Climb Global Solutions Inc (CLMB) 2011 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good day, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to Wayside Technology Group first-quarter 2011 results conference call.

At this time, all participants are in listen-only mode.

Later, we will conduct a question-and-answer session, and instructions will be given at that time.

(Operator Instructions).

As a reminder, this conference call may be recorded.

I would now like to turn the conference over to Ms.

Nathalie Turner.

Ma'am, you may begin.

Thank you, Sayid, and good morning, everyone.

Welcome to Wayside Technology's first-quarter 2011 earnings call.

Before turning the call over to Simon Nynens, the Company's Chairman and CEO, I will dispense with the customary cautionary language and comment about the webcast for this earnings call.

We released earnings for the third quarter -- for the first quarter at approximately 5PM Eastern Time Thursday, April 28, 2011.

The earnings release is available at the Company's Investor Relations website at waysidetechnology.com.

Today's call, including all questions and answers, is being webcast live and can be accessed via the website earnings.com.

A rebroadcast of this call will be available at waysidetechnology.com.

This conference call and the associated webcast contain time-sensitive information that is accurate only as of today, April 29, 2011.

A detailed discussion of risks and uncertainties are discussed in our Forms 10-Q and also in greater detail in our Forms 10-K.

Wayside Technology Group, Inc.

sees no obligation to update and does not intend to update any forward-looking statement.

Now I will turn the call over to Simon.

Thank you, Nathalie.

Good morning to everybody.

As always, I would like to start this call by thanking everyone here at Wayside Technology for delivering record results.

I am very proud of the great team that we have here at Wayside Technology Group.

Revenue increased 28%.

Income from operations increased 38%.

Our earnings per share are $0.18, and we have declared a $0.16 dividend per share.

Cash and marketable securities amount to $15.4 million or 58% of our equity as of the end of March.

We are very well financed and ready to invest in our future growth.

Dan Jamieson, our Vice President and General Manager of our Lifeboat division, will discuss his team's Q1.

Dan?

Thank you, Simon.

Lifeboat's Q1 results reflect solid year-over-year growth across all key segments of the business, including increases in revenue, margin and income from operations.

The crucial growth factors in Lifeboat's Q1 results were the successful penetration and expansion of pivotal software lines with a variety of Lifeboat's premier reseller accounts, along with the successful expansion of business within targeted solution providers, including value-added resellers, systems integrators and other consultancy-type companies.

Lifeboat signed seven new distribution agreements in Q1.

These new agreements will strengthen Lifeboat's portfolio and enhance our focus in our go-to-market concentration areas, including virtualization, security, application lifecycle management, database infrastructure, and application and network infrastructure.

Lifeboat's European office continues on a successful growth path.

We continue to add pan-European vendor lines, and our capability to process orders in euros, Great British pounds and US dollars continues to be very attractive to the channel.

Thank you, Dan.

Shawn Giordano, our Vice President for our TechXtend and Programmer's division, will now discuss his team's Q1.

Shawn?

Thank you, Simon.

Our Programmer's Paradise and TechXtend sales organizations continue to perform and achieve results in a very competitive marketplace.

Once again in Q1, our order volumes increase across both transactional and strategic software and hardware lines.

Helping our customers make important decisions and leveraging technology to solve business challenges, being flexible and providing the best customer experience possible continues to be our primary focus in delivering strategic value to our clients.

Thank you, Shawn.

Kevin will now discuss the balance sheet and income statement in more detail.

Kevin?

Thank you, Simon.

I will discuss our first-quarter financial results on a Company-wide basis as well as per segment.

Net sales were $51.5 million compared to $40.4 million last year, representing a 28% increase.

Sales for our Lifeboat segment were $39.5 million compared to $29.1 million last year, representing a 36% increase.

Sales for our Programmer's Paradise segment were $12 million compared to $11.2 million last year, representing a 7% increase.

Gross profit was $4.8 million compared to $4 million last year.

Gross profit as a percentage of net sales was 9.4% compared to 9.8% last year.

Gross profit margin as a percentage of sales for our Programmer's Paradise segment remain unchanged at 11.8% compared to last year.

Gross profit margin as a percentage of sales for our Lifeboat segment was 8.6% compared to 9.1% last year.

Total selling, general and administrative -- SG&A -- expenses were $3.5 million compared to $3 million last year.

As a percentage of sales, SG&A expenses were 6.9% compared to 7.5% last year.

Selling costs increased $300,000, the result of the increased volume and the Company's investing in and rewarding employees for sales growth.

Our net income amounted to $840,000 compared to $620,000 last year.

As a percentage of sales, our net income was 1.6% compared to 1.5% last year.

On a fully diluted basis, our earnings per share were $0.18 compared to the prior year at $0.14.

Now moving on to the balance sheet, compared to our year-end balance sheet, the following accounts had significant fluctuations.

Accounts receivable decreased by $8.1 million and the accounts payable decreased by $8.6 million, both due to the lower sales volume compared to the year-end quarter.

During the quarter, the Company purchased 32,536 shares and still has the authority to purchase another 445,000 shares as market conditions warrant.

Our book value per share is $5.64, and equity now stands at $26.7 million.

And cash and marketable securities make up 58% of equity.

This concludes my remarks.

Thank you, Kevin.

Operator, we can now start with the Q&A session.

(Operator Instructions).

Steve Emerson, Emerson Investment.

First of all, congratulations on a great quarter.

As I've asked you on previous calls, it would be -- please give us an answer as to how much of your revenue is now related to cloud computing or some percentage breakdown virtualization and security.

And in the past, you've been somewhat reluctant, but I think perhaps the interests of your shareholders are more -- could be more important than any possible perceived competitive loss issues or -- meaning loss of this information.

It would be spectacularly important should you be willing to say how much of your sales and sales growth, let's say, is virtualization and cloud computing.

Well, Steve, and I will let Dan Jamieson, our Lifeboat division, answer that question to you as well.

I will tell you one thing -- virtualization a couple of years ago started with just one company offering it.

And to split out our virtualization sales would be very easy.

That was just the sales of VMware, because VMware started with virtualization.

But since the adoption of virtualization, that virtualization part is almost virtually in I would say at least 70% of the products we sell right now.

It is all integrated, so they all work well with virtualization.

They need to be.

So for us, we have the world views and we know what vendors play within certain of those world views to virtualization views.

Virtualization, as I've stated before, is very important for us.

We are ready for the cloud.

As I said in previous calls, and as I will probably say for a couple of remaining -- the next couple of quarters, it seems that the end customer is not ready yet.

We are working with software publishers and everybody getting ready to be able to process those orders and handle those orders.

We are ready to handle those orders.

We have the processes in place, and we are working with the software publishers to put the sales processes in place.

However, the adoption of the cloud is -- it's not as fast a thing as we all thought it would be nine months ago or a year ago.

So having that said, virtualization drives that, and we see strong growth in those areas.

So I will let Dan give you some color on that as well.

Thank you, Simon.

Steve, I can only echo what Simon said.

And just to kind of elaborate a little bit on it, I think it's important to keep in mind, we go back, gosh, 12, 13 years now to the genesis of the virtualization movement within the channel, and over the ensuing years, we have forged agreements and partnerships with over 25-plus third-party tool vendors in that space.

And that represents the most robust and effective offering within the channel of any distributor out there.

So for us, we've got this great, strong legacy database now of virtualization resellers.

And what we really do is, as Simon mentioned, we take our go-to-market strategies, which really revolve around the world views that we have, and we take a virtualization database and then we take our security offerings and we cross-pollinate with the security offerings now with the virtualization database.

So what we do is go back in that explosive trajectory of virtualization, where people jumped in and got really going with it, and then realized, hey, I might be exposed here.

I might be at risk here.

And now security, instead of being a second thought, becomes something they need to implement.

We get in there and kind of growth that.

So for us, it's no longer just a virtualization breakout.

It's a combination of security, and we even try to go in with our other world views as well.

So it continues to be a very important and explosive trajectory for us.

It's key from our perspective.

It's really still inchoate.

It is just getting started.

And we are glad to be there at the foundation of it.

And we are going to continue to grow and adapt and build our business to service our customers as partners as strongly as possible in that space.

Okay.

So is it fair for me to say that 70% of the Company is driven by virtualization adoption?

And what is your perception of the growth rate of that segment or that industry?

Okay.

No, it would be incorrect to state that 70% of our products are driven by virtualization.

Part of our purchases are driven -- and actually, it's an interesting question because we raise the question internally in terms of, like, okay, it's Q1.

The overall economy is not doing too well.

What we are trying to find out, as we have the last four quarters, I know we cannot influence the greater forces at work in the economy.

But I know one thing -- we can service our software publishers and our customers as best as we can.

And if they do make a purchase, whether that, by the way, being a replacement or a new investment, we try to get them to come to us.

Now, it is true that at these growth rates, we are taking market share from other software distributors in terms of the buy-ins from the large resellers.

We are definitely taking market share from other mainstream distributors, because the overall IT industry is not growing at our growth rates.

But having that said, in terms of like qualifying our overall revenue, where it's exactly coming from is a very hard thing to do, to know, is it a replacement?

Our renewals have gone -- the renewal rate, quite really good -- a lot of success with the renewals.

It is not all driven by virtualization.

What is important for us as a distributor is to stay on the front line of that -- those adoption rates.

And I'll tell you one more technology that we have announced that seems to make a lot more waves in software publishing land than our focused on virtualization and on the cloud, is the fact that we have an electronic inventory system.

Still a lot of software publishers depend on mainstream distributors to deliver their box products to a reseller who then ships that product to an end customer.

We can take electronic inventory, electronic licenses, that if somebody buys on a website somewhere from reseller a product, we can e-mail that product within the next hour or two hours.

And that end customer receives the product immediately.

And that is a huge, huge game-changer.

So that is very important for our software publishers.

So are we ready for the cloud?

Absolutely.

I would be shocked if it is more than 2% of anybody's sales right now.

And just to add to that, Steve, we are committed to virtualization.

We have been from the get-go.

We believe in the vision of virtualization.

We will continue to commit towards the companies and partners that are with us in that space.

Our advantage now is that we are platform-agnostic with all the tools and the vendors that we've signed up.

We distribute tools that work with all the varying platforms, whether it be VMware's, Microsoft's, Citrix's or Oracle's.

The tools we work with work with everyone.

So we don't have our eggs in one basket.

We are multifaceted in the space.

And again, as I said earlier, we feel it's just getting started.

I think the greatest success of virtualization lies ahead.

But if your question, Steve, is about are we ready as a distributor to handle cloud or to handle virtualization, I think we've definitely proven it in virtualization, but also for the cloud, yes, we are ready.

No worries about that.

If the sales are going to go there, our processes and our people are in place, and we are ready to grab that market as well.

And one more thing -- virtualization drives the cloud as well.

So it seems to be a two-step process -- virtualize and then push to the cloud.

Jim Devlin, Henley & Company.

Congratulations on another great quarter.

Just a couple of quick questions.

As far as the -- I guess you guys signed seven new vendors during the quarter.

Is that correct?

Yes.

Okay.

And how does that deal pipeline look -- better, more robust moving forward, or kind of still blocking and tackling?

Can you speak to the deal pipeline moving forward, picking up new software vendors?

Absolutely.

In terms of -- we have a strong pipeline, and we've had a strong pipeline for the last three years.

It really is tactically -- it has to make sense for a software publisher and for us.

Sometimes the planning takes a little longer, but that pipeline still looks strong.

Okay.

So seven deals is pretty good for the quarter, though?

Absolutely.

And as I said before, sometimes people try to build their models and say, well, isn't it realistic to expect $500,000 per line or $1 million per -- you really cannot say that.

It's a case-by-case basis.

Absolutely.

If I can just add to that, Jim, we are really thoughtful about the partners that we bring into our portfolio.

So when we bring somebody onto our line card and bring that opportunity out to our reseller base, these resellers understand that we've taken a lot of due diligence and we've really carefully vetted the opportunities.

And they know that they can -- they know they are going to be getting extraordinary technology.

They're going to be having the ability to make some money.

It's going to be a clean and clear channel and that there's primary demand being created.

So we are not all about quantity.

We are about quality and make sure that our line card continues to be a best-of-breed card to our partners in the channel.

Okay.

And then on the international scene, obviously the weakness in the dollar, devaluation, whatever buzzwords people want to use these days, how does that work for you guys as you guys are trying to break into Europe?

And I know you have some other international initiatives.

Two things about that.

One, our European office, we started that in February of last year, although we always sold into Europe.

So, comparatively, I think our growth rate is 4500% because we started in February.

But it's good to see that Q1 of '11, and I won't specifically mention the sales in euros, but it's good for us to see that that was almost as strong in Q4.

So the growth rate in Europe is really, really strong.

Having that said, if the dollar devalues and if people have the expectation that in 30 days that dollar is even lower, then typically our resellers in Europe start buying from us in dollars.

Although we give them the possibility they can buy in either euros, Great British pounds or dollars, they typically start buying in dollars.

Jim Stone, PSK Advisors.

Great quarter, guys.

Great quarter.

Wonder first of all, can you give us some sort of a feel of the sales that came from vendors you had less than a year or customers that you've had less than a year, what that percentage of the revenue is?

Gosh, that might be a tough one.

Traditionally, Jim, due to the third-party nature of what we're doing, we go out there and it usually takes about two quarters to garner some traction within the channel.

But I don't have the number off the top of my head, but it's -- what do you think?

I don't know.

We're guessing about 5% to 10% of our overall sales.

Yes, maybe that.

But I think one of the hallmarks of what we are doing in the channel is that we are trying to be a different type of company in that we -- when we part with somebody, we want them to know we're in it for the long term.

And we are talking about a long-term partnership based on a foundation of integrity and moving out sales.

So we are not necessarily always looking for immediate growth.

Some of our strongest partnerships, for instance our partner of the year, Veeam, that took a little more -- that took over a year to incubate and to really get flying.

So we are pretty patient as long as we're looking at good trending.

The next issue is gross margins would seem to be still trickling down.

Any thoughts on what is happening there, and when does that trend stop, if ever?

So, two things about that.

Definitely the impact of price competitiveness, that continues to be a factor in our channel.

That is also the sort of lines that we decide to go after, whether it's a very good creditworthy customer, if they come to us for slightly lower margins, we tend to absolutely take those lines as well.

So it's a blend of product mix, as well as competitive nature of our business.

We expect that to continue to impact our business.

And as I said before, the vendor rebates are -- they are granted to us based on our growth.

If that growth is not as stellar as it has been, then that could impact our gross margins.

Alan Weinfeld, Kern, Suslow.

Great quarter, guys.

I had a question, to elaborate more on the last caller.

You did talk about the competitive pricing.

How large were several large bids that you discussed in the press release?

Are we talking a $500,000 deal or much higher or not even that high?

No.

In terms of those large bids, actually we had far less this quarter than we had in the previous couple of quarters.

Large bids I would say typically happen on the TechXtend and the Programmer's side of the business, where we finance those deals for multiple years that -- the long-term financing for either two, three, sometimes even longer.

On the Lifeboat side, it's more a reseller decides to acquire -- to basically source that whole line from us.

So those are every times $1000, $2000 purchase.

If there is a large purchase of that software line, we definitely get that.

This is at the end of the quarter.

Wasn't that significant this quarter as other quarters.

It was just strong throughout the quarter.

Last year, we had a very bad January and February.

We had a stronger March.

This year was very stable throughout the whole quarter.

So you're saying you had -- your large bids could've been a few hundred thousand, that's what you're saying?

Yes, yes.

It's more the lines within Lifeboat that we decided to go after aggressively at sometimes lower margins, but very creditworthy customers.

And we decided to get into that customer, and it's grabbing market share.

It's competitive.

It makes sense for us as long as the gross margin dollars overall increase.

That's the game.

That's our objective -- income from operations and net income.

Get that up.

That's our objective.

And it's still obviously the objective here to make the most profit with whatever sales we have.

So you haven't changed the idea at all of not trading sales for profits.

So --

No, no.

I want to state that correctly.

It's like, if you looked at Amazon, their sales increased significantly, but their net income dropped significantly.

That's not our play.

I don't think anybody on the stock market gives us credit for any sales.

I think the only thing that people look at is price/earnings, net income.

And in fact, if we could make more net income with smaller sales, they would applaud that because that means less credit risk.

But it is important to know what we are in the market for, because if you exclude yourself from low-margin sales, you're not in distribution.

So, Dan?

Yes, just add to that, too, one of the things that -- it's quite the contrary, really, one of the things that our vendor partners are really pleased with, that when we do go in and garner that business, there's a services shift that takes place there within that business.

And what the vendors themselves had perceived as perhaps just reactionary orders or business within these major large account resellers, well, all of a sudden we're able to build out, through the efforts of our proactive selling efforts, we are able to build out greater sales within that area.

So our goal is if we do garner the business at a lower margin, we want to make up for that and drive it even further from a business perspective by expanding sales creatively within that company.

But just to state it correctly, it is not our objective to go in and price-fight with anyone.

However, it is also not our objective to try to increase profitability on the lines that we have.

It is our objective to keep the same margins for the lines, but to grow the number of lines.

And I think that is the way to grow in the current economy.

We cannot ask for more money from our current customers.

But we can give them more of the software that they acquire.

So, that is our objective, both on the TechXtend/Programmer's side as well as on the Lifeboat side.

Peter Lux, private investor.

I'd like to make -- ask a question and make a comment, because I've known you guys for a very long time, as you know.

With the rise of smartphones and tablets and all this applications and software being produced, which seems to be never stopping, are you guys involved in any kind of -- in that kind of market at all?

We are as far as developing those kind of applications.

We sell development software.

But we are not involved with the games and the applications that they -- because that's a different model.

It's also a very consumer-oriented model.

It's not a business --

No, I understand that.

So, no, so we are in terms of them developing that kind of software, yes.

We sell development software.

So as far as that happens within the US or through our resellers in the European basis and they acquire that software from us, yes, we are.

As far as my comment, and don't take this personally, but I think you guys have done a terrific job managing this Company.

And that's the good news.

The bad news is that we are always preaching to the choir.

And you sort of can understand that the same four guys are always on the call, and I just wonder if we can expand our universe to let the world know about our Company.

I think that the world has gotten to know our Company as we continue to execute.

I think our stock compared to our competitors is within the price range where it should trade at.

If you look at the performance of our stock over the last year, I as well as a lot of shareholders are quite pleased with the performance of our stock.

So, again, for me to go out on a road show every two weeks and to meet five investors in some hotel and then try to tell them about our stock, I don't think is a good investment of my time.

Instead, I should go out to software publishers and execute and deliver on the business.

I firmly believe that if you execute -- I don't want to make it a currency.

We are not a $1 billion company yet.

It makes much more sense for all of us here to focus on the business as it is than to worry about the stock price.

Stock price will follow execution.

Execute, and that will follow.

Might be a lag because you don't have the best PR guys out there, but I don't care too much about PR.

I care about execution and staying true to who we are instead of tooting your own horn and try to get more people involved.

People can -- it's an electronic interchange.

People go on the websites more and more.

And the more -- there are actually quite a few new investors that came up because of our dividend yield and because of our performance and growth in net income.

And we continue to focus on that.

And I want to be very clear about that.

Okay.

I understand where you're coming from.

Just to talk about dividend yield, have you ever thought about, as a way to sort of put more liquidity into this Company and that seems to be on the market side, stock market side, perhaps giving a small stock dividend in addition to your cash dividend, which might create some more excitement and also put -- wouldn't be too dilutive and put a little more stock into the marketplace?

That is something that we have discussed and it's something that we continue to discuss, yes.

Okay.

Good job.

Steve Emerson, Emerson Investment.

Let me understand the competitive framework in the industry.

A year or two ago, the issue was there were some distributors willing to sell goods at below cost or at loss levels.

Has that now disappeared or corrected itself?

No, it's still the same.

Then your performance is even more impressive.

Thank you, Steve.

Thank you.

Let me try to slice the sales breakdown a little different way.

You mentioned that 70% of sales are compliant, products that are compliant with virtualization.

The obvious -- the obvious question is, what proportion of sales or sales growth is virtualization tools and security tools, two obviously fast-growing segments?

And as you are well aware of, if I can tell people that this is a company at a very low multiple of earnings, that driven -- half of revenues are driven by these fast-growing segments, that's a very powerful stock market story.

I agree.

I agree.

People know that we are primarily in virtualization, primarily in new products, regardless of whether it being virtualization cloud, new security offerings as well.

Don't forget that.

Applications as well.

We are very strong in that.

We've always been on the forefront in terms of software.

That's our specialty.

When you start a new software publishing company, typically a Programmer's Paradise/TechXtend pops up and Lifeboat pops up as a value-added distributor.

We know that market.

So definitely we continue to play in that, but you know what?

Especially for you, Steve, next quarter I will give you some more revenue numbers.

What I will do is compile those numbers for world view for you, because I think that we can blend.

And I will give those numbers in the call.

How's that?

Jim Stone, PSK Advisors.

Could you give us a little more flavor on what's driving you your growth much more, much faster than the industry?

What I'm thinking about is the possibility or we've had bubbles in all sorts of areas, and I'd like to think that your growth is more due to your planning rather than due to any bubble in the atmosphere.

So whatever you can add in terms of flavor would be helpful.

Our growth is due to our customer service, plain and simple.

Our resellers like -- what happens is the biggest fight, the biggest hurdle that you can take as somebody is opening a door.

Once you sell them one line, once you've sold the one computer, as within TechXtend or Programmer's, once you've sold them that first piece of hardware or software, then people know you.

And then your image is what they deal with on an everyday basis, the person on the phone.

So within Lifeboat, what we do is we go to a software publisher, and the biggest hurdle is signing them on.

That's the biggest hurdle.

Once we've signed them on, they know how we work.

They are very pleasantly pleased with the way we pay them, with the way we work with them, the way we open up new value-added resellers for them, the way we open up markets for them.

And the same thing goes for our resellers.

It's unbelievably hard to go to a new VAR or a new DMR or reseller and open up that business, that first line.

What has happened over the last couple of years is we sell them two or three lines, and they come to us and say, you know, I am very dissatisfied with the service of the competitor, XYZ.

Is there any possibility you could take on that line as well?

That is what has happened over the last couple of years, and that's what's driven and I think will continue to drive our growth.

We service our customers, whether they be software publishers or resellers, very well.

If you do that well on a day-to-day basis, they will give you more business and they will become raving fans and start to tell other people about our services.

So, again, that is our plan.

Okay, thank you.

And let's keep up the good work.

Alan Weinfeld, Kern, Suslow.

Excuse me if this was asked and answered, but can you talk about all of your new developments in the possible Singapore office?

Did the earthquake hold you back at all?

And how did the Latin American road show go that I think you just completed, if I'm correct?

Yes, and we have those regularly.

So Latin America road show is something that we -- considering the Singapore office, or the Asian office, that is something we continue to explore.

Again, as I stated in previous calls, we will not go into that office without any support.

And right now, we are being -- we are able to handle that Asian business without an office.

So we are only going to open an office if it really makes sense for us and if we get the support from our publishers.

As I said, the European office is growing strongly.

Some of the business that they handle is that Asian business as well.

So for us, we are only going to invest in that office if it really makes sense for us.

Having that said, I continue to explore that.

Our Latin America, I think we have somebody in Latin America as we speak.

Carlos is down there right now.

He is in Brazil, Mexico and Colombia.

Yes, Brazil, Mexico and Colombia as we speak.

That's a two-week trip.

But we have those regularly.

So that continues to do well for us.

Great.

And I see you announced earlier it might have been 15%, 20% of sales in the quarter?

Yes, 17% this quarter, 17% international business.

And last Q1, in 2010, that was 16%.

So with the considerable growth that we've had, very good performance.

And can give you us the same statement as before, that you see the business, the last Friday, April after the first month of the quarter as strong as you've see it exiting March 31 of the quarter?

April -- comparing April to April, it gives a good picture.

I've got to tell you, though, as we said before, the comparisons are starting to get a lot more difficult to me because Q1 last year was a quarter where the income from operations was below $1 million.

But it ramped up pretty quickly last year as we had a spectacular year.

So comparatively speaking, Q2, Q3 and definitely Q4 will be a lot tougher.

We know that.

Okay, good.

But having that said, I'm very pleased with the first quarter.

All right.

Thank you very much.

Jim Devlin, Henley & Company.

I just had one -- and speaking of the dividend, now that you guys -- it appears to be clearly earning far more than the stated dividend of $0.16, and 25% of the enterprise side of the Company is cash in the bank, so you guys have a surplus of cash on hand.

As the Company continues to prosper moving forward, I guess in the past traditionally you guys have kind of taken a look at the dividend policy towards the second half of the year.

If trends continue, would we expect to see a higher dividend moving forward?

That's definitely on the table, absolutely.

It's one of the options on the table.

But also, in terms of like using our cash creatively to book more business in terms of those long-term financing deals, that's also definitely on the table.

As long as we can earn a high rate of return for our shareholders, all options are on the table.

And as Peter said before, stock dividend is definitely also on the table to create more liquidity within the market.

Well, as a long-term shareholder, and a pretty sizable one, we would echo those sentiments.

A stock dividend would be appreciated.

And we will look forward to hearing from you in the future.

Absolutely.

Thank you for your support.

And we look forward to reporting our next earnings next quarter.

So, operator, if we can close the call, I would appreciate that.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for participating in today's conference.

This concludes our program for today.

You may all disconnect, and have a wonderful day.

Thank you.