Lithium Argentina AG (LAR) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Hello, and thank you for standing by. My name is Tiffany, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Lithium Argentina second-quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions)

您好，感謝您的支持。我叫蒂芬妮，今天我將擔任您的會議主持人。現在，我歡迎大家參加 Lithium Argentina 2025 年第二季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）

I would now like to turn the call over to Kelly O'Brien, Vice President of Investor Relations. Kelly, please go ahead.

現在我想將電話轉給投資者關係副總裁凱利·奧布萊恩 (Kelly O'Brien)。凱利，請繼續。

Thank you, Tiffany. I want to welcome everyone to our earnings conference call this morning. Joining me on the call today to discuss our second-quarter results is Sam Pigott, President and CEO. Alex Shulga, VP and CFO, will also be available during the Q&A session.

謝謝你，蒂芙尼。我歡迎大家參加今天早上的收益電話會議。今天與我一起參加電話會議討論我們第二季業績的是總裁兼執行長 Sam Pigott。副總裁兼財務長 Alex Shulga 也將出席問答環節。

Before we begin, I would like to cover a few items. Our second-quarter 2025 earnings press release was issued earlier this morning, and the corresponding documents are available on our company website. I remind you that some of the statements made during this call, including any production guidance, expected company performance, update on the regional development plan, the timing of our projects, and market conditions, may be considered forward-looking statements. Please note the cautionary language about forward-looking statements in our presentation, MD&A, and news release.

在我們開始之前，我想先談幾點。我們的 2025 年第二季財報新聞稿已於今天早上發布，相應文件可在本公司網站上查閱。我提醒您，本次電話會議中所做的一些聲明，包括任何生產指導、預期的公司業績、區域發展計劃的最新情況、我們專案的時間表以及市場狀況，都可能被視為前瞻性聲明。請注意我們的簡報、管理層討論與分析 (MD&A) 和新聞稿中有關前瞻性陳述的警示性語言。

I will now turn the call over to Sam.

現在我將把電話轉給 Sam。

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us. We will begin on slide 3 with a review of key highlights and milestones from the second quarter. At Cauchari-Olaroz, we delivered strong operational results with higher production volumes and lower costs quarter over quarter.

大家早安。感謝您加入我們。我們將從幻燈片 3 開始回顧第二季度的主要亮點和里程碑。在考查里-奧拉羅斯，我們取得了強勁的營運業績，產量逐季增加，成本逐季降低。

With the completion of the first half, we feel confident in reaching our full-year production guidance of 30,000 to 35,000 tonnes. We also strengthened our financial position, securing $120 million in new bank facilities at Cauchari-Olaroz to support working capital as operations advance.

隨著上半年工作的完成，我們有信心實現全年產量目標 30,000 至 35,000 噸。我們還加強了財務狀況，在 Cauchari-Olaroz 獲得了 1.2 億美元的新銀行貸款，以支持營運過程中的營運資金。

Together with our partner, Ganfeng, we made meaningful progress towards consolidating the Pozuelos-Pastos Grandes basins. We expect to give the market an update shortly as we work diligently to position these assets for long-term growth and to develop a platform for what is expected to be one of the largest lithium operations globally.

我們與合作夥伴贛鋒集團攜手，在鞏固波蘇埃洛斯-帕斯托斯大盆地方面取得了重大進展。我們正在努力為這些資產的長期成長做好準備，並為預計將成為全球最大的鋰業務之一的平台開發平台，因此我們預計很快就會向市場提供最新消息。

On slide 4, we delivered solid performance in the second quarter. You can see a summary of the key operating and financial metrics. Revenue increased despite softer market prices, reflecting the benefit of higher output. The team has done an excellent job executing safely and efficiently.

在幻燈片 4 中，我們在第二季度取得了穩健的業績。您可以看到關鍵營運和財務指標的摘要。儘管市場價格疲軟，但收入仍有所增加，反映出產量增加的好處。該團隊在安全、高效的執行方面做得非常出色。

And during the second quarter, the operations consistently produced at 85% of nameplate capacity, delivering 8,500 tonnes of lithium carbonate for the second quarter and 15,700 tonnes in the first half. While market prices have been quite volatile in recent weeks, we realized an average price of $7,400 for the second quarter, an 8% decrease compared to the first.

第二季度，該業務的產量持續達到額定產能的 85%，第二季度交付了 8,500 噸碳酸鋰，上半年交付了 15,700 噸。雖然最近幾週市場價格波動很大，但我們發現第二季的平均價格為 7,400 美元，比第一季下降了 8%。

We emphasized the reduction of costs quarter on quarter. And turning to the next slide, we will discuss this in more detail. In the second quarter, we brought operating costs down approximately 8% compared to the first quarter, reaching $6,100 per tonne. This decrease is a function of many different cost reduction efforts across the operation.

我們強調逐季降低成本。翻到下一張投影片，我們將更詳細地討論這一點。第二季度，我們的營運成本與第一季相比下降了約 8%，達到每噸 6,100 美元。這種下降是整個營運過程中採取多種不同成本削減措施的結果。

They are structural, long-term changes and part of our transition to a steady-state operator. We are quite proud of these optimization efforts, which bring our current costs below latest feasibility study estimates. The scale and quality of Cauchari-Olaroz, coupled with efficient operations and low production costs, reinforces our position as a resilient producer that is able to sustain profitability across market cycles.

它們是結構性的、長期的變化，也是我們向穩定狀態運營商過渡的一部分。我們對這些優化工作感到非常自豪，這些優化工作使我們目前的成本低於最新的可行性研究估計。Cauchari-Olaroz 的規模和質量，加上高效的營運和低生產成本，鞏固了我們作為能夠在整個市場週期中保持盈利能力的彈性生產商的地位。

Moving to slide 6, in recent months, we have seen increased volatility in lithium prices. Today, prices are just over $10,000 per tonne. We do not believe that these lower prices are sustainable, given strong global growth and the need for new supply, which is often significantly higher cost.

轉到投影片 6，近幾個月來，我們看到鋰價格波動加劇。如今，價格略高於每噸 10,000 美元。鑑於全球經濟強勁成長以及對新供應的需求（這通常會帶來更高的成本），我們認為這些較低的價格是不可持續的。

We have positioned the business to withstand a lower-for-longer price environment and remain focused on what we can control, namely safe, low-cost, and reliable operations. We believe this environment favors low-cost brine operations, which are well positioned on the cost curve and able to execute and grow through the cycles.

我們的業務定位是承受長期低價環境，並繼續專注於我們能夠控制的事情，即安全、低成本和可靠的營運。我們相信，這種環境有利於低成本的鹽水作業，這種作業在成本曲線上處於有利地位，並且能夠在周期內執行和成長。

On slide 7, we have outlined our platform for growth. As we look ahead, we're excited by the scale of opportunity emerging across our platform in Argentina. Our growth strategy targets over 200,000 tonnes per year of lithium carbonate equivalent capacity, leveraging both expansion at our producing operation and at our regional growth projects with Ganfeng, where through consolidating our projects in the Pozuelos-Pastos Grandes basins, we are targeting approximately 150,000 tonnes of capacity.

在第 7 張投影片上，我們概述了我們的成長平台。展望未來，我們對阿根廷平台上出現的大量機會感到興奮。我們的成長策略目標是實現每年超過 20 萬噸碳酸鋰當量產能，同時利用生產業務的擴張以及與贛鋒的區域成長項目，透過整合我們在 Pozuelos-Pastos Grandes 盆地的項目，我們的目標是實現約 15 萬噸的產能。

We've made significant progress in advancing the regional development plan in Salta. Very soon, we expect to combine these three high-quality assets that together cover two entire Salars, something unique in our industry. This positions us to participate in what is expected to be one of the largest lithium projects in the world with the benefits of scale and advanced technology.

我們在推動薩爾塔區域發展計畫方面取得了重大進展。很快，我們期望將這三個涵蓋整個兩個薩拉爾的優質資產結合起來，這在我們的行業中是獨一無二的。這使我們能夠參與預計將成為世界上最大的鋰項目之一，並具有規模優勢和先進技術。

This partnership will allow Lithium Argentina and Ganfeng to bring together their respective strengths in large-scale brine development, building on the capabilities and collaboration already proven at Cauchari-Olaroz. We expect to have an update shortly on the consolidation and a feasibility study complete by the end of the year.

這項合作將使阿根廷鋰業公司和贛鋒鋰業能夠在 Cauchari-Olaroz 已經證明的能力和合作基礎上，整合各自在大規模鹽水開發方面的優勢。我們預計不久後就能得到合併的最新進展，並在年底前完成可行性研究。

Both Lithium Argentina and Ganfeng are working together to advance financing plans including project debt and potential minority equity investments from customers. In addition to our regional growth plans, stage two of Cauchari remains a key component of the pipeline expected to contribute an additional 40,000 tonnes.

Lithium Argentina 和贛鋒鋰業正在合作推進融資計劃，包括專案債務和客戶的潛在少數股權投資。除了我們的區域增長計劃外，考查里管道二期仍是該管道的重要組成部分，預計將額外貢獻 40,000 噸的輸送量。

Our approach is to create a more efficient operating structure that harnesses new technologies, economies of scale, and builds off our track record of Cauchari-Olaroz. As we advance these longer-term growth initiatives, we are focused on strengthening the balance sheet, while preserving and maximizing shareholder value.

我們的方法是創造一個更有效率的營運結構，利用新技術、規模經濟，並藉鏡我們在 Cauchari-Olaroz 的業績記錄。在推進這些長期成長計畫的同時，我們專注於加強資產負債表，同時保持和最大化股東價值。

In closing, on slide 8, we remain focused on executing our core priorities, unlocking value, operational efficiency, and financial flexibility. Looking ahead to the second half of the year, our priorities are clear. At Cauchari-Olaroz, our focus is on continuing our efficient operations and maintaining our position as one of the lowest-cost producers in the industry.

最後，在第 8 張投影片上，我們仍然專注於執行我們的核心優先事項、釋放價值、提高營運效率和提高財務靈活性。展望下半年，我們的重點很明確。在 Cauchari-Olaroz，我們的重點是繼續高效運作並維持我們作為業內成本最低的生產商之一的地位。

We plan to advance the unified development plan for Pozuelos-Pastos Grandes basins, positioning this world-class asset for long-term scalable growth. And at corporate level, we continue to strengthen our balance sheet and preserve financial flexibility without diluting shareholders. Above all, we will execute with discipline, focus on delivering against our targets, and ensure we close out 2025 in a position of even greater strength and opportunity.

我們計劃推進波蘇埃洛斯-帕斯托斯大盆地的統一開發計劃，使這一世界級資產實現長期可擴展的成長。在公司層面，我們持續強化資產負債表並保持財務彈性，同時不稀釋股東權益。最重要的是，我們將嚴格執行，專注於實現我們的目標，並確保我們在 2025 年結束時擁有更強大的實力和更大的機會。

Thank you for your continued support. And with that, I think we'll open up to questions.

感謝您一直以來的支持。有了這些，我想我們就可以開始提問了。

(Operator Instructions) Katie Lachapelle, Canaccord Genuity.

（操作員說明）Katie Lachapelle，Canaccord Genuity。

Hi, Sam and team. Congrats on a good quarter. I just want to talk about the surge in lithium futures we saw overnight on reports of CATL shutting down one of their major mines in China. We've seen a number of news outlets suggest that this is not necessarily a permit-related action but could be part of a broader push by the government to address overcapacity in domestic competition, which has been leading to some price destruction.

嗨，Sam 和團隊。恭喜本季取得良好業績。我只想談談我們在有關 CATL 關閉其在中國的一個主要礦場的報道之後看到的隔夜鋰期貨價格飆升的情況。我們看到許多新聞媒體表示，這不一定是與許可證相關的行動，而可能是政府為解決國內競爭中產能過剩問題而採取的更廣泛舉措的一部分，產能過剩已導致價格暴跌。

So I'd just be curious, what's your view on China's anti-involution policies specifically? And how do you see these measures impacting the lithium market and the potential longevity of the recent price move?

所以我很好奇，您對中國的反內捲化政策具體有何看法？您認為這些措施將如何影響鋰市場以及近期價格走勢的潛在持續時間？

Thanks, Katie. I mean, we've been following these developments, which are fairly recent, very closely. Yeah, I mean, I think this anti-involution policy is not just specific, obviously, to lithium, but looking across industries and trying to reduce the amount of rapid competition that's ongoing. So it's something we're monitoring. I don't think we have anything kind of novel to contribute to the discussion around that.

謝謝，凱蒂。我的意思是，我們一直在密切關注這些近期的發展。是的，我的意思是，我認為這種反內捲化政策顯然不只是針對鋰產業，而是放眼整個產業，試圖減少正在進行的快速競爭。所以這是我們正在監控的事情。我認為我們沒有任何新穎的東西可以為這一討論做出貢獻。

I think from our position and the strategy with the business is that we've set this business up to manage price volatility. I think in Q2, this was evidenced in where our costs came in, really focused on ensuring that we can get through any price environment.

我認為從我們的立場和商業策略來看，我們設立這項業務是為了管理價格波動。我認為在第二季度，這體現在我們的成本上，我們真正專注於確保我們能夠度過任何價格環境。

So yeah, I mean, we're very pleased with where our costs are. Obviously, if we have some support from pricing, that's great. But again, we've kind of set this business up to withstand this volatility. I'd say it's like a more general comment. And it's something that I think the industry has been talking a lot about over the past 12 months.

是的，我的意思是，我們對我們的成本狀況非常滿意。顯然，如果我們得到一些定價方面的支持，那就太好了。但再次強調，我們已經做好了應對這種波動的準備。我想說這就像是一個更普遍的評論。我認為這是過去 12 個月中業界一直在討論的事情。

It's just a view that pricing that we've experienced so far this year is really unsustainable in the long term. Looking at kind of demand expectations, the need for new supply, and where pricing is right now, we just think pricing is long-term unsustainable. As to the short-term nature, I think it's not for us to comment.

這只是一種觀點，即我們今年迄今為止經歷的定價從長遠來看確實是不可持續的。從需求預期、新供應需求以及當前定價來看，我們認為定價長期來看是不可持續的。至於短期性，我認為我們不方便評論。

Great. And then maybe a follow-up on the regional growth strategy at both Cauchari as well as Salta, are there specific project milestones that need to be achieved to make a formal investment decision on either of those projects? Or what market signals are you guys waiting on to make a go-ahead decision there?

偉大的。然後也許是關於考查里和薩爾塔區域成長策略的後續行動，是否需要實現具體的專案里程碑才能對這兩個專案做出正式的投資決定？或者你們正在等待什麼市場訊號來做出繼續推進的決定？

So I mean, first and foremost, we're still kind of pushing ahead with the feasibility study, which is expected to be complete this year. I think prior to that, we plan to, in the very near term, to disclose a plan for how we're going to consolidate all of these assets, with a view to participating as LAR in one of the largest lithium projects globally. So it's extraordinarily exciting.

所以我的意思是，首先，我們仍在推進可行性研究，預計今年將完成。我認為在此之前，我們計劃在近期披露一項計劃，說明我們將如何整合所有這些資產，以期作為 LAR 參與全球最大的鋰項目之一。所以這非常令人興奮。

In terms of a formal investment decision, I mean, the feasibility study needs to be complete. Beyond that, we've had preliminary discussions with certain customers. And there is a lot of interest to participate in very large, high-quality brine projects, particularly based on the track record that we've been able to demonstrate at Cauchari.

就正式的投資決策而言，我的意思是可行性研究需要完成。除此之外，我們也與某些客戶進行了初步討論。人們對參與大型高品質鹽水計畫很感興趣，特別是基於我們在考查里所取得的成績。

So I think a formal decision on going ahead, we'll have to wait for certainly the feasibility study. But for us, it's important to grow but important to also manage our balance sheet, look at non-dilutive measures in order to finance growth projects.

因此我認為，要做出是否繼續進行的正式決定，我們必須等待可行性研究的結果。但對我們來說，成長很重要，但管理資產負債表也很重要，考慮非稀釋性措施以資助成長項目。

Got it. Thanks again, guys, and congrats on the good quarter.

知道了。再次感謝大家，並恭喜本季取得良好業績。

Thanks, Katie.

謝謝，凱蒂。

Corinne Blanchard, Deutsche Bank.

科琳‧布蘭查德，德意志銀行。

Hey, good morning. Thank you for taking my question. Two questions. Can you talk about the pricing discounts that you received this quarter, and how that compare for -- versus Q1 and maybe what you're thinking you could be getting for the rest of the year?

嘿，早安。感謝您回答我的問題。兩個問題。您能否談談本季獲得的價格折扣，與第一季相比如何，以及您認為今年剩餘時間可以獲得的折扣如何？

And then the other question is on the cost. I mean, you obviously did a great job here and delivered quite significant decrease quarter over quarter. How much more can we expect going into 3Q and 4Q in 2026? Or do you think you have reached kind of your run rate at 6,000-ish per tonne? Thank you.

另一個問題是關於成本。我的意思是，你顯然在這裡做得很好，並且實現了季度環比顯著的下降。我們對 2026 年第三季和第四季的預期是多少？或者您認為您的生產力已經達到了每噸 6,000 左右？謝謝。

Sure. So addressing your first question, the discount to the reference price was approximately $2,000, so very similar to what was achieved in Q1. That reflects, obviously, taxes as well as a reprocessing cost for the material in China. I think this year -- last year was all about ramping up. This year is about operational stability at much higher production volumes.

當然。因此，回答您的第一個問題，參考價格的折扣約為 2,000 美元，與第一季的折扣非常相似。顯然，這反映了稅收以及中國對該材料的再加工成本。我認為今年——去年的一切都是為了提升。今年的重點是在產量大幅提高的情況下實現營運穩定。

And so we're seeing product stability improve, and we expect that to continue through Q3 and Q4. So there may be room to reduce that reprocessing fee. But I think from our perspective, the focus really is on volumes and costs. And if we can deliver on those, then I think the product quality will also improve throughout the end of the year.

因此，我們看到產品穩定性正在提高，我們預計這種趨勢將持續到第三季和第四季。因此，可能還有降低再處理費用的空間。但我認為從我們的角度來看，重點確實在於數量和成本。如果我們能夠實現這些目標，那麼我認為產品品質在年底也會提高。

I think it's important to note, like we're very much aligned with Ganfeng in terms of being able to supply customers with our product -- global customers -- so these are customers outside of China -- going into '26 and certainly going into '27. So it is a high priority. And we'll have more to disclose on that, certainly into next year.

我認為值得注意的是，我們與贛鋒在向客戶（全球客戶）提供我們的產品方面非常一致，所以這些是中國以外的客戶，進入26年，當然也會進入27年。因此，這是一個高度優先事項。我們將會披露更多有關該問題的信息，當然是在明年。

On the cost side, yeah, I mean, we've been very focused on costs. I think every company in the lithium industry has been for very good reason and we continue to be. Some of -- a lot of these cost reduction efforts are a function of entering into steady-state operations.

在成本方面，是的，我的意思是，我們一直非常關注成本。我認為鋰行業的每家公司都有充分的理由這樣做，我們將繼續這樣做。其中一些成本削減措施是進入穩定狀態運作的結果。

Last year, during a ramp-up, it's really hard to kind of, in a sense, freeze things and really take serious efforts to optimize while you're ramping up. This year, that's exactly what we're doing. And the cost savings we've achieved, they're not -- there's not one single bucket that kind of represents a significant portion. It's kind of spread over a number of different initiatives, and these are structural. So they're long term.

去年，在加速過程中，從某種意義上來說，很難凍結一切，也很難在加速過程中付出真正的努力去優化。今年，這正是我們正在做的事情。而我們所實現的成本節約並不是──沒有哪一個桶能代表這麼大的比例。它分佈在許多不同的舉措中，而且都是結構性的。所以它們是長期的。

I think going forward, there will be probably some volatility through this year in terms of where costs are just as a function of these optimization efforts. But the trend is certainly one that we expect to continue through 2026.

我認為，展望未來，今年的成本可能會出現一些波動，這只是這些優化工作的結果。但我們預計這一趨勢肯定會持續到 2026 年。

Joel Jackson, BMO Capital Markets.

喬爾傑克森 (Joel Jackson)，蒙特利爾銀行資本市場 (BMO Capital Markets)。

Hi, Sam and team. Sorry, Sam, I don't see your answer to the last question. So cash costs were down $600 a tonne, like you said, but reported COGS were about flat. Is that because of reprocessing costs? And then so the $600 a tonne cash cost savings not flow through the end. I'm sort of confused. If I missed that, sorry.

嗨，Sam 和團隊。抱歉，山姆，我看不到你對最後一個問題的回答。因此，正如您所說，現金成本每噸下降了 600 美元，但報告的 COGS 基本上持平。這是因為再加工成本嗎？這樣，每噸 600 美元的現金成本節省就無法實現。我有點困惑。如果我錯過了，很抱歉。

Alex, do you want to take that one off?

亞歷克斯，你想把那件脫掉嗎？

Sorry. Sorry, Joel, your question with respect to (multiple speakers) --

對不起。抱歉，喬爾，你的問題是關於（多位發言者）——

Yeah, yeah, your COGS, the JV COGS, divided by tonne was flat quarter over quarter. But your cash COGS per tonne as you disclosed it, are down $600 a tonne. So I was trying to understand the difference between the two. Why was the COGS divided by 10 flat quarter over quarter, cash COGS down?

是的，是的，您的 COGS，合資企業的 COGS，除以噸位，每個季度都是持平的。但正如您所披露的，每噸現金銷貨成本下降了 600 美元。所以我試著去了解兩者之間的差異。為什麼 COGS 除以 10 後季度環比持平，而現金 COGS 卻下降了？

Yeah. I need to remember that cost of sales also includes depreciation. We started depreciation in Q4 of last year when we reached commercial production. So that's one item.

是的。我需要記住銷售成本還包括折舊。當我們去年第四季實現商業化生產時，我們就開始折舊。這是其中一項。

And then in addition, we have some logistics costs and some other costs that are included in cost of sales, but mostly depreciation impacted. The cost was a bit higher in Q2, which sort of resulted in a bit higher cost of sales than, I guess, cash costs.

此外，我們還有一些物流成本和一些其他成本包含在銷售成本中，但主要受到折舊的影響。第二季的成本略高，導致銷售成本略高於現金成本。

Okay. And then I guess, I'm going to sneak in a two-part question to my second question. So first part would be, what kind of visibility do you have into Q3 and Q4 in terms of your order book? Obviously, as Sam said, prices have been whipsawing all over in China now over the last 1.5 months, including today.

好的。然後我想，我將在第二個問題中偷偷加入一個由兩部分組成的問題。那麼第一部分是，就訂單而言，您對第三季和第四季有何了解？顯然，正如 Sam 所說，過去 1.5 個月，包括今天在內，中國各地的價格一直在劇烈波動。

So kind of -- and I know you have some reprocessing with Ganfeng. I don't know if that adds a bit of length to your order book, like when -- so what kind of visibility on that? And on cost, should we expect kind of COGS to be similar in Q3, cash and normal?

所以 - 我知道你和趙鋒有一些再加工。我不知道這是否會為你的訂單簿增加一點長度，例如什麼時候——那麼它的可見度如何？就成本而言，我們是否應該預期第三季的現金和正常情況下的 COGS 會相似？

And then the second part of that question would be, Sam, what are your thoughts here? Q2 was the bottom of the market, came in -- probably, the JV came in maybe slightly negative free cash flow. Maybe you can comment on that. What does that think about your business here across the cycle? Thanks.

那麼問題的第二部分是，山姆，你對此有什麼想法？第二季是市場觸底的時候，合資企業的自由現金流可能略微為負。也許您可以對此發表評論。這對您在整個週期中的業務有何影響？謝謝。

Yeah. I mean, costs -- yeah, I think expecting costs with some minor variability in Q3, Q4 on what we experienced in Q2 is probably a fair way to assess it. Cost of goods sold, I mean, Alex, it's really a function of depreciation -- the delta between that and operating costs.

是的。我的意思是，成本——是的，我認為預計第三季和第四季的成本會與我們在第二季度經歷的成本相比出現一些小的變化，這可能是評估成本的公平方式。我的意思是，亞歷克斯，銷售成本實際上是折舊的函數——也就是它與營運成本之間的差額。

Yeah. I think cost of sales per tonne will generally follow cash flows per tonne in next quarters.

是的。我認為下個季度每噸銷售成本通常會跟隨每噸現金流。

And then in terms of the order book, I mean, the vast majority of our product is under offtake. And the vast majority of that goes to Ganfeng, and so it's all well spoken for. I think there's very strong -- obviously, very strong demand from Ganfeng pulling that material through. So yeah --

就訂單而言，我們的絕大多數產品都已售出。其中絕大部分都歸贛鋒所有，所以這一切都是有道理的。我認為，贛鋒對該材料的需求顯然非常強勁。所以是的--

Is that like a one-month lag, Sam, a two-month lag or three-month lag? How should we think about it?

山姆，這像是滯後一個月、兩個月還是三個月？我們該如何思考這個問題？

Just in terms of the pricing flow through like --?

就定價流程而言--？

The kind of benchmark pricing we can see on the indices and futures and things like that.

我們可以在指數、期貨等看到這種基準定價。

(multiple speakers) Alex, what have you disclosed on that?

（多位發言者）亞歷克斯，你對此透露了什麼？

I think we do have some lag, I would say, several weeks of lag on average.

我認為我們確實存在一些滯後，我想說，平均滯後數週。

And how the business did in Q2 at the bottom?

那麼第二季的業務表現如何？

Yeah. I mean, we're obviously very happy with where the business is today and where we expect it to be over the next 6 months, 12 months, 18 months. Like this is a world-class operation that has some of the lowest costs in the industry.

是的。我的意思是，我們顯然對目前的業務狀況以及未來 6 個月、12 個月、18 個月的業務狀況感到非常滿意。就像這是一項世界級的運營，其成本是業界最低的。

And we -- obviously, this -- even with realized pricing being at $7,400 on an operating basis, we were very marginally operating at a marginal operating profit. I think beyond that, the free cash flow that you referred to is largely tied into working capital, which necessarily higher in Q1 and Q2 given the increase in volume production.

而且我們 — — 顯然，即使實際定價為 7,400 美元的營業成本，我們的營業利潤也只是微薄的。我認為除此之外，您提到的自由現金流很大程度上與營運資本掛鉤，鑑於產量的增加，營運資本在第一季和第二季必然會更高。

And I think as we spoke to on the last call in terms of the cadence of production first half versus second half, we still expect the second half to be the larger volume half of the year.

我認為，正如我們在上次電話會議上談到的上半年與下半年的生產節奏一樣，我們仍然預計下半年將是今年產量較大的半年。

Mohamed Sidibe, National Bank Financial.

穆罕默德·西迪貝，國家金融銀行。

Morning, everyone. Just a follow-up question on the pricing discount that you've seen. And I know in the past, you've guided to that $2,000 per tonne to $2,100 per tonne. Is that something that we should still expect for 2025?

大家早安。我只是想問一下有關您所看到的價格折扣的後續問題。我知道過去您曾將價格指導價定為每噸 2,000 美元至每噸 2,100 美元。我們是否仍應該對 2025 年抱持這樣的期待？

And then just if you could help us reconcile the price realized to, call it, the lithium carbonate average prices of $9,000 per tonne. I think maybe it gets to do with Joel's question around the lag on the sales price received. Thank you.

然後，如果您能幫助我們將實現的價格與碳酸鋰的平均價格（每噸 9,000 美元）進行協調的話，我們會怎麼做？我認為這可能與喬爾關於收到的銷售價格滯後的問題有關。謝謝。

Yeah. The discount was approximately $2,000. I mean, that's comprised of about 50% fixed, 50% variable associated with taxes. And I think Ganfeng and LAR are very aligned in terms of what we want to accomplish this year, which was really getting volume production up, ensuring that operations stabilize at these higher levels, and then driving costs down.

是的。折扣約為 2,000 美元。我的意思是，這其中約 50% 是固定的，50% 是與稅收相關的變動。我認為，贛鋒和 LAR 在今年想要實現的目標上非常一致，那就是真正提高產量，確保營運穩定在較高水平，然後降低成本。

So that's been the priority this year. I think that's going into 2026 and 2027. Given that we're both aligned in the ability to supply global customers outside of China with our product, the focus will shift. So for the remainder of the year, I think the pricing discount that we're receiving today is likely to continue going into 2026. I think the priorities and the focus of both Ganfeng and LAR will shift to be able to provide those customers ex-China with product.

所以這是今年的首要任務。我認為那將持續到 2026 年和 2027 年。鑑於我們都具備向中國以外的全球客戶提供產品的能力，因此重點將會轉移。因此，就今年剩餘時間而言，我認為我們今天獲得的價格折扣可能會持續到 2026 年。我認為贛鋒和LAR的優先事項和重點將會轉變，以便能夠為中國以外的客戶提供產品。

Sounds good. And then just, I guess, maybe a reconciliation between the realized pricing and the average price for lithium carbonate during the quarter. Any color on that would be helpful. And I'm happy to take it offline if that's more of a question for offline.

聽起來不錯。然後，我猜，也許只是本季碳酸鋰的實際價格和平均價格之間的協調。任何顏色都會有幫助。如果這更適合離線，我很樂意將其離線。

I don't know, Alex, do you want to handle that? Or do you want handle it offline?

我不知道，亞歷克斯，你想處理這個嗎？還是您想離線處理？

So I'll just make a comment, as I mentioned, that there is a lag of several weeks between production, pricing, and shipments. That's why a change in spot price isn't reflected immediately in our results. There's several weeks of delay. But yeah, we're happy to provide some more details maybe offline.

因此，正如我所提到的，我只想說，生產、定價和發貨之間存在幾週的滯後。這就是為什麼現貨價格的變化不會立即反映在我們的結果中。已經拖延了好幾週了。但是是的，我們很樂意提供一些也許在線下更詳細的資訊。

Great. Thank you. And just a final question on the third-party debt at Exar. Just $108 million that's due within the next 12 months, what are your expectations around that? Should we expect some potential refinancing of that? Or do you expect to pay that down using some of the available credit that you have? Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。最後一個問題是關於 Exar 的第三方債務。未來 12 個月內僅需支付 1.08 億美元，您對此有何預期？我們是否應該期待一些潛在的再融資？或者您希望使用部分可用信用額度來償還這筆款項？謝謝。

Alex, feel free to answer that.

亞歷克斯，請隨意回答這個問題。

Yeah, sure. As Sam mentioned, we managed to secure $120 million loan facilities in Q2. So we expect to use those facilities to refinance that short-term debt that is coming due.

是的，當然。正如 Sam 所提到的，我們在第二季度成功獲得了 1.2 億美元的貸款。因此，我們希望利用這些工具來為即將到期的短期債務進行再融資。

Thanks, guys.

謝謝大家。

Ben Isaacson, Scotiabank.

加拿大豐業銀行的本‧艾薩克森 (Ben Isaacson)。

Thank you very much, and good morning, everyone. So a question on your partner, Ganfeng. Just looking at the slide, it looks like Ganfeng is going to be involved in not only the pipeline but in the retail development plan as well.

非常感謝，大家早安。所以我有一個關於您的合作夥伴甘峰的問題。從投影片來看，贛鋒似乎不僅會參與通路建設，還會參與零售發展計畫。

Can you talk about their financial health as your partner, if prices were not to change from where they've been in the last kind of six months in that mid-$8000 area? Would Ganfeng be able to continue funding and developing its proportionate share of these projects?

如果價格在過去六個月中一直保持在 8000 美元左右的水平，您作為合作夥伴能否談談他們的財務狀況？贛鋒能否繼續為這些項目提供資金並開發其相應份額？

Would it -- does it rank other projects higher than the ones with LAR? Can you just talk about what the thought process is with respect to Ganfeng as a partner in a period of sustained pressure on pricing and profitability for them? Thank you.

它會使其他項目的排名高於 LAR 項目嗎？您能否談談在贛鋒鋰業持續面臨定價和獲利壓力的時期，作為合作夥伴，您的想法是什麼？謝謝。

Yeah. I'll be careful not to put words into Ganfeng's mouth, but I think addressing some of these questions out of order. One, Argentina is probably the most -- ranks extraordinarily high in terms of Ganfeng's focus outside of China.

是的。我會小心不要把話塞到甘峰的嘴裡，但我認為回答其中一些問題是不合適的。首先，阿根廷可能是贛鋒在中國以外最受關注的國家。

And I think what we've been able to deliver at Cauchari-Olaroz only kind of supports and emboldens that strategy. Obviously, we're very pleased with where costs are coming in Q1 and Q2. Ganfeng is relentless in terms of driving down costs, and they see considerably more to do on that front.

我認為我們在考查里-奧拉羅斯會議中所取得的成果只是對這項策略的支持和鼓勵。顯然，我們對第一季和第二季的成本變化非常滿意。贛鋒在降低成本方面堅持不懈，並且他們認為在這方面還有很多工作要做。

And then in terms of -- I mean, in terms of their financial health, Ganfeng does have access to a lot of capital in China. They also have tremendous relationships with their downstream customers, who I think are interested in being able to minimize the risks that I think a lot of people see in two, three years.

然後就財務狀況而言，贛鋒確實在中國可以獲得大量資金。他們也與下游客戶保持著良好的關係，我認為這些客戶希望能夠將許多人在兩三年內看到的風險降至最低。

Certainly, if prices remain where they are now, I think there is a high probability that there could be certainly market balance potentially market shortage. And so some of their customers are very supportive of Ganfeng's efforts to kind of de-risk the supply chain, bring on low-cost projects like Cauchari-Olaroz that can kind of be resilient through the bottom of a cycle.

當然，如果價格維持在目前的水平，我認為很有可能出現市場平衡或市場短缺。因此，他們的一些客戶非常支持贛鋒集團為降低供應鏈風險所做的努力，並推出像 Cauchari-Olaroz 這樣的低成本項目，這些項目可以在週期底部保持韌性。

So I'd say they do prioritize Argentina as one of their kind of top jurisdictions for investment. I think they do have access to quite a bit of capital in China. And so their appetite is there. Obviously, if prices were to fall dramatically, I think it would give everybody continued pause in terms of investment.

所以我認為他們確實將阿根廷列為優先投資管轄區之一。我認為他們在中國確實可以獲得相當多的資本。所以他們的胃口就在那裡。顯然，如果價格大幅下跌，我認為這會導致每個人在投資方面繼續猶豫不決。

But Ganfeng is certainly a tremendous partner to have. They have great relations with global customers. They have a keen understanding of cost curves and where they want to invest. And so I think we're very well positioned with them with our platform in Argentina, that has kind of a pipeline that can get us to over 200,000 tonnes of production of low-cost lithium units.

但贛鋒無疑是個非常棒的合作夥伴。他們與全球客戶保持著良好的關係。他們對成本曲線以及投資方向有著敏銳的理解。因此，我認為憑藉我們在阿根廷的平台，我們處於非常有利的地位，該平台擁有一條管道，可以讓我們生產超過 20 萬噸低成本的鋰裝置。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

That concludes our question-and-answer session. Ladies and gentlemen, this will conclude today's call. Thank you all for joining. You may now disconnect.

我們的問答環節到此結束。女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝大家的加入。您現在可以斷開連線。