Lumentum Holdings Inc (LITE) 2025 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good day, everyone, and welcome to the Lumentum Holdings third-quarter fiscal-year 2025 earnings call. (Operator Instructions) Please also note today's event is being recorded for replay purposes.

大家好，歡迎參加 Lumentum Holdings 2025 財年第三季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）另請注意，今天的活動將被錄製以供重播。

At this time, I would now like to turn the conference over to Kathy Ta, Vice President of Investor Relations. Ms. Ta, please go ahead.

現在，我想將會議交給投資者關係副總裁 Kathy Ta。Ta小姐，請說。

Thank you, and welcome to Lumentum's fiscal third-quarter 2025 earnings call. This is Kathy Ta, Lumentum's Vice President of Investor Relations. Joining me today are Michael Hurlston, President and Chief Executive Officer; Wajid Ali, Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer; and Wupen Yuen, President, Cloud and Networking.

謝謝，歡迎參加 Lumentum 2025 財年第三季財報電話會議。我是 Lumentum 投資者關係副總裁 Kathy Ta。今天與我一起出席的還有總裁兼執行長 Michael Hurlston；瓦吉德·阿里 (Wajid Ali)，執行副總裁兼財務長；以及雲端運算和網路總裁 Wupen Yuen。

Today's call will include forward-looking statements, including statements regarding our strategies, trends and expectations for our products and technologies, including demand, our customers, our end markets and market opportunities; our expectations and beliefs regarding recent acquisitions, including Cloud Light, macroeconomic trends, including the impact of tariffs and other trade regulations and our expected financial and operating performance, including our guidance as well as statements regarding our future revenues financial model and margin targets.

今天的電話會議將包括前瞻性陳述，包括有關我們的產品和技術的策略、趨勢和期望的陳述，包括需求、我們的客戶、我們的終端市場和市場機會；我們對最近的收購（包括 Cloud Light）、宏觀經濟趨勢（包括關稅和其他貿易法規的影響）以及我們預期的財務和經營業績（包括我們的指導）的期望和信念目標）以及有關我們未來收入和利潤目標的期望和利潤目標模型的期望和信念目標模型以及我們有關我們未來收入模型的期望和利潤目標。

These statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from our current expectations, particularly the risk factors described in our SEC filings. We encourage you to review our most recent filings with the SEC, particularly the risk factors described in our most recent 10-K and in our 10-Q that will be filed soon.

這些聲明受到風險和不確定性的影響，可能導致實際結果與我們目前的預期有重大差異，特別是我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中所述的風險因素。我們鼓勵您查看我們最近向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件，特別是我們最近的 10-K 和即將提交的 10-Q 中描述的風險因素。

The forward-looking statements provided during this call are based on Lumentum's reasonable beliefs and expectations as of today. Lumentum undertakes no obligation to update these statements, except as required by applicable law. Please also note that unless otherwise stated, all financial results and projections discussed in this call are non-GAAP. Non-GAAP financials are not to be considered as a substitute for or superior to financials prepared in accordance with GAAP. Lumentum's press release with the fiscal third-quarter results and accompanying supplemental slides are available on our website at www.lumentum.com under the Investors section.

本次電話會議中提供的前瞻性陳述是基於 Lumentum 截至今天的合理信念和預期。Lumentum 不承擔更新這些聲明的義務，除非適用法律要求。另請注意，除非另有說明，本次電話會議中討論的所有財務結果和預測均為非 GAAP。非 GAAP 財務報表不應被視為替代或優於依 GAAP 編製的財務報表。Lumentum 的新聞稿以及第三季的財務表現和隨附的補充幻燈片可在我們的網站 www.lumentum.com 的「投資者」部分找到。

With that, I'll turn the call over to Michael.

說完這些，我會把電話轉給麥可。

Thank you, Kathy, and good afternoon, everyone. Before diving into our third quarter results, I want to reflect on my first 90 days as CEO of Lumentum. I joined because of the immense cloud and AI opportunity. And the more I've seen, the more confident I am that we're poised for success. Having said that, we have opportunities to accelerate revenue growth, improve margins, and focus spending.

謝謝你，凱西，大家下午好。在深入探討我們的第三季業績之前，我想回顧一下我擔任 Lumentum 執行長的頭 90 天。我加入是因為雲端運算和人工智慧的巨大機會。我見識的越多，就越有信心我們一定能取得成功。話雖如此，我們仍有機會加速收入成長、提高利潤率並集中支出。

As many of you know, part of my core philosophy is that gross margins reflect the value customers place on our products. As we indicated at OFC, we see a path to take gross margins above 40%. And meanwhile, we can and should be able to improve operating margins by cutting spending in noncore areas. At OFC, we outlined a path to drive revenue to $750 million a quarter, gross margins above 40% and operating margins greater than 20%.

正如你們許多人所知，我的核心理念之一是毛利率反映了客戶對我們產品的重視程度。正如我們在 OFC 上指出的那樣，我們看到了一條將毛利率提高到 40% 以上的途徑。同時，我們可以而且應該能夠透過削減非核心領域的開支來提高營業利潤率。在 OFC，我們概述了一條實現每季收入 7.5 億美元、毛利率超過 40% 和營業利潤率超過 20% 的途徑。

Based on my initial observations and the plan we have in place, these targets are all achievable. Our markets are growing at unprecedented rates, greater than 25% compound annual growth rate over the next five years, driven by an accelerating convergence of optics and electronics.

根據我的初步觀察和我們所製定的計劃，這些目標都是可以實現的。我們的市場正以前所未有的速度成長，在光學和電子加速融合的推動下，未來五年的複合年增長率將超過 25%。

Our strength in optical components is unmatched. We build for virtually every type of network. At OFC, we showcased our 400-gig lane speed lasers alongside our proven 100-gig and 200-gig solutions. We also demonstrated differential drive EMLs that boost signal integrity and power efficiency. We're building momentum in the transceiver market with three cloud transceiver customers already on board and more wins expected in the pipeline.

我們在光學元件方面的優勢無與倫比。我們幾乎為每種類型的網路進行建置。在 OFC 上，我們展示了我們的 400 千兆通道速度雷射以及我們成熟的 100 千兆和 200 千兆解決方案。我們也展示了可提高訊號完整性和功率效率的差分驅動 EML。我們正在收發器市場中積聚勢頭，目前已有三家雲端收發器客戶加入，並且預計未來還會有更多客戶加入。

What sets us apart is that our components are embedded across the ecosystem, even in competitors' transceivers. That means we often win regardless of who supplies the module. We're one of the few companies with true end-to-end optical capabilities from long haul to metro to inside the data center. Our scale and breadth make us a truly differentiated optical solutions provider.

我們的獨特之處在於，我們的組件嵌入整個生態系統，甚至嵌入競爭對手的收發器中。這意味著無論誰提供模組，我們通常都會獲勝。我們是少數幾家擁有從長途到城域到資料中心內部的真正端到端光學能力的公司之一。我們的規模和廣度使我們成為真正差異化的光學解決方案提供者。

Let's now turn to our third-quarter results. In Q3, we exceeded the high end of our guidance for both revenue and EPS, driven by strong demand from cloud customers and recovering networking market. Despite ongoing macroeconomic volatility, growth in cloud continues to be a key element of our financial performance.

現在讓我們來看看第三季的業績。在第三季度，受雲端客戶強勁需求和網路市場復甦的推動，我們的營收和每股盈餘都超出了預期的上限。儘管宏觀經濟持續波動，雲端運算的成長仍然是我們財務表現的關鍵因素。

Revenue in our Cloud and Networking segment grew 8% sequentially and 16% year over year, fueled by robust demand from hyperscale cloud customers. As mentioned earlier, when we execute well, the opportunity ahead is significant, and our components business is performing at an exceptional level. We set another record for EML chip shipments this quarter and remain on track to more than double this business by the end of calendar 2025 relative to our June 2024 baseline.

受超大規模雲端客戶強勁需求的推動，我們的雲端和網路部門營收季增 8%，年增 16%。如前所述，當我們執行良好時，未來的機會是巨大的，我們的零件業務表現非常出色。本季度，我們再次創下了 EML 晶片出貨量的紀錄，並且到 2025 年底，相對於 2024 年 6 月的基準，這一業務量預計將增長一倍以上。

We continue to ship 200 gig lane speed EMLs to multiple customers with our set of design wins, we're well positioned in the next generation of 800-gig and 1.6 transceivers supporting AI workloads. Our wafer fab expansion remains on track, supporting higher volumes of EMLs and other indium phosphide lasers and photodetectors. In addition, we are ramping production in CW lasers for silicon photonics transceiver applications in the quarter.

我們繼續憑藉一系列設計成果向多個客戶交付 200 千兆通道速度 EML，我們在支援 AI 工作負載的下一代 800 千兆和 1.6 收發器方面佔據有利地位。我們的晶圓廠擴建仍在進行中，支援更大容量的 EML 和其他磷化銦雷射和光電探測器。此外，本季我們正在加大用於矽光子收發器應用的連續波雷射的產量。

As our indium phosphide capacity grows, we expect to ship an increasing mix of CW lasers. In addition to supplying components into the transceiver market, we took an early lead in co-packaged optics or CPO. We have a highly differentiated ultra high-power laser that was announced as a key component in a CPO solution at GTC last quarter. We have already shipped early production units of that product and expect meaningful revenue in the second half of calendar 2026.

隨著我們的磷化銦產能不斷成長，我們預計將出貨越來越多的連續波雷射。除了向收發器市場供應組件外，我們還在共封裝光學元件或 CPO 領域佔據領先地位。我們擁有一款高度差異化的超高功率雷射器，它是上個季度在 GTC 上宣布的 CPO 解決方案的關鍵組件。我們已經發貨了該產品的早期生產單元，並預計在 2026 年下半年將獲得可觀的收入。

At OFC, we introduced the R300, a 300 by 300 port optical circuit switch, or OCS, engineered to significantly improve the scalability, performance and efficiency of AI clusters and intra data center networks. The device replaces traditional switches, providing customers significant power benefits by keeping signaling in the optical domain. Our OCS solutions built on decades of engineering expertise and the successful deployment of high-performance MEMS technology in demanding telecom environments.

在 OFC 上，我們推出了 R300，這是一款 300 x 300 連接埠光路交換器（OCS），旨在顯著提高 AI 叢集和資料中心內部網路的可擴展性、效能和效率。該設備取代了傳統的交換機，透過將訊號傳輸保持在光域中，為客戶帶來了顯著的功率優勢。我們的 OCS 解決方案建立在數十年的工程專業知識和在苛刻的電信環境中成功部署高效能 MEMS 技術的基礎上。

With over 1 trillion mirror operating hours in the field and a robust patent portfolio, our optical switches are designed for high reliability and energy-efficient performance in AI-driven data centers. At present, we have beta samples being qualified by multiple hyperscaler customers and expect to see early production volumes at the end of the calendar year.

我們的光開關擁有超過 1 兆小時的現場鏡像運行時間和強大的專利組合，專為人工智慧驅動的資料中心的高可靠性和節能性能而設計。目前，我們已有多位超大規模客戶對其測試樣品進行了認證，預計今年底就能實現早期生產量。

We're accelerating our optical transceiver production at our Thailand manufacturing campus and remain on track to begin shipments to our second announced hyperscale data center customer in June as previously communicated. At the same time, we continue to ship to our third announced customer, and we are expanding our product offerings and ramping in shipment volume to our largest cloud hyperscale customer.

我們正在泰國製造園區加速光收發器的生產，並預計在 6 月開始向我們宣布的第二個超大規模資料中心客戶發貨，正如之前所傳達的那樣。同時，我們繼續向第三位宣布的客戶發貨，並且我們正在擴大我們的產品供應，並增加對我們最大的雲端超大規模客戶的出貨量。

In Q4, we expect our overall cloud transceiver revenue to grow over 50% sequentially. We're also experiencing growing demand for our DCI and long-haul transmission solutions. We achieved another sequential increase in segments of narrow-line-width lasers essential to ZR and ZR+ module deployments and in transponders for cloud customers.

在第四季度，我們預計整體雲端收發器營收將較上季成長 50% 以上。我們對 DCI 和長途傳輸解決方案的需求也在不斷增長。我們在對 ZR 和 ZR+ 模組部署至關重要的窄線寬雷射領域以及雲端客戶應答器領域實現了再次連續成長。

This marks the fifth sequential quarter of shipment growth for narrow line width lasers. Even as we ramp additional capacity in Thailand, our shipments will not be able to satisfy demand for the balance of the calendar year. In addition, pulp lasers and line subsystems were up sequentially driven by cloud infrastructure demand.

這標誌著窄線寬雷射出貨量連續第五個季度成長。即使我們增加泰國的產能，我們的出貨量也無法滿足全年的需求。此外，受雲端基礎設施需求的推動，紙漿雷射和線路子系統也持續上漲。

Looking ahead to Q4, we anticipate strong sequential growth in our cloud and networking segment, driven by new capacity coming online across our global operations the continued ramp of customer programs and strengthening demand from network equipment manufacturers.

展望第四季度，我們預計雲端和網路部門將實現強勁的環比成長，這得益於我們全球營運中新產能的上線、客戶計畫的持續成長以及網路設備製造商需求的增強。

Now let me move to our Industrial Tech segment. Industrial Tech segment revenue decreased 5% sequentially but was up 14% from the same quarter last year. Industrial laser revenue declined sequentially, but the drop was less than anticipated, while 3D sensing revenue followed expected seasonal trends. In Q3, ultrafast laser shipments held steady at near-record levels, driven primarily by growing demand from a leading tool supplier supporting high-volume solar cell manufacturing.

現在讓我轉到我們的工業技術部分。工業技術部門營收季減 5%，但比去年同期成長 14%。工業雷射收入環比下降，但降幅小於預期，而 3D 感測收入則遵循預期的季節性趨勢。第三季度，超快雷射出貨量保持穩定，接近歷史最高水平，主要受支持大批量太陽能電池製造的領先工具供應商的需求不斷增長的推動。

We're also actively collaborating with customers on new ultrafast laser opportunities as the minimal thermal impact of ultra short-pulse technology continues to gain traction in advanced packaging display technologies and next-generation semiconductor processes. Consistent with earlier remarks, we have taken actions to rationalize the industrial tech portfolio closing two R&D sites and stopping development activities in three exploratory product areas. With these actions and more focus on the core business, we expect to see increasing profit in this segment over the next handful of quarters.

隨著超短脈衝技術的最小熱影響在先進封裝顯示技術和下一代半導體製程中繼續受到關注，我們也積極與客戶合作，探索新的超快雷射機會。與先前的言論一致，我們已採取行動合理化工業技術組​​合，關閉兩個研發基地，並停止三個探索性產品領域的開發活動。透過採取這些行動並更加關注核心業務，我們預計未來幾季該部門的利潤將會成長。

Looking ahead to fiscal Q4, we expect a sequential decline in Industrial Tech revenue reflecting both the ongoing macroeconomic headwinds impacting industrial laser demand than the typical seasonal decline in 3D sensing revenue. As I reflect on my first 90 days at Lumentum and look ahead, I'm energized by the momentum we're building. Our strong Q3 performance, combined with the strategic positioning we shared at OFC, reinforces that we're on the right path.

展望第四財季，我們預計工業技術收入將環比下降，這不僅反映了持續的宏觀經濟逆風對工業雷射需求的影響，也反映了 3D 感測收入的典型季節性下降。當我回顧在 Lumentum 工作的前 90 天並展望未來時，我們正在建立的勢頭讓我充滿活力。我們第三季的強勁表現，加上我們在 OFC 分享的策略定位，進一步證明我們正走在正確的道路上。

We're executing on a focused strategy, investing in high-growth, high-impact areas where our differentiated technologies provide a lasting competitive advantage. From delivering record EML chip shipments to partnering with AI hyperscalers on connectivity innovation, we're demonstrating that our products are essential to powering the future of cloud and AI.

我們正在執行一項重點策略，投資於高成長、高影響力的領域，我們的差異化技術在這些領域提供持久的競爭優勢。從交付創紀錄的 EML 晶片出貨量到與 AI 超大規模廠商合作進行連接創新，我們正在證明我們的產品對於推動雲端和 AI 的未來至關重要。

While macro uncertainty, tariff dynamics and export controls present near-term challenges, Lumentum has taken recent actions and delivered steps over the years to build resilience, through a globally diversified manufacturing footprint, a flexible supply chain, and active engagement with customers. We remain focused on what we can control. pricing, disciplined spending, and flawless execution. These fundamentals are positioning us to succeed across a variety of market environments.

儘管宏觀不確定性、關稅動態和出口管制帶來了短期挑戰，但 Lumentum 已採取近期行動，並透過全球多元化的製造佈局、靈活的供應鏈和積極與客戶的互動，多年來採取措施增強韌性。我們仍然專注於我們能夠控制的事情。定價、嚴格的支出和完美的執行。這些基本原則使我們能夠在各種市場環境中取得成功。

Finally, strong demand for cloud and AI continues to support our confidence in achieving the medium- and long-term financial targets we outlined at OFC. We remain on track to exceed a $500 million quarterly run rate as we exit the calendar year. There's still work ahead, but the opportunity in front of us is substantial. Our ability to deliver differentiated optical solutions across our portfolio provides a strong resilient foundation for sustainable growth.

最後，對雲端運算和人工智慧的強勁需求繼續支持我們實現在 OFC 上概述的中長期財務目標的信心。在結束這一日曆年時，我們仍有望實現超過 5 億美元的季度營運率。未來仍有工作要做，但眼前的機會是巨大的。我們能夠在整個產品組合中提供差異化的光學解決方案，為永續成長奠定堅實的基礎。

Now I'll hand the call over to Wajid.

現在我將把電話交給 Wajid。

Thank you, Michael. Third-quarter revenue of $425.2 million and non-GAAP EPS of $0.57, were both above the high end of our guidance ranges. GAAP gross margin for the third quarter was 28.8%. GAAP operating loss was 8.9% and GAAP net loss per share was $0.64.

謝謝你，麥可。第三季營收為 4.252 億美元，非公認會計準則每股收益為 0.57 美元，均高於我們預期範圍的高端。第三季的 GAAP 毛利率為 28.8%。GAAP 營業虧損為 8.9%，每股淨虧損為 0.64 美元。

Turning to our non-GAAP results. Third quarter non-GAAP gross margin was 35.2%, which was up 290 basis points sequentially and up 50 basis points year on year due to better manufacturing utilization and favorable product mix due to increased datacom laser shipments. Third quarter non-GAAP operating margin was 10.8%, which was up 290 basis points sequentially and up 1,100 basis points year on year. and driven by improved cloud and networking profitability. Third quarter non-GAAP operating profit was $46.1 million, and adjusted EBITDA was $71 million.

轉向我們的非公認會計準則結果。第三季非公認會計準則毛利率為 35.2%，比上一季成長 290 個基點，比去年同期成長 50 個基點，這得益於製造利用率的提高以及數據通訊雷射出貨量增加帶來的產品組合的有利成長。第三季非公認會計準則營業利益率為 10.8%，較上一季成長 290 個基點，較去年同期成長 1,100 個基點。並受到雲端運算和網路獲利能力提升的推動。第三季非公認會計準則營業利潤為 4,610 萬美元，調整後 EBITDA 為 7,100 萬美元。

Third quarter non-GAAP operating expenses totaled $103.4 million, or 24.3% of revenue, an increase of $5.1 million from the second quarter and a decrease of $2.4 million from the year ago quarter. This demonstrates our disciplined cost management across the organization, even as we ramp investments in our growing cloud opportunities and absorb the typical payroll fringe reset that takes place each year in our third fiscal quarter.

第三季非公認會計準則營運費用總計 1.034 億美元，佔營收的 24.3%，較第二季增加 510 萬美元，較去年同期減少 240 萬美元。這表明，即使我們增加對不斷增長的雲端電腦會的投資，並吸收每年第三財季發生的典型工資福利調整，我們整個組織的成本管理仍然嚴謹。

Q3 non-GAAP SG&A expense was $40.1 million, non-GAAP R&D expense was $63.3 million. Interest and other income was $2.9 million on a non-GAAP basis. Third quarter non-GAAP net income of $40.9 million and non-GAAP diluted net income per share was $0.57. Our fully diluted share count for the third quarter was 72.2 million shares on a non-GAAP basis.

第三季非公認會計準則銷售、一般及行政費用為 4,010 萬美元，非公認會計準則研發費用為 6,330 萬美元。以非公認會計準則計算，利息和其他收入為 290 萬美元。第三季非公認會計準則淨收入為 4,090 萬美元，非公認會計準則每股攤薄淨收入為 0.57 美元。根據非公認會計準則，我們第三季的完全稀釋股數為 7,220 萬股。

Turning to the balance sheet. During the third quarter, our cash and short-term investments decreased by $30 million to $867 million. Our inventory levels increased sequentially to support the expected growth in our Cloud & Networking revenue. In Q3, we invested $59.5 million in CapEx, primarily focused on expanding clean room capacity at our Thailand manufacturing site and increasing equipment capacity for indium phosphide wafer production to support EML chip manufacturing. Nearly all of our CapEx investment was directed toward our Cloud & Networking business.

轉向資產負債表。第三季度，我們的現金和短期投資減少了 3,000 萬美元，至 8.67 億美元。我們的庫存水準連續增加，以支持雲端和網路收入的預期成長。第三季度，我們投資了 5,950 萬美元的資本支出，主要用於擴大泰國製造工廠的無塵室產能，並增加磷化銦晶圓生產的設備產能，以支援 EML 晶片製造。我們幾乎所有的資本支出都用於雲端和網路業務。

Turning to segment details. third quarter Cloud & Networking segment revenue at $365.2 million increased 8% sequentially and 16% year on year. Cloud & Networking segment profit at 20% increased 380 basis points sequentially and increased 540 basis points year on year on higher revenue and favorable product mix. Our third quarter Industrial Tech segment revenue at $60 million was down 5% sequentially and up 14% year on year. Third quarter Industrial Tech segment profit of 4.3% decreased sequentially on lower revenue and increased year on year on higher revenue.

轉向細分細節。第三季雲端與網路部門營收為 3.652 億美元，季增 8%，年增 16%。雲端與網路部門獲利成長 20%，季增 380 個基點，年增 540 個基點，得益於更高的收入和有利的產品組合。我們第三季的工業技術部門營收為 6,000 萬美元，季減 5%，較去年同期成長 14%。第三季工業技術部門利潤為 4.3%，由於收入下降，利潤環比下降，由於收入增加，利潤同比增長。

Now let me move to our guidance for the fourth quarter of fiscal '25, which is on a non-GAAP basis and is based on our assumptions as of today. I want to acknowledge that the impact of tariffs on our supply chain along with broader geopolitical dynamics remains highly uncertain. The guidance we're providing reflects our best assessment based on the current environment. This outlook includes an estimated 100-basis-point reduction in overall company gross margin primarily driven by higher material costs and tariffs on shipments to U.S. destinations where we serve as the importer of record.

現在，讓我談談我們對 25 財年第四季的指導，該指導是基於非 GAAP 基礎並基於我們今天的假設。我想承認，關稅對我們的供應鏈以及更廣泛的地緣政治動態的影響仍然存在著很大的不確定性。我們提供的指導反映了我們基於當前環境的最佳評估。這一前景包括預計公司整體毛利率將下降 100 個基點，主要原因是材料成本上升以及運往我們作為記錄進口商的美國目的地的貨物關稅上升。

For clarity, despite this 100-basis-point headwind, we expect a sequential improvement in gross margins from Q3 to Q4. We expect net revenue for the fourth quarter of fiscal '25 to be in the range of $440 million to $470 million. This Q4 revenue forecast includes the following assumptions: Cloud & Networking to be up sequentially with strong growth in products addressing cloud and AI applications. and Industrial Tech to be down sequentially with the declines in both industrial lasers and 3D sensing.

需要明確的是，儘管面臨 100 個基點的不利因素，我們預計第三季至第四季的毛利率將持續改善。我們預計 25 財年第四季的淨收入將在 4.4 億美元至 4.7 億美元之間。第四季營收預測包括以下假設：雲端和網路業務將持續成長，針對雲端和人工智慧應用的產品將強勁成長。工業技術板塊則隨著工業雷射和 3D 感測板塊的下滑而連續下滑。

We project fourth quarter non-GAAP operating margin to be in the range of 13% to 14% and diluted net income per share to be in the range of $0.70 to $0.80 per share. Our non-GAAP EPS guidance is based on a non-GAAP annual effective tax rate of 16.5%. These projections also assume an approximate share count of 72.7 million shares.

我們預計第四季非公認會計準則營業利潤率將在 13% 至 14% 之間，每股攤薄淨收益將在 0.70 美元至 0.80 美元之間。我們的非公認會計準則每股收益指引是基於 16.5% 的非公認會計準則年度有效稅率。這些預測也假設股票數量約為 7,270 萬股。

With that, I'll turn the call back to Kathy to start the Q&A session. Kathy?

說完這些，我將把電話轉回給凱西，開始問答環節。凱西？

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Samik Chatterjee, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的 Samik Chatterjee。

Hi, good evening. Thanks for the question. This is Joe Cardoso on for Samik. I guess first question and maybe just a big picture question. I noticed you guys didn't necessarily talk about the $500 million-revenue target that you initially laid out on seeing by the end of the calendar year.

嗨，晚上好。謝謝你的提問。這是喬·卡多索 (Joe Cardoso) 代替薩米克 (Samik)。我想第一個問題可能只是一個大問題。我注意到你們不一定會談論最初制定的到今年年底實現 5 億美元收入的目標。

I guess recent performance in the June quarter guidance, how are you thinking about achieving that target by the December quarter, is there the possibility that you can achieve that a bit earlier? And what are the puts and takes to your expectations there? And then I have a follow-up.

我猜想您最近在 6 月季度指引中的表現如何，您認為如何在 12 月季度實現該目標，是否有可能提前實現該目標？您的期望值是多少？然後我有一個後續問題。

Yes. Let me take that one. This is Michael Hurlston. So we did outline that. We're still very much on track for the $500 million by the end of the year. We're obviously not guiding -- we're guiding a quarter at a time, but we feel pretty pleased about where the company is setting up. And still, as we said in the remarks, are very much on track for the $500 million-quarter.

是的。讓我來拿那個。這是邁克爾·赫爾斯頓。所以我們確實概述了這一點。我們仍有望實現今年底前 5 億美元的目標。顯然，我們不會給予指導——我們每次只會給出一個季度的指導，但我們對公司的現狀感到非常滿意。但正如我們在評論中所說的那樣，我們仍有望實現 5 億美元的季度目標。

Did you have a follow-up, Joe?

喬，你還有後續消息嗎？

Yes. Yes. Definitely have a follow-up. So maybe just talked -- maybe just touching on the datacom chip business. I think you were initially targeting a 40% increase in volumes by the June quarter. I guess I just wanted to get an update there in terms of how it's tracking relative to your initial outlook. And whether you're outperforming your initial expectations, both on the volume and ASP front?

是的。是的。肯定有後續行動。所以可能只是談論——可能只是觸及數據通訊晶片業務。我認為您最初的目標是到 6 月季度銷售增加 40%。我想我只是想了解相對於你最初的展望，它的進展如何。無論是在銷售量還是平均售價方面，你們的表現是否超出了最初的預期？

And similar question, but obviously, more related to kind of the calendar '25 outlook, it does look like you're kind of outperforming your initial expectation in terms of where you were going to track towards the end of the calendar year. But any kind of color in terms of how you're thinking about ASPs trending there? And then sorry for the long question, but just curious like what's the contribution that you're expecting from CW lasers now that you're talking about ramping those up as well as EML. Thanks.

類似的問題，但顯然，與 25 年日曆的展望有關，就您在日曆年末的追蹤情況而言，您的表現確實超出了最初的預期。但是，就您認為 ASP 的趨勢而言，有哪種顏色嗎？抱歉，問題這麼長，但我只是好奇，既然您談到了提升 CW 雷射和 EML 的性能，那麼您對 CW 雷射的貢獻有何期待？謝謝。

Yes, I'm going to take the first part of the call for a question and then turn it over to Wupen. So what I would say, look, we're obviously tracking very well. We've increased our capacity in the Indian phosphide fabs. We feel like demand is still outstripping supply on or EMLs. So even as we ramp supply we're still very much sold out.

是的，我將接聽電話的第一部分提問，然後將其交給 Wupen。所以我想說的是，看，我們顯然跟踪得很好。我們提高了印度磷化物工廠的產能。我們感覺 EML 的需求仍然超過供應。因此，即使我們增加了供應量，仍然銷售一空。

That being said, as we increase the capacity, we feel like there's room to add CW into the mix. And the reason for that is it really extends our serviceable market. So we feel like we want to do that to get a foot in that door. Our design, we think, is differentiated and gives us an opportunity to meaningfully participate in CW.

話雖如此，隨著我們增加容量，我們覺得有空間將 CW 添加到組合中。原因是它確實擴大了我們的服務市場。所以我們覺得我們想這樣做，以便踏出這一步。我們認為，我們的設計是與眾不同的，並為我們提供了有意義地參與 CW 的機會。

But the predominant focus is and remains EMLs. From an ASP standpoint, again, given the supply constraints, obviously, there's opportunities there to continue to maximize our price. And we're looking at that. We have opportunities as we think about now transitioning from 100 gig to 200 gig lasers and obviously going up to 400 gig.

但主要焦點仍是 EML。從 ASP 的角度來看，同樣，考慮到供應限制，顯然有機會繼續最大化我們的價格。我們正在研究這個問題。我們現在考慮從 100 千兆過渡到 200 千兆雷射器，顯然還要上升到 400 千兆，這時我們就有機會了。

But maybe Wupen, you want to add some color on the tech and how we think about it.

但也許 Wupen，你想為這項技術以及我們對它的看法添加一些色彩。

Yes. So I'll just comment a little bit on the CFO laser ramp. We're at the very beginning, right? We just won a couple of customers at CFO lasers, as Michael pointed out. plus our fab capacity continue to be ramping up. We would like to be able to play in that market which increase our TAM. So we're at a very issue phase of the ramping. Not huge numbers yet, but we will continue to see that volume going up as time goes by.

是的。因此，我只想對 CFO 雷射坡道發表一點評論。我們才剛開始，對吧？正如邁克爾指出的那樣，我們剛剛在 CFO 雷射器領域贏得了幾個客戶。此外，我們的晶圓廠產能也持續提升。我們希望能夠在該市場中發揮作用，從而增加我們的 TAM。因此，我們正處於成長的一個非常關鍵的階段。目前這個數字還不是很大，但隨著時間的推移，我們會看到這個數量不斷上升。

Thanks, Joe.

謝謝，喬。

Thanks, guys. Appreciate it.

謝謝大家。非常感謝。

Simon Leopold, Raymond James.

西蒙李奧波德、雷蒙詹姆斯。

Thank you very much. I wanted to see if you could maybe unpack what in your assumptions around the tariff headwind, you quantified it around 100 basis points, which we appreciate. I guess what I'm trying to get at is trying to get a sense of how much business or manufacturing do you still have in China in that assumption? I understand you're moving more to Thailand. And what are the other underlying assumptions you've made? And then I've got a quick follow-up.

非常感謝。我想看看您是否可以解釋一下您對關稅逆風的假設，您將其量化為 100 個基點左右，我們對此表示讚賞。我想我想表達的是，在這種假設下，你在中國還有多少業務或製造業？我了解到您更多地搬到泰國。您還做出了哪些其他基本假設？然後我有一個快速的跟進。

Yes. Sure, Simon. I'll start off and then certainly Wupen and Michael can jump in. Yes. So like you mentioned in our prepared remarks, we did talk about the 100-basis-point headwind to gross margins and therefore, operating margins during the quarter. A lot of that headwind is coming from increased component costs in-feed costs where we are having to pay the tariff associated with sub-mount products as well as capacitors. And so wherever we see that we're having to pay a tariff associated with that.

是的。當然，西蒙。我先開始，然後當然是 Wupen 和 Michael 可以加入。是的。因此，就像您在我們準備好的評論中提到的那樣，我們確實談到了本季毛利率和營業利潤率面臨的 100 個基點的阻力。許多不利因素來自於零件成本的增加，包括進料成本，我們必須支付與底座產品和電容器相關的關稅。因此，無論我們看到什麼，我們都必須支付與之相關的關稅。

For most of our customers, we are trying to move our production from China into our Nava facility in Thailand. . We're starting off with our data center interconnect products, but we are eventually going to also be moving products from our downgone facility for cloud modules into Nava as well. So what we've baked into the forecast right now is our current production ramp for the quarter. but we'll see improvements in that in our fiscal Q1 and Q2 as more of our Dongguan production moves to our Nava facility for cloud modules. So certainly, the impact from that perspective will diminish.

對於我們的大多數客戶，我們正嘗試將生產從中國轉移到泰國的 Nava 工廠。。我們從資料中心互連產品開始，但最終我們也會將產品從我們已關閉的雲端模組設施轉移到 Nava。因此，我們現在納入預測的是本季的當前產量成長。但隨著我們東莞的更多生產轉移到 Nava 雲端模組工廠，我們將在第一季和第二季看到這種情況的改善。因此，從這個角度來看，影響肯定會減少。

Thanks. And then just as my follow-up, longer-term question is I'd like to get your latest thinking on what contributions and what role you can play in CPO. It was nice to see that you were announced within the ecosystem back in March. I assume you're providing products like CW lasers, but we can get an idea of maybe some dollar content and forecasting of how you see this affecting your business over the intermediate or longer term? Thank you.

謝謝。然後，正如我的後續問題一樣，我想了解您對在 CPO 中可以發揮什麼貢獻和發揮什麼作用的最新想法。很高興看到你們在三月被宣布加入生態系統。我假設您提供的產品是 CW 雷射之類的產品，但我們可以了解其美元含量，並預測這對您中期或長期的業務有何影響？謝謝。

Simon, this is Wupen speaking. I think the CPO, frankly speaking, the deal some time away, right? We talk about ramp volume in the second half of the next calendar year. number one. So therefore, in the meantime, the module is going to continue to be a ramping business for us. That's going to be a foreseeable strong growing business for us and for the industry to come.

西蒙，我是吳彭。坦白說，我認為 CPO 還需要一段時間才能達成協議，對嗎？我們討論的是下一日曆年下半年的產量成長。第一。因此，與此同時，該模組將繼續成為我們蓬勃發展的業務。對於我們和未來的產業來說，這將是一個可預見的強勁成長業務。

On the other hand, in addition to the laser being an important component in the CPO ecosystem, we're also looking at adding other components in the longer term. There will be other optical chips that will be needed in the CPO world in the longer term. that's very much we're actually looking into as well. But I would say that's really a multiyear prospect. In the near term, there'll be the laser components plus the cloud module ramping in the cloud interconnect world.

另一方面，除了雷射作為 CPO 生態系統的重要組成部分之外，我們還在考慮在長期內添加其他組件。從長遠來看，CPO 領域還需要其他光學晶片。我們實際上也在研究這個問題。但我想說這確實是一個多年的前景。短期內，雷射組件和雲模組將在雲互連領域蓬勃發展。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Thank you so much, Simon.

非常感謝，西蒙。

Blayne Curtis, Jefferies.

布萊恩‧柯蒂斯，傑富瑞集團。

Hi, this is Rainier on for Blayne. Thanks for taking my question. Just a quick one and then probably a follow-up. Just look at the transceiver business, 50%-plus growth for next quarter is great, and clearly, a lot of traction. Can you talk about what you're seeing there from an EML versus CW laser perspective and a plan for in-sourcing versus externally sourcing there?

大家好，我是 Rainier，為 Blayne 服務。感謝您回答我的問題。只是一個快速的回答，然後可能會有後續問題。看看收發器業務，下個季度 50% 以上的成長是巨大的，而且顯然具有很大的發展動力。您能否從 EML 與 CW 雷射的角度談談您所看到的情況以及內部採購與外部採購的計劃？

Yes. Near term, all of our products are using CW lasers. So we're using silicon photonics approach for all of that, including all the revenue growth that you just cited. And all of it actually is externally sourced. So we have not yet incorporated our own lasers in our transceivers, but we would expect to do that sometime early in the calendar year next year. That's kind of the plan. We obviously have a number of big ramps in front of us with multiple customers that we talked about, but our next phase of growth will incorporate our internal lasers.

是的。近期，我們所有的產品都將使用連續波雷射。因此，我們正在使用矽光子學方法來實現所有這些目標，包括您剛才提到的所有收入成長。而實際上所有這些都是來自外部的。因此，我們尚未在收發器中加入我們自己的雷射器，但我們預計將在明年年初的某個時候實現這一目標。這就是計劃。顯然，我們面前有許多大型坡道，我們談到了多個客戶，但我們下一階段的成長將融入我們的內部雷射。

Wupen, anything to add? Okay. Good. Thanks for the question.

Wupen，還有什麼要補充的嗎？好的。好的。謝謝你的提問。

Do you have a follow-up?

你有後續行動嗎？

So there would be three customers all using CW lasers, just kind of wondering what that means for the industry in terms of what you're seeing from people choosing CW or EML?

因此，會有三位客戶都使用 CW 雷射器，我只是想知道，就您看到人們選擇 CW 或 EML 而言，這對行業意味著什麼？

Yes. I mean, obviously, as we talked about a second ago, our EML are very much sold out. In fact, it really is a chase for us to keep up with the demand. We are basically choosing to allocate our supply toward EML, one, because of differentiation, two, because of pricing. So we've really focused our capacity as much as we possibly can on the EML product. As we said, we're really increasing the capacity quarter on quarter, year on year.

是的。我的意思是，顯然，正如我們剛才談到的，我們的 EML 已經售罄了。事實上，為了滿足需求，我們確實在不斷追求。我們基本上選擇將我們的供應分配給 EML，一是因為差異化，二是因為定價。因此，我們確實盡可能地將精力集中在 EML 產品上。正如我們所說，我們的產能確實在逐季、逐年增加。

And as we sort of hit a space where we think we have a bit of room. We think there's an opportunity now to reallocate just a bit toward CW so we can start participating in that market. First, externally, right? We'll source those to third-party transceiver customers. But then strategically, to your point, we will begin in-sourcing those. So it will be mostly CW that we end up in-sourcing, and that's why strategically, it is important for us to develop that muscle.

當我們到達一個我們認為還有一點空間的地方。我們認為現在有機會向 CW 重新分配一點資金，以便我們能夠開始參與該市場。首先，從外部來看，對嗎？我們將把這些產品提供給第三方收發器客戶。但從策略上來說，正如您所說，我們將開始內部採購這些產品。因此，我們最終將主要採購 CW，這就是為什麼從戰略上講，發展這一實力對我們來說很重要。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Meta Marshall, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的 Meta Marshall。

Great. Thanks. Wupen, maybe just some clarity on the margin improvement that you saw on Cloud & Networking business. How much of that is from some of the yield improvements on cloud light versus just kind of pricing mix advantages on EMLs? And then I have a second question.

偉大的。謝謝。Wupen，也許您只是想澄清一下您在雲端和網路業務上看到的利潤率提高。其中有多少是來自雲光的收益改進，還是僅來自 EML 的定價組合優勢？我還有第二個問題。

Yes, sure, Meta. I mean we're seeing across all the product lines, a nudge of improvement, I would say. On our data center interconnect products, we are moving a lot of that production from CMs to our own internal manufacturing in Thailand. And so the margin dollars that used to accrue to them are now accruing to us. So that's certainly helping us both in Q3 and more substantially in Q4.

是的，當然，Meta。我的意思是，我們看到所有產品線都出現了輕微的改善。對於我們的資料中心互連產品，我們正在將大量生產從 CM 轉移到我們在泰國的內部製造。因此，過去歸他們所有的保證金現在都歸我們所有。所以這肯定會對我們在第三季和第四季的業績產生更大的幫助。

And actually, we expect to increase that capacity moving into the back half of the calendar year. So that will continue to benefit us. On the datacom chip side, Michael and Wupen both mentioned earlier, that demand is ahead of supply. And so as that production has improved year over year and sequentially, that's also providing a tailwind for us.

實際上，我們預計在下半年會增加產能。因此這將繼續使我們受益。在數據通訊晶片方面，Michael 和 Wupen 之前都提到，需求超過供應。因此，隨著產量逐年提高，這也為我們提供了順風。

To your earlier question on modules, to the first part of your question on modules, yes, yields have improved. And so the yield issue that we had in our December quarter, which caused a bit of a headwind on our gross margin line, that situation has improved into Q3, and that certainly helped us and into Q4, that's also helping us, especially as revenues are expected to increase 50% sequentially the benefit of improved yields are accruing to our gross margin. So I'd say kind of across the board, we're seeing a nudge of improvement across multiple product lines, and that's helping us.

對於您之前關於模組的問題，對於您關於模組的問題的第一部分，是的，收益率已經提高。因此，我們在 12 月季度遇到的收益率問題對我們的毛利率造成了一些阻力，這種情況在第三季度有所改善，這無疑對我們有幫助，在第四季度也對我們有幫助，特別是預計收入將環比增長 50%，收益率提高的好處正在累積到我們的毛利率中。所以我想說，從整體來看，我們看到多個產品線都有改善，這對我們有幫助。

And Meta, I mean, just from a perspective, we said this in the prepared remarks, but we're going to continue to focus on gross margin. I think there's opportunity on pricing and on our cost line to continue to improve that. So we'd expect a pretty nice ramp toward the 40% target that Wajid outlined at OFC.

至於 Meta，我的意思是，僅從某個角度來看，我們在準備好的評論中提到了這一點，但我們將繼續關注毛利率。我認為我們在定價和成本方面還有機會繼續改進。因此，我們預計該數字將穩定上升，接近 Wajid 在 OFC 上提出的 40% 的目標。

Okay. Got it. And just as a second question, obviously, a very fluid situation with tariffs currently. But assuming kind of the 100-basis-point headwind that you guys are talking about is within that kind of 90-day exemption period kind of considering current tariffs as of that. I'm just kind of wondering what your thinking is, if there are kind of greater tariffs that come from Thailand, just our thoughts about eventually moving production out of Thailand. It sounds like you're moving more production there for now, but just kind of overall thinking if there ends up being tariffs on Thailand. Thanks.

好的。知道了。第二個問題，顯然，目前關稅狀況非常不穩定。但假設你們談論的 100 個基點的逆風是在 90 天的豁免期內，考慮到當時的現行關稅。我只是有點想知道您的想法，如果泰國徵收更高的關稅，我們最終會考慮將生產轉移出泰國。聽起來你們現在正在將更多的生產轉移到那裡，但如果最終對泰國徵收關稅，這只是總體考慮。謝謝。

Yes. I mean, obviously, if there are tariffs on Thailand that will have a headwind that we'll have to work through. Yes, we are moving more of our production to Thailand, whether it's from RCM to us or whether it's from our cloud module business in Dongguan, China to us in Thailand. So we are making that manufacturing shift that's been in place for a number of quarters now. And so I think from an infrastructure and strategy standpoint, that certainly is there.

是的。我的意思是，顯然，如果對泰國徵收關稅，我們將不得不克服這種阻力。是的，我們正在將更多的生產轉移到泰國，無論是從 RCM 轉移到我們，還是從我們位於中國東莞的雲端模組業務轉移到我們在泰國的工廠。因此，我們正在進行已經實施了多個季度的製造業轉變。因此我認為從基礎設施和策略的角度來看，這肯定是存在的。

If there's tariffs that accrue post kind of July 8 because of that, then we'll have to work through that with our customers. And as you can appreciate, as there's been noise on tariffs, we've been speaking to our customers about how we work through the pricing impact to them that is associated with those tariffs. But up until now, for the large part, most of our shipments that come to the U.S., we are not the importer of record. And because we are not the importer of record, those conversations have been a lot simpler, I'd say.

如果因此而在 7 月 8 日之後產生關稅，那麼我們就必須與客戶一起解決這個問題。正如您所了解的，由於關稅問題引發了爭議，我們一直在與客戶討論如何解決與這些關稅相關的價格影響。但到目前為止，對於我們運往美國的大部分貨物，我們基本上都不是記錄在案的進口商。而且由於我們不是記錄進口商，所以我認為這些對話要簡單得多。

So that's really how we're thinking about it.

這就是我們真正思考的問題。

Great. Thanks.

偉大的。謝謝。

Thank you, Meta.

謝謝你，Meta。

Christopher Rolland, SIG.

克里斯多福羅蘭（Christopher Rolland），SIG。

Hi. This is Dylan Ollivier on for Chris. Thanks for taking my question. So for my first question, I wanted to follow up on the 50% sequential growth in the optical transceiver business. So which of your transceiver customer programs will be responsible for that growth. And how should we expect transceiver shipments to trend for the rest of the calendar year? Do you guys think that level is sustainable? And are you guys expecting to grow from there as you add customer programs?

你好。我是迪倫·奧利維爾，為克里斯主持節目。感謝您回答我的問題。因此，對於我的第一個問題，我想跟進光收發器業務連續 50% 的成長。那麼，您的哪個收發器客戶計劃將負責這一成長。那麼，我們該如何預期今年剩餘時間收發器出貨量將呈現什麼樣的趨勢呢？你們認為這個水準可持續嗎？隨著你們增加客戶計劃，你們是否期望從那裡發展？

Yes. On the transceivers, I mean, I don't want to necessarily outline specific customers that are driving it, but it's predominantly the customer that we've had shipping for quite some time will be most of the contribution. We would expect this business to continue to grow. I think we're really well positioned. Obviously, generally speaking, our share is relatively modest.

是的。關於收發器，我的意思是，我不想一定要概述推動它的具體客戶，但主要是我們已經發貨很長一段時間的客戶將做出最大的貢獻。我們預計這項業務將繼續成長。我認為我們確實處於有利地位。顯然，總體來說，我們的份額相對較小。

We think that we've put some of the issues behind us relative to some issues transferring products into manufacturing and getting those into production. And we would expect from here to continue to grow. Will we grow at this growth rate? Hard to say. But certainly, we would expect to continue to grow this business, and it will be a major growth driver for us in 2026.

我們認為，我們已經解決了一些與將產品轉移到製造和投入生產有關的問題。我們期望從現在開始繼續成長。我們會以這個成長率成長嗎？很難說。但當然，我們預計這項業務將繼續成長，它將成為我們 2026 年的主要成長動力。

Wupen, any comments from you?

Wupen，您有什麼評論嗎？

Yes. And also, as Michael said, the more programs started ramping, we will see this to be more broader-based than this one major customer rent. Other programs will gradually be brought into the ramping phase as well. So we're going to see that going forward.

是的。而且，正如邁克爾所說，隨著越來越多的項目開始實施，我們將看到它比單一主要客戶租金的範圍更加廣泛。其他項目也將逐步進入推進階段。因此我們將會看到這一情況的進展。

Did you have any follow-up?

你有後續行動嗎？

Got it. That's great. Yes. So for my follow-up, I wanted to ask about 200 gig EMLs. So it sounds like you're getting solid traction there already. When should we expect that to ramp? And do you expect it to quickly cannibalize 100-gig EMLs or just to layer on top initially?

知道了。那太棒了。是的。因此，為了跟進，我想詢問有關 200 千兆 EML 的問題。聽起來你已經在那裡獲得了堅實的牽引力。我們什麼時候可以預期這數字會上升？您是否預計它會迅速蠶食 100 千兆 EML，還是只是最初在其上層部署？

Yes. This is Wupen speaking. I think the timing-wise is going to be toward the end of this calendar year, that 200 will start to ramp. And we don't see this being a cannibalization of 100G EMLs because there's still a very large growing demand 400G 800G modules the 1.60 modules or solutions will be on top of the 100G demand for quite a while to come. So this should be additional opportunities than a cannibalization opportunity.

是的。我是 Wupen。我認為時間上將在今年年底前開始增加，200 個將開始增加。我們不認為這會對 100G EML 造成蠶食，因為 400G 800G 模組的需求仍然在不斷增長，1.60 模組或解決方案將在未來相當長的一段時間內佔據 100G 需求的首位。因此，這應該是額外的機會，而不是蠶食的機會。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Great, thank you.

太好了，謝謝。

Ryan Koontz, Needham & Company.

瑞安·孔茨 (Ryan Koontz)，Needham & Company。

Thanks for the question. Maybe stepping back a little bit on the datacom transceiver market here. relative to the strong Chinese players. What are you hearing from your customers, your major cloud-oriented customers about their interest in moving away from Chinese suppliers and interest in bringing those products in-house? Thanks.

謝謝你的提問。也許數據通訊收發器市場會稍微退後一步。相對於強大的中國球員。您從客戶，主要的雲端運算客戶那裡了解到了什麼訊息，他們有興趣擺脫中國供應商，並有興趣將這些產品轉移到公司內部？謝謝。

Yes. there's definitely an interest to move away from Chinese supply. I mean, I think the problem right now is that collectively, we can't meet the demand. So they are going to continue, I think, to buy from Chinese suppliers until U.S. suppliers can ramp to a level to meet what looks like a relatively insatiable demand.

是的。人們確實有興趣擺脫中國供應。我的意思是，我認為現在的問題是我們無法滿足需求。因此，我認為，他們將繼續從中國供應商購買，直到美國供應商能夠提高產量以滿足看似相對無法滿足的需求。

Generally seeing there is some design in-sourcing going on. Some of the customers are doing their own designs. But the outsourcing is by far the dominant pull working with third-party transceiver manufacturers. And we obviously are a small player at the moment. We expect, given the number of designs that we have in flight, we expect to be a more meaningful participant in the market starting next quarter, but then really growing into the quarters beyond that.

總體而言，我們看到一些設計內部採購正在進行中。一些顧客正在進行自己的設計。但迄今為止，外包是與第三方收發器製造商合作的主要吸引力。而我們目前顯然只是一個小角色。我們預計，考慮到我們正在試飛的設計數量，我們預計從下個季度開始成為市場上更有意義的參與者，並在此後的幾個季度真正實現成長。

That's great And then maybe I do, yes. On the telecom side of the business. what kind of mix shifts you're seeing there? Obviously, DCI is driving the boat there in terms of growth. As you think about that mix shift, is it kind of in line with your expectations?

那太好了，也許我會這麼做，是的。在電信業務方面。您在那裡看到了什麼樣的混合變化？顯然，DCI 正在推動這一成長。當您考慮這種混合轉變時，它是否符合您的預期？

How should investors think about the shift toward DCI and how it affects your business, whether it's measured on gross profit or revenue per unit, these sorts of things, wallet share. But if you can just step back and explain how investors should think about these shifts in telecom. Thank you.

投資者應該如何看待向 DCI 的轉變以及它如何影響您的業務，無論是透過毛利還是單位收入來衡量，諸如此類的事情，錢包份額。但如果你能退一步解釋一下投資人應該如何看待電信業的這些轉變。謝謝。

Yes. I mean I think that the traditional telecom business targeted to operators and target to MSOs is still obviously meaningful, but the long pull now is the hyperscalers. So DCI, very important. Even these guys are now participating in our long-haul business. So we talked in the call in the prepared remarks about pump lasers, we've seen really an increase in that business.

是的。我的意思是，我認為針對營運商和 MSO 的傳統電信業務顯然仍然有意義，但現在的長遠目標是超大規模企業。所以 DCI 非常重要。甚至這些人現在也參與我們的長途業務。因此，我們在電話會議中準備好的發言中談到了泵浦雷射，我們確實看到該業務的成長。

A lot of the backbone now is being supplied by the hyperscalers, and we're participating in that with our traditional telecom products, but now more targeted toward the hyperscalers. So that's been a surprising growth driver. I think quite frankly, we haven't seen this business perform at these levels in quite some time. So it's really a nice surprise.

現在許多骨幹網路都是由超大規模企業提供的，我們也透過傳統的電信產品參與其中，但現在更專注於超大規模企業。所以這是一個令人驚訝的成長動力。坦白說，我們已經很久沒有看到這項業務達到這樣的水平了。所以這真是個驚喜。

I mean, technology-wise, Wupen, any other things that you're seeing from a trend line?

我的意思是，從技術角度來看，Wupen，您從趨勢線上還看到了什麼其他的東西嗎？

Yes. Certainly, I think overall, we should think about the AI driving force is not just about data center internal data has to be transmitted across data centers. So all these actually have the same driving source, right? We see the ZR being growing very strong, and therefore, (kind of) laser is doing really well. Even the long-distance transmission coherent components doing very well because of the terrestrial long-haul requirement and also the pump lasers for fiber capacity. So all in all, we're seeing a very strong DCI kind of traffic growth, and that's driving our so-called telecom part of the portfolio as well.

是的。當然，我認為總體而言，我們應該認為人工智慧的驅動力不僅僅是資料中心內部資料必須跨資料中心傳輸。所以所有這些實際上都有相同的驅動源，對嗎？我們看到 ZR 發展非常強勁，因此（某種程度上）雷射表現非常好。由於地面長途傳輸的要求以及光纖容量的泵浦雷射器，長距離傳輸相干組件的表現也非常好。總而言之，我們看到了非常強勁的 DCI 流量成長，這也推動了我們投資組合中所謂的電信部分的發展。

I'll just add an additional comment, Ryan. Around your question on gross profit dollars, so DCI products are accretive to us from a gross margin standpoint. Not only where we're currently operating from a gross margin standpoint, but also versus the 40% target that that Michael laid out earlier, it's even accretive to that.

我只想補充一點評論，瑞安。關於您關於毛利的問題，從毛利率的角度來看，DCI 產品對我們來說是增值的。不僅從我們目前的毛利率角度來看，而且與邁克爾之前提出的 40% 的目標相比，它甚至具有增值作用。

And so the combination of increased demand and our increased capacity internally at Thailand is certainly a tailwind for us that that is driving a lot of the confidence that you're hearing from the team around our gross margin abilities is coming from the secular demand along with internal manufacturing along with the pricing power that we believe we have on our data center interconnect products. So it's all adding up together.

因此，需求增加和泰國內部產能增加的結合無疑對我們來說是一個順風，這在很大程度上增強了您從團隊那裡聽到的有關我們毛利率能力的信心，這種信心來自長期需求、內部製造以及我們認為我們在數據中心互連產品上擁有的定價能力。所以，所有一切都加在一起了。

Thank you, Ryan.

謝謝你，瑞安。

Thank you. Really appreciate it.

謝謝。真的很感激。

Karl Ackerman, BNP Paribas.

法國巴黎銀行的卡爾·阿克曼。

Yes, thank you. I have two. I believe you said that your cloud transceiver revenues would grow 50% sequentially on the contribution from all three of your cloud customers. I have to ask, though, is this tied to -- it sounds like it's tied to a new GPU or ASIC program ramping at least at one of them. But I guess how much of this, if at all, is from customers pulling forward transceiver demand ahead of potential tariffs. And if not, how do you manage that supply and demand balance with these three customers?

是的，謝謝。我有兩個。我相信您說過，由於所有三個雲端客戶的貢獻，您的雲端收發器收入將連續成長 50%。不過，我不得不問，這是否與——聽起來它與至少其中一個的新 GPU 或 ASIC 程式有關。但我猜測，如果有的話，這其中有多少是由於客戶在潛在關稅之前提前推動了收發器需求。如果不是，您如何管理這三位客戶的供需平衡？

I have a follow-up, please.

我有後續問題，請告知。

Yes. Karl, Michael Holston. So first of all, we don't see any pull forward. I mean it's been a race for us to keep up. We kind of alluded to this in one of the previous questions. We definitely had an issue ramping. We went through a ramp phase and then a qualification phase.

是的。卡爾，麥可霍爾斯頓。首先，我們沒有看到任何進展。我的意思是，這對我們來說是一場必須跟上的競賽。我們在之前的一個問題中提到過這一點。我們確實遇到了一個問題。我們經歷了提升階段，然後是資格階段。

And really, this is a product that's driving a lot of the increase that was something that's been in our hopper now for a couple of quarters. So we certainly don't see a pull-forward effect. And again, that layering in with the additional two customers beginning to ramp this quarter we feel -- we don't see any effect on pull ahead.

事實上，這是一種推動大量成長的產品，並且已經在我們的庫存中存放了幾個季度了。所以我們當然看不到前拉效應。再次，我們認為，本季另外兩家客戶開始增加，但這並沒有對成長產生任何影響。

I'm going to have Wupen talk a little bit about what those are tied to relative to kind of the customer tech.

我將讓 Wupen 稍微談談這些與客戶技術有何關聯。

Yes. I think from the product release point of view, definitely, I think those ramps are tied to the dominant GPU ramp and also some other accelerate ramp. There's some loose association with those kind of introduction of the accelerated products. But also though I think the demand is pretty broad-based, is not particularly only to those two or three accelerators that are being introduced now into the market.

是的。我認為從產品發布的角度來看，這些提升肯定與主導 GPU 提升以及其他一些加速提升有關。這些加速產品的推出之間存在一些鬆散的關聯。但儘管如此，我認為需求相當廣泛，並不僅限於目前引進市場的兩三種加速器。

Karl, did you have a follow-up?

卡爾，你有後續消息嗎？

I did one if I may. Wajid, you spoke of moving production away from contract manufacturers to in-house solutions. I'm curious, is that for your industrial tech products? Or does that relate more towards cloud and networking? And similarly, do you need to add substantial capacity to move that production in-house, please? Thank you.

如果可以的話我做了一個。Wajid，您談到將生產從合約製造商轉移到內部解決方案。我很好奇，這是你們的工業技術產品嗎？還是這與雲端和網路更相關？同樣，您是否需要增加大量產能以將生產轉移到內部？謝謝。

Yes. So it's revolved around our data center interconnect products. And so those CapEx decisions were made six to nine months ago, and actually the CapEx is showing up this fiscal quarter. and it's expected to improve our capacity for data center interconnect products by 50% exiting this calendar year.

是的。所以它圍繞著我們的資料中心互連產品。這些資本支出決策是在六到九個月前做出的，實際上資本支出是在本財季顯現出來的。預計到今年年底，我們的資料中心互連產品產能將提高 50%。

And so that is the production that instead of providing to our contract manufacturers. We're still keeping them going at full speed but the incremental supply is coming from our Nava facility for CapEx that is being put in place this quarter and that will fully ramp by the end of this calendar year and give us another 50% more capacity on data center interconnect products, specifically tunables.

因此，這不是向我們的合約製造商提供的產品。我們仍在讓它們全速運轉，但增量供應來自我們本季投入使用的 Nava 資本支出設施，該設施將在今年年底前全面投入使用，並為我們的數據中心互連產品（特別是可調產品）提供另外 50% 的產能。

Thanks, Karl.

謝謝，卡爾。

Mike Genovese, Rosenblatt Securities.

羅森布拉特證券公司的麥克吉諾維斯 (Mike Genovese)。

Great. Thanks. I'm not sure if I missed this in the prepared remarks, but do we get an update on telecom performance in the quarter and the sort of product issue last quarter with just getting supply, if that has been solved yet?

偉大的。謝謝。我不確定我是否在準備好的發言中遺漏了這一點，但是我們是否會獲得有關本季度電信業績的最新消息，以及上個季度在供應方面出現的產品問題（如果已經解決）？

Yes, sure. So I'll start off and I'll let Wupen also jump in. So telecom performance came in exactly as expected. We had shortages on pumps. We had shortages on tunables, we had shortages on CDM products from our classic transmission product lines. And so all of those products we were working through supply constraints throughout the quarter. We are expected to see improvements in supply for all three product lines moving into Q4 and into the back half of the year.

是的，當然。所以我先開始了，然後讓 Wupen 也加入進來。因此，電信業績完全符合預期。我們的泵浦短缺。我們的可調裝置短缺，我們的經典傳輸產品線的 CDM 產品也短缺。因此，我們整個季度都在努力解決所有這些產品的供應限制問題。我們預計，進入第四季和下半年，這三條產品線的供應情況都會有所改善。

The earlier question was around our tunables products where we mentioned that we have CapEx that we're putting in place in our Thailand facility to increase the production capacity by 50% over the remaining part of this calendar year. So with that increased capacity, we're going to see the telecom part of our business improve as we move through the quarters for the rest of this calendar year.

先前的問題是關於我們的可調產品，我們提到我們在泰國工廠實施了資本支出，以便在今年剩餘時間內將生產能力提高 50%。因此，隨著容量的增加，我們將看到我們業務的電信部分在今年剩餘時間的各個季度中得到改善。

Maybe you want to talk about pumps a little bit more, Wupen?

也許你想再多談談泵，Wupen？

Yes. I think the overall -- from a demand and supply perspective, we don't expect that our capacity can really fulfill all the demand for the next several quarters. because of the demand is being really strong, although we're doing better than we were able to. So we'll continue to run capacity, continue to get more supply into the picture. But we're going to be in a pretty tight supply situation at least the next couple of quarters.

是的。我認為從總體上看，從需求和供應的角度來看，我們並不認為我們的產能能夠真正滿足未來幾季的所有需求。因為需求非常強勁，儘管我們做得比以前更好。因此，我們將繼續提高產能，並繼續增加供應。但至少在接下來的幾個季度裡，我們的供應狀況將相當緊張。

Did you have a follow-up, Mike?

麥克，你還有後續消息嗎？

Great. And I guess I want to revisit the question whether there's any caution in the guidance for the back half of the year related to macro or tariffs. If I just take the transceiver comment up 50% sequentially, I mean to me, that that gets us $30 million more revenue. That gets us the whole growth in the guide. I know Industrial is supposed to be down, but you've got EMLs growing, you've got telecom that should be up. Is there an extra business conservatism in here? Or am I overthinking this?

偉大的。我想重新討論這個問題：下半年的指導中是否有與宏觀或關稅相關的警告。如果我只是將收發器評論連續提高 50%，那麼對我來說，這將為我們帶來 3000 萬美元的額外收入。這讓我們了解指南中的整體成長。我知道工業應該處於下降趨勢，但 EML 卻在成長，電信也應該處於上升趨勢。這裡是否存在額外的商業保守主義？還是我想太多了？

I'd say you're not overthinking it, Mike. I mean, obviously, we're in an environment where there's a lot of uncertainty. We're quite confident in the guide that we provided. But if you just listen to some of the capacity improvements that we've got, there is certainly opportunity to deal with any type of headwinds that come our way during the fiscal quarter.

我想說你沒有想太多，麥克。我的意思是，顯然，我們處在一個充滿不確定性的環境中。我們對所提供的指南非常有信心。但如果你聽聽我們所取得的一些產能改進，你會發現我們肯定有機會應對財政季度遇到的任何類型的逆風。

As far as the back half of the calendar year looks across all of our product lines, we continue to see an uptick in demand, whether that's datacom chips, whether that's data center interconnect products or whether that's modules, even our industrial lasers product line that is expected to come down in fiscal Q4 has new ultrafast products that are ramping in the back half of the calendar year. demand for those products is quite strong.

就我們所有產品線在下半年的需求而言，我們繼續看到需求上升，無論是數據通訊晶片、數據中心互連產品還是模組，甚至我們預計在第四財季下降的工業雷射器產品線也推出了新的超快產品，這些產品在下半年正在激增。這些產品的需求相當強勁。

But offsetting that, we're seeing some headwinds from customers that take kilowatt products. But overall, the trend is up and our supply plan is up. So we should see improvements from here to the $500 million target that Michael spoke about. But again, I think the macro uncertainty, none of us have a great crystal ball on that.

但與此相反，我們看到使用千瓦級產品的客戶遇到了一些阻力。但總體而言，趨勢是上升的，我們的供應計畫也是上升的。因此，我們應該看到從現在開始朝著邁克爾所說的 5 億美元目標邁進。但我再次認為，對於宏觀不確定性，我們誰也無法預知。

Thanks so much.

非常感謝。

Thanks, Mike.

謝謝，麥克。

David Vogt, UBS.

瑞銀的戴維·沃格特。

Great. Thanks for taking my question. I just want to go back to the telecom business for a second. I jumped on late, and I apologize. Was there anything in the quarter that was similar to last quarter, when I mean by that, there was some channel normalization last quarter. and even in the quarter before. Just trying to get a sense for what's core underlying demand, particularly in the face of tariffs or the risk of tariffs or the potential tariffs.

偉大的。感謝您回答我的問題。我只是想暫時回到電信業務。我來晚了，很抱歉。本季與上一季有哪些相似之處？我的意思是，上一季通路有一些正常化。甚至在上一季也是如此。只是想了解核心潛在需求是什麼，特別是面對關稅或關稅風險或潛在關稅。

And I'll give you my follow-up, and I might have missed this because I jumped on late, could you share with us sort of how the core transceiver business grew in the March quarter relative to either last year or last quarter? Thanks.

我會給你我的後續問題，我可能因為來晚了而錯過了這一點，你能和我們分享一下 3 月份核心收發器業務相對於去年或上一季度的增長情況嗎？謝謝。

Yes. Maybe I mean, look, on the telecom business, obviously, we feel pretty good. I mean, I think there's a lot of opportunities for us to continue to grow. Wupen talked about the narrow line with lasers. We actually said that in the prepared remarks.

是的。也許我的意思是，看看電信業務，顯然，我們感覺相當不錯。我的意思是，我認為我們有很多機會繼續成長。Wupen 談到了用雷射切割窄線。我們實際上在準備好的發言中說過這一點。

So we think that business continues to grow through the balance of the calendar year and into next year. And it's not just that. I think we talked about pump lasers. That really has been a strong product area for us. So across the board on telecom, which, as Wajid said correctly, is a gross margin in [handserve]. It accretive on the gross margin line, we would expect to see that to continue to creep up.

因此我們認為，業務將在今年年底和明年繼續成長。而事情還不僅僅如此。我想我們討論過泵浦雷射。這確實是我們強大的產品領域。因此，正如 Wajid 所說，電信業的毛利率是[手動發球]。它在毛利率上有所增長，我們預計它將繼續攀升。

large portion of growth will be cloud modules. And so as you think about us across the next couple of quarters, in order to keep the gross margins up, we are going to need to see improvements in telecom because we think that that's an area for us that has accretive gross margins.

成長的很大一部分將是雲端模組。因此，當您考慮我們未來幾季的情況時，為了維持毛利率，我們需要看到電信業務的改善，因為我們認為這是我們毛利率能夠成長的領域。

On the Datacom transceivers, the second part of your question, essentially, that was flat on quarter. We didn't see a lot of growth. I think the growth for us, we talked about I think in previous discussions that we'd hit a bit of an air pocket relative to execution on some ramping some of our datacom transceivers. We're past that at this point. We would expect to see the growth in this subsequent quarter in the guide, and then we expect to see pickup from there.

關於數據通訊收發器，您問題的第二部分基本上與上一季持平。我們沒有看到很大的成長。我認為，對於我們來說，在先前的討論中，我們談到過，在執行一些資料通訊收發器的成長方面，我們遇到了一些困難。我們現在已超越了那個階段。我們預計在指南中接下來的這個季度會出現成長，然後我們預計從那裡開始會出現回升。

So on balance, look, we feel really good about the way the business is shaping up. Why go gave correctly a right amount of prudence around tariffs and macroeconomic uncertainty. But if we don't have that, we feel really good about where all of our business is landing right now.

所以總的來說，我們對業務的發展感到非常滿意。為什麼政府在關稅和宏觀經濟不確定性方面給予了正確的適當謹慎？但即使沒有這種情況，我們對目前所有業務的進展感到非常滿意。

Great, thanks, guys.

太好了，謝謝大家。

Dave, did you have a follow-up?

戴夫，你有後續消息嗎？

Nope, those are my two. Thank you.

不，這是我的兩個。謝謝。

Okay, excellent. Thank you. [Josana], I think we have time for one more question.

好的，非常好。謝謝。 [Josana]，我想我們還有時間再問一個問題。

Alek Valero, Loop Capital.

Alek Valero，Loop Capital。

Hey, guys. Thanks for taking my question. This is Alek on for [Nanda]. So I have a question on co-packaged optics. What's your view on when co-packaged optics truly have a chance to gain traction in data center and provide competition to transceivers.

嘿，大家好。感謝您回答我的問題。這是 Alek[難陀]。所以我有一個關於共封裝光學元件的問題。您認為何時共封裝光學元件才真正有機會在資料中心獲得發展並與收發器競爭？

Yes, this is Wupen again speaking. I think the commodities will take some more time. The technology is pretty complex. A lot of engineering challenges, I think, yet to be worked through. As the leading AI customer talk about in their conferences, this year, there will be some -- a first system release. And next year, '26, will be another system release based on the user net switch. We believe that's the timing. We're going to see some level of adoption of the CPO optics.

是的，我是吳彭。我認為商品還需要一些時間。這項技術相當複雜。我認為，還有很多工程挑戰尚待解決。正如領先的人工智慧客戶在他們的會議上所談論的那樣，今年將會有一些——第一個系統發布。明年，也就是 26 年，將會發布另一個基於用戶網路交換器的系統。我們相信時機已經成熟。我們將會看到 CPO 光學元件的一定程度的採用。

However, though, we do believe that the drug will continue to be the dominant form factor going forward. I think it will take in the next several years really to gradually ramp the CPO uptakes to be a meaningful share. And the benefit of CPO is clear, but the adoption will take time for people to figure out how to use it very effectively.

然而，我們確實相信藥物將繼續成為未來的主要形式。我認為，未來幾年內，CPO 的吸收量才能逐步提升到有意義的份額。CPO 的好處是顯而易見的，但人們需要時間來弄清楚如何有效地使用它。

Got it. That's very helpful. And just as a quick follow-up, can you remind us the economic difference between transceivers and co-packaged optics.

知道了。這非常有幫助。作為快速的跟進，您能否提醒我們收發器和共封裝光學元件之間的經濟差異。

The difference?

區別？

The difference between tranceivers --

收發器之間的區別--

So basically, if you take any kind of a switch box, for example, the transceiver basically is at the front panel. So you have the connection between the DSP, sorry, the switch chip in the signal all the way to the front panel of the box, which can be 20, 30 inches actually away from the switch ship. The cobal optics basically remove all that, put the optics directly on to the switch chip. Thereby removing all the signal losses and the complexities associated with that transition. That, in essence, is what the CPO optics does.

因此基本上，如果您使用任何類型的開關盒，那麼收發器基本上就在前面板上。因此，您需要將 DSP（抱歉，是訊號中的開關晶片）一直連接到盒子的前面板，該面板實際上距離開關晶片有 20 到 30 英吋遠。鈷光學元件基本上去除了所有這些，將光學元件直接放到了開關晶片上。從而消除所有訊號損失以及與該轉換相關的複雜性。從本質上來說，這就是 CPO 光學元件的作用。

And then that lower the power consumption, reduce the cost, reduce the complexity. But in a sense, you actually move the complexity from optical modules on to the switch chip which then is some engineering work to be done, right, to make sure that it is a reliable solution.

然後降低功耗、減少成本、降低複雜性。但從某種意義上說，你實際上是將複雜性從光學模組轉移到了交換晶片上，然後需要進行一些工程工作，以確保它是一個可靠的解決方案。

Got it. (multiple speakers)

知道了。（多位發言者）

Go ahead.

前進。

I was going to ask, does co-packaged optics come with an ASP increase compared to transceivers?

我想問的是，與收發器相比，共封裝光學元件的平均售價是否會增加？

Well, it's a different pricing model. Today, the consumption model is the Swiss chip is purchased separately and the boxes made by somebody else, and the modules are purchased through third-party manufacturers such as us. And it's a very different consumption model than the CPO optics, which basically means that the switch vendor will control the entire ASIC plus the optics.

嗯，這是一種不同的定價模式。現在的消費模式是單獨購買瑞士晶片，盒子由別人製作，模組透過我們這樣的第三方製造商購買。這是一種與 CPO 光學元件截然不同的消費模式，這基本上意味著交換器供應商將控制整個 ASIC 和光學元件。

So it's very hard to say how they're going to price it. And therefore, hard to say that which one is going to be cheaper, we depend on the competition and benefit and so on and so forth. Very hard to give an estimation at this point.

因此很難說他們將如何定價。因此，很難說哪一個會更便宜，我們取決於競爭和利益等等。目前很難給出估計。

Thanks, Alek. Thank you, everyone, for your question. That's all the time we have for questions. We look forward to connecting with all of you at upcoming investor conferences and meetings this quarter. And with that, I'd like to thank you for joining us today.

謝謝，阿列克。謝謝大家的提問。我們回答問題的時間就這麼多了。我們期待在本季即將舉行的投資者會議和會議上與大家建立聯繫。最後，我要感謝你們今天參加我們的活動。

That concludes the conference call. Thank you for your participation. Enjoy the rest of your day.

電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。享受剩餘的一天。