Caesars Entertainment Inc (CZR) 2022 Q3 法說會逐字稿

Good day, and thank you for standing by. Welcome to the Caesars Entertainment Third Quarter 2022 Earnings Call. (Operator Instructions) Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. I would now like to hand the conference over to your speaker today, Brian Agnew, Senior Vice President of Finance, Treasury and Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

美好的一天，感謝您的支持。歡迎參加凱撒娛樂 2022 年第三季度財報電話會議。 （操作員說明）請注意，今天的會議正在錄製中。我現在想將會議交給你今天的演講者，財務、財務和投資者關係高級副總裁 Brian Agnew。請繼續。

Thank you, Elizabeth, and good afternoon to everyone on the call. Welcome to our conference call to discuss our third quarter 2022 earnings. This afternoon, we issued a press release announcing our financial results for the period ended September 30, 2022. A copy of the press release is available on the Investor Relations section of our website at investor.caesars.com.

謝謝你，伊麗莎白，大家下午好。歡迎參加我們的電話會議，討論我們 2022 年第三季度的收益。今天下午，我們發布了一份新聞稿，宣布了我們截至 2022 年 9 月 30 日止期間的財務業績。該新聞稿的副本可在我們網站investor.caesars.com 的投資者關係部分獲取。

Joining me on the call today are Tom Reeg, our Chief Executive Officer; Anthony Carano, our President and Chief Operating Officer; Bret Yunker, our Chief Financial Officer; and Eric Hession, President, Caesars Sports & Online gaming.

今天和我一起參加電話會議的是我們的首席執行官 Tom Reeg； Anthony Carano，我們的總裁兼首席運營官； Bret Yunker，我們的首席財務官；凱撒體育和在線遊戲總裁 Eric Hession。

Before I turn the call over to Anthony, I would like to remind you that during today's conference call, we may make certain forward-looking statements about the company's performance. Such forward-looking statements are not guarantees of future performance and therefore, one should not place undue reliance on them. Forward-looking statements are also subject to the inherent risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially from those expressed.

在我把電話轉給安東尼之前，我想提醒你，在今天的電話會議中，我們可能會對公司的業績做出某些前瞻性陳述。此類前瞻性陳述並非對未來業績的保證，因此不應過分依賴它們。前瞻性陳述也受到固有風險和不確定性的影響，可能導致實際結果與所表達的結果大不相同。

For additional information concerning factors that could cause actual results to differ from those discussed in our forward-looking statements, you should refer to the cautionary statements contained in our press release as well as the risk factors contained in the company's filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission. Caesars Entertainment undertakes no obligation to revise or update any forward-looking statements to reflect events or circumstances that occur after today's call.

有關可能導致實際結果與我們的前瞻性陳述中討論的結果不同的因素的更多信息，您應參閱我們新聞稿中包含的警示性聲明以及公司向證券交易委員會提交的文件中包含的風險因素委員會。 Caesars Entertainment 不承擔修改或更新任何前瞻性陳述以反映今天電話會議後發生的事件或情況的義務。

Also, during today's call, the company may discuss certain non-GAAP financial measures as defined by SEC Regulation G. The GAAP financial measures most directly comparable to each non-GAAP financial measure discussed and the reconciliation of the differences between each non-GAAP financial measure and the comparable GAAP financial measure can be found on the company's website at investor.caesars.com by selecting the press release regarding the company's 2022 third quarter financial results.

此外，在今天的電話會議中，公司可能會討論 SEC 條例 G 定義的某些非 GAAP 財務指標。GAAP 財務指標與所討論的每個非 GAAP 財務指標最直接可比，以及每個非 GAAP 財務指標之間差異的調節通過選擇有關公司 2022 年第三季度財務業績的新聞稿，可以在公司網站 Investor.caesars.com 上找到衡量標準和可比較的 GAAP 財務衡量標準。

I will now turn the call over to Anthony.

我現在將把電話轉給安東尼。

Thank you, Brian, and good afternoon to everyone on the call. In the third quarter, we generated a new consolidated EBITDA record, excluding digital, of $1.05 billion. Our Las Vegas segment continued to deliver strong results with $491 million of adjusted EBITDA, excluding the real rent payment. Our regional segment delivered a new Q3 record with same-store adjusted EBITDA of $570 million, up 25% versus Q3 of '19. Caesars Digital reported a $38 million adjusted EBITDA loss, which was our smallest last quarter since rebranding to Caesars Sportsbook in August of '21.

謝謝你，Brian，大家下午好。在第三季度，我們創造了 10.5 億美元的新合併 EBITDA 記錄（不包括數字）。我們的拉斯維加斯分部繼續取得強勁的業績，調整後 EBITDA 為 4.91 億美元，不包括實際租金。我們的區域部門創造了新的第三季度記錄，同店調整後的 EBITDA 為 5.7 億美元，比 19 年第三季度增長 25%。 Caesars Digital 報告了 3800 萬美元的調整後 EBITDA 虧損，這是我們自 21 年 8 月更名為 Caesars Sportsbook 以來的最小上個季度。

In our Las Vegas segment, all areas of the business combined to contribute to the strong EBITDA quarter. Excluding real rent payments, our Las Vegas segment generated EBITDA of $491 million and a 46% EBITDA margin. Occupancy was strong, reaching 94%, driven by July and September. Cash hotel revenue and profit set a new Q3 record. Gaming revenue also set a new Q3 record during the quarter. Group room nights during Q3 of '22 represented approximately 12% of occupied room nights. Forward group revenue pace for the remainder of the year and into '23 is up over double digits versus '19. Results in our 55-plus segment Las Vegas were up again in Q3 to pre-COVID, continuing the trend we experienced in the second quarter. International travel continues to recover and remains a tailwind. Las Vegas has further runway for growth with many exciting new entertainment and sporting events coming to the market over the next 18 months.

在我們的拉斯維加斯分部，所有業務領域共同為強勁的 EBITDA 季度做出了貢獻。不計實際租金，我們的拉斯維加斯分部產生了 4.91 億美元的 EBITDA 和 46% 的 EBITDA 利潤率。在 7 月和 9 月的推動下，入住率強勁，達到 94%。現金酒店收入和利潤創造了新的第三季度記錄。遊戲收入在本季度也創下了第三季度的新紀錄。 22 年第三季度的團體間夜數約佔已入住間夜數的 12%。與 19 年相比，今年剩餘時間和 23 年的集團收入增長速度超過兩位數。拉斯維加斯 55 多個細分市場的業績在第三季度再次上升至 COVID 之前，延續了我們在第二季度經歷的趨勢。國際旅行繼續復甦，仍然是順風。未來 18 個月，隨著許多激動人心的新娛樂和體育賽事將進入市場，拉斯維加斯將進一步發展壯大。

In our regional markets, results strengthened in the third quarter, posting growth versus a strong third quarter last year. Reported EBITDA of $570 million was up 25% to Q3 of '19 and up 30% when excluding Lake Charles, which remained closed during Q3. EBITDA margins improved 840 bps to 38% on a same-store basis versus Q3 of '19, excluding Lake Charles. Trends in our regional segment remained very consistent over the last few quarters.

在我們的區域市場，第三季度的業績有所加強，與去年第三季度的強勁增長相比。報告的 EBITDA 為 5.7 億美元，截至 19 年第三季度增長 25%，不包括在第三季度關閉的查爾斯湖，則增長 30%。與 19 年第三季度（不包括查爾斯湖）相比，同店 EBITDA 利潤率提高了 840 個基點至 38%。在過去幾個季度中，我們區域部門的趨勢保持一致。

Turning to an update on our capital program. Renovations in AC will complete in the first half of '23 with the opening of the Nobu Hotel tower, and we're excited about the recent restaurant openings of Hell's Kitchen in Nobu at Caesars AC. Horseshoe Lake Charles is set to open on December 12, and we look forward to showcasing this brand-new land-based facility. We also expect to open our expanded casino offering in Pompano in December as well. We expect to open temporary casinos in both Danville, Virginia and Columbus, Nebraska by midyear '23. Our expansion at Harrah's Hoosier Park is underway and should open by mid-'23. And lastly, our construction on our new hotel tower and additional amenities at our New Orleans property is progressing well with the new sportsbook and poker room recently opened.

轉向我們的資本計劃的更新。 AC 的翻新工程將於 23 年上半年隨著 Nobu 酒店大樓的開業而完成，我們對最近在 Caesars AC 的 Nobu 開設的 Hell's Kitchen 餐廳感到興奮。 Horseshoe Lake Charles 將於 12 月 12 日開放，我們期待著展示這個全新的陸上設施。我們還預計將於 12 月在龐帕諾開設我們擴大的賭場產品。我們預計到 23 年年中將在弗吉尼亞州的丹維爾和內布拉斯加州的哥倫布開設臨時賭場。我們在 Harrah's Hoosier Park 的擴建工程正在進行中，應該會在 23 年中期開放。最後，我們在新奧爾良的新酒店大樓和其他設施的建設進展順利，新的體育博彩和撲克室最近開業。

As we look to the remainder of '22, we remain optimistic about our business as consumer trends remain healthy, especially versus '19. As we mentioned last quarter, we remain encouraged regarding improving group and convention trends in Las Vegas, the return of the international consumer as well as the potential for the full recovery of our older demographic consumer, who's been the most impacted by COVID-19.

當我們展望 22 年的剩餘時間時，我們仍然對我們的業務保持樂觀，因為消費者趨勢保持健康，尤其是與 19 年相比。正如我們上個季度提到的，我們仍然對改善拉斯維加斯的團體和會議趨勢、國際消費者的回歸以及受 COVID-19 影響最大的老年消費者全面復甦的潛力感到鼓舞。

I want to thank all of our team members for their hard work in 2022 so far. I'm extremely proud of our operating teams, their execution and their exceptional guest service. With that, I will now turn the call over to Eric Hession for some insights on the third quarter performance in our digital segment.

我要感謝我們所有的團隊成員，他們在 2022 年迄今為止的辛勤工作。我為我們的運營團隊、他們的執行力和卓越的賓客服務感到非常自豪。有了這個，我現在將把電話轉給 Eric Hession，以了解我們數字部門第三季度的表現。

Thanks, Anthony. Our digital business reported revenue growth of over 120% and a smaller-than-expected EBITDA loss in the quarter. On the sports betting side, we recently started to realize the benefits from the efforts that we've made over the summer to improve the overall experience for our customers. Specifically, improvements in cash out speeds, customer service response times and our in-play parlay and alternative line offerings are all being well received by our customers. We've also created several analytical tools that provide real-time assistance and insights for our trading team, allowing them to expand the number of markets we offer to our customers and to be more responsive during in-play trading sessions. As a result, our hold volatility has declined and our overall expected hold levels have increased.

謝謝，安東尼。我們的數字業務報告本季度收入增長超過 120%，EBITDA 虧損低於預期。在體育博彩方面，我們最近開始意識到我們在夏季為改善客戶整體體驗所做的努力所帶來的好處。具體來說，提現速度、客戶服務響應時間以及我們的在線投注和替代線路產品都得到了客戶的好評。我們還創建了幾個分析工具，為我們的交易團隊提供實時幫助和洞察力，使他們能夠擴大我們為客戶提供的市場數量，並在進行中的交易會話中更加敏感。因此，我們的持有波動性有所下降，我們的總體預期持有水平有所提高。

During the quarter, we also began to see the results of our initial segmented marketing campaigns that allow us to reward our customers more directly for their loyalty and play with us. These efforts contributed towards our net revenue growth as they allowed us to improve our promotional spending efficiency. We anticipate continued enhancements in this important area over the course of 2023.

在本季度，我們也開始看到我們最初的細分營銷活動的結果，這些活動使我們能夠更直接地獎勵客戶的忠誠度並與我們一起玩。這些努力為我們的淨收入增長做出了貢獻，因為它們使我們能夠提高促銷支出效率。我們預計在 2023 年這一重要領域將繼續得到改進。

On the iCasino side, we hired a new leader for the vertical who started on October 1. In conjunction with our tech team, we have an aggressive product improvement road map identified with numerous enhancements for our customers that will be rolled out as completed with a full product targeted for the start of the second half of 2023. iGaming remains a critical component of our digital growth strategy.

在 iCasino 方面，我們聘請了一位新的垂直領導者，他於 10 月 1 日開始工作。與我們的技術團隊一起，我們制定了一個積極的產品改進路線圖，為我們的客戶確定了許多改進，這些改進將在完成後推出完整產品的目標是在 2023 年下半年開始。iGaming 仍然是我們數字增長戰略的關鍵組成部分。

From an expansion standpoint, during the quarter, we launched our online sports betting product in Kansas and upgraded our tech package in Illinois, Pennsylvania and Washington, D.C. to our most current version. We now offer sports betting in 27 North American jurisdictions, 19 of which offer mobile wager. In Q4, pending regulatory approval, we anticipate launching online sports betting in Maryland and on January 1 in Ohio. In addition, we plan on adding 2 new third-party retail locations during the quarter.

從擴展的角度來看，在本季度，我們在堪薩斯州推出了在線體育博彩產品，並將我們在伊利諾伊州、賓夕法尼亞州和華盛頓特區的技術包升級到了最新版本。我們現在在 27 個北美司法管轄區提供體育博彩，其中 19 個提供移動投注。在等待監管部門批准的第四季度，我們預計在馬里蘭州和 1 月 1 日在俄亥俄州推出在線體育博彩。此外，我們計劃在本季度增加 2 個新的第三方零售點。

With that, I'll turn it over to Brett for some additional comments.

有了這個，我會把它交給 Brett 以獲得一些額外的評論。

Thanks, Eric. Q3 was another productive quarter from a balance sheet perspective as we permanently reduced approximately $900 million of debt using asset sale proceeds and free cash flow. We also successfully syndicated a new $3 billion credit facility comprised of a $2.25 billion revolver and a $750 million Term Loan A. 16 domestic and international banks subscribed to the new facility, and we appreciate their support. Total 2022 CapEx spend net of Atlantic City is now expected to come in at approximately $800 million, which is also our current estimate for total 2023 CapEx spend across growth and maintenance.

謝謝，埃里克。從資產負債表的角度來看，第三季度是另一個富有成效的季度，因為我們使用資產出售收益和自由現金流永久減少了大約 9 億美元的債務。我們還成功地聯合了一項新的 30 億美元信貸額度，其中包括一筆 22.5 億美元的循環貸款和一筆 7.5 億美元的定期貸款 A。16 家國內和國際銀行認購了這項新貸款，我們感謝他們的支持。現在預計 2022 年扣除大西洋城的資本支出總額約為 8 億美元，這也是我們目前對 2023 年增長和維護的資本支出總額的估計。

Finally, we announced that we will be pursuing a downstate casino license in New York with our partner, SL Green. It will obviously be a very competitive process, and we look forward to putting our best foot forward when the RFP begins. Given the inherent sensitivities around the bid process, we aren't in a position to go into details around project costs at this stage. However, we can tell you now that the project starts with an existing building and will be financed within a new joint venture that is not on our balance sheet. Caesars will brand and manage the asset under a long-term management agreement, and any equity investment into the joint venture will be very manageable relative to our free cash flow.

最後，我們宣布我們將與我們的合作夥伴 SL Green 一起在紐約尋求下州賭場執照。這顯然將是一個競爭非常激烈的過程，我們期待在 RFP 開始時盡我們最大的努力。鑑於投標過程固有的敏感性，我們無法在現階段詳細介紹項目成本。但是，我們現在可以告訴您，該項目從現有建築物開始，並將由不在我們資產負債表上的新合資企業提供資金。 Caesars 將根據一項長期管理協議對資產進行品牌化和管理，相對於我們的自由現金流，對合資企業的任何股權投資都將非常易於管理。

Now I'll turn the call over to Tom.

現在我將把電話轉給湯姆。

Thanks, Brett. I'm going to touch a little further on the quarter, and I want to talk about October as well. In Las Vegas, very strong results in the quarter. Normal seasonality returned to Las Vegas in the third quarter. We also had a couple of headwinds that I would call out. In utility, expenses for the quarter were extraordinarily high, particularly August, and we had the finish of the construction of the entrance, which caused some construction disruption. If you look at the impact of the two of those and add it back, you'd end up a little bit ahead of last year on an EBITDA basis and similar from a margin standpoint.

謝謝，布雷特。我將在本季度進一步討論，我也想談談 10 月份。在拉斯維加斯，本季度業績非常強勁。第三季度拉斯維加斯恢復了正常的季節性。我們也遇到了一些我要指出的逆風。在公用事業方面，本季度的支出異常高，尤其是 8 月份，我們已經完成了入口的建設，這造成了一些施工中斷。如果您查看這兩者的影響並將其添加回來，您最終會在 EBITDA 基礎上比去年提前一點，並且從利潤率的角度來看類似。

As you look into October, October was the strongest month in the history of Las Vegas for Caesars. We did over $200 million of EBITDA in October, which is up double digits versus last year on a consolidated basis. October EBITDA for bricks and mortar is pacing double-digit percentage above last year's October despite having one fewer weekend day in the 2022 period.

回顧 10 月，10 月對凱撒來說是拉斯維加斯歷史上最強勁的月份。我們在 10 月份實現了超過 2 億美元的 EBITDA，與去年同期相比增長了兩位數。儘管 2022 年的周末工作日減少了，但 10 月實體店的 EBITDA 仍比去年 10 月高出兩位數。

Regional is obviously quite strong as well, had a little bit of margin improvement there. Strongest third quarter that we've ever had in regionals. And then we've got, as Anthony touched on, we've got Lake Charles coming. We've got temporary casinos in Columbus, Nebraska; Danville, Virginia that will hit next year. We've got the completion of the Atlantic City spend as well, and the Harrah's Hoosier Park in Indianapolis -- outside Indianapolis should finish by the middle of next year. So a number of tailwinds cash that you allowed us to invest as shareholders that you're going to see the fruits of going into the rest of '22 and into '23.

區域顯然也很強勁，那裡的利潤率有所改善。我們在地區性市場中經歷過的最強勁的第三季度。然後我們得到了，正如安東尼談到的那樣，我們有查爾斯湖來了。我們在內布拉斯加州哥倫布有臨時賭場；弗吉尼亞州丹維爾市，明年將登陸。我們也已經完成了大西洋城的花費，印第安納波利斯的哈拉斯印第安納州公園——印第安納波利斯郊外應該在明年年中完成。因此，您允許我們作為股東投資的一些順風現金，您將看到進入 22 年剩餘時間和 23 年的成果。

I'd also like to touch on the Strip asset sale and say that we intend to keep all of our Strip assets as we move forward. We ran into a market where the cash flow of the asset continued to increase. The ability of buyers to raise financing made it a very easy decision for us to keep. I know that despite us talking about how this is and was a discretionary process for us, it created an unnecessary overhang in the stock, and I apologize to all of our shareholders for that. That was a self-inflicted error and that was me. So we will be keeping our Vegas Strip assets as we move forward.

我還想談談 Strip 資產出售，並說我們打算在前進的過程中保留我們所有的 Strip 資產。我們遇到了資產現金流持續增加的市場。買家籌集資金的能力使我們很容易做出決定。我知道，儘管我們談論這對我們來說是一個自由裁量的過程，但它在股票中造成了不必要的過剩，我為此向我們所有的股東道歉。那是一個自我造成的錯誤，那就是我。因此，我們將在前進的過程中保留我們的拉斯維加斯大道資產。

In digital, October digital inflected to positive EBITDA for us. So we are extremely pleased that's 12 months ahead of the schedule that we anticipated. I think most of you are aware, we've got a fairly high profile liability out there with the Astros. So that will have -- that will be a swing factor in whether fourth quarter is positive as a whole. But we'd expect that we have inflected and digital will be a contributor as we move forward.

在數字方面，10 月份的數字為我們帶來了積極的 EBITDA。因此，我們非常高興這比我們預期的時間表提前了 12 個月。我想你們中的大多數人都知道，我們在太空人隊中承擔了相當高的責任。因此，這將成為第四季度整體是否積極的一個搖擺因素。但我們希望我們已經改變，數字化將成為我們前進的貢獻者。

So that's extremely exciting news for us. Great work by Eric and his team in digital, and thank you to all of our shareholders for the capital to invest in that in digital and the patience as we work through it. We continue to believe that on our $1.1 billion of cumulative EBITDA losses that [maturity], we'll be doing in excess of 50% of that in annual EBITDA out of digital. That business continues to outperform our expectations, and really, really inflected over the last 60 to 90 days. So we are quite pleased with that.

所以這對我們來說是非常令人興奮的消息。 Eric 和他的團隊在數字方面的出色工作，感謝我們所有的股東為投資於數字領域的資本以及我們在工作中的耐心。我們仍然相信，在我們 11 億美元的累計 EBITDA 損失（到期）中，我們將超過數字化年度 EBITDA 損失的 50%。該業務繼續超出我們的預期，並且在過去 60 到 90 天內確實發生了變化。所以我們對此非常滿意。

With that, I'll flip back to the operator for questions.

有了這個，我會轉回給接線員提問。

(Operator Instructions) Our first question comes from the line of Carlo Santarelli with Deutsche Bank.

（操作員說明）我們的第一個問題來自德意志銀行的 Carlo Santarelli。

Tom, appreciate the commentary on digital. Could you talk a little bit about how you foresaw or foresee going forward the promotional environment perhaps based a little bit on your experience in the 3Q as well as what you saw in October as we're now in the kind of the meat of football season. And then further, let's just set aside the World Series liability. Could I take your comments to kind of infer that perhaps next year, you're looking at a positive EBITDA contribution from digital?

湯姆，欣賞關於數字的評論。您能否談談您如何預見或預見未來的促銷環境，可能基於您在第三季度的經驗以及您在 10 月份看到的情況，因為我們現在正處於足球賽季的核心階段.再進一步，讓我們把世界大賽的責任放在一邊。我是否可以根據您的評論推斷出，也許明年，您正在考慮數字業務對 EBITDA 的積極貢獻？

Yes, for modeling purposes, Carlo, I'd expect you to be around breakeven, but I'd expect that we've got a really good shot that that's a contributor on a full year basis in '23. Obviously, that's subject to hold, but we feel very, very good about where we are. In terms of promotional environment, you've got -- we've talked for a very long time about how your customers, as they come in, in new states, that's when they're taking advantage of sign-up offers, that those are your highest -- that's your highest promotional spending. We've got, obviously, a mix this year of states, most of which are in their second year -- if not second full year, at least second year of operation during football season. So your promos are to your existing customers. That's typically a much smaller promotional bite than new sign-ups.

是的，出於建模目的，卡洛，我希望你能達到收支平衡，但我希望我們有一個非常好的機會，那就是 23 年全年的貢獻。顯然，這是有可能的，但我們對自己所處的位置感覺非常非常好。在促銷環境方面，我們已經討論了很長時間，當他們進入新州時，當他們利用註冊優惠時，那些是你最高的——這是你最高的促銷支出。顯然，今年的州是混合的，其中大部分是在第二年——如果不是第二年，至少是在足球賽季的第二年。所以你的促銷是給你現有的客戶的。這通常比新註冊小得多。

But I'd also say, we have the ability to segment customers now, which we didn't last year. We've got a full year of looking at -- as you know, we had all spigots opened in digital as we launch the business and launch the brand. Now we can look at various verticals and see what type of customer is coming in through the various channels and adjust our spend based on are we getting a return on our investment. And we made some significant changes there, led by Eric, in the last 60 days that have flowed virtually entirely -- basically, shutting off particular segments, and that cash has flowed immediately to the bottom line with no degradation in market position.

但我還要說，我們現在有能力對客戶進行細分，而去年我們沒有。我們已經進行了一整年的研究——如你所知，在我們開展業務和推出品牌時，我們已經在數字領域打開了所有的龍頭。現在我們可以查看各個垂直領域，了解通過各種渠道進入的客戶類型，並根據我們是否獲得投資回報來調整我們的支出。在過去的 60 天裡，我們在 Eric 的帶領下進行了一些重大改變，這些改變幾乎完全流動——基本上，關閉了特定的細分市場，現金立即流向了底線，而市場地位沒有下降。

So we feel very, very good about where we're at. As I told you, this is -- what we've done on the brick-and-mortar side is figure out how to invest more in your best customers and less in your less profitable customers, and that's really the basic blocking and tackling that we're doing in digital that has led to these results.

所以我們對自己所處的位置感覺非常非常好。正如我告訴你的，這就是——我們在實體方面所做的就是弄清楚如何在你的最佳客戶上投入更多，而在利潤較低的客戶上投入更少，這實際上是基本的阻止和解決問題我們正在做的數字化導致了這些結果。

Yes, I have noticed the latter personally. I appreciate that. And then just one follow-up from the regional perspective. Obviously, results were good against a difficult comparison. It looks like you guys were able to more or less keep OpEx, kind of ex gaming taxes, to the best of our estimation, flattish. Are you kind of where you need to be? Are there any pressures that are kind of creeping there that we need to be aware of outside of traditional labor inflation, things like that? Or is this a pretty good run rate in terms of OpEx?

是的，我個人注意到了後者。我很感激。然後只是從區域角度進行的一項後續行動。顯然，與困難的比較相比，結果是好的。據我們估計，你們似乎能夠或多或少地保持運營支出（一種前博彩稅）持平。你是那種你需要去的地方嗎？在傳統的勞動力通脹之外，是否還有一些我們需要注意的壓力？還是就 OpEx 而言，這是一個相當不錯的運行率？

Yes, I'd say you're at a pretty good run rate. You've been around us long enough that you know we're never done, but we don't see any real cost that's on the sidelines. As you've touched on, we've got labor cost inflation. That rolls through, but that's been for quite some time. And frankly, the labor picture continues to look better as we get quarters in the rearview mirror.

是的，我會說你的運行速度相當不錯。你在我們身邊的時間已經夠長了，你知道我們從未完成過，但我們沒有看到任何真正的成本在場外。正如你所提到的，我們有勞動力成本膨脹。這已經過去了，但這已經有一段時間了。坦率地說，隨著我們在後視鏡中看到宿舍，勞動情況繼續看起來更好。

Our next question comes from the line of Joe Greff with JPMorgan.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根大通的 Joe Greff。

Tom, just starting off on the digital side. As you talk about increasing profitability in this segment, can you talk about over the next few years, 2023, 2024 and beyond, the magnitude of additional operating expenses coming out of that business, maybe particularly with some partnership expenses and how this might be sort of, I don't want to say low-hanging fruit or easy to extract efficiencies from, but can you talk about some of those that kind of gets you to increasing profitability as you think about some of those partnership expenses winding down?

湯姆，剛從數字方面開始。當您談到提高該領域的盈利能力時，您能否談談在未來幾年、2023 年、2024 年及以後，該業務產生的額外運營費用的規模，尤其是一些合作夥伴費用以及這可能如何排序的，我不想說唾手可得的果實或容易從中提取效率，但是當您考慮一些合作夥伴費用逐漸減少時，您能談談使您提高盈利能力的一些方法嗎？

Sure, Joe. As you look at current business, you've got for us what is a sports-dominated business at this point inflecting to profitability. Obviously, we have significant opportunity in front of us in iCasino. We think we now have the right leadership in place to attack that. So we think that will grow from what's a fairly small contributor today into a much more meaningful contributor. But what I think you're referring to is as we launch -- and this is not unique to us. This is throughout the entire digital space. There were a number of partnership deals signed up with media partners, with teams, with leagues that all kind of run 3 to 5 years, in our case, from, let's say, in the middle of last year. So you'll have some running off in a year. You'll have more running off over the next 3 years.

當然，喬。當您查看當前業務時，您已經了解了目前以體育為主導的業務正在轉變為盈利能力。顯然，在 iCasino 中，我們有很大的機會擺在我們面前。我們認為我們現在有合適的領導來解決這個問題。所以我們認為這將從今天的一個相當小的貢獻者成長為一個更有意義的貢獻者。但我認為你指的是我們推出時——這不是我們獨有的。這遍及整個數字空間。從去年年中開始，我們與媒體合作夥伴、球隊、聯賽簽署了許多合作協議，這些協議的運行期限為 3 到 5 年。所以一年後你會有一些流失。在接下來的 3 年裡，你會有更多的流失。

And then you'll look at -- there were assumptions made in terms of what you were willing to pay for those sponsorship opportunities that were based on customer generation -- new customers to your platform. Obviously, we've got much more data today than we had before, and you're not going to be in virtually all of these cases in a launch situation anymore. So for us, that's something that runs in north of $200 million of annual expense, and you should expect as though -- and for now, that's a fixed expense for us as long as those contracts are in place. You should expect some of them will live in a form that may not be as expensive as it is today. A fair amount of those will go away entirely, and that should flow straight to EBITDA for us if you're looking out in that '24, '25 time frame that you laid out.

然後你會看到 - 根據你願意為基於客戶生成的讚助機會支付的費用做出假設 - 你的平台的新客戶。顯然，我們今天獲得的數據比以前多得多，而且您不會再遇到幾乎所有這些情況下的發布情況。所以對我們來說，這是每年超過 2 億美元的費用，你應該期待 - 現在，只要這些合同到位，這對我們來說就是固定費用。你應該期望他們中的一些人會以一種可能不像今天那麼昂貴的形式存在。其中相當一部分將完全消失，如果您在您制定的 24 年、25 年時間框架內尋找，那應該直接流向我們的 EBITDA。

Great. And Tom, just to clarify your comments, switching over to Las Vegas. You mentioned that 3Q would have generated, in Las Vegas, EBITDAR north of last year and margins that are similar and that delta between what you reported and those comments related to those 2 headwinds, utility costs and disruption at CPLV. Can you sort of break out the magnitude of each and explain to us maybe the elevated utility expenses, how do you think about that going forward? And is it recurring? Is it onetime? And then also, [something that we've noticed] that corporate expenses were down a lot sequentially. Can you help explain that? Or was there an expense shifted out to the properties versus what may have been in the past sort of allocated to corporate?

偉大的。湯姆，只是為了澄清你的意見，切換到拉斯維加斯。您提到，在拉斯維加斯，第三季度將產生去年以北的 EBITDAR 和相似的利潤率，並且您報告的內容與與 CPLV 的這兩個逆風、公用事業成本和中斷相關的評論之間存在差異。您能否解釋一下每一項的規模，並向我們解釋一下公用事業費用的增加，您如何看待未來的發展？它會反復出現嗎？是一次性的嗎？然後，[我們注意到的事情]公司開支連續下降了很多。你能幫忙解釋一下嗎？或者與過去分配給公司的費用相比，是否有一筆費用轉移到了房產上？

Bret will take corporate expense. I'll take Vegas.

布雷特將承擔公司費用。我會選擇維加斯。

On corporate expense, yes, we are a bit light to our typical run rate of 30 to 35 per quarter. That's due to a lack of transaction activity and a continued focus on all expenses.

是的，在公司開支方面，我們對每季度 30 到 35 次的典型運行率有點輕率。這是由於缺乏交易活動以及繼續關注所有費用。

And for Vegas, Joe, if you normalize utilities, which was primarily rate in August alone, that's virtually the entire gap between Q3 of '22 or Q3 of '21. And then you have the construction disruption as well. To give you an idea, October on a preliminary basis, Vegas EBITDA margin was about 52% for us.

對於維加斯，喬來說，如果你將公用事業正常化，這主要是僅在 8 月份的費率，這實際上是 22 年第三季度或 21 年第三季度之間的全部差距。然後你也有施工中斷。給你一個想法，10 月份，維加斯 EBITDA 利潤率對我們來說約為 52%。

Our next question comes from the line of Steven Wieczynski with Stifel.

我們的下一個問題來自 Steven Wieczynski 和 Stifel。

So Tom, you just mentioned that Vegas did, I think you said, $200 million in EBITDA in October. And I guess the most simplistic way I can ask this question is should the quarter end up being $600 million in EBITDA? And I guess what I mean by that is, obviously, with -- there's some holidays coming up and what not, I just want to make sure that expectations for the fourth quarter are rightfully set at this point. And hopefully, that makes sense.

所以湯姆，你剛剛提到維加斯在 10 月份實現了 2 億美元的 EBITDA。我想我可以問這個問題的最簡單的方法是本季度的 EBITDA 是否應該達到 6 億美元？我想我的意思是，很明顯，有一些假期即將到來，什麼不是，我只是想確保在這一點上正確設定了對第四季度的預期。希望這是有道理的。

Sure, Steve. October is typically the strongest month in fourth quarter. November is the weakest month. Thanksgiving is not a particularly strong holiday, and your -- so November is the seasonal slowest in the third -- in the fourth quarter and then you get New Year's in December. So if I were thinking about what does the quarter look like, October should be the best month, December should be slightly lower and November lower than that.

當然，史蒂夫。十月通常是第四季度最強勁的月份。 11 月是最疲軟的月份。感恩節不是一個特別強烈的假期，你的 - 所以 11 月是第三季度中季節性最慢的 - 在第四季度，然後你在 12 月迎來新年。因此，如果我在考慮這個季度的情況，10 月應該是最好的月份，12 月應該略低，11 月應該低於那個月份。

Okay. Perfect. And then second question, Tom, on the digital side of the business, and clearly, there's been some significant progress made here in terms of getting that segment profitable. And I guess my question is, or maybe give us your updated kind of thoughts about down the road, do you see any kind of scenario where you would want to potentially spin this business off at some point? And I understand there's probably a lot of value here with the business being tied so closely to the brick-and-mortar side, but just wondering if that would possibly make sense at some point down the road to help the leverage side of the equation.

好的。完美的。然後是第二個問題，湯姆，在業務的數字方面，顯然，在使該部門盈利方面取得了一些重大進展。我想我的問題是，或者也許給我們您對未來的最新想法，您是否看到任何一種場景，您可能希望在某個時候將這項業務分拆？而且我知道這裡可能有很多價值，因為業務與實體方面如此緊密地聯繫在一起，但只是想知道這是否可能在某個時候有意義，以幫助等式的槓桿方面。

So I'd say that our competitive advantage here is tying into the existing brick-and-mortar business and our Caesars Rewards database. And it would be my preference that, that remains 100% owned by the parent company. If you get to different shareholder bases for the 2 businesses, there's a complexity introduced that you see in -- you can see that in some of our peers in terms of when you get to different shareholder bases in the same business. But I'd tell you, you know that we're constantly focused on how do we drive shareholder value. If you get into a market where that ultimately makes sense and that's the way to increase the pie for shareholders in total, certainly, that's something we would consider. In the recent market environment, there hasn't been much value placed on these digital assets. So it's a very easy decision as we sit here today.

所以我想說，我們在這裡的競爭優勢與現有的實體業務和我們的 Caesars Rewards 數據庫息息相關。我的偏好是，它仍然 100% 歸母公司所有。如果您為這兩個業務找到不同的股東基礎，那麼您會看到一個複雜性 - 您可以在我們的一些同行中看到，當您在同一業務中獲得不同的股東基礎時。但我會告訴你，你知道我們一直專注於如何推動股東價值。如果您進入一個最終有意義的市場，並且這是為股東增加總體收益的方式，當然，這就是我們會考慮的事情。在最近的市場環境中，這些數字資產並沒有太多價值。因此，當我們今天坐在這裡時，這是一個非常容易的決定。

Our next question comes from the line of Shaun Kelley with Bank of America.

我們的下一個問題來自美國銀行的 Shaun Kelley。

I wanted to dig in on regionals a little bit. The performance there in the quarter was obviously excellent and probably stronger than many of us were expecting. I was wondering if you could just kind of call out any key markets that might have driven that strength in the third quarter. And specifically, if you could comment on Atlantic City. I feel like -- it's a big seasonal quarter for that market. But directionally, I think we had seen the Caesars properties, on a gross revenue basis, not performing as well as some of the other market participants. I'm just curious if you're doing something different there, focusing on margin, just kind of how that market is evolving specifically.

我想深入研究區域性。該季度的表現顯然非常出色，可能比我們許多人的預期要強。我想知道你是否可以指出任何可能在第三季度推動這種增長的關鍵市場。具體來說，如果您可以評論大西洋城。我覺得——對於那個市場來說，這是一個重要的季節性季度。但在方向上，我認為我們已經看到凱撒的物業，在總收入的基礎上，表現不如其他一些市場參與者。我只是好奇你是否在那裡做一些不同的事情，專注於利潤，只是這個市場具體是如何發展的。

Yes, so what I'd say we're doing differently is we've had most of our market torn up during the peak season. So we've had rooms out of service both at Caesars and at Harrah's. And obviously, the intention, as we began the project, was that would be finished prior to peak season of '22 and for -- there's obviously a well-known story of what happened to supply chain, and we missed the peak season. So really, the results you're seeing in Atlantic City are a function of the construction disruption that we've had going on in that market. That's not a we're making a conscious decision to run off revenue and focus on margins.

是的，所以我想說的是，我們正在做的不同的是，我們的大部分市場在旺季都被撕毀了。因此，我們在 Caesars 和 Harrah's 的客房都無法使用。很明顯，當我們開始這個項目時，我們的意圖是在 22 年旺季之前完成，而且對於供應鏈發生的事情顯然有一個眾所周知的故事，我們錯過了旺季。所以真的，你在大西洋城看到的結果是我們在那個市場上進行的建築中斷的一個函數。這不是我們有意識地決定減少收入並專注於利潤。

So Atlantic City, on a relative basis to the regionals, was an underperformer. In terms of overperformers, New Orleans has come back quite nicely from both the hurricane and the severe COVID restrictions that were in place in the city, and then Northern Nevada continues to be extraordinarily strong. The levels of business that we're doing in Reno and Tahoe are, frankly, beyond what we ever dreamed when we're putting this thing together a few years ago.

因此，大西洋城相對於地區而言，表現不佳。就表現優異者而言，新奧爾良已經從颶風和該市實施的嚴格 COVID 限制中恢復得很好，然後內華達州北部繼續異常強勁。坦率地說，我們在 Reno 和 Tahoe 所做的業務水平超出了我們幾年前將這件事放在一起時的夢想。

Great color. And then just as my follow-up, switching to digital, if I could. While we have Eric, one thing that's been a discussion point in the market is, obviously, really strong hold levels across much of the OSB landscape in the third quarter, certainly in October -- or sorry, in September. Kind of curious on the thoughts. You made a call out on hold and that improving a bit over time. Just could you talk to us a little bit about relative to maybe what we're seeing in the market in September and October, how much do you think this is sustainable based on product and mix versus how much is really just a factor of game luck where we've definitely seen some outcomes that have favored the books?

很棒的顏色。然後就像我的後續行動一樣，如果可以的話，切換到數字化。雖然我們有埃里克，但市場上討論的一件事顯然是第三季度大部分 OSB 領域的持有水平非常強勁，當然是在 10 月 - 或者對不起，在 9 月。有點好奇的想法。你打了一個電話，隨著時間的推移，情況有所改善。你能不能和我們談談相對於我們在 9 月和 10 月在市場上看到的情況，你認為基於產品和組合的可持續性有多少，而有多少實際上只是遊戲運氣的一個因素我們在哪里肯定看到了一些有利於書籍的結果？

Yes, so let me start this, and I'll flip to Eric in terms of -- there's 2 pieces here, right? There's just your normal luck and football season started pretty strong for all books. There's a couple of weeks so far that have been the reverse of that, but the bulk has been favorable to books. But when I'm saying we're positive in October, that's even adjusted for that hold. We've also made a number of changes that have improved our own hold, but I'm going to flip to Eric to talk trough.

是的，所以讓我開始這個，然後我會轉向 Eric——這裡有 2 件，對吧？這只是你的正常運氣，足球賽季開始時對所有書籍來說都非常強勁。到目前為止，有幾個星期的情況正好相反，但大部分都對書籍有利。但是當我說我們在 10 月份是積極的時，這甚至已經針對這種持有進行了調整。我們還進行了一些更改，以改善我們自己的控制，但我將轉向 Eric 談談低谷。

Yes, thanks, Tom. We had higher-than-expected hold towards the higher end of our range for the quarter partially, as Tom mentioned, through luck. The football season has been fortunate to us so far. But beyond that, as I mentioned in the remarks, we did put a lot of tools in place. We're increasing our uptime and our percentage of in-play hold and in-play volume, which naturally translates into a higher hold product.

是的，謝謝，湯姆。正如湯姆所說，由於運氣，我們在本季度的區間高端部分保持了高於預期的水平。到目前為止，足球賽季對我們來說是幸運的。但除此之外，正如我在評論中提到的，我們確實使用了很多工具。我們正在增加我們的正常運行時間以及我們在播放中保持和播放量的百分比，這自然會轉化為更高的保持產品。

In addition, our percentage of parlays has steadily grown and really improved in the third quarter relative to the second and first quarter. A lot of that is due to some enhancements that we made on the tech side to improve the ability for customers to visualize and to place their parlay bets. We also have our analytics team that's come over from the retail casino side that have put together a number of models that allow our traders to be able to keep the odds up during the game longer and then also to be more accurate with respect to their pricing.

此外，相對於第二季度和第一季度，我們的過關投注百分比在第三季度穩步增長並確實有所改善。其中很大一部分是由於我們在技術方面進行了一些改進，以提高客戶可視化和下注的能力。我們還有來自零售賭場方面的分析團隊，他們整合了許多模型，使我們的交易者能夠在遊戲中更長時間地保持賠率，然後在定價方面也更加準確.

And so through a combination of all of those factors, we've really been able to reduce the volatility, and you can see it when we get our results each day. Even on days when we're not lucky with the outcomes, we still managed to pull off positive hold or at least hold that's reasonable for a particular day. And then when we do get lucky, it really compounds and we can get some really solid, double-digit holds. So overall, we put a lot of structural hold changes in place, but we were also a bit lucky in the third quarter.

因此，通過所有這些因素的結合，我們確實能夠減少波動性，當我們每天得到結果時，你就可以看到它。即使在我們對結果不走運的日子裡，我們仍然成功地實現了積極的持有，或者至少持有對特定日子來說是合理的。然後，當我們真的很幸運時，它真的很複雜，我們可以得到一些非常穩固的、兩位數的把握。所以總的來說，我們做了很多結構性的改變，但我們在第三季度也有點幸運。

Our next question comes from the line of Barry Jonas with Truist.

我們的下一個問題來自 Barry Jonas 與 Truist 的對話。

Looks like you found the right structure to move forward with a bid in New York. Just curious if there are any other greenfield opportunities you're interested in, either domestically or internationally.

看起來您找到了在紐約進行競標的正確結構。只是好奇是否有任何其他你感興趣的綠地機會，無論是國內還是國際。

I mean I would say greenfield international, you never say never, but highly, highly unlikely. In the U.S., if you see a major market open like, say, Texas, you should expect that we're going to look for a way to participate there. You've seen us in Danville, Virginia where the temporary will open next year; Columbus, Nebraska, which is smaller, where temporary will open next year. So we will pick and choose, but you should expect it to be domestic focused.

我的意思是我會說綠地國際，你永遠不會說永遠，但非常非常不可能。在美國，如果您看到像德克薩斯這樣的主要市場開放，您應該期望我們會尋找一種參與其中的方式。您已經在弗吉尼亞州的丹維爾看到了我們，該臨時場所將於明年開放；內布拉斯加州哥倫布市較小，明年將臨時開放。所以我們會挑選，但你應該期望它以國內為重點。

Got it. Got it. And then just shifting to digital. You talked about Ohio and Maryland going live. Any expectations you could share for other jurisdictions, whether that's Massachusetts, Nebraska, Puerto Rico? And then just for iCasino, I think the legislative movement has been softer than people thought. Any progress on states making a push for iCasino that you're seeing?

知道了。知道了。然後只是轉向數字。你談到了俄亥俄州和馬里蘭州的直播。您對其他司法管轄區有何期望，無論是馬薩諸塞州、內布拉斯加州還是波多黎各？然後就 iCasino 而言，我認為立法運動比人們想像的要溫和。您看到的推動 iCasino 的各州有什麼進展嗎？

Yes, I'll take that one. You definitely listed off a lot of the ones that we're aware of. So in addition to Maryland, which will hopefully be in November, and then Ohio on October 1, you've also got Massachusetts. The date hasn't been finalized there, but it's looking pretty good for first quarter. It sounds like the retail locations will open first and then online, and we're participating in the online side of that. In addition to Massachusetts, Maine has been moving forward. That's probably going to be late this year, if not into -- sorry, late 2023 rather.

是的，我要那個。你肯定列出了很多我們知道的。因此，除了有望在 11 月舉行的馬里蘭州和 10 月 1 日的俄亥俄州之外，您還有馬薩諸塞州。日期尚未最終確定，但第一季度看起來相當不錯。聽起來零售店將首先開放，然後是在線，我們正在參與其中的在線方面。除了馬薩諸塞州，緬因州一直在前進。這可能會在今年晚些時候，如果不是 - 抱歉，應該是 2023 年末。

We are planning to launch in Puerto Rico. That could happen in the fourth quarter or might push to the first quarter. And then as you mentioned with Nebraska as well, we will plan to have some kiosks up for our temporary casino there. And then we're going to launch a sportsbook at Casino Windsor up in Canada, and that will be a kiosk later this week. And then early next year, we'll open a full book as well.

我們計劃在波多黎各推出。這可能會在第四季度發生，也可能會推遲到第一季度。然後正如你在內布拉斯加州提到的那樣，我們將計劃在那里為我們的臨時賭場設置一些售貨亭。然後我們將在加拿大溫莎賭場推出體育博彩，這將是本週晚些時候的售貨亭。然後明年初，我們也將翻開一本完整的書。

Got it. Any movement on the iCasino side that you're starting to see from the states?

知道了。您開始從各州看到 iCasino 方面的任何動向？

Yes, the iCasino is a little bit more tricky. There really has to be a real coalition. There's a lot of competing interests from both within our industry and ancillary businesses that sometimes compete with us and sometimes participate with us. At this point, it's certainly possible that there could be another state that legalizes or 2 next year. But I wouldn't call out any particular state at this point. And just to add on to that, when we think about the model that Tom's outlaid, we really don't look at any incremental states from those that have been already passed through the legislation. So anything we get on the iCasino side or even any additional states beyond those that I mentioned would be upside to the model.

是的，iCasino 有點棘手。真的必須有一個真正的聯盟。在我們的行業和輔助業務中，有很多相互競爭的利益，有時與我們競爭，有時與我們一起參與。在這一點上，明年可能會有另一個州或 2 個州合法化。但在這一點上，我不會提到任何特定的狀態。再補充一點，當我們考慮湯姆提出的模型時，我們真的不會從已經通過立法的那些州中看到任何增量州。因此，我們在 iCasino 方面獲得的任何東西，甚至是我提到的那些之外的任何其他狀態，都會對模型有利。

Our next question comes from the line of John DeCree with CBRE Securities.

我們的下一個問題來自 CBRE Securities 的 John DeCree。

We've covered a lot of ground. So I apologize, maybe this one's a little bit more granular on the October performance in Las Vegas, kind of record EBITDA levels. I think you've mentioned the low 50s percent margin, 52% if I heard correctly. Curious if you could kind of give us a little bit of insight into customer mix. It is typically a bigger group customer quarter, but it seems like everything is kind of working with that margin. I think 12% group room nights in 3Q. Curious if you could kind of unpack October a little bit in terms of customer mix and what kind of pushed that record performance from a customer perspective.

我們已經覆蓋了很多領域。所以我很抱歉，也許這對 10 月份在拉斯維加斯的表現更加細緻，有點創紀錄的 EBITDA 水平。我想你已經提到了 50% 的低利潤率，如果我沒聽錯的話是 52%。很好奇您是否可以讓我們對客戶組合有所了解。它通常是一個更大的集團客戶季度，但似乎一切都在利用這個利潤。我認為第三季度有 12% 的團體房晚。好奇您是否可以在客戶組合方面稍微解開 10 月的包裝，以及從客戶的角度來看是什麼推動了創紀錄的業績。

Yes, I'd prefer not to go super deep there. But yes, John, groups are a big part of it. Group business was strong in October, [same as here] this week. So it's just the culmination of a significant wave of demand that has included now the group side, and we're thrilled with the way things are coming together. We're going to do over $1 billion cash room revenue in Vegas, which -- for those that have been in the market, and Caesars would have viewed that as impossible not that long ago. So we're really hitting on all cylinders here.

是的，我不想去那裡超深。但是，是的，約翰，團體是其中的重要組成部分。 10 月份集團業務表現強勁，本週 [與這里相同]。因此，這只是包括現在集團方在內的一波重要需求浪潮的高潮，我們對事情的融合方式感到興奮。我們將在拉斯維加斯獲得超過 10 億美元的現金室收入，這對於那些已經進入市場的人來說，不久前凱撒認為這是不可能的。所以我們真的在這裡全力以赴。

Maybe a follow-up for the outlook. I think maybe, Anthony, mentioned that the group room nights are pacing above of '19 with some big events next year. Have you started to see the benefit in booking? We all see the kind of pricing for F1, but it's still a bit of ways away, I think, a year now. Curious if you really started to get traction on some of the big events that you expect next year or if you think there's an opportunity to have an acceleration in both group room nights and pricing for next year.

也許是對前景的跟進。我想也許，安東尼，提到團體房間之夜的節奏比 19 年高，明年會有一些大事件。您是否開始看到預訂的好處？我們都看到了 F1 的定價方式，但我認為距離現在還有一年的路要走。好奇您是否真的開始在您期望明年的一些大型活動中受到關注，或者您是否認為有機會在明年的團體間夜和定價方面都有加速。

Certainly, yes, we think Formula One is kind of a different animal. The demand for that particular event is well beyond what we were expecting. And you saw, as we rolled out rates yesterday, the pricing reflects that with a lot of the big events skewed toward the second half of the year beyond normal CES coming back, things like that. There's easy comps in the first quarter with Omicron impacting '21 -- I'm sorry, '22. But as you look further deeper into the bigger groups, it's a little early to talk about traction. But it should all be extremely positive for room rates and occupancy in the market in '22 -- '23, sorry.

當然，是的，我們認為一級方程式是一種不同的動物。對該特定活動的需求遠遠超出了我們的預期。你看到了，當我們昨天推出費率時，定價反映了許多重大事件都傾向於下半年，而不是正常的 CES 回歸，諸如此類。第一季度的比賽很容易，Omicron 影響了 21 年——對不起，22 年。但是當你更深入地研究更大的群體時，現在談論牽引力還為時過早。但這對 22 年至 23 年的房價和市場入住率都應該是非常有利的，抱歉。

Our next question comes from the line of David Katz with Jefferies.

我們的下一個問題來自 David Katz 與 Jefferies 的對話。

I wanted to just go back to a topic I raised, I think, last quarter about kind of normalized Las Vegas margins And I think the discussion we had was around that 50% benchmark. It seems to me that what we saw was some seasonality as well as some of the cost headwinds. Were those attributable to Las Vegas? And if we can maybe take it a step further, that 50% level or neighborhood, is that a full year number, implying that some may be higher and 3Q may be lower?

我想回到我在上個季度提出的一個關於拉斯維加斯利潤率標準化的話題，我認為我們的討論圍繞著 50% 的基準。在我看來，我們看到的是一些季節性因素以及一些成本逆風。那些歸因於拉斯維加斯嗎？如果我們可以更進一步，那個 50% 的水平或附近，這是一個全年的數字，這意味著一些可能更高，而第三季度可能更低？

Yes, that's accurate. And when I was talking about the utility impact, that was entirely Las Vegas. So you're talking about if you normalize, we should have been between 48%, 49% in third quarter. And then you should see first and fourth quarters should be better than that second should be, somewhere around, let's say, high 40s. But again, we manage for aggregate EBITDA, not EBITDA margin. That 50% that we're talking about is really what falls out of the operating model, not necessarily a target for us.

是的，這是準確的。當我談到公用事業影響時，那完全是拉斯維加斯。所以你說的是，如果你正常化，我們應該在第三季度的 48% 到 49% 之間。然後你應該看到第一和第四季度應該比第二季度更好，在某個地方，比方說，高 40 多歲。但同樣，我們管理的是總 EBITDA，而不是 EBITDA 利潤率。我們正在談論的那 50% 確實是運營模式中的一部分，不一定是我們的目標。

Understood. So there was 300 or 400 basis points impact in the current quarter?

明白了。那麼本季度有 300 或 400 個基點的影響？

I'd say not quite that much. We're at 46%. I said we'd have been 48% to 49%. So call it, 200 to 300 basis points...

我會說沒有那麼多。我們是 46%。我說我們應該是 48% 到 49%。所以叫它，200到300個基點......

Okay. Got it. And if I can ask one other longer-term question with respect to digital, and this may not be the way you're thinking about it either. But when we start getting to a more normalized business level for digital, is there a sort of margin level that makes sense? And I'm just wondering whether it's accretive or dilutive to the aggregate on the company.

好的。知道了。如果我可以問另一個關於數字的長期問題，這可能也不是你考慮的方式。但是，當我們開始達到更規範的數字業務水平時，是否存在一種有意義的利潤率水平？我只是想知道它對公司的總體而言是增值還是稀釋。

So we can see what other mature -- what operators in other mature non-U.S. markets generate in EBITDA margins. We've got a pretty good track record of being a margin leader. So if you're seeing 25%, 30% away from us, I would expect that ultimately, we're going to do better than that, which should be around in line with the rest of the business.

所以我們可以看到其他成熟的——其他成熟的非美國市場的運營商在 EBITDA 利潤率中產生了什麼。我們在成為利潤領先者方面有著非常好的記錄。因此，如果您看到我們離我們有 25%、30% 的差距，我預計最終我們會做得更好，這應該與其他業務保持一致。

Our next question comes from the line of Daniel Politzer with Wells Fargo.

我們的下一個問題來自富國銀行的 Daniel Politzer。

Tom, I think [when we interacted], you mentioned you still get back to that 50% return on the, call it, $1.1 billion investment. Can you maybe just bridge us from that few hundred million dollars that roll off from the partnerships to how you get to that return? Is it iGaming? Is it sports betting? Is it just general growth of the industry?

湯姆，我認為 [當我們互動時]，您提到您仍然可以從 11 億美元的投資中獲得 50% 的回報。您能否將我們從合作夥伴關係中滾出的幾億美元過渡到您如何獲得回報？是網絡遊戲嗎？是體育博彩嗎？這只是行業的普遍增長嗎？

Clearly, the industry is continuing to grow. We know what's happening with our cost structure, what's going to happen with our cost structure. And we make some assumptions on what we'll be able to do in terms of iGaming as we move forward and very comfortable with that 50% plus return on an annual EBITDA to cumulative EBITDA loss measure.

顯然，該行業正在繼續增長。我們知道我們的成本結構會發生什麼，我們的成本結構會發生什麼。我們對我們在 iGaming 方面能夠做的事情做出一些假設，因為我們向前邁進，並且對每年 EBITDA 與累計 EBITDA 損失衡量的 50% 以上的回報率非常滿意。

Got it. And then just moving to the balance sheet. You've certainly been generating some cash and pulling some levers. What additional levers do you have to reduce your debt from here? How topical is Centaur, in your mind, right now just given we're coming up on a period where it might become more topical? And any other levers that we should be thinking about to reduce debt in short order?

知道了。然後只是轉移到資產負債表。你肯定已經產生了一些現金並拉動了一些槓桿。你有什麼額外的槓桿來減少你的債務？在你看來，Centaur 的熱門程度如何，因為我們正處於一個它可能變得更加熱門的時期？以及我們應該考慮在短期內減少債務的任何其他槓桿嗎？

Yes, so we should be doing something in the neighborhood, if not exceeding, $1 billion of free cash flow in '23. You should expect that will be used to pay down debt. It has always been our expectation that VICI would choose to exercise the call option it has on the Centaur assets that opened in January of this year. It closes towards the end of '24. So VICI has been very clear that they anticipate exercising that option for us. If you run that forward and assume they do it toward the end of that period, that should be about a $2.5 billion inflow to us. So quite substantial, and by then you'll have -- if we do nothing else, you should have another couple of billion dollars of free cash flow that we've generated. Between now and then, the vast majority, we expect to use to pay down debt.

是的，所以我們應該在附近做點什麼，如果不超過 23 年的 10 億美元自由現金流。您應該期望這將用於償還債務。我們一直期望 VICI 會選擇在今年 1 月開盤的 Centaur 資產上行使看漲期權。它在 24 年底關閉。因此，VICI 非常清楚，他們期望為我們行使這一選擇權。如果你向前推進並假設他們在那個時期結束時這樣做，那應該是大約 25 億美元流入我們。如此可觀，到那時你將擁有 - 如果我們不做任何其他事情，你應該還有我們產生的另外幾十億美元的自由現金流。從現在到那時，絕大多數，我們希望用來償還債務。

Our next question comes from the line of Stephen Grambling with Morgan Stanley.

我們的下一個問題來自摩根士丹利的 Stephen Grambling。

As a follow-up to your comments on the digital business hitting the 50% ROI and I think you said 25% to 30% margins, how important is market share as an input in those assumptions? Or zooming out, how do you think about scale benefits for this business in general?

作為您對數字業務達到 50% 投資回報率的評論的後續行動，我認為您說過 25% 到 30% 的利潤率，作為這些假設的輸入，市場份額有多重要？或者縮小，您如何看待該業務的總體規模效益？

We think there's clear benefits to scale in the business, and we expect that we're not going to remain static over time, particularly on the iGaming space. But our -- it's important to me personally that we prove that we can generate the returns that we've laid out for the investments that our shareholders allowed us to make before we're doing any let's go out and try to grab significantly more share through promotions. So you should expect us to be living in this band of market share that we've been living, and that market share is ultimately not a target for us. It's can we get the return on investment that we're looking for as in the brick-and-mortar business [market share] falls out of that. It's not an input.

我們認為擴大業務規模有明顯的好處，我們預計隨著時間的推移我們不會保持靜止，尤其是在 iGaming 領域。但是我們——對我個人來說很重要的是，我們證明我們可以產生我們為股東允許我們進行的投資所安排的回報，然後我們就開始努力爭取更多的份額通過促銷。所以你應該期望我們生活在我們一直生活的這個市場份額範圍內，而這個市場份額最終不是我們的目標。我們能否獲得我們正在尋找的投資回報，因為實體業務 [市場份額] 不在其中。這不是輸入。

Makes sense. And then one other quick follow-up on I think you said $1 billion in free cash flow next year. Within that assumption, do you anticipate being a cash taxpayer, excluding any asset sales? And perhaps just in general, when do you expect to be a cash taxpayer?

說得通。然後另一個快速跟進我認為你說明年有 10 億美元的自由現金流。在這種假設下，您是否預計會成為現金納稅人，不包括任何資產出售？也許只是一般來說，您希望什麼時候成為現金納稅人？

No, we should not be -- we will not be a cash taxpayer in '23. Bret, do you want to talk about...

不，我們不應該——我們不會在 23 年成為現金納稅人。布雷特，你想談談...

Yes, we've got multiple years of runway before we're a taxpayer.

是的，在我們成為納稅人之前，我們已經有多年的跑道了。

Our next question comes from the line of Brandt Montour with Barclays.

我們的下一個問題來自巴克萊銀行的 Brandt Montour。

Just a quick follow-up on the digital side, whoever wants to take it. But just curious on the iCasino road map that you just sort of started to sort of lay out for us. How should we think about any sort of incremental investment for that revised or new road map? And is that manageable within the existing OpEx that you're currently running in the business?

只是在數字方面的快速跟進，誰想接受它。但只是對 iCasino 路線圖感到好奇，您剛剛開始為我們佈局。我們應該如何考慮對該修訂或新路線圖的任何形式的增量投資？在您當前在業務中運行的現有運營支出中，這是否可以管理？

Yes, I think as Tom mentioned, this is a really scalable business. And when you're growing at 120% quarter-over-quarter, we are going to continue to staff up to handle state expansions, product improvements, those types of things, but not to the same pace as revenue and not even close to that level. We will have some slight increases in capitalized labor associated with the iCasino product next year, and any impact to the actual P&L will be fairly minimal.

是的，我認為正如湯姆所說，這是一個真正可擴展的業務。當你的季度環比增長達到 120% 時，我們將繼續增加人員來處理州擴張、產品改進等類型的事情，但速度不會與收入相同，甚至不會接近等級。明年與 iCasino 產品相關的資本化勞動力將略有增加，對實際損益的任何影響都將相當小。

And from a promo perspective, it's a very different business than sports. So while you will see some advertising activity around in local market advertising, our casino product, it's a very different scale in terms of launching the sports business. So certainly, easily manageable within the numbers [that we've laid out] earlier.

從促銷的角度來看，這是一項與體育截然不同的業務。因此，雖然您會在本地市場廣告（我們的賭場產品）中看到一些廣告活動，但在開展體育業務方面，它的規模非常不同。所以當然，在[我們已經列出的]數字範圍內很容易管理。

Great. That's really helpful. And then as a follow-up on Las Vegas, I guess no one's asked this macro question, so I might as well take a shot. But Tom, what are you guys seeing in terms of any sensitivity on the part of your [FIT] customers related to the macro? And as a second part of that, as Las Vegas continues to sort of evolve into a more sports friendly destination, what have you seen from sports-focused travelers in terms of gambling habits? And is that something that's a little bit of a concern? Or is that something that, that seems to be in line with other [agents] in the market?

偉大的。這真的很有幫助。然後作為拉斯維加斯的後續，我想沒有人問過這個宏觀問題，所以我不妨試一試。但是，湯姆，就您的 [FIT] 客戶與宏觀相關的任何敏感性而言，你們看到了什麼？作為其中的第二部分，隨著拉斯維加斯繼續發展成為一個對體育更加友好的目的地，您從以體育為中心的旅行者的賭博習慣方面看到了什麼？這是否有點令人擔憂？或者這似乎與市場上的其他 [代理商] 一致？

Yes, so Brandt, we see the same macro going forward that others see in terms of here's what happens with continued rate rises that [for] the consumer, are we facing a recession. We're not. We're certainly cognizant of what's out there. I can't point you to anything in our business in or out of Vegas that shows any slowdown in the consumer. So we feel very good. October was obviously very strong. You've seen the third quarter. We know what investors are anticipating. We're not seeing that in our business to date nor in the forward metrics that we see -- that we look at in our own business.

是的，所以布蘭特，我們看到了與其他人看到的相同的宏觀前景，即持續加息會發生什麼，[對於]消費者來說，我們是否面臨衰退。不是。我們當然知道那裡有什麼。我無法指出我們在拉斯維加斯內外的任何業務都顯示出消費者的任何放緩。所以我們感覺很好。十月顯然非常強勁。你已經看過第三季了。我們知道投資者在期待什麼。迄今為止，我們沒有在我們的業務中看到這一點，也沒有在我們看到的前瞻性指標中看到這一點——我們在自己的業務中看到了這一點。

And then in terms of sports, sports is -- digital for us, we are getting over $200 million of incremental brick-and-mortar casino play out of customers that were sourced in digital. That number continues to grow. Sports in Vegas, the Raiders have been very, very good for the city, give us additional length of the stays on weekends that they're in town, generates a lot of incremental travel from visiting teams. So that's been really a home run from the city's perspective, and we've been able to benefit.

然後在體育方面，體育對我們來說是數字化的，我們從數字來源的客戶那裡獲得了超過 2 億美元的增量實體賭場遊戲。這個數字還在繼續增長。在維加斯的體育運動中，突襲者隊對這座城市非常非常好，讓我們在周末他們在城裡的逗留時間更長，從客隊那裡產生了很多增量旅行。所以從城市的角度來看，這確實是一個本壘打，我們已經能夠從中受益。

Our next question comes from the line of Chad Beynon with Macquarie.

我們的下一個問題來自麥格理的 Chad Beynon。

Just one last follow-up on Vegas. I think we covered pretty much everything out there. But just on the piece with international, the opportunity to kind of bring that back as a tailwind. What do you think it's going to take to get that business back? Is it passage of time? Is it FX related? Or is it really just kind of the sports and the holidays that bring in that customer maybe more on the VIP side? So when do you think this can kind of inflect?

只是在拉斯維加斯的最後一次跟進。我認為我們涵蓋了幾乎所有內容。但就在與國際合作的情況下，有機會將其作為順風帶回來。您認為要恢復該業務需要採取什麼措施？是時光流逝嗎？跟外匯有關嗎？還是真的只是體育運動和假期帶來的客戶可能更多的是貴賓？那麼你認為這會在什麼時候發生變化？

Yes, we've just started to see that business start to come back over the last quarter or so. Obviously, this Chinese New Year will be the first without, knock on wood, without impact of the virus and with the ability to travel. So that will be something we're watching closely. As you know, here, we've got Adele starting in middle of November. And I can tell you, she is an enormous draw across the board but appeals particularly to that international high-end clientele. So we're excited about that. But Chad, it's been 2.5 years at this point. We understand that those people that were coming to Vegas to play, I don't think they stopped gambling. They found other places to do it when travel was impacted, and that's going to be a long road as we build it back.

是的，我們剛剛開始看到該業務在上個季度左右開始恢復。顯然，這個春節將是第一個沒有敲木頭、沒有病毒影響、有旅行能力的新年。所以這將是我們密切關注的事情。如你所知，在這裡，我們已經讓阿黛爾從 11 月中旬開始。我可以告訴你，她在各方面都是一個巨大的吸引力，但特別吸引國際高端客戶。所以我們對此感到興奮。但是乍得，此時已經 2.5 年了。我們知道那些來拉斯維加斯玩的人，我認為他們並沒有停止賭博。當旅行受到影響時，他們找到了其他地方來做這件事，而當我們重建它時，這將是一條漫長的道路。

(Operator Instructions) Our next question comes from the line of Joe Stauff with Susquehanna.

（操作員說明）我們的下一個問題來自 Susquehanna 的 Joe Stauff。

I just had a question. I believe your annual rent adjusts maybe this month or later this quarter. What does it -- without the CPI caps, can you just give us what that number adjusts to and from? And just wondering, you had mentioned that decision to keep the Strip assets and wondering if that changes the way you think about, say, your investments. Do you have to now invest maybe in some of those older properties as a result of that?

我只是有一個問題。我相信您的年租金可能會在本月或本季度晚些時候調整。它是什麼——沒有 CPI 上限，你能告訴我們這個數字的調整範圍嗎？只是想知道，您曾提到保留拉斯維加斯大道資產的決定，並想知道這是否會改變您對投資的看法。因此，您現在是否必須投資一些較舊的房產？

Joe, on the VICI CPI escalator, it's 8.1%, which started on November 1. And so rent next year should be around $1.285 billion consolidated, including GLPI.

喬，在 VICI CPI 自動扶梯上，它是 8.1%，從 11 月 1 日開始。所以明年的租金應該在 12.85 億美元左右，包括 GLPI。

And in terms of investment, obviously, Joe, we're doing as much EBITDA as we've ever done here. The particular assets that we're talking about had some low-hanging fruit that we were talking to potential buyers about. You shouldn't be surprised if we take advantage of that in the coming 12 to 18 months.

在投資方面，顯然，喬，我們所做的 EBITDA 與我們在這裡所做的一樣多。我們正在談論的特定資產有一些我們正在與潛在買家談論的低調成果。如果我們在未來 12 到 18 個月內利用這一點，您應該不會感到驚訝。

All right. [Thank you, everyone, for your time]. We'll talk to you next quarter.

好的。 [謝謝大家，您的時間]。我們將在下個季度與您交談。

Thanks a lot, everybody.

非常感謝大家。

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

今天的電話會議到此結束。感謝您的參與。您現在可以斷開連接。