EVgo Inc (EVGO) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Hello, and thank you for standing by. My name is Regina, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the EVgo fourth quarter and full year 2024 earnings conference call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speaker's remarks, there will be a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions)

您好，感謝您的支持。我的名字是 Regina，今天我將擔任您的會議主持人。現在，我歡迎大家參加 EVgo 2024 年第四季和全年財報電話會議。所有線路均已靜音以防止任何背景噪音。演講者發言後，將進行問答環節。（操作員指令）

I would now like to turn the conference over to Heather Davis, Vice President of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

現在，我想將會議交給投資人關係副總裁 Heather Davis。請繼續。

Good morning, and welcome to EVgo's fourth quarter and full year 2024 earnings call. My name is Heather Davis, and I'm the Vice President of Investor Relations at EVgo.

早安，歡迎參加 EVgo 2024 年第四季和全年收益電話會議。我叫 Heather Davis，是 EVgo 的投資人關係副總裁。

Joining me on today's call are Badar Khan, EVgo's Chief Executive Officer; and Paul Dobson, EVgo's Chief Financial Officer. Today, we will be discussing EVgo's fourth quarter financial results and our outlook for 2025, followed by a Q&A session.

參加今天電話會議的還有 EVgo 執行長 Badar Khan；以及 EVgo 財務長 Paul Dobson。今天，我們將討論 EVgo 的第四季財務表現和我們對 2025 年的展望，然後進行問答環節。

Today's call is being webcast and can be accessed on the Investor section of our website at investors.evgo.com. The call will be archived and available there along with the company's earnings release and investor presentation after the conclusion of this call.

今天的電話會議正在進行網路直播，您可以透過我們網站的投資者部分（網址為 investors.evgo.com）存取。電話會議結束後，將會將此次電話會議存檔，並與公司收益報告和投資者介紹內容一起提供。

During the call, management will be making forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties, including expectations about future performance. Factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from our expectations are detailed in our SEC filings, including in the Risk Factors section of our most recent annual report on Form 10-K and quarterly reports on Form 10-Q. The company's SEC filings are available on the Investor section of our website. These forward-looking statements apply as of today and we undertake no obligation to update these statements after the call.

在電話會議期間，管理階層將做出受風險和不確定性影響的前瞻性陳述，包括對未來績效的預期。可能導致實際結果與我們的預期有重大差異的因素已在我們提交給美國證券交易委員會的文件中詳細說明，包括我們最近的 10-K 表年度報告和 10-Q 表季度報告中的風險因素部分。該公司的美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 文件可在我們網站的「投資者」部分查閱。這些前瞻性陳述自今日起適用，我們不承擔在通話後更新這些陳述的義務。

Also, please note that we will be referring to certain non-GAAP financial measures on this call. Information about these non-GAAP measures, including the reconciliation to the corresponding GAAP measures, can be found in the earnings material available on the Investor section of our website.

另請注意，我們將在本次電話會議中參考某些非 GAAP 財務指標。有關這些非 GAAP 指標的資訊（包括與相應 GAAP 指標的調整）可在我們網站「投資者」部分提供的收益資料中找到。

With the anticipated growth in dedicated stalls or stalls for commercial partners such as autonomous vehicles that are not open to the public, we have now broken out our stall counts into three categories: Public, Dedicated and eXtend. Throughput shown and discussed today is for our public network only. The revenues for dedicated sites have been reclassed from charging revenue commercials to ancillary revenues this quarter, and the associated costs have been reclassed from charging network cost of sales to other cost of sales. We provided a quarterly update for these changes for 2023 and 2024 in the appendix of our investor presentation, so you may update your models appropriately for the impacted periods.

隨著專用攤位或不對外開放的商業夥伴（例如自動駕駛汽車）攤位數量的預期增長，我們現在將攤位數量分為三類：公共、專用和擴展。今天展示和討論的吞吐量僅適用於我們的公共網路。本季度，專用站點的收入已從收費商業廣告重新歸類為輔助收入，相關成本已從收費網路銷售成本重新歸類為其他銷售成本。我們在投資者報告的附錄中提供了 2023 年和 2024 年這些變化的季度更新，因此您可以根據受影響的時期適當更新您的模型。

With that, I'll turn the call over to our Badar Khan, EVgo's CEO.

說完這些，我將把電話轉給 EVgo 的執行長 Badar Khan。

EVgo had yet another strong and record quarter. Customer consumption on our network continues to rise, with average daily throughput for public stall rising by 37% versus the same quarter last year and up more than five-fold in three years. Utilization of our network reached what we believe is an industry-leading 24%, up 5% from a year ago, and now already within the range of our recently updated and therefore still conservative long-term forecast.

EVgo 又度過了一個強勁且創紀錄的季度。我們網路的顧客消費持續上升，公共攤位的日均吞吐量比去年同期成長了 37%，三年內成長了五倍多。我們認為，我們的網路利用率已達到業界領先的 24%，比一年前成長了 5%，並且已經在我們最近更新的範圍內，因此仍然是保守的長期預測。

Full year revenues from our core charging business more than doubled year-over-year, and Q4 represented the nineth sequential quarter of double digit growth. Full year revenue grew 60% year-over-year, a near 12-fold growth in just three years.

我們核心充​​電業務的全年營收年增一倍以上，第四季是連續第九個季度實現兩位數成長。全年營收年增60％，短短三年就成長了近12倍。

We added a record 480 new operational stalls in the fourth quarter, including Dedicated and eXtend stalls which made it a record year with over 1,200 new stalls added in the year, and now have over 4,000 operational stalls.

我們在第四季度新增了 480 個新營運攤位，其中包括專用攤位和擴展攤位，這使今年成為創紀錄的一年，全年新增了 1,200 多個攤位，現在營運攤位總數超過 4,000 個。

And as you all know, after an 18-month process, we finally closed on a $1.25 billion loan guarantee with the Department of Energy Loan Programs Office that fully finances our ability to more than triple our installed base over the next five years throughout the United States. We received our first advance in January for approximately $75 million leaving us with approximately $200 million in cash in January. EVgo has not yet scheduled a next quarterly event.

眾所周知，經過 18 個月的流程，我們最終與能源部貸款計劃辦公室達成了 12.5 億美元的貸款擔保，這筆貸款將為我們在未來五年內在全美範圍內將安裝量增加兩倍以上提供全額資金。我們在一月收到了第一筆預付款，金額約為 7,500 萬美元，因此一月份我們持有的現金約為 2 億美元。EVgo 尚未安排下一季活動。

Taking a step back, we know that new sales of battery electric vehicles in the US have grown considerably over the past several years. However, we are falling behind other markets and in particular China, which is currently winning in an unmistakable race towards electrifying transportation globally. China already outsells the US in automotive sales globally as a result of extensive and prolonged state sponsorship of its EV industry.

回顧一下，我們知道過去幾年美國電動車新銷量大幅成長。然而，我們落後於其他市場，特別是中國，而中國目前在全球電氣化交通競賽中處於領先地位。由於政府對電動車產業長期而廣泛的支持，中國的全球汽車銷量已經超過美國。

US automakers say their EV production is simply responding to demand. Two biggest drivers in survey after survey for why more US drivers have not already made the switch to electric vehicles are the upfront price of the vehicle, despite the fact that the total cost of ownership is already lower and the availability of charging infrastructure.

美國汽車製造商表示，他們的電動車生產只是為了滿足需求。多項調查顯示，為什麼美國駕駛者還沒有轉向使用電動車，兩個最大的原因是汽車的前期成本（儘管總體擁有成本已經較低）和充電基礎設施的可用性。

The good news is that there are more and more electric vehicle models available in the US that are becoming increasingly affordable. However, US electric vehicles remain more expensive than the electric vehicles subsidized in China. This is why US auto CEOs do not support the elimination of incentives and regulations to support the scaling up of EVs in the US.

好消息是，美國市場上的電動車型號越來越多，而且價格也越來越便宜。然而，美國電動車的價格仍然高於中國補貼的電動車。這就是為什麼美國汽車業執行長不支持取消激勵措施和法規來支持美國電動車的擴張。

On charging, China has more than 5 times the DC fast-charging infrastructure for electric vehicle than the US. Increasing the supply of charging infrastructure stimulates demand for electric vehicles, which allows US automakers to increase scale, reduce unit costs, generate profit on their EV businesses and, as a result, improve their competitiveness against Chinese OEMs.

在充電方面，中國的電動車直流快速充電基礎設施數量是美國的5倍以上。增加充電基礎設施的供應將刺激對電動車的需求，這使得美國汽車製造商能夠擴大規模、降低單位成本、從電動車業務中獲取利潤，從而提高與中國原始設備製造商的競爭力。

As one automotive CEO put it, a global street fight is taking place in the automotive sector, and the US needs its EV businesses to scale up, to be able to compete against China and preserve the 2.4 million automotive manufacturing jobs in the United States. Building up public charging infrastructure is a key enabler of that goal.

正如一位汽車產業執行長所說，全球汽車產業正在上演一場街頭鬥爭，美國需要擴大其電動車業務規模，以便能夠與中國競爭並保住美國 240 萬個汽車製造業工作。建立公共充電基礎設施是實現此目標的關鍵因素。

As you know, EVgo's charging revenues are not linked to new sales in any one year, but by the growth of all electric vehicles in operation or VIO and the availability of charging infrastructure. In fact, we estimate that less than 10% of 2025 revenue will likely be driven by new first-time drivers of EVs, and that ratio will continue to fall each year.

如您所知，EVgo 的充電收入與某一年的新銷售量無關，而是與所有運行中的電動車或 VIO 的成長以及充電基礎設施的可用性掛鉤。事實上，我們估計，2025 年首次駕駛電動車的新手駕駛可能只佔總收入的不到 10%，而且這一比例將繼續逐年下降。

Demand growth for our business represented by the growth in EV VIO has been outpacing supply growth of charging infrastructure for years. This is one of the reasons utilizations of our network has grown four-fold in three years. In fact, according to the DOE, we've had flat growth of new DC fast-charging in the US for the past six quarters. Presumably this lack of investment has been driven by the industry's expected slowdown in EV sales, even though EV sales have in fact continued to grow.

以電動車車輛數量增長為代表的我們業務的需求增長多年來一直超過充電基礎設施的供應增長。這就是我們的網路利用率在三年內成長四倍的原因之一。事實上，根據美國能源部的數據，過去六季美國新的直流快速充電量一直保持穩定成長。據推測，這種投資不足是由於該行業預計電動車銷售將放緩，儘管電動車銷量實際上一直在增長。

This demonstrates the resilience of our business model. As EV sales rise, utilization on our network rises because charging supply cannot grow fast enough. If EV sales fall, it's likely the pace of new charger development will fall faster as we've already seen, and utilization on our network rises. In all cases, existing VIO will continue to underpin strong unit economics and demand for our chargers.

這證明了我們商業模式的韌性。隨著電動車銷量的上升，由於充電供應量成長速度不夠快，我們網路的使用率也隨之上升。如果電動車銷售下降，新充電器開發的速度很可能會像我們已經看到的那樣下降得更快，而我們網路的使用率則會上升。在所有情況下，現有的 VIO 將繼續支撐強勁的單位經濟和對我們充電器的需求。

And because we know that the availability of charging infrastructure is one of the most important factors in whether people switch to electric, this means increasing supply actually stimulates demand and utilization on our network rises. In other words, in almost every scenario, we have a resilient business model where we see growth in our business.

我們知道，充電基礎設施的可用性是人們是否轉向電動車的最重要因素之一，這意味著增加供應實際上會刺激需求，從而提高我們網路的利用率。換句話說，在幾乎所有情況下，我們都擁有一個有彈性的商業模式，可以看到業務的成長。

We further benefit from the fact that EVgo is more focused on growing usage in our network and some other charging companies maybe, and therefore, it's likely capturing a greater share of kilowatt hours. Other fast-charging companies are either highway focused, chasing NEVI awards where utilization is lower, who are building charging stations to sell cars versus maximizing utilization, or are non-owners whose revenue is based on equipment or software sales and not on utilization.

我們進一步受益於這樣一個事實：EVgo 更專注於增加我們網路和其他一些充電公司的使用量，因此，它可能會佔據更大份額的千瓦時。其他快速充電公司要么專注於高速公路，在利用率較低的地方追逐 NEVI 獎項，要么建設充電站來銷售汽車而不是最大化利用率，要么是非車主，其收入基於設備或軟體銷售而不是利用率。

Finally, as we've said many times, we also benefit from multiple other tailwinds that have driven up and will continue to drive up utilization. First is rideshare electrification. Companies such as Uber and Lyft have internal goals to get more drivers to switch to electric, and this is supported by policies requiring rideshare become fully electric in large cities such as New York City. When a rideshare driver needs to charge up during their shift, they'll usually do so on DCSC networks so they can get back on the roads quickly.

最後，正如我們多次說過的那樣，我們還受益於其他多種順風因素，這些因素已經推動並將繼續提高利用率。首先是共乘電氣化。Uber 和 Lyft 等公司設定了內部目標，讓更多駕駛人改用電動車，而紐約市等大城市要求共乘完全電動化的政策也支持了這一目標。當共乘駕駛需要在輪班期間充電時，他們通常會透過 DCSC 網路充電，以便能夠快速回到道路上。

Second, as EV adoption moves from early adopters to the mass market driven by more affordable vehicles, more EV drivers are expected to live in multi-family housing without access to home charging. As we've detailed in the past, multi-family EV drivers charged 2 times more in our network than single-family EV drivers.

其次，隨著電動車從早期採用者轉向受更實惠汽車推動的大眾市場，預計會有更多的電動車駕駛員居住在無法使用家庭充電設施的多戶住宅中。正如我們過去所詳述的那樣，在我們的網路中，多戶電動車駕駛的收費比單戶電動車駕駛者高出 2 倍。

Third, as vehicles increase their charge rate with the speed at which they can take electrons from chargers, the use case for DC fast charging becomes more compelling to drivers.

第三，隨著車輛從充電器獲取電子的速度加快，充電速率也隨之提高，直流快速充電的使用對駕駛者來說變得更具吸引力。

Fourth, autonomous vehicles are beginning to hit the roads in several market pilots from a few companies. The financial use case for AVs requires them to be both electric and highly utilized. Therefore, like with rideshare drivers, when AVs need to charge, they'll use fast charging. EVgo already has partnerships with leading AV firms. It has 110 dedicated hub stalls in operation, representing what we estimate to be approximately 20% share of all dedicated fast-charging stalls for the AV sector.

第四，一些公司的自動駕駛汽車開始在多個市場試行。自動駕駛汽車的財務用例要求它們既是電動的，又具有高利用率。因此，就像共享乘車司機一樣，當自動駕駛汽車需要充電時，他們會使用快速充電。EVgo 已經與領先的 AV 公司建立了合作夥伴關係。它擁有 110 個專用樞紐站位，我們估計這佔 AV 領域所有專用快速充電站位的約 20%。

We plan to continue to expand this segment in 2025 and expect this to be an area of growth that may occur faster than previously thought. And finally, the standardization of the charging cables to J3400, commonly referred to as NACS, is an opportunity for EVgo. Today, only a small percentage of drivers that use our network are Tesla drivers. As we add NACS stalls to our network, we are in a unique position to attract roughly 60% of EV VIO to our network that isn't currently using our network today.

我們計劃在 2025 年繼續擴大這一領域，並預計這一領域的成長速度可能比之前預想的要快。最後，充電線標準化為 J3400（通常稱為 NACS），對 EVgo 來說是一個機會。今天，使用我們網路的駕駛者中只有一小部分是特斯拉司機。隨著我們在網路中添加 NACS 攤位，我們處於一個獨特的位置，可以吸引大約 60% 目前尚未使用我們網路的 EV VIO 加入我們的網路。

As I've mentioned before, EVgo stations tend to be in urban and suburban areas closer to amenities than many Tesla stations today. In fact, as of this earnings call, we've begun our pilot rollout of the NACS cable. And while it's very early days, we believe the results are promising. The combination of all these factors are what results in a resilient business model for EVgo, driving growth and adjusted EBITDA.

正如我之前提到的，EVgo 充電站往往位於城市和郊區，比如今的許多特斯拉充電站更靠近便利設施。事實上，截至本次財報電話會議，我們已經開始試運行 NACS 電纜。儘管還處於早期階段，但我們相信結果是令人鼓舞的。所有這些因素的結合，使得 EVgo 擁有了彈性的商業模式，推動了成長和調整後的 EBITDA。

Let's now turn to progress on our four key priorities: improving our customer experience, operating in CapEx efficiencies, capturing and retaining high-value customers and securing additional complementary financing to accelerate growth.

現在讓我們來談談我們的四個關鍵優先事項的進展：改善客戶體驗、提高資本支出效率、吸引和留住高價值客戶以及獲得額外的補充融資以加速成長。

As always, improving our customer experience remains our number one priority, and our strong momentum caps off an excellent year. Customers want a charger to be available when they pull up to an EVgo station. We are deploying larger sites where our standard configuration is now six to eight stalls per site. At the end of 2024, 20% of our sites had six stalls or more. With a record number of deployments during the fourth quarter, we reached our goal of 50% of EVgo stalls served by our higher-power 350 kilowatt chargers compared to 34% a year ago.

像往常一樣，改善客戶體驗仍然是我們的首要任務，我們強勁的發展勢頭為這一年畫上了圓滿的句號。顧客希望當他們到達 EVgo 充電站時能夠使用充電器。我們正在部署更大的站點，現在我們的標準配置是每個站點有六到八個攤位。截至 2024 年底，我們 20% 的站點擁有 6 個或 6 個以上的攤位。憑藉第四季度創紀錄的部署數量，我們實現了 50% 的 EVgo 停車位由我們的高功率 350 千瓦充電器提供服務的目標，而一年前這一比例為 34%。

Autocharge+ continues to gain traction with a big step up in the fourth quarter to 24% of sessions initiated by the seamless plug-and-charge experience. We are gaining significant traction with auto enrollments for OEMs that have Autocharge+ enabled.

Autocharge+ 繼續獲得關注，在第四季度實現了大幅成長，由無縫即插即充體驗發起的會話佔比達到 24%。對於已啟用 Autocharge+ 的 OEM，我們在自動註冊方面取得了顯著進展。

And finally, our key customer success metric of One & Done increased 4 percentage points this quarter versus last year, with 95% of sessions resulting in a successful charge on the first try. In summary, another great quarter of achievement in improving our customer experience.

最後，本季我們的關鍵客戶成功指標「One & Done」比去年同期增加了 4 個百分點，其中 95% 的會話在第一次嘗試時就成功完成收費。總而言之，我們在改善客戶體驗方面又取得了巨大的成就。

We've also made excellent progress on our efficiency priorities. Most notably, we took the MOU with Delta Electronics we signed last October and converted into a signed joint development agreement to co-develop the next generation of charging architecture. EVgo and Delta are making meaningful progress in this initiative and is expected to lower our gross CapEx per stall by 30%. We anticipate production of these stalls to begin in the second half of 2026, and we plan to have a prototype for the second quarter of this year.

我們在效率優先事項上也取得了巨大進展。最值得注意的是，我們將去年 10 月與台達電子簽署的諒解備忘錄轉化為簽署的聯合開發協議，共同開發下一代充電架構。EVgo 和 Delta 在這項措施上取得了重大進展，預計將降低每個攤位的總資本支出 30%。我們預計這些攤位將於 2026 年下半年開始生產，並計劃在今年第二季推出原型。

In 2024, we achieved a 9% reduction in our gross CapEx per stall for our current generation of chargers through multiple ongoing efficiency efforts. Additional reductions are underway in 2025, and we look forward to sharing our continued progress. The first sites built with our prefabricated skids are operational and yield savings in build costs and construction timelines. We expect around 40% of our 2025 deployments will utilize prefabricated skids.

2024 年，我們透過多項持續的效率努力，將當前世代充電器的每個攤位的總資本支出降低了 9%。2025 年也將進一步減排，我們期待分享我們持續取得的進展。採用我們的預製滑軌建造的首批場地已投入運營，並節省了建造成本和施工時間。我們預計，2025 年部署的電力中約有 40% 將採用預製滑軌。

We continue to drive operational efficiencies in our business with total adjusted G&A as a percentage of revenue, delivering a 21-point improvement over 2023. In 2025, EVgo remains focused on operating efficiencies, and we anticipate further improvements in G&A as a percent of revenue while investing in the growth of our business.

我們持續提高業務營運效率，調整後的一般及行政開支總額佔收入的百分比將比 2023 年提高 21 個百分點。2025 年，EVgo 將繼續專注於提高營運效率，我們預計 G&A 費用佔收入的百分比將進一步提高，同時我們將增加對業務成長的投資。

We also continue to make great progress on our growth priority of capturing and retaining high-value customers. 56% of EVgo's throughput came from rideshare, OEM charging credit and subscription accounts in Q4. This provides EVgo with a relatively predictable baseload level of demand at our network. EVgo now has over 1.3 million customer accounts, growing over 50% from 2023.

我們在吸引和留住高價值客戶這一成長重點上仍持續取得巨大進展。第四季度，EVgo 56% 的吞吐量來自共乘、OEM 充電信用和訂閱帳戶。這為 EVgo 提供了我們網路相對可預測的基本負載需求水準。EVgo 目前擁有超過 130 萬個客戶帳戶，較 2023 年成長了 50% 以上。

As a result of our investments earlier in the year in our customer marketing platform, we've been implementing multiple targeted customer lifecycle campaigns that are generating strong growth in retail throughput, which we will continue to prioritize throughout the year. Last year, we began rolling out dynamic pricing in our network, and by year-end, we expanded that to 100% of our existing fast-charging sites. We can already see the benefits of all of these efforts through expanding margins, but also significantly expanding throughput. We expect the next major uptick to our dynamic pricing algorithms in the second half of this year.

由於我們今年稍早對客戶行銷平台進行了投資，我們一直在實施多個有針對性的客戶生命週期活動，這些活動正在帶來零售吞吐量的強勁成長，我們將在全年繼續優先考慮這些活動。去年，我們開始在我們的網路中推出動態定價，到年底，我們將把這項計劃擴展到我們現有的 100％ 快速充電站點。我們已經可以看到所有這些努力所帶來的好處，不僅利潤率有所提高，而且產量也顯著提高。我們預計我們的動態定價演算法將在今年下半年出現下一次重大上漲。

And finally, as I mentioned earlier, we installed native NACS connectors at our first site in early 2025. We're excited to be able to share the results of this pilot project with you throughout the year. Looking ahead, we expect to expand or sign new partnerships with site hosts that are capable of scaling, similar to the expanded partnership we announced in November with Meijer, a Midwest grocery store chain, where we expect to add 480 new public fast-charging stalls at Meijer Properties over the next three years.

最後，正如我之前提到的，我們在 2025 年初在我們的第一個網站上安裝了原生 NACS 連接器。我們很高興能夠在全年與您分享此試點計畫的成果。展望未來，我們期望擴大或與具有擴展能力的充電站營運商簽署新的合作夥伴關係，類似於我們 11 月宣布的與中西部連鎖雜貨店 Meijer 擴大的合作夥伴關係，我們預計未來三年將在 Meijer Properties 新增 480 個公共快速充電樁。

In 2025, we also plan to launch the first of 400 new flagship stalls in partnership with GM with the goal of delivering an elevated customer experience. As a reminder, these sites will feature up to 20 stalls and come with ultra-fast 350-kilowatt chargers, canopies, ample lighting, pull-through stations and security cameras, and like all EVgo sites, will be located near a diverse set of amenities that customers can take advantage of while charging.

2025 年，我們還計劃與通用汽車合作推出首批 400 家新旗艦店，以提供更卓越的客戶體驗。提醒一下，這些站點將設有多達 20 個攤位，並配備超高速 350 千瓦充電器、遮篷、充足的照明、直通式充電站和安全攝像頭，並且與所有 EVgo 站點一樣，將位於各種便利設施附近，客戶可以在充電時利用這些便利設施。

Finally, we expect to expand the number of dedicated stalls serving autonomous vehicle partners, which could represent a very attractive source of potential growth for EVgo given we estimate we have a 20% share of operational sites serving this segment today.

最後，我們希望擴大為自動駕駛汽車合作夥伴提供服務的專用攤位數量，這可能成為 EVgo 一個非常有吸引力的潛在成長來源，因為我們估計目前為這一領域服務的營運站點佔比為 20%。

As for financing the growth of the business, EVgo closed $1.25 billion loan guarantee with the DOE LPO in December 2024 with the first draw for $75 million occurring in January 2025. This loan ensures we are fully funded to add at least 7,500 stalls, more than tripling our installed base over the next five years.

至於為業務成長提供資金，EVgo 於 2024 年 12 月與 DOE LPO 達成了 12.5 億美元的貸款擔保，第一筆 7,500 萬美元的貸款將於 2025 年 1 月提取。這筆貸款確保我們有足夠的資金在未來五年內增加至少 7,500 個攤位，使我們的安裝基數增加兩倍以上。

In September, we completed the transfer of our first 30C income tax credit for our 2023 vintage stalls and expect to complete the transfer of our 2024 vintage portfolio this year. Over the course of this year, we expect around 30% of 2025 vintage CapEx to be offset from state, local and federal grants, utility incentives, OEM payments and 30C.

9 月，我們完成了 2023 年古董攤位的首筆 30C 所得稅抵免的轉移，預計今年將完成 2024 年古董攤位組合的轉移。今年，我們預計 2025 年資本支出的約 30% 將由州、地方和聯邦政府的補助、公用事業激勵措施、OEM 付款和 30C 抵消。

Federal incentives in the form of technology-neutral 30C alternative fuels credit and NEVI represent approximately 10% of our 2025 vintage CapEx. As we said before, this is not a business particularly reliant on federal incentives, and our next generation charging architecture program is targeting, at least, a 30% reduction in gross CapEx per stall, significantly more than the value of these federal incentives.

以技術中立的 30C 替代燃料信貸和 NEVI 形式提供的聯邦激勵措施約占我們 2025 年資本支出的 10%。正如我們之前所說，這不是一個特別依賴聯邦激勵措施的業務，我們的下一代充電架構計劃的目標是將每個攤位的總資本支出減少至少 30％，遠遠超過這些聯邦激勵措施的價值。

And finally, given the very strong cash flows from our operating assets, we continue to receive inbound interest and evaluate additional complementary non-dilutive financing opportunities that would help fund the growth of any charging stations not included in the DOE loan funding to accelerate our growth.

最後，鑑於我們營運資產的現金流非常強勁，我們將繼續獲得入站利息，並評估額外的補充非稀釋性融資機會，這將有助於資助任何未包含在能源部貸款資金中的充電站的成長，以加速我們的成長。

Paul Dobson, EVgo's CFO, will now cover our strong financial performance in the fourth quarter and full year 2024 together with our outlook for 2025.

EVgo 財務長 Paul Dobson 將介紹我們 2024 年第四季和全年的強勁財務業績以及 2025 年的展望。

Thank you, Badar. EVgo delivered another excellent year in 2024. Our operation team mobilized and operationalized many sites in the fourth quarter, and we ended the year with 4,080 operational stalls, a 37% increase over 2023. As Badar mentioned, we continue to add new customer accounts throughout the year and ended 2024 with over 1.3 million customer accounts. Total throughput on the public network for 2024 was 277 gigawatt hours, a 116% increase compared to last year.

謝謝你，巴達爾。EVgo 在 2024 年又取得了出色的成績。我們的營運團隊在第四季度動員並投入營運許多站點，到年底，我們擁有 4,080 個營運攤位，比 2023 年增加了 37％。正如 Badar 所說，我們全年都在不斷增加新的客戶帳戶，截至 2024 年，我們擁有超過 130 萬個客戶帳戶。2024年公共網路的總吞吐量為277吉瓦時，比去年增加116％。

Revenue for 2024 was $257 million, which represents a 60% year-over-year increase. This growth was primarily driven by charging network revenues. Total charging network revenues of $155.7 million grew from $74.2 million in 2024, exhibiting 110% year-over-year increase, with retail, commercial and OEM charging revenue each individually, at least, doubling over the prior year.

2024 年的營收為 2.57 億美元，年增 60%。這一增長主要得益於收費網絡收入。總充電網路收入從 2024 年的 7,420 萬美元成長至 1.557 億美元，年增 110%，其中零售、商業和 OEM 充電收入分別比前一年翻一番至少。

eXtend revenues of $86.6 million increased from $72.4 million in the prior year, delivering growth of 20%. Both charging network gross margin and adjusted EBITDA margin significantly improved in 2024, demonstrating the operating leverage in our business model.

eXtend 的收入為 8,660 萬美元，比上年的 7,240 萬美元有所增加，增幅為 20%。2024年，充電網路毛利率與調整後的EBITDA利潤率均顯著提高，彰顯了我們商業模式中的經營槓桿。

EVgo's public network throughput growth continues to outpace EV VIO growth, driven by multiple factors. Since 2021, our public throughput has grown almost 1,000% compared to EV VIO growth of over 200%. In the fourth quarter, network utilization increased to 24%, up from 19% a year ago.

受多種因素推動，EVgo 公網吞吐量成長持續超過 EV VIO 成長。自 2021 年以來，我們的公共吞吐量成長了近 1,000%，而 EV VIO 成長率超過 200%。第四季度，網路利用率從一年前的19%上升至24%。

Diving into detail a bit more, 65% of our stalls had utilization greater than 15%, 53% of our stalls had utilization greater than 20% and 32% of our stalls had utilization greater than 30%. Each of these utilization categories grew throughout the year with the distribution of the entire utilization curve of the whole portfolio shifting to the right.

進一步詳細地講，65% 的攤位利用率超過 15%，53% 的攤位利用率超過 20%，32% 的攤位利用率超過 30%。隨著整個投資組合的整個利用率曲線的分佈向右移動，每個利用率類別在全年都有所增長。

In the fourth quarter, the average daily throughput for the owned and operated public network was 269 kilowatt hours compared to 197 last year. Looking at the top 15% of our network, the average daily throughput per public stall was 599-kilowatt hours versus 450 kilowatt hours in the prior year. The top 15% of our network is already exceeding where we conservatively think the average stall will grow to when we reach 11,000 public stalls.

第四季度，自有和營運公共網路的平均每日發電量為 269 千瓦時，而去年同期為 197 千瓦時。從我們網路的前 15% 來看，每個公共攤位的日平均用電量為 599 千瓦時，而上年為 450 千瓦時。我們保守估計，當公共攤位數量達到 11,000 個時，我們網路的前 15% 已經超過了平均攤位的成長水準。

We made significant progress in the profitability of the owned and operated public charging network this year. Charging network gross margin for 2024 was 37.6%, up from 26% in 2023. Higher throughput per public stall allows for leverage of the stall-dependent costs, such as rent and property taxes. Revenue for the fourth quarter grew 35% compared to last year with total revenue of $67.5 million. While strong charging revenue continued to meet our expectation, certain timing issues caused $4 million of eXtend revenue to move into the first quarter of 2025.

我們今年在自營公共充電網路的獲利能力方面取得了重大進展。2024 年充電網路毛利率為 37.6%，高於 2023 年的 26%。提高每個公共攤位的吞吐量可以充分利用攤位相關的成本，例如租金和財產稅。第四季營收較去年同期成長35%，總營收達6,750萬美元。雖然強勁的充電收入繼續滿足我們的預期，但某些時間問題導致 400 萬美元的 eXtend 收入轉移到 2025 年第一季。

Adjusted gross profit was $22.8 million in the fourth quarter of 2024, up from $13.3 million in the fourth quarter of 2023. Adjusted gross margin was 33.7% in the fourth quarter of 2024, an increase of 720 basis points compared to the fourth quarter last year.

2024 年第四季調整後毛利為 2,280 萬美元，高於 2023 年第四季的 1,330 萬美元。2024年第四季調整後毛利率為33.7%，較去年第四季增加720個基點。

Adjusted G&A as a percentage of revenue also improved from 54.4% in the fourth quarter of 2023 to 46.2% in Q4 of this year, demonstrating the operating leverage effect. In the fourth quarter, adjusted G&A increased $4 million sequentially as we are hiring to support our next-generation architecture.

調整後的 G&A 佔營收的百分比也從 2023 年第四季的 54.4% 提高到今年第四季的 46.2%，顯示出營運槓桿效應。第四季度，調整後的一般及行政開支環比增加了 400 萬美元，因為我們正在招募人才來支援我們的下一代架構。

Adjusted EBITDA was negative $8.4 million in the fourth quarter of 2024, a $5.6 million improvement versus negative $14 million in the fourth quarter of 2023. For the full year 2024, revenue was $256.8 million, an increase of 60% over 2023. Adjusted gross profit was $75.7 million in 2024, up from $41.8 million in 2023. Adjusted gross margin was 29.5% in 2024, an increase from 26% last year.

2024 年第四季調整後 EBITDA 為負 840 萬美元，較 2023 年第四季的負 1,400 萬美元改善 560 萬美元。2024 年全年營收為 2.568 億美元，比 2023 年成長 60%。2024 年調整後毛利為 7,570 萬美元，高於 2023 年的 4,180 萬美元。2024 年調整後毛利率為 29.5%，高於去年的 26%。

Cost management continued to be a priority for EVgo. With a nearly $100 million increase in revenues, we managed our expenses well and adjusted G&A on an absolute basis increased by only $7.5 million for the full year to $108.2 million. With this leverage, adjusted EBITDA improved to a loss of $32.5 million for the year, a $26.4 million improvement over 2023.

成本管理仍然是 EVgo 的首要任務。在營收增加近 1 億美元的情況下，我們很好地管理了開支，全年調整後的 G&A 絕對值僅增加了 750 萬美元，達到 1.082 億美元。利用這一槓桿，調整後的 EBITDA 全年虧損改善至 3,250 萬美元，比 2023 年改善了 2,640 萬美元。

Cash, cash equivalents and restricted cash was $121 million as of December 31, 2024. We also received our first draw of $75 million under our DOE loans in January 2025, which brought our cash, cash equivalents and restricted cash to approximately $200 million. We're improving our cash flow profile as well. In 2024, we used $7.3 million in cash for operations compared to cash use of $37.1 million in 2023. Gross capital expenditures were $94.8 million in 2024. Capital expenditures net of capital offsets was $46.4 million.

截至 2024 年 12 月 31 日，現金、現金等價物及受限現金為 1.21 億美元。我們也於 2025 年 1 月收到了第一筆 7,500 萬美元的 DOE 貸款，這使我們的現金、現金等價物和受限現金達到約 2 億美元。我們也在改善我們的現金流狀況。2024 年，我們的營運現金使用量為 730 萬美元，而 2023 年的現金使用量為 3,710 萬美元。2024 年總資本支出為 9,480 萬美元。扣除資本抵銷後的資本支出為 4,640 萬美元。

Let's now take a look at our unit economics model. First, we've made a couple of updates to remove the dedicated stalls, their associated throughput, revenue and cost to focus solely on public stalls. Also, with cost of sales, all energy demand charges are now in throughput dependent cost of sales, whereas it previously was split between stall-dependent and throughput-dependent cost of sales.

現在讓我們來看看我們的單位經濟模型。首先，我們做了一些更新，刪除了專用攤位及其相關的吞吐量、收入和成本，只專注於公共攤位。此外，有了銷售成本，所有能源需求費用現在都屬於吞吐量相關的銷售成本，而之前則是分為攤位相關銷售成本和吞吐量相關銷售成本。

And finally, on sustaining G&A per stall, we are looking at a trailing 12 months of G&A to reduce the volatility that occurs when you annualize the quarterly number as G&A has accounting adjustments from time to time that can cause noise.

最後，在維持每個攤位的一般及行政開支方面，我們正在研究過去 12 個月的一般及行政開支，以減少在將季度數字年化時出現的波動，因為一般及行政開支會不時進行會計調整，從而可能產生噪音。

The growth in average throughput per stall drove the increase in revenue per stall as average revenue per kilowatt hour increased by just $0.01. Throughput-dependent cost of sales decreased by $0.02 per kilowatt hour or roughly 8% as we continue our geographic expansion, including in Texas and Florida, where energy tariffs are generally lower, and we are spreading our demand charges over a greater network load. Stall-dependent cost of sales increased year-over-year, primarily driven by maintenance expense as utilization on the network has increased. Sustaining G&A per stall decreased roughly 5%.

每個攤位平均吞吐量的成長推動了每個攤位收入的增加，因為每千瓦時平均收入僅增加了0.01美元。隨著我們繼續進行地理擴張，包括能源關稅普遍較低的德克薩斯州和佛羅裡達州，並且我們將需求費用分攤到更大的網路負載上，與吞吐量相關的銷售成本每千瓦時下降了 0.02 美元，即大約 8%。攤位相關銷售成本較去年同期成長，主要原因是網路利用率增加所導致的維護費用。每個攤位的維持性 G&A 成本下降了約 5%。

It's quite revealing to see the leverage in the EVgo model as annual cash flow per public stall increased 5 times for last year, and the top 15% of our network is now generating roughly $50,000 per stall per year, which is higher than even the top end of our long-term range. Utilization is now already within the range of our updated, but still conservative, long-term utilization range. The enormous tailwind we enjoy from faster charge rate batteries in newer models, combined with faster average speed of our network from our 350-kilowatt charger, drives much of the remaining increase in daily throughput per stall in our long-term assumptions.

EVgo 模式的槓桿作用非常具有啟發性，因為去年每個公共攤位的年現金流增加了 5 倍，而我們網路中排名前 15% 的攤位現在每年每個攤位創造的收入約為 50,000 美元，這甚至高於我們長期範圍的最高值。利用率現在已處於我們更新的但仍保守的長期利用率範圍內。新車型電池的充電速度更快，再加上 350 千瓦充電器帶來的更快的網路平均速度，為我們帶來了巨大的順風，這推動了我們長期假設中每個攤位每日吞吐量剩餘的大部分增長。

Looking at the longer-term, we should see leverage in stall-dependent costs driven by material improvements in the maintenance costs driven by the next-gen architectures improved maintenance profile. For sustaining G&A per stall, we expect this number will increase in 2025. As we are making investments in stall growth is back-half weighted. We are targeting this to reduce to 7,000 in a long term as we build a larger network, and fixed G&A expenses are allocated over a 3 times larger stall base. As we build critical supply of fast-charging infrastructure over the next several years and reach a scale of roughly 11,000 stalls, the leverage of the model is expected to generate annual returns of 50% per stall.

從長遠來看，我們應該看到，下一代架構的維護狀況改善將推動維護成本的大幅提升，而失速相關成本將隨之降低。為了維持每個攤位的 G&A，我們預計這個數字將在 2025 年增加。由於我們對攤位投資的成長是後半部分加權的。隨著我們建立更大的網絡，我們長期的目標是將這一數字減少到 7,000 個，並將固定的 G&A 費用分配到 3 倍更大的攤位基礎上。隨著我們在未來幾年內建立關鍵的快速充電基礎設施供應並達到約 11,000 個攤位的規模，該模型的槓桿預計將為每個攤位產生 50% 的年回報率。

Taking a simple math approach to our unit economics, the path to a much larger business in the long-term is clear. At 11,000 public stalls, we expect to generate around $1 billion in annual revenue, recharging network gross profit of $550 million. There are some investments in G&A to be made, but growth rates anticipated from gross profit scale much faster. At 11,000 public stalls, the core owned and operated business of EVgo could be generating $300 million to $425 million in annual adjusted EBITDA. As a reminder, this excludes contribution from any other business lines like dedicated hubs or growth outside of the DOE loan.

透過簡單的數學方法計算我們的單位經濟學，我們可以清楚地看到長期內實現更大業務的路徑。在11,000個公共攤位的情況下，我們預計年收入約為10億美元，充值網路毛利為5.5億美元。雖然需要在一般及行政管理方面進行一些投資，但預計毛利的成長率要快得多。EVgo 擁有 11,000 個公共攤位，其核心自有和營運業務每年可產生 3 億至 4.25 億美元的調整後 EBITDA。提醒一下，這不包括任何其他業務線的貢獻，例如專用中心或 DOE 貸款以外的成長。

The growth engine we've built at EVgo will continue to deploy stalls at a greater rate in 2025 than we achieved in 2024. We anticipate owned and operated public and dedicated stalls of 800 to 900 in 2025 with the vast majority being stalls for the public network.

我們在 EVgo 建置的成長引擎將在 2025 年繼續以比 2024 年更高的速度部署攤位。我們預計，到 2025 年，自有和經營的公共攤位和專用攤位將達到 800 至 900 個，其中絕大多數是公共網路攤位。

As a reminder, we prudently held back capital towards the end of 2024 awaiting the closure of the DOE loan. And as such, our 2025 build plan will be back-half weighted. We anticipate roughly 50% of the stalls planned for 2025 will be in the fourth quarter of 2025. And we expect to build another 450 to 550 stalls in 2025 for our EVgo eXtend partners. This increase in total deployments in 2025 shows we're on the path to deliver 7,500 stalls under the DOE loan.

提醒一下，我們謹慎地在 2024 年底保留了資本，等待 DOE 貸款結清。因此，我們的 2025 年建設計劃將採用後半加權。我們預計，2025 年計劃開設的攤位中約有 50% 將位於 2025 年第四季。我們預計到 2025 年將為 EVgo eXtend 合作夥伴再建造 450 至 550 個攤位。2025 年總部署數量的增加表明我們預計在能源部貸款下提供 7,500 個攤位。

As a reminder, the public network stall build plan from 2025 to 2029, shown here, is supported by the DOE loan. If we're successful in lowering CapEx per stall in line with our stated plans, we would be able to build approximately 1,600 more stalls without an increase in the DOE loan financing starting from 2027 onwards upon release of our next-generation architecture in 2026. We expect to add even more dedicated stalls for AV partners in 2026 and beyond. Our build plan for the pilot company through our eXtend contract is currently expected to be completed by 2027.

提醒一下，這裡顯示的 2025 年至 2029 年公共網路攤位建設計劃由 DOE 貸款支持。如果我們能夠按照既定計畫成功降低每個攤位的資本支出，那麼從 2027 年開始，當我們在 2026 年發布下一代架構時，我們將能夠再建造約 1,600 個攤位，而無需增加 DOE 貸款融資。我們預計在 2026 年及以後為 AV 合作夥伴增加更多專用展位。我們透過 eXtend 合約為試點公司製定的建設計劃目前預計將於 2027 年完成。

EVgo continues our top-line growth and path to profitability in 2025. We expect total revenues in the range of $340 million to $380 million. We continue to target adjusted EBITDA breakeven in 2025 with a range of negative $5 million to positive $10 million.

EVgo 將繼續保持營收成長，並在 2025 年實現盈利。我們預計總收入在 3.4 億美元至 3.8 億美元之間。我們繼續以 2025 年調整後 EBITDA 損益平衡為目標，範圍為負 500 萬美元至正 1,000 萬美元。

Additional color behind these ranges are as follows, charging network revenue is expected to comprise approximately two-thirds of our total revenue in 2025. In charging network revenue, we anticipate sequential quarterly growth throughout 2025. Q1 is typically flat to Q4 as it is the lowest quarter of the year historically for vehicle miles traveled.

這些範圍背後的其他因素如下：預計到 2025 年，充電網路收入將占我們總收入的約三分之二。在充電網路收入方面，我們預計 2025 年將全年逐季成長。第一季至第四季通常持平，因為從歷史上看，這是一年中車輛行駛里程最低的季度。

eXtend revenues are expected to be roughly flat in 2025 to 2024, with growth in the second half of the year. Ancillary revenues are expected to grow in 2025, with most of the growth coming in the fourth quarter of 2025, driven by the dedicated business.

eXtend 的營收預計在 2025 年至 2024 年間基本持平，並在下半年實現成長。預計 2025 年輔助收入將會成長，其中大部分成長將出現在 2025 年第四季度，主要受專用業務的推動。

Total adjusted gross profit and adjusted G&A as a percentage of revenue are expected to improve in 2025, driving bottom-line adjusted EBITDA improvement. Adjusted G&A is expected to increase modestly on the Q4 run rate throughout 2025, reflecting continued investments in technology and efficiency plus inflation. We expect fiscal CapEx net of offsets to be in the range of $160 million to $180 million for 2025. 2025 will be a pivotal and exciting year for EVgo.

預計 2025 年調整後總毛利和調整後 G&A 佔收入的百分比將有所改善，從而推動底線​​調整後 EBITDA 的改善。預計 2025 年全年調整後的 G&A 費用將在第四季度的運行率基礎上小幅增加，這反映了對技術和效率以及通貨膨脹的持續投資。我們預計，2025 年的財政資本支出淨額將在 1.6 億至 1.8 億美元之間。 2025 年對 EVgo 來說將是關鍵且令人興奮的一年。

Operator, we can now open the call for Q&A.

接線員，我們現在可以開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions) Bill Peterson, JPMorgan.

（操作員指示）摩根大通的比爾彼得森。

Yes, hi, good morning, and thanks for taking the questions. And also nice result in 2024 when looking back at your guidance from last year coming in at the high end on both revenues and adjusted EBITDA, so nice execution.

是的，早上好，感謝您回答這些問題。而且回顧去年的指引，2024 年的業績也相當不錯，收入和調整後 EBITDA 都達到高位，執行得很好。

My first question is on the loan and the status of the loan. Perhaps you can shed some light on when you expect the second drawdown to occur. Is there any conditions that must be fulfilled? I mean, how are discussions happening with the administration? What avenues do you have to counter any attempts to claw back the loan or with this loan apparently being delayed? Just kind of wondering what you have there.

我的第一個問題是關於貸款和貸款狀況。也許您可以解釋一下第二次下跌預計何時發生。有什麼必須滿足的條件嗎？我的意思是，與政府的討論進度如何？您有什麼途徑來應對任何收回貸款的企圖或這筆貸款顯然被延期的情況？只是好奇你那裡有啥。

And then, really, in the worst-case scenario, you talked about some financing options, but I assume those are near term. But can you shed some more light on your non-dilutive financing options with or without the loan? For example, I'm assuming maybe project financing with some debt or equity partners, but what does the appetite look like for such options today?

然後，實際上，在最壞的情況下，您談到了一些融資選擇，但我認為這些都是短期的。但是，您能否進一步說明一下有或無貸款的非稀釋性融資選擇？例如，我假設也許可以透過一些債務或股權合作夥伴進行專案融資，但目前對此類選擇的興趣如何？

Sure. Hey, Bill. So look, we have a very productive relationship with the LPO team. As we've said here on this call and before, we see charging infrastructure is actually key to the long-term competitiveness of the US auto industry as it competes against China. And as you know, and I think as everyone knows, this is not a conditional commitment, but a legally binding contract that we're spending two months on and adds a thousand jobs.

當然。嘿，比爾。所以看，我們與 LPO 團隊保持著非常有成效的關係。正如我們在本次電話會議中以及之前所說的那樣，我們認為充電基礎設施實際上是美國汽車產業在與中國競爭時保持長期競爭力的關鍵。正如你所知，我想大家都知道，這不是一個有條件的承諾，而是一個具有法律約束力的合同，我們花了兩個月的時間才完成這份合同，並增加了一千個工作崗位。

All government funding is under review that, I think, everybody knows that. But we believe that they see what we see and what you're looking at today. These assets have very strong performance. The loan is a good deal for the US government. It's been carefully structured to provide protection to the government and also flexibility for us. And so our confidence in the loan really hasn't changed. We received our first quarterly advance in January, and it's obviously too early for the next quarter, which would be in Q2.

所有政府資金都在接受審查，我想，每個人都知道這一點。但我們相信，他們看到了我們所看到的東西以及你們今天所看到的東西。這些資產的表現非常強勁。這筆貸款對美國政府來說是一筆好交易。它經過精心設計，不僅能為政府提供保護，還能提供我們彈性。因此，我們對貸款的信心確實沒有改變。我們在一月份收到了第一筆季度預付款，但對於下一季（第二季）來說顯然還為時過早。

As we said in December and as we're saying today, we'll become EBITDA breakeven this year and levered free cash flow positive in 2026. Meaning, if we hadn't financed this growth with the DOE loan, there are likely many others that really would have.

正如我們 12 月所說的以及今天所說的那樣，我們今年的 EBITDA 將實現盈虧平衡，並在 2026 年實現槓桿自由現金流為正。意思是，如果我們沒有用能源部貸款來資助這項成長，那麼很可能還有很多其他企業能夠資助這項成長。

And so, Paul, do you want to just comment on the --

那麼，保羅，你想評論一下--

Sure.

當然。

We are also -- we've been talking about additional non-dilutive financing all year last year. At the beginning of this time last year, it was as an option as an alternative to the DOE loan. Of course, now, we consider as complementary to the DOE loan for additional financing, but do you want to maybe just talk about --

我們去年全年都在談論額外的非稀釋性融資。去年年初，它是作為 DOE 貸款的替代選擇。當然，現在我們認為這是對能源部貸款的補充，用於額外融資，但你想談談--

Sure. Yes. So just as Badar mentioned, we're looking at complementary financing to sit alongside the DOE loan. First of all, any projects that the stalls can't go into the DOE loan because they're not public, but also, we just think it's good practice to have alternative sources of funding available. Lots of businesses do that, and I think that's a good thing for EVgo to pursue.

當然。是的。正如巴達爾所提到的，我們正在考慮與能源部貸款相符的補充融資。首先，任何攤位都不能進入能源部貸款，因為它們不是公共的，而且，我們認為擁有其他資金來源是一種很好的做法。許多企業都這樣做，我認為這對 EVgo 來說是一件好事。

So we have been talking with various institutions, banks. And what they like about our model is the steady and predictable cash flows. They've seen our unit economics. They've seen everything that we've shown in the past. And so we're looking at structures that are somewhat similar to the DOE loan, of course, not at the same length of term, but project financing to straight debts or some sort of a hybrid. We are sure that we want to pursue non-dilutive funding as well.

因此我們一直在與各種機構、銀行進行談判。他們喜歡我們模型的原因是其穩定且可預測的現金流。他們已經看到了我們的單位經濟學。他們已經看到了我們過去所展示的一切。因此，我們正在研究與能源部貸款有些相似的結構，當然，期限不同，而是專案融資為直接債務或某種混合債務。我們確信我們也希望追求非稀釋性融資。

But like I said, the reception from the banks has been extremely positive. They like the proven developer. As you mentioned, Bill, execution, they can see the execution happening and they can see the cash flows as well. So confident we're going to be able to execute on a complementary source of financing this year.

但正如我所說，銀行的反應非常正面。他們喜歡經驗豐富的開發人員。正如比爾你所提到的，他們可以看到執行的進展，也可以看到現金流。因此我們有信心今年能夠實現補充融資。

Yes, thanks, Badar and Paul, for that. And then, my second question, I'd like to kind of unpack a little bit about the full year guide again in the context that last year proved to be conservative. So I guess, what can drive the outcomes to the negative or positive end? And does any of this depend on DOE loan deployments? Or perhaps you can shed some more light or quantify how much G&A increase per stall is going up, maybe potentially offset by factors like utilization, charging rate and network throughput? And how should we think about those factors as part of the guidance? Should we use for the fourth quarter as kind of a guidepost or are you assuming any improvement relative to the exit rates in 2024?

是的，感謝 Badar 和 Paul。然後，我的第二個問題是，我想在去年被證明是保守的背景下再次解釋全年指南。所以我猜想，什麼會導致結果走向負面或正面？這些是否依賴能源部貸款部署？或者也許您可以進一步闡明或量化每個攤位的 G&A 增加額，也許會被利用率、收費率和網路吞吐量等因素所抵消？我們應該如何將這些因素視為指導的一部分？我們是否應該將第四季度作為指導方針，或者您是否假設相對於 2024 年的退出率會有所改善？

Yes. Bill, let me just ask Paul to respond to that, but just one thing I will say in response to that question upfront, I did say in my script that we expect less than 10% of our revenue to come from new sales of electric vehicles in 2025, which is simply a reflection -- and that'll reduce over time, it's a reflection that this is a business model that's dependent upon total VIO rather than annual EV sales.

是的。比爾，我想請保羅來回答這個問題，但我首先要回答的是，我在腳本中確實說過，我們預計到 2025 年，來自電動汽車新銷量的收入將占我們總收入的不到 10%，這只是一種反映——而且這一比例會隨著時間的推移而減少，這反映了這種商業模式依賴於總 VIO 銷量而不是年度電動汽車銷量。

I mean, Paul, you can provide some color.

我的意思是，保羅，你可以提供一些顏色。

Sure. So just a bit more background on the guidance. So we said revenue of $340 million to $380 million. We said two-thirds of that is charging revenue. And so the range we put around that really does reflect some variability, not much, but plus or minus 5% on throughput. Plus there is some risk around LCFS pricing as well.

當然。因此，我只想對該指南的背景做一點介紹。所以我們說收入是3.4億到3.8億美元。我們說其中三分之二是收費收入。因此，我們設定的範圍確實反映了一些變化，雖然變化不大，但吞吐量會有正負 5% 的差異。此外，LCFS 定價也存在一些風險。

The other third of revenue is the non-charging revenue. And that range is due to some timing, just timing differences on contracts, the timing of when we get contracts signed, permitting, logistics and then some NEVI risk as well. We've also said G&A, we expect will increase modestly from our Q4 run rate, which reflects our investments in technology plus some inflation. We said our adjusted EBITDA range is minus $5 million to $10 million positive.

其餘三分之一的收入為非收費收入。這個範圍是由於一些時間因素造成的，只是合約的時間差異，我們簽署合約的時間、許可、物流以及一些 NEVI 風險。我們也表示，預計一般及行政開支將較第四季的運行率略有增加，這反映了我們在技術方面的投資以及一些通貨膨脹。我們表示，調整後的 EBITDA 範圍為負 500 萬美元至正 1,000 萬美元。

So with all of that above and looking at our 2024 results, you should be able to derive what our adjusted gross margin would be using the midpoint of all of that -- of those ranges. And you'll see that our adjusted gross margin percentage for both the charging business and the non-charging business is increasing as well.

因此，結合以上所有內容並查看我們的 2024 年業績，您應該能夠使用所有這些範圍的中點來推導出我們的調整後毛利率。您會發現，我們充電業務和非充電業務的調整後毛利率百分比也在增加。

Thanks for sharing those insights, and nice job on the execution in 2024.

感謝您分享這些見解，2024 年的執行做得很好。

Thanks, Bill.

謝謝，比爾。

Thanks, Bill.

謝謝，比爾。

Chris Dendrinos, RBC Capital Markets.

加拿大皇家銀行資本市場 (RBC Capital Markets) 的 Chris Dendrinos。

Yes, thank you, and good morning. And echoing Bill's comments on the good year last year. Maybe just to start out and following up on the prior question as it relates to Trump executive orders. And I guess the question is, if there is like a funding halt this year or next year or something like that, how would you all respond? Would you curtail activity or would you look -- I guess, you mentioned backfilling with some other opportunities for maybe debt funding. So would that be the option to, I guess, continue the growth cadence that you're on right now?

是的，謝謝你，早安。並呼應比爾對去年美好一年的評價。也許只是為了開始並跟進前面與川普行政命令相關的問題。我想問題是，如果今年或明年出現資金停止的情況，或類似情況，你們要如何應對？您會減少活動還是會尋找——我想，您提到過用一些其他機會來填補，例如債務融資。那麼，這是否會成為繼續保持當前成長節奏的選擇？

Chris, are you talking about the executive orders and their impact on electric vehicle sales? Is that what you're talking?

克里斯，你談論的是行政命令及其對電動車銷售的影響嗎？這就是你所說的嗎？

Well, just on -- if, say, like, the DOE loan was paused and they went -- I guess, took you all to court to try to fight it and not fund it?

好吧，就像——比如說，如果能源部貸款被暫停，他們——我想，會把你們告上法庭，試圖抗爭，而不是提供資金？

Right. Okay. So yes, look, as we said before on the last question -- on Bill's question, we feel very confident in the loan. The loan assets themselves are performing very strongly. It's a good deal for the US government with a lot of protections for the government, so we feel pretty good about it.

正確的。好的。是的，正如我們之前在回答比爾的最後一個問題時所說的那樣，我們對這筆貸款非常有信心。貸款資產本身的表現非常強勁。對於美國政府來說，這是一筆很好的交易，因為它為政府提供了許多保護，所以我們對此感到非常滿意。

In terms of funding and cash flow, I mean, we have very strong cash balance. We're starting the year with about $200 million, and so we feel very good about that.

就資金和現金流而言，我們的現金餘額非常充足。我們今年的年初就擁有約 2 億美元的收入，因此我們對此感到非常滿意。

Paul, do you have any other comments to add?

保羅，您還有其他評論要補充嗎？

Yes. So that's right. So as we mentioned, we've got around $200 million of cash, including the drawdown we took in January. And when you step back and look at our model, primary uses of our cash are the cash from operations and then for CapEx.

是的。沒錯。正如我們所提到的，我們有大約 2 億美元現金，其中包括我們在一月份提取的資金。當你回顧並檢視我們的模型時，我們會發現我們現金的主要用途是經營活動現金，其次是資本支出。

So since we're going to be EBITDA breakeven in 2025, that implies that our operating cash flow is close to breakeven as well. You saw in '24, our cash from operations, we used $9 million, which was a significant improvement over 2023. So you can cast that forward and say that's more or less breakeven as well in '25.

因此，由於我們將在 2025 年實現 EBITDA 收支平衡，這意味著我們的經營現金流量也接近收支平衡。您可以在 24 年看到，我們的營運現金流為 900 萬美元，比 2023 年有了顯著改善。因此，你可以將其向前推移，並說在 25 年這或多或少也能夠實現收支平衡。

So that leaves CapEx as kind of the swing factor. So our net CapEx is expected to be $160 million to $180 million, which includes buildouts not only for the 2025 stalls, but also for 2026 vintage as well. And we have the option, of course, to either speed up or slow down the deployment of those stalls if we choose depending on funding or for any other reason. And just to reiterate, we are pursuing complementary non-dilutive financing and confident we'll be able to put something in place this year.

因此，資本支出就成為一種搖擺因素。因此，我們的淨資本支出預計為 1.6 億至 1.8 億美元，其中不僅包括 2025 年攤位的建設，還包括 2026 年攤位的建設。當然，根據資金或其他原因，我們可以選擇加快或減慢這些攤位的部署速度。需要重申的是，我們正在尋求補充性的非稀釋性融資，並相信今年能夠取得一些成果。

Got it. Okay. And then, maybe as a follow-up, you highlighted some opportunities on the AV charging station side, those private stalls. Can you maybe, I guess, talk about the strategy there and how does that compare with the public network stations? Thanks.

知道了。好的。然後，也許作為後續，您強調了 AV 充電站方面的一些機會，那些私人攤位。我想您能談談那裡的策略嗎？與公共網路電台相比有何不同？謝謝。

Yes, absolutely. Yes, look, so, we've been building and operating these dedicated sites, dedicated hubs for autonomous vehicle fleet partners, actually, for a number of years. Last year, we more than doubled the number of stalls that are operational, these dedicated stalls from -- to 110, and that's why we actually separated it out from the public network. We received a fixed dollar amount on a monthly basis for the stalls where the electricity is pass-through. And so, we consider -- it's a different revenue model.

是的，絕對是如此。是的，事實上，我們已經為自動駕駛汽車車隊合作夥伴建造和營運這些專用站點和專用樞紐很多年了。去年，我們經營的攤位數量增加了一倍多，這些專用攤位從--增加到了 110 個，這就是我們實際上將其與公共網路分開的原因。我們每個月都會從透過電力輸送的攤位收到固定金額的收入。因此，我們認為──這是一種不同的收入模式。

In terms of relative attractiveness, margins for this business are a little less, a little lower than our public owned and operated, quite a bit higher than the margins from our eXtend business. But, of course, they don't come with any utilization variability. And so we actually quite like this segment.

就相對吸引力而言，這項業務的利潤率略低一些，比我們公有和經營的業務的利潤率要低一些，但比我們的 eXtend 業務的利潤率要高一些。但是，當然，它們不具備任何利用率可變性。因此我們實際上非常喜歡這個部分。

And I think as we said, at the end of last year, we actually think that this autonomous vehicle robotaxi space could grow quite a bit faster over the coming years than maybe we had thought previously, especially since the election. And so we're quite excited by this. We estimate -- there's not a lot of data on this, but we estimate we have about a 20% share of dedicated hubs for autonomous vehicle partners today.

我認為，正如我們在去年年底所說的那樣，我們實際上認為未來幾年自動駕駛汽車計程車領域的成長速度可能會比我們之前的想像要快得多，尤其是自大選以來。因此我們對此感到非常興奮。我們估計——這方面的數據並不多，但我們估計目前我們為自動駕駛汽車合作夥伴提供的專用樞紐份額約為 20%。

Got it. Thank you.

知道了。謝謝。

Douglas Dutton, Evercore ISI.

道格拉斯·達頓（Douglas Dutton），Evercore ISI。

Thank you. Hey, team. Thanks for having me on. I was just curious about how the strategy has maybe shifted on the prioritization of geographic growth over the next few years. I understand the commentary about tripling the number of stalls, but has this current administration's, we'll call it, more limited scope on electrification had you guys rethink which states or markets to focus on, maybe those where EV density is already at critical mass?

謝謝。嘿，團隊。感謝您的邀請。我只是好奇，未來幾年，該戰略在地理成長優先順序上可能會發生怎樣的變化。我理解關於將攤位數量增加三倍的評論，但現任政府在電氣化方面採取的行動（我們稱之為更有限的範圍）是否讓你們重新考慮應該關注哪些州或市場，也許是那些電動汽車密度已經達到臨界規模的州或市場？

Yes. Look, let me just comment a little bit on the impact on electric vehicle sales. As I said in my remarks, our business is driven by the difference between the supply of DC fast charging and demand in terms of overall VIO, not annual sales. And that supply has exceeded demand for years. It's why we've seen a four-fold increase in utilization over the last three years.

是的。瞧，讓我稍微評論一下對電動車銷售的影響。正如我在發言中所說，我們的業務是由直流快速充電的供應與整體 VIO 需求之間的差異所驅動的，而不是年銷售額。多年來，供應一直超過需求。這就是為什麼我們看到過去三年利用率增加了四倍。

And so that's really what's driving the economics in our business. As demand grows, we benefit with better utilization. If demand slows, what we have already seen is the supply of fast charging across the industry seems to slow, and therefore, we benefit because we've got that supply exceeds demand.

這才是真正推動我們業務經濟發展的因素。隨著需求的成長，我們可以更好地利用這些資源。如果需求放緩，我們已經看到整個行業的快速充電供應似乎放緩，因此，我們將受益，因為供應超過了需求。

If charging supply grows, in other words, if other charging companies are building out charging infrastructure, we know that stimulates demand. This is not a zero-sum game, and we also benefit. We actually think we benefit because we've got better located stalls, and we are singularly focused on usage unlike many other charging companies. And so this is actually a pretty resilient business model.

如果充電供應增加，換句話說，如果其他充電公司正在建造充電基礎設施，我們知道這會刺激需求。這不是一場零和遊戲，我們也從中受益。我們實際上認為我們受益了，因為我們擁有位置更好的攤位，並且與許多其他充電公司不同，我們只專注於使用情況。所以這其實是一個非常有彈性的商業模式。

In terms of your specific question around geographic expansion, we are increasing the share of our store growth and network expansion outside California. That's been a trend that's been underway for a number of years. In the fourth quarter of last year, we saw usage inflect for the first time where the rest of the United States is now greater than California. And we're seeing very strong utilization in many of these non-California markets, and that's really we're following demand. We're going to build -- our network plan is designed to follow demand, and that's really what we're doing.

關於您提到的地理擴展的具體問題，我們正在增加加州以外地區門市成長和網路擴展的份額。這個趨勢已經持續了很多年。去年第四季度，我們首次看到使用量發生變化，美國其他地區的使用量現已超過加州。我們看到許多加州以外市場的利用率非常高，這實際上是遵循需求。我們將進行建造——我們的網路計劃是根據需求而設計的，這也正是我們正在做的事情。

Awesome. That makes a lot of sense. Thank you, team.

驚人的。這很有道理。謝謝你們，團隊。

Gabe Daoud, TD Cowen.

加布·達烏德（Gabe Daoud），TD Cowen。

Thanks. Hey, good morning, everybody. I was hoping we can maybe focus on CapEx just for a minute. And has there been any sensitivities or studies that you guys have done with respect to potential tariffs and how that impacts your personal CapEx figure over time?

謝謝。嘿，大家早安。我希望我們可以暫時關註一下資本支出。你們是否對潛在關稅進行過任何敏感性研究，以及這會對你們的個人資本支出數字產生怎樣的影響？

Okay. We really have sort of minimal direct impact from these tariffs. We don't source our chargers from China. I think as you know, we -- our supply chain is really not impacted by Canada or Mexico tariffs. Our hardware vendors have operations in the United States for BABA compliant shipments. And if things continue to change for whatever reason, we can ramp up that production if we need it.

好的。這些關稅對我們造成的直接影響確實很小。我們的充電器不向中國採購。我想如你所知，我們的供應鏈實際上並沒有受到加拿大或墨西哥關稅的影響。我們的硬體供應商在美國開展業務，以提供符合 BABA 標準的運輸服務。如果情況因某種原因繼續變化，我們可以在需要時提高產量。

In the reality, we really have a lot of options in our supply chain and we are in discussions with our supply chain in different geographies pretty much all the time. And so at this point, with respect to what's been announced, we really don't have much impact in our direct business -- in terms of our charging infrastructure.

事實上，我們的供應鏈中確實有很多選擇，而且我們幾乎一直都在與不同地區的供應鏈進行討論。因此，就目前而言，就我們已宣布的內容而言，就我們的充電基礎設施而言，對我們的直接業務並沒有太大影響。

And in terms of indirect impact on EV demand, as I said already, our business is a resilient business model where our economics and our utilization is driven by the delta between supply of EV versus -- demand of EV versus supply of charging infrastructure, and that's been an imbalance for years and will continue to be. And that's really what's driving our growth.

就對電動車需求的間接影響而言，正如我已經說過的，我們的業務是一種有彈性的商業模式，我們的經濟和利用率是由電動汽車的供應與電動汽車的需求與充電基礎設施的供應之間的差異驅動的，這種不平衡多年來一直存在，並將繼續存在。這才是我們成長的真正動力。

Thanks, Badar. That's helpful. And then, I guess, just as a follow-up, on the demand charge side, could you maybe give us an update on where you stand with some utilities and some jurisdictions on extending or instituting demand charge holidays? And do you think there's maybe a risk over time as there's obviously significant expected load growth in the US for the first time maybe ever on AI data centers, et cetera? But maybe how does that potentially impact, like, demand charges and demand charge holidays? Thanks, guys.

謝謝，巴達爾。這很有幫助。然後，我想，作為後續問題，關於需求費用方面，您能否向我們介紹一下您對一些公用事業公司和一些司法管轄區在延長或設立需求費用假期方面的立場？您是否認為隨著時間的推移可能會存在風險，因為美國的人工智慧資料中心等的負載預計會首次出現顯著增長？但這可能會對需求費用和需求費用假期產生什麼影響？謝謝大家。

Yes. We've got demand charge reductions or holidays across the vast majority of our kilowatt hours today. And as utilization and throughput per stall on a per site basis continues to grow, clearly the impact of demand charges just becomes smaller, frankly, over time. And so it's one of the reasons where we're seeing operating leverage in gross margin. And as throughput per stall continues to grow, as you've seen throughput per stall has grown five-fold, throughput per stall over our network over the last three years, the impact of demand charges just become smaller and smaller over time.

是的。今天，我們絕大部分的千瓦時電費都有需求電費降低或放假。而且隨著每個站點每個攤位的使用率和吞吐量不斷增長，顯然隨著時間的推移，需求費用的影響會變得越來越小。這就是我們在毛利率中看到營業槓桿的原因之一。而且隨著每個攤位的吞吐量不斷增長，正如您所看到的，過去三年來，我們網路的每個攤位的吞吐量增長了五倍，需求費用的影響隨著時間的推移變得越來越小。

Got it. Makes sense. Thank you.

知道了。有道理。謝謝。

Patrick Ouellette, Stifel.

派崔克·奧爾萊特（Patrick Ouellette），Stifel。

Hey. It's Pat on for Stephen Gengaro. Thanks for taking the questions. Would you be able to give us details on how you think of utilization evolving in 2025 based on your guidance? And longer-term, is there sort of a sweet spot of utilization across the network that you're targeting, understanding that if utilization gets up to, I imagine, in the 70%-plus range, then drivers would be waiting to charge at your stations?

嘿。這是 Stephen Gengaro 的 Pat on。感謝您回答這些問題。根據您的指導，您能否向我們詳細介紹一下您對 2025 年利用率發展的看法？並且從長期來看，您所瞄準的整個網路的利用率是否存在一個最佳點，如果利用率達到（我想） 70% 以上，那麼司機們就會在您的充電站等待充電嗎？

Yes. Look, let me -- I'll ask Paul just to comment on 2025, but, I mean, just at a very high level, we're at 24% utilization. We just updated our long-term target just at the end of last year from our previous target, and we're already to 23% to 26%, so we're already in that range. As you saw in one of the slides, roughly two-thirds of our charging stalls are already over 15%. Almost a third are already over 30%. And so we might find ourselves over the course of this year updating that long-term target again.

是的。看，讓我——我會請保羅對 2025 年發表評論，但我的意思是，在非常高的水平上，我們的利用率為 24%。我們剛剛在去年年底更新了我們的長期目標，現在我們已經達到 23% 到 26%，所以我們已經在這個範圍內了。正如您在一張投影片中看到的，我們大約三分之二的充電樁使用率已經超過 15%。近三分之一的比例已經超過 30%。因此，我們可能會在今年再次更新這個長期目標。

In terms of taking a step back, we have the scale and the sophistication today to deploy pricing and customer marketing because we have the scale and the sophistication to do this, to be able to go from not just building charging stations and hoping people show up to actually influencing and shaping who is charging when and, at some point, where. Right now, there's not enough density of these charging stations. There's enormous white space. And that's pretty that -- and we're doing that to allow us to see increases in charging without congestion.

退一步來說，我們今天擁有部署定價和客戶行銷的規模和成熟度，因為我們擁有做到這一點的規模和成熟度，能夠從僅僅建立充電站並希望人們出現到真正影響和塑造誰在何時何地充電。目前，這些充電站的密度還不夠。這裡有巨大的空白。這很不錯——我們這樣做是為了能夠在不造成擁堵的情況下增加充電量。

And so we think we're quite sophisticated there. And over course of this year, we may find ourselves updating utilization again. But as a reminder, throughput per stall is both utilization and charge rate. We have a charge rate tailwind because of faster batteries in the cars, and our network is getting faster and faster every month as we deploy 350 kilowatt chargers. Those two things are what drives the volume in our -- price times volume formula.

因此我們認為我們在這方面相當成熟。今年，我們可能會再次更新利用率。但要提醒的是，每個攤位的吞吐量既是利用率也是收費率。由於汽車電池速度更快，我們的充電率處於順風位置，隨著我們部署 350 千瓦充電器，我們的網路速度每個月都在變得越來越快。這兩個因素就是我們價格乘以交易量公式中交易量的驅動因素。

But Paul, do you want to comment on 2025?

但保羅，你想對 2025 年發表評論嗎？

So yes, without repeating too much of what you just said, Badar, but if you look at our utilization from the slide that we showed in our unit economics, we went from 19% in the end of 2023 or Q4 to 24%. So 5-point increase in one year. As Badar mentioned, our guidance of 23% to 26%, we're already in the range now. So when you're modeling for 2025, I'd encourage you to put utilization at the highest end of the range. And as you mentioned, we may revisit that later on this year as we get more information about the performance of our stalls.

所以是的，巴達爾，我不需要重複太多你剛才說的話，但是如果你從我們在單位經濟學中展示的幻燈片中看我們的利用率，我們的利用率從 2023 年底或第四季度的 19% 上升到了 24%。因此一年內增加了 5 個百分點。正如巴達爾所提到的，我們的預期是 23% 至 26%，現在我們已經在這個範圍內了。因此，當您為 2025 年建模時，我建議您將利用率置於範圍的最高端。正如您所說，隨著我們獲得有關攤位表現的更多信息，我們可能會在今年晚些時候重新審視這個問題。

And then, charge rates, similarly, increasing from 43 kilowatts to 47 kilowatts in Q4 '24. We continue to see that increasing as newer vehicles with faster charge speeds hit the market. And we deploy more 305 kilowatt chargers out there too, which are able to accommodate that. So we see a big increase there or an increase there throughout 2025.

然後，充電率也從 24 年第四季的 43 千瓦增加到 47 千瓦。隨著充電速度更快的新型車輛進入市場，我們持續看到這一趨勢的成長。我們還在那裡部署了更多的 305 千瓦充電器，可以滿足這項要求。因此，我們預計該數字將大幅成長，或在 2025 年全年都將保持成長。

As Badar mentioned, in terms of -- it's not just utilization, it's one thing that we're learning as well. The time of day is almost just as important in terms of how we manage utilization. So we're finding, in some cases, we have chargers deployed where they're being utilized at 15% utilization at 3:00 AM in the morning, which is incredible to see. But how we influence when those chargers are being used through pricing signals and other means, other marketing is going to be important for us to manage utilization going forward.

正如巴達爾所提到的——這不僅僅是利用，這也是我們正在學習的一件事。就我們如何管理使用率而言，一天中的時間幾乎同樣重要。因此我們發現，在某些情況下，我們部署的充電器在凌晨 3 點的利用率為 15％，這是令人難以置信的。但是，我們如何透過定價訊號和其他方式來影響這些充電器的使用時間，以及其他行銷方式對於我們未來的使用率管理至關重要。

Alright. Great. That's very helpful. Just to follow-up, I know in the past you said non-Tesla vehicles make up the majority of the throughput on the network, but just curious if you've seen any uptick in Tesla vehicles charging on the network, especially since it opened its network to the other OEMs?

好吧。偉大的。這非常有幫助。只是為了跟進，我知道您過去說過非特斯拉汽車佔據了網絡吞吐量的大部分，但我只是好奇您是否看到特斯拉汽車在網絡上充電的數量有所增加，特別是自從它向其他 OEM 開放網絡以來？

Yes. I mean, look, so Tesla vehicles generally, as you know, as we've said before, haven't historically charged our network. With the introduction of the NACS cable, [Stephen] we are really excited to be able to start charging and attracting Tesla vehicles on our network without an adapter, with a native connector. And that represents another source of increase in throughput on our network, without any impact on -- without any increase in EV VIO.

是的。我的意思是，正如我們之前所說，特斯拉汽車一般沒有在我們的網路充電。隨著 NACS 電纜的推出，[斯蒂芬] 我們非常高興能夠使用原生連接器，無需適配器即可在我們的網路上為特斯拉汽車進行充電和吸引。這是我們網路吞吐量增加的另一個來源，而不會對 EV VIO 產生任何影響——不會增加任何 EV VIO。

Our first site with NACS cables are now deployed. It's a pilot site. So it's too early for me to comment on the data. I will say I'm excited that we've got the NACS cable deployed, and we're seeing -- clearly, we're seeing Tesla vehicles charge on our network at higher rates than we've ever seen before, but it's too early to be able to project that out across the rest of our network. And we will be looking to increase the deployment of these NACS cables throughout the course of this year.

我們的第一個採用 NACS 電纜的站點現已部署。這是一個試點站點。因此我現在對數據發表評論還為時過早。我想說，我很高興我們已經部署了 NACS 電纜，而且我們看到——顯然，我們看到特斯拉汽車在我們的網路上的充電速率比以往任何時候都要高，但現在就預測這一趨勢將擴展到我們網路的其餘部分還為時過早。我們希望在今年增加這些 NACS 電纜的部署。

Great. Thanks a bunch. I'll turn it back.

偉大的。非常感謝。我會把它轉回去。

William Grippin, UBS.

瑞銀的威廉‧格里平 (William Grippin)。

Thank you. Good morning, everybody. My first question here was just based on the skid-based hardware that you've talked about deploying here in 2025. I don't think you gave the number, but to what extent could that drive some cost reductions for 2025 vintage CapEx? And could that potentially offset the loss of 30C tax credits should that actually happen?

謝謝。大家早安。我的第一個問題只是基於您談到的 2025 年部署的滑橇式硬體。我認為您沒有給出數字，但這在多大程度上可以降低 2025 年資本支出的成本？如果這種情況真的發生，是否可能抵消 30C 稅收抵免的損失？

Yes. I mean, look, the -- I mean, let's just quickly just take a step back on the 30C tax credits. This is, I think, less than 0.5% of the total cost of the IRA. The 30C, it's their technology neutral. They're bipartisan supported because they are incentives for all kinds of charging infrastructure, not just electric vehicles. And these federal incentives, they represent about 10% of our gross CapEx per stall. And so that's why I keep saying our business is really not reliant on federal incentives.

是的。我的意思是，看一下——我的意思是，讓我們快速回顧一下 30C 稅收抵免。我認為這還不到 IRA 總成本的 0.5%。30C 是他們的中立技術。這些計劃之所以得到兩黨的支持，是因為它們可以為各種充電基礎設施提供激勵，而不僅僅是電動車。這些聯邦激勵措施約占我們每個攤位總資本支出的 10%。這就是為什麼我一直說我們的業務實際上並不依賴聯邦激勵措施。

The charger CapEx reduction program that we have in place through the MOU -- through the signed agreement now with Delta is looking at a 30% improvement in gross CapEx per stall. We've seen a 9% improvement in 2024 versus what we were expecting for 2024. We see a modest improvement next year in the overall average gross CapEx per stall, which includes the impact of the higher percentage of prefab skids that we've got going on as well as other efforts around equipment, site design, construction processes.

我們透過諒解備忘錄（透過現在與達美航空簽署的協議）實施的充電器資本支出削減計劃正在尋求將每個攤位的總資本支出提高 30%。與我們對 2024 年的預期相比，我們看到 2024 年將有 9% 的改善。我們預計明年每個攤位的整體平均總資本支出將略有改善，其中包括我們正在進行的預製滑軌比例更高以及圍繞設備、場地設計、施工流程等其他努力的影響。

The only reason why it's an average, it's a modest improvement is because we're introducing flagship stalls this year. As a reminder, we're deploying about 400 flagship stalls over the next few years through our GM relationship. They come with a higher price. They obviously come with a significantly higher offset to make it an economically attractive deal for us. But in other words, absent that or normalizing for that, we're continuing to see incremental improvements in gross CapEx per stall before our next generation of charging equipment, which will take us to a 30% improvement.

它之所以只是一個平均值，是一個適度改善，唯一的原因是我們今年推出了旗艦攤位。提醒一下，未來幾年我們將透過與總經理的關係部署大約 400 個旗艦攤位。它們的價格較高。它們顯然會為我們帶來更高的補償，從而對我們來說這是一筆具有經濟吸引力的交易。但換句話說，如果沒有這種情況或這種情況正常化，在下一代充電設備問世之前，我們將繼續看到每個攤位的總資本支出逐步改善，這將使我們實現 30% 的改善。

Got it. And then, just wanted to follow-up here on the pilot side with the NACS connector. I know you said it was early, but could you speak to what maybe some of the early observations have been here in terms of charging behavior and maybe mix of vehicles?

知道了。然後，只想透過 NACS 連接器在飛行員方面進行跟進。我知道您說現在還為時過早，但您能否談談在充電行為和車輛組合方面的一些早期觀察結果？

Well, it's really too early. We've got more Tesla vehicles charging, clearly, and so we're excited by that. We've done very little marketing or no marketing, frankly, on those Tesla sites. And so until we've done that, it's hard for us to be able to say, okay, now this is something that's -- that you can take -- that we can take as a data point to inform our deployment over the course of the rest of this year. We're thrilled that we --

嗯，確實太早了。顯然，我們有更多的特斯拉汽車可以充電，因此我們對此感到非常興奮。坦白說，我們在特斯拉網站上做的行銷很少，或者根本沒有做過行銷。因此，在我們做到這一點之前，我們很難說，好吧，現在這個是——你可以拿來——我們可以把它作為數據點，為我們在今年剩餘時間的部署提供資訊。我們很高興--

All right. Appreciate the time.

好的。珍惜時間。

Yeah. Go ahead.

是的。前進。

Chris Pierce, Needham.

克里斯·皮爾斯，尼德姆。

Hey. Not to belabor the Tesla NACS point, but is that something you plan to accelerate this year, given prior expectations, given sort of public sentiment towards leadership there or, again, too early to kind of make any statements?

嘿。我不想過多地討論特斯拉 NACS 的觀點，但考慮到先前的預期，考慮到公眾對特斯拉領導層的看法，你是否計劃今年加速推進這項計劃，或者，現在發表任何聲明還為時過早？

Chris, I think you -- so in terms of the deployment of NACS connectors, yes, as a company, we charge all electric vehicles. That's been our policy and our philosophy and our strategy. In our charging lab out in California, we are bringing in and testing all electric vehicles, including Tesla vehicles. We're excited about the standardization of cables. I think it actually simplifies the customer experience.

克里斯，我認為你 — — 就 NACS 連接器的部署而言，是的，作為一家公司，我們為所有電動車充電。這就是我們的政策、理念和策略。在我們位於加州的充電實驗室中，我們引入並測試所有電動車，包括特斯拉汽車。我們對電纜的標準化感到非常興奮。我認為它實際上簡化了客戶體驗。

And so we're excited about deploying NACS cables. I've been talking about it all year last year where we've got the first site now with the NACS cable as a pilot. We expect to be able to deploy those NACS cables throughout our network either through retrofit -- I think starting probably with retrofit and then into new stalls probably late this year or next year. And as I said, it allows us to grow throughput without any increase in VIO. It's another one of the reasons why this business model and our company in particular is so resilient.

因此我們對部署 NACS 電纜感到非常興奮。我去年一整年都在談論這個問題，現在我們已經有了第一個以 NACS 電纜為試點的站點。我們希望能夠透過改造在我們的網路中部署這些 NACS 電纜——我認為可能從改造開始，然後在今年年底或明年部署到新的電纜攤位。正如我所說的，它允許我們在不增加 VIO 的情況下提高吞吐量。這也是為什麼這個商業模式以及我們的公司如此具有彈性的原因之一。

Okay. And then, you sort of hit on a direction of the business regardless of what happens on EV adoption or competition on the charging side of the world. So when you see someone like Ionna move from beta to national release and talking about putting a thousand fast-charging stalls out there this year, what are your kind of -- like, at a high level, how do you think about that and how do you think about it kind of -- I just kind of want to get your thoughts on that from a competition perspective?

好的。然後，無論電動車的採用情況或全球充電領域的競爭如何，你都可以找到業務的方向。因此，當您看到像 Ionna 這樣的公司從測試階段走向全國發布階段，並談論今年要推出一千個快速充電樁時，您對此有什麼看法——比如，從高層次上講，您如何看待這個問題？您對此有什麼看法？我只是想從競爭的角度聽聽您的看法？

Yes. I mean, this is -- I mean, I think we've been saying for a while, this is not a zero-sum game business, unlike many other sectors of the economy. As charging companies deploy charging infrastructure, demand increases. We know that. One of the reasons -- there's two reasons why customers are still on the fence on whether to switch over to electric vehicles. One is the upfront price despite TCO being lower. And the second is charging infrastructure. We know people are worried about range anxiety. And so as people are deploying charging infrastructure, it just stimulates demand, which is good for us.

是的。我的意思是，這是——我的意思是，我想我們已經說過一段時間了，這不是一個零和遊戲，與經濟的許多其他部門不同。隨著充電公司部署充電基礎設施，需求也隨之增加。我們知道這一點。原因之一——客戶對於是否要改用電動車仍猶豫不決的原因有兩個。一是儘管 TCO 較低，但前期價格較高。第二是充電基礎設施。我們知道人們擔心里程焦慮。因此，當人們部署充電基礎設施時，它就會刺激需求，這對我們有利。

With respect to Ionna, you're right. It's been almost a couple of years since Ionna was announced, and I'm glad to see that they've got a handful of sites now finally operational. We obviously look at those sites, and our perspective -- we've got, as you know, very sophisticated network plan and site selection algorithms. It doesn't appear to us that those sites are sites that that we would look at in terms of maximizing utilization. But, again, many of these charging companies have goals other than utilization. Once, chasing NEVI awards, for instance, are clearly not focused on utilization because there's not a lot of growth of utilization on highways. And Ionna may indeed have other goals beyond utilization for the network. Either way, for us, increasing charging supply results increase in demand. And because we've got well located sites, we think we're getting a disproportionate share of kilowatt hours.

關於 Ionna，你是對的。自從 Ionna 發布以來已經過去了近兩年的時間，我很高興地看到他們現在已經有幾個網站開始運營了。我們顯然會關注這些網站以及我們的觀點——如你所知，我們有非常複雜的網路規劃和網站選擇演算法。在我們看來，這些站點並不是我們會從最大限度提高利用率的角度考慮的站點。但是，許多充電公司除了利用率之外還有其他目標。例如，曾經追逐 NEVI 獎顯然沒有關注利用率，因為高速公路的利用率並沒有太大的增長。而 Ionna 可能確實除了利用網路之外還有其他目標。無論如何，對我們來說，增加充電供應就會導致需求增加。而且由於我們的站點位置優越，我們認為我們獲得的千瓦時份額是不成比例的。

Okay. Thanks for the detail, and good luck.

好的。謝謝你的詳細說明，祝你好運。

And that will conclude our question-and-answer session. And I'll now turn the call back over to Badar Khan for closing remarks.

我們的問答環節到此結束。現在我將電話轉回給巴達爾·汗，請他作最後發言。

Great. Well, thank you, everyone. We had yet another record quarter, finishing off a record year. The charging infrastructure we're building is a key ingredient to the long-term competitiveness and sustainability of the US automotive industry, and that's one of the reasons why what we do is so important. Unlike others in the charging space, we have a resilient business model that is set to deliver another year of strong growth and reaching EBITDA breakeven. And I look forward to providing updates on our progress on this and our priorities at our earnings calls throughout the year. Thanks very much, everybody.

偉大的。好吧，謝謝大家。我們又度過了一個創紀錄的季度，結束了創紀錄的一年。我們正在建造的充電基礎設施是美國汽車產業長期競爭力和永續性的關鍵因素，這也是我們所做的事情如此重要的原因之一。與充電領域的其他公司不同，我們擁有彈性的商業模式，預計將實現另一年的強勁成長並達到 EBITDA 收支平衡。我期待在全年的收益電話會議上提供有關我們在這方面的進展和優先事項的最新資訊。非常感謝大家。

That will conclude today's call. Thank you all for joining. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝大家的加入。您現在可以斷開連線。