Re/Max Holdings Inc (RMAX) 2022 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and welcome to the RE/MAX Holdings Fourth Quarter 2022 Earnings Conference Call and webcast. My name is Audra and I will be facilitating the audio portion of today's call.

At this time, I would like to turn the call over to Andy Schulz, Senior Vice President of Investor Relations. Mr. Schulz?

Thank you, operator. Good morning everyone and welcome to RE/MAX Holdings fourth quarter and full year 2022 earnings conference call. Please visit the Investor Relations section of www.remaxholdings.com for all earnings-related materials and to access the live webcast and the replay of the call today. If you are participating through the webcast, please note that you will need to advance the slides as we move through the presentation.

Turning to Slide 2 our prepared remarks and answers to your questions on today's call may contain forward-looking statements. Forward-looking statements include those related to agent count, franchise sales, financial measures and outlook, brand expansion, competition, technology, housing and mortgage market conditions, capital allocation, dividends, share repurchases, strategic and operational plans and business models.

Forward-looking statements represent management's current estimates. RE/MAX Holdings assumes no obligation to update any forward-looking statements in the future. Forward-looking statements address matters that are subject to risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ materially from those projected in forward-looking statements. These are discussed in our fourth quarter 2022 financial results press release, and other SEC filings.

Also, we will refer to certain non-GAAP measures on today's call, please see the definitions and reconciliations of non-GAAP measures contained in our most recent quarterly financial results press release, which is available on our website. Joining me on our call today are Steve Joyce, our Chief Executive Officer, Karri Callahan, our Chief Financial Officer and the Presidents and CEOs of our brands Nick Bailey and Ward Morrison.

With that, I'd like to turn the call over to RE/MAX Holdings' CEO, Steve Joyce. Steve?

Thank you, Andy. And thanks to everyone for joining our call today. Looking at Slide 3, our business showed great resilience during the fourth quarter, while facing the strongest industry headwinds we've seen in more than a decade. The strength of our diversified franchise model was on full display during this period of marked contraction. On a year-over-year basis, our Q4 revenue fell by under 10%, a relatively small amount in the face of a nearly 45% decline in U.S. existing home sales.

Some our notable quarterly highlights included RE/MAX Holdings' total revenue was $81.3 million, down only 8.9% compared to last year, as our recurring revenue model and growing mortgage business help counterbalance the impact from the softening housing markets in both the U.S. and Canada.

We generated an adjusted EBITDA of $26.5 million and our adjusted EBITDA margin was a healthy 32.7%. Our adjusted EPS was $0.41. We modestly accelerated our stock buyback program and repurchased more than 0.5 million shares during the quarter. Overall, RE/MAX agent count grew by over 2,000 agents to a 144,000 agents worldwide and our Motto Mortgage presence continued to grow as we added to our open office count during the quarter.

The rapid decline in housing market activity during Q4 was highly unusual. And although we expect headwinds to persist, we also see cause for optimism as we enter the spring selling season. One thing, the company has learned over the past 5 decades, is the importance of distinguishing between what we can and cannot control. We cannot control the macroeconomic swings that impact the industry, but we can prepare for them and control our reaction to them.

And right now, our 50 years of experience, highlighted by 5 decades of consecutive growth is telling us to stay focused on supporting our 2 networks with the tools, technology and training they need to thrive in any environment. We continue to reinvest in our brands and execute on our strategic growth initiatives, positioning us for profitable growth in the future.

With that, I'll turn it over to Nick.

Thank you, Steve. Turning to Slide 4, this is an exciting year for RE/MAX, as we are celebrating 50 years. Over the past 5 decades, this network has grown to more than 144,000 agents in over 9,000 offices and a presence in more than 110 countries and territories. And our model has proven to be successful in virtually any market, regardless of the economic environment because people buy and sell houses every year.

With the most productive, most experienced agents, RE/MAX is the best choice for consumers who want to buy or sell a home, which is the biggest investment in most people's lifetimes. RE/MAX is built on more than an economic model. It's the combination of the model, the tools, the education, marketing, the network and all the resources that we provide. And these are the true advantages that help real estate professionals to succeed.

Although there has been recent contraction in both the U.S. net agent count and the overall real estate market, we are thrilled that we had thousands of agents join RE/MAX last year. Nearly 10,000 agents in the U.S., almost 4,000 in Canada and over 27,000 agents in the rest of the world joined throughout 2022. And the continuation of this size of activity, combined with our strategic initiatives will be, key to our growth prospects in 2023.

We're capitalizing on the market changes and driving innovation, such as our initiatives around teams and mergers and acquisitions and conversions of brokerages. Both programs are showing early signs of success and we're optimistic that the momentum we've built will help strengthen our agent count this year. In addition, it's important to note the structure of our marketing funds. This is a 100% recurring revenue.

So, we think we're able to continue to invest in advertising and marketing at a much greater level than the market fluctuations dictate for many of our competitors. As we start the year, there is also great confidence throughout the network, demand for housing remains strong and buyers who have been on the sidelines they're jumping back into the game. So we're optimistic to see what the spring market will do.

Consumers are looking for 3 things in an agent: trust, knowledge and experience, and RE/MAX agents are leaders in all of these categories. Our agents have been voted #1 most trusted in the U.S. and Canada. They average twice the experience and production of other U.S. agents and they hold the most professional designation in the United States.

In less than 2 weeks, we'll be celebrating 50 years of RE/MAX at our largest annual event, the R4 Convention. We believe it will drive more than 9,000 attendees from more than 70 countries, making it the highest R4 attendance in almost 2 decades. And engagement like this shows firsthand the confidence and optimism our agents have to the market ahead.

RE/MAX was founded on the principle of attracting the best agents and making good agents great. And great agents succeed in virtually any market. When asked if the market will rebound? My response is, you can't have a rebound without a crash, and we certainly did not have a crash. What we're experiencing is simply a rebalance, putting both buyers and sellers in a more even position and although, not without rebalance pain points, its overall positive for the industry.

The real estate market is about timing, but not about the timing that people think, it's not timing the rates, inflation, the economy or headlines, but its timing based on the personal needs and life events for people. Marriage, kids, divorce, jobs, that will be what the 2023 market is all about and that's what we've seen drive the market for 5 decades. We also believe the agent is and will continue to be the most valuable part of the real estate transaction.

Technology won't replace an agent, but an agent who doesn't adopt tech, will get replaced. And last year, we announced and launched MAX/Tech, powered by kvCORE. It's a world-class technology partnership, providing agents with a full suite of products, to maximize lead generation, their presentations, their marketing, and more importantly, AI and automation, 2 key items that will impact the industry in a much larger way moving forward.

Rollout started in Canada late last year and we are pleased to report that over 90% of agents, they have already on-boarded. And because of the success, we accelerated the U.S. launch to the first week in January, which was 2 months earlier than anticipated. And this is something rarely seen with tech rollouts. A significant competitive advantage is our scale.

On the retail market, this suite of products can cost agents thousands of dollars annually, and we can offer this tech to agents and teams in the U.S. and Canada at no additional charge, which is a major win and a significant enhancement to our value proposition.

Now as we look ahead, we continue to solve for gaps in the business and provide the right tools to narrow these gaps. Real estate is a dynamic, changing industry, which means you must adapt and adapt quickly, especially in market shifts like this. I believe the outlook for '23 is bright and this is our market to win. Just as we've done for 50 years.

Ward, over to you.

Thanks, Nick. Looking at Slide 5, while we experienced solid growth in open offices during the fourth quarter, our overall business has been sluggish due to the current macro environment. That said, the 2 marketing events for potential Motto franchisees we held in January, were among the best-attended we've had in recent memory. And long term, we believe our prospects remain as bright as ever.

The mortgage industry had been hit particularly hard by the Fed's moves to cool inflation by raising interest rates, which has in turn put a chill on the housing market. Unlike RE/MAX, while we believe Motto's franchise model insulates us from a, broader industry gyrations better than most, we're not totally immune. We've seen a tight correlation between the rise in interest rates and the slowdown in our franchise sales in Q2 of last year.

Importantly Motto sales have continued, but at slower pace. We sold 40 franchises last year, a very respectable number in today's business climate, but still off the 60 to 70 units sales pace we experienced the past few years. The news regarding our Motto office openings is better, as 2022 was our best year ever in terms of the number of offices opened. This helped to accelerate our growth rate during Q4, and we ended the year with over 230 open Motto offices, with more in the pipeline.

We remain focused on improving our growth opportunities. Each Motto office that's been open for more than one year should bring in roughly the same amount of annual revenue as a 20 agent RE/MAX office in a company-owned region. It is a meaningful sum, and this is why we continue to invest in our mortgage business by ramping up our Motto franchise sales and [wemlo] 11.22 sales teams, but we aim to be at full capacity by the end of Q2.

We believe this sets us up to return to our normal sales cadence within a matter of months, and positions us to capitalize on the demand we expect to see as inflation retreats and mortgage rates stabilize. We also recently added to our bench strength, as a longtime colleague has come over from RE/MAX's successful original development team to join Motto as VP of Franchise Growth and Development.

We believe the growth, success and long-term potential of our mortgage business is due to the unique and compelling value proposition Motto and wemlo each offer. The ancillary services like mortgage provide real estate entrepreneurs with attractive opportunities to diversify their revenue and earnings, something that is very important during shifting market conditions.

Over 70% of Motto sales went to real estate professionals, who were close to the real estate transactions, namely purchase originations. And that proximity is the key to success for our many of our franchisees. Looking ahead, our future is bright and we expect our mortgage business to continue to grow and our sales to reaccelerate as conditions improve.

With that, I'd like to turn the call over to Karri.

Thank you, Ward. Good morning, everyone, moving to Slide 6. Fourth quarter revenue declined approximately 9%, to $81.3 million. Excluding the marketing funds, revenue was just shy of $60 million, a decrease of approximately 10% compared to the same period last year. This decrease was driven by negative 9.1% organic growth and adverse foreign currency movements of 1.1%.

Organic growth decreased, largely due to lower broker fee revenue. Higher interest rates have adversely impacted housing affordability and weakened housing demand, resulting in fewer transactions and by extension, lower broker fee revenue. 1 of the highlights of our 100% franchise model is, that it is primarily comprised of recurring revenue streams, like continuing franchise fees and annual dues, which helps lessen the financial impact from trivalent market conditions.

For example, excluding broker fee and marketing fund revenue, our organic growth rate was only down about 2%. In Q4, recurring revenue accounted for almost 70% of revenue excluding the marketing funds.

Turning to Slide 7, our Q4 selling, operating and administrative expenses decreased 24.5%, to $35 million, due primarily to lower personnel costs, principally in the form of reduced equity-based compensation, lower bonus expense and decreased headcount, as well as lower acquisition related expenses. Recall, that we substantially completed a restructuring, primarily in the RE/MAX technology department during the third quarter of 2022.

Our fourth quarter SO&A expenses were more favorable than expected due to a handful of reasons, including lower legal expenses. Importantly, we still anticipate reinvesting virtually all the savings from this restructuring back into our business. Also on the expense front, we recorded a $7.1 million goodwill impairment related to the wind down of the Gadberry Group in Q4.

Moving to Slide 8, before I get to our outlook, there are a couple of items I want to briefly mention. We modestly accelerated our buyback activity during the fourth quarter, repurchasing over 500,000 shares. Throughout 2022, we repurchased just over 1.5 million shares in total, returning over $34 million to shareholders.

Combined with our dividend, we returned more than $50 million to our Class A shareholders last year, which was over 80% of our adjusted free cash flow. Returning capital to shareholders remains a top priority for us in 2023. However, given the contraction underway within the industry, we expect to slowdown the pace of our buyback in the near term.

Second, I wanted to call out the impact that today's increasing interest rate environment is expected to have on our earnings, specifically, we expect rising interest rates will increase our Q1 net interest expense by approximately $3.5 million to $3.7 million compared to the first quarter of last year. That estimate includes the 25 basis-point raise by the Fed that was announced earlier this month.

Turning to guidance, this may be the most challenging environment in which to forecast future results that I have seen in my seven years as CFO. Consequently, we have broadened our annual guidance ranges to help account for the heightened uncertainty. The company's first quarter and full year 2023 outlook assumes no further currency movements, acquisitions or divestitures.

For the first quarter of 2023, we expect agent count to increase 0% to 1% over first quarter 2022, revenue in a range of $82 million to $87 million, including revenue from the marketing funds in a range of $20.5 million to $22.5 million and adjusted EBITDA in a range of $18.5 million to $21.5 million.

For the full year 2023, we expect agent count to change negative 1% to 1% over full year 2022, revenue in a range of $315 million to $335 million, including revenue from the marketing funds in a range of $83.5 million to $87.5 million and adjusted EBITDA in a range of $95 million to $105 million.

Now, I'll turn the call over to Steve for closing comments.

Thanks, Karri. Looking at Slide 9, we continue to invest meaningfully in our future. We have faced similar circumstances over the past 5 decades and performed well, and we believe we are positioned to do so again. With a scaled global business, unmatched brands, strong financials and a proven track record of success, we remain optimistic about and confident in our future.

With that, operator, let's open it up for questions.

(Operator Instructions) We'll go to our first question from Anthony Paolone at JPMorgan.

Good morning.

Well, first, I guess, on your revenue expectations for '23, down about 9% excluding marketing and that's on flattish agent count. So maybe can you help us just understand a bit better where you think the biggest draw down is going to be? Maybe order of magnitude you're thinking on broker fees and just what the impact may or may not be on continuing franchise fees?

Yes, so I'll let Karri put color to this, but our forecast is showing where we are now which, is sort of in that fourth quarter continuation of a 20 some percent decline in transaction activity and so, as we look at the year, we have not built in upside to the year. So to the extent that you believe, and we are seeing some reasons that maybe things will improve, if things improve, then we've got significant upside to the forecast that we've got.

However, at this point, what we're seeing is a steady continuation of the deterioration that occurred last year. And so we are, we are setting a baseline number that we feel very confident about and at the same time, our view is, if we get any uptick, then we will significantly benefit from that, because we are putting ourselves in a position to capture that upside opportunity. The bulk of the impact is in broker fees, but let me let Karri give you more color. Karri?

Sure, thanks, Steve. So Tony, Steve is right. I think when I look at the guide on the top line I'd really break it down into three categories. The first is broker fee. So as Steve noted, we've taken a pretty pragmatic look, when we look across kind of the collective of third-parties who are predicting existing home sales for next year, it's kind of ranging between 5% and 20% down, and as Steve said, we're kind -- on the more conservative end, about 20% down.

For purposes of (inaudible) 20.04 we continue to watch where things go going forward. The second bucket is really on the recurring revenue line, so agent count kind of flattish, similar trajectory to what we saw in the back half of the year and assuming that the initiatives are really going to take hold later in the year, but from a financial contribution perspective, it's just going to be a little bit less. And on that note, I just want to make sure that we're clear in terms of some of those investments that we're making across team, mergers, conversions, acquisition.

We think that that's going to be kind of a $3 million to $4 million headwind and net investment into next year. And then the last bucket I would call out is, in our other revenue, with the wind down of the booj legacy business, as well as the Gadberry business, also expecting that's going to be kind of a $2 million to $3 million headwind year-over-year.

That's all helpful. Second question is, as it relates to your capital priorities, you mentioned dialing back on buying back stock, can you give a sense as to what you think CapEx might be for '23? And also just how you're thinking about the dividend versus paying down debt, given the higher rates and so forth?

Yes, certainly I'll start and then Karri, you -- so our #1 priority, #1 is the return of capital to shareholders. We gave -- we distributed back over 80% of our free cash flow last year. We are not changing from that model at all. We are simply looking at where the markets going, getting a real sense of, okay, we know exactly where we are and where we think we're going to end up. And then we're going to continue to aggressively go after both the stock and continue to pay the dividend.

The dividend is absolute, when you look at our financial position. We are in a rock solid business and balance sheet with a very stable cash flow. So our view is that as soon as we see where the market is going to bottom and then begin to come back, then we will be as aggressive as we've been, and so that is our #1 priority. But then, we are investing back in the business because we think we've got significant upside to that. So Karri you want to talk a little bit about CapEx?

Sure, yes. So from a CapEx perspective, with the shift in the technology strategy that we made, we do expect that to come down a little bit, probably in the $8 million to $10 million range. A lot of that is coming on the mortgage side, so continuing really the few points to invest in the wemlo product.

And the technology offerings there and then a little bit on the RE/MAX side as well, as we continue to reinvest in some of the consumer-facing things that we're still doing internally and a lot of that is, we're very excited about as we think about '23 and beyond.

We'll go next to Tommy McJoynt at KBW.

Good morning.

Karri, you were walking through some of the 3 categories of the headwinds there and I just wanted to clarify 1 of those, I think you called out $3 million to $4 million of headwinds related to something like -- the teams pilot program? I just wanted to confirm that that's like the only program that applies. And then just if you guys could just give us your latest thoughts on that team pilot program and it's impacting the top and bottom line?

Sure, so yes, the majority of that -- yes, the majority of that is that $3 million to $4 million is related to the teams program, a little bit also coming from our mergers and conversion program. Both of those, we're seeing some early success on and we're happy with, and I'll let Nick jump in here as well. But a lot of it is just pretty early on, especially -- given the macro, but Nick, if you want to add to that?

Yes, sure. The teams initiative is still new, it was announced August of last year. However, early indications show that we've added more teams and the teams that we have added more agents and so early indications, we like what we're seeing, within the pilot, but it is only halfway through that pilot and so more to come as we move into the first half of this year.

Great. And then, just my second question is on, can you talk a little bit about the health of some of your franchisees. It's obviously been somewhat of a tough stretch here in terms of house and volumes, so just broadly, if you could talk about the health there?

Yes, so it's a combination of -- we've kind of consistently are monitoring how everyone's doing, obviously, collections is top of mind. And so -- the net news is good news that our folks are in good shape, they are going through the toughest cash flow part of the year for them. But as they come out, we are not seeing any significant change in any pattern of payment or financial health of the franchisees and Nick and his team spent an enormous amount of time checking in and making sure that we know that. So Karri or Nick, I don't know if you want to add to that?

No, Steve, I think you summed it up well.

Great.

We'll go next to Ronald Kamdem at Morgan Stanley.

Just a couple quick ones, just going back to the guidance for '23, the adjusted EBITDA is helpful. I'm trying to get a sense of what the flow-through is going to be like, the operating cash flow, because if I look at '22 and I look at sort of the 122 adjusted EBITDA down to $71 million operating cash flow, I get to like a 58% flow through. I'm just trying to get a sense how are you guys thinking about that operating cash flow for '23?

Karri?

Sure. Yes, so I think that really highlights, Ron, the strength of the business model and even with the trying economic times, the favorable position that we're in. And so, I think as we look to 2023, that conversion rate is -- it looks pretty consistent, might go down a couple of percentage points, just because of full year -- a little bit higher interest expense expectations, but kind of in that 50% to 55% range is reasonable as we look ahead to '23.

Okay.

I think the other point to keep in mind is, depending on if we get upside, as that upside comes in, that flow through is at a high margin.

Great. And then, the other question I had, just I'm on. I think I'm on Slide 24, and I'm just looking at sort of the Motto Mortgage piece of it that guys have revenues and sort of EBITDA. Can you just talk a little bit more about that sort of adjusted EBITDA, what's driving that negative number, how do we think about that changing as you go from 225 to over 1,000, just trying to get a sense of the trends there?

Karri?

Yes, so I think the mortgage business is something that we continue to be extremely excited about, obviously, rising interest rates had a direct correlation to the pace of our franchise sales, as Ward noted. We're continuing to invest in it, a lot of that is coming on the wemlo side. And so that put a little bit of pressure from a profitability perspective, but I think it's important to note that once those offices get up and running, they're contributing about what 20 agents are in our company-owned region.

And as we look out over time, we still think it's a $100 million revenue opportunity for us, with margins that are comparable to what we see on the RE/MAX side at scale, ex the marketing funds. And so, we are still continuing to invest right now, we think that once we get to kind of that 300-350 open Motto offices, we can get to profitability across the segment and still think that we just need to position ourselves through this headwind, which is why we're investing and we'll continue to be bullish on that the growth opportunity there.

We'll move next to John Campbell with Stephens Inc.

So I wanted to start off with maybe 1 of the comment that Nick made kind of in the prepared remarks. You mentioned the word strengthened, shrinking the agent base around the new initiatives. So I wanted to see if you could maybe clarify that and maybe unpack that, is that your expectation for better growth, is that better retention, is that more productivity out of agents may be all the above, just curious about that comment there.

Nick?

Yes hi, John great question. It is around growth. I comment on the number of new agents that joined RE/MAX not only in the U.S., Canada, but around the world. And when you look at then that compared to overall our net gain or loss in each 1 of those areas.

We think that when we look at the initiatives that we're investing in, it is all about strengthening the growth and assisting the franchisees on how we do that and that's all based on the initiatives that we started last year and that we're investing in that we believe is key to our growth moving forward even with the rebalance of the market.

Okay, that's helpful. And then, yes, go ahead sorry Steve.

Yes, so I was just going to add to, I think I've met, I met with Nick and his folks, the relative positioning and that they're feeling at this point is the most positive, I've seen since I've been here. And the pipe that they're building and then the expected upside of bringing the technology platform to the U.S. and its impact not only on attracting everybody, but particularly teams because it's got an important teams component to it -- it just gives you a lot of room for optimism.

So not notwithstanding the current macro environment, we just think we're really well positioned in the things that we're going to do are going to make a real difference in terms of the overall numbers, when they turn positive is when the environment lets us do it.

Yes, makes sense. And you guys talked about the strength of the franchisees, I mean, you've mentioned that in a couple different parts of the call, and then back to Tommy's question around the -- just general update around franchisees. I was curious if you could maybe go down the path of renewals, how that's looking?

Obviously, there is a difference -- there can be a difference in the health of your franchisees and whether they stay with you. So curious about how that retention rate has been looking over the last year or so. And then also on the franchise sales pipeline, curious about how impacted that is by the macro as well?

Karri (inaudible) 31.49.

Sure. I mean, it's a great question, John. As we look at renewals on the RE/MAX side of the house, we haven't seen significant deviation or variability from that perspective, at least from a numbers perspective, I think, Nick and his team have done really an outstanding -- outstanding job there and you can probably provide more color as well.

Yes, when we looked at the way our franchise agreements are structured with renewals and the intent to renew and the timeframe prior to expiration, pretty safe to say that were around 99% that we renew, and we're well in front of those changes. And in the event that there is a change in the market or non-renewals for whatever reason, we are not taken by surprise, and that's why our sales team and especially with what's happening with our mergers, conversions and acquisitions initiatives.

It's bringing in what we've seen and experienced thus far, last year and even great results early this year, is independent companies that are marrying, if you will, RE/MAX companies and depending on if there is a succession planning or any type of merger, it's just a nice way for us to be able to marry, which also helps drive the really positive renewal rates.

Next, we'll go to Ryan McKeveny, Zelman and Associates.

Karri, so a follow-up on the economics with Motto I think the detail you gave was very helpful. But, so I guess it sounds like wemlo is part of the expense growth going forward. I guess if we think about maybe the core Motto ex wemlo, is that reaching kind of a point where the expense base is becoming more of that kind of fixed franchise expense base, whereas revenue ramps, you get more leverage there. So that would be part 1?

And then part 2, just specific to wemlo, I guess, I'm just curious if you can remind us, the economics there either kind of per loan processed or even more generally, if you can share qualitatively or quantitatively how much wemlo is contributing either on the revenue or EBITDA side of mortgage? And I assume we'll get the segment level breakout within the K, but I don't think wemlo is necessarily specified so just any thoughts there would be very helpful? Thank you.

Sure, thanks Ryan and great question. And like I said we continue to be really excited about the mortgage opportunity. We are starting to see better leverage and flow through kind of what I would call the legacy Motto business on the franchise sales business. Now that we do have over, just over 230 offices opened. So we are starting to see some of that, but we really I think Ward and the team have done a nice job of really pulling the value proposition together holistically between Motto and wemlo.

So it's a little bit harder for us to kind of say, but I think generally speaking, we're starting to see a little bit, a little bit more of that leverage. We will provide all of the additional kind of segment level detail in the K, when that gets, when that gets filed. But Ward, I will turn it over to you to talk a little bit about the additional breakout.

Yes so, Ryan, on the economics. It's basically, we offer some level of discount of about 725 a file to Motto's directly, whereas the open general public that we also sell to within welmo, is anywhere from 850 to like 1,199 a file, depending on which state, on that basis. So really, it's just trying to drive overall loan processing growth on a per transaction basis right.

So our key there is within Motto, we made some changes to our FTD last year to mandate with 1 exception that they start using our service, our new franchisees. We can't go back on the existing ones until they renew. This year, we'll be making somewhat of a similar change and trying to drive more Motto's to use wemlo. And then, 1 of the thing we've done is also trying to support margin growth within our franchisees is we've hired some of their processors into our wemlo system and sell that service back to them.

So we think there's a lot of upside in 2023 and beyond. It's just getting that particular entity's revenues growing by getting the loan process count up and we have a great team in place to support the Motto's and everybody else. We just have to keep pushing the top-line.

And Ryan, just 1 other thing hey Ryan, 1 other thing to quickly clarify, we did actually include it in our updated investor presentation that's posted on the website. We did post the breakout kind of the segment information, so you can kind of see that in terms of the total segment revenue top-line, a little over 12 and then the net investment of about 6.

Yes, Ryan, it's the wide RE/MAX deck. Our main investor presentation that was posted this morning, at Slide 24, it's the slide that Ron referred to earlier on this call.

And next we'll move to Matthew Filek at William Blair.

This is Matt Filek on for Stephen, thanks for taking my questions. Could you provide some more color on how the rollout of kvCORE is progressing? I know, the rollout just started, but curious on how many agents are currently leveraging the kvCORE platform and if any agents have pushed back on the sunset of booj happening sometime down the road?

Yes, I'll let -- Nick answer that, but I will tell you, rarely do you see franchisees applaud a technology program and the one that Nick has selected is actually getting applause lines in our conferences, which I have never seen in 40 years of franchising. Nick?

Well, thanks, Steve, well said. I will tell you it's a home run. When we look at the rollout in Canada, we have over 90% on-boarded total agent count right now, even though we have 4 phases that started in the U.S., we're around 35,000 agents of the 85,000 agents between the U.S. and Canada are on-boarded, but the U.S. obviously, a big chunk of that that just started the first week in January.

That rollout was not initially anticipated to begin until the end of Q1 and we are thrilled with the fact that we were able to push it 2 months earlier. So it absolutely is welcome, people are applauding it. To your question is there pushback on the booj sunset? The answer is no. I think any pushback that we see is the fact that new tech means that you have to learn something. And so it's, we're investing in the training and the resources to make sure that people have a seamless experience, but the early success stories are pretty incredible, and I'll note 2 of them.

1 came up that an agent that had never used a database put their contacts in the system and within 14 days, got a listing that went under contract within 24 hours had never experienced that. 1 of the testimonials we will be showing at the upcoming R4 Convention I saw yesterday, is 1 of the teams said, thank you, RE/MAX, you're now saving me $24,000 a year that they were spending with KV, that we're now offering for free. And so, as this continues to rollout, we believe it's going to continue to be very positive and get us -- give us a very big recruiting retention advantage.

That's very helpful and super encouraging to hear as well. I just had 1 more question on the alternative fee structure. I know, it came up a little bit ago, but just wanted to clarify something. What's the current adoption for that program like? I think it's offered in 5 states if I recall correctly, and then what do you think adoption could look like over the course of 2023? I suppose said another way, do you expect adoption of that program to ramp up over the course of the year?

Nick?

Yes, so, I mentioned it's still a little early, we announced that pilot in 5 states in August. And so, what we're seeing is, there are 2 ways to grow from this initiative. It's not only recruiting new teams in, which we have seen that happen, of teams of 6 agents and larger but it's also existing teams that we have that are anywhere from 1 to 5 agents that now have incentives to grow their teams. We are seeing positive results in both categories. Not prepared at this point to give any type of forecast on the numbers, because it did just launch in August.

But it's very encouraging and I will say outside of the data, that we're looking at, the network is applauding us, saying that RE/MAX is absolutely adopting the wave of the future and where larger teams are going. And so, the franchisees are very, very supportive and the initial data shows that it's going in the right direction, still early. More to come and likely as we move through this year, we'll have better numbers to share.

There are no further questions at this time. I will turn the conference back over to Andy Schulz for any closing remarks.

Well, thank you, operator, and thanks to everyone for joining the call today. This does conclude today's event. Have a great weekend.

And again, that does conclude today's conference call. You may now disconnect.