華納兄弟探索 (WBD) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Warner Bros. Discovery fourth-quarter 2024 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Additionally, please be advised that today's conference call is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Andrew Slabin, Executive Vice President, Global Investor Strategy. Sir, you may now begin.

女士們、先生們，歡迎來到華納兄弟。Discovery 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）此外，請注意，今天的電話會議正在錄音。現在，我想將會議交給全球投資者策略執行副總裁安德魯‧斯拉賓先生。先生，現在可以開始了。

Good morning, and thank you for joining us for Warner Bros. Discovery's Q4 earnings call. Joining me today is David Zaslav, President and Chief Executive Officer; Gunnar Wiedenfels, Chief Financial Officer; and JB Perrette, CEO and President, Global Streaming and Games.

早安，感謝您參加華納兄弟的活動。Discovery 第四季財報電話會議。今天與我一起出席的是總裁兼執行長 David Zaslav； Gunnar Wiedenfels，財務長；以及全球串流媒體和遊戲執行長兼總裁 JB Perrette。

Earlier this morning, we released our Q4 earnings results, trending schedule, as well as accompanying shareholder letter. We will begin this morning with some very brief remarks by David, and then turn the call right to Q&A.

今天早些時候，我們發布了第四季度收益結果、趨勢表以及隨附的股東信。今天早上我們將以大衛的一些非常簡短的演講開始，然後直接進入問答環節。

Today's presentation will include forward-looking statements that we made pursuant to the Safe Harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. The forward-looking statements may include comments regarding the company's future business plans, prospects and financial performance, and involve risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from our expectations.

今天的演示將包括我們根據 1995 年私人證券訴訟改革法案的安全港條款做出的前瞻性聲明。前瞻性陳述可能包括有關公司未來業務計劃、前景和財務業績的評論，並涉及可能導致實際結果與我們的預期有重大差異的風險和不確定性。

For additional information on factors that could affect these expectations, please see the company's filings with the US Securities and Exchange commission, including, but not limited to the company's most recent annual report on Form 10-K and its reports on Form 10-Q and Form 8-K.

有關可能影響這些預期的因素的更多信息，請參閱公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件，包括但不限於公司最新的 10-K 表年度報告以及 10-Q 表和 8-K 表報告。

In addition, we will discuss non-GAAP financial measures on this call. Reconciliations of these non-GAAP financial measures to the closest GAAP financial measure can be found in our earnings release and in our trending schedules, which can be found in the Investor Relations section of our website.

此外，我們將在本次電話會議上討論非公認會計準則財務指標。這些非 GAAP 財務指標與最接近的 GAAP 財務指標的對帳表可在我們的收益報告和趨勢表中找到，這些對帳表可在我們網站的「投資者關係」部分找到。

And with that, I'm pleased to turn the call over to David.

現在，我很高興將電話轉給大衛。

Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us. 2.5 years ago, when we brought Warner Bros. Discovery together, our vision was to combine Discovery's leading position as a global force in media and entertainment, with local content and local sports, alongside the iconic storytelling brands, IP and libraries of Warner Bros. and HBO. This powerful combination is a unique, compelling offering that we believe would resonate with consumers worldwide.

大家早安，感謝大家的收看。 2.5 年前，我們收購了華納兄弟。與 Discovery 攜手，我們的願景是將 Discovery 在全球媒體和娛樂領域的領先地位與本地內容和本地體育以及華納兄弟和 HBO 的標誌性故事品牌、IP 和圖書館結合起來。我們相信，這強大的組合是一種獨特且引人注目的產品，會引起全球消費者的共鳴。

It was the strategic guts of our transaction. Our direct-to-consumer business ended 2024, with about 117 million subscribers across more than 70 countries, and we still have nearly half the world to go, with many key markets, like the UK, Italy, Germany and Australia, launching over the next few years.

這是我們交易的戰略核心。我們的直接面向消費者的業務於 2024 年結束，擁有遍布 70 多個國家/地區的約 1.17 億用戶，並且我們仍有近一半的市場空間，英國、義大利、德國和澳洲等許多關鍵市場將在未來幾年內推出。

We added about 6.5 million subscribers in the fourth quarter, and nearly 20 million subscribers in less than a year. Max continues to grow at a powerful pace, and we expect it to continue throughout 2025 and beyond.

我們在第四季增加了約650萬用戶，在不到一年的時間內增加了近2,000萬用戶。Max 繼續保持強勁成長勢頭，我們預計這種勢頭將持續到 2025 年及以後。

In this generational media disruption, only the global streamers will survive and prosper, and Max is just that. With the launch of Max internationally in 2024, we now have a global subscription business that is growing subs, revenue and EBITDA. We have a clear demonstrable path to at least 150 million subscribers by the end of 2026, fueling further revenue and EBITDA growth.

在這一代媒體顛覆中，只有全球串流媒體才能生存和繁榮，而 Max 就是這樣的串流媒體。隨著 2024 年 Max 在國際上的推出，我們現在擁有全球訂閱業務，訂閱用戶數量、收入和 EBITDA 都在成長。我們有明確的目標，到 2026 年底，我們的訂閱用戶數量將達到至少 1.5 億，進一步推動營收和 EBITDA 成長。

Max is one of the world's very few global and profitable streaming services. Our direct-to-consumer business contributed almost $700 million in EBITDA, a $3 billion improvement in just two years, and we expect direct-to-consumer EBITDA to nearly double in 2025.

Max 是全球極少數實現全球化且獲利的串流服務之一。我們的直接面向消費者的業務貢獻了近 7 億美元的 EBITDA，僅兩年就提高了 30 億美元，我們預計到 2025 年直接面向消費者的 EBITDA 將增長近一倍。

As I mentioned in our last earnings call, we are laser focused on getting our Studios back to a place of industry leadership, and generating $3 billion or more in EBITDA. We are showing growth and real strength in our Warner Bros. television business, which I believe is the highest quality and largest maker of TV content in the world.

正如我在上次財報電話會議上提到的那樣，我們正致力於讓我們的工作室重回行業領先地位，並創造 30 億美元或更多的 EBITDA。我們的華納兄弟電視業務正在展現成長和真正的實力，我相信它是世界上最高品質、規模最大的電視內容製造商。

We are excited about our Studios' creative and financial outlook this year and beyond, particularly all that's coming from Warner Bros. Pictures and DC Studios, kicking off with the release of Superman this July.

我們對工作室今年及以後的創意和財務前景感到興奮，尤其是來自華納兄弟的所有消息。影業和 DC 影業將於今年 7 月上映《超人》並拉開合作序幕。

Despite the headwinds facing linear television, we recently struck a flurry of multiyear renewal agreements with five of the six largest ATV providers in America, many of which were a year early, and all of which commanded overall rate increases. These long term deals provide real security and stability to our linear business.

儘管線性電視面臨阻力，但我們最近還是與美國六大 ATV 供應商中的五家達成了一系列多年期續約協議，其中許多協議提前了一年，並且所有協議都要求總體費率上漲。這些長期交易為我們的線性業務提供了真正的安全性和穩定性。

Finally, we have been hard at work and have made real progress implementing the reorganization we announced in December, which went into effect on January 1. This new structure will provide investors with better visibility to the strength of our streaming and Studios business, and will give us real strategic value and optionality into the future.

最後，我們一直在努力工作，並在實施去年 12 月宣布的重組方案方面取得了真正的進展，該重組方案已於 1 月 1 日生效。這種新結構將使投資者更了解我們的串流媒體和工作室業務的實力，並為我們提供真正的策略價值和未來選擇權。

2024 marked a year of significant progress in transforming Warner Bros. Discovery, laying the foundation for what's next, and positioning us as a global media leader committed to providing shareholders with sustainable future growth. We remain fully focused on enhancing shareholder value and welcome your questions.

2024 年是華納兄弟轉型取得重大進展的一年。探索，為未來的發展奠定基礎，並將我們定位為致力於為股東提供可持續未來成長的全球媒體領導者。我們始終致力於提高股東價值，歡迎您的提問。

(Operator Instructions) Jessica Reif Ehrlich, Bank of Securities.

（操作員指示）證券銀行 Jessica Reif Ehrlich。

Thank you. Good morning, everybody. Two questions, please. Can you give us an update -- David, you just alluded to the restructuring taking place as of January 1. Can you talk about potential longer term more transformative actions?

謝謝。大家早安。請問兩個問題。您能否提供我們最新情況？大衛，您剛才提到重組將於 1 月 1 日開始。您能談談潛在的長期、更具變革性的行動嗎？

And then secondly, in the shareholder letter, there was a comment on near term linear pressure as you add direct-to-consumer and greater packaging flexibility. Can you flush that out? And maybe discuss the along -- in '25, will there be consolidated growth?

其次，在致股東的信中，有一條評論提到，隨著直接面向消費者的產品和更大的包裝靈活性的增加，短期線性壓力會增加。你能把它沖洗掉嗎？或許可以討論一下──25 年是否會出現穩固的成長？

Morning Jessica. This is Gunnar. Let me take those two. Starting with the corporate restructuring, so this, as you know, has been a real priority for us, and we've made great progress. As we said in the letter, we have implemented that new structure effective January 1.

早安，潔西卡。這是 Gunnar。讓我拿走那兩個。從公司重組開始，如你所知，這一直是我們的真正優先事項，而且我們已經取得了巨大進展。正如我們在信中所說，我們已於 1 月 1 日起實施這項新結構。

As you would imagine, there's still a lot of contract work underway. To manage and implement the financial aspects of the reorganization, we would still have processes run out of the wrong entities, tax implications, et cetera. So we're still working through that with a lot of focus, and we're making great progress. And as I said -- as we said in the letter, we're hoping to wrap that up really within the next few weeks.

正如您所想像的，仍有大量合約工作正在進行中。為了管理和實施重組的財務面，我們仍然會遇到錯誤實體、稅務影響等流程。因此我們仍在全神貫注地努力解決這個問題，並且取得了巨大進展。正如我在信中所說，我們希望在接下來的幾週內完成這項任務。

The point I want to --

我想說的是--

So I would just add that I think this restructure creates real visibility to the strength of our Studio and library and global streaming business. It allows us to -- we'll be better able to respond to this generational disruption.

因此，我想補充一點，我認為這次重組真正彰顯了我們的工作室、圖書館和全球串流媒體業務的實力。它使我們能夠更好地應對這種代際混亂。

The new structure will enhance our strategic flexibility and also create potential opportunities to unlock additional shareholder value, which we're focused on. And we're also focused on executing our strategy while ensuring we're able to take advantage of broader opportunities as they arise. In this disruption, we expect that there will be.

新架構將增強我們的策略靈活性，並創造釋放額外股東價值的潛在機會，這正是我們關注的重點。我們也專注於執行我們的策略，同時確保我們能夠利用出現的更廣泛的機會。在這次混亂中，我們預計會出現這種情況。

Great. Yeah. Last thing I was going to add, Jessica, is we don't think, from today's perspective, that we're going to see a dramatic change to our segment reporting. But we are planning to provide incremental guidance beyond that to create more clarity on the global linear networks on the one side and then streaming and Studios. Think of it as sort of a sub consolidation and -- based on the progress we're making, I'm hopeful that we'll be able to provide that as we report first quarter earnings.

偉大的。是的。傑西卡，我要補充的最後一件事是，從今天的角度來看，我們認為我們不會看到分部報告發生重大變化。但我們計劃在此基礎上提供漸進式指導，以便一方面更加清晰地了解全球線性網絡，另一方面更加清晰地了解串流媒體和工作室。把它看作是一種子合併，並且基於我們正在取得的進展，我希望我們能夠在報告第一季收益時提供這一點。

And then on the -- to your point about linear pressure packaging flexibility, look, I think I want to take a step back. The work that our affiliate team has done in 2024 is just absolutely unbelievable. Working through all these agreements ahead of schedule and securing rate growth in the current environment, I think is a remarkable accomplishment.

然後關於——關於線性壓力包裝彈性的觀點，看，我想我要退一步。我們的附屬團隊在 2024 年所做的工作簡直令人難以置信。我認為，提前完成所有這些協議並在當前環境下確保利率成長是一項了不起的成就。

And it takes us -- it gives us a different cadence, having started in the distribution side of the business. Normally, you would have your deals coming up 20% a year. So you're always facing that on that either opportunity or uncertainty.

它帶給我們不同的節奏，從業務的分銷方面開始。通常情況下，你的交易量每年會增加 20%。所以你總是面臨機會或不確定性。

In my -- in all of my experience, we've never had this secure of a base, where virtually -- where almost all of our deals are done with increases, with all of our channels carried, for a period of years that gives us I think a real advantage as we go in -- it takes one issue off the table for us.

以我的經驗來看，我們從來沒有過如此穩固的基礎，實際上，我們幾乎所有的交易都是在增加的情況下完成的，我們所有的管道都在增長，我認為這在幾年內給了我們一個真正的優勢，它為我們解決了一個問題。

And as we look forward, the one thing I would want to call out, we've seen pretty strong rate increases in the prior year. I mean, in Q4, close to 6% rate increases in our domestic affiliate business. With the new set of deals, those rate increases are going to be slightly slower or more in the low single digit versus mid-single-digit rate. But as we laid out, we have also, as an industry, I think come together and created some flexibility that will drive the sustainability and longevity of that ecosystem.

展望未來，我想指出的一件事是，我們在前一年看到了相當強勁的利率成長。我的意思是，在第四季度，我們的國內附屬業務的利率上漲了近 6%。根據新的協議，利率上調幅度將會略微放緩，或維持在低個位數而非中位數個位數。但正如我們所闡述的，我認為，作為一個行業，我們已經走到了一起，並創造了一些靈活性，這將推動該生態系統的可持續性和長壽。

And then specifically when we look at the international part of our business, it's really remarkable how across our international footprint in the aggregate, we are already seeing positive net revenue impact from our affiliate renewals.

然後具體來說，當我們審視我們業務的國際部分時，我們會發現，從我們的整體國際足跡來看，我們已經看到附屬公司的續約對淨收入產生了積極的影響，這真是令人驚訝。

What does that mean? In many of these renewals, we're working together with our affiliate partners to make some concessions on the linear side, where they're facing not as pronounced, but similar pressures as domestically here. But we're cooperating through software hard bundles on the B2C side. And net-net in the aggregate, we're growing.

這意味著什麼？在許多續約中，我們都與我們的附屬合作夥伴共同努力，在線上做出一些讓步，他們面臨的壓力雖然不那麼明顯，但與國內類似。但我們是在B2C端透過軟體硬捆綁進行合作的。總體來說，我們正在成長。

Across our international affiliate portfolio, we're up in revenues. That's the kind of crossing of the lines that we're looking for. We're not there in the US yet, but it's a great proof point that we're seeing that strong value and demand for our content internationally, already leading to consolidated growth.

在我們的國際附屬公司組合中，我們的收入增加。這正是我們所尋找的跨越界線的行為。我們還沒有進入美國市場，但這是一個很好的證據，表明我們的內容在國際上具有強大的價值和需求，並且已經帶來了穩固的成長。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Okay, let's move to the next question.

好的，我們進入下一個問題。

Robert Fishman, MoffettNathanson.

羅伯特·菲什曼、莫菲特·納森森。

Hi, good morning. Two for you guys. As you think about the importance of scale in DTC, curious, does Max have enough diversity in programming as a standalone service to compete with those larger SVoD platforms? Or maybe asking it differently, any updated thoughts on whether the smaller streaming platform ultimately need to consolidate?

嗨，早安。給你們兩個。當您思考規模在 DTC 中的重要性時，您會很好奇，Max 作為一項獨立服務，其節目是否具有足夠的多樣性，可以與那些更大的 SVoD 平台競爭？或者換個問法，對於小型串流平台最終是否需要整合，您有什麼最新的想法嗎？

And then on a related note, when you think about the strategy to use sports and news on Max, pulling that content from the ad tier, I think, yesterday. Can you talk more about how you plan to explore ways to evolve the sports and news distribution ecosystem? Thank you.

然後，在相關說明中，當您考慮在 Max 上使用體育和新聞的策略時，我想，昨天就從廣告層中提取了這些內容。您能否詳細談談您計劃如何探索發展體育和新聞發行生態系統的方法？謝謝。

Thanks, Robert. We really see our offering is unique, and there are very few global streaming services and the kind of demand and consumption that we're seeing around the world is quite compelling, and it's really driven by the quality of the original storytelling, whether it's White Lotus, House of the Dragons, The Pit, together with the great library of content that we have and the great IP and motion pictures.

謝謝，羅伯特。我們確實認為我們提供的產品是獨一無二的，全球串流媒體服務非常少，我們在世界各地看到的那種需求和消費相當引人注目，這實際上是由原創故事的質量推動的，無論是《白蓮花》《龍之屋》《深淵》，還是我們擁有的龐大內容庫以及優秀的知識產權和電影。

But you add that to the fact that we have 20, 25 years of entertainment content from our free-to-air channels, cable channels around the world and sports. It's really the quality package of content you really want to see, which includes even things like Friends and Big Bang Theory.

但此外，我們還擁有來自免費電視頻道、全球有線電視頻道和體育頻道的 20 至 25 年的娛樂內容。這確實是您真正想看到的高品質內容包，其中甚至包括《老友記》和《生活大爆炸》等。

It's got a great menu. It's distinguished from others because, in addition to that very high quality, you also have meaningful local. And so -- and that is also driving not only consumer interest, but distributors' interest in the product. So we feel really good about where we are.

它的菜單很棒。它與其他產品的不同之處在於，除了非常高的品質之外，還具有有意義的本地性。所以——這不僅推動了消費者的興趣，也推動了經銷商對產品的興趣。所以我們對於目前的狀況感到非常滿意。

JB, talk a little bit about our news and sports strategy because it differs in the US versus other markets.

JB，請談談我們的新聞和體育策略，因為它在美國和其他市場有所不同。

Yeah. Robert, I think both on the diversity point also, we've never gone into a period, as we look out the next two years and frankly, well into 2027 at this point, where we feel better about the lineup, the consistency, the strength.

是的。羅伯特，我認為從多元化的角度來看，我們從未進入過這樣的時期，當我們展望未來兩年，坦白說，到 2027 年，我們對陣容、一致性和實力感覺更好。

So in our note, we have 15 franchises returning, they've have been in our top 20 at times. So we feel really good about the content lineup coming and the diversity of that content lineup over the next two plus years. On the sports and news front, we recognize and we've said, I think, fairly openly.

所以在我們的記錄中，我們有 15 個特許經營權回歸，他們有時甚至進入前 20 名。因此，我們對即將推出的內容陣容以及未來兩年多內容陣容的多樣性感到非常滿意。在體育和新聞方面，我們認識到了這一點，而且我認為我們已經相當公開地表達了這一點。

We're continuing to experiment on what the right model is. And the reality is we have a variety of different models in operation around the world. In the US, as you rightly point out, we announced yesterday we're moving sports and news out of the ad-lite and into the premium and standard ad free. In Latin America, we have it across all of our packages. In Europe, we upsell it as an add-on and a buy through.

我們將繼續試驗什麼是正確的模型。事實上，我們在世界各地實施各種不同的模式。在美國，正如您正確指出的那樣，我們昨天宣布將把體育和新聞從精簡版廣告轉移到高級和標準無廣告版。在拉丁美洲，我們的所有包裹都包含該成分。在歐洲，我們將其作為附加產品和直購產品進行銷售。

And so we're openly continuing to experiment as to what the right model is and what the best way is to both drive engagement and first user acquisition through that powerful content. But at the same time, make sure we're figuring out a business model that works. And we continue to experiment and see what works. And we have the beauty of a global footprint with rights across the world that we can experiment with.

因此，我們將繼續公開嘗試，以尋找正確的模式，以及透過強大的內容推動參與度和首次用戶獲取的最佳方式。但同時，確保我們能找到可行的商業模式。我們會繼續進行實驗，看看哪些方法有效。我們擁有全球足跡之美，在世界各地擁有可以嘗試的權利。

And one of the things that we've pivoted on is Mark Thompson and Alex MacCallum, who -- the two of them built the digital business at the New York Times, we see that as an opportunity to build a completely separate digital and subscription line of businesses.

我們的重點關注對象之一是馬克湯普森 (Mark Thompson) 和亞歷克斯麥卡勒姆 (Alex MacCallum)，他們兩人共同創建了《紐約時報》的數位業務，我們認為這是一個建立完全獨立的數位和訂閱業務系列的機會。

And over the next few months, they'll be out talking to you about how they're taking advantage of CNN as the largest digital news brand in the world, the most trusted news brand in the world, with over 150 million people coming every month, and how they're going -- and what we're doing to build a sustainable digital business out of that.

在接下來的幾個月裡，他們將告訴你如何利用 CNN 作為全球最大的數位新聞品牌、全球最值得信賴的新聞品牌、每月超過 1.5 億觀眾的優勢，以及他們目前的發展情況——以及我們正在做什麼來在此基礎上建立可持續發展的數位業務。

But when you look at the overall question of what are we, we said three years ago, it's not how much, it's how good. And that has been our focus. So in Europe, when we have sport, we have the best support. And we're going out with the highest quality content. And so that is Casey and Channing and Mike and Pam, the focus is -- and Gun, it's not how much, it's how good for this streaming service.

但當你審視我們是什麼這個整體問題時，我們三年前就說過，問題不在於我們有多少，而在於我們有多好。這正是我們關注的重點。因此在歐洲，當我們進行運動時，我們會得到最好的支持。我們將推出最高品質的內容。這就是 Casey、Channing、Mike 和 Pam 的重點——而 Gun，重點不在於有多少，而在於這項串流服務有多好。

Okay, let's move to the next question, please.

好的，請我們進入下一個問題。

Kannan Venkateshwar, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的 Kannan Venkateshwar。

Thank you. Maybe a couple. First one on strategy. And David, if you could just outline how you see the asset landscape right now. Obviously, there's a lot going on in the industry with different objectives. But in this environment, do you see yourself as a buyer or a seller?

謝謝。也許是一對。第一個是關於策略的。大衛，您能否概述一下您目前對資產狀況的看法。顯然，業內正在發生很多事情，目的各不相同。但在這種環境下，您認為自己是買家還是賣家？

I mean is there an opportunity to maybe become the consolidator and do some kind of a bigger spin-off of networks? So your thoughts on that would be useful.

我的意思是，是否有機會成為整合者並進行某種更大規模的網路分拆？因此，你對此的想法將會很有用。

And I'm going to just to follow-up on Jessica's question on the full year. When you have easier comps on Studios this year, and if you just look at Networks, despite the headwinds, you just take the same trend line as this year into next year, and then DTC profitability that you guided to, it would imply that you should grow EBITDA in '25. So is there something that takes away from that algorithm? It would be great to get your thoughts on that. Thanks.

我只是想跟進傑西卡關於全年的問題。如果今年工作室的業績比較好，而你只看網絡，儘管面臨阻力，但只要將今年的趨勢線延續到明年，再加上你預期的 DTC 盈利能力，這就意味著 25 年 EBITDA 應該會增長。那麼，這個演算法是否有缺陷呢？我很想聽聽您對此的想法。謝謝。

I guess, fundamentally, when you look at the marketplace, we really believe that the global players will be those that will really prosper in the years ahead. And ultimately, the largest sustainable growth media companies, they'll probably be four or five or six.

我想，從根本上來說，當你觀察市場時，我們確實相信全球參與者將是未來幾年真正繁榮的企業。最終，最大的永續成長媒體公司可能是四、五或六家。

And our job every day is to fight to get a seat at that table. And we feel that we've made real progress now in -- with our global streaming service and the global appeal of all of our content and the consumer reaction to assure that seat.

我們每天的工作就是爭取在那張桌子旁佔有一席之地。我們認為，我們現在已經取得了真正的進展——憑藉我們的全球串流媒體服務以及所有內容的全球吸引力和消費者的反應，我們確保了這一地位。

The consequence of that, I think, is there's more and more pressure on regional players. Can they build their own platform? Do they have enough local content? One of the things that we're seeing now is we've been talking about bundling for 2.5 years.

我認為，其結果是，地區參與者面臨越來越大的壓力。他們能建立自己的平台嗎？他們有足夠的本地內容嗎？我們現在看到的事情之一是，我們討論捆綁銷售已經 2.5 年了。

But many of the really high quality local players have come to us now after 2 or 2.5 years and aligned on this -- on our strategy of Better Together. So whether it's Globo in Brazil or Televisa in Mexico or all across Europe, players coming to us. And I expect that that's going to happen.

但許多真正高品質的本地參與者在合作兩年或兩年半之後已經來到我們身邊，並認同我們「更好的合作」策略。因此，無論是巴西的 Globo 還是墨西哥的 Televisa，還是整個歐洲，玩家都會來找我們。我預計這會發生。

There'll be a few global players. There may be some consolidation in getting there. The consolidation may simply come with bundles. And the bundles, as opposed to just being an economic bundle, will be a consumer friendly bundle where you can move between content from one to another. And I think we're going to be a very, very attractive player.

將會有一些全球參與者。在達到這一目標的過程中可能會有一些整合。合併可能僅以捆綁的方式進行。這些捆綁包不僅僅是經濟捆綁包，而是一種消費者友好型捆綁包，您可以在其中從一個內容轉移到另一個內容。我認為我們將成為非常非常有吸引力的參與者。

We're already having a number of discussions, and we'll just have to assess how strong we are alone and who -- and when we need. In the end, we'll always do what's right. We're a public company. We're always going to do what's right for shareholders. But JB, this idea of bundling because we're -- this is something we're attacking regularly.

我們已經進行了許多討論，我們只需要評估我們自己的力量有多強，以及我們需要誰來幫忙以及何時需要。最終，我們總是會做正確的事。我們是一家上市公司。我們始終會做對股東有利的事。但是 JB，這種捆綁的想法是我們經常攻擊的事情。

Yeah. I mean I think, at the end, as David said, there are two forms of aggregation. There's a structural one, which is what David talked about. And then there's a commercial one, which is the bundling strategy. And we've seen great success with it, obviously, here in the US with Disney, seeing it both drive acquisition as well as significantly reduced churn.

是的。我的意思是，我認為最終正如大衛所說，有兩種聚合形式。有一個結構性的問題，這就是大衛談到的。然後還有商業策略，即捆綁策略。顯然，在美國，我們看到了巨大的成功，例如迪士尼，它既推動了客戶收購，也顯著降低了客戶流失。

And to the earlier question that Robert had about diversity. The reality is the industry has gone from a model in the 2010 to 2020 period of everybody trying to do everything, and frankly a lot of content and an overspend to a much more rational spend where we've gotten all back to doing what we're really good at and providing consumers access to all that goodness through these bundles.

回答羅伯特之前提出的關於多元化的問題。現實情況是，2010 年至 2020 年期間，行業模式是每個人都想做所有事情，坦率地說，內容很多，支出超支，但現在，支出更加理性，我們都回到了做我們真正擅長的事情，並通過這些捆綁服務讓消費者享受到所有的好東西。

And so I think that is a commercial path to getting a lot of the value, and we're seeing it happen already. And as David said, the good news is people are seeing that and it's gaining a bit of momentum across the world, not just with global players, but frankly with the regional and local players as well. And so we think that's an exciting new growth vector for us as well.

因此，我認為這是獲取大量價值的商業途徑，而我們已經看到它的發生。正如戴維所說，好消息是人們看到了這一點，而且這種趨勢在世界範圍內獲得了一定的發展勢頭，不僅是全球參與者，坦率地說，地區和本地參與者也同樣如此。因此我們認為這對我們來說也是一個令人興奮的新成長方向。

And sports will be a pressure point. Some regional players are becoming more and more dependent on sports and rental sports. And the ability to really build a long term platform on short term sport rights has not been a good story in the past, and it's unlikely to be a good story in the future.

體育運動將會成為一個壓力點。一些地區性參與者對體育和租賃體育的依賴越來越大。而在短期體育轉播權上真正建立一個長期平台的能力在過去並不是一個好故事，在未來也不太可能是一個好故事。

Okay. And then, Kannan, on your financial follow-up. Look, as you saw in the letter, we're not intending to give consolidated financial guidance this year, as we did in the prior year as well. But we have a lot and I'll just recap some of the points that we put in there and give some real context.

好的。然後，Kannan，請談談您的財務後續情況。你看，正如你在信中看到的，我們今年不打算提供合併財務指導，就像去年一樣。但是我們有很多內容，我只想重述我們在其中提出的一些觀點並提供一些真實的背景。

So starting with B2C, you saw the $1.3 billion EBITDA target. Very achievable from our perspective. And importantly, having gone through a $3 billion swing over 2.5 years here in profitability, I do think we have now earned the flexibility here to make trade-off decisions, get behind what's really working, fuel further growth or optimize for profitability where we don't see those opportunities. So I think that's a pretty specific guidance that you can model.

因此從 B2C 開始，您會看到 13 億美元的 EBITDA 目標。從我們的角度來看，這是非常容易實現的。重要的是，在經歷了兩年半的 30 億美元盈利變化之後，我認為我們現在已經獲得了靈活性，可以做出權衡決策，支持真正有效的方法，推動進一步增長，或者在我們沒有看到這些機會的地方優化盈利能力。所以我認為這是一個非常具體的指導，您可以效仿。

On the Studios side, you're right, we do have a lower comp in 2024. We talked about the limited avails for content licensing in the prior year. That's obviously getting better. We have a hunting TV production business, which we expect to continue growing and improving in profitability. Channing's team is already doing a phenomenal job.

從工作室方面來說，您說得對，2024 年我們的收入確實會較低。我們討論了去年內容授權的有限效益。情況顯然正在好轉。我們擁有一家狩獵電視製作業務公司，預計該業務將繼續成長並提高獲利能力。錢寧的團隊已經做出了非凡的工作。

And then JB, you may have seen the restructuring of the games unit that JB has implemented towards the end of last year. So with that, we should be in a much better position in 2025 as well. And then I also believe that our film slate has a greater balance.

然後是 JB，您可能已經看到 JB 在去年年底實施的遊戲部門重組。因此，我們在 2025 年也應該會處於更有利的地位。而且我也相信我們的電影片會更平衡。

And as we've discussed multiple times, we should be -- with the process rigor we have implemented, we should be doing better financially, both in success and the inevitable misses that you have to expect with a hit driven business as well. So in the nutshell, Studios, certainly very significantly better than EBITDA this year than in the prior year.

正如我們多次討論過的，我們應該——透過實施嚴格的流程，我們應該在財務上做得更好，無論是在成功方面，還是在不可避免的失誤方面，這些都是在熱門驅動的業務中必須預料到的。簡而言之，今年影業的 EBITDA 肯定比去年好很多。

And then the third point, obviously, is the Network business. And I don't want to create the wrong impression here. That business continues to face challenges. We have seen a weaker ad sales result in Q4 than what we had hoped for and what we had expected, frankly. We didn't make a ton of political advertising. But CNN, we had hoped for a greater benefit from the elections, which didn't come in.

第三點顯然是網路業務。我不想在此給人留下錯誤的印象。該業務繼續面臨挑戰。坦白說，第四季的廣告銷售業績低於我們的希望和預期。我們沒有做大量的政治廣告。但是 CNN，我們原本希望從選舉中獲得更大的利益，但結果並未實現。

Now going into the first quarter, we see some mild positive signals from the ad market. It's not a sea change, but we're seeing less upfront cancellations in the prior year. We're seeing scatter CPMs up moderately. But we also acknowledge that we have some work to do in terms of our linear portfolio ratings and delivery.

現在進入第一季度，我們看到廣告市場出現了一些溫和的正面訊號。這雖然不是一個巨大的變化，但是我們發現前一年提前取消的情況有所減少。我們看到散度 CPM 適度上升。但我們也承認，我們在線性投資組合評級和交付方面還有一些工作要做。

Channing has taken over that business as an additional responsibility, has put the team in place. There are a lot of content initiatives that are underway. Some new shows bailing out loud of the TLC, the team that's delivered so many hits in the past is doing very well.

錢寧已將該業務作為額外職責，並組建了團隊。目前有許多內容計劃正在進行中。一些新節目大聲宣布脫離TLC，這個過去推出過許多熱門節目的團隊表現非常出色。

And then the thing that I'm most excited about is that Channing, with her vast knowledge of the deep library at Warner Bros. and HBO, is going to implement a strategy of much more efficiently utilizing those libraries. That's always been one of the core ideas from a synergy perspective here. So hopefully, we'll be seeing some progress there as well.

而最讓我興奮的是，錢寧對華納兄弟和 HBO 的深度圖書館有著淵博的了解，她將實施更有效地利用這些圖書館的策略。從協同效應的角度來看，這始終是我們的核心思想之一。所以希望我們也能看到一些進展。

So -- and then I called out on the affiliate side, the fact that we're going to -- we're expecting to continue to see sub declines. It's quite too early to expect a leveling off or a significant moderation, slightly lower rate increases than in the past.

所以 — — 然後我指出，從附屬公司的角度來看，事實上我們預計將繼續看到訂閱量下降。現在期待利率趨於平穩或顯著緩和、比過去略有下降還為時過早。

We do have a great sports portfolio. And again, I'm very, very happy with how that sports strategy has been implemented over the past few years. And -- but that does mean that we're seeing some incremental expense in 2025.

我們確實擁有出色的運動投資組合。我再次對過去幾年來體育策略的實施感到非常高興。但這確實意味著我們將在 2025 年看到一些增量支出。

Importantly, expense that will come back out in 2026. Because remember, we have a half a season of the NBA this year, and that was a significant chunk of expense, and 2025 is only suffering a little bit on the expense side from having that expense plus the cost of the new rights. So we'll see a very significant improvement as we come out of the year into 2026.

重要的是，這筆費用將在 2026 年再次出現。因為請記住，今年 NBA 只有半個賽季，這是一筆不小的開支，而 2025 年在費用方面只會受到一點點影響，因為有這筆費用加上新版權的成本。因此，到 2026 年，我們將看到非常顯著的改善。

Other than that, we will continue to be very, very focused on cost. It continues to be a huge priority for the team, albeit, obviously, now from a basis of a cost structure that's already been improved very significantly over the past few years.

除此之外，我們將繼續非常非常關注成本。儘管顯然從成本結構的基礎來看，過去幾年中成本結構已經得到了顯著改善，但這仍然是團隊的首要任務。

And then last comment I'll make is on the International side. We continue to see trends in the linear market that are much better than domestically. Not in the aggregate growing, but a much more moderate pressure there, even though in the current geopolitical environment, we have to acknowledge that there's some uncertainty there as well.

我最後要說的是國際方面。我們繼續看到線性市場的趨勢比國內好得多。雖然總體上沒有成長，但壓力要溫和得多，儘管在當前的地緣政治環境下，我們必須承認那裡也存在一些不確定性。

So that's the reason why we're not out here with a firm hard number for that business or the company in the aggregate. But look, we're making phenomenal progress in the transformation of our business and the engine here is obviously to have those lines crossed. And we see so much opportunity in DTC and the Studio businesses, and we have no doubt that we're going to cross the lines at some point by putting a timestamp on it.

這就是為什麼我們沒有給出該業務或公司整體的確切數字。但你看，我們在業務轉型方面取得了驚人的進展，而這裡的引擎顯然是跨越這些界限。我們在 DTC 和 Studio 業務中看到了很多機會，我們毫不懷疑，我們將在某個時候通過為其打上時間戳來跨越界限。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Kutgun Maral, Evercore ISI.

Kutgun Maral，Evercore ISI。

Good morning and thanks for taking the question. I want to ask about free cash flow and the balance sheet. Gunnar, I know you just mentioned that you're not providing explicit consolidated guidance and walk through the moving pieces and the uncertainty ahead.

早上好，感謝您回答這個問題。我想問一下自由現金流和資產負債表。岡納，我知道您剛才提到，您沒有提供明確的全面指導，也沒有詳細介紹未來的動態和不確定性。

So forgive me for the follow-up, but any chance you could expand on the free cash flow outlook for the year, particularly with the moving pieces across working capital?

所以請原諒我的後續問題，但您是否可以詳細說明今年的自由現金流前景，特別是營運資本的變動部分？

And I ask in part to get a better sense of where net leverage can move to from 3.8 times today, because it seems like we could see a healthy year of deleveraging ahead, but I can't really tell with the EBITDA commentary. So I would appreciate your perspective. Thank you.

我提出這個問題的部分原因是為了更好地了解淨槓桿率可以從目前的 3.8 倍升至何種水平，因為看起來我們可以看到未來一年健康的去槓桿化趨勢，但我無法根據 EBITDA 評論來判斷。因此我很感激您的觀點。謝謝。

Sure. Look, Kutgun as you know, free cash flow has been one of our priorities from a financial perspective, the most important metrics. And we have really changed the entire company's mentality. This was -- this is not a fact anyone looked at three years ago, and we have a pretty well-oiled machine now. And that's one of the reasons why we continue to put up these strong cash conversion rates even with some top line pressures, especially on the linear side.

當然。聽著，庫特根，如你所知，從財務角度來看，自由現金流一直是我們的優先事項之一，也是最重要的指標。我們確實改變了整個公司的心態。這是──三年前沒有人注意到的事實，現在我們擁有一台運作良好的機器。這就是為什麼我們即使面臨一些營收壓力（尤其是在線性方面），仍能繼續保持強勁的現金轉換率的原因之一。

The balance sheet, I think is in very good shape now. By the end of this quarter, we will have paid down $19 billion of debt since closing the transaction. And we will continue to be super, super focused on this. At the same time, I also want to reiterate, I'm not worried about any maturities. I view our capital structure as a real asset. The terms that we locked in between the rates and the maturity profile are an absolute strategic asset for this company.

我認為現在的資產負債表狀況非常好。到本季末，我們將償還交易結束以來的 190 億美元債務。我們將繼續高度重視這一點。同時，我也想重申，我並不擔心任何到期事項。我將我們的資本結構視為真正的資產。我們在利率和到期日之間鎖定的條款對該公司來說絕對是戰略資產。

So we'll continue to focus on bringing that debt down further. I continue to believe that 2.5 to 3 times is the right leverage target for this company. But it's not the be all end all, I think, that is the target of this company. And specifically for free cash flow in 2025, again, we're going to continue to focus on it.

因此，我們將繼續致力於進一步降低債務。我仍然認為 2.5 到 3 倍是該公司正確的槓桿目標。但我認為，這並不是這家公司的全部目標。具體來說，對於 2025 年的自由現金流，我們將繼續關注它。

Talking through some individual building blocks, we want to continue growing content investments, albeit with continued improvement of our ROI against those investments, and I see evidence of that every day, moving further through the free cash flow walk.

透過一些單獨的建構模組來談論，我們希望繼續增加內容投資，儘管這些投資的投資回報率持續提高，而且我每天都能看到這方面的證據，並透過自由現金流的不斷增長而不斷前進。

Working capital was -- will be strong again in 2025. We did have a good result in though there was a drag of almost $500 million from paying down some of our securities facility opportunistically, which I don't expect to happen in 2025.

營運資本將在 2025 年再次強勁成長。我們確實取得了不錯的成績，不過，由於機會性地償還了部分證券融資，拖累了近 5 億美元，我預計這種情況在 2025 年不會發生。

We will obviously benefit from lower debt load and corresponding interest payments. We are going to see a little more CapEx as we expand our production footprint, predominantly in (inaudible) expanding our capacity there. And restructuring expenses are going to continue to come down. But to your point, the absolute dollar amount in the end is going to be mostly driven by the resulting final EBITDA number, of course.

較低的債務負擔和相應的利息支付顯然將使我們受益。隨著我們擴大生產範圍，我們將看到更多的資本支出，主要是（聽不清楚）擴大我們在那裡的產能。重組費用將會繼續下降。但正如您所說，最終的絕對美元金額當然主要取決於最終的 EBITDA 數字。

Very helpful, thanks Gunnar.

非常有幫助，謝謝 Gunnar。

Next question.

下一個問題。

Rich Greenfield, LightShed.

里奇‧格林菲爾德 (Rich Greenfield)，LightShed。

Thanks for taking the questions. I've got a few, but hopefully, they're quick. Given your comments about sports stuff that penalized '25 until the NBA ends after the first half, how should we think about the net sports cost savings for '26 versus '25?

感謝您回答這些問題。我有幾個，但希望它們很快。鑑於您對 25 年體育賽事處罰直至 NBA 上半場結束的評論，我們應該如何看待 26 年與 25 年相比的淨體育成本節省？

Disney is also -- this sort of goes to JB's commentary. Disney is dropping a whole bunch of sports. You're probably going to have half the UFC available, all of F1. and Sunday Night Baseball is being now available.

迪士尼也是——這有點符合 JB 的評論。迪士尼將放棄大量運動。您可能會看到一半的 UFC 賽事和全部的 F1 賽事。 《週日棒球之夜》現已上映。

But it doesn't -- given you're renting sport comments, should investors assume that you don't have interest in any of those sports rights at the moment?

但事實並非如此——鑑於您正在出租體育評論，投資者是否應該認為您目前對任何體育版權都不感興趣？

And then just finally to follow up on the earlier question on your new affiliate deals. Do you get any type of minimum penetration guarantees for Max when you included as a wholesale as part of these packages? I know you used to get minimum penetration for your cable networks, I'm curious how that works for DTC.

最後，我想跟進一下之前關於您的新聯盟交易的問題。當您作為批發商納入這些套餐的一部分時，您是否可以獲得任何類型的 Max 最低滲透率保證？我知道你們的有線電視網絡曾經獲得過最低滲透率，我很好奇這對 DTC 是如何運作的。

Thanks, Rich. Look, we like sports, but we're very disciplined and we're opportunistic. So we're money good on almost all of our sports in this company. And we've worked very hard to build our free cash flow, our EBIT, to pay down debt.

謝謝，里奇。瞧，我們喜歡運動，但我們非常自律並且善於抓住機會。因此，我們公司在幾乎所有運動項目上都賺得盆滿缽滿。我們非常努力地建立我們的自由現金流，我們的息稅前利潤，來償還債務。

And I think the critical element for us, as we look at our streaming service, is the quality content, the movies the series that Channing and Casey does, that's the leading -- that's the leading edge of what consumers -- and our library. That's the leading edge of the value equation.

我認為，對我們來說，串流媒體服務的關鍵因素是優質內容，錢寧和凱西主演的電影和電視劇，這些都是領先的——這是消費者和我們圖書館的前沿。這就是價值方程式的前沿。

And we own that. So when we launch Harry Potter in a year or a little over a year, we'll have 10 consecutive years of Harry Potter and be able to amortize that globally around the world. That kind of investment also pays off in merchandising, in our smaller theme oriented parks.

這是我們自己的。因此，當我們在一年或一年多一點的時間內推出《哈利波特》時，我們將擁有連續 10 年的《哈利波特》版權，並且能夠在全球範圍內攤銷這項版權。在我們規模較小的主題樂園中，這種投資在商品銷售方面也獲得了回報。

And so our focus is let's really spend economics on where we can get the best return. So there are sports rights that are -- that we can look at opportunistically and say we can make a real return of. But we are -- we don't need any more sports anywhere in the world in order to support our business.

因此，我們的重點是真正把經濟投入到可以獲得最佳回報的地方。因此，我們可以抓住機會，利用體育版權獲得真正的回報。但是我們——我們不需要世界上任何地方的任何其他體育運動來支持我們的業務。

We would buy sports in order to -- if we think it would enhance our business. And it's been more difficult. Some of those prices being paid, and some of the competitors are opting to go to sports instead of doing what we do, because what we do is long cycle, it's hard and it's not easy to do what Channing and Casey and Mike and Pam and James does.

如果我們認為購買體育產品能夠促進我們的業務，我們就會這麼做。而這變得更加困難。有些代價是必須付出的，有些競爭對手選擇從事體育運動而不是做我們所做的事情，因為我們所做的事情是一個長週期，很難，要做到錢寧 (Channing)、凱西 (Casey)、邁克 (Mike)、帕姆 (Pam) 和詹姆斯 (James) 所做的事情並不容易。

So when I see a real push to pay a lot more for sports to get effective -- guaranteed audiences or an audience that you could really model versus building on great IP, like Batman or the Penguin or -- I think that's a good thing for us because that's where we're going to really build the value and that's what we build our brand around.

因此，當我看到人們真正推動為體育運動支付更多的費用以獲得效果——保證觀眾或真正可以模仿的觀眾，而不是建立在偉大的智慧財產權上，例如蝙蝠俠或企鵝人——我認為這對我們來說是一件好事，因為那才是我們真正創造價值的地方，也是我們建立品牌的基礎。

And then, Rich, on the penetration and carriage commitment question, a couple of things. One is it's not a one size fits all. And globally, we have a variety of different models in play. The second is, obviously, we're doing soft and hard bundles.

然後，Rich，關於滲透率和承運承諾問題，我想說幾件事。一是它並不是一個適合所有情況的解決方案。在全球範圍內，我們實行各種不同的模式。第二，顯然我們正在進行軟捆綁和硬捆綁。

In the soft bundles, obviously, there's no penetration or carriage commitments. In the hard bundles, there's plenty that do have carriage for penetration commitments. And then there's others that don't. So it's really kind of a mixed bag.

顯然，在軟捆綁中沒有滲透或運輸承諾。在硬體捆綁產品中，有許多產品確實有滲透運輸承諾。而有些則不這樣。因此，這確實是一種好壞參半的情況。

It's hard to say it's one particular model, but we certainly do -- in a variety of cases, do have obligations and commitments, and that's part of what we obviously -- the reasons we pursue them is that we do have carriage commitments like we've done in UK with Sky, like we've done in other markets across the world, where the partners agreeing to distribute it to a fixed number of their subscriber base.

很難說這是一種特定的模式，但在各種情況下，我們確實有義務和承諾，這顯然是我們追求它們的一部分——我們追求它們的原因是我們確實有傳輸承諾，就像我們在英國與天空電視台所做的那樣，就像我們在全球其他市場所做的那樣，合作夥伴同意將其分發給固定數量的訂戶群。

How much is (multiple speakers)

多少錢（多位發言者）

I'll just add one last thing on the sports side to be specific. We will see several hundred millions of dollars of sports expense come out in 2026. To be fair, there will be some associated ad revenues as well, but this should be a sort of certainly a few hundred million dollar improvement in 2026 over '25.

我只想就體育方面具體補充最後一件事。2026年，我們將看到數億美元的體育開支支出。公平地說，也會有一些相關的廣告收入，但到 2026 年，這肯定會比 2025 年增加幾億美元。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Mike Ng, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的 Mike Ng。

Hey, good morning. Thank you for the question. I just have two related to DTC. It's encouraging to hear about the 150 million plus subscriber target by the end of 2026. Of that, roughly 35 million subscriber growth over the next two years.

嘿，早安。感謝您的提問。我只有兩個與 DTC 相關。聽到到 2026 年底用戶數將超過 1.5 億的目標，真是令人振奮。其中，未來兩年內用戶數將增加約 3,500 萬人。

Any thoughts on how much is domestic versus international? It sounds like the comments around the international launches and the hard bundles, it seems like it's more international, but just wanted to get your thoughts around that.

對於國內和國際的比例，您有何看法？這聽起來像是有關國際發布和硬體捆綁的評論，似乎更加國際化，但我只是想聽聽你的想法。

And the related ARPU pressures because of these growth drivers, is that more of a comment around ARPU potentially being flattish from here? Or could we actually see ARPU down a little bit before normalizing and returning to growth? Thank you.

而由於這些成長動力而產生的相關 ARPU 壓力，是否更多的意味著 ARPU 值從現在起可能持平？或者我們實際上是否會看到 ARPU 略有下降，然後才恢復正常並恢復成長？謝謝。

Look, the US is a pretty mature market. We think that there's still some growth given the quality of our service. And we're fighting for that. A lot of the growth may come from price as we play around with the quality of what we're providing versus the cost of what we're providing, as well as how many people at home can use the service, and that will be rolling out.

你看，美國是一個相當成熟的市場。我們認為，考慮到我們服務的質量，還有一定的成長空間。我們正在為此而奮鬥。許多成長可能來自價格，因為我們在產品的品質與成本之間尋找平衡，也考慮了有多少人可以在家中使用這項服務，而這些服務將會逐步推廣。

But this idea of a global media company and a global streamer and being able to scale, that is -- that's the point that we're pushing on right now on an open door. And that's where we think, when we look around, there's not a lot of players play in that game. So JB?

但是，這種全球媒體公司和全球串流媒體能夠擴大規模的想法，就是——這是我們現在敞開大門推動的目標。這就是我們的想法，環顧四周，我們發現並沒有很多玩家參與這款遊戲。那麼 JB 呢？

Yeah, I mean, I think, Mike, a large proportion of the growth will come from international, just because, again, as David mentioned, we've got a material footprint outside the US that we're not even reaching yet. And so that international growth will come from launching in new markets as well as penetration growth. So that's the answer on the first question.

是的，我的意思是，麥克，我認為很大一部分成長將來自國際市場，因為，正如大衛所提到的，我們在美國以外的地區已經取得了實質的進展，但我們還沒有達到這個目標。因此，國際成長將來自於新市場的開拓以及滲透率的成長。這就是第一個問題的答案。

On the ARPU question, you will see some deterioration in the ARPU in the near term. But again, it's -- at this point of our expansion particularly given that you think about things like our ad-lite offering prior to about 15 months ago was only available in one market. It's now available in over 45 markets. That's taking time as we go with a lower priced ARPU or price in some of these markets and build up the advertising revenue stream, that will take some time.

關於 ARPU 問題，您會看到短期內 ARPU 有所下降。但是，在我們擴張的這個階段，特別是考慮到，大約 15 個月前，我們的精簡版廣告產品僅在一個市場上提供。目前它已在 45 多個市場上市。這需要時間，因為我們會降低某些市場的 ARPU 或價格並建立廣告收入流，這也需要一些時間。

As we launch in international markets in Asia, which is a region that has generally lower ARPUs, you'll see some, obviously, continued pressure that comes from that. And then as we do recognize that trying to get the product in the hands of more people more quickly is a priority as we do these attractive hard bundled deals, but where we do give up a little bit more on pricing to get immediate scale and distribution, that will as well.

當我們進入亞洲的國際市場時，由於亞洲地區的 ARPU 值通常較低，因此你顯然會看到由此帶來的持續壓力。然後，我們確實認識到，在我們進行這些有吸引力的捆綁交易時，嘗試將產品更快地送到更多人手中是當務之急，但我們確實在定價上稍微放棄一些，以立即獲得規模和分銷，這也將如此。

So you will see that pressure go on. But we'll continue to manage the business smartly in terms of looking at our subscriber acquisition costs and balancing that with the right LTV profile. And we think there's a lot of room still to lean into that equation based on the numbers we're seeing. So -- and medium to long term, we're very confident we can get back to ARPU growth even after this expansion period here over the next sort of 12 to 18 months.

所以你會看到壓力持續存在。但我們將繼續明智地管理業務，專注於我們的用戶獲取成本，並透過正確的 LTV 配置實現平衡。我們認為，根據我們看到的數字，這一等式還有很大的發展空間。因此，從中期到長期來看，我們非常有信心，即使在未來 12 到 18 個月的擴張期之後，我們也能恢復 ARPU 成長。

Great. Thanks David. Thanks JB.

偉大的。謝謝大衛。謝謝 JB。

Ben Swinburne, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的本‧斯威伯恩 (Ben Swinburne)。

Thanks. Good morning and thanks for the shareholder letter. I think it's helpful. There's three sort of long term kind of -- I guess, you wouldn't call them guidance, but long term goals that you guys have talked about either in the letter or this morning, one for each segment.

謝謝。早安，感謝您的股東來信。我認為這很有幫助。有三個長期目標——我想，你不會稱它們為指導，而是你們在信中或今天早上談到的長期目標，每個部分一個。

I was hoping you could talk a little bit more about it. In networks, there's a comment that you think you can stabilize segment revenues over the next few years following the MVPD agreements? That would be certainly exceeding the market's expectations. I'd love to hear a little more about that outlook.

我希望您能就此再多談一點。在網路中，有評論說您認為按照 MVPD 協議，您可以在未來幾年內穩定分部收入嗎？這肯定會超出市場的預期。我很想聽到更多關於這個觀點的看法。

The 20% margin to DTC, any time line that you'd want to share with us at this point? I think you'll be probably around 10% plus for '25. And then, David, the $3 billion plus of Studios EBITDA, I think last year was tough. But even in the prior year, you were kind of in the mid low 2s.

DTC 的利潤率為 20%，您現在想與我們分享任何時間表嗎？我認為 25 年的成長幅度可能會在 10% 以上。然後，大衛，電影公司的 EBITDA 超過 30 億美元，我認為去年是艱難的一年。但即使在前一年，你的成績也只是 2 分左右。

So how can you help us gain confidence across those three metrics, all of which I think would be -- would drive healthy value for your stock and upside to expectations. Thanks a lot.

那麼，您該如何幫助我們對這三個指標獲得信心呢？我認為這三個指標都會為您的股票帶來健康的價值並達到預期。多謝。

Yeah. Okay, Ben, thank you. Let me take them one by one. On the network side, I want to make sure the comments are understood properly. We're not expecting sort of revenue stability as in sort of zero growth or decline, right?

是的。好的，本，謝謝你。讓我一一介紹。在網路方面，我想確保這些評論被正確理解。我們不期望收入出現零成長或下降的穩定，對嗎？

What we're talking about is stabilizing our position within the industry trends. And certainly, we do hope that some of the movement that we've now seen in recent affiliate renewals over time will have a positive impact on the industry overall. But don't take this as sort of guiding to flat revenue from linear. But I do think our hand today, much better than it was maybe six to nine months ago.

我們正在談論的是穩定我們在行業趨勢中的地位。當然，我們確實希望，我們在最近的聯營公司續約中看到的一些動向將對整個行業產生積極影響。但不要將此視為線性收入持平的指導。但我確實認為我們今天的表現比六到九個月前好得多。

On the DTC side, the 20% margin target, it's one of those that we're going to manage. I have no doubt we're going to be able to hit and exceed those margins, but we're not going to be managing towards a margin goal. It would be wrong. As JB laid out, we're looking at lifetime value relative to SAC. We now have a profitable business, and we will use the flexibility to make the trade-off decisions.

在DTC方面，20％的利潤率目標是我們要實現的目標之一。我毫不懷疑我們能夠達到並超過這些利潤，但我們不會努力實現利潤目標。這是錯誤的。正如 JB 所述，我們正在關注相對於 SAC 的終身價值。我們現在擁有一項盈利的業務，我們將利用靈活性來做出權衡決策。

I'd much rather have stronger growth in '25, '26, '27, maybe at the expense of a little bit of EBITDA margin because it builds longer term asset value. Hitting a margin goal a year early or late really doesn't help any of us. First and foremost, shareholders are going to benefit from the asset value we're building. But again, the margin target itself, I think, is very well in hand based on our plans.

我更希望在 25、26、27 年實現更強勁的成長，也許會以犧牲一點 EBITDA 利潤率，因為這可以建立更長期的資產價值。提前或晚一年實現利潤目標實際上對我們任何人都沒有幫助。首先，股東將從我們正在創造的資產價值中受益。但我認為，根據我們的計劃，利潤目標本身已經非常可控。

And then on the Studios side, again, let's go back to what we discussed during the third quarter earnings call. I laid some of the points that impacted 2024. Among others, a year that had a very, very low number of avails in our content library.

然後，在工作室方面，我們再回顧一下我們在第三季財報電話會議上討論的內容。我列出了一些影響 2024 年的要點。其中，有一年我們的內容庫中可用內容的數量非常非常少。

We know that 2025 and all of the years in the near future are going to have a much, much better profile. So there is -- that is a major part of the profitability of our Studio. While the film and TV production drives the replenishment of the library, availability days are a major factor.

我們知道，2025 年以及不遠的將來的所有年份都將擁有更美好的前景。所以這是我們工作室獲利的主要部分。雖然電影和電視製作推動了圖書館的補充，但可用天數是一個主要因素。

The other point is, I don't think we're going to see a year like 2024, again, when it comes to what happened in the games business. This was a real outlier to the negative after, maybe a bit of an outlier on the positive in 2023. But based on the restructuring that JB has implemented, I think we're in a much better place.

另一點是，就遊戲產業而言，我認為我們不會再看到 2024 年那樣的一年。這是之後真正的負面異常值，在 2023 年可能有點正面異常值。但基於 JB 實施的重組，我認為我們的情況會好得多。

And remember, we have made real changes when it comes to managing our franchises, when it comes to driving the ancillary revenues in the consumer products segment, experiences, in tourism, retail, all of those things are now coordinated from the moment of greenlight as opposed to being an afterthought previously. And those are real margin opportunities for every dollar we spend.

請記住，我們在管理特許經營方面、在推動消費品領域的輔助收入、體驗、旅遊和零售方面都做出了真正的改變，所有這些事情現在都是從批准的那一刻開始協調的，而不是之前的事後才想到的。這些都是我們花費的每一美元的真正獲利機會。

So I think we're going to see a real step up in EBITDA in 2025. But when David talks about getting the Studio to $3 billion, that's not an end state, that's sort of fixing where we are right now and then growing from there. And we believe the Studio has enormous potential beyond that.

因此我認為我們將在 2025 年看到 EBITDA 的真正提升。但是當大衛談到讓工作室的收入達到 30 億美元時，這並不是最終目標，而是一種確定我們現在所處的位置，然後從那裡開始成長。我們相信，該工作室還擁有巨大的潛力。

Thanks, Gunnar.

謝謝，Gunnar。

John Hodulik, UBS.

瑞銀的 John Hodulik。

Great, thanks for taking the question. Maybe just a quick one on skinny sports bundles. Despite the wind down of venue, it looks like sort of this distribution model is going to proliferate. You have DirecTV, Comcast , it sounds like what's coming from (inaudible)

太好了，謝謝您回答這個問題。也許只是對瘦身運動套裝的快速介紹。儘管場地逐漸減少，但這種分銷模式看起來將會廣泛傳播。你有 DirecTV、Comcast，聽起來像是來自（聽不清楚）

Just maybe, David, what's your initial thoughts on these bundles in terms of do you think that they're going to see meaningful adoption and drive any sort of meaningful change in either cord cutting or sort of affiliate trends at Warner Bros. Thanks.

大衛，也許吧，您對這些捆綁產品的初步看法是什麼？您認為它們會得到有意義的採用，並推動華納兄弟在有線電視剪線或聯盟趨勢方面發生任何有意義的變化嗎？謝謝。

I think part of it is going to depend on the consumer value proposition. The idea of aggregating sports together and offering it on a contemporary platform, where instead of thinking about channels, you can think about sports and go there and see it, is very compelling.

我認為這在一定程度上取決於消費者價值主張。將體育賽事聚合在一起並在一個現代平台上提供，在這個平台上你不用考慮頻道，而是可以考慮體育賽事並親自到場觀看，這個想法非常引人注目。

It was one of the reasons that we were driving behind venue. So some of these bundles, if you look at them as contemporary platforms that just provide a better consumer experience, is positive. But it really depends on the value equation.

這是我們開車到會場後面的原因之一。因此，如果你將其中一些捆綁產品視為僅提供更好消費者體驗的當代平台，那麼它們是積極的。但這其實取決於價值方程。

If it's very close to the price of the overall bundle, what we've seen over the years is that even though consumers might think that, that is what they choose, when they do get the choice, unless it's significantly less expensive, they opt for the bigger bundle where they could see a wealth of other quality content.

如果它的價格非常接近整個捆綁包的價格，那麼多年來我們看到的情況是，儘管消費者可能認為這就是他們的選擇，但當他們確實有選擇時，除非價格便宜很多，否則他們會選擇更大的捆綁包，這樣他們就可以看到大量其他優質內容。

And so I think, ultimately, everything we're doing is going to be driven by providing a better consumer experience. And everything we do here is driven by that. And it's one of the reasons why we're so optimistic. When you put TV set on and you see 18 apps and 3 people watching TV at the same time, have their phones out googling where a show is or where sport is, it's not a good consumer experience.

因此我認為，最終我們所做的一切都是為了提供更好的消費者體驗。我們在這裡所做的一切都是受此驅動。這是我們如此樂觀的原因之一。當你打開電視機，看到 18 個應用程式和 3 個人同時在看電視，他們用手機搜尋某個節目在哪裡或哪裡有體育賽事，這不是一個好的消費者體驗。

And the value creation over the last 50 years almost always follows a better consumer experience. And that's what we're doing with Disney. That's what we're doing with Verizon when we're together with Netflix. That's what we're doing on our own by having local support, local content together with the best quality TV and motion picture content. But I think there will be an aggregation in a meaningful way behind a couple of the bigger global players.

過去50年來的價值創造幾乎總是伴隨著更好的消費者體驗。這就是我們與迪士尼合作所做的事情。這就是我們與 Netflix 合作時與 Verizon 所做的事情。這就是我們自己所做的事情，我們擁有本地支援、本地內容以及最優質的電視和電影內容。但我認為，在幾家全球大型企業背後，將會以有意義的方式形成一種聚合。

Because consumers at some point, they're going to say, this is too cumbersome and too challenging, and I just want to put the TV on. I want to go to my phone or whatever device I go to and be able to see the content that I love without having to come in and out of products and without googling where things are.

因為消費者在某個時候會說，這太麻煩、太具挑戰性了，我只想打開電視。我希望能夠透過我的手機或任何裝置看到我喜歡的內容，而不必進出產品，也不必透過谷歌搜尋東西在哪裡。

So I think that's going to be the wind at the back of this industry. And everyone's going to have to get on board with that, because consumers are going to demand it. And that's where we're going.

所以我認為這將成為這個行業發展的強大動力。每個人都必須接受這一點，因為消費者會要求這樣做。這正是我們要去的地方。

Alright, thanks, David.

好的，謝謝，大衛。

There are no further questions at this time. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes your conference call for today. We thank you for participating in us that you please disconnect your lines.

目前沒有其他問題。女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。我們感謝您參與我們的活動，請您斷開您的線路。