Safehold Inc (SAFE) 2026 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, welcome to Safehold’s first quarter earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, today’s conference is being recorded.

下午好，歡迎參加 Safehold 第一季財報電話會議。(接線員指示) 提醒各位，今天的會議將被錄音。

At this time, for opening remarks and introductions, I would like to turn the conference over to Pearse Hoffmann, Senior Vice President of Capital Markets and Investor Relations. Please go ahead, sir.

此刻，為了開場致詞與介紹，我想把會議交給資本市場與投資人關係資深副總裁 Pearse Hoffmann。先生，請開始。

Good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining us today for Safehold’s earnings call. On the call, we have Jay Sugarman, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; Michael Trachtenberg, President; Brett Asnas, Chief Financial Officer; and Steve Wylder, Executive Vice President, Head of Investments.

各位下午好。感謝各位今天加入 Safehold 的財報電話會議。今天與會者包括：董事長兼執行長 Jay Sugarman；總裁 Michael Trachtenberg；財務長 Brett Asnas；以及投資主管、執行副總裁 Steve Wylder。

This afternoon, we plan to walk through a presentation that details our first quarter results. The presentation can be found on our website at safeholdinc.com by clicking on the Investors link. There will be a replay of this conference call beginning at 8 PM Eastern Time today. The dial-in for the replay is 877-481-4010 with a confirmation code of 53936. In order to accommodate all those who wanted to ask questions, we ask the participants limit themselves to two questions during Q&A. If you’d like to ask additional questions, you may re-enter the queue.

今天下午，我們將帶各位逐頁說明一份簡報，內容詳述我們第一季的業績表現。本次電話會議的重播將於今日美東時間晚上 8 點開始提供。重播撥入電話為 877-481-4010，確認碼為 53936。為了讓所有想提問的人都有機會，我們請與會者在問答環節每人最多提兩個問題。若您想提出額外問題，可重新排隊。

Before I turn the call over to Jay, I’d like to remind everyone that statements in this earnings call which are not historical facts may be forward-looking. Our actual results may differ materially from these forward-looking statements, and the risk factors that could cause these differences are detailed in our SEC reports. Safehold disclaims any intent or obligation to update these forward-looking statements except as expressly required by law.

在我把電話交給 Jay 之前，我想提醒各位，本次財報電話會議中非歷史事實的陳述可能屬於前瞻性陳述。我們的實際結果可能與這些前瞻性陳述存在重大差異，而可能導致差異的風險因素已在我們的 SEC 報告中詳述。除非法律明確要求，Safehold 不承擔更新這些前瞻性陳述的任何意圖或義務。

Now with that, I’d like to turn it over to Chairman and CEO, Jay Sugarman. Jay?

那麼，現在我想把電話交給董事長兼執行長 Jay Sugarman。Jay？

Thanks, Pearse, and appreciate everyone joining us today. We’re three years into building a standalone Safehold and nine years into building the new modern ground lease Business. In ground lease time frames, we’re still in the early innings. We continue to learn and refine the business model to gain scale and unlock the full value of the business.

謝謝你，Pearse，也感謝各位今天加入我們。我們建立獨立運作的 Safehold 已經三年，而打造全新、現代化的地租（ground lease）業務已經九年。以地租的時間尺度來看，我們仍處於早期階段。我們持續學習並精進商業模式，以擴大規模並釋放業務的全部價值。

Multifamily and its variations have proven to be the core of the business, and we are leaning hard into meeting our customers’ needs with new products and increased outreach. We like the long-term dynamics in the sector and will continue to innovate to penetrate a larger slice of this market.

多戶住宅（multifamily）及其各種變體已被證明是我們業務的核心，我們正積極投入，透過新產品與更廣泛的觸達來滿足客戶需求。我們看好多戶住宅板塊的長期動態，並將持續創新，以滲透並取得更大份額的市場。

One of our key goals in our multifamily push is to expand our success in the affordable multifamily sector beyond the California market, and we’ve begun to see some progress on that front with our first non-California deal closing this quarter and others in the pipeline.

在推進多戶住宅業務的過程中，我們的一個關鍵目標，是將我們在平價多戶住宅（affordable multifamily）領域的成功從加州市場擴展到加州以外；本季我們已在這方面看到一些進展，完成了首筆非加州交易，且另有多筆交易正在洽談中。

We also have a developing situation at our 50th Street asset. As many of you know, new property tax incentives in New York City have made older office buildings candidates for conversion to multifamily. Our tenant approached us seeking permission for a potential conversion as required by our lease, with pro formas indicating multifamily conversion could generate significantly higher ground rent coverage versus office. We provided a framework for preliminary approval subject to certain conditions, including the tenant complying with their obligations under our lease.

此外，我們在第 50 街資產上也有一項正在發展的情況。如各位所知，紐約市新的房產稅優惠措施，使得較老的辦公大樓成為改建為多戶住宅的候選標的。依照我們租約的要求，我們的承租人向我們提出申請，尋求對潛在改建的許可；其財務預測（pro formas）顯示，相較於辦公用途，多戶住宅改建可帶來顯著更高的地租覆蓋倍數。我們提供了一個初步核准的框架，但需符合若干條件，包括承租人必須遵守其在租約下的義務。

While to date fixed ground rent has been paid, the tenant has repeatedly failed to pay property taxes as required under the ground lease. If we’re unable to reach a resolution, which starts with the tenant unconditionally paying the required taxes, we will be forced to exercise our rights under the lease. We’ll share more details depending on the tenant’s course of action but feel comfortable with our position and recent valuation work from our third-party valuation consultants.

截至目前，固定地租已按時支付，但承租人一再未依地租契約要求繳納房產稅。若我們無法達成解決方案，而解決方案的起點是承租人無條件支付所需稅款，我們將被迫行使租約下的權利。我們將視承租人的行動路徑分享更多細節；但基於我們的立場以及第三方估值顧問近期的估值工作，我們對自身處境感到有信心。

The new 467-m tax incentive program has the potential to add important value to the conversion, but the value of these incentives is negatively impacted the longer it takes to get the conversion underway. So time is of the essence.

新的 467-m 稅務優惠計畫有潛力為改建帶來重要增值，但改建啟動得越晚，這些優惠的價值就越會受到負面影響。因此，時間至關重要。

Lastly, another key goal for this year is to address the value gap we see in our share price. With Michael and Steve finding good risk reward on the new deal front and UCA values starting to move up again, we began a buyback program at the tail end of last quarter to take advantage of the under-pricing in our stock. We look forward to highlighting the value in our portfolio and to demonstrating why new ground lease originations at today’s levels can add significant value to shareholders’ long-term returns.

最後，今年另一個關鍵目標是縮小我們在股價上看到的價值落差。在 Michael 與 Steve 於新案源端找到良好的風險報酬機會、且 UCA 價值再次開始上升之際，我們在上一季末啟動了庫藏股回購計畫，以把握我們認為市場對本公司股票的低估。我們期待凸顯投資組合的價值，並說明為何在當前水準進行新的地租案源開發，能為股東的長期報酬帶來顯著增值。

With that, I’d like to turn it over to Michael and Brett to recap the quarter and take you through the details. Michael?

接下來，我想把電話交給 Michael 和 Brett，請他們回顧本季並帶各位深入了解細節。Michael？

Thank you, Jay, and good afternoon, everyone. Let’s begin on slide 2. In the first quarter, we closed four transactions, including three ground leases and one leasehold loan, for an aggregate commitment of $68 million. Credit metrics for these originations are in line with our portfolio targets with a GLTV of 40%, underwritten rent coverage of 2.9 times, and an economic yield of 7.2%.

謝謝你，Jay，各位下午好。我們從投影片第 2 頁開始。第一季我們完成四筆交易，包括三筆地租與一筆租賃權貸款（leasehold loan），合計承諾金額為 6,800 萬美元。這些案源的信用指標符合我們投資組合目標：GLTV 為 40%，承作的租金覆蓋倍數為 2.9 倍，經濟殖利率為 7.2%。

Two of the ground leases were market rate multifamily assets, and one was an affordable housing asset in Austin, Texas, which represents our twentieth LIHTC closing in just over two years and our first outside of California. We’re excited to enter Texas, which is the second-largest LIHTC market in the country, and to be transacting with a high-quality sponsor.

其中兩筆地租為市價多戶住宅資產，另一筆為德州奧斯汀的平價住宅資產；這是我們在兩年多內完成的第 20 筆 LIHTC 成交，也是我們在加州以外的首筆交易。我們很高興進入德州——這是全美第二大的 LIHTC 市場——並與高品質的贊助商進行交易。

Our pipeline remains active with approximately $255 million of non-binding LOIs signed to what we believe are very attractive risk-adjusted returns. We anticipate most of these transactions will close in the next one to two quarters, though there can be no assurances that they close at all.

我們的案源管線仍然活躍，目前約有 2.55 億美元的非約束性意向書（LOI）已簽署，我們認為其風險調整後報酬相當具吸引力。我們預期其中多數交易將在未來一到兩季完成交割，但無法保證一定會完成交割。

At quarter end, the total portfolio was $7.1 billion, and UCA was estimated at $9.5 billion, which is more than a $200 million increase from last quarter. That increase was driven by both external growth from new investments and improving appraisal values on the existing portfolio. GLTV was 51% and rent coverage was 3.4 times. We ended the quarter with approximately $1.1 billion of liquidity, which is further supported by the potential available capacity in our joint venture.

截至季末，投資組合總額為 71 億美元，UCA 估計為 95 億美元，較上季增加超過 2 億美元。該增幅來自兩方面：新投資帶來的外部成長，以及既有投資組合估值的改善。GLTV 為 51%，租金覆蓋倍數為 3.4 倍。季末我們約有 11 億美元的流動性，且合資企業中潛在可用額度亦提供進一步支撐。

Slide 3 provides a snapshot of our portfolio growth. In the first quarter, we funded a total of $85 million, including $50 million of ground lease fundings on new originations that have a 7.2% economic yield, $18 million of ground lease fundings on pre-existing commitments that have a 6.6% economic yield, and $17 million of leasehold loans that yield SOFR plus 238 basis points.

投影片第 3 頁提供了我們投資組合成長的概覽。第一季我們合計撥款 8,500 萬美元，其中包括：5,000 萬美元用於新案源的地租撥款（經濟殖利率 7.2%）、1,800 萬美元用於既有承諾的地租撥款（經濟殖利率 6.6%），以及 1,700 萬美元的租賃權貸款，其收益率為 SOFR 加 238 個基點。

Our ground lease portfolio has 165 assets and has grown 21 times by book value since our IPO, while estimated unrealized capital appreciation has grown 22 times. We have 104 multifamily ground leases in the portfolio and have increased our exposure from 8% by count at IPO to 63% today.

我們的地租（ground lease）投資組合共有165項資產，自IPO以來按帳面價值計已成長21倍，而估計的未實現資本增值已成長22倍。我們的投資組合中有104筆多戶住宅地租，且我們的曝險占比已由IPO時按筆數計的8%提升至目前的63%。

In total, the unrealized capital appreciation portfolio is comprised of approximately 37.6 million square feet of institutional quality commercial real estate, consisting of approximately 23,000 multifamily units, 12.6 million square feet of office, over 4,000 hotel keys, and 2 million square feet of life science and other property types.

整體而言，未實現資本增值投資組合由約3,760萬平方英尺的機構級商用不動產所構成，包括約23,000戶多戶住宅單位、1,260萬平方英尺的辦公室、超過4,000間飯店客房，以及200萬平方英尺的生命科學與其他物業類型。

And with that, let me turn it over to Brett to go through the financials.

接下來，我把時間交給Brett來說明財務表現。

Thank you, Michael. Continuing on slide 4, let me detail our quarterly earnings results. For the first quarter, GAAP revenue was $110.9 million, net income was $28.9 million, and earnings per share was $0.40. The year-over-year decrease in net income was primarily driven by two Park Hotels assets transitioning from a ground lease to fee simple ownership. Replacing ground rent with hotel operations decreased net income approximately $3.5 million, or $0.05, which was in line with our internal forecasts.

謝謝你，Michael。接續第4頁投影片，我來說明我們的季度盈餘結果。第一季，GAAP營收為1.109億美元，淨利為2,890萬美元，每股盈餘為0.40美元。淨利年減主要是因兩項Park Hotels資產由地租轉為完全所有權（fee simple ownership）。以飯店營運取代地租收入使淨利減少約350萬美元，或每股0.05美元，與我們內部預測一致。

There is seasonality in these figures, and we expect hotel performance to improve in the coming months, as Q2 and Q3 have historically been more profitable than Q1 and Q4. Additional financial detail and reconciliation on these assets can be found on page 13 of the deck.

這些數據具有季節性，我們預期未來幾個月飯店表現將改善，因為歷史上第二季與第三季的獲利通常高於第一季與第四季。關於這些資產的更多財務細節與調節資訊，請見簡報第13頁。

On slide 5, we detail our portfolio’s yields. For GAAP earnings, the portfolio currently earns a 3.8% cash yield and a 5.5% annualized yield. Annualized yield includes non-cash adjustments within rent, depreciation, and amortization, which is primarily from accounting methodology on IPO assets, but excludes all future contractual variable rent, such as fair market value resets, percentage rent, or CPI-based escalators, which are all significant economic drivers.

在第5頁投影片，我們說明投資組合的收益率。以GAAP盈餘口徑，目前投資組合的現金收益率為3.8%，年化收益率為5.5%。年化收益率包含租金、折舊與攤銷中的非現金調整，主要源自IPO資產的會計處理方法，但不包含所有未來合約約定的變動租金，例如公允市價重設、百分比租金或CPI連動調升，這些皆為重要的經濟驅動因素。

On an economic basis, the portfolio generates a 6.0% economic yield, which is an IRR-based calculation that conforms with how we’ve underwritten these investments. This economic yield has additional upside, including periodic CPI look-backs, which we have in 81% of our ground leases. Using the Federal Reserve’s current long-term breakeven inflation rate of 2.22%, the 6.0% economic yield increases to a 6.2% inflation-adjusted yield.

以經濟口徑計，投資組合產生6.0%的經濟收益率，這是以IRR為基礎的計算方式，與我們承作這些投資時的評估方法一致。此經濟收益率仍有額外上行空間，包括定期CPI回溯調整（look-backs），我們在81%的地租合約中設有此機制。以聯準會目前長期損益兩平通膨率（breakeven inflation rate）2.22%計算，6.0%的經濟收益率提高至6.2%的通膨調整後收益率。

That 6.2% inflation-adjusted yield then increases to 7.4% after layering in an estimate for unrealized capital appreciation using Safehold’s 84% ownership interest in Caret at management’s most recent estimated valuation. We believe unrealized capital appreciation in our assets to be a significant source of value for the company that remains largely unrecognized by the market today.

接著，在納入以Safehold對Caret之84%持股、並以管理層最近估值所推估的未實現資本增值後，6.2%的通膨調整後收益率進一步提高至7.4%。我們認為資產的未實現資本增值是公司重要的價值來源，但目前市場仍大多未予以反映。

Turning to slide 6, we highlight the diversification of our portfolio by location and underlying property type. Our top 10 markets by gross book value are called out on the right, representing approximately 65% of the portfolio. We include key metrics such as rent coverage and GLTV for each of these markets, and we have additional detail at the bottom of the page by region and property type. Portfolio GLTV, which is based on annual asset appraisals from CBRE, decreased quarter over quarter to 51%, and rent coverage on the portfolio was unchanged at 3.4 times.

轉到第6頁投影片，我們強調投資組合在地理位置與底層物業類型上的分散性。右側列出按總帳面價值計的前十大市場，約占投資組合的65%。我們提供各市場的關鍵指標，例如租金覆蓋倍數（rent coverage）與GLTV，並在頁面底部按區域與物業類型提供更多細節。投資組合GLTV（基於CBRE的年度資產估值）較上季下降至51%，而投資組合的租金覆蓋倍數維持不變，為3.4倍。

Lastly, on slide 7, we provide an overview of our capital structure. At quarter end, we had approximately $5.0 billion of debt, comprised of $2.6 billion of unsecured debt, $1.3 billion of non-recourse secured debt, $890 million drawn on our unsecured revolver, and $270 million of our pro-rata share of debt on ground leases which we own in joint ventures. Our weighted average debt maturity is approximately 18 years, with no significant maturities due until 2029. At quarter end, we had approximately $1.1 billion of cash and credit facility availability.

最後，在第7頁投影片，我們概述資本結構。截至季末，我們約有50億美元的債務，包括26億美元的無擔保債務、13億美元的無追索權擔保債務、無擔保循環信貸（revolver）已動用8.90億美元，以及我們在合資企業中所持有地租資產之按比例分攤債務2.70億美元。我們的加權平均債務到期年限約為18年，且在2029年前沒有重大到期項目。截至季末，我們約有11億美元的現金與信貸額度可用額度。

We are rated A3 by Moody’s, A- by S&P, and A- by Fitch, all with stable outlook. We are well hedged for both the short and long term. Our limited floating rate borrowings are protected by a $500 million SOFR Swap locked at 3% through April 2028, which is paid current on a monthly basis.

我們的信用評等為穆迪A3、標普A-、惠譽A-，展望皆為穩定。我們在短期與長期方面皆有良好的避險配置。我們有限的浮動利率借款已透過一筆5億美元、SOFR交換（Swap）鎖定3%利率至2028年4月來加以保護，並按月以現金結算。

We have an additional $250 million of long-term Treasury Locks at a weighted average rate of 4.0% and current gain position of approximately $33 million. We recognize the value of our Treasury Locks on the balance sheet, but not yet on the P&L. We continue to believe our stock is undervalued and have been repurchasing shares since the end of March. In Q1, we utilized approximately $3.4 million for share repurchases at an average share price of $14.39.

我們另有2.50億美元的長期美國公債利率鎖定（Treasury Locks），加權平均利率為4.0%，目前未實現收益部位約為3,300萬美元。我們在資產負債表上認列這些Treasury Locks的價值，但尚未在損益表（P&L）中反映。我們持續認為公司股價被低估，並自3月底以來持續回購股份。第一季，我們用於股份回購的金額約為340萬美元，平均回購股價為14.39美元。

We are levered 2.04 times on a total debt to equity basis. The effective interest rate on permanent debt is 4.2%, and the portfolio’s cash interest rate on permanent debt is 3.9%. So to conclude, originations are trending up, UCA is trending up, and our balance sheet is well positioned to support new business.

以總債務對股東權益計算，我們的槓桿倍數為2.04倍。永久性債務（permanent debt）的有效利率為4.2%，而投資組合在永久性債務上的現金利息利率為3.9%。總結而言，承作量（originations）呈上升趨勢，UCA呈上升趨勢，而我們的資產負債表也具備良好條件以支持新業務。

And with that, let me turn it back to Jay.

接下來，我把時間交回給Jay。

Thanks, Brett. Let's go ahead and open it up for questions.

謝謝，Brett。我們現在開始進行問答。

(Operator Instructions)

（接線員指示）

Mitch Germain, Citizens Bank.

Mitch Germain，Citizens Bank。

Thank you, guys. What’s the difference -- or maybe what was the challenge in getting affordable transaction done outside of California?

謝謝各位。在加州以外完成可負擔住宅交易的差異是什麼——或者說，挑戰是什麼？

Yeah. Hi, Mitch. So Steve Wylder. A couple things. Part is general awareness, right? Spending time to build profile in that market with the subset of developers, equity sources, debt sources, historically are less familiar with our structure and our kind of gap funding abilities.

是的。嗨，Mitch。我是Steve Wylder。有幾個因素。其中一部分是整體認知度，對吧？我們需要花時間在該市場、在特定開發商、股權資金來源與債務資金來源之間建立能見度；他們過去對我們的架構以及我們提供缺口資金（gap funding）的能力較不熟悉。

The piece we’ve been spending time on and are really excited to kind of get past is the regulatory regime and just the nature of affordable transactions and how they work in the Texas market. So we’re happy to establish a precedent there.

我們一直投入時間、也很期待能夠跨過的部分，是監管制度，以及可負擔住宅交易的本質與其在德州市場的運作方式。因此，我們很高興能在那裡建立一個先例。

California’s going to continue to be a focus just given the size and importance of that market and the supply-demand imbalance that we see. Texas, now that we’ve figured out the regulatory regime and we’re starting to build some profile, is going to be an important market for us. We like the outsized population growth.

鑑於加州市場的規模與重要性，以及我們所看到的供需失衡，加州仍將是我們的重點。德州方面，既然我們已釐清監管制度並開始建立能見度，將會成為我們的重要市場。我們看好其顯著的人口成長。

The long-term demand for housing plays in really nicely with the way we think about the investments that we’re making, and with a large base of active developers in that market and frankly, a limited amount of subsidy dollars to help bridge gaps, we think, our solution’s going to be well received. So we’re excited to get one on the board. It’s going to be continued to be an area of focus for us, and we’re already seeing new customer engagement, which is exciting.

住房的長期需求與我們對所進行投資的思考方式非常契合；而且該市場有龐大的活躍開發商基礎，坦白說，用於彌補缺口的補貼資金也相當有限，因此我們認為，我們的解決方案將會受到良好接受。所以我們很期待能把其中一筆放到董事會上。這將持續是我們的重點領域，而且我們已經看到新的客戶互動，這令人振奮。

Thanks, Steve. And then last one from me. 50th Street. Just remind me of the history there. That was an asset that was acquired out of auction, I believe, right? So the current owner was a new relationship relative to when you made the initial investment. Can you just maybe provide some history and context there?

謝謝你，Steve。接著我最後一個問題：50th Street。請再提醒我那邊的歷史背景。我記得那是一項透過拍賣取得的資產，對吧？所以相較於你們最初投資時，現任所有人算是一段新的合作關係。你能否提供一些歷史與背景脈絡？

Sure. You’re right. The original sponsor there was a large institutional offshore bank. They put it up for auction, received a bid from a tenant that we did not know. And they have approached us on a conversion, but they don’t have any background in that particular in this particular market or in that particular expertise. So that’s where we are today.

當然。你說得沒錯。那邊最初的贊助方是一家大型的境外機構銀行。他們把資產拿去拍賣，收到了一個我們不認識的承租人所提出的出價。他們曾就轉換事宜與我們接洽，但他們在這個市場沒有相關背景，也不具備該領域的專業能力。所以我們目前的情況就是如此。

Anthony Paolone, JP Morgan.

Anthony Paolone，摩根大通。

Thank you. My first question relates to just capital allocation with some of these LOIs here you have -- that you’ve teed up. But you’ve also intimated that maybe you’re able to keep buying back some stock. And I know you’ve got some JV capital available to you. But just how are you thinking about where capital sources may be if your stock’s down at these levels for an extended period of time?

謝謝。我的第一個問題是關於資本配置：你們這裡已經準備了一些LOI（意向書）。但你們也暗示也許還能繼續回購一些股票。我知道你們也有一些可用的合資（JV）資金。不過，如果你們的股價在這些水準下維持一段較長時間，你們對資金來源的規劃是怎麼想的？

Hey, Anthony. It’s Brett. It’s a great question. We’re constantly thinking about how to allocate capital in the best manner. There’s a few areas in which we’re looking at. Number one is, as you point out, the pipeline is, continues to be there. We keep replenishing it with new deals as we close deals each quarter.

嗨，Anthony。我是Brett。這個問題很好。我們一直在思考如何以最佳方式配置資本。我們目前主要從幾個面向來看。第一，如你所指出的，我們的案源管線仍然存在，而且持續有新案補充。我們每季完成交易的同時，也會補進新的交易。

Right now the number’s $255 million, as outlined in our deck. We feel good about those deals over the coming quarters. The funding profile on them will take some time, right? Not all of them are stabilized deals. Some of them fund over time, call it over the next 12 to18 months, and thus, we have some runway. So we’re looking at the outlay that we have over the coming quarters and thinking about that in the context of what’s drawn on a revolver and how our leverage is. So right now we’re at 2 times debt to equity.

目前這個數字是2.55億美元，如我們簡報所列。我們對未來幾季這些交易很有信心。它們的資金撥付節奏需要一些時間，對吧？並非全部都是已穩定（stabilized）的交易。其中一些會隨時間分期撥付，大概在未來12到18個月，因此我們有一些緩衝期。所以我們會看未來幾季的資金支出，並在此脈絡下評估循環信貸（revolver）的動用情況以及我們的槓桿水準。目前我們的負債對股權比率是2倍。

I think I mentioned on last earnings call, it takes every $240 million of fundings on deals to tick leverage up by 0.1 times. So it gives us some good runway. Similarly to your question on repurchases, if we utilize the entire authorization at the moment, the $50 million, that would take leverage up by less than 0.1 times.

我想我在上次財報電話會議提過，每投入約2.4億美元用於交易撥款，槓桿就會上升0.1倍。因此這給了我們不錯的緩衝空間。同樣回到你關於回購的問題，如果我們此刻把5,000萬美元的整體授權額度全部用完，槓桿上升也會不到0.1倍。

So again, when we think about how much outlay there is for those capital outlays in those different forms, we feel like we have some room. And we want the story to be the -- about the good deals that Steve was mentioning across affordable, across entering new markets, achieving some great pricing, and accretion to the book here. And once we do more of that, I think the story will resonate with more folks, and hopefully, all those pieces of the puzzle come together.

所以再一次，當我們思考這些不同形式的資本支出規模時，我們覺得仍有一些空間。我們希望市場關注的重點是Steve提到的那些好交易：涵蓋可負擔住宅、進入新市場、取得很好的定價，以及對帳面價值的增益（accretion）。當我們做出更多這類成果後，我認為這個故事會引起更多人的共鳴，也希望所有拼圖能夠逐步拼在一起。

Okay. Got it. And then second question, just on the hotels. What kind of update can you give us there in terms of where I think the legal matter might sit, and also just looking at now you recognizing hotel revenue and expenses, like should we expect that to continue for a while or is there anything to be done with those at some point here?ygdxyju77777777777777hh//

好的。了解。第二個問題是關於飯店。你能否更新一下目前法律事項大概進展到哪裡？另外，現在你們開始認列飯店收入與費用，我們是否應預期這種情況會持續一段時間，或是之後某個時間點會對這些資產採取一些處置或其他作法？ygdxyju77777777777777hh//

Yeah. We’ve got a trial date coming up early next year. So unless there’s a resolution beforehand, that’s kind of the timeline it’s tracking on.

是的。我們的審判日期排在明年年初。所以除非在此之前達成和解或解決方案，時間表大致就是朝這個方向推進。

Okay. It just stays kind of where it is in terms of watching the hotel revenue and expense just kind of flow in as they operate at this point?

好的。也就是說，就目前而言，飯店收入與費用就維持現狀，隨著它們營運而持續流入、流出？

Yeah. There’s some seasonality, but we’ll see. Unfortunately, the new line items will have to continue with those for a little bit here.

對。會有一些季節性，但我們再觀察。不幸的是，這些新的損益科目還得再持續一段時間。

Yeah. Tony, I think you’ve seen it show up now, the two assets that we owned fee simple. As I mentioned in my remarks, the first quarter is -- the change year over year was $3.5 million. But if you were looking out over the course of the remainder of the year, call it April through December, we expect that to be relatively break even for the remainder of the year, which is pretty consistent with the guidance or the forecast that we gave last quarter. So it’s tracking but wanted to be clear about Q1’s results versus what the expectation would be over the course of the remainder of the year.

對，Tony，我想你現在已經看到它反映出來了：我們以完全所有權（fee simple）持有的兩項資產。如我在發言中提到的，第一季同比變動是350萬美元。但如果你看今年剩餘期間，大概從4月到12月，我們預期今年其餘時間大致會接近損益兩平，這與我們上季提供的指引或預測相當一致。所以目前進度符合預期，但我想釐清第一季的結果與今年其餘期間的預期之間的差異。

Harsh Hemnani, Green Streets.

Harsh Hemnani，Green Street。

So If I understood correctly, I think the presentation laid out the rationale for the share buybacks, and it was that you were able to repurchase stock at a roughly 60% discount to book value. Could you maybe help me understand why you think that discount to book value is the right benchmark, given your book value has ground leases that were acquired at yields in the mid-3s on a going and cash basis? So maybe help me understand the thought process there.

如果我理解正確，我想簡報說明了回購的理由：你們能以相對於帳面價值約六折的折價回購股票。但鑑於你們的帳面價值包含地租（ground leases），而這些地租是以約3%中段的收益率在持有中（going-in）與現金基礎下取得的，你能否幫我理解為什麼你們認為「相對帳面價值的折價」是合適的衡量基準？也請說明一下你們的思考邏輯。

No, Harsh, we really look at the go forward opportunity and returns to an investor, whether it’s us or whether it’s any shareholder buying stock. We think it’s quite attractive right now. We can walk you through some of the dynamics from a levered ROE basis and the growth profile of the underlying assets, both contractually and with the CPI. CPI continues to be running much hotter than the assumptions we use in some of our public filings and in the earnings.

不，Harsh，我們真正看的，是對投資人未來的機會與報酬，不論是我們自己，或是任何買進股票的股東。我們認為目前相當具吸引力。我們可以從槓桿後股東權益報酬率（levered ROE）的角度，帶你走過一些動態，以及標的資產的成長輪廓——包括合約性成長與隨CPI調整的部分。CPI目前持續遠高於我們在部分公開申報文件與財報中所採用的假設。

So there’s quite a bit of upside optionality. There’s some very specific ROE dynamics that we think are really attractive right now with the stock trading at that discount to book. It is a good use of funds. But we have dual mandates here. One is to create value and in the form of capital structure, but the other is to create value in the form of new customers and lifetime value of those customers. So we’re going to try to do both as prudently and judiciously as we can.

所以這裡有相當大的上行選擇權。我們認為，在股價以低於帳面價值的折價交易之際，存在一些非常具體、且目前相當吸引人的 ROE 動態。這是資金的良好運用。但我們在這裡有雙重使命。一個是透過資本結構的方式創造價值，但另一個是透過新客戶以及這些客戶的終身價值來創造價值。因此，我們會盡可能以審慎且明智的方式同時做到這兩點。

Great --

很好。--

I'll be happy to walk you through it offline.

我很樂意私下帶你逐步看一遍。

Okay. And then in comparing those to the creating long-term value with new customer relationships and adding to new ground leases versus repurchasing shares, how are you thinking about what’s more attractive today? Would it be fair to assume that you’re thinking buying back shares is more attractive given the buyback move, especially given it came with, I guess, leverage now slightly above your target? Or how are you weighing those two?

好的。那麼，把這些與透過新客戶關係創造長期價值、以及新增新的地租（ground lease）交易，相較於回購股票，你們如何思考今天哪個更具吸引力？是否可以合理推論，鑑於你們啟動回購、而且我想目前槓桿也略高於你們的目標，你們認為回購更具吸引力？或者你們如何在這兩者之間權衡？

Yeah. Look, I think, these are relatively small dollars at this point compared to the balance sheet size. So it really is a both at this time. Obviously, if we want to go deeper and harder into something, we may have to make a harder trade-off, but we don’t feel that right now, that kind of pressure.

是的。你看，我認為就目前而言，這些金額相對於資產負債表規模都算比較小。所以此刻確實是兩者並行。當然，如果我們想在某一項上投入得更深、更用力，我們可能就必須做出更艱難的取捨，但我們現在並不覺得有那種壓力。

Again, I think the economics on new transactions look really favorable to us. But with the stock trading where it is, we also think you can create some very attractive dynamics off the existing book by just investing in the stock.

再說一次，我認為新交易的經濟性對我們來說看起來非常有利。但在目前股價所處的位置下，我們也認為只要投資自家股票，就能在既有資產組合上創造一些非常吸引人的動態。

So they’re different. They’re slightly different. We don’t line them up exactly A versus B, the way I’m thinking you might be thinking we are. We’re looking at some of the growth dynamics, some of the customer dynamics, trying to assign values to those. And right now, I got to say both of them look really attractive. So it’s our job to figure out a way to do as much of both as we can.

所以它們不一樣。它們是略有不同的。我們不會像你可能以為的那樣，把它們精準地排成 A 對 B 來比較。我們會看一些成長動能、一些客戶動能，並嘗試為它們賦值。而就目前而言，我得說兩者看起來都非常有吸引力。所以我們的工作就是想辦法在可行範圍內，盡可能兩者都做。

Rich Anderson, Cantor Fitzgerald.

Rich Anderson，Cantor Fitzgerald。

Hey, thanks. Can I get back to the Park Hotel situation 'cause I don’t think I’m entirely clear. So you own two assets. They -- can you just describe the sort of the day-to-day management of the two assets? And just where both parties sit in terms of this period of time between now and the beginning of next year of how things might evolve.

嗨，謝謝。我可以回到 Park Hotel 的情況嗎？因為我覺得我還沒有完全弄清楚。所以你們擁有兩項資產。它們——你能否描述一下這兩項資產的日常管理大概是怎麼運作的？以及在從現在到明年年初這段期間，雙方各自處於什麼位置、事情可能會如何演變。

I know you said, well, it’ll just be this way for a little bit of time. But I mean, is there any chance that something gets resolved before then and we sort of have a more clean breaking point between the two situations between Park and yourself? I’m just -- I'm not clear about the exact setup as it stands today.

我知道你說過，嗯，這樣的狀態只會維持一小段時間。但我的意思是，在那之前是否有任何可能把事情解決掉，讓我們在 Park 與你們之間的兩種情況有一個更清楚的分界點？我只是——我不太清楚截至今天的確切安排是什麼。

Yeah. Rich, it’s Jay. It’s unfortunate we’re in a lawsuit. Certainly, that’s kind of a last resort thing for us. But we are exercising the rights under our lease, and that will be adjudicated sometime early next year. We’re commercial. We would prefer to have things resolved.

是的。Rich，我是 Jay。很不幸我們正在打官司。當然，對我們來說那算是最後手段。但我們正在行使租約下的權利，而這件事將在明年年初某個時候由法院裁決。我們是以商業方式處理。我們更希望事情能夠解決。

But in this case, there was no meeting of the minds on that, and we feel pretty strongly about the nature of our lease and the contractual terms. So unfortunately, we are where we are, and we can’t really accelerate these legal processes. I know it’s frustrating. It’s frustrating for us. It’s not core to our business. So we just assume put it behind us. But in this case we’re going to have to play it out.

但在這個案例中，雙方沒有達成共識，而我們對於租約的性質與合約條款有相當強烈的立場。所以很不幸，我們目前就是這樣的處境，而我們也無法真正加速這些法律程序。我知道這很令人沮喪。這對我們也很沮喪。這不是我們業務的核心。所以我們寧可把它拋在腦後。但在這個情況下，我們必須把它走完。

But in terms of the three that are still paying the ground lease, is there any risk that, that stops at some point along the way?

但就仍在支付地租的那三個而言，沿途是否有任何風險會在某個時間點停止支付？

Unlikely. I mean, they’re trying to hold on to those. So they’re obviously better performers. And our view is we had a master lease and they were all tied together, so you can’t default on just one or two. You default, you default.

不太可能。我的意思是，他們正試圖保住那些資產。所以它們顯然是表現較好的。而我們的看法是，我們有一份總租約（master lease），它們是綁在一起的，所以你不能只對其中一個或兩個違約。一旦違約，就是違約。

Okay. Second question is a complete change of direction. How would you describe the liquidation process at iStar timing that with the change -- the step down in the management fees of that business? Is it kind of moving kind of in lockstep with one another? Is it lagging? Is it leading? I’m just curious if you could talk about that process. Thanks.

好的。第二個問題完全換個方向。你會如何描述 iStar 的清算進程，以及它與該業務管理費下調（step down）的時間安排之間的關係？兩者是大致同步前進嗎？是落後？還是領先？我只是好奇你能否談談那個流程。謝謝。

Yeah. We had originally targeted, Rich, at the time of the merger that it would take us about five years to wind that vehicle down. We’re still kind of on that timeframe. So that was early mid-2023. And so early mid 2028 is still the target.

是的。Rich，我們在合併時原本的目標是，大約需要五年把那個載體（vehicle）逐步結束。我們目前仍大致在那個時間框架上。所以那是 2023 年上半年到年中。因此 2028 年上半年到年中仍是目標。

Things are tracking reasonably well. There are a couple pieces of that puzzle we’re still going to have to figure out at the finish line, but for the most part, I think our teams have done really good jobs of managing those assets for liquidity and for monetization.

進度追蹤得相當不錯。在終點線前，我們仍需要把其中幾個拼圖解決掉，但就大多數部分而言，我認為我們的團隊在以流動性與變現為目標管理那些資產方面做得非常好。

The two big ones obviously are tied up with municipalities that have a lot of say over how fast we can go. So that’s really the variable that we can’t control. But everything feels like it’s generally still on the same track as what we originally communicated.

其中兩個最大的項目顯然與地方政府（municipalities）牽涉在一起，而他們對我們能多快推進有很大的發言權。所以那確實是我們無法控制的變數。但整體感覺仍大致沿著我們最初對外溝通的軌道前進。

What happens if you’re not done with the process and you're -- I mean, is there an extension timeframe in terms of the fees that you’ll still collect at Safehold? Or does that shut off by definition?

如果你們在預期時間內還沒完成流程，而你們——我的意思是，在費用方面是否有延長的時間框架，讓你們仍能在 Safehold 收取費用？還是依定義到期就會停止？

Yeah. No, there’s a provision that depending on the dollar amount of assets still there, we get a small fee. So it’s a percentage of assets if we don’t get to the finish line exactly when we expect to.

是的。不，有一項條款規定，視仍留存的資產金額而定，我們會收取一筆小額費用。所以如果我們沒有在預期時間精準到達終點線，我們會按資產的一定百分比收費。

(Operator Instructions) Caitlin Burrows, Goldman Sachs.

(接線員指示) Caitlin Burrows，高盛。

Hi, everyone. Maybe -- sorry to go back to it, but going back to the 50th Street property, you went through before how they’re not currently paying real estate taxes, and it sounds like you’re going to give them some time to hopefully fix that. I guess how long would you think that you would give them to fix that situation? Is it like a month, a quarter, a year? How should we think about that?

大家好。可能——抱歉又回到這個話題，但回到第50街那處物業，你之前提到他們目前沒有繳納房地產稅，聽起來你們會給他們一些時間，希望他們能把這件事處理好。我想問的是，你們大概會給他們多久來修正這個狀況？是一個月、一季，還是一年？我們應該如何看待這件事？

Yeah. I don’t want to go into too many details, Caitlin. But look, we --

是的。我不想談太多細節，Caitlin。但你看，我們--

Maybe not into that location specifically, like in general if that came up.

也許不要針對那個地點本身，而是一般來說如果遇到這種情況。

Yeah. It depends on the underlying customer and their capital commitment and what we think the -- the contracts are pretty clear. You pay your taxes; you pay our rent. There’s not a lot of wiggle room there. So that is our standard.

是的。這取決於底層客戶、他們的資本承諾，以及我們認為——合約其實寫得很清楚。你要繳稅；你要付我們的租金。在這方面沒有太多彈性空間。所以這就是我們的標準。

And I can tell you, we expect our customers to do at a minimum, pay your taxes and pay your rent. So there’s not a lot of wiggle room there. If we’re willing to negotiate, it’s because there are other factors that are positive for us.

我可以告訴你，我們至少期望客戶做到：繳你的稅、付你的租金。所以在這方面沒有太多彈性空間。如果我們願意協商，那是因為還有其他對我們有利的因素。

Got it. I guess just, I don’t think we’ve talked about this yet, just when you consider the different property types that you could be investing in. It seems like your stance is kind of you’ll look at it all if the numbers make sense. But could you talk about in the quarter, in the pipeline now, if you have anything beyond residential?

了解。我想只是——我不認為我們之前談過這個——當你們考量可投資的不同物業類型時。看起來你們的立場有點像是：只要數字合理，你們都會看。但你能談談本季、目前管線中，是否有住宅以外的項目嗎？

Sure, Caitlin. So we really are focused on multifamily as our core asset type, and we’re really finding the ability to generate attractive yields out of those assets, especially in the LIHTC space. So for now, finding good opportunity in that space and leaning in hard to it. Open to all other asset classes as well, but the multifamily really has been the core of our focus.

當然，Caitlin。我們確實把多戶住宅作為核心資產類型，並且我們真的在這些資產上找到創造具吸引力收益率的能力，尤其是在LIHTC領域。所以目前我們在那個領域找到不錯的機會，並且大力投入。我們也對其他所有資產類別保持開放，但多戶住宅一直是我們關注的核心。

Ronald Kamdem, Morgan Stanley.

Ronald Kamdem，摩根士丹利。

Hey, just two quick ones. Just going back to the pipeline a little bit and just thinking about -- I think when we spoke three, six months ago, I think rate volatility, I believe, was sort of the number one mitigate that you thought were sort of slowing down deals. I guess I’m curious to get an update on when deals are not getting through to the finish line. What are the top two or three reasons? And how you guys sort of think about addressing that?

嗨，我只有兩個簡短問題。回到管線稍微談一下，並且想著——我記得我們在三到六個月前談過時，我想利率波動，你當時認為是拖慢交易的首要抑制因素。我想了解一下最新情況：當交易無法走到最後完成時，最主要的兩到三個原因是什麼？你們又是如何思考並加以因應的？

I think that in a lot of cases, deals that don’t get to the finish line are because the sponsor couldn’t otherwise put together their capital stack, or they didn’t necessarily win a deal that we were in line with them to try and consummate because they just didn’t win a process. So those are two really the primary reasons why deals haven’t come together if they don’t.

我認為在很多情況下，交易無法走到最後，是因為贊助方無法把他們的資本結構（capital stack）組合起來；或者他們並沒有在我們與他們一起、準備完成交易的那筆案子中勝出，因為他們就是沒有在流程中得標。所以如果交易沒有成形，主要就是這兩個原因。

I think it’s also fair to say we still compete with the fee financing markets. And I think the liquidity actually appears to be picking up pretty nicely, certainly in the multifamily space.

我想也可以說，我們仍然要和收費型融資市場競爭。而且我認為流動性看起來確實正在相當不錯地回升，尤其是在多戶住宅領域。

Got it. And then not to sort of beat the Park Hotel situation up, but, I guess, just my question is just the ripple effect, right? I mean, I think you said your leases are pretty clear. But in terms of like CapEx provisions or anything else, like does this whole experience make you want to be even more clear on some of those provisions?

了解。然後我不是要一直追打Park Hotel的情況，但我想問的是連鎖效應，對吧？我的意思是，我想你說過你們的租約寫得很清楚。但就像資本支出（CapEx）條款或其他任何內容而言，這整段經驗是否會讓你們想在某些條款上寫得更清楚？

I'm just -- like is there a ripple effect from this sort of lawsuit that you guys think about going forward? And is there sort of any other ripple effect in any parts of the business in terms of your relationship with your clients? That’d be helpful. Thanks.

我只是——比如說，這類訴訟對你們未來的思考是否會有連鎖效應？以及在業務的其他部分，對你們與客戶的關係是否也會有任何連鎖影響？如果能說明會很有幫助。謝謝。

Yeah. I mean, look, the Park deal was done 40 years ago. It’s not our standard lease form. It’s not the modern ground lease. It’s one of those old-fashioned ground leases that we said we need to fix these. They don’t work. They don’t work for either party. There’s ambiguities and uncertainties, and we certainly believe in our reading of our ground lease. But this is one of the things we fixed nine years ago when we started this business.

是的。我的意思是，你看，Park那筆交易是40年前做的。那不是我們的標準租約格式。也不是現代的地上權租約（ground lease）。它是那種老式地上權租約之一，我們曾說過我們需要把這些修正。它們行不通。對任何一方都行不通。裡面有模糊與不確定性，而我們當然相信我們對地上權租約的解讀。但這是我們九年前開始做這門業務時就修正過的事情之一。

That said, we’re still learning. We still find better ways to serve our customers with clearer documents. That is an everyday mission here. And we have -- I think created the gold standard. It’s been described to us by others that we have the gold standard ground lease now, because it is thoughtful, it is comprehensive, it has been worked through on hundreds of transactions now.

話雖如此，我們仍在學習。我們仍在尋找更好的方式，用更清楚的文件來服務客戶。這是我們每天的使命。而且我們——我認為——已經建立了黃金標準。其他人也曾向我們形容，我們現在的地上權租約是黃金標準，因為它周全、完整，而且已在數百筆交易中反覆推敲與驗證。

So yeah, I don’t think Park is representative at all of the modern ground lease business. But I’d also tell you in my intro remarks, we’re still learning the business and how to make it as good as it can be. We love this business. We think it’s going to be a major business as part of the commercial real estate world. But we’re creating it. So anything we can do better, we continue to look at.

所以，是的，我不認為Park能代表現代地上權租賃業務的情況。但我也想告訴你，在我開場的發言中提到，我們仍在學習這門生意，以及如何把它做到最好。我們熱愛這門生意。我們認為它將成為商用不動產世界中的一項重要業務。但我們正在把它建立起來。所以任何我們能做得更好的地方，我們都會持續檢視。

Thank you. And Mr. Hoffmann, we have no further questions at this time.

謝謝。Hoffmann先生，目前我們沒有其他問題。

Thanks everyone for joining us today. If there are additional questions on today’s release, please feel free to contact me directly.

感謝各位今天加入我們。如果對今天的公告還有其他問題，歡迎直接與我聯繫。

Thank you. This does conclude today’s conference. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.

謝謝。今天的電話會議到此結束。您現在可以掛斷電話線。感謝您的參與。