PennyMac Financial Services, Inc. (PFSI) 2026 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, and welcome to PennyMac Financial Services Inc's first quarter 2026 earnings call. Additional earnings materials, including presentation slides that will be referred to in this call as well as an Excel file with supplemental information are available on PennyMac Financial's website at pfsi.pennymac.com.

下午好，歡迎參加PennyMac Financial Services Inc 2026年第一季財報電話會議。其他財報資料（包括本次電話會議將引用的簡報投影片，以及含補充資訊的Excel檔）可於PennyMac Financial網站 pfsi.pennymac.com 取得。

Before we begin, let me remind you that this call may contain forward-looking statements that are subject to certain risks identified on slide 2 of the earnings presentation that could cause the company's actual results to differ materially as well as non-GAAP measures that have been reconciled to their GAAP equivalent in the earnings materials.

在開始之前，提醒各位，本次電話會議可能包含前瞻性陳述，相關風險已於財報簡報第2頁投影片中揭露，可能導致公司實際結果與前述陳述存在重大差異；此外亦可能包含非GAAP衡量指標，並已在財報資料中與其GAAP對應項目完成調節。

Now I'd like to introduce David Spector, PennyMac Financial's Chairman and Chief Executive Officer; and Dan Perotti, PennyMac Financial's Chief Financial Officer.

現在我想介紹PennyMac Financial董事長兼執行長David Spector，以及PennyMac Financial財務長Dan Perotti。

Thank you, operator. Good afternoon and thank you to everyone for participating in our first quarter 2026 earnings call. As shown on slide 3, PennyMac Financial generated net income of $82 million in the first quarter or $1.53 in earnings per diluted share or an 8% annualized return on equity. Excluding the impact of valuation-related changes and transaction expenses related to our acquisition of Cenlar's subservicing business, adjusted EPS was $2.19 per diluted share or an 11% annualized adjusted return on equity.

謝謝，接線員。下午好，感謝各位參與我們2026年第一季財報電話會議。如第3頁投影片所示，PennyMac Financial第一季淨利為8,200萬美元，稀釋後每股盈餘為1.53美元，或年化股東權益報酬率為8%。若排除與估值相關的變動影響，以及我們收購Cenlar次級代管（subservicing）業務所產生的交易費用，調整後稀釋每股盈餘為2.19美元，或年化調整後股東權益報酬率為11%。

As Dan will expand upon, we continue to optimize our hedging strategies to converge GAAP and adjusted ROEs. While our adjusted return on equity this quarter remained below our longer-term expectations, we remain intensely focused on maximizing returns on invested capital over the near and long term.

如Dan稍後將進一步說明，我們持續優化避險策略，以使GAAP與調整後ROE趨於一致。雖然本季調整後股東權益報酬率仍低於我們的長期預期，但我們仍高度專注於在短期與長期最大化投入資本的報酬。

I am also optimistic regarding the underlying trends in our business, particularly higher recapture rates in consumer direct channel, coupled with increasing revenue per loan. In addition to these positive trends, I will also address initiatives we currently have underway later in this call.

我也對我們業務的基本趨勢感到樂觀，尤其是消費者直營通路的回收率（recapture rates）提升，並伴隨每筆貸款收入增加。除上述正向趨勢外，我也將在本次電話會議稍後說明我們目前正在推動的各項計畫。

Our optimism is most evident in the production segment, where we are strategically growing in areas that will optimize returns on capital in what remains a dynamic and fragmented market. Specifically in the correspondent channel, we are leveraging our leadership position to exercise rigorous pricing discipline on the related MSRs while driving an increase in margins across various products. This pricing discipline, combined with continued growth in our consumer and broker direct channels led to production segment generating its highest level of pretax income in nearly 5 years.

我們的樂觀在生產（production）部門最為明顯；在仍然動態且分散的市場中，我們正策略性地在可優化資本報酬的領域擴張。具體而言，在同業轉售（correspondent）通路，我們運用領先地位，對相關MSR採取嚴格的定價紀律，同時推動各類產品利差提升。此一定價紀律，加上消費者直營與經紀直營（broker direct）通路的持續成長，使生產部門創下近5年來最高的稅前盈餘水準。

In addition, we have three distinct production channels: correspondent, broker direct and consumer direct, all of which are operating at significant scale. This diversified platform provides us with multiple complementary avenues for sustainable growth and a unique ability to shift our focus and resources to the channel that offers the most attractive risk-adjusted returns.

此外，我們擁有三個不同的生產通路：同業轉售（correspondent）、經紀直營（broker direct）與消費者直營（consumer direct），且皆具相當規模。此一多元化平台為我們提供多條互補的永續成長路徑，並具備獨特能力可將重點與資源轉向能提供最具吸引力之風險調整後報酬的通路。

Turning to slide 4. Let's review a few additional business updates. During the quarter, we repurchased 560,000 shares or 1% of our outstanding stock for $50 million at a weighted average price of $89.28 per share as we saw tremendous value in the stock at these price levels. I am also pleased to report that we remain on track to close the acquisition of Cenlar's subservicing business in the second half of the year.

接著看第4頁投影片。我們來回顧幾項其他業務更新。本季我們以加權平均每股89.28美元的價格回購56萬股、約占流通在外股數的1%，總金額5,000萬美元，因為我們認為在此價位區間該股票具備極高價值。我也很高興報告，我們仍按計畫於今年下半年完成收購Cenlar次級代管（subservicing）業務的交易交割。

Our teams are collaborating effectively to ensure a seamless integration of Cenlar's subservicing business into our operations. As outlined in our investor update presentation in February, once fully integrated, we expect strong returns from this acquisition, and we are excited about the increase in scale and diversification that this transaction will provide.

我們的團隊正有效協作，以確保Cenlar次級代管業務能無縫整合至我們的營運中。如我們2月投資人更新簡報所述，一旦完成整合，我們預期此項收購將帶來強勁報酬；我們也對此交易將帶來的規模擴大與多元化提升感到振奮。

Turning to our consumer direct origination channel. The deployment of Vesta has been complete for new loan originations and has begun to drive operating efficiencies through the introduction of AI agents and the resulting reduction in previously manual tasks. On recapture, I am also pleased with the meaningful progress we have already achieved with consumer direct origination volumes up meaningfully from recent periods and conventional first lien refinance recapture rates up 5 percentage points from the prior quarter to 22%. This momentum has continued into the second quarter with conventional first lien refinance recapture rates running near 30% in the month of April.

接著談我們的消費者直營承作（origination）通路。Vesta已完成用於新貸款承作的部署，並透過導入AI代理（AI agents）以及因此減少過去需人工處理的工作，開始帶動營運效率提升。在回收（recapture）方面，我也很高興看到我們已取得顯著進展：消費者直營承作量較近期期間明顯上升，而傳統型第一順位抵押貸款再融資（conventional first lien refinance）的回收率較前一季提高5個百分點至22%。此一動能延續至第二季，4月的傳統型第一順位抵押貸款再融資回收率接近30%。

Turning to slide 6. Our mortgage banking operating pretax income was $190 million for the quarter, up from $173 million in the fourth quarter. As we look ahead, we expect adjusted ROEs to remain near current levels in the second quarter before increasing to the low to mid-teens in the second half of 2026 as we realize the benefits of technology and efficiency enhancements.

接著看第6頁投影片。本季我們的房貸銀行業務營運稅前盈餘為1.90億美元，高於第四季的1.73億美元。展望未來，我們預期第二季調整後ROE將維持在目前水準附近，並在2026年下半年隨著我們實現科技與效率提升的效益而上升至低至中十位數（low to mid-teens）。

As just mentioned, we have lowered our ROE guidance from the mid- to high teens to low to mid-teens in the second half of the year due to 2 main factors. First, we have decided to meaningfully accelerate our technology investments to drive significant operational efficiencies in both production and servicing. And second, we expect less origination demand with interest rates at current levels. Over the medium to long term, we continue to expect PFSI to achieve ROEs in the high teens to low 20% range, which we expect to achieve through the realization of these technology investments and increasing scale.

如剛才所提到，由於兩項主要因素，我們已將今年下半年ROE指引由中至高十位數（mid- to high teens）下調至低至中十位數（low to mid-teens）。第一，我們決定大幅加速科技投資，以在生產與服務（servicing）兩端推動顯著的營運效率提升。第二，在目前利率水準下，我們預期承作需求將較少。在中長期，我們仍預期PFSI可達到高十位數至低20%區間的ROE；我們預期將透過落實這些科技投資效益與規模擴大來達成。

On slide 7, we highlight the future opportunity within our consumer direct channel when rates do decline as well as our first lien refinance recapture rates over the 5 most recent quarters. As of March 31, we serviced a combined $320 billion in UPB of loans with note rates above 5%, of which more than half had note rates above 6%. As you can see on the charts in the middle of the page, government refinance originations from our portfolio in the consumer direct channel are nearly double first quarter 2025 loans and our first lien refinance recapture rates remain strong in the 50% range.

在第7頁投影片中，我們重點說明當利率下滑時，消費者直營通路的未來機會，以及最近5個季度的第一順位抵押貸款再融資回收率。截至3月31日，我們服務（serviced）的貸款未償本金（UPB）合計為3,200億美元，其票面利率高於5%，其中超過一半的票面利率高於6%。如頁面中間的圖表所示，消費者直營通路中來自我們投資組合的政府型再融資承作量幾乎為2025年第一季貸款的兩倍，而我們的第一順位抵押貸款再融資回收率仍維持在約50%的強勁水準。

We are seeing even more success in conventional loans, where volumes are up more than fivefold from levels reported in the first quarter of 2025, driven by the previously noted improvement in first lien recapture rates to 22% from 17% in the prior quarter. And as I mentioned earlier, in April, we achieved conventional first lien refinance recapture rates of nearly 30%.

我們在傳統型貸款方面看到更大的成功：受前述第一順位回收率由前一季的17%提升至22%所帶動，承作量較2025年第一季所報告的水準增加逾五倍。此外，如我先前提到，我們在4月達成傳統型第一順位抵押貸款再融資回收率接近30%。

We also completed the transition to Vesta, our new consumer direct loan origination system during the first quarter, and we are in the process of working through the pipeline of loans originated on the old system, which we expect to have completed in the second quarter. This new system has already substantially improved the customer experience. I am very pleased with these initial results and expect to realize material benefits of our new platform in the second half of this year. The early success we are seeing is a direct byproduct of our ability to reduce cost per loan and the days to close as well as leverage real-time data to engage borrowers more effectively.

我們也在第一季完成轉換至Vesta（我們新的消費者直營貸款承作系統），目前正處理在舊系統上承作的貸款管線，預期將於第二季完成。此一新系統已大幅改善客戶體驗。我對這些初步成果非常滿意，並預期在今年下半年可實現新平台帶來的實質效益。我們所見的早期成功，直接源自於我們降低每筆貸款成本與結案天數的能力，以及運用即時數據更有效地與借款人互動。

We have also started the successful release of AI agents within our fulfillment process across multiple products. We are rapidly moving towards a model with exceptionally low manual intervention and in some cases, we will have removed human touch points entirely, thereby improving the customer experience, further increasing recapture rates and driving higher operating margins. Furthermore, we are focused on the implementation of additional specific tech-enabled solutions, ranging from AI-driven lead prioritization to enhanced digital self-service.

我們也已在多項產品的履約流程中，成功開始導入並釋出 AI 代理（AI agents）。我們正快速邁向一種人工介入極低的營運模式，在某些情況下，我們將完全移除人工接觸點，從而改善客戶體驗、進一步提高回收率並推升更高的營業利潤率。此外，我們也專注於導入更多特定的科技賦能解決方案，涵蓋從 AI 驅動的潛在客戶優先排序到強化的數位自助服務。

Turning to slide 8. You can see how our state-of-the-art technology platform is driving significant operating leverage and superior unit economics across the entire enterprise. By combining our technology foundation with our scale advantages, we are driving unit costs to historic lows. As noted on the chart, our direct expenses within the consumer direct channel dropped 26% compared to 2022 levels. Similarly, in our servicing segment, our operating expenses as a percentage of total servicing UPB have dropped 24% to 4.5 basis points as we continued to enhance workforce productivity and automate complex tasks through the deployment of sophisticated technology. In our corporate and other segment, we are clearly achieving more results.

接著看第 8 張投影片。您可以看到，我們最先進的科技平台正為整個企業帶來顯著的營運槓桿與更優異的單位經濟效益。透過結合我們的技術基礎與規模優勢，我們正將單位成本推至歷史低點。如圖表所示，我們在消費者直營通路的直接費用較 2022 年水準下降 26%。同樣地，在我們的服務（servicing）部門，營運費用占服務總未償本金（UPB）的比例下降 24%，降至 4.5 個基點；這是因為我們持續提升人力生產力，並透過部署先進技術將複雜任務自動化。在公司及其他部門，我們也明顯取得更多成果。

By leaning into a unified technology foundation, we have reduced compensation as a percentage of adjusted revenue to 3.7% from 6.5% in 2022, a decrease of 44%. While these results are compelling, we are in a new stage of transformation and AI implementation with significant runway ahead to further optimize our platform, reduce unit costs and capture additional economies of scale. By combining our pricing and capital allocation disciplines with a best-in-class technology infrastructure that is already delivering record low unit costs, we are building a more resilient and profitable enterprise. We have the team, the technology and the scale necessary to drive toward our long-term target of high teens to low 20% ROEs.

藉由採用統一的技術基礎，我們已將薪酬占調整後營收的比例自 2022 年的 6.5% 降至 3.7%，降幅達 44%。儘管這些成果令人振奮，我們正處於轉型與 AI 導入的新階段，未來仍有相當大的空間可進一步優化平台、降低單位成本並取得更多規模經濟。透過結合我們在定價與資本配置上的紀律，以及一流的技術基礎設施（目前已帶來創紀錄的低單位成本），我們正在打造更具韌性且更高獲利能力的企業。我們具備團隊、技術與規模，足以推動我們朝長期目標——股東權益報酬率（ROE）達到高十位數至低 20%——邁進。

I will now turn it over to Dan, who will review the drivers of PFSI's first quarter financial performance.

接下來我將把時間交給 Dan，由他說明 PFSI 第一季財務表現的驅動因素。

Thank you, David. PFSI reported net income of $82 million in the first quarter or $1.53 in earnings per share for an annualized ROE of 8%. Adjusted net income was $118 million or $2.19 in adjusted earnings per share for an annualized adjusted ROE of 11%.

謝謝你，David。PFSI 第一季淨利為 8,200 萬美元，或每股盈餘 1.53 美元，年化 ROE 為 8%。調整後淨利為 1.18 億美元，或調整後每股盈餘 2.19 美元，年化調整後 ROE 為 11%。

The $0.66 difference between our GAAP and adjusted EPS was driven by 2 items. First, $44 million of fair value declines on MSRs net of hedges and costs. This includes principal-only stripped MBS valuation-related accretion changes and provision for losses on active loans. And second, $3 million of expenses related to our acquisition of Cenlar.

我們 GAAP 與調整後 EPS 之間 0.66 美元的差異，主要由兩項因素造成。第一，MSR（抵押貸款服務權）在避險與成本後的公允價值下跌 4,400 萬美元。其中包含僅本金（principal-only）剝離式 MBS 估值相關的增值（accretion）變動，以及對在途貸款的損失準備。第二，與我們收購 Cenlar 相關的費用 300 萬美元。

PFSI's Board of Directors declared a first quarter common share dividend of $0.30 per share. And as David mentioned, we repurchased 560,000 shares of common stock for $50 million.

PFSI 董事會宣告第一季普通股股利為每股 0.30 美元。此外，如 David 所提，我們以 5,000 萬美元回購了 56 萬股普通股。

On slides 10 and 11, beginning with our production segment, pretax income was $134 million, more than double from the same quarter a year ago and up 5% from the prior quarter. As David mentioned, the increase from the prior quarter was driven primarily by strong execution in consumer and broker direct, which combined represented 75% of PFSI's account revenues.

在第 10 與第 11 張投影片，先從我們的生產（production）部門開始，稅前淨利為 1.34 億美元，較去年同期增加逾一倍，並較前一季成長 5%。如 David 所提，較前一季的成長主要來自消費者直營與經紀直營（broker direct）的強勁執行力；兩者合計占 PFSI 帳戶營收的 75%。

Total acquisition and origination volumes were $37 billion in unpaid principal balance, down 12% from the prior quarter. Of this, $34 billion was for PFSI's own accounts and $3 billion was fee-based fulfillment activity for PMT. Total lock volumes were $44 billion in UPB, down 4% from the prior quarter.

總收購與承作（origination）量以未償本金（UPB）計為 370 億美元，較前一季下降 12%。其中，340 億美元屬於 PFSI 自有帳戶，30 億美元為替 PMT 提供的按費用計價履約（fulfillment）業務。總鎖定（lock）量以 UPB 計為 440 億美元，較前一季下降 4%。

PennyMac maintained its leading position in correspondent lending. Correspondent acquisitions were $24 billion in the first quarter, down 20% from the prior quarter. While our platform continues to drive profitable and sustainable growth, we are refining our production mix to better withstand market volatility and maximize the long-term value of our servicing portfolio.

PennyMac 維持其在通訊放款（correspondent lending）領域的領先地位。第一季通訊收購量為 240 億美元，較前一季下降 20%。儘管我們的平台持續推動具獲利性且可持續的成長，我們也正在調整生產組合，以更能承受市場波動並最大化我們服務（servicing）投資組合的長期價值。

Correspondent channel margins were 28 basis points, up from 25 basis points in the prior quarter due to a shift in mix towards higher-margin government loans given the increased levels of competition from the GSE cash window, combined with a meaningful increase in average revenue per loan. Under its fulfillment agreement, PMT retains the right to purchase all nongovernment correspondent loan production from PFSI.

通訊通路利差為 28 個基點，高於前一季的 25 個基點；原因在於產品組合轉向利差較高的政府貸款（在 GSE 現金窗口競爭加劇的背景下），並且每筆貸款平均收入顯著提升。依據其履約協議，PMT 保留向 PFSI 購買所有非政府通訊貸款產量的權利。

In the first quarter, PMT purchased 18% of total conventional conforming correspondent production and 100% of nonconforming correspondent production, both percentages essentially unchanged from the prior quarter. In broker direct, we continued to see momentum as we position PennyMac as a strong alternative to channel leaders. Originations were up 3% and locks were up 26% from the prior quarter. The number of brokers approved to do business with us continues to grow, up 12% from the same time a year ago, reflecting the growing number of brokers who are increasingly leveraging our distinct value proposition. The revenue contribution from broker direct was up from the prior quarter due to higher volumes. Though margins were down slightly, revenue per loan increased, reflecting an increase in our average loan balances.

第一季，PMT 購買了通訊通路中總傳統合規（conventional conforming）產量的 18%，以及 100% 的非合規（nonconforming）通訊產量；兩者占比與前一季基本持平。在經紀直營方面，隨著我們將 PennyMac 定位為通路領導者的有力替代選擇，我們持續看到動能。承作量較前一季成長 3%，鎖定量較前一季成長 26%。獲准與我們合作的經紀商數量持續增加，較去年同期成長 12%，反映出越來越多經紀商正加大運用我們獨特的價值主張。由於量能提升，經紀直營的營收貢獻較前一季增加。儘管利差略有下滑，但每筆貸款收入上升，反映我們平均貸款餘額提高。

Additionally, we recently launched the non-QM product within our broker direct channel and are already seeing strong initial take-up and positive traction from our broker partners as they leverage our expanded product suite. Lots of non-QM loans in our broker channel were $151 million in UPB during the first quarter, and momentum continued in April with $157 million in UPB of blocks.

此外，我們近期在經紀直營通路推出非 QM（non-QM）產品，並已看到強勁的初期採用率，以及經紀合作夥伴在運用我們擴充後的產品組合時所展現的正向進展。第一季，我們經紀通路中的非 QM 貸款批量（lots）為 1.51 億美元（以 UPB 計），而 4 月動能延續，批量（blocks）UPB 達 1.57 億美元。

In consumer direct, volumes were up with originations up 15% and locked up 24% from the prior quarter, driving revenue contribution 30% higher than in the prior quarter. While margins were down slightly, revenue per loan increased sequentially across our conventional jumbo and closed-end second products, indicating higher average loan balances for those loan types.

在消費者直營方面，量能上升：承作量較前一季增加 15%，鎖定量較前一季增加 24%，帶動營收貢獻較前一季高出 30%。儘管利差略有下滑，但在我們的傳統巨額（conventional jumbo）與封閉式第二順位（closed-end second）產品中，每筆貸款收入皆呈現季增，顯示這些貸款類型的平均貸款餘額更高。

Post-lock activities across the channels contributed $13 million to pretax income, down from $34 million in the prior quarter, which benefited from strong secondary market execution relative to initial pricing. Production expenses net of loan origination expense increased 11% from the prior quarter due to higher volumes in direct lending.

各通路的鎖定後（post-lock）活動對稅前淨利貢獻 1,300 萬美元，低於前一季的 3,400 萬美元；前一季受惠於相較初始定價更強的次級市場執行表現。扣除貸款承作費用後的生產費用較前一季增加 11%，主因直營放款量能提升。

Turning to servicing on slides 12 and 13. Our total servicing portfolio UPB ended the quarter at $720 billion, down only 2% from the prior quarter end despite runoff in MSR sales, which were largely mitigated by additions from new production. The servicing segment recorded pretax income of $13 million. Excluding valuation-related changes, pretax income was $57 million or 3.1 basis points of average servicing portfolio UPB, up from $45 million or 2.5 basis points in the prior quarter.

接著看第 12 與第 13 張投影片的服務（servicing）業務。本季末我們的服務投資組合總未償本金（UPB）為 7,200 億美元，較前一季季末僅下降 2%；儘管 MSR 出售帶來自然流失，但新增生產帶來的增量在很大程度上抵銷了影響。服務部門錄得稅前淨利 1,300 萬美元。若排除估值相關變動，稅前淨利為 5,700 萬美元，或平均服務投資組合 UPB 的 3.1 個基點，高於前一季的 4,500 萬美元或 2.5 個基點。

Earnings from custodial balances were down from the prior quarter, primarily due to lower short-term interest rates. Though realized prepayment fees increased slightly from the prior quarter, realization of MSR cash flows was down 7% due to the expectation of lower prepayment fees in future periods resulting from portfolio burnout.

託管餘額所產生的收益較前一季下滑，主要因短期利率走低。儘管已實現的提前清償費用較前一季小幅增加，但由於預期未來期間因投組耗竭而導致提前清償費用降低，MSR 現金流的實現下降了 7%。

Operating expenses remained low at 4.5 basis points of average servicing portfolio UPB or $81 million in the quarter. EBO revenue increased due to higher initiation of modifications and redelivery margins as a result of lower rates in the beginning of the quarter. Including the provision for losses on active loans, the fair value of PFSI's MSR increased by $177 million. An increase of $201 million was due to changes in market interest rates and was partially offset by $24 million in declines from other model and performance-related impacts. Hedge fair value losses, including principal-only stripped MBS valuation-related accretion changes and hedge costs were $221 million.

本季營業費用仍維持低檔，為平均服務投組 UPB 的 4.5 個基點，或 8,100 萬美元。由於本季初利率較低，修改啟動量增加且再交付利差提高，EBO 收入上升。納入活動貸款損失準備後，PFSI 的 MSR 公允價值增加 1.77 億美元。其中 2.01 億美元的增加來自市場利率變動，並部分被其他模型及表現相關影響所致的 2,400 萬美元下降所抵銷。避險公允價值損失（包含僅本金分離 MBS 估值相關的折溢價攤銷變動及避險成本）為 2.21 億美元。

As we talked about last quarter, we increased our hedge ratio to near 100% to proactively manage prepayment risk. While agency MBS spread volatility and tightening of the primary/secondary spread drove a net fair value decline this quarter, our positioning reflects our disciplined approach to maintaining book value stability across a volatile interest rate environment.

如同我們上季所談，我們將避險比率提高至接近 100%，以主動管理提前清償風險。儘管本季機構 MBS 利差波動以及一級/二級利差收斂造成淨公允價值下滑，我們的部位配置反映了在利率高度波動環境下維持帳面價值穩定的紀律性作法。

Corporate and other items recorded a pretax loss of $42 million, up from $30 million in the prior quarter, primarily driven by $9 million in marketing activations related to the Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games, which are not expected to recur in upcoming quarters as well as $3 million of transaction expenses related to our acquisition of Cenlar's subservicing business. The prior quarter also included reduced expenses related to technology accruals.

公司層面及其他項目錄得稅前虧損 4,200 萬美元，高於前一季的 3,000 萬美元，主要受 900 萬美元與奧運及帕運冬季賽事相關的行銷啟動費用所驅動（預期未來幾季不會再發生），以及 300 萬美元與我們收購 Cenlar 次級服務業務相關的交易費用。前一季亦包含與科技應計項目相關的費用下降。

PFSI recorded a provision for tax expense of $22 million, resulting in an effective tax rate of 21.4%. Total debt to equity at quarter end was 4 times and nonfunding debt to equity at the end of the quarter was 1.7 times. The increase in total leverage was driven by higher direct lending production and the increase in nonfunding leverage was driven by higher interest rates, which drove increased utilization for our MSR credit facilities in addition to share repurchases. We expect these leverage ratios to remain near these levels as interest rates remain at current levels.

PFSI 計提所得稅費用 2,200 萬美元，有效稅率為 21.4%。季末總負債對股東權益比為 4 倍，季末非資金性負債對股東權益比為 1.7 倍。總槓桿上升係由直接放款產量增加所致；非資金性槓桿上升則主要因利率走高，帶動我們 MSR 信用融資額度的動用增加，並加上庫藏股回購。在利率維持目前水準的情況下，我們預期這些槓桿比率將大致維持在目前附近。

Finally, we ended the quarter with $4.2 billion of total liquidity, which includes cash and amounts available to draw on facilities where we have collateral pledged.

最後，我們以 42 億美元的總流動性結束本季，其中包含現金以及在我們已提供擔保品的融資額度下可動用的金額。

We'll now open it up for questions. Operator?

接下來我們開放提問。接線員？

(Operator Instructions)

(接線員指示)

Doug Harter, BTIG.

Doug Harter，BTIG。

Thanks. Hoping you could talk about any impact the volatility had on revenue margins in the quarter whether it was increased hedging costs or less effective execution.

謝謝。想請你談談本季波動對收入利差的任何影響，無論是避險成本上升或執行效率較差。

So hi, Doug, how are you? Congratulations on the new role.

嗨，Doug，你好嗎？恭喜你升任新職。

Thank you, David.

謝謝你，David。

So on the production side, I am really encouraged by what I saw take place in the first quarter. On the correspondent side, we saw margins up quarter-over-quarter from the fourth quarter, and we're seeing a continuation of that as we start the second quarter.

就生產端而言，我對第一季所發生的情況感到非常振奮。在同業通路方面，我們看到利差較第四季季增，且在進入第二季時仍持續延續。

In GPO, we're seeing margins currently holding near to the levels we saw in the first quarter. They're actually up a bit, and they're up from the fourth quarter. In our consumer direct channel we're seeing a consistent margin story there, while the mix is going to -- the mix in the second quarter will probably warrant a higher margin of course.

在 GPO 方面，我們目前看到利差大致維持在第一季的水準附近。實際上略有上升，且高於第四季。在我們的消費者直營通路，我們看到利差表現一致；不過產品組合將會——第二季的組合可能會帶來更高的利差，當然。

But I'll tell you that just the focus that we're seeing in the company in driving up the revenue per loan is really showing in our results that we saw in Q1. It's going to continue to be a focus of the company.

但我想說的是，公司目前專注於提升每筆貸款的收入，這點在我們第一季的結果中已充分展現。這將持續成為公司的重點。

On the hedge side, Dan, do you want to answer on the hedge side?

在避險方面，Dan，你要不要回答避險的部分？

Sure. With respect to hedging, as we talked about in the call there was a fair amount of interest rate volatility during the first quarter as you saw in terms of the results and how we laid it out. We think we navigated that volatility well overall with respect to our rate impacts, fairly minimal impact, just $7 million difference between the MSR and hedge versus our rate impacts.

當然。就避險而言，如同我們在電話會議中提到的，第一季利率波動相當明顯，從結果以及我們的拆解方式你也看得到。我們認為整體而言在利率影響方面我們很好地度過了這段波動期，影響相當有限；MSR 與避險相對於我們的利率影響之間僅有 700 萬美元的差異。

Hedge costs, we did see as a little bit elevated, particularly related to the increase in volatility toward the end of the quarter, drove up our hedge costs in March, and that contributed the majority of the hedge costs that we saw, the $14 million in hedge costs that we saw during the quarter. But overall, pleased with our results and our navigation through what was a fairly volatile period in terms of interest rates during Q1.

避險成本方面，我們確實看到略為偏高，特別是季末波動上升，推升了我們 3 月的避險成本，並構成我們本季所見避險成本的大部分，也就是本季 1,400 萬美元的避險成本。但整體而言，我們對結果以及在第一季利率相當波動期間的應對感到滿意。

Great. Appreciate the answer.

很好。感謝你的回答。

Kyle Joseph, Stephens.

Kyle Joseph，Stephens。

Hey, good afternoon, guys. Thanks for taking my questions.

嗨，午安，各位。謝謝回答我的問題。

I guess, yes, as it pertains to hedging, I'd start, and I did hear the operator's warning, but just pending the acquisition how are you thinking about balancing hedging with how the business looks on a pro forma basis? Like, any changes we should expect there?

我想，對，談到避險的話我先問這個；我也有聽到接線員的提醒，但就收購尚未完成而言，你們如何思考在備考（pro forma）基礎上，避險與業務樣貌之間的平衡？例如，我們應該預期有任何變化嗎？

No real changes expected to our hedging strategy as we get through the acquisition. Just to refresh, the business that we're acquiring from Cenlar, their subservicing business is not the MSRs. They have -- it's really a fee-for-service business and so equity light. They don't have any MSRs in particular to speak of.

在完成收購的過程中，我們的避險策略預期不會有實質變動。簡單回顧一下，我們向 Cenlar 收購的業務是其次級服務（subservicing）業務，而不是 MSR。他們——這基本上是按服務收費（fee-for-service）的業務，因此資本占用較低。他們並沒有任何值得特別一提的 MSR。

And so our overall strategy in terms of hedging the MSR, we expect to be consistent with how we've operated to date and not really change with respect to the additional subservicing business that we're bringing on.

因此，就 MSR 的避險整體策略而言，我們預期會與目前為止的運作方式一致，並不會因新增的次級服務業務而有實質改變。

Got it. Thank you. And then just to follow up, just been getting more and more questions on the Homebuyers Privacy Protection Act and how you're thinking about any potential changes to position the business to best address that?

了解。謝謝。接著追問一下，最近大家越來越常問到《購屋者隱私保護法》（Homebuyers Privacy Protection Act），以及你們如何看待任何潛在變動，以便讓業務能最佳因應？

Are you referring to the trigger leads, Kyle?

Kyle，你指的是 trigger leads 嗎？

Yeah, exactly. Thanks, Dave. Yeah.

對，正是。謝謝，Dave。對。

Yes. It's really early. The law went into effect on March 5, and we're just starting to see loans come through that funded that locked at or after that date. We'll have a much better look through in the second quarter. But from the little that we've seen, it's generally positive.

是的。現在還很早。該法律於 3 月 5 日生效，我們才剛開始看到在該日期或之後鎖定利率並完成撥款的貸款進來。我們在第二季會有更清楚的觀察。但就目前看到的少量情況而言，整體上是偏正面的。

Understood. Thanks for taking my question, guys. Appreciate it.

了解。謝謝各位讓我提問。感謝。

You bet.

沒問題。

Bose George, KBW.

Bose George，KBW。

Hey, guys. Good afternoon. Actually, just in terms of your guidance, it looks like you removed the high teens part of the guidance. Now it seems like it's the mid-teens. Is that a reflection of the smaller -- the mortgage market that's expected this year with the move up in rates?

嗨，各位。下午好。其實就你們的指引來看，感覺你們把「高十幾」那一段拿掉了。現在看起來像是「中十幾」。這是否反映了——在利率上升的情況下，今年預期房貸市場規模會更小？

We are -- I will tell you, I've not removed the high teens from the long-term ROE guidance of this company. We believe we're a high teens to low 20% ROE company.

我們——我跟你說，我並沒有把本公司長期ROE指引中的「高十幾」拿掉。我們相信我們是一家ROE落在高十幾到低20%區間的公司。

In the short to medium term, there's really 2 factors that led us to just kind of slow down the return to the historic levels that we've seen. One is the technology spend, and we are investing across -- both across our production channel and our servicing channel.

在短到中期，確實有兩個因素讓我們把回到過去歷史水準的速度稍微放慢。第一個是科技支出，我們正在投資於——同時涵蓋我們的生產通路與服務（servicing）通路。

On the production side we've deployed our new technology into our consumer direct channel. And now we are very busy introducing and implementing AI agents to help reduce not only the cost to fulfill, but also to continue to grow the efficiencies that we're seeing on Vesta for our sales associates.

在生產端，我們已把新技術部署到我們的直客（consumer direct）通路。現在我們也非常忙著導入並落地AI代理（AI agents），不僅要降低核貸交付（fulfill）的成本，也要持續提升我們在Vesta上看到的銷售同仁效率。

And so based on the early results that we're seeing from both, we feel it's incumbent upon us to really move quickly to take humans out of the loop and to be able to close loans faster and cheaper. And so that's going to lead to just growing scale within our consumer direct platform.

因此，基於我們從兩者看到的初步成果，我們認為自己有責任要快速推進，把人從流程迴圈中移除，讓放款能更快、更便宜地完成。這也將帶動我們直客平台的規模擴張。

Similarly based on the results we're seeing in our consumer direct channel, we are moving quickly to move our broker direct channel onto the same platform. There's work that needs to be done to be able to build a broker portal that is very similar in experience and feel to the portal that our brokers experience today. And so that work will be done in the second and third quarters.

同樣地，基於我們在直客通路看到的成果，我們也在加速把我們的經紀商直通（broker direct）通路移到同一個平台上。我們需要完成一些工作，才能打造一個經紀商入口網站（broker portal），在體驗與感受上與經紀商今天使用的入口網站非常相近。這些工作會在第二季與第三季完成。

We expect to see the first broker loans coming on at the end of the year with the full migration taking place in 2027. But the exciting part about the move in broker is that the work we're doing on AI agents for our consumer direct channel are very relevant for our broker partners. And so I feel it's incumbent upon us to deliver the same experience for our brokers that we're seeing within our consumer direct channel.

我們預期今年年底會看到第一批經紀商貸款上線，並在2027年完成全面遷移。但經紀商端轉移最令人興奮的是：我們為直客通路所做的AI代理工作，對我們的經紀商夥伴也非常適用。因此我認為我們有責任把我們在直客通路看到的同等體驗交付給經紀商。

Similarly, on the consumer direct channel, we're doing work to create a human-out-of-the-loop mortgage origination process that I'm excited about that I'm hopeful -- not hopeful, I know we'll see in the second half of this year. And then we're always looking to reduce costs in our correspondent channel and our shared service groups.

同樣地，在直客通路，我們正在打造一個「人不在迴圈中」（human-out-of-the-loop）的房貸承作流程；這件事我很期待，而且我希望——不是希望，我知道——我們會在今年下半年看到。此外，我們也一直在尋找方法，降低我們的同業轉售（correspondent）通路與共享服務團隊的成本。

But other than the technology shared service groups, the cost -- the technology costs with those are pretty minimal with what I'm seeing out of Gemini and Claude and the add-ins that they have to Excel, there's a lot of great work being done around the organization.

不過除了科技共享服務團隊之外，成本——我看到的科技成本其實相當有限；從Gemini、Claude，以及它們對Excel的外掛（add-ins）來看，組織內部正在做很多很棒的工作。

On the servicing side, there's similar work we're doing to drive down the cost to service., okay? And we have a long term -- not long term, a medium-term goal to bring that cost down to $55 a loan a year. It's what we call the drive to $55. And we believe we can get there in 24 to 36 months. And so the benefit there is not only to our own servicing portfolio, but as we add capacity and scale to our servicing platform, we're going to get the benefits with the Cenlar loans.

在服務（servicing）端，我們也在做類似的工作來降低服務成本，好嗎？我們有一個中期目標——不是長期，是中期——要把每筆貸款每年的服務成本降到55美元。我們稱之為「邁向55美元」（drive to $55）。我們相信可以在24到36個月內達成。這樣的好處不僅在於我們自有的服務投組；當我們為服務平台增加產能與規模時，也會在Cenlar的貸款上獲得同樣的效益。

And so it's just -- it's a lot of good exciting investment that I expect is going to really deliver returns starting in the second half of this year, but into '27 and '28. And I feel it's incumbent upon us to make these investments to continue to retain our competitive advantage in the industry and hopefully widen the moat.

所以這些——都是很多很好的、令人振奮的投資；我預期從今年下半年開始就會帶來回報，並延續到2027年與2028年。而且我認為我們有責任做這些投資，以持續維持我們在產業中的競爭優勢，並希望能把護城河再拓寬。

On the origination side, I think to the point you raised there the Fannie MBA average for 2026 is at $2.3 trillion. But given where we're seeing rates today and given where it looks like they're going to be for the future, I suspect and I believe they will be lower. And so that will lead to lower production volumes.

在承作（origination）端，回到你剛剛提到的點，房利美（Fannie）/MBA對2026年的平均預估是2.3兆美元。但以我們目前看到的利率水準，以及看起來未來可能維持的狀況，我懷疑、也相信這個數字會更低。因此這會導致較低的生產量（production volumes）。

Some of that will be offset by lower amortization on the portfolio. But I think given the results we're seeing out of our production units, when rates do decline, I expect to see very good recapture coming out of our consumer direct channel. I expect to see broker direct continue to grow share while growing revenues.

其中一部分會被投組較低的攤銷（amortization）所抵銷。但我認為，考量我們在生產單位看到的成果，當利率下滑時，我預期我們的直客通路會有非常好的回收（recapture）。我也預期經紀商直通會在提升營收的同時，持續擴大市占。

And in our correspondent channel, they had a great first quarter. And when you consider with the GSEs being more aggressive through the cash window and conventional, they really did a nice job at increasing margins, increasing revenue per loan, maintaining the leadership in the correspondent channel and I would expect that to continue for 2026.

至於同業轉售（correspondent）通路，他們第一季表現很出色。而且當你考量到GSE透過現金窗口（cash window）與傳統型（conventional）業務更積極，他們確實在提高利差、提升單筆貸款營收、維持同業轉售通路領導地位方面做得很好；我預期這種態勢在2026年會持續。

Okay, great, that's a great color, thanks. And just a quick follow-up. The mix in the -- the product mix, just given what you noted in terms of the GSEs continuing to be competitive, do you feel like the mix is going to be similar where there's -- you're leaning more into the broker and direct-to-consumer?

好的，很棒，這些補充很有幫助，謝謝。再追問一個很快的問題。關於——產品組合（product mix），鑑於你提到GSE仍會保持競爭力，你覺得組合會不會類似，也就是——你們會更偏向經紀商與直客（direct-to-consumer）？

I think, look, we lean into all 3 channels, but we do so to do it profitably, okay? We -- I often tell people around here since 2023, we, as an industry, have underexecuted to our cost of capital. And we, as an industry, have to make our cost of capital.

我想，你看，我們三個通路都會加碼，但前提是要能獲利地去做，好嗎？我常跟這裡的人說，自2023年以來，我們這個產業的執行表現一直低於資本成本。而我們這個產業必須賺到我們的資本成本。

We have to do what we need to do to increase margins, increase our returns and to do so without being concerned about market share or being concerned about what the GSEs are doing. Obviously, market share leads to scale and it's something -- is a byproduct of our leadership position.

我們必須做我們需要做的事來提高利差、提升報酬，而且要做到這些時不必過度在意市占、也不必過度在意GSE在做什麼。當然，市占會帶來規模，而這——也是我們領導地位的副產品。

But I think that suffice it to say that what we're seeing in broker direct and consumer direct and with that representing 75% of our loan production in Q1, I would expect to see something similar in Q2 for sure, and then we'll see what happens after that.

但我想可以這麼說：我們在經紀商直通與直客通路看到的狀況，加上它們在第一季占我們放款生產量的75%，我預期第二季肯定會看到類似的情況，之後就再看會怎麼發展。

Mark DeVries, Deutsche Bank.

Mark DeVries，德意志銀行（Deutsche Bank）。

David, I was wondering if you could help us understand on that revised ROE guidance for the end of the year, kind of the high teens going down to the maybe low to mid-teens. How much of that is that pulling forward of the investment in technology versus just kind of the smaller market size?

David，我想請你幫我們理解一下：你們把年底的ROE指引下修後，大概是從高十幾降到可能低到中十幾。其中有多少是因為把科技投資提前（pulling forward），又有多少只是因為市場規模變小？

I would say it's about two third technology, one third smaller origination market. I think that the returns we're seeing from the investment are really compelling. And so I think that to wait to invest one versus the other, I don't think -- it doesn't warrant waiting given the returns.

我會說大約三分之二是科技，三分之一是較小的承作市場。我認為我們從這項投資所看到的回報非常有吸引力。因此，我認為在兩者之間等待先投哪一個——我覺得不值得等待，因為回報已經擺在那裡。

And so I think that we feel very strongly and convicted that we want -- that we're going to make the investment. And I think, as I said, we'll see tech at near peak levels. And believe me, starting in the second half of this year, we're going to see the returns from this spend as well as the decline of technology spend over the following 12 to 18 months.

所以我認為我們非常強烈且堅定地相信我們想要——也將會——進行這項投資。而且我認為，如我所說，我們會看到科技支出接近峰值水準。相信我，從今年下半年開始，我們將會看到這筆支出帶來的回報，以及接下來12到18個月科技支出的下降。

I know many people say tech spend doesn't go down, but we reduced our tech spend from '22 to '24, and we will reduce it here as we deploy the finite amount of AI agents that we need to in our production and servicing divisions.

我知道很多人說科技支出不會下降，但我們從'22到'24已經降低了科技支出，而且當我們在生產與服務部門部署所需的有限數量AI代理後，我們也會在這裡進一步降低。

Okay, that's helpful context. And that may help answer the second part of my question. But when I just look back to -- excluding the last 2 quarters, the annualized operating ROE had been kind of more like the mid- to high teens, and we're kind of guiding even in the back half of the year to kind of below that. Is that -- is kind of -- despite the market size, it probably wasn't any bigger then than what we're projecting now. Is this just kind of a -- given this -- maybe this investment imperative in tech, we're looking at some intermediate term lower ROEs as you make these kind of essential investments with hopefully a much more significant longer-term payoffs?

好的，這些背景資訊很有幫助。而且這可能也有助於回答我問題的第二部分。但當我回頭看——排除最近兩個季度——年化營運ROE大概更像是中到高十幾%的水準，而我們即使對今年下半年給的指引也似乎低於那個水準。這是否——也就是說——即便市場規模如此，當時可能也不比我們現在預估的更大。這是不是單純因為——鑑於這種——在科技上的投資勢在必行，我們在進行這些必要投資時，會在中期看到較低的ROE，但希望長期能有更顯著的回報？

I think that's right. Look, I'm always going to present to you what we think is the base case. Everyone on this call knows me well enough that if we can deliver the results faster, we're going to, and you'll see the results sooner. But I think it's going to be, as I said, in the second half of '26, we'll begin to see the results. And I think we will get into that mid- to high teens in the back half -- I'm sorry, the mid-teens in the back half of the year. But I just think that we want to be very enthusiastic about the technology investments that we're making here. They're very meaningful. And that's something that we want to see implemented, given the fact that we work in a competitive environment and others are doing similar.

我認為是的。你看，我一向會向你呈現我們認為的基本情境。這通電話上的每個人都很了解我：如果我們能更快交出成果，我們就會這麼做，你們也會更早看到成果。但我認為，如我所說，大概在'26年下半年，我們會開始看到成果。而且我認為我們會在今年下半年回到中到高十幾%——抱歉，是回到十幾%中段的水準。但我只是認為，我們希望對我們正在進行的科技投資保持非常積極的態度。這些投資非常重要。而且考量到我們處於競爭環境、其他人也在做類似的事，我們希望看到這些投資落地實施。

I think we're ahead of most, if not all of them. And I think it's something that we want to continue to maintain our competitive advantage.

我認為我們領先大多數人，甚至可能領先所有人。而且我認為這是我們希望持續維持競爭優勢的一件事。

Okay, great. Thank you.

好的，很好。謝謝。

Don Fandetti, Wells Fargo.

Wells Fargo 的 Don Fandetti。

Yes, David, I guess you talked a lot about the ROE and tech investments. I mean, if you look at the industry, there are some large players, a lot of investment going on. Like, what gives you the confidence that this is sort of a 4-quarter kind of situation? Why not take that longer-term ROE down? And I guess this incremental spend, it sounds like it's more offensive. I guess you've had some good improvement, looking at the conventional loan, consumer direct recapture up to almost 30%. Like, is this offensive or defensive type incremental investment?

是的，David，我想你談了很多關於ROE和科技投資的事。我的意思是，如果你看整個產業，有一些大型玩家，正在進行大量投資。例如，是什麼讓你有信心這只是大概4個季度左右的情況？為什麼不把長期ROE下修？另外，這筆增量支出，聽起來更像是進攻性的。我想你們在傳統貸款、消費者直銷回收率提升到接近30%方面有不錯的改善。所以，這種增量投資是進攻性的還是防守性的？

I believe it's offensive, Don. And I'll tell you, where we get our confidence from is first, if you just started servicing and what we've done with our servicing technology and driving down our cost to service to industry-leading lows, and I'm not talking by a few dollars here, I'm talking by a lot, and our ability to be able to serve our customers and be able to react to market anomalies.

Don，我相信這是進攻性的。我告訴你我們的信心來源：首先，如果你從服務（servicing）開始看，以及我們在服務科技上所做的事情，將單筆服務成本降到業界領先的低點——我不是說只降了幾美元，我是說降了很多——以及我們服務客戶、並能對市場異常狀況做出反應的能力。

And what we've done in servicing gives me great confidence that we have the culture to be able to identify what the business opportunities and needs are and the technology leadership to be able to deliver those on a low-cost basis.

而且我們在服務端所做的事情，讓我非常有信心：我們具備能夠辨識商機與需求的文化，以及能以低成本交付成果的科技領導力。

Similarly, with AI, what we're seeing is a lot of ability for our business leaders to take ownership and control of developing and building and implementing the AI agents. And they have a staff in place that requires augmentation by moving people out of technology into the business units to build those agents. Now over time, the demand for the agents and the other AI tools is going to lessen. But I believe our business leaders who are -- who have been very tech-focused since we started the company understand what needs to be done. And so that's a factor in my decision-making here.

同樣地，在AI方面，我們看到我們的業務領導者有很強的能力去承擔責任並主導開發、建置與導入AI代理。他們已經有一支團隊，但需要透過把人員從科技部門調到業務單位來建置這些代理，以進行增補。隨著時間推移，對這些代理以及其他AI工具的需求會減少。但我相信我們的業務領導者——自公司成立以來就非常重視科技——了解需要做什麼。因此，這也是我在此做決策的一個因素。

And then finally, with what I'm seeing on Vesta in the platform and the way it's built and the ease to which we can deploy the agents into our workflow is very meaningful. And that's work that is -- that has to be done by the team here as well. And so I just -- I generally believe that we're at a point in the market where we have to go on offense. And we're going to do it as we always do. We're rows and columns folks. We're going to do it responsibly. We're watching the investment. But as I said, I believe we're at or near peak levels.

最後，就我在Vesta平台上看到的——它的架構方式，以及我們能夠輕鬆把代理部署到工作流程中的便利性——都非常關鍵。而這些工作也必須由我們這裡的團隊來完成。所以我只是——我整體上相信我們正處於一個必須採取進攻策略的市場時點。而且我們會像一貫那樣去做。我們是看表格、看數字的人。我們會負責任地去做。我們會監控投資。但如我所說，我相信我們已經在或接近峰值水準。

And given with what I'm seeing in the revenue per loan increasing, gives me great confidence in terms of our ability to pay for some of it. But also what I really expect to see in terms of the cost reduction is going to be very meaningful.

再加上我看到單筆貸款的收入在增加，這讓我對我們支付其中一部分成本的能力非常有信心。但同時，我真正預期會看到的成本下降也將非常顯著。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

Trevor Cranston, Citizens JMP.

Citizens JMP 的 Trevor Cranston。

A bit of a follow-up on that last question. When you think about companies across the industry investing pretty aggressively in AI and new tech with the goal of making it cheaper to originate loans and faster, how do you guys think about the long-term impact of that in terms of -- do you think that ends up resulting in companies just sort of structurally competing down gain on sale margins to a lower level than they've been historically?

針對上一個問題再追問一下。當你想到整個產業的公司都相當積極地投資AI與新科技，目標是讓貸款承作更便宜、更快速時，你們如何看待這對長期的影響——也就是說——你們是否認為這最終會導致公司在結構上把出售收益（gain on sale）利差一路競爭壓低到比歷史水準更低？

I'm curious kind of how you guys think about that dynamic when you think about kind of the long-term ROE guidance for the company.

我很好奇，當你們思考公司長期ROE指引時，是如何看待這種動態的。

Look, I think that we have to compete based on cost to originate and ultimately on price, especially in our consumer direct channel. I think on broker direct I think that if you look at what's taken place in the marketplace and you look at the Q1 results we didn't see the perhaps margin expansion that others may have expected to see.

你看，我認為我們必須以承作成本（cost to originate）為基礎來競爭，最終也要在價格上競爭，特別是在我們的消費者直銷通路。我認為在經紀直銷（broker direct）方面，如果你看市場上發生的事情，再看我們第一季的結果，我們並沒有看到其他人可能預期會出現的那種利差擴張。

But at the same time, I think that we're investing in AI because we believe here at the company that to increase the profitability and to consistently get to ROEs above 20%, we have to be the low-cost provider. And to be the low-cost provider, we have to make the investments in technology to reduce the cost to originate and also to reduce the days to close.

但同時，我認為我們投資 AI，是因為公司相信，若要提升獲利能力並持續達到 20% 以上的 ROE，我們必須成為低成本提供者。而要成為低成本提供者，我們就必須投資科技，以降低承作（發起）成本，並縮短結案天數。

And as an industry, we haven't seen as much movement on that as well. And so I just think that we're going to be competing on -- whether you want to call it gain on sale margins or net margins, we're going to be competing on profitability. But that profitability is going to be more heavily weighted to what the cost is to produce the mortgage and how quickly can you close the loan, especially on the refinance. And so that's where I see really the industry headed.

而就整個產業而言，我們也尚未看到在這方面有那麼多的動作。所以我認為，我們將在——不論你稱之為出售收益（gain on sale）利差或淨利差——我們將在獲利能力上競爭。但這個獲利能力將更大程度取決於生產房貸的成本，以及你能多快完成放款結案，尤其是在再融資方面。因此，我認為這就是產業真正的發展方向。

And I think we're just in a really unique position to be able to be a first mover on this, just given the fact that we have scale in all 3 channels, and we can quickly deploy technologies we created and to see meaningful results.

而我認為我們正處於一個非常獨特的位置，能夠在這方面成為先行者，因為我們在三個通路都有規模，且能快速部署我們所打造的技術並看到具體成效。

Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Appreciate the comments.

是的。好的。這很合理。感謝你的說明。

(Operator Instructions)

(接線員指示)

Shana Qui with Barclays. Your line is now open.

Barclays 的 Shana Qui。您的線路已開通。

Hey, guys, thanks for taking my question.

嗨，各位，謝謝讓我提問。

Leverage is at 1.7 times, which I think is above historical target of 1.5 times. I know you mentioned that your ROE guide is somewhat predicated on the two third technology and one third smaller market. How should we think about where you guys would let leverage run to as you're making these investments if we do perhaps see a smaller market than you currently are anticipating?

槓桿為 1.7 倍，我認為這高於歷史目標的 1.5 倍。我知道你提到 ROE 指引在某種程度上是以三分之二的科技投入與三分之一較小的市場為前提。如果我們確實看到的市場規模比你們目前預期更小，那麼在進行這些投資時，你們會讓槓桿提高到什麼程度？我們應該如何看待？

Overall, we're very focused on leverage. As going back historically, we've maintained our leverage at very responsible levels. And the 1.7 times, as you mentioned, is a bit above our historical target or historical run rate.

整體而言，我們非常重視槓桿。回顧過去，我們一直將槓桿維持在非常負責任的水準。而如你所提到的 1.7 倍，確實略高於我們的歷史目標或歷史運行水準。

We -- as we talked about in the earnings deck, we do expect to maintain our leverage at these levels. We are very focused on maintaining prudent levels of leverage in the business and we do have the ability to adjust and reallocate our capital in order to maintain our leverage ratios as we've shown in the past few quarters around optimizing our MSR portfolio and selling certain portfolios to ensure that we stay within leverage bound.

我們——如同在財報簡報中所談到的——確實預期會將槓桿維持在這些水準。我們非常專注於在業務中維持審慎的槓桿水準，而且我們也有能力調整並重新配置資本，以維持槓桿比率；正如過去幾季所展現的，我們透過優化 MSR 投資組合並出售部分投資組合，確保槓桿維持在界限之內。

And so despite the increases or the -- our -- what we projected for leverage or what we put out as our projection for leverage at the 1.7 times contemplates the increase or the elevated technology spend that David went through. And it's also contemplating the lower levels of activity with the smaller market. So it contemplates both of those factors already. But it is an element in our capital structure and maintaining prudent levels of leverage is something that we are very focused on and will continue to maintain in the business.

因此，儘管槓桿有所上升，或——我們——我們對槓桿的預測、或我們所提出的 1.7 倍槓桿預測，已經納入 David 所提到的科技支出增加或較高的科技支出。同時也已納入在較小市場下較低的活動水準。所以這兩個因素都已經被考量在內。但槓桿是我們資本結構中的一個要素，維持審慎的槓桿水準是我們非常重視的事情，並且會持續在業務中維持。

I'm focused on this every day. And I think we're at the -- I know we're at the upper bounds of where we're comfortable running the company. And so we're going to do what we need to do to try to get that down more towards the historic levels that we've seen in the company.

我每天都在關注這件事。而我認為我們——我知道我們已經在我們覺得公司可接受的上限區間。因此，我們會採取必要措施，努力把它降回更接近公司過去所見的歷史水準。

Great. And then just a follow-up on the accounting. Can you comment on kind of what drove the changes in the breakout of the principal-only stripped MBS valuation related to accretion? I don't believe that was in prior quarters. So any comments on that?

很好。接著想追問會計處理。你能否說明一下，是什麼原因導致與攤銷增值（accretion）相關的「僅本金（principal-only）拆分 MBS」估值拆分項目出現變動？我記得前幾季沒有這個項目。所以能否評論一下？

Sure. That -- we did make a change there or shift some of that geography, and that really relates to the placement of some of the impacts to accounting from the principal-only bonds versus changes in value during the period. So not to get too far into the details, but a piece of the principal-only bonds change in value is captured in the changes in cash flows relating to interest rates is captured in interest income with changes in accretion.

當然。我們確實在那裡做了調整，或把其中一部分重新歸類，而這主要與僅本金債券（principal-only bonds）的會計影響在呈列上的歸屬有關：也就是把部分影響從「期間內價值變動」中區分出來。不深入過多細節的話，僅本金債券價值變動的一部分，會透過與利率相關的現金流變動反映在利息收入中，並以攤銷增值的變動呈現。

If you look in our 10-Q for this quarter, which was released this afternoon, you can see there was actually a negative impact to interest income due to basically changes in projected cash flows and sort of a reversal of the accretion.

如果你查看我們本季的 10-Q（今天下午已發布），你會看到利息收入實際上受到負面影響，主要是因為預估現金流的變動，以及某種程度上的攤銷增值回轉。

Those changes in accretion relating to future projected cash flows and the projected life of the bonds, we really view as being associated with changes in fair value during the period due to changes in interest rates, which obviously is also what impacts MSR fair value. The change is typically, if you look at the past couple of quarters that are presented there on page 13 of the earnings deck has typically been fairly small.

這些與攤銷增值相關的變動，涉及未來預估現金流、以及債券的預估存續期間；我們認為這些本質上與期間內因利率變動所造成的公允價值變動相關，而這顯然也正是影響 MSR 公允價值的因素。通常來說，如果你看財報簡報第 13 頁所呈現的過去幾季，這項變動一般都相當小。

But given the change in the volatility of interest rates during the quarter, and some of the sell-off, it was a bit larger this quarter, and we thought that it made sense and was more appropriate to present associated with changes in fair value of the MSR as opposed to -- and it is noncash and based on future expected projected cash flows as opposed to in the pretax income, excluding the valuation-related changes. And so we've made that change for this period and going back historically.

但由於本季利率波動性上升，以及部分賣壓，這一季的幅度較大；我們認為把它與 MSR 公允價值變動一起呈列更合理、也更恰當，而不是——而且這是非現金項目，係基於未來預期的預估現金流——把它放在稅前收入（排除估值相關變動）之中。因此，我們在本期以及追溯過往期間做了這項調整。

Okay, thank you.

好的，謝謝。

We have no further questions at this time. I'll now turn it back to David Spector for closing remarks.

目前沒有其他問題。我現在把電話交回給 David Spector 做結語。

Well, I want to thank everyone for joining us on the call today, and thank you for taking the time to ask your thoughtful questions. If you have any follow-up questions, I can make myself available, IR is available, and I look forward to ongoing results and good discussions taking place. Thank you very much.

我想感謝各位今天加入我們的電話會議，也謝謝大家撥冗提出深思熟慮的問題。如果你們有任何後續問題，我可以配合安排時間，投資人關係（IR）團隊也會提供協助；我也期待持續的成果以及後續良好的交流討論。非常感謝。

That concludes today's call. You may now disconnect your line.

今天的電話會議到此結束。您現在可以掛斷電話。