(BAM) 2021 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Brookfield Asset Management Third Quarter 2021 Conference Call and Webcast. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝你的支持。歡迎參加布魯克菲爾德資產管理公司 2021 年第三季度電話會議和網絡廣播。 （操作員說明）

Today's conference may be recorded.

今天的會議可能會被錄音。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

I'd now like to hand the conference over to Suzanne Fleming, Managing Partner. Please go ahead.

現在我想將會議交給管理合夥人蘇珊·弗萊明 (Suzanne Fleming)。請繼續。

Thank you, operator, and good morning. Welcome to Brookfield's Third Quarter 2021 Conference Call. On the call today are Bruce Flatt, our Chief Executive Officer; Nick Goodman, our Chief Financial Officer; and Josh Raffaelli, who heads our growth strategy.

謝謝您，接線員，早上好。歡迎參加 Brookfield 2021 年第三季度電話會議。今天參加電話會議的是我們的首席執行官 Bruce Flatt；尼克·古德曼，我們的首席財務官；喬什·拉斐利 (Josh Raffaelli) 負責我們的增長戰略。

Bruce will start off by giving a business update, followed by Nick, who will discuss our financial and operating results for the quarter. And finally, Josh will give an update on the growth strategy.

布魯斯將首先介紹業務最新情況，然後尼克將討論我們本季度的財務和運營業績。最後，喬什將介紹增長戰略的最新情況。

After our formal remarks, we'll turn the call over to the operator and take analyst questions. I'd like to remind you that in today's comments, including in responding to questions and in discussing new initiatives in our financial and operating performance, we may make forward-looking statements. including forward-looking statements within the meaning of applicable Canadian and U.S. securities laws.

在我們正式發言後，我們會將電話轉給接線員並回答分析師的問題。我想提醒您，在今天的評論中，包括在回答問題和討論我們的財務和運營業績的新舉措時，我們可能會做出前瞻性陳述。包括適用的加拿大和美國證券法含義內的前瞻性陳述。

These statements reflect predictions of future events and trends and do not relate to historic events. They're subject to known and unknown risks, and future events and results may differ materially from such statements. For further information on these risks and their potential impacts on our company, please see our filings with the securities regulators in Canada and the U.S. and the information available on our website.

這些陳述反映了對未來事件和趨勢的預測，與歷史事件無關。它們面臨已知和未知的風險，未來的事件和結果可能與此類陳述存在重大差異。有關這些風險及其對我們公司的潛在影響的更多信息，請參閱我們向加拿大和美國證券監管機構提交的文件以及我們網站上提供的信息。

And with that, I'll turn the call over to Bruce.

這樣，我就把電話轉給布魯斯。

Thank you, Suzanne, and welcome, everyone, on the call.

謝謝你，蘇珊娜，歡迎大家來電。

Our results for the quarter were excellent, with distributable earnings of $1.2 billion, taking total earnings for the last 12 months to $6.6 billion. Nick will talk about that later.

我們本季度的業績非常出色，可分配收益為 12 億美元，使過去 12 個月的總收益達到 66 億美元。尼克稍後會談到這一點。

During the quarter, we also completed or advanced a number of strategic initiatives across the business. We monetized numerous mature investments, deployed capital into a number of new opportunities and continued with strong fundraising across the board. I would make an observation, which is that despite the size and scale of the business today, our growth potential seems greater than it has ever been. With our differentiated investment and operating skill set, we have built 5 market-leading businesses that are positioned around global investment themes with secular tailwinds to grow. This gives us conviction in doubling the size of these businesses over the next 5 years.

在本季度，我們還完成或推進了整個業務的多項戰略舉措。我們將大量成熟的投資貨幣化，將資金部署到許多新的機會中，並繼續全面大力籌集資金。我想說的是，儘管今天的業務規模很大，但我們的增長潛力似乎比以往任何時候都大。憑藉我們差異化的投資和運營技能，我們已經建立了 5 個市場領先的業務，這些業務圍繞全球投資主題進行定位，並具有長期增長的動力。這讓我們有信心在未來 5 年內將這些業務的規模擴大一倍。

On top of that, we are adding new growth strategies for the future, insurance solutions, technology transition and secondaries, and we'll touch on a number of these today. The low interest rate environment will continue to push allocations of institutions towards alternatives over time, which is positive for our growth trajectory but also allows us to attract new clients by broadening our product offerings across each of our business.

除此之外，我們還增加了面向未來的新增長戰略、保險解決方案、技術轉型和二級市場，今天我們將討論其中的一些內容。隨著時間的推移，低利率環境將繼續推動機構配置轉向替代方案，這對我們的增長軌跡是積極的，但也使我們能夠通過擴大每項業務的產品範圍來吸引新客戶。

Turning to the market environment for just a moment. With almost all markets lifting restrictions, we have seen a continued reopening of the global economy. This has meant strong GDP growth, improved labor markets and a constructive environment for capital markets activity. Pent-up demand continues to be released. But with disruptions across global -- most global logistics, it has been challenging to match unleased demand with supply, creating increases in prices for at least the time being.

暫時轉向市場環境。隨著幾乎所有市場取消限制，我們看到全球經濟持續重新開放。這意味著GDP的強勁增長、勞動力市場的改善以及資本市場活動的建設性環境。被壓抑的需求持續釋放。但隨著全球範圍內（大多數全球物流）的中斷，將未釋放的需求與供應相匹配一直是一項挑戰，至少暫時導致價格上漲。

We do expect this to stabilize in 2022. Importantly, despite this, the 10-year U.S. Treasury note is still hovering around the mid-1% range. And we expect rates will remain low-ish for longer. This backdrop is a very positive environment for our business, given the nature of real assets and the businesses that we own, which generally benefit from economic growth and have revenues that adjust by contract or with inflation.

我們確實預計這一情況將在 2022 年穩定下來。重要的是，儘管如此，10 年期美國國債仍徘徊在 1% 的中間區間。我們預計利率將在更長時間內保持在較低水平。考慮到我們擁有的實物資產和業務的性質，這種背景對我們的業務來說是一個非常積極的環境，這些資產和業務通常受益於經濟增長，並且收入會根據合同或通貨膨脹進行調整。

As Nick will discuss further, Investment performance has been very strong, and we continue to be active on the monetization front, generating $42 billion in proceeds over the last 12 months. This has allowed us to surpass the preferred hurdle in our early vintage funds, and we now have at least 1 flagship fund across each of our businesses realizing carried interest.

正如尼克將進一步討論的那樣，投資業績一直非常強勁，我們繼續積極參與貨幣化方面的工作，在過去 12 個月內產生了 420 億美元的收益。這使我們能夠跨越早期老式基金的首選障礙，現在我們每個業務中至少有一隻旗艦基金實現了附帶權益。

All monetizations within these funds going forward will drive further carried interest, all of which has been accumulating for years. Valuations in many areas are high. But I would note for you that many are not. This includes numerous non-U.S. markets. I -- just give you an example, India, China, South America as well as some sectors like midstream pipeline.

這些基金未來的所有貨幣化都將進一步推動附帶利息，所有這些利息都已經積累了多年。許多領域的估值都很高。但我想向您指出的是，很多人都不是。這包括許多非美國市場。我只是舉個例子，印度、中國、南美以及中游管道等一些部門。

In addition, we are able to leverage our deep operating capabilities, our flexible capital, our global scale, to find opportunities to deploy capital for value even in growth sectors.

此外，我們能夠利用我們深厚的運營能力、靈活的資本和全球規模，甚至在成長型行業中尋找價值部署資本的機會。

Some examples of the investments recently made include our closing of the inter-pipeline transaction in our infrastructure business and the agreement to acquire a stake in FirstEnergy transmission, both within our various infrastructure funds.

最近進行的投資的一些例子包括我們完成基礎設施業務的管道間交易以及收購 FirstEnergy 輸電公司股權的協議，這兩項交易都屬於我們的各種基礎設施基金。

A $6 billion deal to acquire scientific games in our private equity business and a number of real estate renewable power and credit investments. Over the last 12 months, we have invested or committed over $60 billion of capital. On the other side, fundraising activities have been extremely strong from both a flagship perspective, but as important with respect to our new product offerings.

一項價值 60 億美元的交易，旨在收購我們私募股權業務中的科學遊戲以及一些房地產可再生能源和信貸投資。在過去 12 個月中，我們已投資或承諾了超過 600 億美元的資金。另一方面，從旗艦產品的角度來看，籌款活動非常強勁，但對於我們的新產品供應也同樣重要。

Since the end of last quarter, as noted in our release, we raised $34 billion of capital across our various flagship funds, but also complementary strategies. We currently have 4 out of 5 flagships in the market and are on track to reach our $100 billion target for this round of flagship fundraising and maybe even surpass it.

正如我們在新聞稿中指出的，自上季度末以來，我們通過各種旗艦基金籌集了 340 億美元的資金，同時也採取了補充戰略。目前，我們在市場上擁有五分之四的旗艦產品，有望實現本輪旗艦融資 1000 億美元的目標，甚至可能超越這一目標。

Our flagship fund is -- and our flagship infrastructure fund is also expected to launch fundraising early next year. Efforts in the quarter include raising $9 billion for the flagship real estate fund, $7 billion for the close of our transition fund -- the founder's close of the transition fund, and demand remains strong for these offerings, and we expect to close additional amounts of capital in the coming months.

我們的旗艦基金是——我們的旗艦基礎設施基金也預計將於明年初啟動籌款。本季度的努力包括為旗艦房地產基金籌集 90 億美元，為我們的過渡基金的關閉（創始人關閉過渡基金）籌集 70 億美元，對這些產品的需求仍然強勁，我們預計將關閉更多的資金未來幾個月的資本。

We have been advancing our new strategies and product offerings, all while continuing continuing to scale our existing businesses. Our insurance solutions business, which we spoke at our Investor Day is progressing well and growing quickly. The business has recently closed 2 large block insurance deals for a total of $12 billion of long-dated annuities, and we are now redeploying this capital across a variety of investment strategies, including a number of our Oaktree credit strategies and our Brookfield credit funds.

我們一直在推進我們的新戰略和產品供應，同時繼續擴大我們現有的業務。我們在投資者日上談到的保險解決方案業務進展順利，增長迅速。該公司最近完成了兩項大型大宗保險交易，涉及總計 120 億美元的長期年金，我們現在正在將這筆資金重新部署到各種投資策略中，包括我們的橡樹信貸策略和布魯克菲爾德信貸基金。

The addition of American National group to the business, which is expected to close in the first half of '22 will provide us with an insurance platform from which to grow our presence in the U.S. market. We completed the transition to become the adviser of Brookfield REIT, a public non-listed real estate investment trust last week, which will help us enhance our footprint across the private wealth channel and should attract new investors in the private wealth space.

美國國民集團的加入預計將於 22 年上半年完成，這將為我們提供一個保險平台，從而擴大我們在美國市場的影響力。上週，我們完成了成為布魯克菲爾德房地產投資信託基金（一家公共非上市房地產投資信託基金）顧問的過渡，這將有助於我們擴大在私人財富渠道的影響力，並應該吸引私人財富領域的新投資者。

This product is an income-oriented investment strategy and will invest in high-quality stabilized assets those that we have specialized in for many decades. With 3 newly contributed investment assets from Brookfield to the portfolio, the total value of Brookfield REIT has more than doubled since our purchase to $1 billion, and we are just getting started.

該產品是一種以收益為導向的投資策略，將投資於我們數十年專注的優質穩定資產。隨著布魯克菲爾德向投資組合新註入 3 項投資資產，布魯克菲爾德房地產投資信託基金的總價值自我們購買以來已增加了一倍多，達到 10 億美元，而我們才剛剛開始。

We have also been active with our growth technology strategy, and we held a final close for our second fund for over $500 million this week.

我們還積極實施增長技術戰略，本週我們為第二支基金完成了最終募集，募集資金超過 5 億美元。

Josh Rafale Managing Partner and Head of Growth Strategy, as Suzanne mentioned, is here with us today, and he's going to talk about that. As usual, we have a lot on the go. Thank you all for your support, and I'll hand it over to Nick now.

正如蘇珊提到的，喬什·拉斐爾 (Josh Rafale) 管理合夥人兼增長戰略主管今天也來到我們這裡，他將談論這個問題。像往常一樣，我們有很多事情要做。謝謝大家的支持，現在我就把它交給Nick。

Thank you, Bruce, and good morning, everyone. As Bruce mentioned, our financial performance in the quarter was very strong. We recorded $1.2 billion or $0.77 a share of distributable earnings or DE; operating FFO of $934 million; and net income of $2.7 billion. The total DE generated over the last 12 months is $6.6 billion or $4.23 a share, and that is double the prior 12-month period. The key drivers of the performance are threefold: one, growth in fee-related earnings supported by successful fundraising; two, carried interest realization, underpinned by strong investment performance and monetization activity; and three, stable and growing cash returns on our principal investments.

謝謝你，布魯斯，大家早上好。正如布魯斯提到的，我們本季度的財務業績非常強勁。我們錄得 12 億美元或每股 0.77 美元的可分配收益或 DE； FFO 運營金額為 9.34 億美元；淨利潤為27億美元。過去 12 個月產生的 DE 總額為 66 億美元，即每股 4.23 美元，是前 12 個月期間的兩倍。業績的主要驅動因素有三個：一是成功融資支持的費用相關收入的增長；二是附帶收益的實現，以強勁的投資業績和貨幣化活動為基礎；三是主要投資現金回報穩定且不斷增長。

So starting with fee-related earnings. We currently have 4 of our 5 flagship funds in active fundraising and have a further 25 funds in adjacent strategies also currently in the market. inflows since the end of the second quarter totaled $34 billion, which includes a strong first close for our fourth flagship real estate fund, founder's close for our global transition fund; and inflows in our real estate secondary strategy, insurance solutions business; and across other real estate, infrastructure, private equity and credit funds.

因此，從與費用相關的收入開始。目前，我們的 5 只旗艦基金中有 4 只正在積極籌款，另外 25 只基金目前也在市場上採用相鄰策略。自第二季度末以來的資金流入總額為 340 億美元，其中包括我們的第四個旗艦房地產基金的強勁首次收盤價、我們的全球轉型基金的創始人收盤價；以及我們的房地產二級策略、保險解決方案業務的資金流入；以及其他房地產、基礎設施、私募股權和信貸基金。

Our fee-bearing capital increased by $16 billion to $341 billion at quarter end, and that's an increase of $52 billion over the last 12 months. This has led to strong growth in fee-related earnings, which were $451 million for the 3-month period and totaled $1.8 billion over the last 12 months, an increase of 25% from the prior period. And we expect our fee earnings to continue to grow in the fourth quarter as we raise more capital and receive the incremental fee benefit from fund raise -- funds raised during and subsequent to the third quarter.

截至季度末，我們的收費資本增加了 160 億美元，達到 3410 億美元，比過去 12 個月增加了 520 億美元。這導致與費用相關的收入強勁增長，前 3 個月的收入為 4.51 億美元，過去 12 個月的收入總額為 18 億美元，較上一期增長 25%。我們預計第四季度的費用收入將繼續增長，因為我們籌集了更多資金並從融資中獲得增量費用收益（第三季度期間及之後籌集的資金）。

In addition to the current management fee base, we have $35 billion of additional committed capital that will become fee-bearing once invested, translating to approximately $350 million of incremental annual fee revenues. We maintain our conviction that this next series of flagship fundraising, combined with growth in complementary products, will lead to a step change in our asset management earnings and allow us to double the earnings power of our franchise over the next 5 years.

除了當前的管理費基礎外，我們還有 350 億美元的額外承諾資本，一旦投資，這些資本將成為收費資本，相當於每年約 3.5 億美元的增量年費收入。我們堅信，下一系列的旗艦融資，加上補充產品的增長，將導致我們的資產管理收益發生階躍變化，並使我們的特許經營業務盈利能力在未來 5 年內翻倍。

Moving on to investment performance and monetization activity. We continue to execute on a number of capital recycling initiatives. During the quarter, we realized over $8 billion of proceeds, returning $7 billion to our clients. On the back of this realization activity, we generated $223 million of disposition gains from principal investments and $304 million of realized carried interest.

接下來是投資績效和貨幣化活動。我們繼續執行多項資本回收舉措。本季度，我們實現了超過 80 億美元的收益，向客戶返還 70 億美元。在這一變現活動的支持下，我們從本金投資中獲得了 2.23 億美元的處置收益，並實現了 3.04 億美元的附帶利息。

Over the last 12 months, we have now realized approximately $1.8 billion of gross carried interest compared to $482 million in the prior year period. Our investments performed very well across all our managed funds. We generated around $1 billion of unrealized carried interest in the quarter, increasing the total accumulated carried interest by 16% to $6.9 billion.

在過去 12 個月中，我們已實現約 18 億美元的附帶利息總額，而去年同期為 4.82 億美元。我們所有管理基金的投資表現都非常好。本季度我們產生了約 10 億美元的未實現附帶權益，使累計附帶權益總額增加了 16%，達到 69 億美元。

We expect to recognize this into income over time as we continue to execute on asset sales. And lastly, our principal investments continued to write strong and steady contributions to our distributable earnings. This quarter, distributions from our investments were $572 million, up 19% from the prior year, and the increase was driven primarily by the privatization of BPY as well as higher distributions from our public infrastructure and renewable vehicles.

隨著我們繼續執行資產出售，我們預計會隨著時間的推移將其確認為收入。最後，我們的主要投資繼續為我們的可分配收益做出強勁而穩定的貢獻。本季度，我們的投資分配額為 5.72 億美元，比上年增長 19%，這一增長主要是由於 BPY 私有化以及我們的公共基礎設施和可再生能源汽車分配額增加所致。

Funds from operations or FFO, before realizations, increased 10% since the prior quarter. And the increase was largely driven by the continued growth in our asset management franchise as well as a higher contribution from our real estate business due to the privatization of BPY, and including realizations, FFO grew by 36% to $1.4 billion.

來自運營或 FFO 的資金（在變現之前）自上一季度以來增加了 10%。這一增長主要是由於我們的資產管理業務的持續增長以及由於 BPY 私有化而導致我們的房地產業務的貢獻增加，包括變現在內，FFO 增長了 36% 至 14 億美元。

Our liquidity continues to remain very strong. In addition to $66 billion of uncalled fund commitments, we have approximately $14 billion of core liquidity, including close to $5 billion directly at the BAM level. All of this adds to a total of $80 billion of deployable capital.

我們的流動性仍然非常強勁。除了 660 億美元的未兌現資金承諾外，我們還有大約 140 億美元的核心流動性，其中直接來自 BAM 層面的近 50 億美元。所有這些增加了總計 800 億美元的可部署資本。

During the quarter, we continued to advance our green financing initiatives by issuing $600 million of green bonds due in 2032 and we also published our inaugural green bond and preferred securities framework, which is available on our website.

本季度，我們繼續推進綠色融資計劃，發行了 2032 年到期的 6 億美元綠色債券，我們還發布了首個綠色債券和優先證券框架（可在我們的網站上獲取）。

The proceeds from the green bonds will be allocated to eligible green investments, as outlined by our framework.

正如我們的框架所述，綠色債券的收益將分配給符合條件的綠色投資。

Our balance sheet remains conservatively capitalized with 94% of our debt having no recourse to the corporation and a debt-to-market capitalization ratio of 11%. With $5 billion of core liquidity, $65 billion of investments and $3.6 billion of annual distributable earnings before realizations, we retain significant core financial strength to pursue strategic growth or to buy back shares.

我們的資產負債表仍保持保守資本化，94% 的債務對公司沒有追索權，債務與市值比率為 11%。憑藉 50 億美元的核心流動性、650 億美元的投資和 36 億美元的變現前年度可分配收益，我們保留了巨大的核心財務實力來追求戰略增長或回購股票。

Before I hand the call over to Josh, I am pleased to confirm that our Board of Directors has declared a $0.13 per share dividend payable at the end of December. Josh?

在我將電話轉交給喬什之前，我很高興地確認我們的董事會已宣佈在 12 月底支付每股 0.13 美元的股息。喬什？

Great. And thank you, Nick, and good morning, everyone. I am pleased to be here with you today to provide an update on our technology and growth investing initiative that we've been patiently building since 2016. Over these last 5 years, has developed into a meaningful business for Brookfield that we will continue to scale over time. having deployed over $1 billion in portfolio into a portfolio of technology and growth stage companies that are building solutions to transform mission-critical industries where Brookfield has decades of experience as an owner and operator.

偉大的。謝謝你，尼克，大家早上好。我很高興今天能與大家一起介紹我們自2016 年以來一直耐心構建的技術和增長投資計劃的最新情況。在過去5 年裡，該計劃已發展成為布魯克菲爾德一項有意義的業務，我們將繼續擴大規模隨著時間的推移。布魯克菲爾德已將超過10 億美元的投資組合部署到技術和成長期公司的投資組合中，這些公司正在構建解決方案以改造關鍵任務行業，布魯克菲爾德在這些行業擁有數十年的所有者和運營商經驗。

Real estate, infrastructure, power and the many sectors where our private equity and credit businesses operate, give us a unique opportunity to be advantaged by these changes as both adopter and investor. As the backdrop to Brookfield Growth Partners, enterprises everywhere are increasingly turning to innovation as a means to increase productivity, grow profitability and build competitive differentiation.

房地產、基礎設施、電力以及我們私募股權和信貸業務運營的許多行業，為我們提供了獨特的機會，使我們能夠作為採用者和投資者從這些變化中獲益。作為 Brookfield Growth Partners 的背景，世界各地的企業越來越多地將創新作為提高生產力、增加盈利能力和建立競爭優勢的手段。

Brookfield is no exception, and as highlighted last month during our Investor Day, technology adoption and investing has increasingly come to focus across all of our business lines. These trends were accelerated during the pandemic, when digital solutions went from a nice-to-have to a must-have, and it became the core of the economy's resiliency and accelerating recovery.

布魯克菲爾德也不例外，正如上個月在投資者日期間強調的那樣，技術採用和投資已日益成為我們所有業務線的焦點。這些趨勢在疫情期間加速，數字解決方案從“可有可無”變為“必備”，並成為經濟彈性和加速復甦的核心。

Many of our operating companies experienced exponential growth and corresponding enterprise value enhancement. What was most exciting was that this was a catalyst moment for the intersection of real assets and innovation. We believe that this growing momentum will create an immense investment opportunities for growth and technology investors and an exciting opportunity for investment.

我們的許多運營公司都經歷了指數級的增長和相應的企業價值提升。最令人興奮的是，這是實物資產與創新交叉的催化劑時刻。我們相信，這種增長勢頭將為增長和技術投資者創造巨大的投資機會，也是令人興奮的投資機會。

With the accelerating macro, Brookfield Growth Partners was built on 2 guiding principles. First, our long institutional history of owning assets and operating businesses creates a unique vantage point and identifying and accessing world-class technology companies.

隨著宏觀經濟的加速發展，Brookfield Growth Partners 建立在兩條指導原則之上。首先，我們擁有資產和經營業務的悠久制度歷史創造了獨特的優勢，可以識別和接觸世界一流的科技公司。

We visually understand the pain points technology businesses operating in our core sectors are looking to solve and therefore, understand which opportunities can help resolve these.

我們直觀地了解在核心行業運營的技術企業正在尋求解決的痛點，因此了解哪些機會可以幫助解決這些問題。

Second, when we provide capital to these companies and couple them with access to Brookfield's ecosystem as a means of value creation, it creates a structural advantage that's lacking and generalist growth equity investing.

其次，當我們向這些公司提供資金並將其與布魯克菲爾德生態系統結合起來作為價值創造的手段時，它創造了一種普遍的增長型股權投資所缺乏的結構性優勢。

We create enterprise value in the companies we partner with as customer channel or validation capital. The enterprise value enhancement improves our returns and significantly derisks our investments. These foundational principles have created a great start for our business, channeling our many decades of experience and a thoughtful approach to investing into the technology enablement on the built environment.

我們為合作夥伴創造企業價值，作為客戶渠道或驗證資本。企業價值的提升提高了我們的回報並顯著降低了我們的投資風險。這些基本原則為我們的業務創造了一個良好的開端，將我們數十年的經驗和深思熟慮的方法用於投資建築環境的技術支持。

The enterprise value enhancement that Brookfield provides touches every part of the investment process. sourcing, underwriting, portfolio management and exit.

布魯克菲爾德提供的企業價值提升涉及投資過程的每個部分。採購、承銷、投資組合管理和退出。

In sourcing, we leverage Brookfield's group of 150,000 operating employees to discern scaled and global investment themes that touch the $650 billion of assets and the hundreds of operating companies that we control. Those thematic statements turn into outbound and proactive approach to proprietary investment processes in which we partner with our Brookfield operating employees, who bring their industry expertise alongside our diligence with the lens of being an actual user.

在採購方面，我們利用 Brookfield 的 150,000 名運營員工團隊來辨別規模化的全球投資主題，這些主題涉及我們控制的 6500 億美元資產和數百家運營公司。這些主題陳述變成了對外和主動的專有投資流程，在該流程中，我們與布魯克菲爾德的運營員工合作，他們以實際用戶的視角，將他們的行業專業知識與我們的勤奮結合起來。

As an underwriter, we have something no other growth investors have: we can get our operating companies within Brookfield to pilot technologies and get real and undiluted feedback to mitigate technology risk and enhance execution capabilities. This significantly differentiates our capital as customer and advocate and ensures we are able to price risk.

作為承銷商，我們擁有其他成長型投資者所不具備的東西：我們可以讓布魯克菲爾德境內的運營公司進行技術試點，並獲得真實且未經稀釋的反饋，以降低技術風險並增強執行能力。這顯著區分了我們作為客戶和倡導者的資本，並確保我們能夠對風險進行定價。

As a manager and steward of capital for our LPs, we can steer product development and organic growth strategies and source inorganic acquisitions to maximize top line performance. Below the top line, we are able to leverage best practice from Brookfield's deep operational bench strength that use the same value creation plan we pride ourselves on as an asset manager to help the companies we partner with grow and scale. The $1 billion of investment across multiple funds holds interest in privately held, growth stage software and enterprise technology companies that are growing revenues at 30% plus on average year-on-year.

作為有限合夥人的資本管理者和管理者，我們可以指導產品開發和有機增長戰略，並進行無機收購，以最大限度地提高營收績效。在營收之下，我們能夠利用布魯克菲爾德深厚的運營實力的最佳實踐，使用我們作為資產管理公司引以自豪的相同價值創造計劃來幫助我們合作的公司成長和擴大規模。多個基金的 10 億美元投資持有處於成長期的私營軟件和企業技術公司的興趣，這些公司的收入平均同比增長 30% 以上。

In many cases, our early growth companies grow well in excess of 100% year-over-year, where our core growth companies are those closer to a monetization event and stabilize cash flows grow 30% to 50%.-- We focus on companies that have been significantly derisked, meaning that they have proven technologies, are market leaders with durable competitive moats, obtained, contracted or heavily recurring revenue streams, and most importantly, are generating very attractive unit economics that are repeatable at scale.

在很多情況下，我們的早期成長型公司同比增長超過100%，其中我們的核心成長型公司是那些更接近貨幣化事件且穩定現金流增長30%到50%的公司。--我們專注於公司這些企業已經大大降低了風險，這意味著它們擁有成熟的技術，是擁有持久競爭護城河的市場領導者，獲得的、承包的或大量經常性的收入流，最重要的是，它們正在產生非常有吸引力的可大規模重複的單位經濟效益。

Lastly and most importantly, we believe that our ability to leverage our operating expertise and embedded customer base,further creates downside protections that are critical for our franchise to succeed. While it's still early innings, we've had 2 full realizations, half of our portfolio has significantly -- has had significant valuation gains from third parties, and the track record is performing well ahead of plan, in line with Brookfield's compound growth rate.

最後也是最重要的是，我們相信，我們利用我們的運營專業知識和嵌入的客戶群的能力，進一步創造了對我們的特許經營成功至關重要的下行保護。雖然現在還處於早期階段，但我們已經有2 次完全實現，我們的投資組合中有一半已經從第三方獲得了顯著的估值收益，而且業績記錄的表現遠遠超出了計劃，與布魯克菲爾德的複合增長率一致。

Behind the $1 billion of investments, and with a dedicated team, we have viewed over $50 billion of actionable proprietary opportunities made up of thousands of businesses that we monitor constantly. Our diligent and pragmatic business building has created a cannabis for a much greater scale, both within the growth vertical, but also in more mature forms of investing.

在這 10 億美元的投資背後，以及一支專門的團隊，我們發現了超過 500 億美元的可操作的專有機會，這些機會由我們不斷監控的數千家企業組成。我們勤奮務實的業務建設創造了更大規模的大麻，無論是在垂直增長領域，還是更成熟的投資形式。

Our investors should expect to hear more about our technology-related investing activities over the coming years in many of our business units and in particular, within our private equity group. We will continue to build a durable and differentiated business and technology investing that finds value across all parts of the company's life cycle as a scaled partner.

我們的投資者應該期望在未來幾年中聽到更多有關我們許多業務部門，特別是我們的私募股權集團內與技術相關的投資活動的信息。我們將繼續建立持久且差異化的業務和技術投資，作為規模化合作夥伴在公司生命週期的各個方面尋找價值。

For today's call, we thought it would be helpful to highlight 2 investments representative of our approach to the sector and asset class. First is a business we invested in 2018 called Latch, a public company that's a maker of smart lock and digital access control software for residential applications in the United States. This investment was the result of many years of close work with our multifamily operating employees.

在今天的電話會議中，我們認為重點介紹代表我們對該行業和資產類別的方法的兩項投資將會有所幫助。首先是我們在 2018 年投資的一家名為 Latch 的公司，這是一家上市公司，是美國住宅應用智能鎖和數字門禁軟件的製造商。這項投資是我們與多戶型經營員工多年密切合作的結果。

We're looking for ways in which technology could enhance net operating income, either as an amenity driver, driving greater revenue or as an efficiency driver to reduce costs. Smart locks serve both. They are highly visible and desired for tenants and also solve some significant management challenges for problems such as managing resident access, offering remote showings and package and delivery management.

我們正在尋找技術能夠提高淨營業收入的方法，無論是作為便利設施驅動因素，增加收入，還是作為效率驅動因素，降低成本。智能鎖兼具兩者。它們非常引人注目，深受租戶歡迎，還解決了一些重大的管理挑戰，例如管理居民訪問、提供遠程展示以及包裹和交付管理。

These needs led our group to seek technology-first vendors that can design both hardware and software to create new means of access. Latch stood out amongst a long list of legacy providers as a disruptive start-up quickly gaining market share in the multifamily sector. We combined our commercial and capital efforts to lead the company's $50 million growth round in 2018, joining the Board and commercially agreeing to purchase several thousand Latch units for our multifamily portfolio. This created a step function in growth and through our ability to adopt technology in our own assets, meaning the Brookfield's involvement in earlier-stage business, can create significant competitive advantages long term. And that's exactly what happened.

這些需求促使我們團隊尋求技術優先的供應商，這些供應商可以設計硬件和軟件來創建新的訪問方式。 Latch 作為一家顛覆性初創企業，在眾多傳統供應商中脫穎而出，迅速贏得了多戶住宅領域的市場份額。我們結合商業和資本努力，在 2018 年領導了公司 5000 萬美元的增長輪，加入董事會並在商業上同意為我們的多戶型投資組合購買數千個 Latch 單元。這創造了增長的階梯功能，並通過我們在自己的資產中採用技術的能力，這意味著布魯克菲爾德參與早期業務，可以創造顯著的長期競爭優勢。事實正是如此。

And through the course of the following 3 years, the company's annual bookings grew tenfold, which drove significant sales growth and eventual public listing earlier this year. The equity valuation of Latch during this time increased several times from our initial entry price, creating a strong return on our investment and further solidified our thesis the Brookfield ecosystem can accelerate the trajectory of growth-stage technology companies and drive returns for investors.

在接下來的三年裡，該公司的年度預訂量增長了十倍，這推動了銷售的顯著增長，並最終在今年早些時候公開上市。在此期間，Latch 的股權估值比我們最初的入場價格增長了數倍，為我們的投資創造了強勁的回報，並進一步證實了我們的論點：Brookfield 生態系統可以加速成長階段科技公司的發展軌跡，並為投資者帶來回報。

Another example is our recent investment in -- with the residential solar market through our partnership with a company called GoodLeap, the largest digital first solar loan originator in the United States.

另一個例子是我們最近通過與一家名為 GoodLeap 的公司合作對住宅太陽能市場進行投資，該公司是美國最大的數字首次太陽能貸款發起人。

Across our renewables, properties and infrastructure businesses, we have seen firsthand growth in solar adoption. Residential solar is a particular interest and continues to be a fast-growing end market that we at Brookfield have been involved with for many years. GoodLeap created a software ecosystem for homeowners to access low-cost financing, planning and purchasing and installing solar. 8,000 contractors are standardized on GoodLeap's technology for proprietary origination. GoodLeap also created software for working with the capital markets at scale.

在我們的可再生能源、房地產和基礎設施業務中，我們親眼目睹了太陽能應用的增長。住宅太陽能是一個特別令人感興趣的領域，並且仍然是一個快速增長的終端市場，我們布魯克菲爾德多年來一直參與其中。 GoodLeap 創建了一個軟件生態系統，幫助房主獲得低成本融資、規劃、購買和安裝太陽能。 8,000 家承包商採用 GoodLeap 的專有技術進行標準化。 GoodLeap 還開發了用於大規模與資本市場合作的軟件。

Today, the business has grown to the #1 financing partner in the United States of solar and is quickly building share in storage and other forms of energy efficiency. The financial profile is just as exciting, growing well at north of 50%, while being tremendously cash flow positive. This has led to an already significant multiple on our invested capital in under 1 year since investing.

如今，該業務已發展成為美國第一大太陽能融資合作夥伴，並迅速擴大在存儲和其他形式能源效率方面的份額。財務狀況同樣令人興奮，增長超過 50%，同時現金流量也非常強勁。這使得我們的投資資本在投資後不到一年的時間裡就已經實現了顯著的倍數增長。

These 2 examples are just many in our portfolio -- are just some of many in our portfolio today that represent our unique approach to growth equity. We have designed this program by leveraging our core values of staying disciplined, patient and constantly seeking opportunities where we are differentiated, value-added capital partner.

這兩個例子只是我們投資組合中的許多例子——只是我們今天投資組合中代表我們獨特的增長股權方法的一些例子。我們利用我們的核心價值觀設計了這個計劃，即保持紀律、耐心並不斷尋找機會，讓我們成為差異化的增值資本合作夥伴。

And because of our scaled balance sheet and $650 billion of assets around the world, we'll be able to access some of the highest-quality technologies in the world -- technology companies in the world, and we expect that this will continue at a larger scale in the future. This access is leading to a very strong start for our growth equity business. Thank you all for your time, and I'll turn the call back over to the operator for questions.

由於我們規模化的資產負債表和全球 6500 億美元的資產，我們將能夠獲得世界上一些最優質的技術——世界上的科技公司，我們預計這種情況將繼續以未來規模更大。此次訪問為我們的成長型股權業務帶來了良好的開端。感謝大家抽出寶貴的時間，我會將電話轉給接線員詢問問題。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from Alex Blostein with Goldman Sachs.

（操作員說明）我們的第一個問題來自高盛的 Alex Blostein。

So maybe taking a little bit of a step back, lots of moving pieces in the quarter with the reporting changes and whatnot. But I guess when I think about third-party capital, between privatization of BPY and the insurance build out, there are a lot of entities that BAM now essentially owns 100% of on balance sheet, but that are on the reporting convention pay a fee to BAM as well.

因此，也許可以退一步，本季度有很多變化，包括報告的變化等等。但我想，當我想到第三方資本時，在 BPY 私有化和保險建設之間，BAM 現在在資產負債表上基本上擁有很多實體 100% 的股份，但按照報告慣例，這些實體需要支付費用也到BAM。

So I think it would be helpful just to say out of the $341 billion of fee-bearing capital that you guys report, how much of that fee bearing is ultimately related to entities that BAM owns mostly on balance sheet? So call it, 90-plus percent ownership? Just to kind of help us set the stage a little bit.

因此，我認為，在你們報告的 3,410 億美元的收費資本中，有多少費用最終與 BAM 在資產負債表上擁有的實體相關，會有所幫助？這麼說吧，90%以上的所有權？只是為了幫助我們做好一些準備。

Alex, yes, listen, I mean the insurance is just getting started. And I think -- listen, we've been through this in the past, and we do footnote it in our materials. It's around $50 billion comes from those entities. But I think we've talked about this distributable earnings being the focus. The focus is really on the free cash flow generation from our businesses and the cash that we are earning and is generating a really strong return on capital. And so it's distributable to our earnings. I mean if the cash is paid off as distributions or management fees, it's still cash that we are earning on a perpetual capital basis, very high-quality cash flow and it's reflective of market rates for those management fees. So the answer is $50 billion, but I'm not sure we think of it in a differentiated manner.

亞歷克斯，是的，聽著，我的意思是保險才剛剛開始。我認為 - 聽著，我們過去已經經歷過這種情況，並且我們確實在我們的材料中對其進行了腳註。大約 500 億美元來自這些實體。但我認為我們已經討論過可分配收益是焦點。重點實際上是我們業務產生的自由現金流以及我們賺取的現金以及正在產生非常強勁的資本回報。所以它可以分配到我們的收入中。我的意思是，如果現金作為分配或管理費支付，它仍然是我們在永續資本基礎上賺取的現金，非常高質量的現金流，並且反映了這些管理費的市場利率。所以答案是 500 億美元，但我不確定我們是否以差異化的方式來考慮它。

Got it. And then some of the strategic initiatives you guys highlighted, maybe we can start with Brookfield REIT launch here in the fourth quarter? Can you help us, I guess, with the NAV? And what did you ultimately move into that vehicle from Oaktree?

知道了。然後你們強調的一些戰略舉措，也許我們可以從第四季度推出布魯克菲爾德房地產投資信託基金開始？我想你能幫助我們了解資產淨值嗎？您最終從橡樹資本搬進了那輛車裡的是什麼？

Talk to us a little bit about your distribution plans. Sort of what are the platforms that you're on now? Kind of what are you doing with the wirehouses? Are you on any of the wirehouse platforms today? And if you kind of think about the opportunity set for Brookfield REIT over the next 6 to 12 months, what are you guys shooting for in terms of the monthly inflow opportunity set? .

與我們談談您的分銷計劃。您現在使用的平台有哪些？你在用電線室做什麼？您今天使用過任何wirehouse 平台嗎？如果您考慮一下布魯克菲爾德房地產投資信託基金在未來 6 至 12 個月內所設置的機會，那麼就每月流入機會而言，你們的目標是什麼？ 。

Yes. Sure, Alex. I can start on that one. So we transferred about $1 billion of assets into the vehicle at the start. So that's the size of the entity today. And really just taking a step back, we've talked about combining our wealth solutions platform that was previously in 3 different spots in the business, and we put it together with Oaktree to create Brookfield Oaktree wealth Solutions, that should have tremendous reach and as of the 60 professionals today and is working with all of the major banks with wealth retail networks with various products. And so we think this will provide tremendous leverage to our business and tremendous scale. -- from the retail channel over time, and we're developing and advancing product products specifically for that channel, the nontraded REIT being one of them.

是的。當然，亞歷克斯。我可以從那一個開始。所以我們一開始就將大約10億美元的資產轉移到了這輛車上。這就是今天實體的規模。實際上，退一步來說，我們已經討論過將之前位於業務中3 個不同領域的財富解決方案平台結合起來，我們將其與橡樹資本結合起來創建布魯克菲爾德橡樹財富解決方案，該解決方案應該具有巨大的影響力，並且作為目前擁有 60 名專業人士，並與所有擁有財富零售網絡的主要銀行合作，提供各種產品。因此，我們認為這將為我們的業務和巨大的規模提供巨大的影響力。 ——隨著時間的推移，來自零售渠道，我們正在開發和改進專門針對該渠道的產品，非交易房地產投資信託基金就是其中之一。

And I think if you just think about this specifically, we've transferred it to Brookfield, where, as you know, and we are one of the largest real estate managers and investors in the world and the scale and the scope of our business is really unrivaled. And if you think about everything else that we do in our business around real estate, the scale and potential of the offering that we have is really tremendous, And we think it will really appeal to investors and to banks to get it onto the platform. And we have really, really high hopes.

我想如果你具體考慮一下這個問題，我們已經把它轉移到了布魯克菲爾德，正如你所知，我們是世界上最大的房地產管理公司和投資者之一，我們業務的規模和範圍是確實無與倫比。如果你考慮一下我們在房地產業務中所做的所有其他事情，我們所提供的產品的規模和潛力確實是巨大的，而且我們認為它將真正吸引投資者和銀行將其納入該平台。我們抱有非常非常高的希望。

How much that will be, will tell. But we know there's significant capital in the retail channel, looking for a product like this. And really, we have something that's unrivaled in the space.

那會是多少，會告訴你的。但我們知道零售渠道有大量資本在尋找這樣的產品。事實上，我們擁有該領域無與倫比的東西。

Great. And then if I could just squeeze in one more around the capital return dynamic. I think over the last couple of quarters, we talked about the opportunity you see for share repurchases given the fact that you guys are generating a lot more cash flow in the business, which seems to be certainly only increasing from here given the outlook for carried interest and things like that.

偉大的。然後我是否可以在資本回報動態方面再擠進一個。我認為在過去的幾個季度中，我們討論了您看到的股票回購機會，因為你們在業務中產生了更多的現金流，考慮到持有的前景，現金流似乎肯定只會從現在開始增加。興趣之類的東西。

So when we look at the fully diluted share count, obviously, there are some deals that drove that higher over the last few quarters. The path from here, should we expect you guys to be a lot more aggressive to actually drive the total share count down over the next 12, 24 months? Or is the goal to maybe be a little more gradual and keep it flattish?

因此，當我們查看完全稀釋的股票數量時，顯然，有一些交易在過去幾個季度推動了這一數字的上升。從這裡開始，我們是否應該期望你們在未來 12、24 個月內更加積極地推動總股數下降？或者目標是更加漸進並保持平坦？

Yes. I mean listen, it's dependent. It's capital allocation opportunities. Right now, we have really, really good opportunities to reinvest that capital back into the business, as we mentioned, things like buying an insurance platform in the U.S. But you're right, as carry continues to pick up and the business is growing, the free cash flow is just compounding and growing every single year, and it will grow again from here. So there will be excess cash flow, and the plan is to buyback shares.

是的。我的意思是聽著，這是依賴的。這是資本配置機會。現在，我們有非常非常好的機會將這些資本重新投資回業務，正如我們提到的，例如在美國購買保險平台之類的事情。但你是對的，隨著利差持續回升，業務不斷增長，自由現金流每年都在復合增長，並且將從現在開始再次增長。所以現金流會過剩，計劃就是回購股票。

And I think we've said in the past, we do plan, over time, to retire the shares that were issued recently for recent acquisitions. And so whether it's 1, 2 or in the next 3 to 5 years, that is the intention.

我想我們過去曾說過，隨著時間的推移，我們確實計劃退役最近為近期收購而發行的股票。所以無論是1年、2年還是未來3到5年，這都是我們的意圖。

Our next question comes from Ken Worthington with JPMorgan.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根大通的肯·沃辛頓。

It looks like the fundraising and the perpetual funds stepped up this quarter and it could suggest that something has changed. Could the marketing of the flagship products be driving more interest in these perpetual funds rather than the other option, which would be to crowd out those investments?

看起來本季度的籌款和永續基金有所增加，這可能表明情況發生了變化。旗艦產品的營銷是否會激發人們對這些永續基金的更多興趣，而不是其他選擇，即排擠這些投資？

And do you have any insights on the stronger level of these non-flagship fundraising this quarter? And maybe how the emergence from COVID-related travel restrictions could be influencing these fund sales?

您對本季度這些非旗艦融資的強勁水平有何見解？也許與新冠病毒相關的旅行限制的出現會如何影響這些基金的銷售？

Yes. Thanks, Ken. No, it's a great question. And I actually believe that what we are doing with the flagships and the complementary strategies, it is tremendously additive, highly, highly additive to the franchise because we're in front of our clients talking to them with multiple products, and they have different pools of capital with different risk appetite, different requirement for value versus yield and growth.

是的。謝謝，肯。不，這是一個很好的問題。我實際上相信，我們正在做的旗艦產品和補充戰略，對特許經營權來說是巨大的附加，高度附加，因為我們在客戶面前用多種產品與他們交談，而他們有不同的產品池具有不同風險偏好、對價值與收益率和增長的不同要求的資本。

And so I think it's very, very additive that we can have a number of active conversations with our peers. And I think we launched some of our perpetual vehicles over the last few years, and they've been building scale and now they are really, really delivering, both in terms of deal flow and conversations around fundraising. And they are able to attract new clients to the business and then cross-sell into even our flagship. So I think that it's all very additive.

因此，我認為我們可以與同行進行大量積極的對話，這是非常非常有益的。我認為我們在過去幾年中推出了一些永久性工具，它們一直在擴大規模，現在無論是在交易流程還是圍繞籌款的對話方面，它們都確實非常有效。他們能夠吸引新客戶加入該業務，然後交叉銷售甚至我們的旗艦產品。所以我認為這都是非常累加的。

And in the quarter, big contributors would have been our infrastructure perpetual vehicle, our public vehicle and infrastructure-issued securities, which were very well subscribed. And so that was a major contributor into the quarter, but just generally, and there is tremendous momentum now around this area for us.

在本季度，主要貢獻者將是我們的基礎設施永續工具、我們的公共工具和基礎設施發行的證券，這些證券的認購量非常大。因此，這是本季度的主要貢獻者，但總的來說，現在我們在這一領域有巨大的動力。

Okay. And then I think you mentioned at least 1 flagship fund in each category is in carry. Of the, call it, $6.9 billion of accrued carry, how much is in funds that are ready to take cash carry at this point?

好的。然後我認為您提到每個類別中至少有一隻旗艦基金處於套利狀態。在 69 億美元的應計利差中，目前準備好接受現金利差的基金中有多少？

We're building towards it. I think in our material, we do talk about what could be realized over the next few years, and I think it was $2 billion to $3 billion over the next 3 to 5 years, but that's really based on pace of sales and asset sales. And in the market that we're in, some of that could be accelerated. But it's our early vintage funds, our first real estate fund, our first infrastructure fund and our fourth, which was our biggest -- our first large-scale private equity fund are still monetizing assets and still realizing carry.

我們正在朝著這個目標努力。我認為在我們的材料中，我們確實討論了未來幾年可以實現的目標，我認為未來 3 到 5 年將達到 20 億到 30 億美元，但這實際上是基於銷售和資產銷售的速度。在我們所處的市場中，其中一些可能會加速。但這是我們的早期基金，我們的第一隻房地產基金，我們的第一隻基礎設施基金，以及我們最大的第四隻基金——我們的第一隻大型私募股權基金仍在將資產貨幣化並實現套利。

And then those mix vintage funds, as we monetize, we'll move towards that preferred return and be able to start realizing. So I think it's -- we lay it out of what it will be in the next 5 years, but I'd say that we're tracking really well against those numbers.

然後，當我們貨幣化時，這些混合老式基金將朝著首選回報邁進，並能夠開始實現。所以我認為，我們對未來 5 年的情況進行了規劃，但我想說，我們對這些數字的追踪非常好。

Our next question comes from Sohrab Movahedi with BMO.

我們的下一個問題來自 BMO 的 Sohrab Movahedi。

Two questions. First one on private credit. I think you've highlighted in the shareholder letter that it is a source of growth, presumably at the expense of commercial banks and the like. I guess if you could just provide some quantification as to what sort of a growth you're expecting from that over the next, call it, 5 years? And what will that do to the overall dynamics of the fee rate and fee margins and the like at the broader Brookfield level? So that's question number one.

兩個問題。第一個是關於私人信貸的。我認為您在股東信中強調了它是增長的源泉，但可能是以犧牲商業銀行等為代價的。我想您能否提供一些量化數據，說明您預計未來（即 5 年）會出現什麼樣的增長？這會對更廣泛的布魯克菲爾德層面的費率和費率等的整體動態產生什麼影響？這是第一個問題。

And then I'll have a second one around stagflation,please.

然後我將就滯脹問題進行第二次演講。

So I'll maybe just -- Bruce, I'll take the first one and just say that the question. Nick just state the question again.

所以我可能會——布魯斯，我會回答第一個問題，然後說這個問題。尼克再次提出問題。

So Sohrab, can you state the question again?

索拉博，你能再說一遍這個問題嗎？

Yes, I just wanted to get a bit more maybe color around the private credit opportunity that you've highlighted in the shareholder letter, just to kind of get a bit of a quantification around it over the next 5 years? And what sort of implications will that have to your broader I'll call it, kind of standardized ratios that we look at. Whether it's the, call it, margins and fee-related margins and the like?

是的，我只是想對您在股東信中強調的私人信貸機會有更多的了解，只是為了在未來 5 年內對其進行一些量化？這會對更廣泛的領域產生什麼樣的影響，我將其稱為我們所關注的標準化比率。是否是所謂的利潤率和與費用相關的利潤率之類的？

I got it. So first, I'd say on the private credit side, I don't think it's taking anything from the banks. What's happening globally is that Institutional clients used to have large sums of money invested into fixed income instruments. And they weren't -- these weren't competing with the banks, they were buying government securities, and they earned 4% or 5%, owning a government security for 6% or 8% historically. Today, they can't put that money into government securities and earn a reasonable return. So the private credit is widening out. So banks still are doing what they do and participate in the business what they do.

我得到了它。首先，我想說在私人信貸方面，我認為它沒有從銀行那裡拿走任何東西。全球範圍內發生的情況是，機構客戶過去將大量資金投資於固定收益工具。他們不是——他們不與銀行競爭，他們購買政府證券，他們賺取 4% 或 5% 的收益，歷史上以 6% 或 8% 的價格持有政府證券。如今，他們無法將這些錢投入政府證券並獲得合理的回報。因此，私人信貸正在擴大。因此，銀行仍然在做他們所做的事情，並參與他們所做的業務。

But what's happening is there's a -- the amount of money coming into the sector that needs to be deployed is dramatically increasing. And some of that may go to products in the liquid markets issued by the banks. But a lot of it is in the private market, and it's just finding opportunities to put money to work privately that we're doing for these institutions. And so it's really supplanting fixed income from government securities in their portfolios. I think the second part of your question is just to margins and what does it do. And of course, if you're investing at lower returns, you can't charge as much to your clients. And therefore -- and I wouldn't think of it as -- the margins we have is amalgam of a whole bunch of things, some highly profitable things that we do, which pay us very, very high margins, but we earn a lot for our clients to do that. And then some things that pay us small amounts because -- or lower amounts because the returns for them are less.

但實際情況是，進入該行業需要部署的資金量正在急劇增加。其中一些可能會流向銀行在流動市場發行的產品。但其中很多都在私人市場，我們為這些機構所做的只是尋找將資金投入私人工作的機會。因此，它確實取代了投資組合中政府證券的固定收益。我認為你問題的第二部分只是關於利潤率及其作用。當然，如果您的投資回報率較低，您就不能向客戶收取那麼多費用。因此，我不認為我們擁有的利潤是一大堆事情的混合體，我們所做的一些高利潤的事情給我們帶來了非常非常高的利潤，但我們賺了很多讓我們的客戶能夠做到這一點。然後，有些事情支付給我們的金額很小，因為——或者支付的金額較低，因為它們的回報較少。

And so I'd say the -- our margins overall are will be lower if we drive more into credit. Having said that, we don't look at it that way. It's just an amalgam of highly profitable businesses each on their own.

所以我想說，如果我們加大信貸投入，我們的總體利潤率將會更低。話雖如此，我們並不這麼看。它只是各個高利潤業務的混合體。

If I could just have a quick follow-up on that. So just on the private credit, you wouldn't broadly qualify this as regulatory arbitrage that governs the banks or maybe excludes the banks from doing certain things? Do you view this as just private credit that you have access to as, I guess, as a yield play, but not so much on a regulatory arbitrage? Is that the right way to think about it?

如果我能對此進行快速跟進就好了。因此，就私人信貸而言，您不會將其廣泛地視為監管銀行的監管套利，或者可能排除銀行做某些事情？您是否認為這只是您可以獲得的私人信貸，我想，這是一種收益遊戲，而不是監管套利？這是正確的思考方式嗎？

Yes. And I would just say, we're -- we have the ability to put money work in different places around our businesses, which is just different. And a lot of our money is mezzanine money as opposed to first lien money. And we look at it, it's investing seniors to the equity we'd otherwise buy. So a lot of it is, I'll call it, in a lower than first lien, which is mostly what the banks are doing.

是的。我只想說，我們有能力將資金投入到我們業務的不同地方，這是不同的。我們的很多錢都是夾層資金，而不是第一留置權資金。我們看看，它正在將老年人投資於我們原本要購買的股權。所以很多，我稱之為，低於第一留置權，這主要是銀行正在做的事情。

Okay. And I had a second question just around the topic of stagflation. It's getting a little bit more airtime maybe. And I just wanted to get your thoughts, maybe, Bruce, if you could just talk out loud for us what -- how you, as a management team, think about the topic of stagflation. If it's viewed as a tail risk event? And whether or not there's any actions you could take in advance to inoculate I guess, some of the fee-related earnings growth expected of you that you have?

好的。我的第二個問題是關於滯脹的話題。也許播出時間會多一些。我只是想了解你的想法，布魯斯，如果你能為我們大聲談談你作為一個管理團隊如何思考滯脹這個話題。如果將其視為尾部風險事件？我想，您是否可以提前採取任何行動來預防您預期的一些與費用相關的收入增長？

Look, we're not experts in macro finance. But I'll just tell you what our thinking is. And essentially, it is that in the things that we do, which are real assets, and businesses around real assets and the type of things we do, essentially produce growing streams of cash flow over long periods of time. and you can debate each business or type, but that's essentially what they do.

看，我們不是宏觀金融專家。但我只是告訴你我們的想法是什麼。從本質上講，我們所做的事情，即實物資產，以及圍繞實物資產的業務和我們所做的事情類型，本質上在很長一段時間內產生不斷增長的現金流。你可以對每種業務或類型進行辯論，但這本質上就是他們所做的。

And those type of businesses are really, really good in a low-interest rate environment. And when there's some inflation, that's even better for the businesses because it means by contractor going up or inflation helps the contracts go up a little bit if they're not strictly contractual.

這些類型的企業在低利率環境下確實非常好。當出現一定程度的通貨膨脹時，這對企業來說甚至更好，因為這意味著承包商的價格上漲或通貨膨脹會幫助合同價格上漲一點，如果它們不是嚴格的合同的話。

So I'd say just generally, this environment is a highly positive environment for our businesses.

所以我想說，總的來說，這種環境對我們的企業來說是一個非常積極的環境。

Now the only thing that could happen is that you don't have any growth and then you have inflation, and that's generally bad for countries' GDP or for countries. And I just don't think that's going to happen. It will happen in some countries of the world. There's no doubt. But in the major -- let's call it -- I think you're talking mostly about the United States. Look, everyone worries about the thing of the day that everyone is commenting on, and there's no doubt, prices are higher. And there's no doubt that there are issues of supply chain, but a lot of this is caused by the fact that we shut down the economy for 12 months.

現在唯一可能發生的事情是沒有任何增長，然後出現通貨膨脹，這通常對國家的國內生產總值或國家不利。我只是認為這不會發生。這將發生在世界上的一些國家。毫無疑問。但在主要方面——讓我們這麼稱呼吧——我認為你主要談論的是美國。看，每個人都擔心每個人都在評論的當天的事情，毫無疑問，價格更高。毫無疑問，存在供應鏈問題，但這很大程度上是由於我們關閉經濟12個月造成的。

And to restart the economy, it takes a lot of work, and I -- we can just see it in our businesses. It just takes time to get people back to the manufacturing facilities. It takes time to hire people. It takes time to get logistics properly back into place. And once that occurs, I think you're going to see all of this settled down. It just takes time.

要重啟經濟，需要做很多工作，而我——我們可以在我們的企業中看到它。讓人們返回生產設施只是需要時間。僱用人員需要時間。讓物流正確恢復到位需要時間。一旦發生這種情況，我想你將會看到這一切都安定下來。只是需要時間。

Our next question comes from Cherilyn Radbourne with TD Securities.

我們的下一個問題來自道明證券的 Cherilyn Radbourne。

Bruce, we've had some questions from investors on recent developments in the real estate market in China. So maybe you could give your perspective on what's going on there. And what are the outcome may be opportunities for Brookfield over time?

布魯斯，我們收到了投資者關於中國房地產市場近期發展的一些問題。所以也許你可以對那裡正在發生的事情發表你的看法。隨著時間的推移，布魯克菲爾德可能會面臨哪些機會？

Yes. So look, I'll -- our business in China is small relative -- our real estate business in China is small relative to the global business we have in real estate, but I can tell you by -- just, I guess, evidence of our business there is that people are still renting space. People are still buying goods and things are pretty good in the market. in general. I would say what gets the headlines is that Chinese real estate has an issue. But really, what it is, it's the residential developers that built -- were building condos had significant amounts of leverage in the companies, and that is unwinding itself given what's going on in the country.

是的。所以，我會——我們在中國的業務相對較小——相對於我們在房地產領域的全球業務而言，我們在中國的房地產業務很小，但我可以通過——我想，證據來告訴你我們的業務之一是人們仍在租賃空間。人們仍在購買商品，市場情況也不錯。一般來說。我想說，成為頭條新聞的是中國房地產存在問題。但實際上，它是由住宅開發商建造的——正在建造的公寓在公司中擁有大量的槓桿作用，考慮到該國正在發生的情況，這種槓桿作用正在逐漸消失。

So they say real estate, but really what's the -- really what the focus is on is the residential condominium developers in all the types of cities, Tier 1, 2, 3 in China. So I think as that unwinds, there's less capital and what's going -- given what's going on in China, there's less capital in the country.

所以他們說的是房地產，但真正的焦點是中國一、二、三線所有類型城市的住宅公寓開發商。所以我認為，隨著這種情況的展開，資本會減少，而且正在發生的事情——考慮到中國正在發生的事情，該國的資本也減少了。

And to your second part of the question, which is does, that lead to opportunity. And it has, it will, and I think continuously -- continuing, there will be more opportunity in China at more of a value basis than you've seen for many, many years.

對於問題的第二部分，即確實會帶來機會。我認為，過去、將來、將來，中國將會有更多的機會，而且在價值基礎上，這將比你多年來看到的更多。

Great. That's helpful. Second one is for Nick. In terms of the $35 billion of committed capital that will generate fees once it's deployed, can you remind us which pools of fee-bearing capital generate fees on committed capital versus fees on deployment? And should we assume that, that $35 billion gets deployed relatively evenly over the next 3 years? Or is there a reason that the cadence might be different than that?

偉大的。這很有幫助。第二個是給尼克的。就部署後將產生費用的 350 億美元承諾資本而言，您能否提醒我們哪些收費資本池會產生承諾資本費用和部署費用？我們是否應該假設 350 億美元在未來 3 年內得到相對均勻的部署？或者有什麼原因導致節奏可能與此不同？

Yes. Sure, Cherilyn. Thanks. So our flagship funds across real estate, infrastructure, transition, private equity, earned fees on committed capital, our flagship opportunities fund in credit, is capital on -- its fees on invested. So that's a large component, that's a large fund. And so as that capital, it's highly committed right now, but not -- it's a lower level of actually invested or deployed. So as that gets deployed, that would that would increase fee-bearing capital fairly in the short order, given the level that's actually committed to date. And the rest is just across sort of our perpetual long-dated offerings and other credit products that will just gradually get deployed over time.

是的。當然，切瑞琳。謝謝。因此，我們在房地產、基礎設施、轉型、私募股權方面的旗艦基金、承諾資本賺取的費用、我們信貸方面的旗艦機會基金，都是資本——其投資費用。所以這是一個很大的組成部分，這是一個很大的基金。因此，就該資本而言，目前它的投入程度很高，但實際投資或部署的水平卻較低。因此，考慮到迄今為止實際承諾的水平，一旦部署，這將在短期內公平地增加收費資本。其餘的只是我們的永久長期產品和其他信貸產品，這些產品將隨著時間的推移逐漸部署。

So it's probably not too long. And then we've got some flagship funds that end their investment period. and they have some capital set aside for follow-on investments that will get deployed over the next 5 years. So there's probably some front loading to it and some will be evenly over the next few years. .

所以可能不會太長。然後我們有一些旗艦基金結束了投資期。他們還留出了一些資金用於後續投資，這些投資將在未來 5 年內部署。因此，可能會有一些前期加載，有些會在未來幾年內均勻加載。 。

Our next question comes from Bill Katz with Citigroup.

我們的下一個問題來自花旗集團的比爾·卡茨。

Just on the fundraising. Your commentary that you had sort of $30-some-odd billion of sales since the second quarter. So give you had about $20 billion in your disclosure, I'm presuming some of that spilled into the fourth quarter. I'm wondering if you could maybe talk to where you're seeing that growth. And then if you could tie it to your commentary that you think you could exceed $100 billion in this flagship funds, where that upside might center in?

就在籌款的事上。您的評論稱，自第二季度以來，您的銷售額約為 30 億美元左右。因此，考慮到您披露的信息約為 200 億美元，我猜想其中一些會溢出到第四季度。我想知道您是否可以談談您在哪裡看到了這種增長。然後，如果您能將其與您認為這只旗艦基金可能超過 1000 億美元的評論聯繫起來，那麼上漲空間可能集中在哪裡？

Yes. Yes, Bill, that's right. So I think it's a $24 billion in the quarter, $10 billion has happened subsequent to quarter end before release. And I'd say that right now, the fundraising is strong across the spectrum, and we really laid that out, as Bruce said, the amount of capital that is seeking to be invested into alternatives across the risk spectrum, whether it's our opportunistic all the way through to our core and then into our debt funds, the appetite is just incredibly strong.

是的。是的，比爾，沒錯。所以我認為本季度的收入為 240 億美元，季度末發布後已發生 100 億美元。我想說，現在，各個領域的籌款活動都很強勁，正如布魯斯所說，我們確實列出了尋求投資於各種風險範圍內的替代品的資本數額，無論是我們的機會主義所有一直到我們的核心，然後進入我們的債務基金，胃口非常強烈。

And so I think if you look at the flagship funds, which is what the 100 is focused on, Oaktree is done now at 15.90 ops. That was very successful. And we've -- I've seen that we've had a first and founder's close for real estate transition, respectively. And the appetite is really well. I think that speaks to the flows of capital, but it also speaks to the product offering and the franchise and investment track record and opportunities that we present.

因此，我認為如果你看看 100 指數重點關注的旗艦基金，橡樹現在的股價為 15.90。那是非常成功的。我已經看到我們分別完成了房地產轉型的首次交割和創始人交割。而且胃口真的很好。我認為這不僅關係到資本的流動，也關係到我們提供的產品、特許經營和投資記錄以及我們提供的機會。

And for a first-time fund in renewables and transition investing, again, it talks to the really, really unique proposition that we have in that space, and the momentum around that space and the product that we can offer to our clients to help them with their ambitions around net zero is really unrivaled. So I think it's just strong across the board.

對於可再生能源和轉型投資領域的首次基金來說，它再次談到了我們在該領域真正非常獨特的主張，以及圍繞該領域的勢頭以及我們可以向客戶提供幫助他們的產品他們對淨零排放的雄心確實是無與倫比的。所以我認為它在各方面都很強大。

Okay. And just my follow-up is a bit of a 2 part, so I apologize. First, I appreciate all the extra disclosure. Is there a way to think about the segment accounting by the major bucket real estate, credit, private equity, et cetera?

好的。我的後續行動有點像兩部分，所以我很抱歉。首先，我感謝所有額外的披露。有沒有辦法按房地產、信貸、私募股權等主要類別來考慮細分會計？

You're giving revenues, but wanted to try to see if I could tie it back to the FRE margin opportunity as those platforms scale. And then separately, and I'm sorry to go over this one again, but can you unpack the sequential change of BPY internalizing it? And sort of what came out of the invested capital side? And what sort of came through on the FRE side? Just trying to understand the sequential changes in those lines.

您正在提供收入，但想嘗試看看我是否可以將其與這些平台規模擴展時的 FRE 利潤機會聯繫起來。然後分別進行，我很抱歉再次回顧這一點，但是您能解開 BPY 內化它的順序變化嗎？投資資本方面產生了什麼？ FRE 方面經歷了什麼？只是想了解這些行中的順序變化。

On the breakdown by fees, yes, over time, maybe we'll look to introduce the cost and give you margins by business. But the scale opportunity is really relative to the size of the business as they scale up, you should see that operational leverage come through in the numbers. But over time, we can help that -- break that out for you. On your question around capital, I think the fees is consistent with what we laid out, the BPY business itself is paying fees on its core and transitional development assets, and that's a basis points on NAV. fee rate consistent with what we'd see for our -- more like our perpetual private real estate funds, and then their investments into the funds would be earning the fees the offset is went away. The growth is is no different, but just the offset doesn't interest anymore and that capital flows through the private fund side or the fees flows the private fund side.

關於按費用細分，是的，隨著時間的推移，也許我們會考慮引入成本並按業務為您提供利潤。但規模機會實際上與業務規模擴大有關，您應該看到運營槓桿在數字中體現出來。但隨著時間的推移，我們可以幫助您解決這個問題。關於你關於資本的問題，我認為費用與我們規定的一致，BPY業務本身正在為其核心和過渡性開發資產支付費用，這是資產淨值的基點。費率與我們所看到的一致——更像是我們的永久私人房地產基金，然後他們對基金的投資將賺取抵消消失的費用。增長沒有什麼不同，但只是抵消不再感興趣，資本流經私募基金方或費用流經私募基金方。

Our next question comes from Mario Saric with Scotiabank.

我們的下一個問題來自豐業銀行的馬里奧·薩里奇。

Listen it has been 5 or 7 years ago, that you highlighted at Investor Day or AGM. I can't remember which one it was, that infrastructure could be field's largest vertical which in 10 years, indeed, has seen material growth. You provided some 5-year growth forecast at your Investor Day, talking about recycling capital out of real estate, in particular.

聽著，您在投資者日或年度股東大會上強調的事情已經是五七年前的事了。我不記得是哪一個了，基礎設施可能是該領域最大的垂直行業，確實在 10 年內實現了實質性增長。您在投資者日提供了一些 5 年增長預測，特別談到了從房地產中回收資本。

But if we look out over the next 10, 15 years, and keeping in mind some of the new growth verticals that you've discussed, how do you think about that answer today relative to 5, 7 years ago?

但如果我們展望未來 10、15 年，並牢記您討論過的一些新的垂直增長領域，相對於 5、7 年前，您如何看待今天的答案？

I don't know. Here's what I would say. Real estate is going to continue to grow, but it's a vast business today. So it just can't -- it can't quadruple in size, but it can continue to grow. Infrastructure will get bigger and bigger. Renewables is growing and transition are growing fast, but there -- it's a limited -- it's 1 business, it's not 10 businesses, like each of those other ones have.

我不知道。這就是我要說的。房地產將繼續增長，但如今它是一項龐大的業務。所以它的大小不能增加四倍，但它可以繼續增長。基礎設施將變得越來越大。可再生能源正在增長，轉型也在快速增長，但它是有限的——它只是 1 項業務，而不是像其他業務那樣有 10 項業務。

Private equity will be getting bigger. Insurance if interest rates stay low, our insurance solutions business could get very large in size of it in terms of size of AUM. And I think the the wild card here is how successful we are in transitioning the business with what Josh was talking about, being able to affect our investing into later-stage technology businesses in our private equity area. And I think that could become large because just in the last 5 years, that's become a business for buyouts, and it will increasingly become that as opposed to just a venture and growth business. It could become very significant. .

私募股權將會變得越來越大。保險如果利率保持在低位，我們的保險解決方案業務的資產管理規模可能會變得非常大。我認為這裡的未知因素是我們在喬希所說的業務轉型方面是否成功，能夠影響我們對私募股權領域後期技術業務的投資。我認為這可能會變得很大，因為就在過去五年裡，這已經成為一項收購業務，而且它將越來越多地成為一項收購業務，而不僅僅是一項風險和成長業務。它可能變得非常重要。 。

Great. And I guess my second question just relates to the capital intensity on the balance sheet. I think with more of a focus on DE, the cash flow from perpetual affiliates was 58% of the DE before realization this quarter. You've clearly laid out the strategic benefits of the perpetual capital on the balance sheet in the past and the importance of the partnerships. That being said, when you look out over time, are there any more macro factors, whether it's valuation, interest rates and so on? Would -- how do you reconsider what you think to be the optimal capital intensity on the balance sheet, given the expectation that fee-related earnings can grow at 20% plus CAGR?

偉大的。我想我的第二個問題與資產負債表上的資本密集度有關。我認為，隨著更多地關注 DE，來自永久附屬公司的現金流在本季度實現之前佔 DE 的 58%。您過去已經在資產負債表上清楚地闡述了永續資本的戰略利益以及合作夥伴關係的重要性。話雖如此，當你隨著時間的推移觀察時，是否還有更多宏觀因素，無論是估值、利率等？考慮到與費用相關的收益可以以 20% 以上的複合年增長率增長，您將如何重新考慮您認為的資產負債表上的最佳資本密集度？

Look, and I would just say -- and we -- as all of -- everybody on the line that's interested in Brookfield would observe, the fastest-growing business we have for the past 20 years and probably the next 20 years, has been our investment management business. There's no doubt it grows in a spectacular rate, like others that are out there. In fact, ours probably grows faster. And the reason it grows faster is we have access to capital that virtually nobody else has access to.

聽著，我只想說 - 我們 - 作為所有人 - 每個對布魯克菲爾德感興趣的人都會觀察到，我們在過去 20 年以及可能在未來 20 年中增長最快的業務是我們的投資管理業務。毫無疑問，它像其他市場一樣以驚人的速度增長。事實上，我們的增長速度可能更快。它增長更快的原因是我們可以獲得其他人幾乎無法獲得的資本。

It differentiates our strategy for our clients. It differentiates our ability to make money for them. And while on the face of it, it looks like it earns a lower return, it is the reason our clients come to us and the reason why we can earn the returns that are shown in the shareholder letter that we have for our clients. And I'd say it's just -- so I guess our view is, yes, it does earn a lower return, but our business is special because of it. And in the fullness of time, it doesn't matter. Whether -- it's still earned 16% the other one earns a lot more, but on balance, it contributes very significant to us.

它使我們為客戶制定的策略與眾不同。它使我們為他們賺錢的能力與眾不同。雖然從表面上看，它的回報率似乎較低，但這就是我們的客戶來到我們這裡的原因，也是我們能夠獲得我們為客戶提供的股東信中顯示的回報的原因。我想說這只是 - 所以我想我們的觀點是，是的，它確實獲得了較低的回報，但我們的業務因此而特殊。在時間充足的情況下，這並不重要。是否——它仍然賺取 16%，而另一個賺取更多，但總的來說，它對我們的貢獻非常重要。

So that's not to say that over time, we won't take capital off and use it to buy back shares, we will. But having a differentiated offering to be able to make us different than many others is a special thing that we have, and we're not going to give that up ever.

因此，這並不是說隨著時間的推移，我們不會拿走資本並用它來回購股票，我們會的。但是，擁有差異化的產品能夠使我們與許多其他公司不同，這是我們所擁有的一件特殊的事情，我們永遠不會放棄這一點。

Okay. Makes sense. And if I may, just one really quick other one on the corporate liquidity, Nick, that you highlighted, $5.2 billion at quarter end. There's been a lot of activity recently. Where would that stand roughly today?

好的。說得通。如果可以的話，請讓我簡單介紹一下關於企業流動性的另一個非常快的問題，尼克，您強調的，季度末為 52 億美元。最近有很多活動。今天大致處於什麼位置？

It's probably consistent, Mario. There's inflows and some outflows, but it's probably consistent on what you had have seen at the end of the quarter.

這可能是一致的，馬里奧。有流入，也有一些流出，但這可能與您在本季度末看到的情況一致。

Our next question comes from Robert Lee with KBW.

我們的下一個問題來自 KBW 的 Robert Lee。

I am just curious, maybe focusing on the secondaries business and maybe a little bit on direct lending. But you've highlighted both of them in the letter opportunities and places for growth. I mean if we look at the secondaries business, I mean, you've raised some money for real estate secondaries. But in the marketplace, you've seen a fair number of actually large properties, secondaries managers trade who are arguably already at scale.

我只是好奇，也許專注於二級市場業務，也許還有一點直接貸款。但您在信中強調了他們的機會和成長場所。我的意思是，如果我們看看二級市場業務，我的意思是，你已經為房地產二級市場籌集了一些資金。但在市場上，你已經看到了相當多的大型房產，二級市場經理的交易可以說已經達到了規模。

So can you talk about kind of your interest or willingness to kind of accelerate growth of at least your secondaries initiatives through M&A? And then I guess on direct lending, obviously, Oaktree has that capability. But again in that kind of specific sleeve of private credit, there's many larger competitors. I mean do you see a need -- again, do you see a need to accelerate your scale or size in the direct lending business through M&A as a possible avenue? That's my question.

那麼您能否談談您對通過併購至少加速您的二級計劃的增長的興趣或意願？然後我想在直接貸款方面，顯然橡樹資本有這種能力。但在這種特定的私人信貸領域，同樣存在許多規模更大的競爭對手。我的意思是，您是否認為有必要——再次強調，您是否認為有必要通過併購作為可能的途徑來加速直接貸款業務的規模或規模？這就是我的問題。

Thanks, Rob. Yes, listen, they are good questions. I think the secondary businesses that you're seeing trading in the market is maybe slightly different to what we're looking to do. And I think if we look at secondaries and direct lending, Our intentions right now are to build these organically because we see secondaries as an extension of what we are already doing in our business, but it's just a new product that we can offer our clients and an extension of our existing capabilities, as opposed to building a dedicated business. And I think we've already seen very, very early success in that regard in real estate before we even listed or launched the first fund. But our brand, our reputation, and the view of having us as a partner in more of the GP-led secondary space, we think is differentiated and really leans on our business and it's not something that we need to acquire externally.

謝謝，羅布。是的，聽著，這些問題都很好。我認為您在市場上看到的二級業務可能與我們想要做的略有不同。我認為，如果我們看看二級貸款和直接貸款，我們現在的意圖是有機地建立這些貸款，因為我們將二級貸款視為我們已經在業務中所做的事情的延伸，但這只是我們可以為客戶提供的新產品以及擴展我們現有的能力，而不是建立專門的業務。我認為，在我們上市或推出第一隻基金之前，我們就已經在房地產領域看到了非常非常早期的成功。但我們的品牌、我們的聲譽以及讓我們作為更多GP 主導的二級領域的合作夥伴的觀點，我們認為是差異化的，並且真正依賴於我們的業務，這不是我們需要從外部獲取的東西。

So the intention right now is to build that organically. And I would draw the exact same argument on the Oaktree side that, while it may not be at the scale of others, we have all the expertise internally. And therefore, we believe, with the relationships and the reputation that we have in that credit space that as we turn our minds to it, we can scale that organically.

所以現在的目的是有機地構建它。我會在橡樹方面提出完全相同的論點，即雖然可能沒有其他公司的規模，但我們內部擁有所有專業知識。因此，我們相信，憑藉我們在該信用領域所擁有的關係和聲譽，當我們將注意力轉向它時，我們可以有機地擴大規模。

Great. And then maybe a follow-up just on -- this is -- it relates to Oaktree. So I'm just curious, I mean their flagship fund, you mentioned is kind of getting close to the finish ending its fundraising, but it's also 70% invested.

偉大的。然後也許是一個後續行動——這與橡樹資本有關。所以我只是很好奇，我的意思是他們的旗艦基金，你提到的融資即將結束，但它也已完成 70% 的投資。

And since typically, you start raising the next fund when they get to like 75% or so, is -- Should we expect that there actually could be another fund kind of quickly coming to market? Or do they have recycling capacity in that fund? So that's still going to be maybe a couple of years before you start the next flagship fund at Oaktree?

因為通常情況下，當下一隻基金達到 75% 左右時，你就開始籌集資金，所以——我們是否應該期望實際上可能會有另一隻基金迅速進入市場？或者他們的基金有回收能力嗎？那麼，在橡樹資本啟動下一個旗艦基金之前，可能還需要幾年時間？

And then I guess when we get to '22, that's the first opportunity to buy in some additional piece of Oaktree, I believe, if I'm not mistaken. So can you just remind us when that could be and the potential terms around that?

然後我想，當我們進入 22 年時，這是購買橡樹資本的第一個機會，我相信，如果我沒記錯的話。那麼您能否提醒我們什麼時候可以這樣做以及相關的潛在條款？

Yes, sure. So on the first part -- Rob, on the first part, I'm just trying to -- sorry, I'm just trying to remember the question. Yes, your second part of the question answered it, and we do have recycling capacity in that fund. So while they're at 70% today, it's a bit different to our flagship funds. So it won't be sort of immediate fundraising in the next few months, but it may not also be as far as 2 years out, it could be sooner than that, but that depends on the recycling and the investment nature, but they do have that capacity.

是的，當然。所以在第一部分——羅布，在第一部分，我只是想——抱歉，我只是想記住這個問題。是的，你問題的第二部分回答了這個問題，我們的基金確實有回收能力。因此，雖然它們現在的比率為 70%，但與我們的旗艦基金有些不同。因此，在接下來的幾個月內不會立即籌集資金，但也可能不會長達兩年，也可能比這更早，但這取決於回收和投資性質，但他們確實這樣做了有那個能力。

On the Oaktree liquidity mechanic. Just to remind you, it's a put option that they have, not a call option. And the kind of the guardrails around are I think when we did this, it was 13.5 times 3-year trailing fee revenue and 6.75 times the carry, that's the mechanic around it. And there are limits around how much can be monetized in any 1 year, and this is really their right to put it to us if they so choose.

關於橡樹資本的流動性機制。只是提醒您，他們擁有的是看跌期權，而不是看漲期權。我認為當我們這樣做時，周圍的護欄是 3 年跟踪費用收入的 13.5 倍和套利的 6.75 倍，這就是圍繞它的機制。一年內可以變現的金額是有限的，如果他們願意的話，這確實是他們將其交給我們的權利。

That concludes today's question-and-answer session. I'd like to turn the call back to Suzanne Fleming for closing remarks.

今天的問答環節到此結束。我想將電話轉回給蘇珊·弗萊明，讓其致閉幕詞。

And with that, we will end today's call. Thank you, everyone, for joining us.

我們就這樣結束今天的通話。謝謝大家加入我們。

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連接。