Hippo Holdings Inc (HIPO) 2023 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Hello, everyone. And welcome to the Hippo Holdings Fourth Quarter 2023 earnings call. My name is Charlie, and I'll be coordinating the call today. (Operator Instructions)

大家好。歡迎參加 Hippo Holdings 2023 年第四季財報電話會議。我叫查理，今天我將協調通話。（操作員說明）

I'll now hand over to our host, Mark Olson, Director of Corporate Communications to begin. Mark, please go ahead.

現在請我們的東道主企業傳播總監馬克·奧爾森 (Mark Olson) 開始演講。馬克，請繼續。

Thank you, operator. Good morning, and thank you for joining Hippo's 2023 fourth quarter earnings call. Earlier today, we issued a shareholder letter announcing its Q4 and full year results, which is available at investors.hippo.com.

謝謝你，接線生。早安，感謝您參加 Hippo 2023 年第四季財報電話會議。今天早些時候，我們發布了一封股東信，宣布其第四季度和全年業績，該信函可在 Investors.hippo.com 上查閱。

Leading today's discussion will be Hippo President and Chief Executive Officer, Richard McCathron; and Chief Financial Officer, Stewart Ellis. Following management's prepared remarks, we will open the call to questions.

今天的討論將由 Hippo 總裁兼執行長 Richard McCathron 主持。和首席財務官斯圖爾特·埃利斯。在管理階層準備好發言後，我們將開始提問。

Before we begin, we'd like to remind you that our discussion will contain predictions, expectations forward-looking statements and other information about our business that are based on management's current expectations as of the date of this presentation. Forward-looking statements include, but are not limited to, expectations or predictions of financial and business performance, and conditions and competitive and industry outlook.

在開始之前，我們想提醒您，我們的討論將包含預測、期望、前瞻性陳述以及有關我們業務的其他信息，這些信息基於管理層截至本演示文稿之日的當前預期。前瞻性陳述包括但不限於財務和業務績效、條件以及競爭和行業前景的預期或預測。

Forward-looking statements are subject to risks, uncertainties, and other factors that could cause our actual results to differ materially from historical results and/or from our forecast, including those set forth in those Form 8-K filed today. For more information, please refer to the risks, uncertainties, and other factors discussed in Hippo's SEC filings, in particular in the section entitled Risk Factors.

前瞻性陳述受到風險、不確定性和其他因素的影響，這些因素可能導致我們的實際結果與歷史結果和/或我們的預測（包括今天提交的表格8-K 中列出的結果）有重大差異。欲了解更多信息，請參閱 Hippo 向 SEC 提交的文件中討論的風險、不確定性和其他因素，特別是標題為“風險因素”的部分。

All cautionary statements are applicable to any forward-looking statements we make whenever they appear. You should carefully consider the risks and uncertainties and other factors discussed in Hippo's SEC filings. Do not place undue reliance on forward-looking statements as Hippo is under no obligation and expressly disclaims any responsibility for updating offering or otherwise revising any forward-looking statements, whether as the result of new information of future events or otherwise, except as required by law.

所有警告性聲明均適用於我們每次出現時所做的任何前瞻性聲明。您應該仔細考慮 Hippo 的 SEC 文件中討論的風險和不確定性以及其他因素。請勿過度依賴前瞻性陳述，因為Hippo 不承擔任何義務，並明確表示不承擔更新產品或以其他方式修改任何前瞻性陳述的責任，無論是由於未來事件的新資訊還是其他原因，除非另有要求。法律。

During this conference call, we refer to non-GAAP financial measures such as total generated premium and adjusted EBITDA. Our GAAP results and description of our non-GAAP financial measures with full reconciliation to GAAP can be found in the fourth quarter 2023 shareholder letter, which has been furnished to the SEC and is available on our website.

在本次電話會議中，我們參考了非公認會計準則財務指標，例如產生的總保費和調整後的 EBITDA。我們的 GAAP 結果以及與 GAAP 完全一致的非 GAAP 財務指標的描述可以在 2023 年第四季度的股東信中找到，該信函已提交給 SEC，並可在我們的網站上找到。

And with that, I will turn the call over to Rick McCathron, our President and CEO.

接下來，我會將電話轉給我們的總裁兼執行長 Rick McCathron。

Good morning, everyone. The beginning of the new year always presents an opportunity to reflect on past and internalize its lessons before moving forward with renewed enthusiasm and focus. In two short years, we have nearly doubled our total generated premium from $606 million to $1.1 billion, and more than doubled our revenue from $91 million to $210 million, all while lowering fixed expenses and improving the gross loss ratio on our Hippo home insurance program by approximately 40 percentage points.

大家，早安。新年伊始，我們總是有機會回顧過去，吸取教訓，然後以新的熱情和專注向前邁進。在短短兩年內，我們的保費總額幾乎翻了一番，從6.06 億美元增加到11 億美元，收入增加了一倍多，從9,100 萬美元增加到2.1 億美元，同時降低了Hippo 家庭保險計劃的固定費用並提高了毛損率約 40 個百分點。

Over the past year, we learned that our customers want the ability to buy not just Hippo home insurance policies from us, but other kinds of policies from third party carriers as well. We have taken this to heart and refocused our consumer agency on finding the best policy for each customer regardless of the carrier.

在過去的一年裡，我們了解到，我們的客戶不僅希望能夠向我們購買 Hippo 家庭保險，還希望能夠從第三方保險公司購買其他類型的保單。我們牢記這一點，並重新將我們的消費者代理機構的重點放在為每個客戶尋找最佳保單上，無論運營商如何。

We believe that for our target customer, generation better customers, especially those who are buying a newly-built home, a Hippo homeowner's policy will be the best option. But if a customer is a better fit with another carrier, we will work to find the best option from across our 50-plus carrier partners.

我們相信，對於我們的目標客戶，一代更好的客戶，尤其是那些購買新建房屋的客戶來說，河馬房屋保險將是最佳選擇。但如果客戶更適合另一家營運商，我們將努力從 50 多家營運商合作夥伴中尋找最佳選擇。

We also learned that there is a real need in the market for carrier services focused on servicing MGAs, where much of the innovation in the insurance market is happening. Our Spinnaker, Insurance-as-a-Service business, has an industry-leading platform and robust underwriting processes that have allowed us to grow at an accelerating rate in 2023, while avoiding many of the pitfalls experienced by our competitors over the past year.

我們也了解到，市場確實需要專注於為 MGA 提供服務的承運人服務，而保險市場的許多創新都在 MGA 上進行。我們的 Spinnaker 保險即服務業務擁有業界領先的平台和強大的核保流程，使我們能夠在 2023 年加速成長，同時避免競爭對手在過去一年中經歷的許多陷阱。

We are especially excited to have achieved this growth while expanding our operating margin in this already profitable portion of our business, truly a win-win for both Spinnaker and its MGA customers. And finally, we also learned that there are some risks in some geographies to which we prefer less exposure as we seek to improve the predictability and profitability of our Hippo home insurance program.

我們特別高興能夠實現這一成長，同時擴大我們已經獲利的業務部分的營業利潤率，這對 Spinnaker 及其 MGA 客戶來說確實是雙贏。最後，我們也了解到，在某些地區存在一些風險，當我們尋求提高 Hippo 家庭保險計劃的可預測性和盈利能力時，我們希望減少風險敞口。

As discussed in the last quarter earnings call in the second half of 2023, we launched an aggressive program to raise deductibles for wind and hail in certain geographies and began non-renewing policies in higher cat areas where we had excess concentration. These actions are intended to reduce exposure to the kinds of losses we experienced in the second quarter of 2023.

正如2023 年下半年上一季度財報電話會議中所討論的那樣，我們推出了一項積極的計劃，以提高某些地區的風和冰雹的免賠額，並在我們過度集中的高貓地區開始不再更新政策。這些行動旨在減少我們在 2023 年第二季所經歷的損失。

A quick thought experiment illustrates how those decisions are paying off. If we experienced the exact same hailstorms this coming year with the same level of severity, the program of deductible changes and selective non-renewals in cat concentrated areas that is currently in progress, would reduce post direct losses by approximately 55%.

一個快速的思想實驗說明了這些決定是如何得到回報的。如果我們明年經歷同樣嚴重程度的完全相同的冰雹，目前正在進行的巨災集中地區的免賠額變更和選擇性不續簽計劃將減少約 55% 的直接損失。

Moreover, because these changes that began last October take a full year to work their way through the policy renewal dates, the benefits in 2025 would be even greater, an almost 80% reduction in direct losses if the hailstorms from the second quarter of 2023 were to reoccur.

此外，由於去年10 月開始的這些變更需要一整年的時間才能完成保單續約日期，因此2025 年的效益將更大，如果2023 年第二季的冰雹沒有發生，直接損失將減少近80% 。再次發生。

These initiatives, when combined with the actions we took in the second half of 2023 to streamline our operations and reduce our fixed expenses, give us greater confidence that we are on track to achieve our profitability goals ahead of schedule, with a mix that is shifting towards businesses with lower volatility and higher predictability. As we enter 2024, we believe we are incredibly well positioned to compete for business in our core markets and our core customer segments. It's time for Hippo to go back on offense.

這些舉措與我們在 2023 年下半年為簡化營運和減少固定支出而採取的行動相結合，使我們更有信心，我們將提前實現盈利目標，並且組合正在發生變化面向波動性較低、可預測性較高的企業。進入 2024 年，我們相信我們處於非常有利的位置，可以在核心市場和核心客戶群中競爭業務。現在是河馬重新進攻的時候了。

Now, I'd like to turn the call over to our Chief Financial Officer, Stewart Ellis, to walk through the highlights of our full year and Q4 2023 financial results, as well as our expectations for the future.

現在，我想將電話轉給我們的財務長 Stewart Ellis，他將介紹我們全年和 2023 年第四季財務表現的亮點，以及我們對未來的預期。

Thanks, Rick, and good morning everyone. 2023 was a remarkable year for Hippo. We doubled down on meeting the needs of our customers, streamlined our operations, focused on segments of the market where we have a significant competitive advantage, and simplified our reinsurance structure.

謝謝瑞克，大家早安。 2023 年對 Hippo 來說是不平凡的一年。我們加倍努力滿足客戶的需求，簡化我們的運營，專注於我們擁有顯著競爭優勢的細分市場，並簡化我們的再保險結構。

We exit the year as a business transformed by these efforts, increasingly predictable and with far clearer visibility into both how and when we will achieve profitability. During 2023, we grew TGP from $811 million to more than $1.1 billion, an increase of 40%. More important than the growth itself was how we achieved it. The parts of our business that are less exposed to underlying weather and underwriting volatility grew at an accelerating rate while we significantly reduced our exposure to weather in our primary homeowners insurance program.

今年結束時，我們的業務經過這些努力而發生了轉變，變得越來越可預測，並且對如何以及何時實現盈利有了更清晰的了解。2023 年，我們將 TGP 從 8.11 億美元增加到超過 11 億美元，成長了 40%。比成長本身更重要的是我們如何實現成長。我們的業務中受潛在天氣和承保波動影響較小的部分正在加速成長，同時我們在主要房屋保險計劃中顯著減少了對天氣的影響。

During Q4, the most profitable and predictable components of our business, Insurance-as-a-Service and Services, collectively represented 77% of our TGP, up from 59% in the fourth quarter of 2021 and 65% a year ago. We expect these trends to continue in the coming year with TGP growing during 2024 to more than $1.3 billion, with the services and Insurance-as-a-Service segment collectively representing 85% of total TGP by the final quarter of the year.

在第四季度，我們業務中最賺錢、最可預測的組成部分——保險即服務和服務，合計占我們TGP 的77%，高於2021 年第四季的59% 和一年前的65% 。我們預計這些趨勢將在未來一年持續下去，TGP 在 2024 年將成長至超過 13 億美元，到今年最後一個季度，服務和保險即服務領域合計佔 TGP 總額的 85%。

During 2023, we grew revenue significantly faster than TGP from $120 million in 2022 to $210 million in 2023, an increase of 75%. This growth was the result of increases in the scale of our services and Insurance-as-a-Service segments, combined with structural changes we made to our program specific reinsurance structure at HHIP.

2023 年期間，我們的營收成長速度明顯快於 TGP，從 2022 年的 1.2 億美元增至 2023 年的 2.1 億美元，成長了 75%。這一增長是我們的服務和保險即服務細分市場規模擴大以及我們對 HHIP 計劃特定再保險結構進行的結構性變革的結果。

In 2022, we retained only 12% the premium associated with our homeowners policies for approximately 30% of the risk. In 2023, we were able to retain about 40% of the premium, but only 46% of the risk, significantly narrowing the gap between risk retention and premium retention, thereby getting paid more fully for the risk we retain.

2022 年，我們僅保留與房屋保單相關的 12% 保費，承擔約 30% 的風險。2023年，我們能夠保留約40%的保費，但只有46%的風險，顯著縮小了風險自留和保費保留之間的差距，從而為我們保留的風險獲得更充分的支付。

By moving away from our past reinsurance structure and bringing premium more in line with the risk that we are retaining, we are able to monetize the insurance risk more effectively, which is a key driver of both revenue growth and profitability. We expect 2024 revenue to continue to grow at an accelerated rate relative to TGP, rising more than 60% from $210 million this past year to more than $340 million in 2024.

透過擺脫過去的再保險結構並使保費更加符合我們所保留的風險，我們能夠更有效地將保險風險貨幣化，這是收入成長和獲利能力的關鍵驅動力。我們預計 2024 年營收將繼續以相對於 TGP 的加速速度成長，從去年的 2.1 億美元成長到 2024 年的 3.4 億美元以上，增幅超過 60%。

Importantly, we expect to be able to achieve this while lowering our underlying volatility and exposure to the weather that has driven our historical losses as measured by an almost 60% reduction we expect to achieve in our underlying severe weather exposure.

重要的是，我們期望能夠實現這一目標，同時降低導致我們歷史損失的潛在波動性和天氣風險，我們預計潛在的惡劣天氣風險將減少近 60%。

Because of our consistent historical track record of attritional loss ratio improvement, combined with the expected reduction in underlying volatility and exposure to the weather that Rick discussed earlier, we felt comfortable transitioning to a more traditional excess of loss or XOL reinsurance structure, retaining nearly all the attritional risks and purchasing XOL reinsurance to protect against major catastrophic weather events.

由於我們在消耗損失率改善方面的一貫記錄，再加上里克之前討論的潛在波動性和天氣風險的預期減少，我們感到很樂意過渡到更傳統的超額損失或 XOL 再保險結構，保留了幾乎所有消耗風險並購買XOL 再保險以防範重大災難性天氣事件。

This transition to XOL reinsurance will better align our net earned premium with risk retention and will also allow us to further narrow the gap between gross and net loss ratio.

向 XOL 再保險的過渡將更好地將我們的淨賺保費與風險自留保持一致，也將使我們能夠進一步縮小總損失率和淨損失率之間的差距。

Turning now to loss ratio. Our loss and loss adjustment expenses during 2023 were significantly higher than our expectations because of outsized weather losses in the second quarter. The wind and hail losses during that time masked the significant and continued improvement in our non-PCS loss ratio over the course of the year, with 2023 non-PCS loss ratio improving 13 percentage points to 63% in 2023 versus 76% in 2022.

現在轉向損失率。由於第二季天氣損失過大，我們 2023 年的損失和損失調整費用明顯高於我們的預期。那段時間的風和冰雹損失掩蓋了我們在這一年中非PCS 損失率的顯著持續改善，2023 年非PCS 損失率提高了13 個百分點，達到2023 年的63%，而2022 年為76 %。

As Rick mentioned earlier, we responded to the excess weather losses during the year with aggressive actions to raise deductibles in wind- and hail-exposed geographies and selective policy non-renewals in cat-exposed geographies more generally. The combined effect of rate and underwriting actions taken over the past two years, which resulted in a 28% written rate increase in Q4, and the actions taken to structurally reduce our exposure to cat-related volatility, mean that the expected loss ratio of the business we wrote in Q4 2023 was far better than in Q4 2022.

正如里克之前提到的，我們針對這一年的過度天氣損失採取了積極行動，提高了遭受風和冰雹影響的地區的免賠額，並在更廣泛的情況下，選擇性地取消了遭受貓襲擊的地區的政策。過去兩年採取的費率和承保行動的綜合影響，導致第四季度承保費率增加了28%，以及為結構性減少我們與巨災相關的波動性而採取的行動，意味著我們的預期損失率我們在 2023 年第四季寫的業務遠好於 2022 年第四季。

In 2024, we expect to realize additional benefit to our gross loss ratio as previous rate and underwriting actions burn into our financials, as well as significantly lower losses from cat events due to reduced exposure and higher deductibles. In 2024, we expect HHIP gross non-PCS loss ratio to be between 52% and 58%, with an expected PCS cat load of 20%.

到2024 年，我們預計我們的總損失率將獲得額外的好處，因為先前的費率和承保行動會影響我們的財務狀況，並且由於風險敞口減少和免賠額提高，巨災事件造成的損失將顯著降低。到 2024 年，我們預計 HHIP 總非 PCS 損失率將在 52% 至 58% 之間，預計 PCS 巨負載為 20%。

In 2024, we expect HHIP net loss ratio to be between 85% and 90%, down more than 160 percentage points from 2023 due to the improvements in gross loss ratio and more effective use of reinsurance. Similarly to the trend we experienced in 2023, we expect the net loss ratio improvement to happen gradually over the year, with Q4 2024 expected net loss ratio under 75%. We expect additional improvements in 2025 when we expect net loss ratio to be less than 75% for the full year.

由於總損失率的改善和再保險的更有效利用，我們預計 2024 年 HHIP 淨損失率將在 85% 至 90% 之間，較 2023 年下降超過 160 個百分點。與我們在 2023 年經歷的趨勢類似，我們預計淨虧損率將在一年內逐步改善，預計 2024 年第四季淨虧損率將低於 75%。我們預計 2025 年將進一步改善，全年淨虧損率將低於 75%。

During 2023, we complemented our robust top line growth with a disciplined and sustained effort to drive efficiency into our operations. The result has been a year-over-year decline in our fixed expenses from $166 million in 2022 to $138 million in 2023.

2023 年，我們透過嚴格、持續的努力提高營運效率，補充了強勁的營收成長。結果是我們的固定費用年減，從 2022 年的 1.66 億美元減少到 2023 年的 1.38 億美元。

This efficiency improvement is even more impressive when viewed in conjunction with our top line growth, with fixed expenses falling from 138% of 2022 revenue to only 66% of 2023 revenue. And more encouraging, only a small percentage of the benefits of our late 2023 cost reduction measures are reflected in these numbers.

結合我們的營收成長來看，這種效率的提高更加令人印象深刻，固定費用從 2022 年收入的 138% 降至僅佔 2023 年收入的 66%。更令人鼓舞的是，這些數字只反映了我們 2023 年末成本削減措施的一小部分收益。

For 2024, we expect fixed expenses to continue to decline by more than 20% in absolute dollar terms into less than 31% of expected 2024 revenue. During 2023, our top line growth mix shifts toward more predictable and profitable businesses, more effective use of reinsurance, continued rate and underwriting improvements at HHIP, and efficiency gains across our organization, leave us with a clear line of sight to delivering positive adjusted EBITDA earlier than we expected when we entered the year.

到 2024 年，我們預計固定費用以美元絕對值計算將持續下降 20% 以上，佔 2024 年預期收入的比例將低於 31%。2023 年，我們的營收成長組合將轉向更可預測和盈利的業務、更有效地利用再保險、HHIP 的持續費率和承保改進以及整個組織的效率提升，使我們能夠清晰地實現積極的調整後EBITDA比我們進入這一年時的預期要早。

We finished Q4 2023 with an adjusted EBITDA loss of $22 million, down more than 50% from our adjusted EBITDA loss of $47 million in Q4 of 2022. And as mentioned previously, many of the improvements we have made in 2023 are only partially reflected in our Q4 financials.

截至 2023 年第四季度，我們的調整後 EBITDA 虧損為 2,200 萬美元，比 2022 年第四季調整後 EBITDA 虧損 4,700 萬美元下降了 50% 以上。如前所述，我們在 2023 年所做的許多改進僅部分反映在我們的第四季財務數據中。

Looking forward, we expect an adjusted EBITDA loss of only $41 million to $51 million for the full year 2024, down more than 75% from 2023 with over 90% of this loss coming in the first half of the year. We expect to turn adjusted EBITDA positive during the second half of the year and for the fourth quarter to be fully adjusted EBITDA positive.

展望未來，我們預計 2024 年全年調整後 EBITDA 損失僅為 4,100 萬至 5,100 萬美元，比 2023 年下降超過 75%，其中 90% 以上的損失來自上半年。我們預計下半年調整後 EBITDA 為正，第四季調整後 EBITDA 為正。

We have made significant progress during 2023 along our path to profitability. We enter 2024 with increased confidence that we will achieve it sooner and to a greater extent than previously anticipated. I'd now like to summarize our updated guidance for 2024.

2023 年，我們在獲利之路上取得了重大進展。進入 2024 年，我們信心倍增，相信我們將比之前的預期更快、更大程度地實現這一目標。我現在想總結一下我們的 2024 年更新指南。

We expect TGP to grow to more than $1.3 billion, driven by the components of our business that are less exposed to weather and underwriting volatility. We expect revenue to grow to more than $340 million. We expect HHIP gross loss ratio to be between 72% and 78%, with 20% related to PCS cat losses; and between 52% and 58% related to non-PCS losses.

我們預計 TGP 將成長至 13 億美元以上，這主要得益於我們業務中受天氣和承保波動影響較小的部分。我們預計營收將成長至 3.4 億美元以上。我們預期 HHIP 總損失率在 72% 至 78% 之間，其中 20% 與 PCS 巨災損失有關； 52% 到 58% 與非 PCS 損失有關。

Because of the seasonality of weather and areas where our policies are distributed, we expect our 2024 cat load to be allocated: 29% to the first quarter, 41% for the second quarter, 19% to the third quarter, and 11% to the fourth quarter. We expect HHIP net loss ratio to be between 85% and 90%, with Q4 2024 HHIP net loss ratio under 75%.

由於天氣和政策分佈區域的季節性，我們預計2024 年的貓負荷分配：29% 分配給第一季度，41% 分配給第二季度，19% 分配給第三季度，11% 分配給第三季度。第四季。我們預計 HHIP 淨虧損率將在 85% 至 90% 之間，其中 2024 年第四季 HHIP 淨虧損率將低於 75%。

We expect an adjusted EBITDA loss of between $41 million and $51 million for the full year, with more than 90% of the losses coming in the first two quarters, and to be adjusted EBITDA positive in Q4. As a reminder, the definition of adjusted EBITDA that we are using< and have used historically, excludes interest income from the float on premium that we retain.

我們預計全年調整後 EBITDA 虧損在 4,100 萬美元至 5,100 萬美元之間，其中 90% 以上的虧損來自前兩個季度，第四季度調整後 EBITDA 為正值。提醒一下，我們正在使用的以及歷史上使用的調整後 EBITDA 的定義不包括我們保留的浮存保費中的利息收入。

Finally, we expect minimum cash and investments at the time we turn adjusted EBITDA positive to meet more than $400 million, up significantly from our previous guidance. And now we'll be happy to take your questions. Operator?

最後，我們預計調整後 EBITDA 為正值時的最低現金和投資將達到 4 億美元以上，這比我們先前的指引大幅提高。現在我們很樂意回答您的問題。操作員？

(Operator Instructions) Tommy McJoynt, KBW.

（操作員說明）Tommy McJoynt，KBW。

Good morning, guys. Thanks for taking our question. Just from a competitive standpoint, we're still seeing a lot of the largest competing homeowners insurers out there pushing through accelerating the rate increases. Can you just remind us where you guys stand on the rate increases and the adequacy that you have throughout your geographies? And then just how you feel competitively as the competition seems to be accelerating more rate increases?

早上好傢伙。感謝您提出我們的問題。僅從競爭的角度來看，我們仍然看到許多最大的競爭性房屋保險公司正在推動加速費率上漲。您能否提醒我們，你們對升息的立場以及你們所在地區的充足性？那麼，當競爭似乎加速更多的利率成長時，您對競爭的感覺如何？

Yes, great. Thanks. Thanks for the question, Tommy, A couple of different things. As you all know, we've been taking additional rate and underwriting actions for the last couple of years. We did that in a far more aggressive stance after Q2 of 2023. Good news is all of our rate filings are in, most of them have gone live. But I will point out that going live takes effect for new business and renewal business on their effective date.

對，很好。謝謝。謝謝湯米的提問，有幾個不同的問題。眾所周知，過去幾年我們一直在採取額外的費率和承保行動。2023 年第二季之後，我們以更積極的姿態做到了這一點。好消息是我們所有的費率申請均已提交，其中大部分已上線。但我要指出的是，新業務和續約業務的上線自生效之日起生效。

So we're still relatively early in getting the actual portfolio to rate adequacy, which is one of the reasons why these numbers I think are very exciting because we still have lots of positive benefit to work ourselves into the P&L.

因此，我們在對實際投資組合進行充分性評級方面還相對較早，這就是我認為這些數字非常令人興奮的原因之一，因為我們仍然有很多積極的好處可以將自己納入損益表中。

I do think others are taking rate. I think there's a lot of rate that was needed in the industry. We feel very good about our current rate level with those things already filed and already in flight, as I mentioned, to get back on offense. So we feel like we're in good shape competitively to write profitable business.

我確實認為其他人正在接受利率。我認為該行業需要很多費率。正如我所提到的，我們對目前的費率水平感到非常滿意，這些事情已經提交並且已經在飛行中，以重新進攻。因此，我們覺得我們處於良好的競爭狀態，可以編寫有利可圖的業務。

Okay, got it. And how much of the improvement would you say that you guys have seen and underwriting has come from actual rate which you can quantify versus the terms and conditions and the higher deductibles that you've got to push through. Is there a reasonable way to think about the mix of those contributions?

好，知道了。你們認為你們看到的改善和承保有多少來自於你們可以量化的實際費率與條款和條件以及你們必須遵守的更高免賠額。是否有合理的方法來考慮這些貢獻的組合？

It's an interesting question. So there are three primary factors that impacts our forward-looking statements. First is terms and condition changes, predominantly deductibles and high cat-exposed areas. Second, of course, is the rates. And third is selective non-renewals on business that we are getting out of where we are overly concentrated.

這是一個有趣的問題。因此，影響我們前瞻性陳述的三個主要因素。首先是條款和條件的變化，主要是免賠額和高貓暴露區域。其次，當然是費率。第三是選擇性地不再續約我們正在擺脫過度集中的業務。

I think all of these things are very, very important for us to reduce that volatility in our portfolio. And that's been a singular focus of the Company over the last six months. I don't think any one of them specifically is driving the positive results. I think they are all collectively driving the positive results.

我認為所有這些事情對於我們減少投資組合的波動性都非常非常重要。這是公司在過去六個月中的一個獨特關注點。我認為其中任何一個都沒有具體推動積極的結果。我認為他們共同推動了積極的成果。

Hey, Tommy, this is Stewart. I'll just add one thing to Rick's point just to clarify When we think about our expectations for the future and the confidence we have in the numbers, we look at the expected results and then we look at the spread around the expected results. The changes in the terms and conditions and the selective non-renewals and high cat areas are going to be things that are going to affect both of those.

嘿，湯米，這是史都華。我只想在里克的觀點中添加一件事，只是為了澄清當我們考慮對未來的期望以及我們對數字的信心時，我們會考慮預期結果，然後考慮預期結果周圍的分佈。條款和條件的變化以及選擇性不續約和高貓區域將影響這兩者。

But predominantly the spread of the results and the change in the rates is one of the things that's going to be driving the expectation of actuarially where do we think we're going to come out. So it really is a combination of all three things, all three factors.

但主要是結果的傳播和利率的變化是推動精算結果預期的因素之一。所以它確實是所有三件事、所有三個因素的結合。

Okay, thanks. And then just last one I'll sneak in here. I guess we are already into March now, so it would be great to get an update on the first quarter in terms of some of the potential storm activity and losses from that. We've seen some headlines around losses and flooding around Texas, and they have had a decent exposure there. Anything you can share with an update on the first quarter?

好的謝謝。然後最後一個我會偷偷溜進去。我想我們現在已經進入三月了，所以如果能夠獲得第一季度的一些潛在風暴活動和由此造成的損失的最新信息，那就太好了。我們已經看到了一些有關德克薩斯州周圍損失和洪水的頭條新聞，他們在那裡的曝光率相當高。您可以分享第一季的最新情況嗎？

I think it's a little premature for us to be sharing Q1 results at this point. I think we'd be happy to talk about Q4 and 2023, but it's a little early for Q1.

我認為我們現在分享第一季的結果還為時過早。我認為我們很樂意談論第四季度和 2023 年，但現在談論第一季還為時過早。

The one thing I would add is that when we give guidance for the year, we take all current information that's available, and we've baked in our expectations on what's been happening with Q1 weather at this point in our current guidance.

我要補充的一件事是，當我們給出今年的指導時，我們會考慮所有可用的當前信息，並且我們在當前指導中對第一季度天氣情況的預期進行了調整。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

(Operator Instructions) Yaron Kinar, Jefferies.

（操作員說明）Yaron Kinar，Jefferies。

Thank you. Good morning, everybody. I want to start maybe with a couple of questions on the revenue guide, and if we could start maybe with HHIP. You're talking about switching to offense, but I guess I'm looking at two different numbers here. One, if you look at TGP, the guide there seems to be, it's a downwards movement there, like 20% and 30% down; whereas the revenue number is up quite significantly in the midpoint of the guidance range.

謝謝。大家早安。我想先回答幾個關於收入指南的問題，以及我們是否可以從 HHIP 開始。你正在談論轉向進攻，但我想我在這裡看到的是兩個不同的數字。第一，如果你看看 TGP，那裡的指導似乎是向下的，例如下降 20% 和 30%；而收入數字在指導範圍的中點大幅上升。

So can you help us maybe sort things out there? How much of the revenue change is driven by change in reinsurance? How much of the playing offense should we expect to see flow through TGP and revenue?

那你能幫我們解決一下問題嗎？有多少收入變化是由再保險變化所驅動的？我們應該期望看到多少進攻流通過 TGP 和收入？

Yaron, thank you for the question. This is Stewart. I'm happy to start and then I'm happy to let Rick add. You're right. As we think about TGP, the fastest growing pieces of our business in Q4 anyway, which to the extent that that influences next year and the trends continue, it's important to understand that our Insurance-as-a-Service segment and our services segment were the primary drivers of TGP growth in 2024 -- excuse me, in Q3. Let me start over.

亞龍，謝謝你的提問。這是斯圖爾特。我很高興開始，然後我很高興讓里克補充。你說得對。當我們考慮 TGP 時，無論如何，TGP 是我們第四季度成長最快的業務，這會影響明年並且趨勢會持續下去，重要的是要了解我們的保險即服務部門和我們的服務部門2024 年第三季TGP 成長的主要驅動力。讓我重新開始。

Those two pieces of our business were the primary drivers of growth in the fourth quarter of 2023. That trend is going to continue in 2024 on the TGP side. And that's important for us because those two pieces of the business are the most profitable and least volatile in the portfolio. The HHIP business is improving from a revenue standpoint, both in Q4 and continuing again in 2024 because of the factors we talked about earlier, the rate improvements and that sort of thing, but also because of the change in the reinsurance structure.

我們的這兩項業務是 2023 年第四季成長的主要驅動力。到 2024 年，TGP 方面將繼續這種趨勢。這對我們來說很重要，因為這兩項業務是投資組合中利潤最高且波動性最小的。從收入的角度來看，HHIP 業務在第四季度和 2024 年都在持續改善，這是因為我們之前討論過的因素、費率提高等因素，而且還因為再保險結構的變化。

And what we're doing there, as the loss ratio has come down, as the attritional loss ratio has come down, as the expected volatility around that number has come down, we are increasingly comfortable retaining more of the premium associated with the attritional risk within HHIP.

我們在那裡所做的，隨著損失率下降，隨著損耗率下降，隨著圍繞該數字的預期波動性下降，我們越來越願意保留更多與損耗風險相關的溢價在 HHIP 內。

And so we've transitioned almost entirely away from a quota-share reinsurance structure to a more traditional excess of loss reinsurance structure, which means that we're getting paid for the risks that we are retaining in 2022 and 2023. We ended up retaining more of the risk functionally than we retained on the premium, which was a key contributor to some of the losses from the HHIP program.

因此，我們幾乎完全從配額份額再保險結構過渡到更傳統的超額損失再保險結構，這意味著我們將為 2022 年和 2023 年保留的風險獲得報酬。我們最終在功能上保留的風險比我們在保費上保留的風險要多，這是造成 HHIP 計劃部分損失的關鍵因素。

And in 2024, we're correcting that. It won't happen on January 1 because some of the policies from the 2023 tree year are still under a partial net quota share structure. But in 2024, we're moving, As I said, we're moving almost entirely away from that, and retaining premium that is far more in line with the risks that we're retaining.

到 2024 年，我們將糾正這個問題。這不會在 1 月 1 日發生，因為 2023 年樹年的一些保單仍處於部分淨配額份額結構之下。但到 2024 年，我們將採取行動，正如我所說，我們幾乎完全擺脫這種情況，並保留與我們保留的風險更一致的溢價。

Yeah. Yaron, if I could add, this is Rick. If I could add a few things to that. I would look at it almost in two categories. The current portfolio, our historical portfolio and growth in the HHIP program in creating our new portfolio and/or expanding the portfolio that we already have that's profitable. So we continue to take the actions necessary to reduce the volatility in the book. That's efforts for our existing portfolio.

是的。Yaron，如果我可以補充的話，這是 Rick。如果我可以添加一些東西的話。我幾乎會分為兩類來看待它。目前的投資組合、我們的歷史投資組合以及 HHIP 計劃在創建新投資組合和/或擴展我們已有的盈利投資組合方面的增長。因此，我們繼續採取必要的行動來減少帳面的波動。這是我們對現有產品組合所做的努力。

When I mentioned going back on the offense, that's our comfort writing business in segments and demographics and geographies and products where we believe we have a strong competitive advantage. In these areas, we have a competitive advantage, a distribution competitive advantage, and a product competitive advantage.

當我提到反擊時，這是我們在細分市場、人口統計、地理和產品方面的舒適寫作業務，我們相信我們在這些領域擁有強大的競爭優勢。在這些領域，我們有競爭優勢、經銷競爭優勢、產品競爭優勢。

So with all of these components, that business we're doubling down on and going to grow in an accelerated fashion. And over time, we'll overtake the reduction in that historical portfolio, TGP. So we're really excited that we can continue the efforts of Hippo to really write business profitably with these areas that we think are ones that we have a distinct advantage.

因此，透過所有這些組件，我們將加倍努力並以加速方式發展該業務。隨著時間的推移，我們將超越歷史投資組合 TGP 的減少。因此，我們非常高興能夠繼續 Hippo 的努力，在我們認為具有明顯優勢的這些領域中真正實現盈利。

Got it. And Rick, maybe to your last comment there. How should we think about of the inflection point when the pivot to offense starts overtaking the retrenchment and other parts of the business or other segments and geographies in HHIP? Namely, when should we start seeing maybe TGP moving back up again, or gross premiums written moving back up again?

知道了。瑞克，也許是你最後的評論。當轉向進攻開始超越裁員和其他業務部分或 HHIP 中的其他部門和地區時，我們應該如何看待轉折點？也就是說，我們什麼時候應該開始看到 TGP 再次回升，或者毛保費再次回升？

Yes, a couple of things. And just as a point of clarification, and I know your question was specific to HHIP. As Stewart mentioned, we never shut down for business in our agency segments. They continue to sell homeowners policies from third parties, and they continue to sell and cross-sell other products. In the HHIP section, we've already begun opening up in those areas that I mentioned where we have these advantages.

是的，有幾件事。需要澄清的是，我知道您的問題是針對 HHIP 的。正如史都華所提到的，我們的代理部門的業務從未停止過。他們繼續銷售第三方的房屋保單，並繼續銷售和交叉銷售其他產品。在 HHIP 部分，我們已經開始在我提到的那些我們擁有這些優勢的領域開放。

And we will accelerate that opening as we continue to get comfort around the success of the portfolio, the existing portfolio. So I think you're going to start seeing the traditional business slows down in terms of its decrease, and then you'll start seeing increases in premium for these new segments.

隨著我們繼續對現有投資組合的成功感到滿意，我們將加速這一開放。因此，我認為您將開始看到傳統業務的減少速度放緩，然後您將開始看到這些新細分市場的保費增加。

Can you offer a time line around that, or is it too early?

你能提供一個大概的時間表嗎？還是現在還太早嗎？

Yes. I would say late '24, early '25 is when you start really seeing this inflection point, but there's growth that's happening all along the way,

是的。我想說的是，24 年底、25 年初，你開始真正看到這個拐點，但一路上都在成長，

Got it. And then if I could take my second question, was going to be just around the continued gap between the net loss ratio and gross loss ratio that I think we're going to see. When I looked at your guidance even into 2025. I would have thought that, with the changes in the reinsurance program and really a diminishing quota share and much more XOL, we'd see that gap almost eliminated. Can you talk about that? Or are there still lost quarters that we should be thinking of and how's that playing out?

知道了。然後，如果我可以回答第二個問題，我認為我們將會看到淨損失率和總損失率之間持續存在的差距。當我看到你的指導甚至到 2025 年。我以為，隨著再保險計劃的變化以及配額份額的減少和 XOL 的增加，我們會看到這種差距幾乎消除。你能談談嗎？或者我們仍然應該考慮損失的季度以及結果如何？

Thank you, Yaron. And I think as the 2023 treaty runs off, there will be small effects there, but I don't believe those are meaningful and significant. I think the major driver of the difference between the gross and the net loss ratio as we get into 2024 and certainly beyond is just going to be the premium that we're ceding off for XOL reinsurance.

謝謝你，亞龍。我認為隨著 2023 年條約的結束，將會產生一些小的影響，但我不認為這些影響是有意義和重大的。我認為，進入 2024 年以及之後的時間，總損失率和淨損失率之間差異的主要驅動因素將是我們為 XOL 再保險放棄的保費。

I think that's a pretty standard gap between gross and net. We do a little bit of '23 quota share that's running down at this point. But again, that shouldn't be a factor for 2025.

我認為這是毛額和淨額之間相當標準的差距。我們做了一些 23 年的配額份額，目前已經用完。但同樣，這不應該成為 2025 年的因素。

Okay. Thank you.

好的。謝謝。

(Operator Instructions) Matt Carletti, JMP.

（操作員說明）Matt Carletti，JMP。

Thanks. Good morning. Something pretty loud and clear, the kind of the increased confidence you guys have and the path to EBITDA positivity. Can you talk a bit about the exact drivers that got you to that increased confidence. We've talked a lot about pricing and terms and conditions, maybe that's the answer. But are there other factors that play in store?

謝謝。早安.一些非常響亮而清晰的東西，就是你們信心的增強以及 EBITDA 積極性的途徑。能談談讓您信心增強的具體驅動因素嗎？我們已經討論了很多關於定價以及條款和條件的問題，也許這就是答案。但還有其他因素在起作用嗎？

You obviously highlighted some of the more structural expense changes that have taken place. Just trying to understand what's changed over the past few quarters that give you a better line of sight now?

您顯然強調了一些已經發生的結構性費用變化。只是想了解過去幾季發生了什麼變化讓您現在擁有更好的視野？

Good morning, Matt. Thanks for the question. I think it breaks down into a few categories of things, all of which are moving in the right direction. I think on a written basis, we're achieving slightly more rate than we expected in the fourth quarter, and we expect that to continue.

早安，馬特。謝謝你的提問。我認為它分為幾類，所有這些都在朝著正確的方向發展。我認為，從書面數據來看，我們在第四季度取得的成績略高於我們的預期，我們預計這種情況將持續下去。

I think we also made more progress reducing losses in the fourth quarter than we had expected previously. Both of those things, along with the structural changes that you mentioned in your question, mean a better expected loss ratio in 2024 with lower volatility around that expectation than we had anticipated previously.

我認為我們在第四季度減少損失方面也取得了比我們之前預期更多的進展。這兩件事，再加上您在問題中提到的結構性變化，意味著 2024 年的預期損失率會更好，而該預期周圍的波動性比我們之前的預期更低。

I think beyond that, we just came through our 2024 reinsurance placement. And I think that maybe the market was a little bit better than we expected. And I think maybe our story was a little bit more well received by the reinsurance market than we had expected. So I think we have slightly improved reinsurance economics and structure compared to where we were a quarter or two ago.

我認為除此之外，我們剛剛完成了 2024 年再保險安排。我認為市場可能比我們預期的要好一些。我認為再保險市場對我們的故事的接受度可能比我們預期的要高一些。因此，我認為與一兩個季度前相比，我們的再保險經濟和結構略有改善。

And then finally, we talked a lot about the cost-saving initiatives, both people- and and vendor-related in Q3, I think we were able to achieve slightly more benefit from the cost reduction initiatives in the fourth quarter than we had previously expected. And so you'll see those work their way into our 2024 P&L progressively over the course of the year. So I think really all the drivers are moving in the right direction, and we're feeling increasingly confident as we move into '24.

最後，我們在第三季度討論了許多與人員和供應商相關的成本節約舉措，我認為我們能夠從第四季度的成本削減舉措中獲得比我們之前預期稍多的收益。因此，您將看到這些內容在這一年中逐步納入我們的 2024 年損益表中。所以我認為所有的推動者都在朝著正確的方向前進，隨著我們進入 24 世紀，我們感到越來越有信心。

Okay, great. And then one follow-up if I could. Rick, you talked about the competitive environment a little bit and leaning in where you have an advantage, right, whether it's geography, technology, demographic, whatever it might be. I think as we think about the market broadly, we still think of a lot of your competitors as kind of being on their heels, pushing a lot of rate, not looking to grow new business in those areas that you're looking to grow.

好的，太好了。如果可以的話，然後進行一次後續行動。里克，你談到了競爭環境，並傾向於你有優勢的地方，對吧，無論是地理、技術、人口，無論是什麼。我認為，當我們從廣泛的角度考慮市場時，我們仍然認為您的許多競爭對手都緊隨其後，提高了許多速度，而不是尋求在您希望發展的領域發展新業務。

Is that a similar picture, or are these pockets of the market and maybe others view as less cat-exposed and other things as well and there is more competition in those markets? Just trying to get a feel for the competitive environment in the spots where it was going to have to grow?

這是一個類似的情況，還是市場的這些部分，也許其他人認為貓接觸較少，以及其他事情，而這些市場的競爭更加激烈？只是想感受一下它必須發展的地方的競爭環境嗎？

Yes. No, it's a really good question, and so a couple of things. One, we were actually, I think, ahead of the curve from most of our competitors on changing, given the hardening of the market. The main reason we were ahead of the curve is our technology actually allows us to put changes in quicker and get them to market quicker. So I would say we had a 6- to 12-month advantage in terms of timing to our competitors. That's one aspect of it.

是的。不，這是一個非常好的問題，還有一些事情。第一，我認為，考慮到市場的硬化，我們實際上在變革方面領先於大多數競爭對手。我們領先的主要原因是我們的技術實際上使我們能夠更快地做出改變並更快地將其推向市場。所以我想說，就時間安排而言，我們比競爭對手有 6 到 12 個月的優勢。這是它的一方面。

The second aspect of it, which we've talked about before and this is one example, we do have comparative and competitive advantages in certain channels. So we've talked about our builder channel, as an example. We have a tech advantage because quoting a property that doesn't even have a street number or a street name requires significant ingestion of data from builder partners.

第二個方面，我們之前講過，這就是一個例子，我們在某些​​管道上確實有比較和競爭優勢。作為一個例子，我們已經討論了我們的建造者頻道。我們擁有技術優勢，因為引用甚至沒有街道號碼或街道名稱的房產需要從建築商合作夥伴獲取大量數據。

We have a distribution advantage because we are getting those leads directly from the builder partners. And we have a product advantage. We have constructed a specific homeowner's policy for new home builds. All of those are areas in, although what some may think is a niche, there's between 1 million and 1.5 million new homes being built every year. So if that's a niche, it's a massive one where we have four years of moat building and competitive advantage that we're doubling down on.

我們擁有分銷優勢，因為我們直接從建築商合作夥伴那裡獲得這些線索。而且我們有產品優勢。我們為新建住宅制定了具體的房主政策。所有這些領域，雖然有些人可能認為是小眾領域，但每年都會建造 100 萬至 150 萬套新房屋。因此，如果這是一個利基市場，那麼它就是一個巨大的利基市場，我們有四年的護城河建設和競爭優勢，我們正在加倍努力。

Great. Thanks. That's helpful. I appreciate it.

偉大的。謝謝。這很有幫助。我很感激。

You're welcome.

不客氣。

Yaron Kinar, Jefferies.

亞倫·基納爾，傑弗里斯。

Thanks, actually, two follow-up questions, if I could. One, when you say that the actions you've taken now would reduce direct losses from hail events like 55%, and if the same hail events occurred in '24 as we did in '23, is that on a dollar basis?

謝謝，實際上，如果可以的話，還有兩個後續問題。一，當你說你現在採取的行動可以減少冰雹事件造成的直接損失55%左右時，如果24年發生了與23年相同的冰雹事件，這是按美元計算的嗎？

Yes, Yaron, that's on a dollar basis. So basically, if you just apply the exact same storms, the exact same severity in the exact same geographies, and you roll our changes in wind and hail deductibles and selective non-renewals through the portfolio progressively over the course of the year with their renewal date, we'll achieve a 55% reduction relative to 2023 and 2024. And then it rises to nearly 80% if you allow those changes to work their way all the way through the book.

是的，Yaron，這是以美元計算的。因此，基本上，如果您在完全相同的地理位置應用完全相同的風暴、完全相同的嚴重程度，並且在一年中逐步通過投資組合滾動我們在風和冰雹免賠額以及選擇性不續簽方面的變化，並進行續約到那時，我們將比 2023 年和 2024 年減少 55%。如果你允許這些改變貫穿整本書，那麼這個比例就會上升到近 80%。

The reason for the difference is because these storms happened -- we didn't really start the process of rolling these changes out until the fall of 2024. So not all of our portfolio policies will have had a chance to come up for renewal by the time we get to hail season this year. So we'll still have some of that exposure, but it will be dramatically reduced in '24 and then even further reduced in '25.

造成差異的原因是這些風暴發生了——我們直到 2024 年秋天才真正開始推出這些變更。因此，今年冰雹季節到來時，並非我們所有的投資組合政策都有機會更新。因此，我們仍然會有一些曝光，但它會在 24 年大幅減少，然後在 25 年進一步減少。

Yaron, this is Rick. Just to add to that and really with one of the previous questions. If you really think about when we started the work on reducing volatility in the portfolio, we actually started that work in 2022. And so we significantly reduced the volatility from 2022 to 2023. Just 2023 was a first half and a horrible hail season. So we hadn't benefited from all of the actions that we had already been taking.

亞倫，這是瑞克。只是為了補充這一點，實際上是前面的問題之一。如果你認真思考我們何時開始減少投資組合波動性的工作，我們實際上是在 2022 年開始這項工作的。因此，我們顯著降低了 2022 年至 2023 年的波動性。2023 年上半年是可怕的冰雹季節。因此，我們並沒有從我們已經採取的所有行動中受益。

So now as we look forward to 2024, we have all of the 2022 actions already in the portfolio. We have a portion of the 2023 actions that Stewart mentioned that we started in October as a result of of our Q2 partially in. And then they'll be fully in to the portfolio by the end of 2024.

因此，現在當我們展望 2024 年時，我們已經將 2022 年的所有行動都納入了投資組合中。史都華提到的 2023 年行動的一部分是我們在 10 月開始的，因為我們的第二季已部分完成。然後到 2024 年底，他們將完全納入投資組合。

So we've got a stacking effect of two different years worth of efforts to get us highly confident in our projections.

因此，我們透過兩年不同的努力產生了疊加效應，使我們對自己的預測充滿信心。

And the loss ratio impact should be even more pronounced, right, because the premiums earned components continue to grow?

損失率的影響應該更加明顯，對吧，因為賺取的保費繼續增長？

Yes, that's right because we'll be retaining more in the attritional -- the premium associated with the attritional losses.

是的，這是正確的，因為我們將保留更多的損耗——與損耗損失相關的溢價。

Okay. And then going back to revenues for a second. So in the services segment, the guide there is for a bit of a reduction in growth relative to where you were in 2023. And I understand it's still a very young business that you're still ramping up. So I guess on the one hand, I could say maybe you have a larger base and growing off of that base is more challenging. On the other hand, it's still young and still in ramp-up mode. So why should we see the same level of growth as we saw in '23 or if not better when we look at '24?

好的。然後再回到收入。因此，在服務領域，與 2023 年相比，該指南的成長略有下降。據我所知，這仍然是一項非常年輕的業務，您仍在不斷發展。所以我想，一方面，我可以說，也許你有一個更大的基礎，而在這個基礎上成長更具挑戰性。另一方面，它還很年輕，仍處於起步階段。那麼，為什麼我們會看到與 23 年相同的成長水平，或者在 24 年時看到的成長水平不是更好呢？

Yaron, that's a great question. And I think it gives us an opportunity to clarify maybe one of the drivers that's going on that, that should should be clear to everybody, but because we have and there are some eliminations in the numbers between segments, may be a bit confusing. One of the headwinds for our services segment is the pullback in the pause in underwriting that we've had at HHIP.

亞龍，這是一個很好的問題。我認為這給了我們一個機會來澄清可能是其中一個驅動因素，每個人都應該清楚這一點，但是因為我們已經並且在細分市場之間的數字上有一些消除，可能會有點令人困惑。我們服務部門面臨的阻力之一是 HHIP 承保暫停的回落。

So our service business sells policies that are third party carrier policies, and it also sells Hippo home insurance policies. And so the third party business is the primary driver of growth in the fourth quarter of 2023. It will continue to be the primary driver of growth as we move into 2024 and the beginning of the year when we start to reopen some of the segments of our Hippo home insurance policies that Rick mentioned, and you start to get a tailwind effect from that.

因此，我們的服務業務銷售第三方承運人保單，也銷售 Hippo 家庭保險保單。因此，第三方業務是2023年第四季成長的主要驅動力。隨著我們進入 2024 年和年初，它將繼續成為成長的主要驅動力，屆時我們將開始重新開放 Rick 提到的 Hippo 家庭保險保單的一些部分，並且您將開始從中獲得順風效應。

But the services business grew 20% TGP year over year in the fourth quarter despite the fact that we had paused most of the Hippo premiums. So I actually look at the services business and the growth that we're seeing there as a bright spot when you understand that there was a headwind associated with the Hippo home insurance program pause.

但儘管我們暫停了大部分 Hippo 保費，但第四季度服務業務的 TGP 年比成長了 20%。因此，當您了解 Hippo 家庭保險計劃暫停帶來的不利因素時，我實際上將服務業務和成長視為亮點。

Makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.

說得通。感謝您的澄清。

Absolutely.

絕對地。

Thank you. At this stage, we currently have no further questions. So I'll hand back over to Rick, CEO, for any closing remarks.

謝謝。在此階段，我們目前沒有進一步的問題。因此，我將把結束語交回給執行長里克 (Rick)。

Great. Well, thank you very much for your attention. We look forward to chatting with you next quarter. Have a good day.

偉大的。嗯，非常感謝您的關注。我們期待下個季度與您交談。祝你有美好的一天。

Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's call. Thank you for joining, and you may now disconnect your lines.

女士們、先生們，今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的加入，您現在可以斷開線路了。