Joint Corp (JYNT) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

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  • Operator

  • Good day and welcome to the Joint Corp first quarter 2025 financial results conference call.

  • (Operator Instructions)

  • I would now like to turn the conference over to David Barnard of Alliance Advisors Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

  • David Barnard - CFA

  • Thank you, Drew. Good afternoon, everyone. Again, this is David Barnard with Alliance Advisors of Investor Relations. Joining us on the call today are President and CEO Sanjiv Razdan; and CFO Jake Singleton. Please note we are using a slide presentation that can be found at https://ir.thejoint.com/ under the events section.

  • Today, after the close of the market, the Joint Corp issued its results for the quarter ended March 31, 2025. If you do not already have a copy of this press release, it can be found in the investor relations section of the company's website.

  • As provided on slide 2, please be advised that today's discussion includes forward-looking statements within the meaning of the Safe Harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995.

  • All statements other than statements of historical facts may be considered forward-looking statements. Although the company believes that the expectations and assumptions reflected in these forward-looking statements are reasonable, it can make no assertion assurances that such expectations or assumptions will prove to have been correct.

  • Actual results may differ materially from those expressed or implied in forward-looking statements due to various risks and uncertainties. As a result, we caution you against placing undue reliance on these forward-looking statements for discussion of the risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ from those expressed or implied in the forward-looking statements.

  • Please review the risk factors detailed in the company's reports on Forms 10-K and 10-Q as well as other reports that the company files from time to time with the SEC.

  • Finally, any forward-looking statements included in this earnings call are made only as of the date of this call, and we do not undertake any obligation to revise our results or publicly release any updates to these forward-looking statements in light of new information or future events.

  • The results of operations of the corporate client's business segment have been classified as discontinued operations for all periods discussed, and the following comments represent continuing operations unless otherwise stated.

  • Management uses EBITDA and adjusted EBITDA which are non-financial measures. These are presented because they are important measures used by management to assess financial performance. Management believes they provide a more transparent view of the company's underlying operating performance and operating trends in GAAP measures alone.

  • Reconciliation of net income to EBITDA and adjusted EBITDA is presented in the press release. The company defines EBITDA as net income or loss before net interest, tax expense depreciation, and amortization expenses.

  • The company defines adjusted EBITDA as EBITDA before acquisition-related expenses, which includes contract termination costs associated with reacquired regional developer rights, stock-based compensation expense, bargain purchase gain, net gain or loss on disposition or impairment, costs related to restatement filings, restructuring costs, and litigation expenses consisting of legal and related fees for specific proceedings that may arise outside of the ordinary course of our business.

  • Management also includes commonly discussed performance metrics. System-wide sales include revenues at all clinics, whether operated by the company or by franchisees.

  • While franchised sales are not recorded as revenues by the company, management believes the information is important in understanding the company's financial performance because these sales are the basis on which the company calculates and records royalty fees and are indicative of the financial health of the franchisee base.

  • Comp sales include the revenues from both company-owned or managed clinics and franchise clinics that in each case have been open for at least 13 full months and exclude any clinics that have closed.

  • Turning to slide 3, it's my pleasure to turn the call over to Sanjiv Razdan.

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Thank you, David, and I welcome everyone to the call.

  • Turning to slide 4. I'm excited to speak with you today to review progress we are making. For those new to the club, our mission is to improve the quality of life through routine and affordable chiropractic care.

  • After we execute our strategy to become a pure play franchisor, growth sales reduce overhead, and improve profitability, we will strive for our new big bold vision to become America's most accessible health and wellness services company.

  • As part of our transformation journey, in April, we hosted an incredibly productive franchisee spring convention during which we discussed next steps and continued to improve franchise relationships. Before I elaborate, I'll summarize our Q1 2025 financial results compared to Q1 2024.

  • System-wide sales were $132.6 million, up 5%, demonstrating resilience in this economic environment. Com sales for all clinics opened 13 months with 3% for the quarter and 4% in March.

  • Revenue from continuing operations increased 7%, adjusted EBITDA from continuing operations was $46,000 compared to $425,000 in quarter 2024. Jake will provide greater detail in a moment.

  • Turning to slide 5. I want to acknowledge the dynamic consumer environment that we're in. While we monitor the situation closely, we are pushing ahead with our transition plan.

  • As unveiled on our March call, we have constructed a multi-year phased approach. The changes we're making increase the potency and flexibility of our model. To become a pure play franchisor, we are re-franchising. We have signed LOIs for 93% of our corporate clinics, and we are well into the due diligence phase for many.

  • When we reach binding asset purchase agreements, we intend to make public announcements. In the Joint 2.0, we are focused on strengthening our core, reigniting growth, and improving clinic and the company level profitability. We will initiate dynamic revenue management, strengthen our digital marketing and promotional calendar, and upgrade our patient-facing technology.

  • Turning to slide 6. The franchisee spring convention was aptly named the Pulse Summit. Since I joined, we have been taking a pulse check of the business. At the summit, we reviewed the Joint's pulse with our franchisees, regional developers, and our employees.

  • We seize the opportunity to reinvigorate, to create momentum through collaboration, to ensure we're working as one team and to identify ways to become stronger, bigger, and faster, so we can care for more patients more effectively.

  • And we must always remember that when patients stay at the center of our focus, the business grows, profitability follows, and everyone wins. And to do that well, we know we have to level up across the board with a stronger brand, sharper marketing, better operations, and higher impact training.

  • During the summit, our team and franchisees signed a franchise partnership pact. That is a shared promise between franchisor and franchisee to lead with clarity, act with integrity, and stay true to the values that define the Joint.

  • During the summit, we discussed near and longer term initiatives, including marketing execution with our new marketing agency and strategies to increase new patient leads, our plan to regain patient momentum, and our new brand architecture.

  • Operational execution with our priority focus on excellent patient experiences and clinic economics, a new clinic launch best practices and tool kit update, and our new clinic report cards that provide quantitative data and diagnostics on patient satisfaction, operational efficiency, and sales.

  • As well as training, we are introducing the Joint Chiropractic Elite Academies, think of it as our version of the Joint university. We have planned the inaugural academy for Doctor of Chiropractic to be launched in 2025. Events like the summit enable us to synchronize with our franchisees, improve relationships with them and strengthen our operating culture.

  • Turning to slide 7, let's review dynamic revenue management. We must be intentional and balanced when reviewing price increases. We promise affordability as part of our mission, and it's a key determination among our patient demographics. Yet since our last meaningful price adjustment in March 2022, labor costs have increased significantly, squeezing clinic level margins.

  • Working to alleviate the pinch, we have begun testing elasticity for different prices for various packages and wellness plans. We are reviewing the entire model including legacy plans, nothing is sacred. Our goal is to create an innovative, flexible pricing model that more accurately aligns with treatment plans and patient usage during all phases of care from acute to maintenance.

  • Options include premium memberships with more visits in the first month of care, new price options for our wellness plans, and increases for our packages. For example, for patients in acute pain that need to be adjusted more than one time per week for their treatment plan, we will begin offering pre-paid visit pricing in the second half of this year.

  • Turning to slide 8. Let's review strengthening on digital marketing. We are working with our new marketing agency to drive brand awareness and consideration as well as improve our SEO performance with enhanced content and technical strategies.

  • Our new content strategy aims to increase relevance and foster trust. Our new user generated content is focused on building authority and community validation. The early tests are delivering encouraging results.

  • Turning to slide 9, let's review strengthening our promotional calendar. In February, we implemented a new step into wellness promo to encourage target existing patients to buy into wellness plans. We offered them the first month at $45 and then the rest of the membership at the standard rate.

  • Although this impacted revenue in February, we increased active membership conversion significantly during the month. The Joint's buy-five-get-one wellness promo begins on Monday, June 3, and will provide patients with an affordable way to commit to their treatment plan and stay on the path to good health.

  • This has been a very successful promo in the past, and I look forward to reviewing the results with you next quarter.

  • Turning to slide 10. Let's review patient-facing technology. We polled patients, wellness coordinators, and doctors of chiropractic to ensure the most essential elements for the users are included in our mobile app. Features include clinic finder, which doctor is in clinic, in-clinic check-in, and push notifications.

  • Ultimately, all will benefit when we communicate to patients directly using in-app push notifications. For example, we can remind them that they have adjustments, x number of adjustments remaining for the month, which would strengthen usage and engagement.

  • Regarding the app, our data is going well, and we expect to be in the app stores by June 30. With that, I'll turn the call to Jake.

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Thank you, Sanjiv. And let's turn to slide 12. Let's discuss our operating metrics. When reviewing our quarterly results, I want to remind you of two factors. First, in 2024, it was a leap year and included an extra sales day in February compared to 2025.

  • Then in February of 2025 we conducted a promotion targeted at our existing non-wellness plan members that lowered the first month's membership rate to $45 which impacted sales and dollars while securing more patients for the medium term.

  • In Q1 2025, system-wide sales were up 5%, as Sanjiv mentioned, showing resilience while consumer sentiment is wavering. Comp sales for all clinics opened 13 months were 3% in Q1 of 2025. They increased to 4% in March of 2025. Comp sales for mature clinics opened 48 months were negative 2%.

  • Turning to slide 13. Let's discuss our clinics. As previously indicated, we expect franchise license sales to be impacted by our re-franchising strategy. We sold nine licenses in Q1 2025 compared to 15 in Q1 2024.

  • During Q1, we had 16 regional developers, covering approximately 56% of the network, and we had 146 franchise licenses in active development. In Q1 2025, we opened five franchise clinics. We franchised two corporate clinics and closed one corporate clinic. On March 31, 2025, we had 969 clinics of which 847 or 87% are franchise clinics.

  • Turning to slide 14, let's discuss our financials. As discussed in March 2025 will be a year of transition as we conclude the refranchising efforts. We are recording the company-owned or managed clinics as discontinued operations.

  • Please note, we have not yet experienced the financial benefit from our corporate clinic revenues, transitioning to franchise royalties and fees, nor have we yet fully reduced our DNA expense.

  • We are critically focused on reducing our G&A and will shed more overhead than what is currently reported in our continuing operations. This will improve the bottom line in the in the coming years. In 2026, we expect to further grow net new clinic openings, system-wide sales, comp sales, and adjusted EBITDA.

  • Now I'll review continuing operations for Q1 2025 compared to Q1 2024. Revenue reached $13.1 million compared to $12.2 million, increasing 7% due to the greater number of franchise clinics in operation and offsetting the effects of the 2024 leap year and the 2025 February promotion.

  • Cost of revenues was $3 million, up 10% over the same period last year, reflecting the associated higher regional developer royalties and commissions and the greater number of franchise clinics and operations.

  • Selling and marketing expenses were $3.5 million compared to $2.2 million. The increase reflects the costs related to carrying two marketing agencies while we ensure a smooth transition to our new team, engaged to strengthen our digital marketing strategy.

  • Depreciation and amortization expenses increased 10% compared to the prior year period due to depreciation expenses related to development of an internal use software deployed in 2024. G&A expenses were $6.9 million or 53% of revenue, compared to $7.3 million or 60% of revenue in the same period last year, reflecting lower payroll and stock-based compensation.

  • Income tax expense was $13,000 compared to $9000 in Q1 2024. Net loss from continuing operations was $506,000 or $0.03 per basic share compared to a loss of $399,000 or $0.03 per basic share in Q1 2024.

  • I'll provide adjusted EBITDA for three categories for continuing operations, discontinued operations, and consolidated operations. Adjusted EBITDA for continuing operations was $46,000 compared to $425,000. Adjusted EBITDA for discontinued operations was $2.8 million compared to $3.1 million. And adjusted EBITDA for consolidated operations were $2.9 million compared to $3.5 million.

  • On the slide 15, I'll review our balance sheet and cash flow. On March 31, 2025, our unrestricted cash was $21.9 million compared to $25.1 million on December 31, 2024. Cash used in operations for the quarter was $3.7 million which included the previously discussed legal settlement payment and annual employee bonuses, both of which were accrued as of December 31, 2024.

  • The line of credit with JP Morgan Chase grants us immediate access to $20 million through February 2027.

  • On the slide 16, we are reiterating 2025 guidance. While the Joint provides services within the US and is not directly impacted by potential tariffs, many of our patients are concerned about the impact to their lives. After the tariffs were announced in April, shifts in consumer confidence and spending did begin to affect the Joint.

  • System-wide sales are expected to be between $550 million and $570 million compared to $530.3 million in 2024. Com sales for all clinics open 13 months or more are expected to be in the mid-single digits compared to an increase of 4% in 2024.

  • Consolidated adjusted EBITDA to be between $10 million and $11.5 million compared to $11.4 million in 2024. The 2025 consolidated adjusted IBEDA estimates includes an adjustment for approximately $4.4 million related to among other things, stock-based compensation and depreciation and amortization.

  • The company will factor in any additional impairments or restructuring charges related to the refranchising should they occur. New franchise clinic openings, excluding the impact of re-franchised clinics are expected to be between 30 and 40 compared to 57 in 2024.

  • In 2025, franchise license sales and clinic openings are likely to be less than 2024 as we are working through the impact of our re-franchising efforts. Further, we see the impact of economic headwinds, stubborn inflation, and volatile consumer sentiment, impacting the beginning of 2025.

  • That said, if clinics shift from company owned or managed clinics to franchise clinics, there will be a transformative financial impact. Our franchise royalties and fees will increase, and we will rationalize our unallocated G&A expenses, and the Joint Corp will be more profitable.

  • And with that, I'll turn the call back over to you, Sanjiv.

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Thanks, Jake. Turning to slide 18. We've been reviewing the chiropractic care market and testing brand concepts. The bottom line is that America is suffering from pain, and we've got the data to prove it.

  • 74% of our new patients cite aches and pains as at least one of the reasons for coming to the Joint. In fact, back pain is the third most frequent cause for visiting a doctor. The leading cause of job-related disability and one of the top reasons people miss work.

  • But the good news is we are starting to see an important shift. Across the country. People are thinking more about longevity, healthy aging, and how to take care of themselves before something breaks. With a growing focus on holistic fitness and sustainable well-being, people are changing their approach to health.

  • Turning to slide 19, the Joint is in a position to set the pace and shape the pulse of the future of care. Pain is the trigger, bringing patients to our clinics. So we are shifting our external messaging to be pain centric.

  • Once in the system, we start educating patients on the efficacy of chiropractic care for wellness and teach them the benefits of chiropractic care on an ongoing basis. Our new brand creative will empower individuals to reclaim their lives through transformational relief. People can move from pain to a life unpaused. We are excited to launch this new campaign in the second half of the year.

  • Turning to slide 20. I'll reiterate, when we place patience at the heart of everything we do, the business grows, profitability follows, and everyone wins.

  • People are highly motivated to relieve pain. Our hypothesis is that pain relief is more resilient than other purchases in times of economic pressure. As discussed, we are pivoting our marketing to target those in pain.

  • Our team is dedicated to doing the work to improve our system. We are advancing our initiatives to strengthen our core, reignite growth, and improve clinic and the company level profitability.

  • Turning to slide 21. Before we open for questions, I have a few updates and comments. On the corporate side, we welcome Andra Terrell in the newly created role of SVP Legal, an innovative legal strategist with two decades serving franchise systems. Andra is experienced in strategic planning, re-franchising, acquisitions, turnarounds, and more.

  • We also welcome our new SVP operations and patient experience, Eric Wyatt to the executive team. Eric has 30 years of franchise operations experience at numerous national brands and joins us to improve quality and economics of our clinics, reduce variability of the patient experience, and help us reignite growth.

  • On the business side, as stewards of chiropractic, we support and encourage the success of future professionals. In March, we announced our latest scholarship at Northwestern Health Sciences University. Additionally, we received awards from Entrepreneur magazine. The Joint has been named one of the 150 fastest-growing franchises, ranked number 37 of the franchise 500 and added to the 10-plus club.

  • On the investor side, I invite you to meet us at the B. Reilly Securities Annual Investor Conference in Beverly Hills later in May or the virtual Oppenheimer Annual Consumer Growth and E-commerce Conference in June.

  • With that operator, I am ready to begin Q&A.

  • Operator

  • (Operator Instructions)

  • Jeff Van Sinderen, B Riley Securities.

  • Jeff Van Sinderen - Analyst

  • Hi, everyone. [Anjita], I wonder if you can start maybe or Jake, whoever's got the info, maybe speak about the new patient ad metrics and retention metrics and trends around those that you're seeing lately?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, Jeff. I'll take that one. Yeah, we made reference to the overall consumer sentiment. I think we are seeing that reflected in our new patient volumes when we look at the gross number of volume new patient leads that we're getting, those have been affected, especially as we think about the organic leads that are coming through.

  • So critically focused on those marketing strategies that Sanjiv alluded to. From a retention perspective, we're holding on to our patients at a similar rate that we always have. So that metric is holding up well for us.

  • Jeff Van Sinderen - Analyst

  • Okay, great. And then as we're thinking about you becoming a pure franchise business. And I don't know if you're ready to share this or not, but I know you mentioned in your prepared comments, that you'll become more profitable, but just wondering if there are any metrics that you're prepared to share around that, how much you might remove from overhead?

  • What level of margins you think are feasible? Is it the level of margins of similar companies, just wondering any anything new to add on that?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, I don't think we're ready to provide a forward guide on that yet, Jeff. As we look at last year's adjusted EBITDA on a consolidated basis, we did about $11.4 million of adjusted EBITDA, as we reach -- the coming years you've seen our guide for '25, but as we think about 2026 as that pure play franchisor, we do expect profitability both on gross dollars and on a margin basis as a percentage to be higher than we've seen, historically.

  • The way that we accomplish that is by shedding the necessary G&A, and so that's where our critical focus will be. So as we get closer to announcing some of these refranchising deals as they reach those asset purchase agreements, we'll be able to give a better sense for kind of where we're going in the future.

  • Jeff Van Sinderen - Analyst

  • And given that I think you said 90-some-odd percent are basically sort of in the due diligence process I think that was what you said. What do you think the timeframe is to be through the refranchchising process at this point, just based on the pace that it's been going, so far?

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Jeff, we have 93% of the remaining corporate clinics which are now under LOI and most of them are in the process of due diligence. I think it is our intent to exit 2025 as a pure play franchisor. And we'd hope that we can accelerate this process as much as we possibly can even in prior year. But that is the timeline that we're working towards.

  • Jeff Van Sinderen - Analyst

  • Okay, great. Thanks for taking my questions and I'll take the rest of the line.

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Okay. Thank you, Jeff.

  • Operator

  • George Kelly, ROTH Capital Partners.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • Hey, everybody. Thanks for taking my questions. Excuse me, maybe just to start with a follow up from the prior question. Has the refranchising process slowed at all just with some of the macro noise, it's been a pretty crazy last six weeks?

  • I had thought that coming out of the last quarter, the goal was for most of it to be complete sometime in 2Q, maybe I misremember that but just curious if things have slipped at all?

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Hey, George. We are not seeing any meaningful slowdown of the refranchising process. It's the nature of this in terms of due diligence, lease reassignments, et cetera. That it's very difficult to put a firm timeline to that, but we're not seeing any slow down to the process, and definitely not seeing any connection between our process of re-franchising and the macroeconomics.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • Okay, that's great. And then, second topic I wanted to cover is just going back to your comments about comp growth. I guess the two specific questions are can you share what comps were in April? And then secondly, can you disclose quarterly franchise versus owned comp performance?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, we won't give an April number at this point. We did see a slight uptick from February into March. February had the leap year in the promo that I mentioned, but we were back to 4% by March. So those are the figures that we gave there. What was the second part of your question there, George?

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • If you could give Q1 franchise versus owned comps?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, as of right now, because 87% of our clinics are franchise clinics. Their comp, relatively mirrors the consolidated comp. The corporate clinic comp is positive, but it does trail the franchise comp for the period.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • Okay. And then last question for me, well, I guess two last quick ones. Dynamic pricing, I understand it sounds like you want to take a measured approach.

  • How much of a tail like -- How much just all in if you look at the pricing opportunity? I know it's going to range by geography, and you know it's maybe not easy to just put a number to but is this like a high single digit opportunity for pricing? Or where do you see it all kind of shaking out when it's all been implemented?

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Here's what I can say, we're exploring as I try to give a sense on our prepared remarks that really every single lever in in our pricing model.

  • So in the current climate, we're just wanting to be thoughtful and test the various iterations and make sure that whatever we scale nationally is something that's helps us strike that balance between affordability and you know optimizing for price, so that's why the comment -- I'm not sure that we provided guidance on what the pricing impact is to our overall numbers, but it certainly has the capacity to be double digit in terms of dollar value in millions to add to our total system-wide sales.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • Yeah. (multiple speakers) $500 million system like a low, at least a low single digit? Am I thinking about that right?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Correct. Yeah, from a timing perspective, really the only wholesale increase that we've pushed to the full network to date is an increase to our single visit pricing, so that's only about 4% of our gross sales, the rest that are in tests now, you won't really see the impacts of those until the second half of the year, right, as we conclude the evaluation of those test markets.

  • And then roll those out to the full system, so some of that will be back loaded, but that is factored into to the full year guide.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • So that double digits, $10 million-plus is just a partial year, that that's the impact for the full year, but it's really just based on mostly partial year pricing.

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • That's correct.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • Okay, thank you. And then I guess one last one, selling and marketing expense, I understand you we're paying two different agencies in the quarter $3.5 million I think was the line?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Correct.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • When do you expect that to normalize and what kind of range should we expect when you're down to one agency?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, I definitely wouldn't use Q1 as the run rate figure for that. We have a lot of front-loaded cost. I think you'll see a similar burden for Q2 right as we continue that kind of dual transitioned approach. By Q3, I think you'll start to see that more normalized. And then kind of by Q4, you'll get a better sense for overall run rate.

  • George Kelly - Managing Director, Senior Research Analyst

  • Okay, thanks.

  • Operator

  • Jeremy Hamblin, Craig-Hallum Capital Group.

  • Jeremy Hamblin - Analyst

  • Thanks for taking the questions and so, I just want to come back and revisit the same store sales guide for a second here. As we look ahead, I think your compares are a little bit tougher in the second half of the year, maybe, I think about 5% in the second half of '24 versus a lower single digit in the first half of the year.

  • I mean, have you seen a meaningful uptick here over the last five or six weeks, that's providing some confidence of that mid-single digit guide or is there another factor maybe the pricing, that is playing into the mid-single digit guide because obviously, it would imply, a pretty healthy acceleration from run rates, current run rates.

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, the guide is probably more so predicated on some of those dynamic revenue management kind of pricing increases in the second half of the year. You're right, the comp, the rollovers get a little tougher. We had a 6% comp in Q4 of '24, so it's largely predicated on the pricing initiatives that factor into that full year guide.

  • Jeremy Hamblin - Analyst

  • Got it and then and just in terms of rolling out the dynamic pricing and kind of testing around that, obviously, you know it sounds fluid, but in terms of thinking how long you might take to refine, given that it's a new process for you, is it a quarter? Is it a couple of quarters? Is it, I mean, obviously, it's an ongoing process overall, but, any more insight you can share there?

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • But Jeremy, clearly by the nature of its name it is ongoing and also because a lot of our plans, right, like for example if you go into a membership plans, there's a minimum purchase requirement of two months.

  • So in order to understand the impact of some of the things that we're trying to pay a full, I think at the bare minimum we're talking two to three months to understand the impact of test sales at the very least. So just think about it in that way that anything that we test. The earliest we can get a read on is in that sort of time frame, particularly as it relates to our wellness plans and packages.

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • And because we're looking at the full pricing structure, we just have to be mindful that the changes to certain parts of our pricing mix, have a tail impact to other elements of our pricing. So you know it does take some time to evaluate to make sure you're not only evaluating that that core piece of the pricing mix that you've put into test but also how it affects conversions to other elements of our pricing structure.

  • So just, I wouldn't describe it as fluid. I'd describe it more as strategic to make sure that we're understanding the full range of impacts and making sure that it's best for the system before rolling it out.

  • Jeremy Hamblin - Analyst

  • Understood and so do you sense that in the current environment you're having clients that are looking more at kind of the monthly membership model versus the -- like the June 2025 5-for-1 package type promo that you're looking at.

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, I mean, we still see approximately 85% of our gross sales, coming in the form of our monthly recurring products. So that's always the vast majority of our revenue as we think about things like single visit pricing or our package pricing, we have to be very careful of how that impacts the overall wellness.

  • You know we aren't seeing defection away from those core recurring products. In fact, we're trying to do the opposite, right, encourage people to move into those recurring products that better fit, their treatment plans and ongoing care.

  • Jeremy Hamblin - Analyst

  • Got it. Okay, and then I just one last thing, I -- the spring convention, that you did with franchisees and what was the cost of that and then what line item did it flow through G&A or you know some of that allocated to sales and marketing?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, that full burden comes through the sales and marketing line. We did slightly scale back the convention this year in terms of the number of days that we typically do, so it's not the same level of cost impact that you see when we do our every other year full national conference agenda, but that did impact the second quarter sales and marketing line as well.

  • Jeremy Hamblin - Analyst

  • Okay, can you call out what the cost was?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • I don't have that off the top of my head, Jeremy, in a given year, with the full-scale agenda, some of that passed through as much as half million. This was a much smaller production, so it was south of that.

  • Jeremy Hamblin - Analyst

  • Got it. Alright. Thanks so much for taking the questions and best wishes.

  • Operator

  • Jeremy Pearlman, Maxim Group.

  • Jeremy Pearlman - Analyst

  • Thank you for taking my question. So maybe if you could help us connect the dots between the reported comp sales, which are up 3% for clinics that were open at least 13 months, but then the clinics open at least 48 months, I think you said on the call that they were down 2%. So maybe why do you think that is?

  • And then also, are there any specific strategies you're implementing or you plan to implement for the more mature clinics to help them get back to comp sale growth?

  • Jake Singleton - Chief Financial Officer

  • Yeah, Jeremy, that's a typical spread that we've seen over the last five to six quarters in terms of that mature comp versus the system comp. So no real widening in terms of that GAAP. So I would say that's been consistent for us, we're always looking at ways to continue to strengthen all clinics within our system.

  • So a number of the operational strategies and marketing tactics will certainly be geared towards that existing patient or existing clinic profile as well.

  • Jeremy Pearlman - Analyst

  • Okay, thank you. And then you mentioned answer one of the questions that the guide for your system-wide sales and your comp sales for 2025, it was underpinned by dynamic revenue pricing. Is there anything else that's going any other assumptions that you are that go behind the guide?

  • And is that best-case scenario because considering the macroeconomic risks and the consumer sentiment that you talked about on the call, it could affect higher prices, is that baked into the guide or that would may cause you to pull back a little bit?

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Well, let me start then, Jake can add to this, dynamic revenue management is one of a few different strategies that I had outlined which go into driving our comp sales growth, right? Just to recap, we are looking at promotional activity that we feel is stronger than what we've done before.

  • We are looking at in the second half of the year, being much more pointed in our external communications. And I referenced that 74% of our patients' site pain of some kind when they come to us, or external messaging is going to be single-mindedly focused on pain as we transition into the back half of the year, which will help us get more patients into the funnel.

  • The third thing we're doing is stronger digital marketing that's the new agency we brought in and just so that you understand specifically what that does is it allows us to do much better media planning and buying so that all our clinics are buying media in a way that's relevant for that specific patient demographic and psychographics, including those mature clinics, right?

  • Then we referenced patient-facing technology. We're expecting that our mobile app, our first ever, will be in app stores by June 30, which whilst does not drive coms, but we believe over a period of time that helps to drive patient engagement and usage and therefore lifetime value.

  • And then finally, clearly one of the dynamics that we anticipate helping our coms is dynamic revenue management because we have not taken any meaningful pricing since March of 2022 and that we're working through and we do expect to take some pricing in 2025. So hopefully, that gives you a sense for what is underpinning our assumptions on com sales.

  • Jeremy Pearlman - Analyst

  • Thank you very much for that.

  • Operator

  • This concludes our question-and-answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Sanji Razdan for any closing remarks.

  • Sanjiv Razdan - President, Chief Executive Officer, Director

  • Thank you, David. Thank you all for joining us. I look forward to getting to know you at conferences and non-deal roadshows. Have a really good day and know that at the Joint, we always have your back.

  • Operator

  • The conference has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.