Charter Communications Inc (CHTR) 2025 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Hello, and welcome to Charter Communications' fourth-quarter 2025 investor conference call. (Operator Instructions) Also, as a reminder, this conference is being recorded today. If you have any objections, please disconnect at this time.

您好，歡迎參加Charter Communications 2025年第四季投資人電話會議。 （操作說明）另請注意，本次會議正在錄音。如有任何異議，請立即斷開連接。

I will now turn the call over to Stefan Anninger.

現在我將把通話轉交給斯特凡·安寧格。

Thanks, operator, and welcome, everyone.

謝謝接線員，歡迎各位。

The presentation that accompanies this call can be found on our website, ir.charter.com. I would like to remind you that there are a number of risk factors and other cautionary statements contained in our SEC filings, and we encourage you to read them carefully.

本次電話會議的簡報可在我們的網站ir.charter.com上找到。我想提醒各位，我們向美國證券交易委員會提交的文件中包含一些風險因素和其他警示性聲明，我們建議您仔細閱讀。

Various remarks that we make on this call concerning expectations, predictions, plans, and prospects constitute forward-looking statements, which are subject to risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ from historical or anticipated results. Any forward-looking statements reflect management's current view only, and Charter undertakes no obligation to revise or update such statements.

我們在本次電話會議中就預期、預測、計畫和前景所作的各種表述均構成前瞻性陳述，這些陳述受風險和不確定性因素的影響，可能導致實際結果與歷史結果或預期結果存在差異。任何前瞻性陳述僅反映管理層目前的觀點，Charter公司不承擔修訂或更新此類陳述的義務。

As a reminder, all growth rates noted on this call and in the presentation are calculated on a year-over-year basis unless otherwise specified.

再次提醒，除非另有說明，本次電話會議和簡報中提及的所有成長率均以年比計算。

On today's call, we have Chris Winfrey, our President and CEO; and Jessica Fischer, our CFO.

今天的電話會議上，我們有總裁兼執行長克里斯·溫弗瑞，以及財務長傑西卡·費雪。

With that, let's turn the call over to Chris.

那麼，讓我們把電話交給克里斯吧。

Thanks, Stefan.

謝謝你，斯特凡。

In 2025, we continued to compete for customers by delivering great products at great prices with continuously improving service. We added nearly 2 million mobile lines for growth of 19%, and we remained the fastest-growing mobile provider in the United States.

2025年，我們繼續透過提供價格優惠的優質產品和不斷改進的服務來吸引客戶。我們新增了近200萬條行動線路，成長率達19%，並持續維持美國成長速度最快的行動營運商地位。

In Video, we dramatically reduced our Video losses, and in the fourth quarter, we grew our Video customers despite well-known headwinds. The Video product improvements we've made over the past two years, which improve connectivity relationships, are having an impact.

在視訊業務方面，我們大幅降低了視訊業務的虧損，並且在第四季度，儘管面臨眾所周知的不利因素，我們的視訊客戶數量仍然實現了成長。過去兩年我們對視訊產品的改進，提升了連結關係，這些改進正在產生積極影響。

In Internet, competition for new customers remains high, but customer losses improved year over year. Our revenue was down about 0.5% in 2025, driven by customer losses and a challenging political advertising comparison, while EBITDA grew by about 0.5%. The operating environment for new sales, in particular Internet, continues to reflect low move rates and higher mobile substitution, along with both expanded cell phone internet competition and fiber overlap growth similar to earlier in the year. Collectively, that drove fourth-quarter Internet sales slightly lower year over year.

在網路領域，新客戶競爭依然激烈，但客戶流失情況較前一年改善。受客戶流失和政治廣告業務年比基數較高的影響，我們預計2025年的營收將下降約0.5%，而息稅折舊攤提前利潤（EBITDA）則成長了約0.5%。新銷售（尤其是網路銷售）的經營環境依然低迷，行動網路用戶流失率居高不下，同時，行動網路競爭加劇，光纖網路覆蓋範圍重疊成長的情況與年初類似。這些因素共同導致第四季網路銷售額較去年同期略有下降。

Churn improved year over year, as expected, given last year's ACP-related impacts. And Internet churn, including non-pay churn, remains at low levels.

正如預期，考慮到去年與ACP相關的因素，客戶流失率較去年同期有所改善。而且，包括非付費用戶在內的網路用戶流失率仍處於較低水準。

With 2026 in full swing, our shareholders should know that we are a highly competitive group, and we intend to win in the residential and business connectivity marketplace. In this environment, getting back to positive net additions is a game of inches. We're incredibly focused on: one, more clearly messaging our superior value and utility; and two, providing the best-quality service in the market in a way that is recognized by our customers and our service is a competitive advantage.

2026年已全面展開，我們的股東應該了解，我們是一家極具競爭力的公司，我們的目標是在住宅和商業網路連接市場中取得成功。在目前環境下，實現淨新增使用者數為正，需要精打細算。我們目前正全力以赴：第一，更清楚地傳達我們卓越的價值和實用性；第二，以客戶認可的方式提供市場上最優質的服務，使我們的服務成為我們的競爭優勢。

Let me go through how I believe we'll win. Assuming regulatory approval of Cox, Spectrum will cover over 70 million households, which gives us additional scale to develop new products and services, serve more business customers, and save customers significant money. In 2026, we'll nearly complete our rural buildout, providing us with over 1.7 million new subsidized rural passings with growth for years to come, as well as upside from the densification of higher growth areas in places like Texas, Florida, and the Carolinas.

讓我來解釋一下我認為我們如何才能獲勝。假設 Cox 獲得監管部門批准，Spectrum 將覆蓋超過 7,000 萬戶家庭，這將使我們擁有更大的規模來開發新產品和服務，服務更多企業客戶，並為客戶節省大量資金。到 2026 年，我們將基本完成農村地區的網路建設，屆時我們將新增超過 170 萬個補貼農村寬頻接入點，並且未來幾年還將持續成長。此外，隨著德克薩斯州、佛羅裡達州和卡羅來納州等高成長地區的網路密度增加，我們也將獲得進一步的成長。

We're gig-capable everywhere. And by the end of this year, 50% of the current Spectrum network will be upgraded to symmetrical and multi-gig service, with significant work on the remaining 50% in flight and moving to completion in 2027. Those capabilities matter long term as customer data usage continues to increase, and we're working with content owners in Silicon Valley to create applications and next-generation products like Spectrum Front Row. That's immersive content with Apple and the NBA that makes full use of our ubiquitously deployed, largely fallow, fiber-based network.

我們已實現全網千兆傳輸。今年底，Spectrum現有網路的50%將升級為對稱多千兆服務，剩餘50%的升級工作也在緊鑼密鼓地進行中，預計2027年完成。隨著客戶資料使用量的持續成長，這些能力至關重要。我們正與矽谷的內容所有者合作，開發應用程式和下一代產品，例如Spectrum Front Row。 Spectrum Front Row是與蘋果和NBA合作的沉浸式內容，充分利用了我們廣泛部署、目前大部分閒置的光纖網路。

Bandwidth-rich products have always followed our network capabilities. And think of the last few hundred feet of our fiber-powered network as 1.8 gigahertz of continuous spectrum, delivered at full capacity to each individual home and business, with the ability to play cellular radios nearly everywhere along the way, fiber deep, power, and right-of-way.

頻寬豐富的產品始終與我們的網路能力相符。不妨將我們光纖網路的最後幾百英尺視為 1.8 吉赫茲的連續頻譜，以全容量傳輸到每個家庭和企業，並且幾乎可以在沿途任何地方播放蜂窩無線電訊號，這得益於光纖深度、電力供應和通行權。

We already have a fully converged connectivity service and 100% of our footprint, now with expanding hybrid MNO capabilities through CBRS and Wi-Fi to drive our seamless connectivity advantage at gigabit speeds wherever you go. So data usage will continue to increase for both wired and wireless networks, and customers don't know or care which network they're on as they move about; it just has to work. That is the service we uniquely provide.

我們已擁有完全融合的連接服務，覆蓋範圍達100%，現在更透過CBRS和Wi-Fi擴展混合行動網路營運商（MNO）功能，無論您身在何處，都能享受千兆級的無縫連接優勢。因此，有線和無線網路的資料使用量都將持續成長，而使用者在行動過程中無需了解或關心自己連接的是哪個網路；網路必須穩定可靠。這正是我們獨有的服務優勢。

In Mobile, we have a structural and strategic mobile reselling agreement with Verizon for current and future services and will launch an additional MVNO for business with T-Mobile in the next six months. Nearly 90% of Spectrum mobile traffic goes over our network already at higher speeds, making us the fastest mobile operator with the best prices. Mobile is profitable, it will continue to grow and improves broadband churn meaningfully with the opportunity to drive more internet sales.

在行動業務方面，我們與Verizon簽訂了結構性和策略性的行動轉售協議，涵蓋當前和未來的服務。未來六個月內，我們將與T-Mobile合作推出企業的行動虛擬網路營運商（MVNO）。 Spectrum近90%的行動流量已透過我們的網路以更高的速度傳輸，這使我們成為速度最快、價格最優的行動營運商。行動業務獲利能力強勁，並將持續成長，顯著降低寬頻用戶流失率，並有望推動更多網路銷售。

Our network carries more mobile traffic than any operator in our footprint. So we are a facilities-based provider of mobile services with 5G macro cell towers as backup. Our owners economics of a differentiated network create long-term advantage, which means we can save customers over a $1,000 in a single year with Internet and Mobile. And now, we can do the same with Video.

我們的網路承載的行動流量比覆蓋範圍內的任何其他營運商都多。因此，我們是一家以基礎設施為基礎的行動服務供應商，並以5G宏基地台作為備用方案。我們憑藉差異化網路帶來的經濟效益，實現了長期優勢，這意味著我們每年可以為客戶節省超過1000美元的網路和行動費用。現在，我們也可以在視訊服務方面做到這一點。

Our Video product and platform is now a killer app. When our Video customers activate their included apps, video and broadband churn improvement is meaningful. Our Video product can become another unique selling tool. Seamless entertainment with all the key programmer apps included as part of our service over $125 of value per month. And finally, customers have a platform in Xumo that brings unified search and discovery for all your live TV and apps: utility and value.

我們的視訊產品和平台如今已成為一款殺手級應用。當我們的視訊用戶啟動其包含的應用程式後，視訊和寬頻用戶的流失率將顯著降低。我們的視訊產品有望成為另一個獨特的賣點。所有主流節目應用程式均包含在我們的服務中，每月價值超過 125 美元，為您帶來無縫娛樂體驗。此外，Xumo 平台還為用戶提供統一的搜尋和發現功能，方便您找到所有直播電視和應用程式：實用且極具價值。

At Spectrum, we've made huge investments in our 100% US-based sales and service over the past five years, with our own employees whose tenure and skill improve each month, supported by market-leading pay and benefits. That investment is already made, and it is a competitive advantage. And we continue to invest in technology, including AI, to increase customer satisfaction through self-service where customers want and enhancing our employee service capabilities. That's across sales, call center services, field operations, and the network itself.

過去五年，Spectrum 對我們 100% 美國本土的銷售和服務團隊進行了大量投資。我們的員工經驗豐富、技能精湛，每月都在進步，並享有業內領先的薪酬和福利。這項投資已然到位，並成為我們的競爭優勢。我們將繼續投資於包括人工智慧在內的技術，透過提供客戶所需的自助服務並提升員工服務能力，從而提高客戶滿意度。這些投入涵蓋銷售、呼叫中心服務、現場營運以及網路本身。

In 2026, for the first time, granule incentives will include Net Promoter Scores. We have competitive advantage with our service capabilities, and we're going to make sure we earn credit, the reputation that reflects that significant investment from our customers one by one.

2026年，我們將首次把淨推薦值（NPS）納入細化激勵機制。憑藉卓越的服務能力，我們擁有競爭優勢，我們將努力贏得客戶的信任和認可，以彰顯我們對客戶的重大投入。

And we're going to guarantee all of it. We'll guarantee Internet service through a new Invincible Wi-Fi product we'll launch in February, symmetrical and multi-gigabit service with a Wi-Fi 7 router and battery backup and backup 5G service, seamlessly switched on the same SSID for storms or outage, as well as Wi-Fi 7 extenders for larger homes. Invincible Wi-Fi is a market-first product combining Wi-Fi 7 with 5G and battery backup.

我們將為所有服務提供保障。我們將透過二月即將推出的全新 Invincible Wi-Fi 產品來保障您的網路服務。該產品配備 Wi-Fi 7 路由器、備用電池和備用 5G 服務，提供對稱多千兆網絡，即使在暴風雨或斷網情況下也能無縫切換到相同的 SSID。此外，我們也提供適用於大型住宅的 Wi-Fi 7 擴充器。 Invincible Wi-Fi 是市場上首款將 Wi-Fi 7、5G 和備用電池完美結合的產品。

Over a year ago, we deployed the nation's first wireline and wireless service commitment, guaranteeing transparency, reliability, and same-day installation and service. Internally, we're now moving that service window target to two hours, and one hour for business, at your doorstep from the time you call. None of our competitors match our service here.

一年多前，我們推出了全國首個有線和無線服務承諾，保證服務的透明度、可靠性以及當日安裝和服務。現在，我們內部正在將服務窗口期目標縮短至兩小時，企業用戶則縮短至一小時，從您致電之日起即可享受上門服務。在這方面，我們的競爭對手都無法匹敵。

In addition to backing our customer service guarantee with credits, beginning in February, we'll now guarantee you $1,000 of savings per year when you take Internet and two lines of Mobile from Spectrum. If we can't save you $1,000 or more when compared to the big three telco carriers, we'll credit the difference on your bill during the first year.

除了以優惠形式兌現我們的客戶服務承諾外，從二月開始，如果您選擇Spectrum的網路服務和兩條手機線路，我們將保證您每年節省1000美元。如果與三大電信業者相比，我們無法為您節省1000美元或更多，我們將在第一年內將差額計入您的帳單。

Guaranteed connectivity, guaranteed service, and guaranteed savings -- with the best products in the US uniquely serviced by US employees 24 by 7. We want to be America's connectivity company, with hyperlocal service delivered by your neighbors, who are our local employees, and with community investment, including unbiased hyperlocal Spectrum news.

保證連接、保證服務和保證節省——我們提供美國最好的產品，並由美國員工提供 24 小時全天候服務。我們希望成為美國的網路連結公司，由您的鄰居（我們的本地員工）提供超在地化服務，並進行社區投資，包括提供公正的超本地化 Spectrum 新聞。

All of this will expand to Cox following closing, assuming regulatory approvals. Our plan there is to introduce Spectrum pricing and packaging, rapidly grow Mobile, similarly return to Internet growth, and given Cox's low Video penetration and our capabilities, we expect to grow Video in the Cox footprint for a period of time as well. I also believe the combination of our very complementary B2B capabilities will create growth synergies we didn't anticipate when we did the deal.

所有這些舉措都將在交易完成後擴展至Cox，前提是獲得監管部門的批准。我們的計劃是引入頻譜定價和套餐服務，快速發展行動業務，並同樣恢復網路業務的成長。鑑於Cox的視訊普及率較低，而我們擁有相應的能力，我們預計在一段時間內，Cox覆蓋範圍內的視訊業務也將實現成長。此外，我相信我們雙方高度互補的B2B能力結合，將產生我們在交易之初未曾預料到的成長綜效。

Winning connectivity relationships in a cyclical and newly competitive environment is a game of inches. I'm not projecting broadband relationship growth this year. But we expect to see an improved trajectory from the investments we've made over the past three years.

在週期性波動且競爭日益激烈的環境中，贏得網路連結關係是一場寸土必爭的博弈。我預計今年寬頻業務關係不會成長，但我們期待過去三年投資帶來的正面影響能夠逐步改善這一局面。

The recipe for winning here is simple: best connectivity, best overall value, with the best service. And we aren't perfect and we own our mistakes with customers, but we are improving the way we communicate our value, utility, and quality service across our footprint. But I do believe we're the best positioned company in the connectivity industry and we will get better.

制勝之道很簡單：最佳連結、最佳整體價值和最佳服務。我們並非完美無缺，也勇於承認對客戶造成的錯誤，但我們正在不斷改進，努力提升我們在服務覆蓋範圍內傳遞價值、實用性和優質服務的方式。我相信，我們是連結產業中最具優勢的公司，我們會做得更好。

From a financial perspective, we expect our operating plan to deliver EBITDA growth this year. And the investments we've made to lower service transactions and our efficiency programs, including early benefits from customer- and employee-focused AI tools, will continue to provide a tailwind for many years to come.

從財務角度來看，我們預計今年的營運計劃將實現 EBITDA 成長。此外，我們為降低服務交易量和推動效率提升專案所做的投資，包括以客戶和員工為中心的 AI 工具帶來的早期效益，將在未來多年持續推動公司發展。

2025 was our peak year of capital expenditure. And capital expenditures after this year will decline significantly. Free cash flow will take off from an already significant amount. We expect our capital intensity to return to 13% to 14% of revenue by 2028 at Charter standalone. And we can probably do the same even with the Cox integration.

2025年是我們資本支出的高峰年份。此後，資本支出將大幅下降。自由現金流將在此基礎上進一步成長。我們預計，到2028年，Charter獨立營運時的資本密集度將恢復到收入的13%至14%。即使整合了Cox，我們也可能實現同樣的目標。

One of the bigger debates around Charter has been about the best way to deploy our significant free cash flow, and that cash flow is meaningful. It's about to become much larger. Debating how to allocate that cash flow is a first-class problem to have in my mind -- and Jessica will provide an update on our balance sheet strategy and capital return priorities in a moment -- but the key focus for me and real driver, the team and for value creation of our company, is to make sure we deliver long-term customer, EBITDA, and cash flow growth and demonstrate that long-term growth rate for investors along the way. If we do that, the rest will take care of itself.

圍繞Charter的一大爭論點在於如何最佳利用我們可觀的自由現金流，而這筆現金流意義重大，而且即將變得更加龐大。在我看來，如何分配這筆現金流是一個至關重要的問題——Jessica稍後會就我們的資產負債表策略和資本回報重點進行更新——但對我、團隊以及公司價值創造而言，關鍵在於確保我們實現客戶數量、EBITDA和現金流的長期增長，並在此過程中向投資者證明這種長期增長率。如果我們做到了這一點，其他的一切都會迎刃而解。

Now, I'll pass it over to Jessica.

現在，我把麥克風交給潔西卡。

Thanks, Chris. Before covering our results, I [want to mention] that we made several reporting changes to our customer and financial data this quarter, which are detailed in the footnotes to the trending schedule we issued today. To better reflect the converged and integrated nature of our business and operations, we now present our customer relationship statistics inclusive of all mobile customers, including mobile-only customers. We've also added a total connectivity customer section to the trending schedule, which represents all customers receiving our Internet or mobile connectivity services. We've also revised our mobile lines reporting methodology to better align with how we report our other services.

謝謝克里斯。在介紹我們的業績之前，我想先說明一下，本季我們對客戶和財務數據的報告方式進行了一些調整，這些調整詳見今天發布的趨勢分析表的腳註。為了更好地反映我們業務和營運的整合性和整合性，我們現在將客戶關係統計數據涵蓋所有行動客戶，包括僅使用行動服務的客戶。此外，我們還在趨勢分析表中新增了「總連線客戶」部分，該部分代表所有使用我們網路或行動連線服務的客戶。同時，我們也修訂了行動線路的報告方法，使其與我們其他服務的報告方式更加一致。

Please also note that any forward-looking financial or customer information that we provide in today's discussion or presentation does not include Cox or any transition costs related to Cox integration planning, consistent with how we reported during the TWC, BHN transactions.

另請注意，我們在今天的討論或演示中提供的任何前瞻性財務或客戶資訊均不包括 Cox 或與 Cox 整合計劃相關的任何過渡成本，這與我們之前在 TWC 和 BHN 交易期間的報告方式一致。

Now let's please turn to our customer results on slide 9. Including residential and small business, we lost 119,000 Internet customers in the fourth quarter, better than last year's fourth quarter, with lower connects year-over-year, more than offset by lower disconnects driven by last year's ACP-related disconnects. In mobile, we added 428,000 lines with higher gross additions year-over-year and higher disconnects on a larger base. Net adds in the quarter were lower due to heavy device subsidy activity by the big telco competitors, including the new iPhone 17 through the holiday sales cycle.

現在請看第9頁的客戶業績報告。包括住宅用戶和小型企業用戶在內，我們第四季流失了11.9萬網路用戶，情況比去年同期好。雖然新增用戶數量較去年同期下降，但被去年因ACP（自動續費計畫）導致的斷網用戶數量下降所抵銷。行動用戶方面，我們新增了42.8萬條線路，較去年同期成長，但由於基數擴大，斷網用戶數量也相應增加。本季淨新增用戶數量下降，主要是由於大型電信業者在假日銷售週期內大力補貼設備，包括新款iPhone 17。

Video customers grew by 44,000, versus a loss of 123,000 in 4Q '24, with the improvement primarily driven by lower churn year-over-year resulting from the new pricing and packaging we launched last fall, Zumo and seamless entertainment product improvements, including our Programmer App inclusion packaging. New connects and upgrades to our fully featured video package with apps were up year-over-year. Our video customer results also include a small benefit related to YouTube TV Disney dispute.

視訊用戶數量增加了 4.4 萬，而 2024 年第四季則減少了 12.3 萬。這一成長主要得益於去年秋季推出的新定價和套餐方案帶來的用戶流失率同比下降，以及 Zumo 和無縫娛樂產品改進（包括我們包含 Programmer App 的套餐）。新增用戶和升級到我們功能齊全的視訊套餐（含應用程式）的用戶數量也同比增長。此外，我們的視訊用戶成長還包含因 YouTube TV 與迪士尼的糾紛而帶來的少量收益。

Wireline voice customers declined by 140,000 with year-over-year improvement, primarily driven by lower churn.

固話用戶減少了 14 萬，但年比有所改善，主要原因是用戶流失率降低。

In rural, we continue to see a strong customer relationship growth. We generated 46,000 net customer additions in our subsidized rural footprint in the quarter. And in the fourth quarter, we grew our subsidized rural passings by 147,000 and by over 483,000 over the last 12 months, above our 450,000 target. We expect subsidized rural passings growth of approximately 450,000 in 2026, our last large build year, in addition to continued nonrural construction and fill-in activity.

在農村地區，我們持續看到客戶關係的強勁成長。本季度，我們在補貼的農村地區新增了4.6萬名客戶。第四季度，我們補貼的農村通行證數量增加了14.7萬個，過去12個月累計增加了超過48.3萬個，超過了我們45萬個的目標。我們預計，到2026年（我們最後一個大規模建設年），補貼的農村通行證數量將增加約45萬個，此外，非農村地區的建設和補充活動也將持續進行。

Moving to fourth quarter revenue on slide 10. Over the last year, residential customers declined by 1.2%. And residential revenue per customer relationship also declined by 1.2% year-over-year, given the growth of lower priced video packages within our base, a decline in video customers during the last year, $165 million of costs allocated to programmer streaming apps and netted within video revenue versus $37 million in the prior year period and our 3 months promotion for new residential customers that we mentioned on our last call and which is no longer in the market. Those factors were partly offset by promotional rate step-ups, rate adjustments, the growth of Spectrum Mobile lines and $34 million of hurricane-related residential customer credits in the prior year period.

請參閱第10頁投影片，了解第四季營收。過去一年，住宅用戶數量下降了1.2%。由於低價視訊套餐在我們現有用戶群中的成長、去年視訊用戶數量的下降、分配給串流媒體應用的1.65億美元成本計入視訊收入（而去年同期為3700萬美元），以及我們在上次電話會議上提到的針對新住宅用戶的為期三個月的促銷活動（該活動現已結束），住宅用戶每筆交易的收入也同比下降了1.2%。這些因素部分被促銷價格的提升、價格調整、Spectrum Mobile線路的成長以及去年同期因颶風造成的3,400萬美元住宅用戶信用額度所抵銷。

By the way, the streaming app [GAAP] allocation headwind to residential revenue that I mentioned a moment ago should continue to grow over time as more customers authenticate into our streaming app offers. It could be as much as $1 billion for the full year 2026. And as a reminder, the GAAP adjustment is ultimately neutral to EBITDA as an equal and offsetting benefit is applied to our programming expense line every quarter.

順便一提，我剛才提到的串流應用[GAAP]調整對住宅收入的負面影響，隨著更多用戶使用我們的串流應用，預計會持續成長。到2026年全年，這項影響可能高達10億美元。另外要提醒的是，由於每季都會在我們的節目製作費用中給予等額的抵銷收益，因此GAAP調整最終對EBITDA的影響是中性的。

As slide 10 shows, in total, residential revenue declined by 2.4% and was down by 1.2% when excluding costs allocated to streaming apps and netted within video revenue in both periods.

如投影片 10 所示，總體而言，住宅收入下降了 2.4%，如果排除分配給串流應用程式的成本並在兩個時期內計入視訊收入，則下降了 1.2%。

Turning to commercial. Total commercial revenue grew by 0.3% year-over-year, with mid-market and large business revenue growth of 2.6%. And when excluding all wholesale revenue, mid-market and large business revenue grew by 3%. Small business revenue declined by 1.3%, reflecting modest year-over-year declines in small business customers and in revenue per small business customer.

再來看商業業務。商業業務總收入年增0.3%，其中中型和大型企業收入成長2.6%。若剔除所有批發收入，中型和大型企業收入成長3%。小型企業收入下降1.3%，反映出小型企業客戶數量和每位小型企業客戶的收入均出現小幅較去年同期下降。

Fourth quarter advertising revenue declined by 26%, including the impact of less political revenue. Excluding political, advertising revenue was essentially flat year-over-year. Other revenue grew by 7.3%, driven by higher mobile device sales. And in total, consolidated fourth quarter revenue was down 2.3% year-over-year and down 0.4% when excluding advertising revenue and Programmer App allocation.

第四季廣告收入下降了26%，其中包括政治廣告收入減少的影響。剔除政治廣告收入後，廣告收入與去年同期大致持平。其他收入成長了7.3%，主要得益於行動裝置銷量的成長。整體而言，第四季合併收入較去年同期下降2.3%，若剔除廣告收入及程式設計師應用收入，則較去年同期下降0.4%。

Moving to operating expenses and adjusted EBITDA on slide 11. In the fourth quarter, total operating expenses decreased by 3.1% year-over-year. Programming costs declined by 8.4% due to a higher mix of [lighter] video packages, a 2.2% decline in video customers year-over-year and $165 million of cost allocated to programmer streaming apps and netted within video revenue versus $37 million in the prior period, partly offset by higher programming rates. Other cost of revenue increased by 2.4%, primarily driven by higher mobile service direct costs and mobile devices, partly offset by lower advertising sales costs given lower political revenue and lower franchise and regulatory fees.

第11頁投影片展示了營運費用和調整後EBITDA。第四季度，總營運費用較去年同期下降3.1%。節目製作成本下降8.4%，主要原因是輕量級視訊套餐佔比增加、視訊用戶同比下降2.2%，以及分配給節目製作商串流應用的成本為1.65億美元，併計入視訊收入（上一季為3700萬美元），部分被更高的節目製作費率所抵消。其他收入成本成長2.4%，主要原因是行動服務直接成本和行動裝置成本增加，部分被政治收入和特許經營費、監管費下降而導致的廣告銷售成本降低所抵銷。

Cost to service customers, which combines field and technology operations and customer operations, decreased 3.9% year-over-year, primarily due to lower labor costs and lower bad debt expense. Excluding bad debt, cost to service customers declined 3.2%. Marketing and residential sales expense was essentially flat year-over-year due to lower labor expense, offset by a change in sales mix to higher cost sales channels. Transition expenses related to the pending Cox transaction totaled $15 million in the quarter. And finally, other expense declined by 3.1%, primarily due to lower labor expense.

客戶服務成本（包括現場和技術營運以及客戶營運）較去年同期下降3.9%，主要原因是人力成本和壞帳支出減少。剔除壞帳後，客戶服務成本下降3.2%。由於人工成本降低，行銷和住宅銷售費用基本上與去年同期持平，但部分原因是銷售組合轉向成本更高的銷售管道。與待完成的Cox交易相關的過渡費用在本季度總計1500萬美元。最後，其他費用下降3.1%，主要原因是人工成本降低。

Adjusted EBITDA declined by 1.2% year-over-year in the quarter. And for the full year 2025, EBITDA grew by 0.6%. For the full year 2026, we are planning for slight EBITDA growth, excluding the impact of transition costs. Note that first half 2026 EBITDA will be more challenged than second half EBITDA given the onetime benefits we saw in 1Q last year and the benefit of political advertising that we expect in the second half of 2026.

本季調整後 EBITDA 年減 1.2%。 2025 年全年 EBITDA 預計成長 0.6%。 2026 年全年，我們預計 EBITDA 將略有成長（不計過渡成本的影響）。需要注意的是，鑑於去年第一季的一次性收益以及我們預計 2026 年下半年政治廣告帶來的收益，2026 年上半年的 EBITDA 將比下半年面臨更大的挑戰。

Turning to net income, we generated $1.3 billion of net income attributable to Charter shareholders in the fourth quarter, compared to $1.5 billion in the prior year period, given lower adjusted EBITDA and higher income tax expense.

就淨利潤而言，由於調整後 EBITDA 下降和所得稅支出增加，我們在第四季度歸屬於 Charter 股東的淨利潤為 13 億美元，而去年同期為 15 億美元。

Turning to slide 12, fourth quarter capital expenditures totaled $3.3 billion, $23 million higher than last year's fourth quarter, primarily due to 2 multiyear software agreements that were accrued in the quarter and higher network evolution spend, which lands in upgrade rebuild spend. 2025 capital expenditures totaled $11.66 billion, slightly above our recent expectation for $11.5 billion, given the new software agreements I just mentioned, which will drive other benefits across the business. We expect total 2026 capital expenditures to reach $11.4 billion.

翻到第12張投影片，第四季資本支出總額為33億美元，比去年同期增加2,300萬美元，主要原因是本季計入了兩項多年期軟體協議以及網路升級改造支出增加（計入升級重建支出）。鑑於我剛才提到的新軟體協議，2025年資本支出總額為116.6億美元，略高於我們先前115億美元的預期，這將為公司帶來其他方面的效益。我們預計2026年資本支出總額將達到114億美元。

On slide 13, we have provided our current expectations for capital spending through the year 2029, and now including line extension spending associated with the BEAD program, which totals about $230 million and is mostly in 2027 to 2029. For the years 2025 through 2028, the outlook you see on slide 13 is in line with what we have provided in January 2025, with the inclusion of BEAD, some modified timing across the years and slight changes across category. As I mentioned, we have added 2029 to our outlook and expect it to exhibit about the same amount of spend as we expected for 2028.

在第13頁幻燈片中，我們提供了截至2029年的資本支出預期，其中包括與BEAD項目相關的產品線擴展支出，總額約為2.3億美元，主要集中在2027年至2029年。對於2025年至2028年，您在第13頁幻燈片中看到的展望與我們在2025年1月提供的展望基本一致，只是納入了BEAD項目，並對各年度的時間安排和部分類別進行了微調。正如我之前提到的，我們已將2029年納入展望，預計其支出金額將與我們對2028年的預期大致相同。

Looking beyond 2026, we expect total capital spending in dollar terms to be on a meaningful downward trajectory. And after our evolution and expansion capital initiatives conclude, our run rate capital expenditures should be below $8 billion per year. Just to highlight, that reduction in capital expenditures on its own from approximately $11.7 billion in 2025 to less than $8 billion in 2028 is equivalent to $28 of free cash flow per share based on today's share count.

展望2026年後，我們預期以美元計的總資本支出將呈現顯著下降趨勢。在我們完成發展和擴張資本計畫後，我們的年度資本支出應低於80億美元。值得一提的是，光是資本支出一項，從2025年的約117億美元降至2028年的不到80億美元，就相當於以當前股數計算，每股可產生28美元的自由現金流。

Turning to free cash flow on slide 14, fourth quarter free cash flow totaled $773 million, about $200 million lower than last year given a less favorable change in working capital and higher CapEx, partly offset by lower cash taxes due to the One Big Beautiful Bill Act and cash paid for interest.

在第 14 張投影片中，我們來看自由現金流。第四季自由現金流總計 7.73 億美元，比去年同期減少了約 2 億美元，因為營運資本變化不太有利，資本支出增加，部分被《一項偉大的法案》帶來的現金稅收減少和支付的利息現金所抵消。

Turning to cash taxes. Fourth quarter cash taxes totaled $139 million, and while full year 2025 cash tax payments totaled just under $900 million. We currently expect that our calendar year 2026 cash tax payments will total between $500 million and $800 million.

接下來談談現金稅。第四季現金稅總額為1.39億美元，而2025年全年現金稅支出總額略低於9億美元。我們目前預計2026日曆年的現金稅支出總額將介於5億美元至8億美元之間。

We finished the fourth quarter with $95 billion in debt principal. Our weighted average cost of debt remains at an attractive 5.2% and our current run rate annualized cash interest is $4.9 billion. During the quarter, we repurchased 2.9 million Charter shares totaling $760 million at an average price of $259 per share. As of the end of the fourth quarter, our ratio of net debt to last 12-month adjusted EBITDA remains at 4.15x and stood at 4.21x pro forma for the pending Liberty Broadband transaction. During the pendency of the Cox deal, we plan to be at or slightly under 4.25x leverage pro forma for the Liberty transaction.

第四季末，我們的債務本金為950億美元。加權平均債務成本仍維持在5.2%的宜人水平，目前的年化現金利息支出為49億美元。本季度，我們以每股259美元的平均價格回購了290萬股Charter股票，總計7.6億美元。截至第四季末，我們的淨負債與過去12個月調整後EBITDA的比率維持在4.15倍，若計入待完成的Liberty Broadband交易，則該比率為4.21倍。在Cox交易完成期間，我們計劃將Liberty交易後的槓桿率維持在4.25倍或略低於4.25倍。

As you may recall, when we announced the Cox transaction, we committed to move our target leverage to the midpoint of a 3.5 to 4x range. We're very comfortable with our balance sheet and our ability to pivot rapidly given our significant free cash flow generation, which provides flexibility to reduce leverage by up to 0.5 turn annually over the next several years. But we have also heard our shareholders' preference for less leverage during a lower-growth period. So today, we are moving our post-transaction target leverage to the low end of a new 3.5 to 3.75x range, which we expect to achieve within 3 years following close.

您可能還記得，當我們宣布收購 Cox 時，我們承諾將目標槓桿率調整至 3.5 倍至 4 倍區間的中點。鑑於我們充裕的自由現金流，我們對自身的資產負債表和快速調整能力充滿信心，這使我們能夠在未來幾年內每年靈活地將槓桿率降低至多 0.5 倍。但我們也聽到了股東們希望在成長放緩時期降低槓桿的呼聲。因此，今天我們將交易後的目標槓桿率調整至新的 3.5 倍至 3.75 倍區間的低端，我們預計將在交易完成後的三年內實現這一目標。

Even with this delevering, we continue to expect significant ongoing capital returns to shareholders. Lower leverage will drive some impact to our weighted average cost of capital which should, in turn, positively affect valuation. It should attract a broader constituency of holders to the stock and open the potential for improved debt ratings, including an investment-grade corporate family rating, although that is not an explicit goal.

即使進行了去槓桿化，我們仍然預期股東將獲得可觀的持續資本回報。較低的槓桿率將對我們的加權平均資本成本產生一定影響，進而對估值產生正面影響。這應該會吸引更廣泛的股東群體，並有可能提升債務評級，包括獲得投資等級企業家族評級，儘管這並非我們的明確目標。

We will continue to generate very meaningful and growing levels of free cash flow. And while we always reinvest in the business as our top capital allocation priority, there are no large-scale projects like RDOF or network evolution on the horizon. We expect to revert to normalized CapEx in the range of $7.5 billion to $8 billion per year by 2028. We will have significant additional capital available to return to shareholders. And following our normal course review of accretive uses of cash flow with our Board and consistent feedback from shareholders, we plan to continue to return that capital through our share repurchase program.

我們將繼續創造可觀且不斷增長的自由現金流。儘管我們始終將業務再投資作為資本配置的首要任務，但目前沒有類似RDOF或網路升級的大型專案。我們預計到2028年，資本支出將恢復到每年75億至80億美元的正常水準。屆時，我們將有大量額外資金可用於回饋股東。在與董事會定期審查現金流增值用途並持續聽取股東回饋後，我們計劃繼續透過股票回購計畫回饋股東。

We have significant free cash flow growth in front of us, but ultimately, to overcome the perception of negative perpetuity growth implied in our valuation today, we need to win in the marketplace. And as Chris outlined, that's where we are focused and where we believe we can drive value going forward.

我們未來擁有可觀的自由現金流成長，但歸根究底，為了消除目前估值中隱含的負成長預期，我們需要在市場競爭中取勝。正如克里斯所指出的，這正是我們關注的重點，也是我們相信未來能創造價值的領域。

With that, I'll turn it over to the operator for Q&A.

接下來，我將把問答環節交給接線員。

(Operator Instructions) Craig Moffett, Moffett Nathanson.

（操作說明）克雷格·莫菲特，莫菲特·納坦森。

Let me start with wireless. First, you signed a new agreement that both Comcast and Verizon have talked about. I wonder if you could just say anything about what that new agreement looks like and whether it has any impact on your (inaudible) and offload strategy. And then on that point, Chris, you said that you're close to 90% offload. I think you had previously said 85% a couple of quarters ago and then, last quarter, I think, said 88%.

先說說無線業務。首先，您簽署了一份新協議，Comcast 和 Verizon 都對此有所討論。我想請您透露一下這份新協議的具體內容，以及它是否會對您的（聽不清楚）和業務外包策略產生影響。還有，Chris，您之前說過您的業務外包率接近 90%。我記得您之前在幾個季度前說過是 85%，上個季度好像又說是 88%。

That already is a 20% reduction in how much you're sending over the wholesale network that you're leasing from Verizon. Is the 90% just a reference to that similar to 88%? Or has it gotten even -- has the offload gotten even better since then?

這已經比你從Verizon租用的批發網路發送的資料量減少了20%。 90%是指和88%類似的情況嗎？還是說已經達到平衡－卸載效果比那時更好了？

Sure. Look, for obvious reasons, we'll stay consistent with what Comcast and Verizon have said as well. But that's, for the most part, we've amended and modernized our long-term MVNO agreement with Verizon and continue to support profitable growth for both Charter and Verizon. It is a very good deal for them and a relationship for both. As you know, it's long term and the market evolves over time.

當然。你看，出於顯而易見的原因，我們會與康卡斯特和威瑞森保持一致。但總的來說，我們已經修訂並更新了與威瑞森的長期虛擬網路營運商（MVNO）協議，並將繼續支持Charter和威瑞森雙方的獲利成長。這對他們來說都是一筆非常划算的交易，也是雙方的合作關係。如你所知，這是一項長期合作，市場也會隨著時間而改變。

And so it's just natural that you have partners inside of a deal take a look and want clarity on certain things. So I'd look at it more in that context as opposed to anything else. We have a structural and long-term agreement that underpins everything that we're doing here and that hasn't changed. On the 90%, I think it's around 89% or something like that, it's bumping in that area. So it's moved up a bit, but it's on a steady climb.

所以，交易中的合作夥伴自然會關注並希望澄清某些事項。因此，我會更多地從這個角度來看待這個問題，而不是從其他方面來考慮。我們有一份結構性的長期協議，它支撐著我們在這裡所做的一切，而這份協議並沒有改變。至於90%這個數字，我認為現在在89%左右，在這個範圍內略有波動。所以它略有上升，但總體趨勢是穩定上升。

And as we've always talked about before, the reality is that we have a very attractive structure and partnership with Verizon, and so we can be opportunistic here. But because of the favorable economics that we've always had with Verizon and continue to have, there's a balance there in terms of the pace of CBRS rollout, and we're focusing that on positive ROI areas.

正如我們之前一直討論的那樣，現實情況是，我們與Verizon建立了非常有吸引力的架構和合作關係，因此我們可以抓住機會。但由於我們與Verizon之間一直保持著有利的經濟關係，並且在CBRS部署速度方面需要保持平衡，我們將重點放在能夠帶來正投資回報率的領域。

I'll mention, we did roll out to the 23 markets last year that we talked about for CBRS, probably do, I think, maybe 20 or so more. But we'll be in all the states where we have CBRS [power] licenses within this year. So we continue to roll out there at an opportunistic pace.

我得提一下，去年我們已經把CBRS推廣到了之前提到的23個市場，可能還會再增加20個左右。但今年之內，我們會在所有擁有CBRS電力許可證的州都推出這項服務。所以我們會繼續以靈活應變的方式推進推廣。

Ben Swinburne, Morgan Stanley.

本‧斯溫伯恩，摩根士丹利。

Chris, you guys have been competing in the market with a converged strategy for a number of years now. I'm wondering if you could maybe assess the position of Spectrum Mobile, in particular, in the market with consumers. You guys have been marketing the product for a long time at very attractive price points. But you've been building a new product and new brand for some time. Where do you think that sits with consumers today?

克里斯，你們多年來一直採用融合策略在市場上競爭。我想請你評估一下Spectrum Mobile在消費者心目中的市場地位。你們長期以來一直以極具吸引力的價格銷售產品。但你們也花了一段時間打造新產品和新品牌。你認為目前消費者對這個品牌的接受度如何？

Is there more work to do? And maybe tie in how the sales force is executing in your mind on selling that into base into new customers. Obviously, it's core to the long-term growth of the company.

還有什麼工作要做嗎？或許你也需要考慮一下銷售團隊在將現有客戶轉化為新客戶方面的執行情況。顯然，這對公司的長期發展至關重要。

It is. So the convergence strategy is working. You can see that in our results. On one hand, you was looking and said, well, the net add rate ticked down a little bit, but it ticked down in the an environment with a tremendous amount of flooding the market with subsidies that we didn't match and yet we continue to grow, which I think shows and demonstrates the value of the product that customers perceive that we have. I don't think that customers are ultimately, at the end of the day, fooled.

確實如此。所以，融合策略是有效的。這一點可以從我們的業績看出。一方面，您可能會說，淨增用戶率略有下降，但這是在一個充斥著大量補貼、而我們無法與之匹敵的市場環境下發生的。即便如此，我們仍然保持成長，我認為這充分展現了客戶對我們產品價值的認可。我認為，最終客戶不會被蒙蔽。

They can be entertained with an offer at one point in time, but at the end of the day, you look at the total amount that's on your bill, and if you compare that of our competitors to what our bill looks like, you can buy a lot of advanced telephones, cellular devices with that savings that we provide. So we're the all-in best product for both speed as well as savings.

他們或許會被某個優惠吸引，但最終，你還是要看帳單總額。如果你把我們和競爭對手的帳單對比一下，你會發現我們省下的錢足夠買很多高階手機和行動裝置了。所以，無論從速度或價格來看，我們都是最佳選擇。

Now your question about market perception, Spectrum Mobile is still a relatively new brand in the marketplace and getting that product from your cable providers and still relatively new concept. So our brand awareness continues to go up every year. The reputation of the product continues to improve and settle in. The savings recognition and the word of mouth, I think, is improving. But it will take time for that to continue to develop.

關於您提到的市場認知度問題，Spectrum Mobile在市場上仍然是一個相對較新的品牌，從有線電視供應商購買這項產品也是一個比較新的概念。因此，我們的品牌知名度每年都在持續提升。產品的口碑也不斷改善與鞏固。我認為，使用者對節省費用的認知度和口碑傳播都在提高。但這還需要時間來進一步發展。

And if you think back to some of the things that we did around video, there are other products: broadband, video, even phone, can both be an asset as well as it can be a liability to the mobile reputation in a particular moment in time. And so when we have programming-related rate increases that go through on the cable bill and impacts the Spectrum customer there (inaudible) through a little bit to mobile. So that's a piece that we try to manage and think through as well.

回想一下我們之前在視頻領域所做的一些事情，你會發現其他產品，比如寬頻、視頻，甚至電話，在特定時期都可能對移動業務的聲譽產生影響，既可以是優勢，也可以是劣勢。因此，當與節目製作相關的費用上漲反映在有線電視帳單上，並最終影響Spectrum的用戶時，也會對行動業務產生一定程度的影響。所以，這也是我們需要管理和考慮的一個面向。

But I think the -- do I think there's more that we can do? Of course. But we're on a steady path to increasing brand awareness. I think the increasing capabilities, the convergence, is recognized. Most customers still today haven't picked up on the fact that as you're moving around across the country, both inside our markets as well as other MSO cable operator markets, that you're actually connecting to faster speeds through WiFi.

但我認為——我是否認為我們還能做得更多？當然。但我們正穩步提升品牌知名度。我認為我們不斷增強的功能和融合趨勢已被人們所認可。時至今日，大多數客戶仍然沒有意識到，當他們在全國各地移動時，無論是在我們自己的市場內還是在其他MSO有線電視運營商的市場內，他們實際上都是透過WiFi連接到更快的網路速度。

For those of our investors who live in, for example, New York City or L.A., I just encourage you as a Spectrum Mobile customer, drive around and walk around, and what you'll notice is that you're actually attached not to a 5G network, but you're attached to Spectrum Mobile at a vastly superior speed than you would have gotten with 5G.

例如，對於居住在紐約市或洛杉磯的投資者們，我鼓勵你們這些 Spectrum Mobile 的用戶，開車四處轉轉，走走看看，你們就會發現，你們實際上連接的不是 5G 網絡，而是 Spectrum Mobile，而且速度比 5G 快得多。

And we haven't -- in my mind, we have work to do to really show and demonstrate that product capability in the way that we go to market. And I think that's upside for us, because it is better speeds, it's at a better price. So eventually, word of mouth gets around that it is a great product, it's better than anything else out there and it saves you money. So I'm positive. And the fact that we can do that in an environment that had so much, as I said, flooding the market with subsidy, I think, gives us a lot of confidence.

在我看來，我們還有很多工作要做，才能真正展現出我們產品的市場競爭力。我認為這對我們來說是有利的，因為它的速度更快，價格也更實惠。最終，口碑會傳播開來，大家都會知道這是一款很棒的產品，比市面上任何其他產品都好，而且還能省錢。所以我很樂觀。而且，正如我之前所說，在補貼充斥市場的環境下，我們還能做到這一點，我認為這給了我們很大的信心。

Vikash Harlalka, New Street Research.

維卡什·哈拉爾卡，新街研究。

I have one quick one for Jessica. Chris, could you provide us any details on how your market share has trended in markets where you've competed against fiber operators for a few years now? And how do you see that evolve over time? And then one for Jessica. Jessica, you said you expect EBITDA growth to be slightly positive this year.

我還有一個問題想問潔西卡。克里斯，你能否詳細介紹一下，在你與光纖業者競爭的這些市場中，你的市佔率變化趨勢如何？你認為這種趨勢會如何發展？還有一個問題想問潔西卡。傑西卡，你說過你預計今年的EBITDA成長會略微為正。

By our estimate, political advertising adds about a percentage point to EBITDA growth. Could you grow EBITDA higher than 1% this year?

據我們估計，政治廣告能使 EBITDA 成長約 1 個百分點。您今年能否實現 EBITDA 成長超過 1%？

Sure. So I'll take the first question related to fiber competition. We've competed well against fiber for many years. We expect to continue to do so. The reality is that's been going on for 15 years, so we have a lot of experience and we have a lot of data and runs there.

當然。那我先回答第一個關於光纖競爭的問題。多年來，我們一直與光纖展開激烈的競爭，我們預計未來也會繼續保持這種優勢。事實上，這種競爭已經持續了15年，因此我們累積了豐富的經驗、數據和運作經驗。

We have greater penetration than our fiber competitors, even in mature fiber markets. And when it happens, overbuild impact tends to be limited to a few percentage points of Internet penetration during the first year (inaudible) a new overbuilding vintage, where, as it were, coming online. It's not ideal for us, but the pace of that's tied to the pace of overbuild and that's been fairly consistent. And in the meantime, as a result of all that, we really don't see overbuilders reaching their ROI goals within our footprint now or in the future.

即使在成熟的光纖市場，我們的滲透率也高於光纖競爭對手。而且，當出現網路過度建設時，其影響通常僅限於新一輪網路過度建設的第一年，也就是網路存取初期，網路滲透率的幾個百分點。這對我們來說並非理想情況，但網路過度建設的速度與網路過度建設的速度密切相關，而且一直相當穩定。同時，正因如此，我們認為，無論現在或將來，過度建設者都無法在我們的覆蓋範圍內實現其投資回報率目標。

The piece that I would add to that is -- and I know you've done some analysis around this. Obviously, the introduction of fixed wireless access has impacts on everyone's penetration. I think that needs to be factored in as well. But inside of our footprint where we have a lot of experience, a lot of years of fiber overlap, as I mentioned in the prepared remarks, that's not new. And while it is new competition, and that in itself presents some challenges, it's one that we've dealt with over time.

我想補充一點——我知道您已經對此進行了一些分析。顯然，固定無線存取的引入會對所有使用者的網路覆蓋率產生影響。我認為這一點也需要考慮。但在我們擁有豐富經驗、光纖網路多年重疊覆蓋的區域內，正如我在準備好的演講稿中提到的，這並不算什麼新鮮事。雖然這確實帶來了新的競爭，本身也帶來了一些挑戰，但我們已經應對過這些挑戰。

The bigger issue over the past 3 years is the macro environment in terms of housing, [low] moves and the introduction of, even though it's an inferior product, is a brand-new competitor in the marketplace with expanding footprint through self-funded Internet or fixed wireless access.

過去三年更大的問題是住房方面的宏觀環境，[低]搬家率，以及引入了一個新的競爭對手，儘管它是一種劣質產品，但它通過自籌資金的互聯網或固定無線接入，在市場上不斷擴大其影響力。

So on your second question, which I think is will we grow EBITDA when excluding advertising, I think the answers maybe. It's certainly our goal, like EBITDA growth is challenged in 2026 given the headwind from broadband subscriber declines. But we think we can overcome that with the combination of mobile growth, changing mix of Internet driving positive ARPU growth, continued operational improvements and attentive expense management, in addition to what we see from the political advertising space.

關於你的第二個問題，我認為是剔除廣告收入後，我們的 EBITDA 能否成長，答案是可能。這當然是我們的目標，但考慮到寬頻用戶數量下降的不利影響，2026 年 EBITDA 成長確實面臨挑戰。不過，我們認為可以透過行動業務成長、網路組合變化推動 ARPU 成長、持續改善營運、有效控製成本以及政治廣告領域的正面影響來克服這些挑戰。

Jessica Reif Ehrlich, BofA.

傑西卡·雷夫·埃爾利希，美國銀行。

I guess 2 questions. Of course, I'm going to ask on video. Chris, what do you think the sustainability of the video sub gains are? And is there any color that you can provide on first quarter trends? And then just to follow up with your comments, just (inaudible) really quickly, but Silicon Valley, can you give a color on what you're doing, what the endeavors are, what's the goal and what's the timing of maybe some products coming out?

我想問兩個問題。當然，我會透過視訊提問。克里斯，你認為影片訂閱用戶成長的可持續性如何？能透露一下第一季的趨勢嗎？然後，我想接著你剛才的評論快速問一句（聽不清楚），矽谷，你能簡單介紹一下你們正在做的事情、正在進行的專案、目標以及一些產品的發佈時間嗎？

Sure. Look, for video, I want to be really clear. Our North Star here, our goal is not to have net gain of video just for net gain stakes. Our goal is to have a video product that supports broadband acquisition and broadband retention. And I think it's a powerful tool to do that if we provide value and utility for customers.

當然。關於視頻，我想明確一點。我們的目標並非僅僅為了追求淨收益而增加視訊業務，而是要打造一款能夠促進寬頻用戶成長和留存的影片產品。我認為，如果我們能為用戶提供價值和實用性，它就能成為實現這一目標的強大工具。

I do, and I know you spend a lot of time in this space, I do think it's good for the ecosystem, everything that we've done. And of course, we're pleased about that. But that's not what our shareholders ask us to do, and so it's a nice side benefit. But in getting there, I think it does help broadband.

是的，我知道您在這方面投入了很多時間，我認為我們所做的一切都對生態系統有益。當然，我們對此感到高興。但這並非股東的要求，所以這只是一個意外之喜。但我認為，在實現這一目標的過程中，它確實有助於寬頻發展。

I think it's important to thank the programmers here and particularly some of the key execs, I'm not going to name them out, but it's a handful and they know who they are. They leaned in and they continue to lean in to help us. I think they believed in what we were doing. It wasn't easy to get there, but eventually did believe what we're doing. And the reason is because, again, with the viewpoint of solving for our broadband customers, we're really solving for customers first and providing that value.

我認為我應該感謝這裡的程式設計師們，尤其是幾位關鍵的主管，我就不點名了，人數不多，他們自己也知道我說的是誰。他們積極參與，並且一直都在幫助我們。我認為他們相信我們正在做的事情。雖然過程並不輕鬆，但他們最終還是相信了我們正在做的事情。原因在於，我們始終以解決寬頻用戶的問題為出發點，真正做到了以客戶為先，並提供價值。

And we're unique in the relationship with the programmers because we bring a broadband distribution capability that most others don't have. And that means that we can serve all of these customers with the programmer's product, whether that's a skinny bundle, whether that's full expanded product with apps. We get to put in ad-free upgrades that benefits the customer at a much lower incremental cost as well as the programmer. And then from their perspective, the direct-to-consumer apps that we sell a la carte to our 30 million customers now, and that's going to be an increasing component.

我們與程式設計師的合作關係獨樹一幟，因為我們擁有大多數其他公司不具備的寬頻分發能力。這意味著我們可以為所有客戶提供程式設計師的產品，無論是精簡套餐還是包含應用程式的完整擴展產品。我們可以提供無廣告升級，不僅能讓客戶受益，還能以更低的增量成本惠及程式設計師。此外，從程式設計師的角度來看，我們目前向3000萬客戶單獨銷售的直接面向消費者的應用程序，未來也將佔據越來越重要的份額。

And so what we've been able to do with video is create the best economics and choice for the customer, which means that we're actually -- I think we're the best channel distribution path to maximize the opportunity for the programmer as well. And so back to your question about video growth, I mean the ecosystem is still really challenged. Programming costs continue to go up, in particular, retrans is a real problem. But around that, I think you'll see us continue to innovate. We do have some new product ideas.

因此，我們在影片領域所做的，是為客戶創造了最佳的經濟效益和選擇，這意味著我們實際上——我認為我們也是能夠最大限度地提升節目製作方機會的最佳管道分發途徑。回到您關於視訊成長的問題，我的意思是，整個生態系統仍然面臨諸多挑戰。節目製作成本持續上漲，尤其是重播成本，這是一個非常棘手的問題。但圍繞這些挑戰，我認為我們將繼續創新。我們確實有一些新產品的想法。

We'll talk to the programmers about that in the course of this year. But the key for us is to go back to connectivity, acquisition and churn.

今年我們會和程式設計師討論這個問題。但對我們來說，關鍵在於回歸連結性、用戶獲取和用戶流失率。

So on your net gain question, it's not the goal. You're on the razor's edge. If you use that parallel, there's -- and you said, well, what happened in Q4? Q4 was really no different than Q3. There's a slight difference between Q3 and Q4 that went from net loss to net gain.

所以關於你提到的淨收益問題，那並不是最終目標。你現在處境非常危險。如果你用這個例子來類比，你會發現──你問，第四季發生了什麼事？其實第四季和第三季並沒有什麼不同。第三季和第四季之間唯一的差異就是從淨虧損轉為淨利。

So you can just as easily flip back into the net loss category and it's -- the net gain isn't our goal. I think the parallel there is when you're on the edge and you have a high amount of gross adds and a high amount of gross disconnects, it's a dangerous place to be in terms of volatility. I think there's some parallel there to Internet in the way that we need to get ourselves out of that space. And when I talk about game of inches, that really applies to all subscription businesses. And if you can get a more commanding lead through the things I talked about ways I think we win, I think that helps us in Internet, which really is the goal here together with mobile.

所以，你很容易就會回到淨虧損的境地，而淨利潤並不是我們的目標。我認為這和我們處於臨界點的情況類似，當你的新增用戶和流失用戶都很多時，波動性會非常大，非常危險。我認為這和網路產業的情況有些相似，我們需要擺脫這種困境。我之前提到的「寸土必爭」其實也適用於所有訂閱業務。如果你能透過我剛才提到的那些我認為可以製勝的方法獲得更顯著的領先優勢，我認為這對我們在互聯網領域的發展大有裨益，而互聯網和移動領域才是我們真正的目標。

Silicon Valley, the big overarching thing that we're trying to do there is communicate to the people who develop products and software that they should stop developing to the least common denominator in terms of network capabilities. That because the cable ecosystem covers nearly in the entire country, unlike fiber overbuilders who do a lot of cherry picking, red lining, we upgrade everywhere, we have -- already, we have a gigabit everywhere we operate. We're upgrading to symmetrical and multi-gig speeds effectively nationwide. And that's the platform, with low latency, by the way, and that's the platform that software developers and product developers should be developing to. They have unfettered access to that network, convergence, multi-gig.

在矽谷，我們目前最主要的目標是向產品和軟體開發者傳達一個訊息：他們應該停止在網路功能方面只滿足最低標準。這是因為我們的有線網路生態系統幾乎覆蓋了全國，不像那些只做「挑肥揀瘦」的光纖網路建設者，我們幾乎在所有地方都進行了升級，而且——實際上，我們運營的所有區域都已經實現了千兆網路。我們正在全國範圍內有效地升級到對稱和多千兆速度。順便說一句，這就是低延遲的平台，也是軟體開發者和產品開發者應該開發的平台。他們可以不受限制地存取這個融合的多千兆網路。

And the product capabilities that come about as a result of that, I think they're significant, and our networks put us in a new place to go deliver that.

我認為由此產生的產品能力意義重大，而我們的網絡使我們處於一個新的位置去實現這些能力。

And so the product that we supported, Apple and the NBA with Spectrum Front Row. Do we need to own those rights? Do we need to own that product? No, absolutely not. In fact, what we're just trying to do is show the way that a ubiquitously deployed network in the U.S.

所以，我們支持的產品，像是蘋果和NBA的Spectrum Front Row，我們需要擁有這些版權嗎？我們需要擁有這款產品嗎？不，絕對不需要。事實上，我們只是想展示在美國普遍部署的網路是如何運作的。

exists that can carry that type of 8K or 16K product that provides an immersive experience, that can actually have caching at the local edge in a way that hasn't been thought of before. And given the fact that just at Charter alone, we have 1,000 hubs or localized data centers that provide local edge compute. And so we have a lot of assets that aren't being used today. Our experience has been, once people understand that these networks exist and their capabilities there, that they'll develop products to go do that.

現有的技術能夠承載8K或16K產品，提供沉浸式體驗，並能以前所未有的方式在本地邊緣進行快取。光是Charter一家公司就擁有1000個樞紐或本地資料中心，提供本地邊緣運算服務。因此，我們擁有大量目前尚未利用的資源。我們的經驗是，一旦人們了解這些網路的存在及其能力，他們就會開發相應的產品。

And so our time out in Silicon Valley has really been spent around making sure people understand that this platform has been built for them. There are things that we can do with it. If you take a look at what we've done with Amazon in terms of convergence and offloading, if you think about the things that we could do in the electrical vehicle market in terms of offloading in a way that's attracted for them and really make use of the tools that we have. So that's the major goal. The biggest one is we've, internally, we've called it the fill-the-pipe tour, and to go really explain to people that this network is available there for them and they should develop to it.

因此，我們在矽谷的這段時間主要圍繞著確保人們明白這個平台是為他們而建的。我們可以利用這個平台做很多事。看看我們與亞馬遜在整合和業務分流方面所做的工作，想想我們可以在電動車市場做些什麼，以一種吸引他們的方式進行業務分流，並真正利用我們現有的工具。這就是我們的主要目標。最重要的目標，我們內部稱之為“填滿管道之旅”，就是要真正向人們解釋這個網絡是為他們而設的，他們應該利用它進行發展。

Operator, we'll take our next question.

接線員，我們來回答下一個問題。

Michael Ng, Goldman Sachs.

Michael Ng，高盛集團。

I wanted to ask about operating expense growth next year and investment opportunities. You guys are obviously seeing really good momentum on the video side and streaming app conclusions and obviously also with convergence and Spectrum Mobile. So how are you balancing the commitments to EBITDA growth with the potential to invest to drive these opportunities a little bit faster? And how do you balance that with efficiencies that you could potentially realize?

我想問一下明年的營運費用成長以及投資機會。你們顯然在視訊業務和串流媒體應用方面取得了非常好的發展勢頭，融合業務和Spectrum Mobile業務也表現出色。那麼，你們是如何平衡EBITDA成長目標與投資潛力（以加速推進這些機會）之間的關係的呢？又是如何平衡這兩者與潛在效率提升之間的關係呢？

I think Jess can chime in for a second. But strategically, if you step back, we've made the investments. So if you think about the place we're coming from, we've made the investment by keeping our pricing low. We've made the investment by having a fully U.S.-based in-source sales and service capability across the country. We've made the investment in our technology platforms.

我想傑西可以補充一點。但從策略角度來看，如果我們從宏觀角度出發，就會發現我們已經進行了投資。想想我們目前的處境，我們透過保持低價位實現了投資。我們透過在美國本土建立覆蓋全國的銷售和服務體系實現了投資。我們也投資了我們的技術平台。

And so that gives us the ability to have increasing efficiency through the business and still be able to innovate and develop new products along the way and to be able to manage both your foot on the gas and foot on the brake at the same time.

因此，這使我們能夠在業務過程中不斷提高效率，同時也能不斷創新和開發新產品，並能夠同時控制好前進和後退的步伐。

Yes, I think that's right. And if you think about how that translates into something like cost to service customers, like ultimately, I expect that cost to service customers to be slightly down over the year, in the year versus last year. But a big chunk of that is related to improvements in operating efficiency and in the way that we utilize technology to make our services more efficient. I guess on top of that, in marketing and resi sales, last year, we had seen some pretty substantial growth in the year-over-year. I expect that to be meaningfully slower this year than what we saw last year, largely related to sort of investment we already made sort of bringing the expense rate up and then changes that we've made that I think Chris talked quite a bit about inside of last quarter to really try to find the right way to drive our message into the marketplace and to do so efficiently.

是的，我認為你說得對。如果你考慮一下這會如何影響客戶服務成本，最終，我預計今年的客戶服務成本會比去年略有下降。但這很大程度上歸功於營運效率的提升，以及我們利用科技提高服務效率的方式。此外，在行銷和住宅銷售方面，去年我們實現了相當可觀的年增長。我預計今年的成長速度會比去年顯著放緩，這主要是因為我們已經投入資金提高了費用率，以及我們做出的一些調整——克里斯在上個季度也多次談到了這些調整——旨在找到將我們的信息有效傳遞給市場的最佳方式。

And so I think with those, we believe in our ability to generate EBITDA growth while still doing the right things for the business to drive medium and long-term growth, which ultimately has always been sort of the strategic goal of the management team.

因此，我認為憑藉這些優勢，我們相信我們有能力在實現 EBITDA 成長的同時，繼續為企業做正確的事情，以推動中長期成長，而這最終一直是管理團隊的策略目標。

Operator, we'll take our next question, please.

接線員，請問我們下一個問題是什麼？

Michael Rollins, Citi.

麥可‧羅林斯，花旗集團。

There's been a bit of discussion lately around pricing strategies for these services and whether companies should move to everyday value pricing versus that lower, higher promotional stack. And just curious, Charter's latest views on how you're approaching pricing in that strategy, the sustainability for what you've been employing now for quite some time.

最近關於這些服務的定價策略引發了一些討論，探討企業是否應該轉向日常價值定價，而不是採用低低價高促銷的組合定價模式。我很好奇Charter公司對於這種定價策略的最新看法，以及你們目前採用的定價策略的可持續性。

Sure. You know this, but by way of background for everybody else, in September of 2024, we introduced new pricing and packaging. And really what that pricing and packaging did was lower our promotional price for Internet as well as our retail price for Internet, [that's] all tiers, and both a stand-alone and bundled and to provide a pricing lock for up to 2 to 3 years depending on how many products you bundled at those lower prices. And despite that, we've been able to maintain relatively consistent ARPU, in many cases, growing.

當然。您肯定知道，但為了讓其他人了解背景，我還是簡單介紹一下：2024年9月，我們推出了新的定價和套餐方案。新方案降低了網路產品的促銷價和零售價，涵蓋所有層級，包括獨立套餐和捆綁套餐，並根據您捆綁購買的產品數量，提供長達2到3年的價格鎖定。儘管如此，我們仍然保持了相對穩定的ARPU值，在許多情況下甚至實現了成長。

And in parallel, use that to first reactively and then proactively migrate good portions of the existing base to lower product pricing. But in the meantime, maintain or actually grown customer relationship or through that process, absent some of the video tier mix that is well known, because people are taking more products for household. And so that's been a long-held strategy at Charter, that you can change your product pricing (inaudible) and you can have higher customer relationship ARPU by getting higher product penetration. And that was the goal of that pricing packaging.

同時，先被動地，然後主動地將現有客戶群中相當一部分轉移到價格較低的產品上。但在此過程中，要維持甚至發展客戶關係，儘管眾所周知，視訊套餐組合有所減少，因為人們正在為家庭用戶購買更多產品。因此，Charter長期以來一直奉行這樣的策略：透過改變產品定價（聽不清楚），提高產品滲透率，從而提升客戶關係和平均每用戶收入（ARPU）。這正是該定價方案的目標。

At the end of 2025, about 40% of our footprint had that new pricing and packaging, we'll probably be at 60% at the end of this year. And so we've been able to manage an environment where you are really lowering your broadband pricing promotion and at retail both in stand-alone, but more importantly, in bundled pricing and packaging, in a way that creates significant savings for customers, and whether that's mobile where we can save you over $1,000 a year, or it's in video where actually now we can also save here over $1,000 a year because of the inclusion of the apps, we're using these tools that we have that are really unique in the marketplace. We can offer mobile everywhere, we can offer video everywhere.

到2025年底，我們約40%的服務區域將採用新的定價和套餐方案，預計今年底將達到60%。因此，我們成功地降低了寬頻促銷價格，無論是在零售通路還是在獨立套餐和捆綁套餐方面，都能大幅降低客戶成本。例如，在行動端，我們每年可以為您節省超過1000美元；在視訊服務方面，由於我們整合了應用程序，現在每年也能為您節省超過1000美元。我們利用了市場上獨一無二的工具，實現了行動端和視訊服務的覆蓋範圍。

And I know you didn't ask it, but -- so I was thinking about Mobile Everywhere, I know one of our large competitors the other day mentioned that in their wireline footprint, which is limited to where they offer mobile, they thought they could get normal penetration to 75% to 80%. I thought that was interesting because, if that's true, and it was said by one of our large competitors, I mean, the implications for Charter and Comcast are, I think, dramatic, if you can get 75% to 80% penetration on our broadband footprints. And that's sustainable. Well, maybe to the earlier point, we don't have the brand to go do that, but a structural advantage without the same macro cell tower and spectrum investments that's required out of the big telcos, and 90% of our traffic goes on a much faster multi-gig network.

我知道你沒問，但是——我一直在想「移動無所不在」這個概念。前幾天，我們的一家大型競爭對手提到，在他們的有線網路覆蓋範圍內（也就是他們提供行動服務的區域），他們認為行動網路的正常滲透率可以達到75%到80%。我覺得這很有意思，因為如果這是真的（而且是我們的大型競爭對手所說的），那麼對Charter和Comcast來說，這意味著巨大的改變。如果我們的寬頻網路也能達到75%到80%的滲透率，而且這種滲透率是可持續的。當然，就像之前提到的，我們可能沒有足夠的品牌影響力來實現這一點，但我們擁有結構性優勢，無需像大型電信公司那樣投入巨資建設宏基站和頻譜資源，而且我們90%的流量都通過速度更快的多千兆網絡傳輸。

So we have a product advantage and we have the ability to offer those products ubiquitously to cover all of our DMAs essentially. And so that provides a marketing and service advantage. And then we can save customers a lot of money with the pricing strategies that we have, back to your original question. So we're pleased with where we're heading. It's -- this is a -- it's a tough migration path to manage, but we've got a lot of experience doing it and we've done it many times, and we'll actually end up doing the same thing with Cox and look forward to doing that assuming we get regulatory approval there.

因此，我們在產品方面具有優勢，並且能夠廣泛地提供這些產品，基本上涵蓋我們所有的DMA區域。這為我們帶來了行銷和服務優勢。回到您最初的問題，憑藉我們現有的定價策略，我們可以為客戶節省大量資金。所以我們對目前的發展方向感到滿意。這是一條艱難的遷移之路，但我們在這方面擁有豐富的經驗，並且已經多次成功完成。實際上，我們最終也會對Cox採取同樣的做法，並且期待在獲得監管部門批准後能夠順利完成。

Maybe it would helpful there and translate a little bit of that into the financials as well, because I know folks are focused on sort of what does that mean for ARPU across the business. And we don't often talk about product [but I want to] go there because I think it's helpful in this context as we're sort of doing the pricing migration. Ultimately, I think we expect Internet ARPU to grow this year, though more slowly than it has in prior years as we drive Spectrum pricing and packaging through the footprint.

或許這能有所幫助，也能將一些資訊轉化到財務數據中，因為我知道大家都很關注這會對整個業務的平均每用戶收入（ARPU）產生什麼影響。我們通常不怎麼談論產品，但我想談談產品，因為我認為在進行價格調整的背景下，這很有幫助。最終，我認為我們預計今年的網路ARPU會成長，儘管成長速度會比往年慢，因為我們正在逐步推進頻譜定價和套餐整合。

I think mobile ARPU has been declining as more customers take our gig product, which includes unlimited plus at unlimited pricing, and as we see some contra revenue from phone balance (inaudible) plan. I think that we're at a low point there and so there might be additional mobile ARPU declines in the year-over-year going forward. But sequentially, I think that we've bottomed out on that front.

我認為，隨著越來越多的客戶選擇我們的零工產品（包括無限流量套餐），以及我們從話費餘額（聽不清楚）計劃中獲得一些抵消收入，行動端ARPU一直在下降。我認為我們目前正處於低谷，因此未來幾年行動端ARPU可能會繼續同比下降。但從環比來看，我認為我們已經觸底了。

And then there are multiple headwinds that impact video ARPU that make that one difficult. You've got programmer streaming app allocation, which continues to accelerate. You have some more unfavorable bundled revenue allocation and you have a higher mix of skinnier video tiers. If you think about that together with programming and programming cost per video sub, I expect that programmer cost per video sub will be up in low single digits when you exclude that program or streaming app allocation. And we did pass through some programmer costs in our video pricing at the beginning of this year.

此外，還有許多不利因素影響視訊ARPU值，使得預測更加困難。例如，節目製作方將部分收入分配給串流媒體應用，而且這一比例還在不斷上升。捆綁銷售收入分配也更加不利，而且影片套餐中單價較低的產品層級比例也較高。如果將這些因素與節目製作成本和每個影片訂閱用戶的節目製作成本結合起來考慮，我預計，如果排除節目製作方或串流媒體應用的分配，每個影片訂閱用戶的節目製作成本將出現個位數百分比的成長。今年年初，我們確實將部分節目製作成本轉嫁到了影片定價中。

So ultimately, what happens then, think of it in margin instead of individual costs, so you might have video ARPU continuing to decline, but it's really based on those impacts.

所以最終，接下來會發生什麼事？要從利潤率而不是單一成本的角度來看待這個問題，影片 ARPU 可能會繼續下降，但這實際上是基於這些影響。

Steven Cahall, Wells Fargo.

史蒂文‧卡哈爾，富國銀行。

First, Chris, just going back to fiber, you said you don't expect the fiber overbuilders to reach their ROI goals. And we haven't necessarily seen that pressure translate into a slowdown, especially from the telcos. I don't know if that's due to lower cash taxes or something else. But I was wondering if you could just speak to how you expect the competitive environment to play out when we might actually see a slowdown in that activity that could lessen some of the competitive pressure.

首先，克里斯，回到光纖的話題，你說過你預期光纖建造者無法實現他們的投資報酬率目標。而且我們也沒有看到這種壓力轉化為經濟放緩，尤其是來自電信業者的放緩。我不知道這是因為現金稅減少還是其他原因。但我很想知道，如果市場活動真的放緩，減輕一些競爭壓力，你會預期競爭環境會如何改變。

And then also just on the promotional environment. I thought slide 5 was interesting with maybe a $40 gig offer in the market. I was just wondering if you see a really attractive opportunity to be more promotional this year or if I'm misreading that slide. But if you are, what you think that could do to subscriber trends as we move through the year?

另外，關於推廣環境，我覺得第五張投影片很有意思，裡面提到市場上可能會出現40美元的單次服務報價。我想知道您是否認為今年這是一個加強推廣的絕佳機會，還是我誤解了那張投影片的內容。如果您認為這是一個絕佳的機會，您覺得這會對今年的訂閱用戶成長趨勢產生什麼影響？

Yes. So let me start with that one first. The $40 gig is when bundled with either 2 mobile lines or video. That's been in the market since September of 2024. So that's our every day pricing that's out there that's been in the market.

是的。那我就先說這個。 40美元的套餐是和兩條手機線路或視訊服務捆綁銷售的。這個套餐從2024年9月就開始販售了。所以這是我們一直以來在市場上提供的日常價格。

And clearly, it's had a big impact on the percentage of gig uptake in -- amongst acquisition. So it's not new and we think it's positive.

顯然，這極大地影響了零工經濟在企業收購中的佔比。所以這並非新鮮事，我們認為這是正面的。

The ROI question, I mean I've said this for 25 years, that when we take a look at ROI, we think about classic IRR, cash-on-cash payback, years for that return to take place. And I guess the danger is always that other people's ROI may be based on a going concern as opposed to a real financial ROI, that I'm not sure that you should be investing for going concern ROI because I think most shareholders would say we'd rather have that capital back as opposed to deploying it in a more return way. But that's not new. I mean that's existed in -- with the telcos for at least, I've been in here for almost 30 years and it's always been the case. So that makes it dangerous when your competitor isn't focused on traditional financial returns and shareholders are either confused or willing to look the other way and not insist on understanding what those ROIs are.

關於投資報酬率（ROI）的問題，我25年來一直強調，當我們審視ROI時，我們通常會想到傳統的內部報酬率（IRR）、現金報酬率，以及實現回報所需的時間。我認為，風險在於其他人的ROI可能基於持續經營，而非真正的財務回報。我不確定是否應該為了持續經營的ROI而投資，因為我認為大多數股東會說，我們寧願收回資金，而不是將其用於回報更高的投資。但這並非新鮮事。至少在電信業，這種情況已經存在了近30年，我一直都身處其中。因此，當你的競爭對手不專注於傳統的財務回報，而股東要麼感到困惑，要麼選擇視而不見，不願堅持了解這些ROI究竟是什麼時，就會變得非常危險。

I think that's -- and that's not me complaining. That's just saying I think that's what the case is. I don't think it's going to change, and we have to be able to compete irrespective of that. And we do. And we've been doing that for a really long time.

我認為——我這麼說並不是抱怨。我只是說我認為情況就是這樣。我不認為情況會改變，我們必須能夠在這種情況下保持競爭力。而我們也確實做到了。而且我們已經這樣做了很久了。

So given what I just said, I don't know when the competitive slowdown occurs. I do know that as you get deeper into the market, the density gets lower and the cost per passing ultimately has to increase when the density gets lower. And so there's a natural throttling mechanism that exists there relative to what they've done in the past, whether it's taxes or interest rates that put an additional lever on that, I'm not sure. But we're -- that's not our job. And so our job is to go compete against whatever is being brought to us, and that's what we've been doing since fiber has been doing overlaps with overbuilds for the past 15 years or so.

鑑於我剛才所說的，我不知道競爭放緩何時會發生。但我知道，隨著市場深度的增加，網路密度會降低，而單次傳輸成本最終必然會上升。因此，相對於他們過去的做法，這裡存在著一種天然的限速機制，至於稅收或利率是否會對此產生額外影響，我並不確定。但這並非我們的職責。我們的職責是應對任何挑戰，而這正是我們過去15年來一直在做的事情，因為光纖網路一直在與現有網路重疊。

Operator, we will take our last question, please.

接線員，我們最後一個問題請問。

Frank Louthan, Raymond James.

弗蘭克·盧森，雷蒙德·詹姆斯。

Great. When you -- looking forward here, as far as some of the promotional activity that you have, how long do you see the need for price locks? And what are sort of your thoughts on that as a long-term solution? And then how quickly could you think you can get the Charter -- the Cox customers up to levels of wireless penetration that you experience in your base footprint?

好的。展望未來，就你們的促銷活動而言，你們認為價格鎖定需要持續多久？你們如何看待將其作為長期解決方案？另外，你們認為多久才能讓Charter和Cox的客戶達到你們主要覆蓋區域內的無線網路普及率？

Look, we don't have any change -- plans to change our pricing strategy. I think the price locks is both a good competitive reaction on our part and it's something that gives customers a lot of comfort and the ability to switch. And so I think that's here to stay. Could you see over time that we evolve that further into a next evolution? Yes.

你看，我們目前沒有任何改變定價策略的計畫。我認為價格鎖定既是我們應對競爭的有效措施，也讓客戶感到安心，並方便他們隨時切換。所以我認為這項政策會繼續保留。你認為隨著時間的推移，我們會進一步發展這項政策嗎？是的。

But we're not at that stage today. We actually think what we have is working and will work. But we'll always continue to modernize our pricing strategies. So I don't see any big change today. On the wireless or the mobile penetration at Cox, I think you should take a look at maybe not our early days of Spectrum Mobile penetration because we were still putting the product together, getting larger brand awareness.

但我們目前還沒到那個階段。我們認為現有的策略行之有效，將來也會繼續有效。不過，我們會持續改進定價策略。所以，我認為目前不會有任何重大的變動。至於Cox的無線或行動網路滲透率，我認為你應該看看Spectrum Mobile早期的滲透情況，因為那時我們還在完善產品，努力提升品牌知名度。

But I think you can take a look at the Spectrum Mobile penetration and Charter curve, I think that's a good indication. I would expect the earlier days to be much faster. And that's simply because we're a better operator in that space than we were, whatever it is, 6, 7 years ago. In terms of our platforms, our sales channel, our marketing, our national brand awareness, it's all in a much better place. But I think an improvement to that original curve, it's probably a good starting point for people to think about how we can get into the market there.

但我認為你可以看看Spectrum Mobile和Charter的滲透率曲線，我認為這是一個很好的參考指標。我預計早期階段的滲透速度會快得多。這只是因為我們在這個領域的營運能力比六、七年前要強得多。無論是我們的平台、銷售管道、行銷或全國品牌知名度，都比以前好得多。我認為，對最初曲線的改進，或許可以作為人們思考我們如何進入該市場的一個很好的起點。

Operator, I'll pass it back to you to close out. Thank you.

操作員，我這就把活兒交還給你，讓你結帳。謝謝。

Thank you for joining today's call. You may now disconnect.

感謝您參加今天的電話會議。您現在可以掛斷電話了。