Materion Corp (MTRN) 2024 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the Materion third quarter 2024 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) Please note, this conference is being recorded. I will now turn the conference over to your host, Mr. Kyle Kelleher, Director, Investor Relations and Corporate FP&A. Sir, the floor is yours.

大家好，歡迎參加 Materion 2024 年第三季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）請注意，本次會議正在錄音。現在，我將會議交給主持人、投資者關係和企業 FP&A 總監 Kyle Kelleher 先生。先生，現在請您發言。

Good morning, and thank you for joining us on our third quarter 2024 earnings conference call. This is Kyle Kelleher, Director, Investor Relations and Corporate FP&A. Before we begin our remarks this morning, I would like to point out that we have posted materials on the company's website that we will reference as part of today's review of the quarterly results.

早安，感謝您參加我們 2024 年第三季財報電話會議。這是投資者關係和企業 FP&A 總監 Kyle Kelleher。在我們今天早上開始發言之前，我想指出，我們已經在公司網站上發布了一些資料，我們將在今天的季度業績審查中參考這些資料。

You can also access the materials through the download feature on the earnings call webcast link. With me today is Jugal Vijayvargiya, President and Chief Executive Officer; and Shelly Chadwick, Vice President and Chief Financial Officer.

您也可以透過收益電話會議網路直播連結上的下載功能存取這些資料。今天與我在一起的是總裁兼執行長 Jugal Vijayvargiya；以及副總裁兼財務長 Shelly Chadwick。

Our format for today's conference call is as follows: Jugal will provide opening comments on the quarter. Following Jugal, Shelly will review the detailed financial results for the quarter in addition to discussing expectations for the remainder of 2024. We will then open up the call for questions.

我們今天的電話會議形式如下：Jugal 將對本季發表開場評論。繼 Jugal 之後，Shelly 將回顧本季的詳細財務結果並討論 2024 年剩餘時間的預期。然後我們將開始提問。

Let me remind investors that any forward-looking statements made in the presentation, including those in the outlook section and during the question-and-answer portion, are based on current expectations. The company's actual performance may materially differ from that contemplated by the forward-looking statements as a result of a variety of factors. Those factors are listed in the earnings press release we issued this morning.

我要提醒投資者，簡報中所做的任何前瞻性陳述，包括展望部分和問答部分的陳述，都是基於當前預期。由於多種因素，公司的實際業績可能與前瞻性陳述所預期的業績有重大差異。這些因素都列在我們今天早上發布的收益新聞稿中。

Additionally, comments regarding earnings before interest, taxes, depreciation, depletion and amortization, net income, and earnings per share reflect the adjusted GAAP numbers shown in Attachments four through eight in this morning's press release. The adjustments are made in the prior year period for comparative purposes and remove special items, noncash charges, and certain discrete income tax adjustments.

此外，有關息稅折舊攤銷前利潤、淨收入和每股收益的評論反映了今天上午新聞稿中附件四至八中顯示的調整後 GAAP 數字。為了比較目的，對上年同期進行了調整，並刪除了特殊項目、非現金費用和某些單獨所得稅調整。

And now I'll turn over the call to Jugal for his comments.

現在我將把電話轉給 Jugal 來徵求他的意見。

Thanks Kyle and welcome everyone. It's nice to be with you today to discuss our third quarter results and provide an update on our outlook for the remainder of the year. Sales for the quarter were down slightly with the expected inventory corrections in Clad Strip as well as general market softness across several of our end markets, while we continue to see strength in space and defense.

謝謝凱爾，歡迎大家。很高興今天能與大家討論我們的第三季業績並提供今年剩餘時間的展望。由於複合帶材預期庫存調整及多個終端市場整體疲軟，本季銷售額略有下降，但我們繼續看到太空和國防領域的實力。

Despite these market headwinds, our team has been laser focused on delivering strong performance. For the quarter, we achieved record EBITDA margins of 21.5%. In fact, for four of the last six quarters, our team has delivered north of 20% EBITDA margins, which has been our overall margin target, while the markets have been soft over the last several quarters, we have focused on aligning our portfolio to global mega trends, optimizing our footprint and improving the cost structure of the company.

儘管存在這些市場阻力，我們的團隊仍然專注於提供強勁的業績。本季度，我們的 EBITDA 利潤率達到創紀錄的 21.5%。事實上，在過去六個季度中的四個季度中，我們的團隊實現了超過20%的EBITDA利潤率，這也是我們的整體利潤率目標，儘管過去幾個季度市場一直疲軟，但我們專注於調整我們的投資組合以適應全球大趨勢，優化我們的足跡並改善公司的成本結構。

Let me highlight some details around each of these areas, although the semiconductor recovery is materializing slower than we anticipated. This was the second quarter in a row that we saw year over year, growth in overall semi sales. With higher demand for logic and memory applications driving this volume increase we have been able to capitalize on related opportunities with our broad portfolio of semiconductor products and solutions.

儘管半導體復甦的速度比我們預期的要慢，但我還是要強調每個領域的一些細節。這是我們連續第二季看到整體半銷售額年增。隨著對邏輯和記憶體應用的需求不斷增加，推動了這種產量的成長，我們能夠利用我們廣泛的半導體產品和解決方案組合來抓住相關機會。

We're pleased to announce that Materion has entered into an agreement to serve as the technology partner for a major global supplier of semiconductor processing equipment. We will support this customer in its development of a new deposition material that will pave the way for a wide range of next generation consumer and automotive electronic devices.

我們很高興地宣布，Materion 已簽署協議，成為全球主要半導體加工設備供應商的技術合作夥伴。我們將支援該客戶開發新的沉積材料，為下一代消費和汽車電子設備鋪路。

Strength in the emerging space market and steady year over year, growth in defense is more than offsetting the impact of continued softness in airplane builds leading to the 14th consecutive quarter of growth in overall demand for the aerospace and defense market.

新興航太市場的強勁表現和逐年穩定的國防成長足以抵消飛機製造持續疲軟的影響，導致航空航太和國防市場整體需求連續 14 個季度增長。

We continued our momentum this quarter with new business wins in defense, including the selection of our SupremEX lightweight composite material for use on the prototype for the US Army's future tilt rotor broader long range aircraft. This win is just another example of how Materion products are uniquely suited for next generation applications.

本季我們繼續保持良好勢頭，在國防領域取得了新的業務勝利，包括選擇 SupremEX 輕質複合材料用於美國陸軍未來傾轉旋翼更寬遠程飛機的原型。此次獲獎只是 Materion 產品獨特地適合下一代應用的另一個例子。

In space, one of our newest high performance products, the AyontEX alloy, was selected for a new telescope mirror that will be tested by NASA in its pyrogenic test facility. This opportunity allows us to continue to build on our legacy of innovation leading to advances in space discovery, while demonstrating the full potential of some of our most advanced materials. Just as we're adding to our portfolio in support of mega trends, we are taking steps to eliminate underperforming non-core businesses.

在太空領域，我們最新的高性能產品之一 AyontEX 合金被選為新型望遠鏡鏡子的材料，美國太空總署將在其熱解測試設施中對該鏡子進行測試。這次機會使我們能夠繼續發揚我們的創新傳統，推動太空探索的進步，同時展示我們的一些最先進材料的全部潛力。正如我們不斷擴大投資組合以支持大趨勢一樣，我們也採取措施消除表現不佳的非核心業務。

Today, we're announcing the sale of a facility in Albuquerque, New Mexico that produces coatings for architectural glass, mainly used in commercial construction. We've taken a number of additional steps to optimize our footprint over the last year with a focus on driving scale and efficiency, we closed a facility in Suzhou, China, consolidating production into other facilities in both Asia and North America.

今天，我們宣佈出售位於新墨西哥州阿爾伯克基的一家工廠，該工廠生產主要用於商業建築的建築玻璃塗料。去年，我們採取了許多額外措施來優化我們的足跡，重點是提高規模和效率，我們關閉了位於中國蘇州的一家工廠，將生產整合到亞洲和北美的其他工廠。

We are also in the midst of right sizing two additional facilities in Asia, which should be completed by early next year, and we will be closing a facility in Albuquerque, New Mexico, in conjunction with the business sale I mentioned earlier. Many of these actions are focused on improving the performance of our electronic materials business.

我們也正在對亞洲的另外兩家工廠進行規模調整，預計於明年年初完工，而且我們將關閉位於新墨西哥州阿爾伯克基的一家工廠，配合我之前提到的業務出售。許多舉措都集中在提高我們電子材料業務的績效。

As a result, this business is now delivering approximately 20% EBITDA margins, representing close to 400 basis points improvement so far this year on lower volume. Regarding our cost structure, we have been taking a series of decisive actions to streamline our organization and position us for greater efficiency.

因此，該業務目前實現的 EBITDA 利潤率約為 20%，這意味著今年迄今在銷量較低的情況下，利潤率已提高近 400 個基點。關於我們的成本結構，我們已經採取了一系列果斷的措施來精簡我們的組織並提高效率。

Over the last year, we have reduced 150 positions through targeted reductions and optimizing back office operations while controlling discretionary spending. At the same time, we remain focused on investing for the future. Our R&D spend this year is at an all-time high.

去年，我們透過有針對性的裁員、優化後台營運以及控制可自由支配的開支，減少了 150 個職位。同時，我們仍然專注於未來的投資。我們今年的研發支出達到了歷史最高水準。

As we focus on partnering with our customers to deliver next generation products and solutions, even through periods of market softness, we have remained focused on investing for the future, further aligning the business to high growth opportunities supported by global mega trends. Across our plants, we are improving yields and profitability through process and technical innovations and continuous improvement initiatives.

我們專注於與客戶合作提供下一代產品和解決方案，即使在市場低迷時期，我們仍然專注於投資未來，進一步使業務與全球大趨勢支持的高成長機會保持一致。在我們的工廠中，我們透過製程和技術創新以及持續改進措施來提高產量和獲利能力。

Turning to Precision Optics, we're in the early stages of driving a meaningful transformation in that business, and have appointed a new President, Jason Moore, to lead the efforts. While this business has experienced some speed bumps over the past couple of years. We believe the long term fundamentals remain strong.

談到精密光學，我們正處於推動該業務有意義轉型的早期階段，並已任命新總裁傑森·摩爾（Jason Moore）來領導這項工作。雖然這項業務在過去幾年中遇到了一些障礙。我們相信長期基本面依然強勁。

As a reminder, we provide the world's most extensive offering of precision optical components, thin film coatings and assemblies, enabling a number of different technologies and applications in many of the markets we serve. Jason is quickly working with this team to review the overall cost structure and footprint to ensure we're maximizing the value of this important business and prioritizing the many growth opportunities the business is developing.

提醒一下，我們提供世界上最廣泛的精密光學元件、薄膜塗層和組件，在我們服務的許多市場中支援多種不同的技術和應用。傑森正在迅速與該團隊合作，審查整體成本結構和足跡，以確保我們最大限度地提高這項重要業務的價值，並優先考慮該業務正在開發的眾多成長機會。

The number of careful and deliberate actions we're executing have allowed us to deliver record performance and are setting the stage for even stronger performance in the future.

我們採取的一系列謹慎而深思熟慮的行動使我們能夠取得創紀錄的業績，並為未來更加強勁的業績奠定了基礎。

I'm proud of our team's unwavering focus on delivering for our customers, while also taking the necessary steps to manage cost and improve performance. As we look ahead to the rest of the year, we expect to deliver sequential improvement in sales and profitability despite the soft end market conditions, we will continue our discipline focus and deliver a solid 2024 further cementing the strong foundation we've built to accelerate results as markets recover.

我為我們的團隊始終如一地專注於為客戶提供服務，同時採取必要措施管理成本和提高績效而感到自豪。展望今年剩餘時間，儘管終端市場狀況疲軟，但我們預計銷售額和盈利能力仍將連續改善，我們將繼續專注於紀律，在 2024 年取得堅實的業績，進一步鞏固我們為在市場復甦時加速業績而建立的堅實基礎。

Now let me turn the call over to Shelly to cover more details on the financials.

現在，讓我將電話轉給 Shelly，以介紹更多有關財務的詳細資訊。

Thanks Jugal and good morning everyone. During my comments, I will reference the slides posted on our website this morning, starting on slide 10. In the third quarter, value added sales, which exclude the impact of pass through precious metal costs, were 263.8 million, down 2% from prior year.

謝謝 Jugal，大家早安。在我的評論中，我將參考今天早上我們網站上發布的幻燈片，從第 10 張開始。第三季度，不包括轉嫁貴金屬成本影響的加值銷售額為 2.638 億，較上年下降 2%。

This decrease was driven by general market softness combined with lower precision Clad Strip sales. Continued strength in space and defense and some improvement in semiconductor partially offset the decrease. When looking at earnings per share, we delivered third quarter adjusted earnings of $1.41 down 7% from prior year,

造成這一下降的原因是由於整體市場疲軟，加上精密複合帶材銷售下降。太空和國防領域的持續走強以及半導體領域的一些改善部分抵消了下降。從每股盈餘來看，我們第三季調整後的每股盈餘為 1.41 美元，較上年同期下降 7%。

Moving to slide 11, adjusted EBITDA in the quarter was $56.7 million, or 21.5% of value added sales up 2% with 100 basis points of margin expansion from the prior year. We remain pleased with the margin performance, delivering margins above our midterm target of 20% for yet another quarter.

轉到第 11 頁，本季調整後的 EBITDA 為 5,670 萬美元，佔增值銷售額的 21.5%，成長 2%，利潤率較上年擴大 100 個基點。我們對利潤率表現仍然感到滿意，又一個季度的利潤率超過了我們 20% 的中期目標。

This year over year increase was driven by continued cost management and operational performance offsetting lower volume and some weaker price mix. Moving to slide 12. Let me now review third quarter performance by business segment, starting with performance materials, value added sales were $163.6 million down 3% as compared to prior year.

今年同比成長的動力來自於持續的成本管理和營運績效，抵消了銷售下降和價格組合疲軟的影響。移至投影片 12。現在讓我回顧一下按業務部門劃分的第三季業績，首先是性能材料，增值銷售額為 1.636 億美元，較上年下降 3%。

This year over year, decrease was driven by industrial and automotive market softness combined with lower precision Clad Strip sales, partially offset by strength in space and defense. EBITDA, excluding special items, was $46.5 million or 28.4% of value added sales flat compared to the prior year, with 90 basis points of year over year, margin expansion, strong operational performance and cost management helped offset the volume decline and unfavorable price mix.

與去年同期相比，下降的主要原因是工業和汽車市場疲軟，加上精密複合帶材銷售下降，但被航太和國防市場的強勁表現部分抵消。扣除特殊項目的 EBITDA 為 4,650 萬美元，佔增值銷售額的 28.4%，與上年持平，比上年增長 90 個基點，利潤率擴大、強勁的營運業績和成本管理幫助抵消了銷量下滑和不利的價格組合。

EBITDA margin also improved 350 basis points on a sequential basis. Moving to the Q4 outlook, we expect incremental sales improvement driven by some seasonality, combined with continued strength in space and defense and a step up in beryllium nickel demand as the commercial construction inventory correction starts to subside.

EBITDA 利潤率也比上一季提高了 350 個基點。展望第四季度，我們預計在季節性因素的推動下，銷售額將逐步改善，同時隨著商業建築庫存調整開始消退，航太和國防領域將繼續保持強勁增長，鈹鎳需求將增加。

Next, turning to electronic materials on slide 13, value added sales were $77.8 million, a 3% increase year on year, driven by improving semiconductor sales. EBITDA, excluding special items, was $15.6 million, or 20.1% of value added sales in the quarter up 290 basis points versus the prior year and the second quarter in a row with EBITDA margins north of 20%. This increase was driven by higher volume, strong operational performance and cost management. As we look to the fourth quarter, we expect semiconductor sales to be roughly flat sequentially as customer inventory levels have been slow to come down.

接下來，轉向幻燈片 13 上的電子材料，增值銷售額為 7,780 萬美元，較去年同期成長 3%，這得益於半導體銷售的成長。不包括特殊項目的 EBITDA 為 1,560 萬美元，佔本季增值銷售額的 20.1%，比上年同期成長 290 個基點，且連續第二季 EBITDA 利潤率超過 20%。這一成長主要得益於銷售增加、強勁的營運績效和成本管理。展望第四季度，我們預計半導體銷售額將與上一季基本持平，因為客戶庫存水準下降緩慢。

Turning to Precision Optics segment on slide 14, value added sales were $22.4 million down 14% compared to the prior year. This decrease was driven largely by defense order timing and general market weakness across automotive and industrial. EBITDA excluding special items, was $0.5 million or 2.2% of value added sales. The decrease year over year was driven by lower volume and unfavorable price mix, partially offset by cost management.

談到第 14 頁的精密光學部門，增值銷售額為 2,240 萬美元，比上年下降 14%。這一下降主要是由於國防訂單時間表以及汽車和工業市場整體疲軟所致。不包括特殊項目的 EBITDA 為 50 萬美元，佔增值銷售額的 2.2%。與去年同期相比，銷售下降和價格組合不利是導致下降的原因，但成本管理部分抵消了這一影響。

Looking out to the fourth quarter, we expect the top line to be comparable to Q3 as markets remain challenged. Despite comparable sales, we expect a slight margin pick up through continued cost management efforts. Moving now to cash debt and liquidity on slide 15, we ended the quarter with a net debt position of approximately $477 million and approximately $127 million of available capacity on the company's existing credit facility.

展望第四季度，由於市場仍面臨挑戰，我們預期營收將與第三季相當。儘管銷售額類似，但我們預計透過持續的成本管理努力，利潤率將略有回升。現在轉到投影片 15 上的現金債務和流動性，我們在本季結束時的淨債務狀況約為 4.77 億美元，公司現有信貸安排的可用容量約為 1.27 億美元。

Our leverage at 2.2 times remains just below the midpoint of our target range. Cash flow remains an important focus, and we expect to generate strong cash flow in the fourth quarter with leverage at approximately two times by year end.

我們的槓桿率為 2.2 倍，略低於我們目標範圍的中點。現金流仍然是我們關注的重點，我們預計第四季將產生強勁的現金流，到年底槓桿率將達到約兩倍。

Lastly, let me transition to slide 16 and address the full year outlook for the company. While end market conditions remain soft, we expect to deliver a stronger top and bottom line in the fourth quarter, with higher volumes and the continued benefit of our cost, portfolio and footprint actions. As a result, we expect to deliver a full year 2024 adjusted earnings in the range of $5.20 to $5.40 per share.

最後，讓我轉到第 16 張幻燈片並談談公司全年前景。儘管終端市場狀況依然疲軟，但我們預期第四季營收和淨利將更加強勁，銷售量將增加，成本、產品組合和足跡行動也將持續帶來收益。因此，我們預計 2024 年全年調整後每股收益將在 5.20 美元至 5.40 美元之間。

This concludes our prepared remarks. We will now open the line for questions.

我們的準備好的演講到此結束。我們現在將開放問答熱線。

(Operator Instructions) Mike Harrison, Seaport Research Partners.

（操作員指示）邁克·哈里森（Mike Harrison），海港研究合作夥伴。

I was hoping that we could start out maybe talking about some of the portfolio optimization actions that you referenced in your remarks there. Can you talk a little bit about the timing and maybe the potential savings that would be associated with the actions that you referenced in Albuquerque and the three sites in Asia.

我希望我們可以開始談論您在評論中提到的一些投資組合優化行動。您能否談談您在阿爾伯克基和亞洲三個站點採取的行動的時間表以及可能節省的成本？

Yeah, let me just talk a little bit about the portfolio and then, and then have Shelly talk about the savings and the timing. So by this business, as we indicated, you know, it's our large area targets that we make for the architecture, glass, so commercial construction, primarily, that's the business that we've had.

是的，讓我稍微談談投資組合，然後讓雪莉談談儲蓄和時間安排。因此，正如我們所指出的，就這項業務而言，我們為建築、玻璃等製造的大面積目標是商業建築，主要是，這是我們的業務。

We've had it for a while and in the in the Albuquerque facility, as we've looked at the, you know, our priorities going forward and look at alignment to our company, we decided this is not something that makes sense for us on a go forward basis. Obviously it does for somebody else and so we decided to take action.

我們已經擁有這種情況有一段時間了，在阿爾伯克基工廠，當我們研究了我們未來的優先事項並考慮與我們公司的一致性時，我們認為從未來的角度來看，這對我們來說沒有任何意義。顯然，對其他人來說，情況確實如此，因此我們決定採取行動。

We did the closing here last week, so the business has been transitioned. It's one facility that goes with the business, and then there's a second facility nearby that is a related facility that we've decided to close. It just allows our electronic materials business to be much more focused on true electronic materials that are used in the semiconductor space and other spaces that they participate in, such as automotive and some other some other areas.

我們上週在這裡完成了收尾工作，因此業務已經轉變。這是與業務相關的一個設施，附近還有另一個相關設施，我們決定關閉它。它只是讓我們的電子材料業務更加專注於半導體領域和他們參與的其他領域（例如汽車和其他一些領域）所使用的真正的電子材料。

So that's what the portfolio action is. It's about $10 million of sales for us on an annual basis, and it is a business that, you know, was not a profitable business for us. So with that, Shelly, comment on the timing of the savings.

這就是投資組合的行動。我們每年的銷售額約為 1000 萬美元，但你知道，這項業務對我們來說並不是一項盈利的業務。因此，雪莉，請評論一下儲蓄的時間。

Yes, as we think about the savings, you know, going forward, really, if you think about 10 million of sales at little to, negative profitability that will go away. So you'll see a slight lift in the electronic materials margins from that. You know, that's really how I would think about modeling it.

是的，當我們考慮節省時，你知道，展望未來，實際上，如果您考慮 1000 萬的銷售額，那麼負盈利能力就會消失。因此你會看到電子材料利潤率略有上升。您知道，這確實就是我對建模的看法。

And the other actions that you mentioned in Asia, the facility closure and consolidations?

您提到的在亞洲的其他行動還有工廠關閉和合併嗎？

Yes. So if you look at the if you look at the facilities, you know, in Asia, the Suzhou facility that we mentioned was something that we've actually done over the last 12 months. So this is something that's been completed. It has been, you know, these are actions that we've in general, by the way that we've talked about, that we've done over the last year or so, as we have had this market softness, we've really focused on making sure that we make the company and overall, a stronger, stronger company.

是的。所以如果你看看這些設施，你知道，在亞洲，我們提到的蘇州工廠是我們在過去 12 個月內實際建造的。所以這是已經完成的事情。您知道，這些都是我們整體上採取的行動，從我們談論的方式來看，我們在過去一年左右採取了這些行動，由於市場疲軟，我們真正專注於確保公司整體變得更加強大。

And so that has been completed, whereas the other two actions are underway, so partially completed, but then some will be done here. Some actions will be finished here in Q4 and then remaining, I would say, in Q1 time frame. So that's roughly the actions for those optimizing the two additional facilities.

所以這一項已經完成了，而另外兩項行動正在進行中，因此部分完成了，但是接下來還有一些將在這裡完成。一些行動將在第四季完成，其餘的行動將在第一季的時間範圍內完成。這就是優化這兩個附加設施的大致行動。

All right, that's very helpful, though. I think we've been trying to figure out how much of the cost action for you've been taking are more structural or structural or permanent in nature, versus how much is it's temporary. So that's very helpful,

好吧，但這非常有幫助。我想，我們一直在試圖弄清楚，您所採取的成本行動中，有多少是結構性的、結構性的或永久性的，又有多少是暫時的。這很有幫助，

Mike, if you, if you want me to give a little more color on that I can, because I know that, you know, a question on, on everybody's mind is really, okay, you're talking a lot about cost reduction. We're seeing these great margins with, you know, lower volumes. What should we expect as things pick up, you know?

麥克，如果你想讓我對此再詳細闡述一下，我可以，因為我知道，每個人心中都有一個問題，那就是，好吧，你一直在談論降低成本。我們看到，儘管銷售量較低，但利潤卻很高。你知道嗎，隨著事態好轉，我們該期待什麼？

And if we look at kind of the cost takeout, I would say it's in the $15 million to $20 million range of what's already been done. I would say more than half of that is permanent and then we're getting a little extra lift from incentive comp that, you know, we would look for that to come back. So really, it's, you know, it's the $15 million to 20 million plus call it five or six incentive comp is what you're seeing in the in the P&L today, a little better than half will stick.

如果我們看一下成本支出，我會說已經完成的成本在 1500 萬美元到 2000 萬美元之間。我想說，其中一半以上是永久性的，然後我們從激勵補償中獲得了一些額外的提升，你知道，我們會期待它回歸。所以實際上，你知道，這是 1500 萬到 2000 萬美元加上所謂的五六項激勵性薪酬，這就是你今天在損益表中看到的，其中一半以上會保留下來。

All right, very helpful. A couple other questions that I had one is we've seen some recent headlines saying that the US military is facing a shortage of missiles. I know you guys don't like to talk specifically about where your advanced material solutions are used, particularly in defense applications, but I'm just curious, could a higher missile production be a positive for your defense business as we start to get into next year.

好的，很有幫助。我還有幾個問題，我們看到最近的一些頭條新聞說美國軍方正面臨飛彈短缺的問題。我知道你們不喜歡具體談論你們的先進材料解決方案的用途，特別是在國防應用方面，但我只是好奇，在進入明年之際，更高的導彈產量是否會對你們的國防業務產生積極影響。

Well, defense as a market for us, as you know, Mike, has been a stronger market than in other years. You know, we indicated, for example, in our last call that, our bookings for defense for the first half of the year were roughly at the same level as the entire year last year.

嗯，麥克，正如你所知，對我們來說，防禦市場比往年更加強勁。你知道，例如，我們在上次電話會議中表示，今年上半年我們的國防訂單量與去年全年大致相同。

So I think in general, defense business has been picking up its result of the number of things that are going on in the world right now, all the geopolitical issues that we're all well aware of, we also are having, I would say, more push for defense business outside the US, in the countries that we are permitted to work in. So there's opportunities, and then we're capturing some of those opportunities as well.

因此我認為總體而言，國防業務一直在回升，這是當今世界發生的許多事情的結果，我們都很清楚地知道地緣政治問題，我想說，我們也正在加大對美國以外、在我們被允許開展業務的國家開展國防業務的推動力。因此存在機會，我們也正在抓住其中的一些機會。

So in general, I would say that our defense business is at a much higher pace this year. Now when it comes to, I think, you know, quarterly, as Q4 tends to be a higher quarter in general, in defense. But if you take the seasonality out, I would say defense has been a growing business for us, and some of the things that you just mentioned could be contributing factors for that.

所以總的來說，我認為今年我們的國防業務發展速度要快得多。現在說到季度，我認為，第四季在國防方面通常是一個較高的季度。但如果排除季節性因素，我想說國防一直是我們不斷成長的業務，而您剛才提到的一些因素可能是促成這一點的因素。

All right. And then last question for me, I was just curious on the Precision Clad Strip customer and their rollout plans. Are your expectations that they're still going to be destocking in Q4 and we should still expect some kind of year over year weakness within that Precision Clad Strip business, or have the rollout plans change just any precision you can provide on, I guess the timing of improvement in that business would be helpful,

好的。這是我的最後一個問題，我只是對 Precision Clad Strip 客戶及其推出計劃感到好奇。您是否預計他們仍將在第四季度去庫存，並且我們仍應預計精密複合帶業務同比會出現某種疲軟，或者推出計劃是否會改變您可以提供的任何精度，我想該業務改善的時機會有所幫助，

Right. So, we had indicated that we would have a slowdown of that business here in the back half of this year, which we are having. It's in line with what we have discussed. We continue to have discussions with them about next year. I would say that their inventory correction, that they have shared with us, I would expect that to continue and roll over into the new year.

正確的。因此，我們曾表示，今年下半年我們的業務將會放緩，事實也確實如此。這和我們討論的內容一致。我們將繼續與他們討論明年的事情。我想說的是，他們與我們分享的庫存調整，我預計會持續到新的一年。

But at the same time, would say that we continue to have discussions with them on how long that rollover may be and how much more time it'll take them to continue to work through that. But we will still have good sales and we have good sales in Q3 good sales, I would expect in Q4 just not to the same levels that we had over the past several quarters.

但同時，我們會繼續與他們討論這一展期可能持續多長時間，以及他們還需要多少時間才能繼續完成這項工作。但是我們的銷售業績仍然良好，第三季的銷售業績也很好，我預期第四季的銷售業績不會達到過去幾季的水準。

Daniel Moore, CJS Securities.

丹尼爾·摩爾（Daniel Moore），CJS 證券。

Maybe I know crystal ball, obviously, but just what are you hearing from your customers in semi regarding outlook as we think about '25 kind of first half versus second half, and when it sounds like flattish for Q4 but it's been starting to grow a little. One might mean, when are they thinking about a potential turn or positive inflection to maybe more meaningful growth back half '25 more like '26 just, what are your discussions, telling?

顯然，我可能知道水晶球，但是當我們考慮 25 年上半年與下半年的前景時，您從客戶那裡聽到了什麼關於前景的信息，當第四季度聽起來持平但已經開始略有增長時。一個人的意思是，他們什麼時候考慮出現潛在的轉變或積極的拐點，也許在 2025 年上半年或 2026 年出現更有意義的增長，您的討論說明了什麼？

Yes, as Dan, forecasting semiconductor market has been extremely challenging for not only us, but I think, for the general market, probably over the last four to six quarters. You know, initial thoughts were that the recovery would have already happened, and we would be nearly approaching some of the peak levels that we had back in the '22 timeframe but that's not what has transpired at all.

是的，正如丹所說，預測半導體市場不僅對我們來說極具挑戰性，而且我認為，對於整個市場來說，可能在過去四到六個季度都是如此。你知道，最初的想法是復甦已經發生，我們將幾乎接近 2022 年期間的一些峰值水平，但事實並非如此。

The high computing segment has improved, but the rest of the segments have just not improved at all. It seems like wafer shipments, one of the main large customers in the chip industry indicated that wafer shipments are still down 16% from peak levels, which is a key component of what impacts our sales.

高計算部分有所改善，但其餘部分則完全沒有改善。似乎晶圓出貨量，晶片產業的主要大客戶之一表示，晶圓出貨量仍比高峰下降16％，這是影響我們銷售的關鍵因素。

And so it's just been a very, very difficult market, and very difficult to forecast, frankly, as it just continues to push out. We have seen little bit of a life led by the logic side, the high band memory side, which is all part of high performance computing here in the last couple of quarters, we would expect that to continue to.

所以，這是一個非常非常困難的市場，而且坦白說，很難預測，因為它還在繼續擴張。在過去的幾個季度裡，我們看到邏輯方面、高頻記憶體方面略有增長，這些都是高效能運算的一部分，我們預計這種情況將會持續下去。

I think have incremental growth over the next few quarters, but the rest of the chip segment, I think will continue to be, we'll continue to see, I think, flattish to slight improvement here in the next couple of quarters and then perhaps in the back half of '25 we're starting to see more of an increase but at the same time.

我認為在接下來的幾個季度會有所增長，但我認為晶片領域其餘部分將繼續保持這種狀態，我認為在接下來的幾個季度裡，我們將繼續看到持平或略有改善，然後也許在25年下半年，我們會開始看到更多的成長，但同時。

I would tell you, I mean this is a market now that we really are monitoring almost week by week, month by month, quarter by quarter, just because the last four to six quarters have not materialized to what the markets, you know, have indicated, and experts have indicated, customers have indicated. So it's just almost kind of monthly monitoring is what I think we are doing on this market.

我想告訴你，我們現在幾乎每週、每月、每季都在監控這個市場，只是因為過去四到六個季度並沒有實現市場、專家和客戶所指示的結果。所以我認為我們在這個市場上所做的幾乎就是每月一次的監控。

Nope, completely understood. It's helpful. And then following up on the prior question on Clad Strip, just remind us, you know, are there any milestones coming up that might give you a little bit more visibility into when phase beyond the current inventory management, once we get through the next two quarters, when might Phase 2 start to ramp in terms of incremental production and revenue, and what are we waiting for? What's the customer sort of waiting for that might give us a little bit more visibility as we look out, 12, 24 months.

不，完全明白。這很有幫助。然後繼續回答關於 Clad Strip 的先前問題，請提醒我們，是否有任何里程碑即將到來，可以讓您更清楚地了解當前庫存管理之外的階段，一旦我們度過接下來的兩個季度，第二階段何時會開始增加產量和收入，我們還在等什麼？客戶在等待什麼？ 這可能會讓我們在未來 12 至 24 個月內獲得更多的可見性。

Yes as you know, the customer you know, has continued to roll this product out globally. They're having good success in all the countries that they have been launching. And so I think, I'm sure you're able to read on that in terms of the rollout that they have done, one large market that they would like to enter is the US.

是的，如您所知，您所認識的客戶已經繼續在全球推出該產品。他們在開展業務的所有國家都取得了巨大的成功。因此我認為，我相信您能夠從他們所做的推廣中讀到這一點，他們想要進入的一個大市場是美國。

They have applied and they're working through the FDA. It could be that they are getting an approval towards the end of '25 it could be that it goes into '26 I mean, hard for us to know exactly when that approval is, but I would imagine that when that happens, that would open up another very large market for them, which should then have additional demand for this product.

他們已提出申請並正在透過 FDA 處理。他們可能會在 25 年底獲得批准，也可能在 26 年之前獲得批准，我的意思是，我們很難確切知道批准時間，但我想，當批准發生時，這將為他們打開另一個非常大的市場，從而對該產品產生額外的需求。

So, combination of the continued global growth that they have combined with, I think the approval and roll out of this on the US side, should lead to growth over the next two to three years.

因此，我認為，加上他們所擁有的持續全球成長，再加上美國方面的批准和推行，將在未來兩到三年內推動經濟成長。

Helpful and then appreciate the color on the architectural glass, and obviously we continue to improve the margin structure as well as the growth outlook of the overall portfolio over time. Are there any other businesses that might consider non-core or explore strategic alternatives, or, you know, at least where we sit today?

很有幫助，然後欣賞建築玻璃上的顏色，顯然我們會隨著時間的推移繼續改善利潤結構以及整體投資組合的成長前景。還有其他業務可能會考慮非核心業務或探索策略替代方案嗎？

Yeah, and we can sort of look at our portfolio, and in general we've indicated that we are very happy with our portfolio. We like the markets that we're participating in. We like the mega trends that our portfolio is aligned to, there's always opportunity of here and there, that we have some and we took, we took the opportunity here on this large area targets business. Certainly, we'll continue to study our portfolio and if there are any other minor changes we will continue to execute on.

是的，我們可以看看我們的投資組合，總的來說，我們對我們的投資組合非常滿意。我們喜歡我們所參與的市場。我們喜歡我們的投資組合所遵循的大趨勢，這裡和那裡總是有機會，我們抓住了一些機會，我們抓住了這個大區域目標業務的機會。當然，我們會繼續研究我們的投資組合，如果有任何其他小變化，我們將繼續執行。

Philip Gibbs, KeyBanc Capital Markets.

KeyBanc 資本市場公司的 Philip Gibbs。

So I'm just trying to think about some of the things that you announced today in terms of rationalization or consolidation. You have a number of things you're doing within the portfolio in North America and in Asia, and you said yourself to target longer term improvement in electronic materials.

所以我只是試著從合理化或合併的角度來思考你今天宣布的一些事情。您在北美和亞洲的投資組合中做了很多事情，您自己也說過，目標是實現電子材料的長期改善。

So, at a high level, what's the trade off in terms of top line, you may lose or margin or profit improvement, and what's the calculus behind some of these moves in terms of what you gain, and in what you may lose, leaving some of these geographies or products?

那麼，從高層次來看，就營業額而言，您可能會損失利潤或利潤率或利潤改善，而這些舉措背後的計算結果是什麼，您會得到什麼，以及您可能會失去什麼，離開這些地區或產品？

Yes. So, Phil, great question. I can tell you that on the top line side, it's very, very simple. The really, the only impact is the larger area targets business that we are divesting, and that's the roughly $10 million that we indicated. Our goal is to continue to support our customers, really at the same level, but in fact, even grow with the improved footprint on a more cost optimized footprint, as we drive efficiencies as we drive new business.

是的。所以，菲爾，這個問題問得很好。我可以告訴你，從頂線方面來看，這非常非常簡單。真正的唯一影響是我們正在剝離的更大區域目標業務，也就是我們所說的大約 1000 萬美元。我們的目標是繼續為客戶提供支持，實際上，在同一水平上，甚至隨著我們在推動新業務的同時提高效率，在更加成本優化的覆蓋範圍內實現增長。

So I think in general, I want to leave you with a message that these changes that we are making on the footprint side and the portfolio side are not really leading to top line reductions other than as I said, the divest part that that we've indicated. We've made sure that as we make these consolidations and as we make these changes, that we're working with our customers very closely, we're making sure that our products are getting qualified from the new facility that we are supplying them to. So these are actions that we are doing to drive improvements across the company and make our company a stronger company as the markets recover, not a top line concern.

因此，我認為總的來說，我想告訴你們的是，我們在足跡方面和投資組合方面所做的這些改變並沒有真正導致營收減少，除了我所說的我們已經指出的剝離部分。我們確保在進行這些合併和變更時，與客戶密切合作，確保我們的產品從我們供應的新工廠獲得合格認證。因此，我們採取這些行動是為了推動整個公司的改進，並在市場復甦時讓我們的公司變得更強大，而不是為了對營收的擔憂。

And then, as it relates to the divestiture that you mentioned in I believe it was New Mexico. So are you expected to get any proceeds from that sale?

然後，由於它與您提到的資產剝離有關，我相信是新墨西哥州。那麼您預計從該次銷售中獲得任何收益嗎？

Yes, it's so we'll receive, you know, a material amount, I would say it's not a price that we've disclosed, but they are paying for some of the assets and working capital. And we'll work through that calculation here over the next quarter and report out on that in our acquisition footnote for the K but it's, it's enough to give us a little bit cash flow and really unload a business that unfortunately was not profitable.

是的，我們會收到一筆可觀的金額，我想說這不是我們披露的價格，但他們正在支付部分資產和營運資金。我們將在下個季度完成該計算，並在 K 的收購腳註中報告，但它足以為我們提供一點現金流，並真正擺脫不幸沒有盈利的業務。

Thank you. And then believe in your slide deck you had made the comment that oil and gas started to pick up in the third quarter. It's been kind of a slow slide down there for probably the last year and a half. As recounts have adjusted. Do you think we've passed the point of bottom and we can get some easier comparisons as we head into 2025 for that business?

謝謝。然後相信您在幻燈片中所說的那樣，石油和天然氣在第三季開始回暖。大概在過去的一年半里，那裡的情況一直在緩慢下滑。隨著計票工作已經調整。您是否認為我們已經越過了底部，並且在邁向 2025 年時我們可以更輕鬆地對該業務進行比較？

Yes when I look at the rig counts back a couple years ago, it seemed like the rig counts were all throughout the year more in the 900s range. You know, last year it seemed like that they tend to be in the 800's, mid-800s even towards higher 800's. This year there seemed to be a lot more sevens.

是的，當我查看幾年前的鑽孔機數量時，似乎全年的鑽機數量都在 900 多個範圍內。您知道，去年它們似乎傾向於在 800 多一點、800 多一點，甚至 800 多一點。今年似乎出現了更多“7”。

When you look at the rig count. I mean, the latest number is below 800 or right around 800 I mean, for rig count. So I would like to think Phil that, that that we are perhaps at a point where the rig counts are towards a low point. It's hard to gage, kind of how things may play out in '25 but I would like to think that we're approaching the bottom, and would have you know better comps going into going into '25

當你查看鑽孔機數量時。我的意思是，最新的鑽孔機數量低於 800 或約為 800。因此，我想菲爾，我們或許正處於鑽井數量趨於低點的階段。很難預測 25 年的情況會如何，但我認為我們正在接近底部，並希望你能更好地了解 25 年的情況

Thank you. And then lastly, for me, you mentioned beryllium nickel starting to pick up as the commercial construction destocking subsides. I mean, I know that was a pretty material impact for you all through the first several months of the year. You clearly have enough visibility at this point to say that it's going to improve in the fourth quarter relative to the third. Is your backlog or customer indications telling you that that is going to persist into 2025 and what are those high level conversations and things that you're tracking? Thanks.

謝謝。最後，對我來說，您提到隨著商業建築去庫存的消退，鈹鎳價格開始回升。我的意思是，我知道這對你們今年頭幾個月來說產生了相當大的影響。現在你顯然已經有足夠的預見性可以說第四季的情況將比第三季有所改善。您的積壓訂單或客戶跡像是否表明這種情況將持續到 2025 年，以及您正在追蹤的高層對話和事項是什麼？謝謝。

Yes, that's been a really tough business comp for us this year. As you know, not only is that business has been a good business over the last few years, it's also a positive mix business for us and the first half of this year, I mean, we're practically at zero. I mean, very close to zero, I think in terms of our sales in that area, with a little bit of a lift here in Q3 and then, yes, there is a higher lift that's forecasted now for Q4.

是的，對我們來說，今年的業務真的很艱難。如您所知，這項業務不僅在過去幾年中表現良好，而且對我們來說也是一項積極的組合業務，而今年上半年，我們的業務幾乎為零。我的意思是，非常接近零，我認為就我們在該領域的銷售而言，第三季度會略有增長，然後，是的，現在預測第四季度的增幅會更高。

I would say our initial indications are that the inventory issue is getting better, and therefore there should be improved sales going into '25 but I'd like to see the Q4 play out and I think I'd like to have a little bit more data that to be able to call on that, and so I think we'll be better prepared to comment on that at the beginning of the year but I think the initial indications are favorable.

我想說，我們的初步跡象表明庫存問題正在好轉，因此進入25年的銷售應該會有所改善，但我想看看第四季度的表現，我想我希望有更多的數據能夠對此作出判斷，因此我認為我們將在年初更好地準備對此發表評論，但我認為初步跡像是有利的。

David Silver, CL King

大衛·西爾弗（David Silver），CL King

This is Kevin Holder on for David this morning, I want to first focus on the current expansion projects that you have underway in your electronic materials business, given the how demand has varied across your end markets this year, has there been a change in your thinking on timing of completion for the new in and Milwaukee facility expansions? Thank you.

今天上午，我是 Kevin Holder，代替 David 做客節目。謝謝。

Yes. So we have, you know, a number of different we have a number of different projects that we're working on for the electronic materials to ensure that we've got the right level of capacity that we're putting in for the next three to five year growth that we see in this market, as well as I think, we continue to work on these projects that will drive more efficiency and more cost competitive products to our customers.

是的。因此，您知道，我們正在為電子材料開展許多不同的項目，以確保我們擁有正確的產能水平，為未來三到五年市場的成長做好準備。

So they're in the Milwaukee project, which is, I think, proceeding very well. It's a big contributor to our growth in the ALD, or atomic layer deposition space. We expect that business to continue to do well over the next three to five years. We have a large project that we're doing in our Newton facility, where we have a second furnace that we're putting in place that is on track and proceeding.

所以他們參與了密爾瓦基項目，我認為這個項目進展非常順利。它對我們在 ALD 或原子層沉積領域的發展做出了巨大貢獻。我們預計未來三到五年該業務將繼續表現良好。我們在牛頓工廠正在實施一個大型項目，我們正在安裝第二個熔爐，目前一切進展順利。

And then we have a number of smaller projects, you know, that we're involved in as well at our sites and all those we are staying with those projects. We're not slowing down because we want to make sure that we have the right capacity and the right efficiencies in place as the markets recover and we can support the growth that is projected for the next three to five years.

然後，我們還有許多較小的項目，你知道，我們也參與了我們的網站以及所有這些項目。我們不會放慢腳步，因為我們想確保在市場復甦時我們擁有適當的產能和效率，並且能夠支持未來三到五年預計的成長。

Great. Thank you. That's very helpful. I guess I want to next touch on your underlying margin targets and given that you have achieved your 20% adjusted EBITDA margin goal on an accelerated timetable, how should we be thinking about what an updated 2025, adjusted EBITDA margin target might be heading into next year?

偉大的。謝謝。這非常有幫助。我想接下來談談您的基本利潤率目標，鑑於您已在加速的時間表上實現了 20% 的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率目標，我們應該如何考慮明年更新的 2025 年調整後 EBITDA 利潤率目標？

Yes, I mean, we're pleased with, I think, the progress that we've made on delivering our margin profile, but we've said all along that we want to make sure that we can do that on a consistent basis. I think in our remarks, we indicated that it's the last four out of six quarters that we have done that on.

是的，我的意思是，我們對實現利潤率的進展感到滿意，但我們一直表示，我們希望確保能夠持續做到這一點。我想我們在評論中指出，在過去六個季度中，我們已經做了四個季度的這項工作。

I wish that I would have said six out of six, and then I think we would have perhaps been having a different discussion. So I'm going to continue -- we're going to continue to manage the business and continue to deliver, and continue to look for consistent delivery of that north of 20% EBITDA margin. And then I think that'll allow us to have, perhaps, other discussions in the future.

我希望我能說六分之六，然後我想我們也許會進行不同的討論。因此我將繼續進行——我們將繼續管理業務、繼續交付，並繼續尋求持續實現 20% 以上的 EBITDA 利潤率。然後我認為這將使我們能夠在未來進行其他討論。

Great, thank you. And then maybe one last one, you continue to grow your space business, can you maybe discuss your success to date and broadening your customer base in your private versus your government customers? And then, what does Materion need to do to maintain or strengthen its market share in the space business?

太好了，謝謝。然後也許是最後一個問題，您繼續發展您的太空業務，您能否討論一下迄今為止的成功以及擴大私人客戶和政府客戶的客戶群？那麼，Materion 需要做什麼來維持或加強其在太空業務的市場份額？

Yes, space has been a very important and growth market for us in the last 12 to 24 months. We've traditionally been more on the government side. We have been, I would say, you know, really the provider of key critical materials, led by our beryllium portfolio, into the into the government space activities, commercial space has emerged as a really, really good growth area for us, for a number of our different products, whether it's our ToughMet products or other products that we supply to them and have added on to government, we have also working outside the US and Europe and Asia on various space related activities, on both government sponsored programs as well as commercial space.

是的，在過去的 12 到 24 個月裡，太空對我們來說一直是一個非常重要且成長迅速的市場。我們傳統上更站在政府方面。我想說，我們一直是關鍵材料的真正供應商，以鈹產品組合為首，為政府提供太空活動，商業太空已經成為我們許多不同產品的一個真正良好的增長領域，無論是我們的 ToughMet 產品還是我們向他們提供並添加到政府的其他產品，我們也在美國、歐洲和亞洲以外的各種太空相關活動上開展工作，既涉及政府資助的項目，也涉及商業太空。

So we're going to continue to do that. I think we've got a good pipeline of new programs that we're working on, as well as, of course, the existing portfolio that we have and as we look at this area as being one of the mega trend type of areas, so we will continue to focus on this.

因此我們將繼續這樣做。我認為我們正在進行一系列新項目，當然還有我們現有的產品組合，我們認為這一領域是大趨勢領域之一，所以我們將繼續關注這一領域。

David Storms, Stonegate.

大衛‧斯托姆斯 (David Storms)，Stonegate。

I just want to circle back on some of the cost reduction conversations that you had earlier in the call. Shelly, I know you mentioned that there's been about $15 million to $20 million worth of cost ratios already done. Just curious if there's any internal targets that you're willing to share with us, or maybe how we should think about the runway that's left here for more sizable cost takeouts?

我只是想回顧一下您早些時候在通話中談到的一些有關降低成本的討論。雪莉，我知道你提到已經完成了價值約 1500 萬至 2000 萬美元的成本比率。只是好奇您是否願意與我們分享任何內部目標，或者我們應該如何考慮這裡留下的更大成本削減空間？

Yes, thanks for the question. So I think that the way we look at that is that all the actions we've taken have been very thoughtful and deliberate. So it really hasn't been let's go into a big program, take a big bite. It's more one step at a time, kind of evaluating different pieces of our business, different parts of our cost structure, and taking those actions and kind of digesting that before we move on.

是的，謝謝你的提問。因此我認為，我們看待這個問題的方式是，我們所採取的所有行動都是經過深思熟慮和謹慎的。因此，我們其實並不是要開展一個大計劃，大舉進攻。這更像是一步一步來，評估我們業務的不同部分、成本結構的不同部分，然後採取這些行動，並在繼續前進之前消化這些行動。

So to say that there is or isn't more left. It's not an easy answer. We like how we're running today. We like the results that that's putting up, and we are going to continue to look at our cost structure for opportunities, and also at the same time, obviously, be investing for growth. So it is a thoughtful balance and something that we think we're taking a pragmatic approach to.

所以可以說還剩下或不剩下更多了。這不是一個容易回答的問題。我們喜歡今天的跑步方式。我們喜歡由此產生的結果，並且我們將繼續在我們的成本結構中尋找機會，同時顯然也會為成長進行投資。因此，這是一個深思熟慮的平衡，我們認為我們正在採取務實的方法。

Understood. Thank you. And then just turning to end markets in your consumer electronics, I know you've talked a lot about precision clad and kind of some of the destocking stuff there. Are you seeing anything outside of precision clad that gives you optimism that consumer electronics might have a bit of a turnaround?

明白了。謝謝。然後談到消費性電子產品的終端市場，我知道您已經談論了很多關於精密包層以及一些去庫存的事情。您是否看到精密包層之外的任何跡象，讓您樂觀地認為消費性電子產品可能會出現一些好轉？

Yes, I would say at this time, I think just the number of things that are going on, whether it's the typical handheld devices or even household appliances and other consumer applications, I think it just continues to be a bit of a choppy market for us, and so nothing meaningful that I would indicate outside of the precision side

是的，我想說，目前，我認為正在發生的事情很多，無論是典型的手持設備，還是家用電器和其他消費應用，我認為對我們來說這仍然是一個不穩定的市場，所以除了精密方面之外，我沒有什麼有意義的事情可以指出。

Understood. Thank you. And then just one more here, I know you're not giving guidance for 2025 yet, as we're looking into 2025 as analyst, is there anything from a seasonal standpoint that you can think of off the top of your head, that would make 2025 look unusual.

明白了。謝謝。然後這裡再問一句，我知道您還沒有給出 2025 年的指引，但作為分析師，我們正在展望 2025 年，從季節的角度來看，您能想到的有什麼事情會讓 2025 年看起來不尋常嗎？

Well, I mean I think Q4 as we know, typically tends to be a strong quarter, you know, for defense and therefore the overall quarter tends to be stronger and then Q1 tends to be a little bit weaker one from a defense side, but then also semi and consumer electronic side there's typically build ups happen in Q3, Q4 time frame, and then a bit of a slow-down in Q1. So I think I would say general seasonality, that our business experiences every year is what I would indicate, nothing abnormal to our general seasonality.

嗯，我的意思是，我認為正如我們所知，第四季度通常是一個強勁的季度，對於國防而言，因此整個季度往往會更加強勁，而從國防方面來看，第一季度往往會稍微弱一些，但半導體和消費電子方面通常也會在第三季度和第四季度出現增長，然後在第一季度略有放緩。所以我認為，我想說的是，我們的業務每年都會經歷一般的季節性，這對我們的一般季節性來說沒有什麼異常。

Thank you. As we have no further questions in the queue at this time, I would like to hand it back over to Mr. Kelleher for any closing remarks.

謝謝。由於我們目前沒有其他問題，我想將發言權交還給凱萊赫先生，請他做最後發言。

Thank you. This concludes our third quarter 2024 earnings call. Recorded playback of this call will be available on the company's website, materion.com. I'd like to thank you for participating on this call and your interest in Materion. I'll be available for any follow up questions. My number is 216-383-4931. Thank you again.

謝謝。這就是我們 2024 年第三季財報電話會議的結束。此通話的錄音重播將在公司網站 materion.com 上提供。感謝您參加本次電話會議並關注 Materion。我將隨時回答任何後續問題。我的電話號碼是 216-383-4931。再次感謝您。

Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. This does conclude today's conference, and you may disconnect your lines at this time and we thank you for your participation.

謝謝各位，女士們、先生們。今天的會議到此結束，您可以掛斷電話，我們感謝您的參與。