Anywhere Real Estate Inc (HOUS) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good morning, and welcome to the Anywhere Real Estate second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call via webcast. Today's call is being recorded, and a written transcript will be made available in the Investor Information section of the company's website tomorrow. A webcast replay will also be made available on the company's website. Unless stated otherwise, growth figures should be assumed to be year over year.

早安，歡迎參加透過網路直播的 Anywhere Real Estate 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。今天的電話會議正在錄音，書面記錄將於明天在公司網站的投資者資訊部分發布。網路直播重播也將在公司網站上提供。除非另有說明，否則成長數字應假定為逐年成長。

At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Anywhere Vice President, Tom Hudson. Please go ahead, Tom.

現在，我想將會議交給 Anywhere 副總裁 Tom Hudson。請繼續，湯姆。

Thank you, Bella. Good morning, and welcome to the second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call for Anywhere Real Estate. On the call with me today are Anywhere's CEO and President, Ryan Schneider; and CFO, Charlotte Simonelli.

謝謝你，貝拉。早安，歡迎參加 Anywhere Real Estate 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。今天與我一起參加電話會議的有 Anywhere 的執行長兼總裁 Ryan Schneider 和財務長 Charlotte Simonelli。

As shown on slide 3 of the presentation, the company will be making statements about its future results and other forward-looking statements during the call. These statements are based on current expectations and the current economic environment. Forward-looking statements, estimates and projections are inherently subject to significant economic, competitive, antitrust and other litigation, regulatory and other uncertainties and contingencies, many of which are beyond the control of management, including, among others, industry and macroeconomic developments. Actual results may differ materially from these expressed or implied in the forward-looking statements.

如簡報第 3 張投影片所示，本公司將在電話會議期間就其未來業績和其他前瞻性陳述發表聲明。這些聲明是基於當前的預期和當前的經濟環境。前瞻性陳述、估計和預測本質上受重大經濟、競爭、反壟斷和其他訴訟、監管和其他不確定因素和意外事件的影響，其中許多因素超出了管理層的控制範圍，包括但不限於行業和宏觀經濟發展。實際結果可能與前瞻性陳述中表達或暗示的結果有重大差異。

July month-to-date data is through July 21, 2025, with both open and closed volume comparisons based on the same number of business days in July 2025 versus last year. Three onetime free cash flow headwinds are excluded from our 2025 free cash flow guidance. First, $41 million was paid in Q2 for 1999 extended legacy tax matter that we intend to appeal. Next, $20 million that we expect to pay in Q3 for the TCPA litigation settlement. Last, the final $54 million payment towards our antitrust litigation settlement will be due when the appeals are resolved, the timing of which is uncertain, but is now estimated to be made in late 2025 or early 2026.

7 月月初至今的數據截至 2025 年 7 月 21 日，開倉和平倉交易量比較均基於 2025 年 7 月與去年相同的工作日數。我們 2025 年的自由現金流指引中不包括三次一次性的自由現金流逆風。首先，我們打算對 1999 年延長遺留稅問題在第二季支付了 4,100 萬美元的款項提出上訴。接下來，我們預計將在第三季支付 2000 萬美元用於 TCPA 訴訟和解。最後，我們反壟斷訴訟和解的最終 5,400 萬美元付款將在上訴解決後到期，具體時間尚不確定，但現在估計將在 2025 年底或 2026 年初支付。

Growth in business recruited pursuant to other productive agent recruiting program at advisers is measuring using the estimated last 12 months closed gross commission income of the new agents prior to joining Anywhere.

根據顧問公司其他高效能代理商招募計畫招募的業務成長是使用新代理商加入 Anywhere 之前估計的過去 12 個月的已結總佣金收入來衡量的。

The top half of agents retained advisers is measured using the amount of production generated by agents remaining with the company a year following initial 12-month period based on gross commission income generated during the initial measuring period. Important assumptions and factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those in the forward-looking statements are specified in our earnings release dated today as well as in our annual and quarterly SEC filings. For those who listen to the rebroadcast of this presentation, we remind you that remarks made herein as of today, July 29, have not been updated after the initial call.

代理商保留顧問的前半部分是根據初始測量期間產生的總佣金收入，使用初始 12 個月期間一年後留在公司中的代理商所產生的產出量來衡量的。我們今天發布的收益報告以及年度和季度 SEC 文件中詳細說明了可能導致實際結果與前瞻性陳述中的結果大不相同的重要假設和因素。對於那些收聽此演講重播的人，我們提醒您，截至今天（7 月 29 日）在此發表的評論在首次通話後尚未更新。

Now I'd like to turn the call over to our CEO and President, Ryan Schneider.

現在我想將電話轉給我們的執行長兼總裁 Ryan Schneider。

Thank you, Tom. It is incredibly exciting to speak with you here in late July. AI will change how real estate is done, and we plan to lead the way. We are using generative AI to revolutionize how this industry works, both how we go to market and how we run our company. This transformation is creating better experiences faster and at lower cost, all with the goal of driving growth for our great agents and franchisees, unlocking efficiencies and improving margins.

謝謝你，湯姆。七月下旬在這裡與您交談真是令人興奮。人工智慧將改變房地產的運作方式，我們計劃引領這一趨勢。我們正在利用生成式人工智慧來徹底改變這個行業的運作方式，包括我們進入市場的方式和我們經營公司的方式。這種轉變正在以更快的速度和更低的成本創造更好的體驗，其目標是為了推動我們優秀的代理商和特許經營商的成長，提高效率和提高利潤率。

The future of the real estate industry includes a truly end-to-end integrated transaction for the consumer.

房地產行業的未來包括為消費者提供真正的端到端整合交易。

We are leveraging our scale across brokerage, title, mortgage and home services to deliver more seamless and connected home buying and selling experiences and to drive better economics. And while we are in a historically challenging housing cycle, we are winning and creating octane for the future with powerful proof points in productive agent recruiting and retention, franchise sales and especially luxury success. Most excitingly, we are seeing strong growth momentum this month that has us more optimistic for the back half of the year.

我們利用我們在經紀、產權、抵押貸款和住房服務方面的規模來提供更無縫和互聯的購房和賣房體驗，並推動更好的經濟發展。儘管我們正處於歷史上最具挑戰性的房地產週期，但我們正在贏得未來並為未來創造辛烷值，並在高效的代理商招募和保留、特許經營銷售，尤其是豪華房產銷售方面取得了有力的證明。最令人興奮的是，本月我們看到了強勁的成長勢頭，這讓我們對今年下半年更加樂觀。

Turning to Q2. We exited the quarter with confidence, supported by meaningful operating EBITDA, a strengthened balance sheet and our unique collection of assets. This strong foundation enables us to invest in AI-driven initiatives and capture scale, operating efficiency across the company. We delivered $1.7 billion of revenue and $133 million of operating EBITDA, demonstrating the strength and resilience of our model.

轉向 Q2。在可觀的營運 EBITDA、增強的資產負債表和我們獨特的資產組合的支持下，我們滿懷信心地結束了本季。這個堅實的基礎使我們能夠投資人工智慧驅動的計劃並實現整個公司的規模和營運效率。我們實現了 17 億美元的收入和 1.33 億美元的營業 EBITDA，證明了我們模式的實力和韌性。

Closed transaction volume was flat year-over-year in Q2. The quarter started off challenged due to macroeconomic volatility, but we saw volume trends improve with June closed volume solidly positive. And we love the business momentum we are delivering in July. July closed transaction volume is up mid-single digits year-over-year with growth in both units and price. Even more exciting, July open volume is up 9%, with this future growth indicator about equally driven by increases in both units and price.

第二季成交量與去年同期持平。由於宏觀經濟波動，本季一開始面臨挑戰，但我們看到交易量趨勢有所改善，6 月成交量穩定成長。我們非常滿意七月份的業務發展動能。7 月成交量年增中個位數，成交量和物價均有所成長。更令人興奮的是，7 月開盤量上漲了 9%，這一未來成長指標大致受到數量和價格上漲的共同推動。

And looking even further into the future, our July Advisors listings are up significantly, over 10% compared to the prior year. Together, this paints a strong growth picture for the back half of the year that we hope continues.

展望未來，我們 7 月的顧問名單與去年相比大幅增加 10% 以上。總的來說，這為今年下半年描繪了一幅強勁的成長前景，我們希望這種前景能夠持續下去。

Q2 also saw a notable geographic variation across key markets where our Advisors business is concentrated. New York City outperformed the broader portfolio, delivering double-digit growth in both units and price. And Florida by contrast, faced a more challenging quarter with volume down double digits.

第二季度，我們的顧問業務集中的主要市場也呈現出明顯的地理差異。紐約市的表現優於整體投資組合，單位數和價格都達到兩位數成長。相比之下，佛羅裡達州本季面臨更大的挑戰，交易量下降了兩位數。

Now our industry-leading luxury businesses, anchored by Sotheby's International Realty, Corcoran and Coldwell Banker Global Luxury continues to be a strategic growth engine, outperforming the broader market. Luxury delivered 3.5% year-over-year volume growth in the quarter and about 8% year-over-year growth in the first half as we obviously love this higher-margin, high-impact segment. We sold 369 homes priced $10 million or higher in Q2, a 20% increase from the prior year. And our luxury businesses are delivering incredibly strong growth momentum in July. For example, Sotheby's International Realty July open volume is up 13% and Corcoran is up about 20%.

現在，我們業界領先的奢侈品業務，以蘇富比國際房地產、科克倫和 Coldwell Banker Global Luxury 為支柱，繼續成為策略成長引擎，表現優於大盤。奢侈品本季銷量年增 3.5%，上半年年增約 8%，因為我們顯然喜歡這個利潤率更高、影響力更大的細分市場。我們在第二季售出了 369 套售價 1,000 萬美元或以上的房屋，比前一年增長了 20%。我們的奢侈品業務在七月呈現出令人難以置信的強勁成長勢頭。例如，蘇富比國際房地產 7 月開盤量上漲 13%，科科倫房地產上漲約 20%。

We are also raising the bar on what's possible in luxury real estate, bringing new innovative ways to deliver value to agents, franchisees and the consumer. Our Sotheby's Concierge Auctions JV is a great example. It provides an innovative way to match buyers and sellers of luxury properties while enabling us to capture much higher per transaction economics. The venture continues to scale with Q2 revenue up 10% and an average sales price of $5 million.

我們也提高了豪華房地產的標準，帶來了新的創新方式來為代理商、特許經營者和消費者創造價值。我們的蘇富比禮賓拍賣合資企業就是一個很好的例子。它提供了一種創新的方式來匹配豪華房產的買家和賣家，同時使我們能夠獲得更高的每筆交易經濟效益。該合資企業持續擴大規模，第二季營收成長 10%，平均銷售價格為 500 萬美元。

Now beyond our success in luxury, we're driving meaningful growth across our broader portfolio. Our high-margin franchise business welcomed 13 new US franchisees and 3 international expansions, strategically expanding our footprint, including in key growth markets such as California, North Carolina and Georgia.

現在，除了在奢侈品領域取得成功之外，我們還在更廣泛的產品組合中推動有意義的成長。我們的高利潤特許經營業務迎來了 13 家新的美國特許經營商和 3 家國際擴張店，策略性地擴大了我們的業務範圍，包括加州、北卡羅來納州和喬治亞州等主要成長市場。

We are seeing strong momentum in our Advisors business, driven by robust agent recruiting and near-record levels of agent retention for productive agents. Our compelling value proposition centered on delivering best-in-class products and services, great marketing and industry-leading support is increasingly resonating with great agents across the country.

我們的顧問業務發展勢頭強勁，這得益於強勁的代理商招募和高效代理商接近創紀錄的保留水平。我們引人注目的價值主張以提供一流的產品和服務、出色的行銷和行業領先的支援為中心，越來越受到全國各地優秀代理商的共鳴。

Advisors recruited 625 productive agents in the quarter and saw a 31% year-over-year growth in business recruited with strong gains against many of our biggest competitors. And we are having even greater success retaining top talent in this highly competitive market, with Advisors agent retention reaching 95% -- about 95% among the top half of producing agents. This is rarefied air, right around the highest rates we've ever achieved. And in our great luxury brands, our retention is even higher.

顧問公司在本季度招募了 625 名高效代理，招募的業務同比增長 31%，與我們的許多最大競爭對手相比取得了強勁增長。在這個競爭激烈的市場中，我們在留住頂尖人才方面取得了更大的成功，顧問代理的保留率達到了 95%——在生產代理的前半部分中約為 95%。這是一種稀薄的空氣，恰好也是我們曾經達到的最高速率。而對於我們的優質奢侈品牌來說，我們的留任率甚至更高。

Now putting this all together, you can see why I'm excited about our growth potential going into the back half of the year. And in addition to growth, our other main priority is Reimagine '25 as we leverage and harness emerging technologies like generative AI to reshape how real estate works for agents, franchisees, consumers and how we operate our company, all in the spirit of delivering better experiences faster and at lower cost and to drive growth for our great agents and franchisees, unlock efficiencies and improve margins.

現在把所有這些放在一起，你就會明白為什麼我對我們下半年的成長潛力感到興奮。除了成長之外，我們的另一個主要優先事項是重新構想 '25，因為我們利用和駕馭生成人工智慧等新興技術來重塑房地產為代理商、特許經營商、消費者服務的方式以及我們經營公司的方式，所有這些都是為了以更快的速度和更低的成本提供更好的體驗，並推動我們優秀的代理商和特許經營商的增長，提高效率並提高利潤率。

Anywhere is accelerating generative AI-driven innovation across every corner of its businesses. We are delivering AI-enabled tools to help agents and consumers better sell homes such as Listing Concierge. We are using AI for productive agent and franchisee recruiting, for smarter lead targeting, to use AI to generate higher-quality content and to process documents faster and at lower cost. We have pilots and at scale examples across the whole company. And since we last spoke, we piloted Amazon Q in our contact centers and AI-generated comparative market analysis as we continue to build proof points of our broader strategy to scale AI.

Anywhere 正在加速其業務各個角落的生成性人工智慧驅動創新。我們正在提供支援人工智慧的工具，例如 Listing Concierge，以幫助代理商和消費者更好地銷售房屋。我們正在使用人工智慧進行高效的代理商和加盟商招募，進行更聰明的潛在客戶定位，使用人工智慧產生更高品質的內容，並以更快、更低的成本處理文件。我們在整個公司都有試點和大規模的例子。自從我們上次談話以來，我們在我們的聯絡中心和人工智慧生成的比較市場分析中試用了 Amazon Q，同時我們繼續為我們更廣泛的人工智慧擴展策略建立證明點。

And our open architecture approach lets us also deploy best-in-class third-party AI-driven products to agents through enterprise agreements like our just announced Canva offering.

我們的開放式架構方法還使我們能夠透過企業協議（例如我們剛剛宣布的 Canva 產品）向代理商部署一流的第三方 AI 驅動產品。

Finally, the future of real estate includes a truly end-to-end integrated transaction for the consumer. This means a seamless and connected home buying and selling experience across not only real estate brokerage, but across mortgage, title, home insurance and other home services. We have all of these transaction components in our unique collection of assets and continue to innovate and succeed on this holy grail that others are chasing.

最後，房地產的未來包括為消費者提供真正的端到端整合交易。這意味著不僅在房地產經紀方面，而且在抵押貸款、產權、房屋保險和其他房屋服務方面，都能實現無縫互聯的購房和賣房體驗。我們獨特的資產集合中擁有所有這些交易組件，並將繼續創新，在其他人追逐的這個聖杯上取得成功。

In that spirit, we're increasingly delivering better experiences to consumers by introducing the right services at the right time. This better experience of an integrated transaction also adds to our economics. So let me give you two real examples that crystallized in Q2.

本著這種精神，我們將在適當的時間推出合適的服務，為消費者提供更好的體驗。這種更好的綜合交易體驗也增加了我們的經濟效益。那麼，讓我給你舉兩個在第二季中具體化的真實例子。

First, as I told you last quarter, we see the opportunity to turn buyer agreements of perceived market risk into an opportunity and have begun using this consumer interaction to integrate the marketing of both our title and our mortgage services. While the title pilot results are still pending, our initial mortgage pilot showed approximately 2.5 percentage points increase in mortgage capture, the biggest increase that we've seen from any past initiative to drive this higher revenue per transaction.

首先，正如我上個季度告訴您的那樣，我們看到了將買方協議中感知到的市場風險轉化為機會的機會，並且已經開始利用這種消費者互動來整合我們的產權和抵押貸款服務的營銷。雖然產權試點結果尚未公佈，但我們的初步抵押貸款試點顯示，抵押貸款收入增加了約 2.5 個百分點，這是我們在過去推動每筆交易收入增加的任何舉措中看到的最大增幅。

Second, we redesigned the consumer workflow to embed our warranty offering more seamlessly into the home sale transaction. Based on pilots in multiple markets, we've seen attach rates increase by approximately 4 percentage points. And with these exciting results, we plan to roll out both pilots nationally later this year.

其次，我們重新設計了消費者工作流程，將我們的保固服務更無縫地嵌入房屋銷售交易中。根據多個市場的試點情況，我們發現附加率增加了約 4 個百分點。憑藉這些令人興奮的成果，我們計劃今年稍後在全國推出這兩項試點。

By integrating more components of the real estate transaction, we enhance the customer journey, increase satisfaction and generate greater per transaction economics. This also elevates the agent central role in the transaction, helping them build deeper, more trusted relationships with consumers. So we're excited to be here in July with powerful growth momentum, AI-led Reimagine '25 transformation progress and more proof points on our ability to integrate the transaction and generate greater per transaction economics.

透過整合房地產交易的更多組成部分，我們可以改善客戶體驗、提高滿意度並創造更高的每筆交易經濟效益。這也提升了代理商在交易中的核心作用，幫助他們與消費者建立更深厚、更信任的關係。因此，我們很高興能在 7 月取得強勁的成長勢頭、人工智慧主導的 Reimagine '25 轉型進展以及更多證明我們整合交易和創造更大每筆交易經濟效益的能力的證明點。

With that, let me turn the call over to Charlotte.

說完這些，讓我把電話轉給夏洛特。

Good morning, everyone. Anywhere delivered another strong quarter, driving solid operating EBITDA, accelerating cost efficiencies and increasing our financial flexibility. We are continuing to build on years of disciplined operational excellence, commitment to deleveraging the balance sheet and foresight to prime the business for its next chapter of AI-enabled growth.

大家早安。Anywhere 又一個季度表現強勁，推動了穩健的營運 EBITDA，加快了成本效率並提高了我們的財務靈活性。我們將繼續以多年嚴謹的卓越營運、致力於降低資產負債表槓桿率和遠見卓識為基礎，為企業開啟人工智慧驅動的成長新篇章做好準備。

I will now highlight our Q2 '25 financial results. Q2 revenue was $1.7 billion, up 1% versus prior year, and Q2 operating EBITDA was $133 million, a decrease of $10 million versus prior year, primarily due to higher employee benefit costs, increased investment in Reimagine initiative and an increase in agent commission costs in our own brokerage business. We realized $25 million in cost savings in the quarter and $39 million of cost savings year-to-date, and we are on target to achieve $100 million in cost savings for 2025 with 95% of our savings already identified.

現在我將重點介紹我們 2025 年第二季的財務表現。第二季度營收為 17 億美元，比上年增長 1%，第二季度營業 EBITDA 為 1.33 億美元，比上年減少 1000 萬美元，主要原因是員工福利成本增加、對 Reimagine 計劃的投資增加以及我們自己的經紀業務的代理佣金成本增加。我們在本季實現了 2,500 萬美元的成本節約，年初至今已實現 3,900 萬美元的成本節約，我們的目標是到 2025 年實現 1 億美元的成本節約，其中 95% 的節約已經確定。

Q2 free cash flow was $36 million before the $41 million onetime payment made for a 1999 Cendant legacy tax matter. Free cash flow was also negatively impacted by $25 million in seasonal volatility from our securitization facility. This facility historically can create working capital volatility quarter-by-quarter due to the seasonality of the business.

在支付 1999 年 Cendant 遺留稅款的 4,100 萬美元一次性款項之前，第二季的自由現金流量為 3,600 萬美元。我們的證券化工具帶來的 2,500 萬美元季節性波動也對自由現金流產生了負面影響。從歷史上看，由於業務的季節性，該設施可能會逐季度造成營運資金波動。

Consistent with our capital allocation priorities, we opportunistically issued $500 million in new second lien debt and repurchased $345 million of our exchangeable notes at a discount. In addition, we utilized the excess proceeds to further reduce our revolver balance. And as of July 28, our revolver balance was $460 million, down $230 million from our last earnings release date.

根據我們的資本配置重點，我們抓住機會發行了 5 億美元的新第二留置權債務，並以折扣價回購了 3.45 億美元的可交換票據。此外，我們也利用超額收益進一步減少循環信貸餘額。截至 7 月 28 日，我們的循環信貸餘額為 4.6 億美元，比上次發布收益時減少了 2.3 億美元。

We expect to repurchase the remaining $58 million in exchangeable notes outstanding over the next six months, and I remain confident in our financial position with no meaningful note maturities until 2029, ample revolver liquidity and enhanced flexibility following our recent refinancing. This continues to provide the balance sheet strength to invest organically or inorganically while fortifying the business now so we can return even stronger when the housing market normalizes. And our normalized market target leverage remains 3 times EBITDA.

我們預計將在未來六個月內回購剩餘的 5800 萬美元未償還可交換票據，並且我對我們的財務狀況充滿信心，因為直到 2029 年都沒有重大票據到期，而且在我們最近的再融資之後，循環信貸流動性充足且靈活性增強。這將繼續增強資產負債表的實力，以便進行有機或無機投資，同時鞏固當前的業務，以便當房地產市場恢復正常時，我們能夠更強大地回歸。我們的標準化市場目標槓桿率仍為 EBITDA 的 3 倍。

Now let me provide more details about our business segment performance. Our Anywhere Brands business, which includes lease and relocation, generated $163 million in operating EBITDA. Operating EBITDA increased $4 million, primarily due to strength in our Cartus Relocation business. Our franchise business expanded margins in the quarter, showing improved financial leverage despite flat volume.

現在讓我提供有關我們業務部門表現的更多詳細資訊。我們的 Anywhere Brands 業務（包括租賃和搬遷）產生了 1.63 億美元的營業 EBITDA。營業 EBITDA 增加了 400 萬美元，主要得益於我們的 Cartus Relocation 業務的強勁成長。我們的特許經營業務在本季度擴大了利潤率，儘管業務量持平，但財務槓桿有所提高。

Our Anywhere Advisors operating EBITDA was zero, a $4 million decrease versus prior year, driven by higher employee benefit costs as well as commission costs, partially offset by higher revenue and cost savings initiatives. This business generated $93 million in operating EBITDA before the transfer of intercompany royalties and marketing fees paid to our franchise business.

我們的 Anywhere Advisors 營運 EBITDA 為零，比前一年減少 400 萬美元，因為員工福利成本和佣金成本增加，但收入增加和成本節約措施部分抵消了這一影響。在轉移支付給我們特許經營業務的內部公司特許權使用費和行銷費用之前，該業務產生了 9,300 萬美元的營業 EBITDA。

Advisors' average broker commission rate increased 2 basis points year-over-year, increasing revenue capture per transaction. Following last year's industry changes, we have seen changes in how and when negotiation of commission occurs, but ABCR has been sequentially stable for the last 12 months, highlighting the value that agents bring to the transaction. Q2 agent commission splits were 80.9%, up 36 basis points year-over-year. The increase was primarily attributable to business mix with noncore items such as new development business and company-generated leads, which have lower splits on average, having a more material impact in the prior year. About one-third of the increase was because of agent mix as our top agents continue to take a greater share of transactions.

顧問的平均經紀佣金率較去年同期增加 2 個基點，增加了每筆交易的收入。繼去年的產業變化之後，我們看到佣金談判的方式和時間發生了變化，但 ABCR 在過去 12 個月中一直保持穩定，突顯了代理商為交易帶來的價值。第二季代理商佣金分成率為80.9%，較去年同期上升36個基點。成長主要歸因於業務組合中非核心項目，例如新開發業務和公司產生的銷售線索，這些項目的平均分成較低，對上一年產生了更實質的影響。約三分之一的成長是由於代理商組合，因為我們的頂級代理商繼續佔據更大的交易份額。

Anywhere Integrated Services Q2 '25 operating EBITDA of $10 million was up $1 million from Q2 '24 due to higher revenue and mortgage JV earnings. We continue to enhance our operations through Reimagine '25, an ambitious multiyear transformation effort designed to set us up for greater growth and success in the future. This comprehensive program encompasses all aspects of our enterprise, and we expect it will significantly contribute to our savings targets for 2025 and beyond.

由於營收和抵押貸款合資企業收益增加，Anywhere Integrated Services 2025 年第二季的營業 EBITDA 為 1,000 萬美元，比 2024 年第二季增加了 100 萬美元。我們將繼續透過「重塑 25」計劃來加強我們的運營，這是一項雄心勃勃的多年轉型計劃，旨在為我們未來取得更大的成長和成功做好準備。這項綜合計畫涵蓋了我們企業的各個方面，我們預計它將為我們實現 2025 年及以後的節約目標做出重大貢獻。

By leveraging AI-enabled technology to reduce manual processes, we aim to enhance our value proposition and unlock growth opportunities. No area of our business is out of scope for this transformation, and all our core businesses and corporate teams are engaged, finding new and innovative ways to deliver better experiences faster and at lower costs.

透過利用人工智慧技術減少手動流程，我們旨在增強我們的價值主張並釋放成長機會。我們業務的任何領域都參與到這項轉型中，我們所有的核心業務和企業團隊都參與其中，尋找新的創新方式，以更快、更低的成本提供更好的體驗。

Some of our most recent examples include leveraging generative AI to improve our brokerage transaction processing. Our brokerage operations team receives about 15,000 documents every day. One-third of our Coldwell Banker brokerage document submissions are now automated with a path to 90% by the end of this year. This substantial automation not only lets us accomplish these tasks faster, but lets us operate 24/7, delivering better quality with meaningfully lower costs.

我們最近的一些例子包括利用生成性人工智慧來改進我們的經紀交易處理。我們的經紀營運團隊每天收到約 15,000 份文件。目前，我們三分之一的 Coldwell Banker 經紀文件提交已實現自動化，到今年年底將達到 90%。這種大規模的自動化不僅使我們能夠更快地完成這些任務，而且使我們能夠全天候運行，以顯著降低的成本提供更好的品質。

Our Cartus Relocation business continues to leverage transformation initiatives to enhance both revenue generation and operational performance. These efforts have proven effective in helping secure new clients and expand current relationships to drive top line growth. At the same time, automation and workflow improvements have significantly boosted operational efficiency, resulting in the highest quarterly margin since Q3 2022.

我們的 Cartus Relocation 業務繼續利用轉型措施來提高收入和營運績效。事實證明，這些努力能夠有效地幫助獲得新客戶並擴大現有關係，從而推動收入成長。同時，自動化和工作流程的改進顯著提高了營運效率，實現了2022年第三季以來的最高季度利潤率。

Now turning to our '25 estimates. We reiterate our guidance and expect operating EBITDA for the full year to be about $350 million and free cash flow, excluding onetime charges to be about $70 million, with the biggest swing factor being the housing market itself, which is inherently volatile.

現在轉向我們的 25 年估計。我們重申我們的指導意見，預計全年營業 EBITDA 約為 3.5 億美元，不包括一次性費用的自由現金流約為 7000 萬美元，其中最大的波動因素是房地產市場本身，而房地產市場本身就具有波動性。

Let me now turn the call back to Ryan for some closing remarks.

現在，請瑞安發表一些結束語。

Thank you, Charlotte. In closing, we are using generative AI to revolutionize how this industry works. We are moving to the future of a seamless end-to-end transaction experience for the consumer, and we are winning across multiple growth vectors that build octane for the future. And most excitingly, we are seeing strong July growth momentum, increasing our optimism for the back half of the year. It's an incredibly exciting time.

謝謝你，夏洛特。最後，我們正在使用生成式人工智慧來徹底改變這個產業的運作方式。我們正在邁向為消費者提供無縫端到端交易體驗的未來，並且我們正在贏得多個成長載體，為未來注入活力。最令人興奮的是，我們看到了強勁的七月成長勢頭，這增強了我們對今年下半年的樂觀情緒。這是一個無比令人興奮的時刻。

With that, we are happy to take your questions.

我們很樂意回答您的問題。

(Operator Instructions) Matt Bouley, Barclays.

（操作員指示）巴克萊銀行的 Matt Bouley。

Maybe just one around the overall housing market. I guess kind of thinking about this interplay between home prices and transaction sides. Ryan, you called out a lot of geographic variation. And so my question is, in those markets where you may be starting to see lower home prices, is it actually starting to, on the other hand, spur some transactions? And then if you kind of think about the markets where you still have inventory really tight, kind of how are you thinking about the actual unit volumes in those type of markets?

也許只是圍繞整個房地產市場的一個問題。我想思考一下房價和交易雙方的互動。瑞安，你指出了許多地理差異。所以我的問題是，在那些你可能開始看到房價下跌的市場中，它是否實際上開始刺激一些交易？然後，如果您考慮庫存仍然非常緊張的市場，那麼您如何看待這類市場的實際單位數量？

A couple of things I'll say, Matt, thank you for the good question. So first off, something is happening, at least in our portfolio in July because in July, we are seeing units up and price up. I kind of gave the numbers on our closed volume in July and our open volume in July and our open luxury volume in July. And it's at least 50-50 units up and price up. And in luxury, it's actually mostly units up.

我想說幾件事，馬特，謝謝你提出這個好問題。首先，至少在我們 7 月份的投資組合中，一些事情正在發生，因為在 7 月份，我們看到單位數量增加，價格上漲。我給出了我們七月份成交量、七月開盤量以及七月開盤奢侈品交易量的數字。而數量和價格至少上漲了 50%。而在豪華住宅中，其實大部分都是單元式住宅。

So in July, we're seeing something happen where units seem to be having a little bit of a renaissance, which is awesome because most of the gains this year so far have been price driven. When you look at the markets out there, there's really very few where price is actually dropping. And I think sometimes how the newspapers do comparisons is a problem, but we always look at year-over-year. And so like when we look at our portfolio and you look at Q2, there were only two states where prices dropped at all. One was -- at least among the meaningfully sized one, right?

因此，在七月份，我們看到一些事情發生，單位似乎正在經歷一些復興，這是非常棒的，因為今年迄今為止的大部分收益都是由價格驅動的。如果你觀察外面的市場，你會發現價格真正下跌的地方真的很少。我認為有時報紙如何進行比較是一個問題，但我們總是逐年進行觀察。因此，當我們查看我們的投資組合併查看第二季度時，只有兩個州的價格下跌。其中一個是──至少是具有一定規模的一個，對嗎？

One was Florida and the other was Colorado. And like in Florida, the units dropped more than the price did. So it's not like price is going down and it's spurring more units. In fact, in Florida, it was mostly a unit decline with a little bit of price decline. So I think there is still this dynamic out there, Matt, that demand is actually greater than supply still even at these higher affordability levels.

一個是佛羅裡達州，另一個是科羅拉多州。就像在佛羅裡達州一樣，單位數量的下降幅度超過了價格的下降幅度。因此，價格不會下降，也不會刺激更多的單位。事實上，在佛羅裡達州，主要是單位數量下降，價格也有所下降。因此，馬特，我認為仍然存在這種動態，即使在這些更高的負擔能力水平下，需求實際上仍然大於供應。

And so almost all states were looking at have prices still rising no matter what's happening with their units. And then a few places where prices are going down, it's pretty -- it's not spurring more units.

因此，幾乎所有州都認為，無論其單位發生什麼情況，價格都會繼續上漲。而一些地方的價格正在下降，這並沒有刺激更多的單位。

And then the other thing that's unique to us is part of the reason our Florida prices are down is last year, we sold nine homes in the second quarter over $50 million. And this year, I believe we sold one. And a number of those were in Florida. So even a little bit of the Florida price drop in our book is driven by the mix, not actually same-store home prices going down. So I think the talk of prices falling is a little overstated out there, and it hasn't spurred units, but we have seen units in July come back but still with some price growth.

我們的獨特之處還在於，佛羅裡達州房價下跌的部分原因是去年第二季我們售出了 9 套房屋，總價值超過 5,000 萬美元。今年，我相信我們賣了一輛。其中許多位於佛羅裡達州。因此，在我們看來，佛羅裡達州房價的少量下跌也是由混合因素推動的，而不是同店房價的下降。因此，我認為有關價格下跌的說法有點誇大其詞，而且它並沒有刺激房屋銷售，但我們看到 7 月份房屋銷售量有所回升，但價格仍有所增長。

So it's a weird market out there.

所以這是一個奇怪的市場。

Got it. Well said. And yes, understood and great color. So very helpful. So just other question is just obviously, given everything in the background around this sort of private and exclusive listings, I guess, dispute for lack of a better term.

知道了。說得好。是的，明白了，顏色很棒。非常有幫助。因此，另一個問題顯然是，考慮到圍繞這種私人和獨家清單的所有背景，我猜，由於缺乏更好的術語而存在爭議。

Are you seeing any, I guess, disruption out there related to that? And given your public stance on the issue, is it actually kind of, I don't know, helping with the kind of recruiting and retention here? Or just any update to sort of how that's playing out from your perspective?

我想，您是否看到與此相關的任何混亂情況？鑑於您在這個問題上的公開立場，這是否實際上有助於招募和留住人才？或者從您的角度來看，有什麼更新可以說明事情進展如何嗎？

Yes. I'll give you -- I'll touch on a number of different things because I think it's an important industry topic. So one is it absolutely is helping us in recruiting. And we are winning this year more than we did in '24 or '23, not just with the overall numbers I gave you on recruiting, but against some of our -- many of our direct competitors. And one of the things that I think is helping us win is this kind of stance on we want to do what's best for the consumer, and that's typically getting as many people looking at your listing as you can.

是的。我會給你——我會談及許多不同的事情，因為我認為這是一個重要的行業話題。所以，首先它絕對有助於我們招募。我們今年取得的勝利比 2024 年或 2023 年還要多，這不僅是因為我向你們提供了招募方面的整體數據，還因為我們戰勝了許多直接競爭對手。我認為幫助我們成功的因素之一是我們想要為消費者提供最好的服務，這通常會讓盡可能多的人看到您的清單。

And so while again, we sell 6% of our listings privately, we think the vast majority of people -- you should have a broad distribution of listings. And that resonates with agents who want to do business that way, and it's helping on recruiting. There is a little bit of disruption starting to happen. I think different policies that portals have put into place have started to bite a little bit. And you can see people getting kind of worked up over that.

因此，雖然我們私下出售了 6% 的房源，但我們認為絕大多數人——應該廣泛分佈房源。這引起了想要以這種方式開展業務的代理商的共鳴，並有助於招募人才。開始出現一些混亂的情況。我認為門戶網站實施的不同政策已經開始產生一些影響。你可以看到人們對此感到有些興奮。

But again, given our stance, it hasn't really affected us, and we believe in our stance.

但再次強調，鑑於我們的立場，這並沒有真正影響到我們，我們相信我們的立場。

And then we rolled out in the second quarter, we did it in June, we rolled out some technology we use in our own brokerages, Matt, to all of our franchisees that lets our brokerages do private listings that they want within their brokerage, just like we do and totally compliant with all the industry parameters and Zillow's approach, et cetera. But we also have other features in that thing that let people do things like sneak peeks and wants and needs kind of at the brand level, so you can share things across Better Homes and Gardens Real Estate or Coldwell Banker. And then in August, we're going to be enhancing that with some more of that stuff that will let you share it across any part of the Anywhere network.

然後我們在第二季度推出了這項技術，也就是在六月份，我們向我們所有的特許經營商推出了一些我們在自己的經紀公司中使用的技術，馬特，這使得我們的經紀公司可以在他們的經紀公司內進行他們想要的私人上市，就像我們一樣，完全符合所有行業參數和 Zillow 的方法等等。但是，我們還有其他功能，可以讓人們在品牌層面上做一些事情，例如預覽和了解需求，這樣你就可以在 Better Homes and Gardens Real Estate 或 Coldwell Banker 之間分享東西。然後在八月份，我們將對其進行增強，添加更多功能，讓您可以在 Anywhere 網路的任何地方共享它。

And then finally, embedded in that is the ability to turn on private listings if we really ever want to if the market goes that way. I view that as more of a, again, kind of -- if the market goes that way, we're going to be ready and make sure our people are in an advantaged position. But we've made that strategic progress getting that to all of our franchisees since we talked to you last. And we like both the way it's going to let us do more things on, like I said, sneak peeks and wants and needs to do more kind of things within and across brands. We think that will be additive, just a great thing to be doing out there in the world.

最後，如果市場真的朝著這個方向發展，我們就可以開啟私人上市功能。我認為這更像是一種——如果市場朝著這個方向發展，我們就會做好準備，確保我們的員工處於有利地位。但自從上次與您交談以來，我們在將這項服務推廣給所有加盟商方面取得了策略進展。我們喜歡這種方式，因為它可以讓我們做更多的事情，就像我說的，可以先睹為快，並且希望和需要在品牌內部和跨品牌做更多的事情。我們認為這將是有益的，是世界上一件偉大的事。

And then we like the kind of preparation for a defensive play if the world does go more toward private listings that we'll have our whole ecosystem ready to succeed on it.

然後，如果世界確實更多地轉向私人上市，我們就會做好防禦性的準備，讓我們的整個生態系統做好準備，並取得成功。

Nick McAndrew, Zelman.

尼克·麥克安德魯，澤爾曼。

Ryan, maybe just to start, I think the pilot to introduce title and mortgage at the buyer agreement stage sounds pretty promising. And I'm just wondering, as mortgage capture improves, is that being driven primarily by better timing and introduction during the process? Or are there also tangible cost savings for the consumer such as, I don't know, closing cost discounts, for example, when they choose to bundle ancillaries? I'm just trying to think about kind of the potential levers.

瑞安，也許只是開始，我認為在買方協議階段引入產權和抵押貸款的試點聽起來很有希望。我只是想知道，隨著抵押貸款獲取的改善，這是否主要得益於流程中更好的時機和引入？或者，當消費者選擇捆綁輔助設備時，是否也能節省實際成本，例如，成交成本折扣？我只是在思考潛在的槓桿。

That's a great question. Look, we're really excited about this, right? I mean, again, this whole buyer agreement thing was so much work last year. but let's turn into a positive. So far, all the upside we've seen, and it's early, and we think there can be more, and we're going to test and optimize.

這是一個很好的問題。瞧，我們對此真的很興奮，對吧？我的意思是，去年整個買方協議的事情做了很多工作。但讓我們轉向正面的方面。到目前為止，我們已經看到了所有的好處，而且現在還為時過早，我們認為還可以有更多好處，我們將進行測試和優化。

But we still like the 2.5% increase in capture. We've never seen anything like that, that we're going to go nationally just with what we have and want to keep making it better. So far, Nick, it is 100% driven by getting to the customer early with a good value proposition and communicating with them right at the start of their home buying journey as opposed to waiting until they purchased a house. We have done no discounts. We have done no lower rates.

但我們仍然喜歡 2.5% 的捕獲率成長。我們從未見過這樣的事情，我們將利用現有的資源在全國範圍內開展業務，並希望不斷使其變得更好。到目前為止，尼克，我們的動力完全來自於儘早接觸客戶，提供良好的價值主張，並在客戶購屋之旅開始時就與他們溝通，而不是等到他們購買了房子。我們沒有打折。我們沒有降低利率。

And we know there's a few people out there in the world that will say, "Hey, if you use our stuff and bundle it, we'll give you 50 basis points off your mortgage." Maybe that stuff will be in our future, but that will be upside to what we're achieving now. So the real benefit is getting there to the consumer right away at the start of their home journey with mortgage, the title results will come in soon, and we're still -- we're optimistic we can get benefits there, but I don't have anything to share with you yet. And then even getting the insurance, we haven't done this yet with, but we're going to definitely be piloting that. And then I showed you that on like this warranty home service, we've been able to get some of that similar effect. So, so far, it's all get to the consumer, get there at the right time with a good product, get to them directly is where the benefit and get to them early.

我們知道世界上有些人會說，“嘿，如果你使用我們的產品並將其捆綁在一起，我們會給你 50 個基點的抵押貸款折扣。”也許這些東西會出現在我們的未來，但這對我們現在所取得的成就來說是一種好處。因此，真正的好處是消費者在開始辦理抵押貸款購屋之旅時就能立即獲得好處，產權結果很快就會出來，我們仍然——我們樂觀地認為我們可以從中獲得好處，但我還沒有什麼可以與你們分享的。然後，甚至連保險，我們還沒有這樣做，但我們肯定會試行這一點。然後我向你們展示了像這種保固上門服務，我們已經能夠獲得一些類似的效果。所以，到目前為止，一切都是為了接觸消費者，在正確的時間將好的產品送到消費者手中，直接送到他們手中才是好處所在，並且儘早送到他們手中。

That's where the benefit is coming from. We haven't had to give economics away to drive these benefits yet, and that's really exciting.

這就是好處的來源。我們還沒有放棄經濟利益來推動這些利益，這真的很令人興奮。

Yes, that's very helpful. And Charlotte, maybe just one for you. While I know there's no formal guidance on cost savings for 2026, I'm just wondering, can you speak directionally about the potential for any additional cost action, has most of the low-hanging fruit already been addressed? Or are there further actions that could occur even in an improving housing environment?

是的，這非常有幫助。夏洛特，也許只有一件適合你。雖然我知道沒有關於 2026 年成本節約的正式指導，但我只是想知道，您能否指導性地談談採取任何額外成本行動的可能性，大多數唾手可得的成果是否已經得到解決？或者，即使在住房環境改善的情況下，是否還會採取進一步的行動？

Yes, it's a great question. And I kind of nodded to it a little bit in my prepared remarks around that Reimagined should deliver meaningful cost savings this year and beyond. So as per typical starting in Q3 or at the year-end release, I will give more specific guidance, but there is still meaningful cost opportunity from my perspective. I think if you look back five years ago, that was the low-hanging fruit. This is more about transforming our business and using AI and things that were not as widely used five years ago to make this place like super bulletproof when the market does come back that we won't be adding back cost in the same way to support much higher volume and transactions.

是的，這是一個很好的問題。我在準備好的發言中稍微提到了這一點，即 Reimagined 應該會在今年及以後實現有意義的成本節約。因此，按照從第三季開始或年底發布的典型情況，我將提供更具體的指導，但從我的角度來看，仍然存在有意義的成本機會。我想如果你回顧五年前，那是唾手可得的成果。這更多的是關於轉變我們的業務，並使用人工智慧和五年前尚未廣泛使用的東西，使這個地方變得超級防彈，當市場確實回歸時，我們不會以同樣的方式增加成本來支持更高的交易量和交易。

So I think there's a lot left to be done. I'm excited to be able to share a number with you later this year. It will be meaningful like it has been. I think on average, in the six years I've been sitting in this seat, give or take, it's been about $100 million, and that's meaningful. And I do believe there's more meaningful cost to go get.

所以我認為還有很多工作要做。我很高興能夠在今年稍後與大家分享這個數字。它會像以前一樣有意義。我認為，在我擔任這個職位的六年裡，平均下來，大約有 1 億美元，這是有意義的。我確實相信還有更有意義的代價可以實現。

So more to follow on specific numbers, but it really should be the transformative stuff. The low-hanging fruit has probably gone a long time ago, and this is just sort of rightsizing the business and automating what we can for better experiences as well as lower cost.

因此，需要更多地關注具體數字，但它確實應該是變革性的東西。唾手可得的成果可能早已消失，這只是對業務進行適當調整併實現自動化，以獲得更好的體驗並降低成本。

Yes. Nick, if I can just build on that because you triggered me with the low-hanging fruit. I mean, as Charlotte said, the low-hanging fruit is gone, right? That's been done, good stuff. The exciting thing, and I'm going to talk about this on stage at an industry conference in 48 hours, is just how every day some of the advances with like GenAI are creating new cost efficiency opportunities.

是的。尼克，如果我能在此基礎上繼續發展，因為你用唾手可得的果實激發了我。我的意思是，正如夏綠蒂所說，唾手可得的果實已經沒了，對吧？已經完成了，好東西。令人興奮的是，48 小時後我將在一個產業會議上就此進行討論，GenAI 等技術進步每天都在創造新的成本效益機會。

But they're also creating new speed opportunities and new better experience opportunities. And even like the brokerage document processing example, Charlotte gave, that wasn't technically possible three years ago, and you just couldn't do it. And now it's doable. It's not only more efficient, but it runs 24/7. And I mean it's -- and so I want -- I'm trying to shift everybody's mindset to -- it's not about like low-hanging fruit and how high you can get on the tree anymore, it's literally just the new opportunities that are getting created that touch efficiency, that touch speed, that touch the experience.

但他們也在創造新的速度機會和新的、更好的體驗機會。甚至像夏洛特給出的經紀文件處理範例一樣，這在三年前從技術上來說是不可能的，你根本做不到。現在這是可行的。它不僅效率更​​高，而且可以全天候運作。我的意思是——所以我想——我試圖改變每個人的思維方式——這不再是關於低垂的果實和你能爬到樹上多高，而是實際上正在創造的新機會，觸及效率，觸及速度，觸及體驗。

And they're coming out of all this pretty fast. And it's true for every industry and being a leader in using that kind of thing like generative AI to do those things, has these awesome benefits, including letting us continue even if we label it a cost program to kind of drive changes to our margins and the bottom line, but also all those other speed and experience things. And so it's really exciting that it's opening up just areas that three years ago, you could have never have thought about for a cost program or the kind of economic changes.

他們很快就擺脫了這一切。對於每個行業都是如此，成為使用生成式人工智慧等技術來做這些事情的領導者，會帶來很多好處，包括讓我們能夠繼續下去，即使我們將其標記為成本計劃，以推動利潤和底線的變化，以及所有其他速度和經驗方面的事情。因此，這真的令人興奮，因為它開闢了三年前你從未想過的成本計劃或經濟變化領域。

Tommy McJoynt, KBW.

湯米·麥克喬伊特，KBW。

Can you help us out with how we should think about modeling the brokerage commission split just as we contemplate a gradual reversion to a more normal, what we'll call a 5 million existing home sale market. We understand there are inputs of mix by top-performing agents and agents moving up commission ladders and the impact of new business development. Is there any way to rank order or even provide some magnitudes to help us quantify these factors?

當我們考慮逐步恢復到更正常的狀態（我們稱之為 500 萬現有房屋銷售市場）時，您能否幫助我們思考如何模擬經紀佣金分成。我們了解到，業績最好的代理商和佣金不斷上升的代理商的投入以及新業務發展的影響。有沒有什麼方法可以依序排列，甚至提供一些量級來幫助我們量化這些因素？

Yes. I think the best thing I can point you to is like all the prepared remarks I've had over the past few years, agent mix started and was really pronounced during COVID, like as far back as 2020. And you would think at some point, you're lapping it and that it kind of goes away, but it really hasn't gone away. And so the theory is that it does improve as there are more transactions to be shared, but I think that remains to be seen. And I think the agent mix thing is probably the biggest contributor over time, but also has the possibility of more normalizing if it's sort of 5 million, 5.5 million or 6 million units again.

是的。我認為我能指出的最好的事情是，就像我過去幾年準備好的所有發言一樣，代理商組合在 COVID 期間開始並且非常明顯，例如早在 2020 年。你可能會認為，在某個時刻，你正在研磨它，它會消失，但它實際上並沒有消失。因此，理論上，隨著有更多的交易可供共享，情況確實會有所改善，但我認為這還有待觀察。我認為代理商組合可能是隨著時間的推移最大的貢獻者，但如果再次達到 500 萬、550 萬或 600 萬單位，也有可能更加正常化。

As far as new business development, on average, that's sort of flattish on a full year basis. It kind of gives us some noise quarter-by-quarter, but I don't think you should expect that to be a big benefit or hurt on an annual basis going forward. So I think that's just -- it's just seasonal and quarterly variations. And then as far as like the split tables, not all agents are on the table. In fact, it's like half-ish.

就新業務發展而言，平均而言，全年來看，這一數字比較穩定。這在某種程度上給我們帶來了季度間的一些噪音，但我認為你不應該期望這會在未來的年度基礎上帶來巨大的好處或傷害。所以我認為這只是季節性和季度變化。至於拆分錶，並非所有代理程式都在表中。事實上，它就像是一半。

And so it kind of works in concert with agent mix because usually, the highest producing agents are not on a table. They're on a fixed rate. So if they're getting more of the transactions, you're also not going to see the uptick from what's implied in a table. So I think -- I'd look at agent mix first. And then the table thing, yes, sure, it's going to have a little bit of an impact, but it's just not all the agents are on the table.

因此，它與代理商組合協同工作，因為通常情況下，產量最高的代理商不在考慮範圍內。他們的利率是固定的。因此，如果他們獲得了更多的交易，你不會看到表格中隱含的上升趨勢。所以我認為——我會先看看代理商組合。然後是桌子的事情，是的，當然，它會產生一點影響，但並不是所有的代理商都在桌子上。

Okay. Great. That's helpful color. And then switching over, just a housekeeping one. The corporate operating EBITDA was down quite a bit year-over-year.

好的。偉大的。這是很有幫助的顏色。然後切換，只是一個家事。公司營業EBITDA年比大幅下降。

What caused that in the second quarter? And then when we think about a good run rate to assume for that corporate segment going forward, what should use or if you have a full year expectation, that would be helpful.

是什麼原因導致第二季出現這種情況？然後，當我們考慮未來該公司部門的良好運作率時，應該使用什麼，或者如果您有全年的預期，那將會有所幫助。

On a full year basis, the corporate costs really do tend to stay about the same. There's only some variation, and that usually is driven by like bonus, bonus timing and like benefits where we haven't like spread it out to the business units. There was an impact in the second quarter from some charges that remained at corporate that will probably be allocated out to the business units in the future. But it's largely driven by bonus and by benefits. So as far as like on a full year basis, the corporate costs have actually kind of stayed flattish, like so cost savings are helping to offset inflation, but there was a little bit of a more pronounced impact in the second quarter of things that resided in corporate.

從全年來看，企業成本確實趨於維持不變。只有一些變化，通常是由獎金、獎金時間和福利等驅動的，我們還沒有將其分散到業務部門。第二季度，公司保留的一些費用產生了影響，這些費用將來可能會分配給業務部門。但這很大程度上是由獎金和福利所驅動的。因此，就全年而言，企業成本實際上保持平穩，因此成本節約有助於抵消通貨膨脹，但第二季度企業成本的影響更為明顯。

Okay. So is there anything in 2025 that's happening now that I guess we should think about backing out as we think about what the '26 kind of run rate should be and beyond?

好的。那麼，2025 年是否發生了一些事情，讓我們在思考 2026 年及以後的運行率應該是多少時，應該考慮退出？

The biggest challenge, and this is -- and I called it out in the script, it's kind of like unusual, but we're not the only company facing it, materially higher employee benefit costs. Like what we're seeing, and I think other companies are seeing is that there's more usage. So it's a bit of a price implication, but it's also usage. More people are going to the doctor than they have in the past, and it's actually material. It's material in our first half results, which is why I called it out.

最大的挑戰是——我在劇本中提到過，這有點不尋常，但我們並不是唯一面臨這個問題的公司，員工福利成本大幅增加。就像我們所看到的，而且我認為其他公司也看到了更多的使用。所以這有點涉及價格，但也涉及用途。與過去相比，現在去看醫生的人越來越多，而且這實際上很重要。這對我們的上半年業績來說很重要，這就是我提出這一點的原因。

That's the only like -- so what that I'm not sure about for next year. If this continues, like then you would see that flow through into 2026. Obviously, on an annual basis, you make decisions about your benefit plans. We're about to go through that process before we launch sort of people renewing their benefit programs and things like that in the fall. But that's kind of the single biggest factor that could potentially sort of move into 2026 with us.

這是唯一類似的——所以我對明年的情況不太確定。如果這種情況持續下去，那麼您會看到這種趨勢持續到 2026 年。顯然，您每年都會對您的福利計劃做出決定。我們將在秋季啟動人們的福利計劃更新等類似項目之前完成這項流程。但這可能是影響我們進入 2026 年的最大因素。

That concludes our Q&A session. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you all for joining. You may now disconnect. Everyone, have a great day.

我們的問答環節到此結束。女士們、先生們，感謝大家的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。祝大家有個愉快的一天。