Fortinet Inc (FTNT) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Hello, and welcome to Fortinet second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please be advised that this call is being recorded.

您好，歡迎參加 Fortinet 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，此通話正在錄音。

I would now like to hand the call over to Aaron Ovadia, Senior Director of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

現在我想把電話交給投資者關係高級總監 Aaron Ovadia。請繼續。

Thank you, and good afternoon, everyone. I am pleased to welcome everyone to our call to discuss Fortinet's financial results for the second quarter of 2025.

謝謝大家，下午好。我很高興歡迎大家參加我們的電話會議，討論 Fortinet 2025 年第二季的財務表現。

Joining me on today's call are Ken Xie, Fortinet's Founder, Chairman and CEO; Christiane Ohlgart, our CFO; and John Whittle, our COO. Ken will begin our call today by providing a high-level perspective on our business, Christiane will then review our financial results for the second quarter of 2025, before providing guidance for the third quarter and updating the full year. We will then open the call for questions. (Operator Instructions)

參加今天電話會議的還有 Fortinet 創辦人、董事長兼執行長 Ken Xie、財務長 Christiane Ohlgart 和營運長 John Whittle。肯 (Ken) 將在今天的電話會議上首先從高層次介紹我們的業務，然後克里斯蒂安 (Christiane) 將回顧我們 2025 年第二季度的財務業績，然後提供第三季度的指導並更新全年業績。然後我們將開始提問。（操作員指示）

Before we begin, I'd like to remind everyone that on today's call, we will be making forward-looking statements, and these forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties, which could cause actual results to differ materially from those projected. Please refer to our SEC filings, in particular, the risk factors in our most recent Form 10-K and Form 10-Q for more information. All forward-looking statements reflect our opinions only as of the date of this presentation, and we undertake no obligation and specifically disclaim any obligation to update forward-looking statements.

在我們開始之前，我想提醒大家，在今天的電話會議上，我們將做出前瞻性陳述，這些前瞻性陳述受風險和不確定性的影響，可能導致實際結果與預測結果有重大差異。請參閱我們的 SEC 文件，特別是我們最新的 10-K 表和 10-Q 表中的風險因素以獲取更多資訊。所有前瞻性陳述僅反映我們截至本簡報發布之日的觀點，我們不承擔任何義務，並明確否認更新前瞻性聲明的任何義務。

Also, all references to financial metrics that we make on today's call are non-GAAP, unless stated otherwise. Our GAAP results and GAAP to non-GAAP reconciliations are allocated in our earnings press release and in the presentation that accompany today's remarks, both of which are posted on our Investor Relations website.

此外，除非另有說明，我們在今天的電話會議上提到的所有財務指標都是非公認的會計準則。我們的 GAAP 結果和 GAAP 與非 GAAP 的對帳資訊已在我們的收益新聞稿和今天的演講附帶的簡報中公佈，兩者都已發佈在我們的投資者關係網站上。

As a reminder, this is a live call that will be available for replay via webcast on our Investor Relations website. The prepared remarks will also be posted on the quarterly earnings section of our IR website following today's call. Lastly, all references to growth are on a year-over-year basis, unless noted otherwise.

提醒一下，這是一次現場通話，您可以透過我們的投資者關係網站上的網路直播重播。今天的電話會議結束後，準備好的評論也將發佈在我們 IR 網站的季度收益部分。最後，除非另有說明，所有提及的成長均基於同比增長。

I will now turn the call over to Ken.

現在我將把電話轉給肯。

Thank you, Aaron, and thank you to everyone for joining our call. We are pleased with our strong second quarter performance beating both our building and operating margin guidance. Building on this business momentum, we are reaching our full year building outlook.

謝謝你，亞倫，也謝謝大家參加我們的電話會議。我們對第二季度的強勁表現感到非常滿意，其建築和營業利潤率均超過了預期。基於這項業務勢頭，我們正在實現全年建設目標。

In the second quarter, building grew by 15% and revenue grew by 14%, and we achieved a strong non-GAAP operating margin of 33%. Our strong top line results were driven by continued momentum among large enterprise customers with a total value of deal over $1 million increased by more than 50%. This growth reflects the strength and value of our innovation, the recent global demand of our integrated solution and the impact of go-to-market investment.

第二季度，建築業務成長了 15%，營收成長了 14%，我們實現了 33% 的強勁非公認會計準則營業利潤率。我們強勁的營收業績得益於大型企業客戶的持續成長勢頭，總交易價值超過 100 萬美元的客戶成長了 50% 以上。這一成長反映了我們創新的力量和價值、近期全球對我們整合解決方案的需求以及市場投資的影響。

Additionally, our recent investment in the fast-growing market of unified SASE and AI-driven secure operations are continuing to deliver strong return as building for both grew over 20% to a combined 35% of total buildings. Fortinet's strong momentum in SASE has been recognized by industry analysts as we are recently named a leader in the 2025 Garment Magic Quadrant for SASE platform, while also ranking number one in a secure branch network monetization case. We are the only vendor in the report that is also recognized in five different neo-securitimagic quadrant, which all run on a unified FortiOS.

此外，我們最近在快速成長的統一 SASE 和 AI 驅動的安全營運市場中的投資繼續帶來強勁回報，因為這兩項業務的建築物數量增長了 20% 以上，佔建築物總數的 35%。Fortinet 在 SASE 領域的強勁發展勢頭得到了行業分析師的認可，我們最近被評為 2025 年服裝 SASE 平台魔力像限的領導者，同時在安全分支網絡貨幣化案例中排名第一。我們是報告中唯一同時獲得五個不同新安全幻想像限認可的供應商，它們全部運行在統一的 FortiOS 上。

We continue to be the only vendor that has developed all core SASE capability in a single operation system, the FortiOS, including Negen firewall, SD-WAN, ZTNA, Secure Web Gateway, CASB and DLP. This native integrate of next-gen firewall, SD-WAN and SASE has become new generation SASE firewall, making it easy for customers to adopt an upgrade while reducing capacity and operation cost, enhancing user experience and ensure integrated hybrid secure access across both on-premise and cloud environment.

我們繼續是唯一在單一作業系統 FortiOS 中開發所有核心 SASE 功能的供應商，包括 Negen 防火牆、SD-WAN、ZTNA、安全性 Web 閘道、CASB 和 DLP。這種新一代防火牆、SD-WAN 和 SASE 的原生整合已成為新一代 SASE 防火牆，讓客戶可以輕鬆採用升級，同時降低容量和營運成本，增強用戶體驗並確保跨本地和雲端環境的整合混合安全存取。

Our success in unified SASE reflect the value customer placed in our new generation SASE firewall, beginning with their investment in our industry-leading FortiGate firewall build on our FortiASIC from their most large enterprise expanding into a secure SD-WAN capability before advancing to a FortiSASE solution.

我們在統一 SASE 方面的成功反映了客戶對我們新一代 SASE 防火牆的重視，首先是他們對我們業界領先的 FortiGate 防火牆的投資，該防火牆建立在我們的 FortiASIC 之上，從他們最大的企業擴展到安全的 SD-WAN 功能，然後再推進到 FortiSASE 解決方案。

As a result, 13% of large enterprise customers have purchased FortiSASE and increased over 60% year-over-year. Furthermore, we have invested around $2 billion to build and operate a global own infrastructure, spending around 5 million square feet across data centers, now on SOX customer supporting centers, executive briefing centers and the research and development facility.

結果顯示，13%的大型企業客戶購買了FortiSASE，較去年同期成長超過60%。此外，我們還投資了約 20 億美元來建造和營運全球自己的基礎設施，在資料中心方面花費了約 500 萬平方英尺，目前包括 SOX 客戶支援中心、高階主管簡報中心和研發設施。

This large-scale footprint give us a competitive advantage in delivering FortiSASE, FortiSASE cloud and other cloud services by owning and manage our infrastructure we ensure better customer experience, better cost efficiency, strong data solvency and high performance and scale.

這種大規模的覆蓋範圍使我們在提供 FortiSASE、FortiSASE 雲端和其他雲端服務方面具有競爭優勢，透過擁有和管理我們的基礎設施，我們確保更好的客戶體驗、更好的成本效率、強大的資料償付能力以及高效能和規模。

We also leveraged our Fortistack technology to provide enhanced security and better management across our SaaS services. Today, we announced -- we are expanding our FortiCloud offering with three new services, the FortiIdentity, FortiDrive and FortiConnect. These services natively integrate into the Fortinet Security Fabric providing centralized visibility, consistent policy enforcement and real-time threat protection across users, devices, applications, data and AI agents.

我們也利用 Fortistack 技術為我們的 SaaS 服務提供增強的安全性和更好的管理。今天，我們宣布——我們將透過三項新服務擴展我們的 FortiCloud 產品，即 FortiIdentity、FortiDrive 和 FortiConnect。這些服務原生整合到 Fortinet Security Fabric 中，為使用者、裝置、應用程式、資料和 AI 代理程式提供集中式視覺性、一致的策略實施和即時威脅防護。

In OT security, while we are achieving building growth of over 20%, we have recently named the overall leader in the Westland adviser IT and OT network protection platform Navigator 2025 report. For the third time in a row, earning the highest ranking in both strategic direction and technical capability. We continue to invest in AI, which we began developing more than 15 years ago and hold over 500 issued and pattern more than any other competitors.

在 OT 安全領域，我們實現了超過 20% 的建築成長，最近，我們在 Westland 顧問 IT 和 OT 網路保護平台 Navigator 2025 報告中被評為整體領導者。連續第三次在戰略方向和技術能力方面獲得最高排名。我們持續投資人工智慧，15 多年前我們就開始開發人工智慧，目前已發布超過 500 個版本，模式比其他任何競爭對手都多。

Our latest AI innovation, including FortiAI-Protect for advanced threat detection, FortiAI-Assist for automating security task and FortiAI-SecureAI for protecting AI infrastructure. As a result of our investment and recent innovations, our AI head-on solution are the fastest growing part of our business.

我們最新的人工智慧創新，包括用於進階威脅檢測的 FortiAI-Protect、用於自動化安全任務的 FortiAI-Assist 和用於保護人工智慧基礎設施的 FortiAI-SecureAI。由於我們的投資和最近的創新，我們的 AI 正面解決方案是我們業務中成長最快的部分。

I would like to thank our employees, customers, partners and suppliers worldwide for the continuous support and hard work. I will now turn the call over to Christiane.

我要感謝我們全球的員工、客戶、合作夥伴和供應商的持續支持和辛勤工作。現在我將把電話轉給克里斯蒂安。

Thank you, Ken. Thank you, Aaron, and good afternoon, everyone. As Ken mentioned, Fortinet's growth and momentum are strong. We beat our billings and operating margin guidance for the second quarter and raised our full year billings outlook. Total billings grew by 15% to $1.78 billion, driven by 21% growth in unified SASE and 31% growth in SecOps. Unified SASE and SecOps now account for 24% and 11% of total billings, respectively, up 1 point each.

謝謝你，肯。謝謝你，Aaron，大家下午好。正如 Ken 所提到的，Fortinet 的成長和勢頭強勁。我們超越了第二季度的營業額和營業利潤率預期，並提高了全年營業額預期。總帳單成長 15%，達到 17.8 億美元，其中統一 SASE 成長 21%，SecOps 成長 31%。統一 SASE 和 SecOps 目前分別佔總帳單的 24% 和 11%，各上升 1 個百分點。

Our strong billings growth was driven by continued momentum in expanding into the large enterprise as the number of deals greater than $1 million increased by 29%, while the total dollar value grew by 51%. Among our top five verticals, financial services, the vertical with arguably the most sophisticated and discerning security purchases led the way with billings growth of over 30%.

我們強勁的營業額成長得益於我們繼續向大型企業擴張的勢頭，超過 100 萬美元的交易數量增加了 29%，而總美元價值增長了 51%。在我們的五大垂直產業中，金融服務業可說是最成熟、最挑剔的證券購買業，其營業額成長率超過 30%。

In addition, we continue to expand our customer base. Over 6,900 new organizations chose our unified single FortiOS platform to power their cybersecurity strategy. The robust growth in new customers is a clear testament to our strong position in the SMB market, driven by the continued commitment and loyalty of our channel partners.

此外，我們也持續擴大我們的客戶群。超過 6,900 個新組織選擇了我們統一的單一 FortiOS 平台來支援他們的網路安全策略。新客戶數量的強勁成長清楚地證明了我們在中小企業市場的強勢地位，這得益於我們通路合作夥伴的持續承諾和忠誠。

Total RPO grew by 12% to $6.64 billion, while current RPO grew by 15% to $3.45 billion. With regards to ARR, unified SASE increased by 22% to $1.15 billion and SecOps increased by 35% to $463 million. Within unified SASE, FortiSASE, our SSE solution delivered strong results with ARR growth of over 100%, while the customer base expanded by 65%. Furthermore, adoption momentum has remained strong as 13% of our large enterprise customers have purchased FortiSASE, highlighting our continued expansion of FortiSASE in our customer base.

總 RPO 成長 12% 至 66.4 億美元，而目前 RPO 成長 15% 至 34.5 億美元。就 ARR 而言，統一 SASE 成長 22%，達到 11.5 億美元，SecOps 成長 35%，達到 4.63 億美元。在統一的 SASE FortiSASE 中，我們的 SSE 解決方案取得了強勁的業績，ARR 成長超過 100%，而客戶群擴大了 65%。此外，由於 13% 的大型企業客戶已經購買了 FortiSASE，採用勢頭依然強勁，這突顯了我們在客戶群中繼續擴大 FortiSASE。

As a reminder, the typical customer journey begins with the purchase of our FortiGate firewall. From there, customers often expand to our integrated secure SD-WAN solution before adopting our single vendor SASE offering, reflecting the growing convergence of security and networking. Over 50% of our FortiSASE customers also leverage our SD-WAN solution, while 90% of our large enterprise FortiSASE customers began their journey with SD-WAN, reflecting the value of our integrated platform approach and the convergence of security and networking.

提醒一下，典型的客戶旅程始於購買我們的 FortiGate 防火牆。從那裡開始，客戶通常會擴展到我們的整合安全性 SD-WAN 解決方案，然後再採用我們的單一供應商 SASE 產品，這反映了安全性和網路的日益整合。超過 50% 的 FortiSASE 客戶也利用我們的 SD-WAN 解決方案，而 90% 的大型企業 FortiSASE 客戶都是從 SD-WAN 開始他們的旅程的，這反映了我們的整合平台方法以及安全和網路融合的價值。

Total revenue grew by 14% to $1.63 billion, led by EMEA with growth of 18%, while the Americas and APAC both grew 11%. Product revenue increased by 13% to $509 million, benefiting from upgrade buying and strong growth in operational technology. We saw growth in all geos as we continue to lead the cybersecurity industry and product revenue.

總營收成長 14% 至 16.3 億美元，其中歐洲、中東和非洲地區成長最快，達 18%，美洲和亞太地區均成長 11%。由於升級購買和營運技術的強勁成長，產品收入成長 13% 至 5.09 億美元。隨著我們繼續引領網路安全產業和產品收入，我們看到所有地區都實現了成長。

Software license revenue grew at a high teens rate and accounted for a high teens percentage of total product revenue. Service revenue grew by 14% to $1.12 billion. Service billings grew by 17%, our highest growth rate in the past six quarters, reflecting many enterprise agreement renewals as our loyal customers continue to invest in our solutions and benefit from our strong track record of innovation.

軟體授權收入以高十幾個百分點的速度成長，並佔總產品收入的高十幾個百分點。服務收入成長14%，達到11.2億美元。服務費用成長了 17%，這是過去六個季度以來的最高成長率，這反映了許多企業協議的續簽，因為我們的忠實客戶繼續投資於我們的解決方案並受益於我們強大的創新記錄。

Now I'd like to highlight some seven-figure deals that demonstrate how customers are adopting FortiSASE, consolidating networking and security and expanding the overall footprint with Fortinet. First, an educational institution in APAC purchased solutions across all three of our pillars, including FortiSASE for 3,000 users.

現在，我想重點介紹一些七位數的交易，這些交易顯示了客戶如何採用 FortiSASE、整合網路和安全以及擴大 Fortinet 的整體影響力。首先，亞太地區的一家教育機構購買了我們涵蓋三大支柱的解決方案，包括適用於 3,000 名使用者的 FortiSASE。

This customer chose Fortinet over the competition for our simplified, flexible and consistent security enforcement, enabling secure access to both on-premises and cloud applications while delivering a seamless user experience. By leveraging FortiOS and FortiSASE, the school achieves superior performance, reduced total cost of ownership and simplified operations through our integrated security platform.

這位客戶之所以選擇 Fortinet，是因為我們擁有簡化、靈活且一致的安全實施能力，能夠安全地存取本地和雲端應用程序，同時提供無縫的用戶體驗。透過利用 FortiOS 和 FortiSASE，學校透過我們的整合安全平台實現了卓越的性能、降低了整體擁有成本並簡化了營運。

Next, in an expansion and displacement deal, a leading retailer with 1,700 locations significantly increased the investment in Fortinet purchasing solutions across all three pillars, including FortiAPs, FortiSwitches and FortiAIOps. Already FortiGate customer with firewalls deployed at every location, the retailer selected FortiAPs for all sites and FortiSwitches for 600 locations, with the remainder planned for early 2026.

接下來，在一項擴張和替代交易中，一家擁有 1,700 家門市的領先零售商大幅增加了對 Fortinet 採購三大支柱解決方案的投資，包括 FortiAP、FortiSwitches 和 FortiAIOps。該零售商已經是 FortiGate 的客戶，在每個位置都部署了防火牆，並為所有站點選擇了 FortiAP，為 600 個位置選擇了 FortiSwitches，其餘位置計劃在 2026 年初完成。

This customer chose Fortinet for our integrated FortiOS operating system, which enables seamless convergence of networking and security. As part of the deployment, they adopted FortiAIOps to proactively manage their access points and switches, leveraging our AI-driven capabilities to improve operational efficiency.

該客戶選擇 Fortinet 是因為我們的整合 FortiOS 作業系統，可實現網路和安全的無縫融合。作為部署的一部分，他們採用 FortiAIOps 來主動管理他們的存取點和交換機，利用我們的人工智慧驅動功能來提高營運效率。

In another large deal, a top US school district expanded its footprint with the purchase of FortiGates, FortiSwitches and FortiAPs as part of a 350-plus site refresh, displacing multiple vendors, already utilizing solutions across all three of our pillars, including FortiSASE, the district continues to invest in Fortinet to drive deeper network segmentation, stronger security outcomes and greater infrastructure resiliency.

在另一筆大交易中，美國一家頂尖學區透過購買 FortiGates、FortiSwitches 和 FortiAP 擴大了其覆蓋範圍，作為 350 多個站點更新的一部分，取代了多家供應商，該學區已經利用了我們所有三大支柱的解決方案，包括 FortiSASE，該學區繼續投資更高層 Fortinet，以推動更強大的分段設施和更強大的基礎設施。

Due to their continued consolidation on Fortinet products, they are realizing significant operational benefits, including simplified guest access, accelerated deployments and more efficient upgrade cycles all managed through our unified FortiOS platform.

由於他們持續整合 Fortinet 產品，他們實現了顯著的營運優勢，包括簡化的訪客訪問、加速的部署和更高效的升級週期，所有這些都透過我們統一的 FortiOS 平台進行管理。

Lastly, a technology company upgraded a portion of the high-end firewalls as a result of the upcoming 2026 and of support deadline and expanded their deployment with additional FortiGate appliances in the data center. They selected Fortinet for our FortiOS operating system, which enables streamlined operations while delivering a lower total cost of ownership.

最後，一家科技公司為應對即將到來的 2026 年支援期限而升級了部分高階防火牆，並在資料中心增加了 FortiGate 設備來擴展其部署。他們選擇了 Fortinet 作為我們的 FortiOS 作業系統，該系統可以簡化操作，同時降低整體擁有成本。

Turning to margins and cash flow. Total gross margin increased by 10 basis points to 81.6% and exceeded the high end of the guidance range by 60 basis points due to strong execution and cost control. Product gross margin of 67.8% increased by 180 basis points as inventory-related charges normalized. Service gross margin of 87.8% was down by 80 basis points due to increased investments associated with the expansion of our hosted security solutions.

轉向利潤和現金流。由於強有力的執行和成本控制，總毛利率增加了 10 個基點，達到 81.6%，超出指導範圍的高端 60 個基點。由於庫存相關費用恢復正常，產品毛利率為 67.8%，增加了 180 個基點。由於與擴展託管安全解決方案相關的投資增加，服務毛利率為 87.8%，下降了 80 個基點。

Operating margin of 33.1% decreased by 200 basis points, while being 60 basis points above the high end of our guidance range. The year-over-year decline reflects increased investments in sales headcount, the absorption of costs from recent acquisitions and foreign exchange headwinds stemming from a weaker US dollar as most of our operating expenses are denominated in foreign currencies.

營業利益率為 33.1%，下降了 200 個基點，但比我們的指導範圍高端高出 60 個基點。同比下降反映了銷售人員投資的增加、近期收購成本的吸收以及由於美元疲軟而導致的外匯不利因素（因為我們的大部分營運費用都是以外幣計價的）。

Free cash flow was $284 million and adjusted free cash flow was $428 million, up $104 million. Cash generation in the first half of the year was very strong with adjusted free cash flow reaching $1.27 billion, representing a margin of 40% year-to-date. Infrastructure investments were $168 million, up $145 million as we continue to build out our infrastructure footprint to support FortiSASE, FortiCloud and other services. We repurchased approximately 4.6 million shares of our common stock for an aggregate cost of $401 million in the second quarter. The remaining share buyback authorization as of today is approximately $1.6 billion.

自由現金流為 2.84 億美元，調整後自由現金流為 4.28 億美元，增加 1.04 億美元。上半年現金產生非常強勁，調整後的自由現金流達到 12.7 億美元，年初至今的利潤率為 40%。基礎設施投資為 1.68 億美元，增加了 1.45 億美元，因為我們繼續擴大基礎設施覆蓋範圍以支援 FortiSASE、FortiCloud 和其他服務。我們在第二季回購了約 460 萬股普通股，總成本為 4.01 億美元。截至今日，剩餘的股票回購授權約為 16 億美元。

Before moving on to guidance, I'd like to provide an update on our firewall upgrade cycle and the broader macro environment. During our Analyst Day last November, we shared that approximately 650,000 firewall units will reach end of service by the end of 2026, followed by another cohort of 350,000 low-end units in '27.

在提供指導之前，我想先介紹一下我們的防火牆升級週期和更廣泛的宏觀環境。在去年 11 月的分析師日上，我們曾表示，到 2026 年底，大約有 650,000 個防火牆單元將停止服務，隨後在 2027 年，又有 350,000 個低端單元停止服務。

While the 2027 cohort is less significant than the 2026 cohort in terms of product revenue due to its lower price point, firewall upgrade discussions offer valuable opportunities to engage with both, our customers and channel partners, allowing us to showcase our ongoing innovation in FortiOS. By upgrading to our new generation SASE firewalls, customers gain enhanced security capabilities and benefit from our unified platform approach.

雖然由於價格較低，2027 年隊列在產品收入方面不如 2026 年隊列重要，但防火牆升級討論提供了與我們的客戶和通路合作夥伴互動的寶貴機會，使我們能夠展示我們在 FortiOS 方面的持續創新。透過升級到我們的新一代 SASE 防火牆，客戶可以獲得增強的安全功能並受益於我們的統一平台方法。

We estimate that we are approximately 40% to 50% of the way through the 2026 upgrade cycle at the end of the second quarter based on the remaining active units and service contracts, and we expect continued upgrade activity for the remaining devices over the next six quarters.

根據剩餘的活躍單位和服務合同，我們估計到第二季度末我們已經完成了 2026 年升級週期的約 40% 到 50%，並且我們預計剩餘設備的升級活動將在未來六個季度內繼續進行。

Our focus and open communication regarding the refresh allow us and our channel partners to have conversations with our customers around both, the upgrade and the customers' overall security strategy, benefiting us longer term.

我們對更新的關注和開放的溝通使我們和我們的通路合作夥伴能夠與我們的客戶就升級和客戶的整體安全策略進行對話，這將使我們長期受益。

Despite ongoing uncertainty surrounding tariffs and the global economic outlook, we have not experienced a negative impact on our business. The cybersecurity market and the demand for our solutions remains strong and resilient.

儘管關稅和全球經濟前景持續存在不確定性，但我們的業務並未受到負面影響。網路安全市場和對我們解決方案的需求依然強勁且有彈性。

Now moving on to guidance. As a reminder, our third quarter and full year outlooks, which are summarized on slide 17 and 18 are subject to the disclaimers regarding forward-looking information that Aaron provided at the beginning of the call.

現在開始指導。提醒一下，我們的第三季和全年展望（在第 17 和 18 張投影片中進行了總結）受 Aaron 在電話會議開始時提供的有關前瞻性資訊的免責聲明的約束。

For the third quarter, we expect billings in the range of USD1.76 billion to USD1.84 billion, which at the midpoint represents growth of 14%. Revenue in the range of USD1.67 billion to USD1.73 billion, which at the midpoint represents growth of 13%. Non-GAAP gross margins of 80% to 81%, non-GAAP operating margin of 32.5% to 33.5%. Non-GAAP earnings per share of $0.62 to $0.64, which assumes a share count between 772 million and 776 million.

對於第三季度，我們預計營業額將在 17.6 億美元至 18.4 億美元之間，中間值代表成長 14%。營收在 16.7 億美元至 17.3 億美元之間，中間值代表成長 13%。非公認會計準則毛利率為80%至81%，非公認會計準則營業利益率為32.5%至33.5%。非公認會計準則每股收益為 0.62 美元至 0.64 美元，假設股票數量在 7.72 億至 7.76 億之間。

Infrastructure investments of $110 million to $130 million. A non-GAAP tax rate of 18%, cash taxes of $60 million to $90 million. As a result of our strong results in the first half of the year, we are pleased to have raised the midpoint of our full year billings guidance by $100 million. We maintained our total revenue guidance while adjusting the revenue mix by shifting $50 million from service to product revenue.

基礎建設投資1.1億至1.3億美元。非公認會計準則稅率為 18%，現金稅為 6,000 萬至 9,000 萬美元。由於我們上半年的強勁業績，我們很高興將全年營業額預期中位數提高了 1 億美元。我們維持總收入指導，同時調整收入結構，將 5,000 萬美元從服務收入轉移到產品收入。

Despite the shift towards product revenue for the full year, we maintained our gross margin range and slightly increased our operating margin guidance midpoint. We continue to remain on track to achieve the Rule of 45 in 2025 for the sixth consecutive year.

儘管全年收入轉向產品收入，我們仍維持了毛利率範圍，並略微提高了營業利潤率指引中點。我們將繼續朝著在 2025 年連續第六年實現 45 規則的目標邁進。

For the full year, we expect billings in the range of USD7.325 billion to USD7.475 billion, which at the midpoint represents growth of 13%. Revenue in the range of USD6.675 billion to USD6.825 billion, which at the midpoint represents growth of [13%]. Service revenue in the range of $4.55 billion to $4.65 billion, which at the midpoint represents growth of 14%.

我們預計全年營業額將在 73.25 億美元至 74.75 億美元之間，中間值代表成長 13%。收入在 66.75 億美元至 68.25 億美元之間，中間值代表[13%]。服務收入在 45.5 億美元至 46.5 億美元之間，中間值代表成長 14%。

Non-GAAP gross margin of 79% to 81%, non-GAAP operating margin of 32% to 33.5%. Non-GAAP earnings per share of $2.47 to $2.53, which assumes a share count of between 773 million and 777 million. Infrastructure investments of $380 million to $430 million. A non-GAAP tax rate of 18% and cash taxes of between $400 million to $450 million, which is $125 million lower than our prior expectation, primarily due to new tax law changes.

非美國通用會計準則毛利率為79%至81%，非美國通用會計準則營業利益率為32%至33.5%。非公認會計準則每股收益為 2.47 美元至 2.53 美元，假設股票數量在 7.73 億至 7.77 億之間。基礎建設投資為3.8億至4.3億美元。非公認會計準則稅率為 18%，現金稅在 4 億至 4.5 億美元之間，比我們先前預期的低 1.25 億美元，主要原因是新的稅法變化。

I now hand the call back over to Aaron to begin the Q&A session.

我現在將電話交還給 Aaron，開始問答環節。

Thank you, Christiane. (Operator Instructions) Operator, please open the line for questions.

謝謝你，克里斯蒂安。（接線員指示）接線員，請打開熱線以回答問題。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Shaul Eyal, TD Cowen.

沙烏爾·埃亞爾（Shaul Eyal），考恩（Cowen）TD。

Alright, thank you very much. Good afternoon, team. Congrats on the improved outlook for the year. Ken, Christiane, one of the questions we are constantly receiving from investors is whether sales of FortiSASE potentially cannibalize the core appliance business, but it would appear we are currently seeing tailwinds across both these segments. Can you help us maybe reconcile these views?

好的，非常感謝。大家下午好。祝賀今年的前景有所改善。Ken、Christiane，投資人經常向我們提出的一個問題是，FortiSASE 的銷售是否有可能蠶食核心家電業務，但目前看來，這兩個領域都呈現順風態勢。您能幫助我們調和這些觀點嗎？

Yeah, I think probably, we do see customer expanding beyond the traditional firewall and -- but also traditional firewalls still the important control point for all this traffic, especially within the enterprise, within the data center. On the other side, some supporting whether work from home or traveling or some other branch office, that's also kind of a certain SASE and especially certain like use case, we see a way beyond the traditional network security there. So we don't see SASE replacing the firewall. We just see is keeping enhancing. That's what we call the SASE firewall.

是的，我想我們確實看到客戶超越了傳統的防火牆——但傳統防火牆仍然是所有這些流量的重要控制點，特別是在企業內部、資料中心內部。另一方面，無論是在家工作、旅行還是在其他分支機構工作，一些支援也是一種特定的 SASE，特別是某些用例，我們看到了超越傳統網路安全的方法。因此，我們並不認為 SASE 會取代防火牆。我們只是看到它正在不斷增強。這就是我們所說的 SASE 防火牆。

It's really the firewall itself need to keep adding new function like from 25 years ago, when we started Fortinet, the new generation of firewall add like application control, like intrusion prevention, like antivirus in the traditional for VPN.

防火牆本身確實需要不斷添加新功能，就像 25 年前我們創立 Fortinet 時一樣，新一代防火牆在傳統的 VPN 功能中添加了應用程式控制、入侵防禦和防毒等功能。

Now the traditional firewall also need additional like a SASE function together with some other edge device like FortiAP, FortiSwitch and also endpoint device and also the cloud deployment. So that's from the whole protection infrastructure, which is really give much better security for the enterprise user.

現在傳統的防火牆還需要額外的像是SASE功能以及一些其他邊緣設備，如FortiAP、FortiSwitch和端點設備以及雲端部署。從整個保護基礎設施來看，這確實為企業用戶提供了更好的安全性。

Let me add to what Ken just said. In our win-loss analysis, we see very little reason codes for customers moving to the cloud and not continuing to buy. So I think it's an expansion. It's not a replacement.

讓我補充一下肯剛才說的話。在我們的勝負分析中，我們發現客戶轉向雲端但不再繼續購買的原因很少。所以我認為這是一種擴展。這不是替代品。

And to your point, we see both markets growing. And then if you look at the market share, they're very fragmented markets on the firewall side. And so we can grow both by the market growing on the firewall side and expanding our market share by taking business from other competitors.

正如您所說，我們看到兩個市場都在成長。如果你看一下市場份額，你會發現防火牆方面的市場非常分散。因此，我們既可以透過防火牆方面的市場成長來實現成長，又可以透過從其他競爭對手那裡搶佔業務來擴大我們的市場份額。

Understood. And Christiane, thank you so much for the color about where we stand in a refresh cycle. Maybe a little bit of a long-term view of kind of already touching on the fiscal '27 cohort of products that will be refreshed. Are there any specificities associated with those family of products as we think about the 2027, which is coming to a renewal or a refresh?

明白了。克里斯蒂安，非常感謝您詳細說明我們在更新周期中的位置。也許從長遠角度來看，我們已經觸及了 27 財年將要更新的產品群。當我們考慮即將更新或刷新的 2027 年時，這些產品系列是否具有任何特殊性？

Yeah. I think I've shared that in previous meetings potentially, that 2027 cohort is the low end of the low end. So it's not -- unit-wise, it's significant. Product revenue wise, it's not as significant, but that's why we included the message in my remarks, it's significant because we can talk to a lot of customers about where the security is going, right? And so that's where it provides a lot of upsell potential for us.

是的。我認為我在之前的會議上可能已經分享過這一點，即 2027 年的隊列是低端中的低端。所以從單位角度來看，這並不重要。從產品收入的角度來看，這並不那麼重要，但這就是我們在我的評論中加入這個資訊的原因，它很重要，因為我們可以與許多客戶討論安全的發展方向，對嗎？因此，這為我們提供了許多追加銷售潛力。

Got it. Thank you so much.

知道了。太感謝了。

Brian Essex, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的布萊恩艾塞克斯。

Great, good afternoon. Thank you for taking the question. Maybe Christiane, I was wondering if you could tell us what are some of the maybe untapped the services guidance a little bit. It's great to see the upside in the quarter, particularly with regard to product billings and services strength this quarter. But how should we, I guess, -- what can we take away from the services guide? And what's embedded in the guidance for the year given the strength that you're seeing this quarter?

太好了，下午好。感謝您回答這個問題。也許是克里斯蒂安，我想知道您是否可以告訴我們一些可能尚未開發的服務指導。很高興看到本季的上漲，特別是本季產品帳單和服務實力的提升。但是我想，我們該如何做呢——我們可以從服務指南中得到什麼呢？鑑於本季的強勁表現，您對今年的業績預期有何展望？

So -- the services billings to revenue conversion takes a little bit longer, right? And that's what we are seeing based on the remaining waterfall. We are pleased with our current RPO growth. But for the rest of the year, we decided to be prudent, take the midpoint down, but we believe that we are not -- we are confident that the product revenue is going to be stronger for the rest of the year based on the pipeline.

那麼——服務帳單到收入的轉換需要更長的時間，對嗎？這就是我們根據剩餘的瀑布所看到的情況。我們對目前的 RPO 成長感到滿意。但在今年剩餘時間內，我們決定採取謹慎態度，降低中間點，但我們相信我們不會——我們相信，根據通路情況，今年剩餘時間內的產品收入將會更加強勁。

Yeah. Also probably last quarter, it's the first time in the last few years, the product revenue growth starting faster now. it's more like four years ago, like 2021, not in the product revenue growth we very fast, and then that gave us kind of benefit in the last few years, the service revenue still maintain a pretty healthy level, even the product revenue going down in the last one to two years.

是的。也可能是上個季度，這是過去幾年第一次，產品收入成長開始加快。這更像是四年前，例如 2021 年，我們的產品收入成長不是很快，這在過去幾年為我們帶來了一定的好處，服務收入仍然保持相當健康的水平，即使產品收入在過去一兩年有所下降。

Now we see the product revenue sitting accelerating, which will be the leading indicator for the future service revenue, which we also view since starting turnaround, especially in both the product revenue and also the service revenue starting kind of instead of keeping dropping gradually probably will be starting kicking up.

現在我們看到產品收入正在加速成長，這將成為未來服務收入的領先指標，我們也看到，自從開始好轉以來，特別是產品收入和服務收入都開始出現下降趨勢，而不是逐漸下降，可能會開始回升。

And do you have the split FortiGuard, FortiCare? And is this a component of, like if you have a refresh? Obviously, is it that customers aren't completely replacing their subscription revenue? They're just extending their subscription revenue with maybe less upside to that revenue line item? I mean so you have a new box with the same at tax revenue.

您有分割的 FortiGuard 和 FortiCare 嗎？這是否是您刷新時的一個組成部分？顯然，客戶的收入還不能完全取代他們的訂閱收入嗎？他們只是在擴大訂閱收入，但該收入項目的上升空間可能較小？我的意思是，您有一個與稅收收入相同的新盒子。

Correct. So that's part of it. I think there's part of it that the devices that they're using to replace, they may use a higher box, but they can consolidate one to two boxes, right? So it's different components that, that factor into the service revenue attached to the boxes, and this is where it's so critical for us to upsell not only SASE, but all our other revenue streams that benefit the customer.

正確的。這就是其中的一部分。我認為部分原因是他們用來替換的設備可能會使用更高的盒子，但他們可以合併一到兩個盒子，對嗎？因此，不同的組件都會影響與盒子相關的服務收入，而這對我們來說不僅要追加銷售 SASE，還要追加銷售所有其他使客戶受益的收入來源，這一點至關重要。

But that's super helpful color.

但那是非常有用的顏色。

Thank you so much.

太感謝了。

And based on the customer journeys, you can see the customer journeys work, right? Use is working. It's just not necessarily at the same point in time when they buy a firewall.

根據客戶旅程，您可以看到客戶旅程是有效的，對嗎？使用有效。只是他們購買防火牆的時間不一定是同一時間。

Got it. Understood.

知道了。明白了。

Tal Liani, Bank of America.

塔爾·利亞尼（Tal Liani），美國銀行。

Here we go. (inaudible), I am muted myself. Can you hear me?

開始了。 （聽不清楚），我自己也靜音了。你聽得到我嗎？

Yeah, that's good.

是的，很好。

Okay. Sorry. The SASE, the profile of SASE customers, what is it? Meaning, are these displacements of existing vendors, let's say, a customer has the scale or how often you're displacing them? Are these -- do they purchase at the end of a contract that they had before with someone else?

好的。對不起。SASE，SASE 客戶的概況是什麼？意思是，這些是否會取代現有的供應商，比如說，客戶有規模，或者你取代他們的頻率是多少？這些是——他們是否在與其他人簽訂的合約結束時購買的？

Or are these completely greenfield. They didn't have anything before. Now they're having. I'm just trying to understand where you have success with your SASE. What is kind of the profile of the deployment, the (inaudible) of the ones you're seeing? Thanks.

或者這些是完全未開發的地區。他們之前什麼都沒有。現在他們正在。我只是想了解您的 SASE 在哪些方面取得了成功。您所看到的部署概況是什麼樣的？ （聽不清楚）謝謝。

Both. From our current customer base, a lot of than they do see the new operation system gave them a SASE capability, both the software and hardware. So that's where the in unable to SASE. You can see the slide 4 in the presentation, that's how we did in the SASE a few years ago. Now the SASE become a fast-growing part of the business there, especially coming from the current installation base.

兩個都。從我們目前的客戶群來看，許多客戶確實看到了新的作業系統為他們提供了 SASE 功能，包括軟體和硬體。這就是無法使用 SASE 的原因。您可以看到簡報中的第 4 張投影片，這就是我們幾年前在 SASE 所做的。現在，SASE 已成為那裡業務中快速成長的一部分，尤其是從目前的安裝基礎來看。

But we also see quite a few were successful case replacing competitor because we also -- because we offer all these kind of integrated SASE solution, and some of our partners, especially service providers also like this kind of a single OS solution. So a thing called SASE firewall basically, just like how NextGen firewall starting replacing the traditional firewall.

但我們也看到不少成功取代競爭對手的案例，因為我們也——因為我們提供所有這些類型的整合 SASE 解決方案，而且我們的一些合作夥伴，特別是服務提供者也喜歡這種單一作業系統解決方案。所以基本上有一種叫做 SASE 防火牆的東西，就像 NextGen 防火牆開始取代傳統防火牆。

The SASE firewall was starting to replace in not just next-gen firewall, but also on the SASE. Because a lot of customers they view SASE, just like a few years ago, like sandbox like 20 years ago intrusion prevention starting from separate solutions, now they want to have with whatever the network security infrastructure technology they have. So once the integrated solution in place, the single solution starting kind of last year age and also starting kind of huge disadvantage for actual management cost for all the actual costs basically.

SASE 防火牆不僅開始取代新一代防火牆，也開始取代 SASE。因為許多客戶認為 SASE 就像幾年前一樣，就像 20 年前的沙盒一樣，入侵防禦是從單獨的解決方案開始的，現在他們希望擁有他們擁有的任何網路安全基礎設施技術。因此，一旦整合解決方案到位，單一解決方案從去年開始就存在了，基本上對所有實際成本的實際管理成本都產生了巨大的不利影響。

So that we see a lot of customers love the gene love all this SASE firewall solution without the integrated solution together. So that we see both the current customer base and a lot of other customers from competitors to quickly adopt this new solution, and this is the fast-growing part of our business right now.

因此我們看到很多客戶喜歡基因喜歡所有這個 SASE 防火牆解決方案而不需要整合解決方案在一起。因此，我們看到現有客戶群和來自競爭對手的許多其他客戶都迅速採用了這項新解決方案，這是我們目前業務中快速成長的部分。

You said in the past that 95% of the customers are existing firewall customers, is still the case?

您以前說過95%的客戶都是現有的防火牆客戶，現在還是這樣嗎？

Yeah, over 90% come from the current customer base, but we do see some other customer, which using our competitors' solution also changing to our solution now.

是的，超過 90% 來自現有客戶群，但我們確實看到一些其他客戶，他們使用我們競爭對手的解決方案，現在也轉向使用我們的解決方案。

Got it. If I can squeeze in one more. If not, we can move on. But I want to ask about the margins. You said in the past that you want to invest. What is the margin outlook? And where is the balance between investments and margin upside?

知道了。如果我能再擠進一個的話。如果沒有，我們可以繼續。但我想問一下利潤率。您以前說過您想投資。利潤前景如何？投資和利潤上漲之間的平衡點在哪裡？

Yeah, we like to play the long-term game. Same just like the SASE, as we did in the firewall market, which we are the only one building ASIC chip. So for SASE, we also invest in the infrastructure, which has a much better cost advantage also more secure compared to leverage some other third party.

是的，我們喜歡玩長期遊戲。就像 SASE 一樣，我們在防火牆市場也是唯一一家製造 ASIC 晶片的公司。因此，對於 SASE，我們也投資了基礎設施，與利用其他第三方相比，它具有更好的成本優勢，也更安全。

So that's where we do believe if a long-term SASE kind of our own infrastructure, like 70% of traffic, then 30% in certain locations still using third party. That will be the best cost model, even in the first few years, many more investment.

因此，我們確實相信，如果我們自己的基礎設施長期採用 SASE 類型，例如 70% 的流量，那麼某些地方的 30% 仍然使用第三方。那將是最好的成本模式，即使在最初幾年，也需要更多的投資。

But long term, both customers or partners ourselves or benefit -- so that's where we do believe we have a very healthy margin. And this model, long-term game will also benefit both ourselves and our customers, both short term and long term.

但從長遠來看，無論是客戶還是合作夥伴，我們自己都會受益——因此，我們相信我們擁有非常健康的利潤率。而這種模式，長期的博弈，對我們自己和客戶來說，無論是短期或長期，都是有利的。

Yeah, thank you.

是的，謝謝。

Gabriela Borges, Goldman Sachs.

加布里埃拉·博爾赫斯，高盛。

Hi, good afternoon. Thank you, Ken and Christian, I wanted to follow up on your prepared remarks that we are 40% to 50% through the 2026 refresh cohort. What I wanted to understand is how to think about our growth in true cycles? Because if I can pay a billings growth what you're guiding to this year, it's about similar to what you guided to and what you achieved in 2023? 2025 is a really big or larger than normal refresh cohort. So I want to better understand why are we not seeing more upside in the numbers this year from the refresh cohort?

嗨，下午好。謝謝 Ken 和 Christian，我想跟進一下你們準備好的發言，我們已經完成了 2026 年更新隊列的 40% 到 50%。我想了解的是，如何看待我們在真實週期中的成長？因為如果我能支付您今年所指導的帳單成長，那麼它與您在 2023 年所指導的和所取得的成就大致相同？2025 年是一個非常大的或比正常更新隊列更大的更新隊列。所以我想更能理解為什麼我們今年沒有看到更新群體的數字有更多上升？

And the comment earlier on potentially consolidating down boxes. Is it possible that perhaps customers have excess capacity in their networks from a 2021 COVID-type elevated throughput environment? Would love to hear about it. Thank you.

之前有關於可能合併框的評論。在 2021 年 COVID 類型的高吞吐量環境下，客戶的網路容量是否可能過剩？我很想聽聽這件事。謝謝。

Gabriela, good points. I think we need to look at it by FortiGate model. And the large firewalls that are end of support. We have a really good reporting and handle on because we know where they are. These are always well enterprise customers, right?

加布里埃拉，說得好。我認為我們需要透過 FortiGate 模型來看一下。大型防火牆也已停止支援。我們有很好的報告和處理能力，因為我們知道他們在哪裡。這些都是很好的企業客戶，對嗎？

We have a good handle on the lower end of the firewalls where it's with enterprise customers in retail or other scenarios, OT scenarios, where it's harder for us to predict. And we can only track registration rates and similar is in the lower end.

我們對防火牆的低端有很好的把握，它適用於零售或其他場景、OT 場景中的企業客戶，對於這些場景我們很難預測。我們只能追蹤註冊率，類似的註冊率處於較低水準。

And there could be some excess capacity from prior years that has been replaced or that is replacing some of the EOS models. We are comfortable with our guidance. But yeah, the expectations by the Street might have been a little bit higher, but we said we are outperforming the market, and it was baked in, right? So we've been consistent in our messaging here.

並且可能存在一些前幾年的過剩產能，這些產能已經被取代或正在取代一些 EOS 型號。我們對我們的指導感到滿意。但是，華爾街的預期可能要高一點，但我們說我們的表現優於市場，這是可以接受的，對吧？因此，我們在這裡傳達的訊息是一致的。

Yeah. Also the -- the refresh upgrade of the product go out next year is the product you all been like 12 to 15 years after we introduced the product. It's not a product like four, five years ago when the supply chain issue happened. But if you compare to like a 10, 12, 15 years ago, the business size probably like current side is probably 5 times, maybe even 10 times larger. So that's where the operate refresh, we do see is very different than the supply chain issue a few years ago.

是的。此外，明年推出的產品的更新升級版是我們推出產品 12 至 15 年後推出的產品。這不再是四、五年前出現供應鏈問題時的產品了。但如果與 10 年、12 年、15 年前相比，業務規模可能擴大了 5 倍，甚至 10 倍。因此，我們確實看到營運更新與幾年前的供應鏈問題有很大不同。

It's a much older product. We really -- after we introduced a new product, they use every selling maybe like seven, eight years. And then after we stop selling still supporting five additional year for the service. After five additional year stop shipping, but we do support service, then the customer reach to the end of service. So that's early probably average maybe like 12 to 15 years after the product being introduced.

這是一個非常古老的產品。我們確實——在我們推出新產品後，他們每次銷售可能都要花費七、八年的時間。在我們停止銷售後，仍支援額外五年的服務。額外五年後停止出貨，但我們提供支援服務，然後客戶即可享有服務終止。所以這可能是產品推出後平均約 12 到 15 年的時間。

So that's the sense we kind of try to help customers to upgrade. And so like I said, even we have a large number of products, but that's utilized the business we have like 12, 15 years ago.

我們從某種意義上來說試圖幫助客戶升級。就像我說的，即使我們擁有大量的產品，但那隻是利用了我們 12 到 15 年前的業務。

I would also say we have additional incremental TAM to address going forward with SASE and SecOps where those are becoming meaningful parts of our business. So if you look at historical results, they were more focused on the firewall, but those are becoming real growth drivers for us.

我還要說的是，我們還有額外的增量 TAM 來解決 SASE 和 SecOps 的問題，它們將成為我們業務中有意義的部分。因此，如果你看一下歷史結果，你會發現他們更關注防火牆，但這些正在成為我們真正的成長動力。

Thank you for the color. Christiane, maybe as a follow-up. The commentary last quarter on hesitancy in the sales for us and in some of the sales force conversations. I think today, you said macro didn't have an impact on the business. So maybe just reconcile those two data points. Are you still seeing hesitancy is the hesitancy gone? Thank you.

謝謝你的顏色。克里斯蒂安，也許作為後續行動。上個季度的評論針對的是我們的銷售猶豫不決以及一些銷售人員的對話。我認為今天您說宏觀經濟對業務沒有影響。所以也許只需協調這兩個數據點。還看到猶豫嗎？猶豫已經消失了嗎？謝謝。

I would say that we've seen that we are resilient despite macroeconomic uncertainty. And -- the pipeline for the rest of the year and the sales confidence is good. So that's where we are confident to raise our billings guidance.

我想說，儘管宏觀經濟存在不確定性，但我們已經看到我們具有韌性。並且——今年剩餘時間的銷售管道和銷售信心都很好。因此，我們有信心提高我們的營業額預期。

Thank you for the thoughts.

謝謝你的想法。

Rob Owens, Piper Sandler.

羅伯歐文斯、派珀桑德勒。

Great. Thank you for taking my question. Love for you to expand a little bit on the OT opportunity because I don't think I recall anything from your prepared remarks. Just in terms of what you're seeing there, both either increased competition? Or is this opportunity also playing into the refresh cycle? Thanks.

偉大的。感謝您回答我的問題。希望您能稍微詳細地介紹一下 OT 機會，因為我認為我不記得您準備好的發言中的任何內容。就您所看到的情況而言，競爭是否都加劇了？或者這個機會也適用於更新周期？謝謝。

Yeah, that's in my comment there. The OT growing over 20%, continue to be one of the fast-growing area for us. And also, we are the only leader in the West and the OT security report. So that's where we see huge potential and OT need to have a special product, even special software to handle. We invest in this year for like more than 10 years. We don't see much other competitor invest as we are so early, so broadly in the OT security. So we do see -- we do believe this is a strong growing area going forward.

是的，這就是我的評論。OT 成長率超過 20%，繼續成為我們成長最快的領域之一。而且，我們是西方和 OT 安全報告的唯一領導者。因此，我們看到了巨大的潛力，而 OT 需要有特殊的產品，甚至特殊的軟體來處理。我們今年投資了大概有10多年了。由於我們在 OT 安全領域還處於早期階段，且涉足範圍較廣，因此我們沒有看到太多其他競爭對手的投資。所以我們確實看到——我們確實相信這是一個未來強勁成長的領域。

And when you break down that over 20%, is that consistent internationally with domestically? Can you give you a view across the various theaters?

當您將其細分為 20% 以上時，國際上與國內一致嗎？能介紹一下各個劇場的情況嗎？

I think it's pretty consistent.

我認為它相當一致。

Yeah. We are -- We are strong in OT across the board. EMEA has always been leading in OT for us. And that's where you also -- I mean, it's aligned with the strong revenue growth that we see in EMEA as well, right? So -- you also, I think, asked whether it plays into the upgrade cycle.

是的。我們——我們在 OT 領域全面實力雄厚。對我們來說，EMEA 地區一直在 OT 領域處於領先地位。這就是你也看到的地方——我的意思是，這與我們在歐洲、中東和非洲地區看到的強勁收入成長一致，對嗎？所以——我想你也問過它是否會影響升級週期。

It does. We have a number of rocket devices that are part of the 2026 cohort benefiting from that. But we just see expansion and also the thought leadership that we've always had in OT and bringing this to the forefront of our customer as an important security area, I think, has helped us a lot.

確實如此。我們有許多火箭裝置屬於 2026 年隊列的一部分，將從中受益。但我們只看到了擴張，以及我們在 OT 領域一直擁有的思想領導力，並將其作為重要的安全領域帶到客戶的最前沿，我認為這對我們有很大幫助。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Junaid Siddiqui, Truist.

朱奈德·西迪基（Junaid Siddiqui），Truist。

Thank you for taking my question. Just had a question. Ken, your SASE business continues to show a lot of momentum. Could you just talk about how your sovereign SaaS solution is tracking? And how that's different from some of -- from what your competitors are doing in that space? And how important of a differentiator you think that is in furthering your competitive moat in SASE?

感謝您回答我的問題。只是有個問題。Ken，您的 SASE 業務繼續展現出強勁的發展勢頭。您能談談您的主權 SaaS 解決方案的追蹤情況嗎？這與您的競爭對手在該領域的做法有何不同？您認為這種差異化對於增強您在 SASE 的競爭力有多重要？

Yeah, that's a great question. Thanks a lot. That's also kind of -- my thinking in early days. I do believe a SASE long term, the service provider carrier will play a more important role, just like how they did like 15, 20 years ago in the network security, but somehow, they're moving kind of slow in the last few years. That's the reason we started to launch our own SASE almost two years ago.

是的，這是一個很好的問題。多謝。這也是我早期的想法。我確實相信，從長遠來看，服務提供者營運商將發揮更重要的作用，就像 15、20 年前他們在網路安全方面所做的那樣，但不知何故，他們在過去幾年裡進展得有點慢。這就是我們兩年前開始推出自己的 SASE 的原因。

But we do working with a lot of carrier service provider. They do start to launch their own kind of SASE service now. Leverage both their infrastructure, their cost relations with local customer there. So we do believe that will be the long-term trend because a lot of customer if not the most, they do concern who will be processed their data where the data being secured processed. So that's where leverage the local service provider kind of solvent SASE solution, that's all the servers provided special telecom service provider, they love a lot.

但我們確實與許多運營商服務提供者合作。他們現在確實開始推出自己的 SASE 服務。利用他們的基礎設施以及與當地客戶的成本關係。因此，我們確實相信這將是長期趨勢，因為許多客戶（如果不是大多數）確實關心誰將處理他們的數據，在哪裡安全地處理他們的數據。這就是利用本地服務供應商類型的溶劑型 SASE 解決方案的地方，這些伺服器都是由特殊電信服務供應商提供的，他們非常喜歡。

Even they're a little bit slow on adopting all this SASE solution there, but I do see the very strong supporting the sovereign SASE. That's one of the key advantage we have because we can have all the SASE the same OS, which they can deploy locally, whether in their own infrastructure, sometimes also in the customer premise there.

儘管他們在採用所有 SASE 解決方案方面有點慢，但我確實看到了對主權 SASE 的強烈支持。這是我們的主要優勢之一，因為我們可以讓所有 SASE 使用相同的作業系統，他們可以在本地部署，無論是在他們自己的基礎設施中，有時也可以在客戶處。

So that's a huge advantage than some other SASE players. So we do see that momentum starting to accelerating now. That's including the telecom area starting to kind of also go back to grow probably above average now.

因此，這比其他一些 SASE 參與者俱有巨大的優勢。所以我們確實看到這種勢頭現在開始加速。其中包括電信領域現在也開始恢復成長，可能高於平均值。

So that's a strong area. I do believe probably in the next few years in the SASE market, the sovereign SASE probably can be taken almost half the market share compared to this global cloud-based SASE. So that's I still believe, long term, that's the long-term direction. Even short term, there are some kind of change in back and forth, but long-term solvent will be the long-term solution.

所以這是一個強項。我確實相信，在未來幾年的 SASE 市場中，與全球基於雲端的 SASE 相比，主權 SASE 可能可以佔近一半的市場。所以從長遠來看，我仍然相信這是一個長期的方向。即使短期內，也會出現某種來回的變化，但長期的解決之道才是長久之計。

Great, thank you.

太好了，謝謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Patrick Cook, Scotiabank.

加拿大豐業銀行的 Patrick Cook。

Oh, terrific. Thank you for taking my question. I guess, Ken and Christiane, I just want to circle back to the firewall upgrade comments. I mean very helpful disclosure that we're 40% to 50% through the 2026 upgrade cycle and that the 2027 end of life cycle is kind of lower throughput devices.

噢，太棒了。感謝您回答我的問題。我想，肯和克里斯蒂安，我只是想回到防火牆升級的評論。我的意思是，非常有幫助的揭露是，我們已經完成了 2026 年升級週期的 40% 到 50%，而 2027 年生命週期結束時的設備吞吐量會較低。

I guess the question we're getting from investors in our inbox over the last half an hour is what should we be excited about beyond this upgrade cycle? What is going to continue momentum when these tailwinds, which are clearly benefiting numbers now and you guys are executing very well in a tough environment? But if we look beyond 2026 upgrade and '27 upgrade, what can continue this kind of rocket momentum.

我想，過去半小時裡，投資人在收件匣裡向我們提出的問題是，除了這次升級週期之外，我們還該對什麼感到興奮？當這些順風明顯有利於數字並且你們在艱難的環境中表現非常出色時，什麼將會繼續保持勢頭？但如果我們把目光投向 2026 年升級和 2027 年升級之後，什麼能夠延續這種火箭般的勢頭？

Yeah, I believe the cement will be the new SASE firewall. So it's very different than the traditional next-gen firewall. So the customers do need a new function and also address the new infrastructure security need. So that's the huge opportunity and not just additional product but also additional servers on top of that, give them kind of a secure whole infrastructure.

是的，我相信水泥將成為新的 SASE 防火牆。所以它與傳統的下一代防火牆有很大不同。因此，客戶確實需要新功能並滿足新的基礎設施安全需求。所以這是一個巨大的機會，不僅僅是額外的產品，還有額外的伺服器，為他們提供一個安全的整體基礎設施。

So that's we're starting to train the sales force, train the partner and also customer for this new SASE firewall solution, which is where they gave them better security and also kind of much better total cost of ownership also.

因此，我們開始對銷售人員、合作夥伴和客戶進行此新 SASE 防火牆解決方案的培訓，這為他們提供了更好的安全性，同時也降低了整體擁有成本。

And let me add to that. I think when we talk about the refresh cycle, we are only talking about the FortiRefresh due to end of support. But as Gabriela pointed out, there's the COVID cycle as well that it's not end of support yet, but is going to be five, six, seven years out in a year or two. So that with security and with the additional functionalities that are part of the firewall and also the additional network requirements that you have with running ChatGPT, you name it. We believe there is -- there are going to be enough tailwinds for us to continue to grow.

讓我補充一下。我認為當我們談論刷新周期時，我們只談論由於支援終止而導致的 FortiRefresh。但正如加布里埃拉指出的那樣，新冠疫情也有一個週期，支援還沒有結束，但會在一兩年內持續五、六、七年。這樣，有了安全性和防火牆的附加功能，以及運行 ChatGPT 的額外網路需求，您就能做出決定。我們相信，有足夠的順風幫助我們繼續發展。

Yes. I think to Ken's point, cloud services, that's growing really, really fast, and we view that as largely an incremental additional total addressable market for us. And like Ken said, it's what we have in SASE right now, and you can layer on additional cloud services over time. So that should be high growth. And we really like our model of the common operating system between firewall, SASE, SD-WAN.

是的。我認為肯的觀點是，雲端服務的成長速度非常非常快，我們認為這對我們來說基本上是一個增量的額外總可尋址市場。正如 Ken 所說，這就是我們現在在 SASE 中所擁有的，您可以隨著時間的推移添加其他雲端服務。所以這應該是高成長。我們非常喜歡防火牆、SASE、SD-WAN 之間的一般作業系統模式。

And we think that firewall market will continue to grow naturally as well, and we'll take market share there, too. We've got all these other additional growth drivers in terms of SASE and SecOps, which are new TAM and really becoming meaningful to our business and our high growth.

我們認為防火牆市場也將繼續自然成長，我們也將在那裡佔據市場份額。我們在 SASE 和 SecOps 方面擁有所有其他額外的成長動力，它們是新的 TAM，對我們的業務和高成長真正具有意義。

Yeah. Again, a few we're probably a little bit over discussed about this refresh because this device has been there like 12 to 15 years ago. And that time, all size, probably one fit for (inaudible) of our current size. Even all this product being in refresh or upgrade within like one or two years still not much business impact. So that's a few -- the more important is really we leveraged the opportunity to introduce customer with a new FortiOS, new hardware, upsell cross-sell.

是的。再次，我們可能對這次更新討論得有點過度了，因為這個設備已經存在 12 到 15 年了。到那時，所有尺寸，可能都適合（聽不清楚）我們現在的尺寸。即使所有這些產品在一兩年內進行更新或升級，也不會對業務產生太大影響。所以這只是其中幾個——更重要的是我們真正利用這個機會向客戶介紹新的 FortiOS、新硬體、追加銷售交叉銷售。

So to measure the percentage of some old device been there like 12, 15 years ago, probably much less important than helping customers to upgrade to the new security infrastructure. And also the business impact for the old device is also a much smaller percentage than the total business we have today.

因此，衡量 12 或 15 年前舊設備的百分比可能遠不如幫助客戶升級到新的安全基礎設施重要。而且舊設備對業務的影響也比我們今天的總業務比例小得多。

Okay. Very helpful. And I guess, I mean, Ken, you've been a thought leader in security for many, many years. When we think about agentic AI security, I guess how are you thinking about that domain and Fortinet's position as a vendor that can help in agentic AI security?

好的。非常有幫助。我想，我的意思是，肯，多年來您一直是安全領域的思想領袖。當我們考慮代理 AI 安全時，我想您如何看待該領域以及 Fortinet 作為能夠幫助代理 AI 安全的供應商的地位？

Yeah, I do believe like keeping sense for probably 10 years, whether the agentic AI or the device security selling get more and more important than some people, human security, which people access. Right now, the device, even the agent probably already like a 10x more than the people access all these information, Internet or the data there.

是的，我確實相信，在未來 10 年內，無論是代理人工智慧還是設備安全銷售，都會比某些人、人類存取的安全越來越重要。現在，設備甚至代理可能已經比人們存取所有這些資訊、互聯網或資料的速度快了 10 倍。

So that's where we invest in this area for more than 10 years and has multiple angle to address the AI security, including gen AI, including all these OT, IoT device security. So that's where we feel will be huge market potential, but also kind of need to address this instead of like bolt-on some of the solutions need to be integrated together.

因此，我們在這個領域投資了 10 多年，並從多個角度解決人工智慧安全問題，包括人工智慧、所有這些 OT、物聯網設備安全。因此，我們認為這將是巨大的市場潛力，但也需要解決這個問題，而不是像螺栓一樣將一些需要整合在一起的解決方案整合在一起。

So example, (inaudible)gen AI whether you want to check the identity or you want to check the access control, they need to be part of the infrastructure just like a part of the firewall product end point, part of the edge device instead of a separate solution.

舉個例子，（聽不清楚）gen AI 無論您是想檢查身分還是想檢查存取控制，它們都需要成為基礎設施的一部分，就像防火牆產品端點的一部分、邊緣設備的一部分，而不是單獨的解決方案。

So once this solution be integrated together, customers have a better management and also better secure infrastructure to address all these agentic AIs, or IoT device security there. So that's where the integrated solution address the whole infrastructure will be much better than like a separate solution, which bolt down some of the current solutions. So we do believe this long-term integrated solution will be the key to address this GenAI the same as like IoT solution security there.

因此，一旦將此解決方案整合在一起，客戶就可以擁有更好的管理和更好的安全基礎設施來解決所有這些代理 AI 或物聯網設備安全問題。因此，解決整個基礎設施問題的整合解決方案將比單獨的解決方案好得多，而單獨的解決方案將限制一些當前的解決方案。因此，我們確實相信，這種長期綜合解決方案將成為解決 GenAI 問題的關鍵，就像解決物聯網解決方案安全問題一樣。

Saket Kalia, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的 Saket Kalia。

Okay, great. Hey guys, thanks for taking my questions here. Christiane, maybe for you, 40% to 50% through the upgrade cycle, can you just talk about sort of what that cadence is going to look like this year? I mean I think that intra-quarter, we were talking about sort of a 20% type of number maybe the real question is, where do we end '25 in terms of the percentage of that of the cohort that we're through?

好的，太好了。嘿夥計們，感謝你們在這裡回答我的問題。克里斯蒂安，也許對你來說，升級週期已經完成了 40% 到 50%，你能談談今年的節奏是什麼樣的嗎？我的意思是，我認為在本季度內，我們談論的是 20% 左右的數字，也許真正的問題是，就我們已完成的群體百分比而言，25 年的結束位置在哪裡？

Good question. We've -- if you look at our updated guidance, you see that we believe there is strength in product for the rest of the year. Where we exactly end is hard to say because -- of course, it's not only upgrade refresh product that we are planning to sell. So -- but I think we will get through those cycles faster than we expect.

好問題。如果您查看我們的最新指南，您會發現我們相信今年剩餘時間內的產品仍將保持強勁。我們究竟在哪裡結束很難說，因為——當然，我們計劃銷售的不僅僅是升級更新產品。所以——但我認為我們會比預期更快度過這些週期。

Got it. That makes sense. Maybe the follow-up is, I think you're hearing the question just about sort of what's the growth going to look like here after the upgrade cycle? And of course, it's FortiSASE, it's SecOps. I'm trying to think if we've talked about this before, but have you -- can we touch on sort of what percentage of the services revenue kind of comes from those two businesses versus attached subscription because just to the earlier point, that's really that mix shift that has to happen. So any color that you could sort of give on and where we are in that kind of mix shift within services?

知道了。這很有道理。也許後續問題是，我想你聽到的問題是升級週期之後這裡的成長會是什麼樣子？當然，它是 FortiSASE，它是 SecOps。我在想我們之前是否討論過這個問題，但是你能否——我們能否談談服務收入中有多少百分比來自這兩項業務而不是附加訂閱，因為就像之前提到的那樣，這確實是必鬚髮生的組合轉變。那麼，您能否透露一下我們在服務混合轉變方面處於什麼位置？

Mix shift between FortiCare and security subscriptions?

FortiCare 與安全訂閱之間的混合轉換？

Yeah. Well, maybe more specifically, attached sort of subscriptions and maintenance versus FortiSASE and SecOps. So maybe firewall versus non-firewall in more late terms?

是的。好吧，也許更具體地說，附加的訂閱和維護與 FortiSASE 和 SecOps 相比。那麼從較晚的方面來看，防火牆與非防火牆之間是否有差異？

The non-attached subscriptions are growing faster, for sure.

毫無疑問，非附加訂閱的成長速度更快。

Yeah. On the touch part, the service is also starting to have a more high percentage because we offer more service whether the SASE definitely there's more service, more function behind. So that's also sitting at a higher percentage compared with the hardware. So that's both sides. There's some additional service like we launched the hree FortiCloud service, FortiIdentity, FortiDrive, FortiConnect, that's a new service attached, but there's also a touch service, which has a more higher ratio percentage compared with the hardware side of it.

是的。在觸控部分，服務也開始有更高的比例，因為我們提供更多的服務，無論 SASE 背後是否有更多的服務、更多的功能。因此與硬體相比，這也佔據了更高的比例。這就是雙方的情況。還有一些附加服務，例如我們推出了三個 FortiCloud 服務、FortiIdentity、FortiDrive、FortiConnect，這些都是附加的新服務，但還有觸控服務，與硬體方面相比，其比例更高。

Very helpful. Thank you.

非常有幫助。謝謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Shrenik Kothari, Baird.

什雷尼克·科塔里，貝爾德。

Hey, can you guys hear me? All right, So just a quick question on the go to market. You guys have been pushing towards platform adoption and multiproduct. You can you thought a little bit about how the channel incentives are moving towards kind of achieving your internal targets? I mean, in terms of the rewarding models that are favoring platform cross-sell or pure volume. Can you just give us an update on what's been most effective in driving that? Where are the areas where you're still working on? Yeah, I would really appreciate that.

嘿，你們聽得到我說話嗎？好的，那麼關於進入市場，我只想問一個簡短的問題。你們一直在推動平台採用和多產品化。您能否稍微思考一下管道激勵是如何實現您的內部目標的？我的意思是，就有利於平台交叉銷售或純銷售的獎勵模式而言。您能否向我們介紹一下推動這項進程最有效的措施？您仍在努力的領域有哪些？是的，我會非常感激。

Yeah, traditionally, we are a more channel-focused company. Now in the last few years, we most starting to invest in like direct marketing, direct sales, especially all these big enterprise. So you can see the -- whether the bigger deal and big enterprise sales grew very strong, like 40%, 50% -- that's all come from all this direct touch approach and also integrate solutions, selling platform like multiple products instead of single product.

是的，傳統上，我們是一家更注重通路的公司。在過去的幾年裡，我們開始投資直銷、直銷，特別是這些大企業。所以你可以看到——無論是大交易還是大企業的銷售成長都非常強勁，例如 40%、50%——這都來自於這種直接接觸的方式以及整合解決方案，銷售平台就像銷售多種產品而不是單一產品。

That's also needed to train the sales either train a partner, how to sell this multiple solutions, multiple products together into an integrated solution there, including whether the SASE, SD-WAN, including the SecureOP. So that's also kind of leading to the AI part of story, which we believe is a fast-growing part of our business there, even we only introduced for a few years, but that's AI kind of based SecureOP and also like a security AI infrastructure to the FortiAI-Assist, FortiAI-Protect as well customers see the benefit of this AI-driven operation so operation center there. So that's where we see is kind of an integrated solution with all this AI bot kind of SecureOP, that's become a fast-growing part of our business right now.

這也需要培訓銷售人員或培訓合作夥伴，如何將這些多種解決方案、多種產品組合成一個整合解決方案進行銷售，包括 SASE、SD-WAN 以及 SecureOP。因此，這也引出了故事中的人工智慧部分，我們相信這是我們業務中快速成長的一部分，儘管我們只推出了幾年，但這是基於人工智慧的 SecureOP，也像 FortiAI-Assist、FortiAI-Protect 的安全人工智慧基礎設施一樣，客戶也看到了這種人工智慧驅動運營的好處，因此營運中心就在那裡。因此，我們看到的是一種整合了所有 AI 機器人類型的 SecureOP 的解決方案，它現在已經成為我們業務中快速成長的一部分。

And to answer your question on the channel incentives, they are exactly aligned around multi product. So we make sure that the channel introduces new products and for that, they get higher again, rebates.

關於通路激勵的問題，它們的確切內容是圍繞著多種產品進行的。因此，我們確保通路推出新產品，並因此再次獲得更高的回扣。

Eric Heath, KeyBanc.

艾瑞克‧希思（Eric Heath），KeyBanc。

Hi, good afternoon. Can you hear me?

嗨，下午好。你聽得到我嗎？

Okay.

好的。

Great, thank you. Just come back to the comments on the refresh cycle for more time and sorry for belaboring this point. But if I'm understanding this correctly, you've done well in excess of $100 million in refresh activity in the past two or three quarters, which would suggest Product revenue, excluding this refresh benefit has been flat to negative in the last couple of quarters. So can you just help me understand why the underlying firewall demand isn't stronger?

太好了，謝謝。請花更多時間再回來查看有關刷新周期的評論，對於這一點我深感抱歉。但如果我理解正確的話，你們在過去兩三個季度的更新活動中賺得了超過 1 億美元的收入，這意味著不包括這次更新收益的產品收入在過去幾個季度一直持平甚至為負。那你能幫助我理解為什麼底層防火牆的需求不夠強嗎？

I would not say it would be negative, it's continue to refresh, but because it's such a small percentage of the overall business, that's the reason we gave additional like building guidance for the rest of the year on top of what we already overachieved in Q1 and Q2. So that's just keeping -- we believe, whether the market and also our solution is much better.

我不會說這會帶來負面影響，它會繼續刷新，但因為這只佔整體業務的一小部分，所以我們在第一季度和第二季度已經超額完成的基礎上，為今年剩餘時間提供了額外的建設指導。所以這只是保持——我們相信，市場和我們的解決方案是否會更好。

We're not too much content on the refresh. It's a very small percentage. We're just using a will to calculate whether internally or incentive the channel to helping customers to upgrade and especially for the new SASE firewall.

我們在刷新上沒有太多的內容。這是一個非常小的比例。我們只是用一種意願來計算是否在內部或激勵管道來幫助客戶升級，特別是針對新的 SASE 防火牆。

So that's where we kind of -- we do give a much more number measurement, sometimes could be it be confusing, but I do believe it's the way we try to helping the customer partner to upgrade the new SASE firewall instead of have too big business impact because, like I said, the end of service, that's the product being there 12, 15 years ago. It's a pretty small percentage of our total business.

所以這就是我們——我們確實給出了更多的數位測量，有時可能會令人困惑，但我相信這是我們嘗試幫助客戶合作夥伴升級新的 SASE 防火牆的方式，而不是對業務產生太大的影響，因為就像我說的，服務的終結，那是 12、15 年前的產品。這只占我們整個業務的很小一部分。

Andrew Nowinski, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的安德魯·諾溫斯基。

Okay, thank you for squeezing me in. I'm wondering -- still a little bit unclear on my services revenue growth is decelerating so much. Looking back over the last, call it, four quarters? And then also going forward. And I'm wondering if you could just provide any color around what's really driving that deceleration? And then related to that, why is your unified SASE has so much momentum right now.

好的，謝謝你邀請我。我很疑惑——我仍然不太清楚為什麼我的服務收入成長會如此大幅放緩。回顧過去四個季度？然後繼續前進。我想知道您是否可以解釋一下真正導致這種減速的原因？與此相關的是，為什麼您的統一 SASE 現在有如此大的發展勢頭。

Why would that be flat sequentially in Q2? Because it looked like it was about $1.15 billion in Q2 and the same thing that you had in your slide deck in Q1. So just wondering if you could comment on -- I know on a year-over-year basis, it was up, but sequentially, why would it be flat? Thank you.

為什麼第二季的環比成長持平？因為看起來第二季的金額約為 11.5 億美元，與您在第一季的幻燈片中展示的金額相同。所以我只是想問您是否可以評論一下——我知道與去年同期相比，它是上升的，但與上一季相比，為什麼它會持平？謝謝。

Go ahead, Christiane.

繼續吧，克里斯蒂安。

To answer your second question first, sequentially, it's flat because there are a number of products, some of them have not been growing or turning a little bit while unified SASE -- while SSE has been growing nicely and is offsetting that. So that's part of this.

首先回答你的第二個問題，按順序來看，它是持平的，因為有許多產品，其中一些產品在統一 SASE 時沒有增長或轉變——而 SSE 一直在良好增長並抵消了這一點。這就是其中的一部分。

On the service revenue growth, the -- I think that what you're seeing is that we had significant deferred revenues that were sold during the COVID period, and they have come. So we've recognized service revenue over the last couple of years, benefiting from that growth. And now the product revenue and the service revenue are aligning more with our billings growth. And so we need to grow faster, and we are planning to grow faster to drive that pulse revenue streams up.

關於服務收入成長，我認為您看到的是，我們在 COVID 期間出售了大量遞延收入，這些收入已經到來。因此，我們在過去幾年中確認了服務收入，並受益於此成長。現在產品收入和服務收入與我們的帳單成長更加一致。因此，我們需要更快地發展，並且我們計劃更快地發展以推動脈衝收入流的成長。

Yeah, the service revenue -- service line, if you look at like three, four years ago, the product revenue grew like 30% 40%, some quarter, maybe even close to 50%, that drive the service revenue because service turn your average may be like 30 months -- 29, 30 months. So that need to be recognized during that like 2.5-, 3-year period.

是的，服務收入——服務線，如果你看看三四年前，產品收入成長了 30% 到 40%，某個季度，甚至可能接近 50%，這推動了服務收入，因為服務週轉期平均可能是 30 個月——29、30 個月。因此需要在 2.5 年或 3 年的時間內認識到這一點。

On the other side, keeping refer back to the presentation number 4, slide number 4, which is really the SSE part of case growing very, very strong because Unified SASE including SD-WAN. Because SD-WAN, we already have a pretty good penetration reading enterprise. That's where customers were starting to adopt beyond SD-WAN starting quickly adopt SASE now.

另一方面，請繼續參考簡報 4、投影片 4，這實際上是案例的 SSE 部分，由於統一 SASE 包括 SD-WAN，因此成長非常非常強大。因為SD-WAN，我們已經有一個相當不錯的滲透閱讀企業。這就是客戶開始採用 SD-WAN 以外的技術的地方，現在他們開始快速採用 SASE。

So that's where the growth is still very strong. So we do believe -- so we are the number one firewall, number one, we believe we are the number one SASE within the next few years because -- we believe we have a huge advantage on SASE in a single OS and also can very easily for the current customer base to upgrade to the SASE, which not other SASE player has a huge customer base. and also our own infrastructure give us cost advantage. So how this advantage of SASE in not our competitors had, that we do believe we'll be the number one SASE player in the next few years

所以那裡的成長仍然非常強勁。所以我們確實相信——我們是第一的防火牆，第一，我們相信在未來幾年內我們是第一的 SASE，因為——我們相信我們在單一作業系統上對 SASE 具有巨大優勢，並且當前客戶群可以非常輕鬆地升級到 SASE，而其他 SASE 參與者則沒有龐大的客戶群。而我們自己的基礎設施也為我們提供了成本優勢。那麼，SASE 的優勢在於我們的競爭對手所不具備的，我們確實相信，在未來幾年內，我們將成為 SASE 的頭號玩家

So I'd say we focus on the value to the customer, and we've got 800,000 customers and that path to value from firewall to SD-WAN to SASE with the integrated single operating system approach is really pretty straightforward. And so we see a huge opportunity both there and with new sales of SASE, and that will be a real growth driver for us.

所以我想說，我們專注於客戶的價值，我們擁有 80 萬名客戶，從防火牆到 SD-WAN 再到 SASE，採用整合的單一作業系統方法的價值實現路徑真的非常簡單。因此，我們看到了巨大的機遇，而 SASE 的新銷售也帶來了巨大的機遇，這將成為我們真正的成長動力。

This concludes our Q&A session. I will now hand it back to Aaron Ovadia for closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。現在我將把發言權交還給 Aaron Ovadia，請他作最後發言。

Thank you. I'd like to thank everyone for joining today's call. We will be attending investor conferences hosted by Deutsche Bank, Citi and Goldman Sachs during the third quarter. The fireside chat webcast link will be posted on the Events and Presentations section of our Investor Relations website. If you have any follow-up questions, please feel free to contact me. Have a great rest of your day.

謝謝。我要感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。我們將在第三季參加由德意志銀行、花旗銀行和高盛銀行主辦的投資者會議。爐邊談話網絡直播連結將發佈在我們投資者關係網站的活動和演示部分。如果您有任何後續問題，請隨時與我聯絡。祝您今天剩餘的時間過得愉快。