Silvercrest Asset Management Group Inc (SAMG) 2022 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning, and welcome to the Silvercrest Asset Management Group Inc. Fourth Quarter and Full Year 2022 Earnings Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) Please note, this event is being recorded.

早上好，歡迎來到 Silvercrest 資產管理集團公司 2022 年第四季度和全年收益電話會議。 （操作員說明）請注意，正在記錄此事件。

Before we begin, let me remind you that during today's call, certain statements made regarding our future performance are forward-looking statements. They are based on current expectations and projections, which are subject to a number of risks and uncertainties, and many factors could cause actual results to differ materially from the statements that are made. Those factors are disclosed in our filings with the SEC under the caption Risk Factors. For all such forward-looking statements, we claim the protections provided by the Litigation Reform Act of 1995. All forward-looking statements made on this call are made as of the date hereof, and Silvercrest assumes no obligation to update them.

在我們開始之前，讓我提醒您，在今天的電話會議中，關於我們未來業績的某些陳述是前瞻性陳述。它們基於當前的預期和預測，受到許多風險和不確定性的影響，許多因素可能導致實際結果與所做的陳述存在重大差異。這些因素在我們提交給美國證券交易委員會的文件中以風險因素為標題進行了披露。對於所有此類前瞻性陳述，我們要求獲得 1995 年《訴訟改革法案》提供的保護。在本次電話會議上做出的所有前瞻性陳述均截至本公告發布之日，Silvercrest 不承擔更新這些陳述的義務。

I would now like to turn the conference over to Rick Hough, Chairman and CEO of Silvercrest. Please begin.

我現在想將會議轉交給 Silvercrest 董事長兼首席執行官 Rick Hough。請開始。

Good morning, and thanks for joining us for the fourth quarter of 2022 and year-end 2022 results. Silvercrest finished a volatile fourth quarter and calendar year 2022 with total assets under management of $28.9 billion and discretionary AUM of $20.9 million. Total AUM declined 10.5% during the calendar year 2022. Discretionary AUM, which primarily drives our revenue, declined 16.7% during the year 2022.

早上好，感謝您加入我們的 2022 年第四季度和 2022 年底業績。 Silvercrest 結束了動蕩的第四季度和 2022 日曆年，管理的總資產為 289 億美元，可自由支配的資產管理規模為 2090 萬美元。總資產管理規模在 2022 年下降了 10.5%。在 2022 年，主要推動我們收入的可支配資產管理規模下降了 16.7%。

Revenue consequently fell 15.7% and 6.4% for the fourth quarter and full year 2022, respectively, compared with 2021. This decline in revenues significantly affected our adjusted EBITDA and adjusted diluted earnings per share. Adjusted EBITDA declined to $4.4 million and $32 million for the fourth quarter and full year 2022, respectively, from 2021. Our adjusted diluted earnings per share also declined to $0.15 and $1.35 for the fourth quarter and full year 2022, respectively. Our adjusted EBITDA margin for the fourth quarter and full year 2022 was 15.6% and 26%, respectively. While down from the firm's 33% adjusted EBITDA margin for the year ended 2021, Silvercrest adjusted EBITDA margin remains historically healthy for the company, especially in light of the declining markets last year.

因此，與 2021 年相比，2022 年第四季度和全年的收入分別下降了 15.7% 和 6.4%。收入的下降嚴重影響了我們調整後的 EBITDA 和調整後的攤薄每股收益。從 2021 年開始，第四季度和 2022 年全年調整後的 EBITDA 分別下降至 440 萬美元和 3200 萬美元。我們調整後的攤薄每股收益也分別下降至 2022 年第四季度和全年的 0.15 美元和 1.35 美元。我們調整後的 EBITDA 利潤率在第四季度和 2022 年全年分別為 15.6% 和 26%。 Silvercrest 調整後的 EBITDA 利潤率雖然低於公司截至 2021 年 33% 的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率，但在歷史上對公司來說仍然是健康的，尤其是考慮到去年市場下滑的情況。

The volatile market conditions of 2022 relaxed during the fourth quarter of the year. And as a result, 2022 year-end discretionary AUM increased by $1.5 billion or 7.7% over the third quarter to $20.9 billion. Silvercrest also gained $220 million in new relationships during the fourth quarter, which is one of our better new relationship development quarters over the past couple of years.

2022 年動蕩的市場狀況在今年第四季度有所緩解。因此，2022 年底可自由支配的 AUM 比第三季度增加 15 億美元或 7.7%，達到 209 億美元。 Silvercrest 在第四季度還獲得了 2.2 億美元的新關係，這是我們在過去幾年中更好的新關係發展季度之一。

We've stated that market volatility and uncertainty create long-term opportunities that have typically benefited the high quality of Silvercrest's capabilities, and Silvercrest's suite of asset management capabilities have maintained their solid relative performance. Our pipeline of new business opportunities also increased during the quarter. And finally, the firm's Outsourced Chief Investment Officer initiative now manages AUM of $1.45 billion. Silvercrest repurchased approximately 190,000 shares of Class A common stock for approximately $3.5 million during the fourth quarter.

我們已經指出，市場波動和不確定性創造了長期機會，這些機會通常有利於 Silvercrest 的高質量功能，而 Silvercrest 的資產管理功能套件保持了穩健的相對錶現。我們的新業務機會渠道在本季度也有所增加。最後，該公司的外包首席投資官計劃現在管理著 14.5 億美元的資產管理規模。 Silvercrest 在第四季度以約 350 萬美元的價格回購了約 190,000 股 A 類普通股。

Those conclude my preliminary remarks. We'll turn it over to Scott Gerard, our CFO, and then we will take questions. Thank you.

以上就是我的初步發言。我們將把它交給我們的首席財務官 Scott Gerard，然後我們將回答問題。謝謝。

Great. Thanks, Rick. As disclosed in our earnings release for the fourth quarter, discretionary AUM as of December 31, 2022, was $20.9 billion, and total AUM as of the end of 2022 is $28.9 billion. Revenue for the quarter was $28.5 million, and reported consolidated net income for the quarter was $3.3 million.

偉大的。謝謝，瑞克。正如我們在第四季度財報中披露的那樣，截至 2022 年 12 月 31 日，可自由支配的 AUM 為 209 億美元，截至 2022 年底的總 AUM 為 289 億美元。本季度收入為 2850 萬美元，報告的本季度綜合淨收入為 330 萬美元。

Looking further into the fourth quarter of '22. Again, revenue was approximately $28.5 million, and this represented approximately a 16% decrease over revenue of $33.8 million for the same period last year. This decrease was driven primarily by market depreciation and net client outflows in discretionary AUM. Expenses for the fourth quarter were $24.4 million, representing less than a 1% decrease from expenses of $24.5 million for the same period last year. This decrease was primarily attributable to a decrease in general and administrative expenses of $1.2 million, and this was partially offset by an increase in compensation and benefits expense of $1 million.

進一步展望 22 年第四季度。同樣，收入約為 2850 萬美元，這比去年同期的收入 3380 萬美元減少了約 16%。這一下降主要是由於市場貶值和可自由支配的 AUM 客戶淨流出。第四季度的支出為 2440 萬美元，比去年同期的 2450 萬美元下降不到 1%。這一減少主要是由於一般和行政費用減少 120 萬美元，這部分被補償和福利費用增加 100 萬美元所抵消。

Compensation and benefits increased by $1 million or approximately 6% to $18.7 million for the fourth quarter of 2022 from $17.7 million for the same period last year. The increase was primarily attributable to an increase in the accrual for bonuses and salaries and benefits expense primarily as a result of merit-based increases and newly hired staff.

2022 年第四季度的薪酬和福利從去年同期的 1770 萬美元增加 100 萬美元或約 6% 至 1870 萬美元。增加的主要原因是獎金、薪金和福利費用的應計費用增加，主要是由於績效增加和新僱用的員工。

General and administrative expenses decreased by $1.2 million to $5.7 million for the fourth quarter of 2022 from $6.8 million for the same period in 2021. This was primarily attributable to a decrease in the adjustment to the fair value of contingent consideration related to the Cortina Acquisition of $1.9 million, partially offset by an increase in travel and entertainment expenses and professional fees.

一般和行政費用從 2021 年同期的 680 萬美元減少 120 萬美元至 2022 年第四季度的 570 萬美元。這主要是由於與 Cortina 收購相關的或有對價的公允價值調整減少190 萬美元，部分被旅行和娛樂費用以及專業費用的增加所抵消。

Reported consolidated net income was $3.3 million for the quarter. This compared to $8.6 million in the same period last year. Reported net income attributable to Silvercrest or the Class A shareholders for the fourth quarter of 2022 was approximately $2.1 million or $0.22 per basic and diluted Class A share.

本季度報告的綜合淨收入為 330 萬美元。相比之下，去年同期為 860 萬美元。報告的 2022 年第四季度歸屬於 Silvercrest 或 A 類股東的淨收入約為 210 萬美元或每股基本和稀釋 A 類股 0.22 美元。

Adjusted EBITDA, which we define as EBITDA without giving effect to equity-based compensation expense and noncore and nonrecurring items, was approximately $4.4 million or 15.6% of revenue for the quarter compared to $13 million or 38.5% of revenue for the same period in the prior year. Adjusted net income, which we define as net income without giving effect to noncore and nonrecurring items and income tax expense, assuming a corporate rate of 26%, was approximately $2.2 million for the quarter or $0.16 and $0.15 per adjusted basic and diluted EPS, respectively.

調整後的 EBITDA（我們將其定義為 EBITDA，不考慮基於股權的薪酬費用和非核心和非經常性項目）約為 440 萬美元或占本季度收入的 15.6%，而同期為 1300 萬美元或占收入的 38.5%去年。假設公司稅率為 26%，我們將調整後的淨收入定義為不影響非核心和非經常性項目的淨收入和所得稅費用，本季度約為 220 萬美元，或每調整後基本每股收益和稀釋每股收益分別為 0.16 美元和 0.15 美元.

Adjusted EPS is equal to adjusted net income divided by the actual Class A and Class B shares outstanding as of the end of the reporting period for basic adjusted EPS. And to the extent dilutive, we add unvested restricted stock units and nonqualified stock options to the total shares outstanding to compute diluted adjusted EPS.

調整後的每股收益等於調整後的淨收入除以截至報告期末基本調整後每股收益的實際流通在外的 A 類和 B 類股票。就稀釋性而言，我們將未授予的限制性股票單位和非合格股票期權添加到已發行股票總數中，以計算稀釋後的調整後每股收益。

Looking at the full year, revenue for 2022 was approximately $123.2 million, representing approximately a 6% decrease over revenue of $131.6 million for the same period last year. This decrease was driven primarily by market depreciation, partially offset by net client inflows in discretionary AUM. Expenses for 2022 were $84.7 million, representing approximately a 16% decrease from expenses of $101.1 million for the same period last year. This decrease was primarily attributable to decreases in compensation expense and general and administrative expenses of $1 million and $15.5 million, respectively.

從全年來看，2022 年的收入約為 1.232 億美元，比去年同期的收入 1.316 億美元下降約 6%。這一下降主要是由市場貶值推動的，部分被可自由支配的 AUM 中的客戶淨流入所抵消。 2022 年的支出為 8470 萬美元，比去年同期的 1.011 億美元減少約 16%。這一減少主要是由於補償費用以及一般和行政費用分別減少了 100 萬美元和 1550 萬美元。

The compensation and benefits decrease was approximately 1% to $71.6 million for the year compared to $72.6 million for the same period last year. The decrease was primarily attributable to decreases in the accrual for bonuses and equity-based compensation expense due to a decrease in the number of unvested restricted stock units and unvested nonqualified stock options outstanding, partially offset by an increase in salaries and benefits expense, primarily as a result of merit-based increases and newly hired staff.

與去年同期的 7260 萬美元相比，本年度薪酬和福利減少約 1% 至 7160 萬美元。減少的主要原因是由於未授予的限制性股票單位和未授予的未授予的非合格股票期權的數量減少，獎金和基於股權的薪酬費用的應計費用減少，部分被工資和福利費用的增加所抵消，主要是因為基於績效的加薪和新聘用的工作人員的結果。

General and administrative expenses decreased by $15.5 million or approximately 54% to $13 million for 2022 from $28.5 million for the same period in the prior year. This was primarily attributable to decreases in the fair value of contingent consideration related to the Cortina Acquisition of $17.5 million, occupancy and related costs and trade errors, partially offset by increases in travel and entertainment expense, professional fees and portfolio and systems expense.

2022 年的一般和行政費用從去年同期的 2850 萬美元減少 1550 萬美元或約 54% 至 1300 萬美元。這主要是由於與 1750 萬美元 Cortina 收購相關的或有對價的公允價值下降、佔用和相關成本以及貿易錯誤，部分被差旅和娛樂費用、專業費用以及投資組合和系統費用的增加所抵消。

Reported consolidated net income for the year was $30.8 million compared to $24.9 million in the same period in the prior year. Reported net income attributable to Silvercrest for the year ended December 31, 2022, was approximately $18.8 million or $1.92 per basic and diluted Class A share. Adjusted EBITDA was approximately $32 million or 26% of revenue for 2022 compared to $43.4 million or 33% of revenue for 2021. Adjusted net income was approximately $19.7 million for 2022 or $1.40 and $1.35 per basic adjusted and diluted EPS, respectively.

報告的年度綜合淨收入為 3080 萬美元，而去年同期為 2490 萬美元。截至 2022 年 12 月 31 日止年度，歸屬於 Silvercrest 的報告淨收入約為 1880 萬美元，或每股基本和稀釋 A 類股票 1.92 美元。調整後的 EBITDA 約為 3200 萬美元，佔 2022 年收入的 26%，而 2021 年為 4340 萬美元，佔收入的 33%。2022 年調整後的淨收入約為 1970 萬美元，即每股基本調整後和稀釋每股收益分別為 1.40 美元和 1.35 美元。

Quickly looking at the balance sheet. Total assets at the end of 2022 were approximately $212.7 million compared to $229.3 million as of the end of 2021. At the end of 2022, cash and cash equivalents were approximately $77.4 million compared to $85.7 million at the end of 2021. Total borrowings as of the end of 2022 were $6.3 million, and total Class A stockholders' equity was approximately $84.6 million at the end of 2022.

快速查看資產負債表。 2022 年底的總資產約為 2.127 億美元，而 2021 年底為 2.293 億美元。截至 2022 年底，現金和現金等價物約為 7740 萬美元，而 2021 年底為 8570 萬美元。借款總額截至2022年底為630萬美元，2022年底A類股東權益總額約為8460萬美元。

That concludes my financial remarks. I'll now turn it over to Rick for Q&A.

我的財務評論到此結束。我現在將其交給 Rick 進行問答。

Great. Thanks, Scott. We're now available for questions about the fourth quarter and the year.

偉大的。謝謝，斯科特。我們現在可以回答有關第四季度和年度的問題。

(Operator Instructions) The first question comes from Sumeet Mody with Piper Sandler.

（操作員說明）第一個問題來自 Sumeet Mody 和 Piper Sandler。

So I just wanted to start with the institutional pipeline, specifically OCIO. I know last quarter, you mentioned you were around $700 million in the pipe and AUM was below $1 billion. And now that you're at $1.45 billion on AUM, I just wanted to see what the update there was on the OCIO pipeline.

所以我只想從機構管道開始，特別是 OCIO。我知道上個季度，你提到你的管道中有大約 7 億美元，而 AUM 低於 10 億美元。現在你的資產管理規模為 14.5 億美元，我只想看看 OCIO 管道有什麼更新。

And then if you could also just secondly touch on the international distribution effort and how that's progressing and how you view that opportunity over the next couple of years.

然後，如果您還可以再談談國際分銷工作，以及它的進展情況以及您如何看待未來幾年的機會。

Sure. So we'll start with the OCIO. Obviously, that's a really nice pickup for us. Some of that effect is going to be the increase that we saw in the fourth quarter in the markets. I think the S&P was up on the order of 7%, which helps. But we also won new business into the OCIO platform. So a meaningful part of that includes those wins, which is great.

當然。所以我們將從 OCIO 開始。顯然，這對我們來說是一個非常好的選擇。其中一些影響將是我們在第四季度看到的市場增長。我認為標準普爾指數上漲了 7% 左右，這很有幫助。但我們也贏得了新業務進入 OCIO 平台。所以其中一個有意義的部分包括那些勝利，這很棒。

As I said before, getting over the $1 billion threshold was really important for us being a player in the market. We were right up against it, as you know, before the market declined in 2022. And I had projected that this will be a few to several billion dollar business for the firm. So I feel really good that we're almost at $1.5 billion, not quite there, just a couple more wins.

正如我之前所說，超過 10 億美元的門檻對於我們成為市場參與者來說非常重要。如你所知，在 2022 年市場下滑之前，我們就反對它。我曾預計這對公司來說將是幾億美元到幾十億美元的業務。所以我感覺非常好，我們幾乎達到了 15 億美元，還不算多，只是多贏了幾場。

The pipeline is -- for that capability is looking really solid. It has picked up as well. And I think it's on the order of $700 million, just under that, probably $690 million or something like that. That has increased as well. So we feel good about the business opportunities there.

管道是——因為這種能力看起來非常可靠。它也有所回升。而且我認為它大約是 7 億美元，略低於此，可能是 6.9 億美元或類似的數字。這也增加了。因此，我們對那裡的商機感到滿意。

I might as well get ahead of the general pipeline question since I usually get asked it. But the total pipeline for all of our capabilities on the institutional side of the business, including OCIO, is $1.65 billion now. And that is up from $1.43 billion at the end of the third quarter.

我還不如先問一般的管道問題，因為我經常被問到。但我們在機構方面的所有能力的總管道，包括 OCIO，現在為 16.5 億美元。這高於第三季度末的 14.3 億美元。

Your second question has to do with international value. That pipeline has increased. It's small, yes. But most importantly, the performance in that capability has picked up very nicely in the current environment. They are definitely a value-oriented strategy. And so the risk off and the volatility and kind of return to fundamentals in some parts of the market has definitely helped their strategy. So that's great. And we've also seen some more allocations internally from our wealth clients into that strategy.

你的第二個問題與國際價值有關。該管道增加了。它很小，是的。但最重要的是，該功能的性能在當前環境中得到了很好的提升。它們絕對是一種以價值為導向的策略。因此，市場某些部分的風險規避、波動和回歸基本面無疑對他們的戰略有所幫助。那太好了。我們還看到我們的財富客戶在內部對該策略進行了更多配置。

That's helpful. And then just to kind of round out the institutional growth strategy overall. On the value and growth sides, it seems like the focus is organic growth, maybe some small team lift-outs. I know from a product perspective, you talked about being comfortable where you are today. But are there any regions across the U.S. you find most interesting today that maybe you haven't penetrated into yet? Or is it kind of more just scaling within where you're at?

這很有幫助。然後只是為了全面完善機構增長戰略。在價值和增長方面，重點似乎是有機增長，也許是一些小團隊的退出。我知道從產品的角度來看，你談到了今天的舒適。但是，美國各地是否有任何您今天覺得最有趣但您可能尚未深入了解的地區？或者它更像是在你所在的地方進行縮放？

Yes. So -- and with regards to the overall institutional strategy, I'm very happy with where we are. We've got plenty of capacity to build in both value and growth. The growth performance with our Milwaukee professionals has absolutely been outstanding through this environment. Their relative outperformance is really great. And for the kind of performance that they can deliver, it's really nice to see them hold value in a down market. And their pipeline has grown commensurately with that. The value equity pipeline also remains strong. And so I expect good things there, but we're really focused on building those strategies. We've got the main pieces that we need as an asset management company for now. I am not necessarily looking for other lift-outs or strategies to enhance the institutional business at this time.

是的。所以 - 關於整體機構戰略，我對我們所處的位置感到非常滿意。我們有足夠的能力來創造價值和增長。在這種環境下，我們密爾沃基專業人士的成長表現絕對出色。他們的相對錶現非常出色。對於他們可以提供的那種表現，很高興看到他們在低迷的市場中保持價值。他們的管道也相應地增長了。價值股權渠道也依然強勁。所以我期待那裡有好事，但我們真的專注於製定這些戰略。我們現在擁有作為資產管理公司所需的主要部分。我目前不一定在尋找其他提升或策略來增強機構業務。

With the change in the interest rate environment, there's possibility we look at more credit that has been of less interest to many clients and allocators as you might expect, given the low interest rates. And there's more and more attention being paid to different types of credit strategy, whether that's distressed or other capabilities, even more so than what we were seeing in PE only a few years ago. So there may be an opportunity there, but I can't say I'm aggressively looking or trying to add that. We've got enough to try to build here as it is.

隨著利率環境的變化，鑑於低利率，我們可能會看到更多客戶和分配者不太感興趣的信貸。越來越多的人關注不同類型的信貸策略，無論是苦惱還是其他能力，甚至比幾年前我們在 PE 中看到的還要多。所以那裡可能有機會，但我不能說我正在積極尋找或試圖添加它。我們有足夠的資源嘗試按原樣在這裡建造。

Regionally, the institutional business isn't something that I'm focused on. The reason we went to Milwaukee was because it was a great strategy. It was a great team and a great growth strategy. It had nothing to do per se with the region. It's nice to be in the Midwest. We work well with Midwesterners. It was a great cultural fit, but that's just a circumstance of them being really excellent. And they could have been in another city entirely.

在區域上，機構業務不是我關注的重點。我們去密爾沃基的原因是因為這是一個很棒的策略。這是一個偉大的團隊和一個偉大的增長戰略。它本身與該地區無關。很高興在中西部。我們與中西部人合作良好。這是一種很好的文化契合，但這只是他們非常優秀的一個情況。他們本可以完全在另一個城市。

Geography is much more important for us when we think about the high net worth business. And I'm, as you know, always looking for opportunities to find the right partners in different regions of the country.

當我們考慮高淨值業務時，地理對我們來說更為重要。如您所知，我一直在尋找機會在國內不同地區尋找合適的合作夥伴。

Great. And then maybe just one last one for Scott. On the G&A costs, I know you guys run a pretty much under -- just under $6 million a quarter on average in '21, maybe just over that in 2022 for 10% growth rate year-over-year. Is that a fair growth rate to assume for '23? What are some of the impacts we should think about for G&A for this year?

偉大的。然後也許只是 Scott 的最後一個。關於 G&A 成本，我知道你們在 21 年的平均每季度略低於 600 萬美元，到 2022 年可能略高於這一水平，同比增長率為 10%。對於 23 年來說，這是一個合理的增長率嗎？對於今年的 G&A，我們應該考慮哪些影響？

Yes. I think one of the noteworthy lines is related to travel and entertainment expense. That's certainly going to -- has started normalizing. So that, as you can imagine, because of the pandemic, that expense in 2021, even well into '22, is lower than historical levels. And other fees such as professional fees, some of the research services that we use, we're in an inflationary environment. As much as we do our best to negotiate either nominal built-in increases in our agreements or more common now, various services are hiking up their fees, and we try and do our best to negotiate that down to a reasonable level. But I would say that pretty much covers some of the -- some of what you've seen in G&A and what I would expect to continue.

是的。我認為值得注意的一條線與旅行和娛樂費用有關。這肯定會 - 已經開始正常化。因此，正如您可以想像的那樣，由於大流行，2021 年的支出，甚至是 22 年的支出，都低於歷史水平。以及其他費用，例如專業費用，我們使用的一些研究服務，我們處於通貨膨脹的環境中。儘管我們盡最大努力談判我們協議中的名義內置增加或現在更常見，但各種服務正在提高他們的費用，我們盡力將其談判降低到合理水平。但我想說這幾乎涵蓋了一些——你在 G&A 中看到的一些內容以及我希望繼續進行的內容。

The next question comes from Christopher Marinac with Janney Montgomery Scott.

下一個問題來自 Christopher Marinac 和 Janney Montgomery Scott。

Scott and Rick, can you talk about the EBITDA margin and kind of what's realistic in this environment? I know there is some noise and unique factors in Q4. But just thinking -- going forward, kind of how you see the business unfolding there.

斯科特和里克，你們能談談 EBITDA 利潤率以及在這種環境下什麼是現實的嗎？我知道第四季度有一些噪音和獨特因素。但只是想想 - 展望未來，你如何看待那裡的業務發展。

Yes. Thanks, Chris. I'll start, but Scott may be able to fill in some detail. First of all, where we sit in the fourth quarter, and I think you may have noted this in your note this morning, at, what are we, 26%, 27% EBITDA for the fourth quarter, is actually right in line with historical EBITDA for the company, if you go prior to some of our recent growth spurts. So we feel really good about that, considering the year and compared to some peers, even looks quite good.

是的。謝謝，克里斯。我會開始，但 Scott 可能會補充一些細節。首先，我們在第四季度的位置，我想你今天早上可能已經在你的筆記中註意到了這一點，我們是什麼，第四季度的 EBITDA 為 26%、27%，實際上與歷史一致公司的 EBITDA，如果你先於我們最近的一些增長突飛猛進的話。所以我們對此感覺非常好，考慮到這一年並與一些同行相比，甚至看起來相當不錯。

As I said a year ago, 2021, when we were hitting 32%, 33% EBITDA, that was really kind of historically high. In part, that was driven by performance fees, which we saw in multiple years. Leading up to that, obviously, last year was not a good year for performance fees. So you're kind of looking at the true business. So it's quite sustainable and will only look better as the markets recover.

正如我一年前所說，2021 年，當我們達到 32%、33% 的 EBITDA 時，這確實是歷史高位。在某種程度上，這是由我們多年來看到的績效費用推動的。在此之前，很明顯，去年對於績效費用來說並不是一個好年頭。所以你是在看真正的生意。所以它是相當可持續的，只會隨著市場復甦而變得更好。

There's another important point here, which I talked about in several calls, which is that we would be making investments in personnel and the strategy, intellectual capital to grow the company. We've done that. It was hidden a bit in our EBITDA margins because we were growing. So we were growing faster than we were even making those investments. Well, with the declining markets, they've become a little more obvious. They're paying off, but that sort of investment takes a long time to pay off in a business like ours, especially on the high net worth side.

這裡還有另一個重要的點，我在幾次電話中都談到了這一點，那就是我們將投資於人員和戰略，以及發展公司的智力資本。我們已經做到了。它在我們的 EBITDA 利潤率中隱藏了一點，因為我們在增長。因此，我們的增長速度甚至超過了進行這些投資的速度。好吧，隨著市場的下滑，它們變得更加明顯了。他們正在獲得回報，但這種投資需要很長時間才能在像我們這樣的企業中獲得回報，尤其是在高淨值方面。

We were also recognizing high performers and different strategies with increased compensation due to performance. A good example would be the growth team in Milwaukee I just mentioned. That's going to hit your EBITDA margin a little bit. It's money we're very happy to pay. So I view this as a very sustainable level. I view it as a good level. It's in line with history. It's very good compared to the competitors. And if we get performance fees or you see growth from some of those investments, I see increases from there. Anything to add to that, Scott?

我們還認可高績效者和不同的策略，並根據績效提高薪酬。一個很好的例子就是我剛才提到的密爾沃基的增長團隊。這會稍微影響您的 EBITDA 利潤率。這是我們很樂意支付的錢。所以我認為這是一個非常可持續的水平。我認為這是一個很好的水平。這是符合歷史的。與競爭對手相比，它非常好。如果我們獲得績效費用，或者您看到其中一些投資的增長，我會看到那裡的增長。斯科特，還有什麼要補充的嗎？

Yes. The only thing I'll add is the fourth quarter trend that you typically see with us is that we true up our compensation pools at the end of the year, and a lot of it is based on full year results. So that's why you saw -- you may see atypical margin levels, EBITDA margin levels in the fourth quarter. A year ago, our fourth quarter adjusted EBITDA margin was 38.5%, and then it was a little bit north of 15% fourth quarter of this year. So this all reflects what Rick said, investments in new staff that it takes time to develop their business in a year where revenue levels and markets were down. So just to provide that color that it's not unusual in the fourth quarter of each year for Silvercrest to see some movement in EBITDA and related margins.

是的。我唯一要補充的是，您通常會在我們這裡看到的第四季度趨勢是，我們在年底調整了我們的薪酬池，其中很多是基於全年業績。所以這就是為什麼你看到 - 你可能會看到非典型的利潤率水平，第四季度的 EBITDA 利潤率水平。一年前，我們第四季度調整後的 EBITDA 利潤率為 38.5%，然後略高於今年第四季度的 15%。因此，這一切都反映了 Rick 所說的，對新員工的投資，即在收入水平和市場下滑的一年裡，需要時間來發展他們的業務。因此，為了提供這種顏色，Silvercrest 在每年第四季度看到 EBITDA 和相關利潤率出現一些變化並不罕見。

Yes. I figured we'd get there as well. That's a great point. I would just add that even on compensation, which is the bulk of the true up, obviously, the performance fees that can help you with the upside, which happened last fourth quarter in 2021 and hurt us in 2022. There's the compensation adjustment. We're accruing at approximately 55% of revenue, and we went well below that because of the good year we had in 2021. 2022, we went above it. And then you kind of average it out, and you look at the long-term trends of this business, not even that long term, a year trend, not quarter over -- 1 year or quarter-over-quarter, but if you look at calendar year. So we're hanging right in there around 55% or just below, which we've done historically and managed very well.

是的。我想我們也會到達那裡。這是一個很好的觀點。我只想補充一點，即使是薪酬，這是真正上漲的大部分，顯然，績效費用可以幫助你實現上行，這發生在 2021 年最後一個第四季度，並在 2022 年傷害了我們。有薪酬調整。我們的收入大約佔收入的 55%，但由於 2021 年的表現不錯，我們遠低於這一水平。2022 年，我們超過了這一水平。然後你對它進行平均，然後你看看這個業務的長期趨勢，甚至不是那麼長期，一年的趨勢，而不是四分之一 - 一年或四分之一，但如果你看在日曆年。所以我們就掛在 55% 左右或略低於 55%，這是我們在歷史上所做的並且管理得很好。

And to Scott's point that he just made on the EBITDA margin, you may have hit the fourth quarter at 38% last year and more like 15% this year for the fourth quarter. When you average that, you're right at 27%, 26.5%, which is exactly where we would expect to sit. So I think you need to be careful about where we're -- what comparison period we're comparing here.

斯科特剛剛在 EBITDA 利潤率上提出的觀點是，你去年第四季度的利潤率可能達到 38%，而今年第四季度的利潤率可能達到 15%。當你平均時，你是正確的 27%，26.5%，這正是我們期望的位置。所以我認為你需要注意我們所處的位置——我們在這裡比較的比較時期。

No. That's all very helpful. I appreciate that. And then could you just continue a little bit down on the sort of the revenue side at the core from sort of the basis points you can charge? I know some of this gets influenced by mix as you continue to be successful in other parts of the business. But is there any additional pressure on fees in general compared to how you've managed this year-to-year?

不，這一切都非常有幫助。我很感激。然後你能不能從你可以收取的基點上繼續在核心收入方面稍微降低一點？我知道隨著您在業務的其他部分繼續取得成功，其中一些會受到組合的影響。但是，與您今年的管理方式相比，總體上是否存在額外的費用壓力？

No. I think it's more mix. As the institutional business grows and accelerates, including OCIO, which had a big -- which has increased nicely, you're going to have lower fees on discretionary assets. But that business, as you know, has a lot more leverage in it. So just looking at the fee basis, you've sort of missed the enhanced EBITDA margin that you get with those wins.

不，我認為它更混雜。隨著機構業務的增長和加速，包括 OCIO，它有一個很大的 - 增長很好，你將對可自由支配資產收取較低的費用。但是，如您所知，該業務在其中具有更大的影響力。所以只看費用基礎，你有點錯過了通過這些勝利獲得的提高的 EBITDA 利潤率。

The high net worth side of the business has been very, very steady from a fee basis. I pointed out in the past that the very largest high net worth clients have always asked for institutional pricing plus full service and have aggressively negotiated fees for years. At the very top end, they don't look that different from the institutional business. So as we've won more of the really large families, that has lowered the fee basis a bit as well. That's a high-class problem. I'd rather have that the aura and reputation of the firm really benefits from associating from that level of wealth.

從收費的角度來看，該業務的高淨值方面一直非常非常穩定。我過去曾指出，最大的高淨值客戶總是要求機構定價加上全方位服務，並且多年來一直在積極協商費用。在最高端，它們看起來與機構業務沒有什麼不同。因此，隨著我們贏得了更多真正的大家庭，這也降低了收費基礎。這是一個高級問題。我寧願公司的光環和聲譽真正受益於與這種財富水平的聯繫。

The institutional side, I would say, has been about the same pressure on fees that we've experienced in the past decade, nothing changing dramatically one way or the other. So there's noise in there, of course, depending where people allocate and when we get cash flows in and then where they go with their funds. But I don't discern a significant trend or I haven't noticed anything across the firm that's going to move around. But it's been pretty stable.

我要說的是，制度方面的費用壓力與我們在過去十年中所經歷的壓力大致相同，無論哪種方式都沒有發生顯著變化。所以那里當然有噪音，這取決於人們在哪里分配以及我們何時獲得現金流量以及他們的資金去向。但我沒有發現明顯的趨勢，或者我沒有註意到整個公司有任何變動。但是一直很穩定。

The next question comes from Chris Sakai with Singular Research.

下一個問題來自 Singular Research 的 Chris Sakai。

Can you talk about the acquisition environment? How are you seeing valuations out there?

能談談收購環境嗎？你如何看待那裡的估值？

Yes. So valuations have definitely come down a bit. I've observed a couple of things. Obviously, with the higher interest rate environment, for those who've had to reset debt and have highly levered balance sheets unlike Silvercrest, it's constrained their ability to continue rolling up and participating in very high -- in my view, very high pricing in the industry for some mediocre businesses. And the higher interest rate is just going to be a hurdle of that. So it's coming down a bit.

是的。所以估值肯定下降了一點。我觀察到了一些事情。顯然，在利率較高的環境下，對於那些不得不重新設置債務並擁有與 Silvercrest 不同的高槓桿資產負債表的人來說，這限制了他們繼續滾動和參與非常高的能力——在我看來，非常高的定價這個行業對於一些平庸的企業來說。而更高的利率只會成為一個障礙。所以它有點下降。

What I'm seeing more is much more careful scrutiny of deals and the terms of those deals and much more emphasis on how much AUM comes over with the deal and projecting the -- much more emphasis on earn-outs, et cetera. So you could view the restrictions in terms of the deal getting tighter as a form of price reduction as well. So yes, it's coming down a bit.

我看到的更多是對交易和這些交易的條款進行更仔細的審查，更多地強調交易帶來的資產管理規模和預測——更多地強調盈利等等。因此，您也可以將交易的限制視為一種降價形式。所以是的，它正在下降一點。

And I've also seen some players who had been very active kind of stepping out of the market. So that's an indicator potentially of where it's going. The number of deals has definitely come down substantially as well. So that's about all the color I can give. I haven't seen a lot else.

而且我還看到一些非常活躍的玩家退出了市場。所以這可能是它走向何方的一個指標。交易數量肯定也大幅下降。這就是我能給出的所有顏色。我還沒有看到很多其他的。

Okay. And then can you talk about what were the main drivers for client outflows this quarter?

好的。然後你能談談本季度客戶外流的主要驅動因素是什麼嗎？

Just normal expenses and life. There's always a leak in the bucket in this business. Some of the outflows were due to pension funds that may be winding down. And so you kind of see -- you see a drip out for that. Some of it's the normal high net worth living. This is why it's -- in this business, you've always got kind of 2 steps forward, 1 back. Obviously, early in the year, both in the third quarter and in the second quarter, we saw very large outflows primarily for taxes, right? There were some events that caused significant tax outflows. Outflows this quarter were pretty moderate. It wasn't unusual one way or the other. It's -- sometimes we have a little positive there. Very often, it's a low negative, which is what this quarter was. So can't give you much color beyond that.

只是正常的開支和生活。這個行業總是漏水。一些資金流出是由於養老基金可能正在縮減。所以你有點看到 - 你看到了一點點。其中一些是正常的高淨值生活。這就是為什麼——在這項業務中，你總是向前邁出兩步，向後邁出一步。顯然，今年年初，無論是在第三季度還是第二季度，我們都看到了主要用於稅收的大量資金流出，對吧？有些事件導致大量稅收外流。本季度的資金流出相當溫和。不管怎樣，這並不罕見。這是 - 有時我們在那裡有一點積極。通常，這是一個低負值，這就是本季度的情況。所以不能給你更多的顏色。

On the closed account basis, it was very low. In fact, it was quite low this entire year. It was one of the lowest years that we've had for closed accounts since 2017 and 2014. So we did really well on that basis in terms of the number of accounts that we've maintained or relationships we've maintained, one of our best years in the past 5. And since we're talking about flows, it was a very good new business, new relationship quarter at $220 million. It was certainly the best quarter of last year and the year as a whole for new relationships, regardless of some of the net in outflows. But for new relationships, it was actually better than 2017 or 2018 or 2019. 2019 looks a bit distorted because that was the year of the Cortina merger. If you take out acquired assets from that, the 2022 is actually better for new relationships than all of those years. So I would argue pretty solid, especially in the environment.

在封閉賬戶的基礎上，它非常低。事實上，這一整年都很低。這是自 2017 年和 2014 年以來我們關閉賬戶數量最少的年份之一。因此，就我們維持的賬戶數量或我們維持的關係而言，我們在這方面做得非常好，我們的其中一個過去 5 年最好的年份。由於我們談論的是流量，這是一個非常好的新業務、新關係季度，達到 2.2 億美元。對於新的關係來說，這無疑是去年和全年最好的一個季度，儘管有一些淨資金流出。但對於新的關係，它實際上比 2017 年或 2018 年或 2019 年要好。2019 年看起來有點扭曲，因為那是 Cortina 合併的一年。如果你從中剔除獲得的資產，2022 年實際上比所有那些年都更適合建立新的關係。所以我認為非常可靠，尤其是在環境方面。

The next question comes from Timothy Call with The Capital Management Corporation.

下一個問題來自 The Capital Management Corporation 的 Timothy Call。

Yes. That's The Capital Management Corporation. So your balance sheet is very clean. Your cash and receivables almost equal all of your liabilities combined. And with your cash being more than 10x your draw on your credit line, I was wondering why you're not interest income -- net interest income positive? I would have expected that versus rising net interest expense.

是的。那就是資本管理公司。所以你的資產負債表非常乾淨。您的現金和應收賬款幾乎等於您所有負債的總和。由於您的現金是您信用額度提款的 10 倍以上，我想知道為什麼您沒有利息收入——淨利息收入為正？我本以為這是與不斷上升的淨利息支出相對應的。

Yes. I mean, we do have some of our cash invested to get some yield on it. We don't typically tie up our cash too long when we have strategic initiatives and uses for the cash. We also do receive some meaningful, what I would call, income credits from our bank, which helps reduce any banking fees that we need for our transactions. But strategically, that is definitely something that we look at and we weigh based on our strategic needs for our cash.

是的。我的意思是，我們確實投資了一些現金以獲得一些收益。當我們有戰略計劃和現金用途時，我們通常不會將現金佔用太久。我們也確實從我們的銀行收到了一些有意義的，我稱之為收入信貸，這有助於減少我們交易所需的任何銀行費用。但從戰略上講，這絕對是我們關注的問題，我們根據我們對現金的戰略需求進行權衡。

Maybe putting half the cash in the money market would make you net interest income positive.

也許將一半的現金投入貨幣市場將使您的淨利息收入為正。

Yes. Thank you.

是的。謝謝。

It looks great, good balance sheet. And can you comment on when you -- what factors go in your decision-making for -- when you buy back stock?

看起來不錯，資產負債表不錯。當你回購股票時，你能評論一下你的決策中考慮了哪些因素嗎？

Yes. I've talked about this a bit in the past. Appreciate the question. It's primarily weighing the discussions that we're having in the marketplace and opportunities where significant cash may be needed against our ability or desire to purchase one of the highest quality asset managers we can, which would be ourselves. You never know when one of those things are going to hit, and I think the acquisition we made in 2019 when we joined forces with Cortina is a great example. That was a good, prolonged discussion. It takes us a while to get to know teams that we want to join with. The cultural aspect is very important. So we're very careful about those conversations. And it was the biggest merger in our history and required significant cash for us to step up and do all of a sudden.

是的。我過去談過這個。感謝這個問題。它主要權衡我們在市場上進行的討論以及可能需要大量現金的機會與我們購買我們能夠購買的最優質資產管理公司之一的能力或願望，這將是我們自己。你永遠不知道這些事情什麼時候會發生，我認為我們在 2019 年與 Cortina 聯手時進行的收購就是一個很好的例子。那是一次很好的、長時間的討論。我們需要一段時間才能了解我們想要加入的團隊。文化方面非常重要。所以我們對這些談話非常小心。這是我們歷史上最大的一次合併，需要大量現金才能讓我們突然挺身而出。

And so keeping some of that powder dry is a big reason that we're -- that we weigh against. As you know, it's also not always easy to buy the stock back that we'd like to. We put quite a bit to work last year. We've still got more to go as we've revealed in this latest filing. I think, Scott, we've got another $5 million.

因此，保持一些粉末乾燥是我們反對的一個重要原因。如您所知，回購我們想要的股票也並不總是那麼容易。去年我們投入了很多工作。正如我們在最新的文件中透露的那樣，我們還有更多工作要做。我想，斯科特，我們還有 500 萬美元。

Yes. About $5.7 million.

是的。大約 570 萬美元。

$5.7 million or so in potential buybacks. And as everyone knows, we've been transparent about it. We've been active in the market. As we work through that, we will again reassess what we might do on that front for the reasons I stated.

570 萬美元左右的潛在回購。眾所周知，我們對此一直保持透明。我們一直活躍在市場上。當我們解決這個問題時，我們將再次重新評估我們在這方面可能會做些什麼，原因我已經說過了。

(Operator Instructions) This concludes our question-and-answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Rick Hough for any closing remarks.

（操作員說明）我們的問答環節到此結束。我想將會議轉回 Rick Hough 的閉幕詞。

Great. Thank you so much for joining us for both the fourth quarter and year-end '22 results. It's nice to have a little reprieve in the fourth quarter and continuing on the first quarter this year. I feel quite good about the margins and control of expenses that we were able to maintain throughout 2022, while we also returned very good performance and built our pipelines. Notable was progress in our OCIO business, as I mentioned, and the opportunities we have elsewhere. It was a nice reversal to see and I think really important to keep into context what we've been able to do year-over-year, calendar year-over-calendar year and not just quarter-to-quarter or a distorted quarter compared to another quarter.

偉大的。非常感謝您加入我們的第四季度和年終 '22 結果。很高興在第四季度稍作緩刑，並在今年第一季度繼續。我對我們在整個 2022 年能夠保持的利潤率和費用控制感到非常滿意，同時我們也獲得了非常好的業績並建立了我們的管道。正如我提到的，值得注意的是我們 OCIO 業務的進展，以及我們在其他地方的機會。這是一個很好的逆轉，我認為非常重要的是要了解我們能夠逐年、逐年、逐年完成的工作，而不僅僅是季度與季度或扭曲的季度比較到另一個季度。

Feel free to reach out to us at any time. Look forward to talking to you at the end of the next quarter. Thank you so much for joining us.

請隨時與我們聯繫。期待在下個季度末與您交談。非常感謝您加入我們。

The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

會議現已結束。感謝您參加今天的演講。您現在可以斷開連接。