Energy Vault Holdings Inc (NRGV) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Greetings and welcome to Energy Vault's fourth-quarter and full-year 2023 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. It is now my pleasure to introduce your host, Bernie Colson, Vice President of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

歡迎參加 Energy Vault 第四季和 2023 年全年財報電話會議。（操作員指示）謹此提醒，本次會議正在錄製中。現在我很高興向您介紹主持人，投資者關係副總裁伯尼·科爾森。請繼續。

Thank you. Hello and welcome to Energy Vault's fourth-quarter and full-year 2023 financial results conference call. As a reminder, Energy Vault's fourth-quarter earnings press release and presentation is available now on our Investor website, and we will be referring to the presentation during this call. A replay of this call will be available later today on the Investor Relations page of our website. This call is now being recorded. If you object in any way, please disconnect now.

謝謝。您好，歡迎參加 Energy Vault 第四季和 2023 年全年財務業績電話會議。謹此提醒，Energy Vault 第四季度收益新聞稿和簡報現已在我們的投資者網站上發布，我們將在本次電話會議期間參考該簡報。今天晚些時候，我們網站的投資者關係頁面將提供本次電話會議的重播。目前該通話正在錄音中。如果您以任何方式反對，請立即斷開連接。

Please note that Energy Vault's earnings release and this call contains forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties. These forward-looking statements are only estimates and may differ materially from the actual future events or results due to a variety of factors. We caution everyone to be guided in their analysis of Energy Vault by referring to our 10-K filing for a list of factors that may cause our results to differ from those anticipated in any forward-looking statement.

請注意，Energy Vault 的收益發布和本次電話會議包含前瞻性陳述，這些陳述存在風險和不確定性。這些前瞻性陳述僅是估計，可能由於多種因素而與實際的未來事件或結果有重大差異。我們提醒大家，在對 Energy Vault 進行分析時，請參考我們的 10-K 文件，以了解可能導致我們的結果與任何前瞻性聲明中預期的結果不同的因素清單。

We undertake no obligation to publicly update or revise any forward-looking statements except as required by law. In addition, please note that we will be presenting and discussing certain non-GAAP information. Please refer to the Safe Harbor disclaimer and non-GAAP financial measures presented in our earnings release for more details, including a reconciliation to comparable GAAP measures.

除法律要求外，我們不承擔公開更新或修改任何前瞻性聲明的義務。此外，請注意，我們將展示和討論某些非 GAAP 資訊。請參閱我們的收益報告中提供的安全港免責聲明和非公認會計原則財務指標，以了解更多詳細信息，包括與可比公認會計原則指標的調節。

Joining me on the call today is Robert Piconi our Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, and Jan Kees van Gaalen, our Chief Financial Officer. At this time, I'd like to hand the call over to Robert Piconi.

今天與我一起參加電話會議的是我們的董事長兼執行長 Robert Piconi 和我們的財務長 Jan Kees van Gaalen。現在，我想把電話轉給羅伯特·皮科尼。

Great. Thank you, Bernie. And I'd like to welcome everyone to our fourth-quarter and full-year 2023 earnings call.

偉大的。謝謝你，伯尼。我謹歡迎大家參加我們的 2023 年第四季和全年財報電話會議。

We're announcing results on our second year now as a public company, which happens to be also our second year of revenue. As you tend to do sometimes, it can be helpful to step back, zoom out if you will, and look at how we progressed these past two years as I did after our first year.

我們現在公佈了作為上市公司第二年的業績，這也是我們實現收入的第二年。正如您有時會做的那樣，如果您願意的話，退後一步，縮小範圍，看看我們在過去兩年中取得的進展，就像我在第一年之後所做的那樣，這可能會有所幫助。

We've grown this company as a public company globally in unprecedented ways across multiple continents, multiple technologies while serving different customer segments, public utilities, independent power players, and large industrial energy users. The result has been the fastest-growing company in energy storage in only our first two years.

我們以前所未有的方式將這家公司發展成為一家全球上市公司，跨越多個大洲，採用多種技術，同時為不同的客戶群、公共事業、獨立電力公司和大型工業能源用戶提供服務。結果是，在我們成立的頭兩年裡，我們就成為了能源儲存領域成長最快的公司。

We continue to monetize our long duration gravity, technology via regional license and royalty agreements that will pay long term dividends and royalties. And capped a tremendous second half of 2023 executing multiple battery energy storage projects across the US market with a newly developed Energy Management software platform that is winning rave reviews from customers and has been a key differentiator in our rapid commissioning timeframes and ability to quickly get through commissioning inside energization regardless of the underlying hardware.

我們繼續透過區域許可和特許權使用費協議將我們的長期引力和技術貨幣化，這些協議將支付長期股息和特許權使用費。並透過新開發的能源管理軟體平台為2023 年下半年在美國市場執行的多個電池儲能專案畫上了圓滿的句號，該平台贏得了客戶的好評，並且是我們快速調試時間和快速通過的能力的關鍵差異化因素無論底層硬體為何，都可以在通電內部進行調試。

I think finally and as a testament to our strategy of solving customer problems as an energy storage solutions provider, we began construction on a first-of-its-kind green hydrogen hybrid energy storage system to provide multi-day storage to the city of Calistoga, California for Pacific Gas and Electric, California's largest utility. Energy Vault uniquely will own this system under a tolling agreement to PG&E as we also presented the only fully sustainable solution to replace their prior diesel generation systems historically used to secure continuous power and it will be operational in the mid part of this year.

我認為最後，為了證明我們作為能源儲存解決方案提供商解決客戶問題的策略，我們開始建造第一個綠氫混合能源儲存系統，為卡利斯託加市提供多日存儲，加州太平洋天然氣電力公司，加州最大的公用事業公司。Energy Vault 將根據與 PG&E 的收費協議擁有該系統，因為我們還提出了唯一完全可持續的解決方案，以取代他們先前用於確保持續供電的柴油發電系統，並將於今年中期投入運營。

So those are some of the key highlights, very proud of our progress, our delivery in our first two years and never been more excited about what the future holds as I am now as we continue to push boundaries in innovation while fortifying strong customer relationships that will be the basis of our future. Clearly, we continue to operate in our sector in a very volatile capital market. And despite that, the team has remained focused on the most important investor priorities, and I would say there are three of those.

因此，這些是一些關鍵亮點，我們對我們的進步和前兩年的交付感到非常自豪，並且像我現在一樣對未來感到無比興奮，因為我們繼續突破創新界限，同時加強牢固的客戶關係，將是我們未來的基礎。顯然，我們繼續在非常不穩定的資本市場中經營我們的產業。儘管如此，該團隊仍然專注於最重要的投資者優先事項，我想說其中有三個。

First, executing for our customers and keeping the customer loyalty. That are really the key to our future and really the foundation of our house that we're building here after getting through two years. Without those customers and without those future revenue streams and with those customers now uniquely as reference points for future deals and future customers, we would not have a bright future. I feel very good about that.

首先，為客戶執行並維持客戶忠誠度。這確實是我們未來的關鍵，也是我們兩年後在這裡建造的房子的基礎。如果沒有這些客戶，沒有這些未來的收入流，如果沒有這些客戶現在作為未來交易和未來客戶的獨特參考點，我們就不會擁有光明的未來。我對此感覺很好。

Second, profitable unit economics as we grow. You can imagine as a new company when you're approaching the likes of some of the largest public utilities and some of the most prominent independent power producers, you don't necessarily have the highest leverage in the contract negotiation. Despite us having I think one of the most experienced team in the industry, which is what led some of these largest customers to have the confidence and faith in us to deliver for them on very critical projects, we negotiated -- we put -- they put their faith in us and we've delivered quarter over quarter with profitable unit economics.

其次，隨著我們的成長，獲利單位經濟效益。您可以想像，作為一家新公司，當您與一些最大的公用事業公司和一些最著名的獨立電力生產商接洽時，您不一定在合約談判中擁有最高的影響力。儘管我們擁有我認為是業內最有經驗的團隊之一，這使得一些最大的客戶對我們有信心和信心為他們交付非常關鍵的項目，但我們談判 - 我們把 - 他們他們對我們充滿信心，我們每個季度都實現了盈利的單位經濟效益。

And finally, and I think this is definitely not least from an investor perspective, we have protected our balance sheet and liquidity as a company to allow us to control our destiny, to invest in growth, and eliminate any dilutive types of financing to shareholders. I think this and as you've seen -- if our results -- if you've happened to read through them, which I'll highlight them here in just a minute, this has been an important aspect in particular in Q4, where we took some proactive actions as it is clear the market has spoken on the desire for even new young companies in a very high growth and necessary market for the future, the planet must get to cash flow positive.

最後，我認為這絕對不是最不重要的，從投資者的角度來看，我們保護了我們作為一家公司的資產負債表和流動性，使我們能夠控制自己的命運，投資於成長，並消除對股東的任何稀釋類型的融資。我認為這一點，正如您所看到的 - 如果我們的結果 - 如果您碰巧讀過它們，我將在一分鐘內強調它們，這是一個重要的方面，特別是在第四季度，其中我們採取了一些積極主動的行動，因為很明顯，市場已經表達了對新成立的公司的渴望，即使是新的年輕公司，在一個非常高的成長和未來的必要市場中，地球必須實現正現金流。

With that, I want to begin by covering some of the highlights from our release with some more color. And then we'll turn it over to Jan Kees, our CFO, to review detailed financials and get to questions.

首先，我想用更多的色彩來介紹我們發布的一些亮點。然後我們會將其交給我們的財務長 Jan Kees，以審查詳細的財務數據並回答問題。

Off the top, our revenue finished in the range that we'd been reaffirming all year, $341.5 million which is up over 130% year over year and 18% quarter over quarter. Within our annual range due to some shifts of revenue at the end of Q4, that will take place in Q1 and in 2024, it's for the lower end of that range. We ended the year, however, with an increased cash position of $146 million and with no debt, which is above our prior guidance of $132 million from Q3 2023 earnings and projections. This is pretty noteworthy as we have kept and funded projects in California for example, the Calistoga project for PG&E, and Texas on our balance sheet.

最重要的是，我們的收入達到了我們全年重申的範圍，即 3.415 億美元，年增 130% 以上，環比增長 18%。在我們的年度範圍內，由於第四季度末收入發生一些變化，這將在第一季和 2024 年發生，這是該範圍的下限。然而，我們在年底的現金部位增加了 1.46 億美元，並且沒有債務，這高於我們先前根據 2023 年第三季收益和預測得出的 1.32 億美元的指引。這是非常值得注意的，因為我們在資產負債表上保留並資助了加州的項目，例如 PG&E 的卡利斯託加項目和德克薩斯州的項目。

So we can participate in these projects in a longer term predictable and less lumpy cash flows and revenue streams from these tolling agreements. Yet we were still able to grow cash quarter over quarter as we began to turn some of our first projects in the second half of the year to substantial completion and final completion.

因此，我們可以以長期可預測的方式參與這些項目，並且從這些收費協議中獲得的現金流和收入流不會那麼不穩定。然而，隨著我們在下半年開始將一些首批專案基本完成並最終完成，我們的現金仍然能夠逐季成長。

Very importantly, we also reduced our quarterly cash operating expense run rate by 25% to 30% through actions taken in Q4 2023. This should enable a 2024 reduced quarterly cash OpEx of a range of $13 million to $15 million. We expect these actions to help us accelerate our shift to cash flow positive as we exit 2024 and for full year 2025 results, which we'll be sharing more about during our announced Investor Day which I'll be talking about shortly.

非常重要的是，我們也透過 2023 年第四季採取的行動將季度現金營運費用運行率降低了 25% 至 30%。這將使 2024 年季度現金營運支出減少 1,300 萬至 1,500 萬美元。我們預計這些行動將幫助我們在2024 年退出時加速向正現金流轉變，並實現2025 年全年業績，我們將在宣布的投​​資者日期間分享更多相關信息，我很快就會談到這一點。

For the year, on gross margin, we delivered a positive gross margin of 5.1% while reflecting a portion of that, a lower than expected Q4 gross margin due only to timing of revenue and associated gross profit recognition that shifted from Q4 into Q1 in 2024 for gravity license and also some battery projects. As I will discuss, gross margins will improve significantly in the first quarter of 2024 benefiting from this shift from Q4, but also due to the mix of revenue with gravity and battery project timing.

今年，就毛利率而言，我們實現了5.1% 的正毛利率，同時反映了其中一部分，即第四季度毛利率低於預期，這只是由於收入的時間安排以及相關的毛利確認從2024 年第四季度轉移到了第一季用於重力許可以及一些電池項目。正如我將討論的，受益於第四季度的這一轉變，以及重力和電池項目時機的收入組合，2024 年第一季的毛利率將顯著提高。

While this did impact Q4 for both revenue and final EBITDA and EPS, this represents only a timing shift, which will be recognized under US GAAP accounting in 2024.

雖然這確實影響了第四季度的收入以及最終 EBITDA 和每股收益，但這只是時間上的轉變，這一轉變將在 2024 年根據美國公認會計原則會計得到承認。

And finally, our commercial pipeline continues to expand with annual year-over-year growth of 24.5 gigawatt hours to a total of 52 gigawatt hours or almost 90% growth. It also expanded sequentially quarter over quarter by 5.8 gigawatt hours, up 13%. This shows continued market growth, continued market activity also with significantly larger projects, two of which we are announcing as new project awards in the US for gravity and a large 2.5 gigawatt hour long duration battery project, representing an additional continental expansion with a large global IPP.

最後，我們的商業管道繼續擴大，每年同比增長 24.5 吉瓦時，達到總計 52 吉瓦時，即增長近 90%。它還環比增長了 5.8 吉瓦時，增長 13%。這表明市場持續成長，市場活動也明顯更大，我們在美國宣布其中兩個項目為重力新項目獎項，以及一個大型 2.5 吉瓦時長持續時間電池項目，代表著在全球範圍內的額外大陸擴張。獨立發電計劃。

While these larger project awards have large impacts in forecasting revenue recognition and can create more lumpy quarters and annual guidance, they are both quite transformational in size, scope, and technology adoption in both first of a kind because of those attributes. As always, we are focused on converting this growing commercial funnel into contracts that further bolster our revenue and backlog. And we remain committed to continue our track record of building profitable growth and unit economics with all new projects we choose to take on.

雖然這些較大的專案獎項對預測收入確認有很大影響，並且可能會產生更多不穩定的季度和年度指導，但由於這些屬性，它們在規模、範圍和技術採用方面都具有相當大的變革性。一如既往，我們致力於將這一不斷增長的商業管道轉化為合同，以進一步增加我們的收入和積壓訂單。我們仍然致力於透過我們選擇承接的所有新項目繼續保持獲利成長和單位經濟效益的記錄。

We want to work on the velocity through our funnel. We post every quarter our four stages of our more near term sales funnel that starts from submitted proposals, goes to shortlisted, goes to awarded projects, and then to final bookings. I encourage you to keep an eye on that. And take a look at our latest investor website with that update with the numbers that I just reviewed.

我們希望提高漏斗的速度。我們每季都會發布近期銷售漏斗的四個階段，從提交的提案開始，進入入圍項目，進入獲獎項目，然後進入最終預訂。我鼓勵你關注這一點。並查看我們最新的投資者網站，其中包含我剛剛查看的數據的更新。

As you all know from our announced and executed project so far, we focus on larger and meaningful projects with strong customers that have a funnel of projects where we are developing deep partnerships over time. I realize for many of you and our investor base, Energy Vault is quite a unique animal relative to any other pure play energy storage company, given our unique portfolio of short, long, and even ultra long duration storage solutions. But I believe this has also enabled us to be one of the most customer-centric energy storage customers, listening to our customers and solving their problems with a broad portfolio of technology, innovation, and solutions that is unmatched in the market.

眾所周知，從我們迄今為止宣布和執行的項目中，我們專注於擁有強大客戶的大型且有意義的項目，這些客戶擁有一系列項目，隨著時間的推移，我們正在這些項目中發展深厚的合作夥伴關係。我意識到，對於你們中的許多人和我們的投資者群體來說，鑑於我們獨特的短期、長期甚至超長期存儲解決方案組合，相對於任何其他純粹的能源存儲公司，Energy Vault 是一種非常獨特的動物。但我相信，這也使我們成為最以客戶為中心的儲能客戶之一，傾聽客戶的聲音，並透過市場上無與倫比的廣泛技術、創新和解決方案組合解決他們的問題。

Looking forward as we are just a few weeks away from our Q1 2024 finish, we expect revenue to be in line with our prior Q1 2023 given normal seasonality of revenue recognition and project starts with potential for upside from items that were expected in Q4 2023. We also expect stronger double-digit gross margins in Q1, again, given the shift of revenue and gross margin recognition from the prior Q4 2023. I think very importantly, as we go to investor priorities, we expect to exit Q1 2024 with an unrestricted cash balance in a range of $125 million to $150 million. Additionally, we've reduced any remaining restricted cash on the balance sheet to less than $1 million and remain 100% debt free.

展望未來，距離2024 年第一季結束僅幾週時間，考慮到收入確認的正常季節性和專案啟動與2023 年第四季預期專案相比，我們預計收入將與先前的2023 年第一季保持一致。鑑於營收和毛利率確認較 2023 年第四季有所變化，我們也預期第一季的毛利率將再次達到兩位數。我認為非常重要的是，當我們考慮投資者優先事項時，我們預計到 2024 年第一季退出時，現金餘額將在 1.25 億美元至 1.5 億美元之間，不受限制。此外，我們已將資產負債表上剩餘的受限現金減少至 100 萬美元以下，並保持 100% 無債務。

Our performance here on cash is attributed to our focus and tight management of our business as our growth and our cash balance at the end of the year shows. And we project to keep cash levels maintained at these levels without the need for debt or any dilutive equity transactions going forward. As we continue to look at owned projects on our balance sheet, providing predictable longer-term revenue streams, we may evaluate project financing alternatives if they're attractive.

我們的現金表現歸功於我們對業務的專注和嚴格管理，正如我們的成長和年底現金餘額所顯示的那樣。我們計劃將現金水準保持在這些水平，而無需債務或任何稀釋性股權交易。當我們繼續關注資產負債表上的自有項目，提供可預測的長期收入流時，我們可能會評估項目融資替代方案是否有吸引力。

This aspect of cash management, managing our operating expense, our culture tied to innovation, and focus on customers is all ingrained in the employees of this company and as demonstrated by the proactive actions we took in Q4 to reduce our quarterly cash OpEx rate by about 30% as we entered into 2024. We took these actions to continue to provide strong balance sheet flexibility for growth while accelerating our move to operating cash flow positive, which we have guided for our finish in Q4 this year and for the full year of 2025.

現金管理、管理我們的營運費用、我們與創新相關的文化以及對客戶的關注都在該公司的員工中根深蒂固，正如我們在第四季度採取的積極行動所證明的那樣，我們將季度現金營運支出率降低了約進入 2024 年時，將成長 30%。我們採取這些行動是為了繼續為成長提供強大的資產負債表靈活性，同時加速實現正營運現金流，這是我們為今年第四季和 2025 年全年的目標所製定的目標。

We understand the nature of the lumpiness in our current business model and are also taking actions to adapt our product mix and business to reduce this volatility over time. We will be sharing much more detail in this regard in May formally at our first Investor Analyst Day on May 8.

我們了解當前業務模式中不穩定的本質，並正在採取行動調整我們的產品組合和業務，以隨著時間的推移減少這種波動性。我們將在 5 月 8 日的首屆投資者分析師日正式分享這方面的更多細節。

While we are discussing forecast, I want to mention two projects that were awarded in Q4 that are both multi gigawatt hour and transformational in technology and territory expansion. We are awarded in Q4 a 2.5 gigawatt hour DC long-duration battery energy storage project by a leading international IPP that also represents a territorial expansion, and we'll be sharing more details on this project at our Investor Day.

當我們討論預測時，我想提一下第四季度授予的兩個項目，它們都是數千兆瓦時的項目，並且在技術和領土擴張方面具有變革性。我們在第四季度獲得了一家國際領先的 IPP 授予的 2.5 吉瓦時直流長時電池儲能項目，這也代表了領土擴張，我們將在投資者日分享有關該項目的更多詳細信息。

We also announced a new development agreement with a large primary public utility in the state of Washington, using our gravity energy storage technology to address another multi gigawatt hour storage need regionally in the Northwest. This is so exciting for us as it represents the first public utility in the US with an agreement of this size and scope for gravity, which complements the previously announced gravity collaboration project with Enel Green Power in Snyder, Texas, which is now up and out of the ground.

我們也宣布與華盛頓州的一家大型主要公用事業公司達成一項新的開發協議，利用我們的重力儲能技術來滿足西北地區另一個多吉瓦時的儲存需求。這對我們來說非常令人興奮，因為它代表了美國第一個與這種規模和範圍的重力協議達成的公共事業，這補充了先前宣布的與德克薩斯州斯奈德的Enel Green Power 的重力合作項目，該項目現已啟動並退出地面的。

Most of you are aware that demand for long-duration storage remains more nascent at this stage, although Energy Vault continues to solidify its global leadership role here with various gravity and green hydrogen ultra-long duration solutions and multi-day storage solutions that are now starting deployment in large scale across three of the largest energy storage markets in the world, in the US, China, and Africa.

大多數人都知道，現階段對長期儲存的需求仍處於萌芽階段，儘管 Energy Vault 透過各種重力和綠色氫超長持續時間解決方案以及多日儲存解決方案繼續鞏固其全球領導地位。開始在美國、中國和非洲這三個全球最大的儲能市場進行大規模部署。

Specific to our gravity business, important to highlight our territory expansion to Southern Africa, as I just mentioned, across the 16-member SADC member countries via a new license and royalty agreement that was executed in Q4. In China, in Rudong, we achieved state grid interconnection as planned in December of Q4 2023 for the first 25 megawatt EVx gravity storage system and achieved inverse power operation.

具體到我們的重力業務，重要的是要強調我們透過第四季度執行的新許可和特許權使用費協議將領土擴展到南部非洲，跨越 16 個 SADC 成員國。在中國，如東，我們首個25兆瓦EVx重力儲存系統按計畫於2023年第四季實現國家電網聯網，並實現逆功率運作。

Also in China, there are now three additional gravity energy storage systems of 360 megawatt hour, bringing the total projects underway and announced to over 3.7 gigawatt hours. China continues to be an amazing bed of growth and growth and focus as state mandated for not only renewable generation projects, but also for the state mandated energy storage. We continue to be very excited about the work with China Tianying and their active development and expansion in the market locally.

同樣在中國，目前已新增三個重力儲能係統，容量為360兆瓦時，使正在進行和宣布的項目總數超過3.7兆瓦時。中國仍然是一個驚人的成長和成長的基地，因為國家不僅要求再生能源發電項目，而且還要求國家強制儲能。我們對與中國天鷹的合作以及他們在當地市場的積極發展和擴張仍然感到非常興奮。

As also noted above, we have our first USA-based gravity project with a public utility with the announcement of the new development agreement in Washington. And an application of our technology that's being uniquely applied to take advantage of existing topology to maximize efficiency at a reduced CapEx and thus providing strong economics without the need for any subsidies. We'll be very excited to share more on this project, given its scale, size, and application of a new technology.

如上所述，我們在華盛頓宣布了新的開發協議，這是我們在美國的第一個公共事業重力計畫。我們的技術的獨特應用是利用現有的拓撲結構，以減少資本支出的方式最大限度地提高效率，從而提供強大的經濟效益，而無需任何補貼。考慮到該項目的規模、大小和新技術的應用，我們將非常高興分享有關該項目的更多資訊。

Moving from gravity to our battery businesses, we delivered and progressed final commissioning on our first three battery energy storage systems totalling almost 1 gigawatt hour. Specifically with Wellhead Electric, as previously announced and Nevada Energy, 440-megawatt hour were commissioned on schedule and in record time frames from site mobilization to system energization. Also, the project with Jupiter Power is expected to be fully commissioned in the coming weeks here prior to the first quarter close.

從重力轉向我們的電池業務，我們交付並推進了前三個電池儲能係統的最終調試，總容量近 1 吉瓦時。特別是像之前宣布的那樣，Wellhead Electric 和 Nevada Energy 已按計劃在創紀錄的時間內調試了 440 兆瓦時的發電量，從現場動員到系統通電。此外，Jupiter Power 的專案預計將在第一季結束前的未來幾週內全面投入使用。

Regarding our green hydrogen, microgrid, and ultra long storage duration, we commenced construction on the largest green hydrogen project and microgrid system in the US with California's largest public utility, Pacific Gas and Electric. The project is supported by a 10.5-year tolling agreement with commercial operation expected in mid-2024. This solidifies Energy Vault's global leadership role in green hydrogen technology for long-duration energy storage and specific microgrids for multi-day storage.

在綠氫、微電網、超長儲存方面，我們與加州最大的公用事業公司太平洋天然氣電力公司啟動了美國最大的綠氫計畫和微電網系統建設。該計畫獲得為期 10.5 年的收費協議的支持，預計將於 2024 年中期投入商業運營。這鞏固了 Energy Vault 在用於長期儲能的綠色氫技術和用於多日儲存的特定微電網方面的全球領導地位。

It's important to note here that while owning this project on our balance sheet will impact near-term revenue recognition in favor of long-term and predictable revenue streams, from the tolling agreement, we believe this will also result in more predictable and less lumpy revenue streams with increased margins over time, which we believe is best for Energy Vault and our investors as we scale our business.

這裡要注意的是，雖然在我們的資產負債表上擁有這個項目將影響近期收入確認，有利於長期和可預測的收入流，但我們相信這也將帶來更可預測和更少的不穩定收入隨著時間的推移，利潤率會不斷增加，我們認為，隨著我們擴大業務，這對 Energy Vault 和我們的投資者來說是最好的。

Very excited to share progress now as we ramped up new systems with our new software platform and energy management system, our proprietary VaultOS energy management software, showing its innovation right out of the gate, enabling efficient commissioning of our first projects that were turned over in the second half of 2023 and will begin contributing SaaS-based recurring revenues in 2024.

非常高興現在能夠分享進展，因為我們使用新的軟體平台和能源管理系統（我們專有的VaultOS 能源管理軟體）開發了新系統，一開始就展示了其創新，使我們在2019 年移交的第一個專案能夠高效調試。2023 年下半年，並將於 2024 年開始貢獻基於 SaaS 的經常性收入。

Albeit small at the start, and will always be a smaller percentage of the overall portfolio, but critical high-margin part of the portfolio and our product mix, the software portfolio continues to introduce new capabilities, which now includes two additional products that we will be reviewing in more detail at the upcoming Investor Day.

儘管一開始規模很小，而且在整個產品組合中所佔的比例始終較小，但它是產品組合和我們的產品組合中關鍵的高利潤部分，軟體產品組合不斷引入新功能，其中現在包括我們將我們將在即將到來的投資者日進行更詳細的審查。

One being Vault-Manager for maximizing project, return on investments via optimizing asset performance, using enhanced performance analytics and predictive models to provide greater system reliability and visibility. And secondly, Vault-Bidder, to provide competitive dispatch, continuous revenue optimization via market participation, serving the ISO and IPP markets as well as for our own projects that we manage and operate.

其中之一是 Vault-Manager，透過優化資產效能、使用增強的效能分析和預測模型來提供更高的系統可靠性和可見性，從而最大化專案和投資回報。其次，Vault-Bidder，透過市場參與提供有競爭力的調度和持續收入最佳化，服務於 ISO 和 IPP 市場以及我們自己管理和營運的專案。

Finally, I'd be remiss if I was not recognizing a great year around our project execution. This was an important proven year for us to execute on over 1.7 gigawatt hour of projects announced in our first year of revenue and as a public company in 2022 in which we demonstrated that we can deliver on our promises and complete world-class energy storage facilities on time, on budget, and at performance levels at or above expectations of our very challenging customers.

最後，如果我沒有認識到我們專案執行的美好一年，那就是我的失職。對我們來說，這是經過驗證的重要一年，我們在第一年的收入中宣布了超過1.7 吉瓦時的項目，並且作為一家上市公司，我們在2022 年證明了我們可以兌現我們的承諾並完成世界一流的能源儲存設施按時、按預算、按性能水平達到或高於我們極具挑戰性的客戶的期望。

Although there are many to mention, one example, we built, commissioned, and energized the 440-megawatt hour system in Nevada Energy's Reid Gardner site about an hour outside of Las Vegas within four months of site mobilization, energizing the system on December 29 in order to meet the customers' requirement to be online prior to year-end. I spent some time at the site with our team on site that was working with the local contractors with some of our partners and the tremendous work they did to do something that as far as we know, has never been done before at this size, at this scale, and within this time frame.

儘管有許多值得一提的例子，但我們在現場動員的四個月內，在內華達能源公司的里德加德納工廠（距拉斯維加斯約一小時車程）建造、調試了440 兆瓦時系統並為其通電，並於12 月29 日為該系統通電。以滿足客戶年底前上線的要求。我和我們的團隊在現場花了一些時間，他們正在與當地承包商和我們的一些合作夥伴合作，他們所做的大量工作據我們所知，以前從未以這種規模、在這個規模，這個時間範圍內。

These are the things that go unseen and unheard about these unprecedented turnaround times in project delivery and energization are the nights, weekends, holiday times dedicated by our Energy Vault team to move heaven and earth to deliver for the customer. I want to recognize all of our employees that make this happen every day for our customers as our first projects demonstrated, none of which were without supply chain and supplier delivery issues that needed to be managed, solved, anticipated, and resolved.

在專案交付和通電方面，這些史無前例的周轉時間中，我們的 Energy Vault 團隊竭盡全力為客戶提供服務，在夜間、週末和假日期間，這些都是看不見和聞所未聞的事情。我想表彰我們所有的員工，他們每天為我們的客戶實現這一目標，正如我們的第一個項目所展示的那樣，沒有一個項目沒有需要管理、解決、預測和解決的供應鏈和供應商交付問題。

Just to our employees, I'm happy to be on this call today to stand upon your shoulders on this quarterly report to talk about these results. I do not take it lightly, as you know. It is a pleasure to be here and support you in what you're doing every day. These customer satisfaction areas and testimonials are proving to be some of our best sales tools as we are well-positioned now for the next level of success, both within these customers that we've executed for as well as new customers that observe our performance.

對於我們的員工來說，我很高興今天參加這次電話會議，站在你們的肩膀上討論這份季度報告。如你所知，我不會掉以輕心。很高興來到這裡並為您每天所做的事情提供支持。事實證明，這些客戶滿意度領域和推薦是我們最好的銷售工具，因為我們現在已經為下一階段的成功做好了充分準備，無論是在我們已經服務的這些客戶中，還是在觀察我們績效的新客戶中。

We look forward to providing more detail on our Investor Day and Analyst Day that is scheduled for May 8, 2024, in New York City. We've received a lot of feedback from the investor base about getting in front of you in more detail about our strategy, about the evolution of our portfolio, and also about a view into where we're going as a company in achieving the vision that we set out at the beginning.

我們期待在定於 2024 年 5 月 8 日在紐約市舉行的投資者日和分析師日提供更多詳細資訊。我們收到了來自投資者的大量反饋，希望能夠更詳細地向您介紹我們的策略、投資組合的演變以及我們作為一家公司將如何實現願景我們一開始就設定了這一點。

The events can include new product and customer announcements, portfolio updates, and financial guidance. It will include customers and partners that will be speaking -- customers and partners that have experience with us in delivery, but also new technology and new partners that we're working with and expanding our growth across the globe.

這些活動可以包括新產品和客戶公告、產品組合更新和財務指導。其中包括將要發言的客戶和合作夥伴——在交付方面擁有與我們合作經驗的客戶和合作夥伴，也包括我們正在合作並在全球擴大成長的新技術和新合作夥伴。

I look forward to seeing any of you that can attend at that session.

我期待見到能夠參加該會議的任何人。

I'd like to now turn it over to Jan Kees, who will share some financial details for the quarter. Jan Kees?

我現在想將其交給 Jan Kees，他將分享本季的一些財務細節。簡基斯？

Yes. Thank you, Rob. Good afternoon, everybody.

是的。謝謝你，羅布。大家下午好。

Let's talk about revenue. Financial results are highlighted by our full-year 2023 revenue of more than $340 million, 134% higher than in 2022. This revenue reflects the successful execution across our project portfolio in the United States under a build, commission, and transfer model.

我們來談談收入。財務表現的亮點是我們 2023 年全年營收超過 3.4 億美元，比 2022 年成長 134%。這項收入反映了我們在美國的專案組合在建造、委託和轉讓模式下的成功執行。

Next, going into gross margin. Our gross margin was 5.1% for the full year of 2023, temporarily impacted by the unfavorable timing of a few items. First, we delivered a significant amount of hardware in the second half of the year that didn't have any margin associated with it due to the PoC accounting rules under GAAP. The value-add margin on that hardware will be recognized in the first half of 2024. And second, a high-margin licensing transaction shifted out from the fourth quarter of 2023 to 2024.

接下來，進入毛利率。2023 年全年毛利率為 5.1%，暫時受到一些專案不利時機的影響。首先，我們在下半年交付了大量硬件，但由於 GAAP 下的 PoC 會計規則，這些硬體沒有任何相關利潤。該硬體的增值利潤將於 2024 年上半年確認。其次，高利潤的授權交易從 2023 年第四季轉移到了 2024 年。

Adjusted EBITDA. During 2023, our net loss amounted to $98.4 million, reflecting the points I previously mentioned. And for the quarter, net loss amounted to $22.2 million for the year ending December 31, 2023. Our adjusted EBITDA was negative $62.1 million. And for the fourth quarter, adjusted EBITDA declined $3.6 million year over year to negative $14.8 million, reflecting a shift in timing of both battery and gravity revenue and gross profit from Q4 2023 to Q1 2024.

調整後的 EBITDA。2023 年，我們的淨虧損達到 9,840 萬美元，反映了我之前提到的幾點。截至 2023 年 12 月 31 日止的本季淨虧損達 2,220 萬美元。我們調整後的 EBITDA 為負 6210 萬美元。第四季度，調整後 EBITDA 年減 360 萬美元，至負 1,480 萬美元，反映出電池和重力收入以及毛利的時間安排從 2023 年第四季度轉向 2024 年第一季。

The key non-cash items added back in the fourth quarter were $8.6 million of stock-based compensation expense and $2 million in net interest income. We do remain laser-focused on optimizing our cost structure to realize profitability as soon as possible as the business continues to scale up, and we remain very encouraged with our progress towards positive adjusted EBITDA.

第四季增加的主要非現金項目是 860 萬美元的股票補償費用和 200 萬美元的淨利息收入。我們仍然專注於優化成本結構，以便隨著業務的不斷擴大盡快實現盈利，並且我們對正調整 EBITDA 的進展感到非常鼓舞。

Cash. As of December 31, 2023, we had $145.6 million in cash, cash equivalents, and restricted cash, leaving us well-positioned to continue our growth strategy and execute on our projects. Our primary uses of cash are cash operating expenses and working capital needs associated with equipment purchases for our energy storage projects. As the projects achieve milestones and ultimately begin to generate revenue and gross margin, some of that cash will return to our balance sheet.

現金。截至 2023 年 12 月 31 日，我們擁有 1.456 億美元的現金、現金等價物和限制性現金，這使我們有能力繼續我們的成長策略並執行我們的專案。我們的現金主要用途是現金營運支出和與儲能專案設備採購相關的營運資金需求。隨著專案實現里程碑並最終開始產生收入和毛利率，其中一些現金將返回我們的資產負債表。

In addition to this strong cash position, as of today, we have reduced the restricted portion of our cash significantly from $35.6 million to -- that we had at the end of December 2023. Restricted cash is now down to less than $1 million as of today. Please keep in mind that we maintain a bonding capacity in excess of USD1 billion to facilitate additional growth projects as we desire.

除了強大的現金狀況外，截至今天，我們已將現金的限制部分從 3560 萬美元大幅減少到 2023 年 12 月底的水平。截至目前，現金限制已降至 100 萬美元以下。請記住，我們保持著超過 10 億美元的擔保能力，以促進我們希望的更多成長項目。

Thank you. And with that, I'll hand the call back to Rob.

謝謝。然後，我會將電話轉回給 Rob。

Great. Thank you, Jan Kees.

偉大的。謝謝你，簡·基斯。

Look, in closing here, before getting to questions, I want to first thank again all of our employees that in only our second year as a public company delivered with quality, with velocity, and profitability across all of our projects, model behaviors define our culture and customer focus, innovation, delivery, all underscored by our core values in humility, collaboration, problem-solving, and leading as an organization to deliver a more sustainable world for our future.

聽著，最後，在回答問題之前，我想首先再次感謝我們所有的員工，在我們作為上市公司的第二年裡，我們所有的項目都以質量、速度和盈利能力交付，模型行為定義了我們文化和以客戶為中心、創新、交付，所有這些都由我們的核心價值所強調，即謙遜、協作、解決問題以及作為一個組織領導為我們的未來創造一個更永續的世界。

A few critical milestones upcoming this year. Full operation of multiple gravity energy storage systems in China, which will generate future royalty streams and help China curtail its current increasing greenhouse gas emissions, which are larger than the next six to seven countries combined. Delivering commissioning of the first and largest green hydrogen energy storage system in California, to serve as a critical replacement of diesel generation for the residents of Calistoga, California sustainably.

今年即將到來的一些重要里程碑。中國多個重力儲能係統的全面運行，將產生未來的特許權使用費，並幫助中國減少目前不斷增加的溫室氣體排放量，該排放量比接下來的六到七個國家的總和還要多。交付加州第一個也是最大的綠色氫能儲存系統的調試，以可持續地為加州卡利斯託加的居民提供柴油發電的關鍵替代品。

And then territory expansions for our entire storage portfolio from Southern Africa to new starts in Europe, Australia, and the Middle East. A few things to keep an eye on there, priorities this year. We'll begin updates on all those areas at our upcoming Investor Day. And then financially, very clear as you've heard as a theme on this call, setting ourselves up in 2024 as a profitable growth platform while achieving cash flow positive as we exit and for full year 2025.

然後我們整個儲存產品組合的領土擴張，從南部非洲到歐洲、澳洲和中東的新起點。今年需要關注的一些事情是優先事項。我們將在即將到來的投資者日開始更新所有這些領域的資訊。然後在財務方面，正如您在本次電話會議上聽到的主題一樣，非常明確，我們將在2024 年將自己打造為一個盈利增長平台，同時在我們退出時和2025 年全年實現正現金流。

As you have seen in our results and forecast, we have a strong balance sheet with no debt, strong OpEx management in place, and thus the flexibility to continue to invest in growth. This is enabling us to invest and own projects with longer term and more predictable and higher-margin cash flows as the case in Calistoga, for example, with PG&E with a long-term tolling agreement.

正如您在我們的業績和預測中看到的那樣，我們擁有強大的資產負債表，沒有債務，擁有強大的營運支出管理，因此可以靈活地繼續投資於成長。這使我們能夠投資和擁有具有更長期、更可預測和更高利潤現金流的項目，例如卡利斯託加的項目，與 PG&E 簽訂了長期收費協議。

While this business model will result in less recognized revenue in the near term on projects that we would otherwise build commission and transfer under an EPC model, as previously discussed, we believe this can be in the best long-term interest of our shareholders and thus Energy Vault, while helping to buffer the quarterly impact of larger projects that are being awarded on a global basis.

雖然這種業務模式將導致我們在 EPC 模式下建立佣金和轉讓的項目在短期內的確認收入減少，如前所述，但我們相信這符合我們股東的最佳長期利益，因此Energy Vault，同時有助於緩衝全球範圍內授予的大型專案的季度影響。

We look forward to seeing many of you that could join us in New York at our Investor and Analyst Day on May 8. We will be speaking again on May 7 at our Q1's earnings announcement. We have a lot of new and exciting developments to share that will help provide context on the next 12 months to 24 months given the magnitude of the project awards we've announced here today as well as our ongoing growth of the business.

我們期待在 5 月 8 日在紐約舉行的投資者和分析師日見到你們中的許多人。我們將於 5 月 7 日在第一季財報公告中再次發表演說。考慮到我們今天在這裡宣布的專案獎項的規模以及我們業務的持續成長，我們有許多令人興奮的新進展要分享，這些進展將有助於為未來 12 個月到 24 個月提供背景資訊。

With that, operator, we're now ready for questions.

接線員，我們現在準備好回答問題了。

(Operator Instructions) Justin Clare, Roth MKM.

（操作員說明）Justin Clare，Roth MKM。

Yeah. Hi. Thanks for taking my questions here. So I guess, first off, I just wanted to see if you could talk a little bit more about the revenue that had shifted from Q4 into Q1. If you can provide a little bit of more detail on what led to the shift. It sounds like the projects just moved out slightly here. And then maybe if you could just speak to how much additional battery revenue and then royalty or licensing revenue shifted. And then is that all going to be in Q1 or mix of Q1 and Q2?

是的。你好。感謝您在這裡提出我的問題。所以我想，首先，我只是想看看你是否可以多談談從第四季轉移到第一季的收入。如果您能提供更多有關導致這種轉變的原因的詳細資訊。聽起來這些項目剛剛稍微移出了這裡。然後也許您可以談談額外的電池收入以及特許權使用費或許可收入發生了多少變化。那麼這一切都會出現在 Q1 還是 Q1 和 Q2 的混合中？

Sure. Hey, Justin. Good to hear you. Yeah, we had a combination of, as Jan Kees mentioned, there was the hardware deliveries we took that led to the implementations and towards substantial completion and in some cases, final completion of some of the battery projects, there's a portion of that that has double-digit margins that just due to PoC accounting is shifting into Q1, okay?

當然。嘿，賈斯汀。很高興聽到你的聲音。是的，正如 Jan Kees 所提到的，我們有一個組合，我們交付的硬體導致了實施和實質完成，在某些情況下，最終完成了一些電池項目，其中一部分已經完成兩位數的利潤率只是由於PoC 會計正在轉移到第一季度，好嗎？

The other thing, as you know, we announced a new gravity energy storage license agreement. And that also shifted in revenue recognition that will be shifting into 2024. Our expectation is that some of that will be recognized in Q1 and then throughout 2024 as we progress. So those were the two, I think, main items that are just timing related. Even on, I think, the gravity portion alone, had we recognized that, we would have exceeded the adjusted EBITDA EPS numbers as well. But that's the color I'd say on those -- on the two areas that have shifted.

另一件事，如你所知，我們宣布了一項新的重力儲能許可協議。收入確認也發生了變化，這種變化將持續到 2024 年。我們的期望是，隨著我們的進展，其中一些將在第一季得到認可，然後在 2024 年全年得到認可。我認為這就是與時間相關的兩個主要項目。我認為，即使只考慮重力部分，如果我們認識到這一點，我們也將超過調整後的 EBITDA EPS 數字。但這就是我要說的顏色——在已經改變的兩個區域上。

And in terms of the amount that shifted, I can share with you that it's a double-digit million amount at this point. And as I said in the comments, we'll be providing clarity around both 2024 and into 2025 with the updated information that we're going to have regarding our -- some of these larger project awards and as well as our Investor Day in the context of some of the new product announcements that I referenced on the release here.

就轉移的金額而言，我可以與您分享的是，目前的金額已達到數百萬美元。正如我在評論中所說，我們將在 2024 年和 2025 年期間提供有關我們的一些較大項目獎項以及我們的投資者日的最新信息。我在此處的發布中引用了一些新產品公告的背景。

Got it. Okay. Okay. I appreciate that. And then I was wondering if you could maybe just speak to the visibility that you have into battery projects for 2024 beyond. After you complete the NV Energy project, the Jupiter Project, those are fully operational. Just what's next in the pipeline? And then are there key projects that need to reach NTP before you could see awards get converted into the backlog and then you can start moving forward on projects?

知道了。好的。好的。我很感激。然後我想知道您是否可以談談您對 2024 年以後電池項目的了解。完成內華達能源專案、木星專案後，這些專案就完全投入運作了。下一步是什麼？然後，是否有一些關鍵項目需要先達到 NTP，然後才能看到獎項轉化為待辦事項，然後才能開始推進專案？

Sure. Great question. We have a few projects between awards and bookings that are -- essentially have notice-to-proceed dates, some of which are known and in other cases, are being finalized. Some of this has to do with some of the supply chain timelines that are not for our scope, but around things like transformers, for example, in the market, which I know as you're probably aware, have some longer lead times, breakers is another item.

當然。很好的問題。我們有一些處於授予和預訂之間的項目——基本上都有開始通知的日期，其中一些是已知的，而在其他情況下，正在最終確定。其中一些與一些供應鏈時間表有關，這些時間表不屬於我們的範圍，而是圍繞諸如變壓器之類的東西，例如，在市場上，我知道你可能知道，有一些更長的交貨時間，斷路器是另一項。

We also have a set of projects that we can choose to own on our balance sheet that have attractive double-digit IRRs. And so we're working on some of those relative to what I mentioned about potentially continuing to own, not necessarily all but part of those projects that has an impact on rev rec as well. So as you can see from the growth in the funnel itself, we have a lot of those sitting in that awarded category where we're finalizing the actual starts and therefore, will be critical to the 2024 rev rec number.

我們還有一系列可以選擇在資產負債表上擁有的項目，這些項目具有有吸引力的兩位數內部收益率。因此，我們正在研究其中一些與我提到的可能繼續擁有的項目相關的項目，這些項目不一定是所有項目，而是部分項目，這些項目也會對轉速記錄產生影響。因此，正如您從漏斗本身的成長中看到的那樣，我們有很多屬於獲獎類別，我們正在最終確定實際的啟動，因此，這對於 2024 年的轉速記錄數至關重要。

So we're -- we'll be in a better position to give an update on that at our Investor Day just after our Q1 earnings on May 8.

因此，我們將能夠在 5 月 8 日第一季財報發布後的投資者日上更好地提供最新情況。

Got it. Okay. And then just one more on your gravity solution. I was wondering what's the latest on the Rudong project? Is that expected to be fully operational and in use in the near term here? And then any sense for the timing on when you could provide performance metrics? Would that likely be at the Analyst Day? Could we see something sooner? And then any sense for what might be shared at that time?

知道了。好的。然後再談你的重力解決方案。我想知道如東計畫的最新進展如何？預計該系統會在短期內全面投入使用嗎？那麼什麼時候可以提供效能指標有什麼意義呢？那可能是在分析師日嗎？我們能早點看到一些東西嗎？那麼當時可能分享的內容有什麼意義嗎？

Sure. Yeah. We -- as I mentioned, we were state grid interconnected in December, and they are actively commissioning that system, especially now as things are warming up there in Rudong. Our CTO was just at the site 2.5 weeks ago, and we're expecting per their guidance to have in the second half of this month.

當然。是的。正如我所提到的，我們在 12 月實現了國家電網的互聯，他們正在積極調試該系統，特別是現在，隨著如東的情況正在升溫。我們的首席技術長 2.5 週前剛到達現場，我們預計根據他們的指導，將在本月下半月到達現場。

So in the coming weeks, some initial performance data. By the time we get to our Investor Day, we should have a good set of metrics for you on performance data of that system as well as, I think, as we announced before, there's a second system that's up out of the ground.

因此，在接下來的幾週內，我們將提供一些初步的性能數據。當我們到達投資者日時，我們應該為您提供一套關於該系統性能數據的良好指標，並且我認為，正如我們之前宣布的那樣，還有第二個系統已經拔地而起。

We don't expect anything on that system because it will be nearing its completion toward the second half of 2024 and into the first quarter of 2025. So I would expect more significant updates, potentially even some videos of all the operations of that system by the Investor Day. But as we get performance data, more than likely, we will be doing probably some announcement dependent on the robustness of the data and some of the time frames on having accurate data in terms of the actual operation of the systems and the slices.

我們對該系統沒有任何期望，因為它將在 2024 年下半年和 2025 年第一季接近完成。因此，我預計會有更多重大更新，甚至可能會在投資者日之前發布該系統所有操作的一些影片。但是，當我們獲得性能數據時，我們很可能會根據數據的穩健性以及在系統和切片的實際操作方面擁有準確數據的一些時間範圍來發布一些公告。

Okay. Got it. Thank you.

好的。知道了。謝謝。

All right. Thanks, Justin.

好的。謝謝，賈斯汀。

Joseph Osha, Guggenheim Partners.

約瑟夫‧奧沙，古根漢合夥人。

Yeah, hey, everybody. Thanks for the detail. Yeah. Just to follow up a little bit on Justin's question. I believe I heard during your prepared comments, Rob, that you said full operation of these other systems following on Rudong this year or did I mishear that? I just wanted to make sure I understand what the expectations are for these other systems that are breaking ground.

是的，嘿，大家。謝謝你的詳細資料。是的。只是為了跟進賈斯汀的問題。羅布，我相信我在您準備好的評論中聽說您說今年如東將全面運行這些其他系統，還是我聽錯了？我只是想確保我了解這些正在破土動工的其他系統的期望是什麼。

Well, we have, as I mentioned, one system that's up out of the ground. I think we actually put that in our announcement. We did an update announcement during the quarter. That's up about five floors right now and Rudong remains the focus in terms of getting full operational performance data as they have the state grid interconnection. They're going through Joe, the homologation process. They're now -- they've demonstrated inverse operations. These are all local announcements they've made publicly. They're a public company, China Tianying there.

嗯，正如我所提到的，我們有一個從地面上拔出來的系統。我認為我們實際上已將其納入我們的公告中。我們在本季發布了更新公告。目前已上升約五層樓，而如東仍是取得完整營運績效數據的焦點，因為它們擁有國家電網互連。他們正在經歷喬的認證過程。他們現在——他們已經示範了逆運算。這些都是他們在當地公開發布的公告。他們是一家上市公司，就是中國天鷹。

So what I would expect is what I just outlined to Justin, is initial performance data coming out in the coming weeks and months that, again, as we get things third-party validated, we will be sharing that. And then on the other projects that we've announced, one's up and out of the ground and there's two others that have broken ground. The one that's up out of the ground, they might be able to get started on commissioning in Q4. The others will be 2025 in terms of operation commissioning as well of those systems.

因此，我期望的是我剛剛向賈斯汀概述的內容，即在未來幾週和幾個月內發布的初始性能數據，同樣，當我們獲得第三方驗證時，我們將分享這些數據。然後，在我們宣布的其他項目中，一個項目已經破土動工，另外兩個項目已經破土動工。他們可能會在第四季開始調試。其他系統的運作調試時間為 2025 年。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

Yes.

是的。

The next question, we haven't heard much about Snyder, Texas for a while. I'm wondering what the story is there.

下一個問題，我們已經有一段時間沒有聽說太多關於德克薩斯州斯奈德的消息了。我很好奇那裡有什麼故事。

Yeah. Our collaboration with Enel remains, and we're up out of the ground in Snyder. So we'll get -- I imagine we can get pictures of the site and where we are there. We actually have a key customer, an international customer that's there at the site with the team as well.

是的。我們與 Enel 的合作仍然存在，而且我們在斯奈德已經取得了進展。所以我們會得到——我想我們可以獲得該地點和我們所在位置的照片。實際上，我們有一個重要客戶，一個國際客戶，他也和我們的團隊一起在現場。

The other thing Joe, I'll share with you, we haven't announced this publicly yet, but we are, and in the interest of Enel, utilizing that site to also demonstrate other applications of our gravity technology. So Joe, we're going to be sharing more about that at our Investor Day. But there's no change in the collaboration agreement we have with Enel and enforcing what we're sharing with them on our progress in building up that site. What I'll anticipate to you, as I just mentioned, is we're going to be sharing what we're doing within other applications of gravity technology at that site and in line with our discussions with Enel.

喬，我將與您分享的另一件事是，我們尚未公開宣布這一點，但為了 Enel 的利益，我們正在利用該網站來展示我們重力技術的其他應用。所以喬，我們將在投資者日分享更多相關內容。但我們與 Enel 簽訂的合作協議並沒有改變，也沒有改變我們與他們分享的關於我們建造該網站的進展。正如我剛才提到的，我對您的期望是，我們將在該站點分享我們在重力技術的其他應用中所做的事情，並與我們與 Enel 的討論保持一致。

Okay. So I guess just to -- because this is a site that is going to be easier for some of us to get to any sense as to when we might be able to roll up on that site and see it work.

好的。所以我想只是因為這個網站對於我們中的一些人來說會更容易了解我們何時能夠在該網站上滾動並看到它的工作。

Sure. I would say Q3 would be a good time to get to the site, and we might have some surprises for you there when you come.

當然。我想說第三季度是訪問該網站的好時機，當您來時我們可能會為您帶來一些驚喜。

Okay. And then my last question, and I'm trying to keep track of all this stuff, I apologize. You made reference on your Q2 call and your Q2 press release to a project award with a major Southeast Asian sustainable energy company for two energy storage products totalling 500 megawatts to be booked in the second half of '23, blah, blah, blah. I'm trying to understand whether that is in your -- because that's a good chunk of business, right, whether that's showing up in your 2024 backlog.

好的。然後是我的最後一個問題，我正在努力追蹤所有這些內容，我很抱歉。您在第二季度的電話會議和第二季度的新聞稿中提到了與一家大型東南亞可持續能源公司簽訂的項目合同，該項目涉及兩種總計500 兆瓦的儲能產品，將於23 年下半年預訂，等等，等等。我試圖了解這是否在您的業務中——因為這是很大一部分業務，對吧，無論它是否出現在您 2024 年的積壓工作中。

Yeah. That project is still in our awarded column. So it's not in a booking column. It's in our awarded because that project is just awaiting final development, and there's a local study that was done on that continent in that country for that project. So it still remains in our funnel. It remains in the awarded category. And we're looking at trying to convert that within 2024. That may be a project also, maybe one of the ones that we might look to help develop in line with some other comments Joe, I've made about us looking at maintaining some equity ownership in some of the projects as they get developed through these tolling agreements.

是的。該項目仍在我們的獲獎專欄中。所以它不在預訂欄中。我們之所以授予它，是因為該專案正在等待最終開發，並且在該國家/地區的該大陸上對該專案進行了一項本地研究。所以它仍然保留在我們的漏斗中。它仍然屬於獲獎類別。我們正在考慮在 2024 年內嘗試實現這一目標。這也可能是一個項目，也許是我們可能希望根據其他一些評論來幫助開發的項目之一，喬，我已經說過，我們正在考慮在某些項目通過這些項目開發時保持一些股權。收費協議。

But there's active work going on in the project, the studies that have to be done. It's a country where the grid operates a little bit differently as some special requirements and studies that have to be performed. And those studies are underway, funded, and ongoing.

但該項目正在進行積極的工作，必須進行研究。在這個國家，電網的運作方式略有不同，因為需要執行一些特殊要求和研究。這些研究正在進行中、資助並且正在進行中。

Okay. And then finally, my last, last, last, last question. I do apologize. I'm trying to understand in a little bit more detail what your role is on this PG&E project. I assume they're not your electrolyzers. Are you integrating using Plug's electrolyzers? Are they your batteries or UDPC? I'm just trying to understand a little bit more what your role is in this project.

好的。最後，我的最後一個、最後一個、最後一個、最後一個問題。我很抱歉。我試圖更詳細地了解您在這個 PG&E 專案中的角色。我認為它們不是你的電解槽。您是否使用 Plug 的電解槽進行整合？他們是你的電池還是UDPC？我只是想更多地了解您在這個專案中的角色。

Sure. I'll explain it. It's -- essentially, we designed this microgrid and the energy storage system with a combination of a hydrogen fuel tank. So to be clear, we aren't making the green hydrogen. We're procuring it. We designed and sized a hydrogen fuel tank. We announced this. We worked with Chart on that. We also, as part of the design, worked with Plug on their fuel cells, so not the electrolyzers but with the fuel cells themselves.

當然。我會解釋一下。本質上，我們設計了這個微電網和結合氫燃料箱的儲能係統。要先明確的是，我們並不是生產綠氫。我們正在採購它。我們設計了氫燃料箱並確定了其尺寸。我們宣布了這一點。我們與 Chart 就此事進行了合作。作為設計的一部分，我們也與 Plug 合作開發他們的燃料電池，因此不是電解槽，而是燃料電池本身。

So we architected the number of fuel cells combining with that with the hydrogen tank. We also architected in one of our B-VAULTs. So to address the grid forming and black start capabilities that PG&E wanted. So we architected and designed this entire system, brought some pieces to the table, and then have our energy management systems that's orchestrating the -- essentially the discharge and charging, charging in terms of the small amount. There's a single container of our B-VAULT with lithium-ion, combined with the green hydrogen and the fuel cell aspect.

因此，我們設計了燃料電池的數量與氫氣罐的數量相結合。我們還在我們的 B-VAULT 之一中進行了設計。因此，要解決 PG&E 想要的電網形成和黑啟動功能。因此，我們建造和設計了整個系統，將一些部分放在桌面上，然後讓我們的能源管理系統負責編排——本質上是放電和充電，以及少量的充電。我們的 B-VAULT 有一個單一容器，裡面裝有鋰離子電池，並結合了綠氫和燃料電池。

And that is the project that we're building. We are the owner and the EPC. So there's a separate company, we own it, and we have a 10.5-year tolling agreement with Pacific -- with PG&E.

這就是我們正在建造的項目。我們是業主和EPC。因此，我們擁有一家獨立的公司，我們與 Pacific 以及 PG&E 簽訂了 10.5 年的收費協議。

Okay. Thank you. I --

好的。謝謝。我--

So our role is -- also the role of asset. So we're managing the asset as well. Is that clear?

所以我們的角色是──也是資產的角色。所以我們也在管理資產。明白了嗎？

I just heard you say that's a black start capabilities facility. I assume that's part of -- why that's part of the attraction of this to PG&E. Yeah.

我剛剛聽到你說那是一個黑啟動功能設施。我認為這就是這對 PG&E 的吸引力的一部分。是的。

Yeah, for black start. Yes. Well, black start is a portion required as this is a microgrid backup system. So to be clear, the use case here is something that's not going to be discharged frequently, probably four to five times a year. And PG&E can probably speak better to that, but it's designed so that in the fire season, you'll know, Joe, because I think you're up in that area. You'll remember that Calistoga was hit pretty hard, and they had to shut down the grid. And so this microgrid, it can work stand-alone.

是的，黑啟動。是的。嗯，黑啟動是必要的一部分，因為這是一個微電網備份系統。因此需要明確的是，這裡的用例不會經常被釋放，可能每年四到五次。PG&E 可能可以更好地表達這一點，但它的設計是為了在火災季節，你會知道，喬，因為我認為你在那個領域。您會記得卡利斯託加受到了相當嚴重的打擊，他們不得不關閉電網。所以這個微電網可以獨立工作。

It actually is also interconnected. But the design of this is to be discharged during events of what they call PSPS, any power shutdown or safety shutdown event, this thing will kick in. They don't need diesel generation anymore, and the lithium-ion helps them with some specific services and even ancillary power, by the way, that they can use daily.

實際上也是相互關聯的。但這個設計是為了在他們所謂的 PSPS 事件期間放電，任何電源關閉或安全關閉事件，這個東西都會啟動。他們不再需要柴油發電，鋰離子電池可以幫助他們提供一些特定的服務，甚至是他們可以每天使用的輔助電源。

Does that make sense?

那有意義嗎？

Okay. Thank you. I understand that much better now. I appreciate it. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。我現在更明白這一點了。我很感激。謝謝。

Yes, no problem.

是沒有問題。

Okay. And we have about 15 minutes left, and they'll still have a list of people to get through. So if you can limit your questions, please to one and a follow-up. That would be great.

好的。我們還剩大約 15 分鐘，他們仍然有一份人員名單需要處理。因此，如果您可以限制您的問題，請只提出一個問題和一個後續問題。那太好了。

Thomas Boyes, TD Cowen.

托馬斯·博伊斯，TD·考恩。

Appreciate you taking the questions. Maybe the first is, is the royalty structure for the gravity deal in South Africa similar to the one in China, where it's like 5% royalty on the projects and then about 90% gross margin? Just trying to get a sense of how that is situated.

感謝您提出問題。也許第一個問題是，南非引力交易的特許權使用費結構是否與中國類似，專案特許權使用費為 5%，毛利率約為 90%？只是想了解它的位置。

Yes, it is.

是的。

Okay. Thank you. And then the other question was just obviously, great to see the progress in China. I know in the EVS system in Texas is going to or slated to use wind blades and the block construction which I assume, is still on the table. I was just wondering if you're seeing that type of demand for solutions in China. Are they also looking to use waste materials and block construction, something on the --

好的。謝謝。然後另一個問題很明顯，很高興看到中國的進步。我知道德克薩斯州的 EVS 系統將或計劃使用風力葉片，並且我認為塊結構仍在討論中。我只是想知道您是否在中國看到了對解決方案的這種需求。他們是否也考慮使用廢棄材料和砌塊建築，諸如此類--

Yeah. Correct. In fact, just to -- yes, just to share with you on what CNTY or China Tianying plans are. They are a waste remediation and environmental service company. So meaning they do a lot of the standard waste management and have an incinerator and they are using that incinerated ash as part of their brick production.

是的。正確的。事實上，只是為了——是的，只是為了與大家分享 CNTY 或中國天鷹的計劃。他們是一家廢棄物修復和環境服務公司。因此，這意味著他們進行了大量標準廢物管理，並擁有焚燒爐，他們將焚燒後的灰燼用作磚塊生產的一部分。

As a part of our license with gravity, we are collaborating around other forms of waste materials like coal ash, for example, and even the wind blade, the shredded fiberglass, wind blade that they can use there as well. As you know, there's massive wind deployments in China, and about every 10 years, those blades suffer what's called fatigue and the blades have to be replaced. So that is a large opportunity for them.

作為我們重力許可的一部分，我們正在圍繞其他形式的廢料進行合作，例如煤灰，甚至風力葉片，碎玻璃纖維，他們也可以在那裡使用的風力葉片。如您所知，中國有大規模的風電部署，大約每十年，這些葉片就會出現所謂的疲勞，必須更換葉片。所以這對他們來說是一個很大的機會。

There are in China as well, the similar types of, let's say, reuse subsidies there and China Tianying is a player, let's say, in that market. So they are required, in some cases, through their core business to utilize it, but specifically for the energy, that was one of the synergies that we have and that they have with our technology in working with them.

中國也有類似類型的再利用補貼，而中國天鷹是該市場的參與者。因此，在某些情況下，他們需要透過其核心業務來利用它，但特別是對於能源，這是我們以及他們與我們的技術合作時所擁有的協同效應之一。

Excellent. I appreciate it. I'll jump back in queue.

出色的。我很感激。我會插回隊列。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

Chris Ellinghaus, Siebert Williams Shank.

克里斯埃林豪斯、西伯特威廉斯尚克。

Hey, everybody. How are you?

嘿，大家。你好嗎？

Hey, Chris. How you doing?

嘿，克里斯。你好嗎？

Robert, whoever wants to talk about this, but the efforts that you undertook in the fourth quarter to conserve your cash run rate, what line items did you address in terms of reducing costs?

羅伯特，無論誰想談論這個問題，但是您在第四季度為保持現金運行率所做的努力，在降低成本方面您解決了哪些項目？

Great question, Chris. We focus in two areas, basically the controllable OpEx. So that's everything from our internal IT costs, internal infrastructure, things like also our travel, all the things that are really controllable in that sense, but also things that are related to our infrastructure.

好問題，克里斯。我們重點關注兩個領域，基本上是可控的營運支出。這包括我們的內部 IT 成本、內部基礎設施、我們的旅行等所有在這個意義上真正可控的事情，以及與我們的基礎設施相關的事情。

I mean, as an example, we're consolidating some things in Snyder, Texas as a facility since we actually own that site now and consolidating some infrastructure. For example, as we're winding down the R&D facility that had our EVx and still has our EVx system there where we're finalizing some testing with the build-up now of Snyder, we're going to be doing things there.

我的意思是，舉個例子，我們正在將德克薩斯州斯奈德的一些東西整合為一個設施，因為我們現在實際上擁有該站點並整合了一些基礎設施。例如，當我們正在逐步關閉擁有 EVx 的研發設施時，那裡仍然保留著我們的 EVx 系統，我們正在用 Snyder 現在的建設完成一些測試，我們將在那裡工作。

We had some other things that were somewhat discretionary. We had other projects. Some of them were IT related. There were some R&D things also that we made some choices based on priorities that we saw in the market, which, as you know, in this market, in terms of looking at different storage duration and different technology mediums, we're -- given our expertise across multiple domains, we invest and invest and I'd say a strong way in R&D and future energy storage technology.

我們還有一些其他的事情是可以自行決定的。我們還有其他項目。其中一些與 IT 相關。還有一些研發方面的事情，我們根據我們在市場上看到的優先事項做出了一些選擇，正如你所知，在這個市場上，在考慮不同的存儲持續時間和不同的技術媒介方面，我們——給定我們在多個領域的專業知識，我們投資和投資，我想說的是在研發和未來能源儲存技術方面的強有力的方式。

So there was some optimization, I'd say, around that. So anything that was controllable we addressed. And we also addressed a bit on our -- given the business model and gravity where we're essentially continuing to license the technology that means -- what does that mean? We don't have to open up offices in places like what we announced for the SADC, the 16-member countries in Southern Africa, or in China, in places because we don't have to spend that. And we don't have to staff up or keep a certain level of engineering team to go build things directly.

所以我想說，圍繞這一點進行了一些優化。所以我們解決了任何可控制的問題。我們也討論了一些關於我們的業務模式和重要性，我們基本上繼續授權技術，這意味著什麼？我們不必在像我們宣布的南部非洲發展共同體、南部非洲的 16 個成員國或中國這樣的地方開設辦事處，因為我們不需要花錢。我們不需要配備人員或保留一定程度的工程團隊來直接建造東西。

They're built by other local EPC companies with our technical support and guidance, but they're basically executing our partners in the regions. Because of that, we did adapt a bit, both our functional and engineering model to that model. And I'll translate that because they weren't easy decisions, but we did optimize and make decisions around some headcount level that were related to the expansion of our business model.

它們是由其他當地EPC公司在我們的技術支援和指導下建造的，但他們基本上是在執行我們在該地區的合作夥伴。因此，我們確實對我們的功能模型和工程模型進行了一些調整。我會翻譯這一點，因為它們不是容易的決定，但我們確實圍繞著與我們業務模式擴展相關的某些人員數量水平進行了優化和決策。

We proactively did that just looking at, as you do, as things evolve in the market and looking at where our direct management is required on projects. In particular, these complex projects where we're integrating our own equipment, potentially other's equipment, and doing some new things that does require a little more hands on areas.

我們像您一樣積極主動地做到了這一點，只是隨著市場的發展而變化，並研究專案中需要我們直接管理的地方。特別是，在這些複雜的專案中，我們正在整合我們自己的設備，可能是其他人的設備，並做一些確實需要更多動手領域的新事情。

We are accelerating some investments in some of the software capabilities. I mentioned that today. So it was a combination of those things in terms of controllable OpEx and some headcount related that it was just essentially an optimization of our -- of matching our infrastructure costs to our business model. And then secondarily, Chris, I'd say that it's clear, given the market volatility in our sector.

我們正在加快對某些軟體功能的投資。我今天提到過這一點。因此，這是可控營運支出和一些相關人員數量的結合，這本質上只是我們的最佳化——將基礎設施成本與我們的業務模式相匹配。其次，克里斯，考慮到我們行業的市場波動，我想說這很清楚。

And amazing to me -- honestly, that with everything we've delivered in only our first two years and with the revenue growth we've done and positive unit economics and making the adjustments we just made, it's amazing to me where our stock continues to trade. So it is clear. Investors have spoken on the desire to see accelerated road map to cash flow positive.

讓我感到驚訝的是——老實說，憑藉我們在前兩年所交付的一切、我們所做的收入增長、積極的單位經濟效益以及我們剛剛做出的調整，我們的庫存持續增長令我感到驚訝交易。所以很清楚了。投資人表示希望看到加速實現正現金流的路線圖。

So with that also as a backdrop, we wanted to take actions in Q4 to enter 2024 at a lower cash OpEx rate to enable us to essentially accelerate that time frame into cash flow positive. And we're going to be sharing much more on that and by region and some new products and things and providing color on some of the announcements we made today on May 8.

因此，以此為背景，我們希望在第四季度採取行動，以較低的現金營運支出率進入 2024 年，使我們能夠從根本上加快實現正現金流的時間框架。我們將按地區分享更多相關內容以及一些新產品和事物，並為我們今天 5 月 8 日發布的一些公告提供色彩。

Okay. Thanks. That helps. I assume that you'll give us some regional overview of where development stands in say, domestically or on gravity storage projects in general at the Investor Day. Is that where you're headed along with some detailed guidance?

好的。謝謝。這有幫助。我假設您會在投資者日向我們介紹一些區域概況，例如國內或一般重力儲存專案的開發狀況。這就是您要去的地方並提供一些詳細的指導嗎？

Yeah. Correct. Both of those and some other things, too. We have some new product announcements to make tied to some new customer announcements. So we'll -- but yes, correct. Absolutely those two.

是的。正確的。這兩件事以及其他一些事情也是如此。我們有一些新產品公告要與一些新客戶公告相關聯。所以我們會——但是，是的，正確的。絕對是這兩個人。

And if I can give a little sub follow-up on that. Will you have at the Investor Day, the ability to give us a little more color on this Washington state customer?

如果我可以對此進行一些後續跟進。您能否在投資者日向我們介紹更多華盛頓州客戶的資訊？

Yes. We're planning to -- on that. It's a -- we're really excited about it because of the nature of the application of the gravity technology, and that's tied to, Chris, one of the new product announcements that we're going to be making. So we will be adding more color.

是的。我們正計劃就此進行。由於重力技術應用的本質，我們對此感到非常興奮，克里斯，這與我們將要發布的新產品之一有關。所以我們將添加更多顏色。

One thing to share on these. Some customers as they're -- as we're developing projects with them, okay, they have to go acquire land. So it's -- we're -- they're very sensitive about sharing and naming themselves until they've acquired it so as not to drive up pricing on that land. And any time you speak about gravity, you aren't talking about 10 acres, okay? You're talking about large plots of land and things.

關於這些要分享的一件事。一些客戶，因為我們正在與他們一起開發項目，好吧，他們必須去購買土地。所以，他們對分享和命名自己非常敏感，直到他們獲得這塊土地，以免提高那塊土地的價格。任何時候當你談論重力時，你不是在談論 10 英畝，好嗎？你說的是大片土地之類的東西。

So because of that, we -- our customers will require we hold confidential their name until such time as they've acquired the land. Does that make sense to you?

因此，我們—我們的客戶將要求我們對他們的名字保密，直到他們獲得土地。這對你來說有意義嗎？

Yeah. Sure. Absolutely. I'm going to dig into that one myself, but I'm looking forward to the Investor Day. Thanks for the details.

是的。當然。絕對地。我將親自深入研究這個問題，但我很期待投資者日的到來。感謝您提供詳細資訊。

Thank you, Chris. Appreciate it.

謝謝你，克里斯。欣賞它。

Noel Parks, Tuohy Brothers.

諾埃爾·帕克斯、圖伊兄弟。

Hi. I just had a couple of quick ones. One of them is, with the storage market, it does seem that the last year in particular, we've seen like a greater investor awareness specifically, of the role of intermittent power sources, solar wind or the destabilizing effect on the grid. And I just wonder, as a driver of business to you, has that ascended in importance? Is it about the same?

你好。我剛剛吃了幾個快速的。其中之一是，在儲存市場上，尤其是在去年，我們確實看到投資者對間歇性電源、太陽能風能的作用或對電網的不穩定影響的認識有了更大的提高。我只是想知道，作為您業務的推動者，這一點的重要性是否有所上升？是不是都差不多啊？

Yeah. I'd say that continues to be -- I mean, it continues to widen what we're seeing in terms of what used to be a massive one to two hour market that shifted to a two- to four-hour market. So the longer duration, meaning it was more intermittencies there. And quite frankly, the severity of the weather patterns are driving some of that. So we're -- that's going to continue over time.

是的。我想說，這仍然是——我的意思是，它繼續擴大我們所看到的範圍，從過去的一到兩個小時的巨大市場轉變為兩到四個小時的市場。所以持續時間越長，代表那裡的間歇性就越多。坦白說，嚴重的天氣模式是其中的一部分原因。所以我們——這種情況將隨著時間的推移而持續下去。

I would say, as you know, we've seen a tremendous drop in lithium-ion prices. And even then, therefore, the ability for lithium-ion to be utilized, definitely at four hours, and depending on where pricing goes or any other new technologies that come, I think there'll be additional flexibility there. But definitely, this aspect of addressing intermittency as more renewables come on the grid and thus the need for storage. We haven't seen any slowdown necessarily there.

我想說，如您所知，我們已經看到鋰離子價格大幅下跌。因此，即便如此，鋰離子電池的使用時間肯定是在四個小時內，並且取決於定價的走向或任何其他新技術的出現，我認為那裡將會有額外的靈活性。但毫無疑問，隨著更多再生能源進入電網，這方面解決了間歇性問題，從而解決了儲存需求。我們並沒有看到任何放緩。

We are continuing to see, I think, a strong market in shorter duration tech, combined with very interestingly, needs that are in this 8 to 12 hour range for some specific applications. And as you know, we can serve those things pretty broadly.

我認為，我們將繼續看到較短持續時間技術的強勁市場，以及非常有趣的一些特定應用在 8 到 12 小時範圍內的需求。如您所知，我們可以為這些事情提供相當廣泛的服務。

Great. Thanks. And last month, when you disclosed the South African license deal, I believe it was $20 million over 10 years. It was helpful to see that modification. Could you just take a stab at maybe how many similar deals like that you can envision over the next year or two? Are we talking about a handful, dozens, many dozens?

偉大的。謝謝。上個月，當您披露南非許可協議時，我相信該協議在 10 年內價值 2000 萬美元。看到這個修改很有幫助。您能否嘗試在未來一兩年內您可以設想多少類似的交易？我們談論的是少數、幾十個、幾十個嗎？

Yeah. No, it's not dozens, it's sub-10 because if you think about where do we do those types of deals, we're going to do them in places where we can find very credible, reliable large partners, ideally in markets that are experiencing growth, meaning where there is a defined market need. So look at South Africa, I think the things are fairly well. Public has said there about what they call load shedding, which in California, we call rolling blackouts.

是的。不，不是幾十個，而是不到10 個，因為如果你考慮我們在哪裡進行此類交易，我們將在可以找到非常可信、可靠的大型合作夥伴的地方進行這些交易，最好是在正在經歷困難的市場中進行。成長，意味著有明確的市場需求。看看南非，我認為情況相當不錯。公眾在那裡談論了他們所謂的減載，在加州，我們稱之為輪流停電。

And so there is an absolute need for the storage there and in places where we prefer not to go set up shop. I mean we're more of a technology provider, I'd say, overall, although we have the ability to asset manage as we're doing now in Calistoga. So I'd say that there would be definitely something if you look at over the next few years. There's other locations that can be interesting for that model. And in particular, I'd say, for gravity, where you're a -- if you think about it, that is all a local construction project, can be done mostly locally.

因此，那裡和我們不想去開店的地方絕對需要存放。我的意思是，總的來說，我們更像是一家技術提供商，儘管我們有能力像我們現在在卡利斯託加所做的那樣進行資產管理。所以我想說，如果你看看未來幾年，一定會有一些東西。該模型還有其他一些有趣的地方。特別是，我想說，對於重力來說，如果你仔細想想，這都是一個本地建設項目，大部分可以在本地完成。

Some places don't have the power electronics, or they aren't making the big multi-megawatt motors. So those may have to come in. But otherwise, because of the nature of -- it's a building and a construction project, it lends itself to these types of business models. And I think it's -- from an investor perspective, it's interesting because there's typically licenses that are paid upfront or in some cases, they're paid in cash over time. And then there's the royalties tied to volume.

有些地方沒有電力電子設備，或者他們沒有製造大型的多兆瓦馬達。所以那些可能必須進來。但除此之外，由於它是一個建築和建設項目的性質，它適合這些類型的商業模式。我認為，從投資者的角度來看，這很有趣，因為通常有預先支付的許可證，或者在某些情況下，隨著時間的推移以現金支付。然後是與數量掛鉤的版稅。

And I know it can be frustrating when you're new and you just do them and the timing of those royalties, understanding when are they going to come as systems get built and turned over. And specifically with gravity, obviously, we're talking about systems that take 12 months to 18 months to build. So -- but those are coming. They are at quite a significant royalty percentage.

我知道，當你是新人時，你只是做這些事情和這些版稅的時間，了解隨著系統的構建和移交，它們什麼時候會到來，這可能會令人沮喪。顯然，特別是在重力方面，我們正在談論需要 12 個月到 18 個月才能建造的系統。所以——但那些即將到來。他們的特許權使用費比例相當高。

I mean on revenue, 5% is, I'd say, towards the higher end of what you see in royalty agreements. So it's something that we're going to be providing some indicators on in terms of when we expect those to kick in on some of the initial agreements going forward.

我的意思是，就收入而言，5% 是您在特許權使用費協議中看到的較高端。因此，我們將提供一些指標，以表明我們預計這些指標何時會在未來的一些初步協議中發揮作用。

Great. Thanks a lot.

偉大的。多謝。

All right. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

There are no further questions at this time. I'd like to turn the call back to Robert Piconi for closing remarks.

目前沒有其他問題。我想將電話轉回給羅伯特·皮科尼 (Robert Piconi)，讓其致閉幕詞。

Just to thank everyone for joining and their time and again to thank the employees of Energy Vault and what we achieved in 2023 and what we're looking forward to here in '24 and '25. So just to thank the employees of the company and those of you that have joined and have been supporters of Energy Vault, we thank you for that, all the investors there. And we look forward to hopefully seeing some of you post our Q1 earnings, May 7. We'll be speaking again then and potentially in person on May 8 in New York. Thank you very much.

只是要感謝大家的加入，並一次又一次感謝 Energy Vault 的員工以及我們在 2023 年取得的成就以及我們對 24 和 25 年的期待。因此，為了感謝公司的員工以及那些加入並一直支持 Energy Vault 的人，我們感謝那裡的所有投資者。我們期待看到你們中的一些人在 5 月 7 日發布我們的第一季收益。屆時我們將再次發表講話，並可能在 5 月 8 日在紐約親自發表講話。非常感謝。

This concludes today's conference. You may now disconnect your lines. Enjoy the rest of your day.

今天的會議到此結束。現在您可以斷開線路。享受你一天剩下的時間。