科磊 (KLAC) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon. My name is David, and I'll be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the KLA Corporation June quarter 2024 earnings conference call and webcast. (Operator Instructions) Thank you.

午安.我叫大衛，今天我將擔任你們的會議操作員。此時，我謹歡迎大家參加 KLA Corporation 2024 年 6 月季度財報電話會議和網路廣播。 （操作員說明）謝謝。

I will now turn the call over to Kevin Kessel, Vice President of Investor Relations and Market Analytics. Please go ahead.

我現在將把電話轉給投資者關係和市場分析副總裁 Kevin Kessel。請繼續。

Welcome to our earnings call to discuss the June 2024 results and the September quarter outlook. I am joined by our CEO, Rick Wallace; and our CFO, Bren Higgins. We'll discuss today's results released after market close and available at ir.kla.com, along with supplemental materials.

歡迎參加我們的財報電話會議，討論 2024 年 6 月的業績和 9 月份的季度前景。我們的執行長 Rick Wallace 也加入了我的行列。和我們的財務長布倫·希金斯。我們將討論今天收盤後發布的結果（可在 ir.kla.com 上取得）以及補充資料。

Today's discussion and metrics are presented on a non-GAAP financial basis unless otherwise specified. All full year references are to calendar years. The earnings material containing the detailed reconciliation of GAAP to non-GAAP results. KLA's IR website also contains future investor events, presentations, corporate governance information, and links to our SEC filings, including our most recent annual report and quarterly reports on Forms 10-K, and 10-Q.

除非另有說明，今天的討論和指標均基於非公認會計準則財務基礎。所有全年參考均指日曆年。收益材料包含 GAAP 與非 GAAP 業績的詳細調整表。 KLA 的 IR 網站還包含未來的投資者活動、演示文稿、公司治理資訊以及我們的 SEC 文件的鏈接，包括我們最新的年度報告和 10-K 表格和 10-Q 表格的季度報告。

Our comments today are subject to risks and uncertainties reflected in the disclosure of risk factors in our SEC filings. Any forward-looking statements, including those we make on the call today are also subject to those risks and KLA cannot guarantee those forward-looking statements will come true.

我們今天的評論受到美國證券交易委員會文件中揭露的風險因素所反映的風險和不確定性的影響。任何前瞻性陳述，包括我們今天在電話會議上所做的陳述，也都面臨這些風險，KLA 無法保證這些前瞻性陳述一定會實現。

Our actual results may differ significantly from those projected in our forward-looking statements. I will begin the call with some introductory comments, followed by Bren with additional financial highlights, including our outlook. Let me turn the call over to our CEO, Rick Wallace. Rick?

我們的實際結果可能與我們前瞻性陳述中預測的結果有很大差異。我將在電話會議開始時進行一些介紹性評論，然後由布倫介紹其他財務要點，包括我們的前景。讓我把電話轉給我們的執行長里克華萊士。瑞克？

Thank you, Kevin. I will cover a few business highlights for this quarter. KLA's June quarter revenue gross margin and EPS were all above their respective guidance midpoints. Quarter played out mostly as expected with strong customer demand, solid company execution.

謝謝你，凱文。我將介紹本季的一些業務亮點。 KLA 6 月季度的營收毛利率和每股盈餘均高於各自的指引中點。由於強勁的客戶需求和穩健的公司執行力，本季的表現基本上符合預期。

We continue to see signs of a strengthening market environment for customers at the leading edge, and we remain confident in our plan for steady improvement throughout the remainder of this calendar year and into 2025.

我們繼續看到領先客戶的市場環境正在增強的跡象，我們對今年剩餘時間和 2025 年的穩步改進計劃仍然充滿信心。

This quarter, KLA results returned to sequential and year-over-year revenue growth, demonstrating an improving industry environment. Foundry, logic, continuation of scaling, and incorporation of new technologies and slowly rising capital intensity continues to be a long-term tailwind. In memory, technology development investments, supporting AI, high bandwidth memory and the improving supply demand environment, support an expected return to growth for memory markets in 2025.

本季度，KLA 業績恢復環比和同比收入成長，顯示產業環境正在改善。代工、邏輯、持續擴展、新技術的結合以及緩慢上升的資本密集度仍然是長期的推動力。在記憶體方面，支援人工智慧、高頻寬記憶體和不斷改善的供應需求環境的技術開發投資將支援記憶體市場在 2025 年實現預期恢復成長。

June quarter also marked another quarter of strong performance from our portfolio of broadband plasma or BBP products, which we also refer to as Gen 4 and Gen 5. This year marks 40 years of innovation for our BBP patterned wafer inspection business.

六月季度也標誌著我們的寬頻等離子或 BBP 產品組合（我們也稱之為 Gen 4 和 Gen 5）又一個季度表現強勁。

We continue to see significant differentiation, keeping this product line at the forefront of defect discovery for the semiconductor industry. Expect this product family momentum to continue delivering strong relative growth performance in calendar year 2024.

我們繼續看到顯著的差異化，使該產品線保持在半導體產業缺陷發現的最前線。預計該產品系列的勢頭將在 2024 年繼續帶來強勁的相對成長表現。

AI continues to be a driver and enabler for KLA's business. AI adoption is driving higher volume wafer manufacturing, more complex designs, larger dye, and chip size and growing advanced packaging demands which support an increase in process control intensity.

人工智慧仍然是 KLA 業務的驅動力和推動者。人工智慧的採用正在推動更高產量的晶圓製造、更複雜的設計、更大的染料和晶片尺寸以及不斷增長的先進封裝需求，從而支持製程控制強度的增加。

Last quarter, we estimated that the KLA opportunity to reach approximately $400 million in annualized revenue exiting calendar 2024. Today, we're raising that estimate to more than $500 million in total advanced packaging revenue across the entire KLA portfolio on the momentum we are experiencing.

上個季度，我們估計 KLA 有機會在 2024 年實現年化收入約 4 億美元。 。

Additionally, AI is enabling KLA to further differentiate our products and the continuous improvement in the performance of our systems. KLA service business grew to $614 million in the June quarter, up 4% sequentially and 14% year over year.

此外，人工智慧使 KLA 能夠進一步區分我們的產品並持續改進我們的系統效能。 KLA 服務業務在第二季成長至 6.14 億美元，較上季成長 4%，較去年同期成長 14%。

Utilization rates of existing installed capacity are steadily rising across all business segments as end market demand improves. Finally, quarterly free cash flow was $832 million. The last 12 months free cash flow was $3 billion, with free cash flow margin of 31% over the same period.

隨著終端市場需求的改善，所有業務領域的現有裝置容量利用率都在穩步上升。最後，季度自由現金流為 8.32 億美元。過去 12 個月的自由現金流為 30 億美元，同期自由現金流利潤率為 31%。

KLA results continue to demonstrate our sustained process control leadership and the success of our broad portfolio specific product strategies. In this industry environment, KLA will continue to focus on supporting customer requirements executing on product roadmaps, preparing for growth at the leading edge.

KLA 的結果繼續證明了我們持續的製程控制領先地位以及我們廣泛的產品組合特定產品策略的成功。在這種行業環境下，KLA 將繼續專注於支援客戶在產品路線圖上執行的需求，為領先的成長做好準備。

I'll now hand the call over to Bren to go through the financial highlights and outlook.

現在我將把電話轉給布倫，讓他了解財務要點和前景。

Thanks, Rick. KLA's quarterly results demonstrated our market leadership, combined with the consistent execution of our global team. KLA continues to show resourcefulness and the ability to adapt, meet customers' changing requirements.

謝謝，瑞克。 KLA 的季度業績證明了我們的市場領導地位以及我們全球團隊的一貫執行力。 KLA 不斷展現足智多謀和適應能力，滿足客戶不斷變化的需求。

Quarterly revenue was $2.57 billion above the guidance midpoint of $2.5 billion. Non-GAAP diluted EPS was $6.60, and GAAP diluted EPS was $6.18, both above their respective guidance midpoints. Gross margin was 62.5% at the upper end of the guidance range as a richer product mix than modeled and higher revenue volume drove upside to guidance.

季度營收比指導中位數 25 億美元高出 25.7 億美元。非 GAAP 攤薄後每股收益為 6.60 美元，GAAP 攤薄後每股收益為 6.18 美元，均高於各自的指導中點。毛利率為 62.5%，處於指導範圍的上限，因為產品組合比模型更豐富，且收入增加，導致毛利率高於指導值。

Operating expenses were $553 million. Operating expenses were comprised of $324 million in R&D and $229 million in SG&A. Operating margin was 41%. Other income and expense net was a $32 million expense and the quarterly effective tax rate was 12.6%.

營運費用為 5.53 億美元。營運費用包括 3.24 億美元的研發費用和 2.29 億美元的銷售管理費用。營業利益率為 41%。其他收入和支出淨額為 3,200 萬美元，季度有效稅率為 12.6%。

Quarterly non-GAAP net income was $893 million. GAAP net income was $836 million. Cash flow from operations was $893 million and free cash flow was $832 million. The company had 135.3 million diluted weighted average shares outstanding at the end of the quarter. The breakdown of revenue by reportable segments, end markets, major products and regions can be found within the shareholder letter and slides.

非 GAAP 季度淨利為 8.93 億美元。 GAAP 淨利為 8.36 億美元。營運現金流為 8.93 億美元，自由現金流為 8.32 億美元。截至本季末，該公司擁有 1.353 億股稀釋加權平均已發行股票。按可報告部門、終端市場、主要產品和地區劃分的收入細目可在股東信函和幻燈片中找到。

Turning to the balance sheet, KLA ended the quarter with $4.5 billion of total cash, cash equivalents and marketable securities, debt of $6.7 billion and a flexible and attractive bond maturity profile, supported by strong investment grade ratings from all three major rating agencies.

談到資產負債表，KLA 本季末的現金、現金等價物和有價證券總額為45 億美元，債務為67 億美元，債券期限結構靈活且有吸引力，並得到三大評級機構強勁投資級別評級的支持。

Moving to our outlook, we believe our business is transitioning from a period of stabilization to resumption of growth, which began in our June quarter that we expect to continue through the remainder of calendar '24 and into 2025.

展望我們的前景，我們相信我們的業務正在從穩定期過渡到恢復增長期，這一增長期始於 6 月季度，我們預計將持續到 24 日曆年剩餘時間直至 2025 年。

For calendar 2024, we remain encouraged by the improvement in our customers' revenue and profitability over the course of this year. This improvement will ultimately translate into new investment and capital equipment to support semiconductor growth over the medium term.

對於 2024 年，我們仍然對今年客戶收入和獲利能力的改善感到鼓舞。這項改進最終將轉化為新的投資和資本設備，以支持半導體在中期內的成長。

Our high level outlook for the industry remains largely unchanged. Our expectation is for the WFE market to be in the mid $90 billion range and that the second half of the calendar year will be stronger than the first half.

我們對該行業的高層展望基本上保持不變。我們預期 WFE 市場將達到 900 億美元左右，下半年將強於上半年。

While it's too early to be overly specific on expectations for calendar 2025, we do expect the year of growth fueled principally by growth and leading-edge investments in both logic, foundry, and in memory. Given KLA's business momentum, we are confident in our relative performance opportunities moving forward.

雖然現在對 2025 年的預期過於具體還為時過早，但我們確實預計這一年的成長將主要由邏輯、代工和記憶體領域的成長和領先投資推動。鑑於 KLA 的業務勢頭，我們對未來的相對業績機會充滿信心。

KLA September quarter guidance is as follows. Total revenue is expected to be $2.75 billion plus or minus $150 million. Foundry, logic revenue from semiconductor customers is forecast to be approximately 80%, and memory is expected to be approximately 20% of semi process control systems revenue. Within memory, DRAM is expected to be about 83% of the segment mix and NAND the remaining 17%.

KLA 9 月季度指引如下。總收入預估為 27.5 億美元上下 1.5 億美元。代工方面，來自半導體客戶的邏輯收入預計將佔半製程控制系統收入的約 80%，記憶體預計將佔半製程控制系統收入的約 20%。在記憶體領域，DRAM 預計將佔細分市場的 83% 左右，而 NAND 則佔剩餘的 17%。

Gross margin is forecasted to be in a range of 61.5% plus or minus 1 percentage point as higher revenue volumes offset by weaker anticipated product mix. Consistent with our comments last quarter, based on the current industry outlook, top line growth expectations for calendar '24, higher forecasted growth in services and expected system product mix, we are still modeling non-GAAP gross margins to remain relatively stable around the mid 61% range.

由於收入增加被預期產品組合疲軟所抵消，毛利率預計在 61.5% 上下浮動 1 個百分點。與我們上季度的評論一致，基於當前的行業前景、24 世紀的營收成長預期、服務和預期系統產品組合的較高預測成長，我們仍在建模非GAAP 毛利率，以在中期左右保持相對穩定61%範圍。

Variability quarter to quarter is typically driven by product mix fluctuations. Operating expenses are forecasted in September quarter to be approximately $565 million as we continue to make important R&D and scaling investments to support expected revenue growth.

季度與季度之間的變化通常是由產品組合波動造成的。由於我們繼續進行重要的研發和規模投資以支持預期的收入成長，預計 9 月季度的營運費用約為 5.65 億美元。

Looking ahead, we expect approximately $10 million to $15 million incremental growth in quarterly operating expenses for the remainder of calendar '24 and into 2025. This is supported by our revenue growth expectations and in line with our 40% to 50% incremental operating margin business model.

展望未來，我們預計24 年剩餘時間到2025 年，季度營運支出將增加約1000 萬至1500 萬美元。業務相一致模型。

Other model assumptions for the September quarter include other income and expense net of approximately $34 million expense. GAAP diluted EPS is expected to be $6.69 plus or minus $0.60 and non-GAAP diluted EPS of $7 plus or minus $0.60. EPS guidance is based on a fully diluted share count of approximately 135 million shares.

9 月季度的其他模型假設包括扣除約 3,400 萬美元費用後的其他收入和支出。 GAAP 攤薄後每股收益預計為 6.69 美元上下 0.60 美元，非 GAAP 攤薄後每股收益預計為 7 美元上下 0.60 美元。每股盈餘指引是基於約 1.35 億股完全稀釋後的股數。

In conclusion, our business has transitioned from a period of stabilization to one of growth. We remain optimistic that the indicators of improvement we have seen will continue throughout the remainder of calendar '24 and into 2025.

總而言之，我們的業務已從穩定期過渡到成長期。我們仍然樂觀地認為，我們所看到的改善指標將在 24 日曆年剩餘時間內持續到 2025 年。

KLA is focused on delivering a differentiated product portfolio that anticipates customers' technology road map requirements and drives our longer-term growth expectations. For the KLA operating model guiding best in class execution, KLA continues to implement strategic objectives, which are geared to drive outperformance.

KLA 專注於提供差異化的產品組合，預測客戶的技術路線圖需求並推動我們的長期成長預期。為了指導最佳執行力的 KLA 營運模式，KLA 持續實施旨在推動卓越績效的策略目標。

KLA is focused on customer success, delivering innovative and differentiated solutions, and operational excellence is what drives the industry-leading financial and free cash flow performance and allows us to return capital consistent.

KLA 專注於客戶成功，提供創新和差異化的解決方案，卓越的營運推動了業界領先的財務和自由現金流績效，並使我們能夠持續回報資本。

Return of scaling and increasing complexity has solidified our confidence in the increasing importance of process control in enabling technology advancements. This is not just an improving time to results and process integration and fab ramp, but also in optimizing yield across a volume production environment with high semiconductor device design mix.

規模化的迴歸和複雜性的增加堅定了我們對過程控制在實現技術進步方面日益重要的信心。這不僅縮短了獲得結果、製程整合和晶圓廠產能的時間，而且還優化了具有高半導體裝置設計組合的批量生產環境的產量。

This bodes well for KLA's long-term growth outlook. This near-term industry demand trends are continuing to improve. In alignment with this, KLA's business is approving, and the long-term secular trends driving semiconductor industry demand and investments in WFE remain compelling.

這對 KLA 的長期成長前景來說是個好兆頭。近期行業需求趨勢持續改善。與此一致的是，KLA 的業務得到了認可，推動半導體產業需求和 WFE 投資的長期趨勢仍然引人注目。

That concludes the prepared remarks. Let's begin Q&A. Kevin?

準備好的發言到此結束。讓我們開始問答。凱文？

Thank you, Bren. Operator, we're ready for you to provide instructions and begin the Q&A session.

謝謝你，布倫。接線員，我們已準備好為您提供說明並開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions) Vivek Arya, Bank of America Securities.

（操作員指令）Vivek Arya，美國銀行證券。

Thanks for taking my question. Rick recently, TSMC said they expect the number of new tape outs for 2 nanometer in the first two years to be higher than what they saw for 3 and 5 in their first two years. And I think they've also heard a number of AI customers accelerate their roadmaps. I'm curious what does this mean for KLA in terms of your outlook and kind of your share of the WFE wallet? And do you expect 2 nanometer to be a bigger factor for 2025 or for 2026?

感謝您提出我的問題。 Rick 最近表示，台積電預計前兩年 2 奈米新流片數量將高於 3 奈米和 5 奈米前兩年的流片數量。我認為他們也聽說許多人工智慧客戶加快了他們的路線圖。我很好奇這對 KLA 來說意味著什麼，以及您在 WFE 錢包中所佔的份額？您預計 2 奈米會在 2025 年還是 2026 年成為更大的因素？

Thanks for that. Yes, we're definitely having those same conversations with our customers in terms of in the reticle world, of course, when there are more design starts, we see activity in the retical market in terms of inspection for those reticles and then early lots. We're still early in N2. And in terms of your question, it's really going into '25 and then '26.

感謝那。是的，我們肯定會在標線世界中與客戶進行相同的對話，當然，當有更多設計開始時，我們會看到標線市場在檢查這些標線以及早期批次方面的活動。我們還處於 N2 早期。就你的問題而言，它實際上是進入 25 年，然後是 26 年。

But the other thing we've seen is strengthening in N3 as well. So I think both of those factors are being driven by some of the same drivers we talked about in the prepared remarks, in terms of what we're seeing from AI driving that. So it does lead us to believe that our goals to increase our percent of WFE continue to be supported by the opportunities afforded by the additional process control challenges. So I think we're in pretty good shape with that.

但我們看到的另一件事是 N3 也在加強。因此，我認為這兩個因素都是由我們在準備好的發言中討論過的一些驅動因素所驅動的，就我們從人工智慧驅動的情況來看。因此，這確實讓我們相信，額外的製程控制挑戰所提供的機會將繼續支持我們提高 WFE 百分比的目標。所以我認為我們在這方面的狀況非常好。

The other thing, of course, is being driven in some of these advanced AI chips as larger dye size, which as you know, are bigger challenge from a yield perspective and creates a more incentive for more inspection, especially as these processes are brought online and ramped up. So mostly what we see is it's '25 leading into '26 in terms of when they reach HBM.

當然，另一件事是在一些先進的人工智慧晶片中驅動更大的染料尺寸，正如你所知，從產量的角度來看，這是更大的挑戰，並為更多的檢查創造了更多的動力，特別是當這些過程在線上進行時並加速。因此，我們看到的主要情況是，從他們達到 HBM 的時間來看，25 年領先 26 年。

Bren, anything to add?

布倫，有什麼要補充的嗎？

No, I think you covered most of it Rick. I would say also one of the things that we're encouraged by that with the design start environment given the high mix of parts that our participation with our customers in terms of process control with monitoring that happens in production tends to be at a higher level. So they're trying to manage a robust design environment, that's testing design rules in different ways, and that tends to be positive for continuous process control investment as they ramp up the node.

不，我想你已經涵蓋了大部分內容，瑞克。我還要說的是，我們在設計開始環境中受到鼓勵的一件事是，考慮到零件的高度混合，我們與客戶在生產中發生的過程控制和監控方面的參與往往處於更高的水平。因此，他們正在嘗試管理一個強大的設計環境，以不同的方式測試設計規則，並且隨著節點的增加，這對於持續的過程控制投資往往是積極的。

And remember Vivek, earlier in the year, we talked about a more positive tone we are seeing from our customers, and it was related to the early demand that they were starting to sense from their customers. And that's why we believed and that's how it's playing out that we would see strengthening in our business.

請記住維韋克，今年早些時候，我們談到了我們從客戶那裡看到的更積極的基調，這與他們開始從客戶那裡感受到的早期需求有關。這就是為什麼我們相信，這就是我們的業務將會加強的原因。

Maybe what's new, a little bit new is the additional strengthen in N3, which wasn't as forecasted as the rollout of N2. So I think both of those are adding to our belief that we're in a good period for consistent acceleration in demand on the leading edge.

也許新的一點是 N3 的額外增強，這並不像 N2 的推出那樣預測。因此，我認為這兩者都增強了我們的信念，即我們正處於前沿需求持續加速的良好時期。

Got it. Now on advanced packaging, you raised it up from $400 million to $500 million. I wanted to clarify, is that on an exiting full-year basis or is that for the full year. So just that clarification, then how would you break it out in terms of specialty and inspection metrology?

知道了。現在，在先進封裝方面，您將其從 4 億美元提高到了 5 億美元。我想澄清一下，是在現有的全年基礎上還是以全年為基礎。那麼，澄清一下，那麼您將如何在專業和檢驗計量方面進行突破呢？

Yeah, it's a good question. So that's our expectation for the business level in 2024. So it isn't a run rate necessarily, but what we expect to do, which is significantly above what we did last year, which was closer to $300 million, so mid 60% growth rate with continuing momentum.

是的，這是一個好問題。這就是我們對 2024 年業務水準的預期。率保持持續勢頭。

I would think that we would continue at least through the first half of next year to see strong demand around packaging. So it's really an opportunity for us. Certainly, we're seeing a lot of customer interest as we're seeing more and more focus on front-end capability moving it to the back end. So it's an encouraging opportunity moving forward. I think the growth rate, relative to growth rate of WFE will be higher over the over the next few years.

我認為至少在明年上半年我們會繼續看到包裝的強勁需求。所以這對我們來說確實是一個機會。當然，我們看到了很多客戶的興趣，因為我們看到越來越多的人專注於前端功能並將其轉移到後端。因此，這是一個令人鼓舞的前進機會。我認為未來幾年相對於 WFE 的成長率將會更高。

So that's one of the things Vivek I'm sure you've heard is that one of the bottlenecks now for AI is silicon is part of it, but the packaging (inaudible) is also part of what we're seeing and we had customers for the first time in my career from the front end start pulling us into packaging conversations because they want front end capability, as Bren said, being used in packaging to assist.

所以，Vivek，我相信你聽說過的一件事是，現在人工智慧的瓶頸之一是矽，它是其中的一部分，但包裝（聽不清楚）也是我們所看到的一部分，而且我們有客戶這是我職業生涯中第一次從前端開始將我們帶入包裝對話，因為他們希望前端功能，正如布倫所說，被用於包裝中以提供幫助。

So I think we talked about AI being a driver. It's really driving not just the silicon but also packaging and also, of course, HBM for -- you need all three of those to fully execute on the plans people have.

所以我認為我們談論了人工智慧作為司機。它不僅真正推動了晶片的發展，還推動了封裝的發展，當然還有 HBM，因為您需要這三者來全面執行人們的計劃。

So to your question on mix, about I'd say 60% of it is process control, and then you have the remaining 40% is in our process, specialty process business, and also some exposure in terms of chemical process control as well. But about 60% of it in the classic semiconductor process control part of our business.

因此，對於你關於混合的問題，我想說其中 60% 是製程控制，然後剩下的 40% 是在我們的製程、專業製程業務中，以及在化學製程控制方面的一些接觸。但其中約 60% 屬於我們業務的經典半導體流程控制部分。

Thank you.

謝謝。

C.J. Muse, Cantor Fitzgerald.

C.J.繆斯，坎托·費茲傑拉。

Yeah, good afternoon. Thank you for taking the question. In your prepared remarks, you talked about returning to growth for memory in 2025. I know it's early, but would love to hear kind of your initial thoughts and maybe separating DRAM versus NAND?

是的，下午好。感謝您提出問題。在您準備好的發言中，您談到了內存將在 2025 年恢復增長。

And then within DRAM, how you're seeing HBM conversion versus DDR5 and greenfields? And same for NAND, later accounts versus any sort of expectations for greenfield in the 2025 timeframe.

然後在 DRAM 中，您如何看待 HBM 轉換與 DDR5 和綠地的比較？對於 NAND 來說也是如此，稍後的帳目與 2025 年時間範圍內綠地的任何預期相比。

Well, '24 is really a transition year for memory. We're not seeing a lot of growth overall. Some in the DRAM front and some investment that's happened in China. So I think from a WFE point of view, 2025 is when we expect to see more growth there.

嗯，24 確實是記憶的過渡年。總體而言，我們沒有看到太多成長。一些在 DRAM 領域，一些投資發生在中國。因此，我認為從 WFE 的角度來看，我們預計 2025 年會出現更多成長。

I think you talked about the drivers, particularly around DRAM. and HBM being drivers into next year. I think as we see that our customers' business models improve and we're certainly seeing the financial performance improve with pricing going up so significantly over the course of this year. But that will translate into investment as we move into next year.

我認為您談到了驅動程序，特別是圍繞 DRAM 的驅動程式。和 HBM 是明年的驅動力。我認為，當我們看到客戶的商業模式得到改善時，我們肯定會看到財務表現隨著今年價格的大幅上漲而改善。但隨著我們進入明年，這將轉化為投資。

I think on the flash market, we're less bullish into next year, although it's operating off a pretty low level. We'll see as we get closer to it. But right now, we do see a recovery in both parts of that. But certainly led by more DRAM than flash on an absolute to WFE basis.

我認為在快閃記憶體市場上，我們對明年的看法不那麼樂觀，儘管它的運作水平相當低。當我們越來越接近它時我們就會看到。但現在，我們確實看到這兩方面都在復甦。但從絕對 WFE 的角度來看，肯定是 DRAM 多於快閃記憶體領先。

Yeah. And I think much like some of what we saw in the early discussions of AI last year where we didn't really see an increase in silicon because there were still utilization leverage that our customers have. Some of that's in memory. So we really don't see capacity starting to be added significantly until '25 and it's '26 at HBM. So as Bren said, conversion, but then you don't get the capacity to sell later, and it's really HBM associated DRAM before you see flash.

是的。我認為這很像我們在去年人工智慧的早期討論中看到的一些情況，我們並沒有真正看到晶片的增加，因為我們的客戶仍然擁有利用率槓桿。其中一些是在記憶中。因此，我們確實沒有看到容量在 25 年之前開始顯著增加，而 HBM 則是在 26 年。正如 Bren 所說，轉換，但之後你就沒有能力出售，而且在你看到快閃記憶體之前，它實際上是與 HBM 相關的 DRAM。

Very helpful. And then as a follow-up, again, in the prepared remarks, you talked about confidence in your relative performance and obviously no question around the foundry, logic side, given the complexity of larger dye size.

很有幫助。然後，作為後續行動，在準備好的發言中，您談到了對自己的相對錶現的信心，考慮到較大染料尺寸的複雜性，顯然在鑄造廠、邏輯方面沒有問題。

But curious as you see increased memory into the mix. Is there enough share of wallet on the logic, foundry side to kind of mitigate that and allow that relative outperformance? Would love to hear that kind of puts and takes around that?

但當你看到混合記憶體增加時，你會感到好奇。邏輯、代工方面是否有足夠的錢包份額來緩解這種情況並實現相對優異的表現？想聽聽類似的 put 和 take 嗎？

Yeah, we've done pretty good, CJ. We're seeing relative performance this year. And this is a year that's still pretty heavy overall in what I'll call legacy levels of investment, particularly in China. So as we start to move to leading edge and you see the entry ramp, but also the initial investments in them too, we would expect that given our position, particularly in certain markets that we expect to scale and grow much faster than the overall that we're pretty well positioned into next year to see foundry logic leading-edge investment drive scale and share of the overall spend.

是的，我們做得很好，CJ。我們今年看到了相對的表現。今年整體而言，我所說的遺留投資水準仍然相當沉重，尤其是在中國。因此，當我們開始走向領先地位時，你會看到進入的斜坡，而且也會看到對它們的初始投資，我們預計，鑑於我們的地位，特別是在某些市場，我們預計規模和增長速度將遠遠快於整體市場。

We were talking about DRAM and HBM, and HBM is a device that tends that first of all you have advanced DRAMs. You have EUV as -- you get the introduction of for use of EUV with those chips. But also as you start to put the chips together, it creates not only potential packaging opportunities moving forward, but you also have increased sampling to ensure that each of the DRAM dye is functioning properly.

我們討論的是 DRAM 和 HBM，而 HBM 是一種傾向於首先擁有先進 DRAM 的設備。您可以了解 EUV 與這些晶片的使用。而且當您開始將晶片組裝在一起時，它不僅創造了潛在的封裝機會，而且您還增加了採樣，以確保每種 DRAM 染料都能正常工作。

So we've seen DRAM improve from a process control intensity point of view since the introduction of EUV. And so I would expect to see that continue as well as we move forward. So yeah, I think we feel pretty good about the relative positioning of the company as we move into next year.

因此，自從 EUV 推出以來，我們已經看到 DRAM 從製程控制強度的角度來看有所改善。因此，我希望看到這種情況繼續下去，同時我們也能繼續前進。所以，是的，我認為隨著我們進入明年，我們對公司的相對定位感覺很好。

So CJ, one of the things that we're seeing and we haven't seen in many, many years, if you remember part of the reason memory had lower adoption was because of repair. And it seems that on leading DRAM, repair is less effective than it's been.

因此，CJ，我們所看到的事情之一是我們已經很多很多年沒有看到的事情了，如果你還記得記憶體採用率較低的部分原因是因為修復。對於領先的 DRAM，修復似乎不如以前那麼有效。

And so that is a factor that's driving some of our customers. Obviously, they're going to try to get through that, but that's they are expecting that they're going to have larger need for a greater need for process control because of that.

這就是推動我們一些客戶的一個因素。顯然，他們會嘗試解決這個問題，但他們預計因此會對製程控制有更大的需求。

And as Bren said, you also have because of EUV, you get the introduction of print check into memory and they have issues associated with pellicles. So I know it's very much into the weeds, but it drives more print checks. So process control adoption is setting up to maybe be better than historical levels, at least for the advanced DRAM.

正如 Bren 所說，由於 EUV，您還可以將列印檢查引入內存，並且它們存在與薄膜相關的問題。所以我知道這很麻煩，但它會帶來更多的列印支票。因此，製程控制的採用可能會好於歷史水平，至少對於先進的 DRAM 來說是如此。

Very helpful. Thank you.

很有幫助。謝謝。

Harlan Sur, JPMorgan.

哈蘭‧蘇爾，摩根大通。

Yeah, good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. As the team steps into the second half of this year, advanced technology node deployment is accelerating, obviously reflected in your strong guidance for the September quarter appears to be reflected in your confidence on the spending outlook this calendar year and growth into next.

是的，下午好。感謝您提出我的問題。隨著團隊進入今年下半年，先進技術節點部署正在加速，這顯然反映在您對九月份季度的強有力指導中，這似乎反映在您對本日曆年支出前景和明年增長的信心中。

Near term, does team anticipate sequential growth in the December quarter. And then relative to let's say last earnings call, has your qualitative view on 2025 improved? I mean, I know, Rick, you mentioned incrementally better 3 nanometer investments. Any other indicators that are coming in better versus your prior expectations as you look into next year?

近期，團隊預計 12 月季度將出現環比成長。相對於上次的財報電話會議，您對 2025 年的定性看法是否有所改善？我的意思是，我知道，Rick，你提到了更好的 3 奈米投資。當您展望明年時，還有其他指標比您之前的預期更好嗎？

Yeah, Harlan, I'll start here. First, we do expect sequential growth in the December quarter as we discussed last quarter, when we talked about the March quarter being the bottom and an expectation of sequential growth through the year.

是的，哈倫，我就從這裡開始。首先，正如我們在上個季度討論的那樣，我們確實預計 12 月份季度會出現環比增長，當時我們談到 3 月份季度是底部，並且預計全年會出現環比增長。

So that's how we see things into the December quarter. We'll see how things play out in terms of what that looks like. I would say on the margin, we're incrementally more bullish. Certainly when you look at the funnel in terms of opportunities up into next year, as we've seen that sellout, we have seen strength in the funnel to support our outlook into next year.

這就是我們對 12 月季度情況的看法。我們將看看事情會如何發展。我想說的是，我們逐漸變得更樂觀。當然，當你從明年的機會來看漏斗時，正如我們所看到的那樣，我們看到了漏斗中的力量來支持我們明年的前景。

Perfect. And then for my follow-up, and this is sort of a follow on to what Rick was saying, but as you mentioned in a memory has always had a lower process control intensity. But there are dynamics that are pushing the advanced logic like capabilities right into memory.

完美的。然後是我的後續行動，這有點像里克所說的後續行動，但正如您在記憶中提到的那樣，過程控制強度始終較低。但有一些動力正在將高階邏輯（如功能）直接推入記憶體。

You mentioned in a more EUV layer adoption in DRAM. But like, for example, in HBM DRAM, I think that's requiring is very advanced logic chip that sits at the bottom of the stack, right? That's using against CMOS logic technology. And NAND, the periphery and controller chip, which is increasingly becoming more advanced logic, is being processed separately from the NAND stack, right, and then bonded together.

您提到 DRAM 中更多採用 EUV 層。但就像在 HBM DRAM 中一樣，我認為這需要位於堆疊底部的非常先進的邏輯晶片，對吧？這是針對 CMOS 邏輯技術的使用。 NAND，週邊設備和控制器晶片，正變得越來越先進的邏輯，正在與 NAND 堆疊分開處理，然後粘合在一起。

And then this whole NAND sort of bonding technology process appears to be a nightmare for manufacturability and yield perspective. But kicking in totality, I mean, it does appear that these dynamics are driving memory process control intensity higher. I mean, any way to quantify, I know historically memory intensity has been above 10%. But if you look at all of these trends over the next few years, like where can you see that memory intensity sort of trending to?

然後，整個 NAND 類型的鍵合技術流程對於可製造性和良率來說似乎是一場噩夢。但總的來說，我的意思是，這些動態似乎確實正在推動記憶體過程控制強度更高。我的意思是，無論以何種方式量化，我知道歷史上記憶強度都在 10% 以上。但如果你觀察未來幾年的所有這些趨勢，你會發現記憶強度的趨勢在哪裡？

Yeah, it's a good question, Harlan and you did cover all the advancements that have us pretty excited in terms of opportunity moving forward. We have seen intensity improve over the last couple of years or so. But what we're waiting for to lean in if you will, into those -- to that improvement is to see a full cycle in terms of investment by our customers.

是的，這是一個很好的問題，哈倫和你確實涵蓋了所有讓我們在前進的機會方面感到非常興奮的進步。在過去幾年左右的時間裡，我們已經看到強度有所改善。但如果你願意的話，我們正在等待的就是看到我們的客戶投資的完整週期。

And so I think as we look into next year, I think that where we are today is probably we're historically around 10%, then we're probably in excess of 11% today. And I think moving forward, if we can execute and deliver some of the products and capabilities we have in development here, I think it creates a number of opportunities covering the things you talked about and some of the other things we talked about on the last question or two.

因此，我認為，當我們展望明年時，我認為我們今天所處的位置可能是歷史上的 10% 左右，那麼今天我們可能會超過 11%。我認為，展望未來，如果我們能夠執行和交付我們正在開發的一些產品和功能，我認為這會創造許多機會，涵蓋您談到的事情以及我們上次談到的其他一些事情一兩個問題。

Yeah. And just contrast that from a few years ago, Harlan, if you go back and you think about 3D, 3D happens and our customers go backwards in lithography, right? DRAM's not really pushing design rules nor pushing advanced logic around the DRAM and repair is still working.

是的。與幾年前相比，Harlan，如果你回頭想想 3D，3D 就會發生，我們的客戶會在光刻技術上倒退，對吧？ DRAM 並沒有真正推動設計規則，也沒有推動 DRAM 周圍的高級邏輯，修復仍在進行中。

Like you take all those factors off and you get more into the expected growth and intensity that you get in logic or in the leading edge foundry for similar reasons. But so we haven't fully modeled it because it's really hard.

就像你去掉所有這些因素，你會更專注於邏輯或領先代工廠中出於類似原因獲得的預期增長和強度。但我們還沒有完全建模，因為它真的很難。

Customers are still trying to figure it out. But there's more characterization happening at the leading edge, leading us to believe that there's going to be more implementation. But until they've been through the cycles, they don't know. But it is to Bren's point why we feel more bullish in our engagement in those customers, they recognize an increased need for the process control capability.

客戶仍在試圖找出答案。但前沿領域發生了更多的表徵，讓我們相信將會有更多的實施。但直到他們經歷了這些週期之後，他們才知道。但就布倫而言，我們對與這些客戶的合作感到更加樂觀，因為他們認識到對過程控制能力的需求不斷增加。

And then you just add on this bonding packaging question and that's a huge issue. And you know, the value of HBM is so high also. So I think there's a lot of factors. In many ways, there are plenty of opportunities. Then the other part of that answer is making sure that our solutions actually are going to work for those opportunities and we're still proving that out.

然後你只要加上這個黏合包裝問題，那就是一個大問題。要知道，HBM 的價值也非常高。所以我認為有很多因素。從很多方面來說，都有很多機會。然後，答案的另一部分是確保我們的解決方案實際上能夠為這些機會發揮作用，並且我們仍在證明這一點。

Perfect. Thank you very much.

完美的。非常感謝。

Thanks Harlan.

謝謝哈蘭。

Atif Malik, Citi.

阿蒂夫·馬利克，花旗銀行。

Hi. Thank you for taking my questions. The first one for Rick on gate all around PDC intensity. As some of your peers have talked about 30% increase in metrology intensity at 2 nanometer gate-all-around over 3 nanometer.

你好。感謝您回答我的問題。 Rick 的第一個關於 PDC 強度的門。正如您的一些同行所說，2 奈米全柵的計量強度比 3 奈米提高了 30%。

And the reticle inspection peers have talked about EUV map that's actually coming down to 20 from 30 from 3 nanometers. So when you put these two trends together, I'm curious how you're looking at your overall PDC intensity? And does that imply that you're gaining share on the vertical side?

掩模版檢查同行已經討論過 EUV 圖譜實際上已從 3 奈米的 30 奈米降至 20 奈米。因此，當您將這兩個趨勢放在一起時，我很好奇您如何看待整體 PDC 強度？這是否意味著您正在垂直領域中獲得份額？

So let me unpack that a little bit. I think that is definitely the case for gate all around that it creates new integration challenges. And so we've seen and we've talked about this for some time now the adoption of Gen 4 to support that and a new configuration to be able to resolve the issues around that.

讓我稍微解開一下。我認為這絕對是 Gate all 的情況，它帶來了新的整合挑戰。因此，我們已經看到並且已經討論了一段時間，採用第四代來支援這一點，並採用新配置來解決相關問題。

So there's -- that's a driver. It's also a different approach than what customers have used because of the architectural change. There is more metrology intensity being used and largely it increased in the need to control voltage thresholds. So VT control becomes more important. So that's also part of it.

所以有——那是一名司機。由於架構的變化，這也與客戶使用的方法不同。正在使用更多的計量強度，並且在很大程度上增加了控制電壓閾值的需要。因此VT控制就變得更加重要。這也是其中的一部分。

You also just have film thickness measurement and management hire. So overall, we would anticipate, but that's all kind of rolled into how we model the increasing process control intensity that we've outlined before there's really nothing that's different than when we modeled that going forward toward our 2026 plan in terms of overall process control intensity and our share performance there.

您還只需進行薄膜厚度測量和管理人員招聘。因此，總的來說，我們會預料到，但這一切都融入了我們如何對我們之前概述的不斷增加的過程控制強度進行建模，與我們在整體過程控制方面為2026 年計劃進行建模時相比，實際上沒有什麼不同。

Atif, if you look back to the last local high KLA share WFE, it was when the industry transitioned from planar to (inaudible) structures. So typically, architecture changes do drive because of just the change that's happening and the immaturity of the change, it does drive process control intensity to a higher level. So you know, historically, it's proven.

Atif，如果您回顧上一次本地高 KLA 份額 WFE，那是該行業從平面結構過渡到（聽不清楚）結構的時候。因此，通常情況下，架構變化確實會推動，因為正在發生的變化和變化的不成熟，它確實將製程控制強度推向了更高的水平。所以你知道，歷史上已經證明了這一點。

So Rick talked about not only inspection opportunities, but you're depositing a lot more layers, 20% to 30% more critical layers on the metrology side. So we think in a number of areas it's going to create opportunities and you still have the scaling dynamics, while (inaudible) layers are constant, those are still pretty challenging layers in terms of from a defect control point of view. So we're pretty bullish about the opportunities. I think it's feeding into a lot of what we've said here over the last few questions in terms of our confidence moving into next year.

因此，Rick 不僅談到了檢查機會，還談到了在計量方面沉積了更多的層，即 20% 到 30% 的關鍵層。因此，我們認為在許多領域它將創造機會，並且仍然具有擴展動態，雖然（聽不清楚）層是恆定的，但從缺陷控制的角度來看，這些層仍然是相當具有挑戰性的層。所以我們非常看好這些機會。我認為這反映了我們在過去幾個問題中所說的許多內容，即我們對明年的信心。

Great. And as a follow-up, Bren, the revenue guide is a bit wider than usual, a plus minus $150 million versus $125 million, is that just a function of higher revenues or is there something else?

偉大的。布倫，作為後續行動，收入指南比平常要寬一些，正負 1.5 億美元與 1.25 億美元相比，這只是收入增加的函數還是還有其他原因？

Yeah, a function of higher revenues, it's about 5% or so. At some point as we move through the different quarters and revenue ranges, we start to make an adjustment just because of the higher levels. So there's nothing indicative in that other than revenues up 9% higher, we decided to -- it was 9% in June and then the guidance, another 7%. So that it was prudent to raise the range.

是的，隨著收入的增加，大約是 5% 左右。在某些時候，當我們經歷不同的季度和收入範圍時，我們會因為較高的水平而開始進行調整。因此，除了收入成長 9% 之外，沒有任何其他跡象，我們決定——6 月是 9%，然後是指導，另外 7%。因此，提高範圍是謹慎的做法。

You have to also remember that we do have editors that are quite large. If you think about our broadband plasma systems, they could be anywhere even plus $20 million, depending on the configuration. So tools moving in and out in can have an impact in terms of our overall. So it's really more just the increase in revenue level and not related to anything else.

您還必須記住，我們確實有相當大的編輯器。如果您考慮我們的寬頻等離子系統，它們的售價甚至可能超過 2000 萬美元，具體取決於配置。因此，工具的進出會對我們的整體產生影響。所以這實際上只是收入水準的增加，與其他任何事情無關。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Chris Caso, Wolfe Research.

克里斯‧卡索，沃爾夫研究中心。

Yes, thank you. Good evening. I guess first question is on the trends that you're seeing in mature node? And specifically, while I guess China revenue in general, I think in your prior comments were an expectation for China about flat in the second half. You talk about if that's still your view and what you're seeing outside of the leading edge?

是的，謝謝。晚安.我想第一個問題是您在成熟節點中看到的趨勢？具體來說，雖然我猜測中國的整體收入，但我認為您先前的評論中對中國下半年的收入持平的預期。您談論這是否仍然是您的觀點以及您在前沿之外看到了什麼？

Yeah. It still might not be the absolute dollar basis, right? And then with the second half growing relative to the first half, the percent will start to move in the second half versus the first half. But on an absolute dollar basis as I said last quarter, it's about flat.

是的。它仍然可能不是絕對的美元基礎，對吧？然後，隨著下半年相對於上半年的成長，下半年相對於上半年的百分比將開始變化。但正如我上季所說，以絕對美元為基礎，它幾乎持平。

Now depending on what happens, you've got a lot of new projects and (inaudible) could be an issue with newer customers. So where it shows up in terms of which quarter I'm not going to comment on, but if you just take a step back and look at half to half point of view, it's very similar to what I said last quarter.

現在，根據發生的情況，您有很多新項目，並且（聽不清楚）可能會成為新客戶的問題。因此，我不會評論哪個季度的情況，但如果你退後一步，看看一半到一半的觀點，它與我上個季度所說的非常相似。

Got it. And then following on, you've made some comments about the impact of high NA in the past. One, could you remind us a little bit about the impact of high NA on process control? And then secondly, with regard to timing for that, there has been some noise around that about sort of implementation schedules. Anything different than you've seen in your side? (inaudible) recognize that you folks would probably be a little bit earlier in saying that given the timing of when you install process control?

知道了。接下來，您對過去高 NA 的影響發表了一些評論。第一，您能否提醒我們一些高數值孔徑對製程控制的影響？其次，關於時間安排，圍繞實施時間表存在一些噪音。與你在身邊看到的有什麼不同嗎？ （聽不清楚）考慮到安裝過程控制的時間，你們可能會更早說出這一點？

Well, I think that the difference for high NA, the most obvious difference is you're going to continue scaling. So you're going to get smaller defects and you're going to have new challenges associated with reticle qualification, and that takes the form both in the mass shop and (inaudible) and print check.

嗯，我認為高數值孔徑的區別，最明顯的區別是你將繼續縮放。因此，您將得到更小的缺陷，並且您將面臨與掩模版資格相關的新挑戰，這在大規模商店和（聽不清楚）和列印檢查中都採取形式。

So all those factors continue, but it's really an extension of the trends that we've seen. And when you get high NA, you'll get also just the mix will shift. You'll have some layers initially of high NA, and then you'll have others that are going to be the 0.33.

因此，所有這些因素仍在繼續，但這實際上是我們所看到的趨勢的延伸。當你獲得高 NA 時，你也會發現混合會改變。最初您將擁有一些高 NA 的層，然後您將擁有其他 0.33 的層。

I think what we're hearing and seeing from customers is very consistent with what we believed in terms of what HVM happens, we don't see any acceleration in the timing. If anything, there's the potential for a delay in terms of the HVM implementation. There will be characterization work happening before that.

我認為我們從客戶那裡聽到和看到的情況與我們對 HVM 發生的情況的看法非常一致，我們沒有看到時間上的任何加速。如果有什麼不同的話，那就是 HVM 的實施可能會出現延遲。在此之前將會進行特徵描述工作。

But like all technology transitions, we see the existing technology often extends longer and has more upgrades and is more cost effective. And that's what drives customers. Ultimately, it's about the economics.

但與所有技術轉型一樣，我們看到現有技術通常會延續更長的時間，進行更多的升級，並且更具成本效益。這就是驅動客戶的原因。歸根結底，這與經濟有關。

And so I think what will happen is if they can do that then they'll biased toward extending the life of the 0.33 and the efficacy of that in the leading edge. And then high NA comes after. So nothing's really changed in our view, no acceleration. If anything, a potential for some additional delay in the implementation.

因此，我認為如果他們能夠做到這一點，那麼他們將傾向於延長 0.33 的壽命以及前沿的功效。然後是高 NA。所以我們認為沒有什麼真正改變，沒有加速。如果有的話，那就是實施過程中可能會出現一些額外的延遲。

Got it. Thank you.

知道了。謝謝。

Krish Sankar, TD Cowen.

克里斯·桑卡爾，TD·考恩。

Yeah, hi, thanks for taking my question. I have two of them. First one is actually in China and Rick and Bren thanks to the insight on the China revenues. I just kind of wanted to ask the question a different way, one of your peers ASM International today said that China mature nodes are in a digesting mode and calendar Q1 was the peak.

是的，嗨，謝謝你提出我的問題。我有兩個。第一個實際上是在中國，感謝里克和布倫對中國收入的洞察。我只是想以不同的方式問這個問題，你的一位同行ASM International今天表示，中國成熟節點正處於消化模式，日曆第一季是高峰。

I'm kind of curious, are you seeing that and how to think about China sales into next year, especially given your long lead times, you might have a better insight than others? And also is that a factor in your gross margin down just a smidge in September quarter? And then I have a follow-up.

我有點好奇，你是否看到了這一點，以及如何考慮明年的中國銷售，特別是考慮到你的交貨時間很長，你可能比其他人有更好的洞察力？這也是導致你們九月季度毛利率略有下降的因素嗎？然後我有一個後續行動。

Yeah, Krish. On China, it looks like I said earlier, I think from a half-to-half point of view, it's relatively flat. So I don't see any real change. A lot of that's dependent on project timing, given the level of greenfield activity that we're seeing there.

是的，克里什。關於中國，就像我剛才說的，我認為從一半到一半的角度來看，它是比較平的。所以我沒有看到任何真正的改變。考慮到我們在那裡看到的綠地活動水平，其中很大一部分取決於專案時間。

As we move into next year, my early view on our business levels is more or less consistent with what we're seeing this year. I think when you look at the order funnel, but we have a backlog, what we have in deposits gives me some confidence in terms of what we see into next year.

當我們進入明年時，我對我們業務水平的早期看法或多或少與我們今年看到的情況一致。我認為，當你查看訂單管道時，我們有積壓訂單，我們的存款讓我對明年的情況充滿信心。

So I don't see a change obviously, the mix will be changing. There's infrastructure investments, that's obviously the logic, foundry, memory and so on. But from an overall level, it seems that it's pretty consistent year-to-year.

所以我沒有看到明顯的變化，混合將會改變。還有基礎建設投資，顯然是邏輯、代工、記憶體等。但從整體水準來看，每年的情況似乎相當一致。

On gross margin, while we outperformed in the June quarter was a little bit more than what we had initially modeled in the quarter. There's some adjustment that we're seeing in the September quarter from that. When you look at KLA gross margins, I talk a lot about product mix being the biggest driver of our gross margin in terms of variability quarter to quarter.

就毛利率而言，雖然我們在六月季度的表現優於我們最初在該季度建模的水平。我們在九月季度看到了一些調整。當您查看 KLA 毛利率時，我經常談到產品組合是我們毛利率逐季度變化的最大驅動因素。

It's not customer mix, is not region mix. It is the portfolio mix. And not all the products in our portfolio can carry the same margin profile, but also within the product families themselves, particularly when you're selling across multiple nodes with highly configurable systems, you're going to end up with that with very gross margin profile, even within the same product families.

這不是客戶組合，也不是地區組合。這是投資組合。並非我們產品組合中的所有產品都可以具有相同的利潤率，而且在產品系列本身內也是如此，特別是當您使用高度可配置的系統跨多個節點進行銷售時，您最終將獲得非常高的毛利率配置文件，即使在相同的產品系列中。

So it's really a function of that than it is anything else. And of course, you know that the June quarter was stronger, I did put the comments, which are very consistent with last quarter in terms of expectations for this year in the mid 61% range. That's our expectation.

所以它實際上是它的一個函數，而不是其他任何東西。當然，你知道 6 月季度的表現更為強勁，我確實發表了評論，這與上季度對今年的預期非常一致，在 61% 的中間範圍內。這是我們的期望。

And then moving forward, as we see the business continue to grow into '25, I think you'll see KLA's general incremental gross margin performance in and around that 65% incremental gross margin plus or minus as we move forward here. But in any given quarter could add a little bit of variability, but nothing that's different than what we usually see.

然後，隨著我們看到業務繼續增長到 25 年，我想您會看到 KLA 的總體增量毛利率表現在 65% 的增量毛利率上下，隨著我們在此前進。但在任何特定季度都可能會增加一些變化，但與我們通常看到的沒有什麼不同。

Got it, very helpful, Bren. And then just a follow-up on the advanced packaging. Thanks for the color. Like the $500 million run rate from $400 million like three months ago, is this really a function of the advanced packaging market growing?

明白了，非常有幫助，布倫。然後是高級封裝的後續工作。謝謝你的顏色。就像三個月前的 4 億美元運行率達到 5 億美元一樣，這真的是先進封裝市場成長的結果嗎？

Or are you like targeting newer markets like macro inspection, which I feel like your peers or your competitors are doing better than that. Are you like targeting those markets that's also helping some of this incremental revenue growth (inaudible) yield. And also kind of curious if you can extrapolate that into like panel level packaging, which is probably a few years out? Thank you.

或者您是否喜歡瞄準宏觀檢查等新市場，我覺得您的同行或競爭對手做得比這更好。您是否喜歡瞄準那些也有助於部分增量收入成長（聽不清楚）收益的市場？而且還有點好奇您是否可以將其推斷為類似面板級包裝（這可能需要幾年時間）？謝謝。

Yeah, I think there's no question that the package market is growing and it's for all the reasons that you hear. I think that there's been acceleration. And again, I mentioned earlier in the call that some of the gaps, if you think about what's going on overall with AI or packaging shortage related. So there's a lot of investment happening there.

是的，我認為毫無疑問包裝市場正在成長，這是出於您聽到的所有原因。我認為已經出現了加速。再說一次，我在電話會議之前提到過，如果你考慮一下人工智慧或包裝短缺相關的整體情況，你會發現一些差距。所以那裡發生了大量的投資。

It's not just macro. It's what historically would have been considered pretty advanced lithography, not that -- inspection not that many years ago because the design rules and the yield and what's at risk, cost-wise, it's much higher.

這不僅僅是宏觀的。這在歷史上被認為是相當先進的光刻技術，而不是很多年前的檢查，因為設計規則和良率以及面臨的風險，成本方面，它要高得多。

Many years ago when we bought a company and started doing packaging, one of our customers ask, why are you even bothering, this is not a KLA market. What happened in the last year is now customers are saying we need your capability that you have in the front end to be applied into some of our advanced packaging challenges and accelerated workshops with us talking about that accelerated product roadmaps and a lot of customer excitement and interest.

許多年前，當我們收購一家公司並開始包裝時，我們的一位客戶問，為什麼還要費心，這不是 KLA 市場。去年發生的事情現在客戶說我們需要您在前端擁有的能力應用於我們的一些先進包裝挑戰和加速研討會，我們談論加速的產品路線圖和許多客戶的興奮和興趣。

So they're driving it very hard because they have shortages. And it's really across many of our products, both in our processing but also in our process control. So it's been significant to see the growth and the speed of it. As we said, that's the annualized -- that's the annual number for calendar '24. But we'd expect that trend to continue toward growth in '25 and beyond.

所以他們非常努力地推動這一進程，因為他們有短缺。它確實存在於我們的許多產品中，無論是在我們的加工過程中，還是在我們的製程控制中。因此，看到它的增長和速度非常重要。正如我們所說，這是年化的——即日曆 '24 的年度數字。但我們預計這種趨勢將在 25 年及以後繼續增長。

And most of our growth has been more on the logic side. And I think one of the things we're excited about moving forward is that as you move in high bandwidth memory to hybrid bonding techniques, they do increase the complexity of the process a fair amount.

我們的大部分成長更多地集中在邏輯方面。我認為我們對前進感到興奮的一件事是，當您將高頻寬記憶體轉向混合綁定技術時，它們確實會相當大地增加過程的複雜性。

And as you know, the KLA position in the market is one of higher value offerings supporting more complexity. And so we're encouraged by what those opportunities might look like as we get out into the '26 and '27 time frame.

如您所知，KLA 在市場中的地位是支持更高複雜性的更高價值產品之一。因此，當我們進入 26 和 27 年的時間框架時，這些機會可能會是什麼樣子，我們對此感到鼓舞。

Obviously the industry's thinking a lot about what's next in terms of panel level packaging and so on. And so there's obviously R&D that goes into that. But so that's work that we will be doing in the company. And so I think that those opportunities to Rick's point are just showcasing. I think what the options that are available in this part of the market over the next several years.

顯然，業界對面板級封裝等方面的下一步發展進行了許多思考。顯然，這需要研發。但這就是我們將在公司做的工作。所以我認為，對瑞克來說，這些機會只是展示而已。我認為未來幾年這部分市場有哪些可用的選擇。

Just one final point. Some of our customers -- our competitors are coming at this from a lower end. And in many cases, the requirements are at the top end of their capability. And so what we're hearing from customers is even though in some cases they're buying our systems. What are at the bottom end of our capability, what they also want is the roadmap.

最後一點。我們的一些客戶－我們的競爭對手是從低端進入的。在許多情況下，這些要求已經達到了他們能力的極限。因此，我們從客戶那裡聽到的是，儘管在某些情況下他們購買了我們的系統。我們能力的底端是什麼，他們也想要的是路線圖。

So I think they want the ability to buy that capability now with the expectation and the knowledge that they can upgrade it over time as their requirements continue because you are now with that packaging, there's no question that road map is going to look more like a traditional scaling road map going forward.

因此，我認為他們希望現在能夠購買該功能，並期望並知道隨著時間的推移，隨著他們的需求繼續，他們可以升級它，因為你現在有了這種包裝，毫無疑問，路線圖將看起來更像是傳統的擴展路線圖正在向前推進。

Gotcha. It's future proofing. Thanks Rick, thanks Bren. Very helpful. Thank you.

明白了。這是面向未來的。謝謝瑞克，謝謝布倫。很有幫助。謝謝。

Thanks Krish.

謝謝克里什。

Joe Quatrochi, Wells Fargo.

喬·夸特羅奇，富國銀行。

Yeah, thanks for taking the question. I just want to kind of understand, I think looking at the guide for the second quarter and thinking about sequential growth into the December quarter, is it more fair to assume now you're kind of thinking about low double-digit half-on-half growth rate for the calendar year relative to the high single digit last quarter that you talked about?

是的，感謝您提出問題。我只是想了解一下，我認為看看第二季度的指南並考慮到 12 月季度的連續增長，假設現在您正在考慮低兩位數的半增長是否更公平？的高個位數成長率，日曆年的成長率是多少？

And then kind of dovetailing on that, I think last quarter you talked about process control systems mixes being closer to like 70% for foundry, logic. Is that maybe a bit higher than that now?

然後，與此相吻合的是，我認為上個季度您談到製程控制系統混合對於鑄造、邏輯來說接近 70%。是不是比現在稍微高一點？

Yeah, so on those fronts, so again, I don't want to guide December, but I think high single digit, low double digit is probably the right way to think about our performance for the year overall. So I think that as we saw in June relative to the expectations we had a few months ago, we did better than we thought September guide was higher, certainly higher what consensus was.

是的，在這些方面，我不想指導 12 月，但我認為高個位數、低兩位數可能是考慮我們全年整體表現的正確方法。因此，我認為，正如我們在 6 月看到的，相對於幾個月前的預期，我們的表現比我們想像的要好，9 月的指導值更高，當然也高於共識。

So I think the incremental optimism I talked about earlier in the funnel is revealing in some incremental growth here through the second half of the year. When I look at the overall mix of business, I think that foundry, logic, is likely closer to 75%. So last year it was 70%, 30% or approximate semiconductor with process shipments to revenue to semiconductor customers. It's closer to 75%, 25% and 24%. But we'll see how that ends up.

因此，我認為我之前在漏斗中談到的增量樂觀情緒正在揭示今年下半年的一些增量成長。當我查看整體業務組合時，我認為邏輯代工可能接近 75%。因此，去年半導體客戶的製程出貨量佔收入的比例為 70%、30% 或近似。接近 75%、25% 和 24%。但我們會看看結果如何。

Perfect. That's helpful. And then as a follow up. In the N3 strength you're talking about, and given the lead times for Gen 4, Gen 5, I mean, is that going to kind of enter the model in terms of demand into next year? Is that how we should think about that? Or can some of those tools be pulled into 2024?

完美的。這很有幫助。然後作為後續行動。在您談論的 N3 強度中，考慮到第 4 代、第 5 代的交付時間，我的意思是，這是否會在明年的需求方面進入該模型？我們該這樣思考嗎？或者其中一些工具可以拖到 2024 年嗎？

Well, we are seeing more capacity come online. Those are products where we've been supply constraints, certainly around Gen 4. So as new capacity comes online, I think is one of the challenges for us, frankly, back in 2023, as we were limited and as we move through this year from a quarterly run rate point of view, we are getting incremental supply.

嗯，我們看到更多的容量上線。這些產品我們一直受到供應限制，尤其是在第4 代左右。受到限制，而且隨著我們今年的發展從季度運行率的角度來看，我們正在獲得增量供應。

And that given the supply constraints and at the level of demand, we are seeing growth there and would expect to see that continue into next year. So I'm fairly bullish on that part of the business growing faster than the overall market, both this year and next year.

考慮到供應限制和需求水平，我們看到了那裡的成長，並預計這種情況會持續到明年。因此，我相當看好這部分業務今年和明年的成長速度都快於整體市場。

So I think that's one of those areas that I said earlier about our relative confidence in terms of share of the overall market is our presence in certain markets that are growing extremely fast relative to the overall and certainly high end wafer inspection is one of those.

因此，我認為這就是我之前所說的關於我們對整個市場份額的相對信心的領域之一，那就是我們在某些​​市場的存在，這些市場相對於整體而言增長得非常快，當然高端晶圓檢查就是其中之一。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Toshiya Hari, Goldman Sachs.

Toshiya Hari，高盛。

Hi. Thank you so much for taking the question. I wanted to double click on China and what you're seeing in the region. You guys gave a lot of color in terms of what you're expecting for the overall geo. But by application, any standouts, as you think about DRAM, foundry, other applications or maybe by customer type, mask making, wafer making, et cetera, whether it be trends you saw in the first half or you think about the flattish outlook in the second half and you stand out to the positive side or the negative side?

你好。非常感謝您提出這個問題。我想雙擊中國以及您在該地區看到的情況。你們對整體地理的期望給了許多色彩。但從應用來看，任何突出的應用，當你想到DRAM、代工、其他應用，或者可能是客戶類型、掩模製造、晶圓製造等時，無論是你在上半年看到的趨勢，還是你想到的平淡前景，下半場你表現出正面的一面還是負面的一面？

DRAM is strong in the first half and will be in the second half. I would expect that that wafers probably a little weaker. I think on the reticle side, it is a little bit stronger. And then foundry, logic is stronger, offsetting the weaker memory.

DRAM上半年表現強勁，下半年也將如此。我預計晶圓可能會弱一些。我認為在十字線方面，它更強一些。然後代工，邏輯性更強，抵消了記憶力較弱的地方。

Some weakness in automotive.

汽車領域的一些弱點。

Got it. Thank you. And then as a follow-up on your services business. You guys grew 14% year over year and you're outperforming your peers and I think that's off of a higher base relative to your peers too. So really good to see that.

知道了。謝謝。然後作為您的服務業務的後續行動。你們的業績年增了 14%，而且你們的表現優於同行，我認為相對於你們的同行來說，這個基礎也較高。很高興看到這一點。

You talked about growing towards the high end for the remainder of the year. If I'm not mistaken, is that just simply, you know, utilization rates across your customer base improving or is there more to it. And as a quick follow-up, is 12% to 14% still the right range?

您談到了在今年剩餘時間內向高端發展的情況。如果我沒記錯的話，這只是簡單地說，你知道，整個客戶群的使用率在提高，還是有更多的原因。作為快速跟進，12% 到 14% 仍然是正確的範圍嗎？

Yeah. So utilization rates are certainly a factor. So we've seen those steadily improve across all segments with the course of this year. So that's been a driver of incremental revenue. The other thing, and we had pretty good visibility to this was the shipments that we have -- or the tools that we shifted '21 and '22 have come off of warranty and gone into contract.

是的。因此，利用率肯定是一個因素。因此，我們看到今年所有細分市場的情況都在穩步改善。所以這是增量收入的驅動力。另一件事，我們對此有很好的了解，那就是我們的發貨量，或者說我們在 21 和 22 年轉移的工具已經過了保固期並簽訂了合約。

In our contract (inaudible) rate is about 95%. So those tools go off of warranty and into contract, that's the driver. So we've had pretty good visibility into the service business. We had a headwind from FX because you do have some of the service revenue denominated in local currency, particularly in Japan.

在我們的合約中（聽不清楚）比率約為 95%。因此，這些工具將不再保固並進入合同，這就是驅動因素。所以我們對服務業務有很好的了解。我們遇到了來自外匯的阻力，因為確實有一些以當地貨幣計價的服務收入，特別是在日本。

So there's been some headwinds to the growth rate, frankly. But yeah, we're trending towards that 14% sort of top part of the guidance range. And I think for the mark, the target we put out there. And I think as we go in the next couple of years, I feel like we're closer to the top end of the range than the bottom end of the range.

坦白說，成長率存在一些阻力。但是，是的，我們正朝著指導範圍頂部 14% 的方向發展。我認為對於標記，我們在那裡設定的目標。我認為，隨著我們在未來幾年的發展，我覺得我們更接近該範圍的頂端，而不是該範圍的底端。

Thank you Toshiya.

謝謝你，俊哉。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Joe Moore, Morgan Stanley.

喬摩爾，摩根士丹利。

Great. Thank you. I also had a couple of China follow-ups. In one point, you would had a pretty sizable multinational business in China. Is the business today mostly dominated by the China sovereigns, I assume?

偉大的。謝謝。我還有一些中國的後續行動。曾經，你在中國擁有相當規模的跨國業務。我想，今天的產業主要是由中國主權國家主導的嗎？

Yes. We are a very little multinational business in China.

是的。我們在中國是一家規模很小的跨國企業。

Okay. And then on the China sovereign side, I mean, having seen that business shift to more of a trailing edge focus, what's happened to process control intensity? And you seem to be keeping pace with all of your competitors in terms of China exposure. So you seem to be doing quite well. I might have thought that the process control intensity would drop off given the focus on lagging edge technology.

好的。然後，在中國主權方面，我的意思是，在看到業務轉向更多的後緣焦點後，流程控制強度發生了什麼變化？在中國業務方面，你們似乎與所有競爭對手保持同步。所以你看起來做得很好。我可能認為，鑑於對落後技術的關注，過程控制強度會下降。

Sure, it's definitely not as high as what you would see on leading edge. But often in the case if you have small relatively size wise small sites, then you're not really up against the percent against a huge number of wafer starts. So that's one factor The other factor is some of the infrastructure that people are adding in terms of whether it's mask shops or wafer. So in aggregate, that's why it's for us pretty much help serve.

當然，它絕對沒有您在前沿看到的那麼高。但通常情況下，如果您擁有相對較小的小型站點，那麼您實際上無法對抗大量晶圓啟動的百分比。這是一個因素，另一個因素是人們增加的一些基礎設施，無論是掩模車間還是晶圓。所以總的來說，這就是為什麼它對我們有很大的幫助服務。

Thank you for the update.

謝謝你的更新。

And Joe, on the multinational question, I mean, most of that business is service, right? We're not really -- there's no real equipment business that's happening with our multinational customers there, but there's service activity supporting those fabs.

喬，關於跨國問題，我的意思是，大部分業務都是服務，對吧？我們實際上並沒有與我們的跨國客戶發生真正的設備業務，但有支援這些晶圓廠的服務活動。

Got it. Okay. Thank you so much.

知道了。好的。太感謝了。

Srini Pajjuri.

斯里尼·帕朱里。

Thank you. Hi, guys. Couple of longer -- actually one question about 2025 WFE. And Rick, obviously demand is improving across the board, in China is stable. So that makes sense that WFE will grow next year. I'm just wondering in terms of your assumptions, what sort of assumptions are you making as far as the chips money is concerned because the checks seems to be coming in second half. Just wondering if you are getting any explicit signals from your customers that, that money is being spent in 2025?

謝謝。嗨，大家好。幾個更長的問題——實際上是一個關於 2025 年 WFE 的問題。瑞克，顯然需求正在全面改善，在中國是穩定的。因此，WFE 明年的成長是有道理的。我只是想知道你的假設，就籌碼而言，你做了什麼樣的假設，因為支票似乎會在下半年到來。只是想知道您是否從客戶那裡得到任何明確的信號，表明這筆錢將在 2025 年花掉？

Yeah. Our forecast are entirely independent of any (inaudible) money. There's no dependence on that. That if our customers receive that, it's going to be -- they're going to be getting it what they tell us is to offset cost of building fabs in places that are more expensive, but it's not contributing to -- They're going to build capacity based on demand.

是的。我們的預測完全獨立於任何（聽不清楚）資金。對此沒有依賴性。如果我們的客戶收到了，他們會得到他們告訴我們的東西，以抵消在更昂貴的地方建造晶圓廠的成本，但這並沒有做出貢獻 - 他們會根據需求進行能力建設。

The demand is going to be based on their market and the overall market, and then they'll buy equipment accordingly. But we're not counting on our customers get (inaudible) money to make our plans.

需求將基於他們的市場和整體市場，然後他們會相應地購買設備。但我們並不指望我們的客戶獲得（聽不清楚）錢來制定我們的計劃。

Okay. Thank you. And then more of a technology question, Rick. I time-to-time get questions about APMI for mask inspection. My understanding is that you guys were involved in that market and maybe exited at some point. I'm just curious, maybe I'm wrong here, but I just want to get your thoughts on that as to how you're approaching that, you know, market and what your strategy for that market is.

好的。謝謝。還有更多的技術問題，瑞克。我時常收到有關用於遮罩檢查的 APMI 的問題。我的理解是，你們參與了那個市場，也許在某個時候退出了。我只是很好奇，也許我錯了，但我只是想了解您對如何接近這個市場以及您對該市場的策略是什麼的想法。

Yeah, we have not -- we're heavily involved in the reticle market. It's a market that really we started company with and we're still involved in it heavily. The question on do you need actinic inspection for reticles has been a long debate that we've had and our conclusion based on all the analysis that we've seen is the real market need for that is when high NA gets introduced because of the existing technology nodes, there's really three ways to deal with the problems.

是的，我們沒有——我們大量涉足光罩市場。我們確實是從這個市場起步的，而且我們仍然積極參與其中。關於光罩版是否需要光化檢查的問題一直是我們長期爭論的問題，基於我們所看到的所有分析，我們得出的結論是真正的市場需求，即由於現有技術而引入高 NA 的情況。技術節點，確實有三種方法可以解決問題。

One is the challenges of reticle quality. One is the flagship product line that we've had for a long time. This 6xx, and extensions to that. The other one has an e-beam product that we've talked about that's being used for very high resolution. And right now it's the highest sensitivity reticle inspection tools still. With our customers, we're still in the characterization of that tool, that's the 8xx.

一是掩模版品質的挑戰。一是我們長期以來的旗艦產品線。這個 6xx 及其擴充。另一個有我們已經討論過的電子束產品，它用於非常高解析度。目前它仍然是靈敏度最高的掩模版檢查工具。對於我們的客戶，我們仍然在描述該工具，即 8xx。

And then the last one is printing onto wafers and verifying the goodness of the reticles, and that's what we're using -- basically using the Gen 5 print check application for. When it comes to investment in the actinic or the product that we've identified for high NA, we're pretty confident of our ability to intercept the high (inaudible) volume manufacturing of high NA, which is still some years away.

最後一項是在晶圓上列印並驗證掩模版的質量，這就是我們正在使用的內容——基本上使用 Gen 5 列印檢查應用程式。當談到對光化或我們已確定的高 NA 產品的投資時，我們對攔截高 NA 的高（聽不清楚）批量生產的能力非常有信心，這仍然需要幾年的時間。

Thank you, very helpful.

謝謝你，非常有幫助。

Brian Chin, Stifel.

布萊恩·欽，斯蒂菲爾。

Hi, good afternoon. Thanks for letting us ask a few questions. Rick, you talked about the inflections and sequential and year-over-year revenue growth. Are we also seeing this in terms of bookings? And did your 12-month shippable RPO increase this quarter?

嗨，下午好。感謝您讓我們問幾個問題。里克，您談到了收入的變化以及連續和同比收入增長。我們在預訂方面也看到了這一點嗎？本季您的 12 個月可交付 RPO 是否有增加？

And so we'll have all the specifics on that in the 10-K that we'll file here in another week or two. It was pretty close to flat, down about $70 million quarter on quarter. So pretty flattish compared to last quarter. I think given what we're seeing in the funnel, I would expect you're likely to probably over the next few quarters, you'll start to see it increase. But yeah, just slightly down from last quarter.

因此，我們將在 10-K 中提供有關該問題的所有詳細信息，我們將在一兩週後在此提交。季度環比下降約 7000 萬美元，幾乎持平。與上季相比相當平淡。我認為考慮到我們在漏斗中看到的情況，我預計您可能會在接下來的幾個季度中開始看到它的成長。但是，是的，比上季度略有下降。

Okay. That's helpful. And then I guess you've made a lot of disclosures in the past couple of calls about advanced packaging and you saw the step up on the year forecast over the past three months. Can you sort of ballpark how large the advanced packaging process control TAM is?

好的。這很有幫助。然後我想您在過去幾次有關先進封裝的電話中披露了很多信息，並且您看到了過去三個月的年度預測的進步。您能大概估算一下先進封裝製程控制 TAM 的規模有多大嗎？

You're probably not at your kind of typical on average 50%, 60% market share in process control overall. But yeah, but maybe a sense of what where the starting point is now and obviously you're sure you expect the market to grow and probably your share as well in the years ahead?

在整個製程控制領域，您可能還沒有達到典型的平均 50%、60% 的市佔率。但是，是的，但也許知道現在的起點在哪裡，顯然您確信您預計市場會成長，並且您的份額可能也會在未來幾年增長？

I'll let Bren deal with the specifics. This is Rick. But it's not just process control for us, It's also process tools because of the SPTS acquisition we did about five years ago.

我會讓布倫處理具體細節。這是瑞克。但這對我們來說不僅僅是製程控制，它也是製程工具，因為我們大約五年前收購了 SPTS。

Yeah. Look, we are right now our view is that this part of the market will grow faster than overall WFE. So if you look in the long run, we expect WFE over the next few years, the capital intensity slowly rising to grow a little bit faster than semiconductor revenue that this part of the market will likely grow faster than that. So that's the only quantifying we've done at this point.

是的。看，我們現在的觀點是，這部分市場的成長速度將快於整個 WFE。因此，如果從長遠來看，我們預計 WFE 在未來幾年內，資本密集度會慢慢上升，其成長速度將比半導體收入成長快一點，這部分市場可能會比這成長得更快。這是我們目前所做的唯一量化。

To Rick's point, we have a broad portfolio. We're seeing parts of it on the inspection side, move up market, but we also sell a number of process tools. We also sell some chemical process control capability as well. So we're approaching this market in multiple ways.

就里克而言，我們擁有廣泛的產品組合。我們看到它的一部分在檢查方面，向高端市場發展，但我們也銷售一些工藝工具。我們也出售一些化學製程控制能力。因此，我們正在以多種方式進入這個市場。

And like I said, I think that as we talked about earlier in the memory part of the market as it relates to HBM, we think we're better positioned relative to some of the technology transitions that are coming in terms of our share opportunity moving forward.

正如我所說，我認為正如我們之前討論的與 HBM 相關的市場內存部分，我們認為相對於我們的份額機會移動方面即將到來的一些技術轉型，我們處於更好的位置向前。

Good, great. Thank you.

好，太好了。謝謝。

Blayne Curtis, Jefferies.

布萊恩·柯蒂斯，杰弗里斯。

Thanks for taking my question. I want to ask on the outlook for EPC. I think you were looking for growth last time, but it came in a little bit below. Just curious since we've gone through all the calendar '24 forecast, if you could update that one.

感謝您提出我的問題。我想問一下EPC的前景。我認為您上次正在尋求增長，但增長速度略低。只是好奇，因為我們已經瀏覽了 24 年曆的所有預測，您是否可以更新該預測。

Yeah. On specialty semiconductor quarter to quarter, it dipped a little bit in the June quarter, but that's more of a timing issue. I think our expectation in that business is still some modest growth for the year. That has -- that business has a pretty diversified market exposure. And as power semi related automotive has come down, we've seen packaging pickup, but there's a little bit of a dip in June but recovers and has a much stronger second half.

是的。在特種半導體季度與季度之間，六月季度略有下降，但這更多是一個時間問題。我認為我們對該業務的預期今年仍將適度成長。該業務擁有相當多元化的市場曝險。隨著與功率半導體相關的汽車業的下滑，我們看到包裝業的回升，但六月略有下降，但下半年有所復甦，表現強勁。

Flat panel business is where we announced our exit of that. And so we still have revenue in our plans for that as we exit that business and would expect into manufacturing likely Q1 of 2025. On the PCB front, which is more consumer centric, we still have -- that market's been relatively sluggish. It's improved a bit but not much. And that's obviously tied much more to mobility, and so improvements into the future as we see more cell phone unit growth will drive that business.

平板業務是我們宣布退出的地方。因此，當我們退出該業務時，我們的計劃中仍然有收入，並預計可能在 2025 年第一季開始生產。改善了一點，但幅度不大。這顯然與行動性有更多的聯繫，因此，隨著我們看到更多的手機銷售成長，未來的改進將推動該業務。

Now, that business had a very strong '21 and into '22, a lot of capacity added during that COVID period. And so the industry has still working off some of that capacity. Now in that business, we do have service exposure.

現在，該業務在 21 年表現非常強勁，進入 22 年，在新冠疫情期間增加了大量產能。因此，該行業仍在發揮部分產能。現在，在這項業務中，我們確實有服務曝光。

So we have pretty good contract penetration in the PCB world. So while the systems business has been slower, there have been service contributions from a revenue point of view that we've had over the last year or so. But I don't think that overall, the aggregate part of that businesses is up. A few points year to year, I think it's you call low to mid-single digits.

因此，我們在 PCB 領域的合約滲透率相當高。因此，雖然系統業務成長緩慢，但從收入的角度來看，我們在過去一年左右的時間裡還是做出了服務貢獻。但我認為總體而言，這些業務的整體部分並未上升。每年都有幾個點，我認為這是你所說的低到中個位數。

Thanks. And then I just wanted to ask you, I know there's been a couple of questions on China. I heard from others that you're hearing less new names, and I think the thought was maybe would be more buildout of facilities that were already in process.

謝謝。然後我想問你們，我知道有幾個關於中國的問題。我從其他人那裡聽說，你聽到的新名字越來越少，我認為可能是對已經在建的設施進行更多擴建。

You talked about greenfields there and obviously there's another slug of money potentially coming in. So as you look out a year more and just kind of curious how you think about that frenzy we had before of all these new names that you never heard of before creating companies. Are you seeing any view that might come back.

你談到了那裡的綠地，顯然還有另一筆資金可能會進來。 因此，當你再觀察一年時，你會好奇你如何看待我們之前對所有這些你在創建之前從未聽說過的新名字的狂熱公司。您是否看到任何可能回來的景色？

Well, there's still some new business from new customers. The other thing that's happening in China, as you do see investment from our mature legacy customers in China. And so where we've been engaged in supporting those customers for many, many years, and their businesses are typically driven by supplying for specific markets and in response to expectations of demand moving forward.

嗯，新客戶仍然有一些新業務。中國正在發生的另一件事，你確實看到了我們在中國成熟的傳統客戶的投資。因此，我們多年來一直致力於為這些客戶提供支持，他們的業務通常是透過為特定市場供貨並響應未來需求的預期來驅動的。

So you do have had those customers also investing more here, I think moving forward. And then you do move into second phases with certain ones, but there's also some new ones too. So it's a pretty broad mix as I look at the remainder of this year and into next year.

所以我認為，這些客戶確實也在這裡進行了更多投資。然後你確實進入了某些階段的第二階段，但也有一些新的階段。因此，當我展望今年剩餘時間和明年時，這是一個相當廣泛的組合。

Gotcha. Thank you.

明白了。謝謝。

Tim Arcuri, UBS.

提姆‧阿庫裡，瑞銀集團。

Thanks. I had two. So Bren, my question on China. So there's been some recent news, obviously, the US diplomatic Commerce is trying to use the foreign (inaudible) against some of the non-US suppliers. And it would kind of suggest that maybe there's some forthcoming news that there's a reason why they would want to use the FDPR, like maybe some entity list addition.

謝謝。我有兩個。布倫，我關於中國的問題。所以最近有一些消息，顯然，美國外交商務部正試圖利用外國（聽不清楚）來對付一些非美國供應商。這有點表明，也許有一些即將發布的消息表明他們想要使用 FDPR 是有原因的，例如可能會添加一些實體清單。

So how do you think about that. I know it's kind of hard to even, you know, handicap your guidance for that, and I assume that you're not accounting for that at all because you don't even know like wonder if that's going to come, but how do you kind of think about that and what the likelihood is and how do you even handicap for it?

那麼你對此有何看法呢？我知道這很難，你知道，妨礙你對此的指導，而且我認為你根本沒有考慮到這一點，因為你甚至不知道那是否會發生，但你怎麼做想一想這個問題的可能性是什麼，以及你如何阻止它？

Yeah, Tim, I mean, there's been a lot of news for some time. And so you're right, I can't participate here in speculation and hypotheticals about what could or could not happen. So we will continue to assess. We work very closely with the US government. Of course, we do everything we need to do in the company to be in compliance.

是的，提姆，我的意思是，一段時間以來有很多新聞。所以你是對的，我不能在這裡參與關於可能發生或不可能發生的事情的猜測和假設。所以我們會繼續評估。我們與美國政府密切合作。當然，我們會在公司中盡一切努力遵守規定。

We will follow the laws we do and we'll support our customers as well within the confines of whatever the regulations are. So if and when something happens, we'll assess the impact and let you know what the impact is in sort of the near term and what might be over the long term.

我們將遵守我們所遵守的法律，並在任何法規的範圍內為我們的客戶提供支援。因此，如果發生某些事情，我們將評估其影響，並讓您了解短期影響和長期影響。

Well one of the things we've talked about a lot, Tim, and I know you know this is the because of where we are with AI drivers, we're seeing an acceleration at the leading edge. So if we think about what's really going to propel our business going forward, it's not so much the legacy, which has been maybe overrepresented on historical levels last few years.

提姆，我們經常談論的事情之一，我知道你知道這是因為我們在人工智慧驅動程式方面，我們看到了前沿的加速。因此，如果我們思考什麼真正會推動我們的業務向前發展，那麼遺產並不是什麼，過去幾年遺產的代表性可能在歷史水平上被過高了。

But it's the stuff we're seeing right now, especially at the leading edge in terms of leading edge foundry. And that's been driving a lot of our business and our expectations around what we're seeing at N3 and N2, plus packaging plus we're seeing in HBM. So if I think about '25, '26, those are going to be the things that drive KLA drive our performance and should drive good opportunities for our investors.

但這就是我們現在看到的東西，特別是在領先的代工方面。這推動了我們的許多業務和我們對 N3 和 N2 的期望，以及我們在 HBM 中看到的包裝。因此，如果我考慮“25”、“26”，這些將成為推動 KLA 推動我們業績的因素，並為我們的投資者帶來良好的機會。

And if you go back to 2022, 75% plus of our business was what we'll call leading-edge advanced design rules, 20 nanometer or below. So with the expectation of a ramp into next year from our more leading-edge customers on the logic and memory side, we think that, that's going to drive the hundreds of our business as we move over the course of next year and beyond.

如果你回到 2022 年，我們 75% 以上的業務都是我們所謂的前沿先進設計規則，即 20 奈米或以下。因此，隨著我們在邏輯和記憶體方面更領先的客戶預計明年將迎來成長，我們認為，隨著我們在明年及以後的發展，這將推動我們數百項業務的發展。

Okay. And then last thing. So book-to-bill based on the RPO, book-to-bill was just a touch below [1]. So this is the seventh quarter that it's been below [1]. And it sounds like you think book-to-bill is going to start to drift up actually that we're going to finally start to be above [1].

好的。最後一件事。因此，基於 RPO 的訂單到帳單，訂單到帳單僅略低於 [1]。所以這是低於 [1] 的第七個季度。聽起來你認為訂單出貨量將開始上升，實際上我們最終將開始高於 [1]。

So is there some dynamic where it seems like there was this massive slug of bookings that happened back in mid '22, and we've been kind of shipping off of that ever since. And are we kind of getting to a point now where you think that customers are kind of coming back in there and we can begin to see book-to-bill start to drift above one where we can start to not just be chipping off of this big slug of orders in middle of 2022?

那麼，是否存在一些動態，似乎早在 22 年中期就發生了大量預訂，從那時起我們就一直在擺脫這種情況。我們現在是否已經到了這樣一個地步：你認為客戶正在回來，我們可以開始看到訂單到賬單開始漂移到我們可以開始不僅僅是削減這一點的地步2022 年中期會有大量訂單嗎？

Yeah, I think based on the funnel that we will see -- I think the order profile looks pretty good. Now orders are not always indicative of what's going on given the number of customers and the size of the orders. And then when it comes to KLA, even the size of the ASPs of certain types of products.

是的，我認為根據我們將看到的漏斗 - 我認為訂單概況看起來相當不錯。現在，考慮到客戶數量和訂單規模，訂單並不總是能夠表明正在發生的情況。然後，當談到 KLA 時，甚至是某些類型產品的 ASP 規模。

But all that being said, yeah, it went from about $13 billion at its peak in terms of RPO down to just sub $10 million today. So it's still quite large. But I would expect that moving forward that at least over the next couple of quarters it looks that the order profile looks decent. So yeah, I think that's a reasonable way to see it.

但話雖如此，是的，以 RPO 計算，它從高峰時的約 130 億美元下降到了今天的不到 1000 萬美元。所以規模還蠻大的。但我預計，至少在接下來的幾個季度裡，訂單情況看起來不錯。所以是的，我認為這是合理的看法。

Thank you, Tim.

謝謝你，提姆。

I will now turn the floor back over to Kevin Kessel for any additional or closing remarks.

現在我將把發言權交還給凱文·凱塞爾，請他發表補充或結束語。

All right. On behalf of KLA, we appreciate your time and your interest. We'll be seeing many of you throughout this quarter at different conferences. If you have any follow-up questions, please do reach out to the KLA Investor Relations team. With that, I'll turn it back to the operator to conclude the call.

好的。我們謹代表 KLA，感謝您的寶貴時間和關注。本季我們將在不同的會議上見到你們中的許多人。如果您有任何後續問題，請聯絡 KLA 投資者關係團隊。這樣，我會將其轉回給接線員以結束通話。

This concludes the KLA Corporation June quarter 2024 earnings call and webcast. Please disconnect your line at this time and have a wonderful day.

KLA Corporation 2024 年 6 月季度財報電話會議和網路廣播到此結束。請此時斷開您的線路，祝您有美好的一天。