RPC Inc (RES) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good morning and thank you for joining us for our RPC Inc. first quarter 2025 earnings conference call. Today's call will be hosted by Ben Palmer, President and CEO, and Mike Schmit, Chief Financial Officer. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. Following the presentation, we will conduct a question-and-answer session. Instructions will be provided at this time for you to queue up for questions. I would like to advise everyone that this conference call is being recorded. I will now turn the call over to Mr. Schmit.

早安，感謝您參加 RPC Inc. 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。今天的電話會議將由總裁兼執行長 Ben Palmer 和財務長 Mike Schmit 主持。此時，所有參與者都處於只聽模式。演講結束後，我們將進行問答環節。此時將提供排隊提問的說明。我想告知大家，本次電話會議正在錄音。現在我將電話轉給施密特先生。

Thank you and good morning. Before we begin, I want to remind you that some of the statements that will be made on this call could be forward-looking in nature and reflect a number of known and unknown risks. Please refer to our press release issued today along with our 2024 10K and other public filings that outline those risks. All of which can be found on RPC's website at www.rpc.net. In today's earnings release and conference call, we'll be referring to several non-gap measures of operating performance and liquidity.

謝謝，早安。在我們開始之前，我想提醒您，本次電話會議中的一些聲明可能具有前瞻性，並反映了許多已知和未知的風險。請參閱我們今天發布的新聞稿以及我們的 2024 10K 和其他概述這些風險的公開文件。所有這些資訊都可以在 RPC 的網站 www.rpc.net 上找到。在今天的財報發布和電話會議上，我們將討論幾個非缺口營運績效和流動性指標。

We believe these non-gap measures allow us to compare performance consistently over various periods. Our press release and our website contain reconciliations of these non-gap measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measures. I'll now turn the call over to our President and CEO Ben Palmer.

我們相信，這些無差距措施使我們能夠在各個時期內持續比較績效。我們的新聞稿和網站包含這些非差距指標與最直接可比較的 GAAP 指標的對帳。現在我將把電話轉給我們的總裁兼執行長本·帕爾默。

Thanks, Mike, and thank you for joining our call. Today we will talk about our first quarter results in the acquisition we just closed in early April as well as share our views about the increasing tariffrin macro uncertainties. We are encouraged by the start of the year with respect to our financial performance and excited to bring Pintail into the RPC portfolio. Further, we are confident that our strong balance sheet, even following the funding of the acquisition provides a solid cushion in uncertain times while still affording us the ability to invest as attractive opportunities arise.

謝謝，麥克，感謝您參加我們的電話會議。今天，我們將討論我們剛剛在四月初完成的收購的第一季業績，並分享我們對宏觀不確定性中關稅上調的看法。我們對今年年初的財務表現感到鼓舞，並很高興將 Pintail 納入 RPC 投資組合。此外，我們相信，即使在收購融資之後，我們強勁的資產負債表也能在不確定的時期提供堅實的緩衝，同時仍然使我們能夠在有吸引力的機會出現時進行投資。

First quarter results can be summarized as stable revenues with some EBITDA growth. Recall that our fourth quarter held up relatively well in a sluggish market. That we weren't necessarily expecting a typical seasonal pickup heading into the first quarter. Nevertheless, we were pleased with our financial results, especially sequentially the doc.

第一季的業績可以概括為營收穩定，EBITDA 有所成長。回想一下，在低迷的市場中，我們的第四季表現相對較好。我們並不必然期待第一季出現典型的季節性回升。儘管如此，我們對我們的財務表現感到滿意，尤其是連續的業績。

As we look across the service lines for the quarter, pressure pumping revenues were essentially flat sequentially, and all of the service lines and aggregate declined 1%. We worked diligently to drive utilization, though it did come with some pricing concessions. We are balancing the pricing and utilization strategy to service our customers while not performing work at levels that generate inadequate returns. We still see higher utilization with our frac assets for our tier four DGBs where we have better visibility with dedicated customers and continue to deliver solid well-site performance.

綜觀本季的服務線，壓力幫浦收入基本上與上一季持平，所有服務線和總量均下降了 1%。我們努力提高利用率，儘管這確實帶來了一些價格優惠。我們正在平衡定價和使用率策略，以便為客戶提供服務，同時又不執行產生不足回報的工作水準。我們仍然看到我們的四級 DGB 的壓裂資產利用率更高，我們對專用客戶有更好的可見性，並繼續提供穩定的井場性能。

On the other hand, demand and utilization remains challenging for tier two diesel equipment. The spot and semi-dedicated frac market are amply supplied with horsepower capacity, and pricing remains highly competitive as competitive as [OFS] companies compete to maximize utilization. In the current frac pricing environment, capital investments must be rigorously evaluated, and we suspect some smaller, less well capitalized competitors may disproportionately struggle to maintain asset quality and performance. Some may even exit the business. We are certainly hearing more about pumping equipment for sale at low prices. We believe these are mostly assets with limited useful lives, indicating that some providers are opting to monetize and exit rather than maintain and reinvest. We see this as a positive, potentially tightening frac supply and leading to firmer pricing, but this may take some time to play out.

另一方面，二級柴油設備的需求和利用仍然充滿挑戰。現貨和半專用壓裂市場擁有充足的馬力產能，價格仍然極具競爭力，因為 [OFS] 公司都在競相實現利用率最大化。在目前的壓裂定價環境下，必須嚴格評估資本投資，我們懷疑一些規模較小、資本不足的競爭對手可能會難以維持資產品質和績效。有些人甚至可能退出該行業。我們確實聽到了更多關於低價出售泵送設備的消息。我們認為這些大多是使用壽命有限的資產，顯示一些提供者選擇貨幣化和退出，而不是維護和再投資。我們認為這是一個積極的信號，可能會收緊壓裂供應並導致價格更加堅挺，但這可能需要一些時間才能實現。

Our 2025 plans still do not include a new frac fleet, though if and when we invest in incremental frac equipment, we would expect to retire older fleets. Looking at our non-pressure pumping service lines, combined revenues were down 1% sequentially in the first quarter with no individual service line up or down a significant amount. In short, it was a fairly stable quarter across most of the business. Down tools revenues were flat. Several of our regions delivered solid growth in the quarter but were offset by some unusual weather disruptions in the Rocky Mountains and other regions.

我們的 2025 年計畫仍然不包括新的壓裂船隊，但如果我們投資增量壓裂設備，我們預計會淘汰舊船隊。從我們的非壓力泵送服務線來看，第一季綜合收入環比下降 1%，且沒有單一服務線大幅上漲或下跌。簡而言之，本季大部分業務表現相當穩定。羽絨工具收入持平。我們的幾個地區在本季度實現了穩健的成長，但落基山脈和其他地區的一些異常天氣幹擾抵消了這一增長。

Our new drill and unplugged products continue to gain early traction in the market, and we're pleased with the response, but these are still too small to move the needle on our overall financial results. We look forward to more progress and we'll share updates on key milestones as appropriate. Coal tubing was down a few points in the quarter cementing was flat and rental tools at a nice gain of about 7% as that business did see a noticeable b to begin the new year.

我們的新鑽機和不插電產品繼續在市場上獲得早期關注，我們對市場反應感到滿意，但這些影響仍然太小，不足以影響我們的整體財務表現。我們期待取得更多進展，並將在適當的時候分享關鍵里程碑的最新消息。本季度，煤管業務下降了幾個點，固井業務持平，而租賃工具業務則獲得了約 7% 的良好收益，因為這項業務在新的一年伊始確實出現了明顯的增長。

From a strategic standpoint, we believe bolstering these less capital-intensive service lines with organic investments and acquisitions will help drive growth, improve our customer mix, and reduce volatility in our financial results. And with that, I'll segue into the Pintail completions acquisition. We have been talking increasingly in recent quarters about our optimism for executing acquisitions. We have set several potential transactions since acquiring Spinnaker in 2023, and we were very pleased with our ultimate outcome, acquiring Pintail in an agreed transaction.

從策略角度來看，我們相信透過有機投資和收購來支持這些資本密集度較低的服務線將有助於推動成長，改善我們的客戶結構，並降低財務表現的波動性。接下來，我將轉入 Pintail 完井收購。最近幾個季度，我們越來越多地談論對執行收購的樂觀態度。自 2023 年收購 Spinnaker 以來，我們已經確定了幾項潛在交易，我們對最終結果非常滿意，透過商定的交易收購了 Pintail。

The total purchase price was $245 million comprised of $170 million in cash, a $50 million seller note, and $25 million dollars of issued stock. While we had ample cash to fund the total purchase price, we believe the nodes and stock provide increased alignment and incentives as we move forward together. Pintail's a leading wireline perforation services provider offering some of the newest and most efficient high performance conventional and electric equipment in the industry with more than 30 active fleets. It has a fairly concentrated customer base of blue chip EMPs, and all of its operations serve the Permian Basin. The Pintail management team is well regarded in the industry, having established a reputation for delivering outstanding customer service in a safe and efficient way with low emissions. Pintail generated $409 million in revenues in 2024. We believe it has reached critical mass and expect revenues to trend with the overall market. Its customer retention is a testament to the strength of its relationships and consistent well site performance.

總購買價為 2.45 億美元，包括 1.7 億美元現金、5,000 萬美元賣方票據和 2,500 萬美元發行股票。雖然我們有足夠的現金來支付全部購買價格，但我們相信，在我們共同前進的過程中，節點和庫存將提供更大的一致性和激勵措施。Pintail 是一家領先的電纜穿孔服務提供商，提供業內最新、最高效的高性能常規和電動設備，擁有 30 多個現役設備隊。該公司擁有相當集中的藍籌 EMP 客戶群，其所有業務都服務於二疊紀盆地。Pintail 管理團隊在業界享有盛譽，以安全、高效、低排放的方式提供出色的客戶服務而享有盛譽。Pintail 在 2024 年創造了 4.09 億美元的收入。我們相信它已達到臨界規模，並預期收入將與整體市場同步成長。其客戶保留率證明了其關係的強度和井場表現的一致性。

We note that the quarterly revenue was in the $100 million range in each quarter last year. With no discernible seasonality or year-long directional trend in their top line results. We have not disclosed specifically profitability measures. However, our general expectation is for EBITDA margins to continue to track at about 20% plus or minus a few points.

我們注意到，去年每季的季度營收都在 1 億美元左右。他們的營收業績沒有明顯的季節性或全年方向趨勢。我們尚未披露具體的獲利措施。不過，我們整體預期 EBITDA 利潤率將持續維持在 20% 左右，並上下浮動幾個點。

Pintail will maintain its operational approach, and we expect a relatively light integration with most of our efforts focused on back-office support and financial reporting. It's day to day operations will remain largely unchanged, and the management team will remain focused on serving its customers. With respect to the strategic rationale of the deal, you may recall that during our 4th quarter call, we highlighted several strategic imperatives to executing our goals. Improve margins and execution and optimize our assets. Increase operational scale through M&A. We balance our portfolio with a focus on high cash flow generating service lines and strengthen our customer mix by increasing our focus on blue chip EMPs given industry consolidation.

Pintail 將維持其營運方式，我們預期整合程度相對較低，大部分精力將集中在後台支援和財務報告上。其日常營運將基本保持不變，管理團隊將繼續專注於服務客戶。關於該交易的戰略原理，您可能還記得，在我們第四季度的電話會議上，我們強調了實現目標的幾個戰略要點。提高利潤率和執行力並優化我們的資產。透過併購擴大營運規模。我們平衡了我們的投資組合，重點關注高現金流服務線，並透過在行業整合的情況下增加對藍籌 EMP 的關注來加強我們的客戶組合。

Pintail is very well aligned with those imperatives. Adding over $400 million of revenues certainly adds operational scale and meaningful share in wireline. Pintail is also a high cash flow producing business with relatively low capital intensity, and its exclusive focus on blue chip customers is something we find very appealing. This acquisition is a great fit with our strategic direction as we continue to expand our completion services capabilities and focus on overall company growth and free cash flow.

Pintail 非常符合這些要求。增加超過 4 億美元的收入無疑會增加營運規模和有線業務的顯著份額。Pintail 也是一家現金流量較高、資本密集度相對較低的企業，而且其專注於藍籌客戶，這對我們來說非常有吸引力。此次收購非常符合我們的策略方向，我們將繼續擴大完井服務能力，並專注於公司整體成長和自由現金流。

Looking at our 2024 revenues, pro forma with the addition of pintail, pressure pumping was 32%. Wireline increased from 1% to 23%. Downhole tools was 21%, coal tubing was 7%, and cementing was 6%. All other businesses together would represent approximately 11%. Furthermore, the Pintail transaction would move our Permian concentration up to approximately 60% of total revenues. With that, Michael will now discussed the quarter's financial results as well as some notes on the pintail transaction.

看看我們 2024 年的收入，加上針尾鴨，壓力泵的預計收入為 32%。有線電話從 1% 增加到 23%。井下工具佔21%，煤管佔7%，固井佔6%。所有其他業務合計約佔 11%。此外，Pintail 交易將使我們的二疊紀集中度上升至總收入的約 60%。接下來，麥可將討論本季的財務表現以及有關針尾鴨交易的一些說明。

Thanks, Ben. Shifting to the first quarter of financial results with sequential comparisons to the fourth quarter of 2024. Revenues decreased 1% to $333 million. Breaking down our operating segments, technical services, which represented 94% of our total first quarter revenues was down 1%. Support services, which represented 6% of our total first quarter revenues were up 1%. The following is a breakdown of our first quarter revenues for our top five service lines. Pressure pumping is 40.1%. Downhole tools 28.2%. Coil tubing 9.6%, cementing 8.3%. Rental tools 4.6%. Together these accounted for approximately 91% of our total revenues. Cost of revenues, excluding depreciation and amortization, decreased by $6.4 million to $243.9 million or 3% during the first quarter.

謝謝，本。轉向第一季的財務業績，並與 2024 年第四季進行連續比較。營收下降 1% 至 3.33 億美元。細分我們的營運部門，技術服務占我們第一季總收入的 94%，但下降了 1%。支援服務占我們第一季總收入的 6%，成長了 1%。以下是我們第一季五大服務線收入的明細。壓力泵送率為40.1％。井下工具28.2%。連續油管9.6%，固井8.3%。租賃工具4.6%。這些收入加起來約占我們總收入的 91%。第一季度，不包括折舊和攤提的收入成本減少了 640 萬美元，至 2.439 億美元，降幅為 3%。

The lower cost of revenues can be mainly accounted for by lower expenses in three categories. First, transportation and fuel declined due to job mix as we provided less fuel to our customers. This typically carries little to no profit, so it's actually a positive margin impact for us. Second is lower material and supplies. As the mix of our job's changes quarter to quarter, so does the amount of sand and chemicals we supply on these jobs. Lastly, we noted in the fourth quarter that insurance costs were elevated. The same level of expense did not repeat this quarter, thus contributing to a modest sequential improvement in the first quarter.

收入成本的降低主要歸因於三類費用的降低。首先，由於我們提供給客戶的燃料減少，運輸和燃料因工作組合而下降。這通常很少帶來利潤，所以這實際上對我們的利潤率有正面的影響。二是材料供應減少。隨著我們的工作內容每季發生變化，我們在這些工作中提供的沙子和化學品的數量也會發生變化。最後，我們注意到第四季保險成本上升。本季沒有出現相同的支出水平，導致第一季季比略有改善。

Selling, general and administrative expenses were $42.5 million up from $41.2 million as a percentage of revenues increased 50 basis points to 12.8%, reflecting increased IT modernization project expenses and slightly lower revenues. Our first quarter tax rate was 27.2%, more in line with our normalized tax rate. Recall that our fourth quarter of 2024 tax rate was unusually low due to the impact of tax planning strategies and interest received on past refunds.

銷售、一般及行政開支由 4,120 萬美元增至 4,250 萬美元，佔收入百分比增加 50 個基點至 12.8%，反映 IT 現代化項目開支增加及收入略有下降。我們第一季的稅率為 27.2%，與我們的正常化稅率更加一致。回想一下，由於稅務規劃策略和過去退稅所收到的利息的影響，我們 2024 年第四季的稅率異常低。

Notably, we had higher sequential EBITDA. The increase in tax rate drove a slight sequential net income decline compared to Q4 2024. Diluted EPS of $0.06. In the First quarter was flat versus the fourth quarter. EBITDA was $48.9 million up from $46.1 million with EBITDA margin increasing 100 basis points sequentially to 14.7%. For the quarter, operating cash flow was $39.9 million and after CapEx of $32.3 million free cash flow was $7.6 million. At quarter end, we had $327 million in cash and no debt on the balance sheet. During the quarter, we paid $8.7 million in dividends. Regarding the 2025 capital spending expectations, we now project $165million to $215 million inclusive of pintail for the next nine months, mostly related to maintenance.

值得注意的是，我們的 EBITDA 連續上漲。與 2024 年第四季相比，稅率的提高導致淨收入環比略有下降。稀釋每股收益為0.06美元。第一季與第四季持平。EBITDA 從 4,610 萬美元上升至 4,890 萬美元，EBITDA 利潤率較上季增加 100 個基點至 14.7%。本季度，營運現金流為 3,990 萬美元，扣除 3,230 萬美元的資本支出後，自由現金流為 760 萬美元。截至季末，我們擁有 3.27 億美元現金，資產負債表上沒有債務。本季度，我們支付了 870 萬美元的股息。關於 2025 年的資本支出預期，我們現在預計未來九個月的資本支出將達到 1.65 億美元至 2.15 億美元（包括針尾鴨），主要用於維護。

Shifting now to some pintail modelling notes. Pintail closed after the first quarter, so there was no material PML balance sheet or cash flow impact from the deal in our results. We are not providing explicit accretion guidance for the transactions, but we do expect it to be accretive to EPS and cash flow for 2025. Based on her comments, you should be able to make reasonable projections for revenues in EBITDA, which will be in large part influenced by overall [OFS] market conditions. Beyond the EBITDA impact, please note a few other modelling items. CapEx for Pintail will likely be up to $20 million on an annualized basis, with depreciation expected to approximate annualized CapEx. We will lose interest on the $170 million cash portion of the transaction funding, as well as incremental interest expense on the $50 million seller note. It has a floating rate of sulfur plus 200 basis points. Lastly, based on the share price, immediately before April first, we issued approximately $4.5 million shares.

現在轉向一些針尾鴨造型筆記。Pintail 在第一季後關閉，因此該交易對我們的業績沒有重大的 PML 資產負債表或現金流量影響。我們沒有為這些交易提供明確的增值指導，但我們確實預計它將在 2025 年增加每股收益和現金流。根據她的評論，您應該能夠對 EBITDA 中的收入做出合理的預測，這在很大程度上將受到整體 [OFS] 市場狀況的影響。除了 EBITDA 影響之外，請注意其他一些建模項目。Pintail 的年度資本支出可能高達 2000 萬美元，預計折舊額將接近年度資本支出。我們將損失交易資金中 1.7 億美元現金部分的利息，以及 5,000 萬美元賣方票據的增量利息費用。其硫磺浮動利率為加200個基點。最後，根據股價，在 4 月 1 日之前，我們發行了價值約 450 萬美元的股票。

We will complete accounting in the coming months and note that certain future expenses impacted by the purchase price allocation and related valuation, including the amortization of intangible assets were not contemplated in these figures. On another topic, we may have seen the company has filed an S3 registration statement with the SEC, which includes registering the Rawlings Family control group shares. The Rawlings family has been a longtime shareholder with ongoing representation on our board. They've always been supportive of the company and we do not believe this changes that relationship. We view the registration of the control group shares as good corporate housekeeping. I'll now turn it back over to Ben for some closing remarks.

我們將在未來幾個月內完成會計核算，並注意到這些數字並未考慮受購買價格分配和相關估值影響的某些未來費用，包括無形資產攤提。在另一個主題上，我們可能已經看到該公司向美國證券交易委員會提交了 S3 註冊聲明，其中包括註冊 Rawlings 家族控制集團股份。羅林斯家族一直是我們的長期股東，並在我們的董事會中擁有代表權。他們一直支持公司，我們相信這不會改變這種關係。我們認為控制集團股份的登記是良好的公司管理措施。現在我將把發言權交還給本，請他發表一些結束語。

Thank you, Mike. To wrap up, I want to touch on the macro environment. We, we've entered a period of high uncertainty and limited visibility with respect to tariffs and their impact on inflation and the economy in general. Tariffs in the current form will likely push equipment prices higher, put even more pressure on the industry to be disciplined with capital spending. More broadly, the potential economic impact from tariffs and trade disputes increases uncertainty and contributed to oil prices falling to the low $60 range. Oil at these prices makes it difficult for some customers to justify continued completion activities at prior levels, but only time will tell.

謝謝你，麥克。最後，我想談談宏觀環境。我們已經進入了關稅及其對通貨膨脹和整體經濟的影響高度不確定和可見度有限的時期。當前形式的關稅可能會推高設備價格，給產業帶來更大的壓力，迫使其嚴格控制資本支出。更廣泛地說，關稅和貿易爭端帶來的潛在經濟影響增加了不確定性，並導致油價跌至 60 美元以下。在這樣的油價下，有些客戶很難證明繼續以先前的水平進行完井活動的合理性，但只有時間才能證明一切。

News flow and market developments are dynamic in the current environment. We, as well as [OFS] competitors and upstream and downstream players in the value chain will have to navigate these uncertainties as we assess investment commitments. However, despite some mild turbulence and unknowns, a few things remain unchanged. Our balance sheet is strong, our dividends secure, and we have ample liquidity to ride out volatility and still capitalize on opportunities as they arise. We believe the company has an attractive mix of service lines and brands, customers, and geographic presences, and will execute our strategy with patience and discipline, including our pursuit of additional acquisitions.

在當前環境下，新聞流和市場發展是動態的。在評估投資承諾時，我們以及 [OFS] 競爭對手和價值鏈中的上下游參與者都必須應對這些不確定性。然而，儘管存在一些輕微的動盪和未知因素，但有些事情仍然沒有改變。我們的資產負債表強勁，股息有保障，我們擁有充足的流動性來抵禦波動，並且仍然能夠抓住出現的機會。我們相信該公司擁有極具吸引力的服務線和品牌、客戶和地理分佈組合，並將耐心和紀律地執行我們的策略，包括追求額外的收購。

On a separate note, we'd like to welcome Steve Lewis, our board of directors, after being elected this week. Steve retired from the law firm Troutman Pepper, formerly Trout and Sanders in 2023, where he had served in various leadership roles including Chairman and CEO. At the same time, Gary Rawlings and Pam Rawlings have retired from our board. We thank them for the years of contributions, leadership, and service.

另外，我們歡迎本週當選的董事會成員史蒂夫劉易斯 (Steve Lewis)。史蒂夫於 2023 年從 Troutman Pepper 律師事務所（前身為 Trout and Sanders）退休，他曾在該律師事務所擔任過各種領導職務，包括董事長和執行長。與此同時，加里·羅林斯 (Gary Rawlings) 和帕姆·羅林斯 (Pam Rawlings) 已從我們的董事會退休。我們感謝他們多年來的貢獻、領導和服務。

In an often volatile market, our discipline remains consistent with a focus on financial stability and long term shareholder returns. I also want to thank all our employees who work tirelessly to deliver high levels of service and value to our customers. Thanks for joining us this morning and at this time we'd be happy to address any questions you may have.

在經常波動的市場中，我們的紀律始終如一，注重財務穩定和長期股東回報。我還要感謝所有不知疲倦地工作，為客戶提供高水準服務和價值的員工。感謝您今天早上加入我們，我們很樂意解答您可能遇到的任何問題。

[Operator instructions]

[操作員說明]

And your first question comes from a line of Stephen Gengaro with Stifel.

您的第一個問題來自 Stifel 的 Stephen Gengaro。

Please go ahead.

請繼續。

Good morning.

早安.

You may be on mute.

您可能處於靜音狀態。

Can you hear me?

你聽得到我嗎？

Yeah.

是的。

Oh, there you go. The operator didn't like me. The, when we, you talked a little bit about this, I think on the prepared remarks, but when we think about the pressure pumping market in general, are you seeing like what are you seeing in sort of pricing conversations and are you seeing any differences kind of versus prior periods of softness in the market?

噢，就這樣。接線生不喜歡我。當我們，您談到這一點時，我認為是在準備好的評論中，但是當我們考慮整個壓力泵市場時，您是否看到了您在定價對話中看到的情況，以及您是否看到了與之前市場疲軟時期相比的任何差異？

I think I understand the question. Each one of these cycles are different, yet they're very much the same. I think some of what's happening is, again, with all the uncertainty about what's going on and the fact that you know things could in fact flip back, I think you know our customers are scrambling, they're trying to respond to, their potential impact with lower oil prices, so they're trying to do what they can, service companies like us are trying to, hang in there and do the best we can to TRY to be accommodating to our customers yet, we're trying to, we're trying to maintain our business as well. So, I don't know that the discussions are completely different, but I think circumstances are perhaps a bit different and that may. Impact slightly those discussions, but it's all about, the give and take in trying to reach hopefully a decent place for both parts.

我想我明白這個問題了。每個週期都不同，但它們又非常相似。我認為，由於目前發生的一切不確定性以及情況可能出現逆轉的事實，我們的客戶正在努力應對油價下跌可能帶來的影響，他們正在盡其所能，像我們這樣的服務公司也在努力堅持下去，盡最大努力滿足客戶的需求，我們也在努力維持我們的業務。所以，我不知道討論是否完全不同，但我認為情況可能有點不同，這是可能的。對這些討論有一點影響，但這一切都是為了雙方的互相妥協，希望能夠達到對雙方都有利的局面。

Okay, great. And then following pintail or can you just kind of remind us when you think about capital allocation kind of what the priorities are and when you're looking at M&A what are sort of the two or three most important criteria you look for?

好的，太好了。然後，在針尾鴨之後，您能否提醒我們，當您考慮資本配置時，優先事項是什麼，以及當您考慮併購時，您要尋找的兩三個最重要的標準是什麼？

Well, obviously we want, creative transactions, we certainly, adding to existing businesses that we have that have good strong brands is certainly a criteria, but again looking for customers, we want more exposure to the larger customers that should translate into, more steady business, less volatility, also looking for companies, service lines that have good free cash flow generating capability, we all know the pressure pumping is, it is a very large part of the overall, well completion cost, but it is highly competitive right now. We still are committed to that business, but we're looking to grow in some other service lines and with brands. That, brands with good management teams, that can produce some good free cash flow. So that's really our priority, more exposure to EMP customers and businesses with good free cash flow potential at prices that can be accredited to our results.

嗯，顯然我們想要創造性的交易，當然，在現有業務的基礎上增加強大的品牌當然是一個標準，但再次尋找客戶，我們希望更多地接觸更大的客戶，這應該轉化為更穩定的業務，更少的波動，也在尋找具有良好自由現金流生成能力的公司和服務線，我們都知道壓力泵是整體完井成本中非常大的一部分，但現在競爭非常激烈的一部分，但現在競爭非常激烈。我們仍然致力於該業務，但我們希望在其他一些服務線和品牌上實現成長。擁有優秀管理團隊的品牌可以產生良好的自由現金流。因此，這確實是我們的首要任務，即以能夠反映我們業績的價格，向更多 EMP 客戶和具有良好自由現金流潛力的企業提供產品。

Great, thanks. And then the one final one was when, and I'm just, I don't want to give you the wrong numbers here, but when we think about the pintail business, I think it was running kind of close to about $90 million in revenue a quarter based on the info that was disclosed. Is that about the right starting point right now as we think about layering it in?

太好了，謝謝。然後最後一個是，我只是不想在這裡給你錯誤的數字，但是當我們考慮針尾鴨業務時，根據披露的信息，我認為它每季度的收入接近 9000 萬美元。當我們考慮分層時，這是現在正確的起點嗎？

Stephen, we said in our earlier comments that they did a little over 400 million in 2024, and each quarter was right at 100, so I think. 100 more or less or whatever, they've kind of as we indicated they kind of reached their critical mass so, but certainly not completely or can't avoid the overall market forces that are in place but in round numbers probably closer to 100. Great.

史蒂芬，我們在之前的評論中說過，他們在 2024 年的銷量略高於 4 億，每個季度的銷量都恰好是 1 億，所以我認為。 100 多或少，或其他什麼，他們就像我們所指出的那樣，已經達到了臨界規模，但肯定不是完全的，或者說無法避免整體市場力量的影響，但大致數字可能接近 100。偉大的。

All right, thank you for the.

好的，謝謝你。

Details.

細節。

Thank you, appreciate the questions.

謝謝，感謝您的提問。

[Operator instructions]

[操作員說明]

And your next question comes from the line of Donald Crist with Johnson Rice . Please go ahead.

你的下一個問題來自約翰遜賴斯的唐納德克里斯特。請繼續。

Good Morning guys. How are you all today?

大家早安。大家今天好嗎？

Good morning, Don.

早安，唐。

Are you seeing any shift in kind of customer activity and I know pressure pumping is a generally a large topic of discussion, but in your other service line, do you see any shift away from High CapEx projects, i.e., new wells and new pads towards workovers or anything like that that may have a bigger impact to ENP's cash flows with smaller dollars.

您是否看到客戶活動有任何轉變？我知道壓力泵送通常是一個很大的討論主題，但在您的其他服務線中，您是否看到從高資本支出項目（即新井和新平台）轉向修井或類似項目的任何轉變，這些項目可能會以較少的資金對 ENP 的現金流產生更大的影響。

That's a reasonable question, Don. I think it's a little bit early. To know that, or to have a whole lot of, feedback on that certainly seems reasonable and in prior cycles that type of shift has occurred, so, we're certainly watching for that sort of thing. Good question.

這是一個合理的問題，唐。我認為現在有點早。了解這一點，或者對此有大量的反饋，這當然是合理的，而且在之前的周期中，這種轉變已經發生過，所以，我們肯定會關注這類事情。好問題。

Okay. And on a typical job kind of timeline, like what is your visibility normally. I mean, if you're either, fracking a well or a pad rather, do you have visibility on the next two pads or just the next pad? Like when is that decision point made normally in normal kind of business cycle to where we can kind of forecast like how far out you know kind of what you're going to be doing?

好的。在典型的工作時間表上，您的可見性通常是多少。我的意思是，如果您正在對一個井或一個平台進行水力壓裂，您是否可以看到接下來的兩個平台，還是只能看到下一個平台？例如，在正常的商業週期中，這個決策點通常是在什麼時候做出的，我們可以預測你對自己將要做的事情了解多少？

Well, our frac business, historically, as you and others know, has been more the spot market and semi-dedicated, so it depends on, the size of the customer and the nature of, the type of work we're doing. Typically, for the semi-dedicated customers we have some visibility for months at a time, maybe not a year or more, but we certainly typically have some level of visibility spot market much less so. But we do have a calendar, we watch the calendar, we maintain the calendar. We're always trying to work, and minimize the white space, be that with a dedicated customer, semi-dedicated or spot. So, it just depends on the customer. Some of our other service lines that have more dedicated work, the visibility is a bit longer. As you can imagine though customers are right now, they are looking at different alternatives and. And as we see it right now, kind of looking ahead, early in the 2nd quarter things look to be relatively stable, but, it's hard enough and uncertainty, is the word of the day or the time right now. We know that there are discussions going on and we'll just have to wait and see and get prepared for and then react to whatever happens.

嗯，正如您和其他人所知，從歷史上看，我們的壓裂業務更多的是現貨市場和半專用市場，因此這取決於客戶的規模以及我們所從事的工作的性質。通常情況下，對於半專用客戶，我們可以一次性獲得幾個月的可見性，也許不是一年或更長時間，但我們通常對現貨市場有一定程度的可見性，但情況就不那麼明顯了。但是我們確實有日曆，我們查看日曆，我們維護日曆。我們始終致力於努力工作，盡量減少空白，無論是針對專門客戶、半專門客戶或現貨客戶。所以，這取決於客戶。我們的其他一些服務線有更專注的工作，可見性更長一些。正如您所想像的，客戶現在正在尋找不同的替代方案。正如我們現在所看到的，展望未來，第二季度初的情況看起來相對穩定，但是，這已經夠困難了，不確定性是當前的熱門詞。我們知道正在進行討論，我們只需要等待，做好準備，然後對可能發生的任何事情做出反應。

Okay. And one of your competitors reported last night and talked about a kind of uptick in gas-directed activity, whether it be in the Eagle Ford or midcontinent or other places. Are you seeing any pickup yet or is that still a couple of months down the road, you think?

好的。你們的一位競爭對手昨晚報告稱，天然氣導向活動增加，無論是在鷹福特、中部大陸還是其他地方。您認為現在看到任何回升了嗎？還是說還需要幾個月的時間？

I think probably a little further down the road we are hearing a little bit. We do have exposure to some natural gas focused basins, especially with our downhole tools business. It was very traditionally strong natural gas plays. Our downhole tools business is very well equipped to be able to move people and equipment around very easily and quickly. So having those operating locations in place, we'll be able to. Jump very quickly on the opportunities with that service line and a couple of our other service lines, less so for pressure pumping, we do have some exposure to the mid-on, so if things were to pick up there, we could certainly take advantage there, but the biggest opportunity for us is probably it would be on the downhole tool side.

我想我們可能稍後會聽到一些消息。我們確實接觸了一些以天然氣為重點的盆地，尤其是我們的井下工具業務。傳統上，這是一個非常強大的天然氣產區。我們的井下工具業務設備齊全，能夠非常輕鬆、快速地調動人員和設備。有了這些營運地點，我們就能做到這一點。我們迅速抓住了該服務線和我們的其他幾條服務線帶來的機會，壓力泵服務線的機會較少，但我們確實對中上游有一些接觸，所以如果那裡的情況好轉，我們當然可以利用那裡的優勢，但對我們來說最大的機會可能是在井井有條工具方面。

Okay. I appreciate the colour. I'll turn it back to the operator. Thanks.

好的。我很欣賞這個顏色。我會將其轉回給接線生。謝謝。

Thank you don. I appreciate it.

謝謝你，唐。我很感激。

Your next question comes from the line of John Daniel with Daniel Energy Partners. Please go ahead.

您的下一個問題來自 Daniel Energy Partners 的 John Daniel。請繼續。

Hey Ben, thanks for thanks for including me. Just a couple of quick ones, I think in your prepared remarks. That some of your, some of the older pumping equipment out there is being sold by presumably some of your competitors. I'm just curious if you can talk about is that whether it's frac equipment or other assets in your portfolio, do you guys see a need to sell assets and Just your thoughts on that on that equipment re-entering the market.

嘿，本，謝謝你邀請我。我認為您準備好的發言中只有幾個簡短的問題。你們的一些較舊的泵送設備大概是由你們的一些競爭對手出售的。我只是好奇，您是否可以談談，無論是壓裂設備還是您投資組合中的其他資產，您是否認為有必要出售資產，以及您對這些設備重新進入市場的看法。

What was the very end of your comment?

你的評論最後是什麼？

What if some of your peers, I think have sold or trying to sell some of their older, tier two equipment. Others are smaller companies are selling assets just to try to generate cash. You guys clearly don't need to generate cash because your balance is fine, but I'm just curious if you could broadly speak about. What you're seeing in terms of who's buying some of that equipment, just your thoughts on that side of the market.

我認為，如果您的一些同行已經出售或試圖出售一些較舊的二級設備，該怎麼辦？其他一些規模較小的公司正在出售資產，只是為了賺取現金。你們顯然不需要產生現金，因為你們的餘額很好，但我只是好奇你們是否可以廣泛地談論一下。就購買這些設備的人來說，您看到了什麼，您對這個市場有什麼看法？

Oh, it's a good question. Again, we have, as we indicate, have seen some opportunities. I don't know who might be buying that. We have rarely over the years found an opportunity that we were comfortable trying to make investments on in a used piece of equipment, that we have done a little bit of that but not in a whole small way. And maybe kind of, thinking about the question too, we talked about the fact that, we monitor our equipment and when it comes to end of life or inefficient operations or whatever for frac we look to move those assets out. We don't like to stack them up in the last year or two when that need or opportunity arose, we've been able to reallocate some of those assets to other of our service lines that can use that type of equipment. It can be very, it can contribute very nicely to the other service lines, so we've done some of that. If we were to sell our equipment, we, we've been very diligent about trying to make sure it can or doesn't re-enter the frac market. So that could include selling. It overseas or being able to or to disassemble the parts and try to distribute it that way so we're very keenly aware of trying to you know introduce any more equipment that can be competitive in the market.

哦，這是個好問題。再次，正如我們所指出的，我們已經看到了一些機會。我不知道誰會買這個。多年來，我們很少找到一個讓我們願意嘗試投資二手設備的機會，我們也做過一些這樣的投資，但規模都不大。也許，我們也在思考這個問題，我們談到了這樣一個事實：我們監控我們的設備，當設備壽命終止或運作效率低下或出現任何水力壓裂問題時，我們就會尋求將這些資產轉移出去。我們不想在過去一兩年內將它們堆積起來，當這種需求或機會出現時，我們已經能夠將其中一些資產重新分配給可以使用此類設備的其他服務線。它可以對其他服務線做出很好的貢獻，所以我們做了一些這樣的工作。如果我們要出售我們的設備，我們會非常努力地確保它能夠或不會重新進入壓裂市場。因此這可能包括銷售。它在海外或能夠拆卸零件並嘗試以這種方式分銷，所以我們非常清楚嘗試引進更多可以在市場上具有競爭力的設備。

Okay. The next one, thanks for that. The next one is on CapEx, just quickly, Q1 CapEx is call it low 30s. Which means you're underspending relative to the guidance here on the low end, if you will. What's the, what would you need to see to sort of accelerate that spend in the back half of the year? And is there more of a chance that, we would see that CapEx dollars be allocated to, further creative M&A opportunities?

好的。下一個，謝謝。下一個是關於資本支出，很快，Q1 資本支出是 30 多美元。這意味著，相對於低端指導而言，你的支出是不足的，如果你願意的話。那麼，您需要看到什麼來加速下半年的支出呢？我們是否更有可能看到資本支出被分配到更多有創意的併購機會？

Hey John, Mike. Yes, I think it will just it will be based on market conditions overall. We're looking to spend the CapEx we need to maintain our equipment or if there is something to creative, we, we'll spend the money on that as well, but we are really looking at. Trying to see what we're really going to need to spend to meet all our customer needs for the year because no one knows really what's happening overall the maximum conditions out there so we've really, pushed back or. Ask our businesses to really look at whether they need to do that this year or if we can hold off next year just so we also aren't spending all our cash on equipment that we're not going to get a good return on in the short term so that we still have a strong balance sheet so we, can do further acquisitions also. So, we are still projecting to probably pick up a little bit of spending as the year goes on, but hopefully that kind of gives a little bit. how we think about it.

嘿，約翰，麥克。是的，我認為這將取決於整體市場狀況。我們希望花費維護設備所需的資本支出，或者如果有任何創意，我們也會在這方面花錢，但我們確實在考慮。試圖了解我們真正需要花多少錢才能滿足今年所有客戶的需求，因為沒有人真正知道總體上會發生什麼，在最大限度的條件下，我們真的推遲了。要求我們的企業認真考慮他們是否需要在今年這樣做，或者我們是否可以推遲到明年，這樣我們就不會把所有的現金都花在短期內無法獲得良好回報的設備上，這樣我們仍然擁有強勁的資產負債表，我們也可以進行進一步的收購。因此，我們仍然預計，隨著時間的推移，支出可能會增加，但希望這能帶來一些幫助。我們如何看待它。

Yes, I was just going to say I think yeah, the first quarter number just there was a little bit of managing there trying to, not spend where we don't need to spend, but I think it was just sort of the timing worked out to where it was a relatively low annualized spend that was, I think just the way the everything fell out in terms of.

是的，我只是想說，我認為是的，第一季的數字只是有一些管理，試圖不花我們不需要的錢，但我認為這只是某種時間安排，相對較低的年度支出，我認為這就是一切結果的方式。

Then one quick final one for me as the year unfolds with the uncertainty, I presume you're going to see lots of M&A opportunities and just giving Pintail strong presence in the Permian, would you say that your folk would you be more inclined to be focused on further consolidating the Permian market, not just say wireline but other services, or are you sort of somewhat agnostic and willing to look at other bases?

然後，我最後快速問一句，隨著一年的展開和不確定性，我推測您將會看到很多併購機會，並且只要 Pintail 在二疊紀盆地佔有強大的地位，您是否會說您的員工更傾向於專注於進一步鞏固二疊紀市場，不僅僅是有線服務，還有其他服務，或者您是否有點不可知論並願意考慮其他基地？

I think that's a good question. We're agnostic or we're open to the opportunities in other basins as well. And again, with the impending expected opportunities in the natural gas basins, now may be a good time before things really do pick up big time, maybe there's something up that has exposure to some of those other basins that we could take advantage of. So, I think. We're looking at talking about several things. It's, our discussions are not all around. We need to focus on the permit. Our discussions are around let's look for appropriate opportunities and each company and each business and each service line and each brand has different attributes and, so we're open, we're open.

我認為這是個好問題。我們對此持不可知論態度，或者說我們也對其他盆地的機會持開放態度。而且，鑑於天然氣盆地即將出現的預期機遇，現在可能是事情真正大幅好轉的好時機，也許有一些可以接觸到其他一些盆地的東西，我們可以利用它們。所以，我認為。我們正在討論幾件事。我們的討論並不全面。我們需要關注許可證。我們的討論圍繞著尋找合適的機會，每個公司、每個業務、每條服務線和每個品牌都有不同的屬性，所以我們是開放的，我們是開放的。

Okay, thank you for including me.

好的，謝謝你邀請我。

Sure, thank you, thanks, John.

當然，謝謝你，謝謝，約翰。

This concludes our question and answer session. I will now turn the call back over to Ben Palmer.

我們的問答環節到此結束。現在我將把電話轉回給本·帕爾默。

Okay. Well, thank you all for listening in and your questions. We appreciate it and I hope you have a good rest of the day and look forward to catching up. Take care.

好的。好吧，感謝大家的收聽和提問。我們對此表示感謝，並希望您今天過得愉快，並期待與您見面。小心。

[operator instruction]

[操作員指令]

Thank you all for joining. You may now disconnect.

感謝大家的加入。您現在可以斷開連線。