Central Garden & Pet Co (CENTA) 2025 Q4 法說會逐字稿

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by. Welcome to Central Garden & Pet's fourth-quarter and fiscal 2025 earnings call. My name is Paul, and I will be your conference operator for today. (Operator Instructions) As a reminder, this conference call is being recorded.

I would now like to turn the call over to Friederike Edelmann, Vice President, Investor Relations. Please go ahead.

Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining Central's fourth quarter and fiscal year 2025 earnings call. Joining me today are Niko Lahanas, Chief Executive Officer; Brad Smith, Chief Financial Officer; John Hanson, President of Pet Consumer Products; and J.D. Walker, President of Garden Consumer Products. Niko will start by sharing today's key takeaways followed by Brad who will provide a more in-depth discussion of our results. After their prepared remarks, J.D and John will join us for the Q&A session.

Before we begin, I would like to remind everyone that all forward-looking statements made during this call are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause our actual results to differ materially from those forward-looking statements expressed or implied today. A detailed description of Central's risk factors can be found in our annual report filed with the SEC.

Please note that Central undertakes no obligation to publicly update these forward-looking statements to reflect new information, future events or other developments. Our press release and related materials, including GAAP reconciliation for the non-GAAP measures discussed on this call are available at ir.central.com.

Last but not least, unless otherwise specified, all comparisons discussed during this call are made against the same period in the prior year. If you have any questions after the call or at any time during the quarter, please don't hesitate to contact me directly.

And with that, let's get started. Niko?

Thank you, Friederike, and good afternoon, everyone. I'd like to begin by highlighting three themes we will focus on today. First, fiscal '25 was a year of meaningful progress, intangible accomplishments across Central. Our record bottom line performance underscores the strength of our business model, the rigor of our execution and the relentless commitment of Team Central.

Second, we continue to strengthen our foundation by streamlining operations, consolidating facilities, optimizing our portfolio and driving efficiencies that enhance our cost structure and position us for sustained profitable growth.

And third, as we enter fiscal '26, we're energized by our momentum and the opportunities ahead. Powered by our Central to Home strategy and sharp disciplined execution, we're poised to accelerate our long-term agenda with even greater focus and agility.

Now let me expand on each of these points. First, our fiscal '25 achievements. Thanks to the hard work and dedication of our more than 6,000 employees. We closed the year with expanded gross margins, record EBITDA and record earnings per share. These results underscore the strength and resilience of our business model as well as the drive and commitment of our people.

We delivered consistent performance while advancing portfolio optimization and maintaining disciplined cost management.

Throughout the period, we upheld operational rigor, streamlined our footprint and drove efficiency initiatives across both segments. We also navigated variable weather conditions by simplifying our business and tightly managing costs, actions that have made our model even more resilient and predictable. Results reflected the transition of two third-party product lines in our garden distribution business to a direct-to-retail model.

At the same time, we continue to deliberately reduce our exposure to low-margin durable products in both Pet and Garden. A strategic move that while creating short-term top line pressure strengthens our portfolio and positions us for sustainable profitable growth. We ended the year with record results of fortress balance sheet and strong momentum as we head into fiscal '26.

Second, advancing our Cost and Simplicity agenda. Our initiatives continue to deliver measurable, sustainable benefits, enhancing productivity, expanding margins and positioning us to fuel future growth. We've largely completed our multiyear supply chain network design project, a major milestone that has strengthened customer alignment, increased service speed and improved cost efficiency across our logistics network. The project also established enterprise-wide e-commerce fulfillment capabilities and modernized our distribution footprint.

Together with the sale of our garden distribution business and the intentional exit of the pottery business, this work has enabled us to close 16 legacy facilities to date. By the end of the calendar year, we will be operating a modern high-performing infrastructure anchored by DTC enabled fulfillment centers in Salt Lake City; Eastern Pennsylvania; and Covington, Georgia, a network built for speed, efficiency and growth.

Across our footprint, systems and processes were streamlining operations, boosting productivity and freeing up resources to reinvest in the business. These actions are making Central simpler, stronger and better positioned to scale, creating a more resilient cohesive and predictable company that delivers consistent performance, adapts with flexibility and is poised to capture the full potential of the opportunities ahead.

Third, outlook for fiscal '26. We entered the year with strong momentum, clear priorities and a unified focus on delivering results. Our diversified portfolio, operational agility and prudent cost management give us confidence in our ability to deliver profitable growth despite current global macro environment and policy shifts. We expect consumers to remain focused on value and performance with a promotionally active but stable retail environment and continued channel shifts from pet specialty to e-commerce.

We're delivering with precision to offset cost inflation, tariffs and supply chain complexity through productivity gains driven by our Cost and Simplicity agenda and pricing discipline. After incorporating these factors and our operating plans, we expect fiscal '26 non-GAAP earnings per share to be $2.70 or better.

Supported by margin expansion and operational performance. As always, our outlook excludes potential impacts from acquisitions, divestitures or restructuring actions including activities related to our ongoing Cost and Simplicity agenda.

We remain confident that the Central to Home strategy is the right path and the foundation for long-term value creation. We're combining the agility of a startup with the strength and scale of a category leader, empowering business units to innovate quickly while leveraging Central's operational and financial capabilities to accelerate growth.

By sharing tools, data and talent across the organization, we're building a connected enterprise, one that learns faster, execute smarter and compounds its competitive advantage over time. This approach enables us to bring new ideas to the consumer faster, capture opportunities sooner and scale what works across our platform.

Looking ahead, we'll continue to balance sensible cost and cash management with targeted investments that fuel organic growth, particularly in innovation, e-commerce and digital technology. A key priority is making our data AI ready, improving accessibility, quality and integration to generate deeper insights and unlock meaningful value and competitive advantage across the business. These strategic investments are already translating into stronger innovation momentum. Recent launches highlight how we're combining insights, performance, sustainability and consumer impact.

Examples include wild bird feed, our redesigned Pennington Feeding Frenzy and 3-D pro lines that elevate visibility and engagement, both online and at retail, supported by a robust digital marketing program. Worry Free 30% vinegar, a high-performance multipurpose cleaner, 6 times stronger than standard vinegar. Farnam Endure, gold fly spray a next-generation EPA-approved formula that delivers long-lasting and highly effective fly control, bringing advanced performance and care to horse owners.

In parallel, M&A remains a strategic lever for growth. We're actively pursuing margin-accretive consumable businesses that complement our portfolio and expand our presence in attractive categories. While market engagement has increased, deal flow in our core categories remains somewhat limited. We expect activity to accelerate as market conditions continue to improve.

I want to thank our team across Central for a record year of meaningful progress and unwavering focus. We've done a tremendous amount of foundational work. And as a result, we're entering fiscal '26 with the business performing at a very high level.

With strong financial flexibility and an improving M&A landscape, we're confident in the road ahead. That confidence is reinforced by the strength of our retail partnerships which continue to deepen and drive mutual growth.

As recognition of that strength, we were honored to be named Lowe's' Lawn & Garden Vendor Partner of the Year, and Kaytee was recently recognized with the NCAP's 2025 Pet Amazon best-in-class PDP award for excellence in product content and presentation.

And with that, I'll hand it over to Brad. Brad?

Thank you, Niko. Building on Niko's remarks, I will begin with our fiscal '25 results. Net sales were $3.1 billion, a decrease of 2%, while variable weather and softer demand in pet durables created meaningful headwinds, the overall sales decline for the year was driven entirely by two key factors. First, our proactive decision to reduce exposure to lower-margin businesses, including Pet and Garden durables as well as our UK operations.

This step is part of our ongoing effort to optimize the portfolio, improve margins and strengthen the foundation for sustainable growth.

Second, the transition of two third-party product lines in our garden distribution business to a direct-to-retail model. Importantly, our remaining portfolio grew slightly for the year and delivered record sales across several key businesses, including wild bird, dog treats, equine and our professional portfolio, a clear sign that our underlying business is strong and that our strategy is working.

Non-GAAP gross profit was $1 billion, up 4.5% and non-GAAP gross margin expanded 210 basis points to 32.1%, largely supported by productivity initiatives. Both segments contributed to the improvement. Non-GAAP SG&A expense was $738 million, roughly in line with the prior year. As a percentage of sales, non-GAAP SG&A was 23.6% compared with 23%, mostly due to lower volume and the sequencing of productivity and commercial investments.

Throughout the year, we balanced sensible cost management with continued investment in long-term growth drivers. Non-GAAP operating income for the year increased to $265 million from $223 million and non-GAAP operating margin expanded to 8.5% from 7%, supported by structural cost improvements and overall strong execution. Non-GAAP adjustments totaled $15 million in fiscal '25, all related to our Cost and Simplicity agenda.

In our Garden segment, these adjustments largely reflected the consolidation of two legacy distribution facilities, one in Ontario, California and another in Salt Lake City, Utah, into a single, larger and more modern site in Salt Lake City. That work began in the third quarter and continued into the fourth quarter, resulting in $5 million in SG&A charges.

In our Pet segment, the adjustments were mainly related to the strategic wind down of our UK operations and the transition to a more profitable direct-export-only model. This initiative span the second through fourth quarters and resulted in $10 million in total charges, $6 million in cost of goods and $4 million in SG&A.

Below the line, net interest expense was $33 million compared with $38 million, helped by higher interest income from larger average cash balances. Other expense was $500,000 compared with $5.1 million as we lap the prior year impairment charge on two minority investments.

Non-GAAP net income totaled $174 million, up 22%. We delivered record GAAP and non-GAAP earnings per share of $2.55, up $0.93 and $2.73, up $0.60, respectively, exceeding both our guidance and last year's performance.

Adjusted EBITDA for the year was $371 million compared to $334 million. Our effective tax rate for the year was 24.4% compared to 23.2% due primarily to the nondeductibility for tax purposes of losses incurred in connection with the wind down of our UK operations.

Now turning to the consolidated financials for the fourth quarter. Fourth quarter net sales were $678 million, up 1% versus the prior year, led by strength in Garden. Non-GAAP gross profit for the quarter was $197 million, compared with $174 million and non-GAAP gross margin expanded 310 basis points to 29.1%.

It's worth noting that we lapped a significant grass seed inventory charge that was taken in last year's fourth quarter. Excluding the impact of that charge, our gross margin rate was consistent with the prior year as productivity improvements effectively offset the initial impact of tariffs.

Most of our actions to mitigate tariff-related cost increases are only now beginning to flow through the P&L positioning us for additional benefit going forward.

Non-GAAP SG&A expense for the quarter was $198 million, a 7% increase and as a percentage of net sales was 29.2% compared with 27.7%. The increase largely reflects the cadence of investments tied to our productivity and commercial initiatives.

Non-GAAP operating loss for the quarter was $649,000 compared with $11 million and non-GAAP operating margin improved to negative 0.1% from negative 1.7%. Non-GAAP adjustments for the quarter totaled $6 million, including $3 million related to our UK operations and $3 million associated with the Garden facility consolidation. Of the total, $5 million was recorded in SG&A and $1 million in cost of goods.

Below the line, net interest expense was in line with the prior year. Other expense for the quarter was $600,000 compared with $6 million. Non-GAAP net loss for the quarter was $5 million compared with $12 million, GAAP loss per share was $0.16 compared with $0.51 and non-GAAP loss per share was $0.09 compared with $0.18. Adjusted EBITDA for the quarter was $26 million compared with $17 million.

Now let me provide highlights from the fourth quarter from our two segments, starting with Pet. Net sales for the Pet segment was $428 million, a decrease of 2% due to the closure of our UK operations and lower durable sales, both the result of deliberate actions to simplify the business and enhance profitability. These impacts were partially offset by strong growth in our Animal Health businesses, particularly within our professional portfolio and equine.

While demand for durables remain soft, consumables performance continued to be relatively stable, supported by positive point-of-sale trends in the fourth quarter. Consumables now represent roughly 84% of total Pet segment sales an all-time high, highlighting the strength and resilience of our core business. Across the Pet segment overall, we maintained our market share and delivered gains in dog chews, pet bird, equine and flea and tick as well as in our professional portfolio.

E-commerce continues to play an important role in our channel mix, representing 27% of total Pet segment sales consistent with the prior two quarters and reflecting steady consumer engagement across digital platforms.

Non-GAAP operating income was $31 million compared with $35 million due to slightly lower volumes combined with the timing of investments and productivity and commercial initiatives. Non-GAAP operating margin contracted to 7.2% from 8%. Adjusted EBITDA for the segment was $41 million compared with $45 million.

Now moving to Garden. Net sales for the Garden segment were $250 million, a 7% increase we benefited from an extended selling season driven by favorable fourth quarter weather following a cool and wet third quarter.

We also saw improved sell-through aided by additional product placements strong retail execution and disciplined inventory management. Our wild bird, grass seed, fertilizer and packet seed businesses delivered particularly strong quarters with growth in both sales and share across retailers and channels.

The strong fourth quarter rebound made this our biggest point-of-sale year ever in Garden despite the reduction in our distribution business, variable weather earlier in the year and lower home center traffic, a testament to the agility of our teams and the strength of our retail partnerships in Garden.

Garden e-commerce sales grew at a double-digit rate across every category, surpassing 10% of total segment sales for the first time, enhanced product content improved videos and targeted new item introductions increased click-through, add to cart and conversion rates across retailer platforms.

Results remained especially strong in wild bird and grass seed, where we continue to lead the category and deliver robust growth across both pure-play and omnichannel partners. Given the garden industry's relatively low digital penetration today, we see significant runway for sustained online growth across our categories in future quarters.

Non-GAAP operating income came in at $1 million, an increase of $26 million with non-GAAP operating margin expanding to a positive 0.4% from a negative 10.6%. Adjusted EBITDA totaled $11 million, an improvement of $25 million underscoring the strong finish to the year.

Turning now to the balance sheet and cash flows. Cash flow from operations was $333 million in fiscal '25 compared with $395 million a year ago. Our ongoing focus on working capital efficiency resulted in an additional $36 million reduction in inventory, our tenth straight quarter of year-over-year improvement. CapEx for the year was $41 million, about 4% lower than last year, reflecting prudent investments primarily in productivity-enhancing initiatives and essential maintenance projects.

Depreciation and amortization were $85 million, 7% below prior year, consistent with our focus on efficient capital deployment. By year-end, cash and cash equivalents totaled $882 million, up $129 million, underscoring our strong liquidity and consistent cash generation. Total debt was $1.2 billion, unchanged from the prior year.

Gross leverage ended the year at 2.8 times both below last year and our target range of 3 to 3.5 times, net leverage was approximately 0.8%, supported by our solid cash position and we had no borrowings outstanding under our credit facility at year-end. This balance sheet strength provides the flexibility to invest in growth, maintain financial resilience and return value to shareholders.

Looking ahead to fiscal 2026. And as Niko mentioned earlier, we are guiding non-GAAP EPS to $2.70 a share or better, reflecting continued focus on operational excellence, margin expansion and disciplined cost management.

While the tariff environment remains fluid, we currently project incremental year-over-year gross tariff exposure of roughly $20 million over the next 12 months. The majority of the exposure is within the Pet segment. We are expecting to offset most of the tariffs through pricing and portfolio and supply chain actions.

We plan to invest approximately $50 million to $60 million in CapEx primarily maintenance and productivity initiatives across both segments, underscoring our commitment to high-return projects that strengthen operations and enhance profitability.

For the first quarter, we expect non-GAAP earnings per share of approximately $0.10 to $0.15, consistent with normal seasonal trends. It's important to note that last year's first quarter benefited meaningfully from favorable timing of both shipments and promotional activity.

This year, we also have one less shipping day between Christmas and the end of our fiscal quarter ending December 27. In addition, the results will reflect a temporary shipment hold we initiated with a large retailer and the shifting of certain orders into the second quarter.

As a reminder, the first quarter is typically one of our smaller periods and not indicative of full year performance. As always, our outlook excludes any potential impacts from acquisitions, divestitures or restructuring activities that may occur during fiscal '26, including projects under our cost and simplicity agenda.

That concludes our prepared remarks. Operator, please open the line for questions.

(Operator Instructions)

Brad Thomas, KeyBanc Capital Markets.

Good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. I wanted to ask about the operating margin at a high level. You all have been doing a tremendous job of driving improvements and efficiencies. And so as we think about this upcoming fiscal year, I was hoping you could talk about some of those puts and takes and how they sort of are expected to net out between cost and simplicity, tariffs, demand challenges, et cetera? Thank you.

Brad, this is Niko. Yes, we're going to continue to work on Cost and Simplicity. So we have every intention of expanding margin in '26, we may not get as dramatic results as we've got in the last few years because we're seeing the low-hanging fruit has been picked in a lot of ways.

The other thing I would say, don't underestimate the effect that product mix has. So we have to see how that plays out as well. But I would say for right now, as we put together our plans for '26 we are expecting to continue to expand margin.

Great. And if I could ask a follow-up with respect to the Garden segment. It seems like some really strong execution there. I know that the months ahead will be important as we try to figure out what sell-in can look like for the spring 2026 garden season. But can you give us a little more color about how you're feeling about that? And what the outlook of that garden category may be for next year?

Brad, it's J.D. I'll take that question. Thanks for the question. I'd say that we're looking forward, of course, everything is dependent on what takes place in season, particularly around weather. But I'd say going into it, we are cautiously optimistic.

I think, one of the things that gives us reason to believe is our year-over-year points of distribution or total distribution points, SKU store combinations, distribution gains, if you will. We feel great about that. It's going to -- we're going to show an increase year-over-year.

If you exclude the pottery business that we exited, our points of distribution will be up 8% year-over-year. And if you look at manufactured products, products that we manufacture in our plants, it will be up double digits.

So I think that strong distribution base execution by our team going into season, the controllable causal factors we feel great about. Now it's up to mother nature to do her part but I'd say cautiously optimistic would be my by terminology, looking at the season.

That's very helpful.

Jim Chariker, [Mones Cresp and Hart]

Hi, thanks for taking my question. Just want to talk about -- it looks like corporate expense was up about $11 million in fourth quarter after being down in the first three quarters. So I just wanted to get some more color on that. And then could you quantify the impact of tariffs on fourth quarter, please?

So corporate expenses, I mean, a lot of it had to do with kind of a quarterly variation of timing expenses during the year when compared to last year. But there is that element but on top of that, we had some investments that we made to support commercial growth in '26, some of which that we recorded in corporate.

And then we also had some other miscellaneous true-ups we had related to certain reserves and whatnot. So it was really a combination of three different elements. Nothing that would be kind of suggest anything structural on a full year basis going into this year.

Great. And then on the tariff impact for the quarter?

Yeah. So tariffs -- gross tariffs were, I want to say, roughly $7 million, $8 million in the fourth quarter.

Okay. And then last quarter, you talked about investing behind, I think, a new product launch for Pet. Just curious what that spend looks like and then how that product performed for you?

Yeah. We've got a -- this is John. The product launch we mentioned was the Farnam Endure gold fly spray, and that's a new EPA-approved product. And the efficacy is significantly better. We're in the process of launching it right now.

Customer feedback is really strong. But it's a bit of a seasonal business. So we won't really see that takeaway really until next season, kind of March, April, May, June.

We also made some incremental investment at Farnam in Q4 that ended up paying off quite well where we took several share points in equine during the quarter.

Yeah, we did. We continue to invest where we see high opportunity and high return, and that was one of them, and that was focused on digital and content and paid off.

Great to hear. Thank you.

Bob Labick, CJS Securities.

Good afternoon. Thanks for taking our questions. Kind of sticking with the tariff theme, obviously, you're navigating it through like everyone else as well. You said price is going to be one lever. Can you talk -- have your retail customers accepted your pricing? Have they passed it along? And kind of when will you know consumer, I guess, acceptance and elasticity, how are you thinking about those?

Maybe I'll answer the first part where we are in the negotiations. And maybe, John, maybe you can jump in with the others. Yes, I would say we're more than half the way there in terms of negotiations with customers. It's almost exclusively on the Pet side, a bit on Garden. And they've obviously been very challenging.

We had to hold some shipments as a result of those discussions with one of our customers, which we mentioned a bit earlier. So we are expecting to be done with those discussions, I think, kind of into this quarter, maybe early Q2. John, do you want to comment on the consumer part and passing through the retailer?

Yeah. So we haven't seen the prices go up yet in the marketplace. So a little bit TBD. Now we can model what we've done in the past and we do a good job of doing that. And that speaks to probably around elasticity and it's been pretty consistent.

But we do everything we can to in these tariffs, right? We look at country of origin and we look at our SKUs and make sure we got the right SKUs and if we have to optimize them and then pricing is a partnership with the customer, and we do it as last resort but we do do it and have done it before.

Yeah. And we don't price to build margin. We price to offset some of the costs, and that's something we're very, very disciplined about.

Yeah. I mean, Niko mentioned earlier that we're in a position to modestly expand margin this year, and it's clearly going to be the ongoing Cost and Simplicity efforts, including the tariff products as well as other projects we've got going on that really are going to be needed to get us over the line and be able to expand margin.

Okay. Great. And obviously, you've had a lot of progress over the last few years with Cost and Simplicity and margin improvement. Can you talk about how much your -- you said, I guess, in Q4 a little bit, you reinvested for growth in '26. How do you think about changing the investment level or either promotional activity or brand building as you continue to get this margin improvement from Cost and Simplicity?

Yeah. We're definitely up in our game in terms of investment around the consumer around digital. And also, we want to up our game around innovation. So really, those are the three areas we need to get better at and put some money behind. We're trying to stay agile in a lot of ways. So the great thing about digital is we can make an investment and see how it does and pivot based off of that.

So when we see something that works, we tend to continue to feed the beast. And then if something doesn't, we'll pivot and continue to tweak. So it's a very dynamic agile way of promoting product, mainly through retail media. But we're also building out a lot more content than we have in the past. And you can see that with our feeding frenzy, wild bird product that's out there now.

And we've had some nice results there and plan on building on that. That's really a really nice case study for the company, and we're going to be doing more of that going forward.

Okay great thanks so much.

Brian McNamara, Canaccord Genuity

Good afternoon, guys. Thanks for taking the questions. So I know you don't guide on the top line but I was hoping you could provide some kind of high-level thoughts on how you see 2026 potentially playing out? And what outside of weather could drive better or worse top line trends?

Yeah. I mean our view right now is that top line is going to be challenging once again as it was in '25, we think '26 is going to be extremely challenging. For reasons that we sort of outlined, we've got a little bit of a headwind with tariffs.

Consumer confidence is at a low point right now. So we really need to see how the consumer is going to react to pricing and really their behavior and the whole notion of the bifurcation of income right now is very real. We're seeing it in both of our categories.

So it's a little bit of a wait and see. I think, again, we're not going to guide on that top line, but we make every effort possible to grow every year. And that's what we're going to do going into '26. So that's about all we can say right now. More to come as we get deeper into the year.

And then, as always, weather is going to play a pretty big impact, particularly on the Garden side.

Niko, I think one thing that I would add to that is the SKU rationalization and some of the portfolio management that we've done has also been a drag on the top line, but it's one of the reasons why our margins have been so strong. So we'll continue to look at SKU rationalization. It's an ongoing process.

Yes, that's absolutely right. Great.

Great. And then secondly, I know you mentioned, I think, durables are 16% of your pet sales. How did durables do overall as a category? Is that still a double-digit decline in Q4?

Yeah. It's -- yes, 16% is the right number, and it was a double-digit decline in Q4. Keep in mind what Brad said as well, a big piece of that decline was our proactive decisions to discontinue low margin, no margin SKUs, and that was completed in half one. So we're lapping that. We've got another first half of next year to lap that. But that was a huge contributor to the decline.

Yeah. I mean we -- the hope is kind of as we get into the second half of this year, we'll be at a point where year-over-year durables trends are not significant enough that we're discussing it quarterly.

Great. And what's the company's house view on pet ownership trends currently? And kind of what data do you focus on to inform that view?

Yeah. We've got a variety of sources of data. The view is it's stabilizing and is pretty stable right now. We do have a live animal business as well. And in Q4, we saw that stable kind of up slightly also slightly, but we'll take it, right? So as we look forward into next year, we do believe that's stabilized. And if I looked at the categories that we compete in for the year, I would hope they'd be up. They'd be stable or up slightly low single digits.

Just to pile on to what John said, our live goods -- our live animal business sequentially had less and less declines than actually Q4 posted about a 1% gain. And that gives us some optimism because it's quite a trend. We can see the trend heading in a very positive way.

Great. And then just the last one on capital allocation. I know the company repurchased quite a bit of stock from Q1 to Q3 and very little in Q4, and you're sitting on a record cash balance. So I'm curious how we should read that as the M&A pipeline improves? Or are you keeping dry powder or is it something else?

We're definitely keeping dry powder, and we're actively on the hunt. We are -- as you know, Brian, the market is not as robust as we'd like it to be in terms of interesting opportunities, particularly in margin-accretive pet consumables, which is a bit our bull's eye, but we continue to be optimistic that we're going to find some deals to do this year.

But we're also still remaining opportunistic on the stock price. Even this quarter, we bought back about $18 million in the quarter. And so when we see DIPs, we're going to take advantage of those because we do have conviction that it's undervalued and there's a tremendous opportunity here. So we'll always be there to return money to shareholders.

Great, I appreciate the call.

Andrea Teixeira, JPMorgan.

Hi, good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for taking the question. First, can you comment on the pricing that you're embedding into fiscal '26? And understandably, you mentioned, durables may still have a double-digit decline. I understand first half similar to what happened in this quarter, given the timing of some of the SKU rationalization. So maybe if you can kind of like let us know how the underlying pricing embedded into your guide?

And then my second question is also related to the guidance in fiscal '26. On the margin front, you obviously made significant progress in your rationalization process. What should we be thinking about margins going forward? Should we be keeping that same progress? I mean taking the fourth quarter, of course, there's some seasonality there.

So if you can help us kind of parse out what we should be thinking about margins?

Thanks, Andrea. Yes, pricing, we're looking to take some price fairly modest, about 1% going into '26, really designed to just offset tariffs and some commodity exposure. So pretty modest overall, nothing like we had a few years ago when inflation went completely bananas.

In terms of margin, we go into every year wanting to expand margin. That's really part of our financial algorithm. In Q4, we expanded by 310 basis points going forward, it's going to be a little bit more modest. We've gotten through a lot of the low-hanging fruit but we are planning on expanding margin into '26 for total company.

William Reuter, Bank of America.

So my first question is in Lawn & Garden. So you said your points of distribution, excluding the exit of pottery was up -- looks to be up 10% for next year. It sounds like there maybe is like 1% price in there. If weather were to be equal, I don't see why we wouldn't see a lot of growth in the Lawn & Garden revenues next year. I guess what is the conservatism that's offsetting that and that your tone doesn't sound more bullish?

Well, I did say cautiously optimistic. But just to add a couple of -- a little more color. So excluding the pottery exit, we'll be up high single digits and items that we manufacture will be up double digits. So yes, we're optimistic very bullish with regard to that.

Weather is always an unknown, and we don't plan for improvement in weather year-over-year. However, if there is improvement in weather, then I think we have a very bullish outlook on the year. So again, I'm just trying to keep it somewhat cautious before the season. We are a seasonal business. Last year, during the peak 16 weeks of the season, we had rain on eight of those weekends.

So hopefully, year-over-year, there is improvement there. And if there is, then I think we feel great about our prospects for the year.

I would say, too, on the top line, we are also -- remember, we're still unwinding a large vendor that has chosen to go direct. And so that's going to be a headwind in '26 as well, similar to what we had in '25.

The same vendor.

Yeah. Yeah.

The 8 of 16 key weekends, when does that period start for you?

March through May.

Okay. So basically, March 1 is the first of those days, okay. And the second is going to be a little bit of a follow-up, but you are seeing modest M&A when asked about share repurchases, you said you purchased $18 million.

It's just so small in the context of how much money you guys have. Do you. I mean, are you just going to sit on the cash until the M&A environment and opportunities become more plentiful or would you consider either a large dividend or share repurchase at some point?

Well, the $18 million is just this quarter. If you look at last year, we did over $150 million, which is a little more relevant. We're going to probably go through that with our Board. It's not something we're prepared to discuss right now. My bias and Brad's bias would be to hang on to the money a little while longer and really look for M&A.

For us, that's a lot more exciting, helps grow the top line, help fill out the portfolio. We believe that's really why a lot of shareholders hold the stock is our ability to do M&A. It's really foundational to the company. So that would be our bias. That said, we want to make sure we're doing right by our shareholders, and that's why we continue to buy the stock back.

Got it. Okay.

Cool. I'll pass to others. Thank you.

Carla Casella, JPMorgan.

Hi, thanks for the question. First one is around, you mentioned some shipments that were going to move from 1Q into 2Q. Did you quantify that?

No.

Will you?

No, no. That number is evolving. So It would just be a --

Yeah. Carla, we won't quantify it because there's a number of factors that are at play. It's not only the shipments that we know of right now. But -- and we've talked about this a lot over the years, when we get into that December time frame, so towards the end of Q1, you're competing for trucking with the large retailers as they're kind of winding down Christmas.

And a lot of times, we don't know if the trucks are going to show up. And so what we had last year was all the stars sort of aligned for Q1. If you recall, last year, Q1, we had a little bit of a, call it, pull forward. We had shipments that normally ship in Q2, fall into Q1. Our top line was up and then Q2, early on was a little bit softer.

We have a little bit of the reverse effect that we think is going to happen. And I mean the delayed shipments we know about, but then there's also the noise of will those trucks show up sort of at the end of December, which is a bit of a coin flip.

Yeah. And Niko, I'll add a little more color to that. So Carla, this is J.D. On the Garden side of the business, at the end of Q1, we received a lot of the orders for retailers that are setting their stores for the upcoming season, the Lawn & Garden season. And a lot of that typically ships between Christmas and New Year's.

Oftentimes, they don't want to bring in inventory before Christmas. And this year, our fiscal quarter ends on the 27. So we have one shipping day between Christmas and New Year's.

We haven't even received all of those orders yet from retailers and really, as Niko said, trying to pinpoint exactly what's going to ship in Q1 and what's going to shift into Q2. Intuitively, it tells us that some shift to Q2 will happen, but it's really hard to quantify it. this early. Does that make sense?

Okay, great. Yes, that does. And that's super helpful. The other thing is you talked about that you're seeing the income dispersion that we're also hearing a lot of retailers talk about.

Are you seeing also -- can you talk about whether you're seeing strength or weakness in any of your different channels, home centers, specialty pet, mass, et cetera?

I mean the biggest trend we're still seeing is sort of the migration to online overall across both segments. Pet being more developed online than Garden. But if you look at the Garden growth rate, it's been just tremendous. We have 60% growth on the Garden side with some of the online retailers and it's quickly catching up.

And I think you're just seeing some volume lead brick-and-mortar and go in online. I think some of the retailers that have robust omnichannel strategies are the ones winning right now. So we're seeing some of that. As far as the income and that diversion of income, the bifurcation of income rather. I'm not sure we're seeing it in any specific channel.

I'll let John and J.D. weigh in on it. But as far as we're sitting, we're not seeing a ton of it.

Yeah. On the Pet side, I would add, I don't think we're seeing a ton of it. The pet specialty channel, as we've communicated in the past, remains challenged. Foot traffic has been a bit of a challenge. I do believe as we see the live animals stabilize, that's going to be good for that channel. But bifurcation of income, we're not I can't call anything specific out.

Okay, great. Thanks.

And that was our last question. And with that, we're going to close the call. Happy Thanksgiving, and we'll take your questions if you have any during the quarter.

This concludes today's conference. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.