iHeartMedia, Inc. (IHRT) 2025 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Good afternoon, and welcome to iHeartMedia's fourth-quarter 2025 earnings call.

下午好，歡迎參加 iHeartMedia 2025 年第四季財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

As a reminder, this conference call is being recorded. I would now like to turn the call over to Andrey Hart, Senior Vice President of Investor Relations. Thank you. Please go ahead.

再次提醒，本次電話會議正在錄音。現在我將把電話交給投資者關係高級副總裁安德烈·哈特。謝謝。請繼續。

Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for taking the time to join us for our fourth-quarter 2025 earnings call. Joining me for today's discussion are Bob Pittman, our Chairman and CEO; and Rich Bressler, our President and COO; and Mike McGuinness, our CFO.

各位下午好，感謝各位抽空參加我們2025年第四季財報電話會議。今天與我一起進行討論的有：我們的董事長兼首席執行官鮑勃·皮特曼；我們的總裁兼首席營運官里奇·布雷斯勒；以及我們的首席財務官邁克·麥吉尼斯。

At the conclusion of our prepared remarks, management will take your questions. In addition to our press release, we have an earnings presentation available on our website that you can use to follow along with our remarks.

在我們發言結束後，管理階層將回答各位的問題。除了新聞稿之外，我們還在網站上提供了一份收益報告演示文稿，您可以參考這份簡報來配合我們的演講。

Please note that this call may include forward-looking statements regarding our financial performance and operating results. These statements are based on management's current expectations, and actual results could differ from what is stated as a result of certain factors identified on today's call and in the company's SEC filings, including our recent 8-K filing.

請注意，本次電話會議可能包含有關我們財務績效及經營成果的前瞻性陳述。這些聲明是基於管理層目前的預期，實際結果可能與聲明有所不同，這是由於今天電話會議和公司向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件（包括我們最近提交的 8-K 文件）中確定的某些因素造成的。

Additionally, during this call, we will refer to certain non-GAAP financial measures. Reconciliations between GAAP and non-GAAP financial measures are included in our earnings release, earnings presentation, and our SEC filings, which are available in the Investor Relations section of our website.

此外，在本次電話會議中，我們將提及某些非GAAP財務指標。GAAP 和非 GAAP 財務指標之間的調節表包含在我們的獲利報告、獲利簡報和提交給美國證券交易委員會的文件中，這些文件可在我們網站的投資者關係部分查閱。

And now I'll turn the call over to Bob.

現在我把電話交給鮑伯。

Thanks, Andrey. Good afternoon, everyone. We're pleased with our overall performance in 2025, especially given it was a nonpolitical year. In the fourth-quarter, we generated adjusted EBITDA of $220 million at the midpoint of our previously provided guidance range of $200 million to $240 million, compared to $246 million in the prior year, which, as a reminder, benefited from approximately $80 million of political revenue. Our consolidated revenue for the quarter was $1.1 billion, up 0.8% compared to the prior year quarter and above our guidance of down low single digits. Excluding the impact of political, our consolidated revenue was up 7.7%.

謝謝你，安德烈。大家下午好。我們對2025年的整體表現感到滿意，尤其考慮到這是非政治性的一年。第四季度，我們調整後的 EBITDA 為 2.2 億美元，處於我們先前給出的 2 億美元至 2.4 億美元指引範圍的中點，而去年同期為 2.46 億美元。需要提醒的是，去年同期受益於約 8,000 萬美元的政治收入。本季綜合營收為 11 億美元，比上年同期成長 0.8%，高於我們先前預期的個位數低成長。剔除政治因素的影響，我們的綜合收入成長了7.7%。

Turning to our individual operating segments. Now the Digital Audio Group generated fourth-quarter revenue of $387 million, up 14.1% versus prior year and above our previously provided guidance of up high single digits. The Digital Audio Group generated fourth-quarter adjusted EBITDA of $132 million, up 10.7% versus prior year. The Digital Audio Group's adjusted EBITDA margins were 34.1%, and we finished the full year at 34.4%, up from 32.5% in the prior year, which is consistent with our stated goal of achieving full year adjusted EBITDA margins in the mid-30s, and we see further upside from here.

接下來，我們來看看各個營運部門的狀況。數位音訊集團第四季營收達 3.87 億美元，比上年同期成長 14.1%，高於我們先前給出的高個位數成長預期。數位音訊集團第四季度調整後 EBITDA 為 1.32 億美元，比去年同期成長 10.7%。數位音訊集團的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 34.1%，全年達到 34.4%，高於上年的 32.5%，這與我們設定的全年調整後 EBITDA 利潤率達到 30% 左右的目標一致，而且我們認為還有進一步增長的空間。

Within the Digital Audio Group, our podcast revenue momentum continues, and grew to $174 million, up 24.5% compared to prior year, which was above our guidance of up in the mid-teens. And in Q4, approximately 47% of our podcasting revenue was generated by our local sales force, up from about 13% in Q4 of 2020, demonstrating the unique advantage of having what we believe is the largest local sales force in media, with a presence across 160 markets in addition to our strong national sales force.

在數位音訊集團內部，我們的播客收入動能持續成長，達到 1.74 億美元，比上年成長 24.5%，高於我們先前預測的 15% 左右的成長。第四季度，我們約 47% 的播客收入來自本地銷售團隊，高於 2020 年第四季度的約 13%，這表明我們擁有媒體行業最大的本地銷售團隊的獨特優勢，該團隊業務遍及 160 個市場，此外我們還擁有強大的全國銷售團隊。

And not only do we have the number one audience in podcasting as measured by both Podtrac and Triton, the podcast industry's primary measurement services that measure actual downloads and users, we believe we also have the most profitable podcasting business in the United States.

我們不僅擁有播客領域第一的聽眾群體（根據 Podtrac 和 Triton 這兩個衡量播客行業實際下載量和用戶數的主要衡量服務機構的統計），而且我們相信，我們還擁有美國最賺錢的播客業務。

Our podcasting EBITDA margins remain accretive to our total company EBITDA margins, and we achieved this by continuing to apply rigorous financial discipline to building, partnering, and even renewing our podcast relationships. And one more thing to note. A key to our success in building our podcast business has been that podcasting is, in essence, radio on demand.

我們的播客業務 EBITDA 利潤率持續成長，從而提升了公司整體 EBITDA 利潤率。我們透過持續運用嚴格的財務紀律來建立、合作，甚至更新我們的播客合作關係，實現了這一目標。還有一點要注意。我們成功打造播客業務的關鍵在於，播客本質上就是按需播放的廣播。

For us, it's a truly adjacent and complementary business. We operate Broadcast Radio stations across the country, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with almost 90% of the US population listening every month, and we have the unique assets and expertise, including programming, production and distribution at scale, which power our strong podcast momentum in an expanding podcast marketplace.

對我們來說，這是一個真正相鄰且互補的業務。我們在全國各地經營廣播電台，每週 7 天、每天 24 小時播出，每月有近 90% 的美國人口收聽我們的節目。我們擁有獨特的資產和專業知識，包括大規模的節目製作、發行和分發，這為我們在不斷擴大的播客市場中強勁的播客發展勢頭提供了動力。

In the fourth-quarter, our non-podcast digital revenue grew 6.8% compared to prior year. Turning now to the Multiplatform Group, which includes our Broadcast Radio, Networks and Events businesses. Fourth-quarter revenue was $665 million, down 2.8% versus prior year and in line with our previously provided guidance range of down low single digits.

第四季度，我們的非播客數位營收比去年同期成長了 6.8%。現在讓我們來看看多平台集團，其中包括我們的廣播電台、網路和活動業務。第四季營收為 6.65 億美元，年減 2.8%，與我們先前給出的個位數百分比下降的預期範圍一致。

Excluding the impact of political advertising, Multiplatform Group revenue was up 2.3%. The Multiplatform Group's adjusted EBITDA was $129 million. And as a reminder, the prior year benefited from approximately $40 million of political advertising revenue. We remain confident we can return the Multiplatform Group to EBITDA growth, and to reach that goal, in addition to our continuing efforts on cost, we're focused on four major drivers.

剔除政治廣告的影響，多平台集團的收入成長了 2.3%。多平台集團調整後的 EBITDA 為 1.29 億美元。另外提醒一下，上一年政治廣告收入約 4,000 萬美元。我們仍然有信心能夠使多平台集團恢復 EBITDA 成長，為了實現這一目標，除了持續努力控製成本外，我們還專注於四個主要驅動因素。

Number one, programmatic. We're the first radio company whose broadcast inventory is available through the existing programmatic buying platforms, enabling our Broadcast Radio inventory to participate in the growing programmatic TAM. And as a reminder of the progress we've already made in this effort, we have partnership agreements with Amazon DSP, Yahoo! DSP, and others to include our Broadcast Radio inventory and their programmatic platforms. In the case of Amazon, we expect our Broadcast Radio inventory to be included in their programmatic platform in the second half of the year.

第一，程序化購買。我們是第一家廣播資源可透過現有程序化購買平台取得的廣播公司，使我們的廣播資源能夠參與不斷增長的程序化TAM市場。為了提醒大家我們在這方面已經取得的進展，我們與亞馬遜DSP、雅虎等公司達成了合作協議。DSP，以及其他包括我們的廣播電台資源及其程序化平台。就亞馬遜而言，我們預計我們的廣播電台廣告資源將在今年下半年納入其程式化平台。

Second, integrated sales. We serve as a true marketing partner for our Broadcast Radio clients and agencies. This marketing approach, which focuses on bringing all of our advertising assets to bear and not treating each campaign as a stand-alone transaction increasingly allows us to develop complex media and marketing plans utilizing the unique power of radio to drive the results our partners are looking for, including enhancements of the nonbroadcast components of their other media.

其次，整合銷售。我們是廣播電台客戶和代理商真正的行銷合作夥伴。這種行銷方式著重於調動我們所有的廣告資源，而不是將每次廣告活動視為獨立的交易，這使我們能夠制定複雜的媒體和行銷計劃，利用廣播的獨特力量來推動合作夥伴所尋求的結果，包括增強其其他媒體的非廣播部分。

Third, our broadcast outperformance. In 2025, we outperformed the radio industry revenue performance by 500 basis points according to Miller Kaplan. And given the unique scale of our audience, our ad tech platforms, and the fact that we have the largest local sales force and audio, we expect to continue to increase our share of the radio TAM moving forward.

第三，我們的廣播表現優異。根據 Miller Kaplan 的預測，到 2025 年，我們的營收表現將比廣播業的平均收入表現高出 500 個基點。鑑於我們受眾規模的獨特性、我們的廣告科技平台，以及我們擁有最大的本地銷售團隊和音訊資源，我們預計未來將繼續提高我們在廣播TAM（目標市場規模）中的份額。

Fourth, our resilient radio audience. There are more broadcast radio listeners today than there were 20 years ago, and one constant in advertising is that the revenue always follows consumer usage, even if it sometimes takes a while. As the percentage of Broadcast Radio usage among consumers is far greater than the share of the advertising revenue that Broadcast Radio enjoys, we remain encouraged about this upside potential. We also see some important partnership announcements as validation of the power of Broadcast Radio with important companies like Netflix and TikTok, coming to partner with us and our Broadcast Radio assets.

第四，我們擁有堅韌的廣播聽眾。如今的廣播聽眾比 20 年前多得多，廣告業的一個不規律是，收入總是跟隨消費者的使用情況而變化，即使有時需要一段時間。由於廣播電台在消費者中的使用比例遠大於其廣告收入份額，我們仍然對這種成長潛力感到鼓舞。我們也看到一些重要的合作公告，證明了廣播電台的實力，像 Netflix 和 TikTok 這樣的重要公司都與我們以及我們的廣播電台資產建立了合作關係。

We're now premiering new music with TikTok and radio including last week's preview of Bruno Mars' new album, which set a new bar for the largest album preview and demonstrates the unique power of iHeart and TikTok working together to help artists achieve their goals. And it's also interesting to note that if you look at our video podcasts that are on Netflix today, some of the most popular ones are actually derived directly from our radio shows, including the Breakfast Club and Bobby Bones, more evidence of the unique power of our radio personalities and assets.

我們現在透過 TikTok 和電台首發新音樂，包括上週 Bruno Mars 新專輯的預覽，這為最大的專輯預覽樹立了新的標桿，並展示了 iHeart 和 TikTok 攜手合作幫助藝術家實現目標的獨特力量。值得注意的是，如果你看看我們目前在 Netflix 上的視訊播客，你會發現其中一些最受歡迎的節目實際上直接源自我們的廣播節目，包括《早餐俱樂部》和《鮑比·博恩斯》，這進一步證明了我們廣播節目主持人和資源的獨特影響力。

And finally, before I turn it over to Rich, let me give you our view of the current advertising marketplace. Last year, we successfully navigated an uncertain ad market, and although there was definitely some disruption to the advertising marketplace in this quarter due to major weather events, and there still remains some macro uncertainty as well as clearly evidenced by the events in the Middle East over the weekend we view the advertising marketplace as reasonably healthy, and we still expect a year of meaningful EBITDA and free cash flow growth for iHeart, and Rich will provide you with those details.

最後，在把麥克風交給 Rich 之前，讓我先談談我們對目前廣告市場的看法。去年，我們成功應對了充滿不確定性的廣告市場。儘管本季由於重大天氣事件，廣告市場確實受到了一些幹擾，而且宏觀經濟仍然存在一些不確定性，正如週末中東發生的事件所清楚地表明的那樣，但我們認為廣告市場總體上是健康的，我們仍然預計iHeart今年的EBITDA和自由現金流將實現顯著增長，Rich將為您提供這些細節。

And with that, I'll turn it over to Rich.

接下來，我將把麥克風交給里奇。

Thank you, Bob, and good afternoon. Our Q4 2025 consolidated revenue was above our guidance of down low single digits and was up 0.8% compared to the prior year quarter. Excluding the impact of political, our consolidated revenue was up 7.7%.

謝謝你，鮑勃，下午好。我們 2025 年第四季的合併收入高於我們先前預期的個位數低成長，比去年同期成長了 0.8%。剔除政治因素的影響，我們的綜合收入成長了7.7%。

Let me provide you with some additional detail on our advertising revenue performance this quarter. As a reminder, one of our strengths is our diversified advertising revenues. There is no advertising category greater than about 5% of our total advertising revenue, and no individual advertiser that is more than 2% of our total advertising revenue.

讓我向您提供一些關於我們本季廣告收入表現的更多細節。再次提醒大家，我們的優勢之一是廣告收入多元化。沒有哪個廣告類別占我們廣告總收入的比例超過 5% 左右，也沒有任何單一廣告商占我們廣告總收入的比例超過 2%。

In the fourth-quarter, the largest category gainers in terms of absolute dollars were financial services, retail, entertainment and beauty and fitness, and the four categories that declined the most in terms of absolute dollars were political, government, restaurants and food and beverage. And in the fourth-quarter, our five largest advertising categories in terms of absolute dollars were health care, homebuilding and improvement, financial services, retail, and entertainment.

第四季度，以絕對金額計算，成長幅度最大的類別是金融服務、零售、娛樂以及美容和健身；以絕對金額計算，下降幅度最大的四個類別是政治、政府、餐飲以及食品和飲料。第四季度，以絕對金額計算，我們最大的五個廣告類別是醫療保健、房屋建造和裝修、金融服務、零售和娛樂。

Our consolidated direct operating expenses increased 2.4% for the quarter. This increase was primarily driven by higher variable content costs associated with the revenue growth of our digital businesses partially offset by a decrease in costs incurred in connection with our cost savings initiatives as well as decreased employee compensation costs.

本季我們的綜合直接營運費用成長了2.4%。這一增長主要是由於數位業務收入成長帶來的可變內容成本增加所致，部分被成本節約計劃帶來的成本下降以及員工薪酬成本的降低所抵消。

Our consolidated SG&A expenses increased 4.6% for the quarter. This increase was primarily driven by expenses related to our noncash co-marketing partnerships, partially offset by a decrease in costs incurred in connection with our cost savings initiatives, as well as decreased employee compensation costs.

本季我們的綜合銷售、管理及行政費用成長了 4.6%。這一增長主要是由於與非現金聯合行銷夥伴關係相關的支出，部分被成本節約計劃帶來的成本下降以及員工薪酬成本的降低所抵消。

We generated a fourth-quarter GAAP operating income of $86 million compared to an operating income of $105 million in the prior year quarter. We generated adjusted EBITDA of $220 million at the midpoint of our previously provided guidance range of $200 million to $240 million and compared to $246 million in the prior year.

我們第四季以美國通用會計準則 (GAAP) 計算的營業收入為 8,600 萬美元，而去年同期營業收入為 1.05 億美元。我們調整後的 EBITDA 為 2.2 億美元，處於我們先前提供的 2 億美元至 2.4 億美元指引範圍的中點，而上一年為 2.46 億美元。

As a reminder, Q4 of 2024 benefited from approximately $80 million of political advertising revenue. Before I turn to our segment performances, I want to give you an update on our cost savings initiatives. We are currently implementing $50 million of new in-year cost savings, which will start to benefit from beginning in Q2. This is in addition to the $50 million of cost reductions we announced on last quarter's call, which will bring our 2026 in-year cost savings to a total of $100 million.

需要提醒的是，2024 年第四季政治廣告收入約為 8,000 萬美元。在介紹我們各業務板塊的業績之前，我想先向大家報告我們的成本節約舉措。我們目前正在實施 5,000 萬美元的年度新成本節約措施，這些措施將從第二季開始產生效益。除此之外，我們在上個季度的電話會議上宣布了 5,000 萬美元的成本削減計劃，這將使我們 2026 年的年度成本節約總額達到 1 億美元。

And as a reminder, we achieved the previously announced $150 million of net cost savings in 2025, and we continue to work on the efficiency of our operating structure, including using technologies like AI-powered tools and services.

再次提醒大家，我們已實現先前宣布的 2025 年淨成本節約 1.5 億美元的目標，並且我們將繼續努力提高營運結構的效率，包括使用人工智慧工具和服務等技術。

Turning now to the performance of our operating segments. In the fourth-quarter, the Digital Audio Group's revenue was $387 million, up 14.1% year-over-year and above our guidance of up high single digits. The Digital Audio Group's adjusted EBITDA was $132 million, up 10.7% year-over-year, and our Q4 adjusted EBITDA margins were 34.1%, compared to 35.1% in the prior year.

現在來看我們各業務部門的業績。第四季度，數位音訊集團的營收為 3.87 億美元，年增 14.1%，高於我們先前預期的高個位數成長。數位音訊集團的調整後 EBITDA 為 1.32 億美元，年成長 10.7%；第四季調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 34.1%，而去年同期為 35.1%。

Within the Digital Audio Group, our podcasting revenue was $174 million, which grew 24.5% year-over-year, and above the guidance we provided of up mid-teens. Our fourth-quarter nonpodcasting digital revenue grew 6.8% year-over-year to $213 million.

在數位音訊集團中，我們的播客收入為 1.74 億美元，年成長 24.5%，高於我們先前給出的 15% 左右的預期。我們第四季非播客數位營收年增 6.8%，達到 2.13 億美元。

Turning now to the Multiplatform Group. Revenue was $665 million, down 2.8% compared to prior year, in line with our previously provided guidance range. Excluding the impact of political revenue, our Multiplatform Group revenue was up 2.3%.

現在轉向多平台組。營收為 6.65 億美元，比上年下降 2.8%，與我們先前提供的預期範圍一致。剔除政治收入的影響，我們的多平台集團收入成長了 2.3%。

Adjusted EBITDA was $129 million, down 14.2% from $150 million in the prior year quarter. As a reminder, the Multiplatform Group's prior year Q4 adjusted EBITDA benefited from approximately $40 million of political advertising revenue.

調整後 EBITDA 為 1.29 億美元，較上年同期的 1.5 億美元下降 14.2%。需要提醒的是，多平台集團上年同期第四季調整後的 EBITDA 受惠於約 4,000 萬美元的政治廣告收入。

The Multiplatform Group's adjusted EBITDA margins were 19.4%, compared to 21.9% in the prior year quarter, which, as a reminder, was a political year quarter. As we have previously discussed, some of the investment in our proprietary audience database, which is the foundation of our broadcast programmatic offerings take the form of co-marketing partnerships to drive engagement with the iHeartRadio Digital Services.

多平台集團的調整後 EBITDA 利潤率為 19.4%，而去年同期為 21.9%，需要提醒的是，去年同期是一個政治動盪的年份。正如我們之前討論過的，我們對專有受眾資料庫（這是我們廣播程式化產品的基礎）的部分投資，以聯合行銷夥伴關係的形式，來推動用戶與 iHeartRadio 數位服務的互動。

In Q4, these relationships, again, drove an increase in our noncash partner marketing revenues and expenses. We will continue to experience some quarterly mismatching of these noncash marketing campaigns in both directions in subsequent periods, and we believe that obtaining these critical marketing resources for our broadcast programmatic initiative on a noncash basis is a prudent way to optimize capital and to achieve our goals.

第四季度，這些合作關係再次推動了我們非現金合作夥伴行銷收入和支出的成長。在隨後的幾個季度裡，我們將繼續面臨這些非現金行銷活動在正負方向上的季度性錯配，我們認為，以非現金方式獲取這些關鍵的營銷資源，用於我們的廣播程序化廣告計劃，是優化資本和實現我們目標的審慎方法。

Turning to the Audio & Media Services Group. Revenue was $79 million, down 19.3% year-over-year. Q4 of the prior year benefited from approximately $35 million of political advertising. Excluding the impact of political revenue, the Audio & Media Services Group revenue was up 21.8%. Adjusted EBITDA was $31 million, down 35.7% compared to the prior year. Again, due almost entirely to the impact of political advertising in the prior year quarter. In the fourth-quarter, our free cash flow was $138 million, or $158 million when including the proceeds from certain real estate asset sales compared to a negative $24 million in the prior year quarter.

接下來是音訊和媒體服務群組。營收為7,900萬美元，年減19.3%。上年第四季受惠於約 3,500 萬美元的政治廣告支出。剔除政治收入的影響，音訊和媒體服務集團的收入成長了 21.8%。調整後 EBITDA 為 3,100 萬美元，較上年下降 35.7%。這幾乎完全是由於上一季政治廣告的影響。第四季度，我們的自由現金流為 1.38 億美元，如果計入某些房地產資產出售所得，則為 1.58 億美元，而去年同期為負 2,400 萬美元。

Our Q4 2025 EBITDA to free cash flow conversion was approximately 70% and demonstrates the company's high free cash flow conversion characteristics and gives us confidence in our ability to generate meaningful free cash flow in 2026 and thereafter.

我們 2025 年第四季 EBITDA 到自由現金流的轉換率約為 70%，這表明公司具有較高的自由現金流轉換率，也讓我們有信心在 2026 年及以後產生有意義的自由現金流。

At year-end, our net debt was approximately $4.5 billion. Our total liquidity was $640 million, and our cash balance was $271 million, which includes $50 million borrowed under the ABL facility. Our year-end net debt-to-adjusted-EBITDA ratio was 6.6 times.

截至年底，我們的淨債務約為 45 億美元。我們的總流動資金為 6.4 億美元，現金餘額為 2.71 億美元，其中包括根據 ABL 融資借入的 5,000 萬美元。我們年末淨負債與調整後 EBITDA 比率為 6.6 倍。

Let me now turn to our guidance for the first-quarter and the full year. Within the context that Bob discussed regarding the health of the current advertising marketplace. For the first-quarter, we expect to generate adjusted EBITDA of approximately $100 million. We expect our consolidated revenue to be up high single digits compared to prior year. Our January revenue was up approximately 1% year-over-year, and as a reminder, January 2025 was a strong comp, up 5.5%.

現在讓我來談談我們對第一季和全年的業績預期。在鮑伯討論當前廣告市場健康狀況的背景下。我們預計第一季調整後 EBITDA 約為 1 億美元。我們預計合併後的收入將比上一年實現高個位數成長。我們 1 月的營收年增約 1%，需要提醒的是，2025 年 1 月是一個比較強勁的年份，成長了 5.5%。

Turning to the individual segments. We expect the Digital Audio Group's revenue to be up mid-teens year-over-year with podcast revenue expected to grow in the low 20s. We expect the Multiplatform Group's revenue to be up mid-single digits year-over-year. We expect the Audio & Media Services Group revenue to be up high single digits year-over-year. We are continuing to invest in our important broadcast programmatic efforts that Bob discussed, and our guidance includes the impact of those incremental expenses, and the good news is that the majority of this asset-building expense is noncash.

接下來我們來看各個部分。我們預計數位音訊集團的營收將年增15%左右，其中播客收入預計將成長20%左右。我們預期多平台集團的營收將年增個位數中段。我們預計音訊和媒體服務集團的營收將年增率接近兩位數。我們將繼續投資鮑伯討論過的重要廣播節目製作工作，我們的績效指引包含了這些新增支出的影響，好消息是，這筆資產建設支出的大部分是非現金支出。

And for the full year, we expect adjusted EBITDA to be approximately $800 million, and our free cash flow to be approximately $200 million. Embedded in our adjusted EBITDA guidance are the following. We expect the Multiplatform Group to get back to adjusted EBITDA growth during 2026. We expect to generate approximately $200 million of overall programmatic revenue in 2026, up approximately 50% from $135 million in 2025.

我們預計全年調整後 EBITDA 約為 8 億美元，自由現金流約為 2 億美元。我們調整後的 EBITDA 預期包含以下內容。我們預計多平台集團將在 2026 年恢復調整後 EBITDA 成長。我們預計 2026 年程序化廣告總收入將達到約 2 億美元，比 2025 年的 1.35 億美元成長約 50%。

And as a reminder, we expect our broadcast programmatic revenue trajectory to be similar to that of the growth we experienced in podcasting revenue. We expect podcasting revenue to continue its strong momentum. We expect this to be a robust midterm election year in terms of generating political revenue. And as mentioned before, 2026 will benefit from $100 million of in-year cost reductions, which will help to offset investments we're making to build out our future technological capabilities.

再次提醒大家，我們預期廣播節目營收的成長軌跡將與我們播客收入的成長軌跡類似。我們預計播客收入將持續保持強勁成長動能。我們預計今年中期選舉將帶來可觀的政治收入。正如先前所提到的，2026 年將受益於 1 億美元的年度成本削減，這將有助於抵消我們為建立未來技術能力而進行的投資。

Let me provide some additional inputs embedded in our free cash flow guidance. Interest expense will be approximately $440 million. Cash taxes will be approximately 5% of adjusted EBITDA. Capital expenditures are expected to be approximately $90 million. Cash restructuring expenses will be approximately $50 million. Working capital is expected to be a source of cash this year, driven by political revenue, which is paid upfront.

讓我補充一些我們自由現金流預測中已包含的資訊。利息支出約4.4億美元。現金稅約為調整後 EBITDA 的 5%。預計資本支出約9000萬美元。現金重組費用約5000萬美元。今年，營運資金預計將成為現金來源，這主要得益於預付的政治收入。

We expect our net leverage ratio at the end of 2026 to be in the mid-fives, which would be more than a full turn improvement year-over-year. We are looking forward to 2026 being a year of significant adjusted EBITDA and free cash flow generation for iHeart, driven by the return of the Multiplatform Group to EBITDA growth, the continued strong momentum of our podcasting revenue and audience, our growing programmatic revenues, and our continued focus on efficiencies as evidenced by our cost savings initiatives.

我們預計到 2026 年底，我們的淨槓桿率將達到 5 左右，這將比前一年改善超過一倍。我們期待 2026 年 iHeart 的調整後 EBITDA 和自由現金流能夠顯著增長，這得益於多平台集團 EBITDA 的恢復增長、播客收入和受眾的持續強勁增長勢頭、程序化收入的增長，以及我們持續關注效率提升（如我們的成本節約舉措所證明的那樣）。

Now we'll turn it over to the operator to take your questions. Thank you.

現在我們把麥克風交給接線員，由他來回答您的問題。謝謝。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作說明）

Aaron Watts, Deutsche Bank.

Aaron Watts，德意志銀行。

I've got a couple of questions, if I may. Encouraging to see the growth in core MPG revenues in 4Q and continued strength on the digital side. I thought it was interesting to see Digital EBITDA larger than MPG in the quarter as well. But as I look ahead, I appreciate, if you could help me understand why you're seeing high single-digit revenue growth in the first-quarter but a small decline in year-over-year EBITDA despite all the costs you're taking out, and perhaps how to think about those same factors impacting first-quarter as we think more about the full year performance, too.

如果可以的話，我有幾個問題。令人鼓舞的是，第四季核心 MPG 營收實現了成長，數位業務也持續保持強勁勢頭。我覺得很有趣的是，本季數位業務的 EBITDA 也高於 MPG。但展望未來，如果您能幫我理解為什麼第一季營收實現了高個位數成長，但儘管你們削減了所有成本，EBITDA 卻同比略有下降，以及在考慮全年業績時，如何看待這些影響第一季度的因素，我將不勝感激。

Sure. It's Rich. Let me start. First of all, again, I don't think you see that same. You don't see that same dynamic as you go through the full year. I think, as you can look at our overall guidance for the full year. The second thing is just as a reminder, our first-quarter numbers are so small compared to the rest of the year.

當然。它很富有。我先開始。首先，我再次強調，我認為你並不這麼認為。隨著一年時間的推移，你不會看到同樣的動態變化。我認為，正如您從我們全年的整體業績預期中所看到的。第二點需要提醒的是，我們第一季的數字與今年其他季度相比非常小。

Again, if you look historically in 2025, '24, you look at 2026, what we got for Q1 and what we're guiding for the full year. And also because, again, with the land of small numbers coming out of the quarter of Q4, which is a land of much larger numbers, and are continue to build up on our total critical programmatic offerings that we have, we continue to do co-partner and noncash in Q4 as a way to support that and ramp up.

再說一遍，如果你回顧一下 2025 年、2024 年的歷史數據，再看看 2026 年，看看我們第一季的業績以及我們對全年的預期。此外，由於第四季度的數據較小，而第四季度的數據則大得多，並且我們正在繼續擴大我們關鍵的程序化產品總量，因此我們在第四季度繼續開展合作和非現金交易，以此來支持和擴大規模。

And I think, we started to talk about that in Q3, so it was kind of a natural build. And then some of that about prepaid marketing that's in Q4 and that built up throughout the year, is getting deployed in Q1. So it comes back as expected. So it's just a lot of moving pieces, but it just gets really accentuated because of the land of small numbers in Q1. But as you go throughout the year, you won't see that same kind of effect.

我認為，我們從第三季就開始討論這個問題了，所以這是一個自然而然的發展過程。然後，一些在第四季度開展的、全年累積的預付費行銷活動，將在第一季進行部署。所以結果正如預期的那樣。所以這其中涉及很多變數，但由於第一季的數據量較小，這些問題就顯得特別突出。但隨著時間的推移，你就不會看到同樣的效果了。

Okay. Great. That's helpful. And then thinking about your costs, and I apologize if I missed this, but how should we think about the cadence of the now $100 million of cost savings that you're targeting as we move through the year across like first-quarter, second-quarter, third-quarter, fourth-quarter? And then are their cash costs we should model in to achieve those that you could help us with?

好的。偉大的。那很有幫助。然後，考慮到你們的成本問題，如果我錯過了這一點，我深表歉意，但是我們應該如何考慮你們目前設定的1億美元成本節約目標的進度安排，比如在第一季度、第二季度、第三季度、第四季度？那麼，為了實現這些目標，我們需要將哪些現金成本納入模型中？您能否在這方面提供協助？

Yes. So just on the cost, just doing the math, if you take the program we already announced at Q4 for 2026, take what we're announcing today, which starts to be implemented in Q2, but it's a full year $100 million of cost, in 2026. Think about it just the math, $12.5 million, let's say, to Q1, and about $28 million of the quarter after that.

是的。所以，僅就成本而言，簡單計算一下，如果你把我們已經在 2026 年第四季度宣布的計劃，再把我們今天宣布的計劃（該計劃從第二季度開始實施，但到 2026 年全年成本將達到 1 億美元）也算進去。想想看，就算一下，假設第一季營收為 1,250 萬美元，第二季營收約 2,800 萬美元。

Okay. Perfect. And then, on the political side, we've heard robust expectations for political spend this year, and it sounds like a few races, including Texas are off to a really fast start. As we look at your $800 million of EBITDA guidance for the full year, what political assumptions are you baking into that to help us get our mind around kind of what upside there could be from that number?

好的。完美的。此外，在政治方面，我們聽到了對今年政治支出的強勁預期，而且聽起來包括德克薩斯州在內的一些競選活動已經迅速展開。當我們審視您全年 8 億美元的 EBITDA 預期時，您在其中考慮了哪些政治因素，以幫助我們理解這個數字可能帶來的成長空間？

Yes. I mean we've always said, and I continue to say is that we expect 2026 to be a strong non-presidential cycle political year, and we're seeing obviously all the same signs.

是的。我的意思是，我們一直都說，而且我還會繼續說，我們預計 2026 年將是一個非總統選舉週期的政治強勁年份，而且我們顯然看到了所有相同的跡象。

Okay. All right. Great. And if I could ask one last question, and I appreciate the time. From the outside, as we sit, what benchmarks or milestones should we be looking for with regards to your programmatic efforts as well as some of your recently announced partnerships, including Netflix and are those partnerships adding to the strength in your podcast forecast?

好的。好的。偉大的。如果可以的話，我想問最後一個問題，非常感謝您抽出時間。從我們的角度來看，關於你們的程序化推廣工作以及最近宣布的一些合作關係（包括與 Netflix 的合作），我們應該關注哪些基準或里程碑？這些合作關係是否增強了你們對播客的預測？

Well, I think, in terms of the programmatic, programmatic obviously benefits everything we have, podcast digital streaming and broadcast radio. Broadcast radio is obviously the harder one to get into programmatic because the programmatic systems have really been built for digital inventory. But as we announced, we are going into the Amazon DSP with broadcast, also the Yahoo! DSP, both major DSPs and continuing to add more to that. So that's encouraging on that front.

我認為，就程序化廣告而言，程序化廣告顯然有利於我們擁有的一切，包括播客、數位串流媒體和廣播電台。廣播電台顯然更難進入程序化廣告領域，因為程序化廣告系統實際上是為數位廣告資源而建立的。但正如我們所宣布的那樣，我們將透過廣播進入亞馬遜數位服務平台 (DSP)，以及雅虎！DSP，包括主要的DSP，並且也不斷增加新的DSP。所以這方面情況令人鼓舞。

I think, in terms of how we think it all fits together and how it helps us, obviously, there's a piece of the revenue pie out there that is programmatic. People want to buy programmatically. And if you can't offer programmatic, you're not going to get any of the money.

我認為，就我們認為這一切如何結合起來以及它如何幫助我們而言，顯然，收入蛋糕中有一部分是程序化購買的。人們希望透過程序化方式購買商品。如果你不能提供程序化廣告，你就拿不到任何收入。

So having that kind of capabilities for our podcast and broadcast radio in particular, is very important to us and certainly is behind why we're investing what we have in it and why we're seeing the kind of growth, we are, I think, in terms of the video podcast talking about Netflix and those opportunities, we've got this wonderful expansion of the marketplace from just audio to video podcast.

因此，擁有這種能力來製作我們的播客和廣播節目對我們來說非常重要，這當然也是我們投入資金的原因，也是我們看到這種成長的原因。我認為，就視訊播客而言，談到 Netflix 和這些機會，我們看到了市場從單純的音訊播客到視訊播客的精彩擴展。

Now most people still want to listen to a podcast. The use case is generally in a place where you can't use your eyeballs. But there are people who do want to watch it and -- or we'll watch it occasionally, and we're seeing that market beginning to open up. And for us, that is sort of unforeseen revenue opportunities. And I think, Netflix is -- I probably give credit.

現在大多數人仍然想聽播客。這種應用場景通常是在無法使用眼睛的地方。但確實有人想看，或者我們偶爾會看，我們看到這個市場開始打開了。對我們來說，這算是意想不到的收入機會。而且我認為，Netflix——我應該承認這一點。

YouTube probably opened that up -- people's eyes to that, and Netflix, I think, has taken it to a whole other level. And we expect that to be a continued expanding market for us as well.

YouTube 可能開啟了人們的視野，讓人們意識到這一點，而 Netflix 則將其提升到了一個全新的高度。我們預計這也會是我們持續成長的市場。

And by the way, just one last item close. As we said in terms of our guidance that we expect total programmatic revenue to be approximately $200 million in 2026, up 50% from our total revenue in 2025. So I think, that's a pretty good benchmark in terms of benchmarking our total programmatic progress.

對了，最後還有一件事要說。正如我們在績效指引中所說，我們預計 2026 年程序化廣告總收入約為 2 億美元，比 2025 年的總收入成長 50%。所以我認為，就衡量我們整體的程序化進展而言，這是一個相當不錯的基準。

Stephen Laszczyk, Goldman Sachs.

Stephen Laszczyk，高盛集團。

Bob Rich, I was curious if you could talk a little bit more about the underlying drivers of growth in the podcasting business, continued strong performance to finish 2025. Just curious if you could unpack a bit more what you expect to see in '26? And then also too, if you look further out in '27 and beyond, just the drivers of adding new content, improving engagement, improving monetization, where you see the most opportunity for growth on that front.

Bob Rich，我很好奇您能否再多談談播客行業成長的根本驅動因素，以及該行業在 2025 年繼續保持強勁增長勢頭的原因。我很好奇您能否再詳細說說您對2026年的期望？此外，如果你把目光放得更遠，展望 2027 年及以後，就會發現增加新內容、提高參與度、提高獲利能力等因素，在這些方面都蘊藏著最大的成長機會。

And then I guess related to that, Bob, I think you might have mentioned margins in the mid-30s is continuing to have opportunity to move higher. Just curious what you see as the key drivers on that front as well.

然後，我想和這一點有關，鮑勃，我想你可能提到過，30%左右的利潤率還有繼續上升的空間。我很好奇您認為這方面的主要驅動因素是什麼。

Well, look before Rich jumps in, I just want to say, I think on podcasting, what's great is you have so many vectors of growth. You not only have more people using podcast, but you have them using more podcast each year. And obviously, we're seeing inventory opportunities continue to grow as well. And as we look at getting podcast, from our standpoint, we have this incredible flywheel effect because we are the largest podcast publisher by a pretty good margin.

好吧，在 Rich 開口之前，我只想說，我認為播客最棒的地方在於它有很多增長途徑。不僅使用播客的人更多了，而且他們每年使用播客的頻率也在增加。顯然，庫存機會也持續成長。從我們的角度來看，在播客領域，我們擁有巨大的飛輪效應，因為我們是最大的播客發行商，而且遙遙領先。

We tend to get first look at everything. So if we don't take it, it's because we could figure out how the economics work and we are -- have pretty strong financial discipline in terms of making sure that we have podcasts that are legitimately good businesses for us. And we also have the ability, because we mentioned in the call, we have this incredible array of assets for our broadcast radio that we can apply to podcasting and allows us to build podcast from sort of scratch.

我們往往能第一時間看到所有東西。所以如果我們不接受，那是因為我們能弄清楚其中的經濟運作方式，而且我們在財務方面有著非常強的自律性，以確保我們的播客節目對我們來說是真正好的生意。正如我們在電話會議中提到的，我們擁有廣播電台的大量資源，我們可以將這些資源應用到播客領域，讓我們能夠從零開始建立播客。

And if you look at the major podcast players, we're probably the only ones that have built podcast as opposed to just buying podcast packages from others.

如果你看看主要的播客平台，我們可能是唯一一個自己建立播客平台而不是從其他平台購買播客套餐的平台。

Yes, and look, the only thing I'd add on the margin front, and you've heard Bob, myself and Mike talking about what our goal was on the annual podcasting margins, EBITDA margins, I'm sorry, to be clear, and with respect to DAG, I would just put the overall context and the overall umbrella and you see, if I believe, continue to demonstrate, not just in words, is us striving just to become more efficient in every revenue stream, and in every support in our business.

是的，還有一點，關於利潤率方面，你們也聽鮑勃、我和邁克談過我們關於年度播客利潤率、EBITDA利潤率的目標，抱歉，為了說清楚，關於DAG，我只想把整體情況和整體目標放在一起，你們看，我相信，並且會繼續證明，不僅僅是口頭上，我們正​​在努力提高我們業務中每一個收入來源和每一個支持環節的效率。

So when we talk of it, and I think you all agree, it's a natural outgrowth that, yes, we're at what we had talked about getting to the mid-30s on EBITDA margins for DAG, but we're never going to stop trying to improve those and take advantage of technology and continue to improve upon our risk of in terms of capital allocation, and bring more to the bottom line.

所以當我們談到這一點時，我想你們都會同意，這是一個自然而然的發展結果，是的，我們已經達到了之前討論過的DAG EBITDA利潤率達到30%左右的目標，但我們永遠不會停止努力提高這些利潤率，利用技術，繼續改善我們在資本配置方面的風險，並為最終利潤帶來更多收益。

That's great. And then just a quick follow-up. Within that, I'm curious how big of an opportunity you think video podcasting is perhaps over the next 12 to 24 months? Is this something that can move the needle revenue wise? Or would we need to see maybe an expansion of the Netflix agreement to get it to the point where it starts moving the needle on growth and margins higher?

那太棒了。然後還有一個簡短的後續問題。在此背景下，我很好奇您認為在未來 12 到 24 個月內，視訊播客的發展機會有多大？這能否對營收產生顯著影響？或者，我們是否需要擴大與 Netflix 的合作協議，才能使其開始推動成長並提高利潤率？

Well, look, I think you've got two major video players who really pretty much signal that they want to play in video podcasting, YouTube and Netflix. I suspect we're seeing, and you hear talk from others that they're also interested in it. So I think that's probably what's going to drive the expansion of it.

你看，我認為目前有兩大影片巨頭——YouTube 和 Netflix——已經明確表示他們想要進軍視訊播客領域。我懷疑我們正在看到，而且你也會聽到其他人談論他們也對此感興趣。所以我認為這很可能是推動其擴張的因素。

We certainly know that we can promote these podcasts in a way they've not -- that other streaming shows are not promoted because we're able to utilize our broadcast radio where you've got 90% of Americans listening every month to our broadcast radio. And if you listen to Charlamagne tha God or Bobby Bones or some of the people that are on Netflix, you hear that they're again promoting their appearance there and their podcast there. So I think it gives them a pretty strong showing.

我們當然知道，我們可以用其他串流節目無法做到的方式來推廣這些播客——因為我們可以利用我們的廣播電台，每個月有 90% 的美國人收聽我們的廣播電台。如果你聽聽 Charlamagne tha God、Bobby Bones 或其他一些在 Netflix 上的人的節目，你會發現他們又在宣傳他們在 Netflix 上的演出和播客了。所以我認為這讓他們表現出色。

Sebastiano Petti, JPMorgan.

塞巴斯蒂亞諾·佩蒂，摩根大通。

I guess, Rich, first, I wanted to follow up. You did call out the anticipated growth rate in programmatic for the year. I mean, can you just help us, maybe give us what the 2024 programmatic revenue growth rate was just so we can kind of think about the glide path there? And then relatedly, talking about the DAG margins, obviously, still you have remain healthy, but I think the fourth-quarter 2025 DAG margins were, I think, down year-over-year and I think the lowest fourth-quarter since fourth-quarter of 2022. Anything driving that?

我想，Rich，首先，我想跟進一下。您確實提到了今年程序化廣告的預期成長率。我的意思是，您能幫我們個忙嗎？例如告訴我們 2024 年程序化廣告收入成長率是多少，這樣我們就可以大致考慮未來的發展路徑？然後，說到DAG利潤率，顯然，你們仍然保持健康，但我認為2025年第四季的DAG利潤率同比下降，而且我認為是自2022年第四季以來的最低第四季。有什麼原因導致這種情況嗎？

You talked about some of the noncash partnerships kind of going back and forth. I wasn't sure if there's anything maybe idio in the quarter?

你剛才提到了一些非現金合作關係，有點像是來回拉鋸戰。我不確定這季度裡有沒有什麼可能是白痴的東西？

And then lastly, bringing broadcast to -- back to EBITDA growth or MPG rather back to EBITDA growth. Should (technical difficulty) of incremental savings coming through in '26 are kind of concentrated back towards MPG and hence, the flex you're going to see there?

最後，將廣播業務重新帶回 EBITDA 成長或 MPG，而不是 EBITDA 成長。2026 年實現的增量節省（技術難度）是否應該集中用於提高燃油效率，從而帶來您將看到的靈活性？

Well, let me start. I'll take a couple and then Bob and Mike could chime in. On DAG, as we've always said, there's so many moving pieces on a quarter-to-quarter basis and understand we report on a quarter basis in terms of the margins and understand the questions. But we are -- that's why we have focused people for years and years in terms of, really look at the annual margin base because there's just so many moving pieces that could affect the individual quarters.

那我就先開始了。我先說幾個，然後鮑伯和麥克也可以加入討論。正如我們一直所說，DAG 的季度變化非常大，我們按季度報告利潤率，也理解大家提出的問題。但是，正因如此，我們多年來一直專注於研究年度利潤率基礎，因為有太多因素會影響各季度的業績。

And again, look at the rhythm of our business, Q1 is the smallest, Q2 and Q3, as a general rule, are relatively similar. And then Q4 is the biggest, which I don't think is anything different than any other ad-supported business out there.

再看看我們業務的節奏，第一季最小，第二季和第三季通常都比較接近。第四季是最大的季度，我認為這與其他任何依靠廣告收入的企業並沒有什麼不同。

When it comes to MPG and getting back to EBITDA growth this year, I think we did a pretty good job of outlining what the underlying factors were, I don't have anything in addition to add to that that we outlined in the remarks, all the different pieces there, ranging from whether it's continuing to take market share, as Bob talked about, and Miller Kaplan and right down to just looking at our overall revenue growth, including our total programmatic revenue growth as you kind of go into this year out there. So not -- I don't have anything different to add to that.

就 MPG 和今年的 EBITDA 成長而言，我認為我們已經很好地概述了其根本因素，我沒有什麼要補充的，我們在發言中已經概述了所有不同的方面，從 Bob 和 Miller Kaplan 所談到的是否繼續擴大市場份額，一直到我們整體的收入增長，包括我們今年的程序化總收入增長。所以，我沒什麼要補充的了。

And then in terms of 2024 to 2025, I'm seeing -- Michael, listen, I don't have the 2024 number in hand, the total programmatic revenue growth. But I would -- I don't want to speculate, but it will be substantially less than it was in 2025. But we can circle back and get you that number.

至於 2024 年至 2025 年，我看到──邁克爾，聽著，我手邊沒有 2024 年的數據，也就是程式化廣告總收入成長。但我認為——我不想妄加猜測，但它將比 2025 年的水平大幅下降。但我們可以稍後再幫您找到那個號碼。

Yes. And if I could just add one thing just to put in and what Rich said. I think on MPG, there's really two vectors. One is cost out. You're absolutely correct.

是的。我只想補充一點，就像Rich說的。我認為關於油耗，實際上有兩個方面。一是成本支出。你說得完全正確。

It is the business that we've been able to apply technology to get more and more efficient, and I think make the product better and better. And the second is advertising is -- and there are multiple reasons why we think and why we see the advertising opportunity from programmatic if you want to do an audio buy, you can't get reach without broadcast radio.

在這個產業，我們運用科技不斷提高效率，我認為也讓產品越來越好。第二點是廣告－我們認為並看到程序化廣告機會的原因有很多，如果你想進行音訊購買，沒有廣播電台你就無法獲得覆蓋面。

And in video, you can get reach without broadcast television. They're no longer the reach medium. We're the reach medium in audio. So as people get more and more into audio and really get to -- they have to get the results, there's no way to make the plan without it. So we know it's going to find its way there.

而且，透過視頻，無需廣播電視也能獲得傳播效果。它們不再是主要的傳播媒介。我們是音訊領域的傳播媒介。所以，隨著人們越來越深入地了解音頻，他們必須得到結果，沒有結果就無法制定計劃。所以我們知道它最終會到達那裡。

And it's just a question of how and when. And finally is pushing the client direct marketing capabilities we have is pretty powerful. When you consider these on-air personalities we have on radio, there's nothing like it. They're probably the most powerful influencers today, and when they talk about something, people notice.

問題只在於如何做以及何時做。最後，我們強大的客戶直接行銷能力值得稱讚。想想我們廣播電台的這些主持人，真是獨一無二。他們可能是當今最有影響力的人物，當他們談論某件事時，人們都會注意。

And by the way, one last point is just as a reminder, which we've talked about in previous question, 2026 is a nonpresidential election cycle, which we expect the great greatly benefit from as a company.

順便提一下，最後一點提醒一下，我們在之前的問題中也提到過，2026 年是非總統選舉週期，我們預計公司將從中受益匪淺。

Patrick Sholl, Barrington Research.

Patrick Sholl，巴林頓研究公司。

If I could ask another question on programmatic. You talked about the kind of mismatch of revenues and expenses as you kind of build up your capabilities there. I'm just wondering like how much of a drag you expect that to be on EBITDA for the full year?

我能否再問一個關於程序化廣告的問題？你談到了隨著自身能力的提升，收入和支出之間會出現的那種不匹配現象。我只是想知道，您預計這會對全年的 EBITDA 造成多大的影響？

I think it's built in the numbers we're talking about everything you've got there. So I think, again, we've been pretty prudent in how we've built programmatic. So it's not a big impact on earnings. And we found some ways to build it out using primarily noncash marketing expense as well, which we think has a tremendous benefit to us.

我認為這其中已經包含了我們討論的所有數據。所以我覺得，我們建立程序化廣告的方式一直都相當謹慎。所以對收益影響不大。我們也找到了一些方法，主要利用非現金行銷費用來發展壯大，我們認為這對我們來說非常有利。

If there are no other questions, thank you all again for listening to the iHeart story on behalf of all of us. And we are available, as always, for follow-up questions, myself and Mike and the team. Thanks very much.

如果沒有其他問題，再次代表我們所有人感謝大家收聽iHeart的故事。和往常一樣，我和麥克以及團隊隨時準備回答後續問題。非常感謝。

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連線了。