杜邦 (DD) 2024 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Thank you for standing by, and welcome to the DuPont fourth-quarter 2024 earnings conference call.

感謝您的支持，歡迎參加杜邦 2024 年第四季財報電話會議。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指令）

I'd now like to turn the call over to Chris Mecray.

現在我想將電話轉給 Chris Mecray。

You may begin.

你可以開始了。

Good morning and thank you for joining us for DuPont's fourth-quarter and full year 2024 financial results conference call.

早安，感謝您參加杜邦 2024 年第四季和全年財務表現電話會議。

Joining me today are Ed Breen, Executive Chairman; Lori Koch, Chief Executive Officer; and Antonella Franzen, Chief Financial Officer.

今天與我一起出席的還有執行主席 Ed Breen； Lori Koch，執行長；以及財務長 Antonella Franzen。

We have prepared slides to supplement our remarks, which are posted on DuPont's website under the Investor Relations tab and through the webcast link.

我們準備了幻燈片來補充我們的評論，這些幻燈片發佈在杜邦網站的「投資者關係」標籤下並透過網路廣播連結發布。

Please read the forward-looking statement disclaimer contained in the slides.

請閱讀幻燈片中包含的前瞻性聲明免責聲明。

During this call, we'll make forward-looking statements regarding our expectations or predictions about the future.

在本次電話會議中，我們將就未來的預期或預測做出前瞻性陳述。

Because these statements are based on current assumptions and factors that involve risks and uncertainties, our actual performance and results may differ materially from our forward-looking statements.

由於這些聲明是基於當前的假設和涉及風險和不確定性的因素，我們的實際業績和結果可能與我們的前瞻性聲明有重大差異。

Our Form 10-K as updated by our current and periodic reports, includes detailed discussion of principal risks and uncertainties which may cause such differences.

我們的當前和定期報告更新了 10-K 表格，其中包含可能導致此類差異的主要風險和不確定性的詳細討論。

Unless otherwise specified, all historical financial measures presented today are on a continuing operations basis and exclude significant items.

除非另有說明，否則今天呈現的所有歷史財務指標均以持續經營為基礎，且不包括重大項目。

We will also refer to other non-GAAP measures.

我們也將參考其他非公認會計準則指標。

A reconciliation to the most directly comparable GAAP financial measures included in our press release and presentation materials that have been posted to DuPont's Investor Relations website.

與我們在杜邦投資者關係網站上發布的新聞稿和簡報資料中包含的最直接可比較的 GAAP 財務指標的對帳。

I'll now turn the call over to Lori, who will begin on slide 3.

現在我將電話轉給 Lori，她將從幻燈片 3 開始發言。

Good morning, everyone, and thanks for joining our fourth-quarter call.

大家早安，感謝您參加我們的第四季電話會議。

Earlier today, we reported solid quarterly results to close out a strong year of performance.

今天早些時候，我們報告了穩健的季度業績，為強勁的一年畫上了圓滿的句號。

Fourth quarter sales grew 7%, including another consecutive quarter of double-digit organic growth in E&I and highlighted by a return to organic growth in W&T of 6%.

第四季銷售額成長 7%，其中電氣與儀器 (E&I) 連續一個季度實現兩位數有機成長，而珠寶與珠寶 (W&T) 則重回 6% 的有機成長。

We showed strong operating leverage as operating EBITDA of $807 million increased 13% year-over-year.

我們表現出強勁的經營槓桿，8.07 億美元的經營 EBITDA 較去年同期成長 13%。

Operating EBITDA margin of 26.1% expanded 140 basis points and adjusted EPS of $1.13 grew 30% from the prior year.

營業 EBITDA 利潤率為 26.1%，擴大了 140 個基點，調整後每股收益為 1.13 美元，較上年增長 30%。

From an end market view, fourth quarter saw continued strong demand within Electronics, driven by the ongoing transition to advanced nodes and related AI-enabling technologies.

從終端市場來看，受先進節點和相關人工智慧技術的持續轉型推動，第四季度電子產品需求持續強勁。

Further improvement in health care markets resulted in a return to volume growth for both our medical packaging and biopharma products, which both grew at double-digit rates.

醫療保健市場的進一步改善使我們的醫療包裝和生物製藥產品的銷售恢復成長，均實現了兩位數的成長。

Additionally, we continue to see growth acceleration in Water in the quarter, with 4% sequential sales lift and an 11% year-over-year increase.

此外，我們繼續看到本季水務業務的成長加速，銷售額環比成長 4%，年增 11%。

Looking back at full year financial performance, volume growth of 2% was solid and grew as the year went on, accommodating an 8% growth for the fourth quarter.

回顧全年財務業績，2%的銷售成長是穩健的，並且隨著時間的推移不斷增長，第四季度實現了 8% 的成長。

This, combined with operational discipline and productivity actions, was key to our earnings growth and resulted in strong incremental and margin improvement.

這一點，加上營運紀律和生產力行動，成為了我們獲利成長的關鍵，並帶來了強勁的增量和利潤率提升。

Coupling improved segment earnings with the benefit of a reduced share count led to a robust 17% growth in adjusted EPS.

分部獲利改善與股份數量減少的好處相結合，帶動調整後每股收益強勁增長 17%。

Working capital optimization, which has been another key operating priority for the team helped drive strong cash generation with transaction-adjusted free cash flow conversion of 105%.

營運資本優化是團隊的另一個關鍵營運重點，有助於推動強勁的現金產生，交易調整後的自由現金流轉換率達到 105%。

I'd like to thank the entire DuPont team for all their hard work and dedication to achieve these results.

我要感謝整個杜邦團隊為實現這些成果所付出的辛勤工作和奉獻精神。

Turning to slide 4.

翻到幻燈片 4。

I will cover our key priorities for 2025, organic growth, operational execution and portfolio management.

我將介紹我們 2025 年的重點任務：有機成長、營運執行和投資組合管理。

Starting with the top line.

從第一行開始。

As mentioned, we saw volume growth improvement in both E&I and W&T as we progress through this past year.

如上所述，我們看到，在過去的一年裡，電氣與儀器 (E&I) 和維修與運輸 (W&T) 的銷售量均實現了成長。

Looking into 2025, we expect further acceleration in volume growth, targeting mid-single-digit organic sales growth for the total company.

展望 2025 年，我們預期銷售成長將進一步加速，整個公司的有機銷售額將實現中等個位數成長。

To enable this, we will continue focusing on optimizing our growth opportunities within each business, which includes both continued investment and innovation as well as driving commercial excellence initiatives, including strategic marketing and sales effectiveness activities.

為實現這一目標，我們將繼續專注於優化每個業務領域的成長機會，包括持續投資和創新以及推動商業卓越計劃，包括策略行銷和銷售效率活動。

To ensure success, we recently hired a Chief Commercial Officer to drive consistent execution across all of our businesses.

為了確保成功，我們最近聘請了一位首席商務官來推動所有業務的一致執行。

Additionally, our businesses continue to focus on driving operational excellence.

此外，我們的業務繼續專注於推動卓越營運。

We are entering our fourth year of driving an enhanced focus on OpEx, and our profitability continues to benefit from the expanded toolkit and disciplined rollout across the organization.

我們即將進入更關注營運支出的第四年，而我們的獲利能力繼續受益於整個組織內擴展的工具包和嚴格的推廣。

Coupling our standard OpEx framework with steady investments in digital tools will lead to continued improvement in financial performance.

將我們的標準 OpEx 框架與對數位工具的穩定投資結合起來，將持續改善財務表現。

Finally, regarding portfolio management, we announced last month that we are targeting November 1, of this year for the intended spin-off of the Electronics business, which is nicely accelerated from the initial time frame of 18 to 24 months.

最後，關於投資組合管理，我們上個月宣布，我們計劃在今年 11 月 1 日分拆電子業務，這項計劃比最初計劃的 18 個月至 24 個月的時間框架大大加快。

We remain excited about the sizable shareholder value creation opportunity from creating a leading pure-play electronics company.

我們對於創造一家領先的純電子公司所帶來的巨大股東價值創造機會感到興奮。

We continue to make progress towards establishing the future boards for Electronics and DuPont and remain on track to be able to announce new Board members as well as executive leadership for the future electronics company by the end of the first quarter.

我們在建立電子和杜邦未來董事會方面繼續取得進展，並預計在第一季末宣布新董事會成員以及未來電子公司的執行領導層。

We continue to see the excitement building internally and externally, and I look forward to updating you in the coming months.

我們繼續看到公司內部和外部的興奮情緒不斷高漲，我期待在接下來的幾個月向您報告最新情況。

With that, I'll turn it over to Antonella to cover the financial results and outlook in detail.

接下來，我將把話題轉交給安東內拉，讓她詳細介紹財務表現和前景。

Thanks, Lori, and good morning, everyone.

謝謝，Lori，大家早安。

We are pleased with the solid finish to a strong year of financial performance.

我們對今年財務表現的強勁表現感到非常高興。

End market recovery and improved volumes have been the primary driver of our accelerated sales and earnings growth throughout 2024 and our teams have also continued to execute well on our operational excellence initiatives, including both enhanced productivity and the previously announced cost actions.

終端市場復甦和銷售成長是我們 2024 年銷售和獲利加速成長的主要動力，我們的團隊也繼續出色地執行卓越營運計劃，包括提高生產力和先前宣布的成本行動。

I look forward to the continued momentum that we are carrying into 2025, but first, I'll cover our fourth quarter financial highlights in further detail, beginning on slide 5.

我期待我們能夠繼續保持這種勢頭進入 2025 年，但首先，我將從第 5 張投影片開始詳細介紹我們第四季的財務亮點。

Net sales of $3.1 billion increased 7% versus the year ago period as an 8% increase in volume was slightly offset by a 1% decrease in price.

淨銷售額為 31 億美元，比去年同期成長 7%，因為銷售 8% 的成長被價格 1% 的下降略微抵消。

Currency and portfolio were both flat.

貨幣和投資組合均持平。

Higher volume was led by continued strong demand in Electronics end markets with Semi and Interconnect Solutions, both up double digits.

銷售成長主要是由於半導體和互連解決方案等電子終端市場持續強勁的需求，均實現了兩位數的成長。

Further acceleration in Water Solutions yielding double-digit volume gains and a return to year-over-year growth in both Safety Solutions and Industrial Solutions.

水解決方案業務進一步加速發展，銷售量達到兩位數成長，安全解決方案和工業解決方案業務也恢復年增。

On a segment view, E&I and W&P organic sales grew 10% and 6%, respectively.

從分部來看，E&I 和 W&P 的有機銷售額分別成長了 10% 和 6%。

Organic sales in corporate declined 7% versus the year ago period.

公司有機銷售額較去年同期下降 7%。

From a regional perspective, Asia Pacific delivered 11% organic sales growth year-over-year, including another strong quarter in China, where organic sales also increased 11% due to continued strength in Electronics markets and acceleration in Water.

從區域來看，亞太地區有機銷售額年增 11%，其中中國市場再次表現強勁，由於電子市場持續走強以及水務市場加速成長，中國市場的有機銷售額也成長了 11%。

Organic sales were up 5% in North America and up 1% in Europe.

北美有機銷售額成長 5%，歐洲成長 1%。

Fourth quarter operating EBITDA of $807 million increased 13% versus the year ago period as volume gains, the benefit of higher production rates and savings from restructuring actions were partially offset by higher variable compensation.

第四季營業 EBITDA 為 8.07 億美元，較去年同期成長 13%，原因是銷量增加、生產力提高帶來的好處以及重組舉措帶來的節省被更高的浮動薪酬部分抵消。

Operating EBITDA margin during the quarter of 26.1% increased 140 basis points year-over-year.

本季營業 EBITDA 利潤率為 26.1%，比去年同期增加了 140 個基點。

Fourth quarter cash generation was strong, reflecting a continued working capital discipline across the businesses.

第四季的現金產生能力強勁，反映出各企業持續嚴格遵守營運資本紀律。

On a continuing operations basis, cash flow from operations of $564 million, CapEx of $161 million and $52 million of separation-related transaction cost payments resulted in transaction-adjusted free cash flow of $455 million and related conversion of 96%.

在持續經營基礎上，經營活動現金流為 5.64 億美元，資本支出為 1.61 億美元，以及與分離相關的交易成本支付 5,200 萬美元，交易調整後的自由現金流為 4.55 億美元，相關轉換率為 96%。

As Lori mentioned earlier, 2024 was a strong year for cash performance, with transaction-adjusted free cash flow of $1.8 billion and related conversion of 105%.

正如 Lori 先前所提到的，2024 年是現金表現強勁的一年，交易調整後的自由現金流為 18 億美元，相關轉換率為 105%。

Turning to slide 6.

翻到幻燈片 6。

Adjusted EPS for the quarter of $1.13 per share increased 30% from $0.87 in the year ago period.

本季調整後每股收益為 1.13 美元，較去年同期的 0.87 美元成長 30%。

Higher segment earnings of $0.17 as well as below-the-line benefits totaling $0.09 from a combination of lower share count, tax rate and foreign exchange losses drove the year-over-year increase.

較高的分部收益為 0.17 美元，加上較低的股數、稅率和外匯損失等因素帶來的低於線的收益總計 0​​.09 美元，推動了同比增長。

Turning to segment results, beginning with E&I on slide 7.

轉向分部結果，從幻燈片 7 上的 E&I 開始。

E&I fourth quarter net sales of $1.5 billion increased 11% versus the year ago period on organic sales growth of 10% and favorable portfolio impact of 1%, reflecting the Donatelle acquisition.

E&I 第四季淨銷售額為 15 億美元，較去年同期成長 11%，其中有機銷售額成長 10%，且投資組合有利影響為 1%，反映了 Donatelle 的收購。

Organic sales growth of 10% reflects an 11% increase in volume, slightly offset by a 1% decrease in price.

有機銷售額成長 10%，反映出銷量成長 11%，但價格下降 1% 略有抵銷。

At the line of business level, organic sales for Semi were up low teens on continued semiconductor demand recovery driven by AI technology applications.

在業務層面，由於人工智慧技術應用推動半導體需求持續復甦，半導體業務的有機銷售額實現了低幅度成長。

Semi demand continues to be notably strong in China with the year-over-year growth of about 40% during the quarter.

中國對半導體的需求持續強勁，本季較去年同期成長約 40%。

Given elevated levels of growth throughout 2024, we currently anticipate relatively flat Semi sales in China for 2025, though overall organic growth in Semi is expected to be up 6% to 7% for the full year.

鑑於 2024 年全年的成長水平，我們目前預計 2025 年中國 Semi 銷量將相對持平，但預計全年 Semi 整體有機成長率將達到 6% 至 7%。

Interconnect Solutions posted another quarter of strong results with organic sales up low double digits reflecting broad-based end market strength, additional share gains and continued volume benefits from AI-driven technology ramps.

Interconnect Solutions 公佈了另一個季度的強勁業績，有機銷售額增長了兩位數，反映了廣泛的終端市場實力、額外的份額增長以及人工智能驅動的技術提升帶來的持續銷量優勢。

Industrial Solutions returned to organic growth in the quarter, with organic sales up mid-single digits due to improved demand for biopharma within health care and continued strength in printing and packaging applications.

工業解決方案在本季度恢復了有機成長，由於醫療保健領域對生物製藥的需求增加以及印刷和包裝應用的持續強勁，有機銷售額增長了中等個位數。

Operating EBITDA for E&I of $457 million was up 21% versus the year ago period.

E&I 的營業 EBITDA 為 4.57 億美元，較去年同期成長 21%。

On volume gains, the benefit of higher production rates, savings from restructuring actions and a $13 million gain related to a technology license agreement, which was contemplated in our guidance.

在產量成長方面，我們預期將帶來更高的生產力、重組行動帶來的節省以及與技術授權協議相關的 1,300 萬美元收益。

The year-over-year increase is partially offset by higher variable compensation.

年成長部分被更高的浮動薪酬所抵消。

Operating EBITDA margin during the quarter was 30.3%, up 250 basis points versus the year ago period.

本季營業 EBITDA 利潤率為 30.3%，較去年同期上升 250 個基點。

For the full year, E&I net sales of $5.9 billion increased 11% with 6% organic sales growth.

全年而言，E&I 淨銷售額為 59 億美元，成長 11%，有機銷售額成長 6%。

For the full year, operating EBITDA of $1.7 billion increased 17% with operating EBITDA margin of 29%, up 140 basis points from the prior year.

全年營業 EBITDA 為 17 億美元，成長 17%，營業 EBITDA 利潤率為 29%，較上年上升 140 個基點。

Turning to slide 8.

翻到幻燈片 8。

W&P fourth quarter net sales of $1.4 billion increased 6% versus the year ago period due to an 8% increase in volume, partially offset by a 2% decrease in price.

W&P 第四季淨銷售額為 14 億美元，較去年同期成長 6%，原因是銷量成長 8%，但價格下降 2% 部分抵銷了這一成長。

Safety Solutions returned to year-over-year growth as organic sales were up high single digits, reflecting continued improvement in health care markets, evidenced by medical packaging sales lift for three consecutive quarters, including a 6% increase from Q3.

安全解決方案恢復了同比增長，有機銷售額實現了高個位數增長，反映出醫療保健市場的持續改善，醫療包裝銷售額連續三個季度提升就是明證，其中較第三季度增長了 6%。

Shelter Solutions sales were flat on an organic basis with headwinds in North America construction markets offset by growth in repair and remodel demand.

房屋解決方案的銷售額在有機基礎上持平，北美建築市場的逆風被維修和改造需求的成長所抵消。

Within Water Solutions, sales were up low double digits on an organic basis, driven by continued broad-based volume recovery.

在水處理業務方面，受持續廣泛銷售復甦的推動，銷售額有機增長了兩位數。

On a sequential basis, Water Solutions sales also increased for a third straight quarter with sales up 4% from Q3.

與上一季相比，水解決方案銷售額連續第三個季度成長，季增 4%。

Operating EBITDA for W&P during the quarter of $357 million was up 14% versus the year ago period as volume gains and savings from restructuring actions were partially offset by higher variable compensation and the absence of about $25 million of discrete item benefits reported in the prior year.

本季度，W&P 的營業 EBITDA 為 3.57 億美元，比去年同期增長 14%，原因是銷售增長和重組行動帶來的節省被更高的可變薪酬和上年報告的約 2500 萬美元單獨項目福利的缺失部分抵消。

Operating EBITDA margin during the quarter was 26.3%, up 170 basis points from the year ago period.

本季營業 EBITDA 利潤率為 26.3%，較去年同期上升 170 個基點。

For the full year, W&P generated net sales of $5.4 billion with operating EBITDA of $1.4 billion.

全年，W&P 淨銷售額為 54 億美元，營業 EBITDA 為 14 億美元。

Operating EBITDA margin for the full year of 25.1% increased 50 basis points.

全年營業 EBITDA 利潤率為 25.1%，增加了 50 個基點。

Turning to slide 9, which outlines our first-quarter 2025 and full year guidance expectations.

轉到第 9 張投影片，概述了我們對 2025 年第一季和全年的指導預期。

At a consolidated level for the first quarter, we estimate net sales of about $3.025 billion, operating EBITDA of about $760 million and adjusted EPS of $0.95 per share.

以第一季的綜合水準來看，我們預期淨銷售額約為 30.25 億美元，營業 EBITDA 約為 7.6 億美元，調整後每股收益為 0.95 美元。

Our first quarter net sales guidance assumes mid-single-digit organic growth and a currency headwind of about 1.5% versus the first quarter of 2024.

我們的第一季淨銷售額預期為實現中等個位數有機成長，且與 2024 年第一季相比，貨幣逆風約為 1.5%。

We expect a more normal seasonal progression into the second quarter with a sequential sales lift of about 6% to 7% from the first quarter.

我們預計第二季的季節性變化將更加正常，銷售額將比第一季環比成長約 6% 至 7%。

For the full year 2025, we estimate consolidated net sales of $12.8 billion to $12.9 billion, operating EBITDA of $3.325 billion to $3.375 billion and adjusted EPS of $4.30 to $4.40 per share.

對於 2025 年全年，我們預計綜合淨銷售額為 128 億美元至 129 億美元，營業 EBITDA 為 33.25 億美元至 33.75 億美元，調整後每股收益為 4.30 美元至 4.40 美元。

Our full year consolidated net sales guidance assumes mid-single-digit organic growth and a currency headwind of about 1%.

我們對全年綜合淨銷售額的預期為實現中等個位數有機成長，且貨幣逆風約為 1%。

Our EPS estimate includes a headwind from below-the-line items, totaling $0.10 related primarily to an assumed 1% higher tax rate versus this past year.

我們的每股盈餘預測包括低於線項目的阻力，總計 0.10 美元，主要與假設稅率較去年同期高 1% 有關。

I would also like to highlight that we plan on realigning our segment reporting structure in the first quarter, in advance of the intended separation of Electronics later this year.

我還想強調的是，我們計劃在第一季重新調整我們的分部報告結構，以便在今年稍後實現電子業務的分離。

We will begin reporting under this new structure when we release our first quarter 2025 results.

當我們發布 2025 年第一季業績時，我們將開始按照這一新結構進行報告。

The businesses comprising the future electronics company will be reported as the ElectronicsCo segment.

未來電子公司的業務組成將被報告為 ElectronicsCo 部門。

While the businesses that will remain with DuPont will be reported as the IndustrialsCo segments.

而保留在杜邦旗下的業務將報告為工業公司部門。

We are providing historical segment information reflecting these realignments for comparison purposes, which you can find in the earnings presentation accompanying today's call.

為了進行比較，我們提供反映這些重新調整的歷史分部信息，您可以在今天的電話會議中附帶的收益報告中找到這些信息。

For the new ElectronicsCo segment, we expect full year 2025 organic sales growth in the 6% to 7% range.

對於新的 ElectronicsCo 部門，我們預計 2025 年全年有機銷售額成長率將在 6% 至 7% 之間。

This assumed growth is expected to be driven by ongoing strength within semi, fueled by continued AI adoption and transition to advanced nodes, as well as the impact from more normalized sales in China, as previously mentioned.

預計這一假定的成長將受到半導體領域持續強勁發展的推動，這得益於人工智慧的持續採用和向先進節點的過渡，以及如前所述的中國更正常化的銷售的影響。

In Interconnect Solutions, we expect continued growth driven by improved sentiment within consumer electronics and refresh cycles in support of AI adoption.

在互連解決方案方面，我們預計，受消費電子產品信心改善和支援人工智慧採用的更新周期推動，該解決方案將持續成長。

For the new IndustrialsCo segment, we expect full year 2025 organic sales growth in the 3% to 4% range.

對於新的工業公司部門，我們預計 2025 年全年有機銷售額成長率將在 3% 至 4% 之間。

Within healthcare markets, we expect growth acceleration in medical devices, along with continued stabilization for medical packaging applications and in biopharma markets.

在醫療保健市場中，我們預計醫療設備將加速成長，同時醫療包裝應用和生物製藥市場將繼續保持穩定。

In Water, we expect a strong year for the business with continued volume growth year-over-year, and we expect stable demand within markets served by our remaining industrial-based product lines.

在水務方面，我們預計今年的業務表現強勁，銷售量將繼續同比增長，我們預計我們剩餘的工業產品線所服務的市場需求將保持穩定。

With that, we are pleased to take your questions and let me turn it back to the operator to open the Q&A.

我們很高興回答您的問題，然後我將問題轉回給接線員以開始問答環節。

Thank you.

謝謝。

We will now begin the question-and-answer session.

我們現在開始問答環節。

(Operator Instructions)

（操作員指令）

Scott Davis, Melius Research.

戴維斯 (Scott Davis)，Melius Research。

Hey, good morning, everybody.

嘿，大家早安。

Lori, Antonella and Chris.

洛瑞、安東內拉和克里斯。

You guys talked -- you referenced AI-related revenues a few times in the call.

你們在電話會議中多次提到與人工智慧相關的收入。

Is there any -- can you size that for us at all?

有沒有－您能為我們估算一下尺寸嗎？

And kind of give us a sense of what kind of growth rates you've seen there?

您可以向我們介紹一下您那裡的成長率嗎？

Yeah, Scott, we saw really nice growth this year, up about 30%, in the AI-related sales were up over $300 million now.

是的，史考特，今年我們看到了非常好的成長，成長了約 30%，人工智慧相關的銷售額現在已經成長了 3 億多美元。

And so we continue to expect that to be a key piece of the growth for the ElectronicsCo as we move to separate them towards the end of the year.

因此，當我們在今年年底將其拆分時，我們繼續預期這將成為 ElectronicsCo 成長的關鍵部分。

Okay.

好的。

That's helpful.

這很有幫助。

And then the incremental margins, 47% or so is what I was calculating is pretty strong.

然後增量利潤率，我計算出 47% 左右是相當強勁的。

But you've got a little bit of price perhaps headwind in front of you, how do you think about incremental in 2025 and the sustainability kind of puts and takes of costs coming back?

但是您面前可能有一些價格阻力，您如何看待 2025 年的增量以及成本回升的可持續性？

And I know there's going to be some noise in the transition here.

我知道這裡的過渡過程中會出現一些噪音。

But is there -- do you think there's an opportunity to keep those incremental above historic levels?

但是，您認為是否有機會讓這些增量保持高於歷史水平？

Or do you see some costs coming back and some price issues?

或者您看到一些成本回升以及出現一些價格問題？

Yeah.

是的。

In 2024, we saw incremental kind of in the low to mid-60s, and we have them, as you had mentioned, in the mid-40s in 2025.

到 2024 年，我們看到增量在 60 年代中期，而正如您所說，到 2025 年，增量將達到 40 年代中期。

So again, very strong.

再次強調，非常強大。

We had mentioned that we do have a 1% assumed price headwind in 2025 versus 2024.

我們曾提到，與 2024 年相比，2025 年確實面臨 1% 的假設價格逆風。

But net between that and inflation and absorption tailwinds, we see that about neutral on the bottom line.

但考慮到通膨和吸收順風因素，我們認為底線基本上為中性。

So we'll share a lot more about margin projections when we do Investor Day later in the fall, but we continue to expect to see really nice margins driven across both new DuPont and Electronics.

因此，我們將在秋季晚些時候舉行投資者日時分享更多有關利潤率預測的信息，但我們仍然期望看到新杜邦和電子業務的利潤率真正實現良好的增長。

Okay, congrats on the year.

好的，恭喜這一年。

Best of luck, guys.

祝大家好運。

We'll see you.

我們會見到你的。

John McNulty, BMO Capital Markets.

BMO資本市場部的約翰·麥克納爾蒂 (John McNulty) 說。

Yeah, thanks for taking my question.

是的，感謝您回答我的問題。

So maybe just a question on Water.

所以也許只是一個關於水的問題。

Obviously, there were some easy comps there, but it also it seems like it really continued even on a sequential basis.

顯然，那裡有一些簡單的比賽，但看起來它確實是連續地持續下去的。

Can you help us to think about some of the drivers that you're seeing there that are really pushing that growth and how we should be thinking about them as we go through 2025?

您能否幫助我們思考一下您看到的真正推動這種成長的一些驅動因素，以及我們在 2025 年應該如何看待它們？

Yeah.

是的。

We did see a really nice recovery.

我們確實看到了非常好的復甦。

So it was up about 11% year-over-year organic in the fourth quarter, and we see about mid- to high single-digit organic growth overall in 2025 for Water.

因此，第四季水務業務年增約 11%，我們預計 2025 年水務業務整體有機成長率將達到中高個位數。

So a lot of it really is just around the secular tailwinds in the Water space.

因此，很多事情其實只是圍繞著水領域的長期順風。

So the access to clean water, we see nice growth across all key technologies.

因此，在獲取清潔水方面，我們看到所有關鍵技術都取得了良好的成長。

We are the one player within the space that has all the four key technologies when it comes to filtration.

我們是該領域唯一擁有所有四項關鍵過濾技術的參與者。

And there's some incremental opportunities, not necessarily in '25, but longer term around both DLE, so direct lithium extraction, within the battery space and then also some PFAS opportunity as well.

還有一些漸進的機會，不一定是在2025年，而是長期圍繞DLE，即電池領域內的直接鋰提取，以及一些PFAS機會。

Got it.

知道了。

Okay.

好的。

Thanks for the color.

謝謝你的顏色。

And then with regard to Semis, there is -- it looks like there's a number of node transitions kind of especially rolling in, in the second half of '25.

然後就半導體而言，看起來有許多節點轉換，特別是在 25 年下半年。

Can you help us to think about what that means for the cadence of growth in the semi-tech platform for you as we look through 2025?

您能否幫助我們思考一下，展望 2025 年，這對半技術平台的成長節奏意味著什麼？

Yeah.

是的。

So we had mentioned for overall new ElectronicsCo, it will be about 6% to 7% organic growth.

因此，我們提到，對於整體新電子公司而言，其有機成長率將達到約 6% 至 7%。

That's about even between both sides of it.

雙方的比例大致相同。

So between Semi and ICS.

因此在 Semi 和 ICS 之間。

Q1, just given the favorable comp, will be the highest growth, we said low double digits, I believe, for the new Electronics and then so it will moderate as the year goes on.

鑑於良好的業績，第一季將是新電子產品成長最快的季度，我們預計成長率將達到兩位數以下，但隨著時間的推移，成長率將會放緩。

But again, really nice overall 6% to 7% on top of a really strong year in 2024.

但是，在 2024 年非常強勁的基礎上，整體成長率達到 6% 至 7%，這確實是一個不錯的成績。

Great.

偉大的。

Thanks very much for the color.

非常感謝這個顏色。

Steve Tusa, JPMorgan.

摩根大通的史蒂夫·圖薩。

Did you see any kind of pull forward in demand with regards to any concerns around tariffs or new administration in the fourth quarter?

您是否看到第四季因對關稅或新政府的擔憂而出現需求上行的情況？

Hey, Steve, it's Antonella.

嘿，史蒂夫，我是安東內拉。

We've talked about in the last couple of quarters that we saw, I would call it more of prebuy in the semi space related to a lot of the new fabs that have started up during the course of the year.

我們在過去幾季中討論過，我將其稱為半導體領域的預購，與今年期間啟動的許多新晶圓廠有關。

So you heard us talk about that in Q2 and Q3.

所以您聽到我們在第二季和第三季談論過這個問題。

We would estimate that in Q4, it was probably around $20 million or so.

我們估計第四季的這一數字大概在 2,000 萬美元左右。

I would say we would attribute it more to the new fab start-ups versus tariffs per se, but there could have been a little bit of it related to the tariffs coming in 2025 as well.

我想說，我們認為這更多是歸因於新晶圓廠的啟動，而不是關稅本身，但其中可能也有一點與 2025 年的關稅有關。

Okay.

好的。

And then I think there was a modest gain in the Electronics segment.

然後我認為電子領域取得了適度的成長。

I'm not sure if you flesh that out.

我不確定你是否充分理解這一點。

How big was that?

那有多大？

Yeah.

是的。

So we commented on that in our prepared remarks.

因此我們在準備好的評論中對此進行了評論。

It was $13 million, and it was included in the guidance when we provided it on the third quarter call.

它是 1300 萬美元，它包含在我們在第三季電話會議上提供的指導中。

Oh, okay, got it.

哦，好的，明白了。

All right, thanks a lot.

好的，非常感謝。

Jeff Sprague, Vertical Research.

傑夫‧斯普拉格 (Jeff Sprague)，垂直研究公司。

Hey, thanks.

嘿，謝謝。

Good morning everyone.

大家早安。

Sorry if I missed just at the beginning, I was also about 10 minutes late getting on.

很抱歉我剛開始就錯過了，我上車也晚了大約 10 分鐘。

Just on the spin and the timing now, I feel that's a pretty hard lock on November 1.

僅從現在的旋轉和時間來看，我覺得 11 月 1 日的比賽很難鎖定。

And maybe any update on just kind of the cost to separate and the kind of stand up stand-alone costs associated with Electronics?

也許有任何關於分離成本以及與電子產品相關的獨立成本的更新資訊嗎？

Again, I apologize if you addressed that.

如果您提到了這一點，我再次表示歉意。

Hey Jeff, it's Antonella.

嘿傑夫，我是安東內拉。

So yes, timing is pretty locked in.

是的，時間已經相當確定了。

I would say the team has clearly done a lot of work to accelerate timeline.

我想說的是，團隊顯然已經做了很多工作來加快時間表。

We've had a lot of good practice in the organization in doing this.

我們組織內已經有很多這方面的良好實踐。

So we have a really good plan in place and things are progressing as expected.

因此，我們制定了非常好的計劃，並且事情正在按預期進展。

In terms of a couple of updates.

就一些更新而言。

So our separation costs we had said would be around $700 million.

因此，我們說過，分離成本約為 7 億美元。

We do expect that to be a little less than that as we move forward now given that Water will remain in the DuPont portfolio.

鑑於水務業務仍保留在杜邦投資組合中，我們確實預計，隨著我們繼續推進，這一數字將略低於這一水平。

But I would just be mindful that a lot of things that kind of went into that is will still continue to happen, whether it was one separation or two separations.

但我只是要記住，很多類似的事情仍將繼續發生，無論是一次分離還是兩次分離。

In terms of dis-synergies, we initially quoted that as around $60 million.

就負協同效應而言，我們最初的報價約為 6,000 萬美元。

Now we would expect that, that would be closer to $40 million.

現在我們預計這個數字將接近 4,000 萬美元。

Great.

偉大的。

Then when that -- would that also encompass sort of the stranded cost?

那麼當那——那是否也包括某種擱淺成本？

That $40 million, is that sort of the public company cost for new ElectronicsCo separate and apart from sort of stranded that you'd need to get after?

那 4000 萬美元，是新 ElectronicsCo 的上市公司成本，不包括您需要獲得的擱淺資金嗎？

Could you just kind of put a finer point on that?

您能否更詳細地闡述一下這一點？

Sure.

當然。

So when you kind of take a look at our dis-synergies, it is predominantly standing up two public companies.

因此，當你看一下我們的不協同效應時，它主要是建立兩家上市公司。

So when you kind of compare where our corporate costs are today versus where we expect corporate costs to be in the future, that is a big bulk of it.

因此，當你比較我們現在的公司成本與我們預期的未來公司成本時，你會發現這佔了很大一部分。

There's a little bit of it that is in the businesses.

其中有一點是存在於企業中。

As we've said before, it does not include per se, stranded costs, but I would tell you that at this point, based upon all the work that we've been doing in terms of getting two organizations ready for day one and kind of having a cost structure that's fit for purpose in terms of their size.

正如我們之前所說，它本身並不包括擱淺成本，但我要告訴你，在這一點上，基於我們為讓兩個組織為第一天做好準備以及擁有適合其規模的成本結構所做的所有工作。

We do not expect that to be very material.

我們並不認為這會是一件很重要的事。

Great.

偉大的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

No problem.

沒問題。

Chris Parkinson, Wolf Research.

克里斯·帕金森（Chris Parkinson），沃爾夫研究公司。

Great, thank you so much.

太好了，非常感謝。

Just going back to the water protection, you hit on this towards the end of your prepared remarks, but could you just give us a little bit more perspective on how you see things shaping up across Safety, Shelter and Water throughout '25 as well as just kind of the key considerations that we should be looking at in terms of potential market outperformance?

回到水保護問題，您在準備好的發言即將結束時提到了這一點，但您能否給我們提供更多有關您如何看待 25 年期間安全、住所和水領域形勢的看法，以及在潛在的市場優異表現方面我們應該關注的關鍵因素？

Thank you so much.

太感謝了。

Yeah.

是的。

So I'll answer your question in the new form, given that's how we're going to we're going to report in 2025.

因此，我將以新的形式回答您的問題，因為這就是我們在 2025 年的報告方式。

So for the three pieces within the new DuPont.

新的杜邦內有三個部分。

The Water and Healthcare will be about 40% of the portfolio, and we expect them to have nice mid- to high single-digit growth organically in 2025.

水務和醫療保健將佔投資組合的 40% 左右，我們預計它們在 2025 年將實現良好的中高個位數有機成長。

So a continued improvement coming off at the bottom through that we saw throughout 2024.

因此，我們將在 2024 年看到底部持續改善。

So we had noted medical packaging got better every quarter, and we exited a really nice position from 2024, the same with Water.

因此，我們注意到醫療包裝每個季度都在進步，從 2024 年開始我們將處於一個非常好的位置，水包裝也是如此。

So Water improved kind of every quarter, and we exited in a nice position, and we see the destocking that we had telegraphed early in 2024, essentially complete.

因此，水資源每個季度都在改善，我們以良好的狀態退出，我們看到我們在 2024 年初預測的去庫存化基本上完成。

Then the remaining portion of the portfolio probably will be around the low single-digit growth.

那麼投資組合的剩餘部分可能將保持低個位數成長。

So that would encompass the (inaudible) business, the shelter business, and then the businesses that we picked up from the Industrial Solutions business within electronics.

因此這將涵蓋（聽不清楚）業務、庇護所業務以及我們從電子領域的工業解決方案業務中獲得的業務。

So overall, nice 3% to 4% organic, definitely outsized within the healthcare and the Water portion.

因此總體而言，有機含量為 3% 至 4%，這在醫療保健和水資源部分中絕對佔有很大比例。

Got it.

知道了。

And just as a quick follow-up, just on the Interconnect side.

作為一個快速的後續問題，僅關於互連方面。

You mentioned, obviously, some AI-driven tech benefits.

您顯然提到了一些由人工智慧驅動的技術優勢。

But could you sit on kind of the key drivers of the remainder of the portfolio?

但您能否了解剩餘投資組合的關鍵驅動因素？

And just any differences based on geography as well?

那麼基於地理位置的差異是否存在呢？

Thank you so much.

太感謝了。

Yeah.

是的。

Within Electronics, within the Interconnect business, we had mentioned the AI around the packaging space.

在電子領域、在互連業務中，我們提到了圍繞封裝領域的人工智慧。

There's also a lot of upside that we signed 2024 and continue to expect to 2025 on the layer.

我們簽署了 2024 年的協議，並繼續預計 2025 年的協議，這還有很多上升空間。

So this was the business that we had acquired back in 2021.

這就是我們在 2021 年收購的業務。

It's a lot around thermal management.

它與熱管理有很大關係。

So we're looking as the chips get smaller and (inaudible) for us to be able to drive a lot of outperformance on the layer side.

因此，我們希望隨著晶片變得越來越小，並且（聽不清楚），我們能夠在層面上實現更高的性能。

So that was key to the growth before, and we expect it to be strong again this year.

所以這是之前成長的關鍵，我們預計今年的成長將再次強勁。

Great color.

顏色很棒。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Josh Spector, UBS Financial.

瑞銀金融的喬希‧斯佩克特 (Josh Spector)

Yeah, hi, good morning.

是的，你好，早安。

I wanted to ask on IndustrialsCo guidance, but specifically on first quarter versus the year.

我想詢問有關工業公司指引的情況，特別是第一季與全年的情況。

So in your first quarter, it seems like you're guiding for low single-digit growth.

因此，在第一季度，您似乎預計會實現低個位數成長。

You just did mid-single-digit growth in fourth quarter and you have a pretty easy comp in first quarter.

你們在第四季度實現了中等個位數的成長，並且在第一季也取得了相當不錯的成績。

So what am I missing about why that growth shouldn't be higher in the first quarter as it relates to the year?

那麼，為什麼第一季的成長率不應該高於全年水準？

Yeah.

是的。

So the largest piece is within the automotive portion of new DuPont.

因此，最大的一塊生意是新杜邦的汽車業務。

So overall, last year was still robust for them in Q1 from both the automotive side of the adhesive piece as well as within (inaudible) within the business.

因此總體而言，去年第一季對他們來說仍然是強勁的，無論是從汽車黏合劑還是從業務內部（聽不清楚）方面。

So one of it is a comp a little bit less of a favorable comp than maybe what you would have expected.

因此，其中之一就是，與你所預期的相比，其競爭力略差一些。

Also, if you look at the build, you're going to go year-over-year, you're comparing and you're going to go sequentially, but the (inaudible) in Q1 2025 are expected to be down more year-over-year than what they were in Q4 of 2024.

此外，如果您看一下建置情況，您將進行逐年比較，並且將按順序進行，但 2025 年第一季的（聽不清楚）預計將年比下降幅度大於 2024 年第四季的水平。

So that would meet the expectations.

這樣就符合預期了。

Otherwise, everything else is generally the same between the two quarters.

除此之外，兩季的其他情況基本上相同。

Okay.

好的。

And if I could just follow up on cash deployment.

我是否可以跟進現金部署情況。

You guys haven't bought back stock in about three quarters now.

你們已經有大約三個季度沒有回購股票了。

Your leverage is low, understanding you're going through everything with the splits.

您的槓桿率很低，了解您正在經歷分割的一切。

But seems to be an opportunity for you to deploy some cash into buybacks.

但這似乎是一個利用部分現金進行回購的機會。

So why isn't that something that we're doing now?

那為什麼我們現在不這麼做呢？

Yeah.

是的。

So as we mentioned in some prior calls, we do not plan on doing any more share buyback until (inaudible) to separation.

因此，正如我們在之前的一些電話會議中提到的那樣，我們不打算進行任何股票回購，直到（聽不清楚）分開為止。

I would just be mindful, obviously, there are a lot of cash costs related to the separation.

我只是要記住，顯然分離會產生很多現金成本。

So that's where our cash will be deployed in the near term.

這就是我們近期現金的部署方向。

Okay, thank you.

好的，謝謝。

Patrick Cunningham, Citi.

花旗銀行的派崔克‧坎寧安 (Patrick Cunningham)。

Hi, good morning.

嗨，早安。

The pro forma-seemed to imply the EBITDA margin profile that corporate retained business is maybe high teens, low 20s.

該預測似乎表明，企業留存業務的 EBITDA 利潤率可能處於 10% 左右或 20% 左右。

I mean, would you characterize these as normal levels?

我的意思是，您會將這些描述為正常水平嗎？

And does it change maybe what the long-term margin target would be for the IndustrialsCo versus W&P?

這是否會改變 IndustrialsCo 相對於 W&P 的長期利潤目標？

Yeah.

是的。

So you're right.

所以你是對的。

So the businesses that are coming into the new DuPont.

這就是進入新杜邦公司的業務。

So the businesses that were incorporated (inaudible) &M and then the businesses that were in the Industrial portion E&I and a lower overall margin profile than the heritage businesses.

因此，合併後的業務（聽不清楚）和合併後的業務，以及工業部分 E&I 的業務，其整體利潤率低於傳統業務。

And so from the corporate (inaudible) businesses that came in, you called it right, they were kind of in the high teens, maybe low 20s.

因此，從進來的企業（聽不清楚）業務來看，您說得對，它們的數量大概在 10 多歲，甚至 20 多歲。

I would say that, that benchmark level, if you look to the other existing players, but we are thinking about and then the businesses that we picked up from the Industrial business, a lot of that would be the Spectrum piece that came in through acquisition and then we had done that acquisition, we said the margins

我想說的是，如果你看看其他現有的參與者，那麼這個基準水平就是如此，但我們正在考慮，然後我們從工業業務中收購的業務，其中很多是通過收購而獲得的 Spectrum 部分，然後我們完成了收購，我們說利潤率

(inaudible)

（聽不清楚）

So we're right sitting at 23%, 24% in 2024 for IndustrialsCo.

因此，我們預計工業公司 2024 年的成長率將達到 23% 至 24%。

We'll look to continue to drive productivity and mix enrichment.

我們將繼續努力提高生產力並豐富產品組合。

And as mentioned earlier in the call, we'll get into more of the margin for (inaudible) would expect for each of the two new companies at their Investor Day

正如之前在電話會議中提到的那樣，我們將在投資者日上進一步討論這兩家新公司的利潤率（聽不清楚）。

(inaudible).

（聽不清楚）。

Great.

偉大的。

And apologies if I missed this, but is there any update on Kalrez?

如果我錯過了這個，請原諒，但是有沒有關於 Kalrez 的最新消息？

How is that business performing?

該公司的業務表現如何？

We had a few quarters of sharp destocking, should we expect some rebound there in 2025, helping underpin some of the strong growth rates in the Electronics business?

我們經歷了幾個季度的大幅去庫存，我們是否應該預期 2025 年會出現一些反彈，從而幫助支撐電子業務的強勁成長率？

Yeah.

是的。

I would say midyear 2025 is the one business that we have in the portfolio that hasn't quite gotten through in destock yet.

我想說，2025 年中期是我們投資組合中唯一尚未完全完成去庫存的業務。

So we're targeting midyear 2025 for that to get back to a more normal growth level.

因此，我們的目標是到 2025 年中期恢復到更正常的成長水準。

Thank you so much.

太感謝了。

Aleksey Yefremov, KeyBanc Capital Markets.

KeyBanc 資本市場公司的 Aleksey Yefremov。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Good morning, everyone.

大家早安。

How are you thinking about Industrial's portfolio now that you decided to keep the Water business?

既然您決定保留水務業務，那麼您如何考慮工業業務的投資組合？

Any further divestments or do you see any interesting bolt-ons here?

還有什麼進一步的撤資行動嗎，或者您是否看到這裡有任何有趣的附加措施？

Yeah.

是的。

I would say it's both.

我想說兩者兼具。

I mean, as we continue to look at the [remainco] portfolio and (inaudible) can take (inaudible), to high-growth secular end markets, you'll continue to see portfolio activity on the new DuPont side.

我的意思是，隨著我們繼續關注 [remainco] 投資組合並且（聽不清楚）可以採取（聽不清楚）進入高成長的長期終端市場，您將繼續看到新杜邦方面的投資組合活動。

And then we'll look to invest in M&A primarily around the health care and the Water business as we look to outsize our exposure there.

然後，我們將主要在醫療保健和水務業務領域進行併購投資，以擴大我們在該領域的投資。

So we'll come out at about 40% of sales in the health care and Water and look to (inaudible) for both M&A and also growth as we move forward.

因此，我們的醫療保健和水務業務的銷售額將占到 40% 左右，隨著我們的發展，我們期待（聽不清楚）實現併購和成長。

Great.

偉大的。

And then a follow-up on Electronics.

然後繼續關注電子產品。

Do you have an assumption for underlying market growth in Semis and Interconnect or for her to add growth for each of these segments in '25?

您是否對半導體和互連市場的潛在成長有一個假設，或者她是否會在'25年為每個細分市場增加成長？

Yeah.

是的。

So in 2025, we see MSI of around mid-single digits.

因此，到 2025 年，我們將看到 MSI 達到約中等個位數。

And again, we have talked through 2024 with a little bit disconnected with respect to wafer starts and wafer consumption because of the inventory levels that were consumed on the ship side.

我們再次談到了 2024 年，由於船舶方面消耗的庫存水平，晶圓開工和晶圓消耗方面存在一些脫節。

So we see our view of MSI at around 6% growth.

因此我們認為 MSI 的成長率約為 6%。

We see overall fab utilization in the high 70s in 2025.

我們預計到 2025 年晶圓廠整體利用率將達到 70% 以上。

And then on the ICS side, kind of the combination of PCB and smartphones, we see in the mid-single-digit range.

然後在 ICS 方面，我們看到 PCB 和智慧型手機的結合處於中個位數範圍內。

Thanks a lot.

多謝。

John Roberts, Mizuho.

瑞穗的約翰羅伯茲。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Congrats on a good quarter.

恭喜本季取得良好業績。

Are you planning to change the name of IndustrialCo?

您是否計劃更改 IndustrialCo 的名稱？

And any progress on industry reclassification?

產業重新分類有什麼進展嗎？

Yeah.

是的。

So I'll do the

所以我會做

(inaudible).

（聽不清楚）。

So IndustrialCo will be DuPont, and I'll turn it over to Antonella Franzen on the reclassification.

因此，IndustrialCo 將是杜邦公司，我將把重新分類的工作交給安東內拉·弗蘭岑。

Yeah.

是的。

So we're doing some work around the reclassification as we talked about before with clearly the intent of getting that move from the chemical classification to an industrial classification.

因此，正如我們之前談到的，我們正在圍繞重新分類做一些工作，明確目的是從化學分類轉變為工業分類。

The change would not necessarily be made (inaudible) the separation is complete, but we are working on that, and that is clearly our intent as to where we should be and where we need to be.

改變不一定會實現（聽不清楚），分離已經完成，但我們正在為此努力，這顯然是我們的意圖，即我們應該在哪裡以及我們需要在哪裡。

And then secondly, are you planning on keeping Water separate within IndustrialsCo that would preserve the option for a spin later on if that's what you wanted to do?

其次，您是否計劃將 Water 業務獨立於 IndustrialsCo 內部，以便為以後的旋轉保留選擇權（如果您願意的話）？

So Water will be reported as a segment than new DuPont I think that's probably the question that you're asking.

因此，水將被報告為新杜邦的部分，我想這可能是您要問的問題。

So Water would be a segment, (inaudible) we'll want to highlight water and health care (inaudible) growth profile.

因此，水將是一個部分，（聽不清楚）我們要強調水和醫療保健（聽不清楚）的成長概況。

So those would be segments within an important here.

因此，這些都是這裡的重要部分。

Michael Leithead, Barclays.

巴克萊銀行的麥可‧萊特黑德 (Michael Leithead)。

Great, thank you.

太好了，謝謝。

Good morning to you.

早安.

For the Electronics still, are we 100% headed for a spin here in November?

就電子產品而言，我們是否 100% 會在 11 月開始銷售？

Or is there any chance of merger or selling these assets before them?

或者有沒有可能在他們之前合併或出售這些資產？

Yeah, we're headed towards the spin.

是的，我們正走向旋轉。

Okay.

好的。

And then I apologize if I missed that--

如果我錯過了，我深感抱歉——

We will announce management teams before the end of this quarter, and we're already set with full word slate for Electronics, which we'll also be announcing before the end of the quarter.

我們將在本季結束前宣布管理團隊，並且我們已經準備好電子部門的完整名單，我們也將在本季結束前宣布。

Great, thank you, Ed. And then I apologize if I missed this, but did you announce your new Chief Commercial Officer will be and will they stay with Industrial still, I presume?

太好了，謝謝你，艾德。如果我錯過了這一點，我很抱歉，但是你是否宣布了新任首席商務官的任命？

He will stay with IndustrialsCo.

他將繼續留在工業公司。

His name is (inaudible) joining us from SKF next week.

他的名字是（聽不清楚）下週將從 SKF 加入我們。

Great.

偉大的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

David Begleiter, Deutsche Bank.

德意志銀行的 David Begleiter。

Lori, in Semi, you referenced flat sales in China in '25.

Lori，在《半年度報告》中，你提到 25 年中國汽車銷售量持平。

Can you give a little more color as to why that's happening?

您能否進一步解釋一下發生這種情況的原因？

And just how big is China for the entire semi-tech business?

那麼，對於整個半導體技術產業來說，中國到底有多大呢？

Thank you.

謝謝。

Yeah.

是的。

So it's more around the normalization of the volume growth versus demand.

因此，這更多的是關於產量成長與需求的正常化。

So in 2024 in China for Semi, we saw a 40% volume growth.

因此，到 2024 年，我們將看到中國半導體市場的銷售量成長 40%。

So -- and I mentioned that probably overall, we saw about $6 million for pre-buy activity.

所以 — — 我提到，總體而言，我們看到預購活動的資金約為 600 萬美元。

So normalizing that against 2025 a flat volume within China for semi.

因此，與 2025 年相比，中國半導體產量將保持穩定。

Overall, Semi-China is about a $600 million market, about two-third of it is local Chinese spending producers and the rest are the multinationals and producers in China.

整體而言，中國半導體市場規模約 6 億美元，其中約三分之二是中國本土消費生產商，其餘為跨國公司和中國生產商。

And how much of your basis is semi-tech is China?

你們的半技術基礎有多少是來自中國的？

That's the $600 million.

這就是 6 億美元。

So about 30% -- ish.

大概是30%左右。

Got it.

知道了。

And just on North American construction, any signs of progress in either resi or commercial?

就北美建築而言，住宅或商業建築有任何進展跡象嗎？

Thank you.

謝謝。

If you would actually -- if we look at our shelter business, what I would say is, we've actually fared pretty well again in the environment that we're in.

如果你真的——如果我們看看我們的庇護所業務，我想說的是，在我們所處的環境中，我們實際上又表現得相當不錯。

So as we talked about in the fourth quarter, we did see a little bit of softness on both the resi and non-resi side being offset by some growth in repair and remodel.

因此，正如我們在第四季度所討論的那樣，我們確實看到住宅和非住宅方面的一些疲軟被維修和改造的一些增長所抵消。

And kind of as we go forward, we are currently anticipating, I would say, low single-digit growth in that business for 2025.

隨著我們不斷前進，我們目前預計到 2025 年該業務將實現低個位數成長。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Vincent Andrews, Morgan Stanley.

摩根士丹利的文森安德魯斯。

I wanted to follow up on the divestitures discussion.

我想跟進有關資產剝離的討論。

And I'm just wondering with Water now staying within IndustrialsCo, is there a window between now and spin where you can get some assets out of the business without having to assign pro-rata piece of liabilities to them?

我只是想知道，既然 Water 現在還留在 IndustrialsCo 內，那麼從現在到分拆之間是否有一個窗口期，你可以從業務中剝離一些資產，而不必向它們分配按比例承擔的債務？

And if you don't get that done before November 1, do they presumably would have to have liabilities assigned thereafter is November 1, really the hard date on that?

如果您在 11 月 1 日之前沒有完成這項工作，那麼他們是否必須在 11 月 1 日之後分配債務，這真的是硬性日期嗎？

Yeah.

是的。

So technically, you could do a divestiture between now and November 1 and stay above the $2.5 billion threshold and then therefore, that's on to assigned

因此從技術上講，你可以在現在到 11 月 1 日之間進行資產剝離，並保持在 25 億美元的門檻之上，然後就可以分配

(inaudible).

（聽不清楚）。

We're obviously fully focused on getting the Electronic separation out November 1.

顯然，我們全心全意致力於在 11 月 1 日實現電子分離。

And at that point, we'll comply with the size of (inaudible) and pro rata distribute the side letter agreement with (inaudible) between new Electronics and DuPont.

此時，我們將遵守（聽不清楚）的規模，並按比例分配新電子公司和杜邦公司之間的（聽不清楚）附加協議。

Okay.

好的。

And then just on free cash flow for 2025.

然後只討論 2025 年的自由現金流。

Obviously, you're going to have spin costs and other things that are going to be sort of clouding the underlying performance.

顯然，你會面臨旋轉成本和其他因素，這些因素將會對基礎績效產生一定的影響。

So could you give us a sense of how had excellent conversion this year?

那麼您能告訴我們今年的轉換率有多高嗎？

What you think 2025 might look like?

您認為 2025 年會是什麼樣子？

And so as we look to 2025 in our free cash flow conversion, we would expect it to be greater than 90%, which is kind of (inaudible) the number that we've been focusing on.

因此，當我們展望 2025 年的自由現金流轉換率時，我們預計它將超過 90%，這也是我們一直在關注的數字。

We've had really good conversion this year we were at 105%.

今年我們的轉換率非常好，達到了 105%。

We did have a nice benefit of a lot of the practices were moving in place related to working capital that helped us this year.

我們確實從中獲益良多，因為今年與營運資金相關的許多做法都已到位，對我們幫助很大。

And as we go into next year and then the growth that we're kind of expecting both the ElectronicsCo side and the IndustrialsCo side, we will have some working capital usage.

隨著我們進入明年，我們預計電子公司和工業公司都會成長，我們將使用一些營運資金。

But again, we feel good that we'll be above the 90% conversion, excluding clearly all the transaction costs, which is how we've been reporting our free cash flow over the last couple of quarters.

但是，我們再次感到高興，我們的轉換率將超過 90%，顯然排除了所有的交易成本，這也是我們過去幾季報告自由現金流的方式。

Perfect.

完美的。

Thanks very much.

非常感謝。

Mike Sison, Wells Fargo.

富國銀行的麥克·西森。

Hey, good morning.

嘿，早安。

Nice quarter.

不錯的季度。

So organic growth in IndustrialsCo in the fourth quarter as well as your outlook in the first quarter, appears pretty differentiated relative to traditional chemical companies where growth seems to be pretty negative.

因此，工業公司第四季的有機成長以及第一季的展望，與傳統化學公司相比似乎有很大差異，而傳統化學公司的成長似乎相當負面。

So I expect that helps our cause in getting that designation change.

因此我希望這有助於我們實現這一指定的改變。

But maybe can you remind us of what other metrics margins, returns on capital or sort of just make the case why this should be more of a multi-industrial business than a chemical business?

但也許您能否提醒我們其他指標，例如利潤率、資本回報率，或者只是說明為什麼這應該是多元化企業而不是化學企業？

Yeah.

是的。

No.

不。

I mean, obviously, our growth will be expected 2025 and then even the margin profile is significantly different than what you could see on the chemical side and even just the volatility, like we don't have the swings in pricing that you may see with respect to utilization levels in the commodity chemical side as well.

我的意思是，顯然，我們的成長預計在 2025 年，屆時利潤率狀況將與化學品方面的情況有顯著不同，甚至只是波動性，例如，我們沒有像商品化學品方面的利用率水平那樣出現價格波動。

So any support that we can get in our endeavor is from both would be really helpful because we do believe it's fundamental to how we are (inaudible) the new company.

因此，我們在努力過程中所能獲得的任何來自雙方的支持都將非常有幫助，因為我們確實相信這對我們（聽不清楚）新公司至關重要。

We'll target similar leverage profile to the other non-industrial, we'll have very strong margin profile similar to the multi industrials and a very similar growth trajectory.

我們將目標鎖定在其他非工業領域的槓桿率水準上，我們將擁有與多種工業領域非常相似的強勁利潤率水準和非常相似的成長軌跡。

And by the way, big piece we divested, which was the (inaudible) really the last vestige of a chemical business within the portfolio.

順便說一下，我們剝離了很大一部分業務，這實際上是投資組合中化學業務的最後痕跡。

So we avidly work part for (inaudible) it's seven years now to get to more of a multi-industrial company and now in the chemical space.

因此，我們熱切地工作（聽不清楚），七年來，我們已成為一家多元化工業公司，目前涉足化學領域。

So hopefully, good luck with changing the code.

所以希望您能夠順利完成程式碼修改。

Sounds good.

聽起來不錯。

And then just a quick follow-up.

然後只是快速的跟進。

I think in the past, you talked about advanced nodes as a percent of Electronics, which I assume includes AI-related sales.

我想過去您談論過高級節點佔電子產品的百分比，我認為這包括與人工智慧相關的銷售。

Can you remind us how big, I guess, advanced nodes are now for semi-tech and Interconnect and then maybe what the growth rate for that subset will be in '25?

您能否提醒我們一下，目前半技術和互連的高階節點有多大，以及 25 年該子集的成長率可能是多少？

Yeah.

是的。

So (inaudible) is about 40% of the semi portfolio.

所以（聽不清楚）約佔半導體投資組合的 40%。

Their growth obviously would be higher than the average six to seven that we had mentioned earlier in the call, we have said that for the AI specific exposures, we saw 30% growth within the Semi business.

它們的成長顯然會高於我們早些時候在電話會議中提到的平均六到七年的成長，我們已經說過，對於人工智慧的特定風險，我們看到半導體業務成長了 30%。

So you would expect a nice outperformance in the advances versus the more

因此，你會期待進步的表現優於更多

(inaudible).

（聽不清楚）。

Okay.

好的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Frank Mitsch, Fermium Research.

米奇 (Frank Mitsch)，鋤研究機構。

Good morning.

早安.

And let me echo the congrats on the quarter.

請允許我再次對本季表示祝賀。

You basically hit the trifecta in terms of exceeding guidance on sales, EBITDA and EPS from what you provided in the early part of November.

從銷售額、EBITDA 和 EPS 超出您在 11 月初提供的數據來看，您基本上實現了三連勝。

So I'm curious as to what went right or what exceeded your expectations in November and December?

所以我很好奇 11 月和 12 月哪些事情進展順利或哪些事情超出了您的預期？

Yeah.

是的。

So I'll take that again.

因此我將再次接受這項請求。

So when you look at the Electronics space, I would say that's the one that really drove the beat.

因此，當你看看電子領域時，我會說這是真正推動發展的關鍵。

We did continue to have strong demand, as we talked about a little bit earlier.

正如我們之前談到的，我們確實繼續有強勁的需求。

We did have some prebuy in there as well.

我們確實也有一些預購。

I think the other important thing to mention, when you kind of take a look at Q4 is not only did we exceed our expectations as we set them but we also, I would say, covered incremental pressure of changes in foreign currency exchange rates during the quarter as well.

我認為另一件重要的事情是，當你看一下第四季度時，我們不僅超出了我們設定的預期，而且我想說，我們還在本季度涵蓋了外匯匯率變化的增量壓力。

But other areas, so Electronics (inaudible) stand out.

但其他領域，例如電子領域（聽不清楚）卻脫穎而出。

But as we talked about, the Water business was even a little bit better than we expected on a sequential basis for the time that medical packaging business looks like better than we expected.

但正如我們所討論的，水業務比我們預期的要好一點，而醫療包裝業務的表現也比我們預期的要好。

Biopharma was actually even a little bit better as well.

生物製藥行業實際上也表現得更好一些。

The only area that I would say we kind of expected is that Water would be softer and it was, shelter was pretty much in line.

我想說我們唯一期望的是水會更柔和，而且庇護所基本上符合要求。

So from an operations perspective, that's how I would characterize it.

所以從營運的角度來看，這就是我對它的描述。

Now when you take a look at total EPS the other factor that we clearly had that drove the (inaudible) was the tax rate in Q4 was a bit lower than we had anticipated.

現在，當您查看總每股盈餘時，我們顯然發現推動（聽不清楚）的另一個因素是第四季度的稅率略低於我們的預期。

So that's in the number as well relative to the fourth quarter.

因此，相對於第四季而言，這個數字也是相當高的。

And we did talk about as we go into 2025, we do expect the tax rate to probably be about a point or so higher than where we kind of landed this year.

我們確實談到，進入 2025 年，我們預計稅率可能會比今年的水平高出約一個點左右。

Understood.

明白了。

And as we sit here today in the early part of February, the segments that you thought were doing better, i.e., Water Packaging, et cetera, that has that continued at that pace, so the follow-through that you're seeing here in the early part of 2025?

今天是 2 月初，您認為表現較好的那些領域，例如水包裝等，一直保持著這樣的速度，那麼您認為 2025 年初的後續情況如何？

Yeah, it is playing out as we expected.

是的，一切正如我們預期的那樣。

All right.

好的。

Thank so much.

非常感謝。

Arun Viswanathan, RBC Capital Markets.

加拿大皇家銀行資本市場 (RBC Capital Markets) 的阿倫·維斯瓦納坦 (Arun Viswanathan)。

Good morning.

早安.

This is Adam on for Arun.

這是亞當 (Adam) 代替阿倫 (Arun)。

And congratulations on the great quarter.

恭喜您本季取得如此出色的成績。

I'd like to double click on the cash a little bit.

我想雙擊一下現金。

I know you've said most of the cash deployment for the year is going to be related to transaction costs.

我知道您說過，今年的大部分現金部署都將與交易成本有關。

Could you give us a sense on maybe the cadence of some of those costs?

您能否向我們介紹其中一些成本的節奏？

Are any of those going to linger into the fourth quarter or first quarter of next year?

這些影響會持續到明年第四季或第一季嗎？

Are those mostly going to be advanced?

這些大多都會進步嗎？

Just thinking about, when we could start thinking about resuming maybe cash equipment to other avenues?

只是在想，什麼時候我們才能開始考慮將現金設備恢復到其他管道？

Yeah.

是的。

So what we talked about our transactions are around $700 million.

我們談論的交易金額約為 7 億美元。

We expect it to be slightly less now that we are retaining the Water business within the portfolio.

由於我們保留了投資組合內的水務業務，因此我們預計該數字會略有減少。

I would be mindful that from a cash perspective, as you can see in the schedules attached to our press release that cash out this year related to transaction costs was only $64 million.

我要指出的是，從現金角度來看，正如您在我們新聞稿所附時間表中所看到的，今年與交易成本相關的現金支出僅為 6,400 萬美元。

So a bulk of it is all sitting in 2025.

因此，大部分目標都集中在 2025 年。

I would also be mindful there could be some costs related to debt as well.

我還注意到可能還存在一些與債務相關的成本。

That's in addition to those transaction costs, which is why the focus in 2025 is all around getting the separation done and kind of putting a majority of all those costs behind us.

這是除了交易成本之外的成本，這就是為什麼 2025 年的重點是完成分離並將大部分成本拋在腦後。

I mean, they're a little bit of trickling that goes into the following year, but a majority of it will be 2025.

我的意思是，其中有一點點會流到第二年，但大部分會流到 2025 年。

Great.

偉大的。

Thanks.

謝謝。

And maybe if we could quickly touch back.

也許我們可以快速回覆。

You mentioned health care and Water assets potentially as targets for M&A going forward.

您提到醫療保健和水資源資產可能是未來併購的目標。

Any additional color you could give there may be on types of assets or parameters you do

您可以提供的任何額外顏色可能與您所做資產的類型或參數有關

[such?].

[這樣的？

Thanks.

謝謝。

Yeah.

是的。

So we have an active pipeline in [those] we'll continue to look and see where we can pick up assets that would add to our portfolio.

因此，我們在這些方面都有積極的投入，我們會繼續尋找並看看在哪裡可以找到可以豐富我們投資組合的資產。

Within the Water space, we would even broaden the aperture beyond just filtration and go into some of the other areas in order to be able to bulk up our exposure there.

在水空間內，我們甚至會擴大範圍，不僅僅是過濾，還進入其他一些領域，以便能夠增加我們在那裡的曝光率。

And within healthcare, you would expect a similar dynamic to what we've done with our last few acquisitions around Spectrum and Donatelle in the med-device space.

在醫療保健領域，您可以期待與我們最近在醫療設備領域對 Spectrum 和 Donatelle 進行的幾次收購類似的動態。

So bringing our capability there and adding new capabilities to the toolkit.

因此將我們的能力帶到那裡並為工具包添加新的能力。

Laurence Alexander, Jefferies.

勞倫斯·亞歷山大（Laurence Alexander），傑富瑞（Jefferies）。

So good morning.

早安.

Just wanted to follow up on the comments around the construction outlook.

只是想跟進建築前景的評論。

What specifically are you assuming for remodelling activity?

您對重塑活動具體有何設想？

And also, what's your assumption around FX?

另外，您對 FX 有何假設？

So for remodelling within Shelter, our expectation as we go into 2025 and what's built into our guidance is that, that would be relatively flat on a year-over-year basis.

因此，對於 Shelter 內部的改造，我們預計到 2025 年，改造規模將與去年同期相比相對持平。

Did you say FX, Laurence, for your last question?

勞倫斯，你最後一個問題提到了 FX 嗎？

Yeah, just currency effects.

是的，只是貨幣效應。

Yeah.

是的。

So we have about a 1.5% headwind in Q1 and about a 1% headwind for the full year.

因此，我們在第一季面臨約 1.5% 的逆風，全年面臨約 1% 的逆風。

Perfect.

完美的。

Thank you.

謝謝。

Steve Byrne, Bank of America.

美國銀行的史蒂夫伯恩。

Yeah, thank you.

是的，謝謝。

Lori, you mentioned the fourth water treatment technologies in your remarks.

Lori，您在演講中提到了第四種水處理技術。

I was curious whether any of the revenue in the water business is a service component such as monitoring or maintaining those treatment technologies or do you have an interest in adding a service component to that business to help your industrial customers reduce water usage?

我很好奇，水業務中的收入是否來自服務部分，例如監控或維護這些處理技術，或者您是否有興趣在該業務中添加服務部分，以幫助您的工業客戶減少用水量？

Is that part of your vision in that business?

這是您對該項業務的願景的一部分嗎？

We don't have any service revenue today in the portfolio, but you will look broadly in the Water space to be able to add to our exposure.

我們目前的投資組合中沒有任何服務收入，但您可以廣泛地關注水資源領域，以便能夠增加我們的曝光率。

So I would say, services as well as other areas within the Water landscape would be on the table.

所以我想說，服務以及水景觀內的其他領域都將被提上議程。

I'm just curious about price trends in your various Tyvek products you sell them into construction, into packaging, in the personal protection.

我只是好奇你們在建築、包裝和個人防護領域銷售的各種 Tyvek 產品的價格趨勢。

How do those end markets differ in terms of price trends at those products?

就這些產品的價格趨勢而言，這些終端市場有何不同？

Yeah, there's not really material deviations in price across all the different end markets within Tyvek.

是的，Tyvek 各個終端市場之間的價格實際上並沒有實質的差異。

So it's a high value.

因此它的價值很高。

We've got a lot of expertise in the Tyvek overall space, and we'll continue to benefit from the recovery on the medical packaging side as well.

我們在 Tyvek 整體領域擁有豐富的專業知識，我們也將繼續受益於醫療包裝方面的復甦。

Okay, thank.

好的，謝謝。

You.

你。

And that concludes our question-and-answer session.

我們的問答環節到此結束。

I will now turn the call back over to Chris Mecray for closing remarks.

現在我將把電話轉回給克里斯麥克雷 (Chris Mecray)，請他作最後發言。

Thanks, everybody, for joining today.

感謝大家今天的參加。

For your reference, a copy of our transcript will be posted on our website.

供您參考，我們的成績單副本將在我們的網站上發布。

Now this concludes the call.

通話到此結束。

Thank you.

謝謝。

This concludes today's conference call.

今天的電話會議到此結束。

Thank you for your participation.

感謝您的參與。

You may now disconnect.

您現在可以斷開連線。