're doing that our stages engage is growing year over year, whereas our competitors, that's going down as they restore regional. So that's about a 2 point headwind for RASM, if you did normal stage length adjusting. So I'm just not getting your 8 -- kind of walk us on it, maybe we can answer it.

因此，我們預期 2026 年將會顯示出政策改變所帶來的利益。所以那個即將到來。但顯然，行李費每年都會帶來 3 點好處。連續的，它少於一個，因為大多數政策已經在第三季度實施。我們確實在逐年成長，如果你這樣做的話，我們的舞台參與度會逐年增長，而我們的競爭對手則會隨著區域恢復而下降。因此，如果您進行正常的階段長度調整，那麼 RASM 的逆風約為 2 點。所以我只是不明白你的問題——請告訴我們，也許我們可以回答。

Well, let me ask it differently. In the fourth quarter guide, how much -- what is your initiative RASM then? And if we take -- so whatever your answer is, maybe it's plus 3, maybe plus 11. I mean it's not going to be. But whatever the initiative-related RASM contribution is, shouldn't we think of the difference relative to the 2% midpoint as the core and is that deteriorating?

好吧，讓我換個問法。在第四季指南中，您的主動 RASM 是多少？如果我們採取──那麼無論你的答案是什麼，也許是加 3，也許是加 11。我的意思是這不會發生。但無論與倡議相關的 RASM 貢獻是多少，我們不應該將相對於 2% 中點的差異視為核心，而這種差異是否正在惡化？

I think if we look at -- I'm not sure maybe Tom can help with the initiative stuff. But if you look at other domestic main cabin, which is clearly not their strongest, our -- you look at us as a proxy for a pure-play domestic main cabin, we see sequential improvement and theirs doesn't necessarily imply that either. And we see -- as far as the core, if you look at our core customers, as we mentioned, we see our credit card applications have accelerated with the new products and the new features. We're seeing Rapid Reward sign-ups accelerate and we're seeing the kind of our Road Warrior travel also improved.

我認為如果我們看一下——我不確定湯姆是否能幫助完成主動性的事情。但如果你看看其他國內主艙，這顯然不是他們最強的，你把我們看作純粹的國內主艙的代表，我們看到了連續的改善，而他們的改善並不一定意味著這一點。就核心而言，如果您看看我們的核心客戶，正如我們所提到的，我們會發現我們的信用卡應用程式隨著新產品和新功能的推出而加速發展。我們看到快速獎勵註冊量正在加速成長，我們的 Road Warrior 旅行類型也在改善。

So our core customers are responding back. Our brand -- our Net Promoter Scores from our customers did dip post your conference and kind of went to the bottom in June and now have returned to where they were pre year conferences. So all the kind of tail, tail signs on the micro level show our customers increasingly engage increasingly using Southwest Airlines, whether it's a credit card or -- are traveling with us. So we see good trends in the core.

因此我們的核心客戶正在做出回應。我們的品牌－來自客戶的淨推薦值在您的會議之後確實有所下降，並在六月跌至谷底，現在已恢復到年會前的水平。因此，微觀層面上的所有尾部跡像都表明，我們的客戶越來越多地使用西南航空，無論是信用卡還是與我們一起旅行。因此我們看到核心的良好趨勢。

And maybe what I'd add there, Jamie, as well, is as far as where you draw the line between an initiative versus the base business is not always a clear line. We knew as we announced actually at your conference, several of these initiatives, there would be an offset. And so as we guided these things, we guided them and we gave estimates for some of them, we guided those or gave those estimates as a net. And so it's not always a clear line on where you drop between base business or the initiatives.

也許我還要補充一點，傑米，就計劃和基礎業務之間的界限而言，並不總是一條清晰的界線。我們知道，正如我們在會議上宣布的那樣，其中幾項舉措將會得到抵消。因此，當我們指導這些事情時，我們對它們進行了指導，並對其中一些進行了估計，我們指導了這些事情或將這些估計值作為淨值。因此，基礎業務和計劃之間的界限並不總是很明確。

And then a quick second one for Bob. And thank you for all that color, by the way. So in that lounge survey that you sent around, Southwest used the word hub for what I think might be the first time in history and correct me if I'm wrong. What do you consider your hubs to be? I mean, I guess I could just look at some base level of departures, but that doesn't necessarily speak to connectivity.

然後鮑伯又快速地完成了第二個動作。順便說一句，謝謝你帶來的所有色彩。因此，在您發送的休息室調查中，西南航空使用了“樞紐”一詞，我認為這可能是歷史上的第一次，如果我錯了，請糾正我。您認為您的中心是什麼？我的意思是，我想我可以只看一些基本水準的出發，但這並不一定說明連結性。

Yeah, I think that -- it's just -- it's more choice rather than intended to imply some kind of strategy change or change the way we think about cities. We have -- depending on how you count them, we have roughly 15 to 17, what we call, mega cities and they do some things that traditional hubs do. They have what we call intentional connections or banking opportunities throughout the day they are not full banks, but they also have a lot of banking of aircraft activity. And again, those additional connections are just to drive connectivity across the network. So I wouldn't confuse that word choice as any change in Southwest Airlines network strategy.

是的，我認為——這只是——它更多的是一種選擇，而不是暗示某種戰略變化或改變我們對城市的看法。我們有——取決於你如何計算，我們有大約 15 到 17 個我們稱之為特大城市的城市，它們做一些傳統樞紐所做的事情。他們擁有我們所說的全天有意連接或銀行業務機會，他們不是全銀行，但他們也擁有大量的飛機銀行業務活動。再次強調，這些額外的連結只是為了推動整個網路的連結。因此，我不會將這個詞的選擇與西南航空網路策略的任何變化混淆。

Now back to the survey. Obviously, if we were to choose to go forward with lounges and we've been talking about where do we go next strategically to continue to widen our offering for our customers to continue to widen our offering of things that they desire in particular premium and then how do we do all that to impact the economics of the Rapid Rewards program and the co-brand card, we're looking at what would our customers want in a lounge, where would those lounges be located relative to where we have strong passenger strength and demand. So that's really what it was about. And we're hopeful to -- and again, this work is not just thinking about it. There's active work in terms of developing the next strategy. And I'm hopeful to be able to lay parts of that out early in 2026.

現在回到調查。顯然，如果我們選擇繼續開設休息室，我們一直在討論下一步的戰略方向，繼續擴大我們為客戶提供的服務範圍，繼續擴大他們所希望的特別是高端產品，然後我們如何做才能影響快速獎勵計劃和聯合品牌卡的經濟效益，我們正在考慮我們的客戶在休息室裡想要什麼，這些休息室應該設在哪裡，相對於我們擁有強大乘客力量和需求的地方。這就是事情的真正意義。而我們充滿希望——再說一次，這項工作不僅僅是思考而已。我們正在積極制定下一步戰略。我希望能夠在 2026 年初制定出其中的部分計畫。

I think, Bob, to put a point on that. If you -- domestic RASM, if you index that to 2018, we're getting very close to our competitors here in Q3 and Q4 may close the gap. But what we have still a gap is the other revenue -- is our credit card hasn't done as well as others in recent times. Credit cards, these days, you've probably seen from your own bank and from other newspapers that it's driven by high end, high fee credit cards that come with lounge access. So our gap and RASM is turning into now more other revenue driven by high-end credit cards that is what drives us to look at it as well as the customer desires that Bob talked about.

鮑勃，我認為應該強調這一點。如果您 - 國內 RASM，如果您將其指數化到 2018 年，我們將在第三季度非常接近我們的競爭對手，而第四季度可能會縮小差距。但我們在其他收入方面仍然存在差距——我們的信用卡近期表現不如其他信用卡。如今，您可能已經從自己的銀行和其他報紙上看到，信用卡的流行是由附帶休息室使用權的高端、高費用信用卡推動的。因此，我們的差距和 RASM 現在正在轉變為由高端信用卡驅動的其他收入，這促使我們關注它以及 Bob 談到的客戶需求。

Catherine O'Brien, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的凱瑟琳·奧布萊恩。

Maybe just a quick first one on a shareholder returns. Can you walk us through how you think about the guardrails to shareholder returns? You're within your 1 to 2.5 times leverage target, 2.1 times at the end of 3Q. How much headroom do you want to leave yourself on the high end of that leverage target, given there's still some uncertainty out there? I do have one quick follow-up.

也許只是關於股東回報的第一個簡短介紹。您能否向我們介紹一下您對股東回報的保障措施的看法？您的槓桿率目標在 1 至 2.5 倍之間，第三季末為 2.1 倍。考慮到仍然存在一些不確定性，您希望在槓桿目標的高端留出多少空間？我確實有一個快速的後續問題。

Yeah. Thanks for the question, Catie. Yes, as we look at that, it is, I think, important to us that we do leave a little bit of headroom there, knowing that there's some uncertainty out there. And so as we look at that range of the 1 to 2 to 2.5, we continue to believe that keeps us squarely in the investment grade and strongly within investment grade. And then we've got the $3 billion plus $1.5 billion revolver liquidity target as well, which we were right on for the quarter. And so as we think of shareholder returns, it's about ensuring that we're staying within those guardrails. And then as we look at the variability that might be there within the guide that we leave room to stay within that under those different scenarios.

是的。謝謝你的提問，凱蒂。是的，當我們考慮這個問題時，我認為，對我們來說重要的是我們確實留出一點空間，因為我們知道那裡存在一些不確定性。因此，當我們觀察 1 到 2 到 2.5 的範圍時，我們仍然相信這會讓我們保持投資等級並且保持在強勁的投資等級內。然後，我們也設定了 30 億美元加上 15 億美元的循環信貸流動性目標，而本季我們正好實現了這個目標。因此，當我們考慮股東回報時，我們要確保我們遵守這些規定。然後，當我們查看指南中可能存在的可變性時，我們會留出在不同情況下保持可變性的空間。

Okay. Great. And then I had to laugh at Jamie's cell site insanity, I'm going to keep going on in the past, so forgive me. But I just -- I think it just may be helpful to understand a little bit more as we think about next year and the initiative ramp this year. And so maybe just a question on the EBIT target rather than RASM super specifically.

好的。偉大的。然後我不得不嘲笑傑米的手機網站瘋狂行為，我將繼續講述過去，所以請原諒我。但我只是——我認為當我們考慮明年和今年的舉措時，了解更多可能會有所幫助。因此，這可能只是關於 EBIT 目標而不是 RASM 超級的具體問題。

You reiterated your EBIT target from last quarter, but fuel is down a bit and capacity is a bit higher. Are you able to share the EBIT contribution from the initiatives that you already booked in the third quarter? And then what you're incorporating in fourth quarter? And how much of that fourth quarter figure is already on the books?

您重申了上個季度的息稅前利潤目標，但燃料略有下降，而運力略有上升。您能否分享一下您在第三季已經預訂的計劃所帶來的息稅前利潤貢獻？那麼第四季你們計劃採取什麼措施？那麼第四季的數字中有多少已經記錄在案？

Thanks, Catie. Yeah, I don't know that we'll go into that level of detail with it. I think Bob laid it out pretty well as far as the initiatives that we have this year and the increment that we expect to see next year.

謝謝，凱蒂。是的，我不知道我們是否會深入討論這個問題。我認為鮑伯很好地闡述了我們今年的舉措以及我們預計明年的成長。

Yeah. I think you can think of the -- I believe the bag -- the largest, of course, right now is bag fees and that sequential incremental improvement from third quarter to the fourth quarter's contribution is about 1 point or maybe a little bit less than one point. Obviously, as you get into 2026, all of the EBIT associated with assigned seating extra legroom is fully -- there's nothing today. It's a fully 2026 value then wraps to $1.5 billion in 2027 as it matures. You've got some smaller things, as Andrew talked about, the Rapid Rewards optimization, flight credits, which that will come home as they break, which tends to be later. But yes, we'll lay all that out as we stack up the EBIT guide for 2026, we're just not ready to do that today.

是的。我想你可以想到——我相信袋子——當然，目前最大的貢獻是袋子費用，從第三季到第四季的連續增量改善貢獻約為 1 個百分點，或者可能略低於 1 個百分點。顯然，進入 2026 年，與指定座位額外腿部空間相關的所有息稅前利潤都將完全消失——目前沒有任何收入。該價值為 2026 年的全部價值，到 2027 年到期時將達到 15 億美元。正如安德魯 (Andrew) 所說，您有一些較小的事情，例如快速獎勵優化、航班積分，這些會在他們休息時回來，這往往會在稍後發生。但是的，我們會在製定 2026 年息稅前利潤指南時列出所有這些內容，只是我們今天還沒有準備好這樣做。

And there's, of course, the continued cost savings as well. I think your question was a little more focused on the revenue-related initiatives, but we've got the cost initiative that will continue to ramp up and is also on track for next year.

當然，還可以持續節省成本。我認為您的問題更集中在與收入相關的舉措上，但我們已製定了成本舉措，該舉措將繼續加強，並且明年也將步入正軌。

Brandon Oglenski, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的布蘭登‧奧格倫斯基。

And Tom, maybe I'll just follow up there. You guys did reiterate $4.3 billion, I think, in total initiatives next year, but you guys keep talking about the $1 billion from assigned seat and premium. I get that. So maybe can you talk to the totality of the $4.3 billion, is that still valid? And I want to keep it to one question, but I guess two parts here. Can you give us a better understanding of how the buyout process is working today in the fourth quarter? And then how that potentially changes from like a basic fare to plus fair just based on seat assignments and premium availability?

湯姆，也許我會跟進。我認為，你們確實重申了明年總計 43 億美元的計劃，但你們一直在談論來自指定座位和高級座位的 10 億美元。我明白。那麼，您能否談談 43 億美元的總額，這仍然有效嗎？我想將其保留為一個問題，但我想這裡有兩個部分。您能否讓我們更了解第四季的收購流程是如何進行的？那麼，僅根據座位分配和高級機票供應情況，票價如何從基本票價變為更優惠的票價呢？

Thanks, Brandon. I'll start and then Andrew will take the second part of your question. The $4.3 million is very much still intact. We've talked about $780 million-or-so in cost savings. We've talked about $1 billion that would come from bags.

謝謝，布蘭登。我先開始，然後安德魯將回答你問題的第二部分。這 430 萬美元基本上還完好無損。我們已經談到了約 7.8 億美元的成本節省。我們討論過從袋子中獲取 10 億美元的收入。

We've talked about $1 billion that would come from extra legroom and seat assignments, which will start operating in January. We've got the earn and burn on the frequent flyer. We've got the amendments that we've made and the enhancements that we've made to the Chase program, all of these things stack together. And what's great is we're seeing these continue to be on track as we're ramping through this year and especially as we get into the fourth quarter and into the first quarter of next year, as you see these continue to ramp. So yes, very much still intact for the $4.3 billion.

我們已經討論過 10 億美元將用於增加腿部空間和座位分配，這些措施將於明年 1 月開始實施。我們已經獲得了常旅客的收入和支出。我們對大通計劃進行了修改和改進，所有這些事情都疊加在一起。令人高興的是，我們看到這些業務在今年繼續保持正軌，特別是當我們進入第四季度和明年第一季時，你會看到這些業務繼續成長。所以，是的，這 43 億美元基本上仍然完好無損。

And as far as the bio process goes, right now, the buyout process is mostly about flexibility. Going from basic to choice, the primary differences or flexibility and Rapid Rewards accrual that kind of entice customers to buy up the very highest kind of entry fares are no longer basic. So if you think about a $350 fare as an entry point for flight, that's not basic because it's a pretty high fare to be basic. And so all that to say that about 80% of our tickets were want to get away last year and a little bit less than 50% are buying basic. A portion of the remainder are people who have choices like a stand-alone, that's the first entry point for them.

就生物流程而言，目前，收購流程主要涉及靈活性。從基本到選擇，主要的區別或靈活性和快速獎勵累積，吸引顧客購買最高類型的入場票價不再是基本的。因此，如果您將 350 美元的票價視為航班的入門價，那麼這並不是基本票價，因為對於基本票價而言，這是一個相當高的票價。總而言之，去年我們購買的機票中約有 80% 是出遊票，而略低於 50% 的機票是購買基本票。剩下的一部分有獨立選擇，這是他們的第一個切入點。

And then you have, as I mentioned, a mid-single-digit composition increase of those who voluntary who presented with a low fare and can buy up for the additional features, those is a mid-single-digit increase right now. Now we go into next year with seat assignments, that is much bigger. The booking curve is such that people buy early or generally less elastic. As the booking growth go goes along, you have more elastic demand at the end, it's also again inelastic. And so right now, we're seeing strong buy-up and fare products in the kind of Q1 period with seat assignments.

然後，正如我所提到的那樣，自願以低票價購買附加服務的乘客數量將出現中等個位數的增長，目前，這一數字已經達到了中等個位數的增長。現在我們進入明年的座位分配階段，規模要大得多。預訂曲線是這樣的，人們提前購買或通常不太有彈性。隨著預訂量不斷增長，最終需求會變得更加有彈性，但同時也會變得缺乏彈性。因此，目前，我們看到第一季座位分配的購買和票價產品表現強勁。

We expect, as we get into the meat of the booking curve for Q1 that we have more and more seat only sales that people add in as well. So that composition will mix a little bit. But given the different entry points customers and have into it is all about giving choice as our fair product indicates and that's led to, as I said, a quite strong increase in yields this part of the booking curve.

我們預計，隨著我們進入第一季預訂曲線的核心階段，我們將擁有越來越多的純座位銷售。因此該成分會混合一點。但考慮到客戶的不同切入點，正如我們的公平產品所示，這一切都是為了提供選擇，正如我所說的，這導致了預訂曲線這一部分的收益率大幅增長。

Well, I think the other thing to note, I know we've said many, many times, is -- there are so many transformational initiatives that are underway. And between what we laid out in September, a little more than a year ago, what we laid out in March, all of that stuff is complete. The only thing that is still to come home is the operation of assigned seats, but we're selling those, and that huge change has been really, really smooth. So number one, everything that we laid out as a contributing initiative is done.

嗯，我認為另一件需要注意的事情，我知道我們已經說過很多次了，那就是——有很多轉型舉措正在進行中。我們在一年多前九月份制定的計劃和我們在三月制定的計劃之間，所有這些東西都已經完成了。唯一尚未實現的是指定座位的運營，但我們正在銷售這些座位，而且這一巨大的變化進行得非常非常順利。因此，首先，我們所製定的所有貢獻措施都已完成。

Second, they're done as in high-quality, ready to go and on time and is expected to or already showing signs that is contributing the value that was expected or in the case of bags even greater. So you've got initiatives on time, they'll start as planned, and they are in line right now to deliver the value that we expect as we have high confidence in both the -- in both that total value of EBIT to be delivered through initiatives and then our EBIT guide in the fourth quarter of this year and for the full year and then our -- the EBIT guide that we'll put in front of you in 2026. But the -- I mean, the execution of all this has just been stellar.

其次，它們質量上乘，隨時可用，按時完成，並且有望或已經顯示出為客戶帶來預期價值的跡象，或者在包裝袋的情況下，其價值甚至更大。因此，您已按時制定計劃，它們將按計劃啟動，並且現在它們正在按計劃提供我們期望的價值，因為我們對透過這些計劃實現的息稅前利潤 (EBIT) 總價值以及今年第四季度和全年的息稅前利潤 (EBIT) 指南以及我們將在 2026 年向您提供的息稅前利潤 (EBIT) 指南都充滿信心。但是——我的意思是，所有這一切的執行都非常出色。

Duane Pfennigwerth, Evercore ISI.

杜安‧芬尼格沃斯 (Duane Pfennigwerth)，Evercore ISI。

I'm going to keep it to one, I think we're struggling a little bit with that request. So anyway, I assume some of these initiatives have a learning curve associated with them from a revenue management perspective. And I wonder if you have any anecdotes about early learnings or tweaks you have made since the early rollout? Maybe some of these items were disruptive initially but are settling down as we get more fully baked into the booking curve?

我將只保留一個，我認為我們對這個請求有點困難。所以無論如何，我認為從收入管理的角度來看，其中一些措施具有相關的學習曲線。我想知道您是否有關於早期學習或自早期推出以來所做的調整的軼事？也許其中一些項目最初會造成乾擾，但隨著我們更全面地了解預訂曲線，這些幹擾就會逐漸平息？

Certainly, I think Tom made a good contrast of bags and basic was kind of all at once because you started selling operating right away, whereas assigned seats, we have a long run out to it. So we mentioned last time that we saw a customer reaction to back to basic, which affected the third quarter by 1 point. That since has been resolved, and that basically comes down to -- you have a much wider set of price points. As an earlier question implied, the number of people who buying just your lowest entry point used to be so high and now it's a lot wider. And so you did see different reactions from customers in June and July as they've learned it, we saw that stabilize by mid-July, and the customers are kind of buying life normal, if you will, for that.

當然，我認為湯姆對行李和基本行李進行了很好的對比，因為你馬上就開始銷售，而指定的座位，我們還需要很長時間才能完成。所以我們上次提到，我們看到了客戶對回歸基礎的反應，這對第三季產生了 1 個百分點的影響。這個問題已經解決，基本上可以歸結為——你擁有更廣泛的價格點。正如先前的問題所暗示的，過去購買最低入門價的人數非常多，而現在這個數字更加廣泛了。因此，您確實看到了 6 月和 7 月客戶在了解情況後的反應不同，我們看到到 7 月中旬情況趨於穩定，客戶會開始正常購買商品。

For -- so I consider all the revenue management stuff doing very well on that. And then for Q1, we have a long run up. And so the tweaks are small in nature as you're looking at who buys a seat only, who buys the biops, tweaking those, high-demand, low-demand flights. We have a long runway to do that. So we feel very comfortable about how that's going. Now there still is an overall ramp-up in that -- in my prepared remarks, I told you that the '26 number, the '27 number, the difference is an implied ramp-up in and the value. So to the extent we go faster, obviously, the number gets bigger next year.

對於——所以我認為所有的收入管理工作都做得很好。對於第一季度，我們有一個長期的成長。因此，這些調整本質上是很小的，因為你只專注於誰購買座位，誰購買生物檢測，調整那些高需求和低需求的航班。我們還有很長的路要走來實現這個目標。因此，我們對事情的進展感到非常滿意。現在，總體上仍然在上升——在我準備好的發言中，我告訴過你們，26 年的數字和 27 年的數字之間的差異是隱含的上升和價值的增加。因此，隨著我們步伐的加快，顯然明年的數字會更大。

Yeah. I think that's a really important point is that the -- Andrew, I don't want to -- sorry to just to say the same thing you just did, but I want to make sure everybody hears that, that the $1 billion contribution from assigned seat extra legroom next year contemplates time to do exactly what you said, which is ramp up the value. Some of these things like seats are dynamically priced, learn, tweak and so the $1 billion contemplates a ramp-up time. versus we've got a guide for EBIT for that initiative and there's risk because there's going to be ramp up. We've actually -- that's contemplated in the value that we've given you.

是的。我認為非常重要的一點是——安德魯，我不想——抱歉，只是重複你剛才說的話，但我想確保每個人都聽到，明年從指定座位額外腿部空間中貢獻的 10 億美元正在考慮時間來完成你所說的工作，即提高價值。有些東西，例如座位，是動態定價的，需要學習、調整，因此 10 億美元要考慮一個上升時間。相較之下，我們已經為該計劃制定了息稅前利潤指南，而且由於需要增加，因此存在風險。事實上，我們已經考慮到了我們給予您的價值。

Chris Stathoulopoulos, SIG.

Chris Stathoulopoulos，SIG。

I'm going to be compliant as well here and keep it to one. United gave a CASM-X algo last week over the midterm to help us think about all the moving pieces here as it relates to capacity and their investment here in the product and other areas here. So I realize you're still in your budgeting plan for next year, but any thoughts on how we should frame that, whether you want to describe that as your mid- to long-term algo versus what you've given, I guess, your guide on low single-digit capacity over the midterm. Just wanted to understand the moving pieces around that, and I think we can all do the math on the EBIT side and what that might mean for unit margins and things like RASM?

我在這裡也會遵守規定並將其保持在一個水平。美聯航上週在中期選舉中給出了 CASM-X 演算法，以幫助我們思考與運力以及他們在產品和其他領域的投資相關的所有變動因素。所以我知道你仍在製定明年的預算計劃，但對於我們應該如何制定這個計劃，你有什麼想法嗎？你是否想將其描述為你的中期到長期演算法，還是你給出的，我想，你的中期低個位數容量指南。只是想了解其中的動態部分，我認為我們都可以在息稅前利潤方面進行計算，這對單位利潤率和 RASM 等意味著什麼？

You're right that we're still working through the planning process for 2026. So at our next call, we'll have more detail on next year. What you've seen from us is strong cost performance quarter after quarter, a strong beat this last quarter with or without the incremental capacity that came from operating the 700 seats, it was broad-based. There's work that we're doing on small things and discretionary spending. There's things we're doing on large things around supply chain and optimizing our retirement plan and the component maintenance work that goes along with that, the way we're looking at real estate and technology.

您說得對，我們仍在製定 2026 年的規劃。因此，在下次電話會議上，我們將提供有關明年的更多詳細資訊。您從我們這裡看到的是，每個季度都表現出色，成本表現強勁，上個季度的表現非常出色，無論有沒有 700 個座位運營帶來的增量容量，它都是廣泛的。我們正在針對小事和可自由支配的開支做一些工作。我們正在圍繞供應鏈開展大規模工作，優化我們的退休計畫以及隨之而來的組件維護工作，我們也正在關注房地產和技術。

So we're looking everywhere. And we've talked about being on track this year, next year and to the $1 billion in 2027 for the cost savings initiatives that we have, and that will roll in and again, we'll put that into the context of 2026 at our next call.

所以我們到處尋找。我們已經討論過今年、明年以及 2027 年 10 億美元的成本節約計劃，這些計劃將會陸續到位，我們會在下次電話會議上將其納入 2026 年的背景中。

Scott Group, Wolfe Research.

斯科特集團、沃爾夫研究公司。

So when I think about the $1.8 billion of initiatives this year. The guide has $300 million of incremental EBIT. So call it, $1.5 billion gap. Like do you think we should contemplate something similar next year with a sizable gap between the initiatives and the actual EBIT? Or I mean, is there a reason to think the gap widen is there -- could the gap potentially go away? I guess you're not ready to give '26 guidance, but just at a high level, like how do you think about like that gap and how that develops into next year?

所以當我想到今年 18 億美元的計畫時。該指南有 3 億美元的增量息稅前利潤。可以這麼說，差距是 15 億美元。例如，您是否認為明年我們應該考慮類似的事情，因為這些舉措和實際息稅前利潤之間存在相當大的差距？或者我的意思是，是否有理由認為差距會擴大——差距有可能消失嗎？我猜您還沒有準備好給出 26 條指導，但只是從高層次上講，您如何看待這種差距以及這種差距在明年將如何發展？

Yeah, Scott, you're right. We're not ready to guide 2026. The gap is simply the macro and what happens to the macro inflection like we talked in Q2. And we were down sort of from where we thought the beginning of the year, we would be down roughly 6 points. We've seen, obviously, some of that come back. And it's -- I think absent maybe the uncertainty of the shutdown impact, there would be more certainty that continue to macroeconomic inflection would continue.

是的，斯科特，你是對的。我們還沒準備好引領 2026 年。差距只是宏觀的，以及宏觀拐點會發生什麼，就像我們在第二季討論的那樣。與年初預計的相比，我們的業績有所下降，大約下降了 6 個百分點。顯然，我們已經看到其中一些又回來了。我認為，如果不存在停擺影響的不確定性，那麼宏觀經濟持續轉折點的確定性就會更大。

You've heard some others say that macro inflect back is going to be completely back to pre -- before the issues by the end of this year. You've heard others say close. You just don't know. And so I think that's really what the gap is. It is how much is the macro claw back the gap from where we thought we would start to -- where we thought we would be when we started this year. We got down 6%. We've come back a material piece of that, but we're not all the way back.

您可能聽過其他人的說法，宏觀經濟反彈將在今年年底前完全恢復到問題出現之前的狀態。您曾聽過其他人說「關閉」。你只是不知道。所以我認為這確實存在差距。宏觀經濟能在多大程度上彌補我們今年開始時認為的差距——也就是我們今年開始時認為的差距。我們下降了6%。我們已經恢復了部分實質損失，但還沒有完全恢復。

The other piece of it too, Scott, as you think about the initiatives, what we've done is we have put everything into the initiative bucket that we're doing to counter what would be sort of typical increases in cost in the business. As we move into next year, we've talked a lot about moving more to an EPS guided range. Of course, everything nets into that number. We'll still talk about the initiatives and what they are and what they're doing. But as we guide, likely, we move more toward kind of an EPS range where everything is netted.

斯科特，另一方面，當你考慮這些舉措時，我們所做的就是把所有東西都放進了我們正在做的舉措桶裡，以應對業務中典型的成本增長。隨著我們進入明年，我們已經討論了很多有關轉向 EPS 指導範圍的問題。當然，所有的事情都會算進這個數字。我們仍將討論這些舉措以及它們是什麼以及它們正在做什麼。但正如我們指導的那樣，我們很可能會更傾向於一種每股收益範圍，其中一切都是淨額。

And as we talk about these initiatives, hey, this particular cost savings initiative kind of in a year where we're not so initiative heavy with the transformation that we have, those types of things just find their way into the sort of typical efficiencies that you're -- that you're building into your budget as you're moving forward. And don't confuse my word typical of anything other than just talking about kind of standard budgeting practices. We're going to continue to be really focused on the efficiency coming out on the cost side.

當我們談論這些舉措時，嘿，這種特殊的成本節約舉措有點像是在今年我們對轉型沒有那麼大的主動性，這些事情只是進入了你正在推進的典型效率中——你正在將其納入預算中。並且不要將我的單字與任何其他單字混淆，而不僅僅是談論標準預算實踐。我們將繼續真正關注成本方面的效率。

David Vernon, Bernstein.

大衛‧佛農，伯恩斯坦。

So Andrew, I'd love to kind of narrow in on that comment around the knife edge improvement in yields with bookings for the assigned seating in January. Can you get -- is there a way to dimension it and to talk a little bit about how much of the schedule sold at this point in time whether the sell-through rate is being affected by the higher yields? Or any additional commentary you can give us on what that knife edge comment was would be great?

因此，安德魯，我想就一月份指定座位預訂收益的急劇改善這一評論進行一些探討。您能否得到 - 有沒有辦法對其進行衡量並稍微談談此時銷售了多少計劃以及銷售率是否受到更高收益率的影響？或者您可以針對那條刀鋒評論給我們任何補充評論嗎？

Yeah. Well, I apologize in advance, I'm going to do my best not to because it's early in the curve and so it is our first time doing the assigned seats and stuff like that. So we have studied others. We've scoured for good industry data. We think we have good compares. We have -- our models are trained on how we sell early bird stuff and upgrade boarding. So we think we have good context. And so I'm not going to give you the number because I don't know how long they'll persist in the booking curve. But when you do see a knife edge, it's clearly a change in customer reaction.

是的。好吧，我提前道歉，我會盡力不這樣做，因為現在還處於早期階段，所以這是我們第一次做指定座位之類的事情。因此我們也研究了其他人。我們搜尋了優質的行業數據。我們認為我們有很好的比較。我們已經訓練了我們的模型，學習如何銷售早鳥商品和升級登機。因此我們認為我們擁有良好的背景。所以我不會告訴你這個數字，因為我不知道他們的預訂曲線能持續多久。但當你確實看到刀刃時，這顯然是客戶反應的變化。

You really see knife edges. And when you do see a knife edge, something happen. In this case, we see a disproportionate customer reaction to the ability to buy an assigned seat or to upgrade to a fair product that includes it. And so that gives us confidence that we will see a revenue positive customer reaction as we go throughout the booking curve. It's just the amount being different than our business case is something where it's just too early for us to hit that.

你確實看到了刀刃。當你看到刀刃時，就會發生一些事情。在這種情況下，我們看到客戶對購買指定座位或升級到包含該座位的公平產品的反應不成比例。因此，我們有信心在整個預訂曲線中看到客戶對收入的正面反應。只是這個數字與我們的商業案例有所不同，對我們來說，達到這個數字還為時過早。

Okay. And then maybe just as a quick follow-up, Tom. I applaud the desire to get out of initiative jail here because the incremental math from the site is really tough to get to. But if you think about the cadence of what you guys have in your initiative plan, can you tell us kind of what quarter we hit peak initiatives, is it Q1, Q2, Q3? Like where in the way you guys have done the math around the initiatives, do we kind of get the max contribution from the initiatives?

好的。然後也許只是一個快速的後續問題，湯姆。我很欣賞想要擺脫主動性牢籠的渴望，因為從網站取得增量數學確實很難。但是，如果您考慮一下你們的計劃節奏，您能否告訴我們我們在哪個季度達到了計劃的高峰，是第一季、第二季還是第三季？例如，你們是如何計算這些舉措的，我們是否能從這些舉措中獲得最大貢獻？

Yeah. And of course, the -- and I'm not sure if your question is the quarter where most of the inflection occurs or if it's when you're hitting peak contribution from?

是的。當然，我不確定您的問題是變化最大的季度，還是您達到貢獻高峰的季度？

Peak contribution from.

峰值貢獻來自。

Yeah, peak contribution from would be -- tell me your time horizon, it should be the last quarter. We should continue to build and build and build on these. The big inflection that we have as we continue to move forward, of course, is what Andrew just described, as we move into first quarter where you have that big positive inflection where we've had a full booking curve to be able to sell into that again, contrasting that to what we did with bags. But from there, it should continue to build. We have structured the amended Chase agreement around the attributes of this new program.

是的，高峰貢獻是－告訴我你的時間範圍，應該是最後一個季度。我們應該繼續在此基礎上繼續建設。當然，隨著我們繼續前進，我們遇到的巨大轉折點就是安德魯剛才所描述的，當我們進入第一季度時，我們有一個很大的積極轉折點，我們有一個完整的預訂曲線，能夠再次銷售，這與我們的行李袋銷售情況形成了鮮明對比。但從那時起，它應該會繼續建設。我們根據這項新計劃的屬性制定了修訂後的大通協議。

And so as we have bags, as we have seat assignments, these are things that then you have entitlements to as you have the card. And we talked about other -- Andrew and Bob both talked about other things that we're looking at around the potential for clubs and what that might mean for the ability to buy up. And so the short answer to your question is tell me your time period, and it's going to be the last quarter of your time period, we're going to keep building.

因此，只要我們有行李，有座位分配，只要您有卡，您就有權享受這些權利。我們還談到了其他事情——安德魯和鮑勃都談到了我們正在關注的俱樂部潛力以及這對收購能力意味著什麼的其他事情。因此，對於您的問題，簡短的回答是告訴我您的時間段，這將是您時間段的最後四分之一，我們將繼續建造。

I'm going to do exactly what the Andrew and Tom probably don't want me to do. But if you just sort of speculate on that, I think given that -- if you just know how the booking curve works, and where the meat of the booking curve or you sue the meat of the booking curve for, folks that are now booking the new products at assigned an extra legroom of seating, I think that would tell you somewhere around early third quarter that peak would be my guess. The only -- and I think you'll have annualized the ramp-up of the new voucher exploration policies, those kinds of things would.

我要做安德魯和湯姆可能不想讓我做的事。但如果你只是對此進行推測，我認為，如果你知道預訂曲線是如何運作的，以及預訂曲線的核心在哪裡，或者你起訴預訂曲線的核心，那些現在預訂新產品並分配了額外腿部空間座位的人，我認為這會告訴你，我猜測高峰期會在第三季度初左右。唯一的——我認為你會將新的代金券探索政策的增加按年計算，諸如此類的事情。

The only thing that I can think of that will continue to ramp, obviously, the policy changes -- well, and then especially the changes in values of the card related to assigned seating benefits, boarding benefits, those should continue to ramp all year as that causes customers want to get the card, engaged with the card, the co-branded card, spend on the card. So I would think that initiative continues to ramp throughout the entire year. But the big one, which is assigned an extra legroom seating based on the booking curve, that would tell me at somewhere around early third quarter, you get to peak value.

我能想到的唯一會繼續增加的事情顯然是政策變化——嗯，特別是與指定座位優惠、登機優惠相關的卡價值的變化，這些應該會在全年繼續增加，因為這會導致客戶想要獲得卡，使用卡、聯名卡，用卡消費。所以我認為這項舉措將在全年持續進行。但是，根據預訂曲線分配額外腿部空間座位的大型座位會告訴我，在第三季初左右，您將達到峰值價值。

Andrew Didora, Bank of America.

美國銀行的安德魯·迪多拉。

So maybe I'll ask a non initiatives question to close it out here. But your fuel guidance on -- in this environment was a little bit surprising. I know it's been volatile, but also West Coast crack spreads have been high for several weeks now. I guess a quick two parter here. I guess one, Tom, just curious if you're able to give us what your exposure is to West Coast crack spreads? And then two, Bob, what levers do you have in your business that you think could help offset potentially higher fuel from your guidance?

因此，也許我會問一個非主動性的問題來結束它。但在這種環境下，您的燃料指導有點令人驚訝。我知道情況一直不穩定，而且西海岸裂解價差已經連續數週處於高位。我想這裡可以快速分成兩個部分。我想首先，湯姆，我只是好奇你是否能告訴我們你對西海岸裂解價差的敞口有多大？其次，鮑勃，您認為您的業務中有哪些槓桿可以幫助抵消您指導中可能出現的更高的燃料成本？

Yeah. For us, West Coast is probably somewhere around 30 or so. Gulf Coast were probably more like about half or so of the exposure.

是的。對我們來說，西海岸大概是 30 左右。墨西哥灣沿岸的暴露量可能佔了大約一半左右。

And then just on levers, and I think not just fuel I think just -- you saw -- was, I think, really good work and have what I think is really good cost discipline in the third quarter. And that cost discipline is not -- it's sustainable. It's not just showing cost out to the future. So we're going to work the same way in the fourth quarter and the first quarter and the second quarter to do exactly the same thing. And that is everything from just managing sort of traditional costs and departments.

然後就槓桿而言，我認為不僅僅是燃料，我認為——你看到了——我認為，這確實是很好的工作，而且我認為第三季的成本控制非常好。而且這種成本限制是可持續的。它不僅僅是展示未來的成本。因此，我們將在第四季、第一季和第二季以同樣的方式開展工作，做同樣的事情。這就是管理傳統成本和部門的全部內容。

We have some opportunities to continue to work on fuel efficiency which obviously is material given the amount of fuel. We have efficiency work and a lot of departments that are back office, sort of the everybody is throwing AI around, but it is the ability to automate transactions, that kind of thing, and we're seeing good results there. And then we have large efficiency programs in the operation. Some of those take longer. But my point is that this cost work is really -- it's across the board.

我們有一些機會繼續致力於提高燃油效率，考慮到燃油量，這顯然很重要。我們有效率工作，並且有很多後台部門，每個人都在運用人工智慧，但它具有自動化交易的能力，諸如此類，我們看到了良好的結果。然後我們在營運中擁有大型效率計劃。有些則需要更長的時間。但我的觀點是，這項成本工作確實——是全面的。

It's every discipline within the company and we'll just keep working there. To me, that's the best insurance around whether it's fuel or whether it is the macro or it's the government shutdown impact or whatever it is, the best insurance around hitting our EBIT guide is to just keep putting manage pressure on cost and efficiency and continue to beat those numbers.

這是公司內部的每個學科，我們將繼續在那裡工作。對我來說，無論是燃料、宏觀經濟、政府關門影響還是其他什麼因素，這都是最好的保障，達到我們的息稅前利潤指南的最佳保障就是繼續對成本和效率施加管理壓力，並繼續超越這些數字。

That wraps up the analyst portion of today's call. We appreciate everyone joining.

今天電話會議的分析師部分到此結束。我們感謝大家的加入。

Ladies and gentlemen, we will now transition to our media portion of today's call. Ms. Whitney Eichinger, Chief Communications Officer, will lead us off. Please go ahead, Whitney.

女士們、先生們，我們現在將進入今天電話會議的媒體部分。首席通訊官惠特尼·艾辛格女士將帶領我們。請繼續，惠特尼。

Thanks, Gary. Welcome to the media on our call today. Before we begin taking your questions, Gary, can you please remind us how to queue up for a question?

謝謝，加里。歡迎媒體參加我們今天的電話會議。在我們開始回答您的問題之前，加里，您能否提醒我們如何排隊提問？

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Robert Silk, Travel Weekly.

羅伯特‧西爾克（Robert Silk），《旅遊週刊》。

So what I wanted to ask is, during the last quarter, you talked about your check baggage, you made about 300 -- you were estimating $350 million for this year. Is that number still on course? And in the rate of check bags, how is that weighing in compared to the industry and compared to expectations?

所以我想問的是，在上個季度，您談到了您的托運行李，您賺了大約 3 億美元——您估計今年的收入為 3.5 億美元。這個數字還在正常範圍內嗎？那麼，就托運行李率而言，與業界水準和預期相比，情況如何？

Yes. The financials are right on top of what we have been giving you a little ahead of what we thought. So it's still -- that's right. And then puts the annualized contribution from check bags at right around $1 billion. And the reduction in lobby bags, so check bags is -- Andrew can give you better -- it's about 30%. We are seeing a modest increase in gate check bags. So bags that show up at the gates that have to be handled there. But overall, our bags are down and down materially.

是的。財務狀況正好符合我們所給予的水平，甚至比我們想像的要好一些。所以它仍然是——沒錯。然後，支票袋的年度貢獻就達到了 10 億美元左右。大廳行李減少，因此托運行李是 - 安德魯可以給你更好的 - 大約是 30%。我們發現登機口托運行李數量略有增加。因此，到達登機口的行李必須在那裡處理。但總體來說，我們的包包在材質上是下降了，下降了。

So how does it compares to an industry standard?

那麼它與行業標準相比如何？

It looks like our check bag revenue per passenger is right along the same lines as the big three. So it seems like it's a very similar rate that we're getting.

看起來我們的每位乘客托運行李收入與三大航空公司的水平大致相同。因此看起來我們得到的利率非常相似。

This concludes our question-and-answer session for media. So back over to Whitney now for some closing thoughts.

我們的媒體問答環節到此結束。現在回到惠特尼，談一些結束語。

If you have any further questions, our communications group is standing by. Their contact information and along with today's news release are all available at swamedia.com.

如果您還有其他問題，我們的通訊小組隨時為您服務。他們的聯絡資訊以及今天的新聞稿都可以在 swamedia.com 上找到。

The conference has concluded. Thank you all for attending. We'll meet here again next quarter.

會議已經結束。謝謝大家的出席。我們下個季度還會在這裡見面。