Patria Investments Ltd (PAX) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Patria second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded.

您好，感謝您的支持。歡迎參加 Patria 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄音。

I would now like to turn the conference over to your speaker for today, Rob Lee, Head of Shareholder Relations. Please go ahead.

現在，我想將會議交給今天的發言人，股東關係主管 Rob Lee。請繼續。

Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Welcome to Patria's second quarter 2025 earnings call. Speaking today on the call are our Chief Executive Officer, Alex Saigh; and our Chief Financial Officer, Anna Rus; and our Chief Economist, Luis Fernando Lopes, for the Q&A session.

謝謝。大家早安。歡迎參加 Patria 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。今天在電話會議上發言的有我們的執行長 Alex Saigh、我們的財務長 Anna Rus 以及我們的首席經濟學家 Luis Fernando Lopes，他們將參加問答環節。

This morning, we issued a press release and earnings presentation detailing our results for the quarter, which you can find posted on the Investor Relations section of our website or on Form 6-K filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission. This call is being webcast, and a replay will be available.

今天上午，我們發布了一份新聞稿和收益報告，詳細介紹了本季度的業績，您可以在我們網站的投資者關係部分或向美國證券交易委員會提交的 6-K 表格中找到。本次電話會議正在進行網路直播，並將提供重播。

Before we begin, I'd like to remind everyone that today's call may include forward-looking statements, which are uncertain, do not guarantee future performance and undue reliance should not be placed on them. Patria assumes no obligation and does not intend to update any such forward-looking statements. Such statements are based on current management expectations and involve risks, including those discussed in the Risk Factors section of our latest Form 20-F annual report. Also note that no statements on this call constitute an offer to sell or a solicitation of an offer to purchase an interest in any Patria fund.

在我們開始之前，我想提醒大家，今天的電話會議可能包含前瞻性陳述，這些陳述不確定，不能保證未來的表現，不應過度依賴它們。Patria 不承擔任何義務，也不打算更新任何此類前瞻性聲明。此類聲明基於當前管理層的預期，並涉及風險，包括我們最新的 20-F 表年度報告的風險因素部分中討論的風險。另請注意，本次電話會議中的任何聲明均不構成出售要約或購買任何 Patria 基金權益的要約邀請。

As a foreign private issuer, Patria reports financial results using International Financial Reporting Standards, or IFRS, as opposed to US GAAP. Additionally, we would like to remind everyone that we will refer to certain non-IFRS measures, which we believe are relevant in assessing the financial performance of the business, but which should not be considered in isolation from, or as a substitute for, measures prepared in accordance with IFRS. Reconciliations of these measures to the most comparable IFRS measures are included in our earnings presentation.

作為外國私人發行人，Patria 使用國際財務報告準則（IFRS）而不是美國 GAAP 報告財務結果。此外，我們想提醒大家，我們將參考某些非國際財務報告準則指標，我們認為這些指標與評估企業的財務績效相關，但不應孤立地考慮這些指標，也不應將其作為根據國際財務報告準則編制的指標的替代。我們的收益報告中包含了這些指標與最具可比性的 IFRS 指標之間的對帳。

Now I will turn the call over to Alex.

現在我將把電話轉給亞歷克斯。

Thank you, Rob, and good morning, everyone. In the second quarter, we made continued progress leveraging and expanding the diversified platform we have built the past several years as fundraising was a solid $1.3 billion in the quarter led by our credit, infrastructure, real estate and GPMS global private market solutions businesses. And total fundraising over the first half of the year reached approximately $4.5 billion, 75% of our original $6 billion target for 2025. Reflecting our strong fundraising momentum and confidence in our outlook, we now expect full year fundraising for 2025 to be 5% to 10% higher than our initial target or $6.3 billion to $6.6 billion versus the original $6 billion guidance.

謝謝你，羅布，大家早安。在第二季度，我們繼續利用和擴展過去幾年建立的多元化平台，取得了進展，本季籌集的資金達到 13 億美元，主要來自我們的信貸、基礎設施、房地產和 GPMS 全球私募市場解決方案業務。今年上半年籌集的資金總額達到約 45 億美元，占我們原定的 2025 年 60 億美元目標的 75%。反映出我們強勁的籌資勢頭和對前景的信心，我們現在預計 2025 年全年籌資額將比我們最初的目標高出 5% 至 10%，即 63 億至 66 億美元，而最初的指導金額為 60 億美元。

We also reported second quarter '25 fee-related earnings of $46.1 million, representing 8% sequential and 17% year-over-year growth, while fee-earning AUM grew 6% sequentially and 20% year-over-year, and total AUM reached $48.7 billion. Importantly, we generated over $600 million of organic net inflows into fee-earning AUM in the second quarter of '25, $1.3 billion over the first half of this year and $2.4 billion over the last 12 months.

我們還報告稱，25 年第二季的費用相關收益為 4,610 萬美元，環比增長 8%，同比增長 17%，而費用收入 AUM 環比增長 6%，同比增長 20%，總 AUM 達到 487 億美元。重要的是，我們在 2025 年第二季為收費 AUM 帶來了超過 6 億美元的有機淨流入，今年上半年為 13 億美元，過去 12 個月為 24 億美元。

Year-to-date, net inflows reflect an annualized organic growth rate of about 8% based on fee-earning AUM since the start of the year. This is an important KPI to monitor over time as it highlights our ability to drive organic revenue and earnings growth independent of M&A and investment returns. Overall, our diversification and the expansion of our investments and product capabilities is paying off in the form of robust fundraising and profitable net organic growth, enhancing our confidence in the 3-year targets we introduced at our Investor Day last December.

年初至今，淨流入資金反映了自年初以來基於收費資產管理規模的約 8% 的年化有機成長率。這是一個需要長期監控的重要 KPI，因為它凸顯了我們獨立於併購和投資回報來推動有機收入和獲利成長的能力。總體而言，我們的多元化以及投資和產品能力的擴展正在以強勁的融資和盈利的淨有機增長的形式獲得回報，增強了我們對去年 12 月投資者日推出的 3 年目標的信心。

Now let me quickly summarize our second quarter results before we move on to some of the other highlights for the quarter. First, fee-related earnings per share of $0.29 in the second quarter of '25 rose 7% sequentially and 11% year-over-year, driven by higher management fees due to higher fee-earning AUM as well as a higher fee-related earnings margin as we continue to focus on expense management even as we invest in our business. Overall, we remain comfortable with our 2025 fee-related earnings target of $200 million to $225 million or $1.25 to $1.40 per share, reflecting at the midpoint of the range, approximately 20% year-over-year growth.

現在，讓我快速總結一下我們第二季的業績，然後再介紹本季的其他一些亮點。首先，2025 年第二季每股費用相關收益為 0.29 美元，環比增長 7%，年增 11%，這得益於費用收入 AUM 增加導致的管理費用增加，以及費用相關收益利潤率增加，因為我們在投資業務的同時繼續關注費用管理。總體而言，我們對 2025 年費用相關收益目標仍然感到滿意，即 2 億至 2.25 億美元或每股 1.25 至 1.40 美元，反映在該範圍的中間值，同比增長約 20%。

We generated $39 million of distributable earnings in the second quarter of '25 or $0.24 per share, up 4% sequentially and 9% year-over-year, driven by strong fee-related earnings growth. We did not generate performance-related earnings in this quarter. The net accrued performance fee balance of $394 million or $2.47 per share rose approximately 7% from the first quarter of this year, mainly due to the depreciation of the dollar. For perspective and notwithstanding changes in the value of the public holdings in our carry funds, underlying business trends at our private equity portfolio companies generally remain positive.

受費用相關收益強勁增長的推動，我們在 25 年第二季度創造了 3900 萬美元的可分配收益，即每股 0.24 美元，環比增長 4%，同比增長 9%。本季我們沒有產生與業績相關的收益。淨應計績效費餘額為 3.94 億美元，即每股 2.47 美元，較今年第一季上漲約 7%，主要原因是美元貶值。從長遠來看，儘管我們的基金中公開持股的價值發生了變化，但我們的私募股權投資組合公司的基本業務趨勢總體上仍然是積極的。

In local currency, EBITDA at our nonpublic private equity portfolio companies rose approximately 25% on average over the past year as we focus on resilient sectors of the economy such as agribusiness, food and beverage and healthcare. Furthermore, Infrastructure Fund III with $47 million of net accrued performance fees is in full realization mode, and we continue to expect it will be the main source of realized performance-related earnings over the balance of 2025 and through 2026. On that note, we remain confident that we can achieve our performance-related earnings target of $120 million to $140 million for the fourth quarter of '24 through 2027. Against this target, we realized $41 million of performance-related earnings in the fourth quarter of '24 and expect to realize an additional $15 million to $20 million of performance-related earnings over the second half of this year.

以當地貨幣計算，由於我們專注於農業綜合企業、食品飲料和醫療保健等經濟中具有彈性的行業，我們非公開私募股權投資組合公司的 EBITDA 在過去一年中平均增長了約 25%。此外，基礎設施基金 III 的淨應計績效費為 4,700 萬美元，已完全實現，我們繼續預計它將成為 2025 年和 2026 年實現績效相關收益的主要來源。就此而言，我們仍有信心實現 2024 年第四季至 2027 年業績相關的獲利目標，即 1.2 億美元至 1.4 億美元。依照這個目標，我們在 2024 年第四季實現了 4,100 萬美元的績效相關收益，並預計今年下半年將實現額外的 1,500 萬至 2,000 萬美元的績效相關收益。

Moving on, fee-earning AUM of $37.2 billion rose a robust 20% year-over-year and 6% sequentially. There are several important things to keep in mind regarding our fee-earning AUM results. Net organic inflows in the second quarter of '25 were over $600 million, $1.3 billion year-to-date and $2.4 billion over the past year. This was our fourth straight quarter of positive net organic fee-earning AUM growth and our annualized organic growth rate over the first half of 2025 was over 8% based on fee-earning AUM since the start of the year.

繼續前進，收費資產管理規模達到 372 億美元，年增 20%，季增 6%。關於我們的收費 AUM 結果，有幾件重要的事情需要牢記。2025 年第二季的淨有機流入超過 6 億美元，年初至今為 13 億美元，去年為 24 億美元。這是我們連續第四個季度實現淨有機收費 AUM 正成長，根據今年年初以來的收費 AUM，2025 年上半年我們的年化有機增長率超過 8%。

Additionally, it is very important to mention that our organic growth was helped by a 34% year-over-year reduction on redemptions. We believe this highlights how our expanded platform is primed to grow organically, supported by the capabilities we have acquired through our M&A activity in addition to those we have developed internally. As a result, we have built a better and more resilient business.

此外，值得一提的是，贖回量年減 34%，促進了我們的有機成長。我們相信，這凸顯了我們擴展的平台如何做好有機成長的準備，這得益於我們透過併購活動所獲得的能力以及我們內部開發的能力。因此，我們建立了更好、更具彈性的業務。

Indeed, one of the key features of our business is that it's built to grow no matter the macroeconomic environment. For example, in a high interest rate environment where concerns over inflation may be high, such as the current one, strategies such as credit and infrastructure investments with high yields and/or built-in inflation protections are in demand relative to equity-oriented strategies.

事實上，我們業務的一個關鍵特徵是，無論宏觀經濟環境如何，我們的業務都能夠成長。例如，在高利率環境下，人們對通貨膨脹的擔憂可能很高，例如當前的情況，相對於以股票為導向的策略，高收益和/或內建通貨膨脹保護的信貸和基礎設施投資等策略更受歡迎。

When interest rates decline and those concerns recede, we would expect demand for more equity-oriented strategies such as equity REITs or private equity to improve.

當利率下降且這些擔憂消退時，我們預計對更多以股票為導向的策略（例如股票房地產投資信託基金或私募股權）的需求將會增加。

With regard to acquisitions, our ability to leverage our platform and scale to drive growth through incremental M&A is exemplified by the Brazilian REIT acquisitions we announced in the second quarter of 2025 and closed in July. At a time when the interest rate environment in Brazil makes it difficult to raise capital in listed REITs, we were able to use our position as market leaders to go shopping on the floor of the exchange and acquire a total of seven listed REITs, which are expected to add approximately $600 million of high-margin permanent capital fee-earning AUM. This is an example of how M&A can be an attractive alternative to fundraising as the prices paid for acquisitions are often similar to, or even lower than what it would cost to fundraise the same amount of capital.

在收購方面，我們利用平台和規模透過增量併購來推動成長的能力體現在我們於 2025 年第二季宣布並於 7 月完成的巴西房地產投資信託基金收購中。在巴西的利率環境使得上市房地產投資信託基金難以籌集資金的情況下，我們能夠利用我們作為市場領導者的地位在交易所場內購物併收購總共七隻上市房地產投資信託基金，預計將增加約 6 億美元的高利潤永久資本收費 AUM。這是一個例子，說明併購如何成為融資的一種有吸引力的替代方案，因為收購的價格通常與籌集相同數量的資本所需的價格相似，甚至更低。

Fee-earning AUM in the quarter also benefited from continued strong investment returns and a positive FX impact. Keep in mind that as we highlighted at Investor Day, the fee-related earnings impact from soft currency FX volatility is modest, given that most of our expenses base is denominated in local currencies, providing a substantial natural hedge. As we reviewed at our Investor Day back on December 9, based on our current asset class mix, a 10% variance in soft currencies against the dollar impacts fee-related earnings by only 2%.

本季度收費資產管理規模也受益於持續強勁的投資回報和積極的外匯影響。請記住，正如我們在投資者日所強調的那樣，由於我們的大部分支出基礎都是以當地貨幣計價的，從而提供了大量的自然對沖，因此軟貨幣外匯波動對費用相關收益的影響是適度的。正如我們在 12 月 9 日的投資者日上所回顧的那樣，根據我們目前的資產類別組合，軟貨幣兌美元 10% 的差異僅會對費用相關收益產生 2% 的影響。

Moving on to fundraising. As I noted at the start of my remarks, we are pleased to report that we raised $1.3 billion in the second quarter, approximately $4.5 billion over the first half of the year and are raising our initial $6 billion target for 2025 by 5% to 10% to $6.3 billion to $6.6 billion. The quarter's strong results coming on the heels of our record fundraising in the first quarter of this year highlights the diversified product offering and distribution capabilities of the platform we have been building. Fundraising continues to benefit from new strategies and products we have introduced over the past several years, including various institutional products targeted to local institutional investors in local currencies.

繼續籌款。正如我在演講開始時所指出的，我們很高興地報告，我們在第二季度籌集了 13 億美元，今年上半年籌集了約 45 億美元，並將 2025 年 60 億美元的初始目標提高 5% 至 10%，達到 63 億美元至 66 億美元。繼今年第一季創紀錄的融資之後，本季度取得了強勁的業績，凸顯了我們一直在構建的平台的多樣化產品供應和分銷能力。籌款活動繼續受益於我們在過去幾年中推出的新策略和新產品，其中包括針對當地機構投資者以當地貨幣發行的各種機構產品。

As of the end of the second quarter of 2025, approximately 20% of our fee-earning AUM were in permanent capital vehicles, the growth of which remains a key long-term objective. Drilling down into some of the fundraising highlights for the quarter, credit was once again a standout, led by solid flows into our flagship LatAm US dollar high-yield strategy. Infrastructure benefited from another closing on our flagship development fund, Infrastructure Fund V and co-investments with demand driven by Asian and local institutional investors.

截至 2025 年第二季末，我們收費資產管理規模的約 20% 來自永久資本工具，其成長仍是我們長期的關鍵目標。深入研究本季的一些融資亮點，信貸再次成為亮點，主要原因是流入我們旗艦拉美美元高收益策略的穩健資金。基礎設施受益於我們旗艦發展基金、基礎設施基金 V 的另一筆關閉以及由亞洲和當地機構投資者推動的共同投資需求。

It is worth noting that over the first half of 2025, fundraising in infrastructure is approximately 3x greater compared to all of 2024, led by Infrastructure Fund V, which has reached $2.5 billion of commitments between the drawdown fund and fee-paying co-investment vehicles.

值得注意的是，2025 年上半年，基礎設施領域的融資金額約為 2024 年全年的 3 倍，其中基礎設施基金 V 領銜，其提取基金和付費共同投資工具之間的承諾資金已達到 25 億美元。

Fundraising in credit has already reached 85% of the level achieved in 2024, which was itself a strong year. We believe these extraordinary results highlight how we are leveraging our strong investment performance in these verticals and the investments we have made in our platforms. In addition, Private Equity Fund VII reached $1.4 billion, inclusive of related fee-paying co-investment vehicles. It is important to keep in mind that as we expand our business, a large portion of the capital we raise will only flow into fee-earning AUM as capital is deployed. Our current pending fee-earning AUM totals about $3.3 billion, down modestly from the $3.5 billion in the first quarter of this year due to deployment partially offset by fundraising.

信貸融資已達到 2024 年水準的 85%，而 2024 年本身就是強勁的一年。我們相信，這些非凡的業績凸顯了我們如何利用我們在這些垂直領域的強勁投資表現以及我們在平台上所做的投資。此外，私募股權基金 VII 的規模達到 14 億美元，其中包括相關付費共同投資工具。重要的是要記住，隨著我們業務的擴展，我們籌集的大部分資金將僅流入收費的 AUM，因為資本已部署。我們目前待定的收費資產管理規模總計約為 33 億美元，較今年第一季的 35 億美元略有下降，原因是部署部分被募款所抵銷。

While the level of pending fee-earning AUM can vary over the short term, over time, we would expect it to grow as our fundraising grows and we raise more capital in drawdown funds, SMAs and similar fund structures. Our efforts to diversify our platform and increase the resiliency of our business could not be timelier considering the highlighted global macro uncertainty and increased volatility that has gripped economies and markets around the world since the proposed imposition of widespread tariffs by the United States on its trading partners and the uncertainty over future trade and economic policies.

雖然待定收費資產管理規模水準在短期內可能會有所不同，但隨著時間的推移，我們預計隨著我們的籌資活動增長以及我們在提取基金、SMA 和類似基金結構中籌集更多資金，該水準將會增長。自從美國提議對其貿易夥伴徵收廣泛關稅以來，全球宏觀不確定性凸顯，全球經濟和市場波動加劇，以及未來貿易和經濟政策的不確定性，我們為實現平台多元化和提高業務彈性所做的努力可謂恰逢其時。

Against this backdrop, it is important for investors to understand and appreciate how the region, in general, and Patria specifically, are positioned in these uncertain times. Consider President Trump's renewed threats to impose high tariffs on multiple trading partners, including high tariffs on imports from Brazil, which, if implemented, could have some negative impact on the Brazilian economy. However, the continued uncertainty caused by this on-again, off-again threats, in fact, highlights why LatAm and Europe are becoming more attractive destinations for global capital as investors rethink their global asset allocations. While much uncertainty remains, we believe these regions and Patria are positioned to weather, and indeed possibly thrive, in these challenging conditions.

在此背景下，投資者必須了解並理解該地區，尤其是 Patria，在這些不確定時期的定位。想想川普總統再次威脅對多個貿易夥伴徵收高額關稅，包括對巴西進口產品徵收高額關稅，如果實施，可能會對巴西經濟產生一些負面影響。然而，這種時斷時續的威脅所造成的持續不確定性實際上凸顯了為什麼隨著投資者重新考慮其全球資產配置，拉丁美洲和歐洲正成為對全球資本更具吸引力的目的地。儘管仍有許多不確定性，但我們相信這些地區和 Patria 有能力度過這些充滿挑戰的時期，甚至有可能蓬勃發展。

Consider that, at the strategy or investment level, our private equity investments are mostly oriented towards domestic consumption markets, not export markets. Infrastructure, by its nature, is local and our GPMS solutions business is focused on European and, to a lesser extent, United States, middle market, private equity secondaries, primaries and co-investments. Direct exposure to export-focused businesses and/or investments in the United States is minimal. Investments in Brazil account for approximately 30% of our invested assets.

想想看，無論在策略或投資層面，我們的私募股權投資大多面向國內消費市場，而非出口市場。基礎設施本質上是本地化的，我們的 GPMS 解決方案業務主要集中在歐洲，以及在較小程度上美國的中端市場、私募股權二級市場、一級市場和共同投資。對美國出口型企業和/或投資的直接接觸很少。在巴西的投資約占我們投資資產的30%。

As we noted earlier, demand for our credit and infrastructure products increases in periods of high interest rates and higher inflation concerns. Also, demand for our GPMS products increases as global institutional investors look for liquidity and flexible portfolio solutions for their middle market private equity exposure. Our current exposure to Mexico is minimal at below 3% of AUM. Long term, however, we believe Mexico remains an attractive market for expansion.

正如我們之前提到的，在高利率和通膨擔憂加劇的時期，對我們的信貸和基礎設施產品的需求會增加。此外，隨著全球機構投資者尋求流動性和靈活的投資組合解決方案來投資中端市場私募股權，對我們的 GPMS 產品的需求也在增加。我們目前對墨西哥的投資額極小，低於 AUM 的 3%。然而，從長遠來看，我們相信墨西哥仍然是一個具有擴張吸引力的市場。

As the prospects for a trade war remain high, we believe LatAm, as a region, is a beneficiary given the region's low level of geopolitical risk and export markets that focus on in-demand agricultural products in addition to both hard and soft commodities. With a population of over 650 million people and a combined GDP of over $6.5 trillion, the region also has a large and growing internal markets that provide an attractive export destination for trading partners. The trade war is also driving global investors to take a deeper look at Europe as an alternative destination for investment capital as investors become increasingly concerned that the United States may become a less reliable partner.

由於貿易戰爆發的可能性仍然很高，我們認為，拉丁美洲作為一個地區將從中受益，因為該地區的地緣政治風險較低，而且其出口市場除了硬商品和軟商品外，還專注於需求旺盛的農產品。該地區人口超過 6.5 億，GDP 總和超過 6.5 兆美元，也擁有龐大且不斷成長的內部市場，為貿易夥伴提供了一個具有吸引力的出口目的地。貿易戰也促使全球投資者更深入地考慮歐洲作為投資資本的替代目的地，因為投資者越來越擔心美國可能成為一個不那麼可靠的合作夥伴。

From Patria's perspective, as investors in Latin America for over 37 years with significant boots-on-the-ground resources, we have extensive experience in dealing with and investing through periods of high interest rates, FX volatility and economic uncertainty. As the go-to alternative manager in LatAm, the recent tariff-induced economic uncertainty and other trade actions by the United States have led to increased interest from Asian, Middle Eastern, and increasingly European investors in our infrastructure and other investment strategies, including our European private equity solutions business as investors seek alternative destinations outside the United States to deploy capital and earn returns. This is exemplified by the significant portion of this year's fundraising, which has been sourced from Asian investors.

從 Patria 的角度來看，作為在拉丁美洲投資超過 37 年並擁有大量實地資源的投資者，我們在應對和投資高利率、外匯波動和經濟不確定時期方面擁有豐富的經驗。作為拉丁美洲地區的首選另類投資管理公司，近期關稅引發的經濟不確定性以及美國採取的其他貿易行動，導致亞洲、中東以及越來越多的歐洲投資者對我們的基礎設施和其他投資策略（包括我們的歐洲私募股權解決方案業務）的興趣日益濃厚，因為投資者正在尋求美國以外的替代目的地來部署資本並獲得回報。今年籌集的資金中很大一部分來自亞洲投資者，就證明了這一點。

Our business is also built to serve local investors at the local level. We continue to see early signs of increased allocations to alternatives from local investors and institutions that are both under-allocated to alternative strategies and often required to invest locally and understandably have a home country bias in times of economic stress and uncertainty. Local investors in LatAm and Europe accounted for approximately 55% of our fundraising over the first half of 2025 and 68% in 2024.

我們的業務也旨在為當地投資者提供本地服務。我們繼續看到本地投資者和機構增加對另類投資配置的早期跡象，這些投資者和機構對另類投資策略的配置不足，並且通常需要在本地進行投資，因此在經濟壓力和不確定時期可以理解地傾向於本國。2025 年上半年，拉丁美洲和歐洲的本地投資者占我們融資總額的約 55%，2024 年則佔 68%。

Finally, economically, our fee-earning AUM and management fees are very sticky and highly predictable as approximately 20% of our fee-earning AUM are in permanent capital vehicles and approximately 90% in vehicles with no, or limited, redemption features.

最後，從經濟角度來看，我們的收費 AUM 和管理費非常固定且高度可預測，因為我們收費 AUM 的約 20% 屬於永久資本工具，約 90% 屬於沒有或有限贖回功能的工具。

At the same time, our fee-related earnings has little sensitivity to soft currency FX volatility, as we mentioned earlier. Pulling this all together, our financial results and ongoing fundraising momentum provide additional evidence that our strategy to diversify and grow our business both organically and inorganically while also increasing our resilience is paying off. We believe we are off to a strong start to deliver on our 2025 goals, including the new fundraising target of $6.3 billion to $6.6 billion, and fee-related earnings of $200 million to $225 million or $1.25 to $1.40 per share. Additionally, we expect to achieve the 2027 targets we unveiled at our Investor Day, such as total fee-earning AUM of $70 billion and fee-related earnings of $260 million to $290 million or $1.60 to $1.80 per share.

同時，正如我們之前提到的，我們的費用相關收益對軟貨幣外匯波動幾乎不敏感。綜合起來，我們的財務表現和持續的籌款勢頭進一步證明，我們透過有機和無機方式實現業務多元化和成長，同時提高我們的韌性的策略正在取得成效。我們相信，我們已經有一個良好的開端，可以實現我們的 2025 年目標，包括 63 億至 66 億美元的新融資目標，以及 2 億至 2.25 億美元或每股 1.25 美元至 1.40 美元的費用相關收益。此外，我們預計將實現在投資者日公佈的 2027 年目標，例如總費用收入 AUM 達到 700 億美元，費用相關收益達到 2.6 億至 2.9 億美元或每股 1.60 至 1.80 美元。

Now let me turn the call over to Ana to review our financial results in more detail. Thank you.

現在，讓我將電話轉給 Ana，讓她更詳細地回顧我們的財務結果。謝謝。

Thank you, Alex, and good morning, everyone. As Alex highlighted, we are very pleased with the strong momentum we achieved as we raised $1.3 billion in the second quarter and about $4.5 billion over the first half of the year, clear proof that the strategic investments we've made in our investment platforms, products and distribution capabilities are paying off. The strong results in the quarter increases our confidence that we are on track to achieve our 2025 objectives and off a solid start of our 3-year plan.

謝謝你，亞歷克斯，大家早安。正如亞歷克斯所強調的，我們對所取得的強勁勢頭感到非常高興，因為我們在第二季度籌集了 13 億美元，在今年上半年籌集了約 45 億美元，這清楚地證明了我們在投資平台、產品和分銷能力方面所做的戰略投資正在獲得回報。本季的強勁業績增強了我們的信心，讓我們相信我們正朝著實現 2025 年目標的方向前進，並為我們的三年計劃開個好頭。

Let's review our second quarter results. As Alex highlighted in his remarks, our robust fundraising year-to-date demonstrated that we are well on track to achieve and indeed surpass our initial $6 billion target for the year against a backdrop of increased global uncertainty and volatility. Our FEAUM rose 20% year-over-year and 6% sequentially to approximately $37 billion. While acquisitions contributed to the year-over-year increase, the strong growth reflects a combination of solid net organic inflows as well as the positive contribution from strong investment performance and FX movements due to the depreciating US dollar.

讓我們回顧一下第二季的業績。正如亞歷克斯在演講中所強調的那樣，今年迄今為止我們強勁的籌款活動表明，在全球不確定性和波動性增加的背景下，我們有望實現甚至超越今年最初 60 億美元的目標。我們的 FEAUM 年成長 20%，季增 6%，達到約 370 億美元。雖然收購促成了同比增長，但強勁的增長反映了穩健的淨有機流入以及強勁的投資業績和美元貶值導致的外匯波動帶來的積極貢獻。

It's particularly noteworthy that in the quarter, Patria generated over $600 million of net inflows into FEAUM, bringing our year-to-date to $1.3 billion and approximately 8% annualized organic growth. This is the fourth straight quarter of the net organic inflows, highlighting our expanding fundraising capabilities, coupled with the stickiness and resilience of our asset base. While the US dollar depreciation in the quarter contributed to our strong sequential growth in AUM and fee-earning AUM, importantly, however, and as we highlighted in prior calls, FX fluctuations have limited impact on our FRE since our expense base provides a substantial hedge against currency movements that may impact our fee-earning AUM and consequently, our fee revenues.

尤其值得注意的是，本季度，Patria 為 FEAUM 帶來了超過 6 億美元的淨流入，使我們年初至今的淨流入達到 13 億美元，年化有機成長率約為 8%。這是連續第四個季度實現淨有機流入，凸顯了我們不斷擴大的籌資能力，以及我們資產基礎的黏性和彈性。雖然本季度美元貶值促成了我們 AUM 和收費 AUM 的強勁環比增長，但重要的是，正如我們在之前的電話會議中強調的那樣，外匯波動對我們的 FRE 的影響有限，因為我們的費用基礎提供了對可能影響我們的收費 AUM 以及我們的費用收入的貨幣波動的大量對沖。

As we reviewed at our Investor Day back on December 9, based on our current asset class mix, a 10% variance in soft currencies against the dollar impacts FRE by only about 2%. Pending fee-earning AUM totaled about $3.3 billion, down somewhat from the first quarter due to the active deployment partially offset by fundraising. This pending fee-earning AUM, combined with our fundraising goals, the 20% of fee-earning AUM are in permanent capital vehicles and the almost 35% of fee-earning AUM in the drawdown funds with an average life of 6.5 years, all point to our ongoing ability to generate net organic growth over time.

正如我們在 12 月 9 日的投資者日上所回顧的那樣，根據我們目前的資產類別組合，軟貨幣兌美元 10% 的差異僅對 FRE 產生約 2% 的影響。待定收費資產管理規模總計約 33 億美元，較第一季略有下降，原因是積極部署被募款部分抵銷。這個待定的收費 AUM，加上我們的籌款目標，20% 的收費 AUM 屬於永久資本工具，近 35% 的收費 AUM 屬於平均壽命為 6.5 年的提取基金，所有這些都表明我們能夠持續實現淨有機增長。

Total fee revenue in the second quarter reached $81.1 million, up 14% over the prior year and about 5% sequentially. The sequential increase was driven by strong growth in fee-earning AUM and some incremental incentive fees from one of our real estate funds in Brazil and from the strong active public equity performance. It is worth mentioning that due to the timing of net asset flows into fee-earning AUM, management fee revenues in the second quarter did not reflect the full impact of the quarter's asset growth. Our management fee rate averaged 95 basis points over the last trailing 4 quarters. As we reviewed at our Investor Day, we are steadily diversifying our business and introducing new investment strategies and product structures, which are key drivers of our growth.

第二季總費用收入達 8,110 萬美元，比上年增長 14%，比上一季增長約 5%。這一連續成長得益於收費資產管理規模的強勁成長、我們在巴西的一隻房地產基金的部分增量激勵費用以及強勁的活躍公開股權表現。值得一提的是，由於淨資產流入收費AUM的時間安排，第二季的管理費收入並未反映本季資產成長的全部影響。過去 4 個季度，我們的管理費率平均為 95 個基點。正如我們在投資者日所回顧的那樣，我們正在穩步實現業務多元化，並引入新的投資策略和產品結構，這是我們成長的關鍵驅動力。

Consequently, our management fee rate will continue to evolve, and we expect our fee rate to average between 92 and 94 basis points over the coming quarters, but with the potential to vary, depending on the mix.

因此，我們的管理費率將繼續變化，我們預計未來幾季我們的費率平均在 92 至 94 個基點之間，但可能會有所不同，具體取決於組合。

Moving on, operating expenses, which include personnel and G&A expenses, totaled approximately $35 million in the quarter, practically flat versus Q1 '25 and up 10.7% year-over-year. The year-over-year increase mainly reflects the impact of acquisitions. The very slight sequential increase reflects our continued focus on expense controls and capturing operating efficiencies, even as we continue to invest in the business. Looking ahead, we believe second quarter personnel and G&A expenses combined a good baseline run rate.

接下來，包括人員和一般及行政費用在內的營運費用本季總計約為 3,500 萬美元，與 25 年第一季基本持平，年增 10.7%。同比成長主要反映了收購的影響。環比小幅成長反映出我們持續專注於費用控制和提高營運效率，同時繼續對業務進行投資。展望未來，我們相信第二季度的人員和一般及行政費用相結合將帶來良好的基準運行率。

Putting it all together, Patria delivered fee-related earnings of $46.1 million in the quarter, up 17% versus the prior year and 8% sequentially, with an FRE margin that rose 170 basis points sequentially to 56.8% in the quarter. We continue to expect the full year margin to fall within the range of 58% to 60% guidance as we grow fee revenues and capture incremental expense synergies from our acquisitions. We want to remind everyone that the fourth quarter is often our strongest in terms of FRE margin, driven by the recognition in the quarter of most of our high-margin incentive fees from our credit and public equities platforms. Regarding FRE, with half of the year completed and as our visibility into remainder of 2025 improves, we remain very confident in our ability to hit our 2025 target FRE range of $200 million to $225 million and 2027 FRE target of $260 million to $290 million with an FRE margin target of 58% to 60%.

綜合來看，Patria 本季的費用相關收益為 4,610 萬美元，比上年增長 17%，比上一季增長 8%，FRE 利潤率比上一季上升 170 個基點，達到 56.8%。隨著我們費用收入的成長以及從收購中獲得增量費用協同效應，我們繼續預計全年利潤率將在 58% 至 60% 的指導範圍內。我們想提醒大家，第四季度通常是我們 FRE 利潤率表現最強勁的季度，這得益於我們本季從信貸和公開股票平台獲得的大部分高利潤激勵費用的確認。關於 FRE，隨著今年上半年的完成以及我們對 2025 年剩餘時間的預見性的提高，我們仍然非常有信心能夠實現 2025 年 FRE 目標範圍 2 億至 2.25 億美元和 2027 年 FRE 目標 2.6 億至 2.9 億美元，FRE 利潤率目標為 6058%。

Next our net financial and other income and expense in the second quarter of '25 totaled a negative $4 million, reflecting mainly interest expenses on our credit facilities partially offset by income generated in our new energy trading platform, Tria, which contributed about $0.7 million in the quarter. As of the second quarter, net debt totaled approximately $130 million and our net debt to FRE ratio of 0.6x was well below the 1x at the end of the quarter, in line with our long-term guidance.

接下來，我們在 2025 年第二季度的淨財務和其他收入和支出總計為負 400 萬美元，主要反映了我們的信貸額度的利息支出，但部分被我們的新能源交易平台 Tria 產生的收入所抵消，該平台在本季度貢獻了約 70 萬美元。截至第二季度，淨債務總額約為 1.3 億美元，我們的淨債務與 FRE 比率為 0.6 倍，遠低於本季末的 1 倍，符合我們的長期指引。

As we manage our cash flow and capital structure over the balance of the year, we expect our debt level to remain relatively unchanged even as we fund M&A-related deferred cash payments of approximately $40 million throughout year-end, including the latest REIT acquisition in Brazil. Following this payment, our current deferred M&A-related cash payments through 2027 would be approximately $100 million, consistent with our guidance at our December Investor Day. Consequently, given our expectations regarding our net debt over the balance of the year and a somewhat higher contribution from Tria, our net financial and other expenses line should be at about 30% lower over the coming quarters compared to the second quarter.

由於我們全年管理現金流和資本結構，我們預計我們的債務水準將保持相對不變，即使我們在年底為與併購相關的遞延現金支付提供約 4000 萬美元的資金，包括最近在巴西的房地產投資信託基金收購。此次付款後，我們目前到 2027 年的遞延併購相關現金支付將達到約 1 億美元，與我們 12 月投資者日的指導一致。因此，考慮到我們對今年淨債務的預期以及 Tria 的略高貢獻，未來幾季我們的淨財務和其他支出線應該比第二季低約 30%。

Our effective tax rate in the quarter was 8%, an increase of 1 percentage point versus the prior quarter, mainly reflecting our mix of jurisdictions. We expect our tax rate over the coming years to hover around 10% annually, but will vary quarter-to-quarter depending on the evolving mix of our business, although we expect 2025 to be below 10%. Of note, as exemplified in the fourth quarter of '24, quarters with large amounts of PRE tend to have lower tax rates as PREs largely generate in low or no tax jurisdictions.

本季我們的有效稅率為 8%，比上一季增加了 1 個百分點，主要反映了我們的司法管轄區組合。我們預計未來幾年我們的稅率將徘徊在每年 10% 左右，但會根據我們業務結構的變化而逐季度變化，儘管我們預計 2025 年的稅率將低於 10%。值得注意的是，如 2024 年第四季所示，PRE 金額較大的季度往往稅率較低，因為 PRE 主要產生於低稅或無稅管轄區。

In the second quarter '25, we generated $38.8 million of distributable earnings, up 15% year-over-year and over 5% sequentially, mainly reflecting higher FRE, partially offset by higher net financial interest and expense and higher tax. Second quarter DE per share of $0.24 was up 9% versus prior year and 4% sequentially, mainly on higher FRE, partially offset by higher share count versus both second quarter '24 and first quarter '25. Regarding the share count, we finished the quarter at 159.5 million shares and continue to expect the share count to average between 158 million and 160 million from 2025 through 2027, inclusive of share repurchase, which will be focused on offsetting stock-based compensation.

在 2025 年第二季度，我們創造了 3,880 萬美元的可分配收益，年增 15%，環比增長超過 5%，主要反映了更高的 FRE，但被更高的淨財務利息和費用以及更高的稅收部分抵消。第二季每股 DE 為 0.24 美元，較上年同期成長 9%，較上一季成長 4%，主要由於 FRE 增加，但與 2024 年第二季和 2025 年第一季度相比，股票數量增加部分抵消了這一影響。關於股票數量，本季末我們持有 1.595 億股，並預計 2025 年至 2027 年期間平均股票數量將在 1.58 億至 1.6 億股之間，其中包括股票回購，其重點將用於抵銷股票薪酬。

On that note, the Board of Directors voted to renew and increase our share repurchase program. And over the next 12 months, we have the authorization to repurchase up to 3 million shares. We did not repurchase shares in the quarter, but it remains our intention to repurchase shares over the balance of 2025 and keep our share count within the target range. Finally, as we announced during the past day, the Board approved for 2025 a quarterly dividend per share of $0.15. Overall, we are very pleased with our second quarter results and the momentum we have built as we continue to diversify and improve the resilience of our business.

為此，董事會投票決定更新並增加我們的股票回購計畫。在接下來的 12 個月內，我們有權回購最多 300 萬股。我們在本季沒有回購股票，但我們仍打算在 2025 年剩餘時間內回購股票，並將我們的股票數量保持在目標範圍內。最後，正如我們昨天宣布的那樣，董事會批准2025年每股季度股息為0.15美元。總體而言，我們對第二季度的業績以及我們在繼續多元化發展和提升業務韌性過程中所積累的良好勢頭感到非常滿意。

We believe we are on track to meet our FRE targets for 2025, and we are excited regarding the growth opportunity that lies ahead.

我們相信我們有望實現 2025 年的 FRE 目標，並且對未來的成長機會感到興奮。

Thank you, everyone, for dialing in, and we are now ready to answer your questions.

感謝大家的撥入，我們現在準備回答你們的問題。

(Operator Instructions) Rodrigo Ferreira, Bank of America.

（操作員指示）美國銀行 Rodrigo Ferreira。

You've mentioned how Mexico is an area of interest for future expansion. What type of partner acquisition would you look for there? And is that the next target as we think about your $14 billion target of inorganic inflows from the Investor Day?

您曾提到墨西哥是我們未來擴展的興趣地區。您希望在那裡尋找什麼類型的合作夥伴？當我們考慮您在投資者日設定的 140 億美元無機資金流入目標時，這是下一個目標嗎？

Just as a note, I think before we begin here the Q&A session, I would like to acknowledge here the tragic and senseless events that occurred earlier this week at Blackstone and other firms in their building in New York that led actually to the death of a friend or one of their employees and others in their building. We have many friends at Blackstone given our decade-long relationship with them, and we are heartbroken here over the tragedy they had to endure. And our best wishes go out to everyone there and indeed everyone and their respective families that suffered at the hands of this very senseless violence.

需要注意的是，在我們開始問答環節之前，我想先承認一下本週早些時候在紐約黑石集團和其他公司大樓裡發生的悲慘和毫無意義的事件，這些事件實際上導致了他們的一位朋友或一名員工以及大樓裡的其他人的死亡。我們與黑石集團有著長達十年的合作關係，因此我們在黑石集團中有很多朋友，他們所遭受的悲劇讓我們深感悲痛。我們向在這場毫無意義的暴力事件中遭受苦難的所有人以及他們的家人致以最良好的祝愿。

Going back to Mexico here, Rodrigo, I think Mexico is definitely, as we've mentioned here in a long-term perspective, an attractive market is the second largest economy in Latin America, as you know. And the way I think that we see Mexico as of now is to try to find local partners in some of the asset classes that we think are better to expand at the current moment of the country. So real estate being one of them and credit and infrastructure, I think, being the other ones.

回到墨西哥，羅德里戈，我認為墨西哥絕對是一個有吸引力的市場，正如我們在這裡提到的，從長遠來看，它是拉丁美洲第二大經濟體。我認為，我們現在對墨西哥的看法是，嘗試在我們認為在該國當前形勢下更適合擴張的一些資產類別中尋找當地合作夥伴。其中之一就是房地產，另外兩個就是信貸和基礎建設。

On the real estate front, we did actually buy a very small real estate fund in Mexico, the [FIBRA], which is now similar to the REITs in the US, similar to the FIIs, the PEs here in Brazil. It was a very small acquisition, so we didn't announce it. It was a total assets of this Mexican real estate REIT of $26 million. We did buy the management company together with a local partner called Lexington that is a real estate manager in Mexico. And the management company, the JV between us and them, will manage 50-50, will then manage this $26 million FIBRA.

在房地產方面，我們確實在墨西哥購買了一隻非常小的房地產基金，即[FIBRA]，它現在類似於美國的房地產投資信託基金 (REIT)，類似於巴西的外國機構投資者 (FII) 和私募股權基金 (PE)。這是一次非常小的收購，所以我們沒有宣布。該墨西哥房地產投資信託基金的總資產為 2,600 萬美元。我們確實與當地一家名為 Lexington 的合作夥伴（墨西哥的房地產管理公司）一起收購了這家管理公司。管理公司，也就是我們和他們之間的合資企業，將對 50% 的股份進行管理，然後管理這 2,600 萬美元的 FIBRA。

In addition to buying this small management company that manages just this FIBRA, this $26 million FIBRA, we did buy a portion of the shares of the FIBRA. So as an asset, it will be an investment in our balance sheet. The strategy here is to continue to grow raising money mainly for logistics real estate in Mexico. I don't know if you did see this latest news or not, but two weeks ago, the largest Mexican FIBRA Fibra UNO did announce a spin-off together with new money of its industrial properties, its logistics properties and raised in this spin-off plus IPO over $400 million of fresh capital. So what did Fibra UNO did do?

除了收購這家專門管理 FIBRA（價值 2,600 萬美元）的小型管理公司之外，我們還購買了 FIBRA 的部分股份。因此，作為一項資產，它將是我們資產負債表上的一項投資。這裡的策略是繼續增加籌集資金，主要用於墨西哥的物流房地產。我不知道您是否看到了這條最新消息，但兩週前，墨西哥最大的 FIBRA Fibra UNO 確實宣布將其工業資產和物流資產分拆出來並注入新資金，並通過此次分拆和 IPO 籌集了超過 4 億美元的新資本。那麼 Fibra UNO 做了什麼？

And I believe that Fibra UNO is the largest real estate investment trust in Latin America with around $5 billion of assets -- actually $15 billion of assets of $10 billion of debt, so $5 billion of net worth. So probably is the largest real estate investment trust in LatAm listed in the Mexican Stock Exchange and did the spin-off of their industrial assets.

我相信 Fibra UNO 是拉丁美洲最大的房地產投資信託公司，擁有約 50 億美元的資產——實際上是 150 億美元的資產和 100 億美元的債務，因此淨資產為 50 億美元。因此，它可能是拉丁美洲最大的房地產投資信託公司，在墨西哥證券交易所上市，並剝離了其工業資產。

So there is a demand for industrial assets in Mexico, as you can see from this deal that happened 2 weeks ago. And our strategy is to use this small FIBRA that we did acquire in order to expand into the Mexican also industrial assets, logistic assets. It's slow steps that we're going to take here. So we don't have -- we don't want to have to take a very large step into Mexico as of now. But this came about as a very unique opportunity.

因此，墨西哥對工業資產有需求，正如您從兩週前達成的這筆交易中看到的那樣。我們的策略是利用我們收購的這家小型 FIBRA 來擴展到墨西哥的工業資產和物流資產。我們將採取緩慢的步伐。所以我們現在還不想向墨西哥邁出一大步。但這是一個非常獨特的機會。

The Mexican authorities are not actually giving out authorization for new FIBRA. So that's why we decided to buy one. And we decided to buy a small one, so we can actually learn and grow from there into other assets. And we're excited about the deal.

墨西哥當局實際上並未授權新的 FIBRA。所以這就是我們決定購買它的原因。我們決定購買一個小型的，這樣我們就可以真正從中學習並發展其他資產。我們對這筆交易感到非常興奮。

Of course, it's very small. It doesn't move the needle at all given the size of the FIBRA, but very excited as the first step. With that, I think we also, as I mentioned earlier in the answer here, a huge opportunity to grow in the credit space in Mexico. We do get exposure to the credit space in Mexico through our pan-regional credit funds, our flagship fund, which is the high-yield LatAm pan-regional dollar-denominated fund that does carry securities issued by Mexican economies in US dollars. In total, we have a 3% exposure of our total assets into Mexico, a very small exposure, but most of that is in credit and some in equities, public equities.

當然，它非常小。考慮到 FIBRA 的尺寸，它根本沒有移動針頭，但作為第一步，這非常令人興奮。因此，我認為，正如我之前在回答中提到的那樣，墨西哥的信貸領域也存在著巨大的成長機會。我們確實透過我們的泛區域信貸基金（我們的旗艦基金）接觸了墨西哥的信貸領域，該基金是高收益的拉美泛區域美元計價基金，確實持有墨西哥經濟體以美元發行的證券。總體而言，我們在墨西哥的投資佔總資產的 3%，這是一個非常小的投資，但其中大部分是信貸，有些是股票和公開股票。

As you know, the pension system in Mexico is growing very healthily. It's basically doubling in the next five years in assets under management. NAV growth is one reason, but the main reason is the higher contributions that the government approved from the employers to the pension funds. It is the largest pool of pension funds in Latin America. Mexico is the second largest economy in Latin America, but the pension funds do manage the largest pool of capital, $350 billion approximately versus $250 billion here in Brazil versus $150 billion to $180 billion in Chile.

眾所周知，墨西哥的退休金制度發展非常健康。未來五年內，其管理資產規模基本上將翻倍。淨值成長是一個原因，但主要原因是政府批准雇主向退休基金繳納的金額增加。它是拉丁美洲最大的退休基金池。墨西哥是拉丁美洲第二大經濟體，但其退休基金管理最大的資金池，約 3,500 億美元，巴西為 2,500 億美元，智利為 1,500 億至 1,800 億美元。

And this largest pool, $350 billion, will double in 5 years. So we have to tap that market with local products. FIBRA is a very local product. The real estate investment trust in Mexico that we just acquired, and we intend to actually launch other local products into the Mexican economy targeted initially to the institutional investors.

而這個最大的資金池，3,500億美元，將在5年內翻倍。所以我們必須用本地產品來開拓這個市場。FIBRA 是一種非常本地化的產品。我們剛收購了墨西哥的房地產投資信託，我們打算向墨西哥經濟推出其他本地產品，最初針對的是機構投資者。

Finally, the main investors of this small FIBRA are the Mexican pension funds and one of them being the largest Mexican pension fund that is now our clients together with a couple of other pension funds that became our clients. So we have local clients now in Mexico investing in a local product, which is this FIBRA managed by us. So this is what we intend to do in Mexico. Will it be a major portion of the $14 billion that you mentioned in the later part of your question? I don't think so, Rodrigo.

最後，這個小型 FIBRA 的主要投資者是墨西哥退休基金，其中之一是最大的墨西哥退休基金，現在它是我們的客戶，還有其他幾個退休基金也成為我們的客戶。因此，我們現在在墨西哥有本地客戶投資本地產品，這就是我們管理的 FIBRA。這就是我們打算在墨西哥做的事情。這會是您在問題後半部分提到的 140 億美元中的大部分嗎？我不這麼認為，羅德里戈。

I think it's still early to say that over the next two years up to the end of '27, I think Mexico is going to be still very modest, very small portion of our total AUM or fee-earning AUM. I hope I answered your question.

我認為現在就斷言，在未來兩年直至 27 年底，墨西哥在我們的總 AUM 或收費 AUM 中所佔比例仍然很小，非常小，還為時過早。我希望我回答了你的問題。

That was great. For my follow-up, can you touch on how the deployment pipeline looks like at the moment, particularly in infrastructure? How should we think about the pace of deployment there given the $3.3 billion of uncalled capital?

那很棒。作為我的後續提問，您能否談談目前的部署流程是怎樣的，特別是在基礎設施方面？考慮到有 33 億美元未繳資本，我們該如何考慮在那裡部署的速度？

Yes, we are excited with all the fundraising for this first half of the year, as you probably heard during the call, and we have this, for us, sizable pool of capital that we can actually invest the $3.3 billion that you mentioned. And infrastructure, I think, is one of the main asset classes. It's $1.3 billion out of the $3.3 billion, so a 1/3 of that pending fee-earning AUM. We have a lot of things in the pipeline in infrastructure, mainly in Brazil and Colombia. The usual suspects that we feel very comfortable with investing, for example, toll roads, a lot of auctions are going on in Brazil, as you know, over the next months, and we pretend to select the -- what we consider the best ones to participate.

是的，正如您可能在電話會議中聽到的那樣，我們對今年上半年的所有融資感到非常興奮，我們擁有相當大的資金池，我們實際上可以投資您提到的 33 億美元。我認為基礎設施是主要資產類別之一。這是 33 億美元中的 13 億美元，也就是待收費 AUM 的 1/3。我們在基礎設施方面有很多計劃，主要在巴西和哥倫比亞。我們通常非常樂意投資收費公路等項目，正如您所知，在接下來的幾個月裡，巴西將舉行許多拍賣會，我們會選擇我們認為最好的項目來參與。

We have not only the fund investing, Infrastructure Fund V, but we have a pool of fee-paying co-investors that want to invest alongside. So making us able to actually sign bigger checks for bigger concessions. We also see the energy market in Colombia very, very attractive. As you know, we are finalizing the construction of the largest solar panel farm in Colombia, serving the largest utility company there. And we plan to expand that relationship.

我們不僅有基金投資、基礎建設基金 V，還有一群願意一起投資的付費共同投資者。因此，我們實際上能夠簽署更大的支票以獲得更大的讓步。我們也認為哥倫比亞的能源市場非常有吸引力。如您所知，我們正在完成哥倫比亞最大的太陽能板發電場的建設，為當地最大的公用事業公司提供服務。我們計劃擴大這種關係。

We also look into water sanitation. We also look to other sectors of the infrastructure industry, but mainly these 3 are our priorities as we speak.

我們也研究水衛生問題。我們也關注基礎設施產業的其他領域，但目前我們的重點主要集中在這三個領域。

Also, what we also have is in GPMS, the other 1.4 billion out of the 3.4 billion, so another basically 40% of the money there. Money that we have raised, one of them, our flagship secondaries opportunity Fund V, investing in secondaries buying positions of other LPs and GPs, mid-market, mainly European private equity funds. So very excited with that product as LPs seek for liquidity of their portfolio. So it's a very hot product right now, and we are very well positioned with our GPMS and (inaudible) another SMEs that we did raise within our GPMS industry segment.

此外，我們還擁有 GPMS，即 34 億美元中的另外 14 億美元，所以基本上還有 40% 的資金。我們籌集的資金中，有一筆是我們的旗艦二級機會基金 V，投資於二級市場，購買其他 LP 和 GP 的頭寸，中型市場，主要是歐洲私募股權基金。由於 LP 尋求其投資組合的流動性，因此對該產品感到非常興奮。所以它現在是一個非常熱門的產品，我們的 GPMS 和（聽不清楚）我們在 GPMS 行業領域內籌集的另一家中小企業處於非常有利的地位。

Tito Labarta, Goldman Sachs.

高盛的 Tito Labarta。

This is Tito from Goldman. Alex, my question, I guess, on the higher fundraising that you're expecting for the year. One, just to clarify, that is separate from the REIT that you announced that you acquired of around $600 million, right? So it would be -- that should be considered inorganic, right? So the 5% to 10% increase in fundraising is organic, just to clarify that.

我是高盛的 Tito。亞歷克斯，我的問題是，您預計今年的籌款額會更高。首先，需要澄清的是，這與您宣布收購的價值約 6 億美元的房地產投資信託基金 (REIT) 是分開的，對嗎？那麼——這應該被認為是無機的，對嗎？因此，籌款額增加 5% 到 10% 是自然的，只是為了澄清這一點。

And if so, what is driving that? Because as you mentioned, right, interest rates are still high in Brazil, but I mean, you seem to be getting some more interest here. So where do you see that interest is coming from that's leading to the better fundraising?

如果確實如此，那麼是什麼原因導致的呢？因為正如您所提到的，巴西的利率仍然很高，但我的意思是，您似乎在這裡獲得了更多的興趣。那麼，您認為這種興趣從何而來，從而促進了更好的籌款？

Yes, the uplift in the guidance from $6 billion to $6.3 billion to $6.6 billion or 5% to 10% higher is in addition to the $600 million -- approximately $600 million of AUM REITs that we bought in Brazil. And of course, also in addition to the small Mexican $26 million there that I just mentioned while answering Rodrigo's question from BofA. So we see -- so it is in addition. In addition to the $6.3 billion, $6.6 billion, we did this acquisition of $600 million of Brazilian REITs plus the $26 million of a small Mexican REIT.

是的，指導金額從 60 億美元上調至 63 億美元，再上調至 66 億美元，即上漲 5% 至 10%，這還不包括我們在巴西購買的 6 億美元（約 6 億美元的 AUM REIT）。當然，除了我剛才在回答美國銀行羅德里戈的問題時提到的墨西哥的 2600 萬美元小額資金之外。所以我們看到——另外也是如此。除了 63 億美元和 66 億美元之外，我們還收購了價值 6 億美元的巴西房地產投資信託基金，以及價值 2,600 萬美元的墨西哥小型房地產投資信託基金。

We see a lot of interest coming from Asian investors, Middle East and Europeans mainly and LatAm, local-to-local into our infrastructure credit and GPMS products. So infrastructure, again, inflation protected with alpha. So we see a lot of the local pension funds in the region in Latin America willing to get exposed to this product because of the nature of the inflation-protected revenues that we have for infrastructure and the long-term contracts and concession contracts that we -- that is part of the business, that is a characteristic of this business.

我們發現來自亞洲、中東和歐洲（主要是拉丁美洲）的投資者對我們的基礎設施信貸和 GPMS 產品表現出濃厚的興趣。因此，基礎設施再次受到通貨膨脹的阿爾法保護。因此，我們看到拉丁美洲地區的許多當地退休基金都願意投資這種產品，因為我們擁有基礎設施通膨保護收入的性質以及我們的長期合約和特許合約——這是我們業務的一部分，也是我們業務的一個特點。

On the credit side of the interest rates and alpha, we have been delivering great returns. Probably going to see -- as we file our presentation right now, which we did actually file last night, I'm sorry. You can see the returns on the credit -- all of our credit strategies performing very well as our infrastructure strategies as well. So continue to deliver alpha throughout our credit strategies, which then, of course, attracts investors to be able to tap into the high interest rate environment of most of the Latin American countries, high real interest rates in most of these Latin American countries. So continued interest from investors.

在利率和阿爾法值的信貸方面，我們一直提供豐厚的回報。可能要看看——我們現在提交了我們的演示文稿，實際上我們昨晚就提交了，很抱歉。您可以看到信貸的回報——我們所有的信貸策略以及基礎設施策略都表現得非常好。因此，繼續在我們的信貸策略中提供阿爾法收益，這當然會吸引投資者利用大多數拉丁美洲國家的高利率環境，以及大多數拉丁美洲國家的高實際利率。因此投資者的興趣持續增加。

We also see a slight shift, as I tried to describe and mentioned during my part of the earnings call of investors looking into LatAm as a place to allocate capital versus the US. I don't see people actually redeeming money from the US, but I think the additional allocation, I think people are rethinking about the additional allocation into the US and a small shift of this additional location into LatAm is already for us here, a huge amount of money. So as we see a small shift coming from Asian investors, a small shift coming from Middle Eastern investors, LatAm investors willing to invest more locally, given the volatility, the whole biased nature that people actually feel in uncertain times.

我們也看到了輕微的轉變，正如我在收益電話會議中試圖描述和提到的那樣，投資者將拉丁美洲視為與美國相比的資本配置地點。我並沒有看到人們真正從美國兌換資金，但我認為額外的分配，我認為人們正在重新考慮向美國額外分配資金，而將這一額外地點少量轉移到拉丁美洲對我們來說已經是一筆巨款。因此，我們看到亞洲投資者、中東投資者和拉丁美洲投資者出現了小幅轉變，他們願意在當地進行更多投資，因為考慮到市場的波動性以及人們在不確定時期所感受到的偏見。

And European investors now with a trade agreement between the European block, European Union and the [South Co] market, all of this together adds the uncertainty, the tariffs in the US, the trade agreements be bilateral being made between Latin America and Europe, for example, the allocation of the additional amount of capital, not 100% in the US as we were seeing during the year 2024, a bit of that being shifted to other regions, LatAm being one of them. All of this together, and of course, we are the go-to alternative asset manager in the region is benefiting us in the fundraising.

現在，歐洲投資者與歐盟、南美洲市場之間達成了貿易協定，所有這些都增加了不確定性，例如，美國的關稅、拉丁美洲和歐洲之間達成的雙邊貿易協定，額外資本的分配，不是像我們在 2024 年看到的那樣 100% 在美國，而是有一部分轉移到了其他地區，拉丁美洲就是其中之一。所有這些加在一起，當然，我們是該地區的另類資產管理者，這使我們在籌款方面受益匪淺。

And this is the fourth quarter, sequential quarter that we see net new money in a very positive and growing. So that's why we feel comfortable that we can actually uplift the guidance here. And also within the Brazilian setup that you mentioned, high interest rates, yes. But our credit products here are also doing well and have been able to raise capital in addition, again, investors trying to tap this high real interest rate environment, environment in Brazil as well.

這是第四季度，與上一季相比，我們看到淨新增資金呈現非常積極且不斷增長的勢頭。因此，我們感到很放心，我們實際上可以提升這裡的指導。而且正如您所提到的，在巴西，利率確實很高。但我們這裡的信貸產品也表現良好，並且能夠籌集資金，此外，投資者也試圖利用這種高實際利率環境，巴西的環境也是如此。

No, that's very helpful, very thorough. Maybe just a follow-up. Given that you are maintaining your guidance for FRE, I mean, should we assume to already see a step change from all this fundraising in 3Q? I know 4Q tends to be seasonally strong where you get the incentive fees. But just to get to that guidance, FRE will need to go up in the second half of the year?

不，這非常有幫助，非常透徹。也許只是後續行動。鑑於您維持對 FRE 的指導，我的意思是，我們是否應該假設已經看到第三季所有這些籌款活動帶來的重大變化？我知道第四季往往是季節性強勁的時期，你會獲得激勵費。但是，為了達到這個指導目標，FRE 是否需要在下半年上漲？

But should we already begin to see that in 3Q or should we expect most of that in 4Q?

但是我們是否應該在第三季就開始看到這種情況，還是應該預期在第四季大部分情況都會出現這種情況？

Yes. I think most of that more tail ended because we now have to -- which is a good part of it and the fun part of it for all of my portfolio managers here, we have to then invest this money. And as we invest the money, this money becomes then invested capital that we can charge fees, revenues, et cetera but there's a small-time lag. So as we already in late July, early August here, we will see more in the fourth quarter. But what is the message here?

是的。我認為大部分尾部資金已經結束，因為我們現在必須——這對我這裡的所有投資組合經理來說都是好事，也是有趣的事，我們必須投資這筆錢。當我們投資這些資金時，這些資金變成了投資資本，我們可以收取費用、收入等等，但存在一點時間滯後。因此，正如我們已經在七月底、八月初看到的那樣，我們將在第四季度看到更多。但這裡的資訊是什麼？

Now we will deliver the guidance of $225 million of FRE. We feel very comfortable with that given all the fundraising that transforms into revenues. And we get into -- we end '25 when we get into 2026 in a very strong position because these investments are not made this year, it's going to make late this year, so turning into revenues early 2026. So puts us in a very good position to deliver '26 and then heads us to '27. That's why we feel comfortable as it's a very long-term sticky management fee business that we manage.

現在我們將提供 2.25 億美元 FRE 的指導。考慮到所有籌集的資金都轉化為收入，我們對此感到非常滿意。當我們進入 2026 年時，我們將以非常強大的地位結束 25 年，因為這些投資不是在今年進行的，而是在今年稍後進行的，因此將在 2026 年初轉化為收入。因此，我們處於非常有利的位置，可以實現 26 年的目標，並邁向 27 年。這就是為什麼我們感到安心，因為我們管理的是一項長期黏性的管理費業務。

We can see 2027 delivering the $260 million to $290 million FRE guidance. So all of the fundraising in the beginning of the 3-year plan because we could have this fundraising later in the 3-year plan, we would still read the numbers, but now all of this good fundraising in the beginning of the 3-year plan makes us even more comfortable that we will deliver. If we do a simple math here, Tito, our fee-related earnings in the second quarter was approximately $44 million. Again, just remembering there's no incentive fees in the second quarter. If you multiply that by 4, we're already at $176 million.

我們預計 2027 年 FRE 指導價將達到 2.6 億至 2.9 億美元。因此，三年計劃開始時的所有籌款活動（因為我們可以在三年計劃後期進行這些籌款活動）我們仍然會閱讀數字，但現在三年計劃開始時所有這些良好的籌款活動讓我們更加有信心我們將實現目標。蒂托，如果我們做一個簡單的計算，我們第二季的費用相關收益約為 4400 萬美元。再次提醒，請記住第二季沒有激勵費用。如果將其乘以 4，就已經達到 1.76 億美元。

If we add $10 million to $12 million of incentive fees that happens in the fourth quarter, we are at $186 million, $188 million. So we are touch off the $200 million, which is the entry level of the range of $200 million to $225 million.

如果我們加上第四季的 1,000 萬至 1,200 萬美元的激勵費用，那麼總額將達到 1.86 億美元至 1.88 億美元。因此，我們觸及了 2 億美元，這是 2 億美元至 2.25 億美元範圍的入門級。

$12 million of additional fee-related earnings in the next 2 quarters is a small amount. If you do the math, I have to invest more or less $1.3 billion to $1.5 billion, and we have $3.3 billion already pending fee earnings AUM. So I think we're in a very good position. Of course, we have to do great investments because our name of the game here is to continue delivering great returns as we are with great returns, we managed to then raise more money. But of course, we're going to do great investments with the high-quality portfolio managers that we have here at Patria.

未來兩季 1,200 萬美元的額外費用相關收益只是一筆小數目。如果你算一下，我必須投資大約 13 億到 15 億美元，而我們已有 33 億美元的待處理費用收益 AUM。所以我認為我們處於非常有利的地位。當然，我們必須進行大量投資，因為我們的任務就是繼續提供豐厚的回報，有了豐厚的回報，我們才能籌集更多的資金。但當然，我們將與 Patria 的優質投資組合經理一起進行大量投資。

I'm sure that we're going to do that but we are in a good position. We are in a good position if I do half of my fee-paying AUM that I have in inventory as of today, things work in the way that I just described. And here we are delivering the $200 million to $225 million FRE and putting us in a strong position to start '26. So good position to be in.

我確信我們會做到這一點，但我們處於有利地位。如果我能將截至今天為止庫存的付費 AUM 的一半投入使用，事情就能按照我剛才描述的方式進行，那麼我們就處於有利地位。現在，我們正在交付 2 億至 2.25 億美元的 FRE，並使我們處於有利地位以迎接 26 年的到來。處於如此好的位置。

Of course, as you know, we have a very sophisticated CRM structure to manage our fundraising. We can see what we call internally here the funnel all the way from a lead to a subscription document signed. And when we see that funnel, we also -- makes us comfortable that we can hit the 5% to 10% higher guidance of the $6 billion that we announced as a fundraising guidance for '25. So we're in a great position. I'm happy for the team and congratulations from my team here from Patria’s commercial team that did a great job this first half of the year.

當然，如您所知，我們擁有非常複雜的 CRM 結構來管理我們的籌款活動。我們可以看到我們內部所說的漏斗，從潛在客戶到簽署的訂閱文件。當我們看到這個漏斗時，我們也感到很放心，我們可以達到我們宣布的 2025 年籌款指導價 60 億美元的 5% 到 10% 以上的目標。因此我們處於非常有利的地位。我為團隊感到高興，並代表 Patria 商業團隊向大家表示祝賀，他們在今年上半年表現非常出色。

Ricardo Buchpiguel, BTG.

里卡多·布赫皮格爾，BTG。

You mentioned the 7 REITs acquisition in the presentation is expected to add $600 million in fee earning AUM. Could you walk us through the timeline for when they will start being consolidated in your results? Will any shareholder approval from the REITs be required? And if so, are there any meaningful costs that will be associated with these approvals?

您在演示中提到，7 個 REIT 的收購預計將增加 6 億美元的收費 AUM。您能否向我們介紹一下它們何時開始合併到您的結果中的時間表？是否需要 REIT 股東批准？如果是的話，這些批准是否會產生任何有意義的成本？

Ricardo, we did 2 acquisitions here or a group of REITs that we acquired from Genial, as you know, it's the Brazilian local bank and a group of REITs that we bought from a local alternative asset manager, real estate alternative asset management called Vectis. On the Vectis front, we did the acquisition of one of their holding companies, which managed these funds. So the transaction is basically already closed. So we did sign and already close. So you will see these numbers already in the third quarter, adding to our fee earnings AUM as we did announce in July.

里卡多，我們在這裡進行了兩次收購，一次是從 Genial 收購的房地產投資信託基金集團，如你所知，這是一家巴西當地銀行，另一次是從當地另類資產管理公司 Vectis 購買的房地產投資信託基金集團。在 Vectis 方面，我們收購了他們的一家控股公司，該公司負責管理這些基金。因此交易基本上已經結束。所以我們確實簽署了協議並且已經結束。因此，您將在第三季看到這些數字，正如我們在 7 月宣布的那樣，它們增加了我們的費用收入 AUM。

In the case of Genial, we have to go through the assemblies. We have to call shareholders' vote. But for 90% of the funds, we already got the approval. too much detail here, but you probably know that we need 25% of the quota holders of each fund to actually vote to transfer the management of these REITs from Genial to us. And for 90% of the AUM, we already got the votes in for the shareholders' meetings.

對於 Genial 來說，我們必須經過組裝。我們必須召開股東投票。但對於 90% 的基金，我們已經獲得了批准。這裡有太多細節，但你可能知道，我們需要每個基金 25% 的配額持有人實際投票將這些 REIT 的管理權從 Genial 轉移到我們身上。對於 90% 的 AUM，我們已經獲得了股東大會的投票。

They're still going on because it's a 45 days that we have in order to reach out for these votes, but we already have more than 25% count as of today. So we are in a good position. Just 10% of the Genial funds, which is a $30 million fund of the whole $600 million that we did acquire, 5%. We're still counting to get to the 25%. But I think we'll probably get there, but we still have a couple of weeks to go, which is the 45-day period within the shareholders' meeting that we did call for.

他們仍在繼續，因為我們有 45 天的時間來爭取這些選票，但截至今天，我們已經獲得了超過 25% 的選票。因此我們處於有利地位。僅佔 Genial 基金的 10%，即我們收購的 6 億美元中的 3,000 萬美元，即 5%。我們仍在努力達到 25% 的目標。但我認為我們可能會實現這一目標，但我們仍然需要幾週的時間，也就是我們要求的股東大會的 45 天期限。

And in the worst of the worst case, we can extend that but it's only 5% of the AUM. So you're probably going to see during our third quarter of 2025. Revenues from that is on an annualized basis of $3 million. So going forward, it should add $1.5 million to our revenue which should translate into a $1 million of fee-related earnings, not annualized for the year, $2 million annualized, but for the year, $1 million as we did do this transaction in July. So it's not a -- it doesn't move the needle, but it's $1 million that we will add to our FRE within the year of 2025.

在最壞的情況下，我們可以延長這個期限，但這只是 AUM 的 5%。所以你可能會在 2025 年第三季看到它。每年由此產生的收入為 300 萬美元。因此，展望未來，它應該會為我們的收入增加 150 萬美元，這應該會轉化為 100 萬美元的費用相關收益，不是按年度計算的 200 萬美元，而是按年度計算的 100 萬美元，因為我們在 7 月份確實進行了這筆交易。所以這不是——它不會改變什麼，但我們將在 2025 年之前為我們的 FRE 增加 100 萬美元。

The costs associated with these are irrelevant. It's basically calling on a shareholders' meeting and a very, very insignificant costs that is not -- it doesn't move the needle at all, I think of our transaction costs. And I think this is it.

與這些相關的成本無關。它基本上是召開股東大會，而且成本非常非常小，我認為它對我們的交易成本沒有任何作用。我認為就是這樣。

Very clear. And just a follow-up here still on the real estate segment. We saw a pickup in fundraising during the quarter. If you could comment on what type of investors are driving the demand, which products are they mainly focusing in would be helpful. And also, if you could comment if we should see this level of fundraising from Q2 in the following quarters also would be helpful.

非常清楚。這裡我們繼續關注房地產領域。我們看到本季籌款活動有所回升。如果您能評論哪種類型的投資者在推動需求，他們主要關注哪些產品，這將會很有幫助。此外，如果您能評論我們是否應該在接下來的幾個季度中看到第二季度的這種籌款水平，那也會很有幫助。

Yes. I think our funds have been performing extremely well, and I congratulate here the portfolio managers and my partners that run the business, mainly the industrial logistics, which is the HGLG and also the urban retail fund, which is the HGRU, the ticker of these 2 funds. And of course, the credit fund as well doing very well given the times of high interest rates that we are living in Brazil right now. So we are -- we announced a follow-on offering for the logistics fund, the HGLG as we speak, a BRL 2 billion follow-on. We already have BRL 1 billion taken, which we are exchanging assets for shares of the fund.

是的。我認為我們的基金表現非常好，我在此祝賀投資組合經理和我的合夥人，他們負責管理業務，主要是工業物流基金（HGLG）和城市零售基金（HGRU），這兩隻基金的股票代碼是HGRU。當然，考慮到巴西目前處於高利率時期，信貸基金的表現也非常好。因此，我們宣布了物流基金（即我們所謂的 HGLG）的後續發行，發行金額為 20 億巴西雷亞爾。我們已經獲得了 10 億巴西雷亞爾，我們正在用這些資產交換基金的股份。

So investors that own assets, own real estate assets are in this follow-on offering are exchanging these assets and receiving in exchange shares of the fund. That accounts for more or less half of the offering and the other half of the offering would be new money. So it's a significant offering that we are running right now.

因此，擁有資產、擁有房地產資產的投資者在此次後續發行中交換這些資產並獲得基金份額。這佔到發行資金的一半左右，而另一半將是新資金。因此，這是我們目前正在進行的重要活動。

And the other fund that looks into a good position to be able to do a follow-on is our street retail fund, the HGRU. Why do we see that? Because the share price is trading at a very close level to the NAV of the fund and puts us in a good position to do a follow-on. So street retail, logistics, of course, more than an office fund and credit also doing very well. So we're very -- again, high interest rates environment, but been able to manage the funds, our logistics funds very well, manage them very well.

另一隻尋找良好地點進行後續行動的基金是我們的街頭零售基金 HGRU。我們為什麼會看到這種情況？因為股價與基金淨值非常接近，這讓我們處於有利的後續行動地位。因此，街道零售、物流，當然還有辦公室基金和信貸也表現得很好。因此，我們非常——再次強調，在高利率環境下，但我們能夠很好地管理資金、我們的物流資金，管理得非常好。

Our logistics fund is the largest in the segment. So that attracts a lot of investors because of its size, because of its liquidity. Same with street retail, the largest of the segment.

我們的物流基金是該領域最大的。由於其規模和流動性，它吸引了大量投資者。與街頭零售相同，這是該領域最大的零售。

The Brazilian economy is doing reasonably well. I think it's -- those particular things of Brazil and one of them is very high interest rates, very high real interest rates, but the economy continues to perform reasonably well. GDP at around 3% growth for 2025, which is impressive. You would imagine that such a high interest rates, it would cause a slowdown of the economy, but the economy will probably finish 2025 posting a 3% growth. And that reflects in all our businesses.

巴西經濟表現相當良好。我認為這是巴西的特殊情況，其中之一就是利率非常高，實際利率非常高，但經濟仍然表現得相當好。2025 年 GDP 成長率約 3%，令人印象深刻。您可能會想像，如此高的利率會導致經濟放緩，但到 2025 年，經濟可能會實現 3% 的成長。這反映在我們所有的業務中。

And as you know, Brazilians find a way to protect themselves against inflation, indexing, hedging, et cetera, to the good and to the bad to what I'm saying.

如你所知，巴西人找到了保護自己免受通貨膨脹、指數化、對沖等影響的方法，無論好壞，正如我所說的。

And we see in our private equity portfolio, EBITDA, as I mentioned during my earnings call, organically up 20% year-over-year, which is the whole portfolio, and we have everything in the portfolio from Fund IV all the way to Fund VII exposure to several sectors is quite -- our private equity portfolio is a quasi ETF of the Brazilian economy because it's exposed to so many different sectors and that 20% EBITDA growth organic, it's over 30-something-percent if I consider the acquisitions. So again, the -- as the Brazilian particularities of the Brazilian economy, we continue to perform given this environment. And we continue to fundraise in real estate, in infrastructure, for infrastructure, for real estate and for credit.

正如我在收益電話會議上提到的那樣，我們的私募股權投資組合的 EBITDA 有機增長了 20%，整個投資組合也是如此，從基金 IV 到基金 VII，我們的投資組合中的所有資產都涉及多個行業——我們的私募股權投資組合是巴西經濟的準 ETF，因為它涉及許多不同的行業，EBITDA 有機增長 20%，如果考慮的話，EBITDA 有機增長率超過 20%，如果考慮 20%，則考慮超過 30%。因此，鑑於巴西經濟的巴西特色，我們將在這種環境下繼續表現。我們繼續在房地產、基礎設施、基礎設施、房地產和信貸領域籌集資金。

William Barranjard, Itau BBA.

威廉‧巴蘭賈德 (William Barranjard)，伊塔烏 BBA。

I have a couple of questions here. Starting with the first one regarding fundraising. I just wanted to pick your brains on how do you think the recent news flow regarding the US tariffs on Brazil affected maybe the mood of international investors towards Brazil and the region. I would say it apparently didn't affect so much because of the upward guidance revision but maybe if you could comment here a little bit.

我這裡有幾個問題。從第一個關於募款的問題開始。我只是想問您，您認為最近有關美國對巴西徵收關稅的新聞可能如何影響國際投資者對巴西和該地區的情緒。我想說的是，由於上調指導意見，它顯然沒有產生太大影響，但也許你可以在這裡發表一點評論。

I have a second question now regarding a different topic regarding net debt, dividends and buybacks. So Ana commented during the call, the net debt should remain stable throughout the year, right? And also that you should use this new buyback program as a way to keep the number of outstanding shares in the range of the guided range, right? So I wanted to understand here what should we see in order for the dividend increase from the $0.50 per share we've been seeing for the past 1.5 years. When do you expect net debt to decrease and if we should see that in order for this dividend to increase again?

我現在有第二個問題，涉及淨債務、股息和回購的另一個主題。所以 Ana 在電話會議中評論說，淨債務應該全年保持穩定，對嗎？而且您應該使用這個新的回購計劃來將流通股數量保持在指導範圍內，對嗎？所以我想了解一下，為了使股息從過去 1.5 年來的每股 0.50 美元增加，我們應該看到什麼。您預計淨債務何時會減少，以及我們是否應該看到這一點以便股息再次增加？

First question on US tariffs. they're all predictions and expectations, right? It's very hard to understand exactly what's going to happen given that we haven't lived in an environment similar to this for a while now for over 50, 60, 70 years. So we don't have a lot of data to be able to go back and understand what are the exact effects.

第一個問題是關於美國關稅的。它們都是預測和預期，對嗎？考慮到我們已經有 50、60、70 多年沒有生活在類似的環境中了，所以很難確切地知道會發生什麼。因此，我們沒有大量的數據來回顧並了解確​​切的影響。

Of course, in my general view, higher tariffs globally, it's not good news for global trade, for global growth in general, making this general comment. How will these tariffs be the cost of these tariffs be absorbed by the supplier of the goods and services by the importer of the goods and services, it's hard to say. I think it will probably be absorbed within the whole system.

當然，我總體上認為，全球範圍內提高關稅對全球貿易、對全球經濟成長來說不是一個好消息，所以我做出了這樣的整體評論。這些關稅的成本將如何由商品和服務的供應商和商品和服務的進口商承擔，這很難說。我認為它可能會被整個系統吸收。

As far as Brazil is concerned, as you know, 12% of our exports are directed to the US and a lot of 45% of that 12% were exempt from the tariffs. So 45% of 12% exempt. So 55% of the 12%, around 6% of our exports are going to the US with higher tariffs.

就巴西而言，如您所知，我們的 12% 出口到美國，其中 45% 免關稅。因此 12% 中的 45% 免稅。因此，我們出口的 12% 中的 55%（約 6%）將銷往關稅較高的美國。

And we might see some additional, I think, exemptions. For example, coffee, it seems that it doesn't make a lot of sense given the exemptions that the Trump administration gave on products similar to coffee with the rationale that if there is a plant or something that does not grow in the US, they have to import it without tariffs. And coffee is one of them. Coffee does not grow in the Northern Hemisphere. So that can be another 5% to 7% of the exports.

我認為，我們可能會看到一些額外的豁免。例如咖啡，考慮到川普政府對類似咖啡的產品給予的豁免，這似乎沒有多大意義，其理由是，如果有一種植物或某種東西不在美國生長，他們就必須免關稅進口。咖啡就是其中之一。北半球不生​​長咖啡。因此這可以占出口的另外5%到7%。

And so we might be affected by 35% to 40% of the export, not 55% as of now.

因此，我們可能會受到35%到40%的出口影響，而不是現在的55%。

So in the end, I think we're it might not really change the needle dramatically for Brazil. I have here Luis Fernando Lopes with us. Our initial math does account for a 0.2% to 0.4% of reduction in GDP and the whole thing gets into effect and nothing comes back. And that was more of the 100% of tariffs on 100% of the goods. Tariffs on 55% of the goods is more to the 0.2%, 0.3% than the 0.4%.

所以最終，我認為這可能不會真正為巴西帶來巨大的改變。路易斯費爾南多洛佩斯 (Luis Fernando Lopes) 也和我們在一起。我們最初的計算確實會導致 GDP 下降 0.2% 到 0.4%，而且整件事情都會生效，沒有任何回升。這相當於對 100% 的商品徵收 100% 的關稅。55%的商品關稅比0.2%、0.3%高，比0.4%低。

So as I was mentioning earlier, we were expecting GDP to grow around 3% this year in Brazil. So we might see by the end of the year, that reducing to an annualized growth rate of 2.6%, 2.7% because of the tariff. So it's -- of course, it's painful, but I don't think it's dramatic in the sense that our 3% GDP growth will go down to 0 in Brazil, something like that. It's on the -- as we say here on the margin, right, on the margin. So that's, I think, is more of the economic impact.

正如我之前提到的，我們預計今年巴西的 GDP 將成長 3% 左右。因此，到今年年底，我們可能會看到，由於關稅的影響，年增長率將降至 2.6% 或 2.7%。所以，這當然是痛苦的，但我不認為這有什麼戲劇性，例如我們的 3% GDP 成長率會在巴西降至 0，諸如此類。正如我們在這裡所說的那樣，它在邊緣，對，在邊緣。所以我認為這更多的是經濟影響。

I think the second part of your question, I think there's a political impact, which is caused, I think everybody's concern and attention that these tariffs are not really derived from trading issues, but they come from political issues. And that puts us in a more uncertain scenario, right? Because even if we go back and we have good trade negotiations, but we didn't fix as far as Mr. Trump is concerned, the political side of it, where do we land. And so that puts us in a more uncertain position.

我認為你問題的第二部分，我認為這是有政治影響的，這是由大家關心和關注的這些關稅其實並非源自於貿易問題，而是源自於政治議題。這讓我們陷入了更加不確定的境地，對嗎？因為即使我們回去進行了良好的貿易談判，但就川普先生而言，我們還沒有確定政治方面的問題，我們該如何解決。這讓我們處於更加不確定的境地。

So it's harder to say where will this thing land.

因此很難說這個東西會落在哪裡。

So the third thing that I would say before I conclude the question here, other regions of the world, Middle East and Asians and Europeans, I think they have moved in the direction of investing more in Latin America as we see from our higher and robust fundraising for the first half of '25, and we see the pipeline with very robust fundraising for the next five, six months of 2025. And some of it has to do with this. I think, look, I'm going to direct my exports not into the US, I'm going to direct my exports to Latin America. And the Chinese car industry, for example, they're very competitive. They're directing their exports to Brazil and other countries in LatAm.

因此，在結束這個問題之前，我想說的第三件事是，世界其他地區，中東、亞洲和歐洲，我認為他們已經轉向在拉丁美洲進行更多投資，正如我們從 2025 年上半年更高且更強勁的籌資情況中看到的那樣，而且我們看到 2025 年接下來的五、六個月籌資情況將非常強勁。其中一些與此有關。我想，看，我不會將我的出口導向美國，而是將我的出口導向拉丁美洲。以中國汽車產業為例，競爭非常激烈。他們將產品出口至巴西和拉丁美洲的其他國家。

Other European manufacturers and service providers are directing exports to LatAm and Brazil, in particular. And that, of course, brings them to invest more, be it financial investors, be it strategic investors in the country. And we didn't see any blip in the interest.

其他歐洲製造商和服務提供者則將出口重點放在拉丁美洲和巴西。當然，這會吸引他們進行更多投資，無論是金融投資者還是策略投資者。我們沒有看到任何興趣的波動。

On the contrary, we saw more interest in the region. And I think it has to do -- and they say it out, actually, our clients say that, the uncertainty of -- now of the US economy in general and maybe the uncertainty of the US being that trade partner that we thought it was in the past, I'm going to look for new markets, for new partners. And even if they shift a small amount of their total and it's in the -- only the new money and in the margin of the new money, that's already a huge amount of money for us, right?

相反，我們看到了人們對該地區的更多興趣。我認為這與——他們實際上也這麼說，我們的客戶也這麼說，現在美國經濟總體的不確定性，以及美國作為我們過去認為的貿易夥伴的不確定性，我將尋找新的市場，新的合作夥伴。即使他們轉移的只是總額中的一小部分，而且只是新資金和新資金的利潤，但這對我們來說已經是一大筆錢了，對吧？

For Brazil, we have an FDI of around $60 billion to $70 billion. Another $5 billion to $10 billion raises the FDI by 10%. And today in today's terms, $5 billion to $10 billion is not a lot of money. Look at us, we're managing close to $50 billion, a Brazilian alternative investment manager. So even us could raise another $10 billion.

對於巴西，我們的外國直接投資約為600億至700億美元。再增加 50 億至 100 億美元，外國直接投資將增加 10%。以今天的標準來看，50億到100億美元並不是很多錢。看看我們，我們管理著近 500 億美元的巴西另類投資經理人。因此，即使是我們也可以再籌集 100 億美元。

It would be another 10% of our AUM, and that increases the FDI into Brazil by 5% to 10%, which is amazing. So I think we still -- we continue to be in a good position. So finalizing my answer, I think it's -- the effects of the tariffs are marginal. They're not going -- I think not going to cause major harms in Brazil. Of course, particular sectors are going to suffer a lot more than what I just mentioned.

這將是我們資產管理規模的另外 10%，並且會使流入巴西的 FDI 增加 5% 到 10%，這是非常了不起的。所以我認為我們仍然——我們繼續處於有利地位。所以最終我的答案是，我認為關稅的影響是微乎其微的。我認為他們不會對巴西造成重大損害。當然，特定行業遭受的損失將比我剛才提到的要大得多。

We look into a 0.2% to 0.4% reduction in GDP out of a 3% growth in GDP for Brazil. Of course, very painful, but not very dramatic. But my main concern is on the political side where we land there. But nevertheless, investors continue to show very high interest in our products and in the region.

我們研究發現，巴西的 GDP 在成長 3% 的同時，卻下降了 0.2% 至 0.4%。當然，非常痛苦，但不是十分劇烈。但我主要關心的是我們到達那裡時的政治方面。但儘管如此，投資者仍然對我們的產品和該地區表現出很高的興趣。

On the net debt, share count dividend recount here, William, what I can say is like, as Ana mentioned, we see net debt remaining relatively flat from the number that we posted by the end of the second quarter of '25, around $120 million, $130 million. Net debt probably finished the year with $120 million, $130 million of net debt. Share count, we are 159.5 million. The range that we gave at our December 9, 2024 Investor Day was 158 million to 160 million shares, and I think we're going to stay in that -- within that share count. And we don't foresee any increase in the dividend as of today.

關於淨債務、股票數量股息重新計算，威廉，我可以說的是，正如安娜提到的，我們看到淨債務與我們在 2025 年第二季度末公佈的數字相比保持相對平穩，約為 1.2 億美元、1.3 億美元。年底淨債務可能為 1.2 億美元，淨債務為 1.3 億美元。股數：我們有 1.595 億股。我們在 2024 年 12 月 9 日投資者日給出的範圍是 1.58 億至 1.6 億股，我認為我們將保持在該數量範圍內。截至今天，我們預計股息不會增加。

So we continue with $0.15 per share per quarter, and our Board last week approved the dividend of $0.15 per share to be paid for the second quarter of 2025, and we see that dividends will remain in the third quarter and the fourth quarter.

因此，我們繼續以每季 0.15 美元的價格派發股息，董事會上週批准了 2025 年第二季每股 0.15 美元的股息，我們認為第三季和第四季仍將維持股息。

As we approach the end of the year and if the fundraising continues to go the way that we are seeing and the uncertainties that we just described in my answer here recedes, and we see 2026 as robust as we are seeing when I answer my question here to Tito from Goldman, we can review this dividend policy. But as of today, we're remaining with $0.15 per share for the third quarter and the fourth quarter. I hope I answered your question.

隨著我們接近年底，如果籌款繼續按照我們看到的方式進行，並且我們剛才在回答中描述的不確定性消退，並且我們看到 2026 年的勢頭像我在這裡回答高盛的 Tito 的問題時所看到的那樣強勁，那麼我們可以重新審查這項股息政策。但截至今天，第三季和第四季的每股收益仍為 0.15 美元。我希望我回答了你的問題。

Guilherme Grespan, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的 Guilherme Grespan。

My question is more as well to pick your brain a little bit related, how do you think the business, Alex, in relation to geography? And just the context of the question, I have been having more and more debates around Brazil potential bull case scenario next year. And this bull case, I think it's a combination of potential administration change plus lower rates. So some investors are seeing the scenario of a risk on scenario in Brazil. And my question to you is how do you see Patria nowadays?

我的問題更多的是想向您請教一下，亞歷克斯，您認為業務與地理有什麼關係？就這個問題的背景而言，我一直在就明年巴西潛在的多頭情景進行越來越多的辯論。而這種多頭情況，我認為是潛在的政府變革和較低利率的結合。因此，一些投資者認為巴西的風險情境正在發生。我想問的是，您現在如何看待 Patria？

And how much should we expect in terms of benefits from Brazil, specifically?

那麼，我們具體應該從巴西獲得多少利益呢？

Because if you go into the past 10 years ago, it used to be a very specific concentrated asset in Brazil, right? But I think for the right reasons, you diversified a lot of business. Nowadays, Brazil, I think, if I recall correctly, it's only 25% of the fundraising. And if you can recap, I'm not sure how much it represents in terms of asset allocation. But my point to you is, if we see this bull case scenario in Brazil in terms of risk-only environment, do you think fundraising trends are expected to accelerate or at this point, do you think it's reasonable to see a steady growth going forward independent if Brazil does super well or not?

因為如果你回顧過去 10 年，它曾經是巴西一種非常特殊的集中資產，對嗎？但我認為，出於正確的理由，你們使許多業務多元化了。如今，如果我沒記錯的話，巴西的募款金額只佔 25%。如果你能回顧一下，我不確定它在資產配置方面代表了多少。但我想對你說的是，如果我們從風險環境的角度來看巴西的這種牛市情景，你是否認為融資趨勢有望加速，或者在目前的情況下，無論巴西表現是否出色，你是否認為未來出現穩定增長是合理的？

Guilherme, definitely so. I think if there's a re-rating, as you just explained, linked to the political shift to a center-right government in Brazil, definitely, in my view, fundraising and prices of assets post-election will rise. And we've been seeing that, and we've been following that. And we do cover that very closely. And you can see from all kinds of graphs and data points what happens with -- in the shift from center-left to center-rights in economies like Brazil.

吉列爾梅，確實如此。我認為，如果像您剛才解釋的那樣，與巴西政治轉向中右翼政府有關，那麼選舉後的籌資和資產價格肯定會上漲。我們一直在看到這一點，並且一直在關注這一點。我們確實對此進行了非常密切的報道。您可以從各種圖表和數據點中看到巴西等經濟體從中左翼轉向中右翼轉變的情況。

There's some correction or increase in the prices of assets before, but a big correction in prices of the assets post the election and increases in fundraising, in general.

先前資產價格有一些調整或上漲，但整體而言，選舉後資產價格會大幅調整，募款也會增加。

But what I would like to highlight is not just Brazil. Not by chance, but by strategy, as you mentioned, we did diversify our business into other countries in Latin America first and then into Europe. And what you just mentioned about Brazil is also happening in other countries in Latin America, mainly in Chile and Colombia. And today, on the liability side, we have 65% of our fundraising from investors that are based outside of LatAm, 20% from investors based outside of Brazil, Latin investors that are not Brazilians or based in Brazil and 15% of our fundraising coming from Brazilian-based investors, 65/20/15. On the asset side, where do we invest this money?

但我想強調的不只是巴西。這並非偶然，而是出於戰略考慮，正如您所說，我們首先將業務多元化到拉丁美洲的其他國家，然後再到歐洲。而您剛才提到的巴西的情況也出現在拉丁美洲的其他國家，主要是智利和哥倫比亞。今天，在負債方面，我們籌集的資金中有 65% 來自拉丁美洲以外的投資者，20% 來自巴西以外的投資者，以及非巴西人或位於巴西的拉丁投資者，15% 來自巴西投資者，比例為 65/20/15。在資產方面，我們把這些錢投資到哪裡？

It's is more or less 1/3, 1/3, 1/3, in Brazil. It's 28%, 30%. I'm just rounding the numbers to make it easier here and illustrate my example, 1/3 in LatAm ex-Brazil and 1/3 outside of LatAm, okay?

在巴西，這個數字大約是 1/3、1/3、1/3。分別是28%、30%。我只是將數字四捨五入以使其更容易理解並說明我的例子，1/3 在拉丁美洲（巴西除外），1/3 在拉丁美洲以外，好嗎？

So taking a view of the 1/3, which is LatAm ex-Brazil, and I also mentioned earlier, it's just 3% in Mexico. So it's mainly Chile, Peru and Colombia. These 3 countries are growing -- sorry, are growing over the next 4 to 12 months or 4 to 18 months through elections. And we already see the same effect that you just mentioned for Brazil in Chile. Most probably, the election polls are showing us that a center-right government in Chile will win.

因此，從 1/3 來看，也就是除巴西以外的拉丁美洲，我之前也提到過，墨西哥只佔 3%。主要是智利、秘魯和哥倫比亞。這三個國家正在發展中——抱歉，是在未來 4 到 12 個月或 4 到 18 個月內透過選舉實現發展。我們已經在智利看到了您剛才提到的巴西的同樣影響。最有可能的是，選舉民調顯示智利中右翼政府將獲勝。

Is it Mrs. Matthei or Mr. Kast and that puts us in a very good position to re-rate Chile. You can see that the more liquid securities in the Chilean economy are already being priced up. And we can see also fundraising of our Chilean clients to be more exposed to this re-rating of Chile going up.

無論是馬特希女士還是卡斯特先生，這都讓我們處於非常有利的位置來重新評估智利。您可以看到，智利經濟中流動性較強的證券價格已經上漲。我們還可以看到，我們的智利客戶正在籌集資金，以便更多地了解智利的重新評級。

So we're raising more money in Chile to bet on this re-rating strategy or election strategy or election arbitrage, as we call. And we go then next, which is the presidential elections in Chile are happening -- should happen at the end of this year.

因此，我們在智利籌集了更多資金，押注這種重新評級策略或選舉策略或選舉套利。接下來我們要說的是智利總統大選即將舉行——預計今年底舉行。

Then we go into 2026, we have elections in Colombia and Peru. And in Colombia, the same, the same, a little behind Chile because the elections in Colombia is just in the second quarter of 2026. But what the polls show today that most probably, we're going to have a center-right government because the popularity of the current government President there, Mr. Petro is really, really low. And with that, the whole re-rating, the whole election arbitrage, and we are playing, of course, with that, we're seeing investors willing to invest in our funds.

然後我們進入 2026 年，哥倫比亞和秘魯將舉行選舉。哥倫比亞的情況也一樣，略落後智利，因為哥倫比亞的選舉將於 2026 年第二季舉行。但今天的民調顯示，我們很可能會出現一個中右翼政府，因為現任政府總統佩特羅先生的支持率非常非常低。有了這些，整個重新評級，整個選舉套利，當然，我們也在玩這些，我們看到投資者願意投資我們的基金。

We're having success in raising a private equity fund in Colombia, success in raising an infrastructure fund in Colombia and mostly through our institutional investors clients. And they are saying exactly that, that you mentioned about Brazil, about Colombia.

我們成功地在哥倫比亞籌集了私募股權基金，成功地在哥倫比亞籌集了基礎設施基金，而且主要是透過我們的機構投資者客戶。他們所說的正是您提到的關於巴西、關於哥倫比亞的話。

And then Peru comes next. And we have the Vice President of Peru actually took over as the running President, and she is then conducting elections in 2026. And she managed to do the same thing that Mrs. (inaudible) managed, right? Her popularity is lower than the inflation in Peru, which is a rare position to be in.

接下來是秘魯。秘魯副總統實際上已接任總統一職，她將於 2026 年主持選舉。她也做了和（聽不清楚）夫人一樣的事情，對吧？她的支持率低於秘魯的通貨膨脹率，這是一個罕見的情況。

But her population is lower than the inflation in Peru. I think her population is around 2%, 3%. I don't know how low can you get -- how can you get lower than that, right? And inflation in Peru around 4%. So inflation in Peru is higher than her popularity.

但她的人口低於秘魯的通膨率。我認為她的人口大約是2%、3%。我不知道你能降到多低——你怎麼能比這更低呢，對吧？秘魯的通貨膨脹率約為4%。因此秘魯的通貨膨脹率高於她的受歡迎程度。

We normally say here, at Patria, that when your popularity rate is lower than the inflation rate, I think it's time for you to go, right, which is, I think, the case of the Peruvian President. And she's going to be substituted by a center-right President. So the Peruvian economy also has this election arbitrage.

在 Patria，我們通常會說，當你的支持率低於通貨膨脹率時，我認為你就該下台了，對吧，我認為秘魯總統就是這種情況。她將被一位中右翼總統取代。因此秘魯經濟也存在這種選舉套利。

And then comes us Brazil, end of '26. very, very early to say 16 months before an election, 18 months before an election, so many things can happen. But I think there's a chance of the center-right government to win the elections here in Brazil. And that arbitrage play will come into effect, and we see that into play more of the hedge funds that we see investing in some of our funds. We see the local investors already betting on that.

然後是巴西，26 年底。現在說距離選舉還有 16 個月、18 個月，還為時過早，所以有很多事情可能發生。但我認為中右翼政府有機會贏得巴西的選舉。這種套利行為將會生效，而且我們看到，投資於我們部分基金的對沖基金將會更發揮作用。我們看到當地投資者已經對此進行了押注。

We see also several data points. As you know, we had a very large sizable short position on the real at the beginning of the year. That short position basically diminished. I don't think people are in a buy long position, but I think the short position went to a neutral position. Same in the stock exchange.

我們還看到了幾個數據點。如您所知，我們在年初持有大量雷亞爾空頭部位。此空頭部位基本上已經減少。我認為人們並沒有處於買入多頭部位，但我認為空頭部位已經轉為中性部位。證券交易所也一樣。

I think the short went to a neutral position.

我認為空頭已經轉向中立立場。

So I haven't seen here in Brazil because it's the latest -- it's the fourth country in my list here, Chile, Colombia, Peru and then comes elections in Brazil. So we're a little further down the road, the Brazilian elections. But I already saw a shift from a short position to a neutral and we might get into a long buy position as we head into the end of '25 and '26 and the elections poll shows that the center-right in Brazil have a good chance to win. So yes, very exciting moments, to be honest, William. And we're going to play this 2/3 of our assets, as I mentioned, invested here in the region, not only in Brazil.

所以我還沒有在巴西看到，因為它是最新的——它是我名單上的第四個國家，智利、哥倫比亞、秘魯，然後是巴西的選舉。距離巴西大選還有一段距離。但我已經看到從空頭部位轉向中立，隨著我們進入 25 年和 26 年末，我們可能會進入多頭買入倉位，選舉民調顯示巴西中右翼很有可能獲勝。是的，說實話，威廉，那真是個令人興奮的時刻。正如我所提到的，我們將把 2/3 的資產投資於該地區，而不僅僅是巴西。

In Mexico, we don't see that, of course, the President there was just reelected for a 6-year term. So -- but it's amazing. We look into the Mexican and Colombian and Chilean economy. Why are these economies having -- been able to have low interest rates in Brazil? Very simple, the fiscal, right?

在墨西哥，我們當然不會看到那裡的總統剛剛連任六年。所以——但這太神奇了。我們研究墨西哥、哥倫比亞和智利的經濟。為什麼這些經濟體能夠像巴西一樣維持低利率？很簡單，財政，對吧？

Mexico is investment grade with a 50% debt-to-GDP. Chile is investment grade OECD and Mexico is also OECD member. Chile investment grade OECD member and also interest rates coming down with a fiscal stands relatively under control, 40% debt-to-GDP.

墨西哥的債務佔 GDP 的 50%，屬於投資等級。智利是投資級經合組織成員國，墨西哥也是經合組織成員國。智利是投資等級經合組織成員國，利率也在下降，財政狀況相對可控，債務佔 GDP 的 40%。

Colombia, not investment grade, but it's 50% debt-to-GDP, moving a notch up to 50-something percent of debt-to-GDP, but the leadership in Colombia is quite complex. And us here with gross debt at 76% of gross debt-to-GDP. So the fiscal says a lot about these 4 countries as well, right, that I just mentioned. So we might have even not only a center-right government winning the next election, but a solution or at least a path to a solution to our fiscal problem, and that adds to the whole rerating or election arbitrage in Brazil. So pretty excited, to be honest, and we see all of this happening in all these countries, and we did expose Patria on purpose by strategy to these countries.

哥倫比亞不是投資等級，但其債務佔 GDP 的比例為 50%，上升到 50% 左右，但哥倫比亞的領導階層相當複雜。我們這裡的總債務佔GDP的76％。所以財政狀況也對這四個國家有很大影響，對吧，我剛剛提到了。因此，我們不僅可能看到中右翼政府贏得下屆選舉，還可能看到一個解決方案，或至少是一條解決財政問題的途徑，這將增加巴西的整體重新評級或選舉套利。說實話，我們非常興奮，我們看到所有這些國家都在發生這樣的事情，我們確實有策略地向這些國家展示了 Patria。

And lastly, if I go to Europe, we're basically exposed to the UK. UK is doing reasonably well given the situation and went out and already signed a tariff deal with the US administration, which seems as a good tariff deal given what the European Union signed and given what [Japan] signed. So they are in the good side.

最後，如果我去歐洲，我們基本上就會接觸到英國。考慮到目前的情況，英國做得還不錯，並且已經與美國政府簽署了關稅協議，考慮到歐盟和日本簽署的協議，這似乎是一項很好的關稅協議。所以他們是好的一方。

And that also is an economy that's interesting, a lot of infrastructure investors because of their higher defense spending, et cetera. So I'm pretty excited here, William. I hope I answered your question -- Guilherme, I'm sorry.

這也是一個有趣的經濟體，由於國防開支較高，因此吸引了大量基礎設施投資者，等等。所以我很興奮，威廉。我希望我回答了你的問題——Guilherme，對不起。

And this does conclude the Q&A session for today. I would like to turn the call over to Alex Saigh, CEO, for closing remarks. Please go ahead.

今天的問答環節到此結束。我想將電話轉給執行長 Alex Saigh 來做最後發言。請繼續。

Thank you very much. Thanks for the call. Thanks for coordinating the call as well. And again, we're very excited with the news of the first half of the year and looking to a great 2025. Thanks for your participation.

非常感謝。謝謝您的來電。也感謝您協調這通通話。再次，我們對今年上半年的消息感到非常興奮，並期待 2025 年取得更大的成就。感謝您的參與。

Thanks for the patience, and I hope to see you all in person and safe in the near future. Thank you. Bye-bye.

感謝大家的耐心等待，希望不久的將來能安全地與大家見面。謝謝。再見。

Thank you all for participating in today's conference call. You may now disconnect.

感謝大家參加今天的電話會議。您現在可以斷開連線。