Hertz Global Holdings Inc (HTZ) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to the Hertz Global Holdings Fourth Quarter 2023 Earnings Call. (Operator Instructions) I would like to remind you that this morning's call is being recorded by the company. I would now like to turn the call over to your host, Johann Rawlinson, Vice President of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

歡迎參加赫茲全球控股 2023 年第四季財報電話會議。 （操作員指示）我想提醒您，公司正在錄音今天早上的通話。現在，我想將電話轉給主持人、投資者關係副總裁約翰·羅林森 (Johann Rawlinson)。請繼續。

Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us. By now, you should have our earnings press release and associated financial information. We've also provided slides to accompany our conference call, and these can be accessed through the Investor Relations section of our website.

大家早安，感謝大家的收看。現在，您應該已經收到我們的收益新聞稿和相關財務資訊。我們還提供了電話會議的幻燈片，您可以透過我們網站的投資者關係部分存取這些幻燈片。

I want to remind you that certain statements made on this call contain forward-looking information. Forward-looking statements are not a guarantee of performance and by their nature, are subject to inherent risks and uncertainties. Actual results may differ materially. Any forward-looking information relayed on this call speaks only as of today's date, and the company undertakes no obligation to update that information to reflect changed circumstances.

我想提醒您，本次電話會議中發表的某些聲明包含前瞻性資訊。前瞻性陳述並不能保證業績，而且就其性質而言，存在固有風險和不確定性。實際結果可能存在重大差異。本次電話會議中傳達的任何前瞻性訊息僅代表今日的觀點，本公司不承擔更新該資訊以反映情況變化的義務。

Additional information concerning these statements is contained in our earnings press release and the filings we make with the Securities and Exchange Commission. Our filings are available on the SEC's website and the Investor Relations section of the Hertz website. I would also direct your attention to the Form 8-K that we furnished to the SEC on January 11, which includes information on our strategic decision regarding the sale of a portion of the EV fleet.

有關這些聲明的更多資訊包含在我們的收益新聞稿和我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中。我們的文件可在美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 網站和赫茲網站的投資者關係部分查閱。我還請您注意我們於 1 月 11 日提交給美國證券交易委員會的 8-K 表，其中包含有關我們出售部分電動汽車車隊的戰略決策的資訊。

Today, we'll use certain non-GAAP financial measures, which are reconciled with GAAP numbers in our earnings press release and earnings presentation available on our website. We believe that these non-GAAP measures provide additional useful information about our operations, allowing better evaluation of our profitability and performance. Unless otherwise noted, our discussion today focuses on our global business.

今天，我們將使用某些非 GAAP 財務指標，這些指標與我們收益新聞稿和我們網站上的收益報告中的 GAAP 數字相協調。我們相信，這些非公認會計準則指標提供了有關我們運營的更多有用信息，可以更好地評估我們的盈利能力和業績。除非另有說明，我們今天的討論重點是我們的全球業務。

On the call this morning, we have Stephen Scherr, our Chief Executive Officer; Alex Brooks, our Chief Financial Officer; and Justin Keppy, our Chief Operating Officer.

今天上午的電話會議由我們的執行長 Stephen Scherr 主持；我們的財務長亞歷克斯·布魯克斯 (Alex Brooks)；以及我們的營運長賈斯汀·凱皮（Justin Keppy）。

I'll now turn the call over to Stephen.

我現在將電話轉給史蒂芬。

Good morning and thank you for joining our fourth quarter earnings call. We have a good amount to cover this morning. On our performance, we will address the cost challenges that the business faced in the fourth quarter, which were a continuation of the challenges we faced throughout 2023 as well as the solid demand and stable rate environment we continue to experience. The core message we are sharing this morning as we begin 2024 is one of confidence on the forward.

早安，感謝您參加我們的第四季財報電話會議。今天早上我們要討論很多內容。在我們的業績方面，我們將解決業務在第四季度面臨的成本挑戰，這是我們在整個 2023 年面臨的挑戰的延續，也是我們繼續經歷的強勁需求和穩定利率環境。在進入 2024 年之際，我們今天早上分享的核心訊息是對未來充滿信心。

Our confidence is based on the continued stability of the demand and rate environment, the expected benefits of the strategic decision that we made in the fourth quarter regarding our EV fleet, which is also expected to reduce operational distraction and the continued execution of our enhanced profitability plan. All told, we expect that 2024 will be a transitional year for Hertz, and we expect to regain our operational cadence and improve our financial performance with increasing effect into 2025.

我們的信心是基於需求和價格環境的持續穩定，我們在第四季度針對電動車車隊做出的策略決策的預期收益（預計該決策也將減少營運幹擾）以及我們增強盈利能力計劃的持續執行。總而言之，我們預計 2024 年將是赫茲的過渡年，我們預計將在 2025 年恢復營運節奏並改善財務表現。

With that, let me turn to our Q4 results, both revenue and cost and our progress on select initiatives. Justin Keppy will then share impressions from his first 90 days in his role as our Chief Operating Officer; and the initiatives he is leading to enhance productivity with a particular focus on our goals for 2024. Alex will then conclude our prepared remarks with additional commentary on our financial performance liquidity and outlook before we turn the call over to your questions.

接下來，讓我來談談我們的第四季業績，包括收入和成本以及我們在選定計劃上的進展。賈斯汀·凱皮 (Justin Keppy) 將分享他擔任營運長的頭 90 天的印象；以及他所領導的提高生產力的舉措，特別關注我們的 2024 年目標。

On the quarter, revenue was $2.2 billion, in line with our expectations and in line with sequential seasonality and up 7% year-over-year. Our topline performance reflected continued demand for our product, consistent with travel trends reported across airlines and hotels. Specifically, Q4 volume was up 12% year-over-year. The organization delivered Q4 revenue with a strong focus on rate.

本季營收為 22 億美元，符合我們的預期，也與連續的季節性因素相符，年成長 7%。我們的營收表現反映了對我們產品的持續需求，這與航空公司和飯店報告的旅遊趨勢一致。具體而言，第四季度的銷量較去年同期成長了 12%。該組織在第四季度實現了收入，並專注於利率。

Revenue per day in the quarter came in better than expected at $58.09, which is slightly better than typical seasonality would yield. Year-over-year RPD reflected a moderating trend relative to prior quarterly comparisons and the rate of year-over-year decline decelerated. Overall, this better-than-expected rate performance was the product of a relatively stable rate environment in the quarter and underscores that rate for the whole of 2023 remained 40% higher than rate in 2019. Our ability to capture this rate was not only a product of stable demand, but our prioritization of RPD. We made some very intentional decisions in the quarter to forgo lower-margin business, even though it was at the expense of utilization.

本季每日收入優於預期，達到 58.09 美元，略優於典型季節性收入。與前幾季相比，RPD 年比呈現緩和趨勢，且較去年同期下降速度有所減緩。總體而言，這一好於預期的利率表現是本季度相對穩定的利率環境的結果，並強調 2023 年全年的利率仍比 2019 年高出 40%。我們在本季做出了一些非常有意的決定，放棄利潤率較低的業務，儘管這是以犧牲利用率為代價的。

Further to utilization, we did carry more cars into quarter end than we had previously anticipated. Like all decisions regarding fleet, we are guided by an ROA or return-on-asset mindset with a central objective of keeping our supply of fleet inside profitable demand. Against declining vehicle residual values in the fourth quarter, and what we might yield on sale, we saw the opportunity for greater returns in the continued deployment of these assets. As you are aware, we've been focusing on growing customer channels like Dollar and rideshare both of which can accommodate higher mileage vehicles.

除利用率外，我們在季度末運送的汽車確實比我們之前預期的多。與所有有關船隊的決策一樣，我們以 ROA 或資產回報率為指導思想，核心目標是將船隊供應保持在有利可圖的需求範圍內。針對第四季度車輛殘值下降以及我們可能獲得的銷售收益，我們看到了繼續部署這些資產以獲得更大回報的機會。如您所知，我們一直專注於發展 Dollar 和 rideshare 等客戶管道，這兩種管道都可以容納更高里程的車輛。

In addition, we are being very intentional about our choice of disposition channel. We continue to see the opportunity to increase vehicle sales through retail channels including Carvana and our proprietary network. As compared to auction or wholesale, retail typically yields higher selling prices when residual prices are in decline. In Q4, for example, we saw a positive variance between wholesale and retail gross price in the range of 5% to 10%. This prioritization of more favorable economics related to continued rental versus immediate disposition and the selection of channel to optimize price reflects our continued attention to asset returns. Let me turn to vehicle carrying and operating costs.

此外，我們對處置管道的選擇非常謹慎。我們繼續看到透過包括 Carvana 和我們的專有網路在內的零售通路增加汽車銷量的機會。與拍賣或批發相比，當剩餘價格下降時，零售通常會產生更高的銷售價格。例如，在第四季度，我們發現批發和零售總價之間的正差異在 5% 到 10% 之間。優先考慮與持續租賃而非立即處置相關的更有利的經濟因素以及選擇優化價格的管道反映了我們對資產回報的持續關注。讓我來談談車輛運載和營運成本。

Quickly on carrying costs. Weakness in residual values, together with the charge we took on the held-for-sale EVs, along with higher interest rates, resulted in a higher-than-expected vehicle carrying costs for the quarter. Alex will expand on this in more detail.

快速降低持有成本。殘值疲軟，加上我們對持有待售電動車收取的費用以及更高的利率，導致本季的車輛持有成本高於預期。亞歷克斯 (Alex) 將對此進行更詳細的闡述。

With respect to operating costs, direct operating expense or DOE per transaction day was $36.92 in the fourth quarter. Excluding net collision and damage and adjusting for extraordinary litigation expense in the fourth quarter of 2022, DOE per transaction day was flat in Q4 versus a year ago and decreased by 8% for the year. We continued to experience elevated collision and damage in the quarter, largely driven by costs associated with running our EV fleet. And perhaps more significantly, the challenge of the EVs had an impact on our operational efficiency more generally, further supporting the advisability of our EV sales plan. As Justin will speak to more, DOE is squarely in our sights.

就營運成本而言，第四季直接營運費用或每交易日 DOE 為 36.92 美元。不包括淨碰撞和損壞並調整 2022 年第四季的非經常性訴訟費用，第四季每交易日 DOE 與去年同期持平，全年下降了 8%。本季度，我們繼續經歷高頻率的碰撞和損壞，這主要是由於運行我們的電動車隊相關的成本。或許更重要的是，電動車的挑戰對我們的營運效率產生了更普遍的影響，進一步支持了我們的電動車銷售計畫的可取性。正如賈斯汀進一步談到的那樣，能源部正處於我們的視線之中。

All told, fourth quarter adjusted corporate EBITDA was a loss of $382 million, which includes the $245 million of incremental net depreciation expense associated with the EV sales plan. To be clear, this bottom-line result is unacceptable. But as I said at the beginning of my remarks, I have confidence in our trajectory, particularly with the bold but achievable cost out plan and our decision around EVs. The drivers of this outcome are understood and are being addressed and the opportunities before us are real.

總體而言，第四季度調整後企業 EBITDA 虧損 3.82 億美元，其中包括與電動車銷售計畫相關的 2.45 億美元增量淨折舊費用。需要明確的是，這種最終結果是不可接受的。但正如我在發言開頭所說，我對我們的發展軌跡充滿信心，特別是大膽但可實現的成本計劃和我們圍繞電動車的決定。我們已經了解了導致這結果的因素，並正在加以解決，我們面前的機會也是實實在在的。

Our decision regarding the EV fleet is one driver of opportunity. As we discussed in our 8-K, we expect the consequences of our Q4 decision to be material and positive on the forward. We expect improved adjusted corporate EBITDA and cash flow over the next 2 years from that decision. We will also be positioned to better meet customer demand through higher utilization on fewer and less expensive ICE vehicles. while maintaining an EV fleet where again, supply better meets profitable demand.

我們關於電動車隊的決定是一個機會驅動因素。正如我們在 8-K 報告中所討論的那樣，我們預計第四季度決策將對未來產生重大而積極的影響。我們預計，該決定將在未來兩年內改善企業調整後息稅折舊攤提前利潤和現金流。我們還將透過提高數量更少、更便宜的 ICE 車輛的利用率來更好地滿足客戶需求。同時維持電動車隊，供應更能滿足了獲利需求。

And because we are eliminating a portion of the EV fleet that yielded the lowest RPD and exhibited the highest level of damage incidence, we expect to yield a disproportionately higher financial benefit over this year and next, than the size of the fleet reduction would imply. The anticipated 2-year payback on the charge taken in Q4 related to EVs, in terms of aggregate benefit to adjusted corporate EBITDA production is to be understood as entirely separate and apart from the opportunity to generate an incremental $500 million of adjusted corporate EBITDA, which we have discussed on previous calls.

而且，由於我們正在淘汰一部分 RPD 最低、損壞發生率最高的電動車隊，我們預計今年和明年將獲得比車隊減少規模所暗示的更高的經濟效益。就調整後企業 EBITDA 生產的總收益而言，預計第四季度與電動車相關的費用將在兩年內收回，這應被理解為與創造 5 億美元增量調整後企業 EBITDA 的機會完全無關，我們已經在之前的電話會議上討論過這一點。

This incremental $500 million opportunity falls into 3 areas: First, we have our project-driven initiatives, which are focused on the creation of profitable incremental revenue. This includes growing rideshare and improving our European and value brand businesses.

這個 5 億美元的增量機會可分為三個領域：首先，我們有專案驅動的舉措，專注於創造有利可圖的增量收入。這包括增加共享乘車業務並改善我們的歐洲和價值品牌業務。

In 2024, we will expand on the progress we made across each of these initiatives in 2023, which included on rideshare growing revenue by 75% over the prior year. Uber drivers have now driven over 1 billion miles in EVs rented from Hertz.

2024 年，我們將擴大 2023 年每項措施所取得的進展，其中包括共乘收入比上一年增長 75%。目前，Uber 司機已駕駛從赫茲租借的電動車行駛了超過 10 億英里。

Our international business increased volume across key customer channels and grew annual revenue by 17% over the prior year. We also made progress in our Dollar and Thrifty brands where we now have new websites designed to enable improved direct bookings and enhance customer loyalty. Second, we have our efforts to enhance the yield on our core business and the assets deployed against it through a focus on improved revenue management.

我們的國際業務透過主要客戶管道實現了銷售成長，年收入較上年增長了 17%。我們也在 Dollar 和 Thrifty 品牌方面取得了進展，現在我們擁有新的網站，旨在改善直接預訂並提高客戶忠誠度。其次，我們致力於透過改善收入管理來提高核心業務和相關資產的收益率。

Some specific progress to note. Our team rolled out an improved skip-the-counter process across all brands in select airports during the quarter, reducing pressure on field employees and improving the customer experience with real opportunity to increase the sale of value-added services or VAS products through digital channels. And we started to roll out Apple Pay for the Hertz brand in select U.S. channels, providing our customers with an easy, secure and private payment option. We are already seeing over 20% of eligible reservations completed with Apple Pay. Third and perhaps most in focus now is our disciplined approach on productivity to reduce costs throughout the business. Justin will speak to this cost-out opportunity in more detail, but the work is well underway.

一些值得注意的具體進展。本季度，我們的團隊在部分機場的所有品牌中推出了改進的免櫃檯流程，減輕了現場員工的壓力，改善了客戶體驗，並真正有機會透過數位管道增加增值服務或 VAS 產品的銷售。我們已開始在部分美國管道為赫茲品牌推出 Apple Pay，為我們的客戶提供簡單、安全且私密的支付方式。我們已經看到超過 20% 的符合條件的預訂是透過 Apple Pay 完成的。第三，也許現在最受關注的是我們採取嚴格的生產力方法，以降低整個企業的成本。賈斯汀將更詳細地談論這一成本削減機會，但相關工作正在順利進行中。

The team is energized and sees the opportunity and is working to deliver. A terrific add to the team who is already putting us in an improved position is our new Chief Operating Officer, Justin Keppy and I'm pleased to turn it over for his comments. Justin?

團隊充滿活力，看到了機會並正在努力實現。我們新任營運長賈斯汀·凱皮 (Justin Keppy) 為團隊做出了巨大貢獻，他已經使我們的狀況得到了改善，我很高興聽取他的意見。賈斯汀？

Thank you, Stephen, and good morning, everyone. It's been an exciting first 90 days at Hertz, learning the business, visiting our larger operations and meeting the field operations teams who make it happen. Their engagement and passion to support our customers and move the business forward is inspiring. We have a great foundation to pivot towards improved profitability.

謝謝你，史蒂芬，大家早安。在赫茲工作的前 90 天令人興奮，我學習了業務，參觀了我們更大的營運部門，並與實現這一目標的現場營運團隊會面。他們對支持我們的客戶和推動業務發展的投入和熱情令人鼓舞。我們擁有良好的基礎來提高獲利能力。

Looking forward, I see the road to profitable growth by getting back to the fundamentals in line with the 3 areas, as Stephen referenced. In partnership with our leaders, we are bringing greater operational discipline and focusing on what immediately matters, getting cost out. It's clear that we need to take bold action on both fixed and variable costs and accelerate productivity across our operations. We aimed to get $250 million in benefit this year in addition to the benefit we expect to achieve from the EV reduction. While the company has been successful in tackling costs, we believe we can do more.

展望未來，我認為正如史蒂芬所說，透過回歸基本面，符合三個領域，將能實現獲利成長。透過與我們的領導合作，我們正在帶來更嚴格的營運紀律，並專注於當前重要的事情，從而降低成本。顯然，我們需要對固定成本和可變成本採取大膽行動，並提高整個營運的生產力。除了預期從企業價值減排中獲得的收益之外，我們今年還計劃獲得 2.5 億美元的收益。儘管公司已成功解決成本問題，但我們相信可以做得更多。

On -- productivity and cost benefit efforts fall into 5 core areas. Let's start with staffing and third-party spend across our business. We have taken a first step in rightsizing and reducing third-party spend and are assessing further actions. Within our fleet operations, we are enhancing our workforce planning process to better align staffing to volume and location. We expect meaningful benefit from these actions.

生產力和成本效益工作分為五個核心領域。讓我們從整個業務的人員配備和第三方支出開始。我們已經邁出了調整規模和減少第三方支出的第一步，並正在評估進一步的行動。在我們的車隊營運中，我們正在加強勞動力規劃流程，以便更好地根據數量和地點調整人員配置。我們期望從這些行動中獲益良多。

Footprint is our second core focus area. We have assessed our network, and we expect to reduce the cost of our physical off-airport real estate footprint as we exit underperforming locations. These actions are designed to provide more focus and enable the redeployment of over 10,000 vehicles to more attractive use without the detriment to the robustness of our remaining network. We expect these network actions to be initiated within Q1.

足跡是我們第二個核心關注領域。我們已經評估了我們的網絡，並且我們期望在退出表現不佳的地點時降低機場外實體房地產足跡的成本。這些舉措旨在更加集中精力，使 10,000 多輛車輛能夠重新部署到更有吸引力的用途，同時又不損害我們剩餘網路的穩健性。我們預計這些網路行動將在第一季內啟動。

Third, we are attacking operating costs and improving field productivity. Collision, damage, maintenance, transportation, fuel, and out of service are the prime targets. We are rolling out to the field new digital tools to improve visibility and decision-making. During the quarter, we began to deploy digital capabilities into the field to enable more real-time and simpler documentation of damage upon a vehicle's return to lot. This tool promises to capture an increasing number of damage incidents with better precision and ultimately yield better reimbursement outcomes.

第三，我們正在降低營運成本並提高現場生產力。碰撞、損壞、維護、運輸、燃料和停用是主要目標。我們正在向現場推出新的數位工具，以提高可視性和決策能力。在本季度，我們開始在現場部署數位化功能，以便在車輛返回停車場時能夠更即時、更簡單地記錄損壞情況。該工具有望以更高的精度捕獲越來越多的損害事件，並最終產生更好的償付結果。

The fourth area is procurement, a big opportunity with an addressable spend of nearly $3 billion. We have started to centralize and consolidate spend to reduce consumption and buy more effectively. We will continue to explore opportunities to accelerate our progress in this key area.

第四個領域是採購，這是一個巨大的機遇，可觸及的支出金額接近 30 億美元。我們已經開始集中和整合支出，以減少消費並更有效地購買。我們將繼續探索機會，並加快在這一關鍵領域的進展。

The final area is technology. Technology is critical to what we do. As we have previously mentioned, we are well underway in modernizing our infrastructure, moving solutions to the cloud, and retiring legacy software platforms. We have made real progress and we'll start seeing benefit in 2024, including a year-over-year reduction in spend, as previously highlighted.

最後一個領域是技術。科技對我們的工作至關重要。正如我們之前提到的，我們正在順利實現基礎設施的現代化、將解決方案遷移到雲端以及淘汰舊式軟體平台。我們已經取得了真正的進展，並將在 2024 年開始看到收益，包括支出的同比減少，正如之前所強調的。

To ensure progress against our $250 million target for the year, we are developing detailed action plans with KPIs and implementing a governance process run by a newly formed and expanding program office. In addition, and separate from the $250 million benefit I just outlined, we are progressing our efforts to reduce collision and damage across EVs more broadly. These include active discussions with key OEMs to get access to parts and labor more quickly and at better pricing, leveraging our digital tools and insights to improve underwriting and collections. And in rideshare specifically, lowering driver churn and expanding our EV charging network.

為了確保今年 2.5 億美元的目標，我們正在製定包含關鍵績效指標的詳細行動計劃，並實施由新成立且不斷擴大的專案辦公室運行的治理流程。此外，除了我剛才提到的 2.5 億美元福利之外，我們還在加大力度，更廣泛地減少電動車的碰撞和損壞。這些包括與主要 OEM 進行積極討論，以更快、更優惠的價格獲得零件和勞動力，利用我們的數位工具和見解來改善承保和收款。具體來說，在共享乘車方面，我們降低駕駛者流失率並擴大我們的電動車充電網路。

To wrap up, I joined Hertz to make a real impact. My first impressions of the business are positive, and I'm excited to capture the opportunities ahead. We know what to do and are organized to do it. In future calls, I look forward to providing you with updates on our progress.

總而言之，我加入赫茲是為了發揮真正的影響力。我對這項業務的第一印像是正面的，我很高興能夠抓住未來的機會。我們知道該做什麼，並組織起來去做。在未來的電話會議中，我期待向您提供我們進展的最新情況。

Now let me turn it over to Alex.

現在讓我把它交給亞歷克斯。

Thank you, Justin, and good morning, everyone. Let me start by covering our full 2023 results. Revenue was $9.4 billion, up 8% year-over-year, although down 4% year-over-year, rates remained healthy at $60.62. This was about 40% above 2019, as noted earlier. Volume for the year was up 13% compared to 2022, with meaningful growth across leisure, corporate and rideshare. Our fleet size grew only 9%, resulting in utilization that was 190 basis points higher than 2022, primarily driven by improved out of service levels. Strength in utilization of the fleet meaningfully contributed to RPU of $1,479 in 2023, down slightly versus 2022.

謝謝你，賈斯汀，大家早安。首先讓我介紹一下我們 2023 年的全部表現。收入為 94 億美元，年增 8%，儘管年減 4%，但費率仍保持在 60.62 美元的健康水準。如前所述，這比 2019 年高出約 40%。與 2022 年相比，今年的銷量成長了 13%，休閒、商務和共乘領域均實現了顯著成長。我們的機隊規模僅成長了 9%，導致利用率比 2022 年高出 190 個基點，這主要得益於服務水準的提高。船隊利用率的提高對 2023 年的 RPU 貢獻率為 1,479 美元，較 2022 年略有下降。

DPU of $307 for 2023 was broadly in line with our expectations at the start of the year, notwithstanding the $245 million of incremental net depreciation expense resulting from our EV plan of sale. For the fourth quarter, DPU was $498, inclusive of the incremental depreciation and $350, excluding the charge. As you're aware, DPU is driven by a variety of factors, including fleet mix, mileage and condition as well as views on forward residual values and our historical sales experience. The combination of these factors drove Q4 DPU higher than we expected. We're closely watching residual values entering Q1, particularly in light of our plans to rotate fleet over the course of 2024 to a materially younger composition. As Stephen shared, we bring a return-on-assets mentality to our fleet plan, and that includes our central tenet of maintaining fleet within profitable demand.

儘管我們的 EV 銷售計劃導致了 2.45 億美元的增量淨折舊費用，但 2023 年的 DPU 為 307 美元，基本上符合我們年初的預期。第四季度，DPU 為 498 美元（含增量折舊）和 350 美元（不含費用）。如您所知，DPU 受多種因素影響，包括車隊組合、里程和狀況以及對遠期殘值的看法和我們的歷史銷售經驗。這些因素的綜合作用使得第四季的 DPU 高於我們的預期。我們正在密切關注第一季的殘值，尤其是考慮到我們計劃在 2024 年將船隊輪換為更年輕的船隊。正如史蒂芬所說，我們將資產回報率的理念帶入了我們的機隊計劃，其中包括將機隊維持在盈利需求範圍內的核心原則。

Regarding operating costs, DOE per transaction day in 2023 was consistent with our prior year. Excluding net collision and damage in both years and litigation settlements in 2022, DOE per day was down 8%, reflecting progress on our cost initiatives. Both vehicle and non-vehicle interest expense was higher in 2023 compared to 2022, driven primarily by the macro rate environment with modest impact from fleet size.

關於營運成本，2023 年 DOE 每交易日的營運成本與我們上一年一致。不包括兩年的淨碰撞和損害以及 2022 年的訴訟和解，DOE 每日下降了 8%，反映了我們的成本計劃取得了進展。 2023 年車輛和非車輛利息支出均高於 2022 年，這主要受宏觀利率環境影響，車隊規模的影響不大。

Adjusted corporate EBITDA for 2023 was $561 million, a 6% margin, which reflected a drag of several hundred basis points related to the EV headwinds and previously discussed and further burdened by the charge related to the EV sale plan. Turning to our capital structure and liquidity.

2023 年調整後企業 EBITDA 為 5.61 億美元，利潤率為 6%，這反映了與電動車逆風相關的數百個基點的拖累，並且之前已討論過，並受到與電動汽車銷售計劃相關的費用的進一步拖累。轉向我們的資本結構和流動性。

With respect to our balance sheet, net corporate debt at the end of the fourth quarter was $2.5 billion, resulting in net corporate leverage of 4.5x at year-end. While this is well above our long-term leverage ambition of 1.5x, we intend to delever over time as our operational initiatives yield improved profitability. Our available liquidity at December 31 was $2 billion, comprised of $764 million of unrestricted cash and the balance available under the first lien revolving credit facility. Our corporate debt maturity ladder is well structured with no material maturities until 2026.

就我們的資產負債表而言，第四季末的公司淨負債為 25 億美元，導致年底的公司淨槓桿率為 4.5 倍。雖然這遠高於我們 1.5 倍的長期槓桿率目標，但隨著我們的營運措施帶來獲利能力的提高，我們打算隨著時間的推移降低槓桿率。截至 12 月 31 日，我們可用的流動資金為 20 億美元，包括 7.64 億美元的無限制現金和第一留置權循環信貸安排下的可用餘額。我們的企業債務到期階梯結構良好，直到 2026 年都沒有重大到期債務。

At December 31, we had $2.6 billion of capacity under our vehicle debt facilities globally, with a portfolio that was approximately 70% fixed rate. We maintained sufficient equity cushion in our global ABS facilities at the end of 2023. Of note, $2 billion of medium-term notes under our U.S. ABS facility mature in December of '24, and we intend to refinance those notes in the normal course of business with the exact timing subject to market conditions. Turning to our cash flow and capital allocation.

截至 12 月 31 日，我們在全球範圍內的汽車債務融資額度達 26 億美元，其中約 70% 為固定利率。截至 2023 年底，我們在全球 ABS 工具中保持了足夠的股本緩衝。轉向我們的現金流和資本配置。

Adjusted free cash flow for the year was an outflow of $321 million, primarily comprised of adjusted operating cash flow of $44 million offset by $358 million of net fleet growth. Net fleet growth supported a $1.6 billion increase in revenue earning vehicles on slightly lower-than-anticipated vehicle dispositions. Our non-fleet CapEx for the year was minimal as expenditures were offset by asset sales, including the previously disclosed sale of real estate adjacent to LAX in Q1. Lastly, in 2023, we repurchased $291 million of our common stock.

本年度調整後的自由現金流為 3.21 億美元流出，主要包括調整後的營運現金流 4,400 萬美元，抵銷了 3.58 億美元的淨船隊成長。淨車隊成長支持了車輛收入增加 16 億美元，儘管車輛處置量略低於預期。我們今年的非機隊資本支出很少，因為支出被資產出售所抵消，包括先前披露的第一季出售洛杉磯國際機場附近的房地產。最後，在 2023 年，我們回購了價值 2.91 億美元的普通股。

We entered 2024 with solid demand and a stable rate environment. We expect demand to track to historical seasonal patterns and anticipate supporting RPD through initiatives such as better monetization of upgrades, incremental value-added services revenue through digital channels and improved price capture in our value brands.

我們在強勁的需求和穩定的利率環境下進入了 2024 年。我們預計需求將追蹤歷史季節性模式，並希望透過諸如更好地將升級貨幣化、透過數位管道增加增值服務收入以及提高價值品牌的價格捕獲率等措施來支持 RPD。

Regarding vehicle carrying costs, we expect the dynamic residual environment to be an important macro trend for the industry in the year ahead. It will influence, but not dictate our return-on-asset based approach to fleet rotation and, of course, depreciation we plan for normal seasonality in the used car market, notwithstanding our view that the market is structurally short used vehicles in the near to medium term.

關於車輛持有成本，我們預期動態殘餘環境將成為未來一年產業的重要宏觀趨勢。它將影響但不會決定我們基於資產回報率的車隊輪換方法，當然也不會決定我們針對二手車市場正常季節性計劃的折舊方法，儘管我們認為短期至中期內市場在結構上缺少二手車。

On productivity, we look to achieve $250 million in benefit over the course of 2024, as Justin covered earlier. More broadly, we expect adjusted corporate EBITDA to benefit from improvements associated with the strategic sale of 1/3 of our EV fleet as well as the benefits of our productivity and cost initiatives, and as referenced, a focus on the fundamentals and improved operational discipline.

在生產力方面，正如賈斯汀之前所述，我們希望在 2024 年實現 2.5 億美元的收益。更廣泛地說，我們預計調整後的企業 EBITDA 將受益於我們 1/3 電動車隊策略性銷售帶來的改善，以及我們的生產力和成本舉措帶來的好處，並且如前所述，專注於基本面和改進營運紀律。

In closing, I look forward to the future of our business and bringing the opportunities we discussed today to fruition.

最後，我對我們的業務的未來抱有期待，並希望我們今天討論的機會能夠實現。

With that, let's open the call for Q&A.

現在，讓我們開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from the line of Chris Woronka of Deutsche Bank.

（操作員指示）我們的第一個問題來自德意志銀行的 Chris Woronka。

So since you made that announcement regarding the planned reduction in the EV fleet, I guess the question is, at what point do you kind of evaluate your progress on that? And what would be the kind of markers that might cause you to possibly accelerate that further? Just trying to get a sense for how you're going to evaluate the success of it and when you might decide you need to do more if you need or want to do more.

因此，既然您宣布了計劃減少電動車隊，我想問題是，您在什麼時候評估這方面的進展？那麼什麼樣的標記可能會導致您進一步加速這一進程？只是想了解您將如何評估它的成功，以及何時決定您是否需要做更多或想要做更多。

Sure. Thanks for the question, Chris. Look, this is a dynamic. I mean we are assessing the move we made all of the time, not just simply on the disposition of the cars, but equally on the residual EV fleet that we had. We obviously took and are taking 20,000 cars out. That's largely to bring supply inside demand. And the frame of reference as to whether there's more to do or whether we're content with the fleet we have is going to be a ROIC, a return on invested capital, assessment on the EVs.

當然。謝謝你的提問，克里斯。看，這是一個動態的。我的意思是，我們一直在評估我們的舉措，不僅是汽車的處置，還包括我們剩餘的電動車隊。顯然，我們已經取出並正在取出 20,000 輛汽車。這主要是為了將供應納入需求範圍。而判斷我們是否還有更多工作要做或我們是否對現有的車隊感到滿意的參考標準是投資資本回報率 (ROIC)，即對電動車的評估。

In taking the 20,000 out, think about it this way, we have effectively clipped the lowest rung of demand in terms of RPD and candidly, the most offensive component of demand as it related to damage. And so our view is that while we're taking 1/3 of the fleet down our expectation is that we will capture close to a half, if you will, of the economic drag that's posed there.

在拿出 20,000 時，請這樣想，我們實際上已經削減了 RPD 方面需求的最低層，而且坦率地說，也削減了與損害相關的需求中最具攻擊性的部分。因此，我們的觀點是，雖然我們將減少 1/3 的船隊，但我們預計，我們將能夠消除由此造成的近一半的經濟拖累。

So where does that come from? We obviously told you in the 8-K that we expect over the 2 years in the aggregate to recapture about $250 million of EBITDA and free cash flow of about $250 million to $300 million. So what's embedded in that? And what are we going to look at as we harvest this? Well, first of all, there's a reduction in fleet carrying cost, there's lower operating costs relating to collision and transport and charging and labor. And then we expect enhanced revenue in the context of deploying fewer cars at higher utilization than the cars we're taking out.

那麼這從何而來？我們在 8-K 文件中明確告訴您，我們預計在兩年內總計可收回約 2.5 億美元的 EBITDA 和約 2.5 億至 3 億美元的自由現金流。那麼這其中蘊含著什麼呢？當我們收穫這些時，我們要注意什麼？首先，車隊營運成本降低，與碰撞、運輸、充電和勞動力相關的營運成本也降低。然後，我們期望在部署更少的汽車但使用率高於我們淘汰的汽車的情況下增加收入。

And on the reduced carrying cost, I mean, that's in front of us. The depreciation is captured. That's for us to take. What we do in terms of unit economics will be a function of the fact that we're going to only replace 15,000 of the 20,000 cars taken out. So these are less expensive cars, lower depreciation, lower vehicle carrying costs, operating at higher utilization so that will produce much higher margin dollars to us, and the operating costs just simply around collision transport and labor will be there.

至於降低持有成本，我的意思是，這已經擺在我們面前了。折舊已被捕獲。這是我們能做的。就單位經濟而言，我們所做的將取決於這樣一個事實：我們只會替換被淘汰的 20,000 輛汽車中的 15,000 輛。因此，這些汽車價格較低，折舊率較低，車輛運輸成本較低，利用率較高，因此將為我們帶來更高的利潤，而僅僅是碰撞、運輸和勞動力方面的運營成本就已存在。

And so, a, we need to sell these cars, and we're on pace to do that at or around where our mark was at December 31. Two, we need to capture the cost savings through EBITDA and realize the cash flow that we've laid out to go get. And third, we need to make a constant reassessment. If at the end of the day, the returns that we are modeling for the balance of the fleet against the demand that we believe to be there doesn't show, then you should assume we will take more action than none.

因此，第一，我們需要銷售這些汽車，而且我們正在按計劃在 12 月 31 日左右實現這一目標。第三，我們需要不斷重新評估。如果到最後，我們為船隊平衡建模的回報與我們認為存在的需求沒有顯現出來，那麼你應該假設我們會採取更多的行動而不是什麼都不做。

The other aspect around this, I would point out, and this runs the kind of the expense initiatives that Justin has, is I think we have dramatically derisked the ability to go at costs unrelated to the EVs. Meaning away from the sort of clear categories of expense that we are relieving ourselves in the sale of the EVs, we are reducing kind of the operational distraction in the field in a very meaningful way. And in doing that, we will position the field to action some of the cost reduction that Justin has and will take you through. And I think that's an important variable in this.

我想指出的另一個方面是，這運行著賈斯汀所採取的那種費用舉措，我認為我們已經大大降低了以與電動車無關的成本進行生產的能力。這意味著，除了我們在銷售電動車時減輕的那些明確的費用類別之外，我們還在以一種非常有意義的方式來減少現場營運的干擾。在這樣做的過程中，我們將定位該領域以採取賈斯汀已經採取並將帶您經歷的一些成本削減措施。我認為這是其中一個重要的變數。

And so look, we're about providing choice to customers. We think we've landed on an EV fleet that meets demand. But I can assure you if those numbers don't scratch to an adequate return, then we will take further action against that fleet, again, always with a mindset of keeping supply inside demand. And I think the lesson of this, if you will, is that incremental steps to wrestle down the cost elements of the EVs were not going to work and were not going to work with the speed of execution that we were comfortable with. And as a consequence, and as evident in the fourth quarter, the need to take a big bite out of this issue was one that was in front of us and we took it. And if that's not enough, we'll do more. If it is, we'll play forward with attractive returns on the deployment of those vehicles.

所以，我們是為了提供顧客選擇。我們認為我們已經找到了滿足需求的電動車隊。但我可以向你們保證，如果這些數字沒有達到足夠的回報，那麼我們將對該船隊採取進一步行動，同樣，我們始終本著保持供應滿足需求的心態。我認為，這件事的教訓是，透過漸進的方式降低電動車的成本是行不通的，而且也不會以我們能接受的執行速度來實現。因此，正如在第四季度所看到的，我們需要大力解決這個問題，我們也已經採取了行動。如果這還不夠，我們還會做得更多。如果是的話，我們將繼續努力，透過部署這些車輛獲得豐厚的回報。

Stephen, that's really helpful. I guess as a follow-up, I'm curious about how you're thinking about fleet sourcing. And this is both for kind of the 15,000 or so ICE cars that you want to backfill the EV sales with, but also just kind of your natural rotation. I mean, are you willing to lean more into the used car market now that given the current pricing environment there, is that something that's more on the table this year?

史蒂芬，這真的很有幫助。我想作為後續問題，我很好奇您是如何考慮車隊採購的。這既是為了填補電動車銷量缺口而購買的 15,000 輛左右的 ICE 汽車，也是為了實現自然輪換。我的意思是，考慮到目前的價格環境，您是否願意更傾向於二手車市場？

Well, I would say a couple of things on the fleet. First of all, on the ICE vehicles to sort of substitute in for the EVs, recognize that as we reduced down unprofitable network locations, okay? As Justin noted, we are redeploying fleet, mostly ICE vehicles back to airports and other locations. So part of the 15,000, okay, will be vehicles that we're capturing from other locations where utilization is not sufficient, number one. Number two, we are this month at our lowest out of service. We're going to continue to drive out of service down and redeploy and use those vehicles, right, where we can. Third, in deference to cash, we're going to look to sort of manage between purchases and sales and modulate that, again, based on kind of the return profile of what those activities have.

好吧，我想說一些關於艦隊的事情。首先，關於用內燃機汽車取代電動車的問題，我們要認識到，我們已經減少了無利可圖的網路位置，好嗎？正如賈斯汀所說，我們正在重新部署車隊，主要是 ICE 車輛，返回機場和其他地點。所以，首先，這 15,000 輛中的一部分車輛將是我們在其他利用率不夠高的地區回收的。第二，本月我們的服務中斷率最低。我們將繼續在可能的情況下，將這些車輛停駛並重新部署和使用。第三，為了尊重現金，我們將尋求在購買和銷售之間進行管理，並根據這些活動的回報情況進行調整。

So the point I was making was that it will take 15,000 cars to replace the 20,000 cars that we're taking out in the EVs. Again, lower-cost ICE vehicles used at a higher level of utilization. We do not need to go out and buy 15,000 additional cars to make that happen. Part of that will be lower out of service, part of that will be redeployment of the fleet around the overall network particularly as we pinch off unprofitable locations. And I think we're quite comfortable with what's there in our ability to sort of backfill for demand.

所以我要說的是，我們需要 15,000 輛汽車來取代我們正在淘汰的 20,000 輛電動車。再次，成本較低的 ICE 汽車的利用率較高。我們不需要出去購買額外的 15,000 輛汽車來實現這一目標。其中一部分將是降低服務水平，一部分將是在整個網路內重新部署機隊，特別是在我們關閉無利可圖的地點時。我認為，我們對於滿足需求的能力非常滿意。

Our next question comes from the line of Ian Zaffino of Oppenheimer.

我們的下一個問題來自奧本海默公司的伊恩·扎菲諾。

Great. Thanks for all the details on the cost savings. And just conceptually, I'm trying to understand here, when you think about your normalized EBITDA number, I guess, where do you think that is? And then you've stated it previously, so now is this cost savings on top of that normalized earnings number or EBITDA number? Or is this what you need to get to that number?

偉大的。感謝您提供有關成本節約的所有詳細資訊。從概念上來說，我想理解的是，當您考慮標準化的 EBITDA 數字時，您認為它在哪裡？然後您之前已經說過了，那麼現在這個成本節省是在標準化收益數字或 EBITDA 數字之上的嗎？或者這就是您達到該數字所需要的？

So thanks for the question, Ian. Here's what I would tell you. You need to separate out what we're forecasting in terms of EBITDA benefit from the EV sale, okay, which we believe to be $250 million of EBITDA uplift, okay, over 2 years such that, that's a round trip, if you will, relative to the charge that we took in the fourth quarter.

謝謝你的提問，伊恩。以下是我要告訴你的。您需要將我們對 EBITDA 收益的預測從電動車銷售中分離出來，我們認為這將在 2 年內帶來 2.5 億美元的 EBITDA 增幅，相對於我們在第四季度收取的費用，這是一個往返。

So set that aside and let's call that the normal as it were, right, adjusting for the EV move. On top of that, we are coming back to the $500 million that we've spoken of before, which is a combination of new projects like rideshare and otherwise, okay? Second is realizing higher yield on the assets that we have, so sweating the fleet in a way that we can. And the third and perhaps the most important in the context of this call is an ability to gain productivity and pull costs out of the business.

因此，將其放在一邊，我們稱之為正常現象，對吧，根據 EV 移動進行調整。除此之外，我們還要回到之前談到的 5 億美元，這是諸如共乘等新項目的組合，好嗎？第二是實現現有資產的更高收益，從而以我們力所能及的方式充分利用船隊。在這次電話會議中，第三點也許是最重要的一點，就是提高生產力和降低企業成本的能力。

The combination of those 3 things: Projects, yield and cost amount to a $500 million go get. It's within that $500 million that Justin has talked about $250 million of that $500 million being realized through productivity and cost in 2024. So again, separate out the EBITDA benefit that comes back to us on the EV sale, focus then on $500 million of EBITDA addition. And within that $250 million that is a very definite productivity and cost out in 2024. And Justin can give you kind of his take on what's the makeup of that $250 million of cost out this year.

這三個因素加在一起：項目、收益和成本，總計可達 5 億美元。賈斯汀談到，在這 5 億美元中，有 2.5 億美元將在 2024 年透過提高生產力和降低成本來實現。在這 2.5 億美元中，2024 年的生產力和成本非常明確。

Sure. Thanks, Stephen. Ian, if you look at it, I'll say just the majority of our planned $250 million productivity benefit for the year is cost out. So it's spend reduction, taking costs out. If I look across the categories, and we're looking globally, it's just not an Americas effort, we're working across all of our businesses. First thing within staffing and third party, we've already taken action. So we've got head count actions that are benefiting us coming into the year. We're locking down hire new requests. So any new adds are being scrutinized, and we're only adding where essential. And third-party spend, took a tough look first thing when I came in, and we've already identified over $30 million of spend reductions. And I can tell you, we're not done yet.

當然。謝謝，史蒂芬。伊恩，如果你看一下，我會說我們今年計劃的 2.5 億美元生產力收益中大部分已經用完了。因此，這可以減少開支，降低成本。如果我縱觀各個類別，並將我們放眼全球，這不僅僅是美洲的努力，我們的努力涉及所有業務。在人員配備和第三方方面，我們首先已經採取了行動。因此，我們採取的人員統計行動將使我們在今年受益。我們正在鎖定新的僱用請求。因此，任何新添加的內容都會受到審查，並且我們只添加必要的內容。我加入時首先對第三方支出進行了仔細審查，發現我們已經確定了超過 3000 萬美元的支出削減額。我可以告訴你，我們還沒完成。

On footprint, we've closed year-to-date, 8 of our lower-performing retail locations as we expand our relationship with Carvana and others. And we've completed an assessment of our off-airport rent-a-car locations, looking at the ones that are underperforming. And as Stephen highlighted, it gives us the ability to free up vehicles to reallocate to on-airport or other more profitable locations. We expect a sizable portion of those actions to be complete here in Q1.

在足跡方面，隨著我們擴大與 Carvana 和其他公司的合作關係，今年迄今我們已經關閉了 8 家業績較差的零售店。我們也完成了對機場外汽車租賃點的評估，並專注於那些表現不佳的地點。正如史蒂芬所強調的，它使我們能夠釋放車輛並重新分配到機場或其他更有利可圖的地點。我們預計其中很大一部分行動將在第一季完成。

On field productivity. I'm pleased to say the team's energized, it's going. Technology that we launched last year has taken hold. We're rolling out the digital tool on collision I mentioned before. Also on the telematics, seeing real progress on the fuel that's been talked about before. It's accelerating, it's expanding, and it's looking very positive. In procurement, I said we spent almost $3 billion. Just -- if you just think about that for a second, 1% is $30 million. And first kind of observations, there's more that we can do to leverage our larger spend on categories such as tire or glass and we can get real meaningful reductions here, and we're going to.

關於現場生產力。我很高興地說球隊充滿活力，一切都很順利。我們去年推出的技術已經紮根。我們正在推出我之前提到的關於碰撞的數位工具。同樣在遠端資訊處理方面，我們看到了之前談到的燃料方面的真正進展。它正在加速，正在擴張，看起來非常積極。在採購方面，我說我們花了將近 30 億美元。只是——如果你想一想，1% 就是 3000 萬美元。第一種觀察是，我們可以做更多的事情來利用我們在輪胎或玻璃等類別上的更大支出，並且可以在這裡獲得真正有意義的減少，而且我們會這樣做。

And finally, the last category, technology. Our modernization continues, we're seeing benefit of the capabilities that were developed last year. This year, it's all about prioritization, speed of completion, and we're going to see meaningful reductions in spend year-over-year. And as you [heard], there's a lot of activity there across activities. It's the reason why we're taking a programmatic effort to ensure that we stay on track in building out the program office.

最後，最後一個類別，技術。我們的現代化進程仍在繼續，我們看到了去年開發的能力所帶來的好處。今年，最重要的是優先排序和完成速度，我們將看到支出比去年同期大幅減少。正如您所聽到的，那裡有很多各項活動。這就是我們採取計劃性努力來確保專案辦公室建設順利進行的原因。

And I'd just like to say, while I see $250 million in productivity that I outlined, I'm personally going to be disappointed if we don't do more. The opportunities are there. And it's exciting to see the momentum continue to build. I look forward to giving you updates in the future. Thanks for the question. Hopefully, this clarifies.

我只想說，雖然我看到了我所概述的 2.5 億美元的生產力，但如果我們不做得更多，我個人會感到失望。機會就在那裡。看到這一勢頭持續增強令人興奮。我期待著將來向您提供最新消息。謝謝你的提問。希望這能澄清事實。

No, that's great. And I guess maybe higher level on just another topic. You guys seem a little bit more confident in the rate environment and RPD going forward. Kind of what's giving you that confidence? Or maybe give us a little data point on what you saw in January?

不，那太好了。我想也許只是另一個話題的層次比較高。你們似乎對未來的利率環境和 RPD 更有信心。是什麼給了你這樣的信心？或者您可以提供我們一些您在一月份看到的數據嗎？

Sure. So let me start with what we're seeing in January or what we saw in January. First of all, leisure business and leisure demand is really quite strong, and we're seeing considerable volumes across the sort of Sun Belt from Florida all the way west to Hawaii, Hawaii making sort of a considerable rebound. We've seen larger inbound activity growth, and we've seen strong corporate growth, particularly in the Midwest, locations like Detroit and Chicago that are showing high volume.

當然。因此，讓我先從我們在一月份看到的情況開始。首先，休閒商務和休閒需求確實相當強勁，我們看到從佛羅裡達一直向西到夏威夷的陽光地帶都有相當大的數量，夏威夷正在出現相當大的反彈。我們看到入境活動成長幅度較大，也看到企業成長強勁，特別是在中西部地區，底特律和芝加哥等地的入境業務量較大。

I would say that looking backwards, as I said in the prepared remarks, the rate of decline year-over-year on a quarterly basis is decelerating. And so we saw better performance in the fourth quarter on rate than we had seen, again, on a year-over-year basis in the prior quarters.

我想說，回顧過去，正如我在準備好的發言中所說，按季度計算，同比下降的速度正在減緩。因此，我們看到第四季的利率表現優於前幾季的年比表現。

I'd also say that as we listen, as you listen to sort of what the airlines and the hotels and the travel industry is reporting, forecast growth, which is substantial. And I think that the back half of this year holds considerable promise for us in the context of sort of economic trends that are playing, which is lower inflation, lower interest rates and a clear view that the American consumer, in particular, continues to consume travel as an experiential good that they're looking to partake in. And so we're just seeing very strong demand.

我還想說，當我們聽到航空公司、酒店和旅遊業的報告時，預測的增長是可觀的。我認為，在當前的經濟趨勢下，今年下半年對我們來說是相當有希望的，這些經濟趨勢包括較低的通貨膨脹率和較低的利率，而且很明顯，美國消費者尤其是美國消費者繼續將旅行作為一種他們希望參與的體驗式商品。

I would also say that where there are generally higher cost inputs, there is less incentive for any one of the major players in rental to sort of look to lower rate. And on that -- in that regard, I think we feel quite good about what we're seeing, both in terms of demand and what we saw as a decelerating trend in terms of decline. And I'd also point out that, as I did in the remarks, we're 40% better than where we were and stability around that number, I think, is in front of us.

我還想說，一般來說，成本投入越高，租賃業的主要參與者尋求較低利率的動機就越小。就這一點而言，我認為我們對所看到的情況感到相當滿意，無論是需求方面，還是下降趨勢方面的減速方面。我還要指出的是，正如我在評論中所說的那樣，我們現在比以前的水平好了 40%，而且我認為，我們很快就能穩定下來。

Our next question comes from the line of Adam Jonas of Morgan Stanley.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根士丹利的亞當喬納斯。

I have a question for Steve and one for Justin. Steve, what does transitional year mean? Could Hertz lose money, burn cash, test the covenants? I'm getting a lot of questions, a lot of questions from clients on the covenants as another sign of the lack of confidence in the strategy and execution. I'm sure that's not a surprise to you.

我有一個問題想問史蒂夫，還有一個問題想問賈斯汀。史蒂夫，過渡年是什麼意思？赫茲會不會虧損、燒錢、考驗契約呢？我收到了很多問題，很多客戶關於契約的問題，這也是另一個對策略和執行缺乏信心的表現。我確信這對你來說並不奇怪。

But what message do you have for -- I mean there's just an army of people betting against Hertz right now and kind of how much worse does it have to get? Obviously, we know it gets worse, but kind of is there some kind of -- without providing guidance, some base or kind of clearing or bottom that you might have some confidence in terms of how -- where that bottom would be this year. That would mean a lot.

但是您想傳達什麼訊息呢——我的意思是，現在有一大群人正在做空赫茲，而且情況還會變得多糟糕呢？顯然，我們知道情況會變得更糟，但是是否有某種——不提供指導、某種基礎或清算或底部，讓您對今年的底部會在哪裡有信心。這意義重大。

Yes. So here's what I would say, Adam, I think that had we not taken the step that we did around EVs in the fourth quarter, it would be a rocky path forward in terms of trying to sort of patch up for the continuing operational distraction and the cost that we were otherwise incurring on the bottom 1/3 of that fleet. And so I think by taking that step in the fourth quarter, we've set ourselves up with a much clearer path to sort of the reconciliation of our cost structure to a revenue line that is strong and sustainable.

是的。所以我想說的是，亞當，我認為如果我們沒有在第四季度針對電動車採取措施，那麼在試圖彌補持續的營運幹擾和我們在底層 1/3 的車隊上產生的成本方面，前進的道路將是坎坷的。因此，我認為，透過在第四季度採取這一舉措，我們為自己制定了一條更清晰的路徑，以協調我們的成本結構與強勁而可持續的收入線。

This company is not experiencing revenue intake or demand. What it was and is experiencing is a cost challenge. We pinched off the single largest component of that cost challenge, which is the EVs. And as I've said, if we need to do more, we will, but reducing 1/3 of that fleet puts us in a better position. It yields out certainly on depreciation and a short view on a reduction in expense, and it promises to carry lower direct operating expense relative to our ability to meet that demand with ICE vehicles.

該公司沒有收入來源或需求。它過去和現在所經歷的都是成本挑戰。我們解決了成本挑戰中最大的一個部分，也就是電動車。正如我所說的，如果我們需要做更多，我們會做的，但減少 1/3 的船隊規模可以讓我們處於更有利的地位。它肯定會產生折舊收益，並且從短期來看會減少費用，並且相對於我們使用 ICE 汽車滿足需求的能力，它有望降低直接營運費用。

I think secondly, it sets up Justin to achieve the elements and items in his cost out that he reflected in the prior question. And I think these are in front of us, and this is not sort of a blueprint. These are actions that are being taken right now. It therefore gives us confidence that against a very good and solid demand rate and revenue backdrop, we have a path where we've already taken a very big down payment in the charge we took in the fourth quarter.

我認為其次，它幫助賈斯汀實現他在上一個問題中反映的成本要素和項目。我認為這些就在我們面前，而這並不是什麼藍圖。這些都是目前正在採取的行動。因此，我們有信心，在非常好和穩固的需求率和收入背景下，我們已經在第四季度收取了非常大一筆首付。

And therefore, a transitional year means that in 2024, we are executing against the reduction in the EV fleet against a series of very precise cost-out elements that gives us confidence that we won't be in a position where the covenants will come into play and that we will emerge at the end of '24 into '25 with a much better cost structure against which we can engage on a level of demand that is in front of us.

因此，過渡年意味著在 2024 年，我們將根據一系列非常精確的成本要素來減少電動汽車車隊，這使我們有信心，我們不會處於契約發揮作用的境地，並且我們將在 24 年底到 25 年底出現更好的成本結構，我們可以據此滿足擺在我們面前的需求水平。

And I think equally, if one forecast for what the back end of this year might look like, much as I'm not relying on that for the success of Hertz, but lower interest rates and continued demand and lower inflation spells well both for the core element of demand in the business, a control over cost and equally stability to residual prices, which lends itself to an easier execution across the whole. And so that's what I'm referring to in terms of transitional and kind of a little bit of my own mindset about how the forward is accomplished.

而且我認為，如果有人預測今年年底的情況會是什麼樣子，儘管我並不依賴這一點來預測赫茲的成功，但較低的利率和持續的需求以及較低的通貨膨脹，對於業務需求的核心要素、成本控制和剩餘價格的穩定來說，都是有利的，這有助於整個過程更容易執行。這就是我所指的過渡，以及我自己對如何實現前進的看法。

Thanks, Stephen. Justin, I know you've only been at the company for 90 days, but you did say you were out in the field. I'd be very interested in what the field managers, licensees, people on the desk, what they're most concerned about? What's their top like Justin, you got to fix this. This is not good enough. What -- and anything take you by surprise? And as a follow-up, I'd be -- well, I have one -- and I just have one little follow-up to that question, but what were you hearing from them?

謝謝，史蒂芬。賈斯汀，我知道你來公司才 90 天，但你確實說過你在外地工作。我非常感興趣的是，現場經理、許可證持有者、前台人員最關心的是什麼？他們的頂級作品像賈斯汀一樣，你必須解決這個問題。這還不夠好。什麼－有什麼事情令您感到驚訝嗎？作為後續問題，我想 — — 嗯，我有一個 — — 我對這個問題只有一個小小的後續問題，但是你從他們那裡聽到了什麼？

Yes, sure thing. So I'll say it was extremely invigorating to go see the passion in the field. These employees, some of them have been there for decades, are hugely customer service-oriented and focused. And I'll say the one kind of unanimous theme to answer your question is they were concerned about the EVs and having to substitute EVs for consumers that might not otherwise have wanted them. And that has an NPS effect. It's certainly if people aren't looking to drive an EV or whatnot, we're seeing incident rates of damage and collision.

是的，當然可以。所以我想說，親眼見證現場的熱情是極為令人振奮的。這些員工有些人已經在那裡工作了幾十年，他們非常注重客戶服務並且十分專注。我想說，回答你的問題時，一個一致的主題是，他們擔心電動車，並且必須為那些原本可能不想要電動車的消費者提供替代品。這會產生 NPS 效應。顯然，如果人們不想駕駛電動車或其他車輛，我們就會看到損壞和碰撞事故的發生率。

But that the feedback I've gotten with this announcement. It was -- we didn't take this announcement lightly, is that this will give us some bandwidth to focus back on servicing the customers as Hertz has been known to do.

但這就是我對此聲明所得到的回饋。是的 — — 我們並沒有輕視這一聲明，因為這將為我們帶來一些頻寬，讓我們能夠重新專注於為客戶提供服務，就像赫茲一直以來所做的那樣。

Okay. And my follow-up there is, what about the mileage of the cars? My understanding is your cars are (expletive) old, really just -- what -- did that come up?

好的。我的後續問題是，汽車的行駛里程如何？我的理解是你的車（髒話）很舊，真的只是──什麼──發生了什麼事？

And I'd be curious if you could please give us some data on that. What's the average mileage of your fleet, for example, in the U.S. Where is that versus normal? Where do you want it to be? Because that strikes me as an indicator. I don't know if you'd consider it a KPI, Justin, but it's something that if you have a smelly car with 60,000 miles on it, it's just got -- getting your OpEx up. That's not something Enterprise and Avis is doing right now, but you are. So tell us where you are and where you want to be on that. That's really important.

我很好奇您是否可以提供一些相關數據。例如，在美國，你們車隊的平均行駛里程是多少？你想把它放在哪裡？因為這對我來說是一個指標。賈斯汀，我不知道你是否會將其視為 KPI，但如果你擁有一輛行駛了 60,000 英里並且有異味的汽車，它就會 - 增加你的運營成本。這不是 Enterprise 和 Avis 目前正在做的事情，但您正在做。那麼請告訴我們您目前在哪裡以及您想要去哪裡。這真的很重要。

Adam, let me take it first, and then I'll pass it to Justin. The fleet plan that we have for '24 is to meaningfully reduce the age of the fleet. I mean by several hundred basis points in terms of the percentage of cars that ultimately will be 50,000 miles or older. So that's the path that we are on in the context of the first part of your question and be -- about the transition, okay?

亞當，讓我先拿走它，然後我會把它傳給賈斯汀。我們針對'24年的機隊計劃是大幅縮短機隊的使用年限。我指的是最終行駛里程達到 50,000 英里或更久的汽車所佔比例的幾百個基點。這就是我們在你的問題第一部分所走的路線，關於過渡，好嗎？

The second is that we do have homes for cars that are not otherwise being rented to Hertz premium customers. So for example, growth in Dollar and TNC, I'm not suggesting that these are cars that wouldn't want to be rented, but these are older cars that have homes for them. And I think that's an important sort of element to think about in the context of a comparison to others, where our rideshare business is not sort of common to the others that are in it. But the fleet in our current fleet plan is meant to become -- or meant to be rendered appreciably younger, both in age and miles.

第二，我們確實為那些原本不會租給赫茲高端客戶的汽車提供了存放處。舉例來說，美元和 TNC 的成長，我並不是說這些車不想被租，而是這些老爺車需要有家。我認為，這是一個需要考慮的重要因素，與其他公司相比，我們的共乘業務與其他公司並不相同。但我們目前船隊計畫中的船隊將變得更年輕，或將顯著變得更年輕，無論是船齡還是里程數。

And I'll ask Justin to finish up on your question.

我請賈斯汀繼續回答你的問題。

Yes, just to -- yes, to expand a bit upon that, too. The other positive thing is we look to our fleet plan for 2024, we're noticing a transition with our -- becoming more of a buyer's market than a seller's market that we experienced with the OEMs over the past couple of years. Already in Europe, we're seeing program cars that are at very favorable rates to what we've experienced in '23 and earlier. And it enables us to take good actions with the refresh in the fleet that Stephen otherwise outlined.

是的，只是 — — 是的，也稍微擴展一下這一點。另一件積極的事情是，我們展望了 2024 年的車隊計劃，我們注意到我們正在轉變——變得更加買方市場，而不是過去幾年我們在 OEM 上經歷的賣方市場。在歐洲，我們已經看到計劃汽車的價格與我們在 2023 年及之前經歷的價格相比非常優惠。這使我們能夠按照史蒂芬所概述的方式對艦隊進行更新，並採取良好的行動。

Adam, I'd also say that, obviously, in rendering your fleet younger is one part buy and one part sell. And I wouldn't take the comment lightly in the context of our access, unlike others, to a proprietary retail network and Carvana and others like them in part because in a declining residual market, okay, the delta historically between wholesale and that retail can be 10% or greater.

亞當，我還想說，顯然，讓你的車隊更年輕化，一部分是買，一部分是賣。而且我不會輕視這一評論，因為我們與其他公司不同，可以訪問專有零售網絡以及 Carvana 和其他類似公司，部分原因是在不斷下滑的剩餘市場中，從歷史上看，批發和零售之間的差額可能達到 10% 或更大。

And so the ability for us within the balance of what we're trying to do in a transitional year, to dispose of fleet at prices that are not necessarily reflected in what you see in indices that track wholesale auction will be a benefit to us in the context of managing the financial element of this kind of fleet rotation.

因此，在過渡年中，我們試圖以不一定反映在追蹤批發拍賣的指數中的價格處理船隊，這將有利於我們管理這種船隊輪換的財務要素。

Okay. We'll follow up on the mileage later if you didn't want to provide it.

好的。如果您不想提供里程數，我們稍後會跟進。

Sure.

當然。

Our next question comes from the line of John Healy of Northcoast Research.

我們的下一個問題來自 Northcoast Research 的 John Healy。

Stephen, I wanted to get a couple of big-picture questions into you. Obviously, a lot of time spent this morning on EV. But can we talk about EV and ride hailing together? Obviously, 2 businesses that are kind of newer to the company over the last 5 years. As you look at these businesses, does maybe the hypothesis or the penciling out of the potential need to be longer term revisited just from what you're learning because I think there was an expectation that EV and ride hailing could be actually margin accretive type businesses. I'm curious to know now that you've been in them, if you agree with kind of the longer-term economics and potential of those businesses or is this the sign that maybe it penciled out on Excel, but in reality, just these businesses are just different than we thought. So I'd love to get your thoughts there.

史蒂芬，我想問你幾個宏觀問題。顯然，今天早上我在 EV 上花費了大量時間。但是我們可以一起談論電動車和叫車服務嗎？顯然，這兩項業務對公司來說都是過去 5 年較新的業務。當你審視這些業務時，從你所了解的情況來看，是否需要從長期角度重新審視假設或潛力的計算，因為我認為人們預期電動車和叫車服務實際上可以成為利潤增值型業務。我很好奇，既然您已經涉足這些業務，您是否認同這些業務的長期經濟效益和潛力，或者這是否只是 Excel 上列出的跡象，但實際上，這些業務與我們想像的不同。所以我很想聽聽你的想法。

No, that's an excellent question. I would say the following. I think the long-term proposition around that business is a good one. I think that it's not to be ignored that against the financial model, if you will, at the time that Hertz entered this when it came out of bankruptcy, a number of things have happened, not least of which is the deployment of Teslas has become a more expensive proposition because when the MSRP came down, the residual came down and the depreciation went up. And obviously, the experience around damage has been elevated.

不，這是一個非常好的問題。我想說的是以下幾點。我認為這項業務的長期主張是好的。我認為，不容忽視的是，與財務模型相反，在赫茲擺脫破產並進入這個行業的時候，發生了許多事情，其中​​最主要的是特斯拉的部署變得更加昂貴，因為當製造商建議零售價下降時，殘值下降，折舊上升。顯然，損害方面的體驗已經提升了。

So if you think about your revenue intake and you deduct your cost of the car, largely depreciation, you deduct damage and then you look at other expenses, it yields a positive margin, but not near that, which it had initially -- or we had initially intended it to do. So we need to rotate the sort of cars in there, and we have obviously reduced down the number of EVs that are in there. And the forward will be deployment of less expensive cars, which will render that business more profitable.

因此，如果您考慮您的收入並扣除汽車成本（主要是折舊），扣除損壞，然後再考慮其他費用，它會產生正利潤，但不會接近最初的利潤——或者我們最初打算達到的利潤。所以我們需要輪換那裡的汽車類型，而且我們顯然減少了那裡的電動車數量。未來將會部署價格更便宜的汽車，這將使該業務更有利可圖。

The other thing I will say to you is that this business for drivers that are in our car for an extended period of weeks. So in other words, when you get past 4 weeks or 5 weeks of a driver in that car, the economics are very attractive, meaning you need to get through the initial underwriting of the driver, okay, and some experience of that driver in the car because when you get that combination of a well underwritten driver and a driver that has experience, the margins on that car are very attractive in part because the maintenance and the churn goes down, the driver is keeping the car an extended period just as the model held. The damage level is low because the incident level is low because the driver is experienced in the context of the EV, perhaps they hadn't been at the start.

我要告訴你的另一件事是，這項業務是為那些在我們的車上待了數週的司機開設的。換句話說，當駕駛員駕駛該車輛超過 4 週或 5 週時，經濟效益會非常有吸引力，這意味著您需要通過駕駛員的初始承保，並且需要該駕駛員有一定的駕駛經驗，因為當您獲得承保良好的駕駛員和經驗豐富的駕駛員的組合時，該車輛的利潤率會非常有吸引力，部分原因是維護良好的駕駛員和經驗豐富的駕駛員的組合時，該車輛的利潤率會非常有吸引力，部分原因是維護和客戶流失率會下降，以及將車輛流失率的數量會保持較長時間。損壞程度較低，因為事故發生率較低，因為駕駛者對電動車有經驗，也許他們在開始時並沒有這種經驗。

So the real challenge is to get by if you will, the cost of acquisition on the driver because the margin on the longer-term driver is very, very attractive. And you should assume that we are working with Uber and Lyft and others to sort of overcome that issue. And so I know that's a little bit more than sort of a yes or no answer, but it is a finesse business model, and I think it works. I think we were thrown a curve relative to sort of how it modeled out from the start, but I think that's the direction we're going. And I think that's an attractive business as a general matter, but we need to work through that underwriting segment of it.

因此，真正的挑戰是，如果你願意的話，如何降低司機的收購成本，因為長期司機的利潤率非常非常有吸引力。你應該假設我們正在與 Uber、Lyft 和其他公司合作來解決這個問題。所以我知道這不僅僅是一個是或否的答案，但這是一種巧妙的商業模式，我認為它是有效的。我認為我們從一開始就被拋出了一個曲線，相對於它如何建模，但我認為這就是我們前進的方向。我認為從總體上來說這是一項很有吸引力的業務，但我們需要解決承保部分的問題。

And just a quick follow-up question for me. When you guys talked about the $250 million of cost on EV being recovered over 2 years and then the $250 million of cost benefit this year, how much of that EV item do you think we would recover this year? And when you talk about those cost items, is that flow through for 2024? Or is that like a run rate number? How do we parse what we actually might see kind of in the results this year?

對我來說這只是一個簡單的後續問題。當你們談到 2 年內收回 2.5 億美元的 EV 成本，然後今年獲得 2.5 億美元的成本效益時，您認為我們今年可以收回多少 EV 項目？當您談到這些成本項目時，這些成本項目是否會流向 2024 年？或者這就像一個運行率數字？我們如何分析今年實際上可能看到的結果？

Sure. So I would say on the $250 million of EBITDA recapture over 2 years in the aggregate, I mean, roughly speaking, I would say it's 50-50, right, over '24 and then '25 and then obviously runs, okay, as a permanent fixture in our overall EBITDA production.

當然。因此，我想說，就兩年內總計 2.5 億美元的 EBITDA 回收而言，我的意思是，粗略地說，我會說這是 50-50，對吧，在 24 年和 25 年，然後顯然會作為我們整體 EBITDA 生產的永久固定部分運行。

On the separate $250 million of cost out that Justin was referring to, you should view that as cost coming out and materializing in 2024 and to carry forward on a run rate basis as we move. Again, that's a byproduct of both productivity and cost.

關於賈斯汀提到的另外 2.5 億美元的成本，你應該將其視為 2024 年產生並實現的成本，並將隨著我們的前進按運行率結轉。再次強調，這是生產力和成本的副產品。

Our next question comes from the line of Stephanie Moore of Jefferies.

我們的下一個問題來自傑富瑞（Jefferies）的斯蒂芬妮·摩爾（Stephanie Moore）。

There's a good number of moving pieces here that you kind of went through on the call here. So Stephen, I know you said in the past that you expected to achieve EBITDA growth in 2024. But given the current dynamics and -- but also your own cost reduction programs, is this still the case?

這裡有很多移動的部分，您在通話中已經討論過了。所以史蒂芬，我知道您過去曾說過，預計在 2024 年實現 EBITDA 成長。

Well, I think EBITDA in '24 will show to be higher than what we produced in '23, taking account of the EV charge that was otherwise taken in Q4. So I think we'll see a higher level of EBITDA production in '24 relative to the reported number in '23.

嗯，我認為 24 年的 EBITDA 將高於 23 年的水平，同時考慮到第四季度產生的 EV 費用。因此，我認為，相對於23年報告的數字，24年的EBITDA產量將會更高。

Okay. No, perfect. That's helpful. And then as you think about the cadence of these initiatives, again, these kind of major cost savings, when should we expect to start to see those materialize in 2024? How quickly can these headwinds that we certainly saw in 2023 can start to be offset. I mean, is this more of a second half 2024? Or just any kind of color on the cadence throughout 2024 would be helpful.

好的。不，完美。這很有幫助。然後，當您考慮這些舉措的節奏時，同樣，這些重大的成本節約，我們應該何時期望在 2024 年開始看到它們實現？我們在 2023 年看到的這些逆風多快才能開始被抵銷。我的意思是，這更像是 2024 年下半年嗎？或者 2024 年期間的任何一種顏色節奏都會有幫助。

Well, I think on the EVs, obviously, they are being sold out now, much as the depreciation has been stopped on those cars. So depreciation should fall pretty quickly in the context of that zeroing out on the charge itself. Obviously, the cost will be reduced down as progress is made on the sale of the 20,000 vehicles, which is running at pace. And we're obviously quite incented to see that happen quicker than longer. Maybe I'll ask Justin to comment on kind of the pace and when you'll see some earlier, some later in the context of the categories he's focused on.

嗯，我認為就電動車而言，顯然它們現在已經售罄，因為這些汽車的折舊已經停止了。因此，在費用本身歸零的情況下，折舊應該很快就會下降。顯然，隨著 20,000 輛汽車的銷售進度加快，成本將會降低。我們顯然非常希望看到這項進程能更快實現。也許我會請賈斯汀評論一下節奏，以及何時您會在他關注的類別中看到一些較早的內容，一些較晚的內容。

Sure. On some of just the cost out on budget reductions or third-party spend, we've enacted those already. So we're going to see the benefit of those starting here in Q1, which will run rate through the entire year. Some of the other items will take a bit more time just to get in place as well as roll out across the broader network. So we will see a bit of a ramp as the year goes through. But that's natural with any cost reduction program. As you implement, you see the benefits compound in the back half of the year.

當然。對於一些關於預算削減或第三方支出的成本，我們已經實施了。因此，我們將看到從第一季開始的這些舉措帶來的好處，這些好處將持續全年。其他一些項目可能還需要一些時間才能到位並在更廣泛的網路中推廣。因此，隨著時間的推移，我們將看到一些上升趨勢。但對於任何成本削減計劃來說這都是很自然的。隨著您實施，您會看到收益在下半年不斷增加。

Got it. And then just one kind of somewhat related question. I think we saw that Tesla announced a pretty major recall here in the last couple of weeks. Can you just kind of walk us through what that impact could be on your business?

知道了。接下來只是有點相關的問題。我想我們看到特斯拉在過去幾週宣布了一次相當重大的召回。您能否向我們介紹一下這會對您的業務產生什麼影響？

Well, I think you should always assume that we obviously follow all of the recalls and make sure that we comply with necessary rules and laws as it relates to that with respect to the rental car industry. I would say on the recalls, at least in the past with Tesla, they've been over-the-air recall, so software adjustments that have been made. And so it is easier to execute on those recalls. But that's largely how we're dealing with all of them.

嗯，我認為你應該始終假設我們顯然遵守所有的召回，並確保我們遵守與租車行業相關的必要規則和法律。關於召回，我想說的是，至少過去特斯拉的召回都是透過無線方式進行的，因此對軟體進行了調整。這樣，執行這些召回行動就變得更容易了。但我們處理這些問題基本上都是這樣。

Our next question comes from the line of Ryan Brinkman of JPMorgan.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根大通的瑞安·布林克曼 (Ryan Brinkman)。

I wanted to ask on the softer trend of earnings in 4Q apart from the onetime charge related to the plan to sell 20,000 electric vehicles. I'm curious in order to help us better understand the jumping off point as we head into 2024, the annualized rate of EBITDA, I guess, how much of the shortfall excluding the charge, may have nevertheless still related to the EV fleet headaches that should significantly ameliorate given the sale, such as higher damage repair costs or maybe even the RPD pressures that bled over from having too many EVs in the RAC fleet versus how much of the shortfall in 4Q ex the charge might be more of a recurring nature, such as normal course depreciation on the EVs you are retaining or on the rest of the portfolio or incrementally softer non-EV, RPD, et cetera.

我想問一下，除了與銷售 20,000 輛電動車計畫相關的一次性費用外，第四季獲利趨勢是否有所減弱。我很好奇，為了幫助我們更好地理解進入 2024 年的起點，我想，EBITDA 的年化率，不包括費用在內的缺口中有多少可能仍然與電動汽車車隊的問題有關，這些問題在出售後應該會得到顯著改善，例如更高的損壞修復成本，或者甚至可能是由於 RAC 車隊中擁有電動電動車而導致的電動太多汽車、RPD 等的逐步疲軟。

How are you thinking about these considerations? And after taking them into account and excluding the charge, how should investors be thinking about the sequential trend in EBITDA results generally from 4Q to 1Q this year relative to the more typical 4Q to 1Q seasonal pattern?

您是如何考慮這些因素的？在將這些因素考慮在內並剔除費用之後，相對於更典型的第四季度至第一季度季節性模式，投資者應該如何看待今年第四季度至第一季的 EBITDA 結果的連續趨勢？

Well, I would say that -- remember, we spoke about several points of margin as the effect of EV relative to ICE. So think about that as a $70 million to $80 million drag in the quarter in the context of overall cost. I would say that wholly independent of the specific entry categories of expense, and I made this comment earlier, I think the implication has manifested in the fourth quarter of the EV challenge, which in part motivated us to take the charge and the action that we did is the spillover effect and the distraction on the field more broadly. It meant that we were running with personnel higher than we needed to. It meant that we were incurring transport costs higher than we needed to.

嗯，我想說的是——記住，我們談到了 EV 相對於 ICE 的影響的幾個邊際點。因此，從總成本的角度來看，這將為本季帶來 7,000 萬至 8,000 萬美元的拖累。我想說的是，這完全獨立於具體的費用類別，我之前也發表過這一評論，我認為這種影響已經在第四季度的 EV 挑戰中得到體現，這在一定程度上促使我們承擔起責任，而我們所做的行動產生了溢出效應，並更廣泛地分散了該領域的注意力。這意味著我們的人員配備超過了實際需求。這意味著我們承擔的運輸成本高於實際需求。

All of those or both of those, I should say, are not linked, if you will, to the EV itself and the way in which we refer to several points of margin. But the spillover effect on our cost base was becoming too widespread and therefore, taking a bolder action to arrest that trend by pulling down 1/3 of the fleet was the choice that we made.

我應該說，所有這些或這兩者都與 EV 本身以及我們引用幾個邊際點的方式無關。但對我們的成本基礎的溢出效應變得過於廣泛，因此，我們選擇採取更大膽的行動，透過削減 1/3 的船隊來阻止這種趨勢。

But I'm giving you that because there's an effect that's related to the EV fleet then there's sort of the collateral impact on broader cost that was there. And I think you're equally right in the context of uplift to RPD that we can get by virtue of, if you will, removing sort of the worst performers among the EV fleet in terms of RPD and the like.

但我之所以給你這個數據，是因為這與電動車隊有關，然後對更廣泛的成本產生了某種附帶影響。而且我認為您在提升 RPD 方面同樣正確，如果您願意的話，我們可以透過從電動車隊中剔除 RPD 等表現最差的車輛來實現這一目標。

Okay. And maybe just delving in on that last topic there. Could you help us with dimensioning the step-down in those repair costs and the cadence or pace of that step down, you did suggest that it would drop by more than 1/3 of the repair cost, given that these are the more problematic vehicles, right? But then what are the other kind of knock-on benefits there? Like Tesla was supplying a certain amount of parts that wasn't sufficient but now it will be more sufficient, right?

好的。也許只是深入探討最後一個主題。您能否幫助我們確定維修成本的下降幅度以及下降的節奏或速度，考慮到這些都是問題較多的車輛，您確實說過維修成本會下降 1/3 以上，對嗎？但那還有哪些其他的連鎖效益呢？就像特斯拉之前供應的零件數量不夠，現在應該夠了，對吧？

And then also, there's the efforts that you talked about on the 3Q call, I don't know maybe around vertical integration or something. Just given all of these factors, do you have an estimate for the dollar savings in '24 versus '23, I don't know, in EBITDA or in DOE per transaction day or something like that?

另外，還有您在第三季電話會議上談到的努力，我不知道也許是圍繞垂直整合或其他什麼。考慮到所有這些因素，您是否能估計一下 2024 年與 2023 年相比，EBITDA 或 DOE 每交易日的美元節省金額是多少？

Well, listen, they should trend lower. And remember that there were a series of steps that we were taking to try to address both the elevated damage and the elevated cost of damage, including as Justin referenced, we just didn't begin to negotiate with the OEMs on lower labor and lower parts cost. But at the end of the day, that was not going to make a sufficient difference, okay, to sort of put us back on track as fast as we wanted. So therefore, the reduction mattered.

嗯，聽著，它們應該會呈現下降趨勢。請記住，我們已經採取了一系列措施來嘗試解決損害增加和損害成本增加的問題，包括正如賈斯汀所提到的，我們只是沒有開始與原始設備製造商就降低勞動力和降低零件成本進行談判。但到頭來，這並沒有帶來足夠的改變，無法讓我們以我們想要的速度回到正軌。因此，減少很重要。

It also means though that those measures that we were taking, okay, will have greater effect on the balance of the 2/3 of the EVs that are there. And if they don't, then we'll move more aggressively on that fleet size. But the effect of the cost out, if you will, on the EVs is more effective against 65% of the standing fleet as opposed to 100%. And again, taking out the biggest offenders of RPD and the biggest offenders of damage incident and therefore, cost will translate into what I was saying before, which is probably a 50% reduction in that, notwithstanding only removing 1/3 of the fleet itself.

但這也意味著，我們所採取的那些措施將對現有 2/3 電動車的平衡產生更大的影響。如果他們不這樣做，那麼我們將更積極地擴大船隊規模。但是，如果你願意的話，成本支出對電動車的影響對於 65％ 的現有車隊來說更為有效，而不是 100％。再說一遍，拆除 RPD 的最大違規者和造成損害事件的最大違規者，因此，成本將轉化為我之前所說的，儘管只拆除了 1/3 的艦隊，但成本可能會減少 50%。

That's very helpful. And then just lastly, I know there was some discussion earlier about normalized earnings, but just maybe looking beyond all this noise, maybe out 2 years from now or something like that. What would you say is the normalized earnings power? I mean, I know there's some EBITDA numbers. What about like -- have you looked at it on an EBITDA per car basis just given sort of any structural change in the size of the market or in market share?

這非常有幫助。最後，我知道之前對正常化收益進行了一些討論，但也許拋開所有這些噪音不談，也許是從現在起 2 年後或類似的情況。您認為標準化的獲利能力是多少？我的意思是，我知道有一些 EBITDA 數字。那麼——您是否根據每輛車的 EBITDA 來考慮這個問題，只是考慮到市場規模或市場份額發生了結構性變化？

And when you compare EBITDA per car normalized versus pre-pandemic, what are the big differences there, is it because we've got the RPD tailwind or what improvement do you expect that there is? And what are the biggest drivers of the improvement?

當您將每輛車的 EBITDA 與疫情前的正常化進行比較時，它們之間有哪些很大的區別，是因為我們得到了 RPD 的順風，還是您預計會有什麼改善？那麼推動這項改善的最大因素是什麼？

Well, I mean, listen, from a methodology point of view to try to get back to what you would view to be a normal number, you need to reverse or pull back the benefit of the EV sale right, of $250 million as we've been forecasting over the 2 years and sort of start yourself from there. And then it will be a question of the pace of achievement of the $500 million that we've talked about, which is both revenue and productivity and cost.

嗯，我的意思是，從方法論的角度來看，為了試圖回到你認為的正常數字，你需要扭轉或撤回電動車銷售帶來的收益，也就是我們在過去兩年內預測的 2.5 億美元，然後從那裡開始。然後就是我們談到的實現 5 億美元目標的速度問題，包括收入、生產力和成本。

I think that there ought to be heightened confidence in the ability to take the cost out and ascertain the productivity gains as we represented, we will do to the tune of $250 million by the end of '24. And so half of that $500 million should be seen by the end of '24, right, with progress on the $250 million of EV. So listen, it's hard for me to sort of put myself in your place and understand the assumptions you want to make about the broader market and the like. But there's $250 million of EV and there's $500 million to be had. Of that $500 million, $250 million is in the first year, namely 2024.

我認為，我們應該對降低成本和提高生產力的能力有更高的信心，正如我們所表示的，到24年底，我們將實現 2.5 億美元的目標。因此，這 5 億美元的一半應該會在 24 年底前到賬，對吧，同時 2.5 億美元的 EV 也會取得進展。所以聽著，我很難把自己放在你的立場上，理解你對更廣泛的市場等做出的假設。但企業價值有 2.5 億美元，而且還有 5 億美元可供取得。在這 5 億美元中，有 2.5 億美元用於第一年，即 2024 年。

I think you then need to make assumptions about whether you believe that the deceleration in rate decline and the extent to which we are 40% better than where we were pre-pandemic holds, I don't see a reason why it shouldn't as we hit sort of a more normalized position. I think that -- as it relates to residuals and how that weighs on the industry, no less ourselves, again, there you need to take stock of the fact that while we have seen precipitous decline off of the very elevated levels that existed in '22.

我認為你需要做出一些假設，即你是否相信利率下降的減速以及我們比大流行前好 40% 的程度會保持不變，我認為隨著我們達到一種更加正常化的狀態，它沒有理由不保持不變。我認為—因為它與殘差有關，以及它對行業的影響，更不用說我們自己了，你需要考慮到這樣一個事實，雖然我們已經看到從22年的非常高的水平急劇下降。

The reality is, is that -- the age of cars on U.S. roads right now was less than 10 years pre-pandemic. It's now at about 12.5 years, okay? Number two, there's a structural short of good quality used cars because they weren't made in the pandemic. So off-lease cars are lower.

事實是，目前美國道路上的汽車使用年限在疫情前還不到 10 年。現在大約是 12.5 年了，好嗎？第二，優質二手車有結構性短缺，因為它們不是在疫情期間生產的。因此租賃期滿後的汽車價格較低。

If you further believe that we will come upon a market toward the back half of the year, where auto loans will be more attainable and at lower price that cocktail of factors should lead you to believe that there is at the very least stability in residuals, if not an uptick that could come at the back half.

如果您進一步相信我們將在今年下半年進入汽車貸款更容易獲得且價格更低的市場，那麼這些因素的綜合作用應該會讓您相信，殘值至少是穩定的，如果不是下半年可能出現的上升的話。

Again, we're not gaming, if you will, or modeling necessarily for that. I'm just giving you in response to your question, sort of a sense of where do I think rate is, where do I think residuals are, kind of wholly independent of the tactical moves that we're making to reduce cost.

再說一遍，如果你願意的話，我們不是玩遊戲，也不一定是為了玩遊戲而建模。我只是在回答你的問題，讓你了解我認為利率在哪裡，我認為殘差在哪裡，這完全獨立於我們為降低成本所採取的策略舉措。

Our next question comes from the line of Lizzie Dove of Goldman Sachs.

我們的下一個問題來自高盛的 Lizzie Dove。

You noted that you're prioritizing RPD over utilization this year and you've also talked to stable RPD repeatedly during this call. But wondering if you could just clarify how you're thinking about that, whether that reflects the change in strategy? And what exactly you do mean by stable? I think if I look at the numbers this quarter, it was nearly down kind of mid-single digits. And so I just want to see kind of how you kind of think about it into 2024 and the kind of range of outcomes for RPD.

您指出，今年您優先考慮 RPD 而不是利用率，並且在本次通話中您也多次談到穩定的 RPD。但我想知道您是否可以澄清一下您是如何考慮這個問題的，這是否反映了策略的變化？那你說的穩定到底是什麼意思呢？我想如果我看一下本季的數字，它幾乎下降了中等個位數。所以我只是想看看你對 2024 年的看法以及 RPD 的結果範圍。

Yes. Well, I guess, first principle is that we should continue to hold supply of cars inside where we expect demand to be, right, so that we can run at a respectable level of utilization and I think we're not of a mind to have capital deployed against cars that are simply not going to be used, okay? There are obvious variations in demand, quick moves, troughs and peaks. And so you need to hold cars for that, our view has been not to chase low-quality demand even if it meant that utilization sort of falls.

是的。嗯，我想，首要的原則是我們應該繼續將汽車供應控制在我們預期需求的範圍內，這樣我們才能以可觀的利用率運行，而且我認為我們不介意將資金投入到那些根本不會使用的汽車上，好嗎？需求變化明顯，變化迅速，有低谷，有高峰。因此你需要持有汽車，我們的觀點是不要追逐低品質的需求，即使這意味著利用率會下降。

So there is a baseline of holding supply inside demand. And then there's the execution in the moment where I'm not of a mind to sort of chase low-quality demand that's not expressing sort of a sufficient RPD. And so the combination of those 2 should hold us there.

因此，存在一個保持供應滿足需求的基準。然後就是在執行的時候，我並不想追逐那些無法表達足夠 RPD 的低品質需求。所以，這兩者結合起來應該可以讓我們達到那個目標。

In terms of the broader sort of optimism or confidence on stability, candidly, I look at what you look at, which is I look at whether there is motive, right, to sort of drive price down by any one of our competitors. I don't believe there is. Okay? There's no world in which lowering price brings more demand to the industry. It may split share, but share has been very stable across the majors across a variety of markets.

就更廣泛的樂觀情緒或對穩定性的信心而言，坦白說，我會看你所關注的內容，也就是看我們的任何一個競爭對手是否有動機壓低價格。我不相信有。好的？降低價格並不一定會為產業帶來更多需求。它可能會分割份額，但在各個市場的主要股票份額一直非常穩定。

So there's not an embedded incentive. Nobody is making a decision to take a business trip or not, or to take a vacation or not because the rate on the rental car is $5 higher or lower. So there's no particular incentive across the industry to lower rate as if it's going to generate industry-driven demand. And there doesn't seem to be a chase for share on that basis.

因此不存在內在激勵。沒有人會因為租車費用高出或低出 5 美元而決定是否出差或是否度假。因此，整個產業並沒有特別的動力去降低利率，好像這會產生產業驅動的需求。從這個角度來看，似乎並沒有出現對份額的追逐。

And then again, sort of stability in what we're seeing across travel, in fact, growth that's being forecast by airlines and hotels these are to our left and right in the context of where they deposit our customers at the airport. And so to the extent that travel continues, you should see us rationalize as Justin was saying, our off-airport locations, maintaining sufficiency of network, which I think is very valuable to us, but redeploying cars to the airport where these travelers are coming and optimizing to price at the same time.

再說了，我們看到整個旅遊業呈現一種穩定態勢，事實上，航空公司和飯店預測會出現成長，這些都是我們在機場將客戶送達何處時看到的。因此，在旅行繼續進行的範圍內，你應該看到我們像賈斯汀所說的那樣，合理化我們在機場外的位置，保持網絡的充足性，我認為這對我們來說非常有價值，但重新部署汽車到這些旅客到達的機場，同時優化價格。

That's helpful. And just one follow-up on the EVs. I saw the headline yesterday that you're pausing the plans to buy a 65,000 EVs from Polestar. I was just curious if you have any outstanding kind of minimum agreement -- minimum purchase agreements for this year with any of the others, whether that's GM or Tesla. I know you have the kind of initial kind of framework agreements. But I'm curious if there is any kind of purchase agreements you do have to hit this year?

這很有幫助。關於電動車，我們只討論一個後續問題。我昨天看到頭條新聞，說你們暫停了從 Polestar 購買 65,000 輛電動車的計劃。我只是好奇您是否與其他公司（無論是通用汽車還是特斯拉）達成了任何未達成的最低協議——今年的最低購買協議。我知道你們已經達成了初步的框架協議。但我想知道您今年是否必須達成任何類型的購買協議？

Remember, the -- generally speaking, the agreements that we have long had with the OEMs is sort of a broad understanding about aggregate number of cars over some number of years. The commitment is not final until model year when price and trim and the like is all decided. By the way, that runs both ways. They're not obligated to deliver any more than we're not obligated to buy under these broader agreements.

請記住，一般來說，我們長期與 OEM 達成的協議是對幾年內汽車總數的廣泛共識。當車型年的價格、裝飾等都確定後，承諾才最終確定。順便說一句，這是雙向的。根據這些更廣泛的協議，他們沒有義務提供比我們購買義務更多的產品。

And so we put the pause on obviously buying EVs, except to the extent that they were packaged with other ICE vehicles, but it's a de minimis amount that's there. By and large, we will be net lower for sure in the context of EVs based on the sale and based on a very de minimis number of EVs that come in.

因此，我們顯然暫停購買電動車，除非它們是與其他內燃機汽車一起打包購買的，但這是最低限度的。整體而言，從銷售量和上市電動車數量來看，我們的電動車淨利肯定會較低。

Our next question comes from the line of Christopher Stathoulopoulos of SIG.

我們的下一個問題來自 SIG 的 Christopher Stathoulopoulos。

Justin, on the $250 million with the 5 areas that you've identified, just wondering if you could give a little bit more of a finer point with respect to dollar per category and your comment that you would be disappointed if you don't do more, how should we think about potential upside there? I guess it would be in the third category on operating collision and things like that. But if you just provide a little bit more detail as we think about the cost for those 5 categories you've identified.

賈斯汀，關於您確定的 5 個領域的 2.5 億美元，我只是想知道您是否可以就每個類別的金額提供更詳細的觀點，並且您說過如果您不做更多事情您會感到失望，我們應該如何看待那裡的潛在上升空間？我猜想它應該屬於第三類，即操作碰撞和諸如此類的事情。但如果您能提供更多細節，我們就能考慮您所確定的 5 個類別的成本。

Yes. Sure, Christopher. As you can imagine, we're building internal plans that are going to target a much higher cost. So we see this benefit drop through as committed. That's the first one. And secondly, we're spending less time kind of bucketing these things between categories. There's some accounting things, for instance, subro benefits are turned over a period of time. So while we're getting the immediate recoveries, it may bleed through from a portion of time before we fully recognize it in the benefits there.

是的。當然，克里斯多福。你可以想像，我們正在製定內部計劃，目標是更高的成本。因此，我們認為這項福利已按承諾下降。這是第一個。其次，我們花費更少的時間將這些事物分成不同的類別。有一些會計事項，例如，subro 福利會在一段時間內轉移。因此，雖然我們可以立即獲得恢復，但在我們完全認識到它帶來的好處之前，可能還需要一段時間才能顯現出來。

So my suggestion there would be as we continue to solidify these plans and see real traction beyond the immediate kind of cost reduction, spend reduction, you have my commitment to provide further clarity and updates in the future calls.

因此，我的建議是，隨著我們繼續鞏固這些計劃並看到除了直接的成本削減和支出削減之外的實際進展，我承諾在未來的電話會議中提供進一步的澄清和更新。

Okay. And then second question, Stephen. So your comments around I guess would be -- you alluded to a healthy demand outlook. We've heard similar comments here from the airlines as we wrap up earnings season. But it sounded like you were pointing to some confidence around the second half and curious to your thoughts around there.

好的。接下來是第二個問題，史蒂芬。所以我猜你的評論是——你提到了健康的需求前景。在獲利季即將結束之際，我們也聽到了航空公司的類似評論。但聽起來你對下半場有一些信心，我很好奇你對此的想法。

And then potentially sort of a nuanced question here as these return-to-office mandates accelerate and potentially or arguably could drive a change in nonpeak versus peak demand for the airlines. Any thoughts around that, whether how that might affect length of rentals? Or is it sort of net neutral as this leisure travel phenomenon, if you will, starts to normalize.

隨著這些重返辦公室的要求不斷加速，這可能是一個微妙的問題，並且可能或可以說會導致航空公司非高峰期需求與高峰期需求的變化。您對此有什麼看法？或者說，隨著這種休閒旅遊現象開始正常化，它在某種程度上是網路中立的。

Yes. So let me take the second one first, which is I think that -- we've always tried to sort of manage leisure and corporate so as to manage intra-week like troughy period. So the corporate contracts we have need to stand as profitable in their own right, but they do put the car to better, more normalized, smoother use, if you will, over the course of the week.

是的。因此，讓我先談談第二個問題，我認為——我們一直試圖管理休閒和企業，以便管理週內的低谷期。因此，我們簽訂的公司合約本身就需要具有盈利能力，但如果你願意的話，它們確實會讓賽車在一周內得到更好、更規範、更順暢的使用。

To the extent that there's a return to what was in terms of normal sort of employee and corporate behavior that inevitably will benefit us as it does the airlines and others. So we shouldn't track differently than they do in the context of the benefit of returning back to what's otherwise defined as normal.

只要員工和企業行為恢復正常，我們、航空公司和其他公司必然都會受益。因此，在恢復正常狀態的好處方面，我們不應該採取與他們不同的追蹤方式。

In terms of optimism for the second half, I mean, here, I'm just referring to kind of more macroeconomic trends that would benefit sort of various components of our business. Obviously, the first one is demand and the proclivity -- and inclination to travel. So if things -- if inflation comes down and interest rates come down and there is a higher degree of consumer confidence that springs from it, that inevitably will be better for the travel industry, not limited to us.

關於對下半年的樂觀看法，我在這裡指的是一些將有利於我們業務各個組成部分的宏觀經濟趨勢。顯然，第一個是需求和傾向——以及旅行的傾向。因此，如果通貨膨脹率下降、利率下降，且消費者信心水平更高，這必然會對旅遊業有利，而不僅限於我們。

The second component of that was the comment I was making around residual pricing of used cars, which is -- December into January is historically a low period in the context of volume of activity and the like. Typically, [precedents], they weaken. And then as you move into spring is a more kind of buying period, if you will, around residuals. The comment I was making was, what are the factors that drive that? So we'll see seasonal movement. The question is whether the curve lifts up or stays sustained elevated at the back end.

第二部分是我對二手車剩餘定價的評論，從活動量等來看，12 月到 1 月歷來是個低迷時期。通常情況下，[先例]會削弱它們。然後，隨著春季的到來，如果你願意的話，這將是一個圍繞殘值的購買期。我的評論是，造成這種情況的因素是什麼？因此我們會看到季節性的變化。問題在於曲線是否會上升或在後端保持持續上升的勢頭。

And I think the positive drivers of that as to whether or not they happen, we'll see will be lower interest rates, structural short in the used car market and the extent to which the average age of the car is getting old and people will be compelled to recycle their car, if you will, on the forward. Those are positive leading indicators in the context of what you think or should think that market will do. And if that happens, that will be a benefit to us.

我認為，無論它們是否發生，積極的驅動因素將是較低的利率，二手車市場的結構性短缺以及汽車平均年齡的老化程度，人們將被迫回收他們的汽車，如果你願意的話。根據您認為或應該認為市場將會如何表現，這些都是積極的領先指標。如果發生這種情況，對我們來說是有益的。

Okay we want to thank you all -- sorry, we want to thank you all for your participation today. Before we close the call, I'd like to thank our employees for their continued hard work and dedication over the year and without whose efforts, none of this would be obviously possible. In closing, we look forward to sharing further updates with you on our next call. And with that, I'll turn it back to the operator.

好的，我們要感謝大家——抱歉，我們要感謝大家今天的參與。在結束通話之前，我想感謝我們的員工一年來的持續努力和奉獻，如果沒有他們的努力，這一切顯然都不可能實現。最後，我們期待在下次電話會議中與您分享更多更新內容。說完這些，我就把電話轉回接線生。

Thank you. This concludes the Hertz Global Holdings Fourth Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. Thank you for your participation.

謝謝。赫茲全球控股 2023 年第四季財報電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。