Personalis Inc (PSNL) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, everyone and welcome to Personalis. Third quarter, 2024 earnings conference call.

大家下午好，歡迎來到 Personalis。2024 年第三季財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

I'd now like to turn the conference over to Caroline Corner. Please go-ahead ma'am.

我現在想把會議交給卡洛琳·科納。女士，請繼續。

Thank you, operator. Welcome to personal analysis. Third quarter 2024 earnings call. Joining today's call are Chris Hall, Chief Executive Officer and President Aaron Tsha Bana, chief financial and Chief Operating Officer and Rich Chan, Chief Medical Officer and EVP R&D.

謝謝你，接線生。歡迎大家來個人分析。2024 年第三季財報電話會議。加入今天電話會議的還有執行長兼總裁 Chris Hall、財務長兼營運長 Aaron Tsha Bana 以及首席醫療官兼研發執行副總裁 Rich Chan。

All statements made on this call that do not relate to matters of historical facts should be considered forward-looking statements within the meanings of the US security laws. For example, any statements regarding trends and expectations for our financial performance this year and longer-term cash runway revenue expectations and timing, reimbursement goals, size and booking of orders, products, services, technology, clinical milestones, the outcome and timing of reimbursement decisions, expectations for our existing and future collaboration activities cost expectations, our market opportunity and business outlook.

本次電話會議中發表的所有與歷史事實無關的聲明均應被視為美國安全法意義內的前瞻性聲明。例如，有關我們今年財務表現的趨勢和預期以及長期現金跑道收入預期和時間、報銷目標、訂單規模和預訂、產品、服務、技術、臨床里程碑、報銷結果和時間的任何聲明決策、對我們現有和未來合作活動的預期、成本預期、我們的市場機會和業務前景。

These statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from our current expectations. We encourage you to review our most recent filings with the sec including the risk factors described in our most recent filings. Personnel centre takes no obligation to update these statements except as required by applicable law.

這些陳述存在風險和不確定性，可能導致實際結果與我們目前的預期有重大差異。我們鼓勵您查看我們最近向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件，包括我們最近提交的文件中所述的風險因素。除適用法律要求外，人事中心沒有義務更新這些聲明。

Our press release with our third quarter, 2024 results is available on our website www dot personal dotcom under the investors section and includes additional details about our financial results. Our website also has a related sec filing which we encourage you to review the recording of today's call will be available on our website by 5.00 PM. pacific time today. Now I'd like to turn the call over to Chris for his comments and second quarter of business highlights.

我們關於 2024 年第三季業績的新聞稿可在我們的網站 www.dot individual dotcom 的投資者部分查看，其中包括有關我們財務業績的更多詳細資訊。我們的網站上還有一份相關的 sec 文件，我們鼓勵您查看今天通話的錄音，該文件將於下午 5 點之前在我們的網站上提供。今天太平洋時間。現在我想將電話轉給克里斯，請他發表評論和第二季的業務亮點。

Thank you, Caroline. Good afternoon, everyone and thank you for joining us for our third quarter. Call for those of you joining one of our calls for the first time. Welcome. Personalis is a leader in the fast-growing MRD testing market.

謝謝你，卡洛琳。大家下午好，感謝您加入我們的第三季。邀請那些第一次加入我們電話會議的人。歡迎。Personalis 是快速成長的 MRD 檢測市場的領導者。

MRD stands for minimal residual disease and involves using blood which is commonly called a liquid biopsy instead of imaging or invasive biopsies to monitor therapy and to detect cancer occurrence after treatment. The MRD market is expected to mature into a $20 billion market with our ultra-sensitive MRD assay. Next, personal we believe personal is positioned for success.

MRD 代表微小殘留疾病，涉及使用血液（通常稱為液體活檢）代替影像或侵入性活檢來監測治療並檢測治療後癌症的發生。透過我們的超靈敏 MRD 檢測，MRD 市場預計將成熟為 200 億美元的市場。接下來，我們相信個人是成功的關鍵。

Our technologies are able to spot cancer. When there's only one fragment of tumour DNA circulating and a million DNA fragments in the blood. Our platforms are used by many of the world's top BioPharma companies to improve clinical trial results, personalized treatment and power. A new generation of therapies before we dive into our third quarter results.

我們的技術能夠發現癌症。當循環中的腫瘤 DNA 片段只有一個，而血液中有 100 萬個 DNA 片段。我們的平台被許多世界頂尖生物製藥公司用來改善臨床試驗結果、個人化治療和功效。在我們深入了解第三季業績之前，我們將介紹新一代療法。

I want to share a recent case that highlights the power of next personal to find residual and recurrent cancer and impact the patient's care. The doctor began using xperion to monitor a female in her 70s who had been diagnosed with stage one, her two positive breast cancer. After the patient had undergone lumpectomy and received standard adjuvant therapy. The doctor began monitoring the patient with next personal performing multiple follow up tests over a five-month period.

我想分享一個最近的案例，該案例強調了下一位個人發現殘留和復發癌症並影響患者護理的能力。醫生開始使用 xperion 來監測一名 70 多歲的女性，她被診斷出患有第一期乳癌，她的兩次乳癌呈陽性反應。患者接受腫瘤切除術並接受標準輔助治療後。醫生開始監測患者，並安排下一個人在五個月的時間內進行多次後續檢查。

Each test showed the cancer is still present with circulating DNA tumour at a low level between 25 and 30 parts per million, which is in the ultrasensitive range. That as a reminder, the ultrasensitive range, our measurements of circulating tumour DNA below 100 parts per million that our next personal test excels and quantify that could be missed with less sensitive test in this case because the next personal test detected persistent small traces of residual cancer. The doctor was concerned and ordered additional imaging that led to finding another breast nodule and starting the patient on radiation with plans for additional chemotherapy.

每項測試均顯示癌症仍然存在，循環 DNA 腫瘤的水平較低，在百萬分之 25 至 30 之間，處於超敏感範圍。提醒一下，超靈敏範圍，我們對循環腫瘤DNA 的測量低於百萬分之100，我們的下一個個人測試表現出色，並量化了在這種情況下使用不太敏感的測試可能會錯過的結果，因為下一個個人測試檢測到了持續存在的小量殘留痕跡癌症。醫生很擔心，並要求進行額外的影像，發現另一個乳房結節，並開始對患者進行放射治療，並計劃進行額外的化療。

We're beginning to hear many anecdotes like this, and they demonstrate how our platforms are impacting clinical care pharma partners and oncologists are noticing and starting to adopt next personal and this is driving the performance we experienced this quarter. So now with that example, illustrating how we're driving advancements in care. Let's switch gears and dive into the quarter.

我們開始聽到許多這樣的軼事，它們展示了我們的平台如何影響臨床護理製藥合作夥伴和腫瘤學家正在註意到並開始採用下一個個人，這正在推動我們本季度的業績。現在用這個例子來說明我們如何推動護理領域的進步。讓我們換個話題，進入本季。

Earlier this year, we laid out a strategy to scale our business with three growth engines.

今年早些時候，我們制定了一項策略，透過三個成長引擎來擴展我們的業務。

In the third quarter, we achieved revenue of 25.7 million up 41% year over year. This improvement was driven by our Barra Pharma business which grew 96% year over year, led by strong demand for our tumour profiling product that is used to create personalized cancer vaccines for patients as well as increasing demand for MRD product. Next personal, our strong Q3 revenue also helped us to increase our guidance for the full year and we now expect revenue in the range of 83 to 84 million.

第三季度，我們營收2,570萬美元，年增41%。這項改進是由我們的Barra Pharma 業務推動的，該業務同比增長96%，這是由於對我們用於為患者創建個性化癌症疫苗的腫瘤分析產品的強勁需求以及對MRD 產品的需求不斷增加所致。其次，我們強勁的第三季收入也幫助我們提高了全年指導，我們現在預計收入在 83 至 8,400 萬美元之間。

We're particularly pleased to have been able to deliver this top line growth while making improvements to both our cost and margins. As Aaron will cover shortly, we also raised significant amount of capital this quarter in a cost-efficient manner. Aaron will discuss the details in his section, but we raised approximately $62 million from a combination of proceeds from tempest and from accessing the ATM.

我們特別高興能夠實現營收成長，同時改善成本和利潤。正如亞倫稍後將介紹的那樣，我們本季度還以具有成本效益的方式籌集了大量資金。亞倫將在他的部分討論詳細信息，但我們從 Tempest 和使用 ATM 的收益組合中籌集了大約 6200 萬美元。

Most of this went directly into our bank account and we ended Q3 with 100 and $43.7 million in cash. We believe this takes us into the first half of 2027 and well past the point where we expect to achieve reimbursement for next personal, I'll now review progress this quarter on our three growth engines.

其中大部分直接進入我們的銀行帳戶，第三季結束時我們有 100 美元和 4,370 萬美元現金。我們相信，這將帶我們進入 2027 年上半年，並遠遠超過我們預計實現下一個個人報銷的時間點，我現在將回顧本季度我們三個成長引擎的進展。

The first growth engine when an MRD is the most important as we focus on turning personality into a clinical diagnostic powerhouse, minimal residual disease or MRD testing uses a liquid biopsy to find evidence of residual disease or cancer recurrence and to monitor therapy effectiveness. We laid out our win MRD strategy back in 2023 and have been laser focused on executing its four pillars. One focus on cancer types where an ultra-sensitive approach can unlock significant value for patient's payers and partners. Two drive reimbursement by developing robust clinical evidence and partnering with top global collaborators. Three leverage our deep relationships to accelerate adoption by BioPharma partners and power our revenue growth by the use of next personal and clinical trials and four commercialized.

MRD 是最重要的第一個成長引擎，因為我們專注於將個性轉變為臨床診斷動力，微小殘留疾病或 MRD 測試使用液體活檢來查找殘留疾病或癌症復發的證據並監測治療效果。我們早在 2023 年就制定了獲勝 MRD 策略，並一直專注於執行其四大支柱。其中一個重點關注癌症類型，其中超敏感的方法可以為患者的付款人和合作夥伴釋放巨大的價值。其中兩個透過開發可靠的臨床證據並與全球頂級合作者合作來推動報銷。其中三個利用我們深厚的關係來加速生物製藥合作夥伴的採用，並透過使用下一個個人和臨床試驗來推動我們的收入成長，四個已商業化。

Next personal with a partner centric model to delve into the first pillar. We've previously highlighted some of the evidence of mass to support next person's unique clinical usage and reimbursement of lung cancer, breast cancer and IO therapy monitoring. Our focus on these indications is intentional and our data is demonstrated that next personal can do exceptionally well and win in these markets.

接下來採用以合作夥伴為中心的模型來深入研究第一個支柱。我們先前強調了一些品質證據，以支持 next person 獨特的臨床用途以及肺癌、乳癌和 IO 治療監測的報銷。我們對這些跡象的關注是有意的，我們的數據表明，下一個可以做得非常好並在這些市場中獲勝。

To elaborate a bit on our approach, lung cancer and breast cancer shed very little DNA into the blood. So small traces of cancer can be difficult to detect without an ultra-sensitive approach. Like next personal lung and breast cancers can be aggressive when they recur the early detection is critical for patients on IO therapy. We believe the potential decisions to switch treatment requires the insights for monitoring that are provided by our ultrasensitive test. The data across multiple studies now indicate we're able to see cancer recurrence earlier and this holds out the promise that those patients can seek treatment sooner many months ahead of imaging with potentially better outcomes.

為了詳細說明我們的方法，肺癌和乳癌釋放到血液中的 DNA 非常少。因此，如果沒有超靈敏的方法，就很難檢測到微小的癌症痕跡。就像下一個肺癌和乳癌一樣，當它們復發時，早期檢測對於接受 IO 治療的患者至關重要。我們相信，改變治療的潛在決定需要我們的超靈敏測試提供的監測見解。多項研究的數據現在表明，我們能夠更早看到癌症復發，這預示著這些患者可以在成像前幾個月儘早尋求治療，並可能獲得更好的結果。

The data also suggests that patients who consistently test MRD negative, meaning our test doesn't detect DNA from the tumour are at much lower risk for recurrence in the future. Having more confidence and a negative result may allow a doctor to spare patients from unnecessary necessary therapies and procedures, potentially avoiding toxicities and saving money for the health care system.

數據還表明，MRD 測試始終呈現陰性（這意味著我們的測試未檢測到腫瘤 DNA）的患者未來復發的風險要低得多。更有信心和陰性結果可能會讓醫生讓患者免於不必要的必要治療和程序，從而有可能避免毒性並為醫療保健系統節省資金。

In October 2023 we launched the first commercial ultra-sensitive MRD test into the clinic with our early access program. We started our commercial journey with just 10 doctors and received positive feedback from those physicians and have been able to create significant demand. As we move through the first half of the year, we launched our commercial and marketing collaboration with Tempest in June to strong demand and quickly decided together to accelerate our commercial launch. Tempest. Now has more than 200 representatives calling on the nation's oncologist.

2023 年 10 月，我們透過早期訪問計畫在診所推出了首個商業超靈敏 MRD 檢測。我們在只有 10 名醫生的情況下開始了我們的商業之旅，並收到了這些醫生的積極回饋，並能夠創造巨大的需求。隨著上半年的發展，我們在 6 月啟動了與 Tempest 的商業和行銷合作，以滿足強勁的需求，並迅速決定共同加速我們的商業發布。暴風雨。現在已有200多位代表拜訪全國的腫瘤科醫師。

Our success contributed to a healthy quarter, over quarter growth as we delivered 945 clinical tests in the third quarter, a 68% increase from the 561 results delivered. In the second quarter of this year, physicians have provided feedback that they appreciate the increased action ability from using our test to inform therapy selection intervention. If you remember, we report circulating DNA and the blood down to about one part per million. The extra analytic sensitivity we report on with next personal test, a mask region that had previously been hard to detect consistently.

我們的成功為季度的健康成長做出了貢獻，我們在第三季度交付了 945 項臨床測試，比交付的 561 項結果增加了 68%。今年第二季度，醫生們提供了回饋，表示他們讚賞使用我們的測試來指導治療選擇介入所提高的行動能力。如果你還記得的話，我們報告的循環 DNA 和血液的濃度大約是百萬分之一。我們在下一次個人測試中報告了額外的分析靈敏度，這是以前很難一致檢測到的光罩區域。

We call that region the ultra-sensitive range. We expect our test tighten ability to detect small traces of cancer to drive our success in the clinical market and approximately 35 to 40% of the CT DNA positive samples thus far in our clinical testing have been in this ultra-sensitive range. That is a jump in the actionability of MRD testing. It means physicians can see cancer recurrence earlier, have more discrimination and monitoring therapy and have more confidence that patients with negative CT DNA results are in fact cancer free. I want to take a moment to share one more statistic that underscores the value physicians are placing in our approach. 98% of the physicians who order from us in Q3 have already ordered from us. Again. In Q4, the demand for our approach is high and doctors are largely pleased when they start to utilize next personal with their patients.

我們將該區域稱為超敏感範圍。我們期望我們的測試能夠加強檢測微小癌症痕蹟的能力，以推動我們在臨床市場取得成功，迄今為止，我們臨床測試中大約 35% 至 40% 的 CT DNA 陽性樣本都處於這個超敏感範圍內。這是 MRD 測試可操作性的一個飛躍。這意味著醫生可以更早發現癌症復發，進行更多的區分和監測治療，並更有信心 CT DNA 結果為陰性的患者實際上沒有癌症。我想花點時間分享另一項統計數據，它強調了醫生對我們方法的重視。第三季向我們訂購的醫生中有 98% 已經向我們訂購。再次。在第四季度，對我們的方法的需求很高，當醫生開始使用下一個人來治療患者時，他們非常高興。

Moving to our second pillar, we previously mentioned our focus on building and publishing the clinical evidence to gain reimbursement. We continue to work with many of the top thought leaders around the world and in fact, some of them are deep into the preparation and submission of manuscripts for publications and leading peer reviewed oncology journals. We've previously summarized the findings from investigators at Royal Marston for breast cancer, Vhio for Io Thera and Tracerx for lung cancer. While we won't be providing updates on the publication journey. I am pleased to update you that our breast and io collaborators have now submitted articles to peer review journals for publication.

轉向我們的第二個支柱，我們之前提到我們的重點是建立和發布臨床證據以獲得報銷。我們繼續與世界各地的許多頂尖思想領袖合作，事實上，他們中的一些人正在深入準備和提交出版物和領先的同行評審腫瘤學期刊的手稿。我們先前總結了 Royal Marston 研究人員針對乳癌、Vhio 研究人員針對 Io Thera 和 Tracerx 研究人員針對肺癌的研究結果。雖然我們不會提供出版過程的最新資訊。我很高興地通知您，我們的 Breast 和 io 合作者現已向同行評審期刊提交文章以供發表。

Once these data are published, they will be a key component in our dossier for submission to Medicare for reimbursement for each indication. While our collaborators and the target publication editors control the publication process, our conversations with them give us continued confidence in our goal of achieving reimbursement for two indications. In 2025 two of our key studies were highlighted during the 2024 ESMO conference in Spain. First, an update on our work with the Tracerx Consortium in the area of lung cancer was presented by Charlie Swanton.

這些數據一旦發布，它們將成為我們向 Medicare 提交每種適應症報銷檔案的關鍵組成部分。雖然我們的合作者和目標出版物編輯控制著出版過程，但我們與他們的對話使我們對實現兩種適應症報銷的目標始終充滿信心。2025 年，我們的兩項關鍵研究在 2024 年西班牙 ESMO 會議上得到了強調。首先，Charlie Swanton 介紹了我們與 Tracerx 聯盟在肺癌領域合作的最新情況。

The podium presentation showcased next person's ability to detect residual cancer up to nine months before imaging for a significantly expanded group of patients compared to last year's presentation at EMA and the clinical data continued to show outstanding results.

與去年在EMA 上的演講相比，這次講台演講展示了Next person 在成像前長達9 個月的時間裡檢測殘留癌症的能力，其患者群體顯著擴大，並且臨床數據繼續顯示出出色的結果。

As a reminder, this is one of the larger MRD studies on lung cancer conducted today.

提醒一下，這是當今針對肺癌進行的規模較大的 MRD 研究之一。

The second collaboration highlighted was the valve heon or Vhio collaboration in immunotherapy monitoring for vhio. The work is pan cancer and included an expanded group of patients across 18 different cancer subtypes. The study showed that next person could potentially be used to predict immunotherapy response for patients.

第二個強調的合作是 Valve heon 或 Vhio 在 vhio 免疫療法監測方面的合作。這項研究是泛癌研究，涵蓋了 18 種不同癌症亞型的更多患者。該研究表明，下一個人有可能被用來預測患者的免疫治療反應。

I'm pleased to update you that we now are working with 14 studies across our core indications breast cancer, lung cancer and ither monitoring in lung cancer. We're working with the Tracerx group as mentioned in breast cancer. We're working with Royal Marston, Dana Farber on her two positive patients and the institute curry on an approximately 100 patient early-stage triple negative breast cancer study. We're also working with Vanderbilt John Hopkins and other institutions on the predict study and approximately 180 patient study at early-stage T NBC and her two positive breast cancer and have an ongoing prospective study called B Stronger one that has now enrolled more than 50 patients with T NBC in IO therapy monitoring. We're working with Vhio and UK E in two different melanoma studies with a group of Duke studying gastric cancer patients with U CS D on a pan cancer IO therapy study and with the Tracerx team on a lung cancer IO therapy study called Darwin two.

我很高興地向您通報，我們現在正在進行 14 項研究，涉及乳癌、肺癌以及其他肺癌監測的核心適應症。我們正在與乳癌領域提到的 Tracerx 小組合作。我們正在與 Royal Marston、Dana Farber 合作研究她的兩名陽性患者，並與該研究所合作進行一項約 100 名早期三陰性乳癌患者的研究。我們也與范德比爾特·約翰·霍普金斯大學和其他機構合作進行預測研究，對大約180 名早期T NBC 患者和她的兩種陽性乳癌患者進行研究，並正在進行一項名為B Stronger 的前瞻性研究，目前已招募了50 多名患者IO 治療監測中的 T NBC 患者。我們正在與Vhio 和UK E 合作進行兩項不同的黑色素瘤研究，與杜克大學的一組研究U CS D 的胃癌患者進行泛癌IO 治療研究，並與Tracerx 團隊合作進行一項名為Darwin 2的肺癌IO 治療研究。

The growing data and ongoing studies underline our commitment to demonstrate the value of our approach and platform and patience.

不斷增長的數據和正在進行的研究強調了我們致力於展示我們的方法、平台和耐心的價值。

The third pillar of our next personal strategy is to leverage our BioPharma relationships to drive the use of next personal and clinical trials.

我們下一個個人策略的第三個支柱是利用我們的生物製藥關係來推動下一個個人和臨床試驗的使用。

Customers want need an ultra-sensitive approach to more effectively select patients for clinical trials and to more accurately monitor trial success. For example, the data presented suggests that patients testing negative with our ultra-sensitive assay are much more likely to have recurrence.

客戶需要一種超靈敏的方法來更有效地選擇臨床試驗患者並更準確地監測試驗的成功。例如，所提供的數據表明，使用我們的超靈敏檢測結果呈陰性的患者更有可能復發。

Our BioPharma customers can then expect that these patients are less likely to benefit from a therapeutic intervention. Holding out the promise that next personal could be an excellent approach to optimize BioPharma trials.

我們的生物製藥客戶可以預期這些患者不太可能從治療介入中受益。承諾下一個可能是優化生物製藥試驗的絕佳方法。

Additionally, using an ultra-sensitive test to monitor results could mean being drug effectiveness sooner rather sooner than imaging, potentially allowing the drug to get to market faster over time. Indeed, the value we create for BioPharma clients is increasingly appreciated.

此外，使用超靈敏測試來監測結果可能意味著藥物有效性比成像更早，這可能使藥物隨著時間的推移更快進入市場。事實上，我們為生物製藥客戶創造的價值越來越受到重視。

We're engaged with most of the world's top BioPharma companies and have continued to generate excitement around our next personal test most recently from discussions at ESMO and Asco, we continue to expand our book of revenue orders from BioPharma customers for MRD projects and expect the growth to begin accelerating through 2025.

我們與大多數世界頂級生物製藥公司合作，並且最近通過 ESMO 和 Asco 的討論，繼續對我們的下一個個人測試感到興奮，我們繼續擴大來自生物製藥客戶的 MRD 項目的收入訂單，並期望到2025 年，成長將開始加速。

Now I'll move on to the fourth and final pillar commercializing next person on the clinical market using a partner centric model in August. We announced a new chapter in our relationship with Tempest where we agreed to accelerate our commercial activities. We began the commercial journey with an early access program in October of 2023 followed by the tempest launch at Asco in June.

現在，我將在八月繼續討論第四個也是最後一個支柱，即使用以合作夥伴為中心的模型在臨床市場上將下一個人商業化。我們宣布與 Tempest 的關係翻開新篇章，同意加速我們的商業活動。我們於 2023 年 10 月透過搶先體驗計畫開始了商業之旅，隨後於 6 月在 Asco 發布了暴風雨。

Our efforts have been met with strong demand and interest in an ultra-sensitive approach. And as a result in August, we collectively decided to accelerate our efforts.

我們的努力得到了對超敏感方法的強烈需求和興趣的滿足。因此，我們在八月集體決定加快努力。

Their 200 plus salesperson channel is now trained on our product and talking to oncologists as a reminder, personnel process. The samples in our lab focuses on obtaining reimbursement, invoices, health insurance companies payers and patients under the arrangement and pays TPAS fair market value for the commercial services they provide to us as a part of the August expansion, Tempus exercised their warrants for 18.4 million and invested an additional 17.7 million in Personalis by buying shares at $5.07 per share that brought the aggregate deal value to approximately 48 million for Personalis which includes 12 million in milestone payments plus the 36 million of equity investment from Tempest.

他們的 200 多名銷售人員管道現在接受了我們產品的培訓，並與腫瘤科醫生交談作為提醒，人事流程。我們實驗室的樣本重點是根據安排獲得報銷、發票、健康保險公司付款人和患者，並為他們向我們提供的商業服務支付TPAS 公平市場價值，作為8 月份擴張的一部分，Tempus 行使了1840 萬美元的認股權證並以每股5.07 美元的價格購買股票，向Personalis 追加投資1,770 萬美元，使Personalis 的總交易價值達到約4,800 萬美元，其中包括1,200 萬美元的里程碑付款以及Tempest 的3,600 萬美元的股權投資。

The partnership is working extremely well and we're pleased with our progress.

這個夥伴關係運作得非常順利，我們對我們的進展感到滿意。

Our goal over the next 15 months is to position personal next personal with broad clinical usage, scaled operations and rapidly accelerating revenue on the back of reimbursement.

我們未來 15 個月的目標是定位下一代具有廣泛臨床用途、規模化營運並在報銷的支持下迅速增加收入的個人。

While things are clicking along on our first growth engine, our win and MRD strategy. We've also made progress with our second growth engine leveraging our immuno ID next platform to deepen relationships with BioPharma customers who are pioneering new therapies.

當我們的第一個成長引擎、我們的勝利和 MRD 策略進展順利時。我們的第二個成長引擎也取得了進展，利用我們的免疫 ID 下一個平台來加深與開拓新療法的生物製藥客戶的關係。

Our BioPharma business grew 94% year over year and we had solid performance across our portfolio.

我們的生物製藥業務年增 94%，我們的產品組合表現穩健。

Customers primarily use our amino ID next platform in two ways. First, they leverage our platform to power translational research and find new biomarkers and insights that can enable their drug development efforts in this regard. We've been working with most of the TOP20 global biopharmaceutical companies over the years.

客戶主要透過兩種方式使用我們的amino ID next 平台。首先，他們利用我們的平台來推動轉化研究，並找到新的生物標記和見解，以支持他們在這方面的藥物開發工作。多年來我們一直與大多數全球 TOP20 生物製藥公司合作。

Second companies in a personalized cancer vaccine or P CV market use our platform to create a molecular fingerprint of a patient's tumour to develop personalized therapy. We previously highlighted how our partner Moderna is using our platform in their MRN An Individualized Neo Antigen Therapy program. Our collaboration with Moderna has been an important driver of revenue for us in 2024 and modern and its partner Merck have now enrolled most patients for their phase three clinical trial. Our revenue from Moderna accelerated as they finalize enrolment in their phase three Melanoma clinical study. We anticipate that our revenue from Moderna will fall back over the next few quarters. While the next set of studies ramps up, we continue to support them on multiple clinical studies and expect that our relationship with Moderna will continue to generate substantial revenue over the next several years.

個人化癌症疫苗或 PC CV 市場中的第二家公司使用我們的平台創建患者腫瘤的分子指紋，以開發個人化治療。我們之前強調了我們的合作夥伴 Moderna 如何在他們的 MRN 個人化新抗原治療計劃中使用我們的平台。我們與 Moderna 的合作一直是我們 2024 年收入的重要驅動力，Modern 及其合作夥伴默克現已招募大多數患者進行第三期臨床試驗。隨著 Moderna 完成第三期黑色素瘤臨床研究的招募，我們從 Moderna 獲得的收入加速成長。我們預計來自 Moderna 的營收將在未來幾季回落。在下一組研究開始進行的同時，我們將繼續支持他們進行多項臨床研究，並預計我們與 Moderna 的關係將在未來幾年繼續產生可觀的收入。

The third engine of our growth strategy is growing our personal inside approach as we service enterprise customers in these relationships partners adopt our platforms and technologies to power their solutions. For example, NRA has leveraged our ex O platform is a part of their MRD product to help them scale while they work to build in house capacities. As previously mentioned, they've transitioned this work in house, and we expect to wind down our work with NEA by the end of the fourth quarter. While our biopharming clinical diagnostic business is accelerating. We're shifting the capacity previously earmarked for NEA to support these other strategic efforts. We also continue to have discussions with other companies about doing sequencing work for them.

我們成長策略的第三個引擎是發展我們的個人內部方法，因為我們為這些關係中的企業客戶提供服務，合作夥伴採用我們的平台和技術來支援他們的解決方案。例如，NRA 利用我們的 ex O 平台作為其 MRD 產品的一部分，幫助他們在努力建立內部產能的同時進行擴展。如前所述，他們已將這項工作移交給內部，我們預計將在第四季末結束與 NEA 的合作。同時，我們的生物製藥臨床診斷業務正在加速發展。我們正在轉移先前指定給 NEA 的能力來支援這些其他策略工作。我們也繼續與其他公司討論為他們進行定序工作。

A second enterprise relationship is the VA the VA utilizes our whole genome sequencing capabilities to power the Million Veteran program, a national research program looking at how genes and life health and veterans. We've helped power this program for more than 10 years now. And in September, the va renewed their contract with us for another year. We received a new purchase order in the amount of $7.5 million that we expect to fulfil in 2025.

第二個企業關係是退伍軍人管理局，退伍軍人管理局利用我們的全基因組定序能力來支持百萬退伍軍人計劃，這是一項研究基因與生命健康和退伍軍人關係的國家研究計劃。十多年來，我們一直在幫助推動該計劃。九月份，維吉尼亞州與我們續簽了一年的合約。我們收到了價值 750 萬美元的新採購訂單，預計在 2025 年完成。

It's been another excellent quarter and I'm grateful to the team at Personalis, our early next personal clients, our collaborators and partners for all the work, guidance and feedback this quarter. As we continue to redefine the MRD market with a more sensitive approach. We're building a special company that is impacting patients’ lives and helping us to win the fight against cancer. With that. I'll now turn it over to Aaron to review our financial results.

這又是一個出色的季度，我感謝 Personalis 的團隊、我們早期的下一個個人客戶、我們的合作者和合作夥伴在本季度所做的所有工作、指導和回饋。隨著我們繼續以更敏感的方式重新定義 MRD 市場。我們正在建立一家特殊的公司，該公司正在影響患者的生活並幫助我們贏得與癌症的鬥爭。就這樣。我現在將把它交給亞倫來審查我們的財務表現。

Thank you, Chris.

謝謝你，克里斯。

Total company revenue for the third quarter of 2024 was $25.7 million representing a 41% increase compared with $18.2 million for the same period of the prior year.

2024 年第三季公司總營收為 2,570 萬美元，較上年同期的 1,820 萬美元成長 41%。

The increase in revenue was driven by higher volume from BioPharma customers and the V AM VP which was partially offset by the expected decline from the Tara BioPharma revenue grew 96% compared to the same period last year. And the growth was primarily driven from higher ammonoid next volume from Moderna’s P CV projects.

收入的增長是由生物製藥客戶和 V AM 副總裁的銷量增加推動的，但塔拉生物製藥收入同比增長 96% 的預期下降部分抵消了這一增長。這一增長主要是由 Moderna 的 P CV 項目更高的菊素產量所推動的。

Our V AM VP revenue increased 85% compared to the same period last year as we fulfilled the remaining amount of the 2023 to 2024 task order in alignment with the V AM VPs fiscal year end.

我們的 V AM VP 收入與去年同期相比增長了 85%，因為我們按照 V AM VP 財年末完成了 2023 年至 2024 年任務訂單的剩餘金額。

In addition, we recognized $0.3 million of clinical revenue from our next DX tumour profiling test gross margin expanded to 34% in the third quarter compared with 19.1% for the same period of the prior year. The year over year increase of 14.9% points was primarily due to favourable customer mix and operating leverage from the increase in revenue volume.

此外，我們也確認下一次 DX 腫瘤分析測試帶來的 30 萬美元臨床收入第三季毛利率擴大至 34%，而去年同期為 19.1%。年成長14.9%主要是由於有利的客戶組合和收入增加所帶來的營運槓桿。

Over the last year and a half, our focus has been to reduce product costs, improve productivity, reduce lab operations expenses and improve utilization to drive margins higher.

在過去的一年半中，我們的重點是降低產品成本、提高生產力、減少實驗室營運費用並提高利用率，以提高利潤率。

We are making very good progress.

我們正在取得非常好的進展。

In the third quarter, we saw an impact of over 4% points to our gross margin due to unreimbursed clinical test costs, excluding those costs, gross margin would have been approximately 38%.

第三季度，由於未償還的臨床測試成本，我們的毛利率受到超過 4% 的影響，排除這些成本，毛利率約為 38%。

One of our top goals is to continue expanding gross margin, but we expect some variability from quarter to quarter along the way, operating expenses were $23.1 million in the third quarter compared with $34.3 million for the same period of the prior year. Most of the year over year decrease was attributed to actions taken to reduce headcount in 2023. And also, a facility impairment charge of $5.6 million for the same period. Last year. R&D expense was $11.7 million in the second quarter compared with $16.7 million for the same period last year. And SG&A expense was $11.4 million compared with $12 million for the same period last year.

我們的首要目標之一是繼續擴大毛利率，但我們預計每季都會出現一些變化，第三季的營運費用為 2,310 萬美元，而去年同期為 3,430 萬美元。年比下降的主要原因是 2023 年採取了減少員工人數的行動。此外，同期設施減損費用為 560 萬美元。去年。第二季研發費用為 1,170 萬美元，去年同期為 1,670 萬美元。SG&A 費用為 1,140 萬美元，去年同期為 1,200 萬美元。

Net loss for the third quarter was $39.1 million compared to $29.1 million for the same period of the prior year.

第三季淨虧損為 3,910 萬美元，去年同期淨虧損為 2,910 萬美元。

The third quarter net loss included a $26 million non-cash expense related to fair value. Accounting for the warrants exercised by tempest, this non standard expense was a result of the increase in fair market value of the warrants at the time. Of exercise in early August compared with the fair market value at the end of last quarter.

第三季淨虧損包括與公允價值相關的 2,600 萬美元非現金費用。考慮到 Tempest 行使的認股權證，該非標準費用是由於當時認股權證的公平市場價值增加的結果。八月初的行權與上季末的公平市價相比。

The warrant accounting implications had no impact on the cash value or amount received from tempest.

認股權證會計影響對現金價值或從暴風雨收到的金額沒有影響。

Now under the balance sheet, we finished the third quarter with a strong balance sheet with cash and short term investments of $143.7 million. During the quarter, we received financing proceeds of $62.2 million net of expenses from Tempest exercising their warrants for $18.4 million at an average price of $2 per share. Tempest purchasing an additional $16.6 million of common stock at a price of $5.07 per share and selling $27.2 million of common stock under the at the market or ATM program at a weighted average price of $5.84 per share.

現在在資產負債表下，我們在第三季結束時擁有強勁的資產負債表，現金和短期投資為 1.437 億美元。本季度，我們收到了 6,220 萬美元的融資收益（扣除 Tempest 行使認股權證的費用），每股平均價格為 2 美元，收益為 1,840 萬美元。Tempest 以每股 5.07 美元的價格額外購買 1,660 萬美元的普通股，並根據市場或 ATM 計劃以每股 5.84 美元的加權平均價格出售 2,720 萬美元的普通股。

We used approximately $6 million to fund operations in the third quarter and we have approximately 2.5 years of cash on the balance sheet which is expected to last into the first half of 2027.

我們在第三季使用了約 600 萬美元為營運提供資金，資產負債表上有約 2.5 年的現金，預計將持續到 2027 年上半年。

Now I'd like to turn to guidance the fourth quarter of 2024. We expect total company revenue in the range of 15 to $16 million and all of the revenue is expected to be generated from Pharma tests enterprise sales and other customers.

現在我想談談 2024 年第四季的指導。我們預計公司總收入在 1500 至 1600 萬美元之間，所有收入預計將來自製藥測試企業銷售和其他客戶。

With that. I'd like to provide some context around the fourth quarter, guidance and the sequential decline.

就這樣。我想提供一些有關第四季度的背景資訊、指導和連續下降。

First throughout 2024 revenue from Moderna accelerated due to the increase in patient volume for their Melanoma based three clinical trial. With most of the patient enrolment now completed, we expect revenue from moderna to decline by 55 to 60% in the fourth quarter. Sequentially down from $8.5 million in the third quarter. We remain committed and excited about the long term PC B opportunity with Moderna who have partnered with us for many years. Now, second, we explained on our last call that revenue from NARRA would decline in the second half of 2024.

首先，由於三個基於黑色素瘤的臨床試驗的患者數量增加，Moderna 的收入在 2024 年全年加速成長。隨著大部分患者入組現已完成，我們預計第四季度 Moderna 的收入將下降 55% 至 60%。較第三季的 850 萬美元有所下降。我們仍然致力於與與我們合作多年的 Moderna 提供長期 PCB B 機會，並對這一機會感到興奮。其次，我們在上次電話會議中解釋說，NARRA 的收入將在 2024 年下半年下降。

We currently expect approximately 2 to $3 million from NRA in the fourth quarter as we wind down this project and then no meaningful NRA revenue in 2025.

目前，隨著我們逐步結束該項目，我們預計 NRA 在第四季度將獲得約 200 至 300 萬美元的收入，然後到 2025 年 NRA 就不會產生有意義的收入。

And third, some detail about the B AM VP. In the third quarter, we recognized $4.4 million of revenue from the 2023 to 2024 task order which needed to be fulfilled by the end of September aligning with their fiscal year end, the new $7.5 million task order recently received is for, is for the period of October 2024 to September 2025. And we expect to fulfil this order between the 1st and 3rd quarters of 2025.

第三，關於 B AM VP 的一些細節。在第三季度，我們確認了2023 年至2024 年任務訂單的440 萬美元收入，該任務訂單需要在9 月底前完成，與其財年末一致，最近收到的新的750 萬美元任務訂單適用於該期間2024年10月至2025年9月。我們預計在 2025 年第一季至第三季之間完成該訂單。

And for the full year 2024 we increased our guidance and now expect total company revenue in the range of 83 to $84 million. An increase from our prior guidance of 79 to $81 million revenue from Pharma test enterprise sales and other customers in the range of 76 to $77 million. An increase from our prior guidance of 71 to 73 million. And this estimate includes revenue from the terra of approximately $24 million population sequencing revenue from the V AM VP of approximately 7 million. A decrease from our prior guidance of $8 million net loss of approximately $85 million, which includes the noncash expense of approximately $18 million related to the warrants exercised by tempest cash usage in the range of 53 to $55 million. A decrease from our prior guidance of $60 million and the cash burn reduction is a result of higher gross profit dollars from the increase in revenue and expense control.

對於 2024 年全年，我們提高了指引，目前預計公司總收入在 83 至 8,400 萬美元之間。與我們先前指導的 79 至 8,100 萬美元相比，製藥測試企業銷售和其他客戶的收入增加了 7,600 至 7,700 萬美元。從我們之前指導的 7100 萬增加到 7300 萬。這項估計包括來自約 2,400 萬美元群體定序的收入和來自 VAM VP 的約 700 萬美元的收入。與我們先前指導的 800 萬美元相比，淨虧損減少了約 8,500 萬美元，其中包括與 Tempest 現金使用量在 5,300 至 5,500 萬美元之間行使認股權證相關的約 1,800 萬美元非現金費用。與我們先前指導的 6000 萬美元相比減少以及現金消耗減少是由於收入和費用控制增加導致毛利增加。

We look forward to updating you on our progress during our next conference call in a few months.

我們期待在幾個月後的下一次電話會議上向您通報我們的最新進展。

And with that, I will turn the call back over to the operator to begin the Q&A session operator.

然後，我會將電話轉回給接線員以開始問答會話接線員。

Thank you. We will now be conducting the question-and-answer session.

謝謝。我們現在將進行問答環節。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

Our first question comes from Yoko Ko of Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead. Thank you.

我們的第一個問題來自摩根士丹利的小洋子。請繼續。謝謝。

And on you go. Thanks for taking the question and congrats on the quarter. Maybe start off. I know we're now at almost six months post launch for next personal and sounds like it's been seeing a lot of positive traction here. I know with the expansion with Tempest Agreement, you increase the quantity of patient samples next personal that you would accept. Can you just talk a bit about the rationale behind this decision ahead of reimbursement and how you're balancing the volume ramp ahead of getting paid?

繼續吧。感謝您提出問題並祝賀本季。也許開始吧。我知道我們現在距離下一個個人發布還有近六個月的時間，聽起來這裡已經看到了很多積極的吸引力。我知道隨著《暴風雨協議》的擴展，您將增加您接受的下一個患者樣本的數量。您能否在報銷之前談談這項決定背後的基本原理，以及您如何在獲得付款之前平衡銷售成長？

Yeah. Thanks for the question. Yeah. Yeah. The product's been really well received and what we originally started with just a handful of Tempus reps. And we wanted to, we want to be able to put ourselves in a position where when we get reimbursement, which we're anticipating in 2025 we have a army of people out that are well trained and have worked with the product and then learned how to be pretty agile telling the story.

是的。謝謝你的提問。是的。是的。該產品非常受歡迎，最初我們只有少數 Tempus 代表才開始使用該產品。我們希望，我們希望能夠讓自己處於這樣一個境地：當我們獲得報銷時，我們預計在 2025 年，我們有一支訓練有素的人員隊伍，他們已經使用過該產品，然後學會瞭如何非常敏捷地講故事。

And so, you know, the expansion of the agreement allow us to have more reps out there talking about it and learning and working with it and allowed us to, you know, the tip us folks to, you know, better figure out how to integrate it into their story across, you know, all of the different environments they work at it. So we think that's really positive for shareholders because it puts us in a position where revenue growth, we think will be more explosive on the other side of reimbursement than if we had started out at a, at a slower rate. But we're still gaining it, we're still being very thoughtful about it and we're still, we're still moving in a, in a, in a thoughtful way.

因此，您知道，協議的擴展使我們能夠有更多的代表在那裡談論它、學習和使用它，並允許我們，您知道，提示我們人們，您知道，更好地弄清楚如何您知道，將其融入他們工作的所有不同環境中的故事。因此，我們認為這對股東來說確實是積極的，因為它使我們處於這樣的境地：與我們以較慢的速度開始相比，我們認為在報銷的另一面，收入成長將更具爆炸性。但我們仍然在獲得它，我們仍然對此非常深思熟慮，我們仍然，我們仍然以一種深思熟慮的方式前進。

In addition. So in addition to what Christian articulated and that was the reason the premise for tempest exercising their warrants of $18 million in the quarter as well as adding to that in the form of an additional investment of 3.5 million shares at $5.07.

另外。因此，除了 Christian 所闡述的內容之外，這也是 Tempest 在本季度行使其 1800 萬美元認股權證的前提，並以 5.07 美元的價格追加投資 350 萬股股票的形式增加了這一數額。

They understand that we don't have reimbursement just yet. So in order to go faster, we do need a little more capital. So that was part of the premise as well.

他們知道我們還沒報銷。所以為了走得更快，我們確實需要多一點資本。所以這也是前提的一部分。

Okay. That makes sense. And then maybe just one other one wondering how you're thinking about gross margin, gross margin cadence as we look to 2025 as volumes from next personal start to ramp and what are the kind of key levers you're thinking about pulling there to improve gross margin next year?

好的。這是有道理的。然後也許只是另一個人想知道您如何看待毛利率、毛利率節奏，因為我們展望 2025 年，隨著下一個個人的銷量開始增加，以及您正在考慮採取哪些關鍵手段來提高毛利率明年毛利率？

Yes, a great question. We haven't provided formal guidance for 2025 yet. We'll do that on our fourth quarter and full year call early in 25. Our gross margin for 24 is probably going to be in the 31 to 32% range based on what we, where we're the exit in Q3 and what we're looking at for Q4, what we can say and again on our last couple of calls, now we've stated that we've had headwinds of about 4 to 5% gross margin points for unreimbursed test costs. That's going to increase in 2025 primarily because of the volume increasing as well, right? And so, you know, there could be headwinds into gross margins of somewhere between 15 and 18, gross margin percentage points. Our gross margins aside from that will accrete but that's going to, we'll have those headwinds to deal with as well. So, you know, the gross margins could come down where they're going to exit 2024 at, don't know the exact amount to set and we'll provide that clarity early in 25.

是的，一個很好的問題。我們尚未提供 2025 年的正式指導。我們將在 25 月初的第四季和全年電話會議上這樣做。我們 24 的毛利率可能會在 31% 到 32% 的範圍內，具體取決於我們在第三季度的退出情況以及我們對第四季度的預期，我們可以說的以及最後幾個的電話，現在我們已經表示，由於未報銷的測試成本，我們面臨約4% 至5% 的毛利率點的阻力。到 2025 年，這個數字將會增加，主要是因為數量也在增加，對嗎？因此，您知道，毛利率可能會遇到 15 到 18 個百分點的阻力。除此之外，我們的毛利率將會增加，但我們也會遇到這些阻力。所以，你知道，毛利率可能會下降到 2024 年退出時的水平，但不知道要設定的確切金額，我們將在 25 年初提供明確的資訊。

Got it. Okay. That makes sense. Thanks so much for the time.

知道了。好的。這是有道理的。非常感謝您抽出時間。

Sure. Thank you.

當然。謝謝。

Our next question comes from Dan Brennan of TD Cohen. Please go ahead.

我們的下一個問題來自 TD Cohen 的 Dan Brennan。請繼續。

Hey, this is Joe on for Dan. Thanks for the question.

嘿，這是喬為丹代言。謝謝你的提問。

Seems to be some really great momentum in MRD. But when I look at the filing revenue from moderna increased from 26% to 33% of total sales quarter over quarter, which translates to like 45% sequential volume or revenue growth.

MRD 的勢頭似乎非常強勁。但當我查看 Moderna 的備案收入時，季度環比從總銷售額的 26% 增加到 33%，這意味著連續銷售或收入增長了 45%。

So it seems we may get most if not all the sequential strength in the farmer business. So I guess the question is one, did MRD or CGP revenues increase sequentially? And two, is there an opportunity for these revenues to grow before your first Medicare approval.

因此，看來我們可能會在農民業務中獲得大部分（如果不是全部）連續優勢。所以我想問題是，MRD 或 CGP 收入是否持續增加？第二，在您首次獲得醫療保險批准之前，這些收入是否有機會成長。

Yes. So that's a great question, Joe and thanks for the question in terms of PC B with Moderna. So Moderna has accelerated in Q3 as you had mentioned. So it did grow in addition to that our immuno ID next platform and MRD with BioPharma clients did increase as well. Okay. It didn't increase as much as Moderna. So Moderna did drive most of the increase in the BioPharma line. We did get paid about $300,000 from our C GP next DX test from Medicare. So that was recorded as revenue as well.

是的。這是一個很好的問題，Joe，感謝您提出有關 Moderna 的 PC B 的問題。正如您所提到的，Moderna 在第三季度加速了。因此，除了我們的免疫 ID 下一個平台和生物製藥客戶的 MRD 也有所增加之外，它確實有所增長。好的。它的增幅沒有 Moderna 那麼多。因此，Moderna 確實推動了生物製藥產品線的大部分成長。我們確實從 Medicare 的 C GP 下一次 DX 測試中獲得了約 30 萬美元的報酬。所以這也被記錄為收入。

And the no, I just add the MRD revenue for BioPharma companies also, you know, starting to get traction, you know, the buying cycles on these things. There are longer, we, we, we the first time the data was presented on the product was at ESMO last year. And that got a lot of BioPharma companies starting to spend some time with us in the data. That was the tracerx data and then the ASCO data around breast and IO really accelerated some of the movement. But you know, buying decisions in these big BioPharma companies are not quick, they typically start to interact with you. And they run tests, they run pilots, they may do bake offs. And so we've been moving through that process, we think a really rapid clip and we feel like we're in a position to do, you know, really, really well with the revenue growth around MRD coming from BioPharma companies prior to reimbursement happening in 2025.

不，我只是添加了生物製藥公司的 MRD 收入，你知道，這些東西的購買週期也開始受到關注。還有更長的，我們，我們，我們第一次展示產品的數據是去年在ESMO。這使得許多生物製藥公司開始花一些時間與我們一起研究數據。那是追蹤器數據，然後關於乳房和 IO 的 ASCO 數據確實加速了一些運動。但您知道，這些大型生物製藥公司的購買決策並不快，他們通常會開始與您互動。他們進行測試，進行試點，他們可能會進行烘烤。因此，我們一直在經歷這個過程，我們認為這是一個非常快速的過程，我們覺得我們能夠在報銷之前，透過來自生物製藥公司的 MRD 的收入成長，做得非常非常好。

Got it great. And then on the 945 molecular tests in the quarter, is there a way to think about MRD versus profiling? And I just want to confirm that this is no longer just on the 10 positions that you started with on early access.

太棒了。然後，在本季的 945 項分子測試中，是否有辦法考慮 MRD 與分析？我只是想確認一下，這不再只是您在早期訪問時開始的 10 個位置。

That's right. That's right. That's a combination of some organic growth in the physicians coming from our, you know, small number of reps that we've, that we've, that we've allowed in from the wait list. And then, you know, it's, it's, it's coming tempest is starting to, to grow that number out. So that number is starting to grow in terms of physicians. You know, we're starting to see the strategy of the C the C GP test, next DX, you know, being sold with the MRD test, next person is working really well and our customers, Tempus obviously is not selling next DX. And so, you know, the tests that are coming from them are just next personal. And so we, you know, you, you see most of that a lot of that growth is coming from the MRD product quite frankly, but we're really, really pleased with the success we've had executing, putting the next the XC GP with the MRD because customers want a one stop shop experience and that's what we're seeing.

這是正確的。這是正確的。這是醫生隊伍中一些有機增長的結合，這些增長來自於我們從候補名單中允許進入的少數代表。然後，你知道，暴風雨即將來臨，這個數字將會增加。因此，就醫生而言，這個數字開始成長。你知道，我們開始看到 C C GP 測試的策略，下一個 DX，你知道，與 MRD 測試一起出售，下一個人工作得很好，而我們的客戶，Tempus 顯然不會銷售下一個 DX。所以，你知道，來自他們的測試只是下一個個人的。因此，坦白說，我們，你知道，你看到大部分成長都來自 MRD 產品，但我們對我們所取得的成功感到非常非常滿意，將下一個 XC GP 與MRD 是因為客戶想要一站式服務體驗，這正是我們所看到的。

Is that helpful Joe?

喬這有幫助嗎？

Yeah, very. Thanks for the question.

是的，非常。謝謝你的提問。

Our next question comes from Mark Massaro of BT IG. Please go ahead.

我們的下一個問題來自 BT IG 的 Mark Massaro。請繼續。

Hey guys, congrats on a good quarter. Thanks for taking my questions. Apologies if you covered this, some of us are hopping multiple calls, but would love to just get your insights about how next personal is being received in the marketplace relative to other MRD tests that are available. You know, obviously you guys have talked about the ultra sensitive range. I'm just curious how you think that's resonating how much education needs to go in before people seem to clearly understand what that means. Maybe I'll just start there.

嘿夥計們，恭喜您度過了一個美好的季度。感謝您回答我的問題。如果您報道了這一點，我們深表歉意，我們中的一些人正在多次撥打電話，但很想了解您對市場上下一個人相對於其他可用的 MRD 測試的接受情況的了解。你知道，顯然你們已經談到了超敏感範圍。我只是很好奇你認為這會引起人們的共鳴，需要接受多少教育才能讓人們清楚地理解這意味著什麼。也許我會從那裡開始。

Yeah, I mean, I think, I mean, I think that's the core thing and we really, you know, we really tried to distil that down because every day when we're returning results back to physicians, you know, they're seeing 30 40% of the results in the ultra sensitive range of the positive results. And that has been, you know, super well received because those are patients that they're able to see more, you know, more than what they've been able to see before. And we're seeing tremendous retention. I mean, that, you know, we, we, we put that 90 plus percent number in there, but the physicians that, you know are, that have started with us are still working with us. The you know, customers are ordering, you know, quarter over quarter and sticking with us and we feel like we're in a, in a good spot. Do you want to add something? Which.

是的，我的意思是，我認為，我的意思是，我認為這是核心問題，我們真的，你知道，我們真的試圖將其提煉出來，因為每天當我們將結果回饋給醫生時，你知道，他們看到 30-40% 的結果處於陽性結果的超敏感範圍內。你知道，這非常受歡迎，因為這些患者能夠看到更多，你知道，比他們以前能夠看到的更多。我們看到了巨大的保留率。我的意思是，我們，我們，我們把百分之九十以上的數字放在那裡，但是，你知道，與我們一起開始的醫生仍在與我們合作。你知道，客戶每個季度都在訂購並堅持使用我們，我們感覺我們處於一個很好的位置。你想添加一些東西嗎？哪個。

No, I think you stated it. Well, I think the, the ultra sensitive concept is, is really resonating just like Chris said and, you know, they, they definitely can understand when they see a low level detection, but it's positive, it's easy to say, see that actually, that could have been me if the test was sensitive. So, and all a lot of these physicians have experienced situations where the initial tests, other tests have been negative and it goes on to be positive later on.

不，我想你已經說過了。嗯，我認為，超敏感的概念，就像克里斯所說的那樣，確實引起了共鳴，而且，你知道，當他們看到低水平的檢測時，他們肯定可以理解，但這是積極的，很容易說，實際上看到這一點，如果測試很敏感的話，那可能就是我。因此，所有這些醫生都經歷過這樣的情況：最初的測試和其他測試都是陰性，後來又呈現陽性。

Yeah. And so I, we think it's, it's working well. And then we've had, I talked about the example that we used in the, you know, in the, in the script where, you know, the patient was in that 20 to 30 PPPM range, didn't expect her to be there, started, you know, doing, looking for, for, for evidence of the disease, found it unexpectedly at another spot and then, you know, was able to take action and those types of cases really cement the value proposition and don't take a ton of education and, or teaching to do, right? I think that's what's, that's what's important to be able, the ability that we've had to distil this down into the ultra sensitive range. Tie that to the data that's shown in the by the collaborators with the, you know, with the plots, et cetera have all tied together. Well, well, I made it a good story. I will note that one of the things we're doing is we're trying to sell customers across the continuum. So we learn how to take people that have experience doing testing at MRD testing at a, at a good scale in their clinics. We're trying to work with doctors who dabbled with the technology. Because part of the challenge there is we try to make MRD testing standard of care as an industry is how do we grow their usage? And then we've also found new people quite frankly who are trying out and working with MRD testing in the beginning because we want to be able to, to move the needle on all these different customer segments, if we're going to put person in a position where we're, where we're you know, really, really pushing the needle forward on RD market. And so very, very, purposefully as a part of our execution plan, we're focusing in this phase of the business on learning how to, how to attack each one of those different segments.

是的。所以我，我們認為它運作得很好。然後我們，我談到了我們在腳本中使用的例子，你知道，病人處於 20 到 30 ppm 範圍內，沒想到她會在那裡，你知道，開始做、尋找、尋找疾病的證據，在另一個地方意外地發現了它，然後，你知道，能夠採取行動，這些類型的案例確實鞏固了價值主張，並且不'不需要進行大量的教育和/或教學，對嗎？我認為這就是我們必須將其提煉到超敏感範圍的能力，這就是重要的。將其與合作者顯示的數據聯繫起來，你知道，與情節等等都聯繫在一起。好吧，好吧，我把它編成了一個好故事。我要指出的是，我們正在做的事情之一是我們試圖向整個連續體的客戶銷售。因此，我們學習如何讓有經驗的人在診所進行大規模的 MRD 檢測。我們正在嘗試與涉足該技術的醫生合作。因為我們面臨的部分挑戰是，作為一個行業，我們試圖使 MRD 檢測成為護理標準，我們如何增加它們的使用？然後，坦白說，我們還找到了新人，他們一開始就在嘗試和使用 MRD 測試，因為我們希望能夠在所有這些不同的客戶群中取得進展，如果我們要讓人員我們現在所處的位置，你知道，我們確實在推動研發市場的發展。因此，作為我們執行計劃的一部分，我們非常非常有目的地專注於業務的這一階段，學習如何攻擊每個不同的細分市場。

Okay. So the, the volume number grew, I think 68% sequentially for the molecular test. You were at 66% in Q2. I'm just curious if the, if that's coincidental that it's about the same growth rate. I know it's early days. But, I guess what I'm really trying to get at is, are you intentionally holding back the throttle commercially until you get reimbursement, maybe just remind us we've seen other precision oncology labs do that. And then I'm just wondering when reimbursement does come in. How should we think about resources that you might deploy internally to work together with campus?

好的。因此，分子測試的捲數連續增長了 68%。第二季的利用率為 66%。我只是好奇這是否是巧合，兩者的成長率大致相同。我知道現在還為時過早。但是，我想我真正想要了解的是，您是否故意在獲得報銷之前抑製商業節流，也許只是提醒我們，我們已經看到其他精準腫瘤學實驗室這樣做了。然後我只是想知道報銷什麼時候能到。我們應該如何考慮您可能在內部部署與校園合作的資源？

Well, we, I think it's fair to say we're holding back. I mean, we, we still have a wait list of doctors. We're not pushing hard on it across the board. I mean, we're still, we're moving in a more aggressive pace with the expansion of the temperature range, but we're being really thoughtful about it and, and being, and being purposeful when we get, when we get, when we get reimbursement, we will put some more people in the field on our own, you know, accord those staff will drive organic growth, that's just for personalis. But they'll also quite frankly, you know, work with the Tempest team. Tempus brings a lot of benefits to this to this. They've got the, the knowledge, the skill sets of working with these individual institutions are often integrated into the EMRS.

好吧，我認為可以公平地說我們在猶豫。我的意思是，我們還有醫生的候補名單。我們並沒有全面推動它。我的意思是，隨著溫度範圍的擴大，我們仍然以更加積極的步伐前進，但我們確實對此進行了深思熟慮，並且當我們得到時，當我們得到時，我們是有目的的，當我們獲得報銷時，我們將在該領域安排更多的人員，你知道，這些員工將推動有機成長，這只是為了個人利益。但坦白說，他們也會與 Tempest 團隊合作。Tempus為此帶來了許多好處。他們擁有與這些單獨機構合作的知識和技能，這些知識和技能通常被整合到 EMRS 中。

And we've, you know, largely been different about where the samples are coming. But we will apply more people on our in, in sales and marketing ourselves to, to accelerate, to accelerate the commercial traction once we get, once we get reimbursement, you know, and the other thing we're learning right now also is how to scale the lab, you know, and so learning growing this thing at this in the last couple quarters, 60% really, you know, we're learning how to get samples in here, how to, how to get them through the system, how to meet all of our lead time commitments that we're making to doctors, how to bill for it, you know, with customer care and, you know, building this business, you know, from the ground up, you want to go, you want to keep, you got to keep moving and keep taxing the system to keep nailing it and that's what we're doing.

你知道，我們對於樣品的來源有很大不同。但是，一旦我們獲得報銷，我們將在銷售和行銷方面投入更多人員，以加速商業牽引力，你知道，我們現在正在學習的另一件事也是如何為了擴大實驗室規模，你知道，所以在過去的幾個季度裡，我們正在學習如何在這方面發展這個東西，真的，60％，你知道，我們正在學習如何將樣本放在這裡，如何，如何讓它們通過系統，如何履行我們對醫生做出的所有交貨時間承諾，如何為其計費，你知道，透過客戶服務，以及，你知道，建立這項業務，你知道，從頭開始，你想要去，你想保留，你必須繼續前進，繼續對系統施加壓力，以繼續釘住它，這就是我們正在做的事情。

Okay, great. It's nice to see the extra cash coming in the door from multiple sources. I don't know if you covered this already but can you give us a sense now that your balance sheet is? So maybe on Firmer, a Firmer Foundation, how are you thinking about spending in 2025 maybe walk us through what you're thinking about in terms of commercial organization? And then how, how do you prioritize the timing of that as reimbursement might come in?

好的，太好了。很高興看到來自多個來源的額外現金湧入。我不知道您是否已經介紹過這一點，但是您現在可以讓我們了解您的資產負債表嗎？那麼，也許在 Firmer（一個 Firmer 基金會）上，您如何考慮 2025 年的支出，也許可以向我們介紹一下您在商業組織方面的想法？然後，當報銷可能到來時，您如何確定優先順序？

Yeah, I mean, we're. I would know, just think, appreciate the comment on the, on the cash. I mean, it's, it's super important and we did it in a really cost effective way. And, and we were really excited about that. We called that out on the script but, but, you know, sometimes the fundraising can take a big chunk off the top and, and, and the way we did this, you know, really, I think, think, I think it was really cost effective. We, we, we're going to, we'll stay largely, you know, very, we'll be in cash conservation mode all the way now when we get this company, you know, all the way through to cash break even. And then, you know, as we try to scale it over time to a highly profitable company, we're very focused on, I think we all learned a lot through this last period and we're not going to keep our eyes, we're going to keep our eyes on the, on the bottom line. And certainly in this next phase, be very thoughtful. We'll stay very focused with our current reps in the field, until we start to, until we know that we're going to get reimbursement and then we'll start to grow it out, grow it out from there. But we'll, we, we're not going to expand that out ahead of anything or because you can just burn a lot of money. Unsa and we have a partner that's actually, you know, nailing it in the field for us. So we don't really need to, we're getting the traction that we need and we're starting to get installed at many of the top institutions and we're making the progress commercially. You see that in the 60% sequential, you know, quarter over quarter numbers that we need to do with what we've got.

是的，我是說，我們是。我想知道，只是想一下，感謝對現金的評論。我的意思是，這非常重要，我們以一種非常具有成本效益的方式做到了這一點。而且，我們對此感到非常興奮。我們在劇本中指出了這一點，但是，但是，你知道，有時籌款可能會減少很大一部分，而且，我們這樣做的方式，你知道，真的，我認為，我認為這是真的很划算。我們，我們，我們將，我們將在很大程度上保持，你知道，非常，當我們收購這家公司時，我們將一直處於現金節約模式，你知道，一直到現金收支平衡。然後，你知道，當我們試圖隨著時間的推移將其規模擴大為一家高利潤的公司時，我們非常專注於，我認為我們在過去的一段時間裡學到了很多東西，我們不會一直關注，我們我們將密切關注底線。當然，在下一階段，要深思熟慮。我們將非常專注於我們目前在該領域的代表，直到我們開始這樣做，直到我們知道我們將獲得報銷，然後我們將開始擴大它，從那裡擴大它。但我們、我們、我們不會在任何事情之前就擴大這個規模，或者因為你可能會燒掉很多錢。Unsa 和我們有一個合作夥伴，您知道，他實際上正在為我們解決這個問題。所以我們真的不需要這樣做，我們正在獲得所需的牽引力，我們開始在許多頂級機構安裝，並且我們正在商業上取得進展。你可以看到，在 60% 的連續數字中，你知道，我們需要利用我們所擁有的資源來完成季度環比的數字。

Just one other thing on the capital allocation, one other thing on the capital allocation mark. And so inside of our R&D expense, that's 50 to $55 million per year. Roughly third of that goes towards creating clinical evidence. And that's going to, that's going to stay in a similar range as we go forward into 25 and we could step it up in 26 primarily because we do have to continue down that path to, to be able to go get some of the private payers to pay us as well into the future.

只是資本配置上的另一件事，資本配置標記上的另一件事。因此，我們的研發費用每年為 5,000 至 5,500 萬美元。其中大約三分之一用於創建臨床證據。當我們進入25 個國家時，這將保持在類似的範圍內，我們可以在26 個國家中提高這一水平，主要是因為我們確實必須繼續沿著這條道路走下去，以便能夠吸引一些私人付款人支付我們以及未來的費用。

We'll keep. We'll keep driving hard in clinical evidence showing the value of ultra sensitive testing. No clinical utility studies are, you know, perspective gathered before firing that stuff up. We've got all that embedded in our, in our models and, and I think investors should feel actually, you know, I'm happy that we're, we're, we're, we're going to invest there. I think, I think, I think the learnings from all these diagnostic companies is that is always good spending as you build deeper evidence in the world of the products.

我們會保留。我們將繼續努力提供臨床證據來證明超靈敏測試的價值。你知道，在啟動這些東西之前，沒有任何臨床效用研究會收集觀點。我們已經將所有這些嵌入到我們的模型中，而且我認為投資者實際上應該感到，你知道，我很高興我們將在那裡投資。我認為，我認為，我認為從所有這些診斷公司學到的教訓是，當你在產品領域建立更深入的證據時，這總是很好的支出。

Okay. Thank you guys.

好的。謝謝你們。

Park.

公園。

Our next question comes from Thomas Flaten of Lake Street Capital. Please go ahead.

我們的下一個問題來自 Lake Street Capital 的 Thomas Flaten。請繼續。

Good afternoon guys. Great quarter. Congrats. Chris, in your prepared remarks, you mentioned that that Bret and IO had been submitted to peer reviewed publications. Should we just then extend that logic and assume that those will be the two indications that you're seeking to get reimbursement for 2025? Or do you think there's an opportunity for long to kind of leapfrog one of them?

各位下午好。很棒的季度。恭喜。Chris，在您準備好的發言中，您提到 Bret 和 IO 已提交給同行評審出版物。我們是否應該擴展這個邏輯並假設這將是您尋求 2025 年報銷的兩個跡象？或者你認為在很長一段時間內有機會超越其中之一？

No, no, no, we're, we're, we're all over long. We might, you know, we're shooting to have three out of three. But you know, we think that, you know, two out of two, you want to have three shots on goal with the idea of getting two, if that makes sense, Thomas that something inevitably on the reimbursement road map could happen. And so, you know, presumably you could say those two marbles are, you know, rolling a little faster now, but the long one, you know, could certainly catch up, the data looks really strong there. It's one of the larger MRD trials that long. And, and so, you know, I think, I think we're going to move all three of them pretty aggressively and we have a shot at getting all three reimbursed in 2025. To be perfectly H1st, that's our internal plan. It's just that, you know, we, we, we think it's prudent to, to, to assume that something could happen with one of them on journey, either in a publication or, or, or, or, or somebody wants us to run more data to, to something.

不，不，不，我們，我們，我們都已經結束了。你知道，我們可能會爭取三分之三。但你知道，我們認為，你知道，兩分之二，你希望有 3 次射門，並且有 2 次射門的想法，如果這有意義的話，托馬斯，報銷路線圖上不可避免的事情可能會發生。所以，你知道，大概你可以說，那兩個彈珠現在滾動得更快了一點，但是長的彈珠，你知道，肯定可以趕上，那裡的數據看起來非常強大。這是規模較大、時間較長的 MRD 試驗之一。所以，我認為，我們將非常積極地轉移這三個項目，並且我們有機會在 2025 年獲得所有三個項目的補償。成為完美的 H1st，這是我們的內部計劃。只是，你知道，我們，我們，我們認為謹慎地假設他們中的一個人在旅途中可能會發生一些事情，無論是在出版物中還是，或者，或者，或者，或者有人希望我們逃跑更多數據到某事。

Anything to add to that bridge. Oh, sorry.

任何可以添加到這座橋上的東西。哦，抱歉。

Hi, Thomas.

嗨，托馬斯。

So please go ahead. Rich.

所以請繼續。富有的。

No, it was, it was, there was nothing more. I just, I was just checking in, and he doesn't have any more. Say, go ahead.

不，是，是，沒有別的了。我只是，我剛剛簽到，他沒有更多了。說著，繼續吧。

Got it. So, with, with the, me Moderna Melanoma study largely enrolled at this point. Do you have a sense of timing on when these other studies might ramp up? And, and, and how that might impact your $100 million aspirational target for 2025? Or how should we think about that aspirational target in light of Melanoma now being largely done?

知道了。因此，我的 Moderna 黑色素瘤研究此時已大部分入組。您知道這些其他研究何時會加速進行嗎？而且，以及，這可能會如何影響您 2025 年 1 億美元的理想目標？或者，鑑於黑色素瘤現在已基本完成，我們應該如何考慮這一理想目標？

Yeah, I mean, I think we set that target knowing that Melanoma would, would largely be done this, you know, would largely be done this year. They were, they were pushing pretty aggressively or we're still committed to, you know, shooting and pushing for 100 million. Now, we, we haven't guided next year and we don't want that to be implied that we've guided that. That's what we're pushing for internally and building our plans to, to nail that because that'll be a big, a big spot in the, in the business. And, and that's, and that's where we are. There's a bunch of studies going. I think they just announced a phase three long trial that they're, they're pushing forward with and we're excited about the relationship with them. And I think it's been another cornerstone relationship for personalis and we've got a, had a great, great year supporting them in their journey.

是的，我的意思是，我認為我們設定了這個目標，知道黑色素瘤將在很大程度上完成，你知道，今年將在很大程度上完成。他們非常積極地推動，或者我們仍然致力於，你知道，射擊並推動 1 億。現在，我們還沒有為明年提供指導，我們不希望這意味著我們已經為明年提供了指導。這就是我們在內部推動的目標，並製定我們的計劃，以解決這個問題，因為這將成為業務中的一個很大的位置。這就是我們現在的處境。有很多研究正在進行中。我認為他們剛剛宣布了他們正在推進的第三階段長期試驗，我們對與他們的關係感到興奮。我認為這是 Personalis 的另一個基石關係，我們度過了非常非常好的一年，支持他們的旅程。

Excellent. I appreciate you taking the question. Thank you. Thank you, Thomas.

出色的。我很感謝你提出這個問題。謝謝。謝謝你，托馬斯。

Our next question comes from Mike Matson of need and my company, please go ahead.

我們的下一個問題來自需求的 Mike Matson 和我的公司，請繼續。

Hi guys. It's Joseph on for Mike. So I understand it's still early days with next personal and the partnership with Tempus. But, you know, I'm just kind of wondering if you've seen out of the you know, three indications of a certain indication, whether it be breast long or IO has, has been a predominant driver of volume there. And then, you know, maybe if there's not an answer there, if there's a certain, you know, data set, whether it be something robust like tracer that you've heard from physicians or a similar contacts that have you know, driven awareness of next personal.

嗨，大家好。約瑟夫代替麥克。所以我知道下一個人以及與 Tempus 的合作還處於早期階段。但是，你知道，我只是想知道你是否已經看到，某種跡象的三個跡象，無論是乳房長還是 IO ，一直是那裡成交量的主要驅動因素。然後，你知道，也許如果那裡沒有答案，如果有一個特定的數據集，無論它是強大的東西，比如你從醫生那裡聽到的追踪器，還是你知道的類似聯繫人，驅動意識下個人的。

Yeah, I mean, I think that we're seeing it across all three of those indications. IO therapy monitoring, I think probably does, it's fair to say does a lot of the heavy lifting and that's pan cancer. That's probably true, you know, across all the use of molecular diagnostics. It's the, it's where most of the C GP tests are playing and are covered. So I think that's, that's always one of the key indications.

是的，我的意思是，我認為我們在所有這三個跡像中都看到了這一點。IO 治療監測，我認為可能確實如此，公平地說，它承擔了很多繁重的工作，這就是泛癌。你知道，在所有分子診斷的使用中，這可能都是正確的。這是大多數 C GP 測試進行和覆蓋的地方。所以我認為這始終是關鍵指標之一。

But there's been a lot of interest in what we're doing with breast and lung. We're solving, you know, real problems that physicians have with patient care and that insight is being valued and, and, and, and it's driving the usage. I think all of the data sets have been have been well received. You know, I think the Tracerx data set and the Royal Marston data set where we're able to show finding cancer 15 months ahead of imaging for lung cancer on average, sometimes as long as three years ahead of imaging, but 15 months medium, I think it is. And lung cancer nearly a year ahead of imaging has been really well received and physicians have that's, you know, sort of underlying the power of the ultrasensitive approach.

但人們對我們在乳房和肺部所做的事情很感興趣。你知道，我們正在解決醫生在患者護理方面遇到的真正問題，並且這種洞察力正在受到重視，並且，並且，並且，並且它正在推動使用。我認為所有的數據集都受到了好評。你知道，我認為 Tracerx 數據集和 Royal Marston 數據集能夠顯示肺癌成像平均提前 15 個月發現癌症，有時甚至比成像提前三年，但平均提前 15 個月，我認為是的。比成像提前近一年的肺癌確實受到了廣泛的歡迎，你知道，這就是超靈敏方法的力量的基礎。

Okay, great. And then maybe I think Erin had mentioned that you guys are still, you know, having ongoing discussions with other companies for doing additional sequencing work for the enterprise sales. Just kind of wondering, you know, what type of contract or you know, relationship would have to exist for you guys to maybe shift focus away from your main strategic efforts. MRD being that main one. I, I guess, yeah, what, what, what type of contract, whether size or, or scope would, would need to be you know, presented.

好的，太好了。然後，也許我認為艾琳提到過，你們仍在與其他公司進行持續討論，為企業銷售進行額外的排序工作。只是想知道，你們知道，必須存在什麼類型的合約或關係，才能將注意力從主要策略工作上轉移開。MRD 是主要的。我，我想，是的，什麼，什麼，什麼類型的合同，無論是規模還是範圍，都需要你知道，提出。

Yeah go ahead and answer it.

是的，繼續回答吧。

Yeah. So, so good question in terms of our main focus. Winning an MRD Is our number one focus both in the clinic and with BioPharma. In terms of, you know, discussions, we have some ongoing discussions with potential partners. It's going to have to be something where it's not going to take us down or deviate too far away from what we do and what we're good at. Right. It's going to have to be something along the lines of products that we have in service today to make sure that it can be run in our lab the same way from an efficiency standpoint, right? But it's still in early days. So we don't have anything to report in that regard, but that's just kind of how the, how we think about it today, Joseph.

是的。所以，就我們的主要關注點而言，這是一個很好的問題。贏得 MRD 是我們在臨床和生物製藥領域的首要關注點。在討論方面，我們正在與潛在合作夥伴進行一些討論。它必須是不會讓我們失望或偏離我們所做和擅長的事情太遠的事情。正確的。它必須與我們今天使用的產品系列一致，以確保從效率的角度來看它可以在我們的實驗室中以相同的方式運行，對吧？但現在還處於早期階段。因此，我們在這方面沒有任何可報告的內容，但這就是我們今天的想法，約瑟夫。

Okay. Yeah, that's, that's very helpful. That's all the questions from us and congrats on the quarter.

好的。是的，這非常有幫助。這就是我們提出的所有問題，恭喜本季。

Thank you.

謝謝。

(Operating Instructions)

（操作說明）

Our next question comes from Lee Chen of HC Wainwright. Please go ahead.

我們的下一個問題來自 HC Wainwright 的 Lee Chen。請繼續。

Hello, this is Li for, for RK. Just a quick question from us. So previously, you guided the growth margin for 2025 to be in the low 30s. I wonder if this is still exposed to and if you have any updated thoughts on that. Thank you.

大家好，李為，為RK。我們只是問一個簡單的問題。此前，你們指導 2025 年的成長幅度在 30 左右。我想知道這是否仍然存在，以及您對此是否有任何更新的想法。謝謝。

I'm sorry. We didn't guide 2025 to be in the low 30s. It's really for 2024 2024. Our gross margin estimate is in the low 30s, 31 to 32%.

對不起。我們並沒有將 2025 年的目標定在 30 左右。這真的是2024年2024年的事。我們的毛利率估計在 30% 左右，即 31% 至 32%。

We'll guide, we'll guide for 2025 once we get into our fourth quarter and full year earnings call early 2025.

一旦我們進入 2025 年初的第四季和全年財報電話會議，我們將提供指導，我們將指導 2025 年。

Thank you for the question.

謝謝你的提問。

Thank you, lee.

謝謝你，李。

Thank.

感謝。

With no further questions in the question. Queue. Ladies and gentlemen, we have reached the end of the question and answer session.

問題中沒有進一步的問題。隊列。女士們、先生們，問答環節已經結束。

Thank you for attending and you may now disconnect your lines.

感謝您的出席，您現在可以斷開線路了。