Energy of Minas Gerais Co (CIG) 2024 Q2 法說會逐字稿

(audio in progress) George de Magalhaes, and he's going to talk about our results in the second quarter.

（音頻正在進行中）喬治·德·馬加拉斯，他將談論我們第二季度的業績。

Leonardo George de Magalhaes

萊昂納多·喬治·德·馬加良斯

(interpreted)

（解釋）

Good morning, everyone. Thank you very much for being here. This is a very important moment for the company. This is the chance that we have once a year to be here with all the management of the company, RI, investments, and financial but we believe this is a single opportunity where we can be with you.

大家早安。非常感謝您來到這裡。這對公司來說是一個非常重要的時刻。這是我們每年一次與公司、RI、投資和財務的所有管理層一起聚集在這裡的機會，但我們相信這是我們可以與您在一起的唯一機會。

It's important to be here with investor. It's a very important moment for the company. We are having consistent results. It is very clear that the market is happy about the company's results, but this is very consistent for the past few years and we can seize this opportunity, and we want to talk more to you and be here available and be able to talk more about our strategy.

與投資者在一起很重要。這對公司來說是一個非常重要的時刻。我們取得了一致的結果。很明顯，市場對公司的業績感到滿意，但這在過去幾年中是非常一致的，我們可以抓住這個機會，我們希望與您進行更多的交談，並能夠在這裡進行更多的討論我們的策略。

Let me talk about the results. Once again, consistent results. The company in the last years was sometimes 5% lower than the market consensus and sometimes 5% over. This is very consistent. That makes a big difference and this allows us to have consistency and robustness in our results.

我先說一下結果。再次，結果一致。過去幾年，該公司的股價有時比市場預期低 5%，有時高出 5%。這是非常一致的。這產生了很大的差異，使我們的結果具有一致性和穩健性。

And we have interest -- equity in another quarter over BRL430 million in June, without considering the extraordinary dividends. We are among the -- one of the main dividends payment company and with the additional dividends that we have posted in the last month, clearly this is -- we are clearly the highest dividend paying company.

6 月份，我們在另一個季度的權益權益超過 4.3 億雷亞爾，不考慮特別股息。我們是主要股息支付公司之一，加上我們上個月發布的額外股息，顯然我們是股息支付最高的公司。

Also, we have here BRL1.9 billion operating cash generation. We will talk more about that and despite of results being in line, these non-recurring positive events are not neutral, they will be generating more cash to the company or they have reduced the company's risk related to some topics that were in our balance sheet, so we strengthen our situation.

此外，我們還擁有 19 億雷亞爾的營運現金流。我們將更多地討論這一點，儘管結果符合預期，但這些非經常性積極事件並不是中性的，它們將為公司帶來更多現金，或者降低了公司與我們資產負債表中某些主題相關的風險，所以我們加強了我們的情況。

We believe that the non-recurring effects, and this is a huge example, they come from actions of the management that have generated results and reduced the risk as a -- and as a side-effect, that also improved our base for dividends' payment.

我們相信，非經常性影響，這是一個很大的例子，它們來自管理層的行動，這些行動產生了成果並降低了風險，作為副作用，這也改善了我們的股息基礎。

And finally, investments that were posted in the tariff review, this was a very important one, we can highlight that. And further on, we will be hearing the opinion of other Directors. Maybe, Marco Soligo can talk about the tariff review. We doubled the base for Cemig's transmission to BRL2.6 billion.

最後，關稅審查中公佈的投資是非常重要的，我們可以強調這一點。此外，我們也將聽取其他董事的意見。也許，Marco Soligo 可以談談關稅審查。我們將 Cemig 的傳輸基數增加了一倍，達到 26 億雷亞爾。

And in this quarter, we are in the process that all transmission companies that have similar basis to Cemig follow, which is to reconcile the cash flow that was approved by the approved regulator and the cash flow that we use in our projections when we invested and registered these assets in our balance sheets, in our financial statements. We think this is a fair review. All our investments have been accounted for and we do have the capacity of doing investments at a very low cost.

在本季度，我們正處於與 Cemig 具有類似基礎的所有輸電公司遵循的流程中，即協調經批准的監管機構批准的現金流量和我們在投資和投資時在預測中使用的現金流量。登記在我們的資產負債表和財務報表中。我們認為這是一個公平的評論。我們所有的投資都已經入賬，我們確實有能力以非常低的成本進行投資。

We have a scale and we are very optimistic and we are reconciling here to check the effects of this review and they will be accounted for in the third quarter. So we are in this work of reconciling investments, but we believe this was a very positive tariff review for the company. Then we'll talk more about transmission investments. They are very relevant with a return rate that we understand to be very attractive generating value to our shareholders.

我們有一定的規模，我們非常樂觀，我們正在這裡進行協調，以檢查這次審查的效果，並將在第三季度予以考慮。因此，我們正在進行投資協調工作，但我們相信這對公司來說是一次非常積極的關稅審查。然後我們將更多地討論輸電投資。它們與回報率非常相關，我們認為回報率對股東創造價值非常有吸引力。

Now moving forward, this is our investment program. Reynaldo talked a little bit about this, also Marcio and Fernando Passalio about our investments in the past few years. For investments here, you can see, we are very much in line for -- we have invested in the first quarter of almost 40% of total investments for the year and we have a catch-up in other businesses.

現在，這就是我們的投資計劃。雷納爾多（Reynaldo）談到了這一點，馬西奧（Marcio）和費爾南多·帕薩裡奧（Fernando Passalio）也談到了我們過去幾年的投資。對於這裡的投資，你可以看到，我們非常符合——我們在第一季的投資幾乎佔全年總投資的 40%，並且我們在其他業務方面正在迎頭趕上。

But even with investments in generation that is lower than what was forecasted, we are confident that we might be doing investments that were higher than our target. I think we are going to reach the BRL4.4 billion. And also, in transmission distributed generation, we believe that we will be meeting the forecasted for the year as well as gas and a little bit less in generation because I think part of this investment might be transferred to 2025.

但即使發電投資低於預期，我們仍有信心進行高於目標的投資。我認為我們將達到 44 億雷亞爾。此外，在輸電分散式發電方面，我們相信我們將實現今年的預測以及天然氣和發電量的預測，因為我認為部分投資可能會轉移到 2025 年。

But total, we should be investing close to BRL6 billion this year, very relevant when we consider our history, we used to invest -- we invested BRL1 billion in 2018, now we are going to invest BRL6 billion in 2024, but when compared to last year, we see 40% higher. So the company adjusted itself to the level of investments that is much higher than what we had in the past. And as Reynaldo reminded us, part of this investment is already contracted.

但總的來說，我們今年應該投資接近60 億雷亞爾，當我們考慮到我們的歷史時，這非常相關，我們過去投資- 我們在2018 年投資了10 億雷亞爾，現在我們將在2024 年投資60 億雷亞爾，但與去年，我們看到成長了 40%。因此，公司進行了自我調整，投資水準遠高於我們過去的水準。正如雷納爾多提醒我們的那樣，部分投資已經簽訂合約。

Now moving forward, here we have consolidated results for the second quarter. As we mentioned, consolidated EBITDA almost 30% higher than last year, including non-recurring items, and in line with last year, both in the net profit as well as in the EBITDA when we exclude the non-recurring effects.

現在，我們在這裡匯總第二季的業績。正如我們所提到的，合併 EBITDA 比去年高出近 30%（包括非經常性項目），並且在排除非經常性影響時，無論是淨利潤還是 EBITDA 都與去年持平。

And last year, the trading company results for a lot of reasons, it was very positive. It's still positive this year, but last year because of the convergence of factors that were positive, it brought exceptional results, allowing the non-recurring EBITDA to be close to '24 to '23, but it's good to highlight the recurring as well. So the review of profit-sharing distribution, we were able to revert BRL600 million because we still already have a chance of winning BRL800 million that are provisioned in our balance sheet.

去年，由於許多原因，貿易公司的業績非常積極。今年仍然是積極的，但去年由於積極因素的融合，帶來了非凡的結果，使非經常性 EBITDA 接近 24 至 23 年，但強調經常性也是好的。因此，在審查利潤分享分配時，我們能夠恢復 6 億雷亞爾，因為我們仍然有機會贏得資產負債表中撥備的 8 億雷亞爾。

This is also, thanks to the actions you have taken, the voluntary dismissal program, almost 400 employees that enrolled in the program, that also have a very quick return in less than a year. We can have the payback of the program with the employees that are here for longer, they will receive indemnity and then when we can hire employees that are beginning their career with lower wages and here, we recycle our team. It helps changing our -- the company's culture. We believe that this is a very important investment.

這也是由於你們所採取的行動，自願解僱計劃，近 400 名參加該計劃的員工，也在不到一年的時間裡得到了非常快的回報。我們可以讓在這裡工作時間較長的員工獲得該計劃的回報，他們將獲得賠償，然後當我們可以僱用以較低工資開始職業生涯的員工時，我們會回收我們的團隊。它有助於改變我們公司的文化。我們認為這是一項非常重要的投資。

Now, the issue related to PASEP, PIS, and Cofins; we have returned the BRL6 billion in fiscal gains that we had in this lawsuit, and with this refund, we were able to reconcile our updating criteria of that obligation. Therefore, reverting BRL400 million refers to net profit of BRL271 million.

現在，問題與 PASEP、PIS 和 Cofins 相關；我們已經退還了在該訴訟中獲得的 60 億雷亞爾的財政收益，透過這筆退款，我們能夠協調該義務的更新標準。因此，恢復4億雷亞爾是指淨利2.71億雷亞爾。

Another non-recurring effect that is significant. There is a lawsuit that involves trading company with a large client and we are appealing, but we have provisioned that in this quarter, but we did not give up. We believe that we might win it back. And this is the update that can generate cash. Cemig, few years ago, appealed against the criteria related to workers' legislation.

另一個重要的非重複性影響。有一個涉及大客戶的貿易公司的訴訟，我們正在上訴，但我們在本季度已經對此進行了規定，但我們沒有放棄。我們相信我們可以贏回它。這是可以產生現金的更新。幾年前，塞米格對與工人立法相關的標準提出了上訴。

This is the workers' meal program and just now we were awarded that lawsuit. So these are neutral. If they're not neutral, they are positives as well, and also they hedge because of the FX went up in the last quarter, we did see an effect in our financial statements. And remember that the company's hedge has to do with the bonds that have the final installment of $380 million now at the end of the year.

這是工人膳食計劃，剛才我們贏得了那場訴訟。所以這些都是中性的。如果它們不是中性的，它們也是積極的，並且由於上個季度的外匯上漲，它們也進行了對沖，我們確實在我們的財務報表中看到了影響。請記住，該公司的對沖與今年年底最後一筆 3.8 億美元的債券有關。

Now moving on costs and operating expenses. If we remove the voluntary dismissal program, our obligations were up 1.7% a year when quarterly-on-quarterly comparison lower than the inflation. And as Reynaldo mentioned here, we -- expenses for third parties also our services are improving or increasing actually and this is our concern of really serving the clients.

現在討論成本和營運費用。如果我們取消自願解僱計劃，我們的義務每年增加 1.7%，而季度環比低於通貨膨脹率。正如雷納爾多在這裡提到的，我們的第三方費用以及我們的服務實際上正在改善或增加，這是我們真正為客戶服務的焦點。

We see the society now is demanding a better service and our challenge is to spend on the right place, to spend more in the maintenance operation, and less in other process in a way that the company's costs are still disciplined, growing in a disciplined fashion with no pressure in the operating efficiency of the company and improving quality of service to clients.

我們看到現在社會需要更好的服務，我們面臨的挑戰是把錢花在正確的地方，在維護作業上花更多的錢，在其他流程上花更少的錢，從而使公司的成本仍然有紀律，以有紀律的方式成長。

And at the same time, also related to financial obligations. We have over BRL200 million expenses last year. We are working internally to reduce those. That means that with investments we are able to reduce our financial compensations because we start providing better quality services.

同時，也涉及財務義務。去年我們的開支超過 2 億雷亞爾。我們正在內部努力減少這些。這意味著透過投資，我們能夠減少經濟補償，因為我們開始提供更優質的服務。

And then we can also decrease the fees that we pay to clients. Therefore, we were able to bring down in six months around BRL38 million in fees related to regulatory compensations and this is because of ANEEL Resolution 1000. This is important and we are continuously working in reducing these indemnity penalties.

然後我們還可以減少支付給客戶的費用。因此，我們能夠在六個月內減少約 3,800 萬雷亞爾的監管補償相關費用，這要歸功於 ANEEL 1000 號決議。這很重要，我們正在不斷努力減少這些賠償處罰。

This is the cash flow of the company. We generate a lot of cash and we have a lot of investments to be made. We generated BRL3.5 billion in this quarter, and this half of year between BRL7 billion to BRL8 billion of annual cash generation. This is what we generate in terms of cash annually and we ended the cash with BRL3 billion in the first half of 2024 but we will be using that in our operations and investments that will be done for next month.

這是公司的現金流量。我們產生大量現金，並且有大量投資要做。本季我們創造了 35 億雷亞爾的現金，今年上半年的年度現金創造量在 70 億雷亞爾到 80 億雷亞爾之間。這就是我們每年產生的現金，我們在 2024 年上半年結束了 30 億雷亞爾的現金，但我們將在下個月完成的營運和投資中使用這些現金。

This is the consolidated debt profile. This is close to one-time the EBITDA but in a constant fashion. Now, we go to the market. We have to bring funds to the market. So we went to the market to look for resources and our distribution generates between BRL3 billion to BRL3.5 billion in cash generation annually. So we have investments of BRL4.5 billion. That is, we are going to source funds from the market constantly. This is already increasing and it will be increasing up to the next review, close to 2.5 times in 2027.

這是綜合債務狀況。這接近一次性 EBITDA，但保持不變。現在，我們去市場。我們必須將資金引入市場。因此我們去市場尋找資源，我們的分銷每年產生 30 億至 35 億雷亞爾的現金。因此，我們的投資額為 45 億雷亞爾。也就是說，我們要不斷地從市場上獲取資金。這一數字已經在增加，並且到下一次審查時還將增加，到 2027 年接近 2.5 倍。

But we believe that we are very comfortable and our objective now is to turn the debt profile more adequate. There is a more concentrated growth in '25 and '26. And we want to turn this average term of [data] that is more adequate to the upcoming issuances with -- and this is the company's objective.

但我們相信，我們已經很舒服了，我們現在的目標是讓債務狀況變得更充足。'25 和 '26 的成長更為集中。我們希望將[數據]的平均期限轉變為更適合即將發行的產品——這就是公司的目標。

This is Cemig's D results. With a good result, we will look at the next slide, volume of sale of energy. But we see that in regards to the prior quarter, these results were great, whether including recurring events or not, that's a good result. And there was a month here where the results included the tariff adjustments that happened in May '28, but we understand that Cemig D is at another level now.

這是Cemig 的D 結果。有了好的結果，我們將看下一張投影片，即能源銷售量。但我們看到，就上一季而言，這些結果都很棒，無論是否包括重複事件，這都是一個很好的結果。有一個月的結果包括 28 年 5 月發生的關稅調整，但我們知道 Cemig D 現在處於另一個水平。

It had an EBITDA close to BRL1 billion in 2018 and now it's an EBITDA close to BRL3 billion, BRL3.5 billion. Without considering the ramp-up that we will have in 2028 with a tariff review, this is the energy market. We grew 2.9 even with DG growing 33% and we had an improvement here of 2.9%. If we exclude DG, the market would grow more.

2018 年，該公司的 EBITDA 接近 10 億雷亞爾，現在的 EBITDA 接近 30 億雷亞爾、35 億雷亞爾。如果不考慮 2028 年關稅審查帶來的成長，這就是能源市場。儘管 DG 成長了 33%，但我們還是成長了 2.9%，這裡的成長為 2.9%。如果我們排除 DG，市場將會成長更多。

The minas gerais market is not as elastic in terms of temperature like Rio and Northeast, but even then it was a significant growth. But then you can see that transported energy improved to 6%, a small reduction in the capital market. But even with the residential growing 7% and the other classes being reduced because of the competition of DG or GD and also retail market.

米納斯吉拉斯州市場的溫度彈性不如裡約熱內盧和東北部地區，但即便如此，其成長仍顯著。但隨後你可以看到，運輸能源提高到了 6%，資本市場小幅下降。但即使住宅成長了 7%，而其他類別則由於 DG 或 GD 以及零售市場的競爭而減少。

But even then, in a total, our market was a market that we understand that had an improvement in 3%, and even with the pressure of GD, it was a relevant growth. This is our operating efficiency. Considering non-recurring effects, it was 22% lower than regulatory one.

但即便如此，總的來說，我們的市場是一個據我們了解有 3% 改善的市場，即使有 GD 的壓力，這也是一個相關的成長。這就是我們的營運效率。考慮到非經常性影響，比監管低22%。

But even excluding non-recurring events, we had OpEx within the regulatory OpEx, 2.4%. But remember, last year, the EBITDA ratio here is 10% lower than regulatory. We mentioned at the time that, that was temporary and our commitment was that within the year we have our EBITDA that is higher than the regulatory and that 10% gap is already down 2.4% and we believe that for the next quarters, we'll be able to have an EBITDA higher than the regulatory one as we have done in the prior year since 2021 and OpEx also under the regulatory limit.

但即使排除非經常性事件，我們的營運支出也處於監管營運支出 2.4% 之內。但請記住，去年，這裡的 EBITDA 比率比監管水準低 10%。我們當時提到，這是暫時的，我們的承諾是，年內我們的 EBITDA 高於監管水平，10% 的差距已經下降了 2.4%，我們相信在接下來的幾個季度，我們將能夠讓EBITDA 高於監管水平，就像我們自2021 年以來上一年所做的那樣，並且營運支出也低於監管限額。

This is a commitment and they are very important for us. We want to be within the regulatory coverages. And even being a state-owned company, we have some extra costs that private companies do not have, such as post-employment benefits. That's very specific for the company, we pay that. This brings an additional expense to the company, but even with these additional costs, they are covered by our tariffs.

這是一個承諾，對我們來說非常重要。我們希望處於監管範圍內。即使是國營企業，我們也有一些私人企業沒有的額外成本，例如離職後福利。這對公司來說是非常具體的，我們付錢。這給公司帶來了額外的費用，但即使有這些額外的費用，它們也包含在我們的關稅中。

Here, we have Cemig GT results. Once again, last year was an exceptional year for the trading company, but even excluding the non-recurring effects, we see that the results were very close in '24 compared to '23. And last year, as we said, was the year where we had energy restriction in the Northeast, therefore we were short in the Southeast market.

在這裡，我們有 Cemig GT 結果。去年對這家貿易公司來說又是不平凡的一年，但即使排除非經常性影響，我們也發現 24 年的結果與 23 年的結果非常接近。去年我們也說了，是我們東北地區能源限購的一年，所以我們在東南市場上是做空的。

We were able to acquire energy at a very low price and that increased the margin of the trading company. In addition to that, the contracts with clients had a greater margin than this year we had already announced that to the market. And the prior year, Cemig Day, when we presented the margins for the next years, we're already showing that 2023 was an amazing number. 2024 also would be a great number, but not as in 2023. Of course, Cemig today is a trading company that when compared to the market is an outlier.

我們能夠以非常低的價格獲得能源，這增加了貿易公司的利潤。除此之外，與客戶的合約比今年我們已經向市場宣布的利潤更高。去年，Cemig Day，當我們介紹未來幾年的利潤時，我們已經表明 2023 年是一個驚人的數字。 2024 年也會是一個很大的數字，但不會像 2023 年那樣。當然，今天的 Cemig 是一家與市場相比是異類的貿易公司。

We have superior results when compared to the average of the market. Considering the company's expertise and also our characteristics of being not only a peer-trading company, but also being a generating company that allows us to have margin levels much higher than our competitors.

與市場平均相比，我們取得了優異的成績。考慮到公司的專業知識以及我們不僅是一家同業交易公司，而且還是一家發電公司的特點，這使我們的利潤水平遠高於競爭對手。

Here we have our EBITDA per segment and this is the beauty of being a company with a number of businesses and we'll talk about gas in the next slide, but this was a quarter that was very good for distributing company. Generation was basically in line here. We transferred here the contracts for the trading company, which had a lower result than last year. Last year, as I just said, had an exceptional result, but we believe that [BRL143 million], if we were to annualize those results, we would have a result that would be over BRL600 million, but first quarter was much higher than that.

這裡我們有每個細分市場的 EBITDA，這是一家擁有眾多業務的公司的美妙之處，我們將在下一張幻燈片中討論天然氣，但這個季度對於分銷公司來說非常好。這裡的世代基本上是一致的。我們把貿易公司的合約轉移到這裡，結果比去年還要低。正如我剛才所說，去年取得了出色的業績，但我們相信[1.43億雷亞爾]，如果我們將這些結果按年化，我們將獲得超過6億雷亞爾的業績，但第一季遠高於這個數字。

We believe that the trading company will be delivering now results that are very positive as well. And then our gas business. We have a worse result, 7.1%, but here there are two factors. One, the industrial market had a reduction because of a big customer of GASMIG, reducing their consumption and this affected the GASMIG revenue and the regulatory assets are off balance.

我們相信，貿易公司現在也將取得非常正面的成果。然後是我們的天然氣業務。我們的結果更差，為 7.1%，但這裡有兩個因素。一是工業市場因為GASMIG的大客戶減少了消費，影響了GASMIG的收入，監管資產失衡。

This is called compensatory parcel. It's out of the balance sheet. And last year, they were able to offset that to build BRL24 million of this regulatory asset, which made the result last year to be higher, but annualizing it, the EBIT is greater than BRL900 million, which is extraordinary, a great result.

這稱為補償包裹。它已經脫離了資產負債表。去年，他們能夠抵消這一影響，建立了2400 萬雷亞爾的監管資產，這使得去年的結果更高，但按年計算，息稅前利潤超過9 億雷亞爾，這是一個非凡的、偉大的結果。

A company that is not leveraged, it is a cash cow. A company with a concession until 2053, with the whole market to be tapped into, and we are going to hear more about that when we speak more with the VPs, the officers, and the CEOs of the different companies of the group.

沒有槓桿的公司，就是搖錢樹。這家公司在2053 年之前擁有特許經營權，可以進入整個市場，當我們與該集團不同公司的副總裁、管理人員和首席執行官進行更多交談時，我們將聽到更多關於這一點的訊息。

Here, we have the commitments. It's delivering on our commitments. This is how we are executing our strategy. I mentioned to some of you, if you access the Cemig website and if you look at 2021, the Cemig Day, our presentation in Cemig Day, if you look at our strategy and what we've achieved so far, you will clearly see that 2021 was not just lip service.

在這裡，我們有承諾。它正在兌現我們的承諾。這就是我們執行戰略的方式。我向你們中的一些人提到，如果您訪問Cemig 網站，如果您查看2021 年Cemig Day，我們在Cemig Day 中的演示，如果您查看我們的策略以及我們迄今為止所取得的成就，您會清楚地看到2021 年不只是口頭說說而已。

We did execute our strategy. We said that we invested in regulated assets. We said that we were going to invest in the distribution company, divest from distressed assets where we didn't have any control that we would get more operating efficiency and we were able to deliver on all that.

我們確實執行了我們的策略。我們說過我們投資於受監管的資產。我們說過，我們將投資分銷公司，剝離我們沒有任何控制權的不良資產，這樣我們就能獲得更高的營運效率，而且我們能夠實現這一切。

These are the commitments achieved, the ones in progress, and the future challenges and opportunities where we included technologies for energy transition. We'll have an opportunity to speak more about this during this Cemig Day. So, to conclude, this was a quarter with very solid results for the company. We believe that we are continue (inaudible)--

這些是已實現的承諾、正在進行的承諾以及我們納入能源轉型技術的未來挑戰和機會。我們將有機會在 Cemig Day 期間更多地討論這一問題。因此，總而言之，這是該公司業績非常強勁的一個季度。我們相信我們會繼續（聽不清楚）——

Portions of this transcript that are marked (interpreted) were spoken by an interpreter present on the live call. The interpreter was provided by the company sponsoring this event.

此文字記錄中標記（翻譯）的部分是由現場通話中的口譯員說出的。口譯員由贊助本次活動的公司提供。