180 Degree Capital Corp (TURN) 2022 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Q&A session has started. The recording has started.

問答環節開始了。錄音開始了。

Good morning, and welcome to 180 Degree Capital Corp's fourth-quarter 2022 financial results update call. This is Daniel Wolfe, President, Portfolio Manager of 180 Degree Capital. Kevin Rendino, our Chief Executive Officer and Portfolio Manager and I would like to welcome you to our call this morning. (Conference Instructions)

早上好，歡迎來到 180 Degree Capital Corp 的 2022 年第四季度財務業績更新電話會議。我是 180 Degree Capital 總裁兼投資組合經理 Daniel Wolfe。我們的首席執行官兼投資組合經理 Kevin Rendino 和我歡迎您參加今天上午的電話會議。 （會議須知）

I would like to remind participants that this call is being recorded, and then we are referring to a slide deck that we have posted on our Investor Relations website at ir.180degreecapital.com under financial results. Please turn to our Safe Harbor statement on slide 2.

我想提醒與會者，此電話正在錄音中，然後我們指的是我們在投資者關係網站 ir.180degreecapital.com 上發布的財務業績下的幻燈片。請轉到幻燈片 2 上的安全港聲明。

This presentation may contain statements of a forward-looking nature relating to future events. Statements contained in this presentation that are forward looking events -- are forward-looking statements are intended to be made pursuant to the Safe Harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995.

本演示文稿可能包含與未來事件相關的前瞻性陳述。本演示文稿中包含的前瞻性陳述是前瞻性陳述，旨在根據 1995 年《私人證券訴訟改革法案》的安全港條款作出。

These forward-looking statements are subject to the inherent uncertainties in predicting future results and conditions. These statements reflect the company's current beliefs, and a number of important factors could cause actual results to differ materially from those expressed herein.

這些前瞻性陳述受預測未來結果和條件的固有不確定性的影響。這些陳述反映了公司當前的信念，許多重要因素可能導致實際結果與此處表達的結果存在重大差異。

Please see the company's filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission for a more detailed discussion of the risks and uncertainties associated with the company's business that could affect the company's actual results. Except as otherwise required by federal securities laws, the 180 Degree Capital Corp. undertakes no obligation to update or revise these forward-looking statements to reflect new events or uncertainties.

有關可能影響公司實際業績的與公司業務相關的風險和不確定性的更詳細討論，請參閱公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件。除非聯邦證券法另有規定，否則 180 Degree Capital Corp. 不承擔更新或修改這些前瞻性陳述以反映新事件或不確定性的義務。

I would now like to turn the call over to Kevin.

我現在想把電話轉給凱文。

Thanks, Daniel. Good morning, everyone. After five years of consistent outperformance, 2022 was a difficult year for 180. On slide 3, we show summary. The fourth quarter was challenging for the entire company when taking into consideration the entire portfolio, specifically the legacy private portfolio that came from Harris & Harris, our predecessor company.

謝謝，丹尼爾。大家，早安。在連續五年表現出色之後，2022 年對 180 來說是艱難的一年。在幻燈片 3 上，我們展示了總結。考慮到整個投資組合，特別是來自我們前身公司 Harris & Harris 的遺留私人投資組合，第四季度對整個公司來說都充滿挑戰。

December itself was challenging for the public portfolio, given the frenzy tax loss selling of many of our holdings. Our NAV declined to $6.32. 71% of that decline was due to the private portfolio, which as many of you know, we simply have had no control over. That was led by Quantum and AgBiome. The [balance] was due to a decline in the value of our public holdings, namely Synchronoss, Arena Group, Comscore, Ascent, and Parabellum. We'll have more on those later.

考慮到我們許多持股的瘋狂減稅拋售，12 月本身對公共投資組合來說是一個挑戰。我們的資產淨值跌至 6.32 美元。下降的 71% 是由於私人投資組合，正如你們許多人所知，我們根本無法控制。這是由 Quantum 和 AgBiome 領導的。 [餘額] 是由於我們的公共持股價值下降，即 Synchronoss、Arena Group、Comscore、Ascent 和 Parabellum。我們稍後會詳細介紹這些。

Let's turn to slide 4, which may be the most important slide in the deck, and I'm going to be blunt here. So while the month -- fourth quarter and year were disappointing to me, let's understand where we are as we start 2023. The sins of Harris & Harris are almost done, if not totally done, hidden during the 180 shareholders. We've undergone over the last five years before last year a slow and methodical business transformation.

讓我們轉到幻燈片 4，它可能是幻燈片中最重要的一張，我在這裡直言不諱。因此，雖然這個月——第四季度和這一年讓我感到失望，但讓我們了解一下我們在 2023 年開始時的處境。Harris & Harris 的罪過幾乎已經完成，即使沒有完全完成，也隱藏在 180 名股東中。在去年之前的過去五年裡，我們經歷了緩慢而有條不紊的業務轉型。

We have mitigated the dampening effects of Harris & Harris portfolio by generating nearly $3.50 of gains in our public portfolio since we started. While it's almost unconscionable that the private portfolio in a bull market has had $1.80 of losses through the end of last year, it is what it is. But it's over and as of February 24, we now have a total of $9.5 million in private holdings, but it's really $7 million if you remove the TARA milestone payment, which in and of itself is about $2.5 million.

自我們開始以來，我們通過在我們的公共投資組合中產生近 3.50 美元的收益，減輕了 Harris & Harris 投資組合的抑製作用。截至去年底，牛市中的私人投資組合虧損 1.80 美元，這幾乎是不合情理的，但事實就是如此。但它已經結束，截至 2 月 24 日，我們現在擁有總計 950 萬美元的私人持股，但如果你刪除 TARA 里程碑付款，它實際上是 700 萬美元，這本身約為 250 萬美元。

So the private portfolio now is less than 10% of our NAV. When 180 started, I said it was our goal to have 100% of the assets in public related assets for transparency purposes. We are now 90% of the way there, $6.5 million ex TARA is the remaining value of our private portfolio, given the write-downs that we took in the fourth quarter to clear the decks as we think through the next five years.

因此，私人投資組合現在不到我們資產淨值的 10%。當 180 開始時，我說我們的目標是為了透明度目的將 100% 的資產放在公共相關資產中。我們現在已經完成了 90%，考慮到我們在第四季度進行的減記以清理未來五年的資金，650 萬美元是我們私人投資組合的剩餘價值。

Slide 5 is a different version chart to show you how far we have come in remaking the business. We finally have a balance sheet where we control over 90% of the assets, you could see here. Now our year in 2023 was disappointing as it related to the public holdings, and we own that. But unlike the last six years, it will be nice to have our performance in the future dictated solely from our strategy of picking public microcap stocks without having to fight the massive headwind of a private portfolio that not only didn't carry its weight in the last six years but actually hurt us.

幻燈片 5 是一個不同版本的圖表，向您展示我們在重塑業務方面取得了多大進展。我們終於有了一張資產負債表，我們控制了 90% 以上的資產，你可以在這裡看到。現在，我們在 2023 年的表現令人失望，因為它與公眾持股有關，而我們擁有這一點。但與過去六年不同的是，如果我們未來的表現完全取決於我們挑選公共微型股的策略，而不必與私人投資組合的巨大逆風作鬥爭，那將是一件好事，私人投資組合不僅在過去的六年卻傷害了我們。

To show you how linked our future now is to our core competency of picking public stocks. Let's look at the impact our public portfolio has had on our NAV in 2023, keeping the private portfolio stagnant. Year to date, our book value has climbed as of February 24, to $7.08 on the back of a 14.8% gain in our public portfolio. Our NAV would now be up 12%.

向您展示我們現在的未來與我們挑選上市股票的核心能力有何關聯。讓我們看看我們的公共投資組合在 2023 年對我們的資產淨值的影響，使私人投資組合停滯不前。年初至今，由於我們的公共投資組合增長 14.8%，截至 2 月 24 日，我們的賬面價值已攀升至 7.08 美元。我們的資產淨值現在將上漲 12%。

If this was the case, when we started in 2017, a 14% increase in our public stock picking would have had just a 2.9% increase in our NAV. You can see now our NAV growth is more directly linked to our public stocks rather than having an esoteric private portfolio impacted. It's easier, we think, for shareholders to judge how we're doing, and we'll be much more transparent in the next five years than we were even in the last five. We're finally changed the company the way we always wanted to when we first started.

如果是這樣的話，當我們在 2017 年開始時，我們的公開選股增加 14% 只會使我們的資產淨值增加 2.9%。您現在可以看到，我們的資產淨值增長更直接地與我們的公共股票相關聯，而不是讓深奧的私人投資組合受到影響。我們認為，股東更容易判斷我們的表現，未來五年我們將比過去五年更加透明。我們終於按照我們剛開始時一直想要的方式改變了公司。

Slipping -- skipping ahead to slide 6, you can see the dip in our cash and public securities here. It was indeed a rough quarter for our stock picking with a 7.6% decline versus a similar increase for the Russell Microcap Index. I'd encourage everyone to read our shareholder letter where we take a deep dive into the markets, our holdings, and all the rest. We review 2022, and we provide insight into 2023.

下滑——跳到幻燈片 6，你可以在這裡看到我們的現金和公共證券的下降。對於我們的選股來說，這確實是一個艱難的季度，與 Russell Microcap Index 的類似漲幅相比下跌了 7.6%。我鼓勵大家閱讀我們的股東信，我們在信中深入研究了市場、我們的持股和所有其他方面。我們回顧 2022 年，並提供對 2023 年的洞察。

We struggled last year amidst a risk-off environment with Russian war with Ukraine; subsequent higher rates to combat inflation due to a messy supply chain, which was caused by COVID. We were wrong in thinking that our holdings would perform better, given their low valuations to start, and for the most part, good fundamentals, except for the case of Quantum. We were wrong. The messier the capital structure, the more investors couldn't wait to sell, which is one reason why names like Synchronous and Arena underperform, not only in most of 2022, but certainly in the fourth quarter.

去年，我們在俄羅斯與烏克蘭開戰的避險環境中苦苦掙扎；由於 COVID 造成的供應鏈混亂，隨後提高利率以對抗通貨膨脹。我們錯誤地認為我們持有的股票會表現更好，因為它們的估值開始很低，而且在大多數情況下，良好的基本面，除了 Quantum 的情況。我們錯了。資本結構越混亂，越多的投資者迫不及待地想拋售，這就是為什麼 Synchronous 和 Arena 等公司不僅在 2022 年的大部分時間，而且在第四季度表現不佳的原因之一。

Then the fourth quarter came, especially December, and I haven't seen tax loss selling like that in a very long time. And unfortunately, we were the recipients of it. It wasn't enough that Synchronoss got cut in half during the course of the year, it got cut in half in one month in December as tax loss selling was ramping.

然後第四季度來了，尤其是 12 月，我已經很長時間沒有看到像這樣的減稅銷售了。不幸的是，我們是它的接受者。 Synchronoss 在這一年中被減半是不夠的，它在 12 月的一個月內被減半，因為稅收損失銷售正在增加。

With 2022 in the rear view and our sights on 2023 being here now, being pollyannish isn't part of our thinking as we acknowledge that rates are materially higher than they were just 12 months ago. And this increase will no doubt have a dampening effect on global growth rates as well as equity valuations.

隨著 2022 年的到來和我們現在對 2023 年的展望，樂觀並不是我們想法的一部分，因為我們承認利率比 12 個月前要高得多。而這種增長無疑會對全球增長率和股票估值產生抑製作用。

That said, here's a nutshell of our views, which we will -- which we support in our shareholder letter from a number of charts and research, if you happen to read the letter. One, our overall view is inflation peaked, and the multitude of fed rate hikes have already had a significant effect in lowering inflation. Two, we believe we are already in some sort of recession, given real GDP has declined for more than two quarters in a row already.

就是說，這是我們的觀點的簡要說明，如果您碰巧閱讀了這封信，我們將在來自許多圖表和研究的股東信中支持這些觀點。第一，我們的總體觀點是通脹見頂，美聯儲多次加息已經對降低通脹產生了顯著影響。第二，我們認為我們已經處於某種衰退之中，因為實際 GDP 已經連續兩個多季度下降。

Three, we do not believe we are headed for a financial Armageddon like we had in 2008. In 2008, we had $1.3 trillion of subprime mortgage assets on the balance sheets of banks and insurance companies. That financial leverage simply doesn't exist like it did in the past. We believe stock price valuations have significantly discounted dire economic outlooks that are not occurring currently, and in fact, may never occur.

第三，我們認為我們不會像 2008 年那樣走向金融世界末日。2008 年，我們在銀行和保險公司的資產負債表上擁有 1.3 萬億美元的次級抵押貸款資產。這種財務槓桿根本不像過去那樣存在。我們認為，股票價格估值已經大大低估了目前沒有出現、事實上可能永遠不會出現的嚴峻經濟前景。

We believe we are headed to a normal environment where the market can no longer rely on free money and quantitative easing and 0% interest rates. Stocks will have competition from the bond market, and we do expect multiples as a whole to contract. But bubbles will continue to be popped, slower growth rates will inevitably occur, and companies with real revenues and real cash flow can still prosper.

我們相信我們正在走向一個正常的環境，市場不能再依賴自由貨幣、量化寬鬆和 0% 的利率。股票將面臨來自債券市場的競爭，我們確實預計整體市盈率會收縮。但泡沫會不斷破滅，增速必然放緩，有實際收入和實際現金流的企業仍然可以繁榮發展。

For the time being, we believe rightly so, gone are the gold rush days when talking heads, financial thieves, and children pontificate endlessly on how things have changed and how we are in a new world order with these individuals arguing for an entirely new investment landscape. So we think back to the basics scenario where companies are being judged based on real cash flow and real revenues will come to exist and be more important in the next five years than it was in the last five years.

目前，我們正確地相信，淘金熱的日子已經一去不復返了，那些會說話的人、金融竊賊和孩子們無休止地談論事情是如何改變的，以及我們是如何處於一個新的世界秩序中的，這些人爭論著一項全新的投資景觀。因此，我們回想一下根據實際現金流量判斷公司的基本情況，實際收入將在未來五年出現，並且比過去五年更重要。

Slide 7 shows our quarterly performance for every timeframe. Obviously, we didn't get the job done in 2022, we were down every quarter. The calendar turned on January 1, and our 14.9% performance to start the year, double that of the benchmark. We're off to a good start, but it is what it is, nothing but a start. We know how quickly things can change. But at least, I'm sitting here today. I'm happy that we're up 14.8% than down 14.8% like we actually were in the first quarter of last year as you can see from that chart.

幻燈片 7 顯示了我們在每個時間範圍內的季度業績。顯然，我們沒有在 2022 年完成工作，我們每個季度都在下滑。日曆從 1 月 1 日開始，我們年初的業績為 14.9%，是基準的兩倍。我們有了一個良好的開端，但事實就是這樣，只不過是一個開始。我們知道事情變化的速度有多快。但至少，我今天坐在這裡。我很高興我們增長了 14.8%，而不是下降了 14.8%，就像我們在去年第一季度的實際情況一樣，正如您從該圖表中看到的那樣。

On slide 8, here the sources and changes for our assets in Q4 as you can see. $1.27 or 71% of the decline came from our legacy portfolio.

在幻燈片 8 上，如您所見，這裡是我們在第四季度資產的來源和變化。 1.27 美元或 71% 的跌幅來自我們的傳統投資組合。

Slide 9 shows our '22 year-to-date numbers, not pretty. A public performance of left alone was not competitive, but if left alone, would have caused our NAV to drop only 28% versus where it ended up at the end of the year. Layer on more than a dollar of losses in the private portfolio for the year and you get was a very difficult year.

幻燈片 9 顯示了我們 22 年至今的數字，並不漂亮。獨自一人的公開表現沒有競爭力，但如果任其發展，只會導致我們的資產淨值與年底時的水平相比僅下降 28%。加上今年私人投資組合損失超過一美元，你會發現這是非常艱難的一年。

As you can see on slide 10, obviously, while last quarter and last year were substandard, we have enjoyed significant outperformance from our public holdings. And while it would have been nice to get some help from our private portfolio, it hurt us to the tune of $1.80 per share. The good news, and I really cannot emphasize this enough, our private portfolio is now valued at roughly $0.65 per share rather than comprised of over $5 a share of NAV just six years ago.

正如您在幻燈片 10 中看到的那樣，很明顯，雖然上個季度和去年的表現不佳，但我們的公開持股表現明顯出色。雖然從我們的私人投資組合中獲得一些幫助本來是件好事，但它讓我們損失了每股 1.80 美元。好消息，我真的無法強調這一點，我們的私人投資組合現在的價值約為每股 0.65 美元，而不是六年前的每股資產淨值超過 5 美元。

Slide 11, the performance of every stock we owned in Q4. You can see Arena Group, Synchronoss, Ascent, Parabellum, and Comscore led the way with significant declines. To say a few words about each of our holdings that stood out in the past quarter, please turn to slide 12. On December 13, 2022, Arena announced the acquisition of Men's Journal using a new debt facility from B. Riley to fund the acquisition. The facility was meant to be a bridge to completion of an equity or other type of financing as it has terms that include increases in the interest rate quarterly starting in March '23.

幻燈片 11，我們在第四季度擁有的每隻股票的表現。您可以看到 Arena Group、Synchronoss、Ascent、Parabellum 和 Comscore 領跌，跌幅明顯。請翻到幻燈片 12，談談我們在上個季度表現突出的每一隻股票。2022 年 12 月 13 日，Arena 宣布使用 B. Riley 的新債務工具收購 Men's Journal，為收購提供資金.該設施旨在成為完成股權或其他類型融資的橋樑，因為它的條款包括從 2023 年 3 月開始每季度增加利率。

With the lack of transparency and confusion, unfortunately, Arena stock subsequently collapsed from approximately $16 to $10.61 at the end of the quarter. As it turns out, we like the transaction, it was the funding piece that was a little bothersome to the street.

不幸的是，由於缺乏透明度和混亂，Arena 的股票隨後在本季度末從大約 16 美元暴跌至 10.61 美元。事實證明，我們喜歡這筆交易，這是對街道來說有點麻煩的資金。

Comscore continued to improve -- to show improved financial results for Q3 and announced the negotiation of a data deal with Charter to provide lower costs, increase data access, and a longer term of form of exclusivity with regards to the agreement. But that said, the stock was unable to recover from the collapse that started earlier in the year, due primarily to continued ambiguity around the potential for the special dividend to be called by the preferred stockholders and other concerning corporate governance matters.

Comscore 繼續改善——顯示第三季度財務業績有所改善，並宣布與 Charter 就數據交易進行談判，以提供更低的成本、增加數據訪問以及更長期限的協議排他性形式。但話雖如此，該股仍無法從今年早些時候開始的暴跌中恢復過來，這主要是由於優先股股東要求特別股息的可能性以及其他與公司治理相關的問題仍然存在歧義。

Cerberus did continue buying SCOR's common stock in the open market, with large purchases of 1.5 shares at $1.10. The company does report tonight. We truly believe in the business. We are on the cusp of ramping up our activism, if in fact we don't see improvements from the corporate governance, from the Board of Directors that we intend to see when they report their results tonight.

Cerberus 確實繼續在公開市場上購買 SCOR 的普通股，以 1.10 美元的價格大量購買了 1.5 股。公司今晚確實有報告。我們真正相信業務。我們正處於加強行動主義的風口浪尖，如果事實上我們沒有看到公司治理的改善，我們打算在今晚報告結果時看到的董事會。

In terms of -- we did have a couple of names of help. Potbelly continues to provide strong results across all financial and shop-level metrics. They also provided a strong guide for Q4 and announced the signing of four additional shop development deals with existing franchisees.

就——我們確實有幾個名字的幫助。 Potbelly 繼續在所有財務和商店級別的指標中提供強勁的結果。他們還為第四季度提供了強有力的指導，並宣布與現有特許經營商簽署了另外四項店鋪開發協議。

Commercial Vehicle Group was up in the quarter. They continue to show the improvements made by management through renegotiation of contracts and the streamlining of their business. They reported new business wins, continued strong free cash flow that allowed the company pay down debt near the top end of the guidance.

商用車集團在本季度上漲。他們繼續展示管理層通過重新談判合同和精簡業務所取得的進步。他們報告了新的業務勝利，持續強勁的自由現金流，使公司能夠償還接近指導上限的債務。

And Alta Group reported results that exceeded all analyst expectations and guidance with continued strong performance across all of its businesses. The company also notes that it continues to be constrained on its rental fleet and has not seen any in demand at all.

Alta Group 報告的結果超出了所有分析師的預期和指導，其所有業務的持續強勁表現。該公司還指出，它的租賃車隊繼續受到限制，根本沒有看到任何需求。

The next set of slides starting on slide 15 show our performance for calendar '22, which tells the picture of each of our holdings. We also include on slide 16, as we do every quarter, a snapshot of each of our holdings since the day we started. And clearly, while '22 was an underperforming year, the six years we have been at this have yielded significant outperformance.

從幻燈片 15 開始的下一組幻燈片顯示了我們在 22 年日曆中的表現，它講述了我們每個持股的情況。正如我們每個季度所做的那樣，我們還在幻燈片 16 中包含了自我們開始那天以來我們持有的每筆股票的快照。很明顯，雖然 22 年是表現不佳的一年，但我們在這方面的六年取得了顯著的優異表現。

All of which leads to slide 21, the complete look at what we have done. I'd say last year knocked out three numbers down -- three-year numbers down, but we did very little to our five-year performance numbers and our inception numbers. Fortunately, this year is off to a better start. So we hope to be able to report a much different picture than this chart would dictate -- depict when we visit with you after Q1 of this year.

所有這些都指向幻燈片 21，它完整地展示了我們所做的一切。我想說去年降低了三個數字——三年的數字，但我們對五年的績效數字和我們的初始數字所做的很少。幸運的是，今年有了一個更好的開端。因此，我們希望能夠報告與此圖表所指示的情況截然不同的情況 - 描述我們在今年第一季度之後訪問您的時間。

And finally, to reiterate, we've undergone a significant business transformation that is essentially complete, albeit not necessarily the way we would have wanted the last piece to fall by taking write-downs in AgBiome and Quantum. And remember, between Daniel and I, we own 8% of TURN. Our full team, including the Board, owns 10% of the company. We're economically aligned with our shareholder, and nobody feels the pain of '22 more than we do. It is also over. And as we begin 2023 and the next five years, I'm thankful and (inaudible) many of the private holdings as we did when we first started.

最後，重申一下，我們經歷了一次重大的業務轉型，基本上已經完成，儘管不一定是我們希望通過減記 AgBiome 和 Quantum 來完成最後一塊業務的方式。請記住，在丹尼爾和我之間，我們擁有 TURN 8% 的股份。我們的整個團隊，包括董事會，擁有公司 10% 的股份。我們在經濟上與我們的股東保持一致，沒有人比我們更能感受到 22 年的痛苦。也結束了。當我們開始 2023 年和接下來的五年時，我很感激和（聽不清）許多私人持股，就像我們剛開始時所做的那樣。

Instead of having $50 million of private holdings to worry about and which we couldn't control, we are essentially down to $6.5 million. The decks are cleared, and our performance now will be dictated by our primary focus of picking small microcap stocks with Graham and Dodd focused and an active spend.

我們不必擔心我們無法控制的 5000 萬美元私人持股，而實際上我們只剩下 650 萬美元。甲板已經清理乾淨，我們現在的表現將取決於我們的主要重點是選擇以格雷厄姆和多德為重點的小型微型股並積極支出。

Daniel, why don't I turn it over to you now?

丹尼爾，我為什麼不現在把它交給你呢？

Thank you, Kevin. So as Kevin just mentioned, our business transformation really is almost complete. And if you turn to slide 22, I am really looking forward to the day when we actually no longer have this slide as part of our shareholder update call.

謝謝你，凱文。所以正如凱文剛才提到的，我們的業務轉型真的快要完成了。如果你翻到幻燈片 22，我真的很期待有一天我們實際上不再將這張幻燈片作為股東更新電話會議的一部分。

This quarter, we wrote down the value of our holdings in AgBiome due primarily to declines in the value of public comparable companies. HALE.life has been written down to zero following its management's continued and endless failure to raise capital.

本季度，我們減記了我們持有的 AgBiome 的價值，這主要是由於上市可比公司的價值下降。 HALE.life 在其管理層持續無休止地籌集資金後減記至零。

Following these write-downs, 180's remaining private portfolio has only one material position, which is AgBiome. The total assets of the remaining portfolio, as Kevin said, is approximately $9.5 million, and of that, $2.4 million are payments we expect to receive from the sale of TARA to Valo Health with $1.1 million to be paid in April '23 and $1.3 million in April '24. The remaining legacy companies make up approximately 1.5% of our net assets as of December 2022 and less as of today with the appreciation in our public holdings.

在這些減記之後，180 剩餘的私人投資組合只有一個重要頭寸，即 AgBiome。正如凱文所說，剩餘投資組合的總資產約為 950 萬美元，其中 240 萬美元是我們預計從將 TARA 出售給 Valo Health 後收到的款項，其中 110 萬美元將於 23 年 4 月支付，130 萬美元24 年 4 月。截至 2022 年 12 月，剩餘的遺留公司約占我們淨資產的 1.5%，而隨著我們公眾持股的增加，截至今天的比例有所減少。

There really isn't anything else worth discussing relating to these assets, so I'm going to move on. Please turn to slide 23. For Q4 '22, our regular operating expenses equaled approximately $800,000 versus approximately $750,000 in Q4 '21. The main increase year over year relates to admin and operating expenses, which include our marketing efforts, that I'll discuss in detail on the next slide.

關於這些資產，真的沒有什麼值得討論的了，所以我要繼續了。請轉到幻燈片 23。對於 22 年第 4 季度，我們的常規運營費用約為 800,000 美元，而 21 年第 4 季度約為 750,000 美元。同比的主要增長與管理和運營費用有關，其中包括我們的營銷工作，我將在下一張幻燈片中詳細討論。

We'll maintain a lean cost structure outside of fixed expenses for being a public company, focusing on our expenses on activities designed solely to enhance our investment performance or to increase our revenues for managing outside capital. As that has been the case since Kevin and I took over [running] in 180, we have been consistent in saying that the management team will only participate in the bonus pool, if our performance warrants it. Needless to say our performance for '22 didn't warrant a bonus pool, and thus, no performance-based bonuses are accrued or paid as of the end of Q -- '22.

作為一家上市公司，我們將在固定費用之外保持精簡的成本結構，專注於我們專門用於提高投資業績或增加管理外部資本收入的活動的費用。自從凱文和我在 180 接手[跑步]以來就是這種情況，我們一直說管理團隊只會在我們的表現允許的情況下參與獎金池。不用說，我們在 22 年的表現並不能保證獎金池，因此，截至 22 年 Q 結束時，沒有累積或支付基於績效的獎金。

In addition, no new bonus pools to be accrued until we overcome a high watermark set by our public holdings and payment of that, historically, deferred portion of prior bonus pools will require the same with respect to each year that they were established. Our management team and Board are acutely aware that we are in business to serve our shareholders.

此外，在我們克服我們的公共持股所設定的高水位線之前，不會產生新的獎金池，並且從歷史上看，先前獎金池的遞延部分的支付將需要與它們建立的每一年相同。我們的管理團隊和董事會敏銳地意識到，我們的業務是為股東服務。

Please turn to slide 24. As I mentioned some of the increased year-over-year expenses relates to our marketing efforts with peak strategies, we showed you last quarter some of the efforts that we had. And as you can see on this slide, peaks have done a great job in getting us in front of leading financial journalists to help increase the exposure of TURN. We continue to pursue these opportunities with earnest.

請轉到幻燈片 24。正如我提到的一些同比增加的費用與我們採用高峰策略的營銷工作有關，我們在上個季度向您展示了我們所做的一些努力。正如您在這張幻燈片上看到的那樣，peaks 在讓我們出現在領先的財經記者面前以幫助增加 TURN 的曝光率方面做得很好。我們繼續認真地尋求這些機會。

Please turn to slide 25 and 26. We provide these slides each quarter that enable our shareholders to look at the trend of our total expenses and compensation-related expenses as percentage of net assets. This year, the percentage is increased primarily because of the decline in net assets. We continue to anticipate reductions in our operating expenses as a percentage of net assets will be based on growth in our net assets rather than further reductions in our expenses. We remain committed to treating every dollar of shareholder money with the utmost care and consideration.

請轉到幻燈片 25 和 26。我們每個季度都會提供這些幻燈片，使我們的股東能夠了解我們的總支出和薪酬相關支出占淨資產百分比的趨勢。今年，該百分比增加主要是因為淨資產下降。我們繼續預計我們的運營費用占淨資產的百分比將減少，這將基於我們淨資產的增長，而不是我們費用的進一步減少。我們仍然致力於以最大的謹慎和考慮對待股東的每一美元資金。

Please turn to slide 27. Here, we present our scorecard for Q4 '22 based on certain metrics that we track throughout the year. While '22 is difficult, we believe we are well positioned to grow value for our shareholders across all these metrics over time, as we have done during the prior five years of 180's existence.

請轉到幻燈片 27。在這裡，我們根據全年跟踪的某些指標展示了 22 年第四季度的記分卡。雖然 '22 很困難，但我們相信我們有能力隨著時間的推移在所有這些指標上為我們的股東增加價值，就像我們在 180 年代存在的前五年所做的那樣。

Please turn to slide 28. As of the end of Q4 '22, TURN traded at 84% of NAV. Our securities of publicly traded companies in cash and other assets, net of liabilities were $5.41 per share. Stock price is $5.28. Best, you -- if we receive a 100% credit for the value of these assets, the market is ascribing a negative $0.13 per share or negative $1.35 million to our legacy private portfolio as of the end of the year.

請轉到幻燈片 28。截至 22 年第四季度末，TURN 的交易價格為資產淨值的 84%。我們以現金和其他資產形式持有的上市公司證券（扣除負債後）為每股 5.41 美元。股價為 5.28 美元。最好的，你——如果我們獲得這些資產價值的 100% 信用，截至今年年底，市場對我們的遺留私人投資組合的每股收益為負 0.13 美元或負 135 萬美元。

Now if you take an update this analysis through February 23, '23, given the discussion earlier in this letter. Using solely changes in value of Level 1 or our publicly traded holdings or assets that are valued using Level 1 or publicly traded based information, TURN traded approximately 75% of NAV.

現在，如果您在 2023 年 2 月 23 日之前更新此分析，請考慮到這封信前面的討論。僅使用 1 級價值的變化或我們使用 1 級或公開交易信息估值的公開交易持股或資產，TURN 交易了大約 75% 的資產淨值。

Our securities of publicly traded stock, cash, and other assets were about $6.16 per share. Our stock price was $5.28. If we receive a 100% credit, similar analysis, the market is ascribing value approximately negative $0.89 per share and negative $9.2 million to our legacy private portfolio.

我們的公開交易股票、現金和其他資產的證券價格約為每股 6.16 美元。我們的股價是 5.28 美元。如果我們獲得 100% 的信用，類似的分析，市場對我們的傳統私人投資組合的估值約為每股負 0.89 美元和負 920 萬美元。

As Kevin mentioned earlier and I talked about earlier, I'll remind you that $2.4 million of this legacy product portfolio are payments from the sale of TARA to Valo Health. And we expect to receive the first $1.1 million in April '23. We received 200 -- the first $250,000 in December '22.

正如凱文之前提到的和我之前談到的那樣，我會提醒你，這個遺留產品組合中有 240 萬美元是將 TARA 出售給 Valo Health 的付款。我們預計將在 23 年 4 月收到第一筆 110 萬美元。我們在 2022 年 12 月收到了 200 - 第一個 250,000 美元。

Given how painful the market has been in '22, we think the current construct of our balance sheet has provided really a true floor to our share price. While none of '22 has been fun, had 20 -- 2017 to '21 not occurred, our share price would be nowhere near where it is trading today.

鑑於市場在 22 年的痛苦程度，我們認為我們目前的資產負債表結構確實為我們的股價提供了一個真正的底線。雖然 22 年沒有一個有趣，但如果 20-2017 年到 21 年沒有發生，我們的股價將遠不及今天的交易價格。

Now please turn to slide 29, and I'd like to end with examining this discount to our stock trades that with respect to NAV and a little more detail. The chart shows our stock price versus NAV over time. With the NAV that's being used in the denominator, that is the prior quarter disclosed NAV. And you notice the most abrupt jumps or declines occur when the new end-of-quarter NAV is used in the calculation.

現在請轉到幻燈片 29，我想以檢查與 NAV 相關的股票交易折扣和更多細節作為結束。該圖表顯示了我們的股價隨時間變化的資產淨值。使用分母中使用的資產淨值，即上一季度披露的資產淨值。您會注意到當在計算中使用新的季度末 NAV 時，會出現最突然的跳躍或下降。

As 180's assets are now comprised substantially of publicly traded investments, the NAV is much easier for shareholders to estimate, particularly relative to our share price. We also believe that it will be easier for us going forward to provide a closer look at our business at various points of the year outside of our normal reporting cycle.

由於 180 的資產現在主要由公開交易的投資組成，因此股東更容易估計資產淨值，尤其是相對於我們的股價而言。我們還相信，在正常報告週期之外的一年中的不同時間點，我們將更容易更仔細地了解我們的業務。

While it is still very early in '23 and the performance of the quarter and the full year may be materially different than as what we've listed as of February 23, we are encouraged by the start of '23 and thought it important to provide the interim update to shareholders and that we separately from our normal earnings release.

雖然現在還處於 23 年的早期階段，而且本季度和全年的表現可能與我們截至 2 月 23 日所列的情況大不相同，但我們對 23 年的開始感到鼓舞，並認為提供向股東的中期更新以及我們與正常收益發布分開的信息。

As we can see from this chart, our stock trading discounts NAV expanded during -- due to growth in our NAV rather than declines in our stock price. Our belief in the increased ability to understand where our NAV is at a more frequent basis will aid in our continuing quest to narrow the discount between our stock price and NAV.

正如我們從這張圖表中看到的那樣，我們的股票交易折扣資產淨值在此期間有所擴大——這是由於我們的資產淨值增長而不是股價下跌。我們相信，能夠更頻繁地了解我們的資產淨值在哪裡，這將有助於我們繼續努力縮小股價與資產淨值之間的差距。

That said, we focus on what we control and can control. And that is increasing 180 Degree Capital Corp's NAV. If we are able to do that, the stock price should follow as it has in our six-year history for the benefit of shareholders. If we give that, we certainly do not believe TURN stock price reflects the appropriate value of 180. And as you've seen us do in prior quarters and similar situations, management looks forward to adding to our ownership of 180 in open windows for such purposes.

也就是說，我們專注於我們可以控制和可以控制的事情。這正在增加 180 Degree Capital Corp 的資產淨值。如果我們能夠做到這一點，為了股東的利益，股價應該會像我們六年來的歷史那樣。如果我們給出這一點，我們當然不相信 TURN 股價反映了 180 的適當價值。正如您在前幾個季度和類似情況下看到的那樣，管理層期待在開放窗口中增加我們對 180 的所有權目的。

We would now like to open the call for questions.

我們現在想開始提問。

(Conference Instructions) [Brian Alexis]

（會議說明）[Brian Alexis]

Can we hear you, Brian?

我們能聽到你的聲音嗎，布賴恩？

Can you hear me?

你能聽到我嗎？

Yeah, now we can hear you, Brian.

是的，現在我們可以聽到你的聲音了，布賴恩。

Oh, there we go. I guess I can turn off my mute. Question for you on the Parabellum. I read in your letter that there's a capital raising deadline of now-ish for the pending acquisition and then the target can decide what they want to do. I'm just assuming, let's say that it doesn't work with them, I think you have roughly another eight months or so to -- or Parabellum has eight months to find an acquisition target.

哦，我們開始了。我想我可以關掉我的靜音。關於 Parabellum 的問題。我在你的信中讀到，對即將進行的收購有一個集資截止日期，然後目標可以決定他們想做什麼。我只是假設，假設它對他們不起作用，我認為你還有大約八個月左右的時間——或者 Parabellum 有八個月的時間來尋找收購目標。

Can you just say what would happen to the TURN balance sheet as you guys were the SPAC sponsor? If nothing happens, the SPAC gets redeemed, how -- what's the readthrough? How do we think about that scenario?

你能說一下 TURN 的資產負債表會發生什麼，因為你們是 SPAC 發起人嗎？如果沒有任何反應，SPAC 將被贖回，如何——通讀是什麼？我們如何看待這種情況？

Yeah. So thanks for question, Brian. So obviously, I can't speak too much on Parabellum and the specifics really into, except for what is publicly known, as you mentioned there is that ability -- it's not an automatic determination in terms of if the Board of the target EnOcean wants to pursue different alternatives and terminate the business combination agreement, so that -- and that deadline for having the capital commitment is today. There hasn't been anything announced publicly regarding that, so I can't -- again can't speak in specifics.

是的。謝謝你的提問，布賴恩。很明顯，我不能過多地談論 Parabellum 和具體細節，除了眾所周知的，正如你提到的那樣，這不是一個自動確定目標 EnOcean 的董事會是否想要尋求不同的替代方案並終止業務合併協議，以便 - 資本承諾的最後期限是今天。沒有任何關於這方面的公開宣布，所以我不能 - 再次不能具體發言。

If at the end of the day this transaction does not go forward, from a technical perspective, the SPAC is able to extend its life through September. And then -- but to do that, the sponsors would have to put in approximately $185 per month -- $185,000 per month. And so I think that would have -- that's a decision that would have to be made if EnOcean were to terminate the agreement or we were to terminate the agreement with EnOcean.

如果最終這筆交易沒有進行，從技術角度來看，SPAC 可以將其生命週期延長至 9 月。然後——但要做到這一點，贊助商必須每月投入大約 185 美元——每月 185,000 美元。所以我認為，如果 EnOcean 要終止協議或者我們要終止與 EnOcean 的協議，那將是必須做出的決定。

But if at the end of the day under the scenario where the SPAC was shut down and the trust distributed, then the result to TURN's balance sheet would be a de minimis amount of capital potentially coming back depending on how much is left in the operating account at the end of the day. Right now, we have it valued at about $2.7 million.So in a downside scenario, it would be approximately $0.27 impact to NAV.

但是，如果最終在 SPAC 關閉並分配信託的情況下，那麼 TURN 資產負債表的結果將是可能返回的最低資本數額，具體取決於運營賬戶中剩餘的資金量在一天結束的時候。目前，我們對其估值約為 270 萬美元。因此，在不利情況下，它對資產淨值的影響約為 0.27 美元。

Got it. Then --

知道了。然後 -

What I would say there, Brian, -- hang on, one second. It's a good company in a very difficult market for everything, funding, the debt markets, SPACs, raising capital, so there's been a back and forth in terms of trying to find the right value for the business. And it will either be an agreement or there will not be. I wouldn't take it as if you don't see an announcement by the end of the day, that it's over. You can always have extensions. And there's a give and take always -- a back and forth between investors and the Board.

布賴恩，我要說的是——稍等一下。在一個非常困難的市場中，這是一家好公司，融資、債務市場、SPAC、籌集資金，所以在試圖為企業找到合適的價值方面一直來回走動。要么達成協議，要么不達成協議。我不會認為你在一天結束時沒有看到公告，一切都結束了。你總是可以有擴展。並且總是有一個讓步 - 投資者和董事會之間的來回。

So it's still a work in progress. We hope to be able to conclude on something. But as Daniel said, if we don't, this will have been a waste of time, but it will -- and the waste of time will have been $2.7 million, as Daniel pointed out.

所以它仍在進行中。我們希望能夠得出結論。但正如 Daniel 所說，如果我們不這樣做，這將是浪費時間，但它會——正如 Daniel 指出的那樣，浪費的時間將達到 270 萬美元。

Got it. Then, if I could ask one more on D-Wave. Hard not to notice the volume on February 6, are you guys able to share anything about your position at D-Wave as of today?

知道了。然後，如果我可以在 D-Wave 上再問一個。很難不注意到 2 月 6 日的成交量，你們能分享一下您今天在 D-Wave 的職位嗎？

No, you know that we can't share with you. Unless what our ownership stake in a particular deck, no, can't do that.

不，你知道我們不能與你分享。除非我們在特定甲板上的所有權股份，不，不能那樣做。

Thanks, Brian.

謝謝，布萊恩。

But Brian, (multiple speakers) I will say one other thing to Daniel --

但是布賴恩，（多人發言）我要對丹尼爾說另一件事——

Q&A session is over.

問答環節結束。

So sorry, I hit the wrong button there.

很抱歉，我在那裡按錯了按鈕。

Q&A session has started. This line is now on hold. This line is now off hold.

問答環節開始了。這條線現在被擱置了。這條線路現已暫停。

(technical difficulty) information on where we are periodically during the course of the year because we now know what we own, and we can value what we own because they all trade on the NASDAQ and the New York and the rest. But as it relates to specifically sharing with folks outside of Form 13-D or 13-G filings, we can't and probably won't ever provide what we're doing in the middle of a quarter with regards to our position. That just wouldn't make any sense.

（技術難度）關於一年中我們定期在哪裡的信息，因為我們現在知道我們擁有什麼，我們可以評估我們擁有的東西，因為它們都在納斯達克和紐約等地交易。但由於它涉及與 13-D 或 13-G 表格文件以外的人具體分享，我們不能也可能永遠不會提供我們在季度中期所做的關於我們的職位的事情。那隻是沒有任何意義。

Now if we exited it and we were a filer, you'd probably see that. But we don't -- we're not going to get ourselves in a situation where we're showing our hand when we don't have to show our hand. So that's kind of the professional answer, Brian, to your question.

現在，如果我們退出它並且我們是一個文件管理器，您可能會看到這一點。但我們不會——我們不會讓自己處於一種情況，即我們在不必展示我們的手時展示我們的手。布賴恩，這是對你的問題的專業回答。

Okay. Daniel, go ahead.

好的。丹尼爾，繼續。

Sorry about that. Sorry, everybody. I think we're back on.

對於那個很抱歉。對不起，大家。我想我們又回來了。

Adam Waldo.

亞當沃爾多。

Hi, good morning, Kevin and Daniel. Thanks very much for taking my questions. I hope you can hear me okay.

嗨，早上好，凱文和丹尼爾。非常感謝您回答我的問題。我希望你能聽到我的聲音。

Yes, we can.

我們可以。

So I apologize. I got on the call little bit late. You may have covered this in your prepared remarks, but two topics, AgBiome write-down and Comscore activism.

所以我道歉。我接電話有點晚了。您可能已經在準備好的發言中提到了這一點，但有兩個主題，AgBiome 減記和 Comscore 激進主義。

On AgBiome write-down, there's a bit of a sizable write-down, obviously. And I wonder if you can provide a little more color on the factors that drove the size of that write down. And then conversely, what factors you see going forward that might lead to a write-up? And then I'll follow up on Comscore.

顯然，在 AgBiome 的減記方面，有一些相當大的減記。我想知道你是否可以提供更多關於推動減記規模的因素的顏色。然後相反，您認為未來有哪些因素可能導致增持？然後我將跟進 Comscore。

So Daniel, let me attack AgBiome, then you go ahead. There's two reasons -- look when you do an analysis of any of our private holdings, the analysis encompasses a number of factors. It could be the last raise that the company did. But if you're outside of a raise then you have to look at the company profiles and you do an options pricing methodology with regards to it. And clearly, 2022 was a difficult year for the Ag space. And as such as you're looking at AgBiome and you're a year remove from doing a deal, you have to value it differently than you did starting the year.

所以丹尼爾，讓我攻擊 AgBiome，然後你繼續。有兩個原因——當你對我們的任何私人持股進行分析時，分析都包含許多因素。這可能是該公司最後一次加薪。但如果你不在加薪範圍內，那麼你必須查看公司概況，並就此制定期權定價方法。顯然，2022 年對於 Ag 領域來說是艱難的一年。因此，如果你正在研究 AgBiome，距離達成交易還有一年的時間，你必須以不同於年初的方式對它進行估值。

Daniel, is anything else there?

丹尼爾，還有什麼事嗎？

No, you (inaudible)

不，你（聽不清）

Yeah. And I don't know what to say. I mean, they need to run the business better. I mean that's the best way for me to phrase it, Adam. It's the whole frustrating part about all this stuff is, I don't know, I can't control it. We have no say other than we could -- we speak to the Board. We speak to the management team, but inevitably, we can't control anything. And they've got a lot of work to do to improve their business model. They have a Board that would more than love for them to be public, but are they really ready to be public? I mean, that's all the question. There was a challenging year for the industry. And obviously, you could see from -- our market was a challenging year for AgBiome, that's really all we can say on it.

是的。我不知道該說什麼。我的意思是，他們需要更好地經營業務。我的意思是，這對我來說是最好的表達方式，亞當。所有這些東西最令人沮喪的部分是，我不知道，我無法控制它。我們別無選擇——我們與董事會交談。我們與管理團隊交談，但不可避免地，我們無法控制任何事情。他們還有很多工作要做，以改進他們的商業模式。他們有一個非常希望他們公開的董事會，但他們真的準備好公開了嗎？我的意思是，這就是所有問題。對這個行業來說，這是充滿挑戰的一年。顯然，你可以看到——我們的市場對 AgBiome 來說是充滿挑戰的一年，這就是我們能說的。

In terms of Comscore --

就 Comscore 而言——

Okay, so

可以，然後呢

Go ahead.

前進。

Sorry, I was just --

抱歉，我只是——

If I may say -- so the bulk of (inaudible) was operating performance revenue wasn't discount rate because of backup in interest rates and Fed funds and so forth, it was mainly operating performance for the company was the principal driver.

如果我可以說 - 所以大部分（聽不清）是經營業績收入不是貼現率，因為利率和聯邦基金等的支持，主要是公司的經營業績是主要驅動力。

Well, now that's --

好吧，現在是——

Multiple of Comscore, also.

Comscore 的倍數，也是。

Yeah. So the option pricing model do include, and it's actually not discount rate base, it's actually when interest rates go up, the volatility -- and volatility also goes up. You can actually see the option pricing models have an opposite impact. it really comes down to, as Kevin said, when you have a company that has have financing as over a year out under ASC 820, which is the accounting standard for determining fair value, you need to incorporate other factors into the termination because there's been a long time since that price and the valuation was set. And so when you look at both the some of the inputs that we had around the company, but mostly related to the performance of comparable related companies, again, it was a pretty difficult year for most ag-companies, especially small tech-- small cap, as we know. And that being incorporated into value and determination of value led to the significant decrease in value.

是的。所以期權定價模型確實包括，它實際上不是貼現率基礎，它實際上是當利率上升時，波動率——波動率也會上升。您實際上可以看到期權定價模型具有相反的影響。正如凱文所說，這實際上歸結為，當您的公司根據 ASC 820（確定公允價值的會計標準）融資超過一年時，您需要將其他因素納入終止，因為已經自該價格和估值確定以來已有很長時間了。因此，當你查看我們公司的一些投入時，但主要與可比相關公司的業績有關，同樣，對於大多數農業公司來說，這是非常艱難的一年，尤其是小型科技公司 - 小型上限，正如我們所知。並且被納入價值和確定價值導致價值顯著下降。

Okay. So if I'm hearing you properly, gents, it's really more multiple compression in the comp set rather than way of target operating performance of the business.

好的。因此，如果我沒聽錯的話，先生們，這實際上是競爭集中的多重壓縮，而不是企業目標運營績效的方式。

It's still a relatively early-stage company. You're right. I mean, (multiple speakers) some products on the market, it's not -- and they're not -- the actual operating performance isn't out there, right? But they do have some products there on the market, but it's early stage. And if you look at -- if you look at just the weather, right, a lot of their stuff, they develop fungicides. That's one of their main products that's on the market. For fungicides, you need wet weather. And if you look at just the weather from last year, it was difficult in some of the main growing areas.

它仍然是一家相對早期的公司。你說得對。我的意思是，（多個揚聲器）市場上的一些產品，它不是——而且它們不是——實際操作性能不存在，對嗎？但他們確實在市場上有一些產品，但還處於早期階段。如果你看——如果你只看天氣，對，他們的很多東西，他們會開發殺菌劑。這是他們在市場上的主要產品之一。對於殺菌劑，你需要潮濕的天氣。如果你只看去年的天氣，一些主要種植區的天氣很困難。

So there's -- that's not to say that they don't have really interesting products and capabilities and there is the opportunity for growth into the future. But '22 was a difficult year.

所以 - 這並不是說他們沒有真正有趣的產品和功能，並且有機會在未來發展。但 22 年是艱難的一年。

And needless to say, as it relates to come in public, this market is not about idea stocks. We don't need $1 billion ideas right now. We're in a risk-off environment where that's the last thing on investors' attention and so names like this just get pushed, pushed, pushed to the back of the line, if in fact, there actually is a line.

不用說，就公開而言，這個市場與創意股無關。我們現在不需要 10 億美元的想法。我們處於一個避險環境中，這是投資者關注的最後一件事，所以像這樣的名字只是被推、推、推到隊伍的後面，如果實際上真的有一條線的話。

Obviously, disappointing. We have a high regard -- had a high regard for the company and it's just one other -- just another reason why it's hard for me to ascertain how Harris & Harris existed for as long as it did with names like this. Because we -- as Daniel said, it is early stage, and how long we've owned it? Daniel, how long we own this?

顯然，令人失望。我們非常尊重——非常尊重這家公司，而這只是另一家公司——這只是我很難確定 Harris & Harris 是如何用這樣的名字存在這麼久的另一個原因。因為我們——正如丹尼爾所說，它處於早期階段，我們擁有它多久了？丹尼爾，我們擁有這個多久了？

AgBiome is 2014, if I remember correctly.

如果我沒記錯的話，AgBiome 是 2014 年。

It's nine years of early stage. D-Wave was funded in '19 and in -- yeah, I can't believe I'm saying this, was in 1999.

這是九年的早期階段。 D-Wave 是在 19 年獲得資助的——是的，我不敢相信我會這麼說，那是在 1999 年。

I was -- the D-Wave was founded in 1999. We invested in D-Wave in 2000 -- actually, I take back what I said earlier about AgBiome. We invested -- our initial investment in AgBiome was in '13, and our initial investment in D-Wave, I believe, was in 2006 or 2007.

我是——D-Wave 成立於 1999 年。我們在 2000 年投資了 D-Wave——實際上，我收回我之前所說的關於 AgBiome 的話。我們投資了——我們對 AgBiome 的初始投資是在 13 年，而我們對 D-Wave 的初始投資，我相信是在 2006 年或 2007 年。

It's insane that the company existed for as long as it did. Then, we inevitably would have ended up as a zero, if it didn't change the stripes. On Comscore, Adam, it's business that it's a real franchise. The Board has done some good things. They hire Jon Carpenter. They've been buyers of their own stock in the open market, board members specifically, service as well. Initiated a cost-improvement program, which should help their EBITDA margins; investing in the right areas; and so they've done some good things.

這家公司存在了這麼久真是太瘋狂了。然後，如果它不改變條紋，我們不可避免地會以零結束。在 Comscore 上，亞當，這是一個真正的特許經營權。董事會做了一些好事。他們僱用了喬恩·卡彭特。他們一直在公開市場上購買自己的股票，特別是董事會成員，還有服務。啟動了一項成本改進計劃，這應該有助於他們的 EBITDA 利潤率；投資於正確的領域；所以他們做了一些好事。

Here's where the issue is. Number one, it's a 10-person Board, which is completely unwieldy and out of pocket for a company of this size, just too big. The compensation in 2021 was $4.1 million paid to the Board. Now some of that was payback from '20 to the unconscionable amount of capital.

這就是問題所在。第一，它是一個 10 人的董事會，對於這種規模的公司來說，它完全笨拙而且自掏腰包，太大了。 2021 年的薪酬為支付給董事會的 410 萬美元。現在，其中一些是從 20 世紀到不合理的資本數額的回報。

When I was on the Board of a company, The Street, we didn't get paid. I don't think. We took zero cash from the company because our economic incentive was a 17% ownership stake that we had in The Street. Well, some of the preferred holders which have two [CT], they're actually paying themselves as well. That bothers me. And that needs to change.

當我在 The Street 公司的董事會任職時，我們沒有得到報酬。我不認為。我們從公司獲得的現金為零，因為我們的經濟激勵是我們在 The Street 擁有的 17% 的所有權股份。好吧，一些擁有兩個 [CT] 的優先持有人，他們實際上也在付錢給自己。這讓我很困擾。這需要改變。

You have a lead independent director, who's has been there for 15 years, who hasn't added a day of value in the 15 years that he has been there. And he made $900,000 in 2021, as disgraceful and egregious. And they're not addressing the issue of the preferred, where it is dominating the capital structure. There's a special dividend out there, which the company is entitled, which the preferred holders can call except they can't call it because it would put the company at risk.

你有一位首席獨立董事，他已經在那里工作了 15 年，在他在那裡的 15 年裡沒有增加一天的價值。他在 2021 年賺了 90 萬美元，既可恥又令人震驚。而且他們沒有解決優先股的問題，優先股在資本結構中占主導地位。公司有權獲得特別股息，優先股持有人可以贖回，除非他們不能贖回，因為這會使公司面臨風險。

And the company doesn't necessarily acknowledge this. They don't really discuss it, and they're in a weird spot because they can't say, we can't pay it on the one hand, except on the other hand, they can't pay it. And the special dividend is not going to be called that everyone thinks they're going to call the special dividend.

公司不一定承認這一點。他們並沒有真正討論它，他們處於一個奇怪的位置，因為他們不能說，一方面我們不能支付，但另一方面，他們不能支付。而且不會調用特別股息，每個人都認為他們會調用特別股息。

So there's a number of things at the Board level, which need to be fixed and altered. There's more alignment that the preferred shareholders could make with the common shareholders to show that they are aligned with the common shareholders.

所以在董事會層面有很多事情需要修復和改變。優先股股東可以與普通股股東達成更多一致，以表明他們與普通股股東保持一致。

And we're going to press -- we're going to get more aggressive in some of our commentary, if we don't see some significant changes. We're done talking about the things that we think they should be doing; we're going to start demanding that they do certain things. And if that means writing a public letter, then we'll write a public letter. I'm hopeful we don't have to do it, and the Board will operate properly.

我們將施壓——如果我們沒有看到一些重大變化，我們將在一些評論中變得更加激進。我們已經討論完了我們認為他們應該做的事情；我們將開始要求他們做某些事情。如果這意味著寫一封公開信，那麼我們就寫一封公開信。我希望我們不必這樣做，董事會將正常運作。

They need to shrink the size of the Board. They need to shrink the comp, that's paid to the Board. They need to deal with the special dividend because you can't have a board that's paying themselves over $1 million, and then telling the CEO to fire a bunch of people or hold people's comps that left in inflation. It just -- it doesn't work.

他們需要縮小董事會的規模。他們需要縮減薪酬，這是支付給董事會的。他們需要處理特別股息，因為你不能讓董事會支付超過 100 萬美元，然後告訴 CEO 解僱一群人或保留因通貨膨脹而留下的員工。它只是 - 它不起作用。

So the people that have been disadvantaged here are the employees of Comscore. And the Board, it has a responsibility to not serve preferred shareholders or responsibilities to common shareholders. And we're going to make sure that they were aware of their responsibilities.

所以這裡一直處於不利地位的人是 Comscore 的員工。而董事會，它有責任不為優先股股東服務或對普通股股東負責。我們將確保他們了解自己的責任。

So it's a completely egregiously mispriced business like $1.16 makes zero sense to me. Zero. It's worth three times that amount now, but the Board's got to basically deliver on enhanced corporate governance practices. They are just behind the eight ball here, so we'll see if they do it. Well, hopefully, will. Time will tell. But we're activist for a reason. We're never going to be able to run a proxy contest.

所以這是一個完全錯誤定價的業務，比如 1.16 美元對我來說是零意義。零。現在它的價值是這個數額的三倍，但董事會必須基本上實現增強的公司治理實踐。他們就在八號球的後面，所以我們看看他們是否能做到。好吧，希望會。時間會證明一切。但我們是激進主義者是有原因的。我們永遠無法進行代理權競賽。

I'm the first person that -- we're not going to waste our shareholders' money by launching a proxy contest we can never win. But we'll make their lives a little more difficult by being very bold in letters written to common shareholders and the employees, if they don't change your stripes. Long-winded answer, but that's our answer.

我是第一個 - 我們不會通過發起我們永遠不會贏的代理權競賽來浪費股東的錢。但是，如果他們不改變你的做法，我們會在寫給普通股股東和員工的信中非常大膽，讓他們的生活變得更加困難。冗長的答案，但這是我們的答案。

And maybe the only thing I would add that is, look, we've had a good dialogue with them. They have done a number of things that we have suggested, and they have been somewhat responsive. It's really these remaining topics that we think is there -- if they actually focus on and work to resolve, that should unlock value for everyone.

也許我唯一要補充的是，看，我們與他們進行了很好的對話。他們已經完成了我們建議的許多事情，並且他們已經做出了一定程度的回應。我們認為確實存在這些剩餘的主題——如果它們真正關注並努力解決，那應該會為每個人釋放價值。

Right. So thank you for the helpful comments. And Kevin, thanks for clarifying about a potential proxy contest. You're, obviously, under Delaware corporate law, the Board's obligation is to the common shareholders above the preferred. Could you envision some sort of contingency litigation around fiduciary? Do you hear what other forms might activism take the side [letter writing]?

正確的。因此，感謝您提供有用的評論。凱文，感謝你澄清潛在的代理權競爭。顯然，根據特拉華州公司法，董事會對普通股股東的義務高於優先股股東。您能否設想圍繞受託人進行某種應急訴訟？你聽說激進主義可能採取哪些其他形式[寫信]？

Yeah, the proxy contest, probably not going to do. The Delaware courts have been very emphatic about what the obligations are of Board members that is they are there to facilitate the rights and represent the rights of common shareholders. They haven't really done anything to violate the rights.

是的，代理權競賽，可能不會做。特拉華州法院一直非常強調董事會成員的義務，即他們在那裡促進權利並代表普通股股東的權利。他們並沒有真正做任何侵犯權利的事情。

What would have they done? There's nothing to see them over yet, but we haven't -- we're watching. And if they cross the line, then litigation is an open possibility, like I said to Daniel's point, we've had a good dialogue with the Board. But the dialogue has stopped being a dialogue because they're not addressing certain things that need to be addressed.

他們會做什麼？目前還沒有什麼可以讓他們結束的，但我們還沒有——我們正在觀察。如果他們越界，那麼訴訟是一種公開的可能性，就像我對 Daniel 的觀點所說的那樣，我們已經與董事會進行了良好的對話。但對話已不再是對話，因為他們沒有解決某些需要解決的問題。

They've addressed a lot of other things. They need to keep addressing the issues that are playing the -- there's no reason, given the results, why this share price is $1.16. It was three times the price in April of last year. Three times. Nothing's changed. As a matter of fact, the business is better.

他們已經解決了很多其他事情。他們需要繼續解決正在發生的問題——鑑於結果，沒有理由將股價定為 1.16 美元。這是去年四月價格的三倍。三次。什麼都沒有改變。事實上，生意更好。

But what happened last year, it was -- way better. What happened last year, if you remember is they -- because the preferred is not calculated as equity according to Russell, and so they, unfortunately, ran through to the downside where the market cap levels were to remain in the Russell.

但去年發生的事情——好多了。去年發生的事情，如果你還記得的話——因為根據 Russell 的說法，優先股不是作為股權計算的，所以不幸的是，他們跑到了 Russell 市值水平保持不變的下行。

And we kept sending them notes, convert some of your referred. Because you convert its common at some economic interest to you. We weren't asking them to lose economics here. But if you do that, your market cap will be higher because now because obviously common is calculated as equity, you can retain your status in the Russell, they just completely ignored it. Ignored it. Ignored it. Ignore it. The stock went from $3 to basically $1.50 as a result of the Russell -- being kicked out of the Russell.

我們不斷地向他們發送筆記，轉換您推薦的一些。因為您以某種經濟利益將其共同點轉換為您。我們並不是要他們在這裡失去經濟。但如果你這樣做，你的市值會更高，因為現在顯然普通股是按權益計算的，你可以保留你在羅素的地位，他們只是完全忽略了它。忽略了它。忽略了它。忽略它。由於 Russell——被踢出 Russell，該股從 3 美元漲至 1.50 美元。

So we're not going to allow them to disregard the things that are important to this equity price, which is dealing with the preferred, dealing with the special dividend, talking about it, being transparent about it. They're just ignoring it but hoping it will go away. It's not going to go away. And $1.15 proves it that it's not going to go away because we've had a rally in the market and the stock has done nothing.

所以我們不會讓他們忽視對這個股票價格很重要的事情，這是處理優先股，處理特別股息，談論它，讓它透明。他們只是忽略它，但希望它會消失。它不會消失。而 1.15 美元證明它不會消失，因為我們在市場上出現了反彈，而股票什麼也沒做。

So we're on it. Litigation potentially possible, no proxy contest, but public letters for sure. And if that embarrasses certain members of the Board. So be it. Clean up your act or you're going to get a letter from a big shareholder.

所以我們開始了。可能會提起訴訟，沒有代理權競爭，但肯定會公開信件。如果這讓董事會的某些成員感到尷尬。就這樣吧。清理你的行為，否則你將收到大股東的來信。

Okay. Thanks very much. And keep your chin up, guys.

好的。非常感謝。並保持你的下巴，伙計們。

Thanks, Adam.

謝謝，亞當。

Thanks, Adam. Have a good year.

謝謝，亞當。過個好年。

(Conference Instructions) I am not seeing any other questions in the queue.

（會議說明）我沒有在隊列中看到任何其他問題。

So look, thanks, everyone, it's a -- it was good five years and then a bad last year. There's no getting around that. I promise you full transparency when we got here. That means when it's good, it's bad, you're going to get the same level of transparency. We don't hide behind bad performance. We had bad performance in our public portfolio last year for the first time since we arrived, and that was disappointing.

所以看，謝謝大家，這是 - 五年很好，去年很糟糕。沒有辦法解決這個問題。當我們到達這裡時，我向你保證完全透明。這意味著無論好壞，您都將獲得相同級別的透明度。我們不會躲在糟糕的表現背後。去年我們的公共投資組合表現不佳，這是我們上任以來的第一次，這令人失望。

And while we also had hits in our private portfolio, which was completely disappointing and not helpful in 2022, as I said, our business transformation is now 90% complete. $50 million worth of assets that we had in private holdings when we started is now down to $6.5 million. And so as we stare down the next five or 10 years, our performance is going to be dictated by the public stock picking that we do here. And that's going to drive our NAV unlike it has in the past five or six years where the private portfolio is still dominated. It was the great majority of our assets for more than half of the last six years, that's no longer the case.

雖然我們的私人投資組合也受到了打擊，但正如我所說，這在 2022 年完全令人失望且無濟於事，但我們的業務轉型現已完成 90%。我們開始時私人持有的價值 5000 萬美元的資產現在已降至 650 萬美元。因此，當我們展望未來五年或十年時，我們的表現將取決於我們在這裡進行的公開選股。這將推動我們的資產淨值，這與過去五六年私人投資組合仍占主導地位的情況不同。在過去六年的一半以上時間裡，這是我們資產的絕大部分，現在情況不同了。

So that's not to suggest we're going to have outperformance that's going to take blood, sweat, and tears, and a lot of hard work, but the good news for us is, I no longer have to spend a ton of time worrying about which private portfolio may or may not hurt us this quarter.

所以這並不是說我們要有出色的表現，需要付出鮮血、汗水和眼淚，以及大量的辛勤工作，但對我們來說，好消息是，我不再需要花大量時間擔心本季度哪些私人投資組合可能會或可能不會傷害我們。

We've had some wins in the private portfolio throughout [AGL] and Petra. But for the most part, as you can see in the slides, $1.80 of losses in the last six years has been nothing short of a tremendous headwind that no longer exist as this as we stare out the next five years. And with added transparency, should leave to a narrowing of the discount.

我們在 [AGL] 和佩特拉的私人投資組合中取得了一些勝利。但在大多數情況下，正如您在幻燈片中看到的那樣，過去六年 1.80 美元的損失無異於巨大的逆風，在我們展望未來五年時，這種逆風已不復存在。隨著透明度的提高，折扣應該會縮小。

And remember, at the end of the day, the more that we build scale, the more opportunities we'll have to return capital back to shareholders, whether that's share repurchase or dividends. And if the discount never narrows, then we can always close it down and give all the money back to shareholders. That's not for today's discussion but as we think through the next five years, we do have a chance to make a lot of money here for our shareholders. And we think the dislocation of the equity markets in 2022 is going to serve us well as we look out the next three years.

請記住，歸根結底，我們建立的規模越多，我們將資本返還給股東的機會就越多，無論是股票回購還是股息。如果折扣永遠不會縮小，那麼我們總是可以關閉它並將所有資金返還給股東。這不適合今天的討論，但正如我們在未來五年中所考慮的那樣，我們確實有機會在這里為我們的股東賺到很多錢。我們認為，展望未來三年，2022 年股市的混亂將對我們有利。

So thank you for your time today. We look forward to chatting with you about our Q1 results. If anybody has any questions, you know where to find us. Please email or call, we're happy to jump on the phone with you and discuss whatever it is that you want to discuss, so thanks.

謝謝你今天的時間。我們期待與您討論我們第一季度的結果。如果有人有任何問題，您知道在哪裡可以找到我們。請發送電子郵件或致電，我們很樂意與您通電話並討論您想要討論的任何內容，謝謝。

Thanks, everyone. You can now disconnect.

感謝大家。您現在可以斷開連接。

Goodbye.

再見。