Upland Software Inc (UPLD) 2025 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Thank you for standing by, and welcome to the Upland Software fourth-quarter 2025 earnings call. (Operator Instructions) The conference call will be recorded and simultaneously webcast at investor.uplandsoftware.com, and a replay will be available there for 12 months. By now, everyone should have access to the fourth-quarter 2025 earnings release, which was distributed today at 8:05 AM, Central Time. If you've not received the release, it's available on Upland's website.

感謝各位耐心等候，歡迎參加 Upland Software 2025 年第四季財報電話會議。（接線員指示）本次電話會議將被錄音，並於 investor.uplandsoftware.com 同步網路直播，且回放將在該網站提供 12 個月。截至目前，大家應已取得 2025 年第四季財報新聞稿，該新聞稿已於今日中部時間上午 8:05 發布。若您尚未收到該新聞稿，可至 Upland 官網取得。

I'd now like to turn the call over to Jack McDonald, Chairman and CEO of Upland Software. Please go ahead, sir.

現在我想把電話會議交給 Upland Software 董事長兼執行長 Jack McDonald。先生，請開始。

All right. Thank you, and welcome to our Q4 2025 earnings call. I'm joined today by Mike Hill, our CFO. On today's call, I will start with a Q4 review. And following that, Mike will provide some detail on the Q4 numbers and our guidance.

好的。謝謝各位，歡迎參加我們 2025 年第四季財報電話會議。今天與我一同出席的是我們的財務長 Mike Hill。在今天的電話會議上，我將先回顧第四季表現。接著，Mike 會就第四季數字與我們的財測提供一些細節。

We'll then open the call up for Q&A. But before we get started, Mike will read the statement. Mike?

之後我們將開放問答。但在開始之前，Mike 會宣讀聲明。Mike？

Yeah. Thank you, Jack. During today's call, we will include statements that are considered forward-looking within the meanings of the securities laws. A detailed discussion of the risks and uncertainties associated with such statements is contained in our periodic reports filed with the SEC. The forward-looking statements made today are based on our views and assumptions and on information currently available to Upland management. We do not intend or undertake any duty to release publicly any updates or revisions to any forward-looking statements.

好的。謝謝你，Jack。在今天的電話會議中，我們將包含依證券法定義屬於前瞻性陳述的內容。關於此類陳述所涉及之風險與不確定性的詳細討論，載於我們向 SEC 提交的定期報告中。今日所作的前瞻性陳述係基於我們的觀點與假設，以及目前 Upland 管理層可取得的資訊。我們無意亦不承擔任何義務公開發布任何前瞻性陳述的更新或修訂。

On this call, Upland will refer to non-GAAP financial measures that, when used in combination with GAAP results, provide Upland management with additional analytical tools to understand its operations. Upland has provided reconciliations of non-GAAP measures to the most comparable GAAP measures in our press release announcing our financial results, which are available on the Investor Relations section of our website. Please note that we are unable to reconcile any forward-looking non-GAAP financial measures to their directly comparable GAAP financial measures because the information which is needed to complete a reconciliation unavailable at this time without unreasonable effort.

在本次電話會議中，Upland 將提及非 GAAP 財務衡量指標；當其與 GAAP 結果合併使用時，可為 Upland 管理層提供額外的分析工具以理解其營運狀況。Upland 已在公布財務結果的新聞稿中提供非 GAAP 指標與最可比 GAAP 指標之調節表，該新聞稿可於我們網站的投資人關係專區取得。請注意，我們無法將任何前瞻性的非 GAAP 財務衡量指標調節至其直接可比的 GAAP 財務衡量指標，因為完成該調節所需的資訊目前無法取得，且若要取得將需付出不合理的努力。

And with that, I'll turn the call back over to Jack.

接下來，我把電話會議交回給 Jack。

All right. Thanks, Mike. The headlines in Q4 revenue, adjusted EBITDA, and margins came in roughly as expected. Our Q4 core organic growth rate was flat due to a tough compare to Q4 2024, which contains some lumpy, additional usage volume revenue.

好的。謝謝你，Mike。第四季營收、調整後 EBITDA 與利潤率等主要指標大致符合預期。由於與 2024 年第四季的比較基期較為嚴峻（其中包含一些一次性、額外的使用量收入），我們第四季核心有機成長率持平。

As we said on previous calls, our core organic growth rate will bounce around a bit from quarter to quarter. The general trend has been improving, yet growth rates were negative 2% three years ago, negative 1% two years ago, roughly 1% positive last year, and we're targeting 1% to 2% this year. So a generally improving trend.

如同我們在先前的電話會議所說，我們的核心有機成長率會在各季之間有所波動。整體趨勢一直在改善；然而，三年前成長率為負 2%，兩年前為負 1%，去年約為正 1%，而我們今年的目標是 1% 至 2%。因此整體呈現改善趨勢。

Annual net dollar retention rate was 96% in 2025, consistent with the prior year. Q4 2025 adjusted EBITDA of $15.3 million resulted in an adjusted EBITDA margin of 31%. Free cash flow for Q4 was $7.2 million, stronger than expected due to successful collection efforts, which brought our full year 2025 free cash flow to $24.4 million, exceeding our $20 million target. We welcomed 110 new customers to Upland in Q4, including 15 new major customers. We also expanded relationships with 199 existing customers, 27 of which were major expansions. These new and expanded relationships continue to be spread across our AI-powered product portfolio.

2025 年年度淨美元留存率為 96%，與前一年一致。2025 年第四季調整後 EBITDA 為 1,530 萬美元，調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 31%。第四季自由現金流為 720 萬美元，因收款工作成效良好而優於預期，使得 2025 年全年自由現金流達 2,440 萬美元，超過我們 2,000 萬美元的目標。第四季我們迎來 110 家新客戶加入 Upland，其中包含 15 家新的大型客戶。我們也擴大了與 199 家既有客戶的合作關係，其中 27 件屬於重大擴張。這些新增與擴張的合作關係持續分布於我們以 AI 驅動的產品組合之中。

On the product front in Q4, I'd note that we continue to perform well based on insights from customers as evidenced by earning 49 batches in G2's Winter 2026 market reports, highlighting consistent value and customer validation for our products. Upland was recognized as a major player in the IDC MarketScape: Worldwide General-Purpose Knowledge Discovery Software 2025 Vendor Assessment, which was published in November of 2025. Upland believes its recognition in this report highlights the value of our AI-powered knowledge management solution, Upland RightAnswers, which is driving scalable, smarter support for enterprise contact centers and help desks.

在第四季的產品面，我想指出，根據客戶洞察，我們持續表現良好；這可由我們在 G2 2026 年冬季市場報告中獲得 49 個徽章所證明，突顯我們產品一貫的價值與客戶驗證。Upland 亦在《IDC MarketScape：全球通用型知識探索軟體 2025 年供應商評估》中被認定為主要參與者，該報告於 2025 年 11 月發布。Upland 認為在該報告中獲得肯定，凸顯我們以 AI 驅動的知識管理解決方案 Upland RightAnswers 的價值；該方案正為企業聯絡中心與服務台帶來可擴展、更智慧的支援。

Upland was recognized in the Gartner Market Guide for RFP Response Management Applications, which was published in October of 2025. And we believe our inclusion in that report showcases the impact of our AI-powered RFP response and proactive sales proposal creation software, Upland Qvidian.

Upland 亦獲列入《Gartner RFP 回應管理應用程式市場指南》，該指南於 2025 年 10 月發布。我們相信，納入該報告展現了我們以 AI 驅動的 RFP 回應與主動式銷售提案生成軟體 Upland Qvidian 的影響力。

So, our Q4 results support and illustrate improvements that we made in the business. Adjusted EBITDA margins expanded from 2024 and the first half of 2025 again, up to north of 30% in the fourth quarter. We continue to see healthy cash flow. We are targeting continued strong cash flow in the $20 million range for the year.

因此，我們第四季的結果支持並展現了我們在業務上所做的改善。調整後 EBITDA 利潤率相較 2024 年以及 2025 年上半年再度擴張，第四季提升至 30% 以上。我們持續看到健康的現金流。我們的目標是在今年維持約 2,000 萬美元水準的強勁現金流。

And other important news, last week, we announced the fact that Sean Daniel is going to be joining Upland as our new CEO. I will be transitioning to Chairman as a part of that. And just super happy to announce this news. Sean has a deep familiarity with our business and our operating model, and our customers and our products having been with Upland from 2013 to 2020 and previously serving as our CTO but also serving in senior general management roles across significant chunk of our product portfolio.

另外一則重要消息：上週我們宣布 Sean Daniel 將加入 Upland，擔任我們的新任執行長。作為其中一部分，我將轉任董事長。我非常高興宣布這項消息。Sean 對我們的業務、營運模式、客戶與產品都非常熟悉；他曾於 2013 年至 2020 年在 Upland 任職，先前擔任我們的技術長（CTO），也曾在我們產品組合中相當大的一部分擔任資深的綜合管理職務。

Significantly, Sean brings highly relevant experience, particularly around AI initiatives that are focused on enterprise knowledge and content and data, and welcome folks to take a look at some of the materials that Sean has published over the last few years on AI and the importance of solid knowledge and content and data foundations as a prerequisite for a successful enterprise AI implementations. Sean's vision really centers on reinforcing Upland's role in enabling organizations to convert that knowledge and content and data into trusted operational intelligence to support AI and agent-driven operating models, which is obviously where the market is going.

更重要的是，Sean 帶來高度相關的經驗，特別是在聚焦企業知識、內容與資料的 AI 計畫方面；也歡迎各位參考 Sean 過去幾年所發表的一些資料，內容談及 AI 以及穩固的知識、內容與資料基礎作為成功推動企業 AI 導入的先決條件之重要性。Sean 的願景核心在於強化 Upland 的角色，協助組織將這些知識、內容與資料轉化為可信賴的營運智慧，以支援 AI 與代理（agent）驅動的營運模式，而這顯然也是市場的發展方向。

Upland already has meaningful capabilities aligned with this vision. And Sean's priority moving forward is going to be to sharpen that execution and translate those capabilities into measurable customer and shareholder value. So Sean will be joining us. We'll be on, I think, our next call, and then we'll be running the calls going forward. But you'll have an opportunity to hear directly from Sean, his vision, and for the business going forward and just super happy to welcome Sean back to Upland and to support him in executing his vision and looking forward to that.

Upland 已具備與此願景一致的關鍵能力。而 Sean 接下來的優先事項將是強化執行力，並將這些能力轉化為可衡量的客戶與股東價值。因此 Sean 將加入我們。我想在我們下一次電話會議上，他會出席，之後也將由他主導後續的電話會議。不過各位將有機會直接聽到 Sean 的分享、他的願景，以及公司未來的方向；我也非常高興歡迎 Sean 回到 Upland，並支持他落實其願景，期待後續進展。

So with that, I am going to turn the call back over to Mike.

那麼接下來，我將把電話會議交回給 Mike。

All right. Thanks, Jack. I think Jack covered most of the main points in the financials for the quarter, but I'll just take a few -- make a few additional comments here. For the Q4 income statement, revenues were as expected when taking into consideration our divestitures in Q1 and Q2 of 2025, Q4 gross margin continued to represent an increase from earlier in 2025 as expected as a result of the higher margins realized on our ongoing product lines.

好的。謝謝，Jack。我想 Jack 已經涵蓋了本季財務的大部分重點，但我再補充幾點——在這裡再做一些額外評論。就 2025 年第四季損益表而言，考量到我們在 2025 年第一季與第二季完成的資產剝離，營收符合預期；第四季毛利率如預期較 2025 年稍早期間持續提升，主要是因為我們持續經營的產品線實現了較高的毛利率。

Our adjusted EBITDA and adjusted EBITDA margin came in as expected with our adjusted EBITDA margin of 31%, up from 22% in the quarter, fourth quarter of 2024. So, a big improvement there. For the fourth quarter 2025, GAAP operating cash flow was $7.3 million, and free cash flow was $7.2 million, making our free cash flow for the full-year 2025 of $24.4 million that exceeded our target free cash flow of $20 million. On the balance sheet, at the end of Q4, we had outstanding net debt of approximately $209 million factoring in the approximate $29 million of cash on our balance sheet. And at year-end, our net debt leverage was 3.6 times trailing adjusted EBITDA, which was -- which came in better than our target.

我們的調整後 EBITDA 與調整後 EBITDA 利潤率符合預期；調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 31%，高於 2024 年第四季的 22%。因此，這是一個很大的改善。2025 年第四季，依 GAAP 計算的營運現金流為 730 萬美元，自由現金流為 720 萬美元，使得我們 2025 全年自由現金流達 2,440 萬美元，超過我們 2,000 萬美元的自由現金流目標。在資產負債表方面，截至第四季末，扣除資產負債表上約 2,900 萬美元現金後，我們的未償還淨負債約為 2.09 億美元。而在年末，我們的淨負債槓桿倍數為過去 12 個月調整後 EBITDA 的 3.6 倍，這——這個結果優於我們的目標。

For guidance for the quarter ending March 31, 2026, we expect reported total revenue to be between $47 million and $50 million, including subscription and support revenue between $44.8 million and $47.3 million for a decline in total revenue of 24% at the midpoint from the quarter ended March 31, 2025. Just a reminder, this year-over-year decline is primarily due to the divestitures completed in Q1 and Q2 of 2025.

針對截至 2026 年 3 月 31 日的季度指引，我們預期公告的總營收介於 4,700 萬至 5,000 萬美元之間，其中訂閱與支援營收介於 4,480 萬至 4,730 萬美元之間；以中點計算，較截至 2025 年 3 月 31 日的季度總營收下降 24%。提醒一下，這個年對年下滑主要是因為我們在 2025 年第一季與第二季完成的資產剝離。

First quarter 2026 adjusted EBITDA is expected to be between $11.9 million and $13.4 million, which at the midpoint is a decline of 3% from the quarter ended March 31, 2025. First quarter 2026 adjusted EBITDA margin is expected to be 26% at the midpoint, which is a 500 basis point increase from the 21% adjusted EBITDA margin in the year ago quarter.

2026 年第一季調整後 EBITDA 預期介於 1,190 萬至 1,340 萬美元之間；以中點計算，較截至 2025 年 3 月 31 日的季度下降 3%。2026 年第一季調整後 EBITDA 利潤率以中點計算預期為 26%，較去年同期 21% 的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率提高 500 個基點。

For the full year ending December 31, 2026, we expect reported total revenue to be between $194.2 million and $206.2 million, including subscription and support revenue between $183.6 million and $193.7 million for a decline in total revenue of 8% at the midpoint from the year ended December 31, 2025. This year-over-year decline, as I mentioned earlier, is primarily due to divestitures that we completed in Q1 and Q2 of 2025.

針對截至 2026 年 12 月 31 日的全年，我們預期公告的總營收介於 1.942 億至 2.062 億美元之間，其中訂閱與支援營收介於 1.836 億至 1.937 億美元之間；以中點計算，較截至 2025 年 12 月 31 日的年度總營收下降 8%。如我先前提到，這個年對年下滑主要是因為我們在 2025 年第一季與第二季完成的資產剝離。

Full-year 2026 adjusted EBITDA is expected to be between $52.6 million and $58.6 million, which at the midpoint is a decline of 4% from the year ended December 31, 2025. And full year 2026 adjusted EBITDA margin is expected to be 28% at the midpoint, which is a 100 basis point increase from the 27% adjusted EBITDA margin that we had for 2025. And so to recap, we continue -- our product portfolio is now much more focused on -- around the KCM market knowledge and content management market.

2026 全年調整後 EBITDA 預期介於 5,260 萬至 5,860 萬美元之間；以中點計算，較截至 2025 年 12 月 31 日的年度下降 4%。而 2026 全年調整後 EBITDA 利潤率以中點計算預期為 28%，較我們 2025 年 27% 的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率提高 100 個基點。因此總結一下，我們持續——我們的產品組合現在更加聚焦於——圍繞 KCM 市場（知識與內容管理市場）。

As Jack mentioned, our core organic growth rate is in a positive multiyear uptrend from negative 2% three year ago to negative 1% two years ago, to roughly positive 1% last year in 2025 and we're targeting 1% to 2% positive here for 2026. The big new customer wins during 2025 has validated our product market fit in several key markets, and those major wins validated our product AI strategies. Our adjusted EBITDA margin is significant -- is in a significant multiyear expansion trend with adjusted EBITDA margins expanding from 20% in 2024, 20% to 27% last year in '25 to our guidance midpoint of 28% here this year in 2026. And cash flow, as we've mentioned, remained strong as we generated over $24 million of free cash flow in 2025, and we're targeting around $20 million of free cash flow here this year in 2026.

如 Jack 所提到，我們的核心有機成長率呈現正向的多年上升趨勢：三年前為負 2%，兩年前為負 1%，到 2025 年去年約為正 1%，而我們在 2026 年的目標是正 1% 到 2%。2025 年取得的大型新客戶勝利，已在數個關鍵市場驗證了我們的產品市場契合度，而這些重大勝利也驗證了我們的產品 AI 策略。我們的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率——正處於顯著的多年擴張趨勢：調整後 EBITDA 利潤率從 2024 年的 20%，在 2025 年提升至 27%，並在 2026 年本年度指引中點達到 28%。而現金流方面，如我們所提，仍然強勁；我們在 2025 年產生超過 2,400 萬美元的自由現金流，並且在 2026 年本年度目標約為 2,000 萬美元的自由現金流。

I will note that we beat our 2025 free cash flow target by over $4 million, really due to early receivables collections, which would have otherwise occurred in 2026. So, without those early collections, our 2026 free cash flow target would have actually been higher.

我也要指出，我們 2025 年自由現金流目標超出超過 400 萬美元，主要是因為應收帳款提前回收——原本這些回收會在 2026 年發生。因此，若沒有這些提前回收，我們 2026 年的自由現金流目標其實會更高。

All right. And with that, I'll turn the call back to Jack.

好的。接下來我把電話交回給 Jack。

All right. Thanks, Mike. We're ready to open the call up for Q&A.

好的。謝謝，Mike。我們準備開始 Q&A。

(Operator Instructions) DJ Hynes, Canaccord Genuity.

(接線員指示) DJ Hynes，Canaccord Genuity。

Jack congrats to you on the transition. I know you're still going to be -- remain involved in the business, but I appreciate all the help over the years.

Jack，恭喜你完成交接。我知道你仍然會——繼續參與公司業務，但我很感謝你這些年來的所有協助。

Maybe we can just start on the customer metrics a bit. So look, new customer adds flat year-over-year, majors were down, expansions down year over year. It's just -- it's hard to put context around those metrics, given the business is different than it was a year ago with the divestitures. So just -- like how would you characterize sales execution in the quarter? Do you have comparable metrics for continuing ops?

也許我們可以先從客戶指標談起。所以你看，新客戶新增數年對年持平，大型客戶（majors）下滑，擴張（expansions）也年對年下滑。只是——由於資產剝離後業務與一年前不同，這些指標很難放在同一個脈絡下解讀。所以——你會如何描述本季的銷售執行？你們是否有針對持續經營業務（continuing ops）的可比指標？

And I guess, most importantly, like what's the pipeline look like going into '26? Any color there would be helpful.

另外我想，最重要的是——進入 2026 年時的銷售管線（pipeline）看起來如何？如果能提供一些說明會很有幫助。

Yeah. We had a stronger Q3 in terms of winning sizable major deals. I would say that when we look at the pipe, so a little bit disappointed in Q4 bookings performance. But the pipeline for this year looks decent, particularly around some of the core knowledge management growth products where we are starting to build a healthier pipeline of larger deals. But we've got to execute against it. And yeah, the Q4 numbers could have come in a little bit better than they did.

是的。就贏得規模較大的重大交易而言，我們第三季表現較強。我會說，當我們看管線時，對第四季的訂單（bookings）表現有點失望。但今年的管線看起來還不錯，特別是在一些核心的知識管理成長型產品上，我們開始建立更健康、包含較大型交易的管線。但我們必須把它執行到位。而且是的，第四季的數字本來可以比實際結果再好一些。

Yeah. Okay. And then, Mike, for you, just -- so EBITDA margins north of 31% in the last couple of quarters, obviously shows the earnings power of kind of the new leaner Upland. I look at the guide for 28% margins, it's obviously a bit of a step down from where the business has been running the last couple of quarters. Can you just talk about what's contemplating that guide and why we'd see a step-down in margins from where the business has been running?

是的。好的。接著 Mike 想請教你——最近幾季 EBITDA 利潤率都在 31% 以上，顯然展現了精簡後的新 Upland 的獲利能力。我看你們的指引是 28% 利潤率，顯然比過去幾季的營運水準低了一些。你能談談這個指引的考量是什麼，以及為什麼利潤率會從過去幾季的水準往下走嗎？

Yeah, DJ. So, as you may remember, typically, our EBITDA margins through the course of the calendar year, we tend to exit the year at the highest margins, and we start the year at the lowest margins, things like calendar based to payroll taxes kind of take a bigger hit in Q1 and Q2. So that -- we've always had sort of a tilted, if you will, calendar year ramp up. And so that's mainly what we're seeing here this year again.

好的，DJ。如你可能記得，通常我們的 EBITDA 利潤率在一個曆年中，往往是年底最高、年初最低；像是依日曆計算的薪資稅等因素，在第一季與第二季的影響會比較大。所以——我們一直都有某種傾斜的、如果你願意這麼說的，曆年逐季爬升（ramp up）型態。因此，今年我們主要也是再次看到這種情況。

Scott Berg, Needham & Company.

Scott Berg，Needham & Company。

I hope you can hear me okay. It's quite windy where I'm at. Two questions. First of all, Jack, why step down now? Why the change of CEO kind of leadership today, in particular? I didn't know if there's anything that drove it to change specifically? Or was it just trying to get maybe relaxed on the beach a little bit.

希望你們聽得到我。我這邊風很大。兩個問題。首先，Jack，為什麼現在要卸任？為什麼今天特別要做這種 CEO／領導層的變動？我不確定是否有什麼因素促使你特別做出這個改變？還是只是想在海灘上稍微放鬆一下。

Well, I would say the principal reason is that the business has changed, right? At one point, we were really about growth through acquisitions. And now the focus is really more on operations and advancing our AI-enabled product portfolio. And Sean is a product-centric and AI-focused CEO.

嗯，我會說主要原因是業務已經改變了，對吧？在某個階段，我們主要是透過併購來成長。而現在重點更在於營運，以及推進我們 AI 賦能的產品組合。而 Sean 是一位以產品為中心、並聚焦 AI 的 CEO。

And so I think he's the right person for the job. He knows our products and our markets and our customers. And so, yeah, from an operating perspective, I think that's the kind of executive we need driving the business.

所以我認為他是最適合這份工作的人。他了解我們的產品、我們的市場以及我們的客戶。所以，是的，從營運角度來看，我認為這就是我們需要來推動業務的那種高階主管。

Got it. Understood. And then I know you all have made significant changes to your go-to-market strategy in the last couple of years, and we'll call it the divestitures and whatnot. What do you think you are with those changes? Are we to (inaudible) your infill execution mode? Is there any more of that to still some of the changes that need to be unveiled?

了解。明白。另外，我知道你們在過去幾年對 go-to-market 策略做了重大調整，我們就稱之為資產剝離等等。你認為在這些變動之後，你們現在處於什麼狀態？我們是否（聽不清）你們的補強式執行模式？還是仍有更多變革、一些需要揭露的調整尚未推出？

Just help us understand what's everything that's going on as you enter '26 is just the right, I guess, right horsepower properly framed to really drive the growth in you all are seeing.

請幫我們理解一下，當你們邁入 '26 時，現在正在發生的一切是否就是合適的——我想——合適的馬力、且框架正確，能真正推動你們所看到的成長。

Yeah. I mean one of the things I wanted to get done before doing this transition was taking really the first phase of streamlining the business, and obviously, we sold a number of assets. We've got the debt refinanced. So really wanted to sort of clear the decks on that and hand over a business that is on firmer footing.

是的。我的意思是，在進行這次交接之前，我想完成的一件事，是先把業務精簡的第一階段真正落地；很明顯地，我們出售了多項資產。我們也完成了債務再融資。所以我真的想先把這些事情處理好、清出空間，然後把一個基礎更穩固的業務交出去。

It will be interesting to see what the next few years bring with AI and its impact on enterprise SaaS. I think we've got some products that can do well in this environment. We've got some other products that are going to face some headwinds. But I like Sean's vision, which I think aligns closely with what Dan Doman has been driving in the business and doing a great job on.

接下來幾年 AI 及其對企業級 SaaS 的影響會帶來什麼，會很值得觀察。我認為我們有一些產品能在這樣的環境中表現良好。我們也有一些其他產品會面臨一些逆風。但我喜歡 Sean 的願景；我認為這與 Dan Doman 一直在推動的方向高度一致，而且他在業務上做得非常出色。

And so, I think we've got a core set of products that can do well in this environment. I think there's obviously execution that needs to happen, and we're here to support those guys.

因此，我認為我們有一套核心產品能在這個環境中做得很好。我想很明顯地，仍需要把執行落實，而我們會在這裡支持他們。

Jeff Van Rhee, Craig-Hallum.

Jeff Van Rhee，Craig-Hallum。

Got a couple. First, maybe, Jack, just trying to maybe get a brief refresher on what the revenue mix is now in terms of the core capabilities. How would you bucket the revenue streams by the focus of the underlying software, the underlying capability?

我有幾個問題。首先，Jack，也許想請你簡要回顧一下，目前就核心能力而言的營收組合是什麼。你會如何依據底層軟體的重點、底層能力來劃分各個營收來源？

Well, Jeff, this is Mike. So roughly 2/3 to 3/4 of our revenue, maybe even a little bit more than that as I think about it, is really our growth products versus our specialized markets products. So -- and those growth products, most of those are AI-enabled. So really, the vast majority of our products are in this sort of knowledge and content management market area and using the AI wins as a tailwind as opposed to a headwind.

Jeff，我是 Mike。大約有 2/3 到 3/4 的營收——甚至我現在想想可能還略高於此——來自我們的成長型產品，相對於我們的利基市場產品。而這些成長型產品中，大多數都是 AI 賦能的。所以實際上，我們絕大多數產品都在知識與內容管理這個市場領域，並把 AI 帶來的勝利視為順風而非逆風。

Yeah. Got it. And Jack, when you look at AI, you mentioned it, I mean, obviously, it's front and center for all SaaS companies right now, trying to figure out winners and losers. At a high level, when you're looking at the SaaS landscape, and obviously, we can compare to you own. But when you look at the SaaS landscape, what models do you think are defensible and what do you think will ultimately get consumed by AI?

是的。了解。另外，Jack，談到 AI，你提到了——我的意思是，顯然現在對所有 SaaS 公司而言，AI 都是最核心的議題，大家都在試著分辨誰是贏家、誰是輸家。從高層次來看，當你觀察 SaaS 版圖——當然我們也可以拿來跟你們自身比較——但當你看 SaaS 版圖時，你認為哪些商業模式具備防禦性？又有哪些最終會被 AI 吞噬？

Well, I think the products that we have that are systems of record I think, are going to have the strongest moat. And there are opportunities there to become a key part and to be a key part of larger enterprise AI implementations Also, the products that we have that form an enabling layer of infrastructure, that intelligence layer that Sean calls it. So, you think about products like BA I.

嗯，我認為我們那些屬於「記錄系統」（systems of record）的產品，將會有最強的護城河。而且在那裡也有機會成為大型企業 AI 導入中的關鍵一環、並扮演關鍵角色。另外，我們也有一些產品是作為基礎設施的賦能層，也就是 Sean 所說的那個智慧層。所以，你可以想到像 BA I 這類產品。

And so, I look back over the past year, and it's funny, Jeff, because on the one hand, it's been a tougher market environment because of AI. But on the other hand, we landed over the past 12 months, some of the biggest bookings we've had in the past few years. When you look at major hospitality companies that are doing 40 million customer touches a year and spending big on agentic AI implementations and then bringing in products like Upland RightAnswers because they need a trusted, auditable, governable knowledge layer to train that AI on so that you get the kind of output that you need.

回顧過去一年很有意思，Jeff，因為一方面，因為 AI 的關係，市場環境變得更艱難。但另一方面，在過去 12 個月，我們拿下了一些過去幾年中最大的訂單／預訂額（bookings）。當你看到大型旅宿公司一年有 4,000 萬次客戶互動，並在代理式 AI（agentic AI）導入上投入大量資金，接著引入像 Upland RightAnswers 這樣的產品，因為他們需要一個可信、可稽核、可治理的知識層來訓練 AI，才能得到他們所需要的輸出。

So that's one example of some of the work we've done with major consulting firms around global enterprise AI-driven portals for customers and for internal use. Some of the bigger sales we've had to major hyperscalers for their own internal use and then some of the partnerships that we've now got underway in the market with some of the brand name hyperscalers to bring the capabilities of products like Upland RightAnswers and BA I into their customer base. So it's sort of a tale of two markets in that regard. So, I think those products that can get positioned is enabling tech or systems of record or -- and in some cases, systems to process will be more defensible and others will not be.

這只是其中一個例子：我們與大型顧問公司合作，為客戶與內部使用打造全球企業級、AI 驅動的入口網站。我們也有一些更大的銷售案，賣給主要的超大規模雲端業者（hyperscalers）供其內部使用；此外，我們現在也已在市場上與一些知名 hyperscalers 展開合作夥伴關係，把像 Upland RightAnswers 與 BA I 這類產品的能力帶進他們的客戶群。所以在這方面有點像是兩個市場的故事。因此，我認為那些能被定位為賦能技術、或記錄系統，或——在某些情況下——流程系統（systems to process）的產品，會更具防禦性；其他的則不會。

That concludes our Q&A session. I will now turn the call back over to Jack McDonald.

我們的問答環節到此結束。我現在把電話交回給 Jack McDonald。

All right. Thank you so much, and we will see you on our next earnings call.

好的。非常感謝，我們會在下一次財報電話會議再見。

Ladies and gentlemen, that does conclude our conference call. Thank you all for joining, and you may now disconnect. Everyone, have a great day.

各位女士先生，本次電話會議到此結束。感謝各位參與，現在可以掛線。祝各位有美好的一天。