Five Point Holdings LLC (FPH) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Greetings, and welcome to the Five Point Holdings second quarter 2025 conference call. As a reminder, this call is being recorded. Today’s call may include forward looking statements regarding Five Point’s business, financial condition, operations, cash flow, strategy, acquisitions, and prospects.

您好，歡迎參加 Five Point Holdings 2025 年第二季電話會議。提醒一下，本次通話正在錄音。今天的電話會議可能包括有關 Five Point 的業務、財務狀況、營運、現金流量、策略、收購和前景的前瞻性陳述。

Forward looking statements represent Five Point’s estimates on the date of this conference call and are not intended to give any assurance as to actual future results. Many factors could affect future results and may cause Five Point’s actual activities or results to differ materially from the activities and results anticipated in forward looking statements.

前瞻性陳述代表 Five Point 在本次電話會議召開之日的估計，並非旨在對未來的實際結果提供任何保證。許多因素可能會影響未來的結果，並可能導致 Five Point 的實際活動或結果與前瞻性陳述中預期的活動和結果有重大差異。

These filings include those described in today’s press release and Five Point’s SEC filings, including those in the Risk Factors section of Five Point’s most recent annual report on Form 10-K filed with the SEC. Please note that Five Point assumes no obligation to update any forward-looking statements.

這些文件包括今天的新聞稿和 Five Point 向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中所述的文件，其中包括 Five Point 向美國證券交易委員會提交的最新 10-K 表格年度報告中「風險因素」部分中的文件。請注意，Five Point 不承擔更新任何前瞻性聲明的義務。

Now I would like to turn the call over to Dan Hedigan, President and Chief Executive Officer.

現在我想把電話轉給總裁兼執行長 Dan Hedigan。

Thank you, Paul. Good afternoon and thank you for joining our call. I have with me today, Mike Alvarado, our Chief Operating Officer and Chief Legal Officer; Kim Tobler, our Chief Financial Officer; and Leo Kij, our Senior Vice President of Finance and Reporting. Stuart Miller, our Executive Chairman is joining us remotely.

謝謝你，保羅。下午好，感謝您參加我們的電話會議。今天與我一起出席的有我們的營運長兼首席法律長 Mike Alvarado、我們的財務長 Kim Tobler 和我們的財務和報告高級副總裁 Leo Kij。我們的執行主席 Stuart Miller 將遠端加入我們。

On today’s call, I’ll update you on our Q2 results, which reflects the company’s consistent cadence of quarterly profitability. I’ll provide a snapshot of the status of the company’s current operations including our strategic priorities and expectations for remainder of 2025. I’ll also provide a brief update on our announced acquisition of 75% of the Hearthstone land banking and residential advisory platform.

在今天的電話會議上，我將向您通報我們的第二季業績，這反映了公司季度獲利的持續節奏。我將簡要介紹公司目前的營運狀況，包括我們的策略重點和對 2025 年剩餘時間的期望。我還將簡要介紹我們宣布收購 Hearthstone 土地銀行和住宅諮詢平台 75% 股份的最新情況。

Additionally, I’ve asked Mike to discuss the Hearthstone acquisition and Five Point’s growth strategy in more detail. And finally, Kim will give an overview of the company’s financial performance and condition with updated guidance for the remainder of 2025. We will then open the line for questions. I’d like to ask that you please limit yourself to one question and one follow-up.

此外，我還請麥克更詳細地討論《爐石戰記》的收購和 Five Point 的成長策略。最後，Kim 將概述公司的財務表現和狀況，並提供 2025 年剩餘時間的最新指導。然後我們將開放問答熱線。我希望您只問一個問題並進行一次後續跟進。

Turning to the second quarter, I’m pleased to report another profitable quarter for Five Point. We had anticipated that Q2 would be relatively quiet in comparison to the beginning and end of the year. However, we remained profitable and generated net income of $8.6 million which is largely in line with our guidance for the quarter.

談到第二季度，我很高興地報告 Five Point 又一個季度實現盈利。我們預計第二季度與年初和年末相比會相對平靜。然而，我們仍然保持盈利，並產生了 860 萬美元的淨收入，這基本上符合我們對本季的預期。

The primary driver of this profitability was Great Park land sales. The Great Park Venture closed on a residential land sale consisting of 82 home sites on approximately 5.7 acres for aggregate purchase price of $63.6 million. This enabled the Great Park Venture to generate net income of $48.4 million during the quarter, our share of which adjusted for basis differences was $16.7 million.

獲利能力的主要驅動力是大公園土地銷售。Great Park Venture 完成了一項住宅用地出售，其中包括佔地約 5.7 英畝的 82 處住宅用地，總購買價為 6,360 萬美元。這使得 Great Park Venture 在本季度創造了 4,840 萬美元的淨收入，其中我們根據基礎差異調整後的份額為 1,670 萬美元。

From a balance sheet perspective, we finished the quarter with total liquidity of $581.6 million comprised of cash and cash equivalents totaling $456.6 million and borrowing availability of $125 million under our unsecured revolving credit facility. Against that backdrop, residential markets in general have weakened as a result of higher interest rates and lower consumer confidence. This has been widely reported by many of our builder customers as they have reported in their earnings calls.

從資產負債表的角度來看，本季末我們的總流動資金為 5.816 億美元，其中包括現金和現金等價物總額為 4.566 億美元，以及無擔保循環信貸額度下的 1.25 億美元借款。在此背景下，由於利率上升和消費者信心下降，住宅市場整體疲軟。我們的許多建築商客戶在收益電話會議上廣泛報導了這一點。

Nevertheless, our results reflect our continued focus on generating revenue, controlling our expenses and managing our capital spend. As we look at the remainder of the year, we expect a strong finish to 2025 with anticipated residential land sale closings at the Great Park in Q3 and Q4, notwithstanding current uncertainty in the homebuilding industry.

儘管如此，我們的業績反映出我們繼續專注於創造收入、控制支出和管理資本支出。展望今年剩餘時間，儘管目前住宅建築業存在不確定性，但我們預計 2025 年將迎來強勁收官，大公園的住宅土地銷售預計將在第三季和第四季完成。

While these challenges are leading to slower new home sales by many of the public builders, to our benefit, our existing communities are located in California markets that are chronically undersupplied. Even with the current market conditions, there is continued interest in our communities.

雖然這些挑戰導致許多公共建築商的新房銷售放緩，但對我們有利的是，我們現有的社區位於長期供應不足的加州市場。即使在當前的市場條件下，人們仍然對我們的社區感興趣。

On my last call, I indicated that we believe we were on track to meet our prior guidance with estimated earnings for 2025 that would exceed 2024’s net income of $177.6 million. Even in light of the current market environment, we believe that we will end the year with net income consistent with last year’s earnings. Obviously, the market is very dynamic at this moment, and we will continue to monitor evolving market conditions as the year progresses. Kim will provide more details on our guidance for the remainder of 2025 during his remarks.

我在上次電話會議上表示，我們相信我們預計將實現先前的預期，2025 年的預期收益將超過 2024 年的 1.776 億美元淨收入。即使在當前的市場環境下，我們相信今年的淨收入將與去年的收益保持一致。顯然，目前市場非常活躍，我們將繼續關注未來一年不斷變化的市場狀況。金墉將在演講中提供有關 2025 年剩餘時間指導的更多細節。

Now let me turn briefly to our current operating strategy. As a reminder, the key elements of this strategy are first, optimizing homesite value within our existing three premier master plan communities by matching homesite sales to current homebuilder demand. As I mentioned, homebuilder demand is softening currently. Now withstanding these current conditions, we are positioned to remain patient and continue to optimize the value in our uniquely positioned land, which should allow us to maintain the margins embedded in that value. Second, we are carefully managing our fixed costs and overhead even while we pursue growth opportunities.

現在讓我簡單介紹一下我們目前的營運策略。提醒一下，該策略的關鍵要素首先是透過將住宅用地銷售與當前房屋建築商的需求相匹配來優化我們現有的三個主要總體規劃社區內的住宅用地價值。正如我所提到的，房屋建築商的需求目前正在減弱。現在，面對當前的這些條件，我們準備好保持耐心，繼續優化我們獨特定位的土地的價值，這將使我們能夠保持該價值所蘊含的利潤。其次，即使在追求成長機會的同時，我們也謹慎管理固定成本和管理費用。

Although there are additional costs associated with our planned growth, we’re maintaining our lean operating structure. We anticipate that our acquisition of Hearthstone will be accretive to earnings, notwithstanding the additional labor costs associated with the acquisition. Third, we’re continuing to match development expenditures with revenue generation to ensure that we are not deploying cash too far out in front of the needs of the development. And fourth, while we anticipate closing Hearthstone in the third quarter and we’ll be working to integrate its operations into our platform, we’ll continue to seek growth opportunities on an opportunistic basis through new acquisitions, joint ventures and strategic relationships. Our focus will remain on these strategic elements of our operating platform as we produce recurring earnings along with sustainable long-term growth.

儘管我們的計劃成長會產生額外成本，但我們仍將保持精益的營運結構。我們預計，儘管收購會產生額外的勞動成本，但《爐石戰記》的收購仍將增加我們的收益。第三，我們將繼續將開發支出與創收相匹配，以確保我們不會將現金投入到開發需求的過高水準。第四，雖然我們預計將在第三季度關閉《爐石戰記》，並且我們將努力將其業務整合到我們的平台中，但我們將繼續透過新的收購、合資和策略關係，以機會主義的方式尋求成長機會。隨著我們創造經常性收益並實現可持續的長期成長，我們的重點仍將放在營運平台的這些策略要素上。

With that said, the members of our executive team have all been in this business long enough to know we’ll need to navigate through uncertainty from time to time. Let me now provide you with some updates on our communities. Of note, across both are actually selling new home communities, Great Park and Valencia, we have seen a slowdown in new home sales since early April. At this time, given the housing shortage, we believe this is a temporary condition in the new home market, which will self-correct over the next quarters. As I mentioned earlier, the market is very dynamic at this moment, and we will continue to monitor and adjust as warranted by conditions at both the national and local levels.

話雖如此，我們執行團隊的成員都在這個行業工作了很長時間，知道我們需要不時地克服不確定性。現在讓我向你們提供一些有關我們社區的最新情況。值得注意的是，在 Great Park 和 Valencia 這兩個實際上都在銷售新房的社區中，我們看到自 4 月初以來新房銷售有所放緩。目前，鑑於住房短缺，我們認為這只是新房市場的暫時狀況，未來幾季將會自我修正。正如我之前提到的，目前市場非常活躍，我們將繼續根據國家和地方的情況進行監測和調整。

So let me turn first to our Great Park Neighborhoods community. During the second quarter, builders in this community sold 112 homes versus 233 homes in Q1 of 2025. We currently have 13 actually selling programs in the Great Park, roughly half of which we expect to be sold out by the end of 2025. 10 additional programs are anticipated to start sales later this year. I also previously reported the completion of bidding and contracting for a group of 9 new residential programs at the Great Park totaling 572 homesites, which are being sold to 6 builders.

首先讓我談談我們的大公園社區。第二季度，該社區的建築商售出了 112 套房屋，而 2025 年第一季售出了 233 套房屋。目前，大公園內有 13 個實際銷售項目，預計到 2025 年底，其中約一半將售罄。預計今年稍後將有另外 10 個項目開始銷售。我之前也報告過，大公園 9 個新住宅項目的招標和簽約工作已經完成，共 572 個住宅用地，將出售給 6 家建築商。

We still anticipate that these land sales will close either late third quarter or early fourth quarter of this year. We’ll have more to report on these sales next quarter. I’ve also previously reported that the City of Irvine completed its state mandated regional housing needs assessment, general plan and zoning updates for the Great Park planning area, which will provide the Great Park Venture with the opportunity to convert some or substantial portions of its remaining commercial land holdings to a residential uses. We continue to work with the city to expand our residential opportunities on our remaining land consistent with the Arena program adopted by the city. Now let me discuss Valencia, our other active community.

我們仍然預計這些土地出售將在今年第三季末或第四季初完成。下個季度我們將報告更多有關這些銷售情況的資訊。我之前也曾報道過，爾灣市已完成州政府規定的大公園規劃區區域住房需求評估、總體規劃和分區更新，這將為大公園項目提供機會，將其剩餘的部分或大部分商業用地轉換為住宅用途。我們將繼續與市政府合作，擴大剩餘土地上的住宅機會，這與市政府採用的競技場計劃保持一致。現在讓我來討論一下我們的另一個活躍社區瓦倫西亞。

As a reminder, Valencia is in the early stages of its development and still has many future phases of land delivery ahead of it, which will enable us to provide much needed housing in the Los Angeles market. During the second quarter, our guest builders sold 49 new homes or 69 in quarter one. We currently have six actually selling programs in Valencia with one of those expected to sell out before year end. Additionally, we anticipate another four programs will open during the last 2025 providing a greater diversity of home offerings for prospective home buyers. We’re continuing to work with builders on the potential sale of two new communities.

提醒一下，瓦倫西亞正處於發展的早期階段，未來仍有許多土地交付階段，這將使我們能夠為洛杉磯市場提供急需的住房。第二季度，我們的客座建築商售出了 49 套新房，第一季售出了 69 套。目前，我們在瓦倫西亞有六個實際銷售的項目，其中一個預計將在年底前銷售一空。此外，我們預計 2025 年底將開放另外四個項目，為潛在購屋者提供更多樣化的住房選擇。我們正在繼續與建築商合作，討論兩個新社區的潛在出售事宜。

As I previously discussed, we also continue to work with Los Angeles County and other agencies on our regulatory approvals for future development areas in Valencia that will allow us to deliver thousands of additional home sites in the county severely undersupplied market. In total, these developments are expected to consist of approximately 8,900 market rate home sites and 183 net acres of commercial land, approximately 139 of which is expected to cater towards industrial focused uses.

正如我之前所討論的，我們也將繼續與洛杉磯縣和其他機構合作，爭取瓦倫西亞未來開發區域的監管批准，這將使我們能夠在該縣嚴重供應不足的市場提供數千個額外的住宅用地。總體而言，這些開發案預計將包括約 8,900 個市價住宅用地和 183 淨英畝商業用地，其中約 139 英畝預計將用於工業用途。

Turning to San Francisco. We are currently working on our engineering for the next phase of infrastructure with the expectation of starting construction early next year. As we work on these plans, we continue to explore opportunities to bring in a strategic partner or other capital sources for this mixed-use Bayfront community.

轉向舊金山。我們目前正在進行下一階段基礎設施的工程設計，預計將於明年年初開始施工。在製定這些計劃的同時，我們將繼續探索為這個多功能海濱社區引入戰略合作夥伴或其他資本來源的機會。

So let me now move to the Hearthstone acquisition. As we recently announced, Five Point entered into an agreement to acquire controlling interest in newly formed entity that will include substantially all the business and operations of Hearthstone, a provider of capital solutions to the U. S. Homebuilding industry, a move that represents a meaningful step forward in our long term growth strategy. We believe that this acquisition provides Five Point with a number of benefits and opportunities.

現在讓我來談談《爐石戰記》的收購。正如我們最近宣布的那樣，Five Point 已達成協議，收購新成立實體的控股權，該實體將包括 Hearthstone 的幾乎所有業務和運營，Hearthstone 是美國住宅建築行業的資本解決方案提供商，此舉代表著我們長期增長戰略向前邁出了有意義的一步。我們相信此次收購將為 Five Point 帶來許多好處和機會。

First, provides us with a platform to offer broader capital solutions for the many homebuilders that are already Five Point customers as they continue to adopt land light strategies. We believe this will help fortify their already strong relationship with these customers and will add new ones. Second, this acquisition enhances Five Point’s evolution into a capital allocator and manager of institutional capital through joint venture structures which complements our deep land development expertise. Third, with a proven national platform, Harson allows us to immediately expand our geographic reach, client relationships, and capabilities. Fourth and most importantly, it introduces recurring revenue streams while also connecting us to a broader network of institutional capital providers and builder clients.

首先，為我們提供了一個平台，為眾多已經是 Five Point 客戶的房屋建築商提供更廣泛的資本解決方案，因為他們繼續採用輕土地策略。我們相信這將有助於鞏固他們與這些客戶之間已經很牢固的關係，並將增加新的客戶關係。其次，此次收購透過合資結構增強了 Five Point 向資本配置者和機構資本管理者的轉型，這補充了我們深厚的土地開發專業知識。第三，憑藉成熟的全國平台，Harson 使我們能夠立即擴大我們的地理覆蓋範圍、客戶關係和能力。第四，也是最重要的一點，它引入了經常性收入來源，同時也將我們與更廣泛的機構資本提供者和建築商客戶網絡聯繫起來。

We’re well on our way to obtaining all the necessary third-party consents and we anticipate that the acquisition will close during the third quarter. Let me conclude by saying that while homebuilders are navigating the market uncertainty caused in part by reduced consumer confidence, our balance sheet and liquidity position allow us the flexibility to patiently optimize our land values while still working with our guest builders to ensure the prudent development of our master plan communities. Fundamentally, land is still about location and scarcity. We have well located land in extremely supply constrained markets.

我們正在順利獲得所有必要的第三方同意，預計收購將在第三季完成。最後，我想說的是，雖然房屋建築商正在應對部分由消費者信心下降引起的市場不確定性，但我們的資產負債表和流動性狀況使我們能夠靈活地耐心優化土地價值，同時仍然與我們的客座建築商合作，以確保我們的總體規劃社區的審慎發展。從根本上來說，土地仍然與位置和稀缺性有關。我們在供應極度緊張的市場中擁有地理位置優越的土地。

Now let me turn over to Mike, who will provide more information on the Hearthstone acquisition and will discuss Five Point’s continued focus on additional growth opportunities.

現在讓我把話題轉到麥克身上，他將提供有關《爐石戰記》收購的更多信息，並討論 Five Point 對其他成長機會的持續關注。

Thanks Dan. Let me briefly provide some additional information about our vision for the possibilities with a new Hearthstone venture, as well as our continued efforts to pursue additional growth opportunities. As Dan mentioned, this represents a targeted acquisition for Five Point and is the realization of our efforts to better serve the land light strategy that a number of publicly traded homebuilders have gravitated towards in recent years. It’s been reported that over 70% of land pipelines for homebuilders are optioned rather than purchased outright and that the public homebuilders buy and develop over $35 billion in land per year.

謝謝丹。請容許我簡要介紹我們對《爐石戰記》新專案可能性的願景，以及我們為尋求更多成長機會所做的持續努力。正如丹所提到的，這是 Five Point 的一次有針對性的收購，也是我們為更好地服務近年來許多上市房屋建築商所傾向的輕土地策略而做出的努力的實現。據報道，超過 70% 的房屋建築商土地管道都是選擇權而非直接購買，公共房屋建築商每年購買和開發超過 350 億美元的土地。

We believe our venture has the opportunity to capture a meaningful portion of that market. For those of you who may not be familiar with Hearthstone, they are a market leader in providing these off balance sheet capital solutions to U.S. Homebuilders, with current assets under management of approximately $2.6 billion.

我們相信我們的企業有機會佔領該市場的很大一部分份額。對於那些可能不熟悉 Hearthstone 的人來說，他們是向美國房屋建築商提供這些表外資本解決方案的市場領導者，目前管理的資產約為 26 億美元。

Hearthstone started its slot option program back in 1996, and we believe they are the only lot option investor operating today that has been through multiple business cycles, including the great financial crisis. Over time, the land banking space has become increasingly important as homebuilders have strategically sought to avoid holding land on their balance sheets and have come to rely upon land banking and capital partnerships to secure homesites.

爐石戰記早在 1996 年就啟動了其老虎機期權計劃，我們相信他們是目前唯一一家經歷過多個商業週期（包括金融危機）的老虎機期權投資者。隨著時間的推移，土地儲備空間變得越來越重要，因為房屋建築商從戰略上尋求避免在資產負債表上持有土地，並開始依賴土地儲備和資本合作來獲得住宅用地。

Hearthstone’s model is perfectly aligned with a shift and their proven platform provides Five Point with immediate scale and credibility in this space. Heartstone’s disciplined underwriting and their focus on risk managed capital deployment aligned with Five Point’s commitment to delivering strong long term returns for shareholders. Our Stone’s experienced team combined with Five Point’s public company infrastructure and development capabilities will allow us to grow the new venture efficiently and responsibly.

Hearthstone 的模式與轉變完美契合，其成熟的平台為 Five Point 在該領域提供了直接的規模和信譽。Heartstone 嚴格的承保和對風險管理資本部署的關注與 Five Point 致力於為股東帶來強勁長期回報的承諾相一致。Stone 經驗豐富的團隊與 Five Point 的上市公司基礎設施和開發能力相結合，將使我們能夠有效率、負責任地發展新企業。

For Five Point, this venture helps our transition into an asset light structure, where almost all of the capital for the lot option investments will be provided by third party capital sources through a joint venture arrangement. Hearthstone serves as the operator in these joint ventures and earns asset management fees that are payable monthly and additional performance-based fees when certain financial hurdles are met, while typically only having to contribute 1% of the venture’s equity needs.

對 Five Point 來說，這項合資企業有助於我們轉型為輕資產結構，其中幾乎所有地塊選擇權投資的資本都將由第三方資本來源透過合資安排提供。Hearthstone 在這些合資企業中擔任營運商，並賺取按月支付的資產管理費，以及在滿足某些財務障礙時支付的額外基於績效的費用，而通常只需貢獻合資企業股權需求的 1%。

Beyond the immediate financial benefits, we believe that Hearthstone’s relationships with capital providers and builders across the country will complement Five Point’s existing relationships and will unlock additional strategic growth opportunities for Five Point. As part of that growth, we see a major opportunity in the midterm land market, a segment currently underserved by traditional capital providers. We have already had conversations with capital providers and builders who have expressed an interest in discussing joint ventures or acquisition opportunities for land that does not fit in the shorter-term land banking model. These are the types of assets that fit into the core of what we do as a land development company.

除了直接的經濟利益之外，我們相信，Hearthstone 與全國各地的資本提供者和建設者的關係將補充 Five Point 現有的關係，並將為 Five Point 釋放更多的策略成長機會。作為這一成長的一部分，我們看到中期土地市場存在重大機遇，這一領域目前尚未得到傳統資本提供者的充分服務。我們已經與資本提供者和建築商進行了對話，他們表示有興趣討論合資企業或收購不適合短期土地儲備模式的土地的機會。這些類型的資產符合我們作為土地開發公司的核心業務。

In sum, this is not just an acquisition. It’s a strategic move that reinforces our position in the evolving housing ecosystem and positions us for long term sustainable growth.

總而言之，這不僅僅是一次收購。這是一項策略性舉措，它鞏固了我們在不斷發展的住房生態系統中的地位，並為我們實現長期永續成長奠定了基礎。

Now let me turn it over to Kim to report on our financial results for the quarter.

現在，讓我把麥克風交給 Kim，讓他報告我們本季的財務表現。

Thank you, Mike. As Dan and Mike have shared, we are very excited about the progress Five Point is making in executing on our strategic priorities, including the Hearthstone transaction and the potential it provides to drive revenue growth for the company. I’m now going to review our second quarter financial results and some information about our expectations for the Hearthstone venture. Then I will conclude by updating the guidance of what we are expecting in 2025.

謝謝你，麥克。正如丹和麥克所說，我們對 Five Point 在執行策略重點方面的進展感到非常興奮，包括《爐石戰記》交易及其為公司帶來收入成長的潛力。我現在要回顧我們第二季度的財務業績以及我們對《爐石戰記》計畫的期望的一些資訊。最後，我將更新我們對 2025 年的預期指引。

In the second quarter, we recognized $8.6 million of net income, bringing us to $69.2 million for the six months ended June 30. The quarter’s net income is made up of the following two components. We recognized $17.1 million of equity and earnings from our unconsolidated entities, $16.7 million of which came from the Great Park Venture.

第二季度，我們實現了 860 萬美元的淨收入，截至 6 月 30 日的六個月內，我們的淨收入達到 6,920 萬美元。本季淨收入由以下兩個部分組成。我們從非合併實體中確認了 1,710 萬美元的股權和收益，其中 1,670 萬美元來自 Great Park Venture。

The equity and earnings from the Great Park Venture was attributable to net income of $48.4 million which resulted from land sales revenue of $63.6 million and a 75% gross margin. The venture also had $8.6 million of price participation and profit participation revenue in the aggregate as the venture enjoys revenue streams that come from these different types of land sales structures. Five Point added $7 million of management services revenue, $30.6 million of which is associated with incentive compensation from the Great Park Venture. Our second quarter SG&A was $15.6 million.

Great Park Venture 的股權和收益可歸因於 4,840 萬美元的淨收入，該收入來自 6,360 萬美元的土地銷售收入和 75% 的毛利率。該合資企業還獲得了總計 860 萬美元的價格參與和利潤參與收入，因為該合資企業享有來自這些不同類型的土地銷售結構的收入流。Five Point 增加了 700 萬美元的管理服務收入，其中 3,060 萬美元與 Great Park Venture 的激勵薪酬有關。我們第二季的銷售、一般及行政費用為 1560 萬美元。

And finally, we recognized $1.3 million of tax expense. Now let me provide a little detail about our liquidity and cash. As Dan mentioned, we ended the quarter with $456.6 million of cash as well as $125 million of availability on our revolving credit facility, resulting in total liquidity of $581.6 million. At the end of the quarter, our debt to total capitalization was 19.1% and our net debt was $68.4 million.

最後，我們確認了 130 萬美元的稅費。現在讓我提供一些有關我們的流動性和現金的細節。正如丹所提到的，本季末我們擁有 4.566 億美元的現金以及 1.25 億美元的循環信貸額度，總流動資金達到 5.816 億美元。截至本季末，我們的負債與總資本比率為 19.1%，淨負債為 6,840 萬美元。

During the quarter, our cash went down by $71.7 million This was largely attributable to $32 million of development costs at Valencia and interest on our senior notes of $27.5 million. While we had a sale at the Great Park Venture, the venture did not make a distribution this quarter and had a cash balance of $168.2 million at quarter end.

本季度，我們的現金減少了 7,170 萬美元，這主要歸因於瓦倫西亞 3,200 萬美元的開發成本以及 2,750 萬美元的優先票據利息。雖然我們在 Great Park Venture 進行了出售，但該合資企業本季並未進行分配，季度末的現金餘額為 1.682 億美元。

While Dan and Mike have shared a great deal about the Hearthstone transaction and the transformative nature of this acquisition, I thought I would give some limited information about the expected financial implications to Five Point. First, I want to emphasize that we haven’t completed our accounting analysis for the transaction. So what I share is subject to the completion of that analysis after we close transaction.

雖然 Dan 和 Mike 已經分享了很多有關《爐石戰記》交易和此次收購的變革性質的信息，但我想我還是會提供一些關於對 Five Point 預期的財務影響的有限信息。首先，我想強調的是，我們還沒有完成對交易的會計分析。因此，我所分享的內容取決於我們完成交易後分析的結果。

Since Five Point will own 75% of the common units in the Hearthstone Venture and will control the executive committee that manages the business and affairs of the Venture, we will be expecting to consolidate the activities of the Hearthstone Venture in our financial statements. These activities include asset management and co investment with the managed capital that is raised. As Mike mentioned, the Venture generally expects to invest 1% of the required capital alongside the capital that is raised to finance the lot option fund joint venture structures that it is managing.

由於 Five Point 將擁有 Hearthstone Venture 75% 的普通股，並將控制管理該 Venture 業務和事務的執行委員會，因此我們希望將 Hearthstone Venture 的活動合併到我們的財務報表中。這些活動包括資產管理和利用籌集的管理資本進行共同投資。正如麥克所提到的，該合資企業通常預計將投資所需資本的 1%，以及籌集的資本，以資助其管理的批次期權基金合資結構。

Please note that these fund structures are not expected to consolidate with Five Point. Some of those fund structures currently use limited amounts of borrowed capital to augment the equity capital. That indebtedness is not expected to be consolidated on Five Point’s balance sheet. As I mentioned, this treatment is all subject to our final accounting analysis. Now if you reviewed our 8-K announcing the transaction, you may have noted that in addition to the $56.3 million acquisition price, Five Point expects to contribute an additional $37.5 million over time in order to fund the co investment as the assets under management grow, which as I mentioned is generally 1% of invested capital. Depending upon the amount of leverage that is utilized in the new funds, this would suggest that we can grow the assets under management from the current $2.6 billion to $7 billion or $8 billion. We believe that this growth can occur over the next two to three years and that we can achieve that growth without materially increasing the personnel required to service those funds.

請注意，這些基金結構預計不會與 Five Point 合併。其中一些基金結構目前使用有限數量的借入資本來增加股本。預計該債務不會合併到 Five Point 的資產負債表上。正如我所提到的，這種處理完全取決於我們的最終會計分析。現在，如果您查看了我們宣布此次交易的 8-K 表，您可能已經註意到，除了 5630 萬美元的收購價格外，隨著管理資產的增​​長，Five Point 預計還將額外投入 3750 萬美元，以資助共同投資，正如我所提到的，這通常佔投資資本的 1%。根據新基金所使用的槓桿金額，這意味著我們可以將管理的資產從目前的 26 億美元增加到 70 億美元或 80 億美元。我們相信，這種成長可以在未來兩到三年內實現，並且我們可以在不大幅增加服務這些基金所需的人員的情況下實現這一增長。

The Hearthstone joint venture is expected to be profitable this year. However, we do not expect it to materially contribute to our results for 2025 but expect a larger contribution in 2026 and I will be giving more guidance in that regard at year end.

《爐石戰記》合資公司預計今年將獲利。然而，我們並不期望它對我們 2025 年的業績做出實質貢獻，但預計 2026 年會有更大的貢獻，我將在年底就此提供更多指引。

I’d like to now update our guidance for the balance of 2025. We currently believe that we will end the year with net income consistent with last year’s net income of $177.6 million This change largely reflects the possibility that certain land sales might close in 2026 rather than 2025. As we mentioned last quarter, we continue to monitor the debt markets and remain ready to consummate a right refinance transaction for our senior notes, including a pay down of some amount of principal when we determine it is prudent to do so.

我現在想更新我們對 2025 年餘額的指導。我們目前認為，今年的淨收入將與去年的 1.776 億美元淨收入保持一致。這一變化很大程度上反映了某些土地銷售可能在 2026 年而不是 2025 年完成的可能性。正如我們在上個季度所提到的，我們將繼續監控債務市場，並隨時準備為我們的優先票據完成正確的再融資交易，包括在我們認為謹慎的情況下償還一定數額的本金。

With that, let me turn it back to the operator who will now open it up for questions.

說完這些，讓我把話題轉回給接線生，他現在將開始回答問題。

Thank you. Well, now we're conducting a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions)

謝謝。好的，現在我們來進行問答環節。（操作員指示）

Alan Ratner, Zelman & Associates.

艾倫·拉特納，澤爾曼與合夥人公司。

Hey guys, good afternoon. Congrats on the Hearthstone deal, exciting growth opportunity for company. I know you’ll give more '26 color in a few months, but I just I’m curious in terms of the economics of it, should we just think broadly as that business kind of being a percentage of assets under management less some type of personnel expenses? Is that the right way to think about modeling that longer term?

大家好，下午好。恭喜《爐石戰記》交易成功，對公司來說是一個令人興奮的成長機會。我知道幾個月後你會給出更多有關 26 的細節，但我只是好奇它的經濟性，我們是否應該從廣義上考慮，該業務是管理​​資產的百分比減去某種類型的人員費用？這是思考長期建模的正確方法嗎？

Yes. Alan. That’s the way you should look at that.

是的。艾倫。你應該這樣看待這件事。

Okay, great. And then just in terms of the business itself, there’s been quite a few new entrants into the land banking space over the last year or two and we’ve seen generally kind of terms and structures getting more competitive in that space. Think specifically with Millrose and smaller deposits and kind of smaller interest carry compared to what we’ve heard was kind of ongoing previously in the private arena. Have you given any contemplation to kind of products or new terms or financing vehicles that you’re going to be offering the public community to get that assets under management up to $7 billion or $8 billion over the next few years?

好的，太好了。就業務本身而言，在過去一兩年裡，有不少新進業者進入土地銀行領域，而且我們總體上看到該領域的條款和結構越來越具有競爭力。具體想想 Millrose 的情況，與我們之前在私人領域聽到的情況相比，它的存款和利息都比較少。您是否考慮過向公眾提供哪些產品、新條款或融資工具，以便在未來幾年內將管理資產提高到 70 億美元或 80 億美元？

Thanks, Alan for that question. It’s a very good question. You’re right. There is a lot of let’s just say movement in this space right now. But what I think what we see out there is that demand is much greater than current supply.

謝謝艾倫提出這個問題。這是一個非常好的問題。你說得對。可以說，現在這個領域有很多動靜。但我認為我們看到的是需求遠大於當前供應。

So we don’t need to really make any changes from what we’re currently or what Hearthstone is currently doing. Working with them, we’re going to hopefully expand their capital base and there should be a lot more there’s a lot of need in this space in the homebuilding world. So we don’t think we have to change anything. Hearthstone’s got a great platform and business model and we think we can stay consistent with that.

因此，我們不需要對我們目前的做法或《爐石戰記》目前的做法做出任何改變。透過與他們合作，我們希望能夠擴大他們的資本基礎，而且在住宅建築領域，這一領域的需求會更大。所以我們認為我們不需要改變任何事情。《爐石戰記》擁有出色的平台和商業模式，我們認為我們可以保持一致性。

Great. I appreciate that, Dan. So pivoting to, I guess, the core business, if you will, just on the land side. We’ve been hearing from a lot of public builders the last few days about their business. It seems like everybody is pulling back starts, they’re pulling back land spend.

偉大的。我很感激，丹。因此，我想，如果你願意的話，轉向核心業務，就在陸地方面。過去幾天，我們聽到了很多公共建築商談論他們的業務。似乎每個人都在減少開工，減少土地支出。

Your projects are unique in that they’re obviously very desirable in both good and bad markets. But a lot of management teams are talking about the possibility of achieving lower land prices from sellers and just getting some capitulation on that front. I’m curious when you think about the guidance for the land sale later this year, I know you kind of mentioned the reduction is more, I think, a timing thing, maybe some of those deals get pushed out to '26. But are you contemplating the possibility of potentially lower pricing in either Great Park or Valencia, either on a per lot basis or per acre basis compared to what you’ve achieved more recently given what we’re hearing from the builders recently?

您的項目非常獨特，無論在市場好壞的情況下，它們顯然都非常受歡迎。但許多管理團隊正在談論從賣家那裡獲得更低土地價格的可能性，並在這方面獲得一些讓步。我很好奇，當您考慮今年稍後土地出售的指導時，我知道您提到減少更多的是，我認為，時間問題，也許其中一些交易會推遲到 26 年。但是，根據我們最近從建築商那裡聽到的消息，您是否考慮過大公園或瓦倫西亞的定價可能更低，無論是按每塊土地還是按每英畝計算，與您最近取得的成果相比？

Alan, I’ve actually been reading the same things you’ve been reading. But California is so supply constrained and unique. They can’t really, they can’t replace the land that’s here. But we are not --we will work with our builder partners to the extent that they reach out to us. But I think at this point, we do think that we’ve got the ability to let this market kind of settle down hopefully and move our still move our land forward as we are planning.

艾倫，事實上我一直在讀你讀過的東西。但加州的供應非常有限，而且很獨特。他們真的不能，他們不能取代這裡的土地。但我們不會——我們將與我們的建築商合作夥伴合作，只要他們與我們聯繫。但我認為，目前我們確實有能力讓這個市場穩定下來，並按照我們的計劃繼續推進我們的土地開發。

But at this point, I think that the uncertainty in the market is just going to have to play out just a little bit longer. And so, we are at this point are thinking more about just trying to work with our existing builders and keep our land sales moving forward.

但就目前而言，我認為市場中的不確定性還會持續一段時間。因此，我們現在更多地考慮的是嘗試與現有的建築商合作，並保持我們的土地銷售向前發展。

Got it. That’s helpful, Dan. Then final one for me on the land development cost side. When you think about Valencia and the development work out ahead of you there and then hopefully eventually San Francisco gets up and running. We’ve also heard a lot about potential for driving land development costs lower, kind of given everything that’s going on in the market.

知道了。這很有幫助，丹。最後我要說的是土地開發成本方面。當你想到瓦倫西亞和你面前的發展工作時，希望舊金山最終能開始運作。考慮到市場上發生的一切，我們也聽到了很多關於降低土地開發成本的潛力。

And I know your chairman who’s on the line has talked a lot about potentially utilizing AI as a tool to also leverage that part of the business. So, I’m curious if that longer term, you’re kind of optimistic that that might filter through to Five Points business specifically in the two projects that have a lot of development work out ahead of them?

我知道你們的董事長在線上已經多次談到利用人工智慧作為工具來促進這部分業務的可能性。所以，我很好奇，從長遠來看，您是否樂觀地認為這可能會影響到 Five Points 的業務，特別是這兩個有大量開發工作要做的項目？

I think, Alan, the broad answer to that is that technology progresses. We’re hoping it really helps us really try to be able to manage our land development work better, analyze it better. Ultimately, still we’re going to be in a very kind of physical moving dirt is not going to change. But hopefully, can move it smarter and more efficiently. And I think there is some technology that people are working on that can help us there.

艾倫，我認為，這個問題的廣義答案是技術在進步。我們希望它確實能夠幫助我們更好地管理土地開發工作，並更好地分析它。最終，我們仍然會處於一種物理移動的狀態，泥土不會改變。但希望能夠使其更智慧、更有效率。我認為人們正在研究的一些技術可以幫助我們。

But for this point, we haven’t changed any of our budgeting or our thoughts around that, as we think about our future development. But we are hopeful that it can make us more efficient in moving the dirt.

但就這一點而言，我們並沒有改變任何預算或相關想法，因為我們正在考慮未來的發展。但我們希望它能讓我們更有效率地搬運泥土。

Great. Thanks a lot, and good luck with everything.

偉大的。非常感謝，祝一切順利。

Yeah, thank you, Alan.

是的，謝謝你，艾倫。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指示）

David Lundgren, Private Investor.

David Lundgren，私人投資者。

Yeah, Hi. Thank you for taking my question. I had a question about the using your cash. I don’t know if you consider using some of the cash to buy back shares.

是的，你好。感謝您回答我的問題。我對使用現金有疑問。我不知道您是否考慮使用部分現金來回購股票。

David, yes, thanks for asking. A number of people are interested in that question. Currently, our senior note indenture, we are not able to do that. So that’s part of what we’re looking at as we look to perhaps refinance those notes.

大衛，是的，謝謝你的詢問。許多人對這個問題感興趣。目前，我們的優先票據契約還不能做到這一點。因此，當我們考慮對這些票據進行再融資時，這就是我們正在考慮的部分內容。

Okay. And then I mean, I guess the elephant in the room that rarely gets discussed on these calls is that the stock price being well below book value. And I’ve been a shareholder for many years. And I’m curious like if you’re ever going to try to address that or look into reasons why the market isn’t valuing you where you should be. And I think as an investor, I think one of the reasons you’re not valued at the appropriate stock price is because of your corporate structure, which is very confusing.

好的。然後我的意思是，我想在這些電話會議中很少討論的一個顯而易見的問題是，股價遠低於帳面價值。我已經擔任股東很多年了。我很好奇，您是否會嘗試解決這個問題，或者探究市場沒有給予您應有的評價的原因。我認為，作為一名投資者，你沒有得到適當股價估值的原因之一是你的公司結構非常令人困惑。

And this recent deal to buy Hearthstone is making everything more confusing because you’re buying 75%. So now you have you’re adding like another serpentine layer. So I don’t think that this new transaction helps with the corporate structure. I think if you could somehow simplify the corporate structure, maybe that might help the share price. But as a long-term shareholder, I’m just wondering if you’re this a concern for you that the stock price doesn’t reflect the true value, the fact that you’re well below book value?

而最近購買《爐石戰記》的交易讓一切變得更加混亂，因為你買的是 75%。所以現在您要新增另一個蛇形圖層。所以我不認為這項新交易對公司結構有幫助。我認為如果你能以某種方式簡化公司結構，也許這可能有助於提高股價。但作為長期股東，我只是想知道您是否擔心股價不能反映真實價值，即股價遠低於帳面價值？

David, I appreciate that question. First of all, I want to answer directly about Hearthstone. Hearthstone, when it since it will consolidate, it will not add to any complication, if you will. We’ll own 75%, but we’ll report 100%. But as it relates overall to the concern about the difference between the book value and the fair market value of the stock at this time. I appreciate the difficult structure that exists, but there are advantages to it from the tax side and other elements that are very important to the company.

大衛，我很感謝你提出這個問題。首先，我想直接回答關於《爐石戰記》的問題。爐石傳說，當它因為要合併時，它不會增加任何複雜性，如果你願意的話。我們將擁有 75%，但我們將報告 100%。但它總體上與此時股票帳面價值與公平市場價值之間的差異的擔憂有關。我理解現有的複雜結構，但從稅務方面和其他對公司非常重要的因素來看，它也有優勢。

And additionally, I think at another time, we might go through kind of the elements that are associated with the stock going down in value. But we see it rising and continuing to rise over the next several years.

此外，我認為在另一個時間，我們可能會討論與股票價值下跌相關的各種因素。但我們看到這一數字在未來幾年內還會繼續上升。

Okay. Well, thank you for answering my questions. I think you guys are executing really well. I just -- I’m just always wondering why the stock price doesn’t reflect that. So, but thank you for answering my questions.

好的。嗯，謝謝你回答我的問題。我認為你們的表現非常好。我只是——我只是一直想知道為什麼股票價格沒有反映這一點。所以，還是謝謝你回答我的問題。

Ben Fader Ratner, Nexus Capital.

Nexus Capital 的 Ben Fader Ratner。

Hi. I just wanted to clarify something that you said. You said that there would be some debt pay down when you eventually refi the bonds. I think previously, you talked about $100 million to $200 million of debt paydown. Is that still the right number?

你好。我只是想澄清一下你所說的一些事情。您說過，當您最終重新融資債券時，將會償還一些債務。我想您之前談到過償還 1 億到 2 億美元的債務。這個數字還正確嗎？

Ben, this is Kim. Thank you. That will be determined at the time when we enter into the transaction. I don’t know what it will be at that time. Given that the market is changing daily, it’s important for us to assess our needs and everything as that day comes.

本，這是金。謝謝。這將在我們進行交易時確定。我不知道到時候會是什麼情況。鑑於市場每天都在變化，我們必須評估我們的需求以及日後發生的一切。

Thank you. There are no further questions at this time. I’d like to hand the floor back over to Dan Hedigan for any closing comments.

謝謝。目前沒有其他問題。我想將發言權交還給 Dan Hedigan，請他發表最後評論。

Thank you, Paul. On behalf of our management team, we thank you for joining us on today’s call. We look forward to speaking with you next quarter.

謝謝你，保羅。我代表我們的管理團隊感謝您參加今天的電話會議。我們期待下個季度與您交談。

This concludes today’s conference call. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.

今天的電話會議到此結束。現在您可以斷開線路。感謝您的參與。