Mr Cooper Group Inc (COOP) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and thank you for standing by, and welcome to the Mr. Cooper Group's fourth-quarter 2023 earnings call. (Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded.

美好的一天，感謝您的支持，歡迎參加庫柏先生集團 2023 年第四季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄製中。

I would now like to hand the conference over to our first speaker today. Please go ahead.

我現在想把會議交給今天的第一位發言者。請繼續。

Good morning and welcome to Mr. Cooper Group's fourth-quarter earnings call. My name is Ken Posner, and I'm SVP of Strategic Planning and Investor Relations. With me today are Jay Bray, Chairman and CEO; Chris Marshall, Vice Chairman; Mike Weinbach, President; and Kurt Johnson, Executive Vice President and CFO.

早安，歡迎參加庫柏集團第四季財報電話會議。我叫肯‧波斯納 (Ken Posner)，是策略規劃與投資人關係資深副總裁。今天與我在一起的有董事長兼執行長傑伊·布雷 (Jay Bray)；克里斯馬歇爾，副主席；麥克‧溫巴赫，總裁；執行副總裁兼財務長 Kurt Johnson。

As a reminder, this call is being recorded. You can find the slides on our Investor Relations web page at investors.mrcoopergroup.com.

提醒一下，此通話正在錄音。您可以在我們的投資者關係網頁 Investors.mrcoopergroup.com 上找到這些投影片。

During the call, we may refer to non-GAAP measures, which are reconciled to GAAP results in the appendix to the slide deck. Also, we may make forward-looking statements, which you should understand could be affected by risk factors that we've identified in our 10-K and other SEC filings. We are not undertaking any commitment to update these statements if conditions change.

在電話會議期間，我們可能會參考非 GAAP 衡量標準，這些衡量標準與幻燈片附錄中的 GAAP 結果一致。此外，我們可能會做出前瞻性聲明，您應該了解這些聲明可能會受到我們在 10-K 和其他 SEC 文件中確定的風險因素的影響。我們不承諾在情況改變時更新這些聲明。

And with that, I'll now turn the call over to Jay.

現在，我將把電話轉給傑伊。

Thanks, Ken, and good morning, everyone, and welcome to our call. Typically, we start by reviewing the quarterly highlights, but I assume you saw our pre-release. So instead, I'll make some brief comments on full-year results, talking about our $1 trillion target and then share some thoughts on where we're going from here.

謝謝，肯，大家早安，歡迎撥打我們的電話。通常，我們首先回顧季度亮點，但我假設您已經看到了我們的預發布版本。因此，我將就全年業績發表一些簡短的評論，討論我們的 1 兆美元目標，然後分享一些關於我們今後的發展方向的想法。

Turning to slide 3, let's talk about 2023. For the full year, ROTCE was 12.5%, which was back within our target range. Pretax operating earnings totaled $660 million thanks largely to servicing, while originations made a smaller contribution given where we are in the cycle. Tangible book value ended the year at $63.67, up 12%. The servicing portfolio grew 14% to $992 billion at year end, which we believe establishes us as the industry's number-one servicer.

轉到投影片 3，我們來談談 2023 年。全年的 ROTCE 為 12.5%，回到了我們的目標範圍內。稅前營業利潤總計 6.6 億美元，主要歸功於服務，而考慮到我們所處的周期，原創業務的貢獻較小。年末有形帳面價值達 63.67 美元，成長 12%。截至年底，服務組合成長了 14%，達到 9,920 億美元，我們相信這使我們成為業界第一的服務商。

As we commented last quarter. We expect to achieve our $1 trillion target during the first quarter once pending transactions have completed boarding. Contributing to portfolio growth during the year, we acquired Home Point and its $83 billion portfolio in a transaction which was accretive to tangible book value, and which was essentially self funded through the assumption of $500 million in senior notes.

正如我們上季度評論的那樣。一旦待處理交易完成登機，我們預計將在第一季實現 1 兆美元的目標。為了推動這一年的投資組合成長，我們收購了 Home Point 及其 830 億美元的投資組合，該交易增加了有形帳面價值，並且基本上是透過假設 5 億美元優先票據自籌資金。

Additionally, the acquisitions of Rushmore Servicing and Roosevelt Management added another $32 billion and brought us best-in-class special servicing capabilities in the infrastructure to launch our first MSR fund.

此外，收購 Rushmore Servicing 和 Roosevelt Management 又增加了 320 億美元，並為我們帶來了基礎設施一流的特殊服務能力，以推出我們的第一個 MSR 基金。

A key theme for 2023 was operating leverage. We grew the portfolio at a double-digit pace during the year, while at the same time cutting costs companywide by 8%. These results showcase our highly efficient digital platform, the benefits of incremental scale, and our agile management of originations capacity. Finally, stock repurchase totaled $276 million for the year at an average price of $49.53. And given the current stock price, we're obviously quite pleased.

2023 年的一個關鍵主題是營運槓桿。這一年裡，我們的產品組合以兩位數的速度成長，同時全公司成本削減了 8%。這些結果展示了我們高效的數位平台、增量規模的優勢以及我們對發起能力的敏捷管理。最後，全年股票回購總額為 2.76 億美元，平均回購價格為 49.53 美元。考慮到目前的股價，我們顯然非常滿意。

With that, let's skip ahead to slide 5 and spend a moment on our $1 trillion target because this milestone represents the culmination of a multi-year journey, one that's taken us from very humble beginnings to our current position as industry leader. We're extremely proud of our track record. Very few companies can boast of 30% growth compounded over 15 years. We did this by relentlessly focusing on our platform, investing in the right technology, and building a people-first culture.

說到這裡，讓我們跳到幻燈片5，花點時間討論我們的1 兆美元目標，因為這一里程碑代表了多年旅程的頂峰，這段旅程將我們從非常卑微的起點帶到了目前的行業領導者地位。我們對我們的業績記錄感到非常自豪。很少有公司能夠在 15 年內實現 30% 的複合成長。我們透過不懈地專注於我們的平台、投資正確的技術以及建立以人為本的文化來做到這一點。

If you go back to the WMIH merger in 2018, which is when we became a fully independent public company, our first priority was deleveraging, which we accomplished by refinancing our senior notes and extending our liquidity runway. At the same time, we were rolling out Project Titan, which was a series of technology investments designed to ready our platform for the next leg of growth.

如果你回顧一下 2018 年 WMIH 的合併，當時我們成為一家完全獨立的上市公司，我們的首要任務是去槓桿化，我們透過對優先票據進行再融資和擴大流動性跑道來實現這一目標。同時，我們推出了“泰坦計劃”，這是一系列技術投資，旨在為我們的平台下一步的成長做好準備。

These investments paid huge dividends during the pandemic when we helped over 500,000 customers enter and exit forbearance plans while at the same time driving lower unit cost and servicing. In fact, since 2018, we've cut servicing costs by 30%, leaving us now 38% below industry peers based on the most recent Mortgage Bankers Association benchmark study.

這些投資在疫情期間帶來了巨大的回報，我們幫助超過 50 萬名客戶進入和退出延期計劃，同時降低了單位成本和服務。事實上，自 2018 年以來，我們已將服務成本削減了 30%，根據抵押貸款銀行家協會最新的基準研究，我們現在比行業同行低 38%。

Our investments also pay big dividends when we sold our cloud-native servicing technology to Sagent, which allowed us to focus our IT resources on the customer experience and the latest developments in generative AI.

當我們將雲端原生服務技術出售給 Sagent 時，我們的投資也獲得了巨大的回報，這使我們能夠將 IT 資源集中在客戶體驗和產生人工智慧的最新發展上。

We told you we would monetize Xome. And while we still have work to do with the auction exchange, we generated $528 million in gains in 2021 by selling title, valuation, and field services with extremely opportune timing. We've distinguished ourselves with industry-leading customer retention, which is currently near 80% or almost 4 times the industry average. And as you recall, during the refi boom of 2020, we generated in excess of $1 billion in profits from originations.

我們告訴過你我們會透過 Xome 貨幣化。儘管我們在拍賣交易所方面仍有工作要做，但透過在極其恰當的時機出售產權、估值和現場服務，我們在 2021 年獲得了 5.28 億美元的收益。我們以業界領先的客戶保留率而著稱，目前接近 80%，幾乎是行業平均的 4 倍。正如您所記得的，在 2020 年再融資熱潮期間，我們從原始業務中創造了超過 10 億美元的利潤。

The WMIH merger brought us $1 billion in deferred tax assets. At the time, there was skepticism about their value. Today, we have realized 63% of that balance in the form of incremental cash flow, which has helped us exceed expectations in terms of both growth and stock repurchase.

WMIH 合併帶來了 10 億美元的遞延稅資產。當時，人們對它們的價值表示懷疑。如今，我們已經以增量現金流的形式實現了該餘額的 63%，這幫助我們在成長和股票回購方面超出了預期。

So where are we going from here? We're now seeing some of the best growth opportunities in the company's history, and we will continue to grow our servicing portfolio as we have for the past 15 years. But our strategic focus is now squarely on return on equity, which shouldn't surprise you since we've been commenting on ROTCE on every quarterly call.

那我們接下來要去哪裡呢？我們現在看到了公司歷史上一些最好的成長機會，我們將像過去 15 年一樣繼續擴大我們的服務組合。但我們的策略重點現在完全集中在股本回報率上，這不應該讓您感到驚訝，因為我們在每個季度電話會議上都會對 ROTCE 進行評論。

If you'll turn to slide 6, let me share some updated guidance with you. From 2019 to 2021, the entire mortgage industry enjoyed outsized returns, thanks to the massive refinance wave that generated what will probably turn out to be once-in-a-lifetime margins. During 2022, we passed through an inflection point as the market struggled with the sharpest mortgage rate increases in recent memory, which impacted originations immediately, while it took servicing a few quarters to ramp up.

如果您要翻到投影片 6，請讓我與您分享一些更新的指南。從 2019 年到 2021 年，整個抵押貸款行業享受了巨額回報，這要歸功於大規模的再融資浪潮，產生了可能是千載難逢的利潤。2022 年，我們經歷了一個轉捩點，市場正努力應對近期記憶中最大幅度的抵押貸款利率上漲，這立即影響了貸款發放，而服務需要幾個季度的時間才能增加。

During 2023, we crossed back into our target range of 12% to 20%. And today, as we look out over the next few years, we would expect to drive these returns to a higher level. Specifically, we're forecasting ROTCE to steadily increase, reaching the mid to upper teens by the end of 2025, which is a level that we believe we can sustain thereafter.

2023 年，我們又回到了 12% 至 20% 的目標範圍。今天，當我們展望未來幾年時，我們期望將這些回報推向更高的水平。具體來說，我們預測 ROTCE 將穩定成長，到 2025 年底達到中上十幾歲，我們相信此後我們可以維持這一水平。

Now, bear in mind, as is always the case, we face some headwinds. The market expects somewhat lower rates in 2024, which could create some margin pressure for servicing in terms of higher amortization expense and lower levels of interest income. Although these would likely be offset by a pickup in originations. But the story from Mr. Cooper isn't about interest rates. The real story is the strategic initiatives we're working on that will lift ROTCE to a sustained higher level.

現在，請記住，一如既往，我們面臨一些阻力。市場預計 2024 年利率將有所下降，這可能會因攤銷費用較高和利息收入水平較低而對服務造成一定的利潤壓力。儘管這些可能會被起源的增加所抵消。但庫柏先生的故事與利率無關。真正的故事是我們正在製定的策略性舉措，這些舉措將把 ROTCE 提升到持續的更高水準。

Let me highlight four broad categories. First, we're making terrific progress with servicing costs, for example, by driving lower call volumes with better digital solutions for our customers. Plus, we think there's enormous potential from rolling out the latest generation of AI.

讓我強調四大類。首先，我們在服務成本方面取得了巨大進展，例如，透過為客戶提供更好的數位解決方案來降低呼叫量。另外，我們認為推出最新一代人工智慧具有巨大的潛力。

I'd remind you that Mr. Cooper is already a leader in AI with our mortgage-centric Pyro technology, which we developed in partnership with Google in 2021 in which today we're using internally and marketing to third parties. In 2024, you should expect further positive operating leverage in servicing and across the company.

我想提醒您的是，Cooper 先生已經憑藉我們以抵押貸款為中心的Pyro 技術成為人工智慧領域的領導者，該技術是我們於2021 年與Google 合作開發的，目前我們正在內部使用並向第三方進行行銷。到 2024 年，您應該預期服務領域和整個公司的營運槓桿將進一步提高。

Second, we believe there's enormous opportunity for ROTCE accretion in our asset-light strategies, including subservicing and our MSR fund, since they don't take up any of our liquidity. Third, we are reengineering our DTC platform to drive higher volumes and wider margins in all environments. And finally, the strength of our balance sheet and risk management gives us confidence we can hit these higher returns even in the face of market volatility or less-favorable macro conditions.

其次，我們相信，我們的輕資產策略（包括補貼服務和 MSR 基金）中存在巨大的 ROTCE 增值機會，因為它們不佔用我們的任何流動性。第三，我們正在重新設計我們的 DTC 平台，以在所有環境中推動更高的銷售和更大的利潤。最後，我們強大的資產負債表和風險管理能力讓我們有信心即使面對市場波動或不利的宏觀條件，我們也能實現更高的回報。

In summary, let me share our vision for where the company is going over the next few years. We envision Mr. Cooper as playing a leadership role in the mortgage industry with a platform that's scalable and offers best-in-class efficiency.

總之，讓我分享一下我們對公司未來幾年發展方向的願景。我們預計庫柏先生將透過可擴展且提供一流效率的平台在抵押貸款行業中發揮領導作用。

For our customers, we'll offer an experience that is frictionless and personalized. And as a result, will retain our customers for life. For our stakeholders, Mr. Cooper will work tirelessly to retain their trust. And for our investors, we're optimistic that the company's stock price will overtime receive a premium multiple, reflecting the outlook for return on equity, our track record, and the quality of our balance sheet.

對於我們的客戶，我們將提供無摩擦且個人化的體驗。因此，我們將終生留住我們的客戶。對於我們的利害關係人，庫柏先生將不懈努力，以保持他們的信任。對於我們的投資者來說，我們樂觀地認為該公司的股價將隨著時間的推移而獲得溢價倍數，這反映了股本回報率的前景、我們的業績記錄以及我們的資產負債表的品質。

Obviously, we do not control valuation. That's up to you, but we will work diligently to compound tangible book value at a double-digit pace, which for us is an exciting prospect.

顯然，我們無法控制估值。這取決於您，但我們將努力以兩位數的速度實現有形帳面價值的複合，這對我們來說是一個令人興奮的前景。

And now I'll turn the call over to Chris to take you through more details on our operational performance.

現在我將把電話轉給克里斯，讓您了解更多有關我們營運績效的詳細資訊。

Thanks, Jay. And on that point, it's nice to see our stock finally trading over tangible book. I couldn't help but remember when I first got here in 2019 and our stock dropped to 1 point to as low as half tangible book before the market understood the resilience of our balanced business model. But I don't think 1 times tangible book is the end of our story, not by a long shot, certainly enough for a company with such a successful track record and now such an impressive leadership position.

謝謝，傑伊。在這一點上，很高興看到我們的股票最終超過有形帳面交易。我不禁想起 2019 年我第一次來到這裡時，在市場了解我們平衡業務模式的彈性之前，我們的股價跌至 1 個百分點，低至有形賬面價值的一半。但我不認為 1 次有形的書是我們故事的結局，這對於一家擁有如此成功的業績記錄和現在如此令人印象深刻的領導地位的公司來說當然足夠了。

By the way, this will be my last call as a speaker. Next quarter, you'll hear from Mike Weinbach, Mr. Cooper's new President, who brings exceptional leadership experience at some of the most respected financial institutions in the country. Welcome, Mike. I can't imagine anyone better qualified than you to lead Mr. Cooper forward on our path to further growth and higher returns.

順便說一下，這將是我作為演講者的最後一次通話。下個季度，您將聽到庫柏先生的新總裁 Mike Weinbach 的講話，他在美國一些最受尊敬的金融機構中帶來了卓越的領導經驗。歡迎，麥克。我無法想像還有誰比您更有資格帶領庫柏先生在我們進一步增長和更高回報的道路上前進。

So with that being said, I'll start this morning on slide 7 and discuss servicing portfolio growth, which was very strong this quarter as we ended the year at $992 billion, up 14% year over year. As Jay mentioned, you should look for the portfolio to exceed $1.1 trillion by the end of the first quarter.

話雖如此，今天早上我將從幻燈片 7 開始討論服務投資組合的成長，本季成長非常強勁，年底達到 9,920 億美元，年成長 14%。正如 Jay 所提到的，到第一季末，您的投資組合應該會超過 1.1 兆美元。

As you recall, we announced the $1 trillion target in July of 2021 when the portfolio was only $650 billion. It's taken an enormous amount of energy discipline and effort on the part of our entire workforce, and it's really very gratifying to be reaching the targets so much faster than most people believe possible and now are already exceeding it. So I really need to share my heartfelt thanks to every single member of the Mr. Cooper team for your amazing work. I couldn't be more proud of all of you.

您還記得，我們​​在 2021 年 7 月宣布了 1 兆美元的目標，當時投資組合僅為 6,500 億美元。我們全體員工付出了大量的精力和努力，能夠以比大多數人認為可能的速度快得多的速度實現目標，而且現在已經超過了目標，這真的非常令人欣慰。因此，我真的需要向庫柏先生團隊的每一位成員表示衷心的感謝，感謝你們所做的出色工作。我為你們所有人感到無比自豪。

Now looking ahead, growth conditions remain extraordinarily attractive. We're seeing a very significant pipeline of deals coming to market with rich margins. Consider this, we recently raised $1 billion in high-yield debt at a cost of 7/8, and we're seeing bulk deals come to market with yields of plus or minus 13% for conventional and even higher returns for Ginnie loans. That's a spread of roughly 6 percentage points, whereas three years ago, we were funding a plus or minus 6 and investing at around 9.

現在展望未來，成長條件仍極具吸引力。我們看到大量利潤豐厚的交易進入市場。考慮一下這一點，我們最近以7/8 的成本籌集了10 億美元的高收益債務，並且我們看到大量交易進入市場，傳統貸款的收益率為正負13%，吉尼貸款的收益率甚至更高。這個差距大約是 6 個百分點，而三年前，我們的融資利率為正負 6 個百分點，投資利率約為 9 個百分點。

But that's not even the whole story because the pools today are highly seasonal with note rates well out of the money and very significant equity cushions. On a risk-adjusted basis, spreads today are second only to what we saw in the aftermath of the global financial crisis. And you can see this in option-adjusted spreads for bulk MSR deals, which have more than doubled in the last three years.

但這還不是故事的全部，因為今天的資金池具有很強的季節性，票據利率遠遠超出貨幣範圍，而且股票緩衝非常大。在風險調整後的基礎上，目前的利差僅次於全球金融危機後的利差。您可以從大宗 MSR 交易的選擇調整價差中看到這一點，該價差在過去三年中增加了一倍多。

What's driving these returns is a huge supply-demand imbalance, which reflects the large volumes of MSRs retained by originators during the refinance boom as well as the ongoing retreat of banks from the mortgage sector. Mr. Cooper is extremely well positioned to exploit this opportunity because of our ever-widening cost advantage, which means that we enjoy materially higher cash flow yields than our competitors.

推動這些回報的原因是巨大的供需失衡，這反映了再融資熱潮期間發起人保留了大量的MSR，以及銀行不斷從抵押貸款領域撤退。庫柏先生非常有能力利用這個機會，因為我們不斷擴大的成本優勢，這意味著我們比競爭對手享有更高的現金流收益率。

Also, we have an information advantage consisting of a decade's worth of data on collateral performance on the part of literally thousands of sellers. This information allows us to generate alpha by outperforming market returns.

此外，我們還擁有資訊優勢，其中包括數千名賣家十年來的抵押品績效數據。這些資訊使我們能夠透過超越市場的回報來產生阿爾法。

Subservicing is also a great opportunity for us. As you know, we're currently boarding a $90 billion portfolio for a very important new client, and we're optimistic about additional wins in 2024. We're in the process of raising capital for our first MSR fund, which will also be a source of subservicing volumes. Currently, we're in discussions with several institutional investors as well as pension plans, sovereign wealth funds, asset managers, and family offices.

訂閱服務對我們來說也是一個很好的機會。如您所知，我們目前正在為一位非常重要的新客戶提供 900 億美元的投資組合，我們對 2024 年取得更多勝利感到樂觀。我們正在為我們的第一個 MSR 基金籌集資金，該基金也將成為服務量的來源。目前，我們正在與多家機構投資者以及退休金計劃、主權財富基金、資產管理公司和家族辦公室進行討論。

We've also received reverse inquiries from some very large and sophisticated investors interested in separately managed accounts. Investors are focused on the secular opportunity resulting from the pullback of banks, which is a recurring theme in the private credit sector, and they find the return profile of MSRs extremely attractive given the potential for fully hedged double-digit returns, which are uncorrelated to systemic risk factors. And investors clearly understand the strengths we bring to this strategy as the market's leading platform with significant scale-driven operational and informational advantages.

我們也收到了一些對獨立管理帳戶感興趣的大型且經驗豐富的投資者的反向詢問。投資者關注的是銀行撤資帶來的長期機會，這是私人信貸領域反覆出現的主題，他們發現，考慮到完全對沖兩位數回報的潛力，MSR 的回報狀況極具吸引力，而這與系統性風險因素。投資者清楚地了解我們作為市場領先的平台為這項策略帶來的優勢，並具有顯著的規模驅動的營運和資訊優勢。

So let's turn to slide 8 and talk about pretax servicing income, which totaled $229 million in the quarter, which was just slightly ahead of our revised guidance. As Jay mentioned, there could potentially be some headwinds in 2024, so we guide you to model servicing income climbing steadily but at a pace below our portfolio growth.

因此，讓我們轉向幻燈片 8，討論稅前服務收入，該季度的稅前服務收入總計 2.29 億美元，僅略高於我們修訂後的指導。正如 Jay 所提到的，2024 年可能會出現一些阻力，因此我們指導您建立服務收入穩定攀升的模型，但成長速度低於我們的投資組合成長速度。

Specifically based on the forward curve, we're planning for slightly lower interest rates, which of course, will benefit our origination segment but could drive CPRs and amortization to higher levels and puts some pressure on net interest income. Having said that, we're at a point where many of our strategic initiatives are paying off. And as a result, we're extremely confident in our ability to deliver additional operating leverage in 2024.

具體來說，根據遠期曲線，我們計劃稍微降低利率，這當然有利於我們的發起部門，但可能會推動 CPR 和攤銷達到更高水平，並對淨利息收入造成一定壓力。話雖如此，我們的許多策略舉措正處於取得成效的階段。因此，我們對 2024 年提供額外營運槓桿的能力非常有信心。

One of the key initiatives we've commented on recently is our no-touch environment, the goal of which is to drive lower call volumes and not by cutting back on customer service, but by providing more information to our customers and easy-to-access digital tools. Through Q4, you can see that calls per loan continue to fall. During 2023, we spent a lot of time focused on calls related to payments, and by reworking our processes, we were able to eliminate as much as 90% of calls in that category.

我們最近評論的關鍵舉措之一是我們的非接觸式環境，其目標是降低呼叫量，不是透過減少客戶服務，而是透過向客戶提供更多資訊和易於操作的方式來存取數位工具。透過第四季度，您可以看到每筆貸款的催繳費用持續下降。2023 年，我們花了很多時間關注與支付相關的電話，透過重新設計流程，我們能夠消除該類別中多達 90% 的電話。

But this is only the tip of the iceberg. We're now using generative AI to predict the intent of customer calls so we can route those calls to the right team members and to prompt our team members with the right information to answer questions on the fly and then to summarize call logs and transcripts, so we can identify opportunities to further refine our processes.

但這只是冰山一角。我們現在使用生成式人工智慧來預測客戶呼叫的意圖，以便我們可以將這些呼叫路由給正確的團隊成員，並提示我們的團隊成員提供正確的資訊來即時回答問題，然後總結呼叫日誌和文字記錄，這樣我們就可以找到進一步完善流程的機會。

Jay mentioned our Pyro mortgage-centric AI platform, which we rolled out three years ago. Pyro gives us a decisive advantage in terms of onboarding portfolios because the system identifies missing documents, signatures, and stamps. And it does this with extremely high levels of accuracy without humans in the loop.

Jay 提到了我們三年前推出的以抵押貸款為中心的 Pyro 人工智慧平台。Pyro 在入職投資組合方面為我們提供了決定性的優勢，因為該系統可以識別遺失的文件、簽名和印章。它以極高的準確度完成了這項任務，無需人工幹預。

Last year alone, we scanned extracted and classified millions of documents, comprising 676 million pages of data. This contributes to our advantage in the bulk servicing market where prior servicing documentation is critical in understanding the profile of the loans being boarded.

光是去年，我們就掃描、提取和分類了數百萬份文檔，其中包含 6.76 億頁資料。這有助於我們在大宗服務市場中佔據優勢，在該市場中，先前的服務文件對於了解所提供貸款的概況至關重要。

Now let's turn to slide 9 and talk about originations, where we generated $10 million of EBT, which was above the high end of our updated guidance range as our DTC team was very nimble in taking advantage of the late-quarter rally in mortgage rates. And we also enjoyed wider gain on sale margins for improved capital markets execution.

現在讓我們轉向幻燈片 9，討論起源，我們產生了 1000 萬美元的 EBT，這高於我們更新的指導範圍的高端，因為我們的 DTC 團隊非常靈活地利用了抵押貸款利率季度末的上漲。我們也因改善資本市場執行而獲得了更廣泛的銷售利潤收益。

Bear in mind, these numbers were impacted by the cyber event in November. Excluding that impact, we estimate EBT would have been double this level. For similar reasons, refi recaptures dipped slightly during the quarter, but it's now back up over 80%. Clearly, this remains a difficult environment for originations, but I'd highlight the tremendous progress we've made expanding the scope of DTC.

請記住，這些數字受到 11 月網路事件的影響。排除此影響，我們估計息稅前利潤將是這一水準的兩倍。出於類似的原因，再融資回收量在本季度略有下降，但現在已回升至 80% 以上。顯然，這對發起來說仍然是一個困難的環境，但我要強調我們在擴大 DTC 範圍方面取得的巨大進展。

During the refi boom, DTC focused on rate and term refinances period. As rates began to rise, they did a fantastic job pivoting to cash out refinances. Since then, we've rolled out second liens and are now making great progress with purchase recapture, which together make up more than a third of our total volumes.

在再融資熱潮期間，DTC 重點關注利率和期限再融資時期。隨著利率開始上升，他們在轉向兌現再融資方面做得非常出色。從那時起，我們推出了第二留置權，現在在收回購買量方面取得了巨大進展，這兩項留置權合計占我們總銷量的三分之一以上。

Our DTC platform is extremely profitable, and maximizing DTC's contribution is a strategic priority for us. In fact, it's one of the key initiatives that will help us lift the company's overall returns. We're continuing to invest in the platform to drive lower costs faster turn times, and a more personalized customer experience. These investments include Project Flash, which is our approach to digitizing and automating workflow, which helped drive down unit costs by 22% in 2023.

我們的 DTC 平台利潤極高，最大化 DTC 的貢獻是我們的策略重點。事實上，這是幫助我們提高公司整體回報的關鍵措施之一。我們將繼續投資該平台，以降低成本、縮短週轉時間並提供更個人化的客戶體驗。這些投資包括 Project Flash，這是我們實現工作流程數位化和自動化的方法，幫助我們在 2023 年將單位成本降低了 22%。

Looking ahead, we guide you expect $20 million to $30 million in operating EBT in the first quarter. Bear in mind, this guidance is based on current market conditions, so both volumes and margins could change if interest rates surprise in either direction.

展望未來，我們預計第一季的營運稅前利潤將達到 2,000 萬至 3,000 萬美元。請記住，該指導意見是基於當前的市場狀況，因此如果利率朝任一方向意外變化，交易量和利潤率都可能發生變化。

Okay. If we can move to slide 10, I'd like to finish with an update on Xome. Our team made a lot of progress during the year, enhancing our platform, winning market share, and performing admirably in very difficult conditions. Sales were up 75% year over year in the fourth quarter, and inventories continued to grow, but the foreclosure market remains dormant thanks to home price gains and generous government programs. And as a result, Xome continues to operate at roughly breakeven. I will update you further on conditions as the year progresses.

好的。如果我們可以轉到投影片 10，我想以 Xome 的更新作為結束。我們的團隊在這一年裡取得了很大的進步，增強了我們的平台，贏得了市場份額，並在非常困難的條件下表現出色。第四季銷售額年增 75%，庫存持續成長，但由於房價上漲和慷慨的政府計劃，止贖市場仍處於休眠狀態。因此，Xome 繼續以大致盈虧平衡的方式運作。隨著時間的推移，我將進一步向您通報情況。

And with that, I'll turn the call over to Kurt.

然後，我會將電話轉給庫爾特。

Thanks, Chris. Good morning, everyone. I'll start on page 11, which provides you a summary of the financials. I'll start by taking you through the adjustments, which consisted of $27 million in costs related to the cyber incident as we previously disclosed, $8 million in deal costs associated with the Roosevelt and Home Point transactions, $2 million in severance, and a $2 million share in losses at Sagent.

謝謝，克里斯。大家，早安。我將從第 11 頁開始，其中提供了財務摘要。我將首先向您介紹這些調整，其中包括我們之前披露的與網路事件相關的2700 萬美元成本、與羅斯福和Home Point 交易相關的800 萬美元交易成本、200 萬美元的遣散費和2 美元的遣散費。

During the quarter, we marked down the MSRs by $217 million due to lower interest rates and higher expected CPRs, leading to a quarter-end valuation of 155 basis points of UPB or a 5.2 multiple of the base servicing fee strip.

本季度，由於利率降低和預期 CPR 提高，我們將 MSR 下調了 2.17 億美元，導致 UPB 季度末估值為 155 個基點，即基本服務費的 5.2 倍。

Now this was offset by $176 million hedge gain, which equates to 81% coverage. That's well within policy tolerance as we continue to target a hedge ratio of 75%. Subsequent to quarter end, we issued $1 billion in senior notes with a coupon of 7/8 priced at 7.25% yield to maturity. As a result, you should model in an incremental $12 million in corporate interest expense in the first quarter and $18 million each quarter thereafter. This expense will be offset by lower MSR line interest expense in the servicing segment.

現在，這被 1.76 億美元的對沖收益所抵消，相當於 81% 的覆蓋率。這完全在政策容忍範圍之內，因為我們繼續將對沖比率設定為 75%。季度末後，我們發行了 10 億美元的優先票據，票息為 7/8，到期收益率為 7.25%。因此，您應該在第一季增加 1200 萬美元的公司利息支出，並在之後的每個季度增加 1800 萬美元。該費用將被服務部門較低的 MSR 線路利息費用所抵銷。

Finally, I'd like to add some additional color on the ROTCE outlook. As Jay mentioned, we expect our ROTCE to rise over the next two years into the mid to upper teen levels in 2025. Now this forecast assumes slightly lower rates in line with the current yield curve and modest economic growth. Based on consensus estimate for Mr. Cooper, tangible book should exceed $70 per share a year in 2024. On this basis, it would be reasonable to look for $10 or more per share in operating EPS in 2025.

最後，我想為 ROTCE 的前景添加一些額外的色彩。正如 Jay 所提到的，我們預計我們的 ROTCE 將在未來兩年內上升到 2025 年青少年中上層水平。現在，這項預測假設利率略低，與目前的殖利率曲線一致，且經濟成長溫和。根據庫柏先生的共識估計，到 2024 年，每年有形帳面價值將超過 70 美元。在此基礎上，預計 2025 年營運每股收益達到 10 美元或更多是合理的。

I would echo Jay's comments. If we deliver on higher returns and demonstrate the continued sustainability of our business model, it's not hard to imagine that our stock might trade at a higher multiple of earnings and book, implying significant potential upside. Now, obviously, we've got a lot of work to do to produce these results. And of course, we don't control the valuation, but we do look forward to continuing our growth story as the market leader in servicing.

我會回應傑伊的評論。如果我們提供更高的回報並證明我們業務模式的持續可持續性，那麼不難想像我們的股票可能會以更高的本益比和帳面價值進行交易，這意味著巨大的潛在上漲空間。現在，顯然，我們還有很多工作要做才能達到這些結果。當然，我們無法控制估值，但我們確實期待繼續作為服務市場領導者的成長故事。

Now if you'll turn to slide 12, let's give you an update on asset quality. I'll be brief because concerns about recession have diminished in the last few months. But even so, we want you to know that we're positioning the company to weather a future turn cycle whenever that may occur. In this regard, it was nice to see delinquencies fall another notch to 1.3%. That's the lowest level of Mr. Cooper's history as a public company.

現在，如果您翻到投影片 12，我們將向您介紹資產品質的最新情況。我的發言將很簡短，因為對經濟衰退的擔憂在過去幾個月中有所減弱。但即便如此，我們還是希望您知道，我們正在為公司做好準備，以應對未來可能發生的轉型週期。在這方面，很高興看到拖欠率再次下降至 1.3%。這是庫柏先生作為上市公司歷史上的最低水準。

Turning to slide 13, let's review liquidity. We used $1 billion of proceeds from the high-yield offering to pay down MSR lines. And as a result, on a pro forma basis, our liquidity totaled $3.4 billion at year end, consisting of cash and immediately available capacity on our MSR lines. New bonds aren't due until 2032, which leaves us with a very strong liquidity runway for the next eight years.

轉向投影片 13，讓我們回顧一下流動性。我們使用高收益發行的 10 億美元收益來償還 MSR 額度。因此，按預計，我們的流動性在年底總計為 34 億美元，其中包括現金和 MSR 線路上的立即可用產能。新債券要到 2032 年才會到期，這為我們在未來八年留下了非常強大的流動性跑道。

Finally, I'll comment briefly on advances, which declined 2% year over year, despite growth in the portfolio. Now that's consistent with the favorable delinquency trends I just mentioned. To summarize, our balance sheet has never been in stronger shape.

最後，我將簡要評論預付款，儘管投資組合有所增長，但預付款同比下降了 2%。這與我剛才提到的有利的拖欠趨勢是一致的。總而言之，我們的資產負債表從未如此強勁。

If you'll turn to slide 14, I'd like to wrap up by putting our high-yield offering in some historical context. As Jay mentioned, when the WMIH merger closed in 2018, our first priority was deleveraging. And the reason for that was our core philosophy that balance sheet strength is non-negotiable for market leadership. I think it's fair to say that our approach to balance sheet management has been favorably received by the marketplace, where you can see our spreads have compressed by almost half over the last three years.

如果您翻到投影片 14，我想透過將我們的高收益產品放在一些歷史背景中來結束。正如 Jay 所提到的，當 WMIH 合併於 2018 年結束時，我們的首要任務是去槓桿化。原因是我們的核心理念，即資產負債表實力對於市場領導地位而言是不可協商的。我認為可以公平地說，我們的資產負債表管理方法受到了市場的好評，您可以看到我們的利差在過去三年中壓縮了近一半。

During the fourth quarter, Fitch initiated coverage on us with a BB rating. And subsequent to quarter end, Moody's upgraded our corporate credit rating to Ba3. At quarter end, our capital ratio as measured by tangible net worth assets, were 29.3%. While this was down slightly quarter over quarter on a continued asset growth, still well above our target range of 20% to 25%.

第四季度，惠譽首次對我們給予 BB 評級。季末後，穆迪將我們的企業信用評等提升至 Ba3。截至季末，我們以有形資產淨值衡量的資本比率為 29.3%。雖然由於資產持續成長，這一數字比上一季略有下降，但仍遠高於我們 20% 至 25% 的目標範圍。

With that, I'd like to thank you for listening to our presentation and now will turn the call back to Kevin for Q&A. [Operator], we're ready to take questions, please.

在此，我要感謝您收聽我們的演示，現在將把電話轉回凱文進行問答。 [接線員]，我們準備好回答問題了。

(Operator Instructions) Giuliano Bologna, Compass Point.

（操作員指示）朱利亞諾·博洛尼亞，指南針點。

Let me just start off by saying great quarter. And, Chris, you'll be missed not being on the conference calls going forward. I remember way back when you first started, and I think the share price is in the single digits, and we were both trying to get the message out there back then, so congrats on that.

首先我要說的是偉大的季度。克里斯，如果你不參加未來的電話會議，我們會想念你的。我記得很久以前你剛開始創業的時候，我認為股價只有個位數，當時我們都在努力傳達訊息，所以恭喜你。

If I shift a little bit, you obviously did a large bond deal, you have a lot of capital and liquidity, and you have a lot of MSRs announced for the first quarter or in the pipeline. How should we think about your ability to onboard or the pace of onboarding of new MSRs over the next few quarters?

如果我稍微改變一下，你顯然進行了一筆大型債券交易，你擁有大量資本和流動性，並且你有很多第一季或正在醞釀的 MSR。我們應該如何考慮您在未來幾季內新 MSR 的入職能力或入職速度？

Can you do $50 billion a quarter, or is it -- can you do $100 billion a quarter? I'm just curious about what the structural limitations are from a platform perspective because the opportunity is obviously large out there.

你能每季賺 500 億美元嗎？我只是好奇從平台角度來看結構性限制是什麼，因為那裡的機會顯然很大。

Giuliano, first of all, thank you very much. I remember our very first roadshow and appreciate you showing us a little love early on, so thank you.

朱利亞諾，首先非常感謝你。我記得我們的第一次路演，並感謝您儘早向我們展示一點愛，所以謝謝您。

Look, there's obviously some physical limitation, but it's kind of theoretical. I mean, we're on boarding somewhere around 400,000 loans as we speak. So our ability to ingest large pools is pretty significant. We have talked to you about some of our tools in the past that technology we have developed. Probably the most noteworthy is Project Pyro, which were the tool, Pyro, which allows us to ingest 4 or 5 times the amount of data and reconciling invoices really in real time. So we made a lot of advances there. I wouldn't think of the technology or the process as being any kind of limitation.

看，顯然存在一些物理限制，但這是理論上的。我的意思是，就在我們說話的時候，我們正在接受大約 40 萬筆貸款。因此，我們吸收大型池的能力非常重要。我們過去曾與您討論過我們開發的一些工具和技術。最值得注意的可能是 Pyro 項目，它是 Pyro 工具，它允許我們攝取 4 或 5 倍的資料量，並真正即時核對發票。所以我們在那裡取得了很多進展。我不認為技術或流程有任何限制。

If you look back even a decade ago when we bought the BofA portfolio, it was $200 billion, and we boarded it in the nine months. And to Chris's point the level of sophistication today, the level of investment we've made, obviously we're much more capable today. So yes, I think we can handle pretty much any size and without any issues is what I think about.

如果你回顧一下十年前我們購買美國銀行投資組合的時候，你會發現它價值 2000 億美元，而我們在 9 個月內就買了它。對克里斯來說，今天的複雜程度，我們所做的投資水平，顯然我們今天的能力要強得多。所以，是的，我認為我們可以處理幾乎任何規模，而且不會有任何問題，這就是我的想法。

That's great. And to Chris' point, fortunately, I had my projections out there. But fortunately, you guys came in above and beyond consistently. So that made me look at it along the way.

那太棒了。對克里斯來說，幸運的是，我有我的預測。但幸運的是，你們始終表現得很好。所以這讓我一路上看它。

The next question that I wanted to ask was related to the originations platform. You're obviously bringing on a lot of new MSRs that should see substantial increase in recapture opportunity. I'm curious how you think about the evolution of getting new MSRs onboard versus the delay of potentially being able to pivot recapture onto the Mr. Cooper origination platform.

我想問的下一個問題與起源平台有關。顯然，你們帶來了許多新的海上絲綢之路，這些應該會看到奪回機會的大幅增加。我很好奇你如何看待讓新的 MSR 加入的演變與可能能夠將重新捕獲轉移到庫珀先生原創平台上的延遲。

Well, remember, we're buying pools of all different types. A lot of the pools we're buying are well out of the money, some of them are. I mean, everything's priced differently, but in our -- the time lapse between us boarding a proposal and evaluating it for recapture potential, that may be a couple of days. I mean, we rescore our entire portfolio every night. So pools are loaded on a Monday. It may take until Wednesday, but it's very, very quick.

好吧，請記住，我們正在購買各種不同類型的泳池。我們購買的許多泳池都已經物有所值，其中一些確實是物有所值。我的意思是，一切的價格都不同，但在我們——我們提交提案和評估其重新獲得潛力之間的時間間隔，可能是幾天。我的意思是，我們每晚都會重新評估整個投資組合。所以池在周一加載。可能要等到週三，但速度非常非常快。

That's very helpful. Thank you very much, and I will jump back in the queue.

這非常有幫助。非常感謝，我會插回隊列中。

Thank you, Giuliano.

謝謝你，朱利亞諾。

Kevin Barker, Piper Sandler.

凱文·巴克，派珀·桑德勒。

Great. Thanks for taking my question, and I echo Giuliano's comments. Chris, you will be missed on these calls. I just wanted to follow up on the guidance for the ROE, 14% to 18%. Could you lay out the different scenarios where you think you would come in the lower end versus the higher end, whatever macro scenarios should we consider or what type of shifts in the market may cause you to go at the lower end or the upper end of that viewpoint? Thanks.

偉大的。感謝您提出我的問題，我同意朱利亞諾的評論。克里斯，我們會想念你的這些電話。我只是想跟進 ROE 的指導，14% 到 18%。您能否列出您認為您會進入低端與高端的不同情景，我們應該考慮什麼宏觀情景，或者市場的哪些類型的變化可能導致您進入低端或高端那個觀點？謝謝。

Hey, Kevin, it's Kurt. So I think realistically, the way that we've modeled everything going forward is based on the forward yield curve today. And that doesn't show a whole lot of change in the 10-year or in fact the mortgage rates over the next couple of years. I think, realistically, what we've also said is we've got an equity to asset ratio range of 20% to 25%, and we are and have been consistently above that amount. We're trending closer to 30% at this point in time.

嘿，凱文，我是庫爾特。所以我認為，實際上，我們對未來一切進行建模的方式都是基於今天的遠期殖利率曲線。這並沒有顯示出十年期或實際上未來幾年抵押貸款利率發生了很大的變化。我認為，實際上，我們也說過，我們的股本與資產比率範圍為 20% 至 25%，而且我們一直都高於這個數字。目前我們的趨勢接近 30%。

I think we did $1 billion of debt. I think that gives us a lot of ability as we're seeing MSRs with really attractive returns to invest in those MSRs and to boost the earnings. And I think that's what you'll see going forward. Obviously, if we get into an environment where there's good refinance refinancing recapture ability, we can go up to the top end of the range. But I think we're comfortable in a forward yield curve within that range as we've reported.

我認為我們負債了 10 億美元。我認為這給了我們很大的能力，因為我們看到 MSR 具有非常有吸引力的回報，可以投資這些 MSR 並提高收益。我認為這就是你未來會看到的情況。顯然，如果我們進入一個具有良好再融資再融資回收能力的環境，我們就可以達到該範圍的上限。但我認為，正如我們所報告的那樣，我們對在該範圍內的遠期殖利率曲線感到滿意。

Great. Thanks for taking my questions.

偉大的。感謝您回答我的問題。

Thank you, Kevin.

謝謝你，凱文。

Bose George, KBW.

博斯·喬治，KBW。

Hey, everyone. Good morning. Actually, one follow up on the guidance of the ROTCE. So you guys noted next year, you expect to reach the high end of the range. For full year 2024, do you think you'll be above the low end of the range, so 14% plus for the full-year '24?

嘿大家。早安.實際上，這是 ROTCE 指導的後續行動。所以你們注意到明年，你們預計會達到該範圍的高端。對於 2024 年全年，您認為您是否會高於該範圍的低端，即 24 年全年增加 14%？

Hey, Bose. Look, I don't think we are giving specific guidance nor have we historically, right? I think. But I think, again, if we're able to execute on our plan, we're able to acquire servicing at continued attractive yields. We've indicated where we're comfortable, and to your point, I think guiding to 2025, we've said mid to high teens, and I think we're comfortable with that as well.

嘿，博斯。看，我認為我們沒有提供具體指導，歷史上也沒有提供具體指導，對吧？我認為。但我再次認為，如果我們能夠執行我們的計劃，我們就能夠以持續有吸引力的收益率獲得服務。我們已經指出了我們感到舒適的地方，就你的觀點而言，我認為到 2025 年，我們已經說過中高青少年，我認為我們對此也感到滿意。

Okay, great. Thanks. And then actually one on the MSR hedge, you guys were right at 80% this quarter. Any thoughts about increasing that? Or do you just feel like the remainder is kind of covered by your macro hedge and sort of keep it at that level?

好的，太好了。謝謝。實際上，在 MSR 對沖方面，你們本季的預測正確率為 80%。有關於增加這個的想法嗎？或者你只是覺得剩下的部分被你的宏觀對沖所覆蓋，並保持在這個水平？

Yes, I think that we're planning on keeping it at that level. I think we have, probably, what I'd say has outperformed in both directions over the last quarter. When the portfolio was going up, we had a little bit less than 75% coverage, which was great, which means that we didn't lose as much on the hedge. And when the market was going down, we did better. So we gained a little bit more on the hedge.

是的，我認為我們計劃將其保持在這個水平。我認為我們可能在上個季度在兩個方向上都表現出色。當投資組合上漲時，我們的覆蓋率略低於 75%，這很好，這意味著我們在對沖方面沒有損失那麼多。當市場下跌時，我們做得更好。所以我們在對沖方面獲得了更多的利益。

So I think our hedge effectiveness over the last couple of quarters has been really good, but we're still targeting that 75%. And I think as we continue to acquire new current coupon portfolio, we've got a little bit of loans that are going to be in the money if we see a rate rally. And we think that that can really give us sort of the upside potential against the remaining 25%.

因此，我認為過去幾季我們的對沖有效性非常好，但我們的目標仍然是 75%。我認為，隨著我們繼續獲得新的當前票息投資組合，如果我們看到利率上漲，我們將獲得一些貸款，這些貸款將成為貨幣。我們認為這確實可以為我們帶來相對於其餘 25% 的上行潛力。

Yes, okay. Great. Thanks.

是的，好的。偉大的。謝謝。

Terry Ma, Barclays.

馬特里，巴克萊銀行。

Thanks. Good morning. I just had a follow up on the ROE range of 14% to 18%. If I look at slide 8 on the 2024 outlook, is it possible to maybe dimensionalize some of those drivers of portfolio growth and operating leverage and BTC, how much they contribute toward that ROE range?

謝謝。早安.我剛剛追蹤了 14% 到 18% 的 ROE 範圍。如果我看一下關於 2024 年前景的幻燈片 8，是否有可能對投資組合成長、營運槓桿和 BTC 的一些驅動因素進行維度化，它們對 ROE 範圍的貢獻有多大？

Terry, we wouldn't break it down in those pieces. We -- I think we're giving you guidance that we expect a certain amount of operating leverage. We've been generating it for the last three years consistently. So if you're asking for a specific percentage for each, no. I'd say, on balance, we're very comfortable with the range. And I think we just leave it at that point.

特里，我們不會把它分解成那些部分。我認為我們正在向您提供我們期望一定程度的營運槓桿的指導。過去三年來我們一直在持續生成它。因此，如果您要求每個項目的具體百分比，則不會。我想說，總的來說，我們對這個範圍非常滿意。我想我們就到此為止吧。

I would say on originations, it won't take much in terms of rates to move to see originations produce more meaningful levels. Obviously, in the quarter, we had that rate rally right at the end of the quarter. And our team turned on a dime and started producing a much higher volume of fundings and that was really maybe 10 to 15 days of activity. So if rates do start to move down, as many people expect them to this year, I would expect originations to play a bigger role.

我想說的是，就起源而言，不需要太多的費率就能看到起源產生更有意義的水平。顯然，在本季度，我們在季度末就出現了利率反彈。我們的團隊迅速扭虧為盈，開始籌集更多資金，這實際上可能需要 10 到 15 天的活動。因此，如果利率確實像許多人今年預期的那樣開始下降，我預計起源將發揮更大的作用。

Got it. That's helpful. So if I look at the fourth quarter ROE of 11%, is it possible to, I guess, quantify what the ROE -- or have the adjusted ROE for the disruption like what it would have been?

知道了。這很有幫助。因此，如果我看看第四季 11% 的 ROE，我猜是否有可能量化 ROE，或是根據中斷情況調整後的 ROE？

Yes, if not for the disruption in the fourth quarter, we would have doubled that operating income.

是的，如果不是第四季的中斷，我們的營業收入將會翻倍。

For originations.

對於起源。

Yes, originations.

是的，起源。

From a pro forma perspective.

從準備考試的角度來看。

Yes. I'm sorry, I was just talking about originations.

是的。抱歉，我只是在談論起源。

From a pro forma perspective, it would have been about 12.5% ROTCE for the fourth quarter.

從預期的角度來看，第四季的 ROTCE 約為 12.5%。

Got it.

知道了。

Servicing business was back up. But just to remind everyone, our servicing business -- although the event was disruptive, our servicing business was back up and running in four days. So there was an interruption, but it was not very significant.

服務業務有所恢復。但要提醒大家的是，我們的服務業務——儘管事件造成了破壞，但我們的服務業務在四天內就恢復並運作了。所以有一個中斷，但不是很嚴重。

Right, although we did have, call it, $7 million to $8 million because we waived late fees for the month. And again, doing the right thing for the customers is something we're always going to do. And it did have a slight impact. So you add Chris's doubling of originations plus the servicing -- waiving of late fees, I think you'll get kind of to that. You come back into that same 12.5% number.

是的，儘管我們確實有 700 萬到 800 萬美元，因為我們免除了當月的滯納金。再說一遍，為客戶做正確的事情是我們始終要做的事情。它確實產生了輕微的影響。所以你加上克里斯的雙倍起源加上服務——免除滯納金，我想你會明白這一點。你又回到了同樣的 12.5% 數字。

Got it. Okay, that's helpful. Thank you.

知道了。好的，這很有幫助。謝謝。

Doug Harter, UBS.

道格·哈特，瑞銀集團。

Thanks. Can you talk about the outlook for regulation for yourself in light of some of Treasury Secretary Yellen's comments yesterday?

謝謝。您能否根據財政部長耶倫昨天的一些言論談談自己對監管的展望？

I think -- if you're talking about regulation in terms of size growth, I think you really have to look at our portfolio as in two pieces. While the overall portfolio has grown considerably and we expect it to grow by another 25% this year, only half of it is owned MSR. The other half is subserviced for a number of clients.

我認為，如果您談論規模成長方面的監管，我認為您確實必須將我們的投資組合視為兩部分。雖然整體投資組合已大幅成長，我們預計今年將再成長 25%，但 MSR 擁有的資產中只有一半。另一半則為許多客戶提供輔助服務。

So I don't think -- if there are any limitations on concentration, I think it would be focused more on people -- on owned MSR. So I think we have quite a bit of room for us to grow before that becomes a concern to anybody.

所以我不認為——如果對集中度有任何限制的話，我認為它會更多地關注人——擁有的MSR。所以我認為，在這成為任何人關注的問題之前，我們還有很大的成長空間。

Yes, and if you look in total, I mean, we're still in kind of a single-digit market share. And so I think there's plenty of room to grow from there. And if you look at other sectors in financial services, payments, processing, other processing businesses, you certainly see consolidation to a few players. And so I think that makes sense for the servicing business as well.

是的，如果你從總體上看，我的意思是，我們的市場份額仍然是個位數。所以我認為還有很大的發展空間。如果你看看金融服務、支付、處理和其他處理業務等其他領域，你肯定會看到一些參與者的整合。所以我認為這對服務業務來說也是有意義的。

I mean, it's a scale business. You have to be able to invest in the technology, et cetera. And so we don't have any concerns about continuing to grow the platform. The key for us is sustainability, right? We've invested heavily in technology and compliance and risk. And so those are real key strengths of the company and we'll continue to focus on this. So we feel good about future growth prospects.

我的意思是，這是一個規模化的業務。你必須能夠投資技術等等。因此，我們對繼續發展該平台沒有任何擔憂。對我們來說關鍵是永續性，對吧？我們在技術、合規性和風險方面投入了大量資金。因此，這些是公司真正的關鍵優勢，我們將繼續關注這一點。因此，我們對未來的成長前景感到樂觀。

Any risks -- obviously, you're well above your own target capital ratios. But if they were to apply more stringent capital rules to you, how do you think capital liquidity rules -- how do you think you'll fare if it went to more of bank-like capital standards?

任何風險－顯然，你的資本比率遠高於你自己的目標。但如果他們對你實施更嚴格的資本規則，你如何看待資本流動性規則——如果更多地採用類似銀行的資本標準，你認為你會表現如何？

The targets, the equity targets that we put out, a range of 20% to 25%, is so much -- so far ahead of what is required of banks that I don't think that's any type of concern for us. I can't even imagine it becoming anything of a conversation.

我們提出的目標，即股權目標，範圍為 20% 至 25%，遠遠超出了銀行的要求，我認為這對我們來說沒有任何擔憂。我甚至無法想像它會成為一場對話。

Again, we're talking about a range of 20% to 25%. We're at 29% today. I'm not sure what the average bank is, but maybe it's half that level. So I don't think you -- I think you should think of us as having a rock-solid balance sheet.

我們再次討論 20% 到 25% 的範圍。今天我們的進度是 29%。我不確定銀行的平均水平是多少，但也許只是這個水平的一半。所以我認為你不應該認為我們擁有堅如磐石的資產負債表。

Great. I appreciate that, Chris. Thank you.

偉大的。我很感激，克里斯。謝謝。

Michael Kaye, Wells Fargo.

麥可凱，富國銀行。

Hi. You've grown your servicing portfolio very fast, and the outlook for further acquisitions seems very favorable. But bringing on so much business, how do you think ahead and avoid a melting ice cube effect with the servicing portfolio when the acquisition opportunity eventually slows down. Even now, with the very low runoff of the portfolio, your originations are nowhere near able offset that. Thanks.

你好。您的服務組合成長得非常快，進一步收購的前景似乎非常有利。但帶來如此多的業務，當收購機會最終放緩時，您如何提前思考並避免服務組合的融化冰塊效應。即使是現在，由於投資組合的流失率非常低，你的起源也遠遠無法抵消這一點。謝謝。

Well, actuality, they are more than 80% recapture rate. The concept of a melting ice cube doesn't really apply to us. We're growing the portfolio. CPRs are very, very low at the same time, and we're growing it both through acquisitions and through subservicing growth.

事實上，他們的奪回率超過了80%。冰塊融化的概念並不真正適用於我們。我們正在擴大產品組合。同時，CPR 非常非常低，我們透過收購和服務成長來提高它。

So I think if you look at the mortgage industry as a whole, historically, that melting ice cube description did apply. But when you have recapture as high as we do, as well as the correspondent channel, co-issue channel, replenishment has not been a problem for us at all.

所以我認為，如果你從歷史上看整個抵押貸款行業，融化的冰塊的描述確實適用。但當你有像我們一樣高的收復率，以及通訊管道、合發管道時，補貨對我們來說就完全不是問題了。

And I can imagine, even if acquisitions were to slow down to half the levels they've been and if you look back to, say, 2019 through 2020, that was the situation. And we are still growing at a very, very strong clip.

我可以想像，即使收購放緩至原來水準的一半，如果你回顧 2019 年到 2020 年，情況就是這樣。我們仍在以非常非常強勁的速度成長。

Yes, Michael, to be specific, if you look at our co-issue/correspondent DTC business, we're -- we can maintain the portfolio and grow it slightly. So we have a sustainable model without any bulk acquisitions. But I mean, look at our track record over the last 25 years from a bulk acquisition standpoint, and I think it speaks for itself.

是的，邁克爾，具體來說，如果你看看我們的聯合發行/通訊 DTC 業務，我們可以維持投資組合併略微成長。因此，我們有一個可持續的模式，無需任何批量收購。但我的意思是，從大量收購的角度來看我們過去 25 年的業績記錄，我認為這不言而喻。

There's always going to be portfolios in the market. And as you've seen us execute the last few years when we -- we will get our fair share of those. So I think from a growth standpoint, we feel very good about our existing kind of origination channels and the co-issue channel, and the bulk opportunities are going to be there. And so I think I feel really good about it.

市場上總會有投資組合。正如你所看到的，我們過去幾年的執行情況，我們將得到我們應得的份額。因此，我認為從成長的角度來看，我們對現有的發起管道和聯合發行管道感覺非常好，並且大量機會將會存在。所以我認為我對此感覺很好。

Okay. Thank you very much.

好的。非常感謝。

(Operator Instructions) Derek Sommers, Jefferies.

（操作說明）Derek Sommers，Jefferies。

Hi, good morning. On the $1.1 trillion guide for servicing book at the end of 1Q, is there -- what should we anticipate for the mix between forward MSR and subservicing? And then if you could talk about your pipeline expectations for sub-servicing moving forward, that would be great as well.

早安.在第一季末的 1.1 兆美元服務指南中，我們應該對遠期 MSR 和次級服務之間的組合有何預期？然後，如果您能談談您對未來子服務的管道期望，那就太好了。

It's a great question. I think, in the first quarter, it's about one-third subservicing -- no, it's about two-thirds subservicing, one-third owned. A lot of these deals were deals we closed in the fourth quarter and then just boarding now.

這是一個很好的問題。我認為，在第一季度，大約有三分之一是維修——不，大約是三分之二是維修，三分之一是擁有。其中許多交易是我們在第四季完成的交易，然後現在才開始。

Over the course of the year, we'd like to see a little bit more subservicing because traditionally, as we told you, we'd like to have a 50-50 mix and we're a little bit higher. I think we ended the year more like 60-40 or roughly. So we'd like to board some large subservicing, but a little too early to tell. And that will play out depending on what market opportunities presented.

在這一年中，我們希望看到更多的輔助服務，因為傳統上，正如我們告訴過你的，我們希望有 50-50 的混合，而且我們的水平要高一些。我認為我們今年結束時的成績大概是 60-40 或大約。因此，我們希望進行一些大型的輔助服務，但現在說還為時過早。這將取決於市場機會的出現。

Got it. Thank you. And then on your comments about originations, EBT being double if it weren't for the cybersecurity incident, is the assumption on that double that the incremental volume would have come majority from the DTC channel?

知道了。謝謝。然後，關於您對起源的評論，如果沒有網路安全事件，EBT 會翻倍，是否假設增量數量將主要來自 DTC 頻道？

Yes, exactly. And just the timing of the event, it happened really as there was a -- that mini rate rally, so we did lose some key days in the quarter.

對，就是這樣。就事件發生的時間而言，它確實發生了——利率小幅上漲，所以我們確實失去了本季的一些關鍵日子。

Okay, got it. And then if we were to see any pickup in originations volume looking forward, would that assumption still hold that the mix would shift toward the DTC channels as well?

好，知道了。然後，如果我們看到未來發起量有所回升，那麼這種混合也會轉向 DTC 管道的假設是否仍然成立？

Yes, of course. I mean, correspondent and co-issue are pretty steady producers. DTC obviously is going to flex up and down depending on rates. We don't expect rates to go much higher. But as they do come down, that should immediately generate more activity in DTC.

是的當然。我的意思是，通訊員和合刊是相當穩定的製作人。DTC 顯然會根據費率上下浮動。我們預計利率不會大幅上漲。但當它們確實下降時，應該會立即在 DTC 中產生更多的活動。

Got it. Thanks for answering my questions.

知道了。謝謝回答我的問題。

Thank you. And I'm not showing any further questions in the queue. I'd like to turn the call back over to Jay for any closing remarks.

謝謝。我不會在隊列中顯示任何其他問題。我想將電話轉回給傑伊，讓他作結束語。

Thanks, everybody, for joining us, and we look forward to further conversations. Thank you.

感謝大家加入我們，我們期待進一步的對話。謝謝。

Thank you for your participation in today's conference. That does conclude the program. You may now disconnect. Everyone, have a great day.

感謝您參加今天的會議。程式到此結束。您現在可以斷開連線。大家，祝你有美好的一天。