P10 Inc (PX) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Hello, and welcome to the P10 fourth-quarter 2024 conference call. My name is Lateef, and I will be coordinating your call today. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, today's conference call is being recorded.

您好，歡迎參加 P10 2024 年第四季電話會議。我的名字是拉蒂夫 (Lateef)，今天我將負責協調您的通話。（操作員指示）提醒一下，今天的電話會議正在被錄音。

I will now hand the call over to your host, Mark Hood, EVP and Chief Administrative Officer. Mark, please go ahead.

現在我將電話轉給主持人、執行副總裁兼首席行政官馬克‧胡德 (Mark Hood)。馬克，請繼續。

Thank you, operator, and thank you, all, for joining us. On today's call, we will be joined by Luke Sarsfield, Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; and Amanda Coussens, EVP and Chief Financial Officer. Additionally, in the room with us today are Arjay Jensen, EVP, Head of Strategy and M&A; and Sarita Jairath, EVP, Global Head of Client Solutions.

謝謝接線生，也謝謝大家加入我們。在今天的電話會議上，我們將邀請董事長兼執行長 Luke Sarsfield；以及執行副總裁兼財務長 Amanda Coussens。此外，今天與我們一起在場的還有執行副總裁、策略與併購主管 Arjay Jensen；以及執行副總裁、全球客戶解決方案主管 Sarita Jairath。

Before we begin, I'd like to remind everyone that this conference call as well as the presentation slides may constitute forward-looking statements within the meaning of the federal securities laws, including the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. Forward-looking statements reflect management's current plans, estimates and expectations and are inherently uncertain. Actual results for future periods may differ materially from those expressed or implied by these forward-looking statements due to a number of risks and uncertainties that are described in greater detail in our earnings release and in our periodic reports filed from time to time with the SEC.

在我們開始之前，我想提醒大家，本次電話會議以及簡報投影片可能構成聯邦證券法（包括 1995 年《私人證券訴訟改革法案》）含義內的前瞻性陳述。前瞻性陳述反映管理層目前的計劃、估計和期望，本質上具有不確定性。由於我們的收益報告和不時向美國證券交易委員會提交的定期報告中更詳細描述的若干風險和不確定性，未來期間的實際結果可能與這些前瞻性陳述所表達或暗示的結果存在重大差異。

The forward-looking statements included are made only as of the date hereof. We undertake no obligation to update or otherwise revise any forward-looking statements as a result of new information or future events, except as otherwise required by law.

所包含的前瞻性陳述僅截至本文發布之日有效。除非法律另有規定，我們不承擔因新資訊或未來事件而更新或以其他方式修改任何前瞻性聲明的義務。

During the call, we will also discuss certain non-GAAP measures, which we believe can be useful in evaluating the company's future performance. A reconciliation of these measures to the most directly comparable GAAP measure is available in our earnings release and our filing with the SEC.

在電話會議中，我們也將討論某些非公認會計準則指標，我們認為這些指標有助於評估公司未來的表現。我們的收益報告和向美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 提交的文件中提供了這些指標與最直接可比較的 GAAP 指標的對帳表。

I will now turn the call over to Luke.

現在我將把電話轉給盧克。

Thank you, Mark. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining our fourth quarter and full year 2024 earnings call. We are extremely encouraged by what our team accomplished in 2024, and we are very well-positioned to advance our strategy further in the quarters ahead. On today's call, I will provide an overview of our financial highlights for the quarter and the year, reflect on our record performance, review our 5-year guidance, share our 2025 outlook, update you on the Qualitas Funds acquisition and discuss ongoing strategic imperatives that will support our growth plan. Amanda will also provide additional detail on our financial performance for the quarter and the year and key considerations for the year ahead.

謝謝你，馬克。大家早安，感謝您參加我們的 2024 年第四季和全年財報電話會議。我們的團隊在 2024 年取得的成就令我們深受鼓舞，我們已準備好在未來幾季進一步推進我們的策略。在今天的電話會議上，我將概述本季度和本年度的財務亮點，回顧我們的創紀錄業績，回顧我們的 5 年指導，分享我們的 2025 年展望，向您介紹 Qualitas Funds 收購的最新情況，並討論支持我們增長計劃的持續戰略要點。阿曼達還將提供有關我們本季和年度財務業績的更多詳細資訊以及未來一年的關鍵考慮因素。

In the fourth quarter, P10 made meaningful and demonstrable progress around our strategic initiatives, including adding key members to the leadership team to position P10 to drive growth. We ended the year in a position of strength, exceeding the financial and operating guidance we provided in February of 2024, in which we committed to deliver over $2.5 billion in gross fundraising, double-digit revenue growth, margins in the mid-40% range and a reinvigorated M&A process. To put some numbers around our outperformance, for the full year 2024, fee-paying AUM increased by 10%, revenues increased by 23%, adjusted EBITDA rose by 17%, and we generated $3.8 billion in gross fundraising. Notably, Bonaccord Capital Partners, our GP stake strategy, closed Fund II with a record $1.6 billion. It is our first fund to attract more than $1 billion in capital, and we believe LP interest speaks to the attractiveness of our differentiated middle market focus.

在第四季度，P10 在我們的策略性舉措方面取得了有意義且明顯的進展，包括向領導團隊增加關鍵成員，以使 P10 能夠推動成長。我們以強勁的勢頭結束了這一財年，超出了我們在 2024 年 2 月提供的財務和營運指導，我們承諾實現超過 25 億美元的總融資額、兩位數的收入增長、40% 左右的利潤率以及重新煥發活力的併購流程。以數字來說明我們的優異表現，2024 年全年，付費 AUM 成長了 10%，營收成長了 23%，調整後的 EBITDA 成長了 17%，我們的總募款金額為 38 億美元。值得注意的是，我們的 GP 股權策略 Bonaccord Capital Partners 以創紀錄的 16 億美元完成了第二期基金的募集。這是我們第一個吸引超過 10 億美元資本的基金，我們相信 LP 的興趣反映了我們差異化中端市場重點的吸引力。

Additionally, fee-related revenue grew by 14%, excluding the effects of direct and secondary catch-up fees, while full year FRE margins were 48.8%. In early 2024, we committed to reinvigorate our M&A engine. And in September, we announced our acquisition of Qualitas Funds, a leading European private equity fund-to-funds manager based in Madrid. The firm provides fund-to-funds, direct co-investing and NAV financing opportunities in the European lower middle market. We remain on track to close the transaction in the first quarter.

此外，不包括直接費用和二次補繳費用的影響，費用相關收入增加了 14%，而全年 FRE 利潤率為 48.8%。2024 年初，我們致力於重振我們的併購引擎。9 月，我們宣布收購總部位於馬德里的歐洲領先的私募股權基金管理公司 Qualitas Funds。該公司在歐洲中低端市場提供基金對基金、直接共同投資和資產淨值融資機會。我們仍有望在第一季完成交易。

Additionally, at our September 2024 Investor Day, we shared our longer-term vision, which included our target of more than doubling fee-paying AUM over the next 5 years through 2029. This equates to growth from $23.8 billion to $50 billion of fee-paying AUM. While we expect the vast majority of growth to be organic, we also expect to execute on value-creating M&A that meaningfully advances our strategy and delivers additional fee-paying AUM. Turning to margins. There are 3 key dynamics that are going to impact our FRE margin outlook.

此外，在 2024 年 9 月的投資者日上，我們分享了我們的長期願景，包括在未來 5 年（至 2029 年）內將付費 AUM 增加一倍以上的目標。這相當於付費資產管理規模從 238 億美元成長至 500 億美元。雖然我們預計絕大多數成長將是有機的，但我們也希望執行創造價值的併購，以有意義地推進我們的策略並提供額外的付費 AUM。轉向利潤。有三個關鍵動態將影響我們的 FRE 利潤率前景。

First, the key investments we are making in the business, which are largely focused on human capital in areas like distribution. We expect these investments to drive accelerating growth and provide a high ROI. Second, the ongoing mix shift within our portfolio of strategies. Some of our newer and faster-growing strategies have lower core FRE margins than some of the larger and more established parts of our business. And third, a dynamic that we think is really attractive is the inherent operating leverage in our model, particularly as we scale assets and revenues over the longer term.

首先，我們在業務上進行的關鍵投資主要集中在分銷等領域的人力資本。我們預計這些投資將推動加速成長並提供高投資報酬率。第二，我們的策略組合正在發生持續的變化。我們的一些較新、成長較快的策略的核心 FRE 利潤率低於我們業務中一些較大、較成熟的部分。第三，我們認為真正有吸引力的動態是我們模型中固有的營運槓桿，特別是當我們在長期內擴大資產和收入規模時。

The net aggregate effect of these 3 dynamics, excluding any impact from M&A, is that we see FRE margins expanding from our current near and intermediate-term target of the mid-40s percent to closer to 50% in the out years. Looking at our strong momentum in 2025, we remain on track to meet or exceed our 5-year goals. For 2025, we expect gross fundraising of at least $4 billion. This 2025 guidance reflects a 60% increase over our 2024 guidance of $2.5 billion. The guidance excludes the approximately $1 billion of incremental fee-paying assets we expect to receive following the close of the Qualitas Funds transaction.

在排除併購的影響後，這三種動態的淨總體效應是，我們預計 FRE 利潤率將從我們目前的近期和中期目標 40% 左右擴大到未來幾年的接近 50%。展望 2025 年的強勁勢頭，我們仍有望實現或超越我們的五年目標。到 2025 年，我們預計總籌資額至少為 40 億美元。2025 年指引比 2024 年 25 億美元的指引增加了 60%。該指引不包括我們預計在 Qualitas Funds 交易結束後收到的約 10 億美元增量付費資產。

In addition, we plan to have 19 commingled funds in the market at various times in 2025. This includes 4 Qualitas commingled funds. We expect step-downs and expirations to be in line with 2024 numbers between 5% and 7% of fee-paying AUM. As it relates to our revenue outlook, we expect double-digit growth, excluding direct and secondary catch-up fees and including revenue contribution from Qualitas Funds once the transaction closes. And finally, for 2025, we expect FRE margins to be in line with our Investor Day guidance with core organic FRE margins, excluding M&A, in the mid-40s percent.

此外，我們計劃在 2025 年的不同時間將 19 檔混合基金投放市場。其中包括 4 個 Qualitas 混合基金。我們預計，到 2024 年，遞減和到期金額將與付費 AUM 的 5% 至 7% 之間的數字一致。就我們的收入前景而言，我們預計收入將實現兩位數成長，不包括直接和二次補繳費用，但包括交易完成後 Qualitas Funds 的收入貢獻。最後，對於 2025 年，我們預計 FRE 利潤率將與我們的投資者日指引一致，核心有機 FRE 利潤率（不包括併購）將達到 45% 左右。

The Qualitas Funds business will put some modest downward pressure on 2025 margins, which is already baked into our mid-40s percent guidance. Our confidence in our future performance and our ability to execute is rooted in a number of compelling factors. Our platform is composed of elite high-quality underlying strategies with long track records of delivering durable alpha. We continue to have a vast and growing global LP base with over 3,800 relationships. And with the addition of Qualitas funds to our platform, we anticipate that number will increase to approximately 5,000, further expanding our European investor base and high net worth channel.

Qualitas Funds 業務將對 2025 年的利潤率造成一定程度的下行壓力，這已經反映在我們 40% 左右的預期中。我們對未來業績和執行能力的信心源自於許多令人信服的因素。我們的平台由精英高品質底層策略組成，具有提供持久阿爾法的長期記錄。我們繼續擁有龐大且不斷成長的全球 LP 基礎，擁有超過 3,800 個關係。隨著 Qualitas 基金加入我們的平台，我們預計這一數字將增加到約 5,000，從而進一步擴大我們的歐洲投資者基礎和高淨值管道。

We believe we are well-positioned as a world-class platform to serve clients while expanding our product set and the ways in which we can engage LPs through our investment offerings. With over 2 decades in the middle and lower middle market, P10 is a trusted partner with a unique competitive advantage from our very robust proprietary data platform. We also have a firm conviction that we are an acquirer of choice and an excellent partner to strategies looking to join a larger platform. Finally, the plan we put in place last year functions as the North Star that guides our actions. I would like to unpack each of these imperatives, what we achieved in 2024 and how we are thinking about 2025.

我們相信，我們擁有優越的條件，可以成為為客戶提供服務的世界級平台，同時擴大我們的產品系列以及透過我們的投資產品吸引 LP 的方式。P10 在中低端市場擁有超過 20 年的經驗，是我們值得信賴的合作夥伴，其非常強大的專有數據平台具有獨特的競爭優勢。我們也堅信，我們是首選的收購方，也是尋求加入更大平台的策略的絕佳合作夥伴。最後，我們去年制定的計畫就像是指引我們行動的北極星。我想逐一闡述這些必要條件，以及我們在 2024 年所取得的成就以及我們對 2025 年的展望。

First, we committed to optimizing our leadership team and corporate organizational structure. We made tremendous progress in 2024 by hiring key top-level corporate professionals, such as Arjay Jensen, Head of Strategy and M&A; Sarita Jairath, Global Head of Client Solutions; Melodie Craft, General Counsel and Chief Compliance Officer; and Mike Goodwin, Chief Information Officer. We also elevated our governance framework and appointed Tracy Benford as our first Lead Independent Director in June. As we think about 2025, we are working to strengthen the all-important middle layers of our organization and institutionalize our platform by enhancing our capabilities and skills across the organization. Second, we are committed to driving increased organic growth.

首先，我們致力於優化領導團隊和公司組織架構。2024 年，我們取得了巨大進步，聘請了策略和併購主管 Arjay Jensen 等關鍵的頂級企業專業人士； Sarita Jairath，全球客戶解決方案主管； Melodie Craft，總法律顧問兼首席合規官；以及首席資訊長 Mike Goodwin。我們也提升了治理框架，並於 6 月任命 Tracy Benford 為我們的首位首席獨立董事。展望 2025 年，我們正在努力加強組織中所有重要的中間層，並透過增強整個組織的能力和技能來使我們的平台製度化。其次，我們致力於推動有機成長。

We will find ways to accelerate our trajectory and increase the depth and breadth of our services by expanding our existing client franchise and delivering innovative products and solutions. Third, we committed to reaccelerating M&A by implementing a robust, disciplined and process-driven approach to inorganic growth. The Qualitas Funds acquisition demonstrates our commitment to this strategic pillar and inorganic growth continues to be a key focus in 2025 and beyond. We believe we have built the right team and processes, and we will look to execute on strategic value-creating transactions with franchises that complement our platform. Fourth, we committed to generating operational efficiencies through incentivizing collaboration and leveraging data insights.

我們將透過擴大現有客戶特許經營權和提供創新產品和解決方案來尋找加速我們發展軌跡並增加我們服務的深度和廣度的方法。第三，我們致力於透過實施強勁、嚴謹和流程驅動的無機成長方法來重新加速併購。Qualitas Funds 的收購顯示了我們對此策略支柱的承諾，無機成長仍然是 2025 年及以後的重點。我們相信我們已經建立了正確的團隊和流程，我們將尋求與補充我們平台的特許經營商執行策略價值創造交易。第四，我們致力於透過激勵協作和利用數據洞察來提高營運效率。

This work is underway in earnest, and we are evaluating a host of attractive opportunities. Our mission remains to operate more as one cohesive enterprise and generate the requisite efficiencies and cost savings that will position our teams for success. Our data insights are a key competitive advantage, and we plan on leveraging this in a thoughtful and appropriate way to the benefit of our clients. Fifth, we committed to enhancing our shareholder communications with an eye to greater visibility and transparency. In 2024, we made tremendous progress.

這項工作正在認真進行，我們正在評估一系列有吸引力的機會。我們的使命仍然是作為一個有凝聚力的企業來運營，並產生必要的效率和成本節約，為我們的團隊取得成功奠定基礎。我們的數據洞察力是一項關鍵的競爭優勢，我們計劃以周到和適當的方式利用這一點，為我們的客戶帶來利益。第五，我們致力於加強與股東的溝通，以提高知名度和透明度。2024年，我們取得了巨大的進步。

We established the 5 strategic pillars, held an Investor Day, offered clear financial guidance and disclosed additional KPIs that make it easier for the investment community to draw a comparison to our peers. In 2025, we will build upon our efforts to more broadly communicate P10's capabilities to investors, LPs and others and highlight our aspiration to be the category killer in the middle and lower middle market. Before I hand the call off to Amanda, I want to touch on our capital allocation efforts. We believe our stock represents a compelling entry point for investors, who are looking for access to a diversified alternatives platform focused on the lower and core middle market. In the fourth quarter, we repurchased 815,327 shares at an average price of $12.72, leaving $3.5 million available on the current buyback authorization.

我們建立了五大策略支柱，舉辦了投資者日，提供了明確的財務指導，並揭露了額外的關鍵績效指標 (KPI)，以便投資界更容易與我們的同行進行比較。2025年，我們將再接再厲，向投資者、LP等更廣泛地宣傳P10的功能，並強調我們成為中低階市場品類殺手的願望。在我將電話轉交給阿曼達之前，我想談談我們的資本配置工作。我們相信，我們的股票對於尋求進入專注於中低端市場的多元化替代平台的投資者來說是一個極具吸引力的切入點。第四季度，我們以平均 12.72 美元的價格回購了 815,327 股，目前回購授權中剩餘 350 萬美元可用。

For the full year of 2024, we repurchased 6,641,827 shares at an average price of $8.88. In total, the 2024 buyback amounted to $59.1 million. We continue to see share repurchases as an important tool for us to return capital to shareholders. With today's announcement, the Board has authorized an additional $40 million for share repurchases, bringing the total available for repurchases to approximately $43.5 million.

2024 年全年，我們以平均 8.88 美元的價格回購了 6,641,827 股。整體而言，2024 年的回購總額為 5,910 萬美元。我們持續將股票回購視為向股東返還資本的重要工具。根據今天的公告，董事會已批准額外 4,000 萬美元用於股票回購，使可供回購的總金額達到約 4,350 萬美元。

With that, I'll hand the call over to Amanda to provide a deeper look at our financials.

說完這些，我將把電話交給阿曼達，讓她更深入地了解我們的財務狀況。

Thank you, Luke. During the quarter, fee-paying assets under management were $25.7 billion, a 10% increase on a year-over-year basis. In the fourth quarter, $905 million of fundraising and capital deployment was offset by $152 million in step-downs and expirations. I think it's worth reminding everyone, our fourth quarter gross fundraising total excludes approximately $300 million of fee-paying commitments that closed earlier than expected and were included in our third quarter financials. Fundraising during the fourth quarter was driven by the successful close of Bonaccord II, which added $506 million in the quarter; RCP Multi-Strat II, which raised $75 million and RCP Fund XIX, which added $51 million.

謝謝你，盧克。本季度，管理的收費資產為 257 億美元，年增 10%。第四季度，9.05 億美元的融資和資本配置被 1.52 億美元的逐步減少和到期所抵銷。我認為值得提醒大家的是，我們第四季度的總籌款總額不包括比預期更早完成並包含在我們第三季財務報表中的約 3 億美元的付費承諾。第四季的融資得益於 Bonaccord II 的成功結束，該筆融資在本季增加了 5.06 億美元； RCP Multi-Strat II 籌集了 7,500 萬美元，RCP Fund XIX 又籌集了 5,100 萬美元。

As Luke mentioned earlier in the call, for 2025, we expect step-downs and expirations to be in the range of 5% to 7% of fee-paying assets under management, in line with our historical numbers. In 2025, we expect about 2/3 of the step-downs and expirations to occur in the first half of the year. Revenue in the fourth quarter was $85 million, a 35% increase over the fourth quarter of 2023. Year-over-year, revenue increased from $241.7 million to $296.4 million, up 23%. Average fee rate in the fourth quarter was 133 basis points in total with an average fee rate of 105 basis points, excluding the impact of secondary and direct catch-up fees.

正如盧克在電話會議中早些時候提到的那樣，到 2025 年，我們預計遞減和到期的資產將佔管理的付費資產的 5% 至 7%，與我們的歷史數據一致。到 2025 年，我們預計約有 2/3 的降級和到期將發生在上半年。第四季營收為 8,500 萬美元，比 2023 年第四季成長 35%。與去年同期相比，營收從 2.417 億美元增至 2.964 億美元，成長 23%。第四季平均費率總計為133個基點，扣除二級和直接補繳費用的影響，平均費率為105個基點。

For the full year, average fee rate was 120 basis points with an average fee rate of 107 basis points, excluding the impact of secondary and direct catch-up fees. In 2025, we expect the core fee rate to average 103 basis points, reflecting our expectation for fewer catch-up fees in the year. In the fourth quarter, we had 12 commingled funds in the market and saw a broad participation across our investment platform. Our private equity strategies raised and deployed $712 million. Our venture capital solution raised and deployed $28 million and our private credit strategies added $165 million to fee-paying assets under management.

全年平均費率為120個基點，扣除二級和直接補繳費用的影響，平均費率為107個基點。到 2025 年，我們預計核心費率平均為 103 個基點，這反映了我們對當年補繳費用減少的預期。第四季度，我們在市場上擁有 12 檔混合基金，且我們的投資平台參與度很高。我們的私募股權策略籌集並部署了 7.12 億美元。我們的創投解決方案籌集並部署了 2,800 萬美元，我們的私人信貸策略為管理的付費資產增加了 1.65 億美元。

The performance of P10 strategies is reflective of our diverse global investor base comprised of family offices and wealth managers, public pensions and endowments and foundations as well as our seasoned deal teams, who continue to execute on best-in-class investments and generate durable alpha. In the fourth quarter, catch-up fees were $18.9 million, bringing the total for the year to $38.9 million. Catch-up fees are driven by the timing of fund closings and in the fourth quarter, the fees were primarily attributable to the final closing of Bonaccord II. Bonaccord II's outsized catch-up fees were an extraordinary event that we do not expect to be repeated in the future. In the fourth quarter, direct and secondary catch-up fees incrementally increased ANI per share by around $0.07 per share.

P10 策略的表現反映了我們多元化的全球投資者群體，其中包括家族辦公室和財富經理、公共退休金和捐贈基金和基金會以及我們經驗豐富的交易團隊，他們繼續執行一流的投資並產生持久的阿爾法收益。第四季度，補繳費用為 1,890 萬美元，全年總額達 3,890 萬美元。追趕費用由基金關閉的時間決定，在第四季度，費用主要歸因於 Bonaccord II 的最終關閉。Bonaccord II 的超額補繳費用是一個非同尋常的事件，我們預計未來不會再發生這樣的事情。第四季度，直接和二次補繳費用使每股 ANI 逐漸增加約 0.07 美元。

Operating expenses in the fourth quarter were $62.2 million, an 8% increase over the same period a year ago. For the full year 2024, operating expenses were $235.8 million, a 7% increase over 2023. The increase was primarily driven by compensation expense associated with the successful closing of Bonaccord II and placement fees associated with fundraising at other strategies. GAAP net income in the fourth quarter was $5.7 million, an increase compared to a GAAP net loss of $1.9 million in the prior year quarter. For the full year 2024, GAAP net income was $19.7 million, an increase compared to a GAAP net loss of $7.8 million in 2023.

第四季營運費用為 6,220 萬美元，比去年同期成長 8%。2024 年全年營運費用為 2.358 億美元，比 2023 年成長 7%。成長的主要原因是與 Bonaccord II 成功結束相關的薪酬費用以及與其他策略的融資相關的安置費用。第四季 GAAP 淨收入為 570 萬美元，較去年同期 GAAP 淨虧損 190 萬美元有所增加。2024 年全年，GAAP 淨收入為 1,970 萬美元，較 2023 年 GAAP 淨虧損 780 萬美元有所成長。

Adjusted EBITDA in the fourth quarter was $42.9 million, an increase of 40% from the fourth quarter of 2023. For the year, adjusted EBITDA grew from $123.6 million to $144.5 million, a 17% increase. For the quarter, our adjusted EBITDA margin was 50.5%. Our margin was higher in the quarter due to the strength of our direct strategies and product mix. For the full year, adjusted EBITDA margin was 48.7%.

第四季調整後 EBITDA 為 4,290 萬美元，較 2023 年第四季成長 40%。全年調整後的 EBITDA 從 1.236 億美元成長至 1.445 億美元，增幅為 17%。本季度，我們的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 50.5%。由於我們的直接策略和產品組合的優勢，本季我們的利潤率更高。全年調整後的 EBITDA 利潤率為 48.7%。

For the fourth quarter, adjusted net income, or ANI, was $35.3 million, a 39% increase over the fourth quarter of 2023. For the full year, ANI increased from $102 million to $120.2 million, representing an 18% increase. For the quarter, fully diluted ANI was $0.30 per share, an increase of 44%. For the full year, fully diluted ANI was $1 per share. FRR in the quarter was $85 million, representing a 37% increase and FRE was $42.7 million, representing a 39% increase.

第四季度，調整後淨收入（ANI）為 3,530 萬美元，比 2023 年第四季成長 39%。全年來看，ANI 從 1.02 億美元增至 1.202 億美元，增幅達 18%。本季度，完全稀釋 ANI 為每股 0.30 美元，成長 44%。全年來看，完全稀釋的 ANI 為每股 1 美元。本季的 FRR 為 8,500 萬美元，成長 37%，FRE 為 4,270 萬美元，成長 39%。

Our FRE margin was 50.2% in the fourth quarter. For the full year, FRR was $291.3 million, FRE was $142.1 million, and the FRE margin was 48.8%. Cash and cash equivalents at the end of the fourth quarter were $67.5 million. At quarter end, we had an outstanding debt balance of $325 million and no balance on the revolver. There is $175 million available on the credit facilities.

我們的第四季 FRE 利潤率為 50.2%。全年FRR為2.913億美元，FRE為1.421億美元，FRE利潤率為48.8%。第四季末的現金和現金等價物為6750萬美元。截至季末，我們的未償債務餘額為 3.25 億美元，循環信貸餘額為零。信貸額度有 1.75 億美元可用。

As I reviewed at Investor Day, we plan to begin reporting fully taxed ANI per share in 2025. We believe this metric will further enable the investment community to draw an apples-to-apples comparison with our peers. We will also continue to pay our quarterly dividend for Class A and Class B common stock. Today, we declared a quarterly cash dividend of $0.035 per share payable on March 20, 2025, to stockholders of record as of the close of business on February 28, 2025. Finally, as of December 31, 2024, our Class A shares outstanding were 67,614,875 and Class B shares outstanding were 43,461,442.

正如我在投資者日上所回顧的那樣，我們計劃在 2025 年開始報告每股完全徵稅的 ANI。我們相信，這項指標將進一步使投資界能夠與我們的同業進行同類比較。我們也將繼續支付 A 類和 B 類普通股的季度股息。今天，我們宣布向截至 2025 年 2 月 28 日營業結束時登記在冊的股東派發每股 0.035 美元的季度現金股息，派發日期為 2025 年 3 月 20 日。最後，截至 2024 年 12 月 31 日，我們的 A 類流通股為 67,614,875 股，B 類流通股為 43,461,442 股。

Thank you for your time today. I'll now pass the call over to the operator to begin the Q&A session.

感謝您今天抽出時間。我現在將把電話轉給接線員，開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions) Ken Worthington, JPMorgan.

（操作員指示） 摩根大通的肯‧沃辛頓。

As we look ahead to the next couple of quarters, where is your sales team focusing? So what are the bigger funds in market? So you mentioned 19 funds, I think, in market in 2025. Which of those are sort of the biggest and most important for the sales and marketing team to get right to kind of hit your $4 billion -- hit or exceed, I'll say, that your $4 billion target?

展望未來幾個季度，您的銷售團隊的重點是什麼？那麼市場上有哪些較大的基金呢？所以你提到了 2025 年市場上將有 19 檔基金。對於銷售和行銷團隊來說，哪些是最大、最重要的，可以讓他們達到 40 億美元——或者說，達到或超過 40 億美元的目標？

It's Luke Sarsfield. Thanks for the question. And as we mentioned, you're right, we think we'll have 19 funds in total in the market at different times in 2025, not necessarily all at the same time, but at different times throughout the year. And in particular, 4 of those will come from Qualitas. And obviously, those will be things we'll focus on once we close the acquisition.

他是盧克·薩斯菲爾德。謝謝你的提問。正如我們所提到的，您說得對，我們認為到 2025 年，我們將在市場上的不同時間總共擁有 19 檔基金，不一定是同時出現，而是在一年中的不同時間出現。其中 4 個來自 Qualitas。顯然，這些將是我們在完成收購後將重點關注的事情。

And as we said, we continue to expect to close the acquisition later here in the first quarter. We're really excited about the product offering that we have in market in 2025 and our RCP strategy. We have a number of funds in the market, including our co-investment strategy, including our secondary strategy, including our primary fund-of-funds strategy, small and emerging managers, and we see real momentum across that. And I think that's probably reflective of some of the momentum we're seeing generally in the private equity space. Our TrueBridge, business has a number of strategies in the market that we're really excited about, particularly the blockchain and the seed micro strategy.

正如我們所說，我們仍然預計將在第一季稍後完成收購。我們對 2025 年在市場上推出的產品和 RCP 策略感到非常興奮。我們在市場上擁有許多基金，包括我們的共同投資策略、我們的二級策略、我們的一級基金中的基金策略、小型和新興管理者，我們看到了這些基金的真正發展勢頭。我認為這可能反映了我們在私募股權領域普遍看到的一些動力。我們的 TrueBridge 業務在市場上擁有許多令我們非常興奮的策略，特別是區塊鏈和種子微策略。

Five Points is going to be out raising a new credit strategy. We're really excited about that. We'll probably be back out in the market later this year with a number of other credit strategies, more news to come on that. And then finally, as we mentioned, on Bonaccord, we're excited about the momentum in that business, and I think we'll have some news to announce there as we get later in the year. So we think there are a lot of really interesting things in the market.

Five Points 將推出一項新的信貸策略。我們對此感到非常興奮。我們可能會在今年稍後重返市場並推出其他一些信貸策略，更多相關消息即將公佈。最後，正如我們所提到的，關於 Bonaccord，我們對該業務的發展勢頭感到非常興奮，我認為我們會在今年晚些時候宣布一些消息。所以我們認為市場上有很多真正有趣的東西。

Just to remind everybody, we think one of the really compelling things about our platform is the diversity of our business, the diversification of our fundraising. And I think we're really, really excited about the momentum and the outlook for 2025.

只是提醒大家，我們認為我們平台真正引人注目的事情之一是我們業務的多樣性、我們籌款的多樣化。我認為我們對 2025 年的發展勢頭和前景感到非常興奮。

Ben Budish, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的本‧布迪什 (Ben Budish)。

This is Nick Benoit on the call for Ben this morning. So I wanted to ask about the progress being made on your goals to broaden across new vehicles and different channels and maybe just how we should think about the investments that are going to be made in 2025? And I know last quarter, you provided some color on SMA fundraising. So maybe just an update on maybe what SMA fundraising was in the quarter? And then any updates on progress being made on that kind of vehicle?

我是 Nick Benoit，今天早上為 Ben 打電話。所以我想問一下，你們拓展新車型和不同通路的目標進展如何，以及我們應該如何考慮 2025 年的投資？我知道上個季度您為 SMA 籌款提供了一些資訊。那麼也許只是關於本季 SMA 籌款情況的更新？那麼有關這種車輛的進展有什麼最新消息嗎？

Thanks, Nick, and it's Luke again. That's a great question. And as we mentioned at Investor Day, one of our key areas of focus is going to be really about meeting our clients where they are and being a solution-oriented provider to them as we've always, frankly, aspired to be. And certainly, a part of that is continuing to have the broadest diversification in terms of product offerings to meet them where they want to go, but also to have it in the right wrappers. And so you're right, we think about a number of potential alternatives from SMAs that are helping our clients achieve their goals to different kinds of pooled vehicles we can use.

謝謝，尼克，又是盧克。這是一個很好的問題。正如我們在投資者日提到的那樣，我們關注的重點領域之一就是真正地滿足客戶的需求，並成為他們以解決方案為導向的提供者，坦白說，這也是我們一直以來的願望。當然，其中一部分就是繼續在產品供應方面實現最廣泛的多樣化，以滿足他們的需求，同時也要提供正確的包裝。所以你說得對，我們考慮了 SMA 的多種潛在替代方案，這些替代方案可以幫助我們的客戶實現他們對我們可以使用的不同類型的共享車輛的目標。

We've looked at in the past and had some various different rated feeder funds, and we think that, that's an exciting place. We think about kind of co-mingling some of our different strategies into kind of single point product offerings for our clients, and that's an opportunity. And so under Sarita's leadership, we are looking at a number of different ways to access that, to access different kinds of clients, whether it's in the RIA channel, whether it's in the high net worth channel, whether it's in the institutional channel. And that work continues in earnest, I would say. You're right, last quarter, we did talk about some of the momentum we had in the SMA parts of the business.

我們過去曾研究過一些不同評級的饋線基金，我們認為這是一個令人興奮的地方。我們考慮將我們的一些不同的策略融合在一起，為客戶提供單點產品，這是一個機會。因此，在 Sarita 的領導下，我們正在尋找多種不同的方式來接觸不同類型的客戶，無論是在 RIA 管道、高淨值管道還是機構管道。我想說，這項工作仍在認真地繼續著。你說得對，上個季度，我們確實談到了 SMA 業務部分的一些發展勢頭。

I think we're not going to get into necessarily just disclosing, kind of, by product type every quarter. But one thing we do is when we do have notable progress and notable success, we're going to make it a point, obviously, to note that for you so you can see our progress against those initiatives that we laid out at Investor Day. And so my guess is, as we get into 2025, you'll hear us talk about our progress very specifically around some of these initiatives, not the least of which will be SMAs.

我認為我們不一定每個季度都按產品類型進行披露。但我們會做的一件事是，當我們確實取得顯著進展和顯著成功時，我們顯然會特意向您指出這一點，以便您能夠看到我們在投資者日提出的那些舉措方面取得的進展。因此，我猜測，當我們進入 2025 年時，您會聽到我們談論我們在其中一些舉措方面取得的進展，其中最重要的是 SMA。

Great. If I could sneak in a follow-up question. I also wanted to ask about the M&A pipeline. So obviously, we have the Qualitas acquisition expected to close here in the quarter. But looking later in the year in '25, just kind of, like what looks attractive in the current pipeline?

偉大的。如果我可以偷偷問一個後續問題。我還想詢問有關併購管道的問題。顯然，我們預計 Qualitas 收購將在本季完成。但展望 25 年晚些時候，目前的管道中哪些看起來很有吸引力？

What do you see in terms of pricing? And then how are some of these initiatives under Arjay in terms of more recurring M&A starting to come through and come through this year?

您對定價有何看法？那麼，Arjay 領導下的這些舉措，就更頻繁的併購而言，今年進展如何？

Thanks, Nick. So maybe what I'll do is I'll start and frame it and seeing as Arjay is sitting here right next to me, I will turn it over to him to give a few thoughts. But I would say, look, one of the things we talked about at Investor Day, and I think we've been very successful at prosecuting is building what I would call a disciplined and programmatic approach to M&A. And a key part of that is building out a pipeline that is one that we are consistently monitoring, one that we are consistently executing on, one that we have different potential opportunities in different stages of the funnel. And so I think that, that's really important.

謝謝，尼克。所以也許我會做的是，我會開始並構思它，然後看到 Arjay 就坐在我旁邊，我會把它交給他，讓他表達一些想法。但我想說，你看，我們在投資者日談論的事情之一，我認為我們在起訴方面非常成功，就是建立一種我稱之為有紀律和程序化的併購方法。其中一個關鍵部分是建立一個我們持續監控的管道，一個我們持續執行的管道，一個在管道的不同階段擁有不同潛在機會的管道。所以我認為這非常重要。

I think we feel really good about both the state of the pipeline, but also the feedback we're hearing from potential partners around our attractiveness as a place where they want to be, they want to work and they want to partner with. And so with that, Arjay, maybe you want to add a few thoughts?

我認為我們對管道的狀態感到非常滿意，而且我們從潛在合作夥伴那裡聽到的回饋也讓我們感到很滿意，他們認為我們是他們想要去的地方、想要工作的地方、想要合作的地方。那麼，Arjay，也許你想補充一些想法？

Yes. I would just say -- thank you, Luke. I would just say that, look, we're working very hard at working an active pipeline. We think we have interesting opportunities across the areas and asset classes that we laid out at Investor Day, including focusing on private credit, direct lending, asset-backed. I think those are really important areas for us.

是的。我只想說——謝謝你，盧克。我只想說，看，我們正在努力建立一條活躍的管道。我們認為，我們在投資者日列出的領域和資產類別中都存在有趣的機會，包括專注於私人信貸、直接貸款和資產支持。我認為這些對我們來說確實非常重要。

I think interestingly, we talked about at Investor Day, the 1 step, 2 step, we think with Qualitas now that opens up interest in Europe with respect to direct lending and asset backed. So we're very focused on those things. We think there are interesting things we're looking at, and we're optimistic about the forward.

我認為有趣的是，我們在投資者日討論了第一步、第二步，我們認為 Qualitas 現在打開了歐洲對直接貸款和資產支持的興趣。所以我們非常關注這些事情。我們認為我們正在研究一些有趣的事情，我們對未來充滿樂觀。

Chris Kotowski, Oppenheimer & Co.

克里斯·科托夫斯基，奧本海默公司

I was just wondering, I think I heard Amanda say, you expected an average fee rate of 103 basis points for ex catch-up fees, but the last year was 107. I know it's a little small difference, but just wondering why it would go down quite by that magnitude?

我只是想知道，我想我聽到阿曼達說，你預計補繳費用的平均費率為 103 個基點，但去年是 107 個基點。我知道差異很小，但我只是想知道為什麼它會下降這麼多？

Thank you, Chris, for the question. So I'm going to frame my response around catch-up fees first in general. So as a reminder, we view our catch-up fees in 2 distinct categories. We have core fees from our primary funds, which occur on a more regular rate basis. They tend to be smaller in nature given the shorter duration of the fundraise.

謝謝克里斯提出的問題。因此，我將首先圍繞補繳費用總體來做出回應。因此提醒一下，我們將補繳費用分為兩個不同的類別。我們從主要基金中收取核心費用，這些費用是按照更常規的費率收取的。由於募款時間較短，其規模往往較小。

We also have direct and secondary fund catch-up fees that are episodic in nature. And because they raise bigger funds less frequently, it can be difficult to predict in size and frequency. So during 2024, our catch-up fees were significantly elevated relative to historical levels as a result of the funds that we had in the market, particularly our extraordinary results within Bonaccord II's fundraise that we do not expect to be repeated in the future, as we said. We do expect catch-up fees to be approximately $4 million to $5 million in 2025, which including our core fee rate ex secondary catch-up fees should remain stable at about 103 basis points for 2025.

我們還有直接和二級基金補繳費用，這些費用本質上是偶發性的。而且由於他們籌集大筆資金的頻率較低，因此很難預測其規模和頻率。因此，在 2024 年，由於我們在市場上擁有的資金，我們的補繳費用相對於歷史水平大幅上升，特別是我們在 Bonaccord II 融資中取得了非凡的成績，正如我們所說的那樣，我們預計未來不會再重複這種情況。我們確實預計 2025 年的補課費用約為 400 萬至 500 萬美元，其中包括我們的核心費率（不包括中學補課費用）在 2025 年應保持穩定在 103 個基點左右。

And Chris, I think it's just important to note, if you look back over the history of our business, we've been at that -- pretty consistently at that core fee rate. If you look in the kind of slide show we put out every quarter, you see 2021, we were at 100 basis points. 2022, we were at 103. 2023, we were at 103. 2024 was a little bit of a higher rate at 107.

克里斯，我認為值得注意的是，如果你回顧我們的業務歷史，我們一直保持著這個核心費率。如果您查看我們每季發布的投影片，您會發現 2021 年我們的利率為 100 個基點。 2022 年，我們的利率為 103。2023 年，我們的利率也為 103。2024 年的利率稍高一些，為 107。

And so when we look at kind of the guidance in the -- for 2025 in the 103 level, that's very much in line with the historical kind of trajectory of the fee rate in the business, and we think kind of reflects the momentum.

因此，當我們查看 2025 年 103 水平的指導時，這與業務費率的歷史軌跡非常一致，我們認為這反映了這種勢頭。

Aidan Hall, KBW.

艾丹·霍爾（Aidan Hall），KBW。

I just wanted to follow-up on the FRE margin commentary. I heard the thoughts around remaining in the mid-40s for '25 and also some of the incremental fundraising coming from less scaled managers and a little bit of a headwind. But at the same time, you guys just closed one of your largest funds with Bonaccord II, which is usually a tailwind to the margin. So just wanted to hear, how you're thinking about maybe the trajectory from here in '25? Is it the puts and takes there remain stable?

我只是想跟進一下 FRE 保證金評論。我聽到有人認為 25 年的回報率應該保持在 40% 左右，一些增量融資來自規模較小的管理者和一些逆風。但與此同時，你們剛剛關閉了最大的基金之一 Bonaccord II，這通常對保證金來說是順風。所以只是想聽聽，您對 25 年後的發展軌跡有何看法？那裡的投入和產出是否保持穩定？

Is it still striving for expansion in '25 or should we kind of be thinking about it contracting near term before going towards your longer term goals that you laid out at Investor Day?

它仍在努力在 25 年實現擴張，或者我們是否應該考慮在短期內收縮，然後再實現您在投資者日制定的長期目標？

So good question. And I'd just start by saying the guidance we gave at Investor Day is unchanged, right? We continue to believe in the near to intermediate term, the core, kind of, FRE margin rate will be in the mid-40s. And given the dynamics we see in our business, we think that will expand closer to 50% in the out years. So that guidance, that thinking, that trajectory, that momentum of margin is absolutely unchanged from what we thought back in September and what we continue to believe here today.

這個問題問得真好。我首先要說的是，我們在投資者日給出的指導沒有改變，對嗎？我們仍然相信，在近期至中期內，核心的 FRE 利潤率將在 40% 左右。鑑於我們所看到的業務動態，我們認為未來幾年這一數字將成長接近 50%。因此，這種指導、這種想法、這種軌跡、這種利潤勢頭與我們 9 月的想法以及我們今天仍然相信的完全沒有變化。

I'd make a few observations. The first is, as you can imagine, as Amanda talked about, we had meaningful catch-up fees in 2024. Those will tend to come at a higher margin than some of just what I would call regular way FRR management fees. And as a result, they will have some positive accretive impact on margin. And when we get those, it's great, and they will have a transitory benefit of driving margin higher.

我想提出幾點看法。首先，正如阿曼達所說，你可以想像，我們在 2024 年將收取有意義的補繳費用。這些費用的利潤率往往會高於我所說的常規 FRR 管理費。因此，它們將對利潤率產生一些正面的增值影響。當我們獲得這些時，這很棒，並且它們將具有暫時的提高利潤率的好處。

But when you look at kind of the core of the business, we really think about being in that mid-40s as we said, in the near and intermediate term and then seeing that accretion from there. I'd say 2 things. One, and you'll see it, and we've talked about it, we're still continuing to build out, particularly in our client solutions team focused on distribution. We think it will have ROI. We think it's going to be a really positive growth driver and momentum creator for our business, but the work is not done there yet, right?

但是，當你看到業務的核心時，我們確實會考慮在短期和中期內達到 40 年代中期的水平，然後從那裡開始成長。我想說兩件事。首先，你會看到，我們也討論過，我們仍在繼續建設，特別是專注於分銷的客戶解決方案團隊。我們認為它將獲得投資回報。我們認為這將成為我們業務真正積極的成長動力和動力創造者，但這項工作還沒有完成，對嗎？

Remember, Sarita only started in September. And so we're still very early days on this. Obviously, we're going to do that in a balanced and prudent way. And so everything is factored into our margin guidance. The second thing I would note is, and we've talked about this, it is the impact of the mix shift in our business impacting margin.

請記住，Sarita 是九月才開始的。因此，我們對此還處於非常早期的階段。顯然，我們將以平衡和審慎的方式做到這一點。因此，所有因素都已計入我們的利潤率指引中。我要指出的第二件事是，我們已經討論過這個問題，這是我們業務組合轉變對利潤率的影響。

And so again, we have some strategies that are growing faster, that tend to be at lower core margins because of the nature -- inherent nature of their businesses, and that will have some impact on margin relative to some of our larger, higher-margin businesses that tend to grow a little bit slower. And then I would just point out as well, and I think you heard this in my part of the script, we did mention that we factored it into our margin guidance. But we think in 2025, again, in that vein of different strategies having different kind of core margin profiles, Qualitas, which we're acquiring will have a modest, kind of, downward pressure on margin factored into our core guidance, still factored into that guidance of, kind of, mid-40s right now. But again, that's part of this whole mix shift conversation that we're having.

因此，我們有一些成長較快的策略，由於其業務的性質，其核心利潤率往往較低，這將對利潤率產生一定的影響，相對於我們一些規模較大、利潤率較高但增長速度往往較慢的業務而言。然後我還要指出的是，我想您在我的部分腳本中聽到了這一點，我們確實提到我們將其納入了我們的利潤率指導中。但我們認為，在 2025 年，以不同的策略擁有不同類型的核心利潤率狀況，我們收購的 Qualitas 的利潤率將面臨適度的下行壓力，這已計入我們的核心指導中，目前仍計入該指導中，約為 45%。但再說一次，這是我們正在進行的整個混合轉變對話的一部分。

Michael Cyprys, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的麥可‧賽普里斯 (Michael Cyprys)。

This is Stephanie on for Mike. Just hoping to get an update on Qualitas. What are some of the lower-hanging fruits in terms of integration or synergies? And then maybe longer term, what sort of opportunities do you see around cross-selling, new product development or maybe potentially leveraging additional data sets?

我是史蒂芬妮，代替麥克。只是希望獲得有關 Qualitas 的最新消息。在整合或綜效方面，有哪些容易達成的成果？那麼從長遠來看，您認為在交叉銷售、新產品開發或潛在利用額外資料集方面有哪些機會？

So thank you, Stephanie. Great question, and I think something we are really, really excited about. We actually just spent the last few days at a management offsite and we actually had -- even though the transaction hasn't officially closed yet, we had the opportunity to have the senior leadership team, the managing partners, Eric and Sergio from Qualitas join us. I will tell you the enthusiasm in the room was just absolutely palpable. As we mentioned, they're already working closely and well-known to 2 of our strategies, right?

所以謝謝你，斯蒂芬妮。這個問題問得好，我想這也是我們非常非常興奮的事情。實際上，我們剛剛在一次管理層外部會議上度過了幾天，儘管交易尚未正式結束，但我們有機會讓高級領導團隊、執行合夥人、Qualitas 的 Eric 和 Sergio 加入我們。我可以告訴你們，房間裡的熱情是絕對可以感受到的。正如我們所提到的，他們已經密切合作並且熟悉我們的兩種策略，對嗎？

They've been working with our RCP strategy for years. Their core strategy is a European middle and lower middle market, fund-to-fund strategy. Obviously, RCP has effectively the identical strategy in the U.S. market. And so, the -- when they get together, one is their compelling vision for what we can build on a global basis as a product offering focused on the middle and lower middle market.

多年來，他們一直在採用我們的 RCP 策略。他們的核心策略是歐洲中低階市場、基金對基金的策略。顯然，RCP在美國市場也採取了同樣的策略。因此，當他們聚在一起時，他們有一個令人信服的願景，那就是我們可以在全球範圍內打造專注於中低階市場的產品。

Second thing we spend a lot of time on is, they have a tremendous data set and data attribute that they bring around their kind of analysis of that European market. We have something, you saw it at Investor Day, through GPScout. It's very similar in the U.S. And I think the opportunity to combine that rich data set and be able to be a real solution provider for clients now on a global basis, or at least North America plus EMEA basis, is really, really compelling. The other thing I think that they bring to us is real know-how in how to design products and wrappers in Europe, right?

我們花費大量時間的第二件事是，他們擁有龐大的資料集和資料屬性，可以對歐洲市場進行分析。我們有一些東西，您可以在投資者日透過 GPScout 看到它。美國的情況非常相似。我認為，將豐富的數據集結合起來，並能夠成為全球客戶（或至少是北美和歐洲、中東和非洲地區）真正的解決方案提供者的機會，真的非常引人注目。我認為他們為我們帶來的另一件事是如何在歐洲設計產品和包裝的真正技術，對嗎？

So they've been very successful getting licensed in different European jurisdictions. They obviously have big throwaway in the private bank channel in Europe. That's one of the things. They've sold very successfully on a lot of large private bank platforms. And so that sort of distribution knowledge, that product wrapper knowledge, that synergy is really, really compelling.

因此，他們非常成功地獲得了不同歐洲司法管轄區的許可。他們顯然在歐洲的私人銀行管道中佔有很大的份額。這是其中一件事。他們在許多大型私人銀行平台上的銷售非常成功。因此，這種分銷知識、產品包裝知識和協同作用確實非常引人注目。

They also do a lot -- they are building and they've successfully raised a first fund in the NAV lending space, working closely with our Hark strategy. That's a place where we've been at that business for an incredibly long time, one of the pioneers in that business, as you know. And so, just watching the dynamic that we're seeing there is -- that is a big, big opportunity in Europe. It's still a big opportunity in the U.S., by the way, but it's much more advanced and mature in the U.S. than it is in Europe.

他們也做了很多事情——他們正在建設，並且已經成功在 NAV 借貸領域籌集了第一筆資金，與我們的 Hark 策略密切合作。如你所知，我們在這個領域已經耕耘了很長一段時間，我們是這個領域的先驅之一。因此，只要觀察我們所看到的動態，就會發現這對歐洲來說是一個巨大的機會。順便說一句，這在美國仍然是一個巨大的機遇，但它在美國比在歐洲更先進和成熟。

And so the opportunity to combine their relationship network, their distribution throw weight, their relationships with GPs with our core credit underwriting expertise, our knowledge of that NAV lending market is, we think, really differentiated. And we think we're just right now scratching the surface of that opportunity, but a lot more to come on that in the quarters and years ahead.

因此，我們認為，將他們的關係網絡、分銷權重、與 GP 的關係與我們的核心信用承保專業知識以及我們對 NAV 貸款市場的了解結合起來的機會確實是與眾不同的。我們認為，我們現在才剛剛觸及這一機會的表面，但在未來幾季和幾年內，我們將獲得更多的機會。

Great. And maybe just a follow-up for me. I know you guys just had a successful close for Bonaccord II, but I think the deployment and investment pipeline has been pretty active. So what can we expect in terms of timing and potential for the successor fund, Bonaccord III to come back to market faster and scale?

偉大的。對我來說也許只是後續行動。我知道你們剛剛成功完成了 Bonaccord II 的開發，但我認為部署和投資管道已經相當活躍了。那麼，從時間和潛力來看，我們對繼任基金 Bonaccord III 重返市場的速度和規模有何期待？

Again, another great question. And just stepping back, I think it's really been amazing to watch the momentum that the Bonaccord team has in this GP stake space. Clearly, I think from an LP and perspective LP appetite, there's been enormous focus on where we play, which is the middle and lower middle market. The opportunity set there is incredibly robust. The team is seeing so many different opportunities.

這又是一個好問題。回顧一下，我認為看到 Bonaccord 團隊在 GP 股權領域的進展確實令人驚嘆。顯然，我認為從 LP 和 LP 需求的角度來看，我們非常關注我們的業務領域，即中端和中低端市場。那裡蘊藏著令人難以置信的巨大機會。團隊看到了很多不同的機會。

I think the broad acceptance of the product, both from a GP perspective and then from an LP perspective, looking to invest in the strategy, given some of the attributes, the near term yield, the long-term equity upside with the carry participation is really compelling. And so we're seeing a lot of enthusiasm and excitement around kind of that GP stakes broadening, in particular, our GP stake strategy, which is middle and lower middle market focused, where we think there's just a massive opportunity, and we have a real head start relative to any of the competition. Obviously, we're really proud of what we accomplished with BCP II. It was a fundraising outcome that was very positively unexpected, I would say, and I think highlights the strength and momentum in that business and the investor appetite for that business. You're absolutely right.

我認為，無論是從 GP 角度還是從 LP 角度來看，該產品都得到了廣泛的接受，考慮到它的一些屬性、短期收益率、長期股票上漲以及套利參與，投資該策略確實很有吸引力。因此，我們看到人們對 GP 股權擴大抱有很大熱情和興奮，特別是我們的 GP 股權策略，該策略專注於中端和中低端市場，我們認為這是一個巨大的機會，而且我們相對於任何競爭對手都擁有真正的領先優勢。顯然，我們對 BCP II 所取得的成就感到非常自豪。我想說，這是一次非常出乎意料的融資結果，我認為這凸顯了該業務的實力和發展勢頭以及投資者對該業務的興趣。你說得完全正確。

We have -- there are a lot of really attractive opportunities out there in the world. I think the team has done an extraordinary job of putting capital to work in a very positive way. We've had some really, really positive developments of some of our -- some of the GPs within the portfolio that we're excited about, that I think creates momentum for the business. And to your point, I think we're really excited about the prospects of BCP III. And I think, as I mentioned, we should be in a position to talk about it more here as we roll into 2025.

我們有—世界上有很多真正有吸引力的機會。我認為團隊在以非常積極的方式利用資本方面做得非常出色。我們投資組合中的一些 GP 取得了一些非常積極的進展，這讓我們感到興奮，我認為這為業務創造了動力。正如您所說，我認為我們對 BCP III 的前景感到非常興奮。我認為，正如我所提到的，隨著我們進入 2025 年，我們應該能夠在這裡更多地談論這個問題。

Thank you. I would now like to turn the conference back to Luke Sarsfield for closing remarks. Sir?

謝謝。現在我想請盧克·薩斯菲爾德致閉幕詞。先生？

Well, thank you, operator, and thanks to everyone for joining our call today. Following a truly transformational 2024, we believe we have the infrastructure in place to accelerate growth and drive operational efficiencies for the benefit of our strategies and our shareholders in 2025. We very much look forward to updating you on our first quarter 2025 financial results in May. Have a good morning.

好的，謝謝接線生，也謝謝大家今天參加我們的電話會議。在經歷了真正轉型的 2024 年之後，我們相信我們已經擁有了加速成長和提高營運效率的基礎設施，這將使我們在 2025 年的策略和股東受益。我們非常期待在 5 月向您更新我們 2025 年第一季的財務表現。早安.

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線。