Energy Transfer LP (ET) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, and welcome to the Energy Transfer second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please note, this event is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to Tom Long. Please go ahead.

下午好，歡迎參加 Energy Transfer 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，此事件正在被記錄。現在我想把會議交給湯姆朗。請發言。

Thank you, operator. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to the Energy Transfer Second Quarter 2025 Earnings Call. I'm also joined today by Mackie McCrea and other members of the senior management team who are here to help answer your questions after our prepared remarks.

謝謝您，接線生。大家下午好，歡迎參加能源轉移 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。今天，麥基·麥克雷 (Mackie McCrea) 和其他高級管理團隊成員也與我們一起出席，他們將在我們準備好的發言後幫助回答大家的問題。

Hopefully, you saw the press release we issued earlier this afternoon. As a reminder, our earnings release contains a thorough MD&A that goes through the segment results in detail, and we encourage everyone to take a look at the release, as well as the slides posted to our website to gain a full understanding of the quarter and our growth opportunities.

希望您看到了我們今天下午早些時候發布的新聞稿。提醒一下，我們的收益報告包含詳盡的 MD&A，詳細介紹了各部門的業績，我們鼓勵每個人都查看該報告以及發佈到我們網站上的幻燈片，以全面了解本季度和我們的成長機會。

As a reminder, we will be making forward-looking statements within the meaning of Section 21E of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934. These statements are based upon our current beliefs, as well as certain assumptions and information currently available to us and are discussed in more detail in our Form 10-Q for the quarter ended June 30, 2025, which we expect to file tomorrow, Thursday, August 7. I'll also refer to adjusted EBITDA and distributable cash flow, or DCF, both of which are non-GAAP financial measures. You'll find a reconciliation of our non-GAAP measures on our website.

提醒一下，我們將根據 1934 年證券交易法第 21E 條的規定做出前瞻性陳述。這些聲明基於我們當前的信念以及我們目前掌握的某些假設和信息，並在我們預計於明天，即 8 月 7 日星期四提交的截至 2025 年 6 月 30 日的季度 10-Q 表中進行了更詳細的討論。我也會參考調整後的 EBITDA 和可分配現金流（DCF），這兩者都是非 GAAP 財務指標。您可以在我們的網站上找到我們的非公認會計準則衡量指標的對帳表。

So let's start today by going over our financial results. For the second quarter of 2025, we generated adjusted EBITDA of $3.9 billion compared to $3.8 billion for the second quarter of 2024. We saw several volume records during the quarter, including the midstream gathering, crude transportation, NGL transportation, NGL and refined products terminal and NGL export volumes. We also saw strong volumes through our NGL fractionators, natural gas inter- and intrastate pipelines.

今天我們先來回顧一下我們的財務結果。2025 年第二季度，我們的調整後 EBITDA 為 39 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 38 億美元。本季度，我們見證了多項產量記錄，包括中游集輸、原油運輸、NGL 運輸、NGL 和成品油終端以及 NGL 出口量。我們的 NGL 分餾塔、州際和州內天然氣管道的產量也非常可觀。

DCF attributable to the partners of Energy Transfer, as adjusted, was approximately $2 billion. And for the first six months of 2025, we spent approximately $2 billion in organic growth capital, primarily in the NGL and refined products, midstream and intrastate segments, excluding SUN and USA Compression CapEx.

經調整後，歸屬於 Energy Transfer 合作夥伴的 DCF 約為 20 億美元。2025 年前六個月，我們花了約 20 億美元的有機成長資本，主要用於 NGL 和精煉產品、中游和州內領域，不包括 SUN 和美國壓縮資本支出。

Now turning to our results by segment for the second quarter. And let's start with NGL and refined products. Adjusted EBITDA was $1 billion compared to $1.1 billion for the second quarter of 2024. We saw higher throughput across our Mariner East and Gulf Coast pipeline operations as well as through our fractionation facilities, which were offset by lower gains from the optimization of hedged NGL and refined product inventories, as well as lower blending margins compared to the second quarter of 2024.

現在來看看第二季各部門的業績。讓我們從 NGL 和精煉產品開始。調整後的 EBITDA 為 10 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 11 億美元。我們的水手東線和墨西哥灣沿岸管道運營以及分餾設施的吞吐量均有所提高，但與 2024 年第二季度相比，對沖 NGL 和精煉產品庫存優化帶來的收益降低以及混合利潤率下降抵消了這一增長。

For midstream, adjusted EBITDA was $768 million compared to $693 million for the second quarter of 2024. The increase was primarily due to higher legacy volumes in the Permian Basin, which were up 10% as a result of processing plant upgrades, and increased plant utilization as well as the addition of the WTG assets in July of 2024. These were partially offset by lower gathering volumes in the dry gas areas.

就中游而言，調整後的 EBITDA 為 7.68 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 6.93 億美元。成長的主要原因是二疊紀盆地的遺留產量增加，由於加工廠升級、工廠利用率提高以及 2024 年 7 月增加了 WTG 資產，產量增加了 10%。這些損失被乾氣區較低的聚集量部分抵消。

For our crude oil segment, adjusted EBITDA was $732 million compared to $801 million for the second quarter of 2024. During the quarter, we saw growth across several of our crude pipeline systems as well as contributions related to the recently formed Permian joint venture with SUN. These were offset by lower transportation revenues, primarily on the Bakken pipeline.

對於我們的原油部門，調整後的 EBITDA 為 7.32 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 8.01 億美元。在本季度，我們的多個原油管道系統均實現了成長，並且與 SUN 最近成立的 Permian 合資企業也做出了貢獻。但這些收入被較低的運輸收入（主要是巴肯輸油管的收入）所抵銷。

In our interstate natural gas segment, adjusted EBITDA was $470 million compared to $392 million for the second quarter of 2024. This was primarily due to higher contracted volumes on several of our interstate pipeline systems. And for our intrastate natural gas segment, adjusted EBITDA was $284 million compared to $328 million in the second quarter of last year. During the quarter, we saw increased volumes across our Texas intrastate pipeline system due to third-party volume growth. This was offset by reduced pipeline optimization as a result of shifts to more long-term third-party contracts and their price spreads compared to the second quarter of last year.

在我們的州際天然氣部門，調整後的 EBITDA 為 4.7 億美元，而 2024 年第二季為 3.92 億美元。這主要是因為我們的幾條州際管道系統的合約運輸量增加。對於我們的州內天然氣部門，調整後的 EBITDA 為 2.84 億美元，而去年第二季為 3.28 億美元。本季度，由於第三方運輸量的成長，我們看到德州內管道系統的運輸量增加。與去年第二季相比，由於轉向更多長期第三方合約及其價格差價，導致管道優化減少，從而抵消了這一影響。

Now turning to our organic growth capital guidance. We continue to expect to spend approximately $5 billion on organic growth capital projects in 2025, even with the addition of the newly announced growth projects. We expect to achieve mid-teen returns on a majority of our growth projects, with many also providing incremental downstream benefits. We expect the majority of the upcoming earnings growth to come from our Flexport, Permian processing, NGL transportation and Hugh Brinson Pipeline expansion projects, which are expected to ramp up in 2026 and 2027. And our newly announced projects, along with our significant backlog of opportunities, are expected to provide even greater visibility into additional volumes and earnings growth through the end of the decade.

現在轉向我們的有機成長資本指引。即使加上新宣布的成長項目，我們仍預計 2025 年將在有機成長資本項目上投入約 50 億美元。我們預計大多數成長項目將實現中等水準的回報，其中許多項目也將帶來增量下游效益。我們預計，即將到來的獲利成長大部分將來自我們的 Flexport、Permian 加工、NGL 運輸和 Hugh Brinson 管道擴建項目，這些項目預計將在 2026 年和 2027 年實現成長。我們新宣布的項目以及大量積壓的機會預計將為本世紀末的額外產量和獲利成長提供更大的可視性。

Taking a closer look at some of our recently approved and currently underway projects, we have some exciting updates on the natural gas side of our business, which are expected to support growing demand for gas-fired power plants, data centers and industrial and onshore manufacturing. First, we were very excited this morning to announce the Desert Southwest pipeline project. This strategic expansion of our Transwestern pipeline will enhance system reliability and provide new and existing natural gas demand markets in Southern New Mexico, Arizona and across the Southwest region with access to low-cost, reliable Permian Basin volumes.

仔細研究我們最近批准和正在進行的一些項目，我們在天然氣業務方面有一些令人興奮的更新，預計這些更新將支持對燃氣發電廠、數據中心以及工業和陸上製造業日益增長的需求。首先，我們今天早上非常高興地宣布沙漠西南管道項目。我們對 Transwestern 管道的策略性擴建將提高系統可靠性，並為新墨西哥州南部、亞利桑那州和整個西南地區的新舊天然氣需求市場提供低成本、可靠的二疊紀盆地天然氣。

This project includes construction of a new 516-mile 42-inch pipeline that will provide approximately 1.5 Bcf per day of transportation capacity from the heart of the Permian Basin to the Phoenix area in Arizona. We expect the project to cost approximately $5.3 billion, including $600 million of AFUDC, and expect the project to be in service no later than the fourth quarter of 2029.

該項目包括建造一條新的 516 英里長的 42 英寸管道，該管道將提供從二疊紀盆地中心到亞利桑那州鳳凰城地區每天約 15 億立方英尺的運輸能力。我們預計該項目耗資約 53 億美元，其中包括 AFUDC 的 6 億美元，並預計該項目將不遲於 2029 年第四季投入使用。

The project is backed by significant long-term commitments with investment-grade counterparties, and we expect to launch an open season later this quarter. Also, we expect the capacity to be completely sold out upon completion of the open season. Depending on the final results of the open season, the project could be efficiently expanded to accommodate additional demand.

該項目得到了投資級交易對手的長期重大承諾的支持，我們預計將於本季度晚些時候啟動開放期。此外，我們預計開放季結束後，容量將完全售罄。根據開放季節的最終結果，該專案可以有效擴展以滿足額外的需求。

Phase 1 of our Hugh Brinson Pipeline is expected to provide approximately 1.5 Bcf per day of natural gas takeaway from the Permian Basin upon being placed into service, which we expect to be no later than the fourth quarter of 2026. In addition, we recently reached a positive FID on Phase 2 of the pipeline project, which will include the addition of compression. This system will be bidirectional, with the ability to transport approximately 2.2 Bcf per day from west to east and approximately 1 Bcf per day from east to west.

我們的休·布林森管道第一期投入使用後，預計將每天從二疊紀盆地輸送約 15 億立方英尺的天然氣，我們預計最遲將於 2026 年第四季投入使用。此外，我們最近就管道專案第二階段達成了積極的最終投資決定，其中將包括增加壓縮功能。該系統將是雙向的，每天能夠從西向東輸送約 22 億立方英尺天然氣，從東向西輸送約 10 億立方英尺天然氣。

When this pipeline goes into service, we expect to have more than 2.2 Bcf per day contracted. The Hugh Brinson Pipeline will provide significant optionality by connecting shippers to our vast intrastate natural gas pipeline network and other downstream pipelines, as well as access to the majority of the gas utilities in Texas and to every major trading hub in Texas. We believe this project further establishes Energy Transfer as the premier option for customers seeking a flexible and reliable natural gas solution to support their power plant and data center growth plans.

當該管道投入使用時，我們預計每天的合約輸送量將超過22億立方英尺。休·布林森管道將為托運人提供重要的選擇性，將托運人與我們龐大的州內天然氣管道網路和其他下游管道連接起來，並連接德克薩斯州的大部分天然氣設施和德克薩斯州的每個主要貿易中心。我們相信，該專案進一步確立了 Energy Transfer 作為尋求靈活可靠的天然氣解決方案以支援其發電廠和資料中心成長計劃的客戶的首選地位。

And in July, we announced an open season on our Oasis pipeline, which offers an efficient option for shippers to sign up for future long-term natural gas transportation capacity out of the Permian Basin as it becomes available on the pipeline. This open season allows potential shippers the opportunity to ramp up their volumes over the next four years to better meet their projected volume growth curves. We also recently approved the construction of a new storage cavern at our Bethel natural gas storage facility. This project is expected to double our working gas storage capacity at the facility to over 12 Bcf, and we hope to place the new cavern in service by late 2028.

7 月份，我們宣布綠洲管道開放期，這為托運人提供了一種高效的選擇，讓他們可以在未來簽訂二疊紀盆地長期天然氣運輸協議，以便在管道具備天然氣運輸能力時，獲得從該盆地運出的天然氣。這個開放期為潛在的托運人提供了在未來四年內增加貨運量的機會，以更好地滿足其預計的貨運量成長曲線。我們最近也批准在伯特利天然氣儲存設施建造一個新的儲存洞穴。該計畫預計將使該設施的工作天然氣儲存容量翻一番，達到 120 億立方英尺以上，我們希望新的洞穴能夠在 2028 年底投入使用。

This expansion, which is expected to cost approximately $140 million, will increase our equity gas storage capabilities to serve growing demand in the heart of our extensive intrastate natural gas pipeline network. This will further strengthen the reliability of our systems as well as provide the opportunity to benefit from pricing volatility. We also recently approved an expansion on the SESH pipeline to serve growing power generation needs in the Southeastern region of the United States.

此次擴建預計耗資約 1.4 億美元，將提高我們的權益天然氣儲存能力，以滿足我們廣泛的州內天然氣管道網路核心日益增長的需求。這將進一步增強我們系統的可靠性，並提供從價格波動中獲益的機會。我們最近也批准擴建 SESH 管道，以滿足美國東南部地區日益增長的發電需求。

Looking at the Permian processing expansions. In the second quarter of 2025, Energy Transfer placed the 200 million cubic foot per day Lenorah 2 processing plant in the Midland Basin into service, and the plant is currently running at full capacity. We also recently placed the 200 million per day Badger processing plant into service, which utilized a previously idle plant that was relocated to the Delaware Basin. Volumes are ramping up nicely, and we expect to be at full capacity in the next few months.

看看二疊紀加工擴張。2025 年第二季度，Energy Transfer 位於米德蘭盆地的日產量為 2 億立方英尺的 Lenorah 2 加工廠投入使用，目前該工廠正滿載運轉。我們最近也投入了日產 2 億隻 Badger 加工廠，該加工廠利用了先前搬遷至特拉華盆地的閒置工廠。產量正在穩步增長，我們預計未來幾個月將達到滿載狀態。

Over the last year, we have added approximately 800 million cubic feet per day of processing capacity, including 200 million cubic feet per day of optimizations that we completed at several of our other Permian processing facilities. As a result, our process volumes in the Permian Basin recently reached a new record of nearly 5 Bcf per day, and our Y-grade transportation throughput from the Permian also recently reached a new record.

在過去的一年裡，我們增加了大約 8 億立方英尺/天的處理能力，其中包括我們在其他幾個 Permian 處理設施完成的 2 億立方英尺/天的優化。因此，我們在二疊紀盆地的加工量最近創下了每天近50億立方英尺的新紀錄，我們在二疊紀的Y級運輸吞吐量最近也創下了新紀錄。

In addition, we continue to expect our Mustang Draw plant to be in service in the second quarter of 2026. At our Nederland terminal, we recently placed our Flexport NGL Export Expansion Project into ethane and propane service. And we continue to expect to provide ethylene export services in the fourth quarter of this year. The project will ramp up throughout the remainder of 2025, adding up to 250,000 barrels per day of total NGL export capacity at our Nederland terminal. This project is fully contracted beginning in January 2026, with capacity initially split 50-50 between the ethane and ethylene and propane.

此外，我們預計我們的 Mustang Draw 工廠將於 2026 年第二季投入使用。在我們的荷蘭碼頭，我們最近將 Flexport NGL 出口擴建工程投入乙烷和丙烷服務。我們預計今年第四季將繼續提供乙烯出口服務。該項目將在 2025 年剩餘時間內逐步擴大規模，使我們的荷蘭終端的 NGL 總出口能力達到每天 25 萬桶。該計畫於2026年1月開始全面簽約，初期乙烷、乙烯和丙烷產能各佔50%。

We also recently approved the looping of an NGL pipeline upstream of our Lone Star Express Pipeline, which will expand our access to NGLs from the Northern Delaware Basin, where we see significant growth from our customers. Looping this pipe is expected to allow us to source an incremental 150,000 barrels per day of NGLs for transportation on our NGL pipeline system from this high-growth region. The project will cost approximately $60 million and is expected to be in service in the first half of 2027.

我們最近也批准在 Lone Star Express 管道上游鋪設一條 NGL 管道，這將擴大我們從北特拉華盆地獲取 NGL 的渠道，我們的客戶在該盆地的數量顯著增長。預計該管道繞行後，我們每天可從這個高成長地區額外採購 150,000 桶 NGL，並透過我們的 NGL 管道系統進行運輸。該項目耗資約6,000萬美元，預計於2027年上半年投入使用。

Now turning to Lake Charles LNG. We continue to make substantial progress towards commercialization of this project. During the second quarter, Lake Charles LNG signed an HOA with MidOcean Energy which provides a nonbinding framework for the joint development of the LNG project, with MidOcean entitled to receive 30% of the LNG production, approximately 5 million tons per annum. In addition, Lake Charles signed 20-year SPAs with Kyushu Electric Power Company and Chevron USA.

現在轉向查爾斯湖液化天然氣 (Lake Charles LNG)。我們繼續朝著該專案的商業化方向取得實質進展。第二季度，Lake Charles LNG 與 MidOcean Energy 簽署了一份 HOA，為 LNG 專案的共同開發提供了非約束性框架，MidOcean 有權獲得 30% 的 LNG 產量，約每年 500 萬噸。此外，萊克查爾斯還與九州電力公司和雪佛龍美國公司簽署了為期20年的SPA。

On the marketing side, we are in advanced discussions with multiple parties for our remaining capacity and are getting close to our target of 15 million metric tons per annum. Some of our potential offtake customers are also interested in equity in the project, which if concluded, would reduce our external financing requirements. As we have previously stated, we expect to sell equity in the project to reduce Energy Transfer's ownership to approximately 25%. Over the last several months, we have been working with our financial advisers to finalize marketing materials as we prepare for the launch of the equity sell-down process.

在行銷方面，我們正在與多方就剩餘產能進行深入討論，並且正在接近每年1500萬公噸的目標。我們的一些潛在承購客戶也對該專案的股權感興趣，如果達成協議，將減少我們的外部融資需求。正如我們之前所說，我們預計出售該專案的股權，以將 Energy Transfer 的所有權減少至約 25%。在過去的幾個月裡，我們一直在與我們的財務顧問合作，最終確定行銷資料，為啟動股權出售流程做準備。

Now for a brief update around our new natural gas opportunities for new power plant and data center development. We continue to see a significant level of activity from demand pull customers to supply, store and transport natural gas for gas-fired power plants, data centers and industrial and onshore manufacturing. And we remain in advanced discussions with several facilities in close proximity to our footprint. We would expect these types of projects to generate revenue relatively quickly. Our team continues to do an excellent job of identifying the most likely opportunities, and we will continue to provide updates as we move forward.

現在我們來簡單介紹一下新發電廠和資料中心開發中新的天然氣機會。我們繼續看到需求拉動客戶為燃氣發電廠、資料中心以及工業和陸上製造業供應、儲存和運輸天然氣的大量活動。我們仍在與我們附近的幾家工廠進行深入討論。我們預計這些類型的項目能夠相對快速地產生收入。我們的團隊繼續出色地尋找最有可能的機會，並且我們將在前進的過程中繼續提供更新資訊。

Lastly, construction of a 10-megawatt natural gas-fired electric generation facility continues. The second facility, which is serving our Badger processing plant, was recently commissioned, and we expect two more facilities to be placed into service by the end of the year, with the remainder expected to be in service in 2026.

最後，一座10兆瓦天然氣發電廠的建設仍在持續。為我們的 Badger 加工廠提供服務的第二家工廠最近已投入使用，我們預計今年年底前還將有兩家工廠投入使用，其餘工廠預計將於 2026 年投入使用。

Now turning to our guidance. We now expect to be at or slightly below the lower end of our guidance range of $16.1 billion and $16.5 billion. This is a result of weakness in the Bakken, slower recovery in the dry gas areas than we expected and a lack of normal volatility in our gas optimization business from spreads and storage margins. In addition, we expected stronger growth in our Permian crude business than we have seen year-to-date.

現在轉向我們的指導。我們現在預計該數字將達到或略低於我們指導範圍的下限 161 億美元至 165 億美元。這是由於巴肯地區的疲軟、乾氣地區的復甦速度低於我們的預期以及我們的天然氣優化業務因價差和儲存利潤而缺乏正常的波動。此外，我們預計二疊紀原油業務的成長將比今年迄今的水平更強勁。

In summary, given the substantial growth in demand for energy resources over the next several years driven by natural gas and natural gas liquids, we believe that Energy Transfer is the best positioned company in the industry to help meet this demand. We own one of the largest natural gas pipeline networks in the United States with physical assets in every major US producing basin. We have more than 105,000 miles of natural gas pipelines that is coupled with significant gas storage, and we move approximately 30% of the US natural gas production.

總之，鑑於未來幾年天然氣和天然氣液體推動的能源資源需求大幅成長，我們相信 Energy Transfer 是業界最有能力滿足這項需求的公司。我們擁有美國最大的天然氣管道網路之一，在美國每個主要生產盆地都擁有實體資產。我們擁有超過 105,000 英里的天然氣管道，並配備大量的天然氣儲存設施，我們運輸著美國約 30% 的天然氣產量。

We are connected to nearly 200 gas-fired power plants in the country and have the ability to leverage strong relationships to develop new projects backed by higher quality counterparties on both the supply and demand side.

我們與全國近 200 家燃氣發電廠建立了聯繫，並有能力利用強大的關係來開發由供需雙方更高品質的交易對手支持的新項目。

We offer significant optionality, including bidirectional pipeline flow capabilities and strategically located storage assets, helping secure stable, uninterrupted supply. In addition, our operations team has extensive experience managing pipelines and a long-term proven track record of delivering reliable energy for our customers even during extreme weather events.

我們提供重要的可選性，包括雙向管道流動能力和戰略位置的儲存資產，有助於確保穩定、不間斷的供應。此外，我們的營運團隊在管理管道方面擁有豐富的經驗，並且擁有長期為客戶提供可靠能源的良好記錄，即使在極端天氣事件中也是如此。

Building on our natural gas thing, our Hugh Brinson and Desert Southwest pipeline projects and our Bethel storage expansion project further establish our natural gas pipeline business as the leading option for customers seeking dependable natural gas supply. In addition to numerous opportunities in natural gas, we have one of the largest NGL businesses in the United States with more than 1.4 million barrels per day of NGL export capacity, and we are continuing to expand this business to meet the international demand. We also continue to evaluate projects to expand our crude oil pipeline network.

在我們的天然氣業務的基礎上，我們的休·布林森和沙漠西南管道項目以及伯特利儲存擴建項目進一步確立了我們的天然氣管道業務作為尋求可靠天然氣供應的客戶的首選。除了天然氣領域的眾多機會外，我們還擁有美國最大的 NGL 業務之一，NGL 出口能力超過每天 140 萬桶，我們正在繼續擴大這項業務以滿足國際需求。我們也繼續評估擴大原油管道網路的項目。

Our backlog of well contracted growth projects is expected to generate strong returns, enhance our integrated value chain and promote strong growth well into the future. We have a strong track record of organic growth, which has been enhanced by our long history of successful acquisitions. Each of these acquisitions have added strategic benefits and critical mass, providing the incremental opportunities for continued growth of our nationwide network.

我們簽約的大量成長項目預計將產生豐厚的回報，增強我們的綜合價值鏈，並促進未來的強勁成長。我們擁有良好的有機成長記錄，而我們長期以來的成功收購進一步鞏固了這一記錄。每次收購都增加了策略利益和臨界規模，為我們全國網路的持續成長提供了增量機會。

This concludes our prepared remarks. Operator, please open the line up for our first question.

我們的準備好的演講到此結束。接線員，請接通我們的第一個問題。

(Operator Instructions) Theresa Chen, Barclays.

（操作員指示）巴克萊銀行的 Theresa Chen。

Good afternoon. On the gas to power front related to data centers, following up on your comments about being in advanced discussions with demand-pull customers. Can you provide more detail on the commercialization efforts to date? What are the gating factors at this point? What is your updated view on the size and scale of the set of opportunities and when can we expect to see more discrete announcements on this front?

午安.在與資料中心相關的天然氣發電方面，我們跟進了您關於與需求拉動型客戶進行深入討論的評論。您能否提供迄今為止商業化努力的更多細節？此時的限制因素是什麼？您對這一系列機會的規模和範圍有何最新看法？我們何時可以期待看到這方面的更多獨立公告？

Theresa, this is Mackie. Let me make -- usually, I'll make a statement at the end. I will make a quick statement, and then I'll answer your question, and it kind of rolls into that answer anyway. Since Kelcy started this over 25 years ago, our partnership, we started with a 10-inch pipeline that was idle, run to about 8 counties in East Texas, and we've grown to just a massive company through acquisitions and also through enormous organic projects throughout the US.

特蕾莎，這是麥基。讓我說一下——通常，我會在最後發表聲明。我會做一個簡短的聲明，然後回答你的問題，無論如何，它都會變成那個答案。自從 25 年前 Kelcy 開始合作以來，我們從一條閒置的 10 英寸管道開始，這條管道通往德克薩斯州東部的大約 8 個縣，透過收購以及在美國各地開展的大型有機項目，我們已經發展成為一家大型公司。

And as I sit here today, we look at the folks that are running our business, both in office and especially out in the field and we look at the adversity that we have unparalleled to any of our competitors by far, even with this challenged quarter that we had that we're certainly going to talk about, I've never been -- I'm sure [body in here] joins me is excited about where we sit and where the future is for our industry, but even more importantly, for this call for our partnerships. So we're very excited about that, and a lot of that drive comes to your question.

今天，當我坐在這裡時，我們看著經營我們業務的人們，無論是在辦公室還是在外地，我們看到我們面臨的逆境是迄今為止任何競爭對手都無法比擬的，即使我們經歷了這個充滿挑戰的季度，我們肯定會談論這個，我從來沒有——我相信[這裡的身體]和我一樣對我們的現狀和我們行業的未來感到興奮，但更重要的呼籲，對我們的現狀所以我們對此感到非常興奮，而這種動力很大程度上來自於你的問題。

I've kind of been taking a ribbon for the last three months from these -- our guys saying don't say four to six weeks on something. So I'm going to be a little careful there. But I will say this. These data centers have come out of nowhere. It's a huge and enormously upside for companies like us that have big inch pipes all over the US in very well-located areas for these types of projects, but they're different.

過去三個月來，我一直在為此努力 — — 我們的伙伴們說，不要在某件事上花費四到六週的時間。所以我會小心一點。但我會這麼說。這些資料中心是突然出現的。對於我們這樣的公司來說，在全美各地地理位置優越的地區擁有大口徑管道，這對於此類項目來說是一個巨大的優勢，但它們是不同的。

And they're different in a couple of ways. One, these aren't a plant that cost $1 billion or $0.5 billion. These are $50 billion, $60 billion, $100 billion-type facilities that we're building to. So these things don't just happen overnight. It takes time. And even the announcement on the Desert Southwest, it took 3.5 years to develop that. So it has taken time. I, we are going to be more careful about what we say, but let's say this. I can't say this.

它們在某些方面有所不同。首先，這些工廠的成本並不是 10 億或 5 億美元。我們正在建造價值 500 億美元、600 億美元、1000 億美元的設施。所以這些事情不是一夕之間發生的。這需要時間。甚至關於沙漠西南部的公告也花了 3.5 年的時間來製定。所以需要時間。我，我們會更注意自己的言行，但我們還是這麼說吧。我不能這麼說。

Several months ago, we did sign our first kind of significant deal with a hyperscaler, a behind-the-meter hyperscaler here in Texas. It was 80,000 a day. We have recently, as of now, today increased that to 380,000 a day with the flex right to go to 475, maybe more upside from that from this one area in Texas. But it's just one of -- we've signed three deals now in Texas. We're very close to two more.

幾個月前，我們確實與一家超大規模電力公司簽署了第一份重要協議，這家公司是德州的用戶側超大規模電力公司。每天有8萬人。截至目前，我們今天已將日均客流量增加至 38 萬人，並可靈活增至 475 人，德州這一地區的客流量或許還會更大。但這只是其中之一——我們目前已在德克薩斯州簽署了三項協議。我們很快就能再拿到兩個了。

We've signed very close to signing one pretty significant one outside. But I'm not saying that's two, three, four, five, six weeks, however long it takes. Every data center has different needs, different requirements, different supply sources, et cetera, et cetera. So it does take a while to put these together. This one came together fairly quickly in light of how excited we are about it. We're also excited about a lot of these others we're chasing.

我們已經非常接近簽署一份非常重要的外部協議。但我並不是說需要兩週、三週、四周、五週、六週，無論需要多長時間。每個資料中心都有不同的需求、不同的要求、不同的供應源等等。因此，將它們組合在一起確實需要一段時間。由於我們對此感到非常興奮，所以這個計劃很快就完成了。我們也對我們正在追逐的許多其他事物感到興奮。

So without making promises on new data center and/or a new power plant supporting data centers, any kind of predictions on weeks, just stay tuned. We're pretty excited about what we anticipate announcing over these coming quarters.

因此，我們不會對新資料中心和/或支援資料中心的新發電廠做出承諾，也不對未來幾週做出任何預測，請繼續關注。我們對未來幾季即將發布的消息感到非常興奮。

And turning to the transmission side of things. Congratulations on the FID of Desert Southwest. Can you provide color on the expected build multiple for this project? And at this point, how much of the 1.5 Bcf per day is committed? And pending the results of the open season, to what extent can it be expanded?

再轉向事物的傳輸方面。祝賀沙漠西南部的最終投資決定。您能否提供該專案預期建構倍數的詳細資訊？那麼目前，每天15億立方英尺的產量承諾量是多少？並且，根據開放季的結果，它可以擴大到什麼程度？

So gosh, we haven't announced something in a while that is exciting as this. Beth Hickey and her team did an incredible job. This is just keeping your head to the grindstone for the last 2.5-plus years, very excited. We kept hearing about other projects, kind of ignored that, paid attention to what we do, and we're very excited.

天哪，我們已經有一段時間沒有宣布過這麼令人興奮的事情了。Beth Hickey 和她的團隊做了出色的工作。這只不過是讓你在過去的兩年半多的時間裡埋頭苦幹，非常令人興奮。我們不斷聽到有關其他項目的消息，有點忽略了這一點，關注我們所做的事情，我們非常興奮。

Yes, we haven't fully sold that out. We have 0 concerns about selling out. In fact, to expand on a little bit, because of the incoming calls that we've had today, because of other conversations we've had over the last three or four weeks of folks that aren't in heavy negotiation with us yet, not only do we have zero worries about fully selling out the 1.5, we also kicked off an evaluation today to increase that to a 48-inch, which would more than double the 1.5 Bcf. Certainly not indicating that all on this call, but that's what we're going to do. But because of the enormous demand growth along this pipeline and in the Phoenix area, there's just some upside that's probably going to make sense, seriously looking at that.

是的，我們還沒有完全賣完。我們完全不擔心售罄。事實上，稍微詳細地說一下，由於我們今天接到的電話，由於我們在過去三四個星期與尚未與我們進行深入談判的人們進行的其他對話，我們不僅完全不擔心完全售出 15 億立方英尺，而且我們今天還啟動了一項評估，將其增加到 48 英寸，這將使 15 億立方英尺的容量增加一倍以上。當然，我們不會在這個電話中透露所有的事情，但這就是我們要做的。但由於這條管道沿線和鳳凰城地區的需求增長巨大，認真考慮一下，可能會有一些好處。

And if we do and get that going, we are confident that we'll sell that out. So yes, from the standpoint of returns, there's some upside that I kind of want to talk to about on this call, but like everything else this size, we're going to be in that mid-teens kind of worst case on the returns on this project.

如果我們這樣做並且順利進行，我們有信心將其銷售一空。所以是的，從回報的角度來看，有一些好處，我想在這次電話會議上談談，但就像其他這種規模的項目一樣，我們在這個項目上的回報將處於最糟糕的情況。

Jeremy Tonet, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的傑里米·托內特 (Jeremy Tonet)。

Good afternoon. I just wanted to pivot to Lake Charles, if I could. And maybe I missed it, but just wanted to see where we were with the EPC quote process and firming that up and I guess, marrying that against the SPAs and commercial agreements that you've established so far?

午安.如果可以的話，我只是想轉向查爾斯湖。也許我錯過了，但我只是想看看我們在 EPC 報價流程中處於什麼位置，並將其鞏固，我想，將其與您迄今為止建立的 SPA 和商業協議結合起來？

Yes, this is Mackie again. And Tom is here for any follow-up adders he wants to add. And then [Raj] is here too, who is working closely, has been with EPC contracts for a while. We've had our own expectations as we're waiting kind of for the numbers that have come in, and they're dead on to what we expected. We certainly are including tariff which seemed to change daily, but any kind of tariff impact on that.

是的，我又是 Mackie。湯姆會在這裡為他想要添加的任何後續添加者提供幫助。然後 [Raj] 也在這裡，他與我們密切合作，已經從事 EPC 合約一段時間了。我們有自己的預期，因為我們正在等待數據的結果，而這些數字完全符合我們的預期。我們當然包括似乎每天都在變化的關稅，但任何類型的關稅都會對此產生影響。

So we're very pleased of where the EPC contract looks like it's going to come out. It's right where we expect it to be, fits very well with what we've contracted and what we remain the contract. So we're -- as Tom said in the opening statements, we've been saying this for I don't know how many years.

因此，我們對 EPC 合約的推出感到非常高興。它完全符合我們的預期，與我們所簽訂的合約以及我們將繼續履行的合約非常吻合。所以，正如湯姆在開場白中所說，我們已經說了不知道多少年了。

We're very excited about this. We are pushing hard to get to the finish line, and we're going to do everything we can to make that happen, but we still got some work to do, but there's a lot of interest on this project, and we believe we'll get there over the next couple of months. And then as we said, kick off the financing and get it to FID as soon as we can.

我們對此感到非常興奮。我們正在努力衝刺，並將盡一切努力實現這一目標，但我們仍有一些工作要做，但很多人對這個專案感興趣，我們相信我們會在接下來的幾個月內實現這一目標。然後，正如我們所說的，啟動融資並儘快完成最終投資決定 (FID)。

Got it. And then pivoting back to Desert Southwest, congratulations there. I was just wondering if you could share your thoughts, how ET views construction cost risk sharing as well as dealing with tribal land?

知道了。然後回到沙漠西南部，恭喜你。我只是想知道您是否可以分享您的想法，ET 如何看待建築成本風險分擔以及處理部落土地？

Okay. This is Mackie again. As you can imagine, we've looked at that very closely over the last year, 1.5 years. If we have -- we expect to have 0 right of way across travel lands. And we don't foresee of what we've seen so far, any issues right of way.

好的。我又是 Mackie。你可以想像，在過去的一年半里，我們對此進行了非常密切的研究。如果我們有—我們預計在旅行用地上沒有通行權。並且，就目前的情況來看，我們還沒有預見任何通行權問題。

We're certainly going to be out in front of this, communicating, of course, with FERC, with the Department of Energy, Department of Interior, as well as we'll be heavily involved in discussions with the governors of both New Mexico and Arizona as well as Texas. And we'll be boots on the ground with our government relations team and those counties that we'll be going through in all these three states.

我們肯定會走在前面，當然，我們會與聯邦能源管理委員會、能源部、內政部進行溝通，同時，我們也會積極參與與新墨西哥州、亞利桑那州和德克薩斯州州長的討論。我們將與我們的政府關係團隊一起深入這三個州我們將要去的那些縣開展工作。

And so we're -- we've paid a lot of attention to that. We have put some contingency with some unknowns that we certainly don't know about today. But we -- I feel very good about where the costs are and very confident that we will meet or come in under the cost that we are estimating at this time.

因此我們非常關注這一點。我們已經為一些我們今天肯定不知道的未知因素做好了準備。但是我們——我對成本現狀感到非常滿意，並且非常有信心我們將達到或低於我們目前估計的成本。

Keith Stanley, Wolfe Research.

基斯‧史丹利（Keith Stanley），沃爾夫研究公司。

And sorry to beat the dead horse on Desert Southwest. But I guess starting big picture, what do you see as what your competitive advantage was in winning this project over your peer, especially since it kind of goes along the route of their existing pipeline? Just how did you win this out and basically get all the utilities to support your project?

很遺憾，我再次在沙漠西南部問題上浪費了時間。但我想從大局出發，您認為您在贏得這個項目時比同行有何競爭優勢，尤其是因為它沿著他們現有的管道路線進行？您究竟是如何贏得這場勝利並獲得所有公用事業來支持您的專案的？

Yes. Great question. I guess I go back to my opening statement. We just got some good people and we've got some good assets. And we did a great job of being patient, as I mentioned, and kind of rebuild a little bit.

是的。好問題。我想我應該回到我的開場白。我們只是擁有一些優秀的人才和一些優秀的資產。正如我所提到的那樣，我們非常有耐心，並且進行了一點重建。

We've heard off and on that several other projects were about to go and all that stuff. And we just ignored that. We don't worry about what other companies are doing. We worry about what we're trying to get to the finish line.

我們斷斷續續聽說有其他幾個項目即將啟動等等。而我們卻忽略了這一點。我們不擔心其他公司在做什麼。我們擔心的是，我們要達到什麼目標。

So with our team, their ability to negotiate and what we offer as far as supply sources. I mean, we're tying to some big intrastate pipelines as sources, we're tying to a lot of our large cryogenic facilities. So kind of tying all that together. As we've done over the years, we're pretty good at using synergistic upside to projects that we get to the finish line on. So a combination of all of that and just paying attention to the customers and responding to their needs and tough negotiations on all sides.

因此，憑藉我們的團隊、他們的談判能力以及我們在供應來源方面提供的服務。我的意思是，我們正在利用一些大型州內管道作為能源來源，我們正在利用許多大型低溫設施。所以把所有這些聯繫在一起。正如我們多年來所做的那樣，我們非常擅長利用協同優勢來完成我們完成的專案。因此，將所有這些結合起來，只需專注於客戶並回應他們的需求以及各方的艱難談判。

We got a fair deal across the board, I think. I think our customer, very pleased with where we're at and just kudos to Beth and her team and all the work on our engineering behind all that and all the other support from a lot of the folks are in this office.

我認為，我們得到了全面且公平的待遇。我認為我們的客戶對我們現在的狀況非常滿意，並且要對 Beth 和她的團隊以及我們背後的所有工程工作以及辦公室裡許多其他人的支持表示感謝。

Great. And then I wanted to clarify the two earlier questions. So first, if you're saying mid-teens returns on Desert Southwest, I mean, given it's a 4.5 year kind of permitting and build period. Is it fair to assume that's, call it, a 6x EBITDA multiple or better? And then I wanted to follow up on Jeremy's question. Is there any cost sharing mechanism if you do run into hiccups on this project? Or is it a traditional structure where the midstream company is the one that's in control of the costs and takes that risk?

偉大的。然後我想澄清一下之前的兩個問題。首先，如果你說沙漠西南地區的回報率是十幾歲，我的意思是，考慮到它的許可和建設期為 4.5 年。是否可以合理地假設這是 6 倍 EBITDA 倍數或更高？然後我想跟進傑里米的問題。如果這個專案確實遇到問題，是否有任何成本分攤機制？或者它是一種傳統的結構，由中游公司控製成本並承擔風險？

It's a traditional deal. That's just what we do. We know some of our competitors go out and do projects and low ball the rates, but say if the rates come on -- cost coming higher, it will go up. So no, this is how we built this partnership. We do a lot of work, a lot of studying, and we've got a lot of good folks doing our right-of-way estimations and our pipeline and compression costs.

這是一項傳統交易。這正是我們所做的。我們知道我們的一些競爭對手出去做項目並壓低價格，但如果價格上漲——成本上漲，價格就會上漲。所以，這就是我們建立這種夥伴關係的方式。我們做了很多工作，進行了很多研究，我們有很多優秀的人員來做我們的通行權估算以及管道和壓縮成本。

And we feel -- like I said earlier, we feel real good. We've got tariff cost in these. We've got contingency costs in these, we feel real good about it. And to your first half of your question, yes, 6x is a pretty good number to look at to consider.

我們感覺——就像我之前說的，我們感覺真的很好。這些都有關稅成本。我們已經為此準備了應急成本，我們對此感到非常滿意。對於您問題的前半部分，是的，6x 是一個值得考慮的相當不錯的數字。

Jean Ann Salisbury, Bank of America.

美國銀行的 Jean Ann Salisbury。

I wanted to go back to the comment about 2025 fundamentals being a little bit weaker than you guys had forecast in the Bakken, Permian crude and gas growth. Is that kind of year-to-date comments or more just what you're seeing in the back half?

我想回到關於 2025 年基本面比你們對巴肯、二疊紀原油和天然氣成長的預測要弱一些的評論。您在下半年看到的只是今年迄今為止的評論嗎？

Jean, this is Dylan. Good question. It's a little bit of both. I think that we -- through the beginning of the year, we're just seeing a little bit lower volume. Some of that was coming out of the fourth quarter.

吉恩，這是迪倫。好問題。兩者都有一點。我認為，從今年年初開始，我們的交易量就會稍微下降一些。其中一些是在第四季度出現的。

Our plan had some growth in those we just haven't seen materialize. To the extent that we plan, we are still think strong volumes in the majority of our areas, just not quite at the growth rate that we expected.

我們的計劃取得了一些進展，只是尚未實現。按照我們的計劃，我們仍然認為大多數地區的銷售會很強勁，只是沒有達到我們預期的成長率。

And so looking at the back half of the year, kind of a continuance. We see some growth coming, but we got a little bit of catch-up to get up to where we expected to be at this time of year. And so it's like I said, you got a little bit on both parts of the year.

因此，回顧下半年，這是一種延續。我們看到了一定程度的成長，但還需要一些努力才能達到我們預期的今年這個時候的水平。所以就像我說的，你在一年中的兩個部分都會有一點收穫。

Yes. And if you don't mind, let me add to this. We couldn't be more bullish about Bakken. No, that sounds odd because it certainly was kind of a black eye, it looks like for us in the second quarter, but there's a lot of things happening on the scene. I'll just touch on a few of them real quick.

是的。如果您不介意的話，請容許我補充一點。我們對巴肯非常看好。不，這聽起來很奇怪，因為這確實有點像是第二季的黑眼圈，但現場發生了很多事情。我將很快談及其中的幾個。

We had the TMX expansion project came on about a year ago. What that's done is we've taken crude oil to refineries and more importantly now to export to Asia. It pulled a lot of the Canadian barrels out. That opened up some capacity on some pipelines out of Canada that now could be filled into a certain degree. With 1 of our competitors taking Bakken out, that's going to go away in the next 1.5 years to 2 years. That window is going to close and the volume growth in Canada is going to fill that up, and so those volumes are coming back.

大約一年前，我們啟動了 TMX 擴建計畫。這樣做的目的是將原油運送到煉油廠，更重要的是現在將其出口到亞洲。它拉出了很多加拿大石油桶。這為加拿大一些管道開闢了一定的輸送能力，目前這些管道的輸送能力可以達到一定程度。隨著我們的一個競爭對手拿下巴肯，這種情況將在未來 1.5 年到 2 年內消失。這個窗口即將關閉，加拿大的銷售成長將會填補這個空缺，因此這些銷量將會回升。

Secondly, what happened quarter-to-quarter was we saw volumes come off. We had some cold weather up there in April and May that slowed down completions. There were some deferments of completions. There were even some curtailments, and we saw about 50,000 barrels a day less volume for the second quarter. In addition to that, there are also fires that had impact on barrels moving through both TMX projects, the original and the expansion.

其次，我們看到季度環比變化的情況是銷量下降。四月和五月那裡的天氣有些寒冷，減緩了工程的完工速度。一些工程的完工被延後。甚至還出現了一些減產，第二季的產量每天減少了約 5 萬桶。除此之外，火災也對 TMX 原項目和擴建項目中的桶運輸產生了影響。

And so what that caused was a lot of refineries both in Canada and in the Northwestern US really paid up to get oil to their refineries because they were short out of Canada. And so increased our business through our rail terminals but took some volumes off of our pipeline that's coming back.

結果是，加拿大和美國西北部的許多煉油廠不得不支付高額費用才能將石油運送到他們的煉油廠，因為加拿大的石油供應不足。因此，我們透過鐵路終端的業務增加了，但管道運輸量卻減少了，現在管道運輸量正在恢復。

So you kind of add all that up, there's 80,000, 90,000 100,000, 120,000 barrels that have been kind of going in different directions or weren't being produced that are going to come back in the system. And in addition to that -- and there's no questions about this yet, but I'm going to ahead and talk about it because I'm excited -- we're excited about it. Adam and his whole team is that we've got this open season going with [Enbridge]. And what Energy Transfer has done a good job on all these years is we look at our assets, we look at they're being utilized. As everybody knows, we converted a natural gas pipeline interstate into a crude line that now helps move Bakken to the Gulf Coast.

所以把所有這些加起來，就有 8 萬、9 萬、10 萬、12 萬桶石油流向了不同的方向或沒有被生產出來，但它們又會回到系統中。除此之外——目前還沒有關於此的問題，但我將繼續討論這個問題，因為我很興奮——我們對此感到很興奮。Adam 和他的整個團隊正在為這個開放賽季做準備[安橋]。這些年來，Energy Transfer 做得很好的一點就是，我們專注於我們的資產，並關注它們的利用情況。眾所周知，我們將一條州際天然氣管道改造成了一條原油管道，現在正幫助將巴肯原油輸送到墨西哥灣沿岸。

We converted an interstate pipeline out in West Texas and Mexico to an NGL, we converted another pipeline to diesel, and that's kind of what we do. But we also look at how do we keep our pipelines full today and more importantly, for the next 10 or 15 years? And what's going on in Canada is exciting to us. There's a lot more egress needs to get out. And what better way than to help Canadian producers get production out to a pipeline that already exists. No risk on building, not just on any kind of other issues.

我們將西德州和墨西哥的一條州際管道改造成了天然氣液體管道，將另一條管道改造成了柴油管道，這就是我們所做的事情。但我們也在考慮如何確保我們目前的管道暢通，更重要的是，在未來 10 年或 15 年內如何保持管道暢通？加拿大正在發生的事情令我們興奮不已。需要更多的出口才能出去。還有什麼比幫助加拿大生產商將產品輸送到現有的管道更好的方法呢？建築上沒有風險，其他問題上也沒有任何風險。

And so we're excited about that. We think it's a great opportunity to help Canadian producers. But more importantly, we're going to do everything we can to make sure the producers in North Dakota have an outlet on our pipeline. But in addition to that, we have the ability to increase by adding pumps, capacity or pipeline. And so it fits very well in working with Enbridge to help get more production out of the Canadian.

因此我們對此感到興奮。我們認為這是一個幫助加拿大生產商的絕佳機會。但更重要的是，我們將竭盡全力確保北達科他州的生產商在我們的管道上有一個出口。但除此之外，我們還可以透過添加幫浦、容量或管道來增加產量。因此，與 Enbridge 合作非常有助於提高加拿大的產量。

So once again, I'll start -- I'll end where I started. We're very excited about the future of the Dakota Access.

因此，再次，我將從我開始的地方開始——我將從我開始的地方結束。我們對達科他通道的未來感到非常興奮。

That's great. As a follow-up, as you know, there's a lot of NGL pipeline capacity coming on in the Permian this year and next. Can you kind of dimension, I guess, how much volume loss you think you could see on Lone Star and whether the North Delaware looping project you announced today would offset most of that, maybe all?

那太棒了。作為後續行動，如您所知，今年和明年二疊紀盆地將有大量 NGL 管道產能投入使用。我想，您能否估算一下，您認為孤星號輸電線路的輸電量會損失多少，以及您今天宣布的北特拉華環路項目是否能抵消大部分甚至全部輸電量損失？

Yes. Our night fracs coming on the end of next year. So that kind of plays a role in all of this. We've got to have a home for it. But yes, we're right on target.

是的。我們的夜間壓裂將於明年年底進行。所以這在這一切中發揮了一定的作用。我們必須給它一個家。但是是的，我們確實達到了目標。

As Tom mentioned in the opening statements, we're bringing these crypto up, Lenorah 2. We've got Badger up and ramping up quickly. We'll have Mustang Draw up first quarter, I think, of next year. We're doing everything we can to get the barrels out of Delaware. That's the $60 million expansion to get more down further stream.

正如湯姆在開場白中提到的那樣，我們正在提出這些加密貨幣，Lenorah 2。我們已經讓 Badger 啟動並快速提升。我認為，我們將在明年第一季推出 Mustang Draw。我們正在盡一切努力將這些桶子運出特拉華州。這是一項耗資 6000 萬美元的擴張計劃，旨在獲得更多的後續收益。

We've got more capacity on our existing Lone Star, as you just mentioned. And we feel real good about new contracts that we're signing, of course, the ones that relate to on [Crows], new contracts with other third-party processing plants and then deals that were -- that are coming up for termination. We're being very aggressive of growing those other -- over.

正如您剛才提到的，我們現有的 Lone Star 擁有更大的容量。我們對即將簽署的新合約感到非常滿意，當然，這些合約與 [Crows] 有關，與其他第三方加工廠簽訂的新合同，以及即將終止的交易。我們正在積極地發展其他業務。

So we're focused, we've got a whole team working on this. Like I said, on Dakota Access to keep these pipelines full, to build them to the capacity we need them and then through time to fill them up and then as time goes on, make decisions on further expansions. But we feel real good about where we're at and kind of the timing when barrels start showing up with the completion of some of these projects that we have going on, including the Delaware expansion.

所以我們非常專注，我們有一整個團隊致力於此。就像我說過的，在達科他通道上，要保持這些管道暢通，按照我們需要的容量進行建設，然後隨著時間的推移，將它們填滿，然後隨著時間的推移，再決定是否進一步擴建。但我們對自己目前所處的位置以及隨著我們正在進行的一些項目（包括特拉華州擴建項目）的完成而開始出現桶裝水的時機感到非常滿意。

Gabe Moreen, Mizuho.

加布·莫林，瑞穗。

I just wanted to ask on -- it seems like a long time ago at this point, the whole [Epstein] export saga. But a, whether that had any impact at all on your quarterly results, but b, bigger picture, as you're thinking about some of your expansions and other types of projects, whether it changes your plans in terms of markets you may be targeting either for ethane or ethylene exports and just how things would go in the future commercially for that?

我只是想問一下——整個[愛潑斯坦]出口事件似乎已經是很久以前的事了。但是，a，這是否對您的季度業績有任何影響，但是，b，從更大的角度來看，當您考慮一些擴張和其他類型的項目時，它是否會改變您在乙烷或乙烯出口目標市場方面的計劃，以及未來的商業發展情況如何？

Yes. The first half of your question, no impact. Fortunately, it didn't last long enough to have an impact. We weren't concerned about it. The only impact, I'd say, I would say that it had was when you have deals with companies, international companies, all these years, they've relied on you do business with the US honors.

是的。你的問題的前半部分，沒有影響。幸運的是，它持續時間不夠長，沒有造成影響。我們並不擔心這個。我想說，唯一的影響是，當你與公司、國際公司做交易時，這些年來，他們一直依賴你與美國公司做生意。

So that put a little bit of a black eye on us on our industry, on our country when we've got contracts and billions of dollars that were spent on crackers in this case in China with -- in our case, with a very good partner with satellite. It was -- it wasn't fun, but we worked our way through it. Fortunately, that has gone away.

因此，當我們與中國簽訂了合約並花費了數十億美元購買裂解設備時，這給我們的行業、我們的國家帶來了一些負面影響——在我們的情況下，中國在衛星方面擁有非常好的合作夥伴。這確實並不好玩，但我們還是努力克服了它。幸運的是，這種情況已經消失了。

We think it's going to be probably a little bit more difficult to contract with Chinese crackers, good or bad. We think that they're probably going to be a little bit more hesitant. So to your question, yes, as we've always done, we're looking at other countries, other companies in other countries, and we're beating the bushes and there's a lot of opportunities there, and we're certainly very optimistic and believe that we will have further expansions. We'll need further expansions both at Marcus Hook and at Nederland, and those will come, but this whole ethane issue that popped up here over the last several months certainly slowed things down with China.

我們認為，與中國餅乾生產商簽訂合約可能會變得更加困難，無論好壞。我們認為他們可能會更加猶豫。所以對於您的問題，是的，正如我們一直以來所做的那樣，我們正在關注其他國家、其他國家的公司，我們正在四處尋找，那裡有很多機會，我們當然非常樂觀，相信我們將進一步擴張。我們需要在 Marcus Hook 和 Nederland 進一步擴張，這些擴張將會實現，但過去幾個月出現的整個乙烷問題無疑減緩了與中國的業務往來。

And maybe if I can ask just hydraulically in terms of what's going on with the Hugh Brinson Pipeline in terms of the ability, I think, to make it bidirectional at this point. Are your customers just looking to wheel gas in terms of different points around? Or can you just maybe give us some more color in terms of what those hydraulics kind of do for the project and what sort of demand you're looking to meet there with that?

或許我可以問一下休·布林森輸油管在液壓方面的狀況，就目前而言，能否實現雙向輸送。您的客戶是否只是根據周圍的不同點來尋找燃氣渦輪機？或者您能否向我們詳細介紹一下這些液壓系統對專案的作用以及您希望透過它滿足哪些需求？

We've talked -- we've been pretty excited about Desert Southwest, but it's hard not to be as, if not more excited about Hugh Brinson. Couldn't have been better timing. We missed a lot of projects through the years, but we hit the rate of returns that we needed finally on this project when we got it to the end zone. It's got tremendous interest. We have 0 interest about selling it out, and we're looking at maybe the next stage.

我們已經談過了——我們對《沙漠西南》感到非常興奮，但很難不對休·布林森感到同樣甚至更興奮。時機再好不過了。這些年來我們錯過了很多項目，但當我們最終完成這個項目時，我們達到了所需的回報率。它引起了極大的興趣。我們對出售它毫無興趣，也許正在考慮下一階段。

But we also -- by adding the bidirectional capability, we are able to offer other supply sources for our Texas markets. And so it's really added a boost, especially revenue boost potential for that project to make it a lot better rate of return than what we initially expected.

但透過增加雙向功能，我們也能夠為德州市場提供其他供應來源。因此，它確實增加了推動力，特別是該專案的收入成長潛力，使其回報率遠高於我們最初的預期。

So as I mentioned earlier, we just -- if you look at all our assets out of the country, it's exciting, but gosh, especially in Texas. If you want to build a data center in Texas, who in the world would you want to do it better than Energy Transfer? When you look at all the 42-inch, 36-inch we have, all the storage support we have behind that and our ability and kind of path to being able to deliver at critical times. So we feel real good about that, and Hugh Brinson is going to be a great project for us for many years to come. And we're very fortunate it kicked off when we did.

正如我之前提到的，如果你看看我們在國外的所有資產，這是令人興奮的，但是天哪，特別是在德克薩斯州。如果你想在德州建立一個資料中心，你會希望有誰比 Energy Transfer 做得更好？當你看到我們擁有的所有 42 英寸、36 英寸產品、我們背後的所有存儲支援以及我們在關鍵時刻交付產品的能力和途徑時。所以我們對此感到非常高興，休布林森在未來的許多年裡都將是我們的一個偉大計畫。我們非常幸運，這個計畫在我們這個時間點啟動。

Manav Gupta, UBS.

瑞銀的 Manav Gupta。

Congrats on all the projects. I just wanted to quickly focus on slide 8. It says 50% of your growth capital will be on nat gas focused projects for 2025. I'm trying to figure out, given all these new projects which are being announced, what would that number be for '27, '28? I'm not looking for an exact number, but should we assume that number trends upwards from here?

祝賀所有項目。我只是想快速關注幻燈片 8。據稱，到 2025 年，50% 的成長資本將用於以天然氣為重點的項目。我想弄清楚，考慮到所有這些宣布的新項目，27、28 年這個數字會是多少？我並不是在尋找一個確切的數字，但是我們是否應該假設這個數字從現在開始呈現上升趨勢？

Yes. I think that's safe to assume that number turns up. Obviously, we got a lot of time between now and then and a lot of projects that the team is working on a lot of great projects. Then we will look forward to bringing rate announcement here over the next couple of years. But right now, as we look at -- yes, I think that number would trend higher once the books right now, particularly like that -- with the Desert Southwest project.

是的。我認為可以安全地假設這個數字會出現。顯然，從現在到那時我們有很多時間，團隊正在進行許多偉大的專案。然後，我們期待在未來幾年內在這裡公佈利率。但是現在，正如我們所看到的——是的，我認為一旦現在入賬，這個數字將會趨於上升，特別是像沙漠西南項目那樣。

Perfect. My quick follow-up here is a number of people are trying to develop this LNG. But you are somewhat unique because you have all these pipelines to feed your own LNG. So can you talk about the benefits of vertical integration of moving ahead with Lake Charles, given all the infrastructure that you have in place to feed your LNG facility?

完美的。我在這裡快速跟進的是，許多人正在嘗試開發這種液化天然氣。但你們在某種程度上是獨一無二的，因為你們擁有所有這些管道來輸送自己的液化天然氣。那麼，考慮到您已經擁有為液化天然氣設施供氣的所有基礎設施，您能否談談推進查爾斯湖垂直整合的好處？

Yes, this is Mackie again. Yes, as we've mentioned over the years, we're very excited about LNG. But what really drives us on LNG is pipeline transportation business that we're so good at and that what's kind of built our company. So as you mentioned, we've got multiple pipeline route into that area and into Lake Charles. We certainly will look at an expansion of a pipeline system to bring in more volumes once we get to FID.

是的，我又是 Mackie。是的，正如我們多年來提到的，我們對液化天然氣感到非常興奮。但真正推動我們發展液化天然氣的是我們非常擅長的管道運輸業務，這也是我們公司的基礎。正如您所說，我們有多條管道通往該地區和查爾斯湖。一旦我們做出最終決定，我們肯定會考慮擴大管道系統，以輸送更多的石油。

And we're very excited about that aspect of the project. I mean LNG is going to be a great project. It's going to be a good rate of return for us, but the real upside is our pipeline transportation business upstream of Lake Charles.

我們對該項目的這個方面感到非常興奮。我的意思是液化天然氣將會是一個偉大的計畫。這對我們來說將是一個很好的回報率，但真正的好處是我們的查爾斯湖上游的管道運輸業務。

Michael Blum, Wells Fargo.

麥可布魯姆，富國銀行。

Wanted to go back to Lake Charles and really just clarify your goal to get to 15 million metric tons to get to FID. Does that need to be all firm contracts? Or will you proceed with the combination of HOAs and SPAs?

想要回到查爾斯湖並真正明確你的目標，即達到 1500 萬公噸以達成 FID。這是否需要全部都是固定合約？或者您會繼續採用 HOA 和 SPA 的結合方式嗎？

And Tom may correct this or modify it, but what we plan on doing is once we have FDA and/or HOAs initially -- I'm sorry, HOA or SPAs, we will move forward on finance, kicking off financing once we have our target level of either one, a combination of both. So the HOAs are, for all practical purposes, end up being binding, even though they're not. But we -- with all the parties we're dealing with, once we sign the SPA, we're 99% positive. We'll get to an HOA -- once we sign an HOA -- but once we sign an HOA, we're very confident that we'll get to SPA in a fairly relatively short period of time.

湯姆可能會糾正或修改它，但我們計劃做的是，一旦我們最初有了 FDA 和/或 HOA - 對不起，是 HOA 或 SPA，我們將繼續進行融資，一旦我們達到其中一個或兩者的目標水平，就開始融資。因此，從實際目的來看，HOA 最終具有約束力，儘管事實並非如此。但是，對於與我們打交道的所有各方，一旦我們簽署了 SPA，我們就會 99% 充滿信心。一旦我們簽署了 HOA，我們就會達成 HOA，但一旦我們簽署了 HOA，我們非常有信心我們將在相對較短的時間內達成 SPA。

Okay. Great. That helps. And then I just wanted to ask about how we should think now about the cadence of growth CapEx beyond this year now that you've got Desert Southwest, Lake Charles is moving towards FID, it seems? And you've also announced here, another steady rate of additional projects. And it seems like there's a lot more behind this. So just wanted to get a sense for the cadence beyond this year.

好的。偉大的。這有幫助。然後我想問一下，既然現在已經有了沙漠西南部，那麼我們應該如何考慮今年以後資本支出的成長節奏，而查爾斯湖似乎正在走向 FID？而且你們還在這裡宣布了另一個穩定的附加項目。而這背後似乎還有更多的事情。所以只是想了解今年以後的節奏。

Michael, listen, this is Tom, and I know that Dylan was walking through that a little bit, one of the previous questions. But that is fair. With all these good projects we're having right now, we are seeing that grow. We'll probably be ready later this year to be able to give a little more guidance around that. We normally wait until the year-end earnings call to provide the guidance for 2026. But with all the moving pieces here right now, on a lot of very, very good projects that we're excited about.

邁克爾，聽著，我是湯姆，我知道迪倫已經稍微講過這個問題了，這是之前的問題。但這是公平的。透過我們現在擁有的所有這些優秀項目，我們看到了它的成長。我們可能會在今年稍後做好準備，以便能夠就此提供更多指導。我們通常會等到年底財報電話會議才提供 2026 年的指引。但隨著目前所有進展的進行，我們對許多非常非常好的專案感到興奮。

Just give us a little bit later, but you can appreciate though, those are going to be coming up. And that's not just the Desert Southwest, the Hugh Brinson, the storage all the projects we're talking about right now. And in Lake Charles, when Lake Charles gets going, that one, likewise, we'll be rolling that one in. So just give us a little more time with all the moving pieces. But you can see that definitely going up.

請稍等片刻，但您可以理解，這些即將出現。這不僅僅是沙漠西南部、休布林森、儲存以及我們現在談論的所有項目。在查爾斯湖，當查爾斯湖開始運作時，同樣，我們也會將其推出。所以請給我們多一點時間來處理所有活動部分。但你可以看到，這個數字肯定在上升。

Zach Van Everen, TPH.

範弗倫（Zach Van Everen），TPH。

Maybe going back to the AI power projects. Great to hear the hyperscaler contract that you spoke to. It seems like a lot of these projects are on or around existing assets. And I know you probably can't give an exact number, but is there a range of EBITDA contribution from these projects you could point to? If it's within a mile of the facility, is it a lower contribution? Just trying to get an idea of what these projects might look like.

也許會回到人工智慧電力專案。很高興聽到您談到的超大規模合約。看起來很多項目都是在現有資產或周圍進行的。我知道您可能無法給出確切的數字，但您能否指出這些項目對 EBITDA 的貢獻範圍？如果距離設施一英里以內，貢獻會更低嗎？只是想了解這些項目可能會是什麼樣子。

Yes, this is Mackie. It's probably a little early on to get to that kind of detail. And the reason being is, some of these we may have a mile or two away, some of them, we may have 25 miles away. For the most part, they're much closer to our systems, but we will have an added fee for that.

是的，這是麥基。現在討論這種細節可能還為時過早。原因是，有些地方我們可能距離它一兩英里，有些地方我們可能距離它 25 英里。在大多數情況下，它們與我們的系統更接近，但我們會收取額外的費用。

But I guess I would state that as we get more and more of these done, it will be a very impactful number from an EBITDA perspective and every single project will have -- some will have much higher EBITDA impact than others. But I don't think on this call, I can really quantify exactly what that is, but we are very bullish on where all the -- where that business is going to take us.

但我想說的是，隨著我們完成越來越多的項目，從 EBITDA 的角度來看，這將是一個非常有影響力的數字，而且每個項目都會有——有些項目對 EBITDA 的影響會比其他項目高得多。但我不認為在這次電話會議上我可以真正量化這到底是什麼，但我們非常看好這項業務將帶我們走向何方。

Sounds good. And maybe shifting back to the NGL looping project. Just curious if the 150 barrels is shifting off of another system? Or is this expected to be kind of incremental growth from producers in that area?

聽起來不錯。或許會轉回 NGL 循環專案。只是好奇這 150 桶是否是從另一個系統轉移過來的？或者這是否有望成為該地區生產商的一種增量增長？

It will be incremental growth. As Badger ramps up, we're running out of capacity where we've got more growth up in the Southern Delaware and New Mexico. So it's -- we expect growth, rolling over contracts that exist, new growth on our power process plants that are coming online as well as third-party processing plants that our NGL team is actively negotiating it.

這將是漸進式的成長。隨著 Badger 業務的成長，我們在南特拉華州和新墨西哥州的產能即將耗盡，而我們的成長速度更快。因此，我們預計現有合約將實現成長、即將上線的電力加工廠將實現新成長，我們的 NGL 團隊正在積極協商的第三方加工廠也將實現成長。

John Mackay, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的約翰·麥凱。

I think Manav asked this one way, but I might ask another. Just looking more broadly, now to a ton of gas projects now, do you have a sense of what percentage of the overall business gas could look like as we look forward a couple of years?

我認為 Manav 會用這種方式問這個問題，但我可能會用另一種方式問。從更廣泛的角度來看，現在有大量的天然氣項目，您是否知道在未來幾年內天然氣將佔整體業務的多少比例？

Yes, John, this is Mackie. When you say overall, you mean kind of like a Bcf?

是的，約翰，這是麥基。當您說總體時，您的意思是有點像 Bcf 嗎？

Sorry, I guess, percentage of total ET EBITDA.

抱歉，我想，這是總 ET EBITDA 的百分比。

I don't think at this point, we'd give an exact number on that. Like you said, there's a lot of projects in the works and a lot of good growth opportunities in all of our segments here. I'd say -- as you look right now and you look at the main segments there with the expansion of -- the two biggest expansion projects with the Hugh Brinson in intrastate and Desert Southwest in the interstate, obviously, the expectation is for those segments to grow as a percentage of the whole, probably the quickest of any of our segments as we look out.

我認為目前我們無法給出確切的數字。正如您所說，我們這裡的所有領域都有很多正在進行的項目和許多良好的成長機會。我想說的是——正如你現在所看到的，你看到那裡的主要路段正在擴建——兩個最大的擴建項目是州內的休·布林森 (Hugh Brinson) 和州際的沙漠西南 (Desert Southwest)，顯然，我們預計這些路段佔整體的百分比會有所增長，這可能是我們所看到的所有路段中增長最快的。

And maybe taking that just a little further. I mean, with a lot of these -- a couple of these projects being a little later dated, are you guys getting into a position where you might be able to talk about kind of a go-forward kind of EBITDA growth rate target from here or anything like that, maybe not necessarily guidance, but at least a framework or a general target?

或許還能更進一步。我的意思是，其中很多——其中幾個項目的日期有點晚，你們是否可以談論一下未來的 EBITDA 增長率目標或類似的東西，也許不一定是指導，但至少是一個框架或一個總體目標？

Yes, listen, this is Tom again. That's not been something that we probably bounced around here a lot as far as the discussion. Clearly, with all this happening, we always have a very, very robust forecasting process around here. So we're always in front of rating agencies with those, et cetera. We could consider that.

是的，聽著，我又是湯姆。就討論而言，這可能不是我們經常討論的話題。顯然，面對所有這些情況，我們始終擁有非常非常穩健的預測流程。因此，我們始終站在評級機構的前面，等等。我們可以考慮這一點。

But I think as we sit here right now, we've not necessarily discussed giving some type of a growth trajectory. Our skit's a little bit lumpy, especially when you blend it in with the M&A. So an acquisition comes along, you can probably appreciate the fact that sometimes that will all of a sudden make a jump. And then other times, we're talking about the projects we are right now, which all have varying years of build that come with them.

但我認為，就我們現在坐在這裡而言，我們不一定討論過某種成長軌跡。我們的短劇有點不連貫，特別是當你把它與併購融合在一起時。因此，當收購發生時，你可能會意識到，有時它會突然帶來飛躍。其他時候，我們談論的是我們現在正在進行的項目，這些項目的建設時間各不相同。

So anyway, Dylan, I don't know if you want to add a little bit more to that?

無論如何，迪倫，我不知道你是否想補充一點？

I'll just point back to one thing that we've said publicly before, which is we have our stated growth target for distributions of 3% to 5%. And the additional color we've given around that is that that 3% to 5% for us has to provide a baseline for where we believe is a floor to the long-term growth in distributable cash flow per unit. We're not manufacturing our plan is not to manufacture distribution growth by getting into coverage. So that number is meant to provide a floor for the long-term growth rate there at a bare minimum.

我只想指出我們之前公開說過的一件事，那就是我們設定的分配成長目標是 3% 到 5%。我們對此給出的額外解釋是，對我們來說，3% 到 5% 必須為我們認為的每單位可分配現金流的長期成長底線提供一個基準。我們的計劃不是透過進入覆蓋範圍來實現分銷成長。因此，這個數字至少可以為那裡的長期成長率提供一個底線。

This concludes the question-and-answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Tom Long for any closing remarks.

問答環節到此結束。我想將會議交還給湯姆·朗，請他作最後發言。

All right. Well, listen, we thank all of you for joining us, as always, and we look forward to the follow-up calls. I hope everyone has a good rest of your day.

好的。好吧，聽著，我們一如既往地感謝大家的加入我們，我們期待後續的電話會議。我希望大家今天過得愉快。

This concludes today's conference call. You may disconnect your lines. Thank you for participating, and have a pleasant day.

今天的電話會議到此結束。您可以斷開線路。感謝您的參與，祝您有個愉快的一天。