Kilroy Realty Corp (KRC) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon and welcome to the Kilroy Realty Corporation fourth quarter 2024 earnings conference call. My name is Harry, and I will be your operator today. (Operator Instructions)

下午好，歡迎參加 Kilroy Realty Corporation 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。我叫哈利，今天我將擔任您的接線生。（操作員指示）

I would now like to hand the conference over to [Doug Butterworth], Senior Director of Corporate Finance. Thank you. You may proceed.

現在，我想將會議交給公司財務高級總監 [Doug Butterworth]。謝謝。您可以繼續。

Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us. On the call with me are Angela Aman, CEO; Jeffrey Kuehling, EVP, CFO and Treasurer; and Eliott Trencher, EVP, CIO. In addition, Justin Smart, President; and Rob Porat, EVP, Chief Leasing Officer, will be available for Q&A.

大家早安。感謝您加入我們。與我一起通話的還有執行長 Angela Aman； Jeffrey Kuehling，執行副總裁、財務長兼財務主管；以及執行副總裁兼首席資訊長 Eliott Trencher。此外，總裁賈斯汀·斯馬特 (Justin Smart)；執行副總裁兼首席租賃官 Rob Porat 將接受問答。

Please note that some of the information we will be discussing during this call is forward-looking in nature. Please refer to our supplemental package for a statement regarding the forward-looking information on this call and in the supplemental. This call is being webcast live on our website and will be available for replay for the next eight days. Our earnings release and supplemental package have been filed on a Form 8-K with the SEC, and both are also available on our website.

請注意，我們在本次電話會議中討論的一些資訊本質上是前瞻性的。請參閱我們的補充包，以了解有關本次電話會議和補充文件中前瞻性資訊的聲明。本次電話會議將在我們的網站上進行現場直播，並將在接下來的八天內提供重播。我們的收益報告和補充資料已以 8-K 表格形式提交給美國證券交易委員會 (SEC)，也可在我們的網站上查閱。

Angela will start the call with a strategic overview and quarterly highlights. Elliot will provide a transaction market outlook and Jeffrey will discuss our financial results and provide you with our 2025 guidance, then we'll be happy to take your questions. Angela?

安吉拉將以策略概述和季度重點開始電話會議。艾略特將提供交易市場展望，傑弗裡將討論我們的財務表現並為您提供 2025 年指導，然後我們很樂意回答您的問題。安吉拉？

Thanks, Doug. I'm pleased to report on the strong end to 2024, which was (inaudible) by outperformance in our financial results and a material acceleration in leasing activity. In addition, throughout the course of last year, the team worked tirelessly to prepare for the recovery we knew would take hold in our markets, making critical senior hires across the platform, rethinking processes and systems to be more efficient and nimble, successfully completing several in-process development and major repositioning projects, taking significant steps to address our future development pipeline and other nonincome-producing assets, including the sale of our corporate airplane, which closed in the fourth quarter and actively monitoring the market for opportunistic transactions.

謝謝，道格。我很高興地報告 2024 年的強勁表現，這得益於我們財務業績的優異表現和租賃活動的大幅加速。此外，在去年全年，團隊孜孜不倦地為我們所知道的市場復甦做準備，在整個平台上聘用了關鍵的高級職員，重新思考流程和系統，使其更加高效和靈活，成功完成了幾個正在進行的開發和重大重新定位項目，採取了重大措施來解決我們未來的開發渠道和其他非創收市場資產，包括出售我們的公司（該機會於第四季度），

The Kilroy team has risen to every challenge that has presented itself. And the recent devastation in Los Angeles, the location of our corporate headquarters is no exception. I've been inspired by the strength and resilience of this team as they work to support our Los Angeles tenants and each other as we've collectively navigated a very challenging start to 2025.

Kilroy 團隊已經迎接了所遇到的每一個挑戰。我們公司總部所在地洛杉磯最近遭遇的災難也不例外。我被這個團隊的力量和韌性所鼓舞，他們努力支持我們的洛杉磯租戶並互相支持，我們共同度過了 2025 年非常具有挑戰性的開局。

During the fourth quarter of last year, we signed approximately 708,000 square feet of leases, achieving our highest level of leasing activity since the fourth quarter of 2019, a testament to the ongoing demand for high-quality spaces that align with evolving tenant needs.

去年第四季度，我們簽署了約 708,000 平方英尺的租約，實現了自 2019 年第四季度以來的最高租賃活動水平，證明了對符合不斷變化的租戶需求的高品質空間的持續需求。

The quarter was headlined by two significant deals. First, we executed a multi-floor lease with Walmart at Skyline Tower in Bellevue, Washington. Our regional team worked creatively to accommodate Walmart's significant requirement and accelerated time line, simultaneously executing an early termination with an existing tenant for a portion of the space that Walmart will occupy, addressing a late 2025 expiration and achieving a meaningful rent increase in the process.

本季的焦點是兩筆重大交易。首先，我們與沃爾瑪在華盛頓州貝爾維尤的 Skyline Tower 簽訂了多層租賃合約。我們的區域團隊創造性地開展工作，以滿足沃爾瑪的重要要求和加快的時間表，同時與現有租戶提前終止沃爾瑪將佔用的部分空間的租賃，解決了 2025 年末到期的問題，並在此過程中實現了租金的大幅上漲。

In addition, we executed a 274,000 square foot new lease in the San Francisco Bay area with a global technology company that is the subtenant occupying our largest 2026 expiration. Over 70% of the square footage for this expiration has now been addressed through the lease sign this quarter and a 157,000 square foot lease signed with the same tenant in the fourth quarter of 2023. This execution, combined with the SAP renewal in Bellevue, Washington, announced last quarter, underscores both the proactivity of our team as it relates to addressing our 2026 lease expirations and the increased willingness of tenants to engage and make long-term commitments related to their space needs.

此外，我們在舊金山灣區與一家全球科技公司簽訂了一份 274,000 平方英尺的新租約，該公司是我們最大的轉租人，租期至 2026 年。此次到期的超過 70% 的面積問題已透過本季度的租約簽署和 2023 年第四季度與同一租戶簽署的 157,000 平方英尺的租約得到解決。此次執行，加上上個季度宣布的華盛頓州貝爾維尤 SAP 續約，凸顯了我們團隊在解決 2026 年租約到期問題方面的積極主動性，以及租戶參與並做出與其空間需求相關的長期承諾的意願增強。

Given historically low levels of new supply, and increased workplace attendance requirements taking effect, our markets are demonstrating important signs of sustained recovery, and we expect these trends to continue to accelerate over the next several years.

鑑於新增供應量處於歷史低位，以及工作場所出勤要求的提高，我們的市場正顯示出持續復甦的重要跡象，我們預計這些趨勢將在未來幾年繼續加速。

Kilroy has a number of unique opportunities to capture this growing momentum as we executed over the course of this year. One particular area of focus is the embedded upside inherent in our highest quality vacancies, specifically those concentrated and recently developed or repositioned assets, including (inaudible) ate in Seattle, 2,100 Kettner in San Diego and Indeed Tower in Austin. These properties set the standard for quality, functionality and market-leading amenitization, ideally positioning them within their respective markets.

正如我們今年所執行的那樣，Kilroy 擁有許多獨特的機會來抓住這一成長勢頭。我們特別關注的一個領域是我們最優質空置物業所蘊含的內在優勢，特別是那些集中且最近開發或重新定位的資產，包括西雅圖的 (聽不清楚) ate、聖地牙哥的 2,100 Kettner 和奧斯汀的 Indeed Tower。這些飯店為品質、功能和市場領先的設施設定了標準，並在各自的市場中佔據了理想的地位。

Vacant space at these assets alone represented 410 basis points of leased occupancy upside at year-end, highlighting an exceptional source of future growth for the company. And while not reflected in our occupancy statistics until early 2026, the second phase of Kilroy Oyster Point in South San Francisco will be a substantial growth driver for the company in the coming years. The project received its temporary certificate of occupancy in January 2025, following some slight delays in municipal approvals and is now fully ready to welcome tenants. The spec suites, conference facilities, food and beverage offerings and outdoor meeting and event spaces set this project apart from competitive supply in the market and are driving constructive conversations with several life science and office users.

光是這些資產的空置面積就意味著年底租賃入住率上漲了 410 個基點，凸顯了該公司未來成長的特殊來源。雖然直到 2026 年初才會反映在我們的入住率統計數據中，但南舊金山 Kilroy Oyster Point 的第二期工程將成為該公司未來幾年的重要成長動力。在市政審批略有延遲後，該項目於 2025 年 1 月獲得了臨時入住許可證，目前已完全準備好迎接租戶。規格套房、會議設施、餐飲服務以及戶外會議和活動空間使該項目在市場上的競爭供應中脫穎而出，並與多個生命科學和辦公室用戶進行了建設性的對話。

While the environment in South San Francisco remains highly competitive, we are convicted in the quality of what we're delivering in Oyster Point and the long-term success of this project.

儘管南舊金山的環境仍然競爭激烈，但我們對 Oyster Point 交付的產品的品質以及該專案的長期成功充滿信心。

As discussed on prior calls, we continue to proactively assess our future development pipeline and are executing on various programs to derisk, accelerate and maximize value realization for our shareholders. We expect to continue to hold certain parcels such as the land associated with future phases of Kilroy Oyster Point, as our current program continues to represent the best path forward.

正如之前的電話會議所討論的那樣，我們將繼續積極評估我們未來的發展管道，並正在執行各種計劃，以降低風險、加速和最大化股東的價值實現。我們預計將繼續持有某些地塊，例如與 Kilroy Oyster Point 未來階段相關的土地，因為我們目前的計劃仍然代表著最佳的前進道路。

In other cases, including some of our sites in Southern California, it is clear that the path to maximizing value will be a full reentitlement to an alternative use, such as residential, and we're focused on defining the execution path that will best balance our desire to maximize proceeds with accelerating the timing of monetization. In still other cases, such as with the Flower Mart parcel in San Francisco, the path to value maximization will require more work and exploration.

在其他情況下，包括我們在南加州的一些站點，很明顯，實現價值最大化的途徑將是完全重新獲得替代用途，例如住宅，並且我們專注於定義執行路徑，以最好地平衡我們最大化收益的願望與加快貨幣化的時間。在其他情況下，例如舊金山的花卉市場地塊，實現價值最大化的道路將需要更多的工作和探索。

The original plans for the Flower Mart were created against the backdrop of a very different market environment and contemplated 2.3 million square feet of primarily office space to be supported by significant infrastructure investments in the site, which limit the ability to face construction. Our team is actively working to create additional optionality for this project that will allow us to be responsive to the market as the recovery continues.

花卉市場的最初規劃是在截然不同的市場環境下制定的，預計230萬平方英尺的主要辦公空間將由場地上的大量基礎設施投資來支持，這限制了其建設能力。我們的團隊正在積極努力為該專案創造額外的可選性，以便我們在經濟復甦持續過程中對市場做出反應。

Although the steps we are taking now will maximize the value of the site over time, there will likely be an earnings implication in the second half of the year if our planning and design efforts conclude and development is still unwarranted based on market conditions. Jeffrey will provide some additional details in a moment.

雖然我們現在採取的措施將使該地塊的價值隨著時間的推移而最大化，但如果我們的規劃和設計工作結束，而根據市場情況來看，開發仍然沒有必要，那麼下半年的盈利可能會受到影響。傑弗裡稍後將提供一些額外的細節。

In conclusion, our fourth quarter and full year results, including our robust leasing volume speak to the strength we see emerging across our markets. And the Kilroy team has prepared for a busy year across every part of our platform. I want to thank the team again for their hard work and dedication in 2024 and for the energy and enthusiasm they are bringing to 2025. Eliott?

總而言之，我們的第四季和全年業績，包括強勁的租賃量，都顯示了我們所看到的整個市場正在顯現的強勁勢頭。Kilroy 團隊已經為我們平台各個部分的繁忙一年做好了準備。我要再次感謝團隊在 2024 年的辛勤工作和奉獻精神，以及他們為 2025 年帶來的活力和熱情。艾略特？

Thanks, Angela. The transaction market closed the year on a positive trajectory. Deal volume and financing levels were higher year-over-year with a bias towards smaller deals. In 2024, approximately 85% of office sales were under $100 million. By comparison, this number was 70% of transactions back in 2019. Another sign of progress has been the return of core capital to the sector. In the fourth quarter, there were notable core deals in Austin and the Bay Area with growing in yields in the mid-6% to low 7% range.

謝謝，安吉拉。交易市場以積極的軌跡結束了這一年。交易量和融資水準較去年同期有所提高，且偏向小型交易。2024 年，約 85% 的辦公室銷售額低於 1 億美元。相比之下，這一數字是 2019 年交易量的 70%。另一個進步的標誌是核心資本回歸該行業。第四季度，奧斯汀和灣區的核心交易引人注目，殖利率成長在 6% 中段至 7% 低段之間。

The combination of deeper bidding pools and a variety of capital sources is encouraging us to start testing the sales market again, something we put on hold over the last few years as valuations were in flux. We will focus our disposition efforts on properties where the current market value does not appropriately reflect our assessment of the medium-term risk. Fortunately, our funding needs are modest over the next few years, and our balance sheet is in good shape, so we will only proceed with sales that meet our stringent criteria.

更深層的競標池和各種資本來源的結合鼓勵我們再次開始測試銷售市場，由於估值不斷變化，我們在過去幾年中擱置了這一舉措。我們將重點處置那些當前市場價值不能恰當反映我們對中期風險的評估的資產。幸運的是，未來幾年我們的資金需求不大，而且我們的資產負債表狀況良好，因此我們只會進行符合我們嚴格標準的銷售。

And while we did not acquire anything during the quarter, we remain optimistic about the opportunity set of potential value-creating acquisitions. Our strong balance sheet, local market knowledge and operational insights are all advantages we expect to put to good use in 2025. As always, we will remain disciplined in our approach and judicious for shareholder capital.

雖然我們在本季沒有收購任何公司，但我們仍然對潛在創造價值的收購機會感到樂觀。我們強大的資產負債表、本地市場知識和營運洞察力都是我們期望在 2025 年充分發揮的優勢。像往常一樣，我們將保持嚴謹的態度並明智地使用股東資本。

Turning to land sales. As we mentioned last quarter, we are in advanced discussions with residential developers on two sites in our future development pipeline that are expected to generate in excess of $150 million of proceeds. There remains an acute need for more housing in Southern California and reentitling commercial land is a logical way to address the significant and growing problem. We expect to have more to discuss on our capital recycling initiatives as the year progresses.

談到土地銷售。正如我們上個季度提到的，我們正在與住宅開發商就未來開發案的兩個地點進行深入討論，預計這兩個地點將產生超過 1.5 億美元的收益。南加州仍然迫切需要更多的住房，重新授予商業用地所有權是解決這一日益嚴重的嚴重問題的合理方法。隨著時間的推移，我們期望對資本循環計劃進行更多討論。

Given continued uncertainty in the transaction market and our expectations for an elongated closing process on our land sales, guidance does not contemplate any FFO impact from such activities, and we will continue to update our expectations throughout the year.

鑑於交易市場的持續不確定性以及我們對土地銷售成交過程延長的預期，指導意見並未考慮此類活動對 FFO 的任何影響，我們將在全年繼續更新我們的預期。

With that, I will turn the call over to Jeffrey.

說完這些，我將把電話轉給傑弗裡。

Thanks, Elliot. FFO was $1.20 per diluted share in the fourth quarter, and it was impacted by several onetime items totaling approximately $0.11 per share, including a $6 million gain on the sale of the corporate plan, $4.7 million of GAAP restoration fee income and $2.5 million of GAAP termination fee income. Cash same-property NOI growth was 70 basis points in the fourth quarter, including a 90 basis points contribution related to restoration and termination fee income.

謝謝，艾略特。第四季的 FFO 為每股稀釋後 1.20 美元，並受到幾項一次性項目的影響，總計約每股 0.11 美元，包括出售公司計劃的 600 萬美元收益、470 萬美元的 GAAP 恢復費收入和 250 萬美元的 GAAP 終止費收入。第四季現金同物業淨營業收入成長率為 70 個基點，其中包括與修復和終止費用收入相關的 90 個基點的貢獻。

Occupancy ended the year at 82.8%, and it was impacted by several large move-outs that were discussed on last quarter's call, including Capital One and Microsoft in the San Francisco Bay Area and a short-term lease expiration in Los Angeles.

年底入住率為 82.8%，並受到上個季度電話會議上討論的幾起大規模搬遷事件的影響，包括舊金山灣區的 Capital One 和微軟的搬遷以及洛杉磯的短期租約到期。

Now let's discuss 2025 guidance. Our 2025 FFO guidance range is $3.85 to $4.05 per diluted share, representing a midpoint of $3.95. 2025 average occupancy is expected to range between 80% and 82%, a decrease of approximately 300 basis points versus our average occupancy in 2024. The decrease is primarily driven by the previously mentioned fourth quarter 2024 move-outs as well as three larger move-outs or down sizings expected to occur in the first quarter of 2025 and totaling approximately 216,000 square feet. Following the activity in the first quarter, no remaining expiration in 2025 is in excess of 50,000 square feet.

現在讓我們來討論一下 2025 年的指導。我們 2025 年的 FFO 指引範圍是每股攤薄收益 3.85 美元至 4.05 美元，中間值為 3.95 美元。預計 2025 年平均入住率將在 80% 至 82% 之間，比 2024 年平均入住率下降約 300 個基點。減少的主要原因是前面提到的 2024 年第四季度的搬出以及預計將於 2025 年第一季度發生的三次更大規模的搬出或縮小規模，總計約 216,000 平方英尺。繼第一季的活動之後，2025 年剩餘的到期面積均不超過 50,000 平方英尺。

Cash same-property NOI is projected to decline between negative 1.5% to negative 3%. At the midpoint of the range, base rent will detract approximately 50 basis points from growth, net recoveries will detract approximately 75 basis points and nonrecurring items such as restoration fee income will be tracked approximately 100 basis points. Despite the almost 300 basis points decline in average occupancy expected during 2025, the limited detraction from base rent highlights the strength of our contractual rent growth across the portfolio. Please note that the same-property NOI growth is expected to be lower in the second half of the year, primarily due to the trajectory of occupancy and significant restoration fee income recognized in the second half of 2024.

現金同房淨營業收入預計將下降-1.5%至-3%。在該範圍的中間點，基本租金將從成長中扣除約 50 個基點，淨回收將扣除約 75 個基點，而修復費收入等非經常性項目將扣除約 100 個基點。儘管預計 2025 年平均入住率將下降近 300 個基點，但基本租金的下降幅度有限，凸顯了我們整個投資組合的合約租金成長強勁。請注意，預計下半年同店淨營業收入成長將會較低，這主要是由於入住率的走勢以及 2024 年下半年確認的大量修復費收入。

As part of our enhanced disclosure efforts beginning in 2025, lease termination fee income will be excluded from both cash and GAAP NOI, a change that has been reflected in our cash same-property NOI guidance. FFO guidance assumes $3 million of such income, down from $7 million in 2024. Noncash GAAP NOI adjustments, which include the amortization of deferred rent and net below-market rent, straight line rent and other lease-related adjustments are expected to decline significantly in 2025, but remain positive with a range of $2 million to $5 million, down from over $20 million in 2024. The year-over-year decrease primarily reflects the cadence of leasing activity over the last 24 months.

作為我們從 2025 年開始加強揭露工作的一部分，租賃終止費用收入將被排除在現金和 GAAP NOI 之外，這項變更已反映在我們的現金同物業 NOI 指南中。FFO 指引假設此類收入為 300 萬美元，低於 2024 年的 700 萬美元。非現金 GAAP NOI 調整（包括遞延租金攤提和低於市場的淨租金、直線租金和其他租賃相關調整）預計將在 2025 年大幅下降，但仍將保持在 200 萬至 500 萬美元的正值範圍內，低於 2024 年的 2000 多萬美元。年比下降主要反映了過去 24 個月租賃活動的節奏。

The combination of G&A and leasing costs totaled just under $81 million last year, a steep decline from approximately $100 million in 2023. During 2024, our focus was on both reducing the total amount of overhead spending and ensuring that each dollar of spending was appropriately allocated across the platform. As we executed on these goals, overhead spending in 2024 came in artificially low as cost savings initiatives outpaced the timing of certain platform investments. The $83 million to $85 million overhead guidance we have provided for 2025 represents a more appropriate run rate going forward.

去年，一般及行政費用和租賃成本總計略低於 8,100 萬美元，較 2023 年的約 1 億美元大幅下降。2024 年期間，我們的重點是減少整體管理支出，並確保每一美元的支出都能在整個平台上合理分配。在我們執行這些目標的過程中，由於成本節約計畫超過了某些平台投資的時機，2024 年的管理費用被人為地壓低了。我們為 2025 年提供的 8300 萬美元至 8500 萬美元的間接費用指導代表了未來更合適的運行率。

Moving to interest income. You may recall that last January, we prefunded our capital needs for 2024, resulting in elevated cash balances for most of the year, which were utilized to pay down a portion of our term loan balances and repay $400 million of unsecured notes at maturity in December. We expect to maintain less cash on hand during 2025. And in turn, we expect a significant reduction in interest income, down from $38 million in 2024 to about $6 million in 2025.

轉向利息收入。您可能還記得，去年 1 月，我們預先為 2024 年的資本需求提供了資金，導致全年大部分時間的現金餘額都較高，這些現金餘額用於償還部分定期貸款餘額，並在 12 月償還到期的 4 億美元無擔保票據。我們預計 2025 年庫存現金將會減少。相應地，我們預計利息收入將大幅減少，從 2024 年的 3,800 萬美元降至 2025 年的約 600 萬美元。

As it relates to capitalized interest during 2025, please note two things: One, as construction at KOP Phase 2 was completed in January, interest capitalization will cease at the earlier of tenant occupancy for one year from base building completion, which will now occur in January 2026. Two, as we have previously discussed, we remain committed to methodically evaluating each land parcel to determine its highest and best use and the optimal program for project execution.

由於它與 2025 年的資本化利息有關，請注意兩點：第一，由於 KOP 第二階段的建設已於 1 月完成，因此利息資本化將在基礎建築竣工後租戶入住一年（以較早者為準）時停止，現在將於 2026 年 1 月停止。二，正如我們之前討論過的，我們仍然致力於有條不紊地評估每一塊土地，以確定其最高和最佳用途以及專案執行的最佳方案。

To provide some additional context related to Angela's comments on the Flower Mart, we currently capitalize approximately $7 million of interest expense and an additional $1 million of real estate taxes and other expenses for the project each quarter. Our 2025 guidance incorporates a range of potential capitalization scenarios for this project, and at the midpoint, assumes that capitalization ceases at the beginning of the fourth quarter. This assumption, combined with our assumptions for several other parcels in the future development pipeline, are expected to result in capitalized interest of approximately $72 million in 2025 at the midpoint of the range versus $82.5 million recognized in 2024. We will update these assumptions as our plans to lead side.

為了提供一些與安吉拉對花卉市場的評論相關的額外背景信息，我們目前每季度為該項目資本化約 700 萬美元的利息費用和額外的 100 萬美元的房地產稅和其他費用。我們的 2025 年指導包含了該項目的一系列潛在資本化情景，並在中點假設資本化在第四季度初停止。這個假設，加上我們對未來開發管道中其他幾個地塊的假設，預計將導致 2025 年的資本化利息達到約 7,200 萬美元，處於該範圍的中點，而 2024 年則為 8,250 萬美元。我們將根據我們的計劃更新這些假設。

In conclusion, we remain well positioned to navigate the evolving market landscape with strong liquidity and stable leasing fundamentals and a disciplined capital allocation strategy. Our continued focus on maximizing -- or on maintaining a flexible balance sheet, monetizing noncore assets and delivering high-quality developments will allow us to drive long-term value while adapting to changes in market conditions.

總而言之，憑藉強大的流動性、穩定的租賃基本面以及嚴謹的資本配置策略，我們仍能很好地應對不斷變化的市場格局。我們將繼續致力於最大化——或者維持靈活的資產負債表、將非核心資產貨幣化並實現高品質的發展，這將使我們能夠在適應市場條件變化的同時推動長期價值。

With that, we're happy to take your questions. Operator?

我們很樂意回答您的問題。操作員？

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Upal Rana, KeyCorp.

Upal Rana，KeyCorp。

Great, thanks for taking my question. You guys laid out several known move outs for 2025, particularly one. I was wondering what your current visibility on occupancy is for 2025. Do you expect to potentially bottom this year?

太好了，感謝您回答我的問題。你們列出了 2025 年的幾個已知舉措，特別是其中一項。我想知道您對 2025 年入住率的預期如何。您預計今年有可能觸底嗎？

Yeah. I mean just to talk through a little bit sort of the dynamic in 2021 that I think -- excuse me, the dynamic in 2025 that I think Jeffrey did a good job at laying out. We've got some significant move-outs in the first quarter of the year, which include an 80,000 square foot move out we had talked about previously, in addition to that short-term lease associated with the bankruptcy situation from the fourth quarter that will also be, we believe, significantly downsizing, but remaining in the portfolio in Q1.

是的。我只是想稍微談談我認為的 2021 年的動態——對不起，我認為 Jeffrey 很好地闡述了 2025 年的動態。我們在今年第一季進行了一些重大的搬遷，其中包括我們之前談到的 80,000 平方英尺的搬遷，此外還有與第四季度破產情況相關的短期租賃，我們認為這些短期租賃也將大幅縮減，但在第一季度仍將保留在投資組合中。

In addition, as I mentioned in my prepared remarks, there's a pretty exciting new deal in Bellevue that also resulted in a termination that will take effect during the first quarter with that new tenant coming online later in the year as well. After we get past the first quarter, we do expect a lot more stability in the occupancy level throughout the year. Jeffrey mentioned that after the first quarter, our largest move out -- or largest expiration, I should say, in 2025 is no greater than 50,000 feet. So there's a really granular pool, and we will start to really see the benefit, I think, from the leasing activity that's been done over the last couple of quarters.

此外，正如我在準備好的發言中提到的那樣，貝爾維尤有一項非常令人興奮的新交易，該交易也導致了終止，該終止將在第一季度生效，而新的租戶也將在今年晚些時候上線。度過第一季後，我們確實預計全年的入住率將更加穩定。傑弗裡提到，第一季之後，我們最大的遷出——或者說最大的到期，應該說，在 2025 年不會超過 50,000 英尺。因此，這是一個非常細粒度的池子，我認為，我們將開始真正看到過去幾季的租賃活動帶來的好處。

As we look into 2026, as you can see in the lease expiration schedule, we certainly have a higher move out year in 2026. And I think that Rob and his team have been doing a really excellent job in engaging with tenants as early as possible and starting to address some of those larger expirations. Our largest expiration in 2026 has been one lease that was just under 600,000 feet. And as I also mentioned in my prepared remarks, we made some significant headway on that this quarter and have now addressed over 70% of that expiration.

當我們展望 2026 年時，正如您在租約到期時間表中所看到的，2026 年我們的搬出率肯定會更高。我認為 Rob 和他的團隊在儘早與租戶接觸並開始解決一些較大的到期問題方面做得非常出色。我們 2026 年到期的最大合約是一份面積略低於 600,000 英尺的租約。正如我在準備好的演講中提到的那樣，本季度我們在這方面取得了重大進展，目前已解決了 70％ 以上的到期問題。

So I think we're making really good progress as it relates to 2026, feel pretty good after we get through the first quarter about how expirations look for the balance of 2025, but sort of how things settle out between the back half of '25 and into '26 is just going to depend on our continued ability to proactively address those '26 expirations and continue to see leasing pick up across the portfolio for currently vacant space.

因此，我認為我們在 2026 年方面取得了非常好的進展，在度過第一季後，我們對 2025 年剩餘時間的到期情況感到相當滿意，但 2025 年下半年和 2026 年之間情況如何發展將取決於我們是否有能力繼續主動解決 2026 年到期問題，並繼續看到整個投資組合中繼續看到整個租賃空間的租賃空間回升。

Okay. Great. That was helpful. And then on KOP 2, could you give us a sense of what the conversations have been like over the past few months? And maybe what your existing pipeline is currently there?

好的。偉大的。這很有幫助。那麼關於 KOP 2，您能否向我們介紹一下過去幾個月的對話？也許您現有的管道目前在那裡？

Yeah. I'll just kick it off and then turn it over to Rob for some additional detail. I mean, I think what I'd say about this project today is that the completion of the project in January has really sort of changed the nature of the conversations we're having at that project. I think even if you saw the project pretty recently, now having the amenities fully completed, now having the spec suites fully furnished, having all the landscaping and has really changed the dynamic and how that project feels. And we're seeing that result in additional tour activity and additional constructive conversations across a broad range of tenants and a broad range of sizes as well. I think we had some pretty good traction in a slightly larger format size than just the spec suites has been about 40,000 to 60,000 square foot range as well.

是的。我將開始討論，然後將其交給 Rob 來提供一些額外的細節。我的意思是，我認為我今天要說的是，該專案在一月份的完成確實改變了我們在該專案上進行的對話的性質。我想，即使你最近才看到這個項目，現在設施已經完全完工，規格套房也已經完全裝修完畢，所有的景觀都已經完成，並且確實改變了項目的動態和感覺。我們看到，這將為廣大租戶和各種規模的企業帶來更多的參觀活動和更多的建設性對話。我認為我們在比規格套件稍大一點的格式尺寸方面取得了相當不錯的成績，其面積也大約在 40,000 到 60,000 平方英尺的範圍內。

So I think all of the dynamics are healthy. As we mentioned earlier, South San Francisco remains a very competitive market and there is significant vacancy in the market that we're competing against. But I really believe the quality of what we've delivered in Oyster Point and the scale of what we've delivered in Oyster Point is getting a tremendous amount of focus from market participants, both the brokerage community and from tenants in the market and even tenants that might not have been considering Oyster Point as a location. And I think we're really pleased at how things are evolving, kind of post the completion of that project.

所以我認為所有的動態都是健康的。正如我們之前提到的，南舊金山仍然是一個競爭非常激烈的市場，我們競爭的市場中存在著大量空置空間。但我確實相信，我們在牡蠣角所交付產品的品質和規模正受到市場參與者的極大關注，包括經紀界和市場租戶，甚至那些可能沒有考慮將牡蠣角作為地點的租戶。我認為我們對專案完成後事情的進展感到非常高興。

Sure. Adding on to what Angela said, this is Rob Pratte, by the way, taking a step back and just looking at KOP, now that it's delivered, it is the most notable newly delivered life science project in the most preeminent market on the West Coast for life science, and, as a result, we're seeing a really broad swath of interest from tenants as well as brokers from across the Bay Area.

當然。順便補充一下安吉拉所說的，這是羅布·普拉特，順便說一下，我們退一步來看看 KOP，現在它已經交付了，它是西海岸最傑出的生命科學市場上最引人注目的新交付的生命科學項目，因此，我們看到來自整個灣區的租戶和經紀人的廣泛興趣。

And that focus sort of runs from life science, the buildings or purpose-built life science, that was the original intent, that's still our intent, that's our focus for leasing is life science. But given the campus-like nature of the project and the leading-edge amenities that Angela outlined, it's attracting attention from technology companies and financial services and sort of what you know the Bay area to be, especially from large users. So the project has really come on to its own. And as I said, it's attracting a lot of attention in a positive way. And I know that feedback we're getting both from users as well as the brokerage community is that there's nothing else like this campus that's available.

這種重點源自於生命科學，建築物或專門建造的生命科學，這是最初的目的，這仍然是我們的初衷，我們租賃的重點是生命科學。但考慮到該項目的校園性質和安吉拉概述的尖端設施，它吸引了科技公司和金融服務公司以及您所了解的灣區的關注，尤其是大用戶的關注。因此，該項目已真正開始實施。正如我所說，它以積極的方式吸引了很多關注。我知道，我們從使用者和經紀社群得到的回饋是，沒有其他園區能與這個園區相提並論。

In terms of our pipeline, you've heard us over the past few quarters talk about how our pipeline has continued to grow and that remains the case. We're in discussions with a variety of companies in different sizes. Our spec suites are very well received. They're furnished now. And again, it just makes -- when I think about the years we've been marketing this project, there's nothing like being able to walk it and go through the landscaping and sit in the conference center or go to an office floor as opposed to trying to market something from renderings and photographs. So that touch and feel experience is really translating into, we think, tangible activity.

就我們的管道而言，過去幾個季度您已經聽到我們談論我們的管道如何持續增長，並且這種情況仍然如此。我們正在與各種不同規模的公司進行討論。我們的規格套件很受歡迎。現在已配備家具了。再說一次，當我回想起我們多年來一直在行銷這個專案時，我發現沒有什麼比能夠親自走一走、穿過景觀、坐在會議中心或去辦公樓層更好的了，而不是試圖透過效果圖和照片來行銷某個東西。因此，我們認為，觸摸和感覺體驗實際上可以轉化為有形的活動。

The last thing I'd say is just the overall leasing environment in the Bay Area is improving for life science. VC funding for '24 was $11.1 billion, which is up 39% from 2023. And we all know -- and that's specific to life science, and we all know that VC funding is a big driver of the life science demand. There's also been activity in the market that's increased over '23. So as I said, I think in the overall summary, we're really poised well, and I'm very confident about 2025 in Oyster Point.

我最後要說的是，灣區生命科學領域的整​​體租賃環境正在改善。2024 年創投資金為 111 億美元，比 2023 年成長 39%。我們都知道——這是針對生命科學而言的，我們都知道創投資金是生命科學需求的一大驅動力。23 年以來，市場活動也有所增加。正如我所說，我認為從總體上看，我們確實準備充分，我對 2025 年 Oyster Point 的表現非常有信心。

Steve Sakwa, Evercore ISI.

史蒂夫‧薩誇 (Steve Sakwa)，Evercore ISI。

Great. Angela, I just wanted to come back to your comment about the '26 lease expirations. And I think you said the largest one was $600,000 and addressed over 70% of that. Just to be clear, is that reflected, I guess, within the lease exploration schedule that's still showing 1.9 million feet? Or has that not maybe taken effect yet? I guess I'm just trying to make sure I understand kind of what's been addressed or what's still to be addressed?

偉大的。安吉拉，我只是想回到你關於 26 年租約到期的評論。我認為您說過，最大的一筆款項是 60 萬美元，解決了其中 70% 以上的問題。只是為了清楚起見，我想這是否反映在仍顯示 190 萬英尺的租賃勘探計劃中？或者這可能尚未生效？我想我只是想確保我理解哪些問題已經解決或哪些問題還有待解決？

Yeah. That's a really good question, Steve. That has -- it's still showing in the 2026 expiration schedule. We did add some footnotes this quarter to give you a little bit more detail on what of that number, what in the '25 and '26 towers have already been addressed, which hopefully will be helpful. But the reason it's still showing in the '26 towers is because, as I mentioned in my prepared remarks, it wasn't a renewal with the existing tenant. It was a direct deal with the subtenant. And so you won't see that reflected until the new lease takes effect.

是的。這真是一個好問題，史蒂夫。那已經 - 它仍然顯示在 2026 年到期時間表中。我們確實在本季度添加了一些腳註，以便為您提供有關該數字中哪些內容以及 25 年和 26 年塔中哪些內容已經得到解決的更多詳細信息，希望這會有所幫助。但它仍然出現在 26 號塔樓中的原因是，正如我在準備好的演講中提到的那樣，它不是與現有租戶的續約。這是與轉租人直接達成的交易。因此，在新租約生效之前，您不會看到這一點。

Okay. And then maybe just going back to kind of the Flower Mart. I guess it sounds like you've got maybe five, six months to kind of work out some sort of maybe residential plan for that? I guess I'm just trying to read through the tea leaves. If you don't -- I guess I'm trying to put what milestones do you need to achieve in order to kind of continue to capitalize that project? Or what would sort of prompt you to go down the path that we just ran out of time, and eventually, we've got to just stop capitalizing the costs on that project?

好的。然後也許就回到花市了。我想聽起來你大概有五、六個月的時間來制定某種住宅計畫？我想我只是想透過茶葉來了解情況。如果沒有的話——我想我正在嘗試提出您需要實現哪些里程碑才能繼續利用該專案？或者什麼原因促使您走上這條道路，因為我們沒有時間了，最終，我們必須停止將該專案的成本資本化？

It's what -- and hopefully, we're not making you read through too many (inaudible). We're trying to be as direct and transparent about it as we can. It's less about how much time can we capitalize and more about how much active work we're doing to continue to maximize value on the site and to prepare it for future development.

這就是——希望我們不會讓你讀太多（聽不清楚）。我們正盡量直接和透明地處理此事。這並不是關於我們能夠利用多少時間的問題，而是關於我們做了多少積極的工作來繼續最大化網站的價值並為未來的發展做好準備。

So we think based on where we stand today, as we sort of talked about earlier, one of the main hurdles with this project as we think about how this could get executed at the right time in a way that's responsive to market conditions is the ability to phase the project. And so a lot of the work we're going to be doing over the course of this year is meant to really kind of redesign the program there so that it's easier to phase construction. This is something we talked about. We started talking about probably on last quarter's call, though I'm sure it's come up and conversations with the company has had historically as well.

因此，我們認為，根據我們目前的狀況，正如我們之前談到的，當我們考慮如何在正確的時間以響應市場條件的方式執行該專案時，該專案面臨的主要障礙之一是分階段實施該專案的能力。因此，我們今年要做的許多工作實際上就是重新設計那裡的項目，以便更容易分階段實施。這是我們討論過的事情。我們可能在上個季度的電話會議上就開始談論這個問題了，但我確信這個問題已經出現，而且與公司的對話也曾經有過。

Right now, just based on how the project was designed for 2.3 million square feet high density project with significant infrastructure investments that need to go into the site before you go vertical, just very difficult to face. So given how the market has shifted, I think it's reasonable to assume that even if development were to start or the way to get development started earlier rather than later is to make sure you've got the ability to phase it and you can not go spec on an enormous project, but do it in incremental pieces that are responsive to tenant demand. So that's the lion's share of the first component of the work we're doing.

目前，僅基於該項目的設計，該項目為 230 萬平方英尺的高密度項目，在垂直發展之前需要投入大量基礎設施投資，這非常難以應對。因此，考慮到市場的變化，我認為可以合理地假設，即使要開始開發，或者儘早開始開發的方式也是要確保你有能力分階段進行，並且你不能對龐大的項目進行規範，而是以響應租戶需求的增量部分進行。這就是我們正在做的工作的第一部分的大部分內容。

And then I think to your question, I think the second piece is really evaluating the mix of uses that should be programmed on the site and really trying to understand, not just what will give us the opportunity to maximize value and be most responsive to the way the market kind of continues to shift and evolve, but what does the community need as well.

然後，對於你的問題，我認為第二部分實際上是評估應該在網站上編程的用途組合，並真正試圖理解，不僅要了解什麼能給我們機會實現價值最大化，並且最能響應市場不斷變化和發展的方式，還要了解社區需要什麼。

And so that's the work we're going to do over the course of this year, have been doing that work over the last year as well. But we think the runway for that is probably through at some point in the second quarter. And as Jeffrey said in his prepared remarks, right -- excuse me, second half of the year. And as Jeffrey said in his prepared remarks, right now, we assume that capitalization will stop right around the beginning of the fourth quarter.

這就是我們今年要做的工作，去年我們也一直在做這項工作。但我們認為，這一進程可能在第二季的某個時候實現。正如傑弗裡在準備好的發言中所說，對——對不起，是下半年。正如傑弗裡在準備好的演講中所說，現在，我們假設資本化將在第四季初停止。

Nick Yulico, Scotiabank.

加拿大豐業銀行的 Nick Yulico。

Can you just talk about the cost for KOP Phase 2 went up a bit this quarter and the stabilization date, I think it was pushed out a quarter. Can you just talk about what drove those?

您能否談談本季 KOP 第二階段的成本略有上漲以及穩定日期，我認為它被推遲了一個季度。您能談談是什麼導致了這些現象嗎？

Yeah. The timing was really related to just some slight delays in final municipal approvals. The project did reach full completion in January, as we noted in the press release. And so it's really -- it looks like a full quarter move, it was really less than that, I think, based on our plans. The change in cost was related to that delay, but also just the trajectory of lease-up for the project over the course of the next year.

是的。這一時間安排實際上與最終市政審批的輕微延遲有關。正如我們在新聞稿中指出的，該項目確實於一月份全面完工。所以這真的——看起來像是整個季度的變動，但根據我們的計劃，我認為實際變動幅度要小一些。成本的變化與該延遲有關，但只是明年該專案租賃的軌跡。

Okay. And then second question is just going back to thinking about occupancy for the portfolio. I know you gave a lot of details on this year, which was helpful. But should we assume that you just -- you need sort of an overall pickup in new leasing activity in your markets, meaning that if you look at last year's level, you need to do more than that in terms of new leasing activity based on what I think was a lower retention ratio you've kind of had historically in the portfolio and ordered it back to occupancy growth? Is there anything sort of a high level that you can point to on that would be helpful?

好的。第二個問題就是重新思考投資組合的佔用率。我知道您提供了有關今年的許多細節，這很有幫助。但是，我們是否應該假設您只是——您需要在您的市場中全面增加新的租賃活動，這意味著，如果您看一下去年的水平，您需要在新的租賃活動方面做更多的事情，基於我認為您歷史上投資組合中的保留率較低，並將其恢復到入住率增長？您能指出哪些高層次的東西會有幫助嗎？

No, I think that's the math, right? I think occupancy is going to come from where the retention rate settles out, and we do need new leasing to fill that bucket. I think that the movement you've seen in our leasing volume, particularly in new leasing volumes over the course of the last couple of quarters, give us some real confidence that we'll continue to see our markets overall continue to accelerate through 2025. But as we talked about, we've got some additional larger move-outs in the first quarter of this year. Things really stabilize after that and to really get occupancy moving in the right direction, we're going to need to see new leasing continue to accelerate.

不，我認為這是數學，對嗎？我認為入住率將取決於留存率的穩定，而我們確實需要新的租賃來填補這一空缺。我認為，您看到的我們的租賃量變化，特別是過去幾季的新租賃量變化，讓我們真正有信心，到 2025 年，我們的市場整體將繼續加速發展。但正如我們所說的，今年第一季我們還有一些更大規模的搬遷。此後情況才會真正穩定下來，為了真正讓入住率朝著正確的方向發展，我們需要看到新的租賃持續加速。

Jeffrey Spector, Bank of America.

美國銀行的傑弗裡·斯佩克特。

Great. I guess just a fair follow-up to that conversation around occupancy and your other comments. I mean, -- and I know you're not providing '26 guidance, but I guess I just have to ask, what is the messaging then on '26 occupancy?

偉大的。我想這只是對有關入住率和您的其他評論的談話進行公平的跟進。我的意思是——我知道您沒有提供 26 條指導，但我想我只需要問一下，26 條入住率的信息是什麼？

Yeah, you're right. We're not providing 2026 guidance right now. But I do think we've tried to provide as much color and clarity as we can around 2026 lease expirations. It's been no surprise that 2026 is a larger expiration year for us. And we've talked for the last several quarters, really going all the way back to the fourth quarter of last year about the team's sort of proactivity around addressing those expirations early and doing as much as we can to continue to improve the retention rate off of what has been a historically lower number over the course of last year and 2024.

是的，你說得對。我們目前不提供 2026 年的指導。但我確實認為，我們已盡力為 2026 年租約到期提供盡可能多的細節和清晰度。2026 年對我們來說是一個較大的到期年，這並不奇怪。在過去的幾個季度裡，我們一直在討論，實際上可以追溯到去年第四季度，團隊積極主動地解決這些到期問題，並盡我們所能繼續提高保留率，而去年和 2024 年的保留率一直處於歷史較低水平。

So I do think the announcement this quarter that we signed 274,000 square feet associated with the largest expiration in 2026, which combined with one of the other deals that were signed with the same sub tenant about a year ago, has now addressed 70% of the largest expiration in 2026 is a very positive number.

因此，我確實認為，本季度我們宣布簽署了與 2026 年最大到期合約相關的 274,000 平方英尺的合同，再加上大約一年前與同一轉租租戶簽署的另一項交易，現在已經解決了 2026 年最大到期合約的 70%，這是一個非常積極的數字。

As I mentioned in my prepared remarks as well, last quarter, we had announced the renewal for what I think was a substantial portion of the third largest renewal we had in 2026 as well. So the team really has been doing a very good and very proactive job at chipping away at some of the larger expirations in 2026, trying to get ahead of those and trying to solidify as much of that as possible. And as I mentioned, we've worked this quarter to provide additional clarity and transparency on the lease expiration schedule. So you can see the impact in some of those -- the ways that those have been addressed have been with new deals and not with renewals, they're still sitting in the 2026 towers.

正如我在準備好的演講中提到的那樣，上個季度，我們宣布了續約，我認為這是 2026 年第三次最大續約中相當重要的一部分。因此，該團隊確實一直做得非常出色，並且非常積極主動，努力消除 2026 年一些較大的到期債務，並試圖領先於這些債務，並儘可能地鞏固這些債務。正如我所提到的，本季我們一直致力於為租賃到期時間表提供更多的清晰度和透明度。因此，你可以看到其中一些問題的影響——解決這些問題的方式是透過新的交易而不是續約，它們仍然位於 2026 年的大樓中。

So very focused on addressing that, stabilizing and improving the retention ratio as we look into '25 -- later '25 and into 2026. And and then continuing all the work the team is doing across the portfolio to really focus on new leasing activity and tap into the demand we're seeing recover really across markets.

因此，我們非常重視解決這個問題，在展望 2025 年、2025 年後期以及 2026 年時穩定和提高保留率。然後繼續團隊在整個投資組合中所做的所有工作，真正專注於新的租賃活動，並挖掘我們看到的整個市場真正復甦的需求。

The other thing I want to highlight, which is a comment I made in my prepared remarks, is just taking a step back and looking at what should be some of the easiest bases to lease in terms of new leasing across the portfolio. If you just look at three of the assets that have been recently developed or recently repositioned, West in Seattle, 100 at in San Diego, India Tower in Austin, there's 410 basis points of leased occupancy upside sitting in just those three assets alone, which are some of the highest quality assets in the portfolio.

我想強調的另一件事，也是我在準備好的發言中提到的，就是退一步來看看在整個投資組合中，就新租賃而言，哪些基地應該是最容易租賃的。如果您只看最近開發或最近重新定位的三項資產，即西雅圖的 West、聖地亞哥的 100 和奧斯汀的 India Tower，僅這三項資產的租賃入住率就有 410 個基點的上升空間，它們是投資組合中質量最高的資產。

So again, I think there are a lot of levers this company can pull that many owners and landlords can't pull in terms of how to tap into, where the demand sits today and make sure we're accelerating that and so that we can give better line of sight, I think, as we get through '25 and into 2026 to occupancy growth.

因此，我認為這家公司可以利用很多槓桿，而許多業主和房東在如何利用這些槓桿方面無法利用，如何確定當前的需求，並確保我們正在加速這一進程，以便我們可以更好地預見到 2025 年和 2026 年入住率的增長。

Okay. That's very helpful. And Andrew, I did want to follow up on your opening remarks when you talked about the material acceleration in leasing or strength emerging. Can you -- and again, I know you just talked about some specific achievements. Broader any comments on San Francisco or anything else you could share with us in terms of that strength? Was it really into year-end? Or you're saying that's how '25 has started off too? And then where is the strength coming from, what type of tenants, et cetera?

好的。這非常有幫助。安德魯，我確實想跟進一下你開場白中提到的租賃材料加速或實力顯現的情況。您能否—我知道您剛才談到了一些具體的成就。更廣泛地說，您對舊金山有什麼評論嗎？或者您可以與我們分享其他關於這項優勢的內容嗎？真的到年底了嗎？還是您是說 25 年也是這樣開始的？那麼力量來自哪裡，什麼類型的租戶等等？

Yeah. Thanks, Jeff. I think, I mean, at the heart of the comment is really the fact that fourth quarter represented our highest level of leasing activity since the fourth quarter of 2019 and 2024 was our highest leasing year since 2019. So you really saw, I think -- even if you look at relative to the first three quarters of the year, 2024, even though it is usually seasonally high, it was truly an exception.

是的。謝謝，傑夫。我認為，評論的核心實際上是第四季度代表了我們自 2019 年第四季以來的最高租賃活動水平，而 2024 年是我們自 2019 年以來最高的租賃年份。所以我認為你確實看到了——即使你相對於 2024 年的前三個季度來看，儘管它通常是季節性高點，但這確實是一個例外。

And we do see, I think, really positive stories across the pipeline and across markets as we look into 2025. I will say that, again, -- the fourth quarter is usually seasonally higher. You shouldn't expect that same level of activity to continue on a quarterly basis throughout 2025. But in terms of basic theme and sort of looking year-over-year, I think we're very encouraged by what's in the pipeline.

我認為，展望 2025 年，我們確實看到了整個管道和整個市場的積極發展。我再說一次——第四季通常是一個季節性的成長點。您不應該期望在 2025 年全年每季都保持相同水準的活動。但就基本主題和逐年回顧而言，我認為我們對正在進行的工作感到非常鼓舞。

I'll let Rob comment more specifically.

我會讓 Rob 更具體地評論。

Jeff, let me just take a step back, talk about the portfolio from a broader picture. In the markets where we have the ability to push rents, which are Bellevue, San Diego and Austin, not surprisingly, those are the markets that have had the strongest return to office kind of mandates over time. But they also hit on exactly what Angela said in terms of these are the best projects, most visible projects in the market, and they're attracting very strong tenant demand, and we're really pleased with the activity there.

傑夫，讓我退一步，從更廣闊的角度來談談投資組合。在我們有能力推動租金上漲的市場中，例如貝爾維尤、聖地牙哥和奧斯汀，毫不奇怪，這些市場隨著時間的推移，獲得了最強勁的辦公室回報。但他們也完全符合安吉拉所說的，這些是最好的項目，也是市場上最引人注目的項目，它們吸引了非常強勁的租戶需求，我們對那裡的活動感到非常滿意。

In a market like San Francisco, and I think this is one to really kind of focus in on, in '24, there are a lot of notable things that happened. There were 86 AI deals done in 2024 to put that in perspective. We get questions a lot about is AI real? I think a number like that points to the fact that it's real. There are projections that next year, '25, could be another 1 million to 1.5 million feet of AI absorption.

在舊金山這樣的市場，我認為這是一個真正值得關注的市場，24 年發生了很多值得注意的事情。從這個角度來看，2024 年共達成了 86 筆人工智慧交易。我們常被問到人工智慧是否真實存在？我認為這樣的數字表明它是真實的。根據預測，明年，也就是 25 年，人工智慧的吸收量可能會再增加 100 萬至 150 萬英尺。

Vacancy, which is interesting to note, the decline for the first time in 19 consecutive quarters, and the fourth quarter finished with a moderately positive absorption. So is that a trend? Too early to call, but based on the demand we see in the pipeline, which has remained at about 6.5 million square feet, and that is close to some of the pre-pandemic numbers we've had in the past, I think things look promising for San Francisco.

值得注意的是，空置率連續 19 個季度以來首次下降，第四季以適度正吸收量結束。那麼這是一種趨勢嗎？現在下結論還為時過早，但根據我們看到的在建項目需求（目前仍保持在 650 萬平方英尺左右），而且接近疫情前的一些數字，我認為舊金山的情況看起來很有希望。

The other thing I'd say is that sublease space has declined. So I think we need another quarter or two to know if we've hit that inflection point of continued space absorption and lack of sublease space coming on the market, but things have certainly improved. Los Angeles, I think, is just, unfortunately, with the disasters that happened in early January, understandably transaction activity took a short pause, but things are ramping back up, but LA is still, of our markets, is probably the one that's most still in recovery in terms of just demand for space on the west side, particularly. We do have activity in Hollywood, which is encouraging.

我想說的另一件事是轉租空間已經減少。因此，我認為我們還需要一兩個季度的時間才能知道我們是否已經達到了持續空間吸收和市場上缺乏轉租空間的拐點，但情況肯定有所改善。我認為，不幸的是，由於 1 月初發生的災難，洛杉磯的交易活動短暫暫停是可以理解的，但情況正在回升，但就西區的空間需求而言，洛杉磯在我們的市場中可能仍然是復甦最快的市場。我們確實在好萊塢開展活動，這令人鼓舞。

So I think that's just sort of a good summary. And Indeed Tower, again, you read a lot of statistics about Austin. But keep in mind, we're CBD focused. It's a brand-new product. We're doing -- we've got an incredible tenant roster, and we have more in the pipeline from companies that are actually moving into Austin or expanding their footprint due to the quality of Indeed Tower. So overall, '25 is setting itself up to look pretty positive.

所以我認為這只是一個很好的總結。確實，Tower，你再次閱讀了很多有關奧斯汀的統計數據。但請記住，我們專注於 CBD。這是一個全新的產品。我們正在做——我們有一個令人難以置信的租戶名冊，並且由於 Indeed Tower 的質量，我們還有更多來自實際遷入奧斯汀或擴大其足蹟的公司正在籌備中。因此總體而言，25 年的前景看起來相當樂觀。

Yeah. I would say it's just thematically across the board and across markets right now. One thing you really saw come through in the fourth quarter leasing and we're seeing in the pipeline as we look out into the first quarter as well is just the willingness and ability of tenants to make decisions and to commit to longer term, to know what their plans are to be able to really make decisions around that. So I think that's that's part of the really healthy dynamic we need to see recover in order to feel more confident about how the pipeline transpires over the course of this year.

是的。我想說的是，目前它只是在主題上全面涉及各個市場。您在第四季度的租賃中真正看到的一件事，以及我們在展望第一季時看到的一件事，就是租戶做出決策和長期承諾的意願和能力，了解他們的計劃是什麼，以便能夠真正圍繞這一點做出決策。因此，我認為這是真正健康的動態的一部分，我們需要看到復甦，以便對今年管道的進展更有信心。

Jamie Feldman, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的傑米·費爾德曼。

Great. I guess, Angela to your last point on tenant decision-making and confidence. We've seen a couple of major headlines year-to-date, whether it's AI with DeepSeek and questions around demand there and then now with NIH funding in the life science market and what kind of cuts we'll see. Are you seeing any kind of hesitation for tenants? Like how are both of these headlines -- I mean maybe it's a positive on AI, I'm not quite sure, but what are your thoughts and what are you guys seeing in your conversations with tenants on both of those topics and their ability to make decisions and plans?

偉大的。我想，安吉拉，你的最後一點是關於租戶決策和信心的。今年迄今為止，我們已經看到了一些重大新聞，無論是 DeepSeek 的人工智慧，還是有關那裡的需求問題，以及現在 NIH 對生命科學市場的資助以及我們將看到什麼樣的削減。您是否看到租戶有任何猶豫？例如這兩個標題——我的意思是也許這對人工智慧來說是正面的，我不太確定，但您的想法是什麼？您在與租戶就這兩個主題以及他們制定決策和計劃的能力進行的對話中看到了什麼？

I think they're both really good questions. So I think it's a little early to say with any extreme degree of confidence, but it does feel like what we're hearing and continue to hear on AI, even though this is a rapidly developing situation, is that some of these developments that we've seen recently could be really good for just additional application development and use cases off of AI given the potentially improved cost structure of some of those investments. So I think, right now, we haven't heard anything about a slowdown in activity in that sector relative to what we've seen in the news over the last couple of quarters, which is encouraging.

我認為這兩個問題都非常好。因此，我認為現在就下結論還為時過早，但我們確實聽到並繼續聽到有關人工智慧的消息，儘管這是一個快速發展的形勢，但我們最近看到的一些發展可能確實有利於額外的應用程式開發和人工智慧的用例，因為其中一些投資的成本結構可能會得到改善。因此我認為，目前我們還沒有聽到任何有關該行業活動放緩的消息，相對於過去幾季我們在新聞中看到的情況，這是令人鼓舞的。

On the life science side, again, it's pretty early to say. I think you've got cross currents there, including a really highly deregulation events and pro-innovation event to the new administration. So we'll see how all of that kind of shakes out. But again, I'd just go back to the comments we made specifically about KOP and the kind of traction we're seeing at that project now that it's been completed and the fact that the project, as Phase 1 did, really has the ability to cater to a wide and broad range of uses. I think we're really well positioned to continue to make progress at that asset over the coming year.

就生命科學面而言，現在下結論還為時過早。我認為那裡存在著矛盾，包括新政府高度放鬆管制的事件和支持創新的事件。因此，我們將拭​​目以待，看看這一切將如何發展。但是，我再次回顧我們專門針對 KOP 所發表的評論，以及該項目現已完成時我們所看到的吸引力，事實上，該項目與第一階段一樣，確實有能力滿足廣泛的用途。我認為我們完全有能力在未來一年繼續在該資產上取得進展。

Okay. Maybe a better way to ask is, have you heard of any deals being put on hold in either -- based on either one of these topics?

好的。也許更好的問法是，您是否聽說過有任何交易因上述任一主題而被擱置？

I have not. Rob?

我沒有。搶？

Jamie, this is Rob. We haven't had heard of any deals put on hold. And in fact, I was going to say that some of the activity in our buildings has picked up year-to-date. So more to come, but we're not seeing anything on the ground. And in fact, elsewhere in Seattle, we're seeing AI popping up there as well.

傑米，這是羅布。我們還沒有聽說有任何交易被擱置。事實上，我想說的是，今年迄今為止，我們建築內的一些活動已經開始活躍起來。還會有更多，但我們還沒有看到任何實際跡象。事實上，在西雅圖的其他地方，我們也看到了人工智慧的出現。

Anthony Paolone, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的安東尼保隆 (Anthony Paolone)。

You mentioned residential as alternative uses a couple of times for land and so forth. I think you still own multifamily towers. Just remind us on thoughts on why keep those? Or are there impediments to using those as sources of cash with cap rates there being pretty low?

您幾次提到住宅作為土地的替代用途等等。我認為您仍然擁有多戶住宅大樓。只是提醒我們為什麼要保留這些？或者，由於資本化率相當低，將其用作現金來源是否有障礙？

Yeah, it's a really good question. I would say the three that we continue to own, two in Hollywood and then the residential One Paseo are all projects that are very integrated with the other uses we have at those projects with the office and retail in the case of One Paseo. So it is more challenging to break that out on a stand-alone basis. It's not impossible, but I think it's more challenging. We view some of these assets as significant growth drivers for the company long term.

是的，這是一個非常好的問題。我想說的是，我們繼續擁有的三個項目，兩個在好萊塢，然後是住宅項目 One Paseo，都是與我們在這些項目中的其他用途高度融合的項目，One Paseo 兼具辦公室和零售功能。因此，單獨解決這個問題更具挑戰性。這並非不可能，但我認為它更具挑戰性。我們認為其中一些資產將成為公司長期成長的重要動力。

And so control matters a lot in terms of our ability to continue to maximize value at many of those projects. But as you noted, future development pipeline, we've been clear, I think, over the course of the last year that we're open to whatever path is going to best maximize value for shareholders and really trying to be as creative and proactive as possible to accelerate time lines to monetization. I think Elliott and team have done a great job of continuing to move those things forward. So I'm pleased with what we're seeing there as well.

因此，就我們繼續在許多專案中實現價值最大化的能力而言，控制至關重要。但正如您所說，關於未來的發展管道，我認為，在過去的一年裡，我們已經明確表示，我們願意採取任何能夠最大程度地為股東創造價值的途徑，並真正努力發揮創造力和積極主動性，以加快貨幣化的時間表。我認為艾利歐特和他的團隊在繼續推動這些事情方面做得非常出色。所以我對我們在那裡看到的情況也感到滿意。

Okay. And then just second question. I think Cruise had announced some layoffs and I think it's going back into GM's hands. Just what's the credit behind that? Is it actually like GM? Or is it just contained on its own credit?

好的。然後是第二個問題。我認為 Cruise 已經宣布裁員，我認為公司將回到通用汽車的手中。這背後究竟有何功勞？它真的像 GM 嗎？還是它只是依靠自己的努力？

This is Jeffrey. Yeah, we have GM credit on the entire lease. So there's no payment concerns on our end.

這是傑弗裡。是的，我們在整個租賃期間都享有通用汽車的信貸。因此我們無需擔心付款問題。

Michael Griffin, Citigroup.

花旗集團的邁克爾·格里芬。

Maybe not to beat a dead horse here, but just on the demand you're seeing for those higher-quality repositioned assets like West Ate, Kettner and Indeed. And maybe, Rob, this is best for you, but just given you're seeing increased tenant activity there, but in order to get deals over the finish line, are you going to have to sacrifice, I guess, more on the concession side to get deals done at those properties? Or is the organic demand far enough where you can hold concessions pretty steady?

也許這裡不是在重複老生常談，而只是針對那些像 West Ate、Kettner 和 Indeed 這樣的高品質重新定位資產的需求。羅布，也許這對你來說是最好的，但鑑於你看到那裡的租戶活動有所增加，但為了完成交易，我想你是否必須在特許權方面做出更多犧牲才能在這些房產上達成交易？或者有機需求是否足夠大以至於您可以保持相當穩定的優惠？

I don't think we have to sacrifice, Michael. I think that, again, with the amenities and the mix we have in various assets that we're talking about, which are our premier assets that have vacancy, tenants see value in that. And often, when you get into a discussion with somebody about space like that, the amenities and the life -- quality of life for their employees is what ends up driving the decision.

我認為我們不必做出犧牲，麥可。我認為，憑藉我們所談論的各種資產的便利設施和組合，以及我們目前空置的優質資產，租戶看到了其中的價值。通常，當你與某人討論這樣的空間時，便利設施和生活——員工的生活品質才是最終決定的因素。

That's not to say we're not in a very competitive market, we are, and we're meeting market, but you're not going to see us do the crazy things that have been done in the past with lots of free rent, three years of free rent, et cetera. But we have -- particularly at West Ate, we have increased demand where our team on the ground is very busy. And I'm optimistic about '25 for West Ate and that project just delivered in September of '24 with all new amenities and lobby and it's really paying off in terms of activity.

這並不是說我們處在一個競爭非常激烈的市場，我們處在一個競爭非常激烈的市場，而且我們正在滿足市場需求，但你不會看到我們做過去做過的瘋狂的事情，比如大量的免租金、三年的免租金等等。但是，特別是在 West Ate，我們的需求增加了，我們當地的團隊非常忙碌。我對 West Ate 在 25 年的發展持樂觀態度，該項目剛剛於 24 年 9 月交付，配備了所有新設施和大廳，從活動方面來看，它確實獲得了回報。

Yeah. I mean there's always a balance there, right? I mean I think the point to really call out there is the amount of vacancy that's sitting in some of the highest quality assets that should have some of the best economics across the portfolio. And I think as activity is picking up across all of those markets, should be some of the space that leases first.

是的。我的意思是那裡總是存在著平衡，對吧？我的意思是，我認為真正需要指出的是，一些品質最高的資產中存在大量的空置資產，這些資產應該具有投資組合中最好的經濟效益。我認為，隨著所有這些市場活動的回暖，一些空間應該會首先租賃。

They are, to Rob's point, we're in a competitive market environment. But we don't feel the need -- what we're talking about here is it a desire to undercut the market in order to take occupancy. We know what -- we know the investments we've made in those projects. We know the quality of what we've delivered, and we're going to make sure that we sign leases that are commensurate with the value in those buildings and what the real estate is really worth.

正如羅布所說，我們正處於一個競爭激烈的市場環境中。但我們並不認為有必要——我們在這裡談論的是為了佔據市場而削弱市場競爭力的願望。我們知道——我們知道我們在這些項目上所做的投資。我們知道我們所交付產品的質量，我們將確保簽署的租約與這些建築物的價值以及房地產的實際價值相稱。

Appreciate all the color there. And then maybe just one on the transaction market since we haven't heard from Elliott in a while. It seemed like from your commentary, things are opening back up, maybe falling a bit. You obviously did the deal at DelMar back in the third quarter. But can you give us a sense of what kind of capital is interested in either buying or selling office properties these days and maybe some insights into IRR or hurdle rates that you're underwriting to for prospective transactions?

欣賞那裡的所有色彩。然後也許只有一個關於交易市場的消息，因為我們有一段時間沒有收到艾利歐特的消息了。從您的評論來看，事情似乎正在重新好轉，或許還有些許下滑。您顯然在第三季與 DelMar 達成了這筆交易。但是，您能否讓我們了解目前哪些類型的資本對購買或出售辦公大樓感興趣，以及您對未來交易承保的 IRR 或最低收益率的一些見解？

Yeah. Michael, what we're really seeing is that whereas maybe a year or two ago, it was strictly opportunistic capital, we're starting to see more of a range. And as we kind of talked about our decision to slow some of our dispositions in prior years, it was because when we looked across the table, we were just seeing opportunistic capital, which we didn't think was the optimal counterparty for us as we're trying to maximize value. That's starting to diversify a little bit. You're seeing more institutional funds, you're seeing high net worth. And there are a range of hurdles for those different kinds of buyers. So as a seller, it becomes a little bit more appealing, and that's why we're going to kind of dip our toe and see how things go.

是的。邁克爾，我們真正看到的是，也許一兩年前，它只是嚴格的機會主義資本，但現在我們開始看到更多的範圍。正如我們談到前幾年減緩部分處置的決定時所說，這是因為當我們縱觀全局時，我們看到的只是機會主義資本，我們認為這不是我們試圖實現價值最大化的最佳交易對手。這開始有點多樣化了。你會看到更多的機構基金，你會看到高淨值。對於不同類型的買家來說，存在著一系列的障礙。因此，作為賣家，它變得更有吸引力，這就是為什麼我們要嘗試一下，看看事情會如何發展。

As a buyer, we are looking at what the quality of the opportunities are, and as we talked about in prior quarters, that is improving. We're seeing better real estate to underwrite. And we're going to look at what our IRRs are, take a medium to longer-term view, factor in growth as well as what our cost of capital is at that period of time and look to make accretive investments.

作為買家，我們正在關注機會的質量，正如我們在前幾季所討論的那樣，機會正在改善。我們看到了更好的房地產承銷機會。我們將研究我們的內部報酬率 (IRR)，從中長期角度考慮成長因素以及該時期的資本成本，並尋求進行增值投資。

Caitlin Burrows, Goldman Sachs.

凱特琳·伯羅斯，高盛。

Maybe another follow-up on KOP. I guess, could you just go through if you were to do some spec suite leasing say like today, it seems like those users could move in more quickly. So I don't know if that's like a month or something. And then if there was a larger deal done, what would kind of be the expected timing based on size for like lease signing versus economic occupancy?

也許是 KOP 的另一個後續行動。我想，如果您今天要進行一些規格套房租賃，您能否先介紹一下，似乎那些用戶可以更快地入住。所以我不知道這是否像一個月或類似時間。那麼，如果達成了一項更大的交易，那麼根據交易規模，簽訂租約和經濟入住的預期時間會是怎麼樣的呢？

Caitlin, you're right. I mean we can do a spec suite lease tomorrow and occupy by the weekend. It's furnished -- the labs are furnished and ready to go. For a deal that's larger and going from shell, I would expect probably -- again, it's highly dependent on the tenant and how much they have preplanning in place for design and layout of labs and suites, which we can help accelerate. But I would bet anywhere from probably a year to 18 months maybe if it's -- if they're -- maybe less than 18 months, but it's -- somebody has really got to have their act together. But we've typically seen nine to 12 months, and I think that's probably what you should count on.

凱特琳，你說得對。我的意思是，我們可以明天租一套規格套房，週末就可以入住。實驗室已配備齊全，隨時可使用。對於規模較大且來自空殼的交易，我預計可能會——再次強調，這高度依賴租戶以及他們對實驗室和套房的設計和佈局進行了多少預先規劃，我們可以幫助加速這些規劃。但我敢打賭，可能需要一年到一年半的時間，如果是的話，也許不到一年半，但必須有人齊心協力。但我們通常看到的是 9 到 12 個月的時間，我想這可能是你應該指望的。

Yeah, will really depend to Rob's point on the use and how complex the build-out is.

是的，這確實取決於 Rob 的用途以及建造的複雜程度。

Okay. And then I guess, maybe big picture, thinking about 2024 results, at least on an FFO basis, came in materially higher than original guidance. So I was wondering if you guys could go through -- I know you went through in the prepared remarks one of the drivers for 4Q. But like what might have been noncash surprise items that are more onetime versus I know you did some short-term leasing sort of thing, perhaps it could continue. But just trying to consider like how '24 turned out and what that may or may not suggest for '25?

好的。然後我想，也許從總體來看，考慮 2024 年的結果，至少在 FFO 基礎上，會大大高於最初的指導。所以我想知道你們是否可以討論一下——我知道你們在準備好的評論中討論了第四季度的驅動因素之一。但是，就像可能是一次性的非現金驚喜項目，而不是我知道你做過的一些短期租賃之類的事情，也許它可以繼續下去。但只是想考慮一下 24 年的結果如何以及這對 25 年可能或不可能意味著什麼？

Yeah. Jeffrey, I'll go through more specifics on the fourth quarter number and how much of that sort of is recurring and carries forward versus some of the onetime items. But there really was a an entirely de minimis amount of short-term leasing and the productivity statistics we reported for the quarter. I think it was about 20,000 feet.

是的。傑弗裡，我將詳細介紹第四季度的數字，以及其中有多少是經常性的，有多少是結轉的，有多少是一次性的項目。但實際上，我們報告的本季短期租賃和生產力統計數據都是微不足道的。我認為大約有 20,000 英尺。

Yeah, sure, Caitlin. Just thinking maybe the broader context of 2024 guidance and how 2024 outcomes integrate with 2025, I think the big kind of unexpected driver in 2024 related to some of the restoration fee income that you saw recognized in Q3 and Q4. When we gave the guidance range, we did talk about the same property NOI growth into 2025 and how there is 800 basis points drag associated with that. So when you think next year, there's not really kind of assumptions within our numbers that that's going to continue in the future.

是的，當然，凱特琳。只是考慮一下 2024 年指導的更廣泛背景以及 2024 年的結果如何與 2025 年相結合，我認為 2024 年最大的意外驅動因素與您在第三季度和第四季度看到的一些修復費收入有關。當我們給出指導範圍時，我們確實談到了到 2025 年相同的房地產 NOI 增長，以及與此相關的 800 個基點的拖累。因此，當您考慮明年時，我們的數字中並沒有真正假設這種情況會在未來持續下去。

In Q4, you're right, there was some volatility. A lot of it was, I think, forecasted or highlighted last quarter. But just to reiterate, we did have the termination fee income or $0.02 that was unanticipated. That was a positive outcome from our perspective. It was related to the Walmart deal that we signed up in Seattle. Additionally, there were a couple of smaller just accounting assumptions, if you will, in that a tenant moves from cash to accrual and there is an effect and you sign the extension of our tenant and you see some kind of moderate effects of that. So those are those things I would assume kind of carry over into 2025. And when you look at our guidance for 2025, there's not a big collection of nonrecurring items in that.

您說得對，第四季確實存在一些波動。我認為，上個季度已經預測或強調了很多。但需要重申的是，我們確實有未預料到的終止費收入或 0.02 美元。從我們的角度來看，這是一個正面的結果。這與我們在西雅圖簽署的沃爾瑪協議有關。此外，如果您願意的話，還有一些較小的會計假設，即租戶從現金轉向應計，並且會產生影響，並且您簽署了我們租戶的延期協議，您會看到某種適度的影響。所以我認為這些事情將會延續到 2025 年。當你查看我們對 2025 年的指導時，你會發現其中並不包含大量的非經常性項目。

Yeah. We tried to be as specific and transparent we can about as many line items that might affect that number as possible. So hopefully, that guidance is helpful. And then the other big driver in Q4 was obviously the gain on the sale of the plane.

是的。我們盡力具體、透明地列出可能影響該數字的盡可能多的項目。所以希望該指導能夠有所幫助。第四季的另一個重要推動因素顯然是飛機銷售的收益。

Michael Carroll, RBC.

邁克爾·卡羅爾，RBC。

I just have a couple of clarification questions. I guess, with regards to the 216,000 square feet of move-outs in 1Q '25, mean does that include the Bellevue move-out to accommodate Walmart? Or is that move out or downtime at that specific asset in addition to the 216 that was mentioned?

我只是想澄清幾個問題。我想，關於 2025 年第一季 216,000 平方英尺的搬遷，這是否包括為容納沃爾瑪而搬遷的貝爾維尤？或者除了提到的 216 之外，該特定資產還有搬遷或停機時間嗎？

It does include that.

它確實包括了這一點。

Okay. Great. And then, Eliott, can you talk a little bit more about the land sale activity? I know you have the $150 million in discussions that you've been continuing to highlight what's the level of activity level behind that $150 million? What other projects or interests are there right now? And is that kind of something that we could be talking about throughout the year? Or is that still kind of in the back burner?

好的。偉大的。那麼，艾略特，您能否再多談談土地出售活動的情況？我知道你們一直在討論 1.5 億美元，並且一直在強調這 1.5 億美元背後的活動量如何？目前還有哪些項目或興趣？我們全年都會討論這個話題嗎？或者說，這仍處於擱置狀態？

Potentially, I'd say anything else is at an earlier stage and not something that we are factoring into our 2025 forecast. So -- and as Angela kind of outlined, when we look at our land, there're different buckets. So some of our lands, like you said, KOP, we're not looking to do anything. It's really that second bucket of where there's a higher and better use outside of office or life science. So there might be one or two others, but it's a little too early to get into it.

有可能，我想說其他任何事情都處於早期階段，而不是我們納入 2025 年預測中的因素。所以 — — 正如安吉拉所概述的那樣，當我們審視我們的土地時，會發現不同的桶子。因此，就像你說的，KOP，我們不打算對我們的一些土地採取任何行動。這其實是第二個領域，在辦公室或生命科學之外有更高、更好的用途。因此可能還會有一兩個其他的，但現在討論還為時過早。

Dylan Burzinski, Green Street Advisors.

迪倫·布爾津斯基 (Dylan Burzinski)，Green Street Advisors 的顧問。

Just wanted to touch on sort of the new leasing pipeline. Obviously, you guys had a very strong quarter in terms of new leasing in 4Q. But as you sort of look at the pipeline today, have you guys been able to sort of backfill or punish the strong amount of activity that you guys did during the quarter? And if so, can you kind of talk about sort of what you guys think is sort of driving the renewed activity as it relates to new leasing? Is it simply return to office? Is it less macro uncertainty? Can you kind of walk through that?

只是想談談新的租賃管道。顯然，你們第四季的新租賃表現非常強勁。但是，當您今天查看管道時，您是否能夠補充或懲罰本季所做的大量活動？如果是這樣，您能否談談您認為是什麼推動了與新租賃相關的新活動？只是重返辦公室嗎？宏觀不確定性是否減少了？你能大致講一下嗎？

Yeah, I'll start with the last part first. I mean I think what's creating demand is a variety of factors. One is return to office, and you've got that going on in large scale across the West Coast now, and that's having an impact. I mean, for example, Downtown Seattle has had a 23% increase in traffic in the last 90 days or so. So rush hour is back. But it's also a function of just business needs and business confidence that we're hearing with our -- the customers we're talking to.

是的，我先從最後一部分開始。我的意思是，我認為創造需求的因素有很多。一是重返辦公室，目前西海岸各地已大規模開展這項工作，並且正在產生影響。我的意思是，例如，西雅圖市中心的交通量在過去 90 天左右增加了 23%。尖峰時段又回來了。但這也是我們從與我們交談的客戶那裡聽到的業務需求和業務信心的功能。

There's just -- I think the sentiment is that things are more stable just in terms of predicting the future. And then lastly, some of it's exploration driven. And as Angela has said numerous times, if you've got an expiration coming up, the flight to quality is going to be an important component in that. And I'm sorry, your first part of your question was -- the pipeline. I guess looking back from Q1 of '24. I'd say our pipeline today is stronger, meaning we have more LOIs in place and an LOI has a much higher degree of certainty for closure than proposals are certainly tours. So far, six weeks into the year, it's feeling good.

我認為，就預測未來而言，情況更加穩定。最後，其中一些是探索驅動的。正如安吉拉多次說過的那樣，如果即將到期，那麼追求品質將是其中的一個重要組成部分。很抱歉，您問題的第一部分是—管道。我想回顧一下 24 年第一季。我想說，我們今天的管道更加強大，這意味著我們有更多的意向書 (LOI)，而且意向書的完成確定性比提案的確定性要高得多。到目前為止，今年已經過去六週了，感覺良好。

I think one of the trends we're seeing across the pipeline as well that I think will continue to play out is that what you've seen over the last few years or really maybe even since the start of the pandemic is tenants being much more conservative about space planning and hoping and sort of programming the potential for expansion down the road as their needs continue to change and evolve.

我認為，我們在整個專案過程中看到的一個趨勢也將繼續發揮作用，那就是過去幾年，甚至可能自疫情開始以來，租戶對空間規劃更加保守，希望並規劃未來擴展的潛力，因為他們的需求會不斷變化和發展。

And I think we'll have some pretty interesting expansion to talk about over the coming quarters. So I think that's really positive. Definitely seeing, as Ron highlighted earlier, demand from AI and data analytics companies, I'm hopeful that over the next quarter or so, we're going to see -- what will be the largest lease we signed in the city of San Francisco and some time with one of those types of uses.

我認為在接下來的幾個季度我們將會討論一些非常有趣的擴充。所以我認為這是非常積極的。正如羅恩之前強調的那樣，我確實看到了來自人工智慧和數據分析公司的需求，我希望在接下來的一個季度左右，我們將看到——我們在舊金山市簽署的最大租約是什麼，以及什麼時候用於其中一種用途。

So I think all of this is moving in the right direction. I think Rob really hit it on the head to say, tenants are just more prepared for a bunch of different reasons, including return to office and including just the way their businesses are strategically evolving to be able to commit to longer-term periods and higher square footage numbers, as you'll see in some of these expansions.

所以我認為這一切都在朝著正確的方向發展。我認為羅布說得非常對，租戶只是因為各種不同的原因而做好了更充分的準備，包括重返辦公室，以及他們的業務戰略性地發展，以便能夠承諾更長期的租賃和更高的面積，正如你將在一些擴張中看到的那樣。

And maybe just touching on sort of your comments around the team engaging or trying to engage with tenants more so on at leases expiring, call it over the next 18 months. Are you seeing tenants more receptive to engaging in those conversations earlier than say they were a year or 18 months ago? And then as it relates to sort of the downsizes that we've seen, not only across your markets, but just across the country of tenants upon renewal down-sizing in a large portion of the space. I mean, do you think we're sort of in the latter innings of that? Or do you expect that to continue to be a sort of a headwind for the space for the foreseeable future?

也許只是談談您關於團隊在租約到期時（即未來 18 個月內）與租戶進行更多接觸或嘗試接觸的評論。您是否發現租戶比一年前或 18 個月前更願意參與這些對話？然後，就我們所看到的縮小規模而言，不僅在你們的市場，而且在全國各地，租戶在續約後，很大一部分空間的規模都在縮小。我的意思是，您是否認為我們正處於後期階段？或者您預計在可預見的未來這將繼續成為該領域的一種阻力？

I think a couple of things on that. I mean I think there's always -- even at a more -- if you're talking about San Francisco, for example, in a more normalized market, tenants right size space, whether that means they need more or they need less. It feels like give backs have slowed down, but that's impossible to predict. And on a renewal basis, we've seen some, in our portfolio, keep the same amount of space, some have taken more and some have given back.

我對此有幾點看法。我的意思是，我認為總是存在——即使在更——如果你談論的是舊金山，例如，在一個更規範化的市場中，租戶會選擇合適大小的空間，無論這意味著他們需要更多還是更少。感覺回饋速度已經放緩，但這無法預測。在更新的基礎上，我們發現，在我們的投資組合中，有些公司保留了相同的空間，有些公司佔用了更多的空間，而有些公司則回退了。

And I think that -- to answer your question specifically, I think about a year -- particularly 1.5 years ago, I don't think you could get anyone to really engage in a conversation about a '25 exploration, for example, much less a '26, and that's changed materially in the last, I'd say, 9 months, it's relatively recently, and it's pretty much across the board. We are finging that up in Seattle, San Diego even San Francisco. And again, it just points to companies are planning for the future.

我認為——具體回答你的問題，我想大約一年前——特別是一年半前，我認為你不可能讓任何人真正參與到關於 25 年探索的對話中，例如，更不用說 26 年了，而這種情況在過去 9 個月裡發生了實質性的變化，這是相對較新的情況，而且幾乎是全面的。我們正在西雅圖、聖地牙哥甚至舊金山尋找答案。再次強調，這只是顯示公司正在為未來做規劃。

Brendan Lynch, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的布倫丹·林奇。

You guys have talked a lot about the versatility of KOP to meet various types of demand. One of your competitors commented that life science companies are looking for more traditional office space rather than lab space. So first question is, is that something you're seeing too? And then second question is the excess supply in South San Francisco, primarily on the lab space side?

你們已經談論了很多關於 KOP 的多功能性，可以滿足各種需求。您的一位競爭對手評論說，生命科學公司正在尋找更傳統的辦公空間而不是實驗室空間。所以第一個問題是，這也是你看到的嗎？第二個問題是南舊金山的供應過剩，主要是在實驗室空間？

With respect to the office comment, I won't go into too much. But keep in mind, like I said earlier, KOP is a purpose-built life science project. Some of the projects that we compete with are conversions. So they're former office buildings that have been converted to life science. They've got smaller floor plates so they naturally appeal to the office component of a life science company. But the typical kind of layout that we see and the conversations we have are roughly a 60-40 split between lab and office on a floor.

關於辦公室的評論，我不會說太多。但請記住，就像我之前說的，KOP 是一個專門的生命科學課程。我們競爭的一些項目是轉換項目。它們以前是辦公大樓，後來改建成了生命科學大樓。它們的樓面較小，因此自然會吸引生命科學公司的辦公部門。但我們看到的典型佈局和我們進行的對話是，同一樓層的實驗室和辦公室大約各佔 60% 和 40%。

And just remember, outside of the spec suites at KOP 2, right now, we can accommodate any mix of lab and office that a tenant would want. So we can, I think, be incredibly flexible at meeting the demand wherever it is as well as accommodating, as we mentioned earlier, traditional office uses. To Rob's point, I mean this has been purpose built for life science as we look at the long-term ability to maximize the value of this project over time through future phases, we're certainly hopeful this will go primarily life science. That's been our focus, and that's where we'd like to see it move. But we're really open right now to a range of different uses and really encouraged by some of the non-life science demand that we're seeing that will help us drive, I think, better outcomes across the board.

請記住，除了 KOP 2 的規格套房外，目前，我們可以容納租戶想要的任何實驗室和辦公室組合。因此，我認為，我們可以非常靈活地滿足任何地方的需求，同時也能適應我們先前提到的傳統辦公室用途。對於 Rob 的觀點，我的意思是，這個計畫是專門為生命科學而建的，因為我們著眼於在未來階段隨著時間的推移最大化該計畫價值的長期能力，我們當然希望這個計畫主要應用於生命科學。這就是我們關注的重點，也是我們希望看到它向前發展的方向。但我們現在確實對一系列不同的用途持開放態度，並且確實受到一些非生命科學需求的鼓舞，我認為這將幫助我們在各個領域取得更好的成果。

Great. That's helpful. The press release also alluded to an investment in Fifth Wall. Maybe you could tell us how much you've invested and what you hope to accomplish there?

偉大的。這很有幫助。新聞稿中也提到了對 Fifth Wall 的投資。也許您可以告訴我們您投資了多少以及您希望實現什麼目標？

Brendan, it's Eliott. So it was a pretty modest investment. And our goal in investing is one, Fifth Well is the leader in the proptech space. And so it's important that when -- if we're going to partner, we do it with somebody that sees a lot of different things. But the objective is to really better integrate technology into our operations.

布倫丹，我是艾略特。所以這是一項相當適度的投資。我們的投資目標是，Fifth Well 成為房地產科技領域的領導者。因此，如果我們要合作，那麼與能夠看到許多不同事物的人合作是很重要的。但我們的目標是真正將技術更好地融入我們的營運中。

And by doing so, we think we can drive efficiencies across the portfolio. We've been very vocal about our investments in sustainability over the years. And in addition to, obviously, the benefits that has with the environment. There are drivers in reducing utility costs across the portfolio that we've been able to realize. So I think of it in a similar way.

我們認為，透過這樣做，我們可以提高整個投資組合的效率。多年來，我們一直積極宣傳對永續發展的投資。顯然，這也為環境帶來了好處。我們已經能夠實現降低整個投資組合的公用事業成本的驅動因素。所以我以類似的方式思考這個問題。

Yeah. I mean, Kilroy has been known as a leader in sustainability and innovation, and this investment is one of the many ways I think we're going to maintain that leadership position over time.

是的。我的意思是，Kilroy 一直被譽為永續發展和創新領域的領導者，我認為這項投資是我們長期保持領導地位的眾多方式之一。

John P. Kim, BMO.

John P. Kim，BMO。

Now that you've dodged the private jet, is there anything else that you do on the cost-saving front. I know Jeffrey mentioned in the prepared remarks that platform investments will probably require a higher amount of overhead expense than what you had last year, but I wanted to delve into that a little bit further. And just given the trajectory of earnings, is there anything you could do on the cost savings front?

既然您已經放棄了私人飛機，您還做了哪些節省成本的事？我知道 Jeffrey 在準備好的發言中提到，平台投資可能需要比去年更高的管理費用，但我想進一步深入探討這一點。鑑於獲利軌跡，您在成本節約方面能做些什麼嗎？

Yeah. I think we made material progress on cost savings during the course of 2024. We worked really hard since I joined last January at really looking at G&A and overhead and trying to do two things, which I started talking about as early as this call last year. Number one, reduce the overall level of overhead, an acknowledgment of some of the challenges in our space in our sector, but also, and importantly, making sure that we allocated every dollar of G&A in the most sort of value-enhancing ways across the platform. So it's those two things together.

是的。我認為我們在 2024 年期間在成本節約方面取得了實質進展。自從我去年一月加入以來，我們一直非常努力地關註一般及行政事務和管理費用，並嘗試做兩件事，早在去年的這次電話會議上我就開始談論這件事了。第一，降低整體管理費用水平，承認我們所在行業面臨的一些挑戰，但同樣重要的是，確保我們以最能提升價值的方式在整個平台上分配每一美元的管理費用。所以這是兩件事的結合。

What Jeffrey really highlighted in his remarks is that those two line items together, G&A and leasing costs, totaled right around $100 million in 2023. And so we saw a steep decline from $99 million down to, I think, $83 million -- $85 million, $81 million last year. So now we're looking at that number coming up just a little bit as we look into 2025, which I would say is a little bit better of a run rate. We identified a lot of cost savings, which we executed on over the course of next year.

傑弗裡在演講中真正強調的是，這兩項費用（G&A 和租賃成本）加起來，到 2023 年總計約 1 億美元。因此，我們看到了從 9900 萬美元急劇下降到去年的 8300 萬美元 - 8500 萬美元、8100 萬美元。因此，現在我們看到，當我們展望 2025 年時，這個數字會略有上升，我想說，這是一個更好的運行率。我們發現了許多成本節約措施，並將在明年實施。

We also identified some of the costs we were saving needed to be reallocated into the platform. And that reallocation process just took a little bit longer than the cost savings did. So I wouldn't view this as increase in G&A. I would say we're settling into the right run rate for the company going forward. But I absolutely want to emphasize that we are always looking critically at G&A, and we want to make sure that this platform is as effective and efficient as possible.

我們也發現，我們節省的一些成本需要重新分配到平台中。重新分配的過程比成本節約的過程長一點。所以我不認為這是 G&A 的增加。我想說，我們正在確定公司未來正確的運行率。但我絕對想強調的是，我們始終嚴格審視 G&A，我們希望確保這個平台盡可能有效和有效率。

Okay. And Angela, you mentioned opportunistic investments. How close were you to getting Sale Tower in Austin to pencil out for you? It seems like it would have been a complementary asset to what you're achieving in the market. And also maybe for Rob, if you could talk about the type of tonnes that are active in the market, and whether or not that represents expansions or new tenants in the market? Or is it just musical chairs?

好的。安吉拉，您提到了機會投資。您距離在奧斯汀建造 Sale Tower 還有多遠？這看起來就像是您在市場上所取得成就的補充資產。另外，對於 Rob，您是否可以談談市場上活躍的噸位類型，以及這是否代表市場擴張或新租戶？或者這只是一場搶椅子的遊戲？

Yeah. There's just on the sale building, and I'll let Elliot jump in here as well. Look, we think that's a fantastic building. I do think you're right. It's very complementary or would have been complementary to what we own in Austin today and Indeed Tower from a quality standpoint. I think it's fair to say that pricing more resembled core than opportunistic. And we're very conscious of where our cost of capital is now, and we're very conscious of making sure that as we continue to pursue capital allocation strategies, that we're doing so in a way that maximizes value to shareholders. So we have to balance those things.

是的。那裡正好有待出售的大樓，我也會讓艾略特 (Elliot) 加入進來。看，我們認為那是一棟很棒的建築。我確實認為你是對的。從品質角度來看，它與我們目前在奧斯汀和 Indeed Tower 所擁有的非常互補，或者本來會互補。我認為可以公平地說，定價更像核心定價，而不是機會定價。我們非常清楚我們現在的資本成本在哪裡，我們非常清楚確保我們繼續推行資本配置策略時，能夠以最大化股東價值的方式進行。所以我們必須平衡這些事情。

Yeah, and just to that point, I think that our strategy has always been pretty consistent around not just owning really high quality assets.

是的，就這一點而言，我認為我們的策略始終非常一致，不僅僅擁有真正高品質的資產。

In really good locations, but doing so in ways that we think can can drive, value creation and shareholder value. And so we need to be able, when we look at any investment, look at all of our criteria and make sure that an investment meets all of our criteria for us to pursue it.

地理位置確實很好，但我們認為這樣做可以推動價值創造和股東價值。因此，當我們考慮任何投資時，我們需要能夠考慮我們所有的標準，並確保投資符合我們追求它的所有標準。

And just to that point, I think our strategy has always been pretty consistent around not just owning really high-quality assets in really good locations, but doing so in ways that we think can drive value creation and shareholder value. And so we need to be able to -- when we look at any investment, look at all of our criteria and make sure that an investment meets all of our criteria for us to pursue it.

就這一點而言，我認為我們的策略始終非常一致，不僅在於擁有地理位置優越的優質資產，而且在於以我們認為可以推動價值創造和股東價值的方式持有資產。因此，我們需要能夠——當我們考慮任何投資時，考慮我們所有的標準，並確保投資符合我們追求它的所有標準。

And then, John, are you talking about tenants in the market in Austin? Or are you talking about -- you are talking Austin? Ellie is nodding his head, yes. So I'm intervening. So the types of tenants in the CBD we're seeing are consistent with the deals we've been making, which are professional services, banking, law firms, et cetera.

那麼，約翰，您說的是奧斯汀市場的租戶嗎？或者您是在談論——您是在談論奧斯汀？艾莉點頭，是的。所以我要介入。因此，我們看到的中央商務區租戶類型與我們一直以來達成的交易一致，即專業服務、銀行、律師事務所等等。

I would say a really positive note and something to watch with Austin is that large tenant activity has picked up again in and around the domain and Northwest Austin. So more to come on that. But there are -- in addition to Amazon, there are other large requirements that have been looking around in Northwest Austin. So from our perspective, with Indeed Tower, we have a good pipeline, and we're sort of getting the best of the best of the private services, professional services firms that are out there.

我想說的一個真正積極的跡象和對奧斯汀值得關注的一點是，奧斯汀及其周邊地區和奧斯汀西北部大型租戶的活動再次活躍起來。對此我們還有更多內容。但除了亞馬遜之外，還有其他大型企業也在奧斯汀西北部尋找商機。因此，從我們的角度來看，透過 Indeed Tower，我們擁有了良好的管道，並且能夠獲得最好的私人服務和專業服務公司。

And with no further questions on the line at this time, this will conclude the Kilroy Realty Corporation fourth quarter 2024 earnings conference call. Thank you for your participation today. You may now disconnect your lines.

目前沒有其他問題，Kilroy Realty Corporation 2024 年第四季財報電話會議將結束。感謝您今天的參與。現在您可以斷開線路了。