Kingstone Companies Inc (KINS) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the Kingstone Company's first quarter 2025 earnings conference call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. It's now my pleasure to introduce Karin Daly, Vice President, The Equity Group and Kingstone's Investor Relations representative. Karin, you may begin.

您好，歡迎參加金士頓公司 2025 年第一季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）提醒一下，本次會議正在錄音。現在我很高興介紹 Equity Group 副總裁兼金士頓投資者關係代表 Karin Daly。卡琳，你可以開始了。

Thank you, Melissa, and good morning, everyone. Joining us on the call today will be President and Chief Executive Officer, Meryl Golden. On behalf of the company, I would like to note that this conference call may include forward-looking statements, which involve known and unknown risks, uncertainties, and other factors that cause actual results to be materially different from projected results.

謝謝你，梅麗莎，大家早安。總裁兼執行長 Meryl Golden 將參加今天的電話會議。我代表公司指出，本次電話會議可能包含前瞻性陳述，其中涉及已知和未知的風險、不確定性以及導致實際結果與預測結果有重大差異的其他因素。

Forward-looking statements speak only as of the date on which they are made, and Kingstone undertakes no obligation to update the information discussed. For more information, please refer to the section entitled Risk Factors in Part 1 Item 1A of the company's latest Form 10-K.

前瞻性陳述僅代表其作出之日的觀點，金士頓不承擔更新所討論資訊的義務。欲了解更多信息，請參閱公司最新的10-K表格第1部分第1A項中“風險因素”部分。

Additionally, today's remarks may include references to non-GAAP measures. For a reconciliation of these non-GAAP measures to GAAP figures, please see the tables in the latest earnings release. With that, it's my pleasure to turn the call over to Meryl Golden. Meryl?

此外，今天的演講可能涉及非公認會計準則衡量指標。有關這些非 GAAP 指標與 GAAP 數據的對照表，請參閱最新收益報告中的表格。說完這些，我很高興將電話轉給梅莉爾‧戈爾登 (Meryl Golden)。梅麗爾？

Thanks, Karen. Good morning, everyone, and thanks for joining our call. I'm delighted to share the results of our sixth consecutive quarter of profitability with 18% direct written premium growth overall, including 23% growth in our quarter and net income of $3.9 million or $0.27 per diluted share.

謝謝，凱倫。大家早安，感謝大家參加我們的電話會議。我很高興與大家分享我們連續第六個季度盈利的成果，直接承保保費總體增長 18%，其中本季度增長 23%，淨收入為 390 萬美元，即每股攤薄收益 0.27 美元。

As a Northeast writer, the first quarter is typically the least profitable quarter for the company and we were fortunate to have experienced another mild winter this quarter, which contributed to these terrific results. As always, I want to thank the great Kingstone team for their hard work and our Select producers for their commitment to the company.

身為東北作家，第一季通常是公司利潤最低的季度，我們很幸運本季又經歷了一個溫和的冬天，這有助於取得這些出色的表現。一如既往，我要感謝偉大的金士頓團隊的辛勤工作以及我們精選生產商對公司的承諾。

I'd like to start by providing more insight into the renewal rights transaction we announced a few weeks ago with AmGUARD, a subsidiary of Berkshire Hathaway. You might recall that last year, around the same time that the withdrawal of Adirondack and Mountain Valley from New York was announced.

首先，我想更深入地介紹我們幾週前與波克夏海瑟威子公司 AmGUARD 宣布的續約權交易。您可能還記得，去年大約在同一時間，阿迪朗達克和山谷地區宣布退出紐約。

We mentioned that a third company had also announced their intention to withdraw from the admitted homeowners market nationally and had signed a renewal rights deal with Foremost, a farmer subsidiary. AmGUARD's withdraw plan was never approved by the New York regulator, as Foremost underwriting appetite in Downstate New York was too restrictive. This created the opportunity for Kingstone to replace Foremost and execute a renewal rights agreement for the business in Downstate New York.

我們提到，第三家公司也宣布打算退出全國範圍內的准入房主市場，並與農民子公司 Foremost 簽署了續約權協議。由於 Foremost 在紐約州南部的承保意願過於嚴格，AmGUARD 的退出計劃從未獲得紐約監管機構的批准。這為金士頓取代 Foremost 並為紐約州下州的業務簽署續約權協議創造了機會。

AmGUARD's withdrawal plan with Kingstone as the replacement carrier has now been approved by the New York regulators and we expect to start quoting the business in late third quarter. This transaction gains us access to the data from AmGUARD across all agents that opt into the program, providing several competitive advantages.

AmGUARD 以 Kingstone 為替代承運人的撤資計劃現已獲得紐約監管機構的批准，我們預計將於第三季末開始為該業務報價。透過此交易，我們可以存取所有選擇加入該計劃的代理商的 AmGUARD 數據，從而提供多項競爭優勢。

First, we get to underwrite the business upfront to make sure that we're only quoting those risks that meet our profitability standards. Second, by providing a quote for the business we want to write to the producer, we anticipate a higher overall conversion rate as it will take less effort for them to move the business to us. And last, we'll be able to expand our footprint through the introduction to high-potential producers who had not previously represented Kingstone.

首先，我們要提前承保業務，以確保我們只承保那些符合獲利標準的風險。其次，透過向製作人提供我們想要承接的業務的報價，我們預計整體轉換率會更高，因為他們將花費更少的努力將業務轉移給我們。最後，我們將透過介紹以前沒有代表過金士頓的高潛力生產商來擴大我們的業務範圍。

As policies are written from the AmGUARD book, we are confident that they will contribute to Kingstone's profitability as the business will be written in our Select product, which continues to outperform our expectations. The Select homeowners' programs cumulative frequency has now decreased for 13 straight quarters.

由於保單是根據 AmGUARD 手冊制定的，我們相信它們將有助於金士頓的盈利能力，因為業務將寫入我們的 Select 產品中，而該產品的表現將繼續超出我們的預期。精選房主計畫的累積頻率現已連續 13 個季度下降。

For this quarter, our Select homeowners frequency was 1.6% compared to 2.3% for our legacy product. As mentioned previously, our Select pricing and underwriting has shifted our mix to more preferred risks with well-maintained homes, better insurance scores and higher deductibles, which is driving our frequency improvement. Select represents only 48% of policies in force today, and we expect it to grow to close to 60% by the end year, which bodes well for our continued profitability.

本季度，我們的 Select 房主頻率為 1.6%，而我們傳統產品的頻率為 2.3%。如前所述，我們的精選定價和承保已將我們的組合轉向更優先的風險，包括維護良好的房屋、更好的保險評分和更高的免賠額，這推動了我們的頻率改善。目前，精選保單僅佔有效保單的 48%，我們預計到年底這一比例將成長到接近 60%，這有利於我們繼續獲利。

Our plan for 2025 is to continue our focus on our core state of New York, capitalize on hard market conditions, and maximize our profitable growth in the state we know best. We expect the AmGUARD premium to help to accelerate our growth starting in late third quarter.

我們 2025 年的計劃是繼續關注我們的核心州紐約州，利用艱難的市場條件，並在我們最了解的州實現盈利增長最大化。我們預計 AmGUARD 保費將有助於從第三季末開始加速我們的成長。

While it's very early to have confidence around the level of growth we'll see from this renewal rights transaction, our current estimate is $25 million to $35 million in premiums over a 12-month period. The hard market conditions in our Downstate New York footprint have not changed materially, although companies are starting to increase their underwriting appetite.

雖然現在對這次續保權交易的成長水準抱持信心還為時過早，但我們目前估計，12 個月內的保費收入將達到 2,500 萬至 3,500 萬美元。儘管公司開始增加承保意願，但我們在紐約州南部的業務所在地的艱難市場條件並未發生實質變化。

Our consolidated direct written premium growth at 18% for the quarter, was materially higher than the prior year quarter with 23% growth in our core business, offset by a 64% reduction in noncore as planned.

本季度，我們的綜合直接承保保費成長率為 18%，大幅高於去年同期，其中核心業務成長 23%，但非核心業務按計畫減少了 64%。

The growth in our core business premium was driven by a 68% increase in new business count and a 19% higher renewal average premium for the property lines of business. The new business growth early in the quarter included policies from the Adirondack and Mountain Valley withdrawal, and these withdrawals have now been completed.

我們核心業務保費的成長得益於新業務數量增加 68% 以及財產業務續保平均保費增加 19%。本季初的新業務成長包括來自阿迪朗達克和山谷撤離的政策，這些撤離現已完成。

Core policies in force are up 10% and from the prior year quarter, led by homeowners, our largest product, with a 19% increase, offset by declines in our smaller product lines, particularly dwelling fire. In April, we implemented rate segmentation changes in our dwelling fire product, which should address this decline. Our strategy remains consistent, to focus properly matching rate to risk by improving rate segmentation.

與去年同期相比，核心有效保單數量上漲了 10%，其中，我們最大的產品——房主險上漲了 19%，但被較小產品線（尤其是住宅火災險）的下滑所抵消。今年四月，我們對住宅火災產品實施了費率細分調整，這應該可以解決這個下降趨勢。我們的策略始終如一，即透過改善利率細分來使利率與風險進行合理匹配。

This enables us to be more competitive for the risk we want to write. Growth in net premiums earned exceeded 50% for the quarter as a result of earnings from the $11 million in premium that was returned from the reduction in our quota share, along with the significant increase in growth we achieved in the second half of 2024, which is now being earned.

這使我們能夠在承保風險時更具競爭力。本季淨保費收入成長超過 50%，這得益於我們減少配額份額所獲得的 1,100 萬美元保費收益，以及我們在 2024 年下半年實現的大幅成長（目前正在賺取）。

This substantial increase in net earned premium will be a driver of our higher operating income throughout the balance of the year. For the quarter, our net cat -- excuse me, our non-cat loss ratio was up 0.4 percentage points, driven by a reduction in property frequency, but an increase in severity due to a few large fire losses. For homeowners, all perils combined, but excluding catastrophes, our frequency was down over 35% for the quarter.

淨保費收入的大幅增加將成為我們全年營業收入成長的推動力。本季度，我們的淨巨災損失率（不好意思，我們的非巨災損失率）上升了 0.4 個百分點，這是由於財產損失頻率的降低，但由於幾起大型火災損失，嚴重程度有所增加。對於房主來說，除災難外，所有危險加在一起，本季的發生頻率下降了 35% 以上。

For non-catastrophe water losses, our largest peril, we experienced the lowest level of frequency in recent years, offset by an increase in fire frequency, which is typical during the first quarter. Severity increased markedly during the quarter as fire losses are very costly, resulting in a 3.3 percentage point increase in attritional losses, offset by a 3.5 percentage point reduction in catastrophe losses from a light quarter for catastrophe events.

對於非災難性水災（我們面臨的最大風險）而言，我們經歷了近年來最低的發生頻率，但火災頻率有所增加，這在第一季很常見。由於火災損失成本高昂，本季火災嚴重程度顯著增加，導致人員損失增加 3.3 個百分點，但與輕災季度相比，災難損失減少了 3.5 個百分點。

During the quarter, we recognized $600,000 of favorable prior year development, improving our loss ratio by 1.4 percentage points. Relative to severity, we are monitoring the cost of building materials and acknowledge that tariff-related inflation is a moving target. If costs increased as expected, we will need to increase rates more than currently planned.

在本季度，我們確認了 60 萬美元的上年有利發展，使我們的損失率提高了 1.4 個百分點。相對於嚴重程度，我們正在監測建築材料的成本，並承認與關稅相關的通膨是一個不斷變化的目標。如果成本如預期增加，我們將需要提高比目前計劃更高的費率。

Replacement costs are already updated annually to account for inflation. We don't anticipate that an increase in inflation would have a material impact on our results. Our expense ratio was flat with the prior year at 31.3% even with the significant reduction in ceding commission as growth in expenses continues to be lower than the growth in earned premiums.

更換成本每年都會更新，以反映通貨膨脹。我們預期通貨膨脹的上升不會對我們的業績產生重大影響。儘管分保佣金大幅減少，但由於費用成長仍低於已賺保費的成長，我們的費用率仍與前一年持平，為 31.3%。

While our combined ratio of 93.7% was close to the 93.3% combined ratio in the first quarter last year, our operating income nearly tripled from the prior year period, up $1.6 million to $2.4 million. During the quarter, we finalized the sale of our headquarters building and adjacent property, resulting in a one-time after-tax gain of $1.5 million.

雖然我們的綜合比率為 93.7%，接近去年第一季的 93.3%，但我們的營業收入幾乎比去年同期成長了兩倍，增加了 160 萬美元，達到 240 萬美元。本季度，我們完成了總部大樓和鄰近房產的出售，並獲得了 150 萬美元的一次性稅後收益。

We also fully paid off our remaining holding company debt which will save us over $800,000 in interest annually. Bond issue costs of $175,000 were written off this quarter and are included in other operating expenses. In this uncertain time, it's a relief to have no debt at the holding company, a healthy balance sheet, and sufficient statutory surplus to support our core growth.

我們也全部償還了剩餘的控股公司債務，這將使我們每年節省超過 80 萬美元的利息。本季已註銷 175,000 美元的債券發行成本，並將其計入其他營運費用。在這個不確定的時期，控股公司沒有債務、資產負債表健康、法定盈餘充足以支持我們的核心成長，這讓人鬆了一口氣。

Our net investment income for the quarter increased 36% to $2 million, up from $1.5 million in the same period last year. Strong cash generation from operations continues to support our investment portfolio growth.

本季我們的淨投資收入從去年同期的 150 萬美元成長 36% 至 200 萬美元。強勁的營運現金產生能力持續支持我們的投資組合成長。

During this quarter, we invested $16 million in highly rated mortgage-backed pass-through securities, collateralized mortgage obligations, and other asset-backed securities with a book yield of 5.41% and effective duration of 5.53 years. We have extended duration to take advantage of higher yields further out on the yield curve.

本季度，我們投資了 1,600 萬美元於高評級的抵押貸款支持轉手證券、抵押貸款擔保債券和其他資產支持證券，帳面收益率為 5.41%，有效期限為 5.53 年。我們延長了期限，以利用殖利率曲線上更高的殖利率。

Approximately, $10 million of our fixed income portfolio will mature by the end of the year and another $34 million by the end of '26. These securities have relatively low book yields of 3.1% and 3.6%, respectively. As these assets mature, we plan to invest them at higher market rates, which will further enhance our future investment income.

我們的固定收益投資組合中約有 1,000 萬美元將於今年底到期，另有 3,400 萬美元將於 26 年底到期。這些證券的帳面收益率相對較低，分別為 3.1% 和 3.6%。隨著這些資產的成熟，我們計劃以更高的市場利率進行投資，這將進一步提高我們未來的投資收益。

Our non-cash invested yield average of 3.7% with an effective duration of 4.5 years and a weighted average maturity of 9.7 years. With the drop in interest rates, we saw a $2.2 million net increase in the value of our bond portfolio this quarter. The unrealized gain is reflected in our balance sheet as an increase in other comprehensive income, adding to our overall financial strength.

我們的非現金投資收益率平均為 3.7%，有效期限為 4.5 年，加權平均期限為 9.7 年。隨著利率下降，本季我們的債券投資組合價值淨增加了 220 萬美元。未實現收益在我們的​​資產負債表中反映為其他綜合收入的增加，增強了我們的整體財務實力。

Before I turn the call over for questions, and as shared in yesterday's earnings release, we are reaffirming our calendar year '25 guidance. There is still too much uncertainty with the AmGUARD transaction to determine the benefit, and we plan to include it in our updated guidance next quarter.

在我將電話轉交給提問者之前，正如昨天的收益報告中所述，我們重申了 25 日曆年的指導。AmGUARD 交易仍有太多不確定性，無法確定其收益，我們計劃將其納入下個季度的更新指南中。

Overall, we delivered another strong quarter with 23% direct written premium growth in our core business and 172% increase in net income. Our performance reflects the discipline of our underwriting strategy in a challenging environment.

整體而言，我們又一個季度表現強勁，核心業務直接承保保費成長 23%，淨收入成長 172%。我們的表現反映了我們在充滿挑戰的環境中堅持承保策略的紀律性。

As we look forward, we are highly optimistic about the trajectory of our business. We are confident in our ability to generate long-term value for our shareholders through thoughtful execution and the fundamental building blocks we have put in place over the last few years. With that, I'll open it up to questions. Operator?

展望未來，我們對業務發展軌跡非常樂觀。我們相信，透過深思熟慮的執行以及過去幾年來建立的基本基石，我們有能力為股東創造長期價值。好了，現在我來回答大家的提問。操作員？

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

Bob Farnam, Janney Montgomery.

鮑伯法納姆、珍妮蒙哥馬利。

I wanted to start off with the fire losses. Thanks for the details So it sounds like the fire losses were 3.3 points higher than you had anticipated for a typical first quarter, and that was offset by lower catastrophe loss of 3.5 points. Is that -- do I have that right?

我想先從火災損失說起。謝謝您的詳細信息，聽起來火災損失比您預期的典型第一季度損失高出 3.3 個百分點，而這被 3.5 個百分點的較低災難損失所抵消。那是——我說得對嗎？

Yeah. And let me just tell you, we're really not concerned about these fire losses. So first of all, we're talking about a small handful that are more losses than we experienced in the average of the last three years, and most of those fire losses were for policyholders insured in our legacy product.

是的。我只想告訴你，我們真的不擔心這些火災損失。首先，我們談論的是一小部分火災，這些火災的損失比我們過去三年的平均損失還要多，而且大部分的火災損失都是針對我們傳統產品投保的保單持有人。

So if you remember, we stopped writing new business in the legacy product in the beginning of '22. So these policyholders have been with us quarter after quarter and for many first quarters, and we've never seen an uptick in fire frequency before.

所以如果你還記得的話，我們在 22 年初就停止在舊產品中開展新業務了。因此，這些保單持有人已經與我們合作了好幾個季度，甚至很多第一季度，我們從未見過火災頻率上升。

So it's clearly a random event. And we also looked at all those fire losses, and there is nothing -- we wanted to see if there was something that stood out that was consistent, but they're across different geographies, cause of loss and producers. So it's really just a random uptick for the quarter.

所以這顯然是一個隨機事件。我們也研究了所有這些火災損失，但沒有什麼發現——我們想看看是否有一些突出且一致的事情，但它們分佈在不同的地區，損失原因和生產商也不同。所以這實際上只是本季的一個隨機上漲。

Right. Okay. Good. And that was why since the cat losses and the fire losses offset each other, that was why you didn't feel a need to update any combined ratio guidance, even though cat losses were kind of lighter than you expected? Is that --

正確的。好的。好的。這就是為什麼由於巨災損失和火災損失相互抵消，所以儘管巨災損失比您預期的要輕，但您覺得沒有必要更新任何綜合比率指導？那是嗎--

Yeah. That's exactly the reason.

是的。原因正是如此。

Okay. And now that you paid down the expensive debt, you have -- your opportunities for capital management have opened. Now I understand you have a lot of growth coming on. So I can understand that's going to be the primary focus. But I just wanted to go over kind of like your capital management priorities, where does dividend and share repurchases come into the mix as well and non-organic growth as well?

好的。現在您已經償還了昂貴的債務，您的資本管理機會已經打開。現在我明白你正在快速成長。所以我明白這將是主要關注點。但我只是想談談你的資本管理重點，股息和股票回購以及非有機成長如何發揮作用？

Yeah. So relative to the dividend and share repurchases, the Board actively discusses and considers the opportunities to return capital to shareholders all the time, including restoring the dividend. So it's definitely something that is being discussed. And there's lots of opportunity to deploy our capital given our growth. So I don't envision any share buyback in the near future.

是的。因此，相對於股利和股票回購，董事會一直在積極討論並考慮向股東返還資本的機會，包括恢復股利。所以這肯定是正在討論的事情。鑑於我們的成長，我們有很多機會部署資本。因此，我預計近期不會有任何股票回購。

We currently are pretty confident that we have adequate surplus, adequate capital to support our growth, including the growth from the AmGUARD transaction.

我們目前非常有信心，我們有足夠的盈餘、足夠的資本來支持我們的成長，包括來自 AmGUARD 交易的成長。

Right. Okay. Regarding that transaction, the AmGUARD transaction, I think I asked before, do you have any idea of the price differential between you and AmGUARD? As you look at these policies, are they going to be sticker shock as they get into the Kingstone pricing range?

正確的。好的。關於那筆交易，即 AmGUARD 交易，我想我之前問過，您是否知道您和 AmGUARD 之間的價格差異？當您查看這些政策時，當它們進入金士頓定價範圍時，它們的價格是否會讓您感到震驚？

So AmGUARD got out of homeowners for a reason. I don't -- they weren't making money. So certainly, our pricing is higher. It depends on the risk, obviously. And so my understanding is AmGUARD is filing for a rate increase in New York.

因此，AmGUARD 退出房主市場是有原因的。我不知道——他們沒有賺錢。因此我們的定價當然更高。顯然，這取決於風險。因此，我的理解是，AmGUARD 正在申請提高紐約的費率。

So I think that we'll close the gap somewhat, but we'll have to see. I mean that's one of the -- we have a lot of uncertainty around what this transaction will mean for the company. But I've taken that into consideration in the estimate of $25 million to $35 million over a 12-month period.

所以我認為我們會稍微縮小差距，但我們還需要拭目以待。我的意思是，這是其中之一——我們對這筆交易對公司意味著什麼有很多不確定性。但我已將這一點考慮在內，預計 12 個月內的投資金額將達到 2,500 萬至 3,500 萬美元。

Right. Okay. And thanks for that guesstimate as well. And last question for me, any update on CFO search?

正確的。好的。也感謝您的估計。最後一個問題，財務長搜尋有什麼最新進展嗎？

Yeah. So we're in the process. We have hired a retained search firm, and we are actively in the interview process. I can assure you that Victor Brodsky, our Chief Accounting Officer, who was our former CFO and myself, we're covering the gap in the short term. But we do look forward to adding another great person to our team in the near future.

是的。所以我們正在進行中。我們已經聘請了一家獵人頭公司，目前正在積極進行面試。我可以向你們保證，我們的首席會計官維克多·布羅德斯基（他曾是我們的前首席財務官）和我將在短期內彌補這一缺口。但我們確實期待在不久的將來為我們的團隊增添另一位優秀人才。

[Gabriel McClure], private investor.

[加布里埃爾·麥克盧爾]，私人投資者。

So I had a couple of questions and I would like to -- at the risk of sounding like a broken record, also congratulate you on another great quarter. So we had a nice jump in net investment income. It looks like it's accelerating. And I was just going to see if you could give me a little color on why that happened? And then maybe how I should think about that number evolving in the quarters throughout the year?

所以我有幾個問題，而且我想——儘管聽起來像是老生常談，但我還是要祝賀你們又一個偉大的季度。因此我們的投資淨收入大幅成長。看起來它正在加速。我只是想看看你能否稍微解釋為什麼會發生這種情況？那麼我該如何思考這個數字在全年各季度中的變化呢？

Sure. So the primary reason for the jump in our investment income is that we're generating a lot of cash from the profitability of the insurance company, and we're putting that to work in our investment portfolio. So as our investment portfolio grows, our investment income will grow.

當然。因此，我們的投資收入大幅成長的主要原因是，我們從保險公司的利潤中獲得了大量現金，並將其投入我們的投資組合中。因此，隨著我們的投資組合的成長，我們的投資收益也會成長。

And then as I mentioned, we're also moving duration a bit. We're moving up the curve to have -- take advantage of higher interest-bearing fixed income securities. So that will also have a positive impact on the investment income over time.

然後，正如我所提到的，我們也稍微調整了持續時間。我們正在向上移動以利用更高利息的固定收益證券。因此，從長遠來看，這也會對投資收益產生正面的影響。

Okay. Got it. And then I had another one for you. There's a couple of famous insurance executives out there that like to talk about their idea of value for their companies. They call it intrinsic value.

好的。知道了。然後我為你準備了另一個。有幾位著名的保險業主管喜歡談論他們對公司價值的看法。他們稱之為內在價值。

And I was just wondering, do you -- I know you're pretty busy over there, but do you ever have time to think about the -- your own idea of the value of Kingstone, intrinsic value versus maybe the market value or book value or whatever? And if so, could you share that with us?

我只是想知道，我知道您在那邊很忙，但是您有沒有時間考慮一下您對金士頓的價值的看法，內在價值還是市場價值或賬面價值或其他什麼？如果有的話，可以與我們分享一下嗎？

So I don't really have anything to share. I mean, we certainly think about the value of Kingstone relative to the stock price and what we can do to increase our value, but I don't really have anything to share with you, Gabe.

所以我真的沒有什麼好分享的。我的意思是，我們當然會考慮金士頓相對於股價的價值，以及我們可以做些什麼來提高我們的價值，但我真的沒有什麼可以與你分享的，加布。

Jon Old, Long Meadow Investors.

喬恩·奧爾德（Jon Old），Long Meadow Investors。

Great start to the '25 year. So yeah, Bob, asked -- you answered a question about the CFO search. That was one of my questions. The other one was, in the past, you've talked about possibly looking at other jurisdictions, other states. Where do you stand with that process? Or do you sort of just stay focused on New York at the current time?

25 年的良好開端。是的，鮑勃，你回答了有關財務長搜尋的問題。這是我的一個疑問。另一個問題是，過去您曾談到可能考慮其他司法管轄區、其他州。您對這個過程持什麼態度？還是您目前只關注紐約？

Sure. So our '25 strategy is to continue to focus on Downstate New York and the hard market here and maximize our profitable growth and make sure that we are successfully executing on this AmGUARD transaction.

當然。因此，我們的 25 年策略是繼續專注於紐約州下州和這裡的硬市場，最大限度地提高我們的獲利成長，並確保我們成功執行這項 AmGUARD 交易。

But as I've mentioned in the past, this is a great time for Kingstone to be looking at other geographies because we have a product that properly matches rate of risk, great team, we're nimble, we're efficient. And there's a lot of states around the country that have a market need for more capacity. So it's a hard market in homeowners nationally.

但正如我過去提到的那樣，這是金士頓考慮其他地區的好時機，因為我們擁有與風險率相匹配的產品、優秀的團隊，我們靈活、高效。全國許多州的市場都需要更多的產能。因此，全國的房屋市場都很艱難。

So listen, I do want to -- I know there are some investors that are super concerned about Kingstone expanding given our history. And I want to assure you, we are not the same company we were in 2017. And we know what the mistakes made were in the past. And the primary mistake was that our product did not properly match rate to risk. And therefore, we were adversely selected again.

所以聽著，我確實想——我知道有些投資者非常擔心金士頓的擴張，因為我們的歷史。我想向你們保證，我們已經不再是 2017 年的那家公司了。我們知道過去犯了什麼錯。主要的錯誤是我們的產品沒有正確地將利率與風險配對。因此，我們再次遭遇不利選擇。

So we have a lot of confidence in our product. We're going to be slow and thoughtful and do it right this time. And as we make final decisions, I will certainly inform you, it's a 2026 and beyond strategy for the company. So no impact this calendar year.

所以我們對我們的產品非常有信心。這次我們會慢慢來，深思熟慮，把事情做好。當我們做出最終決定時，我一定會告訴你，這是公司的 2026 年及以後的策略。因此今年不會產生影響。

Ladies and gentlemen, there are no other questions in the queue. I'll turn the floor back to Ms. Golden for any final comments.

女士們、先生們，目前沒有其他問題。我將把發言權交還給戈爾登女士，請她發表最後的評論。

Great. Well, thanks for joining the call today, and we appreciate your continued support. Have a great day.

偉大的。好吧，感謝您今天參加電話會議，我們感謝您一直以來的支持。祝你有美好的一天。

Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.

謝謝。今天的電話會議到此結束。現在您可以斷開線路。感謝您的參與。