Extreme Networks Inc (EXTR) 2025 Q2 法說會逐字稿

Good day. Thank you for standing by and welcome to Extreme Networks second-quarter fiscal year 2025 financial results call. At this time, all participants are on a listen-only mode. After the speakers' presentation, there'll be a question-and-answer session. (Operator Instructions) Please note that today's conference is being recorded.

再會。感謝您的支持，歡迎參加 Extreme Networks 2025 財年第二季財務業績電話會議。此時，所有參與者都處於只聽模式。演講者演講結束後，將有問答環節。（操作員指示）請注意，今天的會議正在錄音。

I will now hand the conference over to your speaker host, Stan Kovler. Please go ahead.

現在，我將會議移交給演講主持人 Stan Kovler。請繼續。

Thank you, Olivia. Good morning and welcome to Extreme Networks second-quarter fiscal year 2025 earnings conference call. I'm Stan Kovler, Senior Vice President of Corporate Development and Investor Relations. With me today are Extreme Networks President and CEO, Ed Meyercord; and EVP and CFO, Kevin Rhodes. We just distributed a press release and filed an 8-K detailing Extreme Networks' financial results for the quarter. For your convenience, a copy of the press release which includes our GAAP and Non-GAAP reconciliations is available on the Investor Relations section of our website at Extremenetworks.com, along with our earnings presentation.

謝謝你，奧莉維亞。早安，歡迎參加 Extreme Networks 2025 財年第二季財報電話會議。我是 Stan Kovler，企業發展與投資者關係資深副總裁。今天與我一起的有 Extreme Networks 總裁兼執行長 Ed Meyercord；以及執行副總裁兼財務長 Kevin Rhodes。我們剛剛發布了一份新聞稿並提交了一份 8-K 報告，詳細介紹了 Extreme Networks 本季的財務表現。為了您的方便，您可以在我們網站 Extremenetworks.com 的投資者關係部分取得包含我們的 GAAP 和非 GAAP 對帳的新聞稿副本，以及我們的收益介紹。

Today's call and our discussion may include certain forward-looking statements based on our current expectations about Extreme's future business, financial, and operational results; growth expectations; and strategies. All financial disclosures made on this call will be on a Non-GAAP basis, unless stated otherwise. We caution you not to put undue reliance on these forward-looking statements as they involve risks and uncertainties that can cause actual results to differ materially from those anticipated by these statements. These risks are described in our Risk Factors in the 10-K report for the period ended June 30, 2024, and the 10-Q report for the period ended September 30, 2024, filed with the SEC. Any forward-looking statements made on this call reflect our analysis as of today and we have no plans or duty to update them except as required by law. A reconciliation of our Non-GAAP results can be found in the press release and financial presentation.

今天的電話會議和討論可能包括基於我們目前對 Extreme 未來業務、財務和營運績效的預期的某些前瞻性陳述；增長預期；和策略。除非另有說明，本次電話會議中的所有財務揭露均以非公認會計準則為基礎。我們提醒您不要過度依賴這些前瞻性陳述，因為它們涉及風險和不確定性，可能導致實際結果與這些陳述預期的結果有重大差異。這些風險在我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的截至 2024 年 6 月 30 日的 10-K 報告和截至 2024 年 9 月 30 日的 10-Q 報告中的風險因素中進行了描述。本次電話會議中所做的任何前瞻性陳述均反映了我們截至今天的分析，除非法律要求，否則我們沒有計劃或義務更新這些陳述。我們的非公認會計準則結果的對帳表可在新聞稿和財務報告中找到。

Following our prepared remarks, we will take questions.

在我們發表準備好的發言之後，我們將回答問題。

And now I will turn the call over to Extreme's President and CEO, Ed Meyercord.

現在我將電話轉給 Extreme 總裁兼執行長 Ed Meyercord。

Thank you, Stan, and thank you all for joining us this morning. Our results in the second quarter were highlighted by a continued and broad-based recovery in the networking market. We grew revenue sequentially for the third quarter in a row, led by product revenues, and achieved our best quarter of product bookings in five quarters.

謝謝你，史丹，也謝謝大家今天早上加入我們。我們第二季的業績亮點是網路市場的持續廣泛復甦。在產品收入的帶動下，我們連續第三個季度實現收入成長，並實現了五個季度以來最好的產品預訂量。

Our competitive win rates continue to improve, especially with larger enterprise customers. In the quarter, 36 customers spent over $1 million with Extreme, up from 27 last quarter. We're seeing a promising recovery with larger customers which is creating meaningful share gains across a variety of verticals including healthcare, manufacturing, and IRS. Our EMEA business grew significantly both sequentially and year-over-year. In the Americas, we continued our strong execution of the enterprise vertical. America's sequential growth was impacted by seasonality in the K-12 vertical.

我們的競爭成功率持續提高，特別是大型企業客戶。本季度，有 36 位客戶在 Extreme 的消費金額超過 100 萬美元，較上一季的 27 位有所增加。我們看到大型客戶呈現出良好的復甦勢頭，這為醫療保健、製造業和國稅局等多個垂直領域的份額帶來了有意義的成長。我們的 EMEA 業務比上個季度和上年均實現了大幅成長。在美洲，我們繼續大力推動企業垂直業務。美國的連續成長受到K-12垂直領域季節性的影響。

From what we see, we believe our customers love the simplicity and feature differentiation of our cloud networking platform. We're the only enterprise player that can deliver end-to-end networking solutions from the campus data center, to the edge, and across the wide area network from one cloud.

從我們看到的情況來看，我們相信我們的客戶喜歡我們的雲端網路平台的簡單性和功能差異化。我們是唯一一家能夠透過一個雲端提供從園區資料中心到邊緣、再到整個廣域網路的端到端網路解決方案的企業。

In addition, our industry-leading enterprise campus fabric continues to be a significant factor in winning new deals because it offers zero touch provisioning, provides the most resilience with sub-second convergence, significantly minimizing or eliminating downtime and minimizes the potential blast radius of lateral cyber attacks on the network.

此外，我們業界領先的企業園區結構繼續成為贏得新交易的重要因素，因為它提供零接觸配置，透過亞秒級融合提供最具彈性的彈性，顯著減少或消除停機時間，並最大限度地減少網路橫向攻擊的潛在爆炸半徑。

Our competitors simply cannot match these features with their IP fabrics designed for data centers. This quarter, customers such as Munchen Klinik, the largest hospital network in Munich; Philadelphia International Airport; the city of Temple, Texas invested in Extreme Fabric for its ability to deliver seamless connectivity, reliability and rapid recovery, ensuring uninterrupted operations across their high-demand environments.

我們的競爭對手根本無法利用其為資料中心設計的 IP 結構來匹配這些功能。本季度，客戶包括慕尼黑最大的醫院網路Munchen Klinik；費城國際機場；德州坦普爾市投資 Extreme Fabric 是因為它能夠提供無縫連接、可靠性和快速恢復，確保其在高需求環境中不間斷運作。

Our competitive displacement span a variety of verticals. We recently secured a multimillion-dollar new logo win with the Pittsburgh Steelers to enhance their fan experience and optimize retail point-of-sale systems for greater stadium-wide efficiency. Taylor Wessing, a large law firm in EMEA with 28 offices, 1,200 employees wanted to untangle themselves from the complex licensing structure of our largest competitor to simplify their operations. They chose Extreme for the ease of use and scalability of ExtremeCloud IQ and our industry-leading premier services.

我們的競爭性位移跨越多個垂直領域。我們最近與匹茲堡鋼人隊贏得了價值數百萬美元的新標誌，以增強他們的球迷體驗並優化零售銷售點系統，從而提高整個體育場的效率。Taylor Wessing 是一家在歐洲、中東和非洲地區擁有 28 個辦事處和 1,200 名員工的大型律師事務所，該公司希望擺脫我們最大競爭對手複雜的許可結構，以簡化其營運。他們選擇 Extreme 是因為 ExtremeCloud IQ 和我們業界領先的優質服務的易用性和可擴展性。

We're encouraged by the early traction of our newer commercial models. Bookings for our MSP pilot program have doubled quarter-over-quarter. And we currently have 37 MSP partners. These MSPs love the flexibility of the consumption-based billing program because it lowers their operational overhead and allows their own customers to scale at their own pace. This makes our offer sticky with upsell opportunities.

我們的新商業模式的早期發展令我們感到鼓舞。我們的 MSP 試點計畫的預訂量較上季增加了一倍。我們目前有 37 個 MSP 合作夥伴。這些 MSP 喜歡基於消費的計費方案的靈活性，因為它降低了他們的營運開銷，並允許他們自己的客戶按照自己的步調擴展。這使得我們的報價具有追加銷售機會。

We're also expanding our funnel of major customers with our private subscription, targeted large service providers. Last quarter, we secured several large global wins with long-term agreements that will drive high margin, recurring revenue for Extreme in the coming quarters.

我們也透過私人訂閱來擴大主要客戶管道，目標是大型服務提供者。上個季度，我們透過長期協議贏得了幾項重大全球訂單，這將為 Extreme 在未來幾季帶來高利潤和經常性收入。

ExtremeCloud Universal Zero Trust Network Access, UZTNA, is also gaining momentum. This SaaS solution integrates our mature network access control with zero trust remote application access. This quarter, a new aerospace customer upgraded their wired and wireless infrastructure with Extreme and adopted UZTNA for enhanced security. They value a single policy engine and unified management of application and network access for both on-site and remote workers.

ExtremeCloud 通用零信任網路存取 (UZTNA) 也正在蓬勃發展。這個 SaaS 解決方案將我們成熟的網路存取控制與零信任遠端應用程式存取相結合。本季度，一家新的航空航太客戶使用 Extreme 升級了其有線和無線基礎設施，並採用 UZTNA 來增強安全性。他們重視單一策略引擎以及對現場和遠端工作人員的應用程式和網路存取的統一管理。

Four years ago, we were the first in the industry to announce a universal platform for a unified wired and wireless portfolio. We combine the power of cloud management with next-generation switches and access points that simplifies the deployment experience for customers, increases flexibility, and allows customers to gradually adopt new technologies or change their desired use case by changing their OS or management system without a hardware upgrade.

四年前，我們在業界率先宣布推出統一有線和無線產品組合的通用平台。我們將雲端管理的強大功能與新一代交換器和存取點相結合，簡化了客戶的部署體驗、提高了靈活性，並允許客戶逐步採用新技術或透過更改其作業系統或管理系統（而無需升級硬體）來改變其所需的用例。

In December, we announced our vision for Extreme Platform ONE, an innovative technology platform that integrates Extreme's networking and security solutions by unifying all our applications into a single interface. The core of the platform includes AI models that will drive impactful advances and automation to the networking experience. We previewed the platform with several of our partners and customers. And their response was overwhelmingly positive. They all highlighted the significant time savings their teams would experience by having everything integrated into a single platform powered by AI and with the support of our AI expert. Platform ONE will drive significant productivity gains for IT teams on network design, deployment, management, commercial operations by reducing complex tasks from days to hours and hours to minutes.

12 月，我們宣布了 Extreme Platform ONE 的願景，這是一個創新的技術平台，透過將所有應用程式統一到單一介面，整合了 Extreme 的網路和安全解決方案。該平台的核心包括將推動網路體驗發生重大變化和自動化的人工智慧模型。我們與多個合作夥伴和客戶一起預覽了該平台。他們的反應非常正面。他們都強調，透過將所有內容整合到一個由 AI 驅動的單一平台並在我們的 AI 專家的支持下，他們的團隊將節省大量時間。Platform ONE 將把複雜任務從幾天縮短到幾小時，將幾小時縮短到幾分鐘，從而顯著提高 IT 團隊在網路設計、部署、管理和商業營運方面的工作效率。

Shortly after our launch in December, CRM magazine named Platform ONE one of the 10 hottest networking products of 2024. We have a lot of exciting plans to expand upon our Platform ONE story and capabilities which we'll demonstrate at Connect, our annual user conference, taking place in May in Paris before it goes GA in our fiscal Q1.

我們在 12 月推出後不久，CRM 雜誌將 Platform ONE 評為 2024 年十大最熱門網路產品之一。我們有許多令人興奮的計劃來擴展我們的 Platform ONE 故事和功能，我們將在 5 月於巴黎舉行的年度用戶大會 Connect 上展示這些計劃，然後在我們的財政第一季推出 GA。

We anticipate further market share gains and revenue growth for the full year at a better than seasonal third quarter. We expect this growth to be accompanied by increased margins and cash flow for the full year.

我們預計全年市佔率和收入將進一步增加，第三季的表現將優於季節性。我們預計這一成長將伴隨全年利潤率和現金流的增加。

And with that, I'd like to turn the call over to our CFO, Kevin Rhodes, to walk us through the results and guidance.

接下來，我想將電話轉給我們的財務長 Kevin Rhodes，請他向我們介紹結果和指導。

Thank you, Ed. Our second quarter marked the third quarter in a row of sequential growth. And our strong gross margin performance and operating expense control demonstrated the strong operating leverage in our model. We achieved earnings per share of $0.21, up 24% from the previous quarter and just above the high end of our guidance range. Customer demand trends continue to improve gradually, particularly with large customers.

謝謝你，埃德。我們的第二季度是連續第三個季度實現成長。我們強勁的毛利率表現和營業費用控制證明了我們模型中強大的經營槓桿。我們實現每股收益 0.21 美元，較上一季成長 24%，略高於我們預期範圍的高點。客戶需求趨勢持續逐步改善，特別是大客戶。

Second quarter revenue of $279.4 million grew 4% sequentially based on 6% growth in product sales and attached subscription and support contracts. Professional services was down slightly year-over-year. On a geographic basis, our EMEA business grew quarter-over-quarter and year-over-year based on share gains and diversifying our business to enterprise verticals. America's revenue declined sequentially owing to difficult comparisons of significant deals that we closed earlier than expected in the first quarter. We do expect Americas to grow sequentially in the third quarter. And our APAC region grew 5% sequentially.

第二季營收為 2.794 億美元，季增 4%，得益於產品銷售額及附帶的訂閱和支援合約成長 6%。專業服務較去年同期略有下降。從地理上看，我們的 EMEA 業務環比和同比增長得益於份額的增長以及業務向企業垂直領域的多元化。由於第一季我們完成的重要交易比預期的早，因此美國業務的營收季減。我們確實預計美洲地區第三季將實現連續成長。我們的亞太地區較上季成長了 5%。

Overall, this was the best bookings quarter in the last five quarters. Trends were in line with our revenue during the quarter and the product backlog was once again within our expected range. Channel inventory continued to improve to pre-pandemic levels. And sell-out was higher than sell-in. On a product basis, bookings were ahead of the prior four quarters with sequential strength in data center and double-digit growth in wireless.

總體而言，這是過去五個季度中預訂情況最好的季度。趨勢與我們本季的營收一致，產品積壓再次處於我們的預期範圍內。渠道庫存持續改善至疫情前的水準。且售出量高於售入量。從產品角度來看，訂單量超過前四個季度，資料中心訂單量連續走強，無線訂單量達到兩位數成長。

Total subscription and support revenue was $107.1 million, consistent with the first quarter. Our recurring revenue growth has been driven by the strength of our cloud subscription revenue. Total recurring revenue was 37% on higher product revenue and a predictable revenue stream for our business. Our subscription deferred revenue was up 18% year-over-year to $290 million. And our total deferred revenue was $589 million, up 7.5% year-over-year. We expect subscription and support revenue to grow sequentially in the second half of the year. This reflects the difficult comparisons to the low product growth we experienced in the second half of fiscal 2024.

總訂閱和支援收入為 1.071 億美元，與第一季持平。我們的經常性收入成長得益於強勁的雲端訂閱收入。總經常性收入佔37%，這得益於更高的產品收入和可預測的業務收入流。我們的訂閱遞延營收年增 18%，達到 2.9 億美元。我們的總遞延收入為 5.89 億美元，年增 7.5%。我們預計下半年訂閱和支援收入將持續成長。這與我們 在 2024 財年下半年所經歷的低產品成長相比有困難。

Gross margin of 63.4% was relatively stable, down 30 basis points sequentially largely due to product and subscription mix. But it was up 90 basis points year-over-year on improvement in standard costs. The combination of higher product revenue versus subscription and support drove the sequential results. We expect our gross margin to be in the range of 62% to 63% in the second half of fiscal 2025, also owing to mix.

毛利率為 63.4%，相對穩定，比上一季下降 30 個基點，主要由於產品和訂閱組合。但由於標準成本的改善，該數字較上年同期上漲了 90 個基點。產品收入與訂閱和支援的結合推動了連續的績效。我們預計，到 2025 財年下半年，我們的毛利率將在 62% 至 63% 之間，這也歸功於產品組合。

Second quarter operating expenses were $136 million, down $2 million sequentially and down $5 million from the year-ago quarter. We continued to focus on driving improvement in operating margin and higher profitability for the year. We expect our operating expenses to increase to a range of $140 million to $146 million in the second half of the year, slightly better than our previous expectations despite a consistently positive revenue outlook. Sales productivity and better efficiency from our new commercial models is driving this updated outlook.

第二季營運費用為 1.36 億美元，比上一季減少 200 萬美元，比去年同期減少 500 萬美元。我們持續致力於提高全年營業利潤率和獲利能力。我們預計下半年營運費用將增至 1.4 億美元至 1.46 億美元之間，儘管收入前景持續樂觀，但略好於我們先前的預期。我們的新商業模式所帶來的銷售生產力和更高的效率正在推動這項更新的前景。

Operating profit for the second quarter was $41.2 million for 14.7% margin, up from $33.5 million or 12.4% of revenue in the prior quarter. Second quarter earnings per share was $0.21 and grew from $0.17 last quarter. All above our guidance range.

第二季營業利潤為 4,120 萬美元，利潤率為 14.7%，高於上一季的 3,350 萬美元，佔營收的 12.4%。第二季每股收益為 0.21 美元，高於上一季的 0.17 美元。均超出我們的指導範圍。

We ended the quarter with $170.3 million in cash and net debt of $15 million. Our inventory position also improved by $11 million sequentially and we continue to target an inventory balance closer to $100 million on-hand by year end. $16 million in free cash flow in the quarter reflects higher revenue and solid profitability. We expect a continued recovery in cash flow in the second half of fiscal 2025 as we grow revenue and improve profitability.

截至本季末，我們的現金為 1.703 億美元，淨債務為 1,500 萬美元。我們的庫存狀況也比上一季改善了 1,100 萬美元，我們繼續致力於使年底的庫存餘額接近 1 億美元。本季 1,600 萬美元的自由現金流反映了更高的收入和穩健的獲利能力。隨著營收成長和獲利能力提高，我們預計 2025 財年下半年現金流將持續復甦。

Now turning to guidance. We are encouraged by the level of customer engagement and growth in the funnel we are seeing which should bode well for us heading into the second half of the year. As a result of our improved visibility, we are increasing our full-year guidance and providing a slightly narrower revenue range for the next quarter.

現在轉向指導。我們看到的客戶參與度和通路成長水準令我們感到鼓舞，這對我們進入今年下半年來說是一個好兆頭。由於我們的知名度提高，我們提高了全年業績預期，並略微縮窄了下一季的收入範圍。

For the third quarter, we expect guidance as follows: Revenue to be in a range of $276 million to $284 million; gross margin to be in a range of 62% to 63%; operating margin to be in a range of 12% to 13.7%; and earnings per share to be in a range of $0.16 to $0.20. Our fully diluted share count is expected to be around 134.7 million shares. The improving cash generation and profitability we are achieving this year will allow us to restart our practice of offsetting dilution from stock-based compensation. For the full fiscal year 2025, we expect revenue to be in a range of $1.120 billion to $1.138 billion.

對於第三季度，我們預期業績指引如下：營收在 2.76 億至 2.84 億美元之間；毛利率在62%至63%之間；營業利益率介於12%至13.7%之間；每股收益在 0.16 美元至 0.20 美元之間。我們的完全稀釋股數預計約為 1.347 億股。我們今年實現的現金創造能力和獲利能力的提高將使我們能夠重新啟動抵銷股票薪資稀釋的做法。對於 2025 財年全年，我們預計營收將在 11.20 億美元至 11.38 億美元之間。

And with that, I'll now turn the call back to the operator to begin the question-and-answer session.

說完這些，我現在將電話轉回給接線生，開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions) Please stand by while we compile the Q&A roster.

（操作員指示）我們正在編製問答名單，請稍候。

Ryan Koontz, Needham.

瑞安·孔茨，尼德姆。

Great. Thanks for the questions. Really nice quarter, guys. With US being down, you attributed that to K-12. And then EMEA being up. Any particular verticals you'd point to there? And can you expand maybe on those trends in the geographies? Thanks.

偉大的。感謝您的提問。夥計們，這真是一個美好的季度。由於美國經濟下滑，你將其歸咎於 K-12。然後 EMEA 開始上漲。您想指出什麼特定的垂直產業嗎？能否詳細闡述地理上的趨勢？謝謝。

Kevin, I'll jump in and then you can come behind. Now our K-12 revenue, Ryan, is usually impacted by E-Rate and then just the general building cycle where K-12 schools, they don't want to build while kids and the class is in session. And so I think it's a normal seasonality as it relate to K-12 and E-Rate. And that's where we felt it. We did see a recovery, I would say, in broader Europe. I will highlight, however, that we are still being negatively impacted by a lack of government in Germany. As many people may be aware, we have a lot of business there. A large percentage of our EMEA business is concentrated in the German market. And a lot of those government customers and a lot of those frame contracts are on hold while the government sorts itself out. So when that happens, we expect pent-up demand to release from that market. So yes, it's an encouraging step in the right direction overall in EMEA, but there's more to come there. And then as it relates to K-12 back in the US, I think you'll see that recover as well.

凱文，我先跳進去，然後你跟在後面。Ryan，現在我們的 K-12 收入通常會受到 E-Rate 的影響，然後是一般的建設週期，K-12 學校不想在孩子上課時建造建築物。所以我認為這是與 K-12 和 E-Rate 相關的正常季節性。我們就在那裡感受到了這一點。我想說，我們確實看到了整個歐洲的復甦。然而，我要強調的是，我們仍然受到德國政府缺失的負面影響。很多人可能知道，我們在那裡有很多業務。我們的 EMEA 業務很大一部分集中在德國市場。在政府解決問題期間，許多政府客戶和框架合約都被擱置。因此，當這種情況發生時，我們預期該市場被壓抑的需求將會釋放。所以是的，這對 EMEA 地區來說總體而言是朝著正確方向邁出的令人鼓舞的一步，但未來還會有更多的事情發生。至於與美國的 K-12 教育相關的，我認為你也會看到它的復甦。

Got it. And sorry, I read into that that the UK maybe is getting a little better?

知道了。抱歉，我讀到的內容是英國的情況可能會好轉？

Yes. That's right.

是的。這是正確的。

Got it. And in terms of FX, any impacts from FX you guys hedge? Can you remind us?

知道了。就外匯而言，你們對沖的外匯有什麼影響嗎？你能提醒我們嗎？

We do hedge, Ryan, and what we're trying to do is just offset any currency fluctuations, really minor adjustments from one quarter to another. We don't report anything on an FX-adjusted basis just because we do hedging. And we keep it pretty solid, pretty even.

瑞安，我們確實進行對沖，我們試圖做的只是抵消任何貨幣波動，實際上是從一個季度到另一個季度的微小調整。我們不會僅僅因為我們進行對沖而以外匯調整後的方式報告任何內容。我們保持它相當堅固、相當均勻。

Got it. And just in closing up, any thoughts about the latest gyrations in HP-Juniper and regulatory approval there?

知道了。最後，您對 HP-Juniper 交易的最新進展及其監管部門的批准有何看法？

I mean, look, I think our view, Ryan, is that combination is -- that we would be a net beneficiary of those two companies coming together. And our expectation would be long term that it would happen. Delays just creates more risk around the transaction. And quite frankly, if you're a partner or you're a customer out there making a buying decision in the enterprise space, you've got to be cautious about the potential risk. And so we think delays probably help us somewhat. We had heard that the deal was going to close in March. Previously, we had heard the deal was going to close in December. And now it looks like there's a fresh round of news throwing doubt on the deal. We think both HP and Juniper want to proceed. There's a pretty hefty breakup fee that we know HP doesn't want to pay. And we're also not exactly sure how a change of administration could affect us.

我的意思是，瑞安，我認為我們的觀點是，合併後我們將成為這兩家公司合併的淨受益者。我們長期期望它會發生。延遲只會增加交易的風險。坦白說，如果您是合作夥伴或客戶，正在企業領域做出購買決策，那麼您必須對潛在風險保持謹慎。因此我們認為延遲可能對我們有幫助。我們聽說該交易將於三月完成。此前，我們聽說該交易將於12月完成。現在似乎又有新一輪的消息讓人對該交易產生懷疑。我們認為 HP 和 Juniper 都希望繼續進行。我們知道，惠普並不想支付相當高額的分手費。我們也不太確定政府的變動會為我們帶來什麼影響。

Right. Okay. Super helpful. Congrats again. I'll pass it.

正確的。好的。超有幫助。再次恭喜。我會通過的。

Thanks, Ryan.

謝謝，瑞安。

Christian Schwab, Craig-Hallum Capital.

克里斯蒂安·施瓦布（Christian Schwab），Craig-Hallum Capital。

A great, fantastic quarter, guys. Well, my question has to do with WiFi 7. Can you give us an update when you think that has the opportunity to have a more meaningful positive impact on your business?

朋友們，這是一個偉大而精彩的季度。嗯，我的問題與 WiFi 7 有關。您能否向我們提供最新消息，以便我們了解這是否有機會對您的業務產生更有意義的正面影響？

Let me jump in, Christian, and thanks for the question. And then, I'll let Kevin -- I'll let you chime in to talk about more specifics than what we're saying. WiFi 7 for us is starting to ramp. I think, Christian, you're well aware that your WiFi 7 brings a lot of benefits in terms of it's faster, it has more bandwidth, and in particular, it's about enhanced reliability and the fact that a lot of enterprise customers today who may not have thought about WiFi for certain applications, mission-critical applications, now are feeling more comfortable given the performance of WiFi 7. So we're expecting strong adoption of WiFi 7. Extreme was one of the first to market with WiFi 7. And we would expect a continued ramp also as we build out our portfolio of WiFi 7 products. Kevin, do you want to add any more specifics or is there anything else to say?

讓我插話一下，克里斯蒂安，謝謝你的提問。然後，我會讓凱文——我會讓你加入討論，談論比我們所說的更具體的內容。對我們來說，WiFi 7 正在開始普及。克里斯蒂安，我想你很清楚 WiFi 7 帶來很多好處，比如速度更快、頻寬更大，尤其是可靠性增強，而如今很多企業客戶可能還沒有考慮過將 WiFi 用於某些應用程序、關鍵任務應用程序，但現在考慮到 WiFi 7 的性能，他們對 WiFi 7 感到更加放心。因此我們期待 WiFi 7 得到廣泛採用。Extreme 是最早推出 WiFi 7 的公司之一。隨著我們擴大 WiFi 7 產品組合，我們預計其成長還將持續。凱文，您想補充更多細節嗎，或者還有其他要說的嗎？

I think the only thing I would add, Ed, is that Gartner said that nearly half of the APs being sold in 2027 are expected to be WiFi 7, right? And then, we're seeing some adoption here, at about 12% of our access points that we're selling right now are on the WiFi 7 category.

艾德，我想我唯一要補充的是，Gartner 表示，預計 2027 年銷售的 AP 中將有近一半是 WiFi 7，對嗎？然後，我們看到了一些採用，我們目前銷售的接入點中約有 12％ 屬於 WiFi 7 類別。

Great. No other questions. Thanks, guys.

偉大的。沒有其他問題。謝謝大家。

Thanks, Christian.

謝謝，克里斯蒂安。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指令）

Timothy Horan, Oppenheimer.

提摩西霍蘭，奧本海默。

Hey guys. Ed, can you -- I know you're going to elaborate at your customer event, but can you elaborate just a little bit more on Platform ONE? Just maybe a little more color how differentiated it is in the market? How much of an improvement? Is it versus what you had previously? And what do you think it means for the business model? Do you think this will start to drive better share gains? Maybe how do you think about the TAM or average contract size and openly what to do for margins? I know that's a long question.

嘿，大家好。艾德，我知道你會在客戶活動上進行詳細說明，但是你能再詳細闡述一下 Platform ONE 嗎？或許可以再多介紹一下它在市場上的差異化程度如何？有多大的進步？這和你以前擁有的相比怎麼樣？您認為這對商業模式意味著什麼？您認為這會開始推動更好的股價上漲嗎？也許您如何看待 TAM 或平均合約規模以及如何公開提高利潤？我知道這是一個很長的問題。

It's okay, Tim. And it's top of mind for a lot of people. We came out in December really with our vision for Platform ONE and there's a huge amount of work going on inside of Extreme right now in developing Platform ONE. But if you think about the applications that we run supporting our business, everything from wireless and wired, we have something called site engine which gives us the multi-domain capability to manage our competitor gears. We have SD-WAN. We have UZTNA. So if you package all of Extreme solutions, you can access them through XIQ through the cloud, but effectively, you're going into a different application. So the big task that's being undertaken here is that we're unifying and consolidating all the applications into a single user interface that we call workspace.

沒關係，提姆。這是很多人最關心的問題。我們在 12 月真正提出了 Platform ONE 的願景，目前 Extreme 內部正在大力開發 Platform ONE。但是，如果您想想我們運行的支援我們業務的應用程序，從無線到有線的一切，我們都有一種稱為站點引擎的東西，它為我們提供了多領域能力來管理我們的競爭對手的設備。我們有 SD-WAN。我們有 UZTNA。因此，如果您打包了所有的 Extreme 解決方案，您可以透過雲端透過 XIQ 存取它們，但實際上，您將進入不同的應用程式。因此，我們在這裡要承擔的一項重大任務就是將所有應用程式統一併整合到我們稱為工作區的單一使用者介面中。

And so I think for the field and for our partners, the big game-changer there is going to be the fact that our fabric which is our hottest technology because it's so differentiated and none of our competitors have it for the campus, you're going to be able to observe from a visibility standpoint, manage and orchestrate fabric from the platform in the cloud. And that's been a huge ask from our field and for our partners. So there'll be this unified solution with common user interfaces; common services; ultimately, common data. And in addition, we're also building in the capability for commercial. So you'll be able, from the same platform, to manage licensing and service, et cetera. And so it's a comprehensive platform that is truly unique in networking and it's broader than just this network management.

因此，我認為對於該領域和我們的合作夥伴來說，最大的改變將是我們的結構，這是我們最熱門的技術，因為它是如此差異化，我們的競爭對手都沒有將它用於校園，您將能夠從可見性的角度觀察，並從雲端平台管理和協調結構。這對我們的領域和我們的合作夥伴來說是一個巨大的要求。因此將會有一個具有通用使用者介面的統一解決方案；共同服務；最終，實現共享數據。此外，我們還在建立商業能力。因此，您將能夠從同一平台管理許可和服務等等。因此，它是一個在網路領域真正獨特的綜合平台，其範圍比網路管理更廣泛。

The other important thing to mention is that we built AI into the core of the platform so that you're going to be able to query -- you're going to be able to interface with Platform ONE in a way that really hasn't been done before and it's everything from starting off with query-ing; if you're looking for a configuration information both inside the network; and if you're looking for client performance or are we meeting all of our SLAs, you're going to be able to interface with the platform for some of these basic functions. And it's going to make it a lot easier to do that. As we move along, the idea is to add automation and build automation into this. So as we find certain network issues that happen all the time, we can recommend a mitigation. And over time, you can just automate that function. And so these are some of the things that we're building into the platform that we feel are fundamentally going to change how people are interfacing with the network.

另一個值得一提的重要事情是，我們將人工智慧融入平台的核心，以便您能夠查詢——您將能夠以一種以前從未有過的方式與 Platform ONE 進行交互，一切都從查詢開始；如果您正在尋找網路內部的設定資訊；如果您正在尋找客戶效能或我們正在滿足所有的 SLA，您將能夠與平台互動以實現其中一些基本功能。這將使這件事變得容易得多。隨著我們的前進，我們的想法是添加自動化並將自動化建置到其中。因此，當我們發現某些網路問題時，我們可以建議採取緩解措施。隨著時間的推移，您就可以自動執行該功能。這些就是我們在平台中建構的一些內容，我們認為它們將從根本上改變人們與網路互動的方式。

So this is -- we talked about limited availability this quarter and then GA happening in our fiscal Q1. We would expect over the next three years that we will migrate all of our base onto this Extreme Platform ONE. And that all new customers would be signing up and joining the platform. If you take our cloud management platform, which is very popular, if you take that and then you look at what you get from Extreme Platform ONE, everyone who's in our cloud is going to want to make that move. And ultimately, what we will see is that there's greater value. And with greater value, we would expect to have the combination of our service and subscription revenue grow at a higher rate than where we are today, both in terms of new as well as renewal rates for subscription license. At the end of the day, we want to make it incredibly simple for people to go on this journey and to fundamentally change your networking experience. Kevin, do you want to add anything?

所以這是 — — 我們討論了本季度的有限可用性，然後 GA 將在財政第一季發生。我們預計在未來三年內，我們將把所有基礎遷移到這個 Extreme Platform ONE 上。所有新客戶都將註冊並加入該平台。如果您採用我們非常受歡迎的雲端管理平台，如果您採用它，然後看看您從 Extreme Platform ONE 獲得了什麼，那麼使用我們雲端的每個人都會想採取這一舉措。最終，我們將看到其更大的價值。而且，隨著價值的提高，我們預計我們的服務和訂閱收入的綜合成長率將比現在更高，無論是新訂閱授權的收入還是續訂收入。最終，我們希望讓人們能夠極其簡單地踏上這趟旅程並從根本上改變您的網路體驗。凱文，你還有什麼要補充嗎？

No. And I think you covered it all very well. I mean to us, right, this is a platform that kind of leapfrogs what we're seeing in the marketplace today. And like you said, a lot of customers are very eager to jump on it. And then the AI is going to bring us to another level that we haven't seen. It's not just AI ops, but it really enables them to see better into their network and all the activity that's happening in their network. And it combines the security as well. So I think all of the above, as what you said.

不。我認為您闡述得非常透徹。我的意思是，對我們來說，這是一個超越我們今天在市場上看到的平台。正如您所說，很多客戶都非常渴望參與其中。然後人工智慧將帶我們進入我們從未見過的另一個層次。它不僅僅是人工智慧操作，而且它確實使他們能夠更好地了解他們的網路以及網路中發生的所有活動。而且它還兼具安全性。所以我認為以上皆是，正如您所說。

And will customers -- will this cost them more initially or is it more the increase in revenue comes from them adding more and more products and services that's already on the platform?

那麼，客戶是否會在最初花費更多，還是收入的成長更多的來自於他們在平台上添加更多現有的產品和服務？

Yeah. I think the value is going to come from the new capabilities of the platform and people getting more value and wanting to trade up for the value. So it's not a big step. But we would expect incremental revenue from the combined offering of Platform ONE which would include service, compared to the standard XIQ license and service today.

是的。我認為價值將來自於平台的新功能以及人們獲得更多價值並願意為價值進行交易。所以這並不是什麼大進步。但與目前的標準 XIQ 授權和服務相比，我們預計包含服務的 Platform ONE 綜合產品將帶來增量收入。

Dave Kang, B. Riley.

戴夫康、B.萊利。

Thank you. Good morning. First question is just wondering if you can talk about opportunities with your service providers like Verizon and can we get an update there?

謝謝。早安.第一個問題是，您是否可以談談與 Verizon 等服務提供者合作的機會，我們可以從中獲得最新消息嗎？

Yeah. Dave, as you know, we have very targeted opportunities with Verizon, Ericsson. These are our largest service provider customers. What we've talked about with new commercial models is a private subscription offer and the opportunity to work with them, more like an MSP or in that capacity, to leverage the MSP platform that we're building. The MSP platform that we're building was designed in something we call workspace which is ultimately the platform, that Extreme platform, will be built on and is being built on. And so we see an opportunity to expand our relationships with these larger service providers that are in -- they have relationships with networking providers that the businesses are not very profitable. We think we can unlock profitability with our new platform and the new commercial model with a private subscription offer. And we believe the economics are meaningful enough to want to pick off and get some of them to move. So it's a much longer term sales process. We are in the middle of that having productive conversations. But I would say that's the latest. We've had some large wins that we mentioned that will come in too and you'll start to see them feather in to our results as we close out our fiscal '25 and turn into fiscal '26. Anything else, Kevin?

是的。戴夫，如你所知，我們與 Verizon、愛立信都有非常有針對性的合作機會。這些是我們最大的服務提供者客戶。我們在新的商業模式中討論的是私人訂閱服務，以及與他們合作的機會，更像 MSP，或以那種身份，利用我們正在建立的 MSP 平台。我們正在建立的 MSP 平台是在我們稱為工作區的東西中設計的，該工作區最終是 Extreme 平台將要建置和正在建置的平台。因此，我們看到了擴大與這些大型服務提供者的關係的機會——他們與網路供應商的關係業務利潤並不高。我們認為，我們可以透過我們的新平台和帶有私人訂閱服務的新商業模式來釋放獲利能力。我們相信，經濟因素具有足夠的意義，值得我們挑選並推動其中一些國家採取行動。因此這是一個更長期的銷售過程。我們正在進行富有成效的對話。但我想說這是最新的。我們之前提到過，我們已經取得了一些重大勝利，這些勝利也將隨之而來，當我們結束 25 財年並進入 26 財年時，您將開始看到它們對我們的業績產生影響。還有什麼嗎，凱文？

No, I think you hit, Ed. That's the update.

不，我認為你擊中了，艾德。這就是更新內容。

Okay.

好的。

Just wondering if you can make a projection. How should we think about the trajectory, maybe 10% of revenue? I mean, maybe not this fiscal year, but can we see that towards the end of the calendar year or more like next calendar year? Any thoughts there?

只是想知道您是否可以做預測。我們該如何考慮軌跡，也許是 10% 的收入？我的意思是，也許不是這個財政年度，但我們能否在日曆年末或更早的明年看到這一點？有什麼想法嗎？

Yeah. Dave, I wouldn't want to get into a projection at this point for '26 or beyond around what that looks like. It's obviously in our pipeline. And as we look at opportunities coming through, we can give updated guidance on what we think revenue mixes will look like in '26 and beyond once we get a little bit closer to year end.

是的。戴夫，我現在還不想對 26 年或以後的情況做出預測。顯然，這已經在我們的計劃之中。當我們尋找即將到來的機會時，一旦我們接近年底，我們可以對26年及以後的收入組合提供最新的指導。

Got it. And my second question is you mentioned data center, how big is it? Are you working with any hyperscalers? Or is it more of a smaller data center operators? And what's driving this trend?

知道了。我的第二個問題是您提到的資料中心，它有多大？您是否與任何超大規模企業合作？或者它更像是一個規模較小的資料中心營運商？那麼，是什麼推動了這個趨勢呢？

Well, Dave, we have very specific use cases for Ericsson and their platform that supports wireless players. So think about that as almost like an OEM relationship. And then in the case of Verizon, we're supporting their services platform in their back office as well as a direct customer. So those are very specific use cases. And that's where we're focused. As you know, we've not been active and investing in these hyperscale data center solutions. The margins in that segment have been getting squeezed and there's a lot of larger players that are aggressively going after that as well as white box players that are going after that market. We do think with some of the announcements that have recently been made, for us, we view them favorably because it's encouraging with the idea that some of these AI workspace workloads and use cases can be built and be applied to smaller enterprise customers in a way that's affordable. And this is something -- obviously, it's early innings here, but we had already begun looking at how do we support our customers to the extent that some of these AI workloads come back on-prem that are more suitable to our solution. So it's early innings on that. You'll hear more about that later. But it's a response to the broader question.

嗯，戴夫，我們對愛立信及其支援無線播放器的平台有非常具體的用例。所以可以把它想像成幾乎像 OEM 關係。就 Verizon 而言，我們為其後台辦公室和直接客戶提供服務平台支援。這些都是非常具體的用例。這正是我們關注的重點。如您所知，我們並未積極投資這些超大規模資料中心解決方案。該領域的利潤率不斷受到擠壓，許多大型企業正在積極爭奪該市場，同時，白盒企業也在爭奪該市場。我們確實認為，對於最近發布的一些公告，我們持積極態度，因為令人鼓舞的是，其中一些人工智慧工作區工作負載和用例可以以可承受的方式建構並應用於較小的企業客戶。顯然，這還處於早期階段，但我們已經開始研究如何支援我們的客戶，以便其中一些 AI 工作負載可以重新回到更適合我們解決方案的本地。因此，這件事還處於早期階段。您稍後會聽到更多有關此內容的資訊。但這是對更廣泛問題的回答。

Got it. Thank you.

知道了。謝謝。

David Vogt, UBS.

瑞銀的戴維沃格特（David Vogt）。

Great. Thanks guys for taking my questions. Maybe, Ed, the first one for you. Can you maybe speak to the type of exposure? Or how you're thinking about sort of the way the US is going about, at least on the federal government side, funding the federal government and what it might mean for states and local municipalities and how that might be filtering in to your business over the next couple of quarters? Just to get a sense for how we should think about it.

偉大的。感謝大家回答我的問題。也許，艾德，對你來說這是第一個。能談談曝光的類型嗎？或者您如何看待美國至少在聯邦政府方面為聯邦政府提供資金的方式，以及這對各州和地方市政當局意味著什麼，以及這將如何影響未來幾個季度的業務？只是為了了解我們應該如何思考它。

And then maybe one for Kevin, I'll give you both upfront. Kevin, when I think about your services and subscription business, particularly on the recurring side, if we adjust for the product. If we (inaudible) about the professional services, that business has been around $100 million, a little $100 million business, how do we think about that from an attach rate going forward as product revenue growth should continue to grow going forward? Is there a good algorithm that we should think about going forward? Or it's a little bit more complicated than that?

然後也許還有一張給凱文，我會預先給你們兩張。凱文，當我考慮你的服務和訂閱業務時，特別是在經常性方面，如果我們針對產品進行調整。如果我們（聽不清楚）關於專業服務，這項業務的規模一直在 1 億美元左右，是一個 1 億美元的小業務，那麼我們如何從未來的附加率來看待這一點，因為產品收入增長在未來應該會繼續增長？是否存在一個值得我們進一步思考的好演算法？或者說情況比這更複雜一點？

Okay. Yeah. I'll let Ed answer the first question.

好的。是的。我請艾德回答第一個問題。

Yes. David, most of our spend on the government side is in the state and local domain as well as in the education domain. And at this stage of the game, it is early innings. But we're not really and we don't -- we're not aware of any impact to the budgets that we're supporting in terms of the networking building for schools, K-12 and higher ed schools, and also our state and local government customers. Our federal spend customers are very well-established government entities. And here again, we don't expect that at this stage -- we're not anticipating any impact on the projects that we have underway that are in our funnel.

是的。戴維，我們在政府方面的大部分支出都是在州和地方領域以及教育領域。而此時比賽還處於早期階段。但實際上我們並沒有意識到這會對我們為學校、K-12 和高等教育學校以及我們州和地方政府客戶的網路建設所支持的預算產生任何影響。我們的聯邦支出客戶都是非常成熟的政府實體。再次強調，我們目前還不認為這會對我們正在進行的專案產生任何影響。

Great, thanks.

太好了，謝謝。

And just to answer the second part of your question with regard to subscription and support and the outlook for that, right? There's really -- I'd call it four factors that are really going to help that. One, just increase in product sales as we've recovered, right, from Q3 and Q4 of last year where we had lower product revenue coming into this year. Remember, subscription and support is kind of lagging indicator against those product sales. You sell the product, we get the attached, and then you've got the growth rate coming behind that. So there's a little bit of lag right now. And we're kind of feeling a little bit of the pain from Q3 and Q4 last year. And the growth rate here, it's still 14%. It's still what we're expecting to be in the mid-teens growth on the subscription side. But nevertheless, a little bit lower than what we experienced.

我只想回答你問題的第二部分，關於訂閱和支援以及其前景，對嗎？確實有——我認為有四個因素確實有助於實現這一點。首先，產品銷售量有所成長，因為我們已經從去年第三季和第四季復甦，而今年我們的產品收入較低。請記住，訂閱和支援是這些產品銷售的落後指標。您銷售產品，我們獲得附加產品，然後您將獲得隨之而來的成長率。因此現在有一點點滯後。我們有點感受到了去年第三季和第四季的痛苦。這裡的成長率仍然是14%。我們預期訂閱業務仍將維持十五六成的成長率。但儘管如此，這還是比我們經歷的低一點。

But platform -- so higher growth in product is going to help us which we're calling in the second half of the year. The second part of that would be the Platform ONE and Platform ONE Attach. It's a little bit higher ASP, but also we're going to get more and more of the customers to renew in Platform ONE and will get not only XIQ, but also we'll add other features to that, including the support to it. And we'll get all of that to renew at the same time with enterprise agreements with these customers. So that's going to be new as well.

但是平台—產品的更高成長將對我們有所幫助，我們預計這將在下半年實現。第二部分是 Platform ONE 和 Platform ONE Attach。它的平均售價稍高一些，但我們也將讓越來越多的客戶在 Platform ONE 上續訂，他們不僅可以獲得 XIQ，而且我們還會添加其他功能，包括對它的支援。我們將與這些客戶同時續簽企業協議。所以這也將是新的。

Three, we've got the Extreme subscription private offer which we just talked about earlier with the service providers. Service providers are really Fortune 100 companies. That continues to do well. And we believe that we will get more and more subscription revenue associated with that. And then the last one is MSP and driving these MSPs which, again, 100% attached for every deal that closes within an MSP. And so it's a combination of a better attach rate, but it's more product sales, and it's these new go-to market motions that we have that both have 100% attach rate as well on the MSP side and the (inaudible) side.

第三，我們有 Extreme 訂閱私人優惠，我們剛剛與服務提供者談過這個。服務提供者實際上是財富 100 強公司。這一表現持續良好。我們相信我們將獲得越來越多相關的訂閱收入。最後一個是 MSP，並推動這些 MSP，同樣，這些 MSP 100% 附加在 MSP 內達成的每筆交易上。因此，這是更好的附加率和更多產品銷量的結合，而且是我們擁有的這些新的進入市場動議，在 MSP 方面和（聽不清楚）方面都具有 100% 的附加率。

Helpful. Can I slip one more in? And I think I heard you say Q3 would be better seasonality this year. Can you maybe talk about kind of what's driving that? Is it what markets, what products? Just general improvement in the networking backdrop just to get a sense of what's going on there.

很有幫助。我可以再放一個進去嗎？我想我聽到您說過今年第三季的季節性會更好。您能否談一談造成這種情況的原因？是什麼市場、什麼產品？只是對網路背景進行了總體改進，以便了解那裡發生的事情。

Yeah, that's right. So what we have is -- and normally, what you would see in our seasonality patterns and trends is a dip in March and then a nice step in the June quarter. And what we're calling here is a flat March quarter and then a nice step in June. So normally, instead of seeing -- you would see a downtick. And the strength in the market and our outlook and the opportunities that we have in our funnel, what we're seeing is that we're confident in calling a flat quarter. So that's why it's a seasonally stronger quarter because we're not expecting the dip in March that we would normally get.

是的，沒錯。因此，我們所擁有的情況是——通常，您會在我們的季節性模式和趨勢中看到三月出現下滑，然後在六月季度出現良好的增長。我們目前所看到的是，三月季度表現平穩，六月則出現良好進展。因此正常情況下，您不會看到—您會看到下降趨勢。鑑於市場的強勁表現、我們的前景以及我們在通路中擁有的機遇，我們有信心預測本季業績將持平。這就是為什麼這是一個季節性強勁的季度，因為我們預計三月不會出現通常會出現的下滑。

And yes, it's the broader market recovery. It's our commercial models that are adding and gaining momentum. We think that our competitive positioning continues to favor us. And we'll continue to create opportunities for Extreme. And as I mentioned, some of our markets in specific like in Germany, in Europe, we continue to be negatively impacted by a lack of spend in that particular market. And we're expecting to have a new government and we're expecting to have budgets. And when that happens, we think spending will be unlocked and that'll be a tail wind for us.

是的，這是更廣泛的市場復甦。我們的商業模式正在不斷壯大並獲得發展動力。我們認為，我們的競爭定位持續對我們有利。我們將繼續為 Extreme 創造機會。正如我所提到的，我們在歐洲的一些特定市場，例如德國，由於該特定市場缺乏支出，我們繼續受到負面影響。我們期待新政府的成立，也期待新預算。當這種情況發生時，我們認為支出將被解鎖，這對我們來說將是一個順風。

Great. Thank you.

偉大的。謝謝。

Eric Martinuzzi, Lake Street Capital Markets.

馬丁努齊 (Eric Martinuzzi)，Lake Street Capital Markets。

Yeah. I'm trying to get a feel for industry growth rates. Given your own action over the last, call it, 12 months or so, it's been hard to get a feel for just the overall industry growth rate. But is this an industry that you see a high single digits growth rate, mid-single digits? Because you've got the puts and takes with the competitive landscape, your own product launches, and then the channel issues from a year ago.

是的。我正在嘗試了解行業成長率。考慮到您過去 12 個月左右的行動，很難了解整個行業的成長率。但您認為這個產業的成長率是高個位數還是中個位數呢？因為您已經了解了競爭格局、您自己的產品發布以及一年前遇到的通路問題。

Yeah. Eric, I think our view of the industry is that it's a mid-single-digit grower and that we're in a share gain position. And when you think about Extreme long term, you think about Extreme in the high single digits, trending to the double-digit territory.

是的。艾瑞克，我認為我們對這個行業的看法是，它是一個中等個位數的成長，而且我們的份額正在增加。當您考慮長期的極端情況時，您會想到極端值處於高個位數，趨向於兩位數的範圍。

Okay.

好的。

Kevin, do you want to add? I'll open the door for you here.

凱文，你想添加嗎？我在這裡給你開門。

No, I think you're right, Ed. I mean that's exactly what we would say. And actually, the larger companies like a Cisco might even, in their networking business, have loaded single digits. But I think that's what we're positioning ourselves for from a long range expectation.

不，我認為你是對的，艾德。我的意思是這正是我們要說的。實際上，像思科這樣的大公司，在其網路業務中，收入甚至可能只有個位數。但我認為，從長遠預期來看，這就是我們的定位。

Okay. And then I just wanted to go a layer deeper on the slight step-down in the gross margin outlook to Q3 versus Q4. You finished out at 63.4% on the Non-GAAP gross margin for Q2 and the midpoint for Q3, actually for the back half, is 62.5%. I understand that it's based on mix, but in particular, what product is pulling that mix down or pulling that margin down?

好的。然後，我想更深入地探討第三季相對於第四季毛利率前景的略微下降。您第二季的非 GAAP 毛利率為 63.4%，第三季中點（實際上是後半年）為 62.5%。我理解這是基於混合，但具體來說，哪種產品會拉低這種混合或拉低這種利潤率？

Yeah. It's just a function of the actual product gross margin is lower than subscription and support gross margin, right? And so the growth that we see coming back here in the second half of the year is primarily going to be on the product side. And so that's the mix shift that we're owing to the slightly lower margin at the end of the day. There's a little bit of -- we also have taxes being reset here in January. And so we've got some COGS expenses as well as operating expenses that will be affected by the FICA limits being reset. And so that's a little bit of a drag on gross margins as well.

是的。這只是實際產品毛利率低於訂閱和支持毛利率的函數，對嗎？因此，我們看到下半年的成長主要集中在產品方面。所以這就是我們歸因於混合轉變，導致最終利潤率略有下降。還有一點——我們也將在一月重新調整稅收。因此，我們的一些 COGS 費用以及營運費用將受到 FICA 限額重置的影響。這對毛利率也會造成一定程度的拖累。

We still feel comfortable, I would say, Eric, in terms of the 64% to 66% long term range for gross margin. And obviously, we'll try to overachieve that as we continue to drive here for the second half of the year with the 62% to 63% range. But I would say it's certainly -- that's what it is. It's primarily just product in general being a higher mix of revenue in the third and fourth quarters.

艾瑞克，我想說，就 64% 至 66% 的長期毛利率範圍而言，我們仍然感到滿意。顯然，我們會努力超額完成這一目標，今年下半年我們將繼續以 62% 至 63% 的範圍推動這一目標的實現。但我想說的是，事實確實如此。這主要是因為產品總體而言是第三季和第四季營收的較高組成部分。

Got it. Thanks for the clarification.

知道了。感謝您的澄清。

Thank you. And as there are no further questions in the queue at this time, I will now turn the call back over to Mr. Ed Meyercord for any closing remarks.

謝謝。由於此時沒有其他問題，我現在將電話轉回給 Ed Meyercord 先生，請他做最後發言。

Okay. Olivia, thank you very much. Thanks, everybody, for joining the call today. We appreciate your support. And we have a lot of exciting things going on at Extreme, certainly, as we go through this quarter and head to May for our user conference with Connect. I want to thank our employees, customers, partners who are dialed in. We're excited about the opportunities that lie ahead. I know we've also opened the door to investors to come to Paris where we're showcasing our new technology and we look forward to seeing you there. Thanks, everybody, and have a great day.

好的。奧利維亞，非常感謝。感謝大家今天的電話會議。我們感謝您的支持。當然，我們在 Extreme 有很多令人興奮的事情正在發生，正如我們度過這個季度並將於 5 月與 Connect 一起舉行用戶大會一樣。我要感謝我們的員工、客戶和合作夥伴的參與。我們對未來的機會感到興奮。我知道我們也向投資者敞開了大門，歡迎他們來巴黎展示我們的新技術，我們期待在那裡見到你們。謝謝大家，祝大家有個愉快的一天。

Thank you.

謝謝。

This concludes today's conference. Thank you for your participation and you may now disconnect.

今天的會議到此結束。感謝您的參與，您現在可以斷開連接。