CNH Industrial NV (CNHI) 2016 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to today's CNH Industrial 2016 Fourth Quarter and Full-Year Results Conference Call.

For your information, today's conference call is being recorded.

(Operator instructions.) At this time, I'd like to turn the call over to Federico Donati, Head of Investor Relations.

Please go ahead, sir.

Thank you, Trish.

Good morning and afternoon, everyone.

We would like to welcome you to the CNH Industrial fourth quarter and full-year 2016 results webcast conference call.

CNH Industrial Group CEO, Rich Tobin; Max Chiara, Group CFO, will host today's call.

They will use the material you should have downloaded from our website, www.cnhindustrial.com.

After introductory remarks, we will be available to answer the questions you may have.

Before moving ahead, let me just remind you that any forward-looking statement we might be making during today's call are subject to the risk and uncertainties mentioned in the Safe Harbor statement included in the presentation material.

I will now turn the call over to Mr. Rich Tobin.

Thank you, Federico.

Good afternoon, and good morning.

For the full year, our overall results are in line with guidance that we announced one year ago despite certain market demand assumptions being inaccurate, particularly in LATAM, commercial vehicle, and construction equipment markets in NAFTA and LATAM.

Despite this, we were able to achieve our goals by pushing hard where markets were more positive and by continuing to deliver operational cost savings, productivity gains, and opportunistic pricing strategies across our operating geographies.

Our operating leverage potential continues to improve in preparation for the future.

As you can see from the bottom of the slide, in addition to the solid operating execution, we were able to significantly over-achieve on our net industrial debt target for the year by $500 million, with a Q4 cash inflow from change in working capital of $1.3 billion.

Furthermore, we were able to reduce our future interest costs through two opportunistic capital market transactions, both of which further our efforts to achieve investment credit grade rating and inherent benefits associated with it.

The Board of Directors of CNH Industrial intends to recommend to the Company shareholders at the Annual General Meeting a dividend of EUR0.11 per common share, totaling approximately EUR150 million.

Before I hand it over to Max for the usual financial overview, in the next slide we have highlighted main product awards during the year.

I don't want to go through each of them individually, but to say that these awards are not only a recognition of our technological prowess, they are a representation of the skills and dedication of our employees, and I'd like to take this moment to thank them for their collective achievements.

I'll hand it over to Max, who will take you through the financial overview of the presentation.

Thank you, Rich.

I'm on slide six with the fourth quarter and full-year financial highlights.

Net sales of industrial activities at $6.7 billion for the fourth quarter, down almost 3% year-over-year, and at $23.7 billion, down 4% for full year.

Operating profit of industrial activities at $412 million for Q4 with 6.2% margin, and at $1.3 billion, or 5.5% margin for the year.

Both measures are in line with our full-year guidance.

In the quarter we reported a $96 million net income, while for the full year we reported a net loss of $249 million, which includes the EC settlement for $551 million, a charge of $60 million related to the repurchase of our ['17] notes, a non-cash charge of $34 million due to the remeasurement of certain assets in our Venezuelan subsidiary, as well as a one-time non-cash tax charge of $59 million as a result of the corporate reorganization of our Latin American operations, which includes changes in valuation allowances recorded against deferred tax assets in the region.

For a complete review of our non-GAAP measures, please refer to the reconciliation table in the back of today's press release.

Adjusted net income was $197 million, with earnings per share at $0.14 for the quarter, or $482 million for the year with adjusted diluted EPS at $0.35 per share.

I would like to highlight that, despite the difficult market environment, we were able to keep our adjusted net income and adjusted EPS in line with last year due to disciplined pricing execution on our several cost reduction initiatives and the lower tax rate.

Net industrial debt was $1.6 billion at the end of December, in line with prior year, and significantly better than our guidance inclusive of the EC settlement.

Available liquidity was $8.7 billion, down $0.6 billion compared to December 2015.

Next slide.

As a precautionary note for the following slides, although we have provided figures for both the full year and Q4, we'll primarily focus on the full-year results.

Moving on, industrial activities net sales breakdown.

For the full year, excluding currency translation impact, which accounted for 1% of the sales decline, net sales decreased about 3% in the year, with agricultural equipment down 7% on lower NAFTA row crop sector demand and a small grain sector demand weakness in EMEA, partially offset by LATAM that showed a positive recovering, particularly in the second half of the year as a result of improved trading condition in Brazil, with shipments up 30% year-over-year in Q4.

Construction equipment net sales were down 8.6% on a constant-currency basis primarily as a result of production realignment to prevailing market conditions and negative pricing in NAFTA, while commercial vehicles net sales were up 2% primarily as a result of increased truck volume, driven by a favorable industry trend and market share gains, and favorable pricing in EMEA, offset partially by negative volume in LATAM, with industry down 30% and lower volume in the specialty vehicle business.

Powertrain was up approximately 5% due to higher volumes to third parties.

As far as net sales by region, share of total net sales continued to decrease in NAFTA, now at 21%, and increase in EMEA at 56%.

Next slide, number eight, [in the year], operating profit of industrial activities was down 10% versus last year, with an operating margin of 5.5%, improvements in CV and powertrain and declines in ag and CE.

For the quarter, operating profit was down 27% to $412 million, and a margin at 6.2%.

Looking at the adjusted net income walk, for the year, adjusted net income was at $482 million, up 2% compared to 2015.

Beyond the change in industrial activities, operating performance, which Rich will walk you through in a minute, the lower ag portfolio and less favorable interest spreads drove financial services operating profit down 7%.

Interest expenses were essentially flat versus last year.

Other net was favorable $80 million on lower cost for FX, pension, and other miscellaneous cost.

JV income improved by $26 million, primarily the result of the Chinese JV restructuring.

Lastly, we had lower taxes as the result of a better adjusted effective tax rate for the year, 39%, an improvement of 7 percentage points from prior year, as we were able to generate profit before tax in previously unbenefited loss-making jurisdiction.

Moving on to slide nine, our change in net industrial debt.

Net industrial debt was $1.6 billion at the end of December, $1.1 billion lower than September, and in line with December 2015, as the $1 billion net industrial cash flow generated during the year offset the impact of the EC settlement payment, a $200 million dividend, and a negative foreign exchange translation impact.

Without the EC settlement payment, our net industrial debt would have been $1 billion at 35% improvement from prior year-end.

This performance has been achieved particularly through a Q4 working capital inflow of $1.3 billion as a result of $900 million reduction in inventory and some favorable payable performance on a comparable basis to year-end 2015.

Next slide, further detail on our cash flow performance.

CapEx was down 23% versus full-year 2015.

The reduction for the year is primarily coming from lower spending for regulatory-related CapEx.

Starting with 2017, we expect the regulatory cycle to restart again in preparation of the upcoming stage five for off-road applications in EMEA.

You can also see the breakdown of the working capital components.

The change in working capital resulted in a cash inflow for the year of $300 million-plus, and, [as said, $1.3 million] in the quarter mainly due to the inventory reduction and the payable change.

On slide 11 now, financial services business.

Net income for the year was $334 million, down 9% year-over-year, primarily due to reduced interest spreads, lower average portfolio in ag, and the negative impact of currency translation.

For the full year 2016, retail [on] originations were at $9 billion, down $0.4 billion compared to 2015.

The managed portfolio of $24.8 billion as of the end of December was down $0.1 billion in constant-currency to prior year.

Credit quality remained strong, with delinquencies of 3.1% for Q4, in line with Q4 prior year.

Slide 12 illustrates [a] Company debt maturity schedule and available liquidity.

As of the end of December 2016, available liquidity was $8.7 billion, down $0.6 billion compared to the prior year.

The reduction was mainly due to two [partial] repurchases in 2016 of notes due in December 2017 for a combined $860 million, as we focus our efforts in reducing third-party debt in industrial activities, down one-third from $10 billion to $6.7 billion at the end of 2016 over the last three years, and also rebalancing the maturity profile of our debt.

Having said that, we continue to keep a strong liquidity position, with our liquidity to revenue ratio at more than 35% at the end of the year in support of our goal of reaching an investment-grade rating.

This liquidity balance sufficiently covers debt maturities until the end of 2018.

Finally, net intersegment balance was at $0.5 billion at the end of the year, down $2.8 billion from December 2014, and 50% lower than the same point last year.

Although we continue to be focused on reducing intersegment debt, its balance could as likely fluctuate in single quarters based on timing of our capital market transactions.

With this remark, I have concluded the financial review portion of the presentation, and I'll turn back to Rich for the business overview section.

Thank you.

Okay, I'm on slide 14.

In terms of the operating profit performance for the year and the quarter, as you can see, that the negative volume has been largely offset with positive pricing cost containment actions and [the] like.

As we've been guiding all year, the Q-to-Q in Q4 was going to be weaker largely as a result of production timing versus last year, but overall a .5 percentage decline in operating margin and a significant headwind on the top line.

So, another strong performance by ag for the year, protecting margins in a difficult market condition while it deleverages its dealer inventory.

Next slide.

Call your attention to the bottom left, NAFTA row crop production in units, down full-year almost 30%, and total channel inventory almost down 20%.

I know the question will come up, what of our plans for 2017 versus 2016.

We expect in NAFTA to under-produce in line with our forecast, which I'll get to in a minute, in terms of the decline, but not to the extent -- the under-production relative to the market will be tighter, meaning that we won't have to under-produce as large as we have been in the previous years.

I think we mentioned on the last call that, in terms of total inventory, we're still a little bit long in channel inventory on high horsepower tractors.

We are largely in line in combines now, so we would expect to have in-line product year-over-year.

You can see on the right side of the slide the performance for the regions.

I think that we guided down NAFTA high horsepower and EMEA a little bit at the end of Q3.

We didn't see any real deterioration from then.

It's probably steady-state.

Next slide.

In construction equipment, the difficult operating environment that we'd experiencing largely through Q2 and Q3 continued into Q4.

We took the decision to make a significant reduction in production intensity in Q4 to help out the pricing environment, largely in NAFTA and EMEA.

I think it's easy to see it on the next slide.

[If] you see the Q4 retail sales to production, we decided to curtail the production significantly.

Now, that cost us something in terms of our earnings, but we believe that that sets us up for more balanced production, even some over-production potential in 2017, and hopefully contributes to some amount of stabilization into the pricing environment, largely in NAFTA.

And you can see the market conditions for the full year.

NAFTA's been a little weaker than we had originally prognosticated, and LATAM, which we thought we would see some green shoots in the second half of the year really never came, so production intensity that we thought we were going to have in Q4 in LATAM never arrived.

So, we're going to have to wait for 2017.

Next slide.

Overall in commercial vehicles, a very good performance, especially in commercial vehicles in Europe.

We'll get to the market share performance in a moment.

Despite negative headwinds in LATAM, where the Brazilian market remained extremely difficult, we had a bad comp Q4 to Q4 because of the emissions change and regulations in Argentina, so we didn't have that tailwind that we had in Q4 last year.

And then, we've got a contractual decline in specialty vehicles, which is really order bank on the military business.

Despite all that, in commercial vehicles, we increased operating profit by over $100 million quarter-to-quarter as a result of volume leverage, positive pricing, and the benefits of the footprint actions which are largely in the production cost line that you see there in previous periods.

Next slide.

Production largely in line with retail for the full year, so we really don't need to make any adjustments in terms of relative to our forecast for 2017.

Can see in the bottom right-hand of the slide that order books are relatively stable year-over-year, so no real decline going into 2017.

We're going to be calling the market flat for European truck demand, may be slightly down in [heavy], but we think the good environment in light commercial vehicle will continue.

And as you can see, that we gained market share in both light and medium trucks.

We had mentioned in the Q3 call that the heavy market was getting a little bit competitive, especially as it relates to price, is likely the result of the NAFTA market going down.

The European market became more competitive.

But, overall, very pleasing results as it relates to market share.

I think that we're doing the right thing in terms of product quality, and it's being recognized by the market.

Next slide.

In terms of powertrain, I think this is the highest margin since the de-merger for the powertrain segment.

A lot of that is due to, as we mentioned before, that the third-party business as a percent of total revenue continues to increase.

We would expect that trend to continue into 2017, but really firing on all cylinders from an operational point of view.

To the extent that our internal business on the off-road segment begins to get some traction, we get some volume leverage through the balance of this portfolio, so we're quite pleased in terms of the performance.

I would tell you that we benchmark our third-party business versus standalone engine suppliers in terms of profitability, and we are closing that margin gap significantly.

And then, you see the units sold on the right side, and we are the beneficiary of some of that change in units, largely driven by European truck demand and third-party business.

But, a very good performance by powertrain.

Moving on, I won't go through this in detail.

I'm sure that you've been through it.

I think that they're relatively in line with other market participants, both in the ag sector and in construction equipment and trucks, so really no news here.

We expect ag in NAFTA to have another difficult environment.

I think, as I mentioned before, that our requirement to underproduce that significantly, as we've done over the last two and a half years now, is less so, less required in the past.

I think that the fact that we did a very good job in terms of production of channel inventory gives us some hope that we can get closer to in balance between wholesale and retail.

Today we would expect to under-produce the market slightly than the numbers that you see here.

We've exited Europe a little bit weak.

I don't think it's any news.

You've seen the data.

In terms of France and Germany being a bit weak, Southern Europe has held up quite well.

We would expect that trend to continue into next year.

I gave you my comments on trucks, where we think European heavy, a lot depended on what happens with the UK, but we see Southern Europe continue to grow strongly.

And in construction equipment, slightly down, really not making any bold predictions in terms of LATAM.

Those are off of incredibly low market comps for 2016.

So, the headline figure looks good, but it's still not nearly where it was 36 months ago.

Next slide.

So, in terms of the outlook, we've got it down here into some drivers of the financial targets for 2017 - agricultural equipment production to be more balanced to retail activity, improving fixed cost absorption, and positive impact from LATAM, end-user demand, which you've already seen in Q4.

Construction equipment pricing environment to stabilize, positive impact from new product launches in our excavator family.

We've launched our mini-excavator a couple weeks ago.

Balanced strategy between market share gains and price realization in commercial vehicles.

We've got some high hopes for our gas product lineup, which should improve the mix in the heavy segment, and sustained third-party volumes in powertrain, which is a more favorable product mix.

As you saw from the press release, back-office consolidation projects and restructuring programs continue to be deployed, with an estimated 2017 expense of $100 million.

We expect to generate appropriately $60 million of incremental savings in 2017 at an $80 million annualized run rate.

Combined R&D and CapEx spending to increase by 10%, driven by precision farming and ag in preparation which we hope to be the return of market demand in the latter half of 2017, if not 2018, and in preparation for stage five emissions regulations in Europe.

Balance sheet deleveraging efforts and opportunistic capital market transactions will positively impact financial costs in 2017, and improvements in pretax profits and changes in corporate structure driving further tax rate reductions for the full year next year, leading to net industrial activities of $23 billion to $24 billion in revenue, adjusted diluted EPS between $0.39 and $0.41 a share, and net industrial debt at the end of 2017 of $1.4 billion to $1.6 billion.

As a note, we have run euro-dollar FX at EUR1.05 to the dollar.

And that wraps it up, so we'll go to Q&A.

Thank you, Mr. Tobin.

Now, we are ready to start the Q&A session.

Please take the first question.

(Operator instructions.) Ann Duignan, JPMorgan.

Can we talk a little bit about your outlook for agriculture NAFTA?

You talked about still under-producing a little bit in 2017.

Can you just update us on your dealers' used equipment, both on the combine side and the high horsepower tractor side?

Do you feel like they sold a lot of that in the [year-end through] option and it's getting cleared out, or do we still have a potential for used equipment prices falling?

From what we can see from the data, I mean, used combines pricing stabilized early in 2016.

We saw some weakness in 2017.

Getting used inventory data's a little bit harder because we actually have to do a lot of channel checks for it, but we did under-produce significantly in Q4 as opposed to last year, which is a lot of the earnings difference in ag year-over-year.

So, we gave ample room and put some money to work to help the dealers out doing it.

At the end of the day, we're probably still long in high horsepower tractors and four-wheel drives, which is going to take at least a half a year, barring a change in commodity prices, to get in balance, but we're feeling pretty good about total inventories, new, used, off-lease in combines right now in the NAFTA market.

Then, can you tell us why you didn't guide for an operating margin range?

And what's implied in your EPS guidance?

What's implied in our EPS guidance is improvement in all four segments year-over-year.

But, is there a reason why you're not guiding to an industrial--?

--We finally got to the point where we believe that we've got our tax rate stabilized.

Up to this point, we had not, as basically the entirely industry does give EPS targets.

We couldn't in the past because of the de-merger and everything that we had to do with our statutory structure, and you've seen our tax rate in the past.

It's been pretty volatile.

You see this year that we believe that we've got a pretty good handle on it.

We finished a rather large LATAM restructuring.

We're making money in Italy, which we haven't been in the past, which has been an issue in terms of non-[benefited] losses, so we felt more comfortable to put us in a position to be like everybody else in the industry.

And just a quick follow-up on the tax situation.

Are you a net importer or a net exporter out of the US?

And what are you thinking about border taxes?

We've run all of the analysis.

We're largely in balance.

We're a net exporter of finished product in total.

A lot of that depends on high horsepower equipment demand, including what we export to Europe and Australia, for example.

To the extent that those markets perform as we think they should, then we should be relatively in balance, but we've run all the traps that we can in terms of the scenario analysis.

We are under-exposed to production out of our joint venture in Mexico, so there's really no material issue there.

And if you include raw materials, would you be a net importer?

Yes.

As you know, and in powertrain, we're an importer.

But it depends on how the legislation is written whether you need to be in balance, or is it just on pure imports.

And also, the impact depends on euro-dollar, as you know.

So, in terms of a weaker euro is positive to us in terms of input costs because we're long euro on the drivetrain.

Martino De Ambroggi, Equita.

My first question is on the free cash flow, and particularly for next year, what's your CapEx assumption for next year, considering you [was] extremely low last year?

And what is the normalized level in normal market conditions, going forward?

In the last slide of the presentation, we mentioned a 10% increase for R&D and CapEx combined, so that our target for now for next year.

And largely, our CapEx number at that point is basically on a steady-state, and you need just to consider the cycles on the regulatory capital, which may go up and down depending of the timing of implementation of the new regulation.

And for raw materials, you mentioned in the press release a tailwind.

Could you expand on current year expectation for raw materials contribution to the improvement in the four divisions you mentioned in the previous answer?

And if you could quantify last year [input] overall for raw materials?

It was a tailwind for the full year.

You can see the raw material tailwind by segment in the production cost line.

It's a portion of that.

I'm not going to break it out into the individual segmental pieces.

But, overall, it was a year-over-year tailwind in terms of raw materials.

We think it is a slight headwind going into 2017, but our expectation is to offset the headwind with reduced costs on productivity gains.

And in LATAM, because of the inflationary environment, we expect to offset that with price.

Last question on M&A potential.

It's a question nobody's asking you for quite a long time.

So, for Iveco, the assumption is to stay as it is today for the next future even if profitability -- maybe it's not the best level it can get, but in any case it's improving.

So, let's stay steady-state, going forward.

Yes.

Our expectation is to improve the profitability of Iveco.

And I think that we have over the past 24 months.

We've been able to gain market share, which is an indication that, from a product acceptance point of view, we're gaining some traction.

So, it's steady-state of improving the performance of that segment.

Mike Shlisky, Seaport Global.

My first question is you've had some (inaudible) moving parts on your gross industrial debt the last few months.

Can you give us any kind of thoughts on your outlook for your interest costs in 2017 after reaching about [$200 million] in 2016?

And is there any kind of savings you've got beyond what you've already booked here, or other interest cost upside for the coming year?

I think that you can take a look in the presentation at the duration table.

You can calculate within some margin of error what our interest costs are going to be in 2017.

And the two open market transactions have a positive impact of approximately $60 million into 2017.

Also, a few years back you guys guided to being a net cash position by the end of 2018.

I know a lot of things have changed obviously since 2014 when you first gave that outlook, but, quite frankly, you've pretty much more or less met your 2016 goals, if not exceeded them on an adjusted basis.

So, can you [tell if] you think you'll be able to make any further steps towards getting to maybe zero net debt by the end of next year?

Do you have anything else in your back pocket that you could possibly do here?

Yes, return of the ag market would go a long way of settling that issue.

No, I think [that what] you can look in the guidance, we've done a significant amount of deleveraging in the balance sheet, which you expect in the face of a market downturn that we've run into.

So, the balance sheet is self-liquidating to the extent that we've drawn down our inventories, and you can see that in the cash flow.

We would hope, in a certain way, that that doesn't continue to accelerate, because that would indicate that we have even more headwind in the demand cycle.

So, what you see there in terms of our forecast for net industrial debt is a reflection of what we think the demand in production intensity is going to be.

Having said all that, clearly we are not, I would say, best in class to net working capital performance.

I think that we're proud of the cash generation that we've been able to do over the past 24 months, but clearly it's our intention to become more efficient at working capital performance and to get to a zero net industrial debt as quickly as we possibly can.

I don't believe that that's possible in 2017.

Just one quick detail.

If you plan to under-produce in ag in NAFTA this year, clearly it'll be less than it has been in previous years, but is it a nine-figure number you plan to under-produce by, or is it something very, very small?

I think the spread is in single digits to the market demand.

So, if the market's going to be down 10, depending on the product category, we'd under-produce by somewhere in the order of 13 to 15, (multiple speakers) 5%.

Monica Bosio, Banca IMI.

The first question is on the Obamacare costs.

Could you please quantify, if it's possible, the Obamacare costs for CNH?

Are they relevant, and are you expecting some benefits from the new administration in the USA?

And the second question is, if it's possible to give us a highlight of the average age of the agricultural equipment machineries for row crops in NAFTA?

Because my feeling is that, for sure, volumes might be down, but maybe there could be a start of replacement cycle.

Am I wrong?

Monica, this is Max speaking.

I'll take the first question.

Without knowing the specifics of the new legislation on healthcare in the US, it's basically impossible to determine an input to our P&L.

So, we will wait and see how that all materialize, and we'll be able to do an assessment later on.

But, do you know how much the Obamacare costs weighted on your accounts?

If you don't have the figures right now, I can [call] you.

Monica, I need to follow up with you on this.

I don't have the figure with me.

In terms of the age of the inventory, if you look at the time cycle of where the peak in the industry was, which was in 2013, and we're moving into 2017, acreage has not changed at all during that time period, so hours of usage on the machines has actually been relatively constant.

If we look at used inventory aging on the dealer lot, approximately 40% of it is what we would consider late model used, one to four years old, and the balance is older than that, so just to give you an idea of what's out there in terms of aging.

But, anybody trying to give you an accurate description of the age of the existing operating fleet, we would be guessing at this point.

Massimo Vecchio, Mediobanca.

My first question is on the drivers that you name in the outlook statement.

You speak about improved fixed cost absorption.

Does it mean that you expect volumes to be up year-on-year in ag in 2017?

No.

In total ag, we'll be very slightly down year-over-year.

Second question still on the outlook, I was surprised by the positive stance on Brazil for trucks.

Can you elaborate a little bit more about what's the drivers behind this plus-15%?

Well, as I mentioned during the presentation, I think that when you look at the percentage basis, it looks like it's a drastic improvement in the operating environment, but you're looking at an industry that's down in excess of 70%.

So, I think that, before we get excited about some improvement in demand, it's coming off an incredibly low base.

Last question, tax rate for 2017.

What kind of P&L number we should expect in terms of percentage?

Massimo, we expect the tax rate to be lower than what we have provided for in 2016.

Lower than 2016?

Massively lower, or marginally lower?

Marginally.

Ross Gilardi, Bank of America.

Just a few on the FINCO.

Do you think earnings have stabilized yet, and can we use the Q4 earnings number, do you think, as an appropriate run rate for 2017?

Is that what you're baking in?

No.

I think that we would take the full-year number of net income for the FINCO and have it slightly down for 2017.

And Rich, I just wanted to clarify.

Ann asked you earlier about directional guidance on the segments, and I think you said everything up, and you just said ag slightly down.

So, I just wanted to clarify what you were referring to.

Were you talking about sales, EBIT, or margins in your earlier response on everything being up?

Margins I was talking about.

Margins, okay.

That's what I figured.

And then, just on the dividend, you guided the dividend slightly lower.

It's not a big deal, but you did guide it slightly lower.

So, why is that?

Because you seemed to feel reasonably confident on the outlook that things are stabilizing.

I think that we went back to what our payout ratio was announced to be, so our payout ratio was 35% of net, or minimum EUR150 million.

I mean, with all of the charges, we've had a net loss this year, so we just came back and said the minimum payout and what we had announced at the AGM some time ago was 35% of net.

So, we thought that that was the prudent thing to do.

And the benefit of continuing to deleverage this business in net income is significant, so we think that shareholders should recognize that we made significant progress in terms of deleveraging the business, and we feel good that we're on a trajectory to get to investment-grade within a realistic time horizon.

Thank you.

That will conclude the question and answer session.

I would now like to turn the call back to Federico Donati for any additional or closing remarks.

Thank you, Trish.

I would like to thank everyone for attending today's call with us.

Have a good evening.

Thank you.

That will conclude today's conference call.

Thank you for your participation, ladies and gentlemen.

You may now disconnect.