Gladstone Capital Corp (GLAD) 2025 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the Gladstone Capital Corporation's first-quarter earnings call. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference is being recorded.

大家好，歡迎參加格拉斯頓資本公司第一季財報電話會議。（操作員指示）提醒一下，本次會議正在錄音。

It is now my pleasure to introduce Mr. David Gladstone, Chief Executive Officer. Thank you. You may begin.

現在我很高興介紹執行長戴維·格拉德斯通先生。謝謝。你可以開始了。

Well, thank you very much. Nice introduction. This is David Gladstone, Chairman, and this is the earnings conference call of Gladstone Capital, trading symbol, GLAD, and it's the quarter ending December 31, 2024. And I want to thank you all for calling in. We're always happy to talk to our shareholders and analysts and welcome the opportunity to provide an update for our company.

好吧，非常感謝。很好的介紹。我是董事長戴維·格拉德斯通 (David Gladstone)，這是格拉德斯通資本 (交易代碼為 GLAD) 的收益電話會議，內容是截至 2024 年 12 月 31 日的季度收益。我還要感謝大家的來電。我們始終樂意與我們的股東和分析師交談，並歡迎有機會向我們提供公司的最新情況。

And now we'll hear from our General Counsel, Michael LiCalsi, regarding certain forward-looking statements. Michael?

現在，我們將聽取我們的總法律顧問 Michael LiCalsi 關於某些前瞻性陳述的意見。麥可？

Thanks, David. Good morning, everybody. Today's report may include forward-looking statements under the Securities Act of 1933, the Securities Exchange Act of 1934, including those regarding our future performance. These forward-looking statements involve certain risks and uncertainties that are based on our current plans, which we believe to be reasonable.

謝謝，大衛。大家早安。今天的報告可能包括《1933 年證券法》和《1934 年證券交易法》規定的前瞻性陳述，其中包括有關我們未來績效的陳述。這些前瞻性陳述涉及某些風險和不確定性，這些風險和不確定性是基於我們目前的計劃，我們認為這些計劃是合理的。

The many factors may cause our actual results to be materially different from any future results expressed or implied by these forward-looking statements including all the risk factors in our Forms 10-Q, 10-K and other documents we filed with the SEC. You can find them on the Investors page of our website, www.gladstonecapital.com. You can also sign up for our e-mail notification service while you're there. You also find documents on the SEC's website at www.sec.gov.

許多因素可能導致我們的實際結果與這些前瞻性陳述所表達或暗示的任何未來結果有重大差異，包括我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的 10-Q 表、10-K 表和其他文件中的所有風險因素。您可以在我們網站 www.gladstonecapital.com 的投資者頁面上找到它們。您也可以在那裡註冊我們的電子郵件通知服務。您也可以在美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 網站 www.sec.gov 上找到相關文件。

Now we undertake no obligation to publicly update or revise any of these forward-looking statements, whether as a result of new information, future events or otherwise, except as required by law. Now today's call is an overview of our results, so we ask that you review our press release and Form 10-Q, both issued yesterday for more detailed information. Again, you can find them on the Investors page of our website.

現在，我們不承擔公開更新或修改任何這些前瞻性聲明的義務，無論是由於新資訊、未來事件或其他原因，除非法律要求。今天的電話會議概述了我們的業績，因此，我們請您查看我們昨天發布的新聞稿和 10-Q 表，以獲取更多詳細資訊。再次，您可以在我們網站的投資者頁面上找到它們。

And with that, I'll turn it over to Gladstone Capital's President, Bob Marcotte. Bob?

現在，我將把話題交給 Gladstone Capital 總裁 Bob Marcotte。鮑伯？

Thank you, Michael. Good morning, all, and thank you for dialing in this morning. I'll cover the highlights for the quarter ended December 31 and a few of the subsequent events before concluding with some comments on our near-term outlook for the company.

謝謝你，麥可。大家早安，感謝您今天早上的來電。我將介紹截至 12 月 31 日的季度亮點和一些後續事件，最後對該公司近期前景發表一些評論。

Beginning with our last quarter results. Fundings were strong last quarter, totaling $152 million, including six new portfolio companies representing a combination of attractive refinancing opportunities and a pickup in the pace of lower middle-market buyout activity. As anticipated, exits and prepayments spiked to $165 million. However, since the inflows include a large equity gain on ARA of $64 million, our total debt investments actually increased by $45 million on the quarter.

從我們上一季的業績開始。上季融資情況強勁，總額達 1.52 億美元，其中包括 6 家新的投資組合公司，代表著有吸引力的再融資機會和中低端市場收購活動步伐的加快。正如預期的那樣，退出和預付款飆升至 1.65 億美元。然而，由於流入資金包括 6,400 萬美元的 ARA 巨額股權收益，我們的總債務投資實際上在本季度增加了 4,500 萬美元。

Investment income for the period declined by $1.8 million to $22 million as the decline in SOFR rates accounting for the bulk of the 90 basis point reduction in the weighted average portfolio yield to 13.1%. Average earning assets also declined 2.6% with the magnitude of portfolio turnover and because of an additional investment being added to our nonearning asset list.

該期間的投資收入減少了 180 萬美元，至 2,200 萬美元，因為 SOFR 利率的下降佔加權平均投資組合收益率下降 90 個基點至 13.1% 的主要原因。由於投資組合週轉率的大幅提高以及非營利資產清單中又增加了一項投資，平均盈利資產也下降了 2.6%。

Interest and financing costs declined by $700,000 or 13% on lower average line borrowings and net management fees declined by $1.7 million with the surge in new deal origination fee credits, leading to an increase in net investment income of $300,000 to $11.2 million. Net realized gains came in at $58 million for the quarter and contributed to the $15.9 million of net realized and unrealized gains, which lifted our ROE to just over 22% for the quarter and the TTM period.

由於平均借款額度較低，利息和融資成本下降了 70 萬美元，降幅為 13%，由於新交易發起費用信貸激增，淨管理費下降了 170 萬美元，導致淨投資收入增加 30 萬美元，達到 1,120 萬美元。本季的淨實現收益為 5,800 萬美元，貢獻了 1,590 萬美元的淨實現和未實現收益，這使我們本季和 TTM 期間的 ROE 上升至略高於 22%。

With respect to the portfolio, the reinvestment of the ARA proceeds lifted our senior debt holdings to 73.4% of the fair value of the portfolio and total debt holdings by 5% to 89.3% of the portfolio at fair value. During the quarter, we foreclosed on EGs, a regional QSR based in the Southwest and today are well into the operational restructuring of the business, including new management, the closing of unprofitable locations and significant overhead cost reductions. We expect to achieve the timely completion of this process, which should result in the sale of the investment or return of the investment to our performing status.

就投資組合而言，ARA 收益的再投資使我們的優先債務持有量上升至投資組合公允價值的 73.4%，總債務持有量上升 5%，達到投資組合公允價值的 89.3%。在本季度，我們取消了位於西南地區的一家區域性 QSR EGs 的贖回權，目前該公司的業務運營重組已全面展開，包括新的管理層、關閉無利可圖的門市以及大幅削減管理費用。我們希望及時完成此過程，從而出售投資或使投資恢復到我們的經營狀況。

With the addition of this company to our non-earning investments, the total at the end of the quarter rose to $52.7 million at cost or $28.5 million or 4% of assets at fair value. The bulk of the $15.9 million of net appreciation for the quarter was led by our equity co-investment in Sokol Foods, which was sold to a strategic buyer shortly after the end of the quarter, and a small incremental appreciation of our position in ARA. The improved performance of several smaller manufacturing consumer and service-oriented businesses also outpaced the underperformers and we elected to exit our small underperforming position in DKI at a modest loss.

隨著這家公司加入我們的非營利投資，本季末的總成本上升至 5,270 萬美元，或 2,850 萬美元，或公允價值的 4%。本季 1,590 萬美元的淨增值主要源於我們對 Sokol Foods 的股權共同投資，該公司在本季度末不久後被出售給了一位戰略買家，以及我們在 ARA 的持股略有增量增值。幾家規模較小的製造、消費和服務型企業的業績改善也超過了表現不佳的企業，因此我們選擇以適度損失的價格退出 DKI 中表現不佳的小型倉位。

Following the end of the quarter, we exited two additional portfolio investments representing debt proceeds of $26.1 million and a $5.8 million equity proceeds from our Sokol investment. And consistent with last quarter's activity, we remained -- maintained our momentum by closing two new portfolio investments thus far this quarter, representing a total originations of $38 million.

在本季結束後，我們退出了另外兩項投資組合，分別為 2,610 萬美元的債務收益和來自 Sokol 投資的 580 萬美元的股權收益。與上一季的活動一致，我們保持了發展勢頭，本季迄今已完成了兩項新的投資組合，總投資額為 3,800 萬美元。

And reflecting on our outlook for the next quarter or two, I'd like to leave with the following: we continue to expect the elevated level of portfolio exit and repayments to continue for the next one to two quarters and are very focused on the timely redeployment of these exit proceeds to maintain our investment asset base. Prepayments or closing fees are expected to remain elevated during this period of portfolio turnover and the magnitude of margin compression in the lower middle market has been more muted as evidenced by our originations last quarter, which were closed at a weighted average spread above 700 basis points over SOFR and a weighted average closing leverage of 3.4 times EBITDA.

回顧我們對未來一兩個季度的展望，我想得出以下結論：我們預計未來一到兩個季度投資組合退出和償還的水平將繼續保持較高水平，我們非常注重及時重新部署這些退出收益，以維持我們的投資資產基礎。在這項投資組合週轉期間，預付款或結算費用預計仍將保持在高位，而中低端市場利潤率壓縮的幅度則較為溫和，這一點從我們上個季度的發起交易中可以看出。

We continue to see a healthy level of attractive lower middle market financing opportunities, typically under $10 million of EBITDA, and where low leverage or pricing dictate, we will consider teaming with commercial banks to blend down the overall cost of the financings we can deliver.

我們繼續看到具有吸引力的健康水平的中低端市場融資機會，通常低於 1000 萬美元的 EBITDA，並且在低槓桿或定價要求的情況下，我們將考慮與商業銀行合作，以降低我們可以提供的融資的總體成本。

In addition to recycling some mature investments, we expect to continue to benefit from an incumbent position as the originator, lead lender and in some case, equity co-investor in the newer vintage growth-oriented businesses as they look to grow through acquisition or expansion and support the appreciation of their equity position. We ended the quarter with a conservative leverage position with debt at 70% of NAV and the bulk of our bank credit facility available to support the growth of our earning assets and shareholder distributions in the coming year.

除了回收一些成熟的投資外，我們還期望繼續受益於作為發起人、牽頭貸款人以及在某些情況下作為較新的成熟增長型企業的股權共同投資者的現有地位，因為它們希望通過收購或擴張來實現增長並支持其股權地位的升值。我們在本季結束時採取了保守的槓桿率，債務佔資產淨值的 70%，並且大部分銀行信貸額度可用於支持我們明年的盈利資產和股東分配的增長。

And now I'd like to turn the call over to Nicole Schaltenbrand, the CFO of Gladstone Capital, to provide some more details on the fund's results for the quarter.

現在，我想將電話轉給 Gladstone Capital 的財務長 Nicole Schaltenbrand，提供有關該基金本季業績的更多詳細資訊。

Thanks, Bob. Good morning, everyone. During the December quarter, total interest income declined $2.1 million or 8.8% to $21.3 million as the weighted average yield on our interest-bearing portfolio declined from 14% to 13.1% with a 62 basis point decline in the average SOFR rate from last quarter. Other income rose to $600,000 and total investment income was $22 million, which was down $1.8 million or 7.4% from last quarter.

謝謝，鮑伯。大家早安。12 月季度，總利息收入下降 210 萬美元（即 8.8%）至 2,130 萬美元，因為我們的計息投資組合的加權平均收益率從 14% 下降至 13.1%，而平均 SOFR 利率較上一季下降了 62 個基點。其他收入增至 60 萬美元，總投資收入為 2,200 萬美元，較上一季下降 180 萬美元，降幅為 7.4%。

Total expenses declined $2 million quarter over quarter as net management fees decreased $1.7 million with the surge in origination fee credits. Interest expenses declined $700,000 on lower bank borrowings and other expenses increased $300,000 with several onetime deal-related expenses. Net investment income for the quarter rose 2.5% to $11.2 million or $0.50 per share. The net increase in net assets resulting from operations was $21 million or $1.21 per share for the quarter ended December 31, as impacted by the realized and unrealized valuation depreciation covered by Bob earlier.

由於發起費用激增導致淨管理費減少 170 萬美元，總支出較上季下降 200 萬美元。由於銀行借款減少，利息支出減少了 70 萬美元，由於幾項一次性交易相關費用，其他支出增加了 30 萬美元。本季淨投資收入成長 2.5% 至 1,120 萬美元，即每股 0.50 美元。受 Bob 先前所述的已實現和未實現估值折舊的影響，截至 12 月 31 日當季，經營活動產生的淨資產淨增加額為 2,100 萬美元，即每股 1.21 美元。

Moving over to the balance sheet. As of December 31, total assets rose slightly to $815 million, consisting of $799 million in investments at fair value and $16 million in cash and other assets. Liabilities declined with the retained earnings -- retained equity gains to $335 million as of December 31 and consisted primarily of $254 million in senior notes and $61.5 million in advances under our line of credit.

轉到資產負債表。截至 12 月 31 日，總資產小幅上升至 8.15 億美元，其中包括 7.99 億美元的公允價值投資以及 1,600 萬美元的現金和其他資產。負債隨著留存收益（即截至 12 月 31 日的留存股權收益）的減少而下降至 3.35 億美元，主要包括 2.54 億美元的優先票據和 6,150 萬美元的信用額度預付款。

As of December 31, net assets rose to $480 million from the prior quarter end with investment appreciation and a small amount of shared issued under our ATM program. Specifically early last quarter, we issued just under 100,000 shares, raising $2.5 million at an average price of $24.90 per share. As a result, NAV per share rose $1.21 from $21.18 to $21.51 as of December 31.

截至 12 月 31 日，由於投資增值和 ATM 計劃下發行的少量股票，淨資產較上一季末增加至 4.8 億美元。具體來說，上個季度初，我們發行了近 10 萬股股票，以每股 24.90 美元的平均價格籌集了 250 萬美元。結果，截至 12 月 31 日，每股資產淨值從 21.18 美元上漲 1.21 美元至 21.51 美元。

Our leverage as of December 31 declined to 70% of net assets. And after the end of the quarter, we funded two new investments, including an $18 million second lien investment in the private label food producer and a $19.4 million first lien loan to Viron International. We also received $20.7 million from the payoff of our debt investment in Fix-It and a debt repayment of $5.4 million and equity proceeds of $5.8 million from the sale of our interest in Sokol.

截至12月31日，我們的槓桿率下降至淨資產的70％。本季結束後，我們資助了兩項新投資，包括對自有品牌食品生產商的 1800 萬美元第二留置權投資和向 Viron International 提供的 1,940 萬美元第一留置權貸款。我們也從對 Fix-It 的債務投資收益中獲得了 2,070 萬美元，從出售我們在 Sokol 的權益中獲得了 540 萬美元的債務償還和 580 萬美元的股權收益。

With respect to distribution, monthly distributions for January, February and March are $0.165 per common share, which is an annual run rate of $1.98 per share. The Board will meet in April to determine the monthly distribution to common stockholders for the following quarter. At the current distribution rate for our common stock and with the common stock price at about $28.09 per share yesterday, the distribution run rate is now producing a yield of about 7%.

就分配而言，一月、二月和三月的月分配為每股普通股 0.165 美元，年分配率為每股 1.98 美元。董事會將於四月召開會議，以確定下一季向普通股股東的每月分配。以我們普通股的當前分配率，以及昨日普通股價格約為每股 28.09 美元的情況，分配運行率目前產生的收益率約為 7%。

And now I will turn it back to David to conclude.

現在我將主題轉回給 David 來做總結。

All right. Thank you so much. Bob, Nicole, Michael, you all did a great job of informing our stockholders and analysts that company is doing a great job and wow, what a quarter that was. In summary, just a wonderful quarter in Gladstone Capital, including team rose to the challenge of sourcing and closing on $152 million of new investments. That's a great way to start a quarter.

好的。太感謝了。鮑伯、妮可、邁克爾，你們都做得很好，向我們的股東和分析師告知了公司正在做的很棒，哇，那是一個多麼好的季度啊。總而言之，格拉斯頓資本 (Gladstone Capital) 度過了一個精彩的季度，其團隊迎接了尋找和完成 1.52 億美元新投資的挑戰。這是開始新季度的良好方式。

And we look at the underwriting and the leverage and the pricing disciplines to maintain the portfolio investment balance at almost $800 million now. Company delivered a net investment income and realized gains totaling $69 million, and that's about $3.09 per share, which is more than supporting the $895 million in regular capital gains and dividends and distributions paid out last quarter. Strong portfolio performance generated another quarter of net profitable portfolio appreciation, bringing the cumulative portfolio appreciation in the past year to $2.53 per share and lifted NAV per share by 12% compared to December 2023.

我們透過承銷、槓桿和定價原則將投資組合餘額維持在近 8 億美元。該公司實現淨投資收入和已實現收益總計 6,900 萬美元，約合每股 3.09 美元，超過了上個季度支付的 8.95 億美元常規資本收益和股息及分配。強勁的投資組合表現帶來了另一個季度的淨盈利投資組合增值，使過去一年的累計投資組合增值達到每股 2.53 美元，並且與 2023 年 12 月相比，每股資產淨值增長了 12%。

In summary, the company continues to stick with a strategy that has proven for the last 20 years to bring nice returns and dividends to our shareholders. We're investing in growth-oriented lower middle market businesses with good management. Many of these investments are supported by midsized private equity funds. This is about the same size as our funds, some of them. And they're looking for experienced partners to support the acquisition and growth of the businesses which they are investing. And this gives us an opportunity to make attractive interest-paying loans with small equity investments along the way; we call them sometimes equity kickers. And it's just a wonderful business. I've been doing that for most of my career, and Bob picked it up and has run with it and have a great team of people that we brought along with us now. So we're in a very strong position.

總而言之，公司將繼續堅持過去 20 年已被證明能為股東帶來豐厚回報和股息的策略。我們投資的是具有良好管理的成長型中低階市場企業。許多此類投資都得到了中型私募股權基金的支持。這和我們的一些基金的規模大約相同。他們正在尋找經驗豐富的合作夥伴來支持他們所投資企業的收購和發展。這使我們有機會透過小額股權投資獲得有吸引力的付息貸款；有時我們稱他們為股權激勵者。這真是一樁美妙的生意。在我的大部分職業生涯中，我一直在做這件事，而鮑勃繼承了這項傳統，並一直堅持下去，現在我們擁有了一支優秀的團隊。因此我們處於非常有利的地位。

And now operator, if you'll come on and let's have some questions from the analysts or investors in our company.

現在，接線員，請您來回答我們公司分析師或投資者的一些問題。

(Operator Instructions) Mickey Schleien, Ladenburg Thalmann.

（操作員指令）Mickey Schleien，Ladenburg Thalmann。

Yes. Good morning, everyone. Bob, many BDCs avoid investing in restaurants because they're very difficult to underwrite. But you've had success there recently with Salt & Straw with the Salt & Straw exit, and now you've invested in Wings 'N More. Could you tell us what attracts you to this sector and what do you look for in a restaurant deal before you invest?

是的。大家早安。鮑勃，許多 BDC 避免投資餐館，因為它們很難承保。但是您最近成功退出了 Salt & Straw，現在您又投資了 Wings 'N More。您能告訴我們是什麼吸引您進入這個行業嗎？

Good question. Good morning, Mickey. The bar is very high on restaurants. Typically, what we're looking for is a compelling business model that has a margin profile, a loyal customer base, a management team that can continue to perpetuate that. And we go in with a very disciplined approach to the leverage structure that generally squeezes down leverage the moment that results or challenges arise.

好問題。早上好，米奇。餐廳的標準很高。通常，我們所尋找的是一種引人注目的商業模式，該模式具有利潤率、忠誠的客戶群以及能夠持續維持這種狀況的管理團隊。我們採取非常嚴謹的方法來處理槓桿結構，一旦出現結果或挑戰，我們通常會立即壓縮槓桿。

We've been invested in several restaurants and are very focused on sustainable margins on a cost basis. Certainly, food and protein costs are somewhat volatile, very efficient labor models where they are cognizant of our hourly and scheduled labor burden. And lastly, restaurants that don't require massive build-out since that extends the life period to achieve a reasonable return. Most of the restaurants we're looking at are somewhere between three and four years in terms of payback.

我們投資了多家餐廳，非常注重成本基礎上的可持續​​利潤。當然，食品和蛋白質的成本有些不穩定，非常有效率的勞動模式會考慮到我們每小時和計畫的勞動負擔。最後，餐廳不需要大規模的擴建，因為這可以延長餐廳的生命週期並獲得合理的回報。我們所考察的餐廳大多的回報期都在三至四年之間。

So when we look at our restaurants, typically, we're going into those well under three turns of leverage. And in cases where, EGs, as an example, things did not work out the ability to squeeze down costs, close some locations and see a path to exiting to a strategic or through cash flow continue to exist. It's just a sector that we drill in deep and focus on those issues and have been able to manage them to reasonable overall returns.

因此，當我們審視我們的餐廳時，通常我們會進入槓桿率遠低於三倍的餐廳。以 EG 為例，在事情沒有成功的情況下，壓縮成本、關閉部分門市以及透過策略或現金流退出的途徑仍然存在。我們只是深入研究並專注於這些問題的一個領域，並且能夠管理它們以獲得合理的整體回報。

That's great.

那太棒了。

I would also add, Mickey, we're probably not going to be putting a ton more of restaurants on the portfolio. There's a point at which saturation makes some sense.

我還要補充一點，米奇，我們可能不會在投資組合中增加大量餐廳。達到某個程度時飽和才有意義。

No, I understand. Thanks for that. Bob, you're in this position with a lot of liquidity on the balance sheet and the stock trading at a very large premium to NAV. So in that situation, would you consider temporarily investing in more liquid credits to put some of this capital to work?

不，我明白。謝謝。鮑勃，你處於這樣的境地，資產負債表上有大量流動性，而且股票交易價格遠高於資產淨值。那麼在這種情況下，您是否會考慮暫時投資更具流動性的信貸，以使部分資本發揮作用？

Mickey, it's an interesting question. Frankly, I don't think so. And the simple reason is our marginal capitals are bank lines. Our bank lines are not cheap. And when you look at the spreads that are available on liquid credits today, I think the marginal return on equity would be very low, given the spread compression on those issues. And most of those larger liquid names, quite frankly, we can't get the primary diligence so we can't engage with the management teams or sponsors as much as we'd like. We don't get the covenant structure we're looking for, and we're basically along the ride on documents that we may not necessarily control. So I don't see us going in that direction for a variety of reasons.

米奇，這是一個有趣的問題。坦白說，我不這麼認為。原因很簡單，因為我們的邊際資本就是銀行線。我們的銀行額度並不便宜。當您查看當今流動信貸的利差時，我認為，考慮到這些問題的利差壓縮，股本邊際回報率將非常低。坦白說，對於大多數較大的流動性較大的公司，我們無法獲得初步的盡職調查，因此我們無法像我們希望的那樣與管理團隊或贊助商接觸。我們沒有得到我們所尋求的契約結構，而且我們基本上只是遵循那些我們無法控制的文件。因此，出於多種原因，我認為我們不會朝那個方向發展。

I understand. My last question is, if you could give us some insight into the outlook for Engineer Manufacturing Tech or Engineering Manufacturing Tech?

我明白。我的最後一個問題是，您能否向我們介紹一下工程製造技術或工程製造技術的前景？

Good question. That company is a very highly automated, attractive capital base that can produce a variety of products. It has capability and diversity of its customer base. Unfortunately, one of the larger customers last year, late in the year, decided to in-source a significant amount of revenue. It was actually the largest customer. And we have been backfilling some of that customer opportunity. I will say that there is some additional management that we're putting in place in that particular situation.

好問題。該公司自動化程度非常高，資本基礎雄厚，能夠生產多種產品。其客戶群實力雄厚、多元。不幸的是，去年年底，其中一位較大的客戶決定將大量收入轉嫁到內部。它實際上是最大的客戶。我們一直在填補一些客戶機會。我想說的是，針對這種特殊情況，我們正在採取一些額外的管理措施。

And the outlook for '25 is actually fairly strong. They've had the largest or the most significant increase in January that they've had in a number of years. Some of it's driven by data center customers that are continuing to build out looking for precision products. Others are folks that are resourcing or altering their supply chain to bring products back to the US. So we are working to retool some of the sales efforts, replace that sales exit and capitalizing on current trends in the marketplace. It's still generating a reasonable level of cash flow and supporting its debt. It's the EBITDA momentum that we're looking to rebuild given what I've described.

而 25 年的前景其實相當強勁。他們一月份的增幅是多年來最大或最顯著的。其中一些是由資料中心客戶推動的，他們正在不斷尋求精密產品。其他人則透過提供資源或改變供應鏈將產品運回美國。因此，我們正在努力重新調整一些銷售工作，取代銷售出口，並利用市場上的當前趨勢。它仍在產生合理水平的現金流並支持其債務。根據我所描述的情況，我們希望重建 EBITDA 勢頭。

I understand, and that's good to hear. Those are all my questions this morning. Thanks for your time.

我明白，我很高興聽到這個消息。這些就是我今天早上提出的所有問題。感謝您的時間。

Do we have another question?

我們還有其他問題嗎？

(Operator Instructions) Robert Dodd, Raymond James.

（操作員指示）羅伯特·多德、雷蒙德·詹姆斯。

Hi, everybody, and congrats on the quarter and the realized gains generated. Just Bob, if I can go back to EGs, you said you're well along the way. Do you have -- and I know this is hard, right, but a rough time, I mean, how long do you think it would be before that the Capital either becomes income producing again or gets liquidated? I mean, is it six months, twelve months? I mean, do you have any view on how long that's going to be?

大家好，恭喜本季取得的成果和實現的收益。只是鮑勃，如果我可以回到 EG，你說你已經做得很好了。您有嗎——我知道這很難，對吧，但這是一個艱難的時期，我的意思是，您認為要過多久資本才能再次產生收入或被清算？我的意思是，是六個月還是十二個月？我的意思是，您認為這會持續多久？

I'll say six months, Mickey, but I hope it's significantly less than that.

我想說是六個月，米奇，但我希望它比這少得多。

Thank you. And then, excuse me, I mean, your activity levels are very robust. I mean, obviously, you just had a big inflows as well, but nonetheless, you're deploying a lot of capital. Where -- I believe your target leverage is about 1:1, I think, if I remember right. How long do you think you could take to get there if '25 is an active year? You're clearly finding good opportunities with good structures, et cetera. So I mean, do you think you could be at, say, 1:1 leverage at this time next year or is that unrealistic with the amount of repayment activity that might be coming in?

謝謝。然後，對不起，我的意思是，你的活動水平非常強勁。我的意思是，顯然你剛剛也獲得了大量的資金流入，但儘管如此，你還是投入了大量的資金。如果我沒記錯的話，我相信您的目標槓桿率大約是 1：1。如果 25 年是活躍年份，您認為需要多長時間才能到達那裡？您顯然找到了具有良好結構等的良好機會。所以我的意思是，您是否認為明年此時您可以達到 1:1 的槓桿率，或者這對於即將到來的還款活動量來說是否不切實際？

I think you asked that similar question last quarter. (laughter) I would say what I told you last year last quarter was, the mission is to hold serve. I mean, $150 million on an $800 million portfolio is close to 20% turn in one quarter. I would expect that we could see a similar amount over the course of the next quarter or two. So 40% in two quarters, if we can run ahead of that, I think it's a plus. And then it just becomes a matter of whether things calm down.

我想您在上個季度問過類似的問題。（笑聲）我想說，我去年上個季度告訴你們，我們的任務是保住服務。我的意思是，8 億美元投資組合中的 1.5 億美元在一個季度內的周轉率接近 20%。我預計我們可以在接下來的一個或兩個季度內看到類似的數字。因此，在兩個季度內實現 40% 的成長率，如果我們能夠領先於這個數字，我認為這是一個優勢。接下來的問題只是事情是否會平靜下來。

I do think that continuing to string together $150 million origination quarters is well above our historical pace of probably $200 million a year. But I do think that there is a reasonable prospect in the last two quarters of the year to move the leverage up. I would say that part of that equation is, what are we looking for in terms of yield given the overall market situation. We've been very disciplined in trying to hold our overall incremental ROE on these investments.

我確實認為，繼續保持每季 1.5 億美元的貸款額，遠高於我們每年 2 億美元的歷史速度。但我確實認為，今年最後兩季槓桿率有合理的上升空間。我想說，這個等式的一部分是，考慮到整體市場狀況，我們在收益率方面尋求什麼。我們一直非常嚴格地努力保持這些投資的整體增量 ROE。

And so, as I said, limited amount of return degradation. To manage that, there's probably two things. One, scale will help, but we also need to address our capital costs. And whether it's our bank line or whether it's the refinancing of a couple of our outstanding liabilities, those would be part of the equation to drive incremental volume in the second half of the year.

因此，正如我所說，回報的下降程度是有限的。為了解決這個問題，可能需要做兩件事。首先，規模會有所幫助，但我們還需要解決資本成本問題。無論是我們的銀行信用額度，還是對我們的一些未償還債務的再融資，都是推動下半年增量的一部分。

I'll remind you that we have a fairly expensive baby bond call date in September at 7.75% refinancing that to lower our cost to give us additional flexibility to take on additional assets and grow the pacing. So the answer is a multi-tiered solution, but we're not going to push it if we don't get the yields we're looking for or can't modify our cost to preserve our ROE.

我要提醒你的是，我們在 9 月有一個相當昂貴的嬰兒債券贖回日，利率為 7.75%，以降低我們的成本，讓我們有更多靈活性來承擔更多資產並加快步伐。因此，答案是一個多層次的解決方案，但如果我們沒有獲得我們想要的收益或無法修改我們的成本以保持我們的 ROE，我們就不會推動它。

Thank you. Very, very helpful. If I got one more on -- excuse me -- have you got any preliminary analysis that you've done like exposure to tariffs or on -- with (inaudible) exposure to government contracts, et cetera? I mean, how do you feel about your exposure on those fronts with things changing rather rapidly at the moment?

謝謝。非常非常有幫助。如果我再問一個問題——抱歉——您是否做過任何初步分析，例如對關稅的影響，或者——（聽不清楚）對政府合約的影響，等等？我的意思是，目前事態變化相當迅速，您對於自己在這些方面的接觸有何感想？

It's interesting. We obviously deal in businesses that fabricate precision products, and metals are a big part of that. Most of the folks that are processing those today are going into markets that feel pretty good about, I mean, defense or aircraft engines, aerospace type products. Those are relatively insensitive markets, and certainly, the final cost of the product is relatively low from a metal perspective. The processing is a meaningful percentage. We don't really have a ton of commodity like processors. We've clearly steered clear of most of the foreign operations and foreign sourcing, given the BDC and domestic assets.

這很有趣。我們顯然從事製造精密產品的業務，而金屬是其中很重要的一部分。今天處理這些產品的大部分人都進入了感覺相當不錯的市場，我的意思是，國防或航空發動機、航空航天類產品。這些都是相對不敏感的市場，而且從金屬角度來看，產品的最終成本當然相對較低。處理是一個有意義的百分比。我們實際上並沒有大量像處理器這樣的商品。鑑於 BDC 和國內資產，我們顯然避開了大多數海外業務和海外採購。

The one area that I say we probably got some exposure to is the auto market. The auto market is one where supply chains extend into Mexico. And as you probably heard in the news between metals and tariffs, there's a lot of turmoil going on. And I think the Chairman of Ford came out earlier today about what the implications might be.

我認為我們可能接觸到的一個領域是汽車市場。汽車市場是供應鏈延伸到墨西哥的市場之一。正如您可能在有關金屬和關稅的新聞中聽到的那樣，目前存在著許多動盪。我認為福特董事長今天早些時候已經談到了這可能產生的影響。

We have two smaller investments in that category. We are watching them closely. They've got good solid platforms, but certainly, these changes are going to create some stress, at least in the near term. So I would say the auto market is probably the single largest area where I think we have some concern about that, but we're monitoring those situations very closely.

我們在這個類別中有兩個較小的投資。我們正在密切關注他們。他們擁有良好而堅實的平台，但這些變化肯定會帶來一些壓力，至少在短期內是如此。因此，我想說汽車市場可能是我們對此感到擔憂的最大領域，但我們正在密切監視這些情況。

Next question, please.

請回答下一個問題。

Thank you. I'm not showing any further questions at this time. So the floor is yours, Mr. Gladstone, for any closing comments.

謝謝。我現在不想再問任何問題。所以，格拉斯頓先生，請您發表最後評論。

All right. Thank you all for calling in. This was a great quarter, and we continue to go forward and make dividends for our shareholders. So tune in next time, and we'll answer questions again. That's the end of this call.

好的。謝謝大家的來電。這是一個偉大的季度，我們將繼續前進並為股東創造紅利。因此，下次請繼續收聽，我們將再次回答問題。本次通話到此結束。

Thank you. That does conclude today's teleconference. We appreciate your participation. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Enjoy the rest of your day.

謝謝。今天的電話會議到此結束。我們感謝您的參與。現在您可以斷開您的線路。祝你剩餘的時光愉快。