DMC Global Inc (BOOM) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, welcome to the DMC Global fourth-quarter and full-year earnings call.

大家好，歡迎參加 DMC Global 第四季和全年財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions) I'll now turn the conference over to your host, Geoff High, VP of Investor Relations.

（操作員指示）我現在將會議轉交給東道主投資者關係副總裁傑夫·海伊 (Geoff High)。

You may begin.

你可以開始了。

Hello, and welcome to DMC's fourth-quarter conference call.

您好，歡迎參加 DMC 第四季電話會議。

Presenting today, our DMC CEO, Michael Kuta, and Chief Financial Officer, Eric Walter.

今天發表演講的是我們的 DMC 執行長 Michael Kuta 和財務長 Eric Walter。

I'd like to remind everyone that matters discussed during this call may include forward-looking statements that are based on our estimates, projections, and assumptions as of today's date and are subject to risks and uncertainties that are disclosed in our filings with the SEC.

我想提醒大家，本次電話會議中討論的事項可能包括基於我們截至今天的估計、預測和假設的前瞻性陳述，並受到我們向 SEC 提交的文件中披露的風險和不確定性的影響。

Our business is subject to certain risks that could cause actual results to differ materially from those anticipated in our forward-looking statements.

我們的業務面臨某些風險，可能導致實際結果與我們前瞻性陳述中的預期有重大差異。

DMC assumes no obligation to update forward-looking statements that become untrue because of subsequent events.

DMC 不承擔更新因後續事件而變得不真實的前瞻性聲明的義務。

Today's earnings release and related presentation on our fourth quarter performance are available on the Investors page of our website located at dmcglobal.com. A webcast replay of today's presentation will be available at our website shortly after the conclusion of this call.

今天的收益發布和第四季度業績的相關演示可在我們網站的投資者頁面上查看，網址為 dmcglobal.com。本次電話會議結束後不久，我們的網站將提供今天簡報的網路廣播重播。

And with that, I'll now turn the call over to Michael Kuta.

現在，我將把電話轉給麥可·庫塔。

Mike.

麥克風。

Hello, and thank you for joining us for today's call.

您好，感謝您參加我們今天的電話會議。

Our 2023 fourth quarter closed out a pivotal year for DMC.

2023 年第四季對 DMC 來說是關鍵的一年。

Full-year accomplishments included new records for several key financial metrics including sales, adjusted EBITDA, and free cash flow.

全年業績包括銷售額、調整後 EBITDA 和自由現金流等多項關鍵財務指標的新紀錄。

We also made key additions to DMC's leadership team and Board of Directors.

我們也對 DMC 的領導團隊和董事會進行了重要補充。

We enhanced the operating strategies in our three business units while also reducing costs across the organization.

我們增強了三個業務部門的營運策略，同時降低了整個組織的成本。

And we initiated a detailed review of our portfolio strategy as we seek to unlock long-term value for DMC's stakeholders.

我們開始對我們的投資組合策略進行詳細審查，尋求為 DMC 利害關係人釋放長期價值。

Looking at the fourth quarter, our manufacturing businesses reported varying conditions in their industrial end markets.

展望第四季度，我們的製造業務報告了其工業終端市場的不同狀況。

Arcadia, which serves the commercial and high-end residential building products market reported a 9% year-over-year sales decline, which is due principally to lower aluminum prices.

服務於商業和高端住宅建築產品市場的Arcadia報告銷售額年減9%，這主要是由於鋁價下跌。

During the quarter, Arcadia completed the first phase of a paint capacity expansion, a key strategic objective.

本季度，阿卡迪亞完成了塗料產能擴張的第一階段，這是一個關鍵的策略目標。

A second expansion is planned for the back half of this year.

計劃於今年下半年進行第二次擴建。

Current market conditions have led to a soft start to the year at Arcadia, but we believe results will improve throughout the balance of 2024.

目前的市場狀況導致阿卡迪亞今年開局不利，但我們相信 2024 年的表現將會有所改善。

DynaEnergetics, our oilfield products business reported another strong quarter in its international markets.

我們的油田產品業務 DynaEnergetics 在國際市場上再次表現強勁。

This solidified a new full year record for international sales, which were up 28% versus 2022.

這鞏固了國際銷售額新的全年記錄，與 2022 年相比增長了 28%。

In Dyna's North American market, fourth quarter unit sales of our flagship Dyna stage system increased 4% sequentially.

在 Dyna 的北美市場，我們的旗艦產品 Dyna 舞台系統第四季的單位銷售量較上季成長了 4%。

However, customer consolidation led to pricing pressure, reducing our overall EBITDA margins to 12.3%.

然而，客戶整合導致定價壓力，使我們的整體 EBITDA 利潤率降低至 12.3%。

Automation and operational excellence initiatives coming online in 2024 should improve Dyna's profitability.

2024 年上線的自動化和卓越營運計劃應該會提高 Dyna 的獲利能力。

In addition, we expect new premium product offerings will support our margin improvement efforts.

此外，我們預計新的優質產品將支持我們提高利潤率的努力。

Dyna's working to ramp up production of its new Gravity 2.0 perforating system, which is the lightest, most compact, self-orienting system on the market and it's generating strong end-user demand.

Dyna 正在努力提高其新型 Gravity 2.0 射孔系統的產量，該系統是市場上最輕、最緊湊的自定向系統，並且正在產生強勁的最終用戶需求。

NobelClad, our composite metals business delivered another outstanding quarter.

我們的複合金屬業務 NobelClad 又迎來了一個出色的季度。

Sales were up 33% year over year, and adjusted EBITDA margins came in at approximately 25%, reflecting a very, very favorable project mix.

銷售額年增 33%，調整後的 EBITDA 利潤率約為 25%，反映出非常非常有利的專案組合。

NobelClad continues to benefit from healthy activity in its global end markets.

NobelClad 繼續受益於其全球終端市場的健康發展。

It's also capitalizing on strong demand and improved production capabilities for its Cylindra cryogenic transition joints.

它還利用其 Cylindra 低溫過渡接頭的強勁需求和改進的生產能力。

Last month, we formally announced our intent to simplify the DMC portfolio as part of a broader effort to enhance shareholder value.

上個月，我們正式宣布打算簡化 DMC 投資組合，作為提高股東價值的更廣泛努力的一部分。

We are pursuing separate strategic alternatives for DynaEnergetics and NobelClad with the help of our financial advisers.

我們正在財務顧問的幫助下為 DynaEnergetics 和 NobelClad 尋求單獨的策略替代方案。

By streamlining our portfolio, we can sharpen our focus on the growth and profitability of Arcadia, which benefits from a strong brand, a differentiated business model, and a larger addressable market.

透過精簡我們的投資組合，我們可以更加關注阿卡迪亞的成長和獲利能力，阿卡迪亞受益於強大的品牌、差異化的商業模式和更大的潛在市場。

We've also strengthened our capital structure and improved our financial flexibility as we embark on a broad range of growth opportunities at Arcadia.

隨著我們在阿卡迪亞尋求廣泛的成長機會，我們也加強了資本結構並提高了財務靈活性。

I'm excited about the DMC's strategic direction and encouraged by our prospects for long-range growth.

我對 DMC 的策略方向感到興奮，並對我們的長期成長前景感到鼓舞。

I'll now turn the call over to Eric for a closer look at our fourth-quarter financial results and a review of our guidance.

現在，我將把電話轉給埃里克，以詳細了解我們第四季度的財務業績並審查我們的指導。

Eric.

埃里克.

Thanks, Mike.

謝謝，麥克。

Our consolidated fourth quarter sales were $174 million, which is relatively flat with the fourth quarter last year.

我們第四季的綜合銷售額為 1.74 億美元，與去年第四季相對持平。

Consolidated gross margin was 26.1%, up 30 basis points from our 2022 fourth quarter due to a more favorable project mix at NobelClad, combined with margin recovery at Arcadia.

由於 NobelClad 的專案組合更為有利，加上 Arcadia 的利潤率回升，綜合毛利率為 26.1%，較 2022 年第四季成長 30 個基點。

Our fourth quarter SG&A expense of $27 million was 15.6% of sales, down from 17.5% in the fourth quarter of last year, driven mostly by lower litigation expenses and IT consulting fees at Dyna and Arcadia, respectively.

我們第四季的 SG&A 費用為 2,700 萬美元，佔銷售額的 15.6%，低於去年第四季的 17.5%，這主要是由於 Dyna 和 Arcadia 的訴訟費用和 IT 諮詢費用分別下降。

It's important to note that our 2023 fourth quarter SG&A expense also includes $1 million of bad debt expense.

值得注意的是，我們 2023 年第四季的 SG&A 費用還包括 100 萬美元的壞帳費用。

Fourth quarter adjusted EBITDA attributable to DMC remained flat year over year at $20 million as improvements in NobelClad and Arcadia offset a decline at Dyna.

由於 NobelClad 和 Arcadia 的改善抵消了 Dyna 的下滑，第四季度 DMC 調整後的 EBITDA 與去年同期持平，為 2000 萬美元。

Inclusive of the Arcadia's noncontrolling interest, consolidated adjusted EBITDA was $23 million or 13.4% of sales, up 60 basis points versus the prior year quarter.

包括 Arcadia 的非控股權益在內，綜合調整後 EBITDA 為 2,300 萬美元，佔銷售額的 13.4%，比去年同期成長 60 個基點。

At the business level, Arcadia reported fourth quarter adjusted EBITDA of $9 million, of which $5 million or 60% was attributable to DMC.

在業務層面，Arcadia 報告第四季度調整後 EBITDA 為 900 萬美元，其中 500 萬美元或 60% 來自 DMC。

Compared with the prior year, Arcadia's adjusted EBITDA rose 29% and expanded 400 basis points as a percentage of sales.

與前一年相比，Arcadia 調整後的 EBITDA 成長了 29%，佔銷售額的百分比擴大了 400 個基點。

Arcadia's product pricing declined at a slower pace than the drop in aluminum costs, while SG&A also declined through lower ERP consulting fees and other miscellaneous costs.

Arcadia 的產品定價下降速度慢於鋁成本下降速度，而 SG&A 也因 ERP 諮詢費和其他雜項成本下降而下降。

Dyna reported fourth quarter adjusted EBITDA of $9 million or 12.3% of sales, less favorable customer mix and lower absorption of manufacturing overhead costs led to a sequential and year-over-year margin contraction.

Dyna 報告稱，第四季度調整後 EBITDA 為 900 萬美元，佔銷售額的 12.3%，不利的客戶組合和製造管理費用的吸收減少導致利潤率連續和同比收縮。

NobelClad reported adjusted EBITDA of $8 million, which was 24.7% of sales and up 990 basis points compared to the fourth quarter of 2022.

NobelClad 報告調整後 EBITDA 為 800 萬美元，佔銷售額的 24.7%，較 2022 年第四季成長 990 個基點。

EBITDA margin improved due to a more favorable project mix and better absorption of fixed manufacturing overhead costs.

由於更有利的項目組合和更好地吸收固定製造間接費用，EBITDA 利潤率有所改善。

Adjusted net income attributable to DMC was $5 million during the fourth quarter of 2023.

2023 年第四季調整後歸屬於 DMC 的淨利為 500 萬美元。

Adjusted EPS attributable to DMC was $0.26, up 18% compared to last year's fourth quarter.

調整後歸屬於 DMC 的每股收益為 0.26 美元，比去年第四季成長 18%。

During the quarter, DMC generated free cash flow of $15 million, which was an improvement of over 10% compared with the prior year quarter.

本季度，DMC 產生了 1500 萬美元的自由現金流，與去年同期相比增長了 10% 以上。

We used fourth quarter free cash flow, primarily for principal payments on our long-term debt, distributions to our Arcadia joint venture partner, and an investment in marketable securities.

我們使用第四季度的自由現金流，主要用於支付長期債務的本金、向阿卡迪亞合資夥伴的分配​​以及對有價證券的投資。

I should note that in this year's first quarter, we used our investments in marketable securities or de-levering, following the closing of our new $300-million senior secured credit facility.

我應該指出，在今年第一季度，我們在完成新的 3 億美元優先擔保信貸安排後，將投資用於有價證券或去槓桿化。

In terms of liquidity, we ended the fourth quarter with cash and marketable securities of $44 million and had no amounts outstanding under our $50 million revolver.

在流動性方面，第四季結束時，我們擁有 4,400 萬美元的現金和有價證券，並且 5,000 萬美元的循環資金下沒有未償還金額。

Our debt to adjusted EBITDA leverage ratio was 1.25 at the end of the fourth quarter, which was well below our covenant threshold of 3.0. On our pro forma net debt basis after subtracting cash and marketable securities, our leverage ratio was 0.78 at the end of the fourth quarter, which represents the eighth quarter in a row that we have de-levered.

截至第四季末，我們的負債與調整後 EBITDA 槓桿比率為 1.25，遠低於我們 3.0 的契約門檻。在減去現金和有價證券後的備考淨債務基礎上，第四季末我們的槓桿率為0.78，這是我們連續第八個季度去槓桿化。

Now turning to guidance for the first quarter of 2024, consolidated sales are expected in a range of $168 million to $178 million.

現在轉向 2024 年第一季的指導，綜合銷售額預計在 1.68 億美元至 1.78 億美元之間。

As Mike mentioned, we expect market conditions in the first quarter to be soft in Arcadia's key markets, while the activity level in Dyna's North American markets are expected to slightly improve.

正如麥克所提到的，我們預計第一季阿卡迪亞主要市場的市場狀況將疲軟，而 Dyna 北美市場的活動水平預計將略有改善。

First quarter adjusted EBITDA attributable to DMC is expected to be in a range of $15 million to $20 million.

第一季調整後歸屬於 DMC 的 EBITDA 預計將在 1,500 萬美元至 2,000 萬美元之間。

Arcadia and NobelClad's EBITDA margins are expected to moderate to levels similar to the prior year first quarter.

Arcadia 和 NobelClad 的 EBITDA 利潤率預計將降至與去年第一季相似的水平。

And Dyna, where we believe sequential comparisons are more relevant, we anticipate EBITDA margins will improve versus the fourth quarter due to higher sales volumes and lower bad debt expense.

我們認為 Dyna 的連續比較更有意義，我們預計由於銷售增加和壞帳費用降低，EBITDA 利潤率將比第四季有所改善。

With that, we're ready to take any questions from our analysts.

這樣，我們就準備好回答分析師的任何問題了。

Operator.

操作員。

(Operator Instructions) Ken Newman, KeyBanc Capital Markets.

（操作員指示）Ken Newman，KeyBanc 資本市場。

Hey, guys.

大家好。

Thanks for taking the questions.

感謝您提出問題。

I guess my first one will be just on the first quarter guide for Arcadia, and obviously, you're expecting that to be weaker here despite the prior year comps easing sequentially from 4Q to 1Q.

我想我的第一個將只是阿卡迪亞第一季指南，顯然，儘管去年的比較從第四季度到第一季連續放鬆，但您預計這裡會較弱。

Just curious, can you talk a little bit about how much of that is still the pricing drag?

只是好奇，您能談談其中有多少仍然是定價拖累嗎？

Is that completely all of it?

這就是全部了嗎？

Any color on just where volumes are within that business and how they're trending?

有沒有關於該業務中的交易量及其趨勢的資訊？

And what are you seeing from an underlying activity outside of pricing within that business?

您從該業務定價以外的基本活動中看到了什麼？

Yeah, so pricing, so a bit of a drag with aluminum costs we're also seeing in the first quarter.

是的，定價，我們在第一季也看到了鋁成本的一些拖累。

I think it's abating now, but January was challenged with weather.

我認為這種情況現在正在減弱，但一月受到了天氣的挑戰。

So we had and severe rain and flooding on the West Coast, our core markets.

因此，我們的核心市場西海岸遭遇了嚴重的降雨和洪水。

So that impacted January for sure.

所以這肯定影響了一月。

Volume is relatively steady.

成交量相對穩定。

We're seeing a bit of softness in our storefront business.

我們的店面業務有些疲軟。

But I think as we play out on the quarters, 2Q, 3Q, 4Q, we're going to see that strengthening.

但我認為，當我們在第二季、第三季、第四季進行比賽時，我們將看到這種加強。

We're also seeing our project business and outlook there strengthening quite a bit and improving.

我們也看到我們的專案業務和前景得到了很大程度的加強和改善。

So it's a bit of a mixed bag.

所以這有點魚龍混雜。

We also see resi is in a bit of a, I'd say, a valley, and we expect that to pick up throughout the year.

我們還看到，我想說的是，雷西正處於一個低谷，我們預計這一情況將在全年有所回升。

So that's kind of the premise behind the, I guess we'd call it, $67 million to $71 million flattish with 4Q.

所以這就是第四季 6,700 萬至 7,100 萬美元持平背後的前提。

Eric, anything else?

艾瑞克，還有什麼嗎？

No, I think you hit that one.

不，我認為你擊中了那個。

Okay.

好的。

And you touched on it a little bit here, but the follow-up here is, what is the confidence with the comfort that margins improve in Arcadia after the first quarter?

您在這裡稍微提到了這一點，但接下來的問題是，第一季後阿卡迪亞的利潤率改善的信心是什麼？

And obviously, the revenue copy is just pretty significantly starting in the second quarter.

顯然，收入副本從第二季開始就相當顯著。

Just hoping to dig on how much the benefit from the capacity expansion -- can you quantify that benefit here in 2024 versus all the other moving pieces around maybe some stabilizing in pricing or expectations for something you expect, some volume improvement as we move through the year?

只是希望深入了解產能擴張帶來的好處有多大——您能否量化 2024 年相對於所有其他移動部件的好處，可能是定價或對您期望的東西的預期趨於穩定，隨著我們通過年？

Yeah, I think volume is going to help as we go throughout the year.

是的，我認為全年的銷量都會有所幫助。

I think Q2, some of the project business, again, there's some good project mix in there.

我認為第二季度，一些專案業務，裡面有一些很好的專案組合。

There's some unfavorable project mix in there.

其中存在一些不利的項目組合。

But I think what we're going to see is revert back to historical 30%, low 30s, 30%-plus margins in Arcadia again.

但我認為我們將看到阿卡迪亞的利潤率再次恢復到歷史 30%、30 多歲、30% 以上的水平。

It's a high variable cost business so it's not entirely volume driven, but volume will help it as we step throughout the year and an increase in residential as well.

這是一項高可變成本業務，因此並不完全由銷售驅動，但隨著我們全年的發展以及住宅的增加，銷售將對其有所幫助。

Got it.

知道了。

Maybe one more before I jump back in the queue, the free cash flow expectation with volumes being -- or with sales kind of being a little bit lighter here in the first quarter to start the year, how do you think about working capital benefit?

在我重新加入隊列之前，也許還有一個問題，即自由現金流預期，以及今年年初第一季的銷售量有所減少，您如何看待營運資本效益？

And any sense on how you think about free cash flow conversion beyond the first quarter?

您如何看待第一季之後的自由現金流轉換？

Yeah, Ken, this is Eric.

是的，肯，這是艾瑞克。

So for 2023, we had free cash flow conversion of 40% to 45%.

因此，到 2023 年，我們的自由現金流轉換率為 40% 至 45%。

And this year, we're aiming to get that up into the, call it low 50%, low to mid-50% level.

今年，我們的目標是達到低 50%、低到中 50% 的水平。

We do think that there's going to be some tailwinds from working capital.

我們確實認為營運資金將會帶來一些推動作用。

We think that the working capital actually was slightly higher in a couple of the businesses in 2023 than maybe what they needed.

我們認為，2023 年一些企業的營運資金實際上略高於他們可能需要的水平。

So as we go forward in 2024, we think we're going to be able to unwind some of that and you get a benefit the free cash flow line.

因此，當我們展望 2024 年時，我們認為我們將能夠放鬆其中一些，並且您可以從自由現金流量中受益。

Alec Scheibelhoffer, Stifel.

亞歷克·沙伊貝爾霍夫，斯蒂菲爾。

Thanks and good afternoon, everyone, and thanks for taking my question.

謝謝大家，下午好，謝謝您提出我的問題。

So just to start soft here, I was wondering if you could provide just an update on the competitive landscape in the perforating business.

因此，首先，我想知道您是否可以提供有關穿孔業務競爭格局的最新資訊。

Any kind of color you can provide on how pricing is trending, given some of the consolidation we've seen in the market in North America and yeah, just some color around that would be great.

考慮到我們在北美市場上看到的一些整合，你可以提供任何關於定價趨勢的顏色，是的，只要有一些顏色就很好了。

So we've seen some pricing pressure from consolidation in the market so that's been a driver to margins.

因此，我們看到了市場整合帶來的一些定價壓力，這也是利潤率的推動因素。

I think we're seeing that.

我想我們正在看到這一點。

And that's ahead of some of the initiatives we have on margin improvement.

這領先於我們為提高利潤率而採取的一些措施。

So we're putting in a lot of automation here in the first and second quarter.

因此，我們在第一季和第二季投入了大量自動化技術。

That's going to drive better margins and quite frankly, better performance of our perf gun systems.

這將帶來更好的利潤，坦白說，我們的高性能噴槍系統也會有更好的性能。

We've also got quite a bit of CI operational excellence initiatives, cost out that we're implementing this year.

我們今年也實施了相當多的 CI 卓越營運計劃，並降低了成本。

That's going to drive margins.

這將提高利潤率。

And quite frankly, also some new tech in our gun systems, improved product mix.

坦白說，我們的槍支系統中也有一些新技術，改進了產品組合。

That is also going to, I think, drive improvements there as well.

我認為這也將推動那裡的改進。

So I think we're seeing a pretty good market out of the gate here in January and in the first quarter.

因此，我認為我們在一月份和第一季看到了一個非常好的市場。

And so we expect improvements off of 4Q, and we should see a much better profile as we go throughout the year.

因此，我們預計第四季度會有所改善，隨著全年的發展，我們應該會看到更好的情況。

Thank you for that.

謝謝你。

And then just shifting gears to Arcadia, I was just wondering if you could provide some additional color on the outlook for the business.

然後轉向阿卡迪亞，我只是想知道您是否可以就業務前景提供一些額外的資訊。

Just curious, in the past, you've mentioned kind of going after some low-hanging fruit and growing the business organically nicely.

只是好奇，在過去，您提到過追求一些容易實現的目標並有機地發展業務。

The CapEx, if I'm looking correctly for '24 is up a little bit sequentially.

如果我沒看錯的話，24 年的資本支出會連續上升一點。

I'm wondering if that's just speaking to some of that organic growth, if there's any inorganic that you're going after as well.

我想知道這是否只是針對一些有機增長，是否還有您追求的無機增長。

Yeah, so I'd start on the organic side.

是的，所以我會從有機方面開始。

I mean, some of it's SG&A and people investment, we've got to pull through or -- our commercial interiors business and Arcadia custom business, which is the luxury residential side of our business.

我的意思是，其中一些是SG&A和人員投資，我們必須渡過難關——我們的商業室內裝飾業務和阿卡迪亞定制業務，這是我們業務的豪華住宅方面。

The predominant business in Arcadia is commercial exteriors, low-rise storefront.

阿卡迪亞的主要業務是商業外觀、低層店面。

So I think that's going to be part of it.

所以我認為這將是其中的一部分。

I think on the CapEx side, some additional investments in paint as well as anodizing are going to drive both volume as well as margin as we outsource some of our anodizing now.

我認為在資本支出方面，對油漆和陽極氧化的一些額外投資將推動銷售和利潤，因為我們現在外包了一些陽極氧化。

Got it, that's great.

明白了，太好了

And actually, if I could squeeze one more in, shifting back to Dyna.

事實上，如果我能再擠進去一點，回到戴納。

I know you mentioned some automation, some other initiatives you have on the margin front.

我知道您提到了一些自動化，以及您在利潤方面採取的其他一些舉措。

I was just curious, for that business, are you factoring any kind of growth in the business in the US, if activity is relatively flat?

我只是很好奇，對於該業務，如果活動相對平穩，您是否會考慮美國業務的任何成長？

Or how should we kind of think about that on a margin standpoint?

或者我們應該如何從利潤的角度來考慮這個問題？

Yeah, so I think what we're expecting is a fairly sizable growth in the international business.

是的，所以我認為我們預計國際業務將出現相當大的成長。

So we exited 2023 record international sales.

因此，我們退出了 2023 年國際銷售記錄。

We have a record backlog internationally, so we'll see growth there.

我們在國際上的積壓數量創歷史新高，因此我們將看到那裡的成長。

North America, we didn't provide full-year guidance, but it's off to a good start, I'd say.

北美，我們沒有提供全年指導，但我想說，這是一個好的開始。

But I wouldn't -- I'd put a bunch of growth into the North America side, probably more on the flatter side.

但我不會——我會在北美方面投入大量成長，可能更多的是在平坦的方面。

Eric, would you

艾瑞克，你願意嗎？

-- ?

——？

Yeah, just to augment what Mike was saying, I think as you think about the revenue trajectory of that business, I think it's going to be relatively flattish kind of going forward.

是的，為了補充麥克所說的內容，我認為當你考慮到該業務的收入軌跡時，我認為未來的發展將相對平坦。

But when you peel it back and look at the domestic versus international components, there's going to be a bit of a mix there.

但當你把它剝離開來，看看國內和國際的成分時，你會發現其中有一些混合。

Like Mike said, the international piece, we're feel pretty confident about.

正如麥克所說，我們對國際作品充滿信心。

They're showing a lot of upward growth there.

他們在那裡表現出很大的向上增長。

But the North American market is probably going to be a bit flattish, maybe a little bit more sluggish than in years past.

但北美市場可能會有點平淡，可能比過去幾年更低迷。

And again, the international piece is also part of what's driving the margins as well so that's a business that should outperform for us in 2024.

再說一遍，國際業務也是推動利潤率的一部分，因此這項業務在 2024 年應該會跑贏我們。

Got it.

知道了。

That's great color.

那顏色真棒。

With that, I'll turn it back.

有了這個，我會把它轉回來。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thank you.

謝謝。

(Operator Instructions) And in this section we have reached the end of the question-and-answer session.

（操作員說明）在本節中，我們的問答環節已經結束。

And I'll now turn the call back over to Michael Kuta for closing remarks.

現在我將把電話轉回給邁克爾·庫塔（Michael Kuta）做總結發言。

Thank you again for joining today's call.

再次感謝您參加今天的電話會議。

We appreciate your interest in DMC and look forward to updating you in May following our first quarter.

我們感謝您對 DMC 的興趣，並期待在第一季後的 5 月向您通報最新情況。

And this concludes today's conference, and you may disconnect your lines at this time.

今天的會議到此結束，大家可以掛斷電話了。

Thank you for your participation.

感謝您的參與。