Maxeon Solar Technologies Ltd (MAXN) 2023 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to the Maxeon Solar Technologies Second Quarter 2023 Earnings Call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference call is being recorded.

美好的一天，女士們先生們。歡迎參加 Maxeon Solar Technologies 2023 年第二季度財報電話會議。 （操作員說明）謹此提醒，本次電話會議正在錄音。

I would now like to turn the conference over to our host, Mr. Robert Lahey of Maxeon Solar Technologies. Sir, you may begin.

現在我想將會議交給我們的東道主 Maxeon Solar Technologies 的 Robert Lahey 先生。先生，您可以開始了。

Thank you, operator. Good day, everyone, and welcome to Maxeon's Second Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call.

謝謝你，接線員。大家好，歡迎參加 Maxeon 2023 年第二季度收益電話會議。

With us today are Chief Executive Officer, Bill Mulligan; Chief Financial Officer, Kai Strohbecke; and Chief Strategy Officer, Peter Aschenbrenner. Let me cover a few housekeeping items before I turn the call over to Bill.

今天與我們在一起的有首席執行官 Bill Mulligan；首席財務官 Kai Strohbecke；首席戰略官 Peter Aschenbrenner。在將電話轉給比爾之前，讓我先介紹一下一些家務事項。

As a reminder, a replay of this call will be available later today on the Investor Relations page of Maxeon's website. During today's call, we will make forward-looking statements that are subject to various risks and uncertainties that are described in the safe harbor slide of today's presentation, today's press release, the 6-K and other SEC filings. Please see those documents for additional information regarding those factors that may affect these forward-looking statements.

謹此提醒，今天晚些時候，Maxeon 網站的投資者關係頁面將提供本次電話會議的重播。在今天的電話會議中，我們將做出前瞻性聲明，這些聲明受到今天演示文稿的安全港幻燈片、今天的新聞稿、6-K 和其他SEC 文件中描述的各種風險和不確定性的影響。請參閱這些文件，了解有關可能影響這些前瞻性陳述的因素的更多信息。

To enhance this call, we have also posted a supplemental slide deck on the Events and Presentations page of Maxeon's Investor Relations website.

為了增強本次電話會議的效果，我們還在 Maxeon 投資者關係網站的活動和演示頁面上發布了補充幻燈片。

Also, we will reference certain non-GAAP measures during today's call. Please refer to the appendix of our supplemental slide deck as well as today's earnings press release, both of which are available on Maxeon's Investor Relations website for a presentation of the most directly comparable GAAP measure as well as the relevant GAAP to non-GAAP reconciliations.

此外，我們將在今天的電話會議中參考某些非公認會計原則措施。請參閱我們補充幻燈片的附錄以及今天的收益新聞稿，兩者均可在 Maxeon 的投資者關係網站上獲取，以了解最直接可比的 GAAP 衡量標準以及相關 GAAP 與非 GAAP 調節表。

With that, let me turn the call over to Maxeon's CEO, Bill Mulligan.

接下來，讓我將電話轉給 Maxeon 的首席執行官 Bill Mulligan。

Thanks, Rob.

謝謝，羅布。

Maxeon delivered a solid second quarter with revenue growth 9% sequentially and 46% year-on-year. This growth was driven largely by our increasing exposure to the U.S. utility-scale sector. In spite of significant price pressure in the distributed generation market, we maintained strong ASPs that allowed us to achieve gross profit and adjusted EBITDA above our guidance midpoint.

Maxeon 第二季度業績強勁，收入環比增長 9%，同比增長 46%。這一增長主要是由於我們對美國公用事業規模行業的投資不斷增加而推動的。儘管分佈式發電市場面臨巨大的價格壓力，我們仍保持強勁的平均售價，使我們能夠實現毛利潤，並將調整後的 EBITDA 高於我們的指導中值。

However, we experienced a rapidly worsening demand environment late in the quarter, which unfavorably impacted our DG shipment volume and associated revenue. Kai and I will cover that in greater detail later in my remarks.

然而，我們在本季度末經歷了迅速惡化的需求環境，這對我們的危險品出貨量和相關收入產生了不利影響。凱和我將在稍後的發言中更詳細地討論這一點。

Last, but certainly not least, I'm very pleased to report that we have selected Albuquerque, New Mexico, as our U.S. manufacturing site, a major step forward for this project.

最後但同樣重要的是，我非常高興地報告，我們已選擇新墨西哥州阿爾伯克基作為我們的美國製造基地，這是該項目向前邁出的重要一步。

I'll now provide an update of our second quarter key initiatives and accomplishments in our utility-scale and distributed generation businesses. Kai will then review our Q2 financial performance and expectations for Q3 and the full year, and then we'll conclude with Q&A.

我現在將介紹我們第二季度在公用事業規模和分佈式發電業務方面的關鍵舉措和成就的最新情況。然後，Kai 將回顧我們第二季度的財務業績以及對第三季度和全年的預期，然後我們將以問答形式結束。

As mentioned above, Maxeon's utility-scale business has become our primary growth driver. We shipped over 1.4 gigawatts of annualized volume in the second quarter, 90% of which was to customers in the United States. This included Primergy's Gemini site outside of Las Vegas. Our first project in the U.S. utility-scale market as an independent company and the new record holder for the largest solar power plant in the country. Completing this 968-megawatt project was a big deal for us, and we can now shift our focus to delivering further into our 3.5 gigawatt backlog with higher contracted ASPs.

如上所述，Maxeon 的公用事業規模業務已成為我們的主要增長動力。第二季度我們的年出貨量超過 1.4 吉瓦，其中 90% 銷往美國客戶。其中包括位於拉斯維加斯郊外的 Primergy 的 Gemini 工廠。我們作為獨立公司在美國公用事業規模市場上的第一個項目，也是該國最大太陽能發電廠的新紀錄保持者。完成這個 968 兆瓦項目對我們來說是一件大事，我們現在可以將重點轉移到以更高的合同平均售價進一步交付 3.5 兆瓦的積壓項目。

We also celebrated our Mexicali Modco achieving full capacity in late June with a ribbon cutting ceremony attended by Governor Ávila and other senior government officials from the State of Baja, California. We expect that Mexicali shipments will continue to ramp up through the second half of this year.

我們還舉辦了剪彩儀式，慶祝墨西卡利 Modco 於 6 月下旬實現滿負荷生產，加利福尼亞州巴哈州州長阿維拉和其他高級政府官員出席了剪彩儀式。我們預計墨西卡利的出貨量將在今年下半年繼續增加。

Over the past 4 quarters, our technology and operations teams have delivered continued improvement, expanding factory output by over 3x and increasing average panel power by around 5%. With this solid operating foundation in place, and offtake visibility at contracted prices into 2027, the table is fit nicely for our U.S. expansion.

在過去的 4 個季度中，我們的技術和運營團隊持續改進，將工廠產量擴大了 3 倍以上，並將平均面板功率提高了約 5%。憑藉堅實的運營基礎，以及到 2027 年以合同價格承購的可見性，該表非常適合我們在美國的擴張。

We disclosed today that we have selected a site near Albuquerque for our U.S. cell and module factory, and we are very grateful for the strong interest and support extended by the state and local governments. I'm speaking to you today from our new site where we will be welcoming Governor Grisham and other dignitaries tomorrow for a press event.

今天我們透露，我們已經在美國阿爾伯克基附近選址建設我們的電池和組件工廠，我們非常感謝州和地方政府的強烈關注和支持。我今天在我們的新網站上向您講話，明天我們將在新聞發布會上歡迎格里沙姆州長和其他政要。

We are pleased to have completed our exhaustive site selection process and are now moving forward quickly to submit site-specific plans to the DOE so that they can conduct site diligence and complete environmental studies, including a NEPA review. Due to strong customer demand and the anticipated availability of sufficient infrastructure at the New Mexico site, we are evaluating the option of upsizing the scale of our U.S. factory by approximately 50% to a nameplate capacity of 4.5 gigawatts. We are currently in discussions with customers and expect to be in a position to provide more definitive information in the near future regarding the final design capacity of our Albuquerque factory.

我們很高興已經完成了詳盡的選址過程，現在正在迅速向 DOE 提交具體場地計劃，以便他們能夠進行場地調查並完成環境研究，包括 NEPA 審查。由於強勁的客戶需求以及預計新墨西哥工廠將擁有足夠的基礎設施，我們正在評估將美國工廠規模擴大約 50% 至銘牌容量 4.5 吉瓦的選擇。我們目前正在與客戶進行討論，並希望能夠在不久的將來提供有關阿爾伯克基工廠最終設計能力的更明確的信息。

Maxeon is uniquely positioned to be a leader in reshoring a solar supply chain to the United States. Our product is in strong demand due to its industry-leading performance, reliable delivery record and high ESG standards. And our stakeholders appreciate the value of our proven experience in deploying world-class solar technology worldwide, including in North America. We are highly focused on moving forward swiftly to realize this exciting project.

Maxeon 擁有獨特的優勢，能夠成為將太陽能供應鏈回流到美國的領導者。我們的產品因其行業領先的性能、可靠的交付記錄和高 ESG 標準而受到強烈需求。我們的利益相關者讚賞我們在全球（包括北美）部署世界一流太陽能技術方面的成熟經驗的價值。我們高度專注於快速推進以實現這個令人興奮的項目。

Now let's shift gears to the DG business. As I mentioned earlier, we experienced an unexpectedly rapid change in the market demand environment late in Q2. The cause of this change was high levels of industry-wide channel inventory in both the U.S. and Europe. In the U.S., the primary drivers were the implementation of NEM 3.0 in California and the effect of higher interest rates on residential sell-through and low cost of power regions such as the Southeast and Texas or sales processes focused mostly on year 1 bill savings. The NEM 2.0 sales rush in the first quarter essentially pulled in demand that would normally have been spread over several quarters. And it will now take time to replenish the top of the funnel.

現在讓我們轉向 DG 業務。正如我之前提到的，我們在第二季度末經歷了市場需求環境出人意料的快速變化。造成這一變化的原因是美國和歐洲全行業渠道庫存水平較高。在美國，主要驅動力是加利福尼亞州實施NEM 3.0，以及較高的利率對住宅銷售的影響以及東南部和德克薩斯州等電力成本較低的地區或主要側重於第一年賬單節省的銷售流程。第一季度 NEM 2.0 的銷售高峰基本上拉動了通常會分散在幾個季度的需求。現在需要時間來補充漏斗頂部。

The consequent installer backlogs led many sales professionals in California to take time off in the second quarter. And dealers are just now testing NEM 3.0 sales processes and the end customer value propositions. We fully expect the California market will regain its fundamental strength over time, but we have tempered our volume outlook in California for the second half of 2023 to reflect the impact of this policy disruption.

由此產生的安裝人員積壓導致加州許多銷售專業人員在第二季度休假。經銷商剛剛測試 NEM 3.0 銷售流程和最終客戶價值主張。我們完全預計加州市場將隨著時間的推移恢復其基本實力，但我們調整了 2023 年下半年加州的銷量預期，以反映這一政策中斷的影響。

We saw less impact from the aforementioned demand softness in the Southeast in Texas since our exposure in those states is relatively limited. In U.S. residential, we are typically most active in locations with high utility prices, roof size constraints and installer sales processes based on product quality and long-term savings.

我們看到上述德克薩斯州東南部需求疲軟的影響較小，因為我們在這些州的業務相對有限。在美國住宅領域，我們通常在公用事業價格高、屋頂尺寸限制以及基於產品質量和長期節省的安裝人員銷售流程的地區最為活躍。

The majority of U.S. DG sales were to SunPower and were in line with the terms of our supply agreement. In addition to SunPower, we now also have our own Maxeon-branded dealer channel, which is showing promising growth, roughly doubling sales from distribution to installers in Q2, although behind our original volume targets due to the demand factors mentioned above. As a reminder, the purpose of this channel is to address segments of the market not currently served by SunPower. We have increased the rate of new sales hires and dealer onboarding and expect to start seeing the results of this activity later this year.

美國 DG 的大部分銷售給了 SunPower，並且符合我們的供應協議條款。除了SunPower 之外，我們現在還擁有自己的Maxeon 品牌經銷商渠道，該渠道呈現出良好的增長勢頭，第二季度從分銷商到安裝商的銷售額大約翻了一番，儘管由於上述需求因素而落後於我們最初的銷量目標。提醒一下，該渠道的目的是解決 SunPower 目前尚未服務的市場領域。我們提高了新銷售人員的招聘率和經銷商的入職率，並預計在今年晚些時候開始看到這項活動的結果。

While we continue to maintain a net positive relationship with SunPower, as recently disclosed, both parties believe that certain provisions under the master supply agreement have not been complied with and have notified the other of such noncompliance. SunPower has alleged noncompliance of the non-circumvention clause, to which we are responding by conducting a thorough investigation and providing the information requested by SunPower as well as taking proactive steps to cure the alleged noncompliance. Maxeon has notified SunPower, in writing, that it has failed to pay approximately $29 million of past due invoices.

正如最近披露的那樣，雖然我們繼續與 SunPower 保持淨積極關係，但雙方均認為主供應協議中的某些條款尚未得到遵守，並已將此類違規情況通知對方。 SunPower 指控其未遵守非規避條款，對此我們的回應是進行徹底調查並提供 SunPower 要求的信息，並採取積極措施糾正所指控的違規行為。 Maxeon 已書面通知 SunPower，其未能支付約 2,900 萬美元的逾期發票。

As contemplated under the dispute provisions of the master supply agreement, we have engaged with SunPower and intend to work towards a swift resolution of such claims. We remain confident that both parties are incentivized to resolve these disputes in a manner that is beneficial for both parties and consistent with the spirit of the current contracts.

根據主供應協議的爭議條款，我們已與 SunPower 接洽，並打算努力迅速解決此類索賠。我們仍然相信，雙方都有動力以對雙方都有利且符合當前合同精神的方式解決這些爭議。

In Europe, overall demand is still growing, although the abundance of low-priced Chinese modules have created a significant inventory bubble in the commodity segment of the market. Because we sell a fundamentally different product and have direct access to installers, the market dynamic is a bit different for Maxeon. Having said that, the sales environment in Europe is also quite challenging, and the job of our sales team is more difficult today as price reductions are a top-of-mind theme in customer conversations.

在歐洲，儘管大量低價中國組件在市場商品領域造成了嚴重的庫存泡沫，但總體需求仍在增長。由於我們銷售的是根本不同的產品，並且可以直接聯繫安裝人員，因此 Maxeon 的市場動態略有不同。話雖如此，歐洲的銷售環境也相當具有挑戰性，今天我們銷售團隊的工作更加困難，因為降價是客戶談話中的首要主題。

In Q2, we reduced IBC prices in line with our earlier plans and made ASP cuts on our performance line panels that were more than offset by cost reductions. Even with these price decreases, we held our Q2 DG gross margins above 20% in Europe. Overall, in our DG business, our differentiated products and channels enabled Q2 ASPs that were largely within the expected range, and we hit our planned profitability levels both in absolute dollars and percentage terms.

在第二季度，我們按照之前的計劃降低了 IBC 價格，並降低了我們的性能係列面板的平均售價，這被成本降低所抵消。即使價格有所下降，我們第二季度在歐洲的 DG 毛利率仍保持在 20% 以上。總體而言，在我們的 DG 業務中，我們的差異化產品和渠道使第二季度的平均售價基本在預期範圍內，並且我們在絕對美元和百分比方面都達到了計劃的盈利水平。

To mitigate the current demand slowdown in residential, we have been allocating increased sales focus and products to C&I applications, both in the U.S. and in Europe. Due to the longer sales cycles associated with C&I projects, we expect these sales to somewhat increase the weighting of our second half shipments towards Q4 and into 2024, as Kai will explain later.

為了緩解當前住宅需求放緩的情況，我們一直在美國和歐洲將更多的銷售重點和產品分配給工商業應用。由於與工商業項目相關的銷售週期較長，我們預計這些銷售將在一定程度上增加我們下半年第四季度和 2024 年出貨量的權重，正如 Kai 稍後將解釋的那樣。

We have experienced several demand cycles in our 19 years in the solar business and have built our product portfolio and channel strategy to be as resilient as possible to the impact of such cycles. We believe that our strategy of selling differentiated products through a differentiated channel is effective, and we intend to continue to develop this strategy. Key next steps along this journey include extending our competitive advantage with Maxeon 7, expanding revenue and profit contributions from our Beyond the Panel strategy and continuing to ramp up our Maxeon-branded channel in the U.S.

在 19 年的太陽能業務中，我們經歷了多個需求週期，並建立了我們的產品組合和渠道策略，以盡可能抵禦此類週期的影響。我們相信，我們通過差異化渠道銷售差異化產品的策略是有效的，我們打算繼續發展這一策略。接下來的關鍵步驟包括通過 Maxeon 7 擴大我們的競爭優勢、擴大我們的 Beyond the Panel 戰略的收入和利潤貢獻以及繼續擴大我們在美國的 Maxeon 品牌渠道。

In summary, we strongly believe that our portfolio of U.S. utility-scale and global DG exposure is a sound strategic platform that provides long-term opportunity for profitable growth while diversifying market risk.

總之，我們堅信，我們的美國公用事業規模和全球分佈式發電投資組合是一個健全的戰略平台，可以為盈利增長提供長期機會，同時分散市場風險。

With that, I'll turn it over to Kai.

這樣，我就把事情交給凱。

Thank you, Bill.

謝謝你，比爾。

I will discuss the drivers and details of last quarter's performance and then provide guidance for the current quarter as well as updated guidance for the full year.

我將討論上季度業績的驅動因素和細節，然後提供當前季度的指導以及全年的更新指導。

Total shipments for the second quarter were 807 megawatts, up 4% sequentially and 55% year-on-year. We fell short of our guidance of 860 to 900 megawatts, primarily due to the previously mentioned unexpectedly rapid changes in U.S. and European DG demand.

第二季度總出貨量為807兆瓦，環比增長4%，同比增長55%。我們未達到 860 至 900 兆瓦的指導值，這主要是由於前面提到的美國和歐洲 DG 需求的意外快速變化。

Revenues for the second quarter were $348 million, also below our guidance. We posted healthy sequential growth in U.S. DG and maintained our ASP levels there above $0.70. In our new Maxeon-branded channel, our volume ramp was lower than expected, but higher-than-planned ASPs allowed us to exceed our objectives in terms of profit margins.

第二季度收入為 3.48 億美元，也低於我們的預期。我們公佈了美國 DG 的健康環比增長，並將 ASP 水平維持在 0.70 美元以上。在我們新的 Maxeon 品牌渠道中，我們的銷量增幅低於預期，但高於計劃的平均售價使我們能夠超出利潤率目標。

In Europe, we executed planned price decreases on both IBC and performance line SKUs, but held our price premium to market, which enabled us to slightly expand gross margin sequentially. Non-GAAP gross profit in the second quarter was $57 million or 16.3% of revenues, which was above our guidance midpoint. This was driven by strong efforts by the sales team to maintain ASPs, continued cost reduction progress by the operations team and the favorable supply chain environment particularly with regards to polysilicon and freight costs.

在歐洲，我們對 IBC 和性能係列 SKU 執行了計劃的降價，但保持了市場溢價，這使我們能夠連續略微擴大毛利率。第二季度非 GAAP 毛利潤為 5700 萬美元，佔收入的 16.3%，高於我們的指導中值。這是由於銷售團隊為維持平均售價而付出的巨大努力、運營團隊持續降低成本的進展以及有利的供應鏈環境，特別是在多晶矽和貨運成本方面。

Non-GAAP operating expenses were $41 million in the second quarter, up from $38 million in the first quarter and consistent with our guidance of $42 million, plus or minus $2 million.

第二季度非 GAAP 運營費用為 4100 萬美元，高於第一季度的 3800 萬美元，符合我們 4200 萬美元的指導，上下浮動 200 萬美元。

Adjusted EBITDA in the second quarter was $30 million or 8.7% of revenue and in line with our guidance of $24 million to $34 million. GAAP net income attributable to stockholders came in at negative $1.5 million compared to the $20 million result in the previous quarter. The difference was primarily driven by a delta of $19 million from the mark-to-market valuation adjustment of our prepaid forward.

第二季度調整後 EBITDA 為 3000 萬美元，佔收入的 8.7%，符合我們 2400 萬至 3400 萬美元的指導。與上一季度的 2000 萬美元業績相比，GAAP 股東應占淨利潤為負 150 萬美元。差異主要是由於我們的預付遠期按市值計價調整產生了 1,900 萬美元的增量。

Moving on to the balance sheet. We closed the second quarter with cash, cash equivalents, restricted cash and short-term investments of $456 million compared to $304 million at the end of the first quarter. This increase was attributable to our capital raise in May and partially offset by second quarter capital expenditures of $24 million as well as some debt repayment.

繼續看資產負債表。截至第二季度末，我們的現金、現金等價物、限制性現金和短期投資為 4.56 億美元，而第一季度末為 3.04 億美元。這一增長歸因於我們 5 月份的資本籌集，並被第二季度 2400 萬美元的資本支出以及部分債務償還部分抵消。

Following our capital raise, we began planned project expenditures for our next-generation IBC technology, which accounted for more than half of our CapEx for the quarter. Inventories expanded from $316 million to $349 million during the quarter, reflecting the slowdown of DG demand and the continued ramp of our performance line cell and module capacity for the U.S. utility-scale market.

籌集資金後，我們開始計劃下一代 IBC 技術的項目支出，該支出佔本季度資本支出的一半以上。本季度庫存從 3.16 億美元增加到 3.49 億美元，反映出 DG 需求放緩以及我們針對美國公用事業規模市場的高性能係列電池和模塊產能的持續增長。

In this current quarter, we expect continued competitive pressure and challenging demand dynamics in the residential market to hamper our growth trajectory on volume and margin. And in utility-scale, we still have some lower price bookings from 2021 to fulfill. In DG, we expect competitive pricing pressure and challenging demand to persist in residential for the remainder of the year and, therefore, expect to see a somewhat higher mix of C&I business.

在本季度，我們預計住宅市場持續的競爭壓力和充滿挑戰的需求動態將阻礙我們銷量和利潤率的增長軌跡。在公用事業規模方面，我們仍然需要完成 2021 年以來的一些較低價格的預訂。在DG，我們預計住宅領域的競爭性定價壓力和挑戰性需求將在今年剩餘時間內持續存在，因此，預計工商業業務的組合將有所提高。

With this context in mind, I'll now turn to our guidance for the third quarter of 2023 and the full year. We project third quarter shipments of between 700 and 740 megawatts. The midpoint of this guidance represents a roughly 10% sequential decline due to the softer near-term residential demand order. We project third quarter revenues of $280 million to $320 million, consistent with the expected sequential volume decrease.

考慮到這一背景，我現在將談談我們對 2023 年第三季度和全年的指導。我們預計第三季度出貨量將在 700 至 740 兆瓦之間。由於近期住宅需求訂單疲軟，該指引的中點表示環比下降約 10%。我們預計第三季度收入為 2.8 億至 3.2 億美元，與預期的環比銷量下降一致。

Non-GAAP gross profit is expected to be in the range of $30 million to $40 million, reflecting expected gross margins in the low double digits. This profile of lower Q3 margin sequentially is consistent with our previous expectations, but we now expect that our Q3 gross margin percentage will be also affected by the challenging market conditions.

非 GAAP 毛利潤預計在 3000 萬美元至 4000 萬美元之間，反映了低兩位數的預期毛利率。第三季度利潤率連續下降的情況與我們之前的預期一致，但我們現在預計第三季度的毛利率百分比也將受到充滿挑戰的市場條件的影響。

Non-GAAP operating expenses are expected to be $43 million, plus or minus $2 million, a $1 million increase from the previous quarter at the midpoint, mainly resulting from incremental investment in our U.S. DG sales and marketing team. Adjusted EBITDA in the third quarter is expected to be between $2 million and $12 million.

非 GAAP 運營費用預計為 4300 萬美元，上下浮動 200 萬美元，比上一季度中點增加 100 萬美元，這主要是由於我們對美國 DG 銷售和營銷團隊的增量投資。第三季度調整後 EBITDA 預計在 200 萬美元至 1200 萬美元之間。

Third quarter capital expenditures are projected to be in the range of $29 million to $35 million, higher than previous quarters, reflecting a full quarter of Maxeon 7 CapEx investment, which we started late in the second quarter following our capital raise. For 2023, we expect total CapEx to be in the range of $150 million to $170 million, consistent with our previous guidance, which we adjusted in May to account for Maxeon 7.

第三季度資本支出預計在2900 萬美元至3500 萬美元之間，高於前幾個季度，反映了Maxeon 7 資本支出的整個季度投資，我們在籌集資金後於第二季度末開始了這項投資。對於 2023 年，我們預計總資本支出將在 1.5 億至 1.7 億美元之間，這與我們之前的指導一致，我們在 5 月份針對 Maxeon 7 進行了調整。

As a reminder, this annual CapEx guidance excludes spending for any U.S. manufacturing. For the full year 2023, we are updating our revenue guidance to $1.25 billion to $1.35 billion and our adjusted EBITDA guidance to $80 million to $100 million.

提醒一下，本年度資本支出指南不包括任何美國製造業的支出。對於 2023 年全年，我們將收入指引更新為 12.5 億美元至 13.5 億美元，調整後的 EBITDA 指引更新為 8000 萬美元至 1 億美元。

With that, I'll turn the call back to Bill to summarize before we go to Q&A.

這樣，在我們進行問答之前，我會將電話轉回給比爾進行總結。

Thanks, Kai.

謝謝，凱。

As I have said on previous earnings calls, my goal is to help make Maxeon one of the most profitable companies in the solar industry by driving aggressive manufacturing cost reduction and operational excellence, while extending our panel technology leadership and leveraging our unique global channels to market. Despite the current industry headwinds, I am still fully focused on this objective.

正如我在之前的財報電話會議上所說，我的目標是通過推動積極降低製造成本和卓越運營，同時擴大我們的電池板技術領先地位並利用我們獨特的全球市場渠道，幫助Maxeon 成為太陽能行業最盈利的公司之一。儘管當前行業面臨阻力，我仍然完全專注於這一目標。

Looking forward, over the coming 3 years, we have a pipeline of projects that I expect will drive financial performance improvement at a structural level. In 2024, we expect to benefit from an entire year of full capacity operation in our utility-scale manufacturing facilities, selling into a firm backlog at higher contracted prices. In 2025, we expect to see significant contribution from our new Maxeon 7 capacity. And in 2026, we are excited about the prospect of ramping our new Albuquerque cell and module factories.

展望未來，在未來三年中，我們將推出一系列項目，我預計這些項目將在結構層面上推動財務業績的改善。到 2024 年，我們預計將從我們的公用事業規模製造設施的全年滿負荷運營中受益，並以更高的合同價格銷售大量積壓訂單。到 2025 年，我們預計新的 Maxeon 7 產能將做出重大貢獻。到 2026 年，我們對擴大阿爾伯克基新電池和組件工廠的前景感到興奮。

Thank you for your support. Now let's go to Q&A. Operator, please proceed.

感謝您的支持。現在讓我們進入問答環節。接線員，請繼續。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員說明）

Our first question from the line of Julien Dumoulin-Smith with Bank of America.

我們的第一個問題來自美國銀行的 Julien Dumoulin-Smith。

Julien, are you there?

朱利安，你在嗎？

Sorry, I was on mute there. Apologies. I wanted to just ask you guys about what's going on in Europe here? And how are you thinking about the IBC versus P-Series. Can you talk a little bit about where the pressures are and just confirm how you're adapting to the new evolving landscape, especially as you think about the international markets? And maybe how you think about C&I as another evolving end market to pivot into. And maybe how this impacts your expansion opportunities, if you think about leaning in the Max 7 and further DG-oriented production expansion?

抱歉，我當時處於靜音狀態。道歉。我想問一下你們歐洲現在發生了什麼？您如何看待 IBC 與 P 系列。您能否談談壓力在哪裡，並確認您如何適應新的不斷變化的形勢，特別是當您考慮國際市場時？也許您如何看待 C&I 作為另一個不斷發展的終端市場。如果您考慮採用 Max 7 並進一步以 DG 為導向的生產擴張，這可能會對您的擴張機會產生怎樣的影響？

Yes. Julien, Yes. Well, it has been tough in Europe. I think the conditions there deteriorated faster than most of us in the industry expected, primarily driven by these really high inventory levels in the commodity sector. We are somewhat immune to that because we sell with a different value proposition and sell direct to installers with a unique product, but we're not isolated from it. So it has created some pressure for us.

是的。朱利安，是的。嗯，歐洲的情況一直很艱難。我認為，那裡的情況惡化的速度比我們大多數業內人士預期的要快，這主要是由於大宗商品行業的庫存水平非常高所致。我們在某種程度上不受此影響，因為我們以不同的價值主張進行銷售，並以獨特的產品直接向安裝人員銷售，但我們並沒有從中孤立。所以給我們造成了一些壓力。

We're going to respond in a couple of ways. First of all, there's still many opportunities to grow within Europe just from a market share standpoint. For example, in Europe and Germany, the biggest PV market in Europe, we still have a very small share. So we're doubling down on our sales and marketing efforts to try to just grow the bigger -- the full pie.

我們將以多種方式做出回應。首先，僅從市場份額的角度來看，歐洲內部仍然有很多增長的機會。比如在歐洲，在歐洲最大的光伏市場德國，我們的份額還很小。因此，我們正在加倍加大銷售和營銷力度，試圖將蛋糕做大。

And you mentioned C&I. That really is a good opportunity for us. We have a lot of past experience in that sector for those of you who have been following this company for a long time. It's a sector we know well. And there is a lot of opportunity there. There are specialty applications within that sector where our high-performance products play really well. For example, in Carrefour, in building integrated TV or even in the U.S. here, particularly in things like agricultural applications where ammonia resistance of our panels is valued.

你提到了 C&I。這對我們來說確實是一個很好的機會。對於那些長期關注這家公司的人來說，我們在該領域擁有很多過去的經驗。這是一個我們熟知的領域。那裡有很多機會。在該領域的一些特殊應用中，我們的高性能產品發揮著非常好的作用。例如，在家樂福建造集成電視，甚至在美國，特別是在農業應用等領域，我們的面板的耐氨性受到重視。

So we do have other markets we can pivot into. But I would say, fundamentally, we do believe Europe is still growing. It's a bit of a plateau. We still are very bullish on the DG market in the long haul, but I think this is obviously a little bit of a bump in a road here.

因此，我們確實有可以轉向的其他市場。但我想說，從根本上來說，我們確實相信歐洲仍在增長。這有點平穩。從長遠來看，我們仍然非常看好 DG 市場，但我認為這顯然是道路上的一點坎坷。

And Julian, this is Kai. Since you also asked about the P-Series specifically in Europe. So on the P-Series, as you know, we are in a position where our costs follow a commodity price index. So basically follow the prices of commodity panels that go into Europe. And also, we have an offtake right from our joint venture, but not an obligation. So here also, we can modulate the offtake in line with our demand forecast.

朱利安，這是凱。因為您還特別詢問了歐洲的 P 系列。因此，如您所知，在 P 系列上，我們的成本遵循商品價格指數。因此基本上遵循進入歐洲的商品面板的價格。而且，我們擁有合資企業的承購權，但不是義務。因此，我們也可以根據我們的需求預測來調整承購量。

Excellent. And then if I can pivot super quickly over to the question of -- look, you've got this SunPower arrangement, obviously, in '23, but also there's some question marks on '24. Can you talk a little bit about that conversation here and the reopener? And how one could impact the other here? Just elaborate a little bit more about the situation at hand and the conversation ahead, if you will, and tie those 2 together, if you can?

出色的。然後，如果我可以非常快速地轉向這個問題——看，你顯然在 23 年有了這個 SunPower 安排，但在 24 年也有一些問號。你能談談這裡的談話和重新開放嗎？一個人如何影響另一個人？如果可以的話，請詳細說明一下當前的情況和未來的對話，然後將這兩者聯繫在一起？

Yes. As we mentioned in my prepared remarks, we have entered into a dispute with SunPower. But at a high level, we do believe that our interests are fundamentally aligned. It's a symbiotic relationship. And they've had many years of experience. They know how to do it well. We deliver a really high-quality product that is great for their channel. So we think it's a mutually beneficial relationship, and it's going to be in the interest of both parties to resolve this thing as fast as possible.

是的。正如我們在準備好的發言中提到的，我們與 SunPower 發生了糾紛。但在較高層面上，我們確實相信我們的利益在根本上是一致的。這是一種共生關係。而且他們有多年的經驗。他們知道如何做好這件事。我們提供非常適合他們渠道的高質量產品。所以我們認為這是一種互利的關係，盡快解決這個問題符合雙方的利益。

All right. But you're still expecting some amount of volumes next year. No change those conversations?

好的。但您仍預計明年會有一定數量的銷量。不改變那些對話嗎？

The contract stands as it is, Julian. So we expect that it will continue and the volumes will continue.

合同保持原樣，朱利安。因此，我們預計這種情況將會持續下去，並且銷量也會繼續增加。

Our next question comes from the line of Philip Shen of ROTH MKM.

我們的下一個問題來自 ROTH MKM 的 Philip Shen。

Just wanted to follow up on the SunPower thread there. You talked about maybe having $29 million that you're collecting and then SunPower has their allegations against you guys. I wanted to understand what the path to resolution might look like and as well as the timing. And so do you think it's a near-term type of resolution? Or do you think this could sustain for some period of time? And during that time, are additional receivables being added to the balance, and so is that increasing over time?

只是想跟進那裡的 SunPower 主題。您談到您可能收取 2900 萬美元，然後 SunPower 對你們提出了指控。我想了解解決問題的途徑以及時機。那麼您認為這是一種近期的解決方案嗎？或者您認為這種情況會持續一段時間嗎？在此期間，餘額中是否會增加額外的應收賬款，並且隨著時間的推移，應收賬款是否會增加？

Yes, Bill here. Yes, this thing has just started. So I don't really want to speculate on the trajectory that will take. I will just say, once again, this is a very symbiotic, mutually beneficial relationship. There's plenty of value here to go around. I think it's something that both parties will be certainly incentivized to resolve quickly. And Kai, maybe you could speak to the second half of that question.

是的，比爾在這裡。是的，這件事才剛剛開始。所以我真的不想猜測未來的發展軌跡。我只想再說一遍，這是一種非常共生、互利的關係。這裡有很多值得遊覽的價值。我認為雙方肯定都會有動力盡快解決這個問題。凱，也許你可以談談這個問題的後半部分。

Yes. I would say that on the topic of the cash flow, we are in contact with SunPower on that topic. We are willing to work with them. But of course, at the same time, we've got to monitor our exposure and modulate accordingly. So -- but generally, I think there is a path that we can come to a resolution there.

是的。我想說的是，關於現金流的話題，我們正在與 SunPower 就該話題進行接觸。我們願意與他們合作。但當然，與此同時，我們必須監控我們的暴露並進行相應的調整。所以，但總的來說，我認為我們可以通過一條途徑達成解決方案。

Got it. Okay. Is there a way to frame what the size of the potential exposure might be? $29 million seems like a base level. Is there an -- like what might a cap be on that number?

知道了。好的。有沒有辦法確定潛在風險的大小？ 2900 萬美元似乎是一個基本水平。這個數字是否有一個上限？

No, not really at the moment. So the number that we have disclosed, obviously, is the $29 million that is overdue, we have shipped more than that. There's other invoices out there. Maybe just one number I can give, which we have publicly disclosed last quarter, our total sales with SunPower were $79.3 million in the second quarter. So just to give an extra reference point.

不，目前還不是。因此，我們所披露的數字顯然是逾期的 2900 萬美元，我們已經發貨了更多。還有其他發票。也許我只能給出一個數字，我們在上季度公開披露了這一數字：第二季度我們與 SunPower 的總銷售額為 7,930 萬美元。所以只是提供一個額外的參考點。

Okay. Got it. And is all of that in question in terms of collections or just a modest percentage?

好的。知道了。就收藏而言，所有這些都是有問題的還是只是一個適度的百分比？

Well, as I said, at the moment, we are stating the facts here, and we are in discussion with SunPower to resolve that situation. So I can't comment about what is in question, what is not. I think we're going to come to a resolution. From our standpoint -- just to add, from our standpoint, you have seen our liquidity balance. So I think we are in a position to help our customers there to some degree.

嗯，正如我所說，目前我們在這裡陳述事實，並且我們正在與 SunPower 討論以解決這種情況。所以我無法評論什麼是有問題的，什麼不是。我想我們會達成解決方案的。從我們的角度來看，只是補充一下，從我們的角度來看，您已經看到了我們的流動性平衡。所以我認為我們能夠在某種程度上幫助我們的客戶。

Shifting over to the slowdown that you're experiencing. In your release you talked about that slowdown could persist at least through Q3. So I was wondering if you could share how long do you think the slowdown lasts and maybe speak to it from the 2 key continents, U.S. and Europe? And then could it persist through '24? And what do you think needs to happen in order for the challenging environment to turn around? So -- and there might be differences between the regions.

轉向你正在經歷的減速。在您的新聞稿中，您談到經濟放緩至少可能持續到第三季度。所以我想知道你是否可以分享一下你認為經濟放緩會持續多久，或者從美國和歐洲這兩個主要大陸來談談？那麼它能持續到24年嗎？您認為需要做什麼才能扭轉充滿挑戰的環境？因此，各地區之間可能存在差異。

Yes. So Phil, I would say, as you can see from our guidance, we expect Q4 to be stronger than Q3. So there's going to be some recovery there. Part of that is due to seasonality. I would say, having been through many of these cycles before, they actually can correct fairly quickly, not oftentimes as fast as they deteriorate, unfortunately, but I'm still quite bullish on the long-term prospects of this market.

是的。所以菲爾，我想說，正如你從我們的指導中看到的那樣，我們預計第四季度將強於第三季度。所以那裡將會有一些復甦。部分原因是季節性。我想說，不幸的是，在經歷過許多這樣的周期之後，它們實際上可以相當快地糾正，而不是像惡化那樣快，但我仍然非常看好這個市場的長期前景。

I think we will see a recovery in California. It's still a very strong market. It's a new world under NEM 3.0, but I think the value proposition still works. You will see increasing storage attach rates. It's still going to make sense economically for end customers. And so I think it's just going to take a little time for this to settle out for the inventory bubble to be bled off. And then hopefully -- no one can predict the future, but hopefully, I think the long-term fundamentals -- I mean, I know the long-term fundamentals of DG are strong.

我認為我們將看到加利福尼亞州的複蘇。這仍然是一個非常強勁的市場。這是 NEM 3.0 下的新世界，但我認為價值主張仍然有效。您將看到存儲附加率不斷增加。對於最終客戶來說，它仍然具有經濟意義。因此，我認為這需要一點時間才能解決，庫存泡沫就會消失。然後希望——沒有人能預測未來，但希望，我認為長期基本面——我的意思是，我知道 DG 的長期基本面是強勁的。

Phil, this is Peter. Just to make a note, just to be clear, we don't see an actual demand slowdown, market slowdown in Europe. The market there is growing nicely. The issue there is inventory that needs to be worked off.

菲爾，這是彼得。需要說明的是，需要明確的是，我們並沒有看到歐洲的實際需求放緩和市場放緩。那裡的市場增長良好。問題是庫存需要清理。

Our next question is from Brian Lee of Goldman Sachs & Company.

我們的下一個問題來自高盛公司的布萊恩·李。

I guess just following up on the line of question around SunPower here. I just wanted to understand a little bit the dynamics. So given the situation there, are you restricting shipments to SunPower in the near term, just given the situation of not getting paid? Or are they, I guess, reneging on contracts, should we obligate in volumes in the near term until some of this gets resolved? Kind of what's the sort of go forward here in 3Q, 4Q? Because it sounded like in your prepared remarks, 2Q came in, in line with expectations, all obligations, what kind of fulfill, but what's this current situation translating into in terms of how you're treating them over the next couple of quarters?

我想只是在這裡跟進有關 SunPower 的問題。我只是想了解一點動態。那麼考慮到那裡的情況，你們是否會在短期內限制向 SunPower 的發貨，只是考慮到沒有收到付款的情況？或者，我猜他們是否違反了合同，我們是否應該在短期內大量履行合同，直到其中一些問題得到解決？第三季度、第四季度的進展如何？因為聽起來就像在你準備好的講話中一樣，第二季度到來了，符合預期，所有義務，什麼樣的履行，但就你在接下來的幾個季度如何對待他們而言，目前的情況會轉化為什麼呢？

Yes. Brian, it's Kai. So we can't really go into all the details here of the conversations at all, so this is relatively fresh. So I just wanted to say that we reiterate from the previous answer that we are willing to work with them. That we, of course, have to monitor our exposure and modulate that we have the ability to be helpful here and also that we expect that the contract is going to be honored. And I think I'll leave it there.

是的。布萊恩，我是凱。所以我們根本無法真正深入討論對話的所有細節，所以這是相對新鮮的。所以我只想說，我們重申之前的回答，我們願意與他們合作。當然，我們必須監控我們的風險並調整我們有能力在這裡提供幫助，並且我們期望合同能夠得到履行。我想我會把它留在那裡。

Okay. But I guess just given the guidance here coming in relatively soft versus expectations and maybe versus normal seasonality this part of the year, I guess the question is how much of this is broader market slowdown, inventory rebalancing versus just this customer-specific issue, albeit I'm sure there's some demand issues underlying some of the challenges with that customer. But what part of this is just the broader market read across versus what you're trying to ultimately resolve with SunPower here in the near term?

好的。但我想，考慮到這裡的指導相對於預期相對疲軟，也許與今年這段時間的正常季節性相比，我想問題是，其中有多少是更廣泛的市場放緩、庫存重新平衡，而不是這個特定於客戶的問題，儘管我確信該客戶面臨的一些挑戰背後存在一些需求問題。但是，這其中的哪一部分只是更廣泛的市場解讀，而不是您在短期內試圖通過 SunPower 最終解決的問題？

Yes. I mean, again, we're assuming that we're going to get the SunPower relationship back on track and the contracted shipments are part of our guidance. The softness we're seeing here is largely a result of the broader market slowdown in inventory buildup in Europe. And so it's at times like these where we see a slowdown in DG that we're very happy that we are a diversified company and have exposure to the utility-scale sector that's very strong and growing.

是的。我的意思是，我們再次假設我們將使 SunPower 關係重回正軌，並且合同發貨量是我們指導的一部分。我們在這裡看到的疲軟很大程度上是歐洲大市場庫存積累放緩的結果。因此，有時當我們看到 DG 放緩時，我們很高興我們是一家多元化的公司，並且涉足非常強大且不斷增長的公用事業規模行業。

As we noted in my prepared remarks, we are -- it's the growth area for our company going forward. In fact, we're here in Albuquerque, New Mexico, at our new site. We're super excited about getting this project up and running. It will be a few years before it starts to contribute meaningfully. But in the meantime, we're also growing our existing Malaysia, Mexicali revenue for next year.

正如我們在準備好的發言中指出的那樣，這是我們公司未來的增長領域。事實上，我們位於新墨西哥州阿爾伯克基的新工廠。我們對這個項目的啟動和運行感到非常興奮。它需要幾年時間才能開始做出有意義的貢獻。但與此同時，我們明年也會增加現有的馬來西亞墨西卡利收入。

So these markets tend to be somewhat cyclical. So we believe having some diversification between the DG market, which is currently in a bit of a slump, and the U.S. utility-scale sector, which is currently on fire is a good strategy.

因此，這些市場往往具有一定的周期性。因此，我們認為，在目前有點低迷的分佈式發電市場和目前火熱的美國公用事業規模行業之間實現一定程度的多元化是一個很好的策略。

Understood. Maybe just 2 final ones, and I'll pass it on, and I hate to keep harping on this, but it seems like it's a pretty incremental development here. So I just want to make sure we're all on the same page. So what it sounds like you're saying, Bill, and correct me if I'm misinterpreting it, you are basically assuming shipments to SunPower over the rest of the year is in line with whatever your original expectations would have been prior to this kind of challenging status with the customer having arisen here recently. That would be the first question.

明白了。也許只有最後兩個，我會把它傳遞下去，我討厭繼續喋喋不休，但這似乎是一個相當漸進的發展。所以我只是想確保我們都在同一頁面上。所以，聽起來你在說什麼，比爾，如果我誤解了，請糾正我，你基本上是假設今年剩餘時間向 SunPower 的發貨量符合你在這種情況之前的最初預期。最近這裡出現了與客戶的挑戰性狀態。這是第一個問題。

And the second question is, presumably, the back and forth here is around price. Is that fair? And then what's the potential resolution if you guys need to come to some sort of compromise? Is it all just going to come down to price?

第二個問題大概是，這裡的來回是圍繞價格進行的。這公平嗎？那麼如果你們需要達成某種妥協，潛在的解決方案是什麼？難道這一切都會歸結為價格嗎？

Yes. I think in terms of the contracted volumes that your presumption was largely correct. In terms of what the dispute is about, I really can't say much more than was in our prepared remarks that there's -- the mutual breaches were discussed there.

是的。我認為就合同數量而言，您的假設基本上是正確的。就爭議的內容而言，我真的不能說比我們準備好的發言中更多的內容——那裡討論了相互違約的情況。

And just to say, the guidance is really the contracted minimum. So no upside or anything -- any additional volume. So really the minimum that is in the contract.

只是說，該指導實際上是合同規定的最低限度。所以沒有任何好處——任何額外的交易量。所以實際上是合同中的最低限度。

Our next question comes from the line of Andrew Percoco of Morgan Stanley.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根士丹利的安德魯·佩爾科科。

I just wanted to come back to the manufacturing facility in Albuquerque. So as you think through that incremental 1.5 gigawatts that you might add, very clearly it's dependent on the strong demand that you're seeing. I mean is that broad-based demand? Or could there be 1 or 2 large customers that are willing to sign as anchor tenants on that incremental capacity?

我只是想回到阿爾伯克基的製造工廠。因此，當您考慮可能增加的 1.5 吉瓦增量時，很明顯它取決於您所看到的強勁需求。我的意思是，這是基礎廣泛的需求嗎？或者是否有 1 或 2 個大客戶願意作為增量容量的主要租戶簽約？

And maybe a slightly different question on the same topic. How are you thinking about contracting out that capacity when it comes to pricing around domestic content and some of the dynamics that play with the global polysilicon prices?

也許關於同一主題的問題略有不同。在圍繞國內含量定價以及影響全球多晶矽價格的一些動態方面，您如何考慮外包產能？

Okay. Great. Well, I'll take the first end of that, and I'll let Peter talk a little bit about the pricing environment.

好的。偉大的。好吧，我先講第一部分，然後讓 Peter 談談定價環境。

Yes. I think when you think about utility-scale customers, the developers we're selling to, they buy in big chunks, right? Our Primergy customer is just a great example, 968 megawatts, right? 4 gigawatts to 1 customer for 1 project. When we think about it, it's less than 10 utility-scale customers that will contract this entire volume.

是的。我認為當你想到公用事業規模的客戶時，我們銷售給的開發商，他們大量購買，對嗎？我們的 Primergy 客戶就是一個很好的例子，968 兆瓦，對嗎？ 1 個項目為 1 個客戶提供 4 吉瓦。仔細想想，只有不到 10 個公用事業規模的客戶會承包這整個數量。

The upscaling is basically just really based on the strong market environment. And also the fact that we found this really outstanding site here that is really shovel-ready, and will have all the necessary facilities that we need for such a large facility in place in time to ramp this facility.

升級基本上是基於強勁的市場環境。事實上，我們在這裡發現了這個非常出色的場地，它真的已經準備好了，並且將擁有如此大型設施所需的所有必要設施，以便及時到位以提升該設施。

So we're in negotiations with customers. We're optimistic about it. It will be at least 3 gigawatts, but we'd like to be in a position to be able to have the land, the space, utilities, the infrastructure to be able to upscale in this really strong market environment right now.

所以我們正在與客戶進行談判。我們對此持樂觀態度。它將至少達到 3 吉瓦，但我們希望能夠擁有土地、空間、公用設施和基礎設施，以便能夠在目前這個非常強大的市場環境中進行升級。

And Peter, I don't know if you want to mention ITC or...

Peter，我不知道你是否想提及 ITC 還是...

Sure. I'd say that in terms of pricing structure for any incremental supply, but also for the baseline 3 gigawatt supply, there's no fundamental difference there in terms of our philosophy. We're looking at pricing that includes the value of local manufacturing, both at the cell and module level.

當然。我想說，就任何增量供應的定價結構而言，而且對於基準 3 吉瓦供應而言，我們的理念沒有根本區別。我們正在考慮包含本地製造價值的定價，無論是在電池還是模塊層面。

And I think we've been clear that we expect that that will be a big help to our customers in terms of getting them the ITC bonus. So there's some value of that for us. And it also would involve indexing to keep price inputs -- cost inputs for us so that our margin would be protected over time with a multiyear offtake tenor.

我認為我們已經明確表示，我們希望這將為我們的客戶獲得 ITC 獎金提供很大幫助。所以這對我們來說有一定的價值。它還將涉及索引以保持價格投入——我們的成本投入，以便我們的利潤隨著時間的推移以多年的承購期限得到保護。

And when we execute this project, we will have signed contracts. And right now, we're talking about contracting all the way through 2028 and into 2029 with these customers.

當我們執行這個項目時，我們將簽署合同。現在，我們正在討論與這些客戶簽訂從 2028 年一直到 2029 年的合同。

Got it. Okay. That's helpful. And then coming back to the size of the facility. So it sounds like it's pretty easy to add extra 1.5 gigawatts based on the land that you have available to you there. How much higher can it go before you need to start doing substantial rework around the land or substation upgrades? Just wondering what's the max capacity that we could be thinking about longer term at this facility specifically?

知道了。好的。這很有幫助。然後回到設施的規模。因此，聽起來根據您那裡可用的土地添加額外的 1.5 吉瓦電力是相當容易的。在您需要開始對土地或變電站升級進行大量返工之前，它還能高到什麼程度？只是想知道我們可以考慮在該設施的長期最大容量是多少？

I'm looking out over a field that runs flat for about 5 miles out to the mountains with nothing there. So we have a lot of space here. And -- actually, in all seriousness, we have options on adjacent parcels that will give us optionality to go even bigger if we want to. And perhaps, I think one of the things that's likely to happen in the U.S. is more localization of components of the supply chain closer to the -- where the end demand is. So I think that's a probable outcome as well over time.

我眺望著一片平坦的田野，綿延約 5 英里一直延伸到山上，那裡什麼也沒有。所以我們這裡有很大的空間。而且——實際上，嚴肅地說，我們對相鄰地塊有選擇權，如果我們願意的話，我們可以選擇擴大規模。也許，我認為在美國可能發生的事情之一是供應鏈組件更加本地化，​​更接近最終需求所在。所以我認為隨著時間的推移，這也是一個可能的結果。

Our next question comes from the line of Graham Price of Raymond James.

我們的下一個問題來自雷蒙德·詹姆斯的格雷厄姆·普萊斯。

I guess just following up on the prior question. If you do end up upsizing the expansion project to 4.5 gigawatts, would the DOE loan scale as well? And if we think about something like an 80% LTV, is that kind of in the ballpark?

我想只是跟進之前的問題。如果最終將擴建項目擴大到 4.5 吉瓦，能源部貸款規模也會擴大嗎？如果我們考慮 80% 的 LTV，這個數字是否合理？

This is Peter. We would expect the DOE loan to scale. The constraints there are typically around some of the financial metrics, loan to total value, debt coverage ratio, et cetera, which should scale with the size of the facility. Obviously, that's not a done deal yet, but that would be our expectation.

這是彼得。我們預計能源部的貸款規模將會擴大。那裡的限制通常圍繞一些財務指標、貸款佔總價值、債務覆蓋率等，這些指標應隨著設施的規模而變化。顯然，這還沒有敲定，但這將是我們的期望。

With respect to the total coverage of the loan to total project costs, we haven't mentioned that or disclosed that specifically. What we've said is we would expect that to be a majority of the -- to cover a majority of the expense of the project -- to the project cost and together with customer prepayments would be a large majority.

至於貸款總額佔項目總成本的比例，我們沒有提到，也沒有具體披露。我們所說的是，我們預計項目成本的大部分（用於支付項目的大部分費用）以及客戶預付款將佔很大一部分。

Okay. Got it. That's helpful. And for my follow-up, just quickly on the guidance, are you able to provide the breakout between IBC versus shingled maybe for 3Q and the full year? I know previously, IBC was expected about 1 gigawatt, but obviously, that's come down a bit.

好的。知道了。這很有幫助。對於我的後續行動，請快速提供指導，您能否提供第三季度和全年 IBC 與疊瓦之間的突破？我知道之前，IBC 預計約為 1 吉瓦，但顯然，這個數字有所下降。

No. No, Graham. Typically, we do not provide that guidance on a shipment or a revenue basis the breakdown. The 1 gigawatt is our internal capacity for IBC.

不，不，格雷厄姆。通常，我們不會提供有關發貨或收入基礎細分的指導。 1吉瓦是我們IBC的內部容量。

Next question comes from the line of Kevin Pollard of Pickering Energy Partners.

下一個問題來自 Pickering Energy Partners 的 Kevin Pollard。

I wanted to stay with the utility-scale just a little bit longer and this expansion in the U.S. with -- I think we've talked in the past kind of about targeted low to mid-teens gross margin for what you were bringing in from Mexico. As you think about the expansion in the U.S. and taking into account the totality of the $0.11 credit ITC value-add pricing, but also higher U.S. costs, what is a reasonable expectation for the margin of those facilities?

我想在美國的公用事業規模上保持更長的一段時間，並且這種擴張——我想我們過去曾討論過將毛利率定為低至中十幾歲的毛利率。墨西哥。當您考慮在美國的擴張並考慮到 0.11 美元的 ITC 信貸增值定價總額以及更高的美國成本時，對這些設施的利潤率的合理預期是多少？

Kevin, it's Kai. I think you already kind of put up the pieces pretty well here in terms of how to think about the margin. The incentives that we are getting -- so-called SEMA incentives under the IRA are meant to kind of bridge the difference in cost between Southeast Asian-made modules and modules made in the United States and also provide a little bit of an incentive to build in the United States and not just make it about the same margin and return-wise.

凱文，我是凱。我認為您已經在如何考慮利潤方面已經很好地闡述了這些內容。我們獲得的激勵措施——即 IRA 下的 SEMA 激勵措施，旨在彌合東南亞製造的模塊和美國製造的模塊之間的成本差異，並為建造模塊提供一點激勵。在美國，不僅僅是實現相同的利潤和回報。

And then, of course, on top of that, there is the ITC credit that we expect to be eligible for with the products, which also is going to provide an additional benefit here. So overall, we actually expect to be above this 15% long-term financial model margins for us in that part of the business. How much above the 15%? We haven't really commented on. I think it's a pretty -- it's a bit premature to comment on that right now on this call, but we do expect them to be above that marker.

當然，最重要的是，我們希望這些產品有資格獲得 ITC 信用，這也將在這裡提供額外的好處。因此，總體而言，我們實際上預計該業務部分的長期財務模型利潤率將高於 15%。比15%高多少？我們還沒有真正發表評論。我認為現在在這次電話會議上對此發表評論還為時過早，但我們確實希望它們能夠高於該水平。

Okay. Great. And then I guess on the DG side, with the shift in focus to the C&I, does that have a similar margin profile to the residential? Or is it a little bit -- I typically think of that as being a little bit lower margin business? Can you comment on that?

好的。偉大的。然後我想在 DG 方面，隨著重點轉向 C&I，其利潤狀況是否與住宅類似？或者是有點——我通常認為這是利潤率較低的業務？你能對此發表評論嗎？

Yes. C&I typically is a little bit lower margin. But as I said earlier, we typically do sell into the value segment of -- subsegments of that segment, which are things like carports and other specialty applications that command a premium. And then also from a cost structure, the format of these panels is different. They're more commercial format panel, and so they're a little less costly to make. So yes, the margin profile is a little bit lower, but they also come in bigger chunks of sales as well. So there's a little less OpEx required to move them into the channel.

是的。 C&I 的利潤率通常略低一些。但正如我之前所說，我們通常會銷售該細分市場的價值細分市場，例如車庫和其他需要溢價的專業應用。然後同樣從成本結構來看，這些面板的格式是不同的。它們是更商業化的面板，因此製造成本要低一些。所以，是的，利潤率有點低，但它們的銷售額也更大。因此，將它們轉移到渠道所需的運營支出會少一些。

Okay. And just one last quick one on the guidance. So the implied Q4 is a pretty decent step-up in EBITDA. I think I heard earlier you referenced seasonality in that. But is there an improvement quarter-on-quarter in the DG business embedded in that improvement in Q4?

好的。最後簡單介紹一下指南。因此，隱含的第四季度 EBITDA 是一個相當不錯的提升。我想我早些時候聽說你提到了季節性。但是，第四季度的改善中包含了 DG 業務的季度環比改善嗎？

If you talk on an absolute level there, Kevin, there is more shipments into the DG and margins on a quarter-on-quarter basis, we would expect them also to be slightly healthier again -- compared to the third quarter. So we will have both volume effect and the favorable margin effect that then gives us more EBITDA dollars basically for the quarter for the reasons that we talked about a seasonal, but also given the Maxeon business recovery.

凱文，如果你從絕對水平上談，與第三季度相比，DG 的出貨量和利潤率會有所增加，我們預計它們也會再次稍微健康一些。因此，我們將同時獲得銷量效應和有利的利潤率效應，這基本上會為本季度帶來更多的 EBITDA 美元，原因是我們談到了季節性，但也考慮到 Maxeon 業務的複蘇。

(Operator Instructions) Our next question comes from the line of Donovan Schafer of Northland Capital Markets.

（操作員說明）我們的下一個問題來自 Northland Capital Markets 的 Donovan Schafer。

So I want to kind of flesh out the C&I side of the business a little bit just because you are kind of a sprawling organization, you've got a heck of a lot of products to offer. And historically, there was -- you could do some larger C&I-type sales with a direct force. You talked about like agrivoltaics and stuff. But then there's also historically when part of SunPower, there was the CVAR channel, commercial value-added resellers. I kind of forget if that's still something that SunPower owns in the U.S. market or if you have your own CVAR channel in the U.S. while also having like a direct C&I channel? And then what that's like in Europe?

因此，我想稍微充實一下 C&I 方面的業務，因為你們是一個龐大的組織，需要提供大量產品。從歷史上看，你可以通過直接力量進行一些更大規模的 C&I 類型的銷售。你談到了農業光伏之類的東西。但歷史上，SunPower 的一部分也有 CVAR 渠道，即商業增值經銷商。我有點忘記這是否仍然是 SunPower 在美國市場擁有的東西，或者您是否在美國擁有自己的 CVAR 渠道，同時還擁有直接的 C&I 渠道？那麼歐洲的情況又如何呢？

And also, again, with all the product offerings, you have cases where IBC can be fantastic if roof space is limited, but then if you're talking about like a big box retail store, maybe they'll go with P-Series. And then you even have stuff that -- like the Maxeon Air panel that was going to be pretty -- was going to be lightweight so that you could go on rooftops in Europe that are 100 years old and not have to retrofit the building. There's a whole suite of stuff you've got there in kind of different channels.

而且，再說一遍，對於所有產品，如果屋頂空間有限，IBC 可能會很棒，但如果你談論的是大型零售店，也許他們會選擇 P 系列。然後你甚至還有一些東西——比如漂亮的 Maxeon Air 面板——重量輕，這樣你就可以登上歐洲已有 100 年曆史的屋頂，而不必改造建築物。您可以通過不同的渠道獲得一整套的東西。

So I'm just wondering if you can kind of update us where the bigger parts of that are? Where the emphasis is? And kind of just help us to think about it instead of -- just, again, it's a real sprawling offering you've got. Anything there would be helpful.

所以我想知道您是否可以向我們介紹一下其中較大部分的最新情況？重點在哪裡？這只是幫助我們思考這個問題，而不是——再說一遍，這是一個真正龐大的產品。那裡的任何事情都會有幫助。

Sure. This is Peter. I'll take that one. So CVAR was kind of the organized channel approach that SunPower had for many years and in fact, that -- we have a similar channel in Europe. SunPower, I believe, got out of that business some time ago. We've continued to serve commercial customers in Europe generally through a similar structure where a lot -- many of the installers do both, but some of the installers are specialized primarily in small commercial, might we say small commercial, but it's up to, say, 0.5 megawatt in terms of roof size.

當然。這是彼得。我會接受那個。因此，CVAR 是 SunPower 多年來採用的一種有組織的渠道方法，事實上，我們在歐洲也有類似的渠道。我相信，SunPower 不久前就退出了該業務。我們繼續通過類似的結構為歐洲的商業客戶提供服務，其中很多安裝人員都做這兩種工作，但有些安裝人員主要專門從事小型商業，我們可以說小型商業，但這取決於，就屋頂尺寸而言，例如0.5 兆瓦。

And as you said, there is certainly a fair share of installations that can benefit from higher efficiency, higher productivity, shade tolerance, all the things that our technology can deliver. And in addition to -- there's some owners that own the building, want a longer-term energy delivery prospect as opposed to being primarily focused on year 1 savings. So you see the same kind of distribution of buying behavior in commercial that you do in residential, and we cater to the premium part of that market.

正如您所說，肯定有相當一部分裝置可以受益於更高的效率、更高的生產力、耐蔭性以及我們的技術可以提供的所有東西。除此之外，還有一些擁有該建築的業主希望獲得更長期的能源供應前景，而不是主要關注第一年的節省。因此，您會看到商業領域的購買行為分佈與住宅領域的購買行為分佈相同，而我們迎合了該市場的高端部分。

In the U.S., we do have kind of -- I'd say, legacy connections to some of the players -- the EPC players that serve that small commercial, light commercial market. And there's also a reasonable amount of demand in slightly larger beyond the meter -- behind-the-meter applications where because of limited land space or because of expensive BOS in the case of a car park, where, again, our product makes a lot of sense. And then as you mentioned, Maxeon Air, planning to introduce that and a little bit higher volumes next year, serves a specific segment.

在美國，我們確實與一些參與者（服務於小型商業、輕商業市場的 EPC 參與者）有某種傳統聯繫。而且，在稍大的表外 - 表後應用中也有相當數量的需求，因為土地空間有限，或者因為停車場的 BOS 昂貴，我們的產品再次在這些應用中賺了很多錢的意義。正如您所提到的，Maxeon Air 計劃明年推出該產品並增加一點銷量，服務於特定細分市場。

So the C&I market's not new for us. I think what is new is the more of a bias towards that market to mitigate a little bit of slack on the resi side until that inventory clears.

因此，工商業市場對我們來說並不新鮮。我認為新的一點是，人們更加偏向於該市場，以緩解渣油方面的一些閒置狀況，直到庫存清理完畢。

Right. And I think what I would add, particularly in Europe, we don't talk a lot about it. But for example, in Italy, we already do a fair amount of C&I business. And up until recently, we have been very supply constrained on our IBC product. So it hasn't been a huge focus for us. But given that we have a lot of historical knowledge and like Peter said, some legacy connections here, it's something we feel like we can move into fairly quickly.

正確的。我想我要補充的是，特別是在歐洲，我們對此談論得不多。但例如，在意大利，我們已經做了相當多的工商業業務。直到最近，我們的 IBC 產品供應一直非常有限。所以這並不是我們關注的重點。但考慮到我們擁有大量的歷史知識，而且就像彼得說的，這裡有一些遺產聯繫，我們覺得我們可以很快進入這個領域。

He also mentioned Maxeon Air, which is still in our plans. And you're right, that could be a really excellent product for a number of different applications.

他還提到了 Maxeon Air，該公司仍在我們的計劃中。您是對的，對於許多不同的應用來說，這可能是一款非常出色的產品。

Okay. And then a second question I have is, this is for you, Bill. I watched a video clip of you from Intersolar Europe. I believe -- I'm kind of trying to recall this off the top of my head. So I might be remembering some things incorrectly here, so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

好的。我的第二個問題是，這是給你的，比爾。我在 Intersolar Europe 觀看了您的視頻片段。我相信——我正在努力從腦海中回憶起這一點。所以我可能記錯了一些事情，如果我錯了，請隨時糾正我。

But in the interview, you were talking about plans to move to topCON with the P-Series shingling. So I'm just curious if you -- if it's -- if you have any kind of a timeline around that, if that's premature? And then if there would be meaningful investments that would need to be done or if this is basically just using really the same type of slicing and dicing shingling equipment that you have? And there would just be sort of additional validation or certification work around shifting or being -- enabling to do topCON.

但在採訪中，您談到了帶著 P 系列瓦片轉移到 topCON 的計劃。所以我只是好奇你是否有任何時間表，如果這還為時過早？然後，是否需要進行有意義的投資，或者這基本上只是使用與您擁有的相同類型的切片和切塊設備？並且只會圍繞轉變或存在進行一些額外的驗證或認證工作 - 從而能夠進行 topCON。

And then lastly, just that's -- if it's just about kind of keeping up with general solar trends or if there would be any sort of special incremental technology benefits? I mean, I know -- or performance benefits? I know you get an uplift in durability, efficiencies and stuff with the current mono PERC cells? Is any of that kind of magnified or multiplied in if you started doing this with topCON?

最後，就是——這是否只是為了跟上一般太陽能趨勢，或者是否會有任何特殊的增量技術優勢？我的意思是，我知道——或者性能優勢？我知道當前的單晶 PERC 電池在耐用性、效率等方面有所提升？如果您開始使用 topCON 進行此操作，這種情況是否會被放大或倍增？

Yes. Okay. Great. Good question. Yes, our new U.S. factory will use topCON technology. It's maturing rapidly right now in the industry. So there's not very much technology risk with it at this stage. That being said, it does get harder and harder to make high-efficiency cells at -- the further up you move in the efficiency charts. Our intel is that there are a lot of companies in the topCON space that are currently still struggling with yields and costs.

是的。好的。偉大的。好問題。是的，我們的美國新工廠將使用 topCON 技術。目前該行業正在迅速成熟。所以現階段不存在太大的技術風險。話雖如此，在效率圖表中越往上移動，製造高效率電池確實變得越來越困難。我們的情報是，topCON 領域有很多公司目前仍在產量和成本方面苦苦掙扎。

Our long, long experience in high-efficiency technology actually puts us in a preferred position to address some of these issues because when we start to converge on very high-efficiency solar cell designs, a lot of the issues converge as well. And so we have technology solutions and expertise that I think can make us a really world-class topCON manufacturer.

我們在高效技術方面長期積累的經驗實際上使我們處於解決其中一些問題的首選位置，因為當我們開始集中於非常高效的太陽能電池設計時，許多問題也集中在一起。因此，我們擁有技術解決方案和專業知識，我認為這些可以使我們成為真正世界一流的 topCON 製造商。

And so that's part of our strategy. Everything going forward will likely be topCON technology. Whether or not we retrofit some of our old PERC capacity, TBD, but it could be because that product is still doing very well, being able to import that into the U.S., and we had to contract it out for a long time.

這是我們戰略的一部分。未來的一切都可能是 topCON 技術。無論我們是否改造一些舊的 PERC 產能，待定，但這可能是因為該產品仍然表現良好，能夠將其進口到美國，而我們不得不將其長期外包。

Don, it's Peter -- just in all of our technology going forward for our performance line will be topCON.

唐，我是彼得——我們的性能係列未來的所有技術都將是 topCON。

That's right. Sorry for the performance line. Of course, we're going to continue to grow and expand our IBC portfolio as well.

這是正確的。抱歉，性能線。當然，我們也將繼續發展和擴大我們的 IBC 產品組合。

Okay. And just to be clear on a couple of things. So Bill, when you said yield -- other companies struggling on yield, you're talking about the manufacturing yields, not like an energy yield or something for the cells?

好的。只是想澄清一些事情。那麼比爾，當你說到產量時——其他公司在產量方面苦苦掙扎，你指的是製造產量，而不是能源產量或電池的產量？

Perhaps a little bit of both, but yes. I think...

也許兩者都有一點，但是是的。我認為...

And then you're saying, so there would be a sort of retrofit of some kind that would be required for, say, like the Mexicali facility? Not that you would necessarily (inaudible) you're not...

然後你說，所以需要對墨西卡利設施進行某種改造？並不是說你一定（聽不清）你不是......

Let's hope not. Yes. Yes. We built those facilities just a couple of years ago, we had seen this trend coming. So we did plan additional space in the facilities to upgrade, if necessary. It's just a pure question of economics of that additional investment payback. And so we'll do that math. And when the time comes, we'll consider that. But for right now, we have a lot of work on our hands to build a 3-gigawatt factory here in New Mexico. So we're going to focus on that.

我們希望不會。是的。是的。我們幾年前才建造了這些設施，我們已經看到了這種趨勢的到來。因此，如果有必要，我們確實計劃在設施中提供額外的空間進行升級。這只是額外投資回報的純粹經濟學問題。所以我們會做這個數學計算。當時機成熟時，我們會考慮這一點。但目前，我們還有很多工作要做，要在新墨西哥州建造一座 3 吉瓦的工廠。所以我們將重點關注這一點。

And for this question, we'll welcome back Philip Shen of ROTH MKM.

對於這個問題，我們歡迎 ROTH MKM 的 Philip Shen 回來。

Just had a few on the DOE loan guarantee and the new facility. I was wondering if you could give us a sense of the timing of when that could be finalized? Are we getting closer? Could it be in the next month or so? Or do you think we have to wait until year-end or perhaps into '24?

剛剛獲得了能源部貸款擔保和新設施的一些信息。我想知道您能否告訴我們什麼時候可以最終確定？我們越來越近了嗎？可以在下個月左右嗎？或者你認為我們必須等到年底或者 24 年？

And then also, can you remind us or help us understand what the wafer sources would be? And so have you with this announcement locked in a secured supply of wafers, if you mentioned that earlier, sorry if I missed it.

另外，您能否提醒我們或幫助我們了解晶圓來源是什麼？因此，您已通過此公告鎖定了晶圓的安全供應，如果您之前提到過這一點，抱歉，如果我錯過了。

And then finally, why announce this facility today when the DOE loan guarantee has not been provided?

最後，為什麼在能源部尚未提供貸款擔保的情況下今天宣布這項安排？

All right. Thanks, Phil. Well, the site selection process, unfortunately, has taken a little bit longer than we liked. It really has been the bottleneck for completion of DOE due diligence. There's a certain amount of site-specific diligence they have to do, including things like environmental review. Also, we really can't finalize the financial model for the project until we knew the site-specific details.

好的。謝謝，菲爾。不幸的是，選址過程比我們希望的要長一些。這確實是完成能源部盡職調查的瓶頸。他們必須進行一定數量的針對具體地點的調查，包括環境審查等。此外，在了解具體地點的詳細信息之前，我們確實無法最終確定該項目的財務模型。

So that's done now. And so we expect that we're going to be able to move this project forward at a rapid clip from this point. I'm sort of hesitant to forecast timing. Perhaps Peter can give some color on that. And also Peter has been a little closer to the wafer supply situation. So...

現在就完成了。因此，我們希望從現在開始能夠快速推進該項目。我對預測時間有點猶豫。也許彼得可以對此給出一些解釋。 Peter 也更接近晶圓供應情況。所以...

Yes. On the timing, Phil, as Bill said, I think the sort of -- this is the last major obstacle out of the way here in terms of completing the DOE diligence. We'll see what that turns into in terms of timing of a conditional approval.

是的。關於時間安排，菲爾，正如比爾所說，我認為這是完成能源部盡職調查的最後一個主要障礙。我們將看看有條件批准的時間會發生什麼變化。

On wafer supply, I think our objective in the midterm on this project is to be able to source wafers in the U.S., and there's a variety of people looking at that. We're in conversations with those. But at the time that we would sign the DOE loan and give the formal go-ahead in the project, we would have all of our wafer supply locked up. That's normally the way we handle as well as the customer offtake commitments. And in terms of the why now, I would say that we have a site event planned for tomorrow, and we thought that investors would want to know about it.

在晶圓供應方面，我認為我們該項目的中期目標是能夠在美國採購晶圓，並且有很多人在關注這個問題。我們正在與這些人進行對話。但當我們簽署能源部貸款並正式批准該項目時，我們將鎖定所有晶圓供應。這通常是我們處理客戶承購承諾的方式。至於現在的原因，我想說的是，我們計劃明天舉辦一場現場活動，我們認為投資者會想了解這一點。

Yes. And I mean it does allow us to get moving, right? We will do a certain amount of engineering and maybe some long lead time risk purchases to keep the timeline moving forward. So we can't -- we really couldn't unlock all of that until we hit the site.

是的。我的意思是它確實讓我們能夠行動起來，對吧？我們將進行一定量的工程設計，也許還會進行一些交貨時間較長的風險採購，以保持時間表的進展。所以我們不能——在我們訪問該網站之前，我們真的無法解鎖所有這些。

As there are no further questions, we will now conclude the call. Thank you all again, and you may now disconnect.

由於沒有其他問題，我們現在將結束通話。再次感謝大家，現在您可以斷開連接了。