Entegris Inc (ENTG) 2024 Q1 法說會逐字稿

Welcome to the Entegris First Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. (Operator Instructions) I would now like to turn the call over to Bill Seymour, Vice President of Investor Relations.

歡迎參加 Entegris 2024 年第一季財報電話會議。 （操作員指示）現在，我想將電話轉給投資者關係副總裁比爾·西摩 (Bill Seymour)。

Good morning, everyone. Earlier today, we announced the financial results for our first quarter of 2024. Before we begin, I would like to remind listeners that our comments today will include some forward-looking statements. These statements involve a number of risks and uncertainties, and actual results could differ materially from those projected in the forward-looking statements.

大家早安。今天早些時候，我們公佈了 2024 年第一季的財務業績。這些聲明涉及許多風險和不確定性，實際結果可能與前瞻性聲明中的預測有重大差異。

Additional information regarding these risks and uncertainties is contained in our most recent annual report and subsequent quarterly reports that we have filed with the SEC. Please refer to the information on the disclaimer slide of the presentation.

有關這些風險和不確定性的更多資訊包含在我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的最新年度報告和後續季度報告中。請參閱簡報免責聲明幻燈片中的資訊。

On this call, we will also refer to non-GAAP financial measures as defined by the SEC in Regulation G. You can find a reconciliation table in today's news release as well as on the IR page of our website at entegris.com.

在本次電話會議上，我們還將參考美國證券交易委員會 (SEC) 在 G 條例中定義的非公認會計準則財務指標。

And finally, for your reference, we have included in the earnings slide presentation consolidated and divisional P&Ls for Q1 and for all 4 quarters of 2023 that exclude divestitures.

最後，供您參考，我們在收益幻燈片演示中包含了第一季以及 2023 年所有 4 個季度（不包括資產剝離）的合併和部門損益表。

On the call today are Bertrand Loy, our CEO; and Linda LaGorga, our CFO.

今天參加電話會議的有我們的執行長 Bertrand Loy；以及我們的財務長 Linda LaGorga。

With that, I'll hand the call over to Bertrand.

說完這些，我會把電話交給伯特蘭。

Thank you, Bill, and good morning. I am pleased with our start to the year. For the first quarter, sales of $771 million were at the high end of our guidance. And gross margin, EBITDA and non-GAAP EPS were above our guidance.

謝謝你，比爾，早安。我對我們今年的開始感到很高興。第一季的銷售額為 7.71 億美元，處於我們預期的高點。毛利率、EBITDA 和非 GAAP EPS 均高於我們的預期。

Looking deeper at our financial performance, sales were down in all divisions and across most product areas as expected and in line with normal seasonality. However, we did see sequential growth in product lines that are critical to our customers' leading-edge node transitions, including selective edge and advanced deposition materials.

深入檢視我們的財務業績，所有部門和大多數產品領域的銷售額均出現下降，這符合預期，也與正常的季節性因素相符。然而，我們確實看到對客戶前沿節點轉型至關重要的產品線的連續成長，包括選擇性邊緣和先進的沉積材料。

From a profitability point of view, even with the market uncertainty, we chose to maintain high levels of investment in R&D. Despite this and despite the lower sales volumes, we delivered strong results in terms of gross margin and EBITDA. Linda will provide more details on all of that shortly.

從獲利能力的角度來看，即使市場存在不確定性，我們仍然選擇維持高水準的研發投入。儘管如此，儘管銷售量較低，但我們在毛利率和 EBITDA 方面仍取得了強勁的業績。 Linda 很快就會提供更多有關這些內容的詳細資訊。

Let me address a few other highlights of the quarter. On March 4, we announced the sale of the PIM business for a total of up to $285 million, the sale of PIM completes our planned divestiture of 4 noncore assets: PIM, QED, Electronic Chemicals and a business we sold to Element Solutions. The approximately $1.3 billion in proceeds from those divestitures were used to significantly pay down our debt.

讓我談談本季的其他幾個亮點。 3 月 4 日，我們宣布以高達 2.85 億美元的價格出售 PIM 業務，PIM 的出售完成了我們計劃中的四項非核心資產的剝離：PIM、QED、電子化學品以及我們出售給 Element Solutions 的業務。這些資產剝離所得的約 13 億美元收益被用來大量償還債務。

Next, we're making steady progress with our 2 major investments in new manufacturing capacity, which are vital for us to fully realize our mid- and long-term growth. In Taiwan, our new Kaohsiung facility is on track to ramp up production and is expected to contribute $40 million to $50 million of revenue in the second half of the year. And in Colorado, construction at our [Rockrimmon] site is progressing rapidly, and we continue to expect initial sales from this facility to be generated in the first half of 2025.

接下來，我們在兩項新製造產能方面的重大投資正在穩步推進，這對我們全面實現中長期成長至關重要。在台灣，我們位於高雄的新工廠正在穩步提高產量，預計今年下半年將貢獻 4,000 萬至 5,000 萬美元的收入。在科羅拉多州，我們 [Rockrimmon] 工廠的建設正在快速進展，我們預計工廠的初始銷售額將在 2025 年上半年實現。

Moving on to our outlook for this year. Our view of the semiconductor industry has not changed. We do believe that the market is healthier with normalizing inventories and a more stable demand environment. And we continue to expect a gradual market recovery throughout the year.

接下來是我們對今年的展望。我們對半導體產業的看法沒有改變。我們確實相信，隨著庫存正常化和需求環境更加穩定，市場將更加健康。我們預計全年市場將逐步復甦。

With this as a backdrop and based on recent forecasts from our customers, for the full year 2024, we continue to expect the market will be up approximately 4% based on our unit and CapEx mix. In addition, given our strong market position in new logic and memory nodes, we continue to expect to outperform the market by 4 to 5 points this year, excluding the impact of divestitures.

在此背景下，並根據我們客戶的最新預測，對於 2024 年全年，我們繼續預期市場將根據我們的單位和資本支出組合上漲約 4%。此外，鑑於我們在新邏輯和記憶體節點領域的強大市場地位，排除資產剝離的影響，我們預計今年的表現仍將超過市場 4 到 5 個百分點。

Putting it all together, we expect our sales in 2024 will be approximately $3.35 billion. We continue to expect EBITDA to be approximately 29% of revenue and non-GAAP EPS to be greater than $3.25. This annual guidance, of course, includes 2 months of the PIM business prior to its sale in early March.

綜合考慮所有這些因素，我們預計 2024 年的銷售額將達到約 33.5 億美元。我們繼續預期 EBITDA 約佔營收的 29%，非 GAAP EPS 超過 3.25 美元。當然，這項年度指導包括了 3 月初出售之前 2 個月的 PIM 業務。

Let me now turn the call over to Linda. Linda?

現在讓我把電話轉給琳達。琳達？

Good morning, and thank you, Bertrand. Our sales in the first quarter were at the high end of our guidance at $771 million, down 16% year-over-year and down 5% sequentially on an as-reported basis. Q1 sales included approximately 2 months of revenue from the PIM business. So excluding divestitures from the first quarter and prior periods, Q1 sales were down 5% year-over-year and down 4% sequentially.

早安，謝謝你，伯特蘭。我們第一季的銷售額達到預期的高位，為 7.71 億美元，按報告計算，年減 16%，季減 5%。第一季的銷售額包括 PIM 業務約 2 個月的收入。因此，若不包括第一季和前期的資產剝離，第一季銷售額年減 5%，季減 4%。

Foreign exchange negatively impacted revenue by approximately $8 million year-over-year and had no impact to revenue sequentially in Q1. Gross margin on a GAAP and non-GAAP basis was 45.6% in the first quarter, above our guidance. The higher margin compared to Q4 primarily reflects improved plant utilization and the PIM divestiture.

外匯對收入產生了約 800 萬美元的年比負面影響，但對第一季的收入沒有造成影響。第一季根據 GAAP 和非 GAAP 計算的毛利率為 45.6%，高於我們的預期。與第四季度相比，利潤率的提高主要反映了工廠利用率的提高和 PIM 的剝離。

Operating expenses on a GAAP basis were $234 million in Q1. Operating expenses on a non-GAAP basis in Q1 were $174 million. Adjusted EBITDA in Q1 was $223 million or 29% of revenue, above our guidance range, driven by the higher gross margin I just discussed and partially offset by increased R&D investment compared to Q4.

根據 GAAP 計算，第一季的營業費用為 2.34 億美元。第一季非公認會計準則下的營業費用為 1.74 億美元。第一季調整後的 EBITDA 為 2.23 億美元，佔營收的 29%，高於我們的指導範圍，這得益於我剛才討論的毛利率提高，但與第四季度相比，研發投資的增加部分抵消了這一影響。

Net interest expense was $54 million in Q1, below our guidance of $60 million, driven primarily by the positive impact of the PIM sale. The GAAP tax rate in Q1 was 7.1%, and the non-GAAP tax rate was 14.1%. GAAP diluted EPS was $0.30 per share in the first quarter. Non-GAAP EPS was $0.68 per share, above our guidance range, driven primarily by the higher gross margin and lower net interest expense.

第一季淨利息支出為 5,400 萬美元，低於我們預期的 6,000 萬美元，主要受 PIM 出售的正面影響。 Q1美國GAAP稅率為7.1%，非GAAP稅率為14.1%。第一季 GAAP 稀釋每股收益為 0.30 美元。非公認會計準則每股收益為 0.68 美元，高於我們的指導範圍，主要得益於毛利率提高和淨利息支出降低。

Sales for our Materials Solutions division in Q1 were $350 million. Sales were down 4% sequentially on an as-reported basis. Excluding the impact of the divestitures, sales were down just 1% sequentially. During the quarter, MS benefited from the early-stage recovery in the memory market, offset by continued weakness in some mainstream end markets.

我們材料解決方案部門第一季的銷售額為 3.5 億美元。據報道，銷售額環比下降 4%。除去資產剝離的影響，銷售額較上季僅下降 1%。本季度，微軟受惠於記憶體市場的早期復甦，但抵消了部分主流終端市場的持續疲軟。

Adjusted as-reported operating margin for MS was 21.5% for the quarter, up almost 500 basis points sequentially. The primary driver of that increase was improved plant utilization.

本季微軟調整後報告營業利潤率為 21.5%，較上一季成長近 500 個基點。推動這一成長的主要因素是工廠利用率的提高。

Our AMH division sales in Q1 of $163 million were down 4% sequentially. The largest driver of the sequential sales decline in AMH were lower sales of fluid-handling products. Adjusted operating margin for AMH was 15.1% for the quarter. The sequential increase in margin was primarily driven by the positive impact of improved plant utilization ahead of the expected sequential growth in Q2.

我們 AMH 部門第一季的銷售額為 1.63 億美元，季減 4%。 AMH 銷售額連續下滑的最大原因是流體處理產品銷售額下降。 AMH 本季調整後營業利益率為 15.1%。利潤率的環比成長主要得益於工廠利用率提高帶來的正面影響，超過了第二季預期的環比成長。

For our MC division, sales in the quarter of $268 million were down 7% sequentially. Revenue was lower in all major product lines, consistent with our expectations. Adjusted operating margin for MC was 32.3% for the quarter. The sequential decline in margin was primarily driven by lower volumes and steady investment in R&D.

就我們的 MC 部門而言，本季的銷售額為 2.68 億美元，季減 7%。所有主要產品線的收入均有所下降，這與我們的預期一致。本季 MC 調整後營業利益率為 32.3%。利潤率連續下降主要是因為銷售下降和研發投入穩定所致。

Moving on to cash flow. First quarter free cash flow was $81 million. CapEx for the quarter was $67 million. We continue to expect to spend approximately $350 million in total CapEx in 2024.

繼續討論現金流。第一季自由現金流為8,100萬美元。本季的資本支出為 6700 萬美元。我們預計 2024 年的總資本支出仍將達到約 3.5 億美元。

During the first quarter, we paid down a total of [$419 million] in debt through a combination of approximately $260 million in PIM sale proceeds and the rest from cash on hand. The term loan balance after the Q1 paydown was approximately [$955 million], which means to date, we have paid down more than $1.5 billion of the term loan since the CMC acquisition.

在第一季度，我們透過約 2.6 億美元的 PIM 銷售收益和其餘的庫存現金償還了總計 [4.19 億美元] 的債務。第一季還款後的定期貸款餘額約為 [9.55 億美元]，這意味著迄今為止，自收購 CMC 以來，我們已經償還了超過 15 億美元的定期貸款。

In addition to the significant debt paydown, at the end of March, we executed a very successful 75 basis point repricing to our term loan, which resulted in a new interest rate of SOFR plus 175. Blended interest on the debt portfolio is now approximately 4.9%. And since the term loan is fully hedged, currently, 100% of our debt is fixed.

除了大量償還債務外，3 月底，我們還對定期貸款進行了非常成功的 75 個基點的重新定價，新的利率為 SOFR 加 175。由於定期貸款已完全對沖，目前，我們的債務 100％ 是固定的。

At the end of Q1, our gross debt was approximately [$4.3 billion] and our net debt was approximately $3.9 billion. Gross leverage was 4.6x and net leverage was 4.3x. We continue to expect our gross leverage will be below 4x at the end of 2024.

截至第一季末，我們的總債務約為 43 億美元，淨債務約為 39 億美元。總槓桿率為4.6倍，淨槓桿率為4.3倍。我們仍然預計到 2024 年底我們的總槓桿率將低於 4 倍。

Moving on to our Q2 outlook. We expect sales to range from $790 million to $810 million. This equates to 8.5% sequential growth to the midpoint of the guidance range, excluding divestitures. We expect the EBITDA margin to be approximately 28%. We expect GAAP EPS to be $0.42 to $0.47 per share and non-GAAP EPS to be $0.68 to $0.73 per share.

接下來是我們對第二季的展望。我們預計銷售額在 7.9 億美元至 8.1 億美元之間。除資產剝離外，這相當於環比增長 8.5%，達到指導範圍的中點。我們預計 EBITDA 利潤率約為 28%。我們預計 GAAP EPS 為每股 0.42 美元至 0.47 美元，非 GAAP EPS 為每股 0.68 美元至 0.73 美元。

Let me provide additional modeling information for Q2. We expect gross margin of 45.5% to 46.5%, both on a GAAP and non-GAAP basis, GAAP operating expenses of $242 million to $245 million and non-GAAP operating expenses of $191 million to $194 million. The sequential increase in non-GAAP OpEx from Q1 to Q2 is primarily driven by higher noncash equity compensation expense.

讓我為 Q2 提供額外的建模資訊。我們預期毛利率為 45.5% 至 46.5%（無論是以 GAAP 或非 GAAP 計算），GAAP 營業費用為 2.42 億美元至 2.45 億美元，非 GAAP 營業費用為 1.91 億美元至 1.94 億美元。第一季至第二季非公認會計準則營運支出的連續成長主要是由於非現金股權薪資費用的增加。

This year and going forward, we changed the timing of our equity grants awards to Q2, whereas historically, these grants were made in Q1. We also expect depreciation of approximately $48 million, net interest expense of approximately [$51 million] and a non-GAAP tax rate of approximately 15%.

今年及以後，我們將股權授予時間改為第二季度，而從歷史上看，這些授予是在第一季進行的。我們也預期折舊約為 4,800 萬美元，淨利息支出約為 [5,100 萬美元]，非 GAAP 稅率約為 15%。

I'll now hand it back over to Bertrand for some closing remarks.

現在我將把發言權交還給伯特蘭，請他作一些結束語。

Thank you, Linda. In closing, we are pleased with our start of the year. During the quarter, we completed our final planned divestiture, and we used the proceeds of that sale and other cash to significantly lower our debt. We continue to expect a gradual market recovery throughout the balance of the year. And we remain very optimistic about the secular long-term growth prospects for the semiconductor industry.

謝謝你，琳達。最後，我們對今年的開始感到非常高興。在本季度，我們完成了最終的計劃資產剝離，並利用出售所得和其他現金大幅降低了我們的債務。我們繼續預計今年全年市場將逐步復甦。我們對半導體產業的長期成長前景仍然非常樂觀。

In addition, the industry is entering a period of unprecedented technology change and device complexity. Our core competencies in materials science and materials purity, coupled with our unique ability to co-optimize solutions that shorten time to yield have become increasingly critical for our customers.

此外，該行業正進入前所未有的技術變革和設備複雜化時期。我們在材料科學和材料純度方面的核心競爭力，加上我們獨特的共同優化縮短產量時間的解決方案的能力，對我們的客戶來說變得越來越重要。

All of this means the market is moving toward Entegris, ultimately translating into rapidly expanding content per wafer and strong outperformance for us for years to come, reinforcing Entegris as a value compounder with attractive organic sales growth, leading to significant opportunity for EBITDA and EPS expansion.

所有這些意味著市場正在向 Entegris 靠攏，最終轉化為我們未來幾年每片晶圓的內容將迅速擴大和強勁的表現，從而鞏固 Entegris 作為一家具有誘人有機銷售增長的價值複合者的地位，為 EBITDA 和 EPS 擴張帶來重大機遇。

With that, operator, let's open the line for questions.

接線員，現在讓我們開始回答問題。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from Toshiya Hari with Goldman Sachs.

（操作員指示）我們的第一個問題來自高盛的 Toshiya Hari。

Bertrand, my first question is on the industry outlook. You're maintaining the up 4% outlook. I'm sure there's quite a few kind of pluses and minuses, puts and takes there. If you can walk us through what you're seeing from a wafer start perspective across DRAM, NAND, leading-edge logic and trailing edge, to the extent your views have changed, that would be super helpful and then a comment or two on the CapEx side as well. And then I've got a quick follow-up for Linda.

伯特蘭，我的第一個問題是關於產業前景。您維持上漲 4% 的預期。我確信這其中存在著相當多的優點和缺點、利弊。如果您能從晶圓啟動的角度向我們介紹 DRAM、NAND、前沿邏輯和後沿的情況，以及您的觀點發生了怎樣的變化，那將非常有幫助，然後您也可以在資本支出方面發表一兩條評論。然後我要快速跟進琳達的狀況。

Okay. Thank you, Toshiya. As I said in my prepared comments, our views for the industry have not really changed since we spoke last. Essentially, we expect the industry to be up 4% using our industry blend of 75% units, 25% CapEx. And what we're seeing is visible signs of life in advanced logic, in DRAM, with a steady increase in wafer fab production.

好的。謝謝你，Toshiya。正如我在準備好的評論中所說，自上次發言以來，我們對該行業的看法並沒有真正改變。本質上，根據 75% 單位數和 25% 資本支出的產業組合，我們預計產業將成長 4%。我們看到先進邏輯和 DRAM 領域出現了明顯的復甦跡象，晶圓廠產量穩定成長。

3D NAND is going through a slower recovery. But again, it's stable, and we expect some gradual recovery in second half of the year. And of course, we've been keeping a close eye on mainstream. We saw a harp compression in fab utilization in Q1. We expect a little bit more of that in Q2, but we expect mainstream to stabilize in the back half of the year.

3D NAND 正在經歷較慢的復甦。但總體而言，它是穩定的，我們預計今年下半年會逐步復甦。當然，我們一直密切關注主流。我們看到第一季晶圓廠利用率大幅壓縮。我們預計第二季這一數字會略有增加，但我們預計主流市場將在今年下半年趨於穩定。

And then for Linda, I guess, a two-parter, one on gross margin and the other on OpEx. So gross margin with the divestiture, you're doing really well and you're guiding Q2 nicely as well. As you think about the second half, I was hoping you could walk us through some of the puts and takes.

對於 Linda 來說，我想，這是一個兩部分，一部分是關於毛利率，另一部分是關於營運支出。因此，剝離後的毛利率表現非常好，並且您對第二季的預期也很好。當您思考下半場時，我希望您能向我們介紹一些要點。

Is there further upside to utilization inside of Entegris? And could that be a tailwind? And how should we be thinking about things like product mix and the ramp of Taiwan and Colorado?

Entegris 內部的利用是否還有其他優點？這會是順風嗎？我們應該如何考慮產品組合以及台灣和科羅拉多州的成長等問題？

And then OpEx, very quickly. So given the shift in the timing of the grants, is it fair to assume Q3 potentially normalizes lower from an OpEx perspective?

然後是 OpEx，非常快。因此，考慮到撥款時間的變化，從營運支出的角度來看，是否可以合理地假設第三季的正常化程度可能會降低？

Sure. So let me first hit your question on gross margin second half, some of the puts and takes. As Bertrand mentioned, we're expecting a gradual progression of the industry. With that, some of the tailwinds can be some volume leverage and it can be mix, depending how those tailwinds evolve.

當然。所以，我首先想回答你關於下半年毛利率的問題，以及一些優點和缺點。正如 Bertrand 所提到的，我們期待該行業逐步進步。這樣，一些順風因素可以是一些成交量槓桿，也可以是混合因素，這取決於這些順風因素如何發展。

That being said, Toshiya, as you mentioned, we still have KSP. And KSP still does provide some headwinds, although we are expecting those headwinds to start to alleviate to some degree with some of the revenue coming on. But there is that mix still of headwinds and tailwinds. So right now, we haven't provided gross margin guidance specifically for the full year, but I would think of those gives and takes as we go through the rest of the year and the second half and see how things evolve.

話雖如此，Toshiya，正如您所說，我們仍然有 KSP。 KSP 仍然帶來一些阻力，儘管我們預計隨著部分收入的增加，這些阻力將在一定程度上開始緩解。但逆風和順風依然存在。因此，目前，我們還沒有提供具體的全年毛利率指引，但我會在展望今年剩餘時間和下半年時考慮這些利弊，並觀察事態如何發展。

On the OpEx side for the second half, most importantly, I would say we are committed to continuing to invest in our business. And we have said we're going to have R&D of approximately 9%. And you will see that commitment throughout the year. We have many exciting things to invest in.

在下半年的營運支出方面，最重要的是，我想說我們致力於繼續投資於我們的業務。我們說過我們將把約 9% 的資金用於研發。您將會在全年看到這項承諾。我們有很多令人興奮的事情值得投資。

So right now, as far as OpEx, again, not giving specific guidance. There will be some SG&A leverage, but you should expect to see us continuing to invest, going forward, which will offset some of that SG&A leverage.

因此現在，就 OpEx 而言，我們還沒有給出具體的指導。會有一些銷售、一般和行政費用槓桿，但你應該會看到我們繼續投資，向前邁進，這將抵消部分銷售、一般和行政費用槓桿。

Congrats.

恭喜。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Our next question comes from John Roberts with Mizuho Securities.

下一個問題來自瑞穗證券的約翰羅伯茲。

Nice quarter. Bertrand, you normally have some price-down in your products over time. As the mix continues to shift towards leading edge here, do you think the pricing dynamics are going to change?

不錯的季度。伯特蘭，隨著時間的推移，你們的產品價格通常會下降。隨著產品組合不斷向前沿轉變，您認為定價動態會改變嗎？

Look, at a high level, I would say that I've been pleased with the pricing trend over the last several years. I mean it's fair to say that in a softer industry environment, this is not really particularly conducive to price increases. But I think that, again, we've had some more favorable trends in the last 3 years as compared to the preceding 3 years.

從高層次來看，我想說我對過去幾年的定價趨勢感到滿意。我的意思是，公平地說，在較為疲軟的產業環境中，這其實並不特別有利於價格上漲。但我認為，與前 3 年相比，過去 3 年我們又出現了一些更有利的趨勢。

And then maybe could you discuss a little bit more currency, given the weakness we've seen in several of the Asian currencies recently?

那麼，鑑於我們最近看到幾種亞洲貨幣的疲軟，您能否再討論一下貨幣問題？

Sure. I'll go ahead and pick up the currency question. So I would say, first, we don't try to forecast FX, but we clearly monitor it. So let me give you the context of how to think about our business.

當然。我將繼續討論貨幣問題。所以我想說，首先，我們不會試圖預測外匯，但我們會明確地監控它。那麼，讓我來為你介紹一下我們業務的背景。

Historically, FX has not had a huge impact on our business, and here's why. Our USD sales are 75% or greater typically in a quarter. We've also had a natural hedge between our sales and our costs. That being said, we have seen this appreciation in the dollar recently. And when that happens quickly, that does have some impact on our margin due to the timing between when products are built and when they're sold.

從歷史上看，外匯並沒有對我們的業務產生巨大的影響，原因如下。我們一個季度的美元銷售額通常能達到 75% 或更高。我們的銷售額和成本之間也存在著自然的對沖。話雖如此，我們最近確實看到美元升值。當這種情況快速發生時，由於產品生產和銷售之間的時間間隔，確實會對我們的利潤產生一定的影響。

So as we looked at our guidance for April, we looked at the currency rates as of the end of last week, and we factored that into our thinking. But we're going to have to continue to monitor currency, going forward.

因此，當我們查看四月份的指引時，我們查看了截至上週末的貨幣匯率，並將其納入我們的考慮範圍。但今後我們必須繼續監控貨幣。

Our next question comes from Bhavesh Lodaya with BMO Capital Markets.

下一個問題來自 BMO 資本市場 (BMO Capital Markets) 的 Bhavesh Lodaya。

Bertrand, with respect to your materials sciences segment, if I look at Slide 17, the numbers excluding divestitures, the segment has flat sales sequentially, but operating profits jumped almost 30%. Can you share what drove that margin uplift? And then it seems like memory markets have just starting to recover here. So what kind of margin uplift should we expect heading into 2024 for the segment?

伯特蘭，關於貴公司的材料科學部門，如果我看第 17 張幻燈片，不包括資產剝離的數字，該部門的銷售額環比持平，但營業利潤卻增長了近 30%。能否分享一下利潤率上升的推動因素？現在看起來記憶體市場才剛開始復甦。那麼，到 2024 年，我們預期該部門的利潤率會出現什麼樣的提升呢？

Right. So Bhavesh, maybe I can take the implied question on top line and what's driving the top line in MS in this past quarter, and then I will defer to Linda to take more precisely your question on margin.

正確的。所以 Bhavesh，也許我可以回答關於營收和過去一個季度推動微軟營收成長的因素這個隱含問題，然後我會請 Linda 更準確地回答你關於利潤率的問題。

But we -- obviously, we were very pleased with the performance of our Material Solutions business, again, being essentially flat sequentially at a time when there was some seasonal softness in the industry.

但顯然，我們對材料解決方案業務的表現非常滿意，在行業出現季節性疲軟的時候，該業務的表現與上一季基本持平。

So what's behind that is really -- I mean, remember that this is the one part of the business that has the most exposure to memory. So obviously, memory was a significant headwind for that business last year. And we've talked about that, especially during the first half of last year.

這背後的真正原因在於——我的意思是，請記住，這是業務中最容易受到記憶體影響的部分。顯然，記憶體是去年該業務面臨的一大阻力。我們已經討論過這個問題，特別是在去年上半年。

But that headwind has turned into a tailwind, and we've seen some gradual sequential improvements in that business in Q3 and Q4 and obviously a very solid Q1, which bodes well for the rest of the year?

但這種逆風已變成了順風，我們看到該業務在第三季度和第四季度出現了一些逐步的連續改善，顯然第一季也表現非常穩健，這對今年剩餘時間的表現來說是一個好兆頭？

Maybe turning to you, Linda, in terms of the implication on margin.

也許可以向你請教一下，琳達，關於利潤率的問題。

Yes. Bhavesh, on margin, to your point of the increase in margin this quarter for MS, I mentioned in the call the plant utilization, but let me give you a bit more specifics. For example, we had lines that were idle that are now up and running. I would also say there was a bit of productivity that contributed to that margin ramp and also some SG&A leverage, cost efficiency as we combined the 2 divisions together.

是的。 Bhavesh，關於利潤率，正如您所提到的微軟本季利潤率的增長，我在電話會議中提到了工廠利用率，但讓我給您更具體的資訊。例如，我們之前閒置的生產線現在已經恢復運作。我還想說，當我們將兩個部門合併在一起時，生產力有所提高，這有助於提高利潤率，也有助於提高銷售、一般及行政開支槓桿率和成本效率。

Got it. And then there seems to be growing noise around U.S. sanctions on Chinese chip makers. Also, the Chinese government is talking about phasing out, say, Intel, AMD chips from their operations. Has this changed your view on the sales impact for your company? And are there any offsets where you lose some sales in one area, but you probably make up for that sales as the domestic Chinese players grow in size?

知道了。有關美國對中國晶片製造商實施制裁的呼聲似乎越來越高。此外，中國政府也正在討論逐步淘汰英特爾、AMD 晶片等。這是否改變了您對公司銷售影響的看法？是否存在某種補償措施，即你們在某個地區損失了一些銷售額，但隨著中國國內企業規模的擴大，你們可能會彌補這些銷售額？

I'm sorry, Bhavesh, I didn't hear your question really well. Could you -- would you mind repeating it?

抱歉，Bhavesh，我沒有聽清楚你的問題。您介意再說一次嗎？

Absolutely. Yes, this is just around the sanctions that the U.S. government probably -- is increasing, I would say, in intensity. And even the Chinese government, they're talking about phasing out Intel and AMD chips from their operations. How does that impact your business? And does your exposure in the Chinese domestic players actually help offset some of this?

絕對地。是的，這只是與美國政府可能正在加大的製裁有關——我想說，制裁的力度正在加大。甚至中國政府也在討論逐步淘汰英特爾和 AMD 晶片。這對您的業務有何影響？您在中國國內玩家中的曝光率是否實際上有助於抵消其中的一些影響？

Oh, I see. Yes. Well, look, I think that we're not going to speculate on potential new restrictions or escalation between U.S. and China. I think that -- the current export restrictions are well understood. We have invested in a solid and capable team to comply with those restrictions. We have quantified that impact, which is about a $20 million loss in revenue on a quarterly basis. We saw that impact reflected in our Q4 2022 numbers and some of it in Q1 2023.

我懂了。是的。嗯，看，我認為我們不會猜測美國和中國之間可能出現的新限製或升級。我認為當前的出口限制是眾所周知的。我們已經投資了一支實力雄厚、能力強的團隊來遵守這些限制。我們已經量化了這種影響，每季收入損失約為 2000 萬美元。我們看到這種影響反映在 2022 年第四季的數據中，部分影響也反映在 2023 年第一季的數據中。

But the business has been actually relatively steady. And we continue to do really well with the customers that we can still serve. We saw some steady fab construction activity in China that benefited our AMH business. And then many of those new mainstream fabs have started production. And we saw the benefits of that in our MS and MC divisions as well.

但實際上業務一直相對穩定。我們將繼續為能夠提供服務的客戶提供良好的服務。我們看到中國的一些穩定的晶圓廠建設活動，這對我們的 AMH 業務有利。目前許多新的主流晶圓廠已開始生產。我們也在 MS 和 MC 部門看到了它的好處。

So if you look at our China business, which is again mostly mainstream and international fabs, I mean, it's been doing pretty well. And again, I won't speculate on what comes next, and we will update you if there's something to talk about.

所以如果你看看我們的中國業務，它主要是主流和國際晶圓廠，它的業績一直很好。再說一次，我不會猜測接下來會發生什麼，如果有事情要談，我們會及時通知你。

Our next question comes from Aleksey with KeyBanc Capital Markets.

我們的下一個問題來自 KeyBanc Capital Markets 的 Aleksey。

Bertrand, could you describe the new node or RAMs at your memory customers, the outlook for 2024 and 2025?

伯特蘭，您能否描述一下記憶體客戶的新節點或 RAM，以及 2024 年和 2025 年的前景？

Yes, Aleksey. So we are obviously paying close attention to node transitions in 3D NAND and in advanced logic and foundry. As you know, we have incremental wafer content opportunities at those new architectures. So this is something that we're watching closely. And we are pleased, first of all, that all of those transitions still appear to be on time.

是的，阿列克謝。因此，我們顯然密切關注 3D NAND 以及先進邏輯和代工廠中的節點轉換。如您所知，在這些新架構中我們有增量晶圓內容的機會。所以這是我們正在密切關注的事情。首先，我們很高興看到所有這些轉變似乎都按時完成。

When it comes to 3D NAND in particular, we have a number of different [material] solutions that are becoming increasingly critical to those high layer count architectures. I mean we've been talking about selective etch for a number of years. But what is really exciting, going forward, is the adoption of molybdenum in high-volume production.

特別是在 3D NAND 方面，我們有許多不同的[材料]解決方案，這些解決方案對於那些高層數架構來說變得越來越重要。我的意思是我們已經談論選擇性蝕刻好幾年了。但未來真正令人興奮的是鉬在大批量生產中的應用。

And Entegris has developed a very unique suite of capabilities, leveraging competencies across a number of different business units to develop an industry-leading pro [evap] canister to sublimate those solid precursors into gases.

Entegris 開發了一套非常獨特的功能，利用多個不同業務部門的能力，開發出業界領先的專業蒸發罐，將固體前驅物昇華為氣體。

Those gases are highly corrosive. So we have developed some proprietary protective coatings for the lines and of course, gas filtration and gas delivery cabinets. So we are very focused on this transition. Those transitions don't happen very often. And we think that we have a unique opportunity to ease the industry migration to molybdenum. So this is something, obviously, that we're going to continue to watch very carefully for the balance of the year.

這些氣體具有很強的腐蝕性。因此，我們為管道、當然還有氣體過濾和氣體輸送櫃開發了一些專有的保護塗層。因此我們非常關注這一轉變。這些轉變並不常發生。我們認為，我們擁有獨特的機會來緩解產業向鉬的轉移。因此，顯然，我們將繼續密切關註今年的餘額。

And just a follow-up on this. I guess, does this -- is it logical that '25 could be maybe a more productive, faster growth year from a content and transition perspective from memory for you than '24?

這只是對此的後續行動。我想，這是否合乎邏輯：從內容和過渡的角度來看，25 年可能比 24 年更有生產力、更成長？

I think, implied -- I mean we're not going to give you a precise guidance on 2025. But you're right, I think that a lot of those node transitions, be it in memory or in logic, will be taking place late in 2024.

我認為，這意味著——我們不會給你關於 2025 年的精確指導。

And so, of course, the bulk of the opportunity from a top line standpoint will be -- I mean we've seen -- we will see a little bit of that, and we expect to see a little bit of that. It's taken into account in our annual guidance for 2024, but the bulk of the positive impact will be felt in 2025.

因此，當然，從營收角度來看，大部分機會將是——我的意思是我們已經看到了——我們將會看到一點這樣的機會，我們也期望會看到一點這樣的機會。我們在 2024 年的年度指導中已經考慮到了這一點，但大部分正面影響將在 2025 年顯現。

Our next question comes from Tim Arcuri with UBS.

下一個問題來自瑞銀的提姆·阿庫裡。

I had a different question, Bertrand, on China. And the question really is, it seems like if you read the tea leaves that the update this fall is going to be a lot more in the supply chain and more on the material side. And there was already some news that came out about some bans on the material side. So I mean, I know you're in close contact with the Commerce Department. So I'm kind of wondering whether you think this presents risk for you this fall when this update comes out.

伯特蘭，我有一個關於中國的不同的問題。而真正的問題是，如果你仔細觀察就會發現，今年秋天的更新將更涉及供應鏈和材料方面。目前已經有一些關於材料方面的禁令的消息傳出。我的意思是，我知道您與商務部保持著密切聯繫。所以我想知道，當這個秋季更新發佈時，您是否認為這會給您帶來風險。

Look, Tim, I don't read tea leaves really well. I'm a coffee drinker myself. But as I said, I'm not going to speculate. We are obviously working closely with the government. But again, as I said, I'm not going to speculate on potentially upcoming new rules. Do you have any other question, Tim?

聽著，提姆，我不太會看茶葉蛋。我自己也是個咖啡愛好者。但正如我所說，我不會去猜測。我們顯然正在與政府密切合作。但是，正如我所說，我不會對可能出台的新規則進行猜測。提姆，你還有其他問題嗎？

I do. I do, Bertrand, yes. So I'm just wondering, to get to the up 4% market number that you're suggesting, I mean, you're guiding your business up [9%] and you're saying that the TAM is up 4%. What is the TAM up 4% based on? Because Gartner has MSI up 11% this year. And if you listen to the [equipment] companies, WFE is up high single digits. I mean I'm [up] more like 10%. But if you listen to them, it's up high singles. So if WFE is up high singles and if Gartner MSI is up 11%, how is the TAM up only 4%? I'm just kind of curious how you're getting to that number.

我願意。是的，伯特蘭，我知道。所以我只是想知道，為了達到您所建議的 4% 的市場數字，我的意思是，您指導您的業務增長 [9%]，並且您說 TAM 增長了 4%。 TAM 上漲 4% 是基於什麼？因為 Gartner 今年的 MSI 上漲了 11%。如果你聽聽設備公司的說法，你會發現 WFE 的漲幅高達個位數。我的意思是我上漲了 10% 左右。但如果你聽他們的歌，你會發現這是一首高品質的單曲。因此，如果 WFE 上漲幅度較大且 Gartner MSI 上漲 11%，那麼 TAM 怎麼只上漲 4% 呢？我只是有點好奇你是如何得出這個數字的。

Yes. I mean, as you know, a lot of those research firms actually will go through multiple revisions of their guidance and forecast for the year. I mean you could say that our assumptions may be conservative, but I think that most market research firms have actually slowly brought their numbers down when it comes to MSI in particular.

是的。我的意思是，如你所知，許多研究公司實際上會對其年度指導和預測進行多次修改。我的意思是，您可能會說我們的假設可能有些保守，但我認為大多數市場研究公司在 MSI 方面實際上已經慢慢降低了他們的數字。

So I think that having a wafer [stub] assumption at about 5 is probably a good place to be at this point. And if it is better, then we will, of course, benefit from that.

因此，我認為，將晶圓 [存根] 假設設定在 5 左右可能是目前的最佳狀態。如果它變得更好，那麼我們當然會從中受益。

When it comes to CapEx, remember that our CapEx number is really a full industry CapEx, it's not just WFE. And we believe that the industry CapEx is going to be essentially flat, maybe modestly up, but essentially flat, right? So I think that's really the basis for that 4% number. And we will update you...

當涉及資本支出時，請記住我們的資本支出數字實際上是全行業的資本支出，而不僅僅是 WFE。我們相信產業資本支出將基本保持平穩，或許會小幅上漲，但基本上保持平穩，對嗎？所以我認為這確實是 4% 這個數字的基礎。我們將向您更新...

Okay. Yes, I guess...

好的。是的，我想…

Go ahead.

前進。

Yes. No, I guess I was just going to say, just to put like a fine point on it, whatever the TAM is, you're saying that you're going to outgrow the TAM this year?

是的。不，我想我只是想說，只是為了強調這一點，無論 TAM 是多少，你是說你今年將超越 TAM 嗎？

That's right. That's right. And that's what we've done. I mean that's -- the reason why we have established that growth algorithm is we recognize that the industry is notoriously hard to predict. And our goal and our commitment is to outpace the industry by that 3 to 6 points. And this year, we said that, that range is going to be 4 to 5.

這是正確的。這是正確的。這正是我們所做的。我的意思是——我們建立該成長演算法的原因是我們認識到這個行業是出了名的難以預測。我們的目標和承諾是領先產業 3 到 6 個百分點。今年，我們表示，範圍將是 4 到 5。

Our next question comes from Charles Shi with Needham.

我們的下一個問題來自 Needham 的 Charles Shi。

I just want to ask a little bit more on the industry-level CapEx expectation for this year. Maybe let me start with the observation of your numbers, first, because I did notice while MS does seem to be off the bottom, if I look at your pro forma numbers for the past 5 quarters. But MC, AMH, both are -- have a little bit more exposure to CapEx side, and they seem to take a little bit [down] in Q1.

我只是想多問一下今年產業層面的資本支出預期。首先，讓我先從觀察您的數字開始，因為我確實注意到，如果我查看過去 5 個季度的預測數字，MS 似乎確實已經脫離底部。但 MC、AMH 都在資本支出方面有稍微多一點的曝險，而且它們在第一季的曝險似乎有所下降。

And I also noticed that you did point out fluid handling in one of the weakness areas, which I believe is probably more on the infrastructure side. So I get that you are expecting the full industry CapEx to be flat to modestly up. But between infrastructure and any equipment, do you have a little bit different view there between those two? Maybe infrastructure does sound like it may be temporarily under pressure in Q1, but I just want to get a little bit of sense on a full year basis. What do you see there?

我還注意到您確實指出了流體處理是薄弱環節之一，我認為這可能更多是在基礎設施方面。所以我明白您預計整個行業的資本支出將持平或略有上升。但是在基礎設施和任何設備之間，您對這兩者有什麼不同的看法嗎？也許基礎設施聽起來確實可能在第一季暫時面臨壓力，但我只是想從全年的角度了解情況。你在那看到了什麼？

If I look at AMH specifically, where you have actually those two components, I mean we sell fluid handling components that go into the new fab construction projects, and then we sell FOUPs that are really more tied to [lens]. So fluid handling has been actually relatively steady, and that's really a function of all of the major new fab construction projects that have been announced and have been -- that we've witnessed around the world.

如果我具體看一下AMH，實際上有這兩個組件，我的意思是我們銷售用於新晶圓廠建設項目的流體處理組件，然後我們銷售與[鏡頭]更緊密相關的FOUP。因此，流體處理實際上一直相對穩定，這實際上得益於我們在世界各地宣布和見證的所有重大新晶圓廠建設項目。

The FOUP business, on the other hand, actually has contracted. I mean we had a very -- still relatively robust demand for our FOUP early in 2023. I mean we came into 2023 with a fair amount of backlog for our FOUP products. That backlog has dissipated. So the FOUP business has been relatively slow and has not recovered. And we expect actually that we have reached bottom in Q1 of this year, and we expect actually to see gradual recovery in that particular product line for the balance of the year.

另一方面，FOUP 業務實際上已經萎縮。我的意思是，在 2023 年初，我們對 FOUP 的需求仍然非常強勁。積壓問題現已消失。所以FOUP業務一直比較緩慢，還沒恢復。我們實際上預計今年第一季已經觸底，並且我們預計該產品線將在今年餘下時間逐步復甦。

So again, a sharper decline in the product lines that are WFE related and less of a decline for the products that are new fab construction related.

因此，與 WFE 相關的產品線的下降幅度更大，而與新工廠建設相關的產品線的下降幅度較小。

And what's the outlook for the full year between infrastructure, CapEx and equipment? What do you see?

全年基礎設施、資本支出和設備的前景如何？你看到了什麼？

So right now, we expect relatively steady infrastructure-related demand. And we expect to see some uptick in WFE-related demand in the back half of the year.

因此目前我們預期基礎設施相關需求相對穩定。我們預計今年下半年 WFE 相關需求將會上升。

And our next question comes from Christopher Parkinson with Wolfe Research.

我們的下一個問題來自 Wolfe Research 的 Christopher Parkinson。

This is Harris Fein on for Chris. So I mean we've seen a lot of grants for new fabs in the U.S. over the last few weeks. I guess, at what point during the construction process for those fabs would customers start to come to you for FOUPs, filtration systems, things of that nature? And then I guess related to that, how are you feeling about Colorado Springs receiving funding? I guess, what could that look like?

以下是哈里斯費恩 (Harris Fein) 代替克里斯上場的節目。所以我的意思是，過去幾週我們看到美國為新晶圓廠提供了大量補助。我想，在這些晶圓廠的建造過程中，什麼時候客戶會開始向您購買 FOUP、過濾系統或類似的東西呢？然後我想與此相關的是，您對科羅拉多斯普林斯獲得資助有何感想？我猜，那會是什麼樣子的呢？

Yes. So let's talk first about the shape of the opportunity when new fabs are being built. So typically, we start by selling fluid handling solutions. I mean those solutions are used in the sub-fab chemical loops. So we see those opportunities really early on when new fabs are being built.

是的。那我們先來談談新晶圓廠建設時的機會型態。通常，我們從銷售流體處理解決方案開始。我的意思是這些解決方案用於子工廠化學循環。因此，當新晶圓廠建設時，我們很早就看到了這些機會。

It's then followed by the large gas purification systems that those advanced fabs will need. I mean all of those advanced fabs are using much greater volumes of processed gases requiring more advanced purities. So those systems are really key to achieve that.

接下來是這些先進晶圓廠所需的大型氣體淨化系統。我的意思是所有這些先進的晶圓廠都在使用大量需要更高品質純度的加工氣體。因此，這些系統對於實現這一目標至關重要。

And then it will be the FOUP fleet, and the fleet is usually delivered at the time the tools are getting into the fabs, right? And then we're going to start actually seeing demand for filters and chemistries when the fabs are gearing up for the ramp. So that's the way you should think about it, essentially three different waves of opportunities for us.

然後就是 FOUP 車隊，車隊通常在工具進入晶圓廠時交付，對嗎？然後，當晶圓廠準備投入生產時，我們將開始真正看到對過濾器和化學物質的需求。所以你應該這樣想，本質上對我們來說有三波不同的機會。

When it comes to our investment in Colorado, we filed our application last year. We've been in constant dialogue -- constructive dialogue with the CHIPS Program Office. We believe that this investment in Colorado is clearly in line with objectives of the administration, an objective that is not just to onshore advanced semiconductor manufacturing but also to make sure that the critical components of the ecosystem will be manufactured here in the U.S. And again, what our plans are for [Rockrimmon], which is the name of the site in Colorado, fits squarely that objective. So that's probably as much as I can tell you.

至於我們在科羅拉多州的投資，我們去年就提交了申請。我們一直在與 CHIPS 計劃辦公室進行建設性的對話。我們相信，這項對科羅拉多州的投資顯然符合政府的目標，這一目標不僅是實現先進的半導體製造本土化，也是為了確保生態系統的關鍵部件能夠在美國製造。這可能就是我能告訴你的全部了。

I would just say that obviously, the more incentives we can have and the sooner we can have access to those incentives, the easier it will be for us to accelerate our Phase 1 and then potentially Phase 2 investment in Colorado.

我只想說，顯然，我們獲得的激勵越多，越早獲得這些激勵，我們就越容易加速我們在科羅拉多州第一階段以及潛在的第二階段的投資。

Got it. That's helpful. And for my follow-up, I know DRAM is not a huge part of your business today. There's some talk around memory customers as they ramp HBM, maybe being a little bit more disciplined than they've been in the past, keeping some capacity off-line. But at the same time, die sizes are getting larger, yields are becoming a little bit more of a challenge for them. I guess it would be good to hear your perspective on how you see that dynamic playing out.

知道了。這很有幫助。我想問的是，我知道 DRAM 目前並不是您業務的重要組成部分。一些記憶體客戶在增加 HBM 時談到，他們可能比過去更加自律，保持一些產能處於離線狀態。但同時，晶片尺寸越來越大，產量對他們來說變得更具挑戰性。我想，聽聽您對這一動態發展的看法會很好。

Yes. No, it's a great question. So I mean, of course, we will benefit from the increase in wafer [stubs] driven by increased demand for HBM. But an HBM chip is essentially a DDR5 chip. I mean the core memory cell is the same. And what it means is that we don't have an additional wafer content opportunity with an HBM chip.

是的。不，這是一個很好的問題。所以我的意思是，我們當然會受益於 HBM 需求增加所推動的晶圓（stub）數量的增加。但HBM晶片本質上是DDR5晶片。我的意思是核心儲存單元是相同的。這意味著我們沒有利用 HBM 晶片來獲得額外晶圓內容的機會。

We think that this is going to change because we know that all industry participants are now really very focused on improving the performance of the core memory cell. And to do that, they are turning to EUV. And they're also considering adopting some 3D architectures in the overall DRAM architecture, all of which will open up a number of new opportunities for us in terms of photoresist filtration, in terms of EUV parts and then, of course, in terms of advanced materials and etching [chemistry].

我們認為這種情況將會改變，因為我們知道所有產業參與者現在都非常專注於提高核心儲存單元的效能。為了實現這一目標，他們開始採用 EUV。他們還考慮在整個 DRAM 架構中採用一些 3D 架構，所有這些都將在光阻過濾、EUV 部件以及先進材料和蝕刻[化學]方面為我們開闢許多新的機會。

So again, today, we are enjoying the increase in wafer [starts]. And in a few years from now, we will enjoy the increase in content per wafer in DRAM.

所以今天我們再次享受晶圓產量的增加。而從現在起的幾年內，我們將享受 DRAM 每片晶圓內容的增加。

And we will take our last question from Chris Kapsch with Loop Capital Markets.

我們的最後一個問題來自 Loop Capital Markets 的 Chris Kapsch。

My question is a follow-up on the memory market but focused on NAND. And just, Bertrand, your willingness to share a little bit more color around the role that molybdenum will have in the technology roadmap sounds encouraging. Is it right to assume the confidence in visibility is backed by process of record wins? And more specifically, are those PORs with just, say, 1 or 2 leading memory producers of NAND chips? Or is it really more broadly across the industry?

我的問題是關於內存市場的後續問題，但重點是 NAND。而且，Bertrand，您願意進一步闡述鉬在技術路線圖中將發揮的作用，這聽起來令人鼓舞。是否可以假設對可見性的信心是由創紀錄的勝利過程所支持的？更具體地說，這些 POR 是否僅與 1 或 2 家領先的 NAND 晶片記憶體生產商合作？或者它確實在整個行業中更為廣泛？

And then as a follow-up to that, are there instances -- given the sort of still soft NAND memory backdrop, are there instances where leading producers are, in fact, looking to skip the 2xx layer node right to the 3xx layer node where moly will more definitively play a role?

然後作為後續問題，是否存在這樣的情況 - 鑑於仍然柔軟的 NAND 內存背景，是否存在領先的生產商實際上希望跳過 2xx 層節點直接進入 3xx 層節點的情況，而鉬將在該節點中更明確地發揮作用？

Yes, Chris. So look, I mean, first, as I said earlier, I think that transitions of that magnitude don't happen very often in this industry. And tungsten -- to put that in context, I mean tungsten has been the interconnect metal of choice for close to 3 decades in NAND, DRAM and logic/foundry.

是的，克里斯。首先，正如我之前所說，我認為這種規模的轉變在這個行業並不常見。至於鎢，具體來說，近 30 年來，鎢一直是 NAND、DRAM 和邏輯/代工廠的首選互連金屬。

But as architectures become more complex and with the desire of all participants to move to [thin-film] deposition, you have a number of new materials that present better thermal and electrical properties, and moly has been on the roadmap for a long time.

但隨著架構變得越來越複雜，並且所有參與者都希望轉向[薄膜]沉積，許多新材料都具有更好的熱性能和電性能，而鉬早已出現在發展路線圖上。

And for all of those thin-film resistivity property and the fact that it has essentially no [resistivity] into the direct material, which allows the deposition of that layer without a barrier layer, which is obviously very important at the time when 3D companies are trying to increase the number of functional layers without increasing the aspect ratio.

對於所有這些薄膜電阻率特性以及它在直接材料中基本上沒有[電阻率]的事實，這使得該層可以在沒有阻擋層的情況下沉積，這在3D公司試圖在不增加縱橫比的情況下增加功能層數量時顯然非常重要。

So all of that is great, but it's -- the materials that are used to deposit moly are notoriously difficult to handle and deliver. And that has been really the challenge that the industry has been trying to solve for several years now. And we think we're getting really, really close. I mean we're working closely with the semiconductor manufacturers, the equipment makers. I think we are within 6 to 9 months of the first POR decisions.

所有這些都很棒，但是用於沉積鉬的材料非常難以處理和輸送。這確實是該行業幾年來一直在努力解決的挑戰。我們認為我們已經非常非常接近了。我的意思是我們正在與半導體製造商和設備製造商密切合作。我認為我們距離第一個 POR 決定還有 6 到 9 個月的時間。

How is that going to play out? Will they -- at what node precisely will they be adopting moly? As I said in previous calls, it's still something that is being discussed. I think all of that is going to be a function of the perceived degree of readiness by the ecosystem. And the ecosystem is really a combination of the equipment makers and the material suppliers.

結果會怎樣？他們究竟會在什麼時候採用鉬？正如我在之前的電話中所說，這仍然是一個正在討論的事情。我認為所有這些都將取決於生態系統的準備程度。這個生態系統其實是設備製造商和材料供應商的結合。

But we think that Entegris has a very, very unique set of capabilities to ease this migration to molybdenum. And this is certainly a very exciting time for the industry, a very exciting time for Entegris.

但我們認為 Entegris 擁有非常獨特的能力來簡化向鉬的遷移。這對業界和 Entegris 來說無疑是一個非常令人興奮的時刻。

That's helpful. Just as a follow-up, given just how enabling this chemistry, it sounds like it will be -- you highlighted a couple of things, the thermal management, elimination of barrier layers, those process steps. It sounds like it's very differentiated in a margin opportunity that will help Material Solutions. Is there any way you can quantify what the potential margin opportunity is in terms of percentages? Or is it just something that should be...

這很有幫助。作為後續問題，考慮到這種化學反應是如何實現的，聽起來它會是——你強調了幾件事，熱管理、消除屏障層、這些工藝步驟。聽起來，它在利潤機會方面非常有差異化，這將有助於材料解決方案。有沒有什麼方法可以用百分比來量化潛在的利潤機會？或者這只是應該發生的事情...

No. I mean, I think we don't really disclose specific gross margin information by product. And I mean -- and frankly, that's -- it would be very difficult for us to do that at the current stage of adoption of that product. So we'll pass on that question, Chris.

不，我的意思是，我認為我們實際上並沒有披露按產品劃分的具體毛利率資訊。我的意思是——坦白說——在該產品採用的現階段，我們很難做到這一點。所以我們會轉發這個問題，克里斯。

It appears that we have no further questions at this time. I will now turn the program back over to Bill Seymour for any additional or closing remarks.

目前看來我們沒有其他問題了。現在我將節目交還給比爾·西摩，請他發表任何補充意見或結束語。

Thank you for joining our call today. Please reach out to me directly if you have any further questions or you want to set up a call. Have a great day, and you can now disconnect.

感謝您今天參加我們的電話會議。如果您還有其他問題或想要通話，請直接與我聯絡。祝您有美好的一天，現在您可以斷開連接了。

Thank you. This concludes today's Entegris First Quarter 2024 Earnings Conference Call. Please disconnect your line at this time, and have a wonderful day.

謝謝。今天的 Entegris 2024 年第一季財報電話會議到此結束。請立即斷開您的線路，祝您有美好的一天。