indie Semiconductor Inc (INDI) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon and welcome to indie semiconductor's fourth quarter 2024 earnings call. (Operator Instructions).

下午好，歡迎參加獨立半導體 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。（操作員指令）。

As a reminder, this conference call is being recorded. I will now turn the call over to Ashish Gupta and Investor Relations. Mr. Gupta, please go ahead.

提醒一下，本次電話會議正在錄音。現在我將電話轉給 Ashish Gupta 和投資者關係部。古普塔先生，請繼續。

Thank you, operator. Good afternoon and welcome to In Semiconductor's fourth quarter 2024 earnings call. Joining me today are Don McClymont, indie's co-founder and CEO; Raja Bal, indie's CFO; and Mark Tyndall, Head of Corporate Development and Investor Relations. Donald will provide opening remarks and discuss business highlights followed by Roger's review of indie's Q4 results and Q1 Outlook.

謝謝您，接線生。下午好，歡迎參加 In Semiconductor 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。今天與我一起出席的還有 indie 聯合創始人兼首席執行官 Don McClymont、indie 首席財務官 Raja Bal 以及企業發展和投資者關係主管 Mark Tyndall。唐納德將致開幕詞並討論業務亮點，隨後羅傑將回顧獨立公司第四季度的業績和第一季的展望。

Please note that we've been making forward-looking statements based on current expectations and assumptions which are subject to risks and uncertainties. These statements reflect our views only as of today and should not be relied upon as representative above views as of any subsequent date.

請注意，我們一直根據目前的預期和假設做出前瞻性陳述，這些預期和假設存在風險和不確定性。這些聲明僅反映我們截至今天的觀點，不應被視為代表任何後續日期的觀點。

These statements are subject to a variety of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results of different materially from expectations.

這些聲明受到各種風險和不確定性的影響，可能導致實際結果與預期有重大差異。

For material risks and other important factors that can affect our financial results, please review our risk factors in our annual report on Form 10-K for the fiscal year ending December 31, 2023, as well as other public reports filed with the SEC.

對於可能影響我們財務表現的重大風險和其他重要因素，請查看我們截至 2023 年 12 月 31 日的財政年度的 10-K 表年度報告中的風險因素，以及向美國證券交易委員會提交的其他公開報告中的風險因素。

Finally, the results and guidance discussed today are based on consolidated non-gap financial measures such as non-gap gross margin, non-gap operating loss, non-GAAP net loss, and non-GAAP net loss per share.

最後，今天討論的結果和指導是基於合併的非差距財務指標，例如非差距毛利率、非差距營業虧損、非公認會計準則淨虧損和非公認會計準則每股淨虧損。

For complete reconciliation to GAAP and the definition of the non-gap reconciling items, please see our Q4 earnings press release, which was issued in advance of this call and can be found on our website at www.inddy.inc.

有關與 GAAP 的完整對帳以及非差距對帳項目的定義，請參閱我們在本次電話會議之前發布的第四季度收益新聞稿，可在我們的網站 www.inddy.inc 上找到。

I'll now turn the call over to Donald.

我現在將電話轉給唐納德。

Thanks Ashish and welcome everybody. Let me first review our financial performance within the context of the overall automotive market environment before focusing on indie's business achievements. During the fourth quarter of 2024, indie achieved total revenue of $58 million coming in at the midpoint of our guidance and marking our second quarter of sequential revenue growth, as well as another quarter of outperformance versus the industry as we continue to gain market share.

謝謝 Ashish，歡迎大家。在關注獨立的業務成就之前，讓我先在整個汽車市場環境下回顧我們的財務表現。2024 年第四季度，獨立遊戲的總收入達到 5800 萬美元，達到我們預期的中點，標誌著我們第二個季度的收入連續增長，並且隨著我們繼續獲得市場份額，我們又一個季度的表現優於行業。

Last quarter, I highlighted the uncertainty in the automotive market and the near-term challenges impacting the automotive industry. This market context did not meaningfully change through the fourth quarter. Thus, the sequential growth in our Q4 results demonstrated indie's resilient business performance. However, in recent weeks, market uncertainty has actually accelerated.

上個季度，我強調了汽車市場的不確定性以及影響汽車產業的近期挑戰。這種市場環境在第四季並沒有顯著變化。因此，我們第四季業績的連續成長證明了獨立遊戲業務的強勁表現。然而，最近幾週，市場不確定性實際上有所加速。

Impending tariffs have exacerbated the challenging market situation, adding to the ongoing inventory and end customer demand issues. Traditional manufacturers could be particularly impacted by cross-border tariffs between the US and Mexico or Canada, with component parts sometimes crossing the border up to half a dozen times.

即將徵收的關稅加劇了市場狀況的嚴峻性，增加了持續的庫存和最終客戶需求問題。傳統製造商可能特別受到美國與墨西哥或加拿大之間跨境關稅的影響，因為零件有時會跨境多達六次。

As an example, Ford recently told suppliers that the update for their mainstay F-150 model range scheduled for 2027 will now be delayed to 2028 as a result. That said, the long term mega trends of ADAS, in cab and user experience, and electrification do remain very strong, and India is ideally positioned to capitalize on those markets.

例如，福特最近告知供應商，其主打車型 F-150 系列原定於 2027 年推出的更新將因此推遲至 2028 年。話雖如此，ADAS、駕駛室和用戶體驗以及電氣化的長期趨勢確實仍然非常強勁，而印度處於利用這些市場的理想位置。

2025 will be an important year for indie as we begin realizing the benefits of our multi-year investments across our product portfolio with multiple ramps in power delivery, in-car networking, ultrasonic intruder detection, vehicle access, vision-based driver and occupant monitoring, and our key corner radar program later in the year.

2025 年對獨立公司來說將是重要的一年，因為我們將開始實現多年來對整個產品組合的投資所帶來的收益，其中包括電力傳輸、車載網絡、超聲波入侵者檢測、車輛通道、基於視覺的駕駛員和乘員監控以及我們的關鍵轉角雷達計劃等多個方面的提升。

I have spoken at length about the key drivers for these mega trends previously, principally global regulation for vehicle safety, reduced emissions, and an accelerating consumer desire for more immersive in cab and user experiences. The key takeaway is that indie is unique amongst its peers with its ability to deliver outsized market growth across these megatrends by leveraging a class-leading, highly differentiated and diverse product technology portfolio.

我之前已經詳細討論過這些大趨勢的關鍵驅動因素，主要是全球車輛安全法規、減少排放以及消費者對更身臨其境的駕駛室和用戶體驗的渴望。關鍵在於，獨立遊戲在同業中獨樹一幟，能夠利用一流、高度差異化和多樣化的產品技術組合，在這些大趨勢中實現超額的市場成長。

Now let me share some of the notable business progress which we achieved in the fourth quarter. Our vision products targeting multiple ADAS applications continue to gain strong traction with multiple global customers. I'm excited to share that our flagship IND 880 vision processor was recently selected for both front sensing and occupant monitoring applications by a large Korean OEM for a new e-Vehicle platform. Starting production in 2027.

現在讓我分享一下我們在第四季度取得的一些顯著的業務進展。我們針對多種 ADAS 應用的視覺產品持續受到全球多家客戶的強烈關注。我很高興地告訴大家，我們的旗艦產品 IND 880 視覺處理器最近被一家大型韓國 OEM 選中，用於新電動汽車平台的前端感測和乘員監控應用。2027年開始生產。

Additionally, we had several design wins for IND 8,880 in China for multi-channel sensor applications. IND 880's low power, low latency, and fast initialization capabilities set it apart from incumbents for applications which are now rapidly growing in popularity with China OEMs.

此外，我們在中國獲得了 IND 8,880 多通道感測器應用的多項設計勝利。IND 880 的低功耗、低延遲和快速初始化功能使其在眾多應用中脫穎而出，並迅速受到中國原始設備製造商的青睞。

Finally, the major driver monitoring design wins for General Motors, Toyota and Ford that we shared last year for our vision products continue on track through the normal structured tier one lead system validation and productionization phases, with first production commencing later this year.

最後，我們去年為通用汽車、豐田和福特贏得的視覺產品主要駕駛員監控設計勝利，將繼續順利通過正常的結構化一級領先系統驗證和生產化階段，並將於今年晚些時候開始首次生產。

Turning to our flagship 77 gigahertz radar program, our lead customer continues to successfully progress through their productionization and remains on track for production launch with multiple OEMs. The initial shipments will begin in late 2025.

談到我們的旗艦 77 千兆赫雷達項目，我們的主要客戶繼續成功推進其生產進程，並繼續與多家 OEM 合作推出生產。首批貨物將於 2025 年底開始出貨。

Additionally, I am pleased to share that engineering samples for our 120 gigahertz radar solution for in carbon occupant monitoring applications have recently been received and tested, and we have already successfully demonstrated these to multiple elite customers, eliciting extremely positive feedback.

此外，我很高興地告訴大家，我們用於碳乘員監測應用的 120 千兆赫雷達解決方案的工程樣品最近已經收到並進行了測試，我們已經成功地向多個精英客戶展示了這些樣品，並獲得了非常積極的反饋。

According to S&P Global Mobility, ultrasonic and radar-based automotive sensing will represent a 6 billion. Dollar market opportunity in 2029, up from $4 billion last year, and we anticipate capturing further wins for our solution which features the industry's most advanced technologies. In this segment, by virtue of operational frequency and the innovation of integrated antennas, India is a clear leader in the market, allowing us to address not only the automotive segment but also emerging industrial mobility applications.

根據標準普爾全球行動公司的數據，基於超音波和雷達的汽車感測市場規模將達到 60 億美元。2029 年的市場機會將達到 40 億美元，高於去年的 40 億美元，我們預計採用業界最先進技術的解決方案將獲得更多勝利。在這一領域，憑藉運行頻率和整合天線的創新，印度在市場上佔據明顯領先地位，這使我們能夠不僅滿足汽車領域的需求，而且還滿足新興工業行動應用的需求。

Looking into our medium term future, we see ever growing applications for our automotive products, particularly Vision, radar, and LIDAR, in industrial spaces including robotics and manufacturing automation, which we plan to exploit.

展望中期未來，我們看到我們的汽車產品（特別是視覺、雷達和光達）在工業領域（包括機器人和製造自動化）的應用日益增長，我們計劃加以利用。

Turning to in cab and user experience, we are able to announce a major win for our vehicle intrusion detection system with a major German OEM, which will commence full production ramp up in the second half of this year. Switching to electrification, a major milestone for the company in the fourth quarter was the announcement of our first product in. Independently certified to the highest automotive functional safety level, ACLD, as defined by the ISO standard.

談到駕駛室和用戶體驗，我們宣布我們的車輛入侵偵測系統與一家德國主要 OEM 達成重大合作，該公司將於今年下半年開始全面投產。轉向電氣化，該公司第四季的一個重要里程碑是發布了我們的第一款產品。依照 ISO 標準定義，通過最高汽車功能安全等級 ACLD 的獨立認證。

This certification is a testament to indie's rigorous internal development processes and also the silicon design innovation deployed to ensure a safe and predictable chip response in the event of a failure. The independent assessment and certification of this solution brings confidence to our customers' mission critical powertrain use case and highlights Idy's ability to deliver the most demanding of applications.

此項認證證明了獨立公司嚴格的內部開發流程以及為確保在發生故障時晶片能夠安全且可預測地響應而部署的矽片設計創新。對此解決方案的獨立評估和認證為我們的客戶的關鍵任務動力系統用例帶來了信心，並凸顯了 Idy 提供最苛刻應用程式的能力。

Finally, our photonics business continues its class leading product innovation in the LIDAR field, announcing the fourth quarter an in-house optical component integration capability for those customers needing turnkey photonic solutions for automotive and mobility sensing applications. We also announced our latest proprietary technology innovation for single frequency lasers, bringing exceptional wavelength stability and spectral purity, which require very high brightness, color reproducibility, and contrast ratio.

最後，我們的光子學業務繼續在雷射雷達領域保持一流的產品創新，並宣佈在第四季度為需要汽車和移動感測應用交鑰匙光子解決方案的客戶提供內部光學元件整合能力。我們也宣布了針對單頻雷射的最新專有技術創新，該技術具有出色的波長穩定性和光譜純度，可滿足非常高的亮度、色彩再現性和對比度的要求。

Despite challenging market conditions, the megatrend driven vehicle semiconductor content growth will easily outpace vehicle production, driving the average semiconductor content per vehicle in 2025 beyond $1000 and 2 times to 3 times its value for premium vehicles and e-Vehicles. In this context, with our unrivaled product portfolio, indie remains incredibly well positioned to benefit from this semiconductor value growth over the long term.

儘管市場條件充滿挑戰，但大趨勢驅動的汽車半導體內容成長將輕鬆超過汽車產量，推動 2025 年每輛汽車的平均半導體內容價值超過 1000 美元，高檔汽車和電動車的價值將是其 2 到 3 倍。在此背景下，憑藉我們無與倫比的產品組合，獨立公司仍然處於非常有利的位置，可以從長期的半導體價值成長中獲益。

M&A has always been an important element of our strategy to enhance our technology and IP portfolio. Given our current strong balance sheet, we continue to appraise multiple opportunities focusing on our core business areas.

併購一直是我們增強技術和智慧財產權組合策略的重要組成部分。鑑於我們目前強勁的資產負債表，我們將繼續評估專注於核心業務領域的多個機會。

I will now turn the call over to Raja for our discussion of our Q4 results and Q1 outlook.

現在我將把電話轉給 Raja，討論我們的第四季業績和第一季展望。

Thanks Donald. Despite the challenging backdrop, indie delivered strong execution in 2024, growing revenue sequentially through the year while maintaining healthy growth margins above 50%. Our fourth quarter revenue grew 7.5% sequentially to $58 million consistent with the midpoint of our outlook and demonstrating continued outsized growth in our target markets. Non-GAAP gross profit was $29.2 million or 50.4%, and flat sequentially in line with our outlook.

謝謝唐納德。儘管面臨挑戰，獨立遊戲在 2024 年仍表現強勁，全年營收連續成長，同時維持 50% 以上的健康成長利潤率。我們的第四季營收季增 7.5%，達到 5,800 萬美元，與我們預期的中位數一致，並表明我們的目標市場持續保持超額成長。非公認會計準則毛利為 2,920 萬美元，即 50.4%，與上一季持平，符合我們的預期。

R&D expense was $31.5 million with SG&A at $11.9 million bringing total operating expenses to $43.4 million consistent with our outlook. As a result, our fourth quarter non-gap operating loss was $14.2 million an improvement of 16% sequentially. With net interest expense of $1.2 million our net loss was $15.4 million and loss per share was $0.07 on a base of 205.7 million shares.

研發費用為 3,150 萬美元，銷售、一般及行政費用為 1,190 萬美元，總營運費用達 4,340 萬美元，與我們的預期一致。因此，我們第四季的非差距營運虧損為 1,420 萬美元，季增 16%。淨利息支出為 120 萬美元，我們的淨虧損為 1,540 萬美元，每股虧損為 0.07 美元（基於 2.057 億股）。

Turning to the balance sheet, in December, we issued $218.5 million of 2029 convertible notes, which yielded net proceeds of approximately $188 million after accounting for the cost of issuance and the cap call. The notes carry a coupon of 3.5% at an effective strike price of $8.06 after taking into account the cap call feature.

談到資產負債表，12 月，我們發行了 2.185 億美元的 2029 年可轉換票據，在扣除發行成本和上限要求後，淨收益約為 1.88 億美元。考慮上限贖回功能後，該票據的票面利率為 3.5%，有效執行價格為 8.06 美元。

Accordingly, we exited the fourth quarter with total cash of $284.5 million up from $107.2 million from the prior quarter. Our strength and cash position improves our ability to capitalize on potential acquisitions while providing ample capital for general corporate purposes.

因此，第四季末我們的現金總額為 2.845 億美元，高於上一季的 1.072 億美元。我們的實力和現金狀況提高了我們利用潛在收購的能力，同時為一般公司用途提供了充足的資金。

Moving to our outlook as we look to 2025, we're generally positive as we see significant growth drivers from our new product launches in the second half of the year and beyond. However, we recognize market uncertainties exist around inventory levels, tariffs, and the broader macroeconomic environment which present heightened industry headwinds impacting the slope of production ramps.

展望 2025 年，我們總體上持樂觀態度，因為我們看到下半年及以後推出的新產品將帶來顯著的成長動力。然而，我們認識到，庫存水準、關稅和更廣泛的宏觀經濟環境存在市場不確定性，這些不確定性加劇了產業阻力，影響了產量成長的斜率。

Consequently, in Q1 2025, we expect to deliver revenue within the range of $52.5 million to $57.5 million or $55 million at the midpoint, down 5% sequentially, but up 5% versus the prior year period. Based on the anticipated product mix, we expect Q1 gross margins to be in the 49% to 50% range. We expect OpEx of $42 million with approximately $31.5 million of R&D expense and $10.5 million of SG&A expense. Below the line, we expect net interest expense of approximately $1.3 million with no cash tax expense.

因此，我們預計 2025 年第一季的營收將在 5,250 萬美元至 5,750 萬美元之間，中間值為 5,500 萬美元，季減 5%，但比去年同期成長 5%。根據預期的產品組合，我們預計第一季的毛利率將在 49% 至 50% 之間。我們預計營運支出為 4,200 萬美元，其中研發費用約為 3,150 萬美元，銷售、一般及行政費用為 1,050 萬美元。在此線之下，我們預計淨利息支出約為 130 萬美元，且無現金稅支出。

Assuming the midpoint of the revenue ranges and with 211 million shares outstanding, we expect an $0.08 net loss per share. While our outlook for Q1 is down sequentially, we remain optimistic and committed to our plan. We continue to move forward with heightened operational discipline, remaining squarely focused on delivering highly innovative and differentiated offerings to our customers and fully expect to emerge stronger from the challenging market backdrop.

假設收入範圍的中點和 2.11 億股流通股，我們預期每股淨虧損 0.08 美元。儘管我們對第一季的預期環比下降，但我們仍然保持樂觀並致力於我們的計劃。我們將繼續加強營運紀律，專注於為客戶提供高度創新和差異化的產品，並完全期望在充滿挑戰的市場背景下變得更加強大。

Finally, on the last call, I mentioned we had initiated an OX review to drive improved operational efficiencies across the company. I'm pleased to report to date this program has resulted in a $2 million reduction in our run rate quarterly non-gap operating expenses when comparing $324.44 million to our Q12025 outlook of $42 million. We look forward to providing further updates regarding this initiatives in forthcoming quarters. With that, I'll turn the call back to Donald for his closing remarks.

最後，在最後一次電話會議上，我提到我們已經啟動了 OX 審查，以推動整個公司的營運效率提高。我很高興地報告，到目前為止，該計劃已使我們的季度非差距營運費用減少了 200 萬美元，而我們的 2025 年第一季預期為 3.2444 億美元，而我們的預期為 4,200 萬美元。我們期待在未來幾季提供有關此舉措的進一步更新。說完這些，我將把電話轉回給唐納德，請他作最後發言。

Thanks Raja. As we close out 2024, indie's competitive position continues to strengthen through our focused execution and expanding technology leadership. While navigating temporary industry dynamics, we are prepared for our transformative 2025 with multiple growth catalysts, including our flagship radar program moving to production and vision processor ramps at major global OEMs. Our compelling and uniquely differentiated product offering underscores indie's strong position to deliver long-term growth above market forecasts. Ensuring we are the semiconductor port of call for automakers and tier ones globally.

謝謝 Raja。隨著 2024 年的結束，透過我們專注的執行和不斷擴大的技術領導地位，獨立的競爭地位將繼續增強。在應對暫時的行業動態的同時，我們已為變革性的 2025 年做好了準備，並採取了多種增長催化劑，包括我們的旗艦雷達項目轉向生產和視覺處理器在全球主要 OEM 上的推廣。我們提供引人注目且獨特的差異化產品，彰顯了獨立遊戲在實現超越市場預測的長期成長方面的強大地位。確保我們成為全球汽車製造商和一級供應商的半導體停靠港。

That concludes our prepared remarks. Operator, please open the line for questions.

我們的準備好的演講到此結束。接線員，請打開熱線來回答問題。

Thank you. We will now be conducting a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝。我們現在將進行問答環節。（操作員指示）

Suji Desilva, Roth Capital Partners.

蘇吉‧德席爾瓦 (Suji Desilva)，羅斯資本合夥人。

Hi Donald, Raja, Mark. Maybe you could talk first about the second half 25 ramp. I think some new products coming on which one, which of those products do you expect to have the most impact on incremental growth out of the ones that will be coming online programs and products in the second half of '25.

你好，唐納德、拉賈、馬克。也許您可以先談談後半段 25 號坡道。我認為即將推出的一些新產品，在 2025 年下半年即將推出的線上計劃和產品中，您預計哪些產品會對增量成長產生最大影響。

Well, we have multiple products ramping in multiple different spaces, as we mentioned in the prepared remarks. The larger ones that we always highlight, of course, the vision products are high ASP and a relatively small volume has a big impact on the revenue.

嗯，正如我們在準備好的評論中提到的那樣，我們有多個產品在多個不同的領域中發展。當然，我們一直強調的較大的產品，視覺產品的平均售價較高，而且相對較小的銷售量對收入有很大影響。

We expect to see the first revenue from a radar product also, but in addition to that, there are many products in the user experience space which all contribute, so we feel that we have a very nice.

我們也期望從雷達產品中獲得第一筆收入，但除此之外，使用者體驗領域還有許多產品可以做出貢獻，因此我們覺得我們擁有非常好的收入。

Pipeline which is now already in many cases Beginning to ramp or has even begun to ramp and we feel generally generally pretty good about what's going to happen in the second half of the year.

現在，在許多情況下，管道已經開始加速，甚至已經開始加速，我們對下半年的前景整體感覺相當樂觀。

Alright, and Donald, specifically on the corner radar program, I know you talked about a billion dollars dollar lifetime value.

好的，唐納德，特別是在角落雷達計劃上，我知道您談到了 10 億美元的終身價值。

What's the shape of the initial years of a few years of ramp into that run rate, starting the second half? How do we think about the first few years as we kind of track towards that billion dollarsllar lifetime value materializing?

從下半年開始，最初幾年的營運率成長如何？當我們朝著實現十億美元終身價值的目標邁進時，我們該如何考慮最初的幾年？

Well, it will ramp over an extended period. There are multiple OEMs through a tier one who will benefit from the technology and we will benefit from the revenue. I'd expect around through '26, '27, even into '28, and actually even in the '29, there'll be a long window of new design ones that we add. We don't do these sub segments, so we don't really talk about the general. Month by month and quarter by quarter and year by year ramp per product, but it is going to be very significant. And the billion-dollar lifetime value is maybe even a little bit on the conservative side.

嗯，它會在一段較長的時間內逐漸增加。有多家一級原始設備製造商將從該技術中受益，而我們也將從收入中受益。我預計在 26 年、27 年甚至 28 年，實際上甚至在 29 年，我們都會有一個較長的時間來添加新的設計。我們不做這些子部分，所以我們實際上不談論一般情況。每個產品的產量都會逐月、逐季、逐年增加，但增幅將非常顯著。而十億美元的終身價值甚至可能有點保守。

Okay, I appreciate that. Thanks.

好的，我很感激。謝謝。

Craig Ellis, B. Riley Securities.

克雷格·艾利斯 (Craig Ellis)，B. Riley 證券。

Yeah, this is Mayora Popuri on for Craig Ellis. I wanted to ask about kind of the OpEx management program that you guys have going on. Of course you, resulted in I think a $2 million dollar reduction, into 1, and you said that you're going to kind of keep working on this. Should I assume that the bulk of these OpEx management, reductions have already happened. Into 11 or is it something that you know is kind of just getting started and it's going to be more aggressively about the rest of the year.

是的，這是 Mayora Popuri 為 Craig Ellis 表演的。我想問一下你們正在進行的 OpEx 管理計劃。當然，我認為你把 200 萬美元減少了 100 萬美元，而且你說你會繼續努力。我是否應該假設這些營運支出管理的大部分已經減少。進入 11 還是您知道這只是剛開始的事情，並且會在今年剩餘時間內更加積極地進行。

Hey Mayer, this is Raja. Yeah, definitely more to come on that. I mean, just a couple of reference points here. Q4 OpEx was $43.4 million right? We provided guidance for Q1 at $42 million, so that's $1.4 million dollar sequential improvement. And from here I expect to see, $1 million to $2 million in run rate reductions as we approach the second half, late 205.

嘿，Mayer，我是 Raja。是的，肯定會有更多內容。我的意思是，這裡僅有幾個參考點。Q4 營運支出是 4,340 萬美元，對嗎？我們為第一季提供的指導金額為 4,200 萬美元，因此比上一季增長了 140 萬美元。從現在開始，我預計隨著我們接近下半年，即 205 年末，運行率將減少 100 萬至 200 萬美元。

Okay, yeah, thank you, and just sort of shifting gears now, I wanted to ask about kind of the impact of, geopolitics and all these tariffs kind of going on at the same time.

好的，是的，謝謝，現在換個話題，我想問一下地緣政治和所有這些關稅同時發生的影響。

Are these impacts sort of necessarily short term? Are they sort of being felt in kind of maybe the 1st and 2nd quarters and not really affecting long term designs, or are there some broader challenges to design in say a market like China?

這些影響一定是短期的嗎？這些影響是否會在第一季和第二季有所體現，但不會對長期設計產生實際影響，還是說在像中國這樣的市場進行設計會面臨更廣泛的挑戰？

At this point, I would say the turbulence is short term because the nature of the tariffs and how they're going to be imposed is still not fixed. The threat of what could happen is causing some short term uncertainty and causing certain OEMs, particularly to pause some of their planning processes in case they have to relocate the geography of where they actually produce things.

目前，我認為動盪是短期的，因為關稅的性質及其實施方式仍未確定。可能發生的威脅正在造成一些短期的不確定性，並導致某些原始設備製造商暫停部分規劃流程，以防他們必須重新安置實際生產地點。

How things work with China in the long term it really kind of depends on their reaction to what might happen. All that being said, for our supply chain, we manufacture in China for China and we manufacture outside of China for outside of China. So we should be all set in that sense when the modules manufactured in China were placed under tariffs under the last Trump administration.

從長遠來看，與中國的關係如何實際上取決於他們對可能發生的事情的反應。綜上所述，對於我們的供應鏈，我們在中國為中國生產產品，也在中國境外為中國境外生產產品。因此，當上屆川普政府對中國製造的模組徵收關稅時，我們應該做好一切準備。

Our T1 customers were able to move the production to other geographies, so we kind of went through that already. At this point it is very much a short term impact we see. The long term implications we're not 100% sure about yet, but at this point it doesn't seem that it would directly affect us.

我們的 T1 客戶能夠將生產轉移到其他地區，所以我們已經經歷了這個過程。目前，我們看到的只是短期影響。我們尚不能 100% 確定其長期影響，但目前看來它不會直接影響我們。

Okay, thank you so much.

好的，非常感謝。

Cody Acree, The Benchmark Company.

科迪·阿克里（Cody Acree），基準公司。

Thanks guys for taking my questions. Let me start with, earlier this last week I guess with ADI's comments about an improving macro, any comments, if you've been able to to look at their comments, I guess, as they've talked about a healthier inventory, and maybe a better macro demand curve which seems to be a bit contrary to what you're saying here.

謝謝大家回答我的問題。首先，我想上週早些時候，ADI 發表了關於宏觀經濟改善的評論，如果您能夠查看他們的評論，我想，他們談到了更健康的庫存，也許還有更好的宏觀需求曲線，這似乎與您在這裡所說的有點相反。

Yeah, I mean, I think the feedback from from our peers has been very mixed and very varied. You can find commentary from others which would contradict what they're seeing. We can only comment from our own perspective for sure inventory levels have significantly improved for us, but that being said, the macro environment is still choppy.

是的，我認為來自我們同行的回饋非常複雜且多樣化。您會發現其他人的評論與他們所看到的觀點相矛盾。我們只能從自己的角度發表評論，當然我們的庫存水準確實已經顯著改善，但話雖如此，宏觀環境仍然不穩定。

The tariffs are just one aspect of the backdrop that's causing uncertainty in the market. I mean, we cited the example of the F-150 refresh being delayed by one year. These things are generally not helping and you know we still expect a fairly muted AR for the automotive market for this year, which we'd already planned into our tour guide.

關稅只是造成市場不確定性的因素。我的意思是，我們舉了 F-150 更新延後一年的例子。這些事情通常沒有幫助，你知道，我們仍然預計今年汽車市場的 AR 將會相當低調，我們已經將其納入了我們的旅遊指南中。

I guess Donald, it doesn't sound like you have a lot of confidence that this macro environment is likely to improve. It doesn't sound like the tariffs are likely to come to any kind of conclusion anytime soon if the inventory is not the major issue. If the macro is a lingering problem, what does this say for the the balance of your 25 visibility that sounds like it has deteriorated in the last 90 days.

我想唐納德，聽起來你對宏觀環境的改善沒有太大的信心。如果庫存不是主要問題，那麼關稅似乎不太可能很快就達成任何結論。如果宏觀是一個揮之不去的問題，那麼這對你的 25 個可見性的平衡意味著什麼呢？聽起來它在過去 90 天內已經惡化。

Not specifically with the exception of the tariffs. We saw some slower rents for our new product introductions through Q1, but we still remain very confident and very optimistic and very positive about the outlook for the remainder of '25.

除關稅外，沒有其他特別規定。我們在第一季看到新產品推出的租金有所放緩，但我們對 25 年剩餘時間的前景仍然非常有信心、非常樂觀、非常積極。

We have a lot of Things in the pipe which are going to contribute materially to the revenue as we move through the year. So generally speaking we still feel very good about it and I think we're consistent in saying that we weren't expecting the macro to significantly recover through '25 in our previous comments and outlooks.

我們有很多正在籌備中的項目，這些項目將在全年為收入做出實質貢獻。所以總的來說，我們對此仍然感覺很好，而且我認為我們一致表示，在我們先前的評論和展望中，我們並不期望宏觀經濟在 25 年內出現顯著復甦。

All right, great. Thank you, guys.

好的，太好了。謝謝你們。

[Grant Johnson], UBS.

[格蘭特·約翰遜]，瑞銀。

Welcome. Hey guys, thanks. Could you talk a little bit about what you're seeing by geography and more detail? Are there any areas where channel inventories are in relatively better shape and you're seeing a little more favorable trends? And then the commentary about policy uncertainty is mostly US focused, but are you also seeing uncertainty in Europe given the portfolio emission standards or in any other geographies you would call out? Thanks so much.

歡迎。嘿，大家，謝謝。您能否從地理角度更詳細地談談您所看到的情況？有哪些地區的通路庫存狀況相對較好，並且您看到了更有利的趨勢？關於政策不確定性的評論主要集中在美國，但考慮到組合排放標準，您是否也看到歐洲或任何其他地區存在不確定性？非常感謝。

Well, taking the last first, I mean, I would say in Europe the concern and disruption in the market there is really due to some of the large European manufacturers losing share to Chinese manufacturers in one of the most profitable markets, and that's caused knock-on effect and some restructuring in some of those companies which have been well publicized that the macro events from the US focus stuff is very significant for us.

嗯，首先說最後一個問題，我想說，歐洲市場的擔憂和混亂實際上是由於一些大型歐洲製造商在利潤最高的市場之一中向中國製造商失去了市場份額，這引起了連鎖反應，一些公司進行了重組，這些公司已經廣為人知，而美國宏觀事件對我們來說非常重要。

So we have to make sure that we have mitigation plans in place for that because the US has been largely a home field market for us. We've always traded well in Detroit. But as regards inventory in the channels, as I said before, we actually, from our perspective, we can only comment really on what we see our inventory being in the channels, and we think most of that has reduced. There are still some isolated pockets where some inventory still exists.

因此，我們必須確保制定緩解計劃，因為美國基本上是我們的主場市場。我們在底特律的貿易一直都很好。但至於通路中的庫存，正如我之前所說，實際上，從我們的角度來看，我們只能評論我們所看到的渠道中的庫存，我們認為大部分庫存已經減少了。仍有一些孤立的地區存在一些庫存。

We've seen some relative strength over the last couple of quarters in the China market, although there was some seasonality also in the first few weeks of this year, which we also had to work through. Nothing specific that I could pick out about inventory saying that one of the areas is particularly worse for us than any other.

過去幾個季度，我們看到中國市場表現相對強勁，儘管今年頭幾週也存在一些季節性因素，我們也必須克服這些因素。關於庫存，我沒有什麼特別之處，可以說其中一個領域對我們來說比其他領域更糟。

Thanks. And then if I could have one follow up on the model, contract revenue is a little bit stronger in Q4 compared to prior quarters, and I think that helped gross margin a little bit. So could you talk a little bit about your expectations for that for 2025 or for 1Q? Thanks.

謝謝。然後，如果我可以對該模型進行跟進，那麼與前幾季度相比，第四季度的合約收入會稍微強勁一些，我認為這對毛利率有一點幫助。那麼，您能否談談對 2025 年或第一季的預期？謝謝。

Yeah, sure. So yeah. Contract revenue has been relatively flat, and if you look at the history of contract revenue has been coming down over time, and I think that trend will continue as we, increasingly focus on standard products and less on custom basics.

是的，當然。是的。合約收入一直相對平穩，如果你看一下合約收入的歷史，你會發現它一直在下降，而且我認為這種趨勢將會持續下去，因為我們越來越多地關注標準產品，而較少關注客製化基礎產品。

Great, thank you.

太好了，謝謝。

Anthony Stoss, Craig Hallam Capital Group.

安東尼·斯托斯（Anthony Stoss），克雷格·哈勒姆資本集團。

Hi guys, Donald, I don't want to follow up on the radar launch. I think, it had been planned kind of mid this year. Now you're saying late this year. When you take a step back, or let me just follow up on that for a second here. Did something change that pushed it from kind of Q3 to Q4, and then also when you take a step back and look at Bosch, Fakasa and the radar win, when they launch over the 1st 12 months, are they still kind of the expected revenue that you had thought they better, or have they shrunk?

大家好，唐納德，我不想跟進雷達發射的情況。我認為，這是在今年年中就已經計劃好的。現在您說的是今年晚些時候。當你退一步時，或者讓我在這裡稍微跟進一下。是否有任何變化將其從第三季度推遲到第四季度，然後當您退一步看看博世、Fakasa 和雷達的勝利時，當它們在前 12 個月推出時，它們是否仍然達到您認為更好的預期收入，還是已經縮水了？

So nothing has changed in the programs. We're still on track exactly to the same schedule that we were a quarter ago for radar, and indeed the other programs, we, we're not really into the deep part of the ramp yet to know for sure what the volumes are going to be, but at this point we still feel confident that they're going to drive significant revenue.

因此程序沒有任何改變。我們仍然按照一個季度前的計劃進行雷達項目，事實上，其他項目也一樣，我們還沒有真正進入深入的階段，還不能確定產量會是多少，但目前我們仍然有信心它們將帶來可觀的收入。

As they sell through into the OEMs we see constant design wins on a per model basis with with their end customers which are only adding to the pile. So if anything, we're seeing positive momentum in that space.

隨著它們向 OEM 廠商銷售產品，我們看到其最終客戶在每個型號上不斷獲得設計勝利，而這只會讓勝利更加豐厚。因此，無論如何，我們都看到了該領域的積極勢頭。

And then a follow up for Raj on the gross margin expectations late this year. I think you guys have been targeting 55% for the December quarter. With things kind of slowing a bit here, do you still think you could attain that 55% gross margin level?

然後，Raj 將跟進今年稍後的毛利率預期。我認為你們 12 月季度的目標已經達到 55%。由於這裡的發展速度有點放緩，您仍然認為可以達到 55% 的毛利率水平嗎？

Yeah, I mean, so, we guided 49 to 50 for Q1, and that's really just a reflection of, our expectations for product mix in Q1 and contract revenue, kind of ticking down as a percentage of total. The good news is that as the year progresses, we are going to have revenue, incremental revenue growth and contributions in the ADA space, and those are all highly accreted to our corporate average gross margins. So, that those will definitely help whether we get 55 exiting 2025, I mean that remains to be seen, but we'll definitely see incremental improvements from here.

是的，我的意思是，我們對第一季的預期是 49 到 50，這實際上只是反映了我們對第一季產品組合和合約收入的預期，佔總收入的百分比有所下降。好消息是，隨著時間的推移，我們將在 ADA 領域獲得收入、增量收入成長和貢獻，這些都與我們公司的平均毛利率高度相關。所以，這些肯定會對我們在 2025 年能否達到 55 個有幫助，我的意思是這還有待觀察，但我們肯定會從現在開始看到逐步的改進。

Alright thanks guys.

好的，謝謝大家。

John Tamang, CJS Securities.

CJS 證券的 John Tamang。

Hi, this is Will on for John. How are you positioning to mitigate the impact of potential tariffs? Thanks.

大家好，我是威爾，代表約翰。您如何定位以減輕潛在關稅的影響？謝謝。

So we don't see tariffs being levied necessarily on our products as they go to the tier ones for conversion into modules.

因此，當我們的產品進入一級供應商轉換成模組時，我們不認為必然會徵收關稅。

Really what we're seeing is a knock-on effect on the uncertainty of the planning capability of the OEMs by virtue of the fact that they are having to anticipate tariffs on either raw materials or between geographies, and that's causing them to consider. The location of where they may manufacture things, so it's more of a knock-on effect rather than a direct impact of our products are 20% more expensive or 20% less competitive.

我們真正看到的是，由於原始設備製造商必須預測原材料或地區間關稅，因此他們的規劃能力的不確定性產生了連鎖反應，這促使他們考慮。他們可能生產產品的地點，因此這更多的是一種連鎖反應，而不是直接影響，我們的產品價格上漲 20% 或競爭力下降 20%。

That's all for me. Thank you.

對我來說就這些了。謝謝。

Thank you. And we have reached the end of the question and answer session and therefore I'll now turn the call back over to Donald for closing remarks.

謝謝。問答環節已經結束，因此我現在將電話轉回給唐納德作結束語。

Thanks very much everybody for your time and see you at the investor conferences through the remainder of the quarter. Thank you and this concludes.

非常感謝大家抽出時間，我們在本季剩餘時間的投資人會議上再見。謝謝，到此結束。

Today's conference, and you may disconnect your line at this time.

今天的會議，此時您可以斷開線路。

Thank you for your participation.

感謝您的參與。